March 18, 2014

Investigators: Flight 370's Westward Turn Was Pre-Programmed into the Flight Management Computer; Thailand Says They Spotted an Unidentified Plane on Their Radar
— Ace

The Flight Management Computer sits on a pedestal between the captain and copilot, so it could be accessed by either. Or by someone with pre-flight access to the computer.

The change may have been made with as little as seven or eight keystrokes of typing into the Flight Management Computer, simply substituting a new, more westerly waypoint for the original, scheduled one. Waypoints have a five character code; I guess the additional characters would be to indicate a new waypoint, and to hit enter.

The fact that the turn away from Beijing was programmed into the computer has reinforced the belief of investigators — first voiced by Malaysian officials — that the plane was deliberately diverted and that foul play was involved. It has also increased their focus on the plane’s captain and first officer.

The Malaysians, by the way, have officially retracted that previous report (already largely debunked) that the ACARS system was turned off before the copilot's last words over the radio.

The new timeline seems to be this:

1:07 am: Last ACARS ping

1:19 am: "All right, good night" communication from cockpit

1:37 am: Scheduled ACARS ping which never happened, because the system had been shut off. ACARS then was shut off sometime between 1:07 am and 1:37 am, and investigators can't pin it down any more than that (for now).


Flight 370Â’s Flight Management System reported its status to the Acars, which in turn transmitted information back to a maintenance base, according to an American official. This shows that the reprogramming happened before the Acars stopped working. The Acars ceased to function about the same time that oral radio contact was lost and the airplaneÂ’s transponder also stopped, fueling suspicions that foul play was involved in the planeÂ’s disappearance.

I sort of understand that but note that previously, evidence that these systems had been turned off at different times fueled suspicion that the plane's flightpath was deliberately altered; the new theory is that the fact that all these systems went out at the same time is evidence of deliberate action.

It seems whether they were turned off at the same time or different times, we're taking that as evidence of foul play. I suspect foul play myself, but it's a bit illogical to take exactly-opposite evidence as proving the same thing.

In an effort to determine whether the pilot had practiced taking down the plane, the authorities have reassembled the simulator for experts to examine.

Have I missed something? Was there a previous report the flight simulator had been disassembled? If not, what's that "reassembled" doing in there? Or do they just mean investigators disassembled it to remove it from the pilot's house? (It was a sizable thing, with three computer screens to simulate the view from the cockpit.)

As far as Thailand's spotting of a UFO: If that was flight 370, that would indicate a northwest trajectory for the plane, toward (Ed Morrissey says) India and the Central Asian Republics.

I suppose it would also indicate Pakistan as possible endpoint.

Given that Thailand detected this UFO on the night the plane went missing, there are questions why it took them 10 days to say something. It seems no one wants to admit the capabilities of their radars. Understandable, I guess, but what's the point of military radar if you can't use it to track down a plane possibly hijacked by terrorists?

What the Hell Did I Just Watch? Yesterday Ronan Farrow had on Lester Holt to play show and tell with a flight simulator. Holt owns one, and calls himself a "frustrated pilot" (I think he means wannabe pilot), and Farrow had him on to show the audience just what a flight simulator is.

I suppose the basics of this are useful enough-- there may be some small number of people who don't know what a flight simulator is, or may imagine that the only flight simulators are those huge, acceleration-simulating multimillion dollar things that pros use to train.

But it's very awkward and strange to watch Farrow ask some dumb questions about what is, basically, an elaborate and difficult videogame available for virtually any computer.

Oh: Farrow keeps asking Holt if it's "suspicious" that a pilot should own a flight simulator.

This is not a dumb question, but it is a stupid question to ask Holt. Holt is not an expert or a pilot capable of offering an opinion on this question. He's just a reporter who owns a flight simulator, period.

Farrow is asking a guy with no good way to know the answer the same question, multiple times.

Whether or not it's unusual for a pilot to own a flight simulator, or to be an enthusiast for flight simulators, is a good question, if you ask an actual commercial pilot.

Posted by: Ace at 08:05 AM | Comments (354)
Post contains 842 words, total size 6 kb.

1 Something new everyday...

Posted by: loneduck at March 18, 2014 08:06 AM (n+hGq)

2 I suspect foul play myself, but it's a bit illogical to take exactly-opposite evidence as proving the same thing. -- You sound like a climate denier.

Posted by: votermom at March 18, 2014 08:07 AM (GSIDW)

3 I suspect foul play myself, but it's a bit illogical to take exactly-opposite evidence as proving the same thing. How you doin'?

Posted by: AGW Cultists at March 18, 2014 08:07 AM (naUcP)

4

"that would indicate a northwest trajectory for the plane, toward (Ed Morrissey says) India"



And India wouldn't think something amiss?

Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 18, 2014 08:09 AM (GsebS)

5 Stop and think of our amazing satellite and radar capabilities. Many used for early detection of ICBMs. Are we really supposed to believe it is not known exactly where this plane is or went down? Especially if there are verified engine updates that could be triangulated? If we truly don't know, just what are we spending billions on for defense, what are the capabilities, and what are we focusing on?

Posted by: @koenigjojo at March 18, 2014 08:09 AM (2wawf)

6 I know foul play,   when  I see it.

Posted by: Bartmann love the Cubbies at March 18, 2014 08:10 AM (VndSC)

7 Or do they just mean investigators disassembled it to remove it from the pilot's house? -- I think I read a news article that implied this - the police had disassembled it.

Posted by: votermom at March 18, 2014 08:10 AM (GSIDW)

8 So, I'm going to revert to my WHAT THE HELL meme from last week.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 08:10 AM (659DL)

9 Curiouser and curiouser.

Posted by: Insomniac at March 18, 2014 08:10 AM (DrWcr)

10 Thai military says they saw plane around time communications went down

Posted by: Unabomber at March 18, 2014 08:11 AM (e8kgV)

11 I read yesterday that they removed it from his home and reassembled it.

Posted by: Minnfidel at March 18, 2014 08:11 AM (/rlXg)

12 My understanding was that the Thai radar contact happened during the westward turn but before the Malay military's last contact. Thailand and Malaysiw share the peninsula the plane flew over, and it probably crossed near that border.

Posted by: Zombie John Gotti at March 18, 2014 08:11 AM (zT0DN)

13

I always consider Pakistan as a possible endpoint.

 

For nuclear cruise missles.

Posted by: Roy at March 18, 2014 08:12 AM (VndSC)

14 Or do they just mean investigators disassembled it to remove it from the pilot's house? Yes. Not sure why, though, if everyone had moved out of the house.

Posted by: t-bird at March 18, 2014 08:12 AM (FcR7P)

15 TFG is a SCOAMF

Posted by: votermom at March 18, 2014 08:12 AM (GSIDW)

16 Thankfully Pakistan is our ally

Posted by: RWC at March 18, 2014 08:12 AM (fWAjv)

17 But they are absolutely sure It's not terrorist related...

Posted by: hello, it's me also a creep-assed cracka.. at March 18, 2014 08:12 AM (9+ccr)

18 i just read a comment over at Gateway Pundit that there is debris field in Strait of Malacca (sp)

Posted by: kelley in virginia at March 18, 2014 08:12 AM (mgzY0)

19 Cops find five Indian Ocean practice runways in MH370 pilotÂ’s simulator, BH reports http://tinyurl.com/ondbtl3

Posted by: Tami [/i][/b][/u][/s] at March 18, 2014 08:14 AM (bCEmE)

20 Paul Ryan is being accused of being racist because he mention AEI scholar Charles Murray's name. The Left consistently refers to Charles Murray as a white nationalist and hard-core racist because he wrote the Bell Curve. Murray, of course, is anything but a racist. Retweeted by Jonah Goldberg AEIdeas Blog ‏@AEIdeas Charles Murray on allegations of racism http://www.aei-ideas.org/2014/03/charles-murray-on-allegations-of-racism/ Â…

Posted by: Costanza Defense at March 18, 2014 08:14 AM (ZPrif)

21 If we truly don't know, just what are we spending billions on for defense, what are the capabilities, and what are we focusing on? I, for one, plan to stop the waste!

Posted by: Barack Obama at March 18, 2014 08:14 AM (FcR7P)

22 i just read a comment over at Gateway Pundit that there is debris field in Strait of Malacca (sp)

Posted by: kelley in virginia at March 18, 2014 12:12 PM (mgzY0)


------


MALACCA!!!!!!


Dammit..... THATS the word I was trying to remember!!

Posted by: George Allen at March 18, 2014 08:14 AM (nELVU)

23 I sort of understand that but note that previously, evidence that these systems had been turned off at different times fueled suspicion that the plane's flightpath was deliberately altered; the new theory is that the fact that all these systems went out at the same time is evidence of deliberate action.


I'd   think    that   all systems going out at the same time would be more likely evidence   of   a catastrophic system failure   rather than deliberate action.   But what the hell do I know?   This whole situation is a cluster.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:14 AM (4df7R)

24 If the engine data kept reporting couldn't you use that to triangulate cooridinates based on which station picked it up and when or if by satellite where it was sent from by which satellite picked up the transmission and how long it took to receive?

Posted by: Jollyroger at March 18, 2014 08:14 AM (t06LC)

25 Others have been summoned.

Posted by: rickb223 at March 18, 2014 08:15 AM (xZxMD)

26 Curiouser and curiouser. Posted by: Insomniac --------------- That's exactly what I said.

Posted by: Alice at March 18, 2014 08:15 AM (aDwsi)

27 Would crashing make everything turn off at the same time?

Posted by: janetoo at March 18, 2014 08:15 AM (DVU82)

28 >>i just read a comment over at Gateway Pundit that there is debris field in Strait of Malacca Found this on a site called NST dot com. >>A twitter user, Richard Barrow, posted a satellite image of ‘a potential crash site’ and ‘possible floating seats’ on the surface of the ocean at coordinate 5°39'08.0"N 98°50'38.0"E.

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 18, 2014 08:16 AM (SUKHu)

29 >> evidence that these systems had been turned off at different times fueled suspicion that the plane's flightpath was deliberately altered That was always stupid, though.

Posted by: Andy at March 18, 2014 08:16 AM (ZZPs4)

30 Wait, the pilot had like a commercial grade flight sim? Dayum. I thought they meant he bought a copy of Microsoft Flight

Posted by: Jollyroger at March 18, 2014 08:17 AM (t06LC)

31 And India wouldn't think something amiss? ------ India admitted yesterday they're not as vigilant about the southeast as they are other areas.

Posted by: Adam at March 18, 2014 08:17 AM (Aif/5)

32 No disassemble Number Five!

Posted by: Bruce at March 18, 2014 08:17 AM (igJW1)

33 >> Or do they just mean investigators disassembled it to remove it from the pilot's house? Yes

Posted by: Andy at March 18, 2014 08:17 AM (ZZPs4)

34 Let's face it we really don't know what happened..... Maybe we should send in the NSA....

Posted by: hello, it's me also a creep-assed cracka.. at March 18, 2014 08:17 AM (9+ccr)

35 If the engine data kept reporting couldn't you use that to triangulate cooridinates based on which station picked it up and when or if by satellite where it was sent from by which satellite picked up the transmission and how long it took to receive? Posted by: Jollyroger --------------------- It is simply a signal that is received. There is no directional detection. It is the equivalent of asking if you can tell where your local radio station is located, simply by listening.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 18, 2014 08:17 AM (aDwsi)

36 Now this is where we enter the territory of a geopolitical thriller. Mr Paulson:

"Here I'm not going to name the senior person, but I was meeting with someoneÂ… This person told me that the Chinese had received a message from the Russians which was, 'Hey let's join together and sell Fannie and Freddie securities on the market.' The Chinese weren't going to do that but again, it just, it just drove home to me how vulnerable I felt until we had put Fannie and Freddie into conservatorship [the rescue plan for them, that was eventually put in place]."

For me this is pretty jaw-dropping stuff - the Chinese told Hank Paulson that the Russians were suggesting a joint pact with China to drive down the price of the debt of Fannie and Freddie, and maximize the turmoil on Wall Street - presumably with a view to maximizing the cost of the rescue for Washington and further damaging its financial health.

Paulson says this guerrilla skirmish in markets by the Russians and Chinese didn't happen.

Posted by: Frankie Goes To BBC at March 18, 2014 08:18 AM (e8kgV)

37 If we truly don't know, just what are we spending billions on for defense, what are the capabilities, and what are we focusing on?

What you don't understand is if we disclose what the capabilities are, then everybody know.  Now where's the fun in that.  Just wait until there is a bright flash over Philadelphia at 45K feet...then it will all become clear...well at least for us.

Posted by: Industrial Military Complex at March 18, 2014 08:18 AM (QGbEp)

38 Or by someone with pre-flight access to the computer. I know nothing about how these systems work, so is there routinely pre-flight access to that system by other than the pilots? Or could a Bad Guy Passenger have somehow gotten access, made the change, then taken over the plane with the new route logged in? Are there checks of the route before take off? I know a couple of pilots, though they don't pilot anything that huge, and they are all sticklers for check and recheck and then recheck the recheck. I find it hard to believe that someone could just sneak that in there without notice of someone not in on the plot.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD/Orion Death Star 2016 at March 18, 2014 08:18 AM (VtjlW)

39 A detail: they've retracted a report that the ACARS was *known* to have been shut off before the handover message and transponder shutoff. It still could have happened that way, though I don't see any reason to assume it did.

Posted by: anonymous irishman at March 18, 2014 08:18 AM (DJgfL)

40 Pilot suicide. 

Posted by: Occam's Razor at March 18, 2014 08:18 AM (DPMu1)

41 LESTER HOLT TOOK THE PLANE?

Posted by: Truck Monkey at March 18, 2014 08:18 AM (32Ze2)

42 Here's Charles Murray's response to the lastest lies by the Left, and their attempt to smear Paul Ryan: --- Since the flap about Paul RyanÂ’s remarks last week, elements of the blogosphere, and now Paul Krugman in The New York Times, have stated that I tried to prove the genetic inferiority of blacks in The Bell Curve. The position that Richard Herrnstein and I took about the role of race, IQ and genes in The Bell Curve is contained in a single paragraph in an 800-page book. It is found on page 311, and consists in its entirety of the following text: "If the reader is now convinced that either the genetic or environmental explanation has won out to the exclusion of the other, we have not done a sufficiently good job of presenting one side or the other. It seems highly likely to us that both genes and the environment have something to do with racial differences. What might the mix be? We are resolutely agnostic on that issue; as far as we can determine, the evidence does not justify an estimate." ThatÂ’s it. The four pages following that quote argue that the hysteria about race and genes is misplaced. I think our concluding paragraph (page 315) is important enough to repeat here: "In sum: If tomorrow you knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that all the cognitive differences between races were 100 percent genetic in origin, nothing of any significance should change. The knowledge would give you no reason to treat individuals differently than if ethnic differences were 100 percent environmental. By the same token, knowing that the differences are 100 percent environmental in origin would not suggest a single program or policy that is not already being tried. It would justify no optimism about the time it will take to narrow the existing gaps. It would not even justify confidence that genetically based differences will not be upon us within a few generations. The impulse to think that environmental sources of differences are less threatening than genetic ones is natural but illusory." Our sin was to openly discuss the issue, not to advocate a position. But for the last 40 years, thatÂ’s been sin enough. IÂ’ll be happy to respond at more length to allegations of racism made by anyone who can buttress them with a direct quote from anything IÂ’ve written. IÂ’ll leave you with this thought: in all the critiques of The Bell Curve in particular and my work more generally, no one ever accompanies their charges with direct quotes of what IÂ’ve actually said. ThereÂ’s a reason for that.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at March 18, 2014 08:19 AM (ZPrif)

43 Has anyone blamed globull warming yet? An extreme weather event could have addled both pilots to the point of not wanting to pollute mother gaia's atmosphere anymore so they intentionally crashed the plane.

It is possible, right?

Posted by: GMB (et al) at March 18, 2014 08:19 AM (nkPV9)

44 40 Pilot suicide.

Posted by: Occam's Razor at March 18, 2014 12:18 PM (DPMu1)

 

There's a shit-ton of other, easier ways to kill yourself.

Posted by: Insomniac at March 18, 2014 08:19 AM (DrWcr)

45 Now, this automobile seems quite complex. I'm guessing it would take some special training to pilot one of these. Perhaps...a college degree, hmm?

Posted by: Ronan Farrow at March 18, 2014 08:19 AM (0cMkb)

46 When this first happened, some commenter here said that something "Big" was going on in the country that Friday, and that this disappearance/crash was going to divert attention away from whatever it was. And that as awful as the disappearance/crash was, the authorities were probably a bit relieved that it had happened at the same time, because it meant that the streets weren't going to erupt in protests. But I've never heard anything else about that - anyone have a clue what I'm talking about? Someone also mentioned that one of the pilots was a fan of the person involved in the "scandal" - don't know if the two are related or not, and the Malaysian government has been keeping a lid on the possible political/religious implications of the whole thing. I don't follow Malaysian news, so I don't have the first clue what the big "scandal" was. Anybody else know what was going on at the time this happened?

Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX (@Teresa_Koch) at March 18, 2014 08:20 AM (PZ6/M)

47 Pilot suicide. Posted by: Occam's Razor at March 18, 2014 12:18 PM (DPMu1) You and O'Reilly believe that..... Could be, but why did it take 5 hours to do it?

Posted by: hello, it's me also a creep-assed cracka.. at March 18, 2014 08:20 AM (9+ccr)

48 Has anyone blamed globull warming yet? An extreme weather event could have addled both pilots to the point of not wanting to pollute mother gaia's atmosphere anymore so they intentionally crashed the plane.



It is possible, right?


Posted by: GMB (et al) at March 18, 2014 12:19 PM (nkPV9)




Who was it last week who    mentioned some moonbat on a message board   positing that a strong   updraft of warm air may have     pushed the   plane   into outer space?

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:21 AM (4df7R)

49 "Wait, the pilot had like a commercial grade flight sim?"

No. He had ordinary consumer grade off the shelf hardware and software.

An elaborate rig with multiple big monitors, and some items made to look and work like 777 flight deck controls, but all of it is stuff which you could order up today if you wanted it.

There's a pretty big flight sim community out there, and it's not uncommon for people to dump a lot of money on the hobby.

Posted by: torquewrench at March 18, 2014 08:21 AM (gqT4g)

50 Just read the New Straits Times article about the debris field.

It comes down to crowdsourced review of satellite imagery showed something might be there.
Ships at that location to investigate have found nothing so far.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at March 18, 2014 08:21 AM (si68n)

51 Has anyone blamed globull warming yet? An extreme weather event could have addled both pilots to the point of not wanting to pollute mother gaia's atmosphere anymore so they intentionally crashed the plane.

It is possible, right?

Posted by: GMB (et al) at March 18, 2014 12:19 PM (nkPV9)


------


well..... there was that wanker that suggested a huge updraft **could** have lifted the 777 into a low earth orbit.


Flight 370 is just stuck in space.

Posted by: George Allen at March 18, 2014 08:21 AM (nELVU)

52 I don't follow Malaysian news, so I don't have the first clue what the big "scandal" was. Anybody else know what was going on at the time this happened? Some Malaysian gubmint official was convicted of being ghey, the pilot attended the trial and was said to be upset about the verdict.

Posted by: Citizen X at March 18, 2014 08:21 AM (7ObY1)

53 Pilot suicide.

Posted by: Occam's Razor at March 18, 2014 12:18 PM (DPMu1)



You and O'Reilly believe that..... Could be, but why did it take 5 hours to do it?

Posted by: hello, it's me also a creep-assed cracka.. at March 18, 2014 12:20 PM (9+ccr)



And why decrease altitude, if that is in fact what happened?   



Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:22 AM (4df7R)

54 You and O'Reilly believe that..... Could be, but why did it take 5 hours to do it? Posted by: hello, it's me also a creep-assed cracka.


A smoke, a couple of drinks, and one last Fap?

Posted by: Bruce at March 18, 2014 08:22 AM (igJW1)

55 Okay, so some Reddit and Twitter peeps used crowd sourcing to look at sat. maps for wreckage. One of the pics I found says "Google Earth" so I don't actually know if they are looking at a map from the last week...hopefully they aren't that dumb...

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 18, 2014 08:22 AM (SUKHu)

56
ugg.... note to self.... change your socks....

Posted by: fixerupper at March 18, 2014 08:22 AM (nELVU)

57 New information has revealed that there was a pot of monkey face orchids in the cockpit at the time of take-off. Case closed.

Posted by: naturalfake at March 18, 2014 08:22 AM (0cMkb)

58 Posted by: @koenigjojo at March 18, 2014 12:09 PM (2wawf) The world is a very very LARGE place. Heck, the US Navy RELIES on being able to hide... we play huge war games based on hiding entire fleets from each other. No one has worldwide coverage... it would cost way to much, and be way to intrusive... And then of course, Military ships can't even turn their powerful Radars on to full power within Miles of the Coast... because it could mess with civilian electronics... Its Hubris to think we can cover the entire world... or even that other countries would LET us.

Posted by: Romeo13 at March 18, 2014 08:23 AM (84gbM)

59 Heh. From The Onion. http://tinyurl.com/madmd2a

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 08:23 AM (659DL)

60 As I stated last night, I'm going full UFO on this. It's easier than dealing with great heaps of speculation, second guessing, and dart throwing. U.F.O.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 18, 2014 08:23 AM (aDwsi)

61 All I know is that Jet Blue has a TV at every seat. Love it

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 18, 2014 08:23 AM (t3UFN)

62 "Who was it last week who mentioned some moonbat on a message board positing that a strong updraft of warm air may have pushed the plane into outer space?"

I had relayed that.

I then read through a back list of comments by that individual. Very, very leftist.

Posted by: torquewrench at March 18, 2014 08:24 AM (gqT4g)

63 how close does one have to be to the black box to hear it?

Posted by: kelley in virginia at March 18, 2014 08:24 AM (mgzY0)

64 Pilot suicide.


Posted by: Occam's Razor at March 18, 2014 12:18 PM (DPMu1)

----

Because all pilots try to crash their planes into the moon.   The plane went to 45000 ft.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 18, 2014 08:24 AM (nELVU)

65 60 As I stated last night, I'm going full UFO on this. It's easier than dealing with great heaps of speculation, second guessing, and dart throwing. U.F.O. Yeah, Maybe Farrakhans Mother ship picked them up...

Posted by: hello, it's me also a creep-assed cracka.. at March 18, 2014 08:24 AM (9+ccr)

66 22:  Given that the plane kept pinging the Inmarsats sp? for 5-7 hours after dropping out of contact in Malaysia, a debris field there could mean something seriously evil,  or just random debris that a boat dumped if one's mind didn't jump to fantastic scenarios like mine does. 

Posted by: PaleRider at March 18, 2014 08:25 AM (5CusZ)

67

Here's Charles Murray's response to the lastest lies by the Left, and their attempt to smear Paul Ryan:



The 1990's were the hey day of Big Liberal Media Lying, from misreporting what "The Bell Curve" actually stated, to an alleged wave of black church burnings that statistically never happened, to calling government program reductions in the rate of spending growth as "cuts".

The Demunist Mole Media was still running on Watergate prestige fumes, Fox News had yet to appear on cable, and bloggers had yet to take the mole media apart.

Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 18, 2014 08:25 AM (GsebS)

68

I fly planes into China all the time.  Oh.  And Russia.

 

/jwest

Posted by: Washington Nearsider at March 18, 2014 08:25 AM (fwARV)

69 >>Has anyone blamed globull warming yet? Well, duh. With the oceans rising and the pilot flying below 5000 feet, what do you expect???

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 18, 2014 08:25 AM (SUKHu)

70 "One of the pics I found says "Google Earth" so I don't actually know if they are looking at a map from the last week...hopefully they aren't that dumb..."

Let's look at Diego Garcia in Google Maps.
I bet the plane is stashed there.

Posted by: Moonbat Detective #7 at March 18, 2014 08:25 AM (si68n)

71 how close does one have to be to the black box to hear it? Posted by: kelley in virginia

Usually ya smell em long before ya hear em.

Posted by: Bruce at March 18, 2014 08:25 AM (igJW1)

72 how close does one have to be to the black box to hear it? Posted by: kelley ----------------------- Is this a setup for some kind of raaaaacist joke?

Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 18, 2014 08:26 AM (aDwsi)

73 Obama disappeared it so we would have something to talk about besides the public ass fucking he is getting from the Russians.

Posted by: the guy that moves pianos for a living... at March 18, 2014 08:26 AM (5REbo)

74 Darn, I had to think my gibberish over again. If the were climate change fanatics they would have crashed as soon as they could and they would have crashed in an area that was very populated.

mother gaia would have approved of the population reduction.

Posted by: GMB (et al) at March 18, 2014 08:26 AM (nkPV9)

75 This is OT, and I know it's a bit early in the thread for that, but I want to make sure the Horde sees it.   I posted it at the    very tail end of the Headlines thread, too.



If y'all are ever in Clemson, SC, don't visit Backstreet's Pub and Grill.      The owner believes you are douchebags.




TWITCHY:     http://tinyurl.com/qz7d3px



Plenty of other fine   watering holes out there.    I recommend y'all   frequent them instead.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:26 AM (4df7R)

76 It is simply a signal that is received. There is no directional detection. It is the equivalent of asking if you can tell where your local radio station is located, simply by listening. Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 18, 2014 12:17 PM (aDwsi) Well that's not exactly the same though. With enough knowledge of the broadcaster, the receiver and various points regarding signal strength you can get a fairly rough estimate of where you radio station is broadcasting from. Hell, you don't even need to know that. I used to listen to a station that I could only get near my parents house and weakly. Given my travel I knew this meant it had to be broadcasting from the "southwest" generally. And when I finally heard it's signals, I was right, it broadcasts from a smaller town southwest of here.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (No Really!) at March 18, 2014 08:26 AM (HDwDg)

77 Neither pilot comes across as a religious nut. And the young pilot had a hot girlfriend.

Posted by: The Yellow Pug at March 18, 2014 08:26 AM (r7mtu)

78 If the engine data kept reporting couldn't you use that to triangulate cooridinates based on which station picked it up and when or if by satellite where it was sent from by which satellite picked up the transmission and how long it took to receive? Posted by: Jollyroger at March 18, 2014 12:14 PM (t06LC) The satellite data only tells them two things. First, the response has a unique identifier for the particular airplane. Second, it tells what the angle is between the plane and the satellite. In this case, it was 40 degrees which gave them the two arcs that have been prominently displayed.

Posted by: Zombie John Gotti at March 18, 2014 08:26 AM (zT0DN)

79 18 That report seems to be a few days old though. Here's a similar one from Sunday: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3133830/posts . If either had really shaken out I think the investigators and media would be all over the area by now (even allowing for typical levels of sluggishness or incompetence).

Posted by: anonymous irishman at March 18, 2014 08:26 AM (DJgfL)

80

Apparently villagers in the Maldives are now saying "oh, yeah.  A big jumbo jet flew really low over us the day that plane disappeared". 

 

Or at least now we're hearing that they're saying it.

Posted by: Frumious Bandersnatch at March 18, 2014 08:27 AM (JtwS4)

81 59 Mwahahahaha

Posted by: votermom at March 18, 2014 08:27 AM (GSIDW)

82 so lester, show me on the simulator, where the bad man touched his airplane.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 08:27 AM (rDidD)

83 It is simply a signal that is received. There is no directional detection. It is the equivalent of asking if you can tell where your local radio station is located, simply by listening.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 18, 2014 12:17 PM (aDwsi)

 

Yes, but it may be determinable about which station received the signal first in the case of recovery by more than one station. If there are multiple stations receiving the data, its as easy as recording the times intercepted by all and then plotting. No extra data needed.

Posted by: Jollyroger at March 18, 2014 08:28 AM (t06LC)

84 I think it was Twitchy that had a post about some amateur pilot that thinks that this flight 'shadowed' another 777 heading out over India towards Afghanistan/Pakistan.  IOW, flew close enough to the other aircraft to only show one blip on radar, and using the other plane's transponder signal.

But, who really knows.

Posted by: CUS at March 18, 2014 08:28 AM (wcLJG)

85 Okay there's a site with sat images that people were using and I'll click on it to see how up to date it is... >>Something's not quite right... >>Tomnod is experiencing technical difficulties. We apologize. We're poking our servers with pointy sticks to figure out what's wrong. >>We will collect new DigitalGlobe satellite images today and hope to have them online as soon as possible. Please check back soon. This proves something...

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 18, 2014 08:28 AM (SUKHu)

86
Yes, but it may be determinable about which station received the signal first in the case of recovery by more than one station. If there are multiple stations receiving the data, its as easy as recording the times intercepted by all and then plotting. No extra data needed.

Posted by: Jollyroger at March 18, 2014 12:28 PM (t06LC)



Clearly you have never      experienced    Common Core  math.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:29 AM (4df7R)

87 Wow, a wannabe-pilot interviewed by a wannabe-reporter.

Posted by: aka.john at March 18, 2014 08:29 AM (zPa3K)

88 With the oceans rising and the pilot flying below 5000 feet, what do you expect

-----


I dont get all the hype about flying at 5000 feet.   Over open ocean thats almost a mile up.

Surely it cant be THAT hard to do.   Some of the talking bobble heads make it sound like nap of the earth piloting.   500 feet???  Yeah.... hard in jet liner.  But a mile up???

Posted by: fixerupper at March 18, 2014 08:29 AM (nELVU)

89 Posted by: Mama AJ at March 18, 2014 12:28 PM (SUKHu) Yeah it proves Digiglobe isn't ready for the big leagues yet. Nothing surprises me about that.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (No Really!) at March 18, 2014 08:30 AM (HDwDg)

90

@86

This is true.

Posted by: Jollyroger at March 18, 2014 08:30 AM (t06LC)

91

Can I raise one question?  How in the fuck after fucking 9-11, do we lose a fucking 777?   This is a MASSIVE plane.

 

WHO IS RUNNING THIS CLOWN SHOW???  I mean, how would this even be possible??   Would we ever let these HUGE planes in our air space w/out some backup pretty damn foolproof method to track them??

 

Final point, I fly on private jets sometimes.  You simply park your car in the hangar, jump in, and you're off.  No security, no check, nada.  Which is awesome.  But folks, a 777 can take down a skyscraper.  How are these not tracked at all times??

Posted by: prescient11 at March 18, 2014 08:30 AM (tVTLU)

92 Surely it cant be THAT hard to do. Some of the talking bobble heads make it sound like nap of the earth piloting. 500 feet??? Yeah.... hard in jet liner. But a mile up???

Posted by: fixerupper at March 18, 2014 12:29 PM (nELVU)



Is it that it's hard to do?   Or nonsensical?   From waht I've heard,   flying that low   for that long     in a plane that large is murder on fuel.    Why do it?

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:30 AM (4df7R)

93 one aviation guy said on FNC that the black box sent signals for 30 days only. & I seem to remember something about 2 miles. so if the plane is 1 mile deep in the water, then searchers would have to be literally on top of it to "hear" the black box signal

Posted by: kelley in virginia at March 18, 2014 08:30 AM (mgzY0)

94 If it was hijacked, the Absence of Cellphone Calls From Missing FlightÂ’s Passengers tells us, what?

Posted by: Jay in PA at March 18, 2014 08:30 AM (3LaGb)

95 debris field Then again, they have to tear the seats out anyways if it's to carry cargo...

Posted by: t-bird at March 18, 2014 08:31 AM (FcR7P)

96 Who was it last week who mentioned some moonbat on a message board positing that a strong updraft of warm air may have pushed the plane into outer space? Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit at March 18, 2014 12:21 PM (4df7R) Great. Googly. Moogly. Beside, it's obvious that this is what happened: http://youtu.be/jBizgLZX7W0 (That's the Megashark eating the plane clip)

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD/Orion Death Star 2016 at March 18, 2014 08:31 AM (VtjlW)

97 Plane crashed into the ocean and sank into one of those deep water heat sinks and melted without a trace. So yeah, global warming.

Posted by: RWC at March 18, 2014 08:31 AM (fWAjv)

98 77 To triangulate you'd need two satellites picking up the signal (or one satellite plus some other observation). MH370 was evidently only visible to one INMARSAT satellite when the last SATCOM ping was sent. (Not surprising as as INMARSAT's not designed as a geolocation system like GPS or GLONASS.) They're doing pretty well to be able to figure out the distance from the satellite.

Posted by: anonymous irishman at March 18, 2014 08:32 AM (DJgfL)

99

But it's very awkward and strange to watch Farrow ask some dumb questions about what is, anything beyond his telemprompter.

 

FIFY

 

 

 

 

Posted by: rd at March 18, 2014 08:32 AM (D+lxs)

100 Posted by: @koenigjojo at March 18, 2014 12:09 PM (2wawf) Regardless of how this turns out, or what happened, a lot of people are learning a lot about what our capabilities and limitations are.

Posted by: Chillin the most at March 18, 2014 08:32 AM (gxtMZ)

101 I blame Bush.

Posted by: Steve in Greensboro at March 18, 2014 08:32 AM (bbivj)

102 Did the pilots have the steak or the fish?

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at March 18, 2014 08:32 AM (8ZskC)

103 If it was hijacked, the Absence of Cellphone Calls From Missing FlightÂ’s Passengers tells us, what? Posted by: Jay in PA at March 18, 2014 12:30 PM (3LaGb) That whoever higjacked it either a) has good opsec or b) doesn't care much about life. If that's the case neither of those options are good.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (No Really!) at March 18, 2014 08:32 AM (HDwDg)

104 Oh: Farrow keeps asking Holt if it's "suspicious" that a pilot should own a flight simulator. This is not a dumb question, but it is a stupid question to ask Holt. Holt is not an expert or a pilot capable of offering an opinion on this question. He's just a reporter who owns a flight simulator, period. -- Brainfart Antiterrorism Insecurity: Hold Holt suspect for owning a flight simulator. Flight Simulators are the new taboo items to own, alongside firearms, etc. Get SWATted if you're not careful, or even if you are as good as good can be.

Posted by: panzernashorn at March 18, 2014 08:32 AM (/vO0r)

105 If it was hijacked, the Absence of Cellphone Calls From Missing FlightÂ’s Passengers tells us, what? They were over the ocean, where there are no cell towers?

Posted by: t-bird at March 18, 2014 08:32 AM (FcR7P)

106 92 Flying low over land could be way to hide, assuming the terrain has enough features to confuse the radar.

Posted by: votermom at March 18, 2014 08:32 AM (GSIDW)

107 94 If it was hijacked, the Absence of Cellphone Calls From Missing FlightÂ’s Passengers tells us, what?

Posted by: Jay in PA at March 18, 2014 12:30 PM (3LaGb)

 

Crash or someplace with no cell phone tower reception, or the hijacker took all the phones away by force. How close do they check pilot's bags for weapons?

Posted by: Jollyroger at March 18, 2014 08:32 AM (t06LC)

108 If it was hijacked, the Absence of Cellphone Calls From Missing FlightÂ’s Passengers tells us, what?

Posted by: Jay in PA at March 18, 2014 12:30 PM (3LaGb)



That the hijackers were somehow able to get  all phones, laptops, and other wifi-equipped     devices from all 240 passengers   simultaneously,   before anyone had a chance to send off even a hurried text,   call,   email   or Tweet.      That's somewhat hard to believe.    Not that I know the    wifi capabilities of a 777 flying between Malaysia and China.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:33 AM (4df7R)

109 Yes, but it may be determinable about which station received the signal first in the case of recovery by more than one station. If there are multiple stations receiving the data, its as easy as recording the times intercepted by all and then plotting. No extra data needed. Posted by: Jollyroger ------------------------------- No. The 'signals' are traveling at the speed of light. To detect the difference of "time received" at point A vs. point B would require very sophisticated time keeping in the Sats, as well as very sophisticated receiving/recording equipment. It isn't that it could not be done..., it's just that it is highly impractical.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 18, 2014 08:33 AM (aDwsi)

110 Yes, but it may be determinable about which station received the signal first in the case of recovery by more than one station. If there are multiple stations receiving the data, its as easy as recording the times intercepted by all and then plotting. No extra data needed. Posted by: Jollyroger if you are referring to the acars data pingng on the inmarsat, there is only one satellite involved so no triangulation possible, at least as is publicly disclosed.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 08:34 AM (rDidD)

111 Wait. What? There's a plane missing?

Posted by: wacky-five at March 18, 2014 08:34 AM (wAQA5)

112 Since when do non-pilots have access to flight simulators? Why, this is an outrage!

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at March 18, 2014 08:34 AM (8ZskC)

113 t-bird,
So do you think it crashed or all the passengers were killed (or had their phones taken) before it landed?

I personally think this plane is in the ocean somewhere.

Posted by: Jay in PA at March 18, 2014 08:34 AM (3LaGb)

114 if by satellite where it was sent from by which satellite picked up the transmission and how long it took to receive? Posted by: Jollyroger at March 18, 2014 12:14 PM (t06LC) Most commercial Sats are not that sophisticated... they don't track where a signal was received from, or even the lag it took from transmission to receipt (as that would take a time stamped message, and would have to have a common time sources down to the micro second....). So, for the most part, we know the Satellite footprint (where it can receive signals from)... and that it got something... but that's about it... UNLESS the data itself has some information in it...

Posted by: Romeo13 at March 18, 2014 08:34 AM (84gbM)

115 Maldives link: http://bit.ly/1dlBzS8

Posted by: Frumious Bandersnatch at March 18, 2014 08:34 AM (JtwS4)

116 I think THE QUESTION IS? Is is suspicious that an Ewok has a blog?

Posted by: Nip Sip at March 18, 2014 08:34 AM (0FSuD)

117 I just watched some program on the storms that hit the UK. They showed these pilots trying to land with these wind gusts. I would have been screaming my head off. The plane goes up down left right - really scary shit.

Posted by: The Yellow Pug at March 18, 2014 08:34 AM (r7mtu)

118 Able leaders anticipate events, prepare for them, and act in time to shape them. My career in business and politics has exposed me to scores of people in leadership positions, only a few of whom actually have these qualities. Some simply cannot envision the future and are thus unpleasantly surprised when it arrives. Some simply hope for the best. Others succumb to analysis paralysis, weighing trends and forecasts and choices beyond the time of opportunity.

President Obama and Secretary of State Clinton traveled the world in pursuit of their promise to reset relations and to build friendships across the globe. Their failure has been painfully evident: It is hard to name even a single country that has more respect and admiration for America today than when President Obama took office, and now Russia is in Ukraine. Part of their failure, I submit, is due to their failure to act when action was possible, and needed.

Posted by: Mitt Romney's temporal twin (Star Trek "The Enemy Within") at March 18, 2014 08:34 AM (e8kgV)

119 Regardless of how this turns out, or what happened, a lot of people are learning a lot about what our capabilities and limitations are. Posted by: Chillin the most at March 18, 2014 12:32 PM (gxtMZ) And that includes as well... 1) timing of info released for public knowledge: how do people respond to being kept in the dark on purpose. 2) info withheld long enough for people to believe whatever is released as (if) fact when finally "news" is broadcast.

Posted by: panzernashorn at March 18, 2014 08:35 AM (/vO0r)

120 Seems like this is the part of the world that is littered with Super Villain Secret Volcano Lairs, no?

Posted by: garrett at March 18, 2014 08:35 AM (gda7y)

121 Yeah, Maybe Farrakhans Mother ship picked them up... I blame George...Clinton

Posted by: Citizen X at March 18, 2014 08:35 AM (7ObY1)

122

YOU LAUGHED AT MY FINALE, BUT WHO'S LAUGHING NOW?

 

Whiney little bitches. I told you everything in the show had a logical explanation. See, this really can happen in real life. The whole plane is in purgatory in a church or something. Fuck. I need more lens flare.

Posted by: J.J. Abrams at March 18, 2014 08:35 AM (t06LC)

123 Well, Paul Ryan is being forced to meet with the Congressional Black Caucus to try an expurgate his sin of mentioning Charles Murray's name. The Left is doing a coordinated demonization of Ryan right now that the Right is ignoring. There is no push back against it. Just as there's no pushback against calling Charles Murray a white nationalist. Cause nobody important on the Right wants to be seen as defending the Bell Curve. The Left is selling this as -- Paul Ryan Praises Notorious White Nationalist. The Right is mainly ignoring this coordinated attack, hoping it blows over and gets mostly lost in the missing plane and Crimea stories. But there's extremely little pushback and saying that the smears against Ryan and Murray are race-baiting lies.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at March 18, 2014 08:36 AM (ZPrif)

124 I forget who the commentator was, but the guy pointed out that if you want a large commercial jet for nefarious activities, you don't have to go through all the trouble of hijacking one, there are thousands of them sitting around that can be stolen.

I think it crashed.

Posted by: Jay in PA at March 18, 2014 08:36 AM (3LaGb)

125 That the hijackers were somehow able to get all phones, laptops, and other wifi-equipped devices from all 240 passengers simultaneously, before anyone had a chance to send off even a hurried text, call, email or Tweet. That's somewhat hard to believe. Not that I know the wifi capabilities of a 777 flying between Malaysia and China. Posted by: MWR ------------------- Why are you assuming that there was, what?, cell phone service. They were hundreds of miles from any sort of service.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 18, 2014 08:36 AM (aDwsi)

126 Maldives link: http://bit.ly/1dlBzS8


The Argentinians.  I always thought it would be Clemenza.

Posted by: Tom Hagen at March 18, 2014 08:36 AM (8ZskC)

127 Meh, it's common knowledge that a good number of professional pilots (though by no means all) play PC flight simulators sometimes, to get some extra practise or just for recreation. Holt may not be an expert witness but he ought to know enough to answer that.

Posted by: anonymous irishman at March 18, 2014 08:36 AM (DJgfL)

128 >> That the hijackers were somehow able to get all phones, laptops, and other wifi-equipped devices from all 240 passengers simultaneously OTOH, if they just depressurized the cabin and killed all the passengers ...

Posted by: Andy at March 18, 2014 08:36 AM (GYX1g)

129 No. The 'signals' are traveling at the speed of light. To detect the difference of "time received" at point A vs. point B would require very sophisticated time keeping in the Sats, as well as very sophisticated receiving/recording equipment. It isn't that it could not be done..., it's just that it is highly impractical. Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 18, 2014 12:33 PM (aDwsi) You clearly have no idea how GPS actually works. (Not that this was GPS obviously, but that principle is common among satellites.)

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (No Really!) at March 18, 2014 08:36 AM (HDwDg)

130 It would be nice if that Tomnod site allowed you to put in coordinates....or does it and I just don't know how to do it?

Posted by: Tami [/i][/b][/u][/s] at March 18, 2014 08:36 AM (bCEmE)

131 Oh: Farrow keeps asking Holt if it's "suspicious" that a pilot should own a flight simulator. This is not a dumb question, but it is a stupid question to ask Holt. Holt is not an expert or a pilot capable of offering an opinion on this question. He's just a reporter who owns a flight simulator, period. -- Brainfart Antiterrorism Insecurity: Hold Holt suspect for owning a flight simulator. Flight Simulators are the new taboo items to own, alongside firearms, etc. Get SWATted if you're not careful, or even if you are as good as good can be. Posted by: panzernashorn well hold on now, holt and gregory are members of special class, magazines, flight training simulators, no problem.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 08:36 AM (rDidD)

132 i just read a comment over at Gateway Pundit that there is debris field in Strait of Malacca (sp) Posted by: kelley in virginia at March 18, 2014 12:12 PM (mgzY0) If true, it means that the plane disappeared right about where the last contact was lost, suggesting that in the choice between malice and incompetence, the latter wins yet again.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 18, 2014 08:36 AM (SY2Kh)

133 is suspicious that an Ewok has a blog? -- Reminds me - Lando was on dancing with the stars last night. I think there were ewoks in the audience.

Posted by: votermom at March 18, 2014 08:37 AM (GSIDW)

134 112 Wait. What? There's a plane missing? Posted by: wacky-five at March 18, 2014 12:34 PM (wAQA5) Yeah. I caught a bit of it when I was waiting for breaking news about some new healthcare law.

Posted by: RWC at March 18, 2014 08:37 AM (fWAjv)

135 That's somewhat hard to believe. Not that I know the wifi capabilities of a 777 flying between Malaysia and China.
===
The NYT posted an article that states the 777 had wi-fi capability for business class.  It also said that the wi-fi could be disabled by the flight crew.

Posted by: mrp at March 18, 2014 08:37 AM (JBggj)

136 >> They were hundreds of miles from any sort of service. Yup. Next time you're at 35,000 feet, try using your cell phone.

Posted by: Andy at March 18, 2014 08:37 AM (GYX1g)

137 Found this linked the comments over at hot air by a pilot named Chris Goodfellow. Since I usually go with Occam razor with most events this analysis makes a lot of sense but sense doesn't sell newspapers or increase ratings.
Here is a bit from Chris's post:
The left turn is the key here. This was a very experienced senior Captain with 18,000 hours. Maybe some of the younger pilots interviewed on CNN didn't pick up on this left turn. We old pilots were always drilled to always know the closest airport of safe harbor while in cruise. Airports behind us, airports abeam us and airports ahead of us. Always in our head. Always. Because if something happens you don't want to be thinking what are you going to do - you already know what you are going to do. Instinctively when I saw that left turn with a direct heading I knew he was heading for an airport. Actually he was taking a direct route to Palau Langkawi a 13,000 foot strip with an approach over water at night with no obstacles. He did not turn back to Kuala  Lampur because he knew he had 8,000 foot ridges to cross. He knew the terrain was friendlier towards Langkawi and also a shorter distance.

Entire post http://tinyurl.com/o43lpfx

Posted by: Frank at March 18, 2014 08:37 AM (7Nabg)

138 They showed these pilots trying to land with these wind gusts. I would have been screaming my head off. The plane goes up down left right - really scary shit.

Posted by: The Yellow Pug at March 18, 2014 12:34 PM (r7mtu)


----



heh.... reminds me of landing at Denvers old Stapleton Airport.   Bummmmppy descent .....

Posted by: fixerupper at March 18, 2014 08:37 AM (nELVU)

139 So do you think it crashed or all the passengers were killed (or had their phones taken) before it landed? Everything is so unlikely that I don't know what to think.

Posted by: t-bird at March 18, 2014 08:37 AM (FcR7P)

140 How far could a 777 glide after it's engines are turned off? This could be the work of some very environmentally conscientious fanatical  new branch of alqueda on gaia group.


Posted by: GMB (et al) at March 18, 2014 08:37 AM (nkPV9)

141 Someone check e-Bay.
Is anyone offering a used 777 for sale?


Just sort of spitballin' here.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at March 18, 2014 08:37 AM (si68n)

142 Why are you assuming that there was, what?, cell phone service. They were hundreds of miles from any sort of service.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 18, 2014 12:36 PM (aDwsi)



I'm not.  That's why I said  I'm not familiar with the    wifi services of a 777   on that   flight path.      We've already established   that there aren't    any cell towers   in the middle of the ocean.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:38 AM (4df7R)

143 It was reported on FNC this morning that while pretty much every other country in the region has agreed to reveal data from their radar, Pakistan has not.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 18, 2014 08:38 AM (DmNpO)

144 I can hear Mooch's black box for miles and miles. That's why I keep sending her halfway around the world.

Posted by: King Barry at March 18, 2014 08:38 AM (YmPwQ)

145 >>If it was hijacked, the Absence of Cellphone Calls From Missing FlightÂ’s Passengers tells us, what? Pilot went up high enough to kill everyone, if he disabled their oxygen masks while keeping his working. Cell phone jammer kept the phones from working until... --the plane crashed --the plane was met with enough people with weapons to kill everyone I think the absence of calls means they are dead.

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 18, 2014 08:38 AM (SUKHu)

146 Since Ed says Pakistan, I'll play his devil's advocate. Flight 370's pre-programmed WESTWARD course directs to Somalia as easily as to any other destination. If Somalia, easily blame the Saudis who, btw, WERE the 9/11/01 culprits. Fool us once, shame on us.

Posted by: panzernashorn at March 18, 2014 08:39 AM (/vO0r)

147 144 I can hear Mooch's black box for miles and miles. That's why I keep sending her halfway around the world. The queef that roared.

Posted by: Citizen X at March 18, 2014 08:39 AM (7ObY1)

148 Is is suspicious that an Ewok has a blog? Suspicious or pathetic? I keed, furry jefe, I keed.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 08:39 AM (659DL)

149 143 It was reported on FNC this morning that while pretty much every other country in the region has agreed to reveal data from their radar, Pakistan has not. -- That's not suspicious at all.

Posted by: votermom at March 18, 2014 08:39 AM (GSIDW)

150

Wow, a wannabe-pilot interviewed by a wannabe-reporter.

 

 

This should be on Vox.

Posted by: Klein and Yglesias at March 18, 2014 08:39 AM (BAS5M)

151 "Stop and think of our amazing satellite and radar capabilities. Many used for early detection of ICBMs."

The US doesn't have global radar coverage.

The US has global satellite coverage with certain types of satellite, which may not necessarily be suitable for spotting a missing airliner.

Someone proposed that the satellites which look for the flashes of nuclear bomb detonations would spot the airliner exploding in flight, if it had exploded in flight.

Actually unlikely. There is filter logic on those satellites which looks for the very characteristic "double flash" from a nuke (I won't get into the physics) so that an alert doesn't go out from every single lightning bolt in the satellite's field of regard.

Someone else the other day suggested that space-based radar would be awfully useful in these circumstances. Yes! Absolutely! It would be awfully useful for many other military and civilian tasks, too. And it has been a longstanding proposal.

Unfortunately, space radar has gotten the financial rug pulled out from under it. It was on USAF's wish list for a while, but the cost overruns in the F-35 program have eaten all the money.

Posted by: torquewrench at March 18, 2014 08:40 AM (gqT4g)

152 That Ronan Farrow video is so embarrassing that I couldn't watch all the way through. Comments about how it easy it is to do certain things based upon moving the mouse or touchpad. Ridiculous.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 18, 2014 08:40 AM (DmNpO)

153 94 If it was hijacked, the Absence of Cellphone Calls From Missing FlightÂ’s Passengers tells us, what?
Posted by: Jay in PA at March 18, 2014 12:30 PM (3LaGb)

Crash or someplace with no cell phone tower reception, or the hijacker took all the phones away by force. How close do they check pilot's bags for weapons?

Posted by: Jollyroger

Again, simplest answer -> no one suspected a problem until too late and no cell coverage. The original flight was to take 6 hours. It's not like people were thinking "It's been three hours and I haven't seen my grandpap's home in Shenzhen. WFT! Storm the cockpit!!!!"

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:40 AM (ligos)

154 Posted by: Jollyroger Nope.... unless they are using something like a Cesium beam time standard... they would not be able to synchronize the time of receipt of an individual data packet enough to be able to figure out the difference in time received... That a huge increase in complexity for a commercial system that is only there to pass on data... Could they do that??? sure, technically possible if designed into the system... but would be WAY expensive for something you might use 'once', if there is a Mysterious Aircraft Disappearance.

Posted by: Romeo13 at March 18, 2014 08:40 AM (84gbM)

155 I think it is not so much that the pilot had a simulator which concerns people but that he had an assault simulator, automatic even.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 08:40 AM (rDidD)

156 >>Oh: Farrow keeps asking Holt if it's "suspicious" that a pilot should own a flight simulator. Neither of them are suspicious that they are mucking up a cable news simulator, so whaddaya expect?

Posted by: ontherocks at March 18, 2014 08:41 AM (XPHw/)

157 Is it "suspicious" that Ronan Farrow has his own television show?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at March 18, 2014 08:41 AM (4vQmk)

158 125 They did fly over Malaysia though. If anyone had their phone on (as a phone, not just in "airplane mode") at that point, cell towers all over Malaysia and Thailand could have picked it up. There are several reasons why that might not have happened though.

Posted by: anonymous irishman at March 18, 2014 08:41 AM (DJgfL)

159 Mmmm I like box,,, black or otherwise,,,,

Posted by: Hillary Clinton at March 18, 2014 08:41 AM (GjPnA)

160 The Argentinians. I always thought it would be Clemenza The Maldives are nowhere near Argentina

Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 18, 2014 08:41 AM (SY2Kh)

161 I'm not. That's why I said I'm not familiar with the wifi services of a 777 on that flight path. We've already established that there aren't any cell towers in the middle of the ocean. Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit at March 18, 2014 12:38 PM (4df7R) I dunno about the specific wifi services of this plane, but I do know that the wifi service on most of the planes I've flown on can be turned off by someone on the plane (I dunno if it's pilot controlled of steward controlled.) So if you wanted to spitball it wouldn't be that hard to suggest that they turned that off too.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (No Really!) at March 18, 2014 08:41 AM (HDwDg)

162 Just do a google news search on Paul Ryan's name, the NYT is leading the racism charges. You might not see these stories if you mainly read right-wing news sources -- but everybody else is seeing these stories. NYT, CNN, HuffPo, Slate, Salon, all the left-wing blogs, of course.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at March 18, 2014 08:41 AM (ZPrif)

163 Lester Holt plays the bass guitar. Like a certain corpulent pony-tailed failed jazz musician many of us know and loathe.

Posted by: Citizen X at March 18, 2014 08:42 AM (7ObY1)

164 for his next show ronan is showing off new retail laser scanning machines.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 08:42 AM (rDidD)

165 >>Actually he was taking a direct route to Palau Langkawi a 13,000 foot strip with an approach over water at night with no obstacles. Which is at the northern end of the Malacca Strait. Hmm.

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 18, 2014 08:42 AM (SUKHu)

166 Farrow keeps asking Holt if it's "suspicious" that a pilot should own a flight simulator.

----


Yes..... its absolutely unacceptable for pilots to practice in their spare time.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 18, 2014 08:42 AM (nELVU)

167 How far could a 777 glide after it's engines are turned off? All the way to crash site. (Shamelessly stolen from Ron White.)

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 08:42 AM (659DL)

168 Oooh -- who's the new Fox newsbabe?

Posted by: Costanza Defense at March 18, 2014 08:42 AM (ZPrif)

169 >> If true, it means that the plane disappeared right about where the last contact was lost Contact with the pilots was lost over the Gulf of Thailand. The Strait of Malacca is where Malaysian ground radar lost the plane after it turned back and crossed the country.

Posted by: Andy at March 18, 2014 08:43 AM (G7UH3)

170 The Argentinians. I always thought it would be Clemenza

The Maldives are nowhere near Argentina

Wait.  What?

http://tinyurl.com/bscog8n

Posted by: Barky O'Genius at March 18, 2014 08:43 AM (8ZskC)

171 168 Oooh -- who's the new Fox newsbabe? New newsbabe? Stuck at work and can't watch. Need moar info. And pics. Asking for a friend.

Posted by: Citizen X at March 18, 2014 08:43 AM (7ObY1)

172 Posted by: Frank at March 18, 2014 12:37 PM (7Nabg) Now THAT is interesting...

Posted by: Romeo13 at March 18, 2014 08:43 AM (84gbM)

173 I think regardless of what happened to the plane -- whether it crashed or is in some super secret hangar somewhere -- the likelihood of the passengers still being alive is virtually zero.   There's always a chance, of course, but it's very slim.   If they're being held as hostages then they'd have to be housed SOMEWHERE,  not to mention fed and watered.   Even   the most basic rations for that many people for more than a week are sizeable.   So if that's the case,   and   the  hijackers are holding onto the passengers as some   kind of human shield for when they carry out their nefarious plan,   you can assume that   several of the victims  - elderly,    very  young,  and sickly  -- would     have passed away by now   from mistreatment.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:43 AM (4df7R)

174 According to the NYT, Flight 370  business class had wifi.

Posted by: mrp at March 18, 2014 08:43 AM (JBggj)

175 I think it is not so much that the pilot had a simulator which concerns people but that he had an assault simulator, automatic even.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 12:40 PM (rDidD)


It sure looked like he had high capacity assault magazines as well.

Posted by: Hrothgar at March 18, 2014 08:44 AM (o3MSL)

176 And Leon's getting LARGER......

Posted by: Johnny at March 18, 2014 08:44 AM (DErq5)

177 Worst case scenario, black-op-pirates took the plane to kidnap-assassinate a person involved in global-heavy-shit. Perhaps the Chinese involved in their government, their national economy, their Military Industrial Complex, their possible alliance with Russia? Without being in the know, when it comes to "Why?" there are enough questions and possibilities to fill the Indian Ocean.

Posted by: panzernashorn at March 18, 2014 08:44 AM (/vO0r)

178 175 I bet they were all in black too.

Posted by: votermom at March 18, 2014 08:44 AM (GSIDW)

179 It sure looked like he had high capacity assault magazines as well. Posted by: Hrothgar multiple engines too.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 08:45 AM (rDidD)

180 If it was hijacked, the Absence of Cellphone Calls From Missing FlightÂ’s Passengers tells us, what?

All on board were a sleep at 1:30 in the F'en morning?

Posted by: Paladin at March 18, 2014 08:45 AM (QGbEp)

181 I don't accept that the westward turn was preprogrammed prior to the last contact with flight control just like I did not accept that the transponder was turned of before last contact. I believe there was a catastrophic event that caused everything to shut down and the pilot made maneuvers applicable to that event.

Posted by: Yes it sucks at March 18, 2014 08:45 AM (ODaO0)

182 I'm sure they are going back and re-processing radar returns for lower figures-of-merit along known tracks.  Depending on the age of the system, this can take some time. I would expect the Indians are doing the same.  Don't expect much from Burma, Bangladesh, or Laos.

Every time the Malaysians provide more info - everyone has to go re-look at their own datasets.  It might be as simple as looking at logs for UFOs, but it could also be some fairly sophisticated forensic processing.

I'd like to see another look at those early reports of a landing a Nanning, China..  The big direction arrow is pointed right up thru Burma/Laos toward Nanning, the last Sat-ping is close, and the time fits.  I am suspicious of the Chinese getting all aggressive and up-in Malaysia's grill about the search - they know that's not the way to get things done in Asia.

I wonder if the Captain's flight simulator had a bunch of C-47 runs over "the hump" programmed in?

Posted by: Jean at March 18, 2014 08:45 AM (Aqvh6)

183 According to the NYT, Flight 370 business class had wifi. Not necessarily satellite, which means that over water, it's useless.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 08:45 AM (659DL)

184 I expect a lot of these things will turn out to be red herrings. Things which seem suspicious and important are likely just routine minor errors which wouldn't be noticed except that there's an intense investigation going on. Like the waypoint change: maybe one of the pilots just made a navigation error, which would have been corrected as soon as they noticed they were heading off course -- but never did because something happened to the plane in the interim. The terrorism explanation just gets less and less plausible as more time goes by without anything happening. The pilot-suicide explanation seems equally unlikely: why go off on some wild path when all you have to do is aim down? I still think we're going to find out something catastrophic happened around 1:15 over the South China Sea and the plane went down right where it was supposed to be.

Posted by: Trimegistus at March 18, 2014 08:46 AM (Zp8Kp)

185 Putin: “Kiev Is The Mother Of All Russian Cities” Weasel Zippers: Ah oh

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 18, 2014 08:47 AM (t3UFN)

186 I think regardless of what happened to the plane -- whether it crashed or is in some super secret hangar somewhere -- the likelihood of the passengers still being alive is virtually zero. There's always a chance, of course, but it's very slim. If they're being held as hostages then they'd have to be housed SOMEWHERE, not to mention fed and watered. Even the most basic rations for that many people for more than a week are sizeable. So if that's the case, and the hijackers are holding onto the passengers as some kind of human shield for when they carry out their nefarious plan, you can assume that several of the victims - elderly, very young, and sickly -- would have passed away by now from mistreatment. Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy I have heard many theories about where the plane is I have not heard much if any disagreement over the status of passengers; only how and when.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 08:47 AM (rDidD)

187 >>Not necessarily satellite, which means that over water, it's useless. Cuz there's no where to plug the cable in, right?

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 18, 2014 08:47 AM (SUKHu)

188 Ace needs his own cable television show. Sure, we can put a black dot over his face so she can maintain her privacy. Her catch phrase can be: Hey, assholes!

Posted by: The Yellow Pug at March 18, 2014 08:47 AM (r7mtu)

189 Rush is talking to a 777 Pilot right now. 5 minutes and I have learned more that the combined coverage of the networks.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at March 18, 2014 08:47 AM (32Ze2)

190

<i> I suspect foul play myself, but it's a bit illogical to take exactly-opposite evidence as proving the same thing.</i>

What the hell are you talking about?

Posted by: IPCC at March 18, 2014 08:48 AM (N8Ijm)

191 Today on MSNBC Ronan Farrow investigates the intricacies of a potato peeler.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at March 18, 2014 08:48 AM (oFCZn)

192 Putin: “Kiev Is The Mother Of All Russian Cities” Ho boy.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 08:48 AM (659DL)

193 Putin: “Kiev Is The Mother Of All Russian Cities”

----


Aw hell...... he's junst punking Obama now isnt he.  


He's pinned Obamas shoulders to the ground and is dangling lugies over his face.

Posted by: fixerupper at March 18, 2014 08:49 AM (nELVU)

194 Better a dull witted twit than a conniving bastard. You'd have thought that Rosemary's Baby would have more cunning. Obviously, Farrow took after his mom, despite being demon spawn. And that's a good thing.

Posted by: Martha Stewart at March 18, 2014 08:49 AM (/vO0r)

195 How far could a 777 glide after it's engines are turned off? All the way to crash site. (Shamelessly stolen from Ron White.) Destination: Hell Personal or Business: Personal Reason: Laughing

Posted by: rickb223 at March 18, 2014 08:49 AM (xZxMD)

196 163?
Citizen X?

Yeah, I'm one of "the banned of brothers" from the foosballs site. Did not violate a single site rule- just hung out with the "wrong people." We regrouped at Gulf Coast Pundits and after a Mod went nuts & nuked the site, regrouped again at Grouchy  Conservative Pundits.

"So it goes...."

Posted by: backhoe at March 18, 2014 08:49 AM (ULH4o)

197 by 2016 obama will be paying biographers to call him modern carter so he can avoid being called chamberlain. at least chamberlain got a piece of paper.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 08:50 AM (rDidD)

198

It was reported on FNC this morning that while pretty much every other country in the region has agreed to reveal data from their radar, Pakistan has not.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 18, 2014 12:38 PM (DmNpO)

 

 

Typical Pakistani or moslem incompetence; obsessive, nonsensical secrecy;  or something more nefarious?

 

My vote is for incompetence.  After all, they have Malaysia blazing a new example for them

Posted by: rd at March 18, 2014 08:50 AM (D+lxs)

199 Not necessarily satellite, which means that over water, it's useless. Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 12:45 PM
===
It's also useless if someone in the cockpit shuts off the service.  For the Kuala Lumpur - Beijing run, with a substantial Chinese business clientele, I'd bet satellite, just to be competitive, but  I don't know.

Posted by: mrp at March 18, 2014 08:50 AM (JBggj)

200 Wait. What? http://tinyurl.com/bscog8n Ah, forgot about that one. Just be glad Biden isn't in charge of the rescue. He'd be looking for debris south of Indiana.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 18, 2014 08:50 AM (SY2Kh)

201 don't accept that the westward turn was preprogrammed prior to the last contact with flight control just like I did not accept that the transponder was turned of before last contact. I believe there was a catastrophic event that caused everything to shut down and the pilot made maneuvers applicable to that event. Posted by: Yes it sucks

If I am reading their statement correctly.  The last ACARS data burst at 0107 has an indication of a FMC reprogramming in the data.  The radar tracks they do have, support that course change.  Could the Malaysians be completely wrong about the ACARS data and their radar returns; sure - but are SITA and Boeing also wrong about the ACARS, and Immersat on the satellite pings, and now Thailand on their radar --- that's a lot of pro's screwing up.

Posted by: Jean at March 18, 2014 08:50 AM (Aqvh6)

202 Putin: “Kiev Is The Mother Of All Russian Cities” Ho boy. Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 12:48 PM (659DL) Yet, they don't speak the same language or even look that much alike.

Posted by: The Yellow Pug at March 18, 2014 08:51 AM (r7mtu)

203 Was the trip to Angels 45 to put the passengers into nappy-poo land so they could be de-gadgeted and/or otherwise managed?

Posted by: akula51[/b][/i][/s] at March 18, 2014 08:51 AM (LA2U/)

204 He's pinned Obamas shoulders to the ground and is dangling lugies over his face. Posted by: fixerupper at March 18, 2014 uh yeah, you have to rotate obama 180 degrees.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 08:51 AM (rDidD)

205 Not necessarily satellite, which means that over water, it's useless.



Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 12:45 PM


===


It's also useless if someone in the cockpit shuts off the service.




And if that's the case, then it's pretty certain that one or both of the pilots was involved.     

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:52 AM (4df7R)

206 Putin: “Kiev Is The Mother Of All Russian Cities” He wouldn't dare cross a red line, would he? I fear he is in for one heck of a scolding!

Posted by: t-bird at March 18, 2014 08:52 AM (FcR7P)

207 I think the new Fox newsbabe (well, new to me) is Sandra Smith. Alisyn Camerota just left. Sandra Smith might just be a temp replacement. She's been on RedEye before and I guess has been a regular at Fox Business for some # of years.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at March 18, 2014 08:53 AM (ZPrif)

208

Btw, there is no need for the lefties to attack Paul Ryan.  He is fucking done.  The "Young Guns" of the house are pretty much our entire fucking problem.

 

Ryan, Cantor, throw them all the fuck out. 

Posted by: prescient11 at March 18, 2014 08:53 AM (tVTLU)

209 that's a lot of pro's screwing up. Posted by: Jean I have great confidence in the experts but not so much in the intermediaries relaying the information.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 08:53 AM (rDidD)

210 Damn it--why is the Monkey Face Orchid still mocking us?

Posted by: tasker at March 18, 2014 08:54 AM (RJMhd)

211 Yet, they don't speak the same language or even look that much alike.

Posted by: The Yellow Pug at March 18, 2014 12:51 PM (r7mtu)


Comrade, those are both fixable problems!

Posted by: Gulag Administrator at March 18, 2014 08:54 AM (o3MSL)

212

@154

No, we can tell the time the data was sent by the elapsed time since the last signal was sent. It beamed every thirty minutes right? Did the time to reception get shorter or longer? Its a small numerical difference, but that difference is the speed and direction the plane is headed.

Posted by: Jollyroger at March 18, 2014 08:54 AM (t06LC)

213 As I stated last night, I'm going full UFO on this. It's easier than dealing with great heaps of speculation, second guessing, and dart throwing.

U.F.O.

Excellent suggestion:  http://youtu.be/Guqm4ufKT9Q

Posted by: Blanco Basura at March 18, 2014 08:54 AM (YEelc)

214 Alisyn Camerota just left. Sandra Smith might just be a temp replacement. She's been on RedEye before and I guess has been a regular at Fox Business for some # of years. Posted by: Costanza Defense at March 18, 2014 12:53 PM (ZPrif) Ummm....I was watching Camerota yesterday.

Posted by: Tami [/i][/b][/u][/s] at March 18, 2014 08:54 AM (bCEmE)

215 Was the trip to Angels 45 to put the passengers into nappy-poo land so they could be de-gadgeted and/or otherwise managed? After hitting it, there'd be no need to de-gadget them.

Posted by: rickb223 at March 18, 2014 08:54 AM (xZxMD)

216 If we've made the leap - and I never thought it was much of a leap - to suspect the terrorism angle, then its not unreasonable to think most of the passengers are still alive.   Live hostages coupled with a weaponized passenger plane sets up all manner of no-win scenarios for us or whoever else will be the eventual target.

Posted by: Jaws at March 18, 2014 08:54 AM (eKZp1)

217 O/T One of our news helicopters crashed here this morning on the street in front of the space needle. Both people on the helicopter are dead. They hit one car and that guy is in critical condition with burns over 50% of his body. He got himself out of his car after the crash and got away from it. It is sad to watch the news reporters because several of them are choking back tears. It happened right outside their office while a lot of them were walking in to work.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlinSeattle at March 18, 2014 08:54 AM (RZ8pf)

218 Putin: “Kiev Is The Mother Of All Russian Cities”



Really?    Then tell me,   why   did    your   precious   Uncle Joe decide that starving millions of Ukrainians was a good idea?    Or    did   he make an exception for Ukrainians in Kiev, because it's bad juju   to starve your mother?

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 08:55 AM (4df7R)

219 if I hear one more guy say "no one ever had an idea about flying a plane into a building before osama"

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 08:55 AM (rDidD)

220
I am still going with Iran to use the plane to hit Israel.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 18, 2014 08:55 AM (0Kobm)

221 I have great confidence in the experts but not so much in the intermediaries relaying the information. Picture Kathleen Sebelius trying to explain a technical subject. Now move that to Malaysia.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 08:55 AM (659DL)

222 It was a bird strike. 

Posted by: Sully at March 18, 2014 08:56 AM (GGCsk)

223 214 Alisyn Camerota just left. Sandra Smith might just be a temp replacement. She's been on RedEye before and I guess has been a regular at Fox Business for some # of years. Oh yeah, Sandra Smith is smokin' hot. Love her.

Posted by: Citizen X at March 18, 2014 08:56 AM (7ObY1)

224 Hmmm..... So according to a seasoned Pilot... the turn West was to the closest useable airport... According to latest... that turn was put into the flight control system... According to other data, altitude was semi erratic after that... Scenario... onboard fire with lot of smoke... Pilot or Co were semi conscious... but going out... so they programmed the Flight control system for nearest airport.... Fire takes out Communications... but leaves Flight control system operational... Crew and passengers out due to smoke inhalation.... plane flies on until it runs out of gas.. This is my latest hypothesis....

Posted by: Romeo13 at March 18, 2014 08:56 AM (84gbM)

225 John Kerry windsurfing looking for debris.

Posted by: Dr Varno at March 18, 2014 08:57 AM (V4CBV)

226 I am still going with Iran to use the plane to hit Israel.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 18, 2014 12:55 PM
====
I dunno.  If the US is willing to shoot down an Iranian airliner, just think how quick on the trigger the IAF would be.

Posted by: mrp at March 18, 2014 08:57 AM (JBggj)

227 The easiest way to find the missing plane would be to raise the gas tax and implement a carbon based tax scheme.

Posted by: Thomas Freidman at March 18, 2014 08:57 AM (4twGa)

228 Posted by: Citizen X at March 18, 2014 12:56 PM (7ObY1)


Sounds like I may have to start watching Fox again.

Posted by: Hrothgar at March 18, 2014 08:57 AM (o3MSL)

229

Putin: “Kiev Is The Mother Of All Russian Cities”

Weasel Zippers:

Ah oh

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 18, 2014 12:47 PM (t3UFN)

 

 

Well did you expect Putin to stop with Crimea?  Putin will manufacture and event by Saturday, if someone does not provide one. 

 

Adolf did not stop with Sudetenland.  And 10 months later, the rest of the world finally realized they were at war.   

Posted by: rd at March 18, 2014 08:57 AM (D+lxs)

230 Circa 192. Kissinger gave the US a mini-history lesson on that already, his Editorial news publication (mutual dissatisfaction the goal of "peaceful" diplomacy). Kiev historically IS where "Russia" began (Bela Russ) and grew into an entity via Moscow (v. Muslim Hordes South and East) that evolved over centuries into Czarist Russia with Peter the Great. Aside, the way Kissinger worded his sneer that Kiev is where "the Russian religion began" was his very crude insult at the Russian Orthodox being older than the Roman Catholic, as if the Christian religion "began" in Kiev. It ain't as if Kissinger ever fails to edit his work before publication.

Posted by: Martha Stewart at March 18, 2014 08:57 AM (/vO0r)

231 Really though, what does infowars think happened?

Posted by: tubal at March 18, 2014 08:57 AM (BJuep)

232

@224

 

That's a hell of a fire to take out all coms but still not so bad as to keep the engines going

Posted by: Jollyroger at March 18, 2014 08:58 AM (t06LC)

233 Altitude = Life.

High good, low bad unless you are trying to burn off fuel.

Posted by: OG Celtic-American at March 18, 2014 08:58 AM (vHRtU)

234 Today on MSNBC Ronan Farrow investigates the intricacies of a potato peeler. And wins a Pulitzer from the rest of the incestuous news community.

Posted by: Additional Blond Agent at March 18, 2014 08:58 AM (PMGbu)

235 It is sad to watch the news reporters because several of them are choking back tears. It happened right outside their office while a lot of them were walking in to work.

---

I suppose I should have some sympathy for the reporters.

But the little demon on my left shoulder says " Stick a mic in THEIR face and ask 'em how they feel."

Posted by: fixerupper at March 18, 2014 08:58 AM (nELVU)

236 if I hear one more guy say "no one ever had an idea about flying a plane into a building before osama" Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 12:55 PM (rDidD) Not me. I was only surprised it had not happened before.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 18, 2014 08:59 AM (t3UFN)

237 The CIA hijacked it and took it to Diego Garcia just so they'd have some people to troture.

Posted by: Alex Jones Bitch at March 18, 2014 08:59 AM (Aif/5)

238 Flight Simulators are the new taboo items to own, alongside firearms, etc. Get SWATted if you're not careful, or even if you are as good as good can be. ----------------------------- ***burns copy of Microsoft Flight Simulator X, buries USB control yoke and pedals in garden***

Posted by: Roy Munson, Dictionary Salesman at March 18, 2014 08:59 AM (CJjw5)

239 Btw, there is no need for the lefties to attack Paul Ryan. He is fucking done. The "Young Guns" of the house are pretty much our entire fucking problem.

Ryan, Cantor, throw them all the fuck out.

Posted by: prescient11 at March 18, 2014 12:53 PM (tVTLU)



Uh, no. Even when the Republican is the RINOiest of RINOs. You can't just let the Demunist Commiecrat Media Smear Machine get away with it. Ever.

Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 18, 2014 08:59 AM (GsebS)

240 Couldn't we tie gravity waves into it, somehow? They're new, and smoking hot.

Posted by: tubal at March 18, 2014 08:59 AM (BJuep)

241 I think pilot was turning back to a nearby Malay runway.And then it went down on autopilot.

Posted by: pat at March 18, 2014 08:59 AM (KCg4m)

242 215 After hitting it, there'd be no need to de-gadget them. Only if you landed somewhere with no coverage of any kind I guess. Someone, even in their potentially incapacitated condition, would have left one of their myriad devices "on" either in checked or carry-on baggage one would have to guess.

Posted by: akula51[/b][/i][/s] at March 18, 2014 09:00 AM (LA2U/)

243 Posted by: Romeo13 at March 18, 2014 12:56 PM (84gbM) OH... and climb to 45 K was attempt to put out the fire... but it was partly electrical... so even though they came down (with passengers probably dead, so no cell phone calls...)... more smoke happened.... Pilot or Co semi conscious tried to get the plane down to an altitude where they could live... but didn't make it... Plane then flew on.... autopilot...

Posted by: Romeo13 at March 18, 2014 09:00 AM (84gbM)

244 214 Alisyn Camerota just left. Sandra Smith might just be a temp replacement. She's been on RedEye before and I guess has been a regular at Fox Business for some # of years. Posted by: Costanza Defense at March 18, 2014 12:53 PM (ZPrif) Ummm....I was watching Camerota yesterday. Posted by: Tami at March 18, 2014 12:54 PM (bCEmE) Ok, maybe I wasn't. Seems the days blur lately.

Posted by: Tami [/i][/b][/u][/s] at March 18, 2014 09:00 AM (bCEmE)

245 Yep, it's Sandra Smith. She is what I like to call -- very attractive.

Posted by: Costanza Defense at March 18, 2014 09:01 AM (ZPrif)

246 You clearly have no idea how GPS actually works. (Not that this was GPS obviously, but that principle is common among satellites.) Posted by: tsrblke ----------------------- Hmm. First my Bona Fides. Expert Class Amateur radio operator. 35 years Electrical Engineer, AMSAT member/user. Consultant for AMSAT environment testing. tsr - I may be in error, I believe that I DO know how GPS works. As you point out this is not a question of a GPS sat. But the issue is the technology. When you use a GPS *receiver*, what happens is that you receive a number of time-stamped signals from a number of satellites. Your receiver then does the work of figuring out where you are based on those data from sats whose position is known. This case is the opposite. It is the equivalent of you holding a transmitter, and sending up a time stamp. The Satellites would then have to receive that time stamp, and based on their known position at that time, calculate and store (or record the data for download to an earth station) your position, or the raw data. Note that the only way that can work is for your time stamp to be very accurate. In the case of a GPS receiver, time keeping is not critical. While it is all possible (as I stated), it is highly impractical, especially given the large quantities of data that would have to be handled from tens of thousands of transmitters.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 18, 2014 09:01 AM (aDwsi)

247

Hey horde, the aeronatical expert Courtney Love has found the aircraft!  She used super professional crayon pointing arrows on a satellite picture and everything!

Sigh

Posted by: Cheri at March 18, 2014 09:01 AM (G+Wff)

248 Question I asked once before- how buoyant is a 777 in water? What if the pilot executed an emergency water landing in the ocean, where it slowly sank before being found? This would explain the lack of debris, the satellite pings continuing after losing contact, and the reported location possibilities of the last ping (pings continued until it submerged).

Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 18, 2014 09:01 AM (SY2Kh)

249 If it was hijacked, the Absence of Cellphone Calls From Missing FlightÂ’s Passengers tells us, what?

Not much.  Esp. if they depressurized for 15min and killed everyone.  Now network accession messages from phones turned on would be interesting - particularly from remote - edge of network towers not setup to dump distant pings.  I would assume the various networks have been looking at this. 

As a proof of concept, I would ask the Malaysians to provide the cell data from the tower en-route that we know they flew near to see if anyone left their phones on.

Posted by: Jean at March 18, 2014 09:01 AM (Aqvh6)

250 I have a portable epirb, should I start flying with it? This: http://tinyurl.com/nptdeos

Posted by: Nip Sip at March 18, 2014 09:01 AM (0FSuD)

251 Speaking of Pakistan--read this a couple of days ago: HYDERABAD: In a mid-air scare, "incorrect" input by Pakistan's air traffic control to a Mumbai-bound Air India Dreamliner plane from London led it to come close to another aircraft, prompting a sharp reaction from India. The Mumbai-bound Air India flight AI-130 from London's Heathrow Airport on Tuesday escaped a near miss incident after the Karachi Air Traffic Control (ATC) gave pilot a wrong frequency that could have changed the flight path of the Boeing 787 and brought it close to Philippine's Cebu Airline from Dubai. "It is a very serious incident and we do not have any precedent of such an incident," Airports Authority of India chairman Alok Sinha told reporters on the sidelines of the India Aviation show here. Times of India

Posted by: tasker at March 18, 2014 09:01 AM (RJMhd)

252 Ummm....I was watching Camerota yesterday. *** Her lat day was two days ago. I've always really liked her.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 18, 2014 09:01 AM (DmNpO)

253 off italians

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 18, 2014 09:02 AM (DmNpO)

254 Fixerupper, well as can be expected with news reporters they are making it all about them. One of the anchors of the station was at the airport on his way to interview President Obama, but he canceled the trip to go back to the station. He said a variation of "I was on my way to interview President Obama" like 4 times. I guess in this particular case it is about them though, since they knew the dead pilot and camera person, and many of them had flown on the helicopter.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlinSeattle at March 18, 2014 09:02 AM (RZ8pf)

255 Hollowpoint, it wouldn't float for seven hours.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 09:02 AM (659DL)

256 Hey horde, the aeronatical expert Courtney Love has found the aircraft! She used super professional crayon pointing arrows on a satellite picture and everything!
Sigh

Posted by: Cheri at March 18, 2014 01:01 PM (G+Wff)



Heck, I trust her more than the Malaysians, the Red Chinese, or the Obama Administration.

Posted by: Curmudgeon at March 18, 2014 09:03 AM (GsebS)

257 More: The Karachi ATC also gave its Mumbai counterpart an incorrect ETA (expected arrival time) when the Air India aircraft was flying over Sapna and Nobat, thereby reducing the time gap between it and the Cebu plane. In the incident that occurred at 1.30am on Tuesday, the Karachi ATC asked the pilot of the Air India flight to report two-way with the ATC in Mumbai. However, the pilot even after trying various frequencies could not contact the Mumbai ATC as it had not yet reached Mumbai airspace but later managed to establish contact with the Ahmedabad ATC.

Posted by: tasker at March 18, 2014 09:03 AM (RJMhd)

258 The answer is so obvious.

Interdimensional Sentient Space Bananas. They're going to turn the passengers into chocolate, strawberry and vanilla ice cream. This explains the secret payload in the plane of giant drums of chocolate, marshmallow and pineapple sauce.

We can head them off if we know where there's a island warehouse full of maraschino cherries and whipped cream.

And Rush Limbaugh thinks he's so clever.

Posted by: MSNBC at March 18, 2014 09:03 AM (pgQxn)

259 someone, aka Jean, to the barrel

Posted by: Nip Sip at March 18, 2014 09:03 AM (0FSuD)

260 Lester, do you think its suspicious that an allegedly legitimate network would give a simpleton like me a show?

Posted by: Ronan Farrow at March 18, 2014 09:03 AM (4twGa)

261 Here's an electrical fire plus hypoxia theory that fits the available evidence. http://www.wired.com/autopia/2014/03/ mh370-electrical-fire/ (cut and paste to reassemble the link)

Posted by: Comrade Arthur at March 18, 2014 09:03 AM (h53OH)

262 Karachi Air Traffic Control I'd rather fly to Mogadishu than Karachi.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 09:04 AM (659DL)

263 Question I asked once before- how buoyant is a 777 in water?

Pulling a Sully in the ocean at night!  I'd put that up their with meteor strikes.  I also think the ELTs would start beeping.

Posted by: Jean at March 18, 2014 09:04 AM (Aqvh6)

264 Posted by: mrp at March 18, 2014 12:57  <<<<

oh I know, but them mullahs aren't known for teh smarts.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 18, 2014 09:04 AM (0Kobm)

265 None of this would be half the mystery it has become if the fucking Malaysians and others involved would stop with the fucking lies and disinformation. At some point it would be reasonable to conclude that these entities are actually culpable in the disappearance.

Posted by: Something at March 18, 2014 09:04 AM (ZW1Ga)

266 What the Hell Did I Just Watch? Yesterday Ronan Farrow had on Lester Holt to play show and tell with a flight simulator. Holt owns one, and calls himself a "frustrated pilot" (I think he means wannabe pilot), and Farrow had him on to show the audience just what a flight simulator is.



When I think   of   Ronan    Farrow,     my   brain  immediately    starts replaying   Eddie Izzard's    impersonation of     royalty.



www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKaAO2HL4mk



"You're a plumber?   What on earth is that?"

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 09:04 AM (4df7R)

267 I suppose I should have some sympathy for the reporters. But the little demon on my left shoulder says " Stick a mic in THEIR face and ask 'em how they feel." I too suppose I should show some sympathy. But if the dead weren't their own, I know damned well that those ghouls would be salivating over the deaths.

Posted by: Citizen X at March 18, 2014 09:04 AM (7ObY1)

268 #5, Do you have any idea how massive the IR signature of an ICBM launch is compared to an aircraft? The sensors on those satellites probably can't even see an aircraft, because their purpose is to detect missile launches, not to track aircraft.

Posted by: ol_dirty_/b/tard at March 18, 2014 09:05 AM (z01LS)

269 Hollowpoint, it wouldn't float for seven hours. Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 01:02 PM (659DL) --------------------------- HUH! Well then this would be the first time in history that metal sank in water!

Posted by: Rosie O'Donnell, Metallurgist at March 18, 2014 09:05 AM (CJjw5)

270 Pakistan probably doesn't have useful data to release. Their ATC is pathetic. Those of us that have flown Perhaps It Arrive airlines have seen countless near misses...

Posted by: OG Celtic-American at March 18, 2014 09:06 AM (vHRtU)

271 Camerata always seemed like a very nice person. And very well liked by her co-workers from what I've read. I personally never got teh hawtness that others saw in her, but I'll miss her.

Posted by: Citizen X at March 18, 2014 09:06 AM (7ObY1)

272 Do you have any idea how massive the IR signature of an ICBM launch is compared to an aircraft? Yes, but--an exploding 777 and all its fuel would trigger a bell or two. Pull a thread on this one and a dozen more shake loose.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 09:07 AM (659DL)

273 Two white men in a white van were spotted in Thailand

Posted by: Chief Charles Moose at March 18, 2014 09:07 AM (aTXUx)

274 270 Pakistan probably doesn't have useful data to release. Their ATC is pathetic. Those of us that have flown Perhaps It Arrive airlines have seen countless near misses... Posted by: OG Celtic-American at March 18, 2014 01:06 PM (vHRtU) ************ Holy shit--so--it's not that rare?

Posted by: tasker at March 18, 2014 09:07 AM (RJMhd)

275 Well then this would be the first time in history that metal sank in water! Posted by: Rosie O'Donnell, Metallurgist ----------------- Excellent point! Aircraft carrier are made from steel..., and they float just fine.

Posted by: Charlie Sheen at March 18, 2014 09:08 AM (aDwsi)

276 meh, pakistan has some decent radars but it is mostly tuned into wavelengths suited for finding goats.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 09:08 AM (rDidD)

277 Posted by: t-bird at March 18, 2014 12:52 PM (FcR7P) ----- Thank you! That was very funny.

Posted by: Chillin the most at March 18, 2014 09:08 AM (gxtMZ)

278 Two white men in a white van were spotted in Thailand Down by the river.....

Posted by: rickb223 at March 18, 2014 09:08 AM (xZxMD)

279 Pulling a Sully in the ocean at night! I'd put that up their with meteor strikes. I also think the ELTs would start beeping. I'm making the assumption that an electrical problem (fire?) damaged the communication systems, and that the Malaysians screwed the pooch. That said, nobody knows what the hell happened. Just throwing out an unexplored potential scenario that might be consistent with what little we know. Or might not be, because every time a new "fact" comes out, it's refuted a couple days later.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 18, 2014 09:09 AM (SY2Kh)

280 RE: the helicopter crash in Seattle.



I certainly do have sympathy for the reporters and other    employees of the station(s)    where the     two   deceased persons worked.    It would be cruel not to have sympathy for them;   they've just lost   two friends and colleagues   in a terrible accident    that hit,   quite literally,    very close to home.



That said,   I hope that their experience here will help temper their    reportorial   "blood lust" when it comes to similar tragedies in the future.  

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 09:09 AM (4df7R)

281 So Burma looks like the worst Third World hell hole in the area--right? Empire of Jeff thinks New Orleans is bad--er, Satan's scrotum.

Posted by: tasker at March 18, 2014 09:09 AM (RJMhd)

282 138 Explanations like this (hypoxia's another favourite) would be the most likely explanations - *if* the plane hadn't apparently changed course and/or altitude at least once or twice after crossing Malaysia, long after a) the time the transponders went out b) the turn west (which afaics was also long after a) ).

Posted by: anonymous irishman at March 18, 2014 09:09 AM (DJgfL)

283 I am not surprised some countries run their radar for normal business hours but I am surprised Australia does not have their jorn facility up continuously.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 09:10 AM (rDidD)

284 Did Malaysian Airlines 370 Disappear Using SIA68?

http://tinyurl.com/mbh7dpt


Posted by: creeper at March 18, 2014 09:10 AM (WDGsE)

285 "Whether or not it's unusual for a pilot to own a flight simulator, or to be an enthusiast for flight simulators, is a good question, if you ask an actual commercial pilot."

Or you could ask a flight simmer.  Roughly 10 percent of simmers play using multi-player networks.  In my squad of 9 there are 2 commercial pilots.

I have a pilot's license.

I've played with and against current and retired military aviators.

What Ace said about these things is true- they're very hard video games.  The community that plays them essentially recreated everything Boyd discovered and to that extent they are a breathtakingly realistic intellectually.  I don't really "get" the ones where you can't shoot, but I'm sure there are commercial pilots in those servers as well. 

My experience is that you can't swing a dead cat in a flight sim without hitting somebody who flies for a living, or did.




Posted by: Sunflower at March 18, 2014 09:10 AM (SJOJJ)

286 >> This would explain the lack of debris, the satellite pings continuing after losing contact, and the reported location possibilities of the last ping (pings continued until it submerged). It doesn't explain why there was no EPIRB signal, though. If it went down in the water, the emergency locating equipment should've been screaming.

Posted by: Andy at March 18, 2014 09:10 AM (3BiPW)

287 Nood.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Bossy Assault Hobbit [/u][/i][/s][/b] at March 18, 2014 09:10 AM (4df7R)

288 Gaia as my witness, I thought planes could fly

Posted by: Ronan Farrow at March 18, 2014 09:11 AM (aTXUx)

289 Down by the river..... Posted by: rickb223 at March 18, 2014 01:08 PM
====

Two by two ... hands of blue ...

Posted by: River at March 18, 2014 09:11 AM (JBggj)

290 "There's a shit-ton of other, easier ways to kill yourself.

Posted by: Insomniac at March 18, 2014 12:19 PM (DrWcr)"



Yes but it is something you only do once so a lot of people kind of make a big deal about it.

Posted by: Obnoxious A-hole at March 18, 2014 09:12 AM (PD6iL)

291 obama is the lyndon johnson of financial strikes.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 09:13 AM (rDidD)

292 Is there any ndication both pilots were involved in this crime, or only one? And didn't someone report yesterday that one of the stewards on the flight also owned a flight simulator? The biggest problem in this mess right now seems to be the Malaysian governments involvement. They apparently won't let US investigators look at any of the electronic information found in either pilots house, for reasons totally obscure to me.

Posted by: MTF at March 18, 2014 09:13 AM (F58x4)

293 Here's an electrical fire plus hypoxia theory that fits the available evidence.

I'm ok with, but it has to smoke - not hypoxia. That's where all the P-3s are looking.

Posted by: Jean at March 18, 2014 09:14 AM (Aqvh6)

294 MWR, to be fair to the station, their reporters are a lot less douchebag driven when it comes to reporting tragic events. Often they show a modicum of respect and even some humanity. On the other hand this is also the station that has a crime reporter who refuses to include the description of criminals if they are black or Hispanic. He has actually come out and stated it publically several times. He also put together a story on washington most wanted that was only white guys.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlinSeattle at March 18, 2014 09:14 AM (RZ8pf)

295 rd, 229 the criticism slamming expansionism goes around to all parties vying to dominate global politics. Don't forget the US Manifest Destiny on record, and Teddy Roosevelt's interventionist war (Cuba conquest for the sugar industry profits to benefit US investors, not Spain's) against Spain, as if we did Spaniards any favors (spreading democracy) toppling their head of state monarchy to devolve into socialist civil war, commies vs. fascists. As for Adolf v. Stalin -- who was WORSE to the civilian populations under control, specifically the eastern regions of the former Austro-Hungarian Empire to which you pointed out? Adolf's millions through genocide only scratch the surface of Stalin's mega-millions enslaved and slaughtered, still not recognized as 'WORSE THAN' by typical Americans. Again, look at what our government has DONE to the Egyptians and to the Libyans, to the Afghans and the Iraqis, in the name of "spreading democracy and freedom" annihilating lives and the ability to survive, entire world populations condemned to death, even as our tax funds are bundled to be stolen through OFFICIAL graft in "foreign aid". Occupation http://tinyurl.com/pzrvc65 on THAT note, remember Jerry Doyle's last hurrah haranguing US Foreign Policy latest objective to use Burma for their latest economic fraud against American Taxpayers and citizenry. Tax funds provide security and infrastructure "nation building" FOR TRANSNATIONAL CORPORATIONS' PROFITS. No positive returns to the USA citizenry. Instead, our national agenda "develops" exceptionally bitter 'feelings' from the dispossessed indigenous peoples in "developing" countries where everyone becomes poorer unless they become part of the organized crime parasites representing (as if) America's best interests. Ike's bane.

Posted by: Martha Stewart at March 18, 2014 09:16 AM (/vO0r)

296 They apparently won't let US investigators look at any of the electronic information found in either pilots house, for reasons totally obscure to me. Might just be national pride- Malaysia is taking a lot of (well deserved) criticism, and if the US finds something of importance that they missed it could make them look even worse.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 18, 2014 09:17 AM (SY2Kh)

297 270 Pakistan probably doesn't have useful data to release. Their ATC is pathetic. Those of us that have flown Perhaps It Arrive airlines have seen countless near misses...
Posted by: OG Celtic-American at March 18, 2014 01:06 PM (vHRtU)

************

Holy shit--so--it's not that rare?

Posted by: tasker

Inshallah should not be the motto of your national airline.

Posted by: Jean at March 18, 2014 09:17 AM (Aqvh6)

298 Stewart darns socks

Posted by: panzernashorn at March 18, 2014 09:17 AM (/vO0r)

299 someone need to have a "this is my boomstick" discussion with the malaysians.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 09:17 AM (rDidD)

300 I found a Zaharie Ahmad Shah in the Kuala Lumpur directory who is a member of the Tea Party. I'll follow up and report back to you

Posted by: Brian Ross at March 18, 2014 09:18 AM (aTXUx)

301 286 And a (non-criminal) pilot conscious enough to attempt a controlled ditching would probably think to try to communicate on one of the 777's big stack of radios before landing, too. Or even maybe turn the transponders back on.

Posted by: anonymous irishman at March 18, 2014 09:19 AM (DJgfL)

302 Posted by: Martha Stewart at March 18, 2014 01:16 PM (/vO0r) Ron Paul is stupid.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 18, 2014 09:19 AM (SY2Kh)

303 I really don't get the obsession with the simulator. You don't become an airline pilot because you hate flying. You live and breath it every day and are typically obsessed with flying. It'd be unusual for a commercial pilot to not have at least a copy of a flight sim installed on their computer.

Posted by: james at March 18, 2014 09:19 AM (1PqiV)

304 The altitudes would have had to have been programmed I believe. Generally the altitude is set on the autopilot and stays there. So someone would have either had to have manually changed it on the auto pilot or pre programmed it in the flight director.

Posted by: Minnfidel at March 18, 2014 09:20 AM (/rlXg)

305 And a (non-criminal) pilot conscious enough to attempt a controlled ditching would probably think to try to communicate on one of the 777's big stack of radios before landing, too. Or even maybe turn the transponders back on. The water landing scenario I suggested relies on the assumption that something caused the communication systems to fail.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 18, 2014 09:21 AM (SY2Kh)

306 253 off italians Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 18, 2014 01:02 PM (DmNpO) ha So say the Venetians, evidently. Internet vote /unofficial popularity to go it alone/

Posted by: panzernashorn at March 18, 2014 09:22 AM (/vO0r)

307 as for the preprogrammed flight plan data, do we know what the suspicious codes were? I have heard some discussion of "igari" and "vampi" by guys that fly in the area key waypoints.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 09:22 AM (rDidD)

308 >> Here's an electrical fire plus hypoxia theory that fits the available evidence. Except the flight path doesn't wind up anywhere near the Inmarsat last-ping arcs without the plane making a turn inconsistent with either the original FCS heading data or the pilot still being in control.

Posted by: Andy at March 18, 2014 09:22 AM (G7UH3)

309 The biggest problem in this mess right now seems to be the Malaysian governments involvement. They apparently won't let US investigators look at any of the electronic information found in either pilots house, for reasons totally obscure to me. Posted by: MTF at March 18, 2014 01:13 PM (F58x4) Maybe they didn't want SWAT teams busting up the house, shooting pets or anyone who twitched or didn't hit the floor fast enough.

Posted by: kbdabear at March 18, 2014 09:23 AM (aTXUx)

310 Anytime any asshat tries to make Adolph Fucking Hitler look better becasue of "x", I am immediately reminded that person is, in fact, an asshat.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 18, 2014 09:24 AM (659DL)

311 185 Putin: “Kiev Is The Mother Of All Russian Cities”

Weasel Zippers:

Ah oh

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 18, 2014 12:47 PM (t3UFN)


True. Also ominous. I think Vlad is thinking of bringing back Kievan Rus.

Posted by: joncelli at March 18, 2014 09:25 AM (RD7QR)

312 It doesn't explain why there was no EPIRB signal, though. If it went down in the water, the emergency locating equipment should've been screaming. Should've. And if it did, the Malaysians should've picked it up. If the mystery surrounding MH370 is ever solved (and it might not be), I suspect there will be more than a couple 'should'ves' that didn't happen.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 18, 2014 09:25 AM (SY2Kh)

313 Be one with Mother Russia.

Posted by: Vlad Putin at March 18, 2014 09:26 AM (GSIDW)

314 292 The biggest problem in this mess right now seems to be the Malaysian governments involvement. They apparently won't let US investigators look at any of the electronic information found in either pilots house, for reasons totally obscure to me. And I'd love to give a very personal shout-out to Ed Snowden for that one. Asshole...

Posted by: akula51[/b][/i][/s] at March 18, 2014 09:30 AM (LA2U/)

315 292 The biggest problem in this mess right now seems to be the Malaysian governments involvement. They apparently won't let US investigators look at any of the electronic information found in either pilots house, for reasons totally obscure to me. again "listen, you primitive screwheads"

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 18, 2014 09:31 AM (rDidD)

316 No more odd for a pilot to have a flight simulator program than for a race car driver to have racing games (pretty much all of them).

Posted by: Go Fast, Turn Left at March 18, 2014 09:35 AM (MdAA3)

317 I really don't get the obsession with the simulator. You don't become an airline pilot because you hate flying. You live and breath it every day and are typically obsessed with flying. It'd be unusual for a commercial pilot to not have at least a copy of a flight sim installed on their computer.

Posted by: james at March 18, 2014 01:19 PM (1PqiV)

 

 

-----------------------------------------

 

 

I don't get this either.  Had a cousin who flew for the airlines and he'd sim every route he had to fly, even if he'd  flown it a hundred times before.  He'd  throw in different scenarios to increase his list of options in  case the flight didn't go as planned.  I'm sure other professional pilots  do the same.  It's why they're professionals.

Posted by: Soona at March 18, 2014 09:35 AM (sx5Tc)

318 Andy @286, An ELT's radio signal is (or was back when I used to look for ELTs) 121.5mhz and won't transmit through deep water. You need much lower frequency for that. From what I understand the flight data recorder has an audio pinging device to help ships locate it if it's in the water, but there are a hell of a lot of sonar signals in the ocean to pick through - pretty much everything on the water that isn't from a third-world country has some kind of depth-sounding equipment.

Posted by: ol_dirty_/b/tard at March 18, 2014 09:37 AM (z01LS)

319 Putin: “Kiev Is The Mother Of All Russian Cities”

Fine, then. You won't mind what we have in mind for Petrograd and Mockba.

If we had game, which we do not, we'd stir some shit in Konigsberg and the Far East just to see the look on his face. But no.

Posted by: Stringer Davis at March 18, 2014 09:38 AM (xq1UY)

320
Should've. And if it did, the Malaysians should've picked it up.

Everyone would have picked up those emergency beacons.  Diego, SriLanka, India, Thailand, Aussies, Indonesia, the Chinese at Coco Is.  Every decent sized ship.  Every naval vessel in a huge arc. 

They didn't go off.  Some of them are battery powered and remote from the cockpit.  I think there are 4.  4 modern, redundant emergency systems failed if this is a crash landing or crash on land. 

Lawn dart into the water, maybe.  But, then where is the acoustic pinger - there are I think I saw a report of eight P-3s/P-8 running grids.  They should be able to pickup that pinger across the Bay of Bengal.  Maybe it failed, as well.

Posted by: Jean at March 18, 2014 09:39 AM (Aqvh6)

321 An ELT's radio signal is (or was back when I used to look for ELTs) 121.5mhz and won't transmit through deep water. You need much lower frequency for that. From what I understand the flight data recorder has an audio pinging device to help ships locate it if it's in the water, but there are a hell of a lot of sonar signals in the ocean to pick through - pretty much everything on the water that isn't from a third-world country has some kind of depth-sounding equipment. Posted by: ol_dirty_/b/tard

These should be mixed 121.5 and 406 mHz units.  The pinger makes a distinctive pattern that signal processing can yank out of the clutter. I'm sure a Singapore ASW frigate would pick it up 10mins off the pier.

Posted by: Jean at March 18, 2014 09:43 AM (Aqvh6)

322 It's not just the simulator, its the practice runs they made, their email accounts, their financial records, everything electronic they ever touched. That's info the Malaysians have and aren't sharing. It's just weird.

Posted by: MTF at March 18, 2014 09:44 AM (F58x4)

323 Next up, Ronan Farrow leads the way towards banning Assault Plane Simulators for private citizens and a fifteen year waiting period on all plane tickets.

Posted by: NR Pax at March 18, 2014 09:46 AM (ODsL5)

324 I'd look towards Kyrgyzstan. Constantly tops the world in corruption, home to a few old soviet airstrips. The Iranians have been ramping up trade relations for several years, and their #2 mining product after gold is uranium. Country is very sparsely populated. Sure there are two bases- both up in the north, both within about 60 klicks of each other, both separated from most of the rest of the country by two massive mountain ranges (ala too and tien shan).

Posted by: what at March 18, 2014 09:50 AM (mXHAG)

325 It's unusual for anyone to build their own elaborate flight, but benign. Airline pilots do all sorts of unusual things with their money, like buy an orchard or fly WWII warbirds. You'd think a professional pilot would have enough of simulators for his work. The sims the airlines use are top notch, far better than anything you could patch together at home. So it seems a bit obsessive to build your own sim, but in a good way.

Posted by: Tantor at March 18, 2014 09:54 AM (659DL)

326

 

1.  Build  accounting simulator.  Either give audits or  undergo one.

 

2.  ????

 

3.  Profits!

Posted by: Count de Monet at March 18, 2014 09:57 AM (BAS5M)

327 I'm starting to think this idea of a fire/smoke condition is a strong possibility explanation. It's certainly the simplest one fitting most of the known facts. It explains why the plane rode to out-of-spec altitude so suddenly, why the pilots diverted, and then ceased communication. What it doesn't explain is why the pilots turned off communication manually. That's the hardest thing to get around, and points strongly to the hijack theory.

Posted by: MTF at March 18, 2014 09:59 AM (F58x4)

328 305 But it seems really unlikely that an accident would take out all of the 777's big partly-redundant heap of radio systems while still leaving the plane able to fly long distances and with enough power to keep SATCOM going, and the pilot able to control and land it. The notorious Gimli Glider 767 still had radio while gliding with no fuel and RAT emergency power http://www.damninteresting.com/the-gimli-glider/ Besides, that ELT beacon has its own battery, and can be activated early from the cockpit by its own separate switch circuit. The beacon can be picked up by satellite, too, so it wouldn't rely on the Malaysians. (source: http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/6028864/#77 )

Posted by: anonymous irishman at March 18, 2014 09:59 AM (DJgfL)

329 Feb 2014, MV Maersk Alabama unloads mysterious cargo Port of Victoria, Seychelles. A 155 island country spanning an archipelago in the Indian Ocean. 1300 miles from Maldives. 24 hours later, 2 ex-Navy Seals that worked security were found dead onboard the Maersk Alabama. Seychelles has several runways over 1,000m and made with concrete/asphalt that could have been used for landing. Oh and Air Seychelles is 40% Owned by Etihad Airways the flag carrier airline of the United Arab Emirates. Farquhar Airport serving Farquhar Atoll in the Seychelles; One runway, concrete, 1,179 by 12.5 m Assumption Airport serving Assumption Island in the Seychelles; One runway, concrete, 1,208 by 12.5 m Praslin Airport serving Praslin Island in the Seychelles; One runway, asphalt, 1,405 by 23 m Alphonse Airport serving Alphonse Island in the Seychelles; One runway, concrete, 1,214 by 12 m Desroches Airport serving Desroches Island in the Seychelles; One runway, concrete, 1,381 by 10 m Coëtivy Airport serving Coëtivy Island in the Seychelles; One runway, concrete, 1,400 by 24 m Seychelles International Airport 9800ft runway.

Posted by: blindgoose at March 18, 2014 10:17 AM (qLv+1)

330 but it's a bit illogical to take exactly-opposite evidence as proving the same thing.

Tell that to the climate alarmists, please.

Posted by: Simon Jester at March 18, 2014 10:45 AM (6B2Vm)

331 Rush's conversation with a 777 pilot today. The transcript is good, listening to the pilot was even better. Excellent professional speaker, very calm, deliberate in his opinion. Kind of voice I prefer on the intercom when I fly as I am a nervous flyer.

Posted by: Jen at March 18, 2014 11:05 AM (JqB3t)

332 http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2014/03/18/retired_777_pilot_calls_the_show

Posted by: Jen at March 18, 2014 11:05 AM (JqB3t)

333 47 Pilot suicide.
Posted by: Occam's Razor at March 18, 2014 12:18 PM (DPMu1)

You and O'Reilly believe that..... Could be, but why did it take 5 hours to do it?

Posted by: hello, it's me also a creep-assed cracka.. at March 18, 2014 12:20 PM (9+ccr)



My hubs scoffed at this idea,  but mine was that IF this particular guy (pilot) went nuts,  (and he had to go nuts as part of the scenario),  he would be exactly the sort of guy to take a joyride because flying was his favorite bestest most beloved thing to do.    

He'd be nuts,  so he wouldn't necessarily be doing a sensible thing,  just something he'd lived for.   He might have contemplated mass murder revenge targets or expected to be followed, but instead he's all alone.   He's committed, as he's already killed/incapacitated everybody onboard. then just got the urge to fly until there was no more flying,  then down into the drink. 

Posted by: SarahW at March 18, 2014 11:24 AM (Lbv/k)

334 327 "What it doesn't explain is why the pilots turned off communication manually. That's the hardest thing to get around, and points strongly to the hijack theory." That may be relatively easy: the pilots started turning off power to different things to try to stop the fire, and the transponders and ACARS were among the things they (rightly or wrongly) powered down. (The tyre-fire guy suggested this.) That does leave two minor coincidences though. Co-incidence 1: the pilots just happen to suddenly notice the emergency for the first time 0-2 minutes after handover from Malaysia to Vietnam. Co-incidence 2: while switching things off to deal with fire, they just happen to switch off the transponders and ACARS, but not SATCOM, the one system that someone who was deliberately trying to go dark would be likely to overlook (because ACARS is shut down, right?) But co-incidences do happen, there's no doubt about it. The big problem for the hypoxia/smoke inhalation/muppets-locked-themselves-out-of-the-cabin/etc. theory is that the plane must have started changing course or altitude again (at *least* once, to get it on a path to one of the SATCOM final-location arcs), long after the (conjectured) sudden emergency at 1:22 or even the first big turn west. (And probably more than once, if the stuff about radar showing the plane zig-zagging between waypoints in the Strait of Malacca/Andaman Sea is accurate.) Weren't the pilots supposed to be dead/out for the count/locked out long before this? If they came round/got back in and started flying again, why did they apparently make no effort to communicate with anyone?

Posted by: anonymous irishman at March 18, 2014 11:26 AM (DJgfL)

335 It was a stupid question unless it is somehow more suspicious for a pilot to have bought a bunch of nerdware on Amazon or less suspicious for a reporter (or other non-professional pilot) to do so. I guess pilots aren't allowed to enjoy flying?

Posted by: Ken in NH at March 18, 2014 12:05 PM (MqjGP)

336 331 Rush's conversation with a 777 pilot today. The transcript is good, listening to the pilot was even better. Excellent professional speaker, very calm, deliberate in his opinion.

Kind of voice I prefer on the intercom when I fly as I am a nervous flyer.

Posted by: Jen at March 18, 2014 03:05 PM (JqB3t)


What did the pilot think?


I still want to know why none of the news peoples are mentioning the 20 missing engineers who deal with "invisibility" of aircraft. But, oh well! I guess it is really, "nothing to see here" with them?


And I just read that some guy is thinking that this plane few behind another 777 somewhere and, I guess, landed somewhere. Still waiting for Hostages in Iran II to get Barry the Bladderwrack wee wee'd up.

Posted by: ChristyBlinky, Bossy Redneck Queen at March 18, 2014 12:06 PM (baL2B)

337 Oh... I now think Thailand shot them down, waiting 10 days to report "because no one asked?" Riiight.

I realize I am the only person down here discussing this.

Posted by: ChristyBlinky, Bossy Redneck Queen at March 18, 2014 12:20 PM (baL2B)

338 336 The Freescale thing is interesting, but two problems: 1) These are guys who shuttled (shuttle?) back and forth regularly between China and Malaysia. http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/03/09/malaysia-airlines-freescale-idUSL2N0M602O20140309 So they were likely just doing semiconductor manufacturing in the Far East - think smartphone components - not the guys who are involved with Freescale's secret-squirrel defence work. 2) There's no question that countries have gone to all kinds of crazy lengths to steal each others defence secrets. But hijacking a big airliner full of US and Chinese citizens? Kidnapping employees of a powerful US company? Then, what, just killing everyone else, or throwing them in some kind of Gitmo somewhere? That would surely be far over the line politically: basically another 9/11 and almost certain to start some kind of war if you are caught.

Posted by: anonymous irishman at March 18, 2014 12:59 PM (DJgfL)

339 "Wait, the pilot had like a commercial grade flight sim? Dayum. I thought they meant he bought a copy of Microsoft Flight"

Not exactly, more like he built (as many flight sim enthusiasts have done) a cockpit shell, with replicated switches, etc, multiple screens, and all running MSFS or X-Plane:

Go to youtube and search "home flight simulator cockpit" to see what I'm talking about.  Some enthusiasts will spend up to 20 grand to make a realistic looking cockpit.

Posted by: cheshirecat at March 18, 2014 01:46 PM (SESZj)

340 "Stop and think of our amazing satellite and radar capabilities. Many used for early detection of ICBMs. Are we really supposed to believe it is not known exactly where this plane is or went down?"

An ICBM is pretty large and moves at supersonic speeds into LEO.  It has a pretty big footprint to track.  A subsonic airplane doesn't.

Furthermore, most of the ICBM tracking stations focus on the Northern Hemisphere, not the South (it's far more difficult to launch an ICBM in the Southern Hemisphere and get it to the USA without it running out of fuel).

Posted by: cheshirecat at March 18, 2014 01:49 PM (SESZj)

341 "Especially if there are verified engine updates that could be triangulated?"

To triangulate, you need at least two or more satellites receiving the data, in order to draw a triangle to determine position (hence, the term).


Posted by: cheshirecat at March 18, 2014 01:50 PM (SESZj)

342 "I know nothing about how these systems work, so is there routinely pre-flight access to that system by other than the pilots? Or could a Bad Guy Passenger have somehow gotten access, made the change, then taken over the plane with the new route logged in?"

The airline dispatcher can program it remotely with an ACARS datalink...that's not something your typical Bad Guy Passenger would have...


"Are there checks of the route before take off? I know a couple of pilots, though they don't pilot anything that huge, and they are all sticklers for check and recheck and then recheck the recheck."

Of course, in fact, it is in the many pre-flight checklists.  But you can change the waypoints during flight.


"I find it hard to believe that someone could just sneak that in there without notice of someone not in on the plot."

Which means one of the pilots probably changed the data mid-flight, either by both in collusion, or perhaps one of the pilots was incapacitated or distracted or perhaps on a bathroom break (not likely as the flight had just started). The dispatcher possibly could have, but again, the pilots would have known about it if that happened.

Posted by: cheshirecat at March 18, 2014 01:56 PM (SESZj)

343 " If it was hijacked, the Absence of Cellphone Calls From Missing FlightÂ’s Passengers tells us, what?"

You are out of range of the nearest cell tower.

Posted by: cheshirecat at March 18, 2014 02:01 PM (SESZj)

344 "Yes, but--an exploding 777 and all its fuel would trigger a bell or two."

It didn't for Lockerbie, why would it now?

Posted by: cheshirecat at March 18, 2014 02:03 PM (SESZj)

345 "They showed these pilots trying to land with these
wind gusts. I would have been screaming my head off. The plane goes up
down left right - really scary shit."

Meh, done all the time. In fact, landed in Baltimore last weekend when there were crosswinds...one missed approach, go around, landed second time.

Posted by: cheshirecat at March 18, 2014 02:06 PM (SESZj)

346 "How far could a 777 glide after it's engines are turned off? This could be the work of some very environmentally conscientious fanatical new branch of alqueda on gaia group."

Depends on it's speed, altitude, descent angle and weight.

Posted by: cheshirecat at March 18, 2014 02:10 PM (SESZj)

347 If a pilot uses a flight simulator, is that an... airbusman's holiday?

Posted by: Frank Underwood (D-SC) at March 18, 2014 02:15 PM (OpaBw)

348 http://tinyurl.com/oxm4eo4 "...Residents of the remote Maldives island of Kuda Huvadhoo in Dhaal Atoll have reported seeing a "low flying jumbo jet" on the morning of the disappearance of the Malaysia Airlines flight MH370. Whilst the disappearance of the Boeing 777 jet, carrying 239 passengers has left the whole world in bewilderment, several residents of Kuda Huvadhoo told Haveeru on Tuesday that they saw a "low flying jumbo jet" at around 6:15am on March 8. They said that it was a white aircraft, with red stripes across it – which is what the Malaysia Airlines flights typically look like. Eyewitnesses from the Kuda Huvadhoo concurred that the aeroplane was travelling North to South-East, towards the Southern tip of the Maldives – Addu. They also noted the incredibly loud noise that the flight made when it flew over the island. "I've never seen a jet flying so low over our island before. We've seen seaplanes, but I'm sure that this was not one of those. I could even make out the doors on the plane clearly," said an eyewitness..." Hey, guess what's about 8,000 ft long, on the island of Addu? 00d 41' 40" S, 73 09' 19" E

Posted by: just da facts, ma'am. at March 18, 2014 02:18 PM (3nRE7)

349 "if I hear one more guy say "no one ever had an idea about flying a plane into a building before osama"

Me too.

Posted by: Zombie Tom Clancy at March 18, 2014 02:20 PM (SESZj)

350 "Hey, guess what's about 8,000 ft long, on the island of Addu?"

Runway 10/28 of Gan International Airport, I presume.  Still, many atolls have airstrips, is this one part of the ones that the flight simmer was practicing on?

It's also not exactly a disused airstrip, it hosts tourist travellers for the Maldives.


Posted by: Zombie Tom Clancy at March 18, 2014 02:28 PM (SESZj)

351 /Sockzombie off

Posted by: cheshirecat at March 18, 2014 02:29 PM (SESZj)

352 Yup, Gan IA. The money quote from that article linked above: "...Satellite data suggests that the last "ping" was recieved from the flight somwhere close to the Maldives and the US naval base on Diego Garcia. But the Maldives is not amongst the countries that Malaysian authorities had sought help from in its search for the missing jet..." So, why didn't this come out earlier? Nobody asked them!

Posted by: just da facts, ma'am. at March 18, 2014 02:41 PM (3nRE7)

353
Pakistan,  Karachi or beyond, bichez.


Posted by: CO at March 18, 2014 03:25 PM (Vf2XA)

354 Hacking an Airliner with an Android Phone: http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-04-12/hacking-an-airplane-with-only-an-android-phone

Posted by: JohnW at March 18, 2014 05:34 PM (aM/gc)

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