1 but he's hawt

2 Whats the big deal.

I smoke in the plane bathroom all the time.

All you have to do is tamper with the smoke detector.

3 Arrogant fool deserves it. I'm not sure I buy the official govt story, but (assuming it's true) it was a terrible thing to joke the way he did. He deserves much more than this (prison, at least), but that's not my call.

4 Maybe he can be reassigned to Israel. Wait a second...

5
Reassigned to where, Department of Homeland Security?

6 We don't know all the details so i will reserve comment. But I will say the airline acted stupidly.

7

3 Arrogant fool deserves it. I'm not sure I buy the official govt story, but (assuming it's true) it was a terrible thing to joke the way he did. He deserves much more than this (prison, at least), but that's not my call.

I hope he got at least a bit roughed up while he was being restrained.

/Today going better than yesterday, ex-consort of Hades? 

 

8 Persona non grata.

9 I'd give him a B+ for diplomacy

10

9 I'd give him a B+ for diplomacy

B++ for appropriate humor too.

11
Anybody watching the masters? 

12 Can't he be the diplomacy czar?

13 I bet he was a Mormon.

14 He likely will be beheaded when he gets back to Qatar, because his smart-ass mouth could have easily been perceived as an Act of War.

15 7 3 I hope he got at least a bit roughed up while he was being restrained.

I'd do it.

/Today going better than yesterday, ex-consort of Hades? 

Kinda. Thanks for asking.

16 That's just how we roll.

17 I wonder what would've happened if I did that while in uniform on official military orders..... I'm guessing ten years of federal prison ass rape

18 With any luck his next assignment will be Iran.  I hear it's nice this time of year.  Or better yet, Haiti.

19 >> I'd give him a B+ for diplomacy

Well.... yeah.  Everyone knows that good diplomacy starts with a nuanced disdain for American laws and ways of life.

20 Surely fuckers like this are henceforth banned from flying to and within the US (and Europe, I would hope), right?  Is there an actual "banned from flying" list?

21 Tampering with an airline smoke detector? Federal offense, no? A felony, no? Why have laws if this guy skates?

22

I'm sick of Tiger too but this is pretty good.

23 Nothing good will come from this whole thing.

It has great spin potential for everyone's agenda.

24 Surely fuckers like this are henceforth banned from flying to and within the US (and Europe, I would hope), right? Is there an actual "banned from flying" list? Posted by: buzz at April 08, 2010 02:50 PM (kwhut) Hey we're not at war with islam--didn't you get that memo?

25 Not that I'm being pessimistic or anything.

26 because his smart-ass mouth

O...M...G... ARE YOU SEWIOUS? ATM? YOU NEVER GO ATM!

27 I'd say I was stunned by this guy's arrogance, but I'm really not. There is certainly a sense of entitlement among these cats.

I'm not sure as to which sorts of "cats" you're talking about.  Did you mean diplomats or muslims, because the muslims have been pulling this sort of arrogant shit ever since they figured out that the US was more into white guilt than national security.  We've had the Flying Imams and tons of other cases where these cats have done stuff that any normal American (excluding The Precedent and his ilk) would not have tried, especially given the tensions, but muslims seem to have taken up the view that the world owes them - not that they ever get any pushback on that from the West. 

This is a probing of the West on a grand scale.  Not centralized, but just some sort of individual behavior on their part that has been activated by our reluctance to call a spade a "spade" and our pathetic way of fighting wars, drawing distinctions between the fighters and the populations that they don't draw, themselves.  We declare mosques to be religious sites, worthy of special treatment, and they treat their own mosques as nothing more than regular buildings with extra protection.

As to our allies in the arab world (such as Qatar/Gutter) Americans will eventually learn that there is no such concept as loyalty among arabs.  There are temporary alliances, but that is the extent of it.  Americans seem to have a hard time coming to grips with this.

So .. yeah, these cats are arrogant, and in the most inappropriate circumstances, too.

28 Is there an actual "banned from flying" list?

Yes. People on it can fly.

29 Damn.  No cigarette summit.

30 You know what might be nice, an actual apology.  The passengers on the plane were delayed for SIX hours for FBI interviews.  Unfortunately, these bastards get free passes on almost everything under their diplomatic credentials.

31 Shoe Bomb II: The Smokening.

32 Muslim diplomats are assholes squared.

33 You know what might be nice, an actual apology.  The passengers on the plane were delayed for SIX hours for FBI interviews. 

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at April 08, 2010 02:58 PM (7VvJB)

Those passengers should file a class action suit against Qatar.  After all, diplomatic immunity for the individual means that that state is wholly responsible for his actions.  It makes sense to me.

34

You Americans never understand how put-upon we Muslims feel after the decadeÂ’s long jihad against our countries by the Imperialist American Armed Forces.

Yes, I harbor a great deal of resentment against America and Americans, and on this particular flight, two men of southern extraction were very condescending to me, calling me raghead, dress wearing pussy, right hand ass wiper, couscous gobbler, goat fucker, and other bad names.

This is the reason I smoked in the lavatory because of you bastards,  and to relieve the stress of sitting next to infidels.  May Allah strike you bastards down with prejudice and hatred for your evil imperialistic society.

PS  I love BBQ pork sandwiches. and BLT's.

 

 

35

"You know what might be nice, an actual apology."

I can ghost-write it for him...  Does butt-face have one t or two?

36

"Likely To Be Reassigned?"

Does that mean he was a tranny?

I'm confused. Hold me.

37

Someone school me on the purpose of "diplomatic immunity". We want to avoid offending other countries by hasseling their officials over stupid little things, right?

But it isn't to allow some dipshit like this to joke about being a terrorist while breaking the law, is it? I mean, isn't this guy being just a little bit extremely offensive to begin with?

38 PS  I love BBQ pork sandwiches. and BLT's.

But does your goat go ATM?

39

Can fire even burn tobacco?

I'm just asking questions

40 Can anybody say "test run"?

41

"19 >> I'd give him a B+ for diplomacy

Well.... yeah.  Everyone knows that good diplomacy starts with a nuanced disdain for American laws and ways of life.
"

Yeah, and that's just the American state department.

42 Well, said dildo is a diplomat from an absolute monarchy, after all. Which probably means that he is son of a sheik or some such thing, given a cushy spot because of the circumstances of his birth. Which means that he's naturally an arrogant, entitled dickhead. Which he's proven.

43

Mohammed Al-Madadi has been banished to Qatar with his Magic Carpet he ripped off from Disneyworld, and can return to his native country for a week of re-training, and thence a re-posting to London where ragheadness is more accepted than in racist Washington.

44 But it isn't to allow some dipshit like this to joke about being a terrorist while breaking the law, is it? I mean, isn't this guy being just a little bit extremely offensive to begin with? Posted by: Randy at April 08, 2010 03:05 PM (zQKSr) He could commit murder and there is nothing we could do but expel him.

45 I've known a lot of Arab guys to get really fanatical about their smoking. So in that sense also, not just that he's a self-entitled diplomat, this doesn't surprise me.

46

We shouldn't make this a bigger incident than it is. We need Qatar. If i am not mistaken we have a rather large base there, or centcom, or something important. Let's not alienate our quasi allies, especially when it looks like we just lost one in Krgyzistan.

This guy is an idiot, needs to go to another country, lets sweep the rest under the rug.

47

I've known a lot of Arab guys to get really fanatical about their smoking.

So let them fly private. No problem.

48 When I'm president, we'll be expelling people via the catapult.

49 39 - Intriguing.  What did Obama know about tobacco, and when did he know it?  I think the American people deserve some serious answers to serious questions.

50 "He could commit murder and there is nothing we could do but expel him.

Posted by: nevergiveup at April 08, 2010 03:07 PM (0GFWk) "

But why? Are we worried that Islam will declare double war on us or something?

Little worthless countries wouldn't even see airplanes if someone hadn't told them what that black goo was for, anyway.

51

I've known a lot of Arab guys to get really fanatical about their smoking. So in that sense also, not just that he's a self-entitled diplomat, this doesn't surprise me.

Elif air ab tizak!

52 Well, said dildo is a diplomat from an absolute monarchy, after all. Which probably means that he is son of a sheik or some such thing, given a cushy spot because of the circumstances of his birth. Which means that he's naturally an arrogant, entitled dickhead. Which he's proven.

Posted by: Chainsaw Chimp at April 08, 2010 03:07 PM (pLTLS)

My question is how many slaves he owns.  I know that Qatar outlawed slavery way, way, way back in 1952 ... but they still have it in practice - as is true around more than a few of the muslim arab nations.

It's sort of odd how blacks have latched onto islam, thinking it likes blacks better than the evil West, where blacks do better than they have ever done anywhere else, when it was the arab-islamic slave trade long before the Europeans ever had a notion about it, and it is the islamic world (and the arabs, in particular) where slavery is still culturally accepted.  Very strange.  But, this is one of those inconvenient truths that Gore must have been talking about in his Nobel Prize winning flash presentation.

What a world!

53

This guy is an idiot, needs to go to another country, lets sweep the rest under the rug.

Posted by: Ben at April 08, 2010 03:07 PM (wuv1c) 

Sir Edmund Hillary Clinton of Mt. Everest fame has taken it upon herself to sweep this turd under the edge of the carpet, spray the entire room with Fabreze, and issued the apology to Qatar for the over reaction of both the Air Marshalls and the United Airlines flight crew.  The turd has disappeared.

54 48 When I'm president, we'll be expelling people via the catapult.

That reminds me of the satiric computer game Nuclear War...

"Infidel Castro has just launched dissidents at Kookamamie's country.  Kookamamie's country gains 2 million citizens."

55 Those passengers should file a class action suit against Qatar.  After all, diplomatic immunity for the individual means that that state is wholly responsible for his actions.  It makes sense to me.

That would be great but that'll get thrown out on immunity grounds.  I'm blanking on the exact name of it but there's a theory of law that US citizens can't pursue actions against foreign states due that mucking about with diplomacy. 

56

I smoke in airplane restrooms all the time.

But I'm smoking pole, guess that could make a difference.

57 May Allah strike you bastards down with prejudice and hatred for your evil imperialistic society.

Tell Allah he's got the address, and I'll be waiting.  Also tell him that if he's going to strike me dead I'm ok with that, but not to be a hypocrite and hang out after the fact to watch sports center on the big screen.  

Also if you get a chance you might want to ask him about this whole 40 virgins thing, see if you can get some pictures first.  I mean if your going to be strapping a bomb to your chest you might want to check to make sure your not going to end up with 40 chicks that are virgins only because nobody else would get anywhere near them.

Think about it, you scream blah blah blah at the top of your lungs, blow yourself up, you wake up in "paradise" and are surrounded by 40 women who are so nasty they have to sneak up on a glass of water.  That's right, your stuck for all eternity with 40 hags that make Nancy Pelosi look like a supermodel. 

So seriously guys, you might want to double check that before your next Jihad.  Just a thought.

58 Sovereign immunity.

59 I spent some time in and around DC for about 3 years.  One of the first lessons you learn is to keep your eye on the vehicles with diplomatic plates.  Since they were generally "on business" traffic laws and parking violations meant little nothing at all.

You definitely didn't want to get into an accident with one.  You learned to give them as much room as possible and to get the hell away from them before they did something stupid to shit up your day.

Not surprising that they have the superiority complex thing going on everywhere else in their life, too.

60 I've known a lot of Arab guys to get really fanatical about their smoking.

Posted by: Christoph at April 08, 2010 03:07 PM (0fq7b)

Fanatical about smoking, huh?  They also kill their own daughters for looking at a guy.  That's the culture.  It's called "primitive" and "savage".  The smoking is not something special.

61

"Can anybody say "test run"?"

Disturbing, seeing as how this man was apparently questioned by marshalls after he was done smoking his cigarette.  As opposed to "during."  Or, "immediately upon ignition."

It's a tiny bathroom.  I would hope that the detector would go off quickly.  Did it?  If not, why?  Did he disable it (which would indicate knowing he shouldn't be smoking in there)?

62

Posted by: progressoverpeace at April 08, 2010 03:13 PM (N49h9)

Racist!

Seriously, it's one of the greatest ironies, I think. Esp with the likes of Keith Ellison.

Dan-o, if you're still around, I emailed you at your moron-la gmail addy.

63

How about that Tom Watson posting a 67?  British Open repeat?

64

Posted by: StuckOnStupid at April 08, 2010 03:16 PM (e8T35)

See Achmed the Dead Terrorist for clarification.

65 Diplomatic immunity is so that arrogant, useless dickwads like this guy can come to our country and treat us like vermin. As for the "we need Qatar" crowd, just what exactly are we getting out this deal? Cheap oil? I don't think so. The right to die and pay to save their necks the next time they get their nuts in a wringer (which they always will)? Ding, ding, ding. This is all a net negative, we are getting hosed financially so that these inbred idiots can live like kings. Like kings? Excuse me, they are kings. Jettison this bilge. Just my $.02

66 That would be great but that'll get thrown out on immunity grounds. I'm blanking on the exact name of it but there's a theory of law that US citizens can't pursue actions against foreign states due that mucking about with diplomacy.

Posted by: alexthechick at April 08, 2010 03:14 PM (8WZWv)

No problem. Sue them in Spain. Spanish courts have jurisdiction over the whole galaxy. Just ask them.

67 "He could commit murder and there is nothing we could do but expel him"

Ya'll have been watching too many movies. It doesn't work that way.

68 Mickelson 5 under, 2 holes to play.

69

 

One more time, Achmed the Dead Terrorist

70

Hey, I hate to interrupt...but did you guys hear that I'm gonna be on Amercian Idol?!!!!!!!

I'm gonna be singing a version of the Black Eyed Peas classic: My Humps

My humps, my humps, my lovely lady lumps

71

Maybe it was one of those "funny" cigarettes. You know what I mean.

He was "smoking down" and then he got "punched down."

What would "clowning down" be? lgf?

72

Yeah reason, I think there are unanswered questions that will remain that way. I still don't understand how they are managing to shut up entire aircrafts of passengers after incidents like this happen.

As I mentioned on another thread, I don't think we should forget that one of the "jihad janes" is from Colorado and also a NYC guy was arrested in Colorado last summer for attempting to buy a large quantity of chemicals--which he was planning on using in an attack in NYC.

God help me, it's wrong, but I almost wish one of them would succeed eventually so we can stop this pretense of "co-existing" and finally take on the threat.

Sadly, I also know I sound a bit like a truther or a birther, but really, the dots are there to be connected how many more "situations" have to happen before the picture becomes clear?

73

I bet he's going to be so pissed off at us when he is sent home.  I mean, sure Obama has completely screwed up the dollar, but it beats going home and getting paid in goats. 

Plus, after living in the DC area, it's going to suck to have to go home and date those goats.

74

63  Outstanding!

See my post at #22?

75

"so nasty they have to sneak up on a glass of water"

This notion amuses me.

76

#67  Ya'll have been watching too many movies. It doesn't work that way.

Really?  Are you also saying that if I was convicted of killing somebody but they weren't really dead - they just faked their death to get me in prison, I couldn't just shoot them "in the middle of Mardi Gas" and get away scot free?

My world-view is shattered.

/Hated that movie.

77

Maybe  he was mistaken about what the Mile "High" Club is about.

I myself am a member.

Yeah, but I was alone.

78 68 Mickelson 5 under, 2 holes to play.

whoo-hoo!

79 AP sources: Diplomat in airline scare from Regan-Nat'l was headed to consular visit with jailed al-Qaida agent when joked about shoe bomb. figures

80 "There is certainly a sense of entitlement among these cats."

Do you mean the Violent Extremists?

81

"79 AP sources: Diplomat in airline scare from Regan-Nat'l was headed to consular visit with jailed al-Qaida agent when joked about shoe bomb.
figures "

Say what?

82 God help me, it's wrong, but I almost wish one of them would succeed eventually so we can stop this pretense of "co-existing" and finally take on the threat.

I hate to say it, but I think that's what it's going to take, PGiS. The people running the country, and that includes a lot of Rs, are so deep in denial it'll take something really big and really bad to wake them up. And some are just plain stuck on stupid.

83

OMG!!!!111111!!1

I just heard that San Fran has declared you can't eat meat on Mondays.

WHY DO THEY HATE GAY PEOPLE?1!!111111!!!

84 Not to worry, Barry will head over there, bow to them, and then bum a smoke off them and say, Ya know, I smoke all the time when I fly now.

85

i hope they went all "capone" on him

86 @82 ... I hate those "COEXIST" bumperstickers.  Whenever I see one, I want to take the owner (Prius and all) and drop them off in Afghanistan.  Let's see how well they "coexist" then.

87 I just heard that San Fran has declared you can't eat meat on Mondays. WHY DO THEY HATE GAY PEOPLE?1!!111111!!! I'm not asking, so don't tell me.

88 I find it hard to believe Qatar is so broke that this asshole has to take coach.

89 why can't you eat meat on monday?

90 Hmmm seems my memory likens Cigarette Man to Senator Cell Phone. Conspiracy to waste travelers time. Send out Mulder to investigate!

91 Smoke 'em if ya got 'em. Wait, wha?

92

@83 ... this is so wrong and I apologize in advance but ...

 

They don't hate gays because fruit isn't meat.

93

Hey Vic, how does it work then?  I've read many articles about diplomats being let off scott free for all sorts of felonies.

What happens is they are declared personal non grata and expelled from the country.

I suppose their home country could voluntarily strip their diplomatic immunity, but that is up to them.

Bottom line it, I think it does work that way.  Much to our sorrow.

94 i don't know why he didn't just light up in his seat

95 And speaking of arrogant, Nancy Pelosi on why the voters shouldn't care that they weren't told thet ruth about what ws in the health care bill:

"ItÂ’s like the back of the refrigerator. You see all these wires and the rest. All you need to know is, you open the door. The light goes on"

File this under Let Them Eat Left Over Cake.

From Hot Air Headlines (or, as I prefer to call it, the Other AOSHQ.)

96

Am I up late? 'Rum and PGiS are both here?

Dang. Howdy, ladies.

(I work nights so I pretty much see the ONT after the fact).

Other than that. If anyone here tried that crap, we would still be sitting in some sort of holding cell awaiting bail. And I'm guessing bail would be a lot higher than any of our relatives could pay.

97

They don't hate gays because fruit isn't meat.

Posted by: Maxine Waters' Ugly Ass Glasses at April 08, 2010 03:32 PM (eJl5O)

We won't even touch that kind of fruit!

98 What movie are you talking about?  Is this that Lethal Weapon movie with the South Africans?

99

from reader's digest......"Between 1997 and the end of 2002, foreign diplomats racked up more than 150,000 unpaid parking tickets -- totaling a staggering $18 million. But thanks to diplomatic immunity, the city has no power to collect."

 

this is just in new york

 

 

100 Is this that Lethal Weapon movie with the South Africans?

Posted by: Ed at April 08, 2010 03:36 PM (OCfDT)

Yes. The original title was "PC Weapon".

101

"I still don't understand how they are managing to shut up entire aircrafts of passengers after incidents like this happen."

Call me names if you wish, but if I were a witness to an "incident," and the FBI told me to keep my yap shut about it...I'd keep my yap shut.  Especially if I had gotten a first-row seat to the air marshalls "subduing" this fine gentlemen.

102 "The smoking is not something special." No, the arabs are often pretty fanatical about smoking. They're not exactly at our current culture's stage of banning it everywhere. The see it as normal and as a right. Also, as others have done, to refer to Arabs as savage is simply wrong. Some are, some aren't. Most Arabs I know are decent, family-oriented, wistful (as in they have a repressive religious culture, but still wistfully long for certain things) people. Arab women are often lovely. And the men vary, with some being excellent of course. Not every Arab is a jihadi or close to it. If you think so, you're ignorant and prejudiced, etc., etc.

103 Hey, HH! Nice to see ya.

This whole thing stinks to high heaven. Sadly, nothing will be done about it and certainly not while we have teh Doofus as president.

104 from reader's digest article on diplomats.........."In early 2005, Virginia police closed in on a suspected child predator -- a man in his 40s who cops say drove four hours to meet a 13-year-old girl he'd met on the Internet, promising to teach her about sex. It turned out the girl was really a cop, and officers arrested the man at a shopping mall.

But then it was the police who got an unpleasant surprise. Their suspect, Salem Al-Mazrooei, was a diplomat from the United Arab Emirates -- and therefore covered by "diplomatic immunity." The cops had to let him go. Days later, Al-Mazrooei left the country, never having spent a night in jail.

105 I hate to say it, but I think that's what it's going to take, PGiS. The people running the country, and that includes a lot of Rs, are so deep in denial it'll take something really big and really bad to wake them up. And some are just plain stuck on stupid.

Posted by: wherestherum at April 08, 2010 03:27 PM (gofDd)

That's exactly right.  But even if the worst happens, we will not respond strongly enough.  All that will happen is that we'll try to find "the guilty" who's ashes will probably be smoking amid the disaster they cause.  Then we'll try to find the mysterious backers of the perpetrators, but they will either never be found or we will not have proof-positive that they did it, even though we know they did.  And we'll maybe bomb a few folks and call it a day until they do it to us again.  Meanwhile the so-called "moderate" muslims are breeding, pumping out a whole new crop of suicidal zealots with every generation. 

Our whole policy of dealing with these pukes is like dealing with an angry little kid who's trying to take a swing - just put your arm out and push his head back so he flails his angry punches in vain.  But this little kid is determined, nasty, ruthless, and learning.  It's going to be like Israel around here one of these days - with regular attacks by muslims becoming part of the ho-hum daily grind.  "Say, Joe, I'd love to have coffee with ya but the Starbucks just blew up again.  Third time this year.  Go figure." 

There is a solution to the muslim problem, but nobody is willing to take the unpleasant steps necessary to insure security and peace.  Instead we sit back, deflecting what attacks we can and getting a punch in here and there, waiting for them to finally figure out how to beat us.

106

When I was a young manager I made the mistake of hiring the son of a career diplomat. He looked good on paper, but something just didn't feel right.

He was one of the most arrogant sons of bitches I have ever met in my life. The sense of entitlement came off of him in waves.

His abilities were sub par, which he absolutely rejected of course, it was everyone else's problem or because the company was so fucked up.

Canned him after 6 months.

107 Just got this Fox new e-mail alert.  Apologies if this has already been posted:

Diplomat who caused midair scare was on way to visit with imprisoned Al Qaeda agent
-------

O RLY?

108

But thanks to diplomatic immunity, the city has no power to collect.

So is the reverse true? Can U.S. diplomats do the same thing in London, or even Qatar?

Because if this is one-sided...

109 I remember after 9/11 when we went in and dropped a few warning shots in the ME. That shut everyone up for awhile. Too bad we can't do that every so often, just to keep that area on its toes.

110 Good story, Dave in Texas. And I'm sure such entitlement isn't limited to Arabs.

111

"ItÂ’s like the back of the refrigerator. You see all these wires and the rest. All you need to know is, you open the door. The light goes on"

This is shit that cannot be made up.  Nancy, you have finally gone beyond beclowing yourself to truly evoking the first tinges of pity from me...

Door goes open, light comes on!

Key goes in, car goes vrooom!

Democrat in office, votes go Yea!

112

never rent to diplomats, from the same reader's digest article...."Perhaps the most brazen deadbeats, though, were officials from Zaire who stopped paying rent to their private landlord and ran up $400,000 in debt. When the landlord sued, the U.S. State Department defended the Zaireans, saying they were protected by immunity -- and a circuit court agreed. The landlord finally cut off the utilities; that's when the officials fled without paying their back rent. (Later, the landlords reportedly reached an "amicable agreement" with Zaire.) "

 

i don't know what "amicable agreement" means in this matter

113 >>Arab women are often lovely. And the men vary, with some being excellent of course.

Excellently lovely, you mean?

Or excellent how?

114 "Excellently lovely, you mean?" "Or excellent how?" Don't you think an Arab fireman risking his life to save a family trapped in a building is "excellent"? Or for that matter, the Egyptian Arab medical personal who saved the life and patched up a North Carolinian girl I know after she was in an awful car accident? And as far as "lovely" goes, I am certain there are some women who would say, "Yes." Arabs are.... people.

115 Arabs are.... people.

Posted by: Christoph at April 08, 2010 03:49 PM (0fq7b)

So is Soylent Green.

Couldn't resist.

116

Hey Vic, how does it work then?  I've read many articles about diplomats being let off scott free for all sorts of felonies.

 

It depends on the crime committed, the diplomatic level of official, AND in some cases, the particular country in question due to specific treaties.

 

This chart from the DOS gives a summary

 

My understanding is that this guy is a “career consular official”.  If so he can be arrested for serious crimes, however if his “bad act” was part of official duties he can not be prosecuted. I would find it hard to consider smoking in the aircraft lavaoratory as an “official act” but it appears they are going to allow that.

 

Also, in most cases, countries will request that immunity be waived for serious stuff and most countries will either do that, or they will handle the prosecution themselves.  There has been a lot of cases on both sides of the fence on this.

 

The bottom line is that it is NOT a cut and dried issue where some Nazi looking thug can hold up an ID card after murdering a hot chick and say “Diplomatic Immunity” so Sgt Murtagh can then blow him away anyway.  

117

Arabs are.... people.

True. But so were the Aztecs. And I'm pretty sure none of us would have wanted to live in either of those cultures.

Not after growing up here.

 

118 I just want to know, why is my Vajayjay is so itchy and dry?

119 I had hot chili before a flight and had smoke coming out of my ass during the flight.

120 Not every Arab is a jihadi or close to it. If you think so, you're ignorant and prejudiced, etc., etc.

Posted by: Christoph at April 08, 2010 03:38 PM (0fq7b)

Nobody is saying it's a majority.  What we DO have is a large minority.  12.5% of young muslim Americans think that suicide bombings are sometimes justifiable.  http://tinyurl.com/yjxf62d

Look at Europe's crime problem (especially rape) and the pattern of muslim on non-muslim violence is unmistakable.  And the larger % of the population they are, the worse it gets.  http://tinyurl.com/y6ab3h

The "nice" muslims aren't really muslims.  They're apostates.  They just haven't gone ahead and declared themselves such.  Time to make a choice.  What is to win out with these people?  Common human decency, or the Koran?  There is no middle ground.  Every single place on earth where they are in charge is a problem area.  They are always attacking their neighbors, and generally causing misery.  They're a blight.

121 Muslim, diplomat... if this guy is a lawyer he could be the most annoying person alive.

122 Not every Arab is a jihadi or close to it. If you think so, you're ignorant and prejudiced...

Oh, that's rich! A bigoted asshole atheist wants to moralize about prejudice...

123 damn sock was stuck on me like a Mormon on Utah.

124 I agree with your points, Reactionary (except that not all "nice" Muslims are actually apostates -- unfortunately: believe me I wish they were).

125 Christoph and someguy. If shit could have bookends...

126 103   ...
Also, as others have done, to refer to Arabs as savage is simply wrong.

Some are, some aren't. Most Arabs I know are decent, family-oriented, wistful (as in they have a repressive religious culture, but still wistfully long for certain things) people.

Arab women are often lovely. And the men vary, with some being excellent of course.

Not every Arab is a jihadi or close to it. If you think so, you're ignorant and prejudiced, etc., etc.

Posted by: Christoph at April 08, 2010 03:38 PM (0fq7b)

Could you perhaps be a bit less general?

One Arab NOT "being a jihadi or close to it" makes your statement true. But there are a couple of hundred million Arabs in the world. We know of 19 or so who were. Then there's the Janjaweed in Sudan, The odds of the rest being not "close to it" (being a jihadi) seem greatly against you.

 

"wistful (as in they have a repressive religious culture, but still wistfully long for certain things)

So "wistful" is important? There are one or two Egyptian cleircs who wistfully long for the days when Muslims could own slaves ...  check Memri for video footage.

127

103 - Christoph @ 3:38

Yeah, Christoph, but until I read Gabe's, um, "News Flash" last night, I hadn't realized that those Shisha Hookak Narghile Pipes were portable. Since you're the expert here, what's the proper way to carry one of those bong pipes? Like a bagpipe under one arm, or how?

This site is sooooo educational. Notice the people who come here now, instead of reading graffitti on the walls on bathroom stalls. 

128 There's a difference between wistfully wishing for love, sex, and more freedom, than wistfully wishing for a return to religious slavery, Arbalest.

129 why can't you eat meat on monday?

Meat is Destroying Teh Planet™*.  But like tobacco, they're too pussy to ban it outright...and, entertainingly, "meatless Fridays" is offensive Christofascism.

* Not really, but their religions says it does.

130 Lots of Arabs are jihadist asshonls, and many who aren't can be persuaded in that direction because of both their religion and their cultural upbringing (although fortunately their culture made up of flesh and blood people is often less vitriolic than the insanity that is the Qu'ran as dictated by the mass-murdering Muslim pedophile, Mohammed). Yeah. I get all that. I certainly point it out with Arabs whom I talk to and those conversations tend not to go well. Yet there are still a lot of great Arab people.

131

128 There's a difference between wistfully wishing for love, sex, and more freedom, than wistfully wishing for a return to religious slavery, Arbalest.

True, Christophe, but:

1. There are, or were, more than a few Turks and other Muslims who emigrated to Germany and other parts of Europe, claiming that they simply wished to find a place where they could worship without interference.  We see how this is working out.

2. Your original and gery general point opened the door ...

 

132 >>>No, the arabs are often pretty fanatical about smoking.

Oy.  I agreed with this, but I tried to point out to you, in vain, that they are fanatical about most things.  This is an artifact of desert culture.  Something you know nothing about, evidently.

>>>Also, as others have done, to refer to Arabs as savage is simply wrong.

Read much?  Did you even read my short comment to see what I said?  Maybe you didn't understand it.  Let me repeat it my EXACT words very slowly for you:

That's. the. culture..  It's. called. "primitive". and. "savage"..

I know that the idea was very complex and difficult to folow, but the "it" in the second sentence referred to THE CULTURE.  And it - THE CULTURE - is primitive and savage.  There is no question about this, at all.

Some are, some aren't. Most Arabs I know are decent, family-oriented, wistful (as in they have a repressive religious culture, but still wistfully long for certain things) people.

Proof by anecdote.  That's great, Christoph.  You discuss like a dem.  You really just don't know jack shit.

Arab women are often lovely. And the men vary, with some being excellent of course.

Huh?  What the fuck are you babbling on about?

Not every Arab is a jihadi or close to it. If you think so, you're ignorant and prejudiced, etc., etc.

Posted by: Christoph at April 08, 2010 03:38 PM (0fq7b)

Most arabs (and most muslims, in general) support jihad and the war against the West.  That has been borne out in every poll that's been taken of the arab/persian/muslim world, and for people like you who are too stupid to understand this, they show it in their newspapers and media. 

Get a brain, Christoph.  You don't know jack about the arab world.  Desert cultures are very different from Western culture.  Life in a desert is always on the knife's edge, and they develop very fanatical cultures. This is why an arab can be your buddy for years, and then turn around and slice your throat one day, for seemingly no reason.  I tried to get this idea across to you by talking about honor killings, which take a certain attitude that few in the West could ever understand (thank G-d) but you conveniently ignored that.  There are thousands of other such examples, but I don't have time to instruct you on something that anyone with a brain should have been able to pick up pretty easily over the past few years (if you had been so ignorant of it beforehand).

133 Why don't the Arab pussies stop being all "wistful"  and "emo"and do something about it then?

How many more decades are they going to let old fuckers in dirty nightshirts beat their women and bankrupt their countries and starve them to death?

Let "wistful" Abu Samuel Mohammed bin Adams get off his ass and save the next generation of Arabs from these crazy sharia fucks.

It's not like they don't have a gozillion AK's and RPG's laying around.

134 Don't you think an Arab fireman risking his life to save a family trapped in a building is "excellent"?

Posted by: Christoph at April 08, 2010 03:49 PM (0fq7b)

Interesting example, Christoph.  In Saudi Arabia, if girls are suitably dressed to be inpublic, they must be allowed to burn in the school.  And the excellent arab fireman stand and watch.

Not a savage culture, at all.  Huh?

135 Look, progressoverpeace, the murdering you refer to is similar to murders that were often done in the name of religion, or motivated by religion, in the west. As we SECULARIZE our culture and increase the reliance on reason and science, this violence goes down... as religion is marginalized. Yes, desert culture had a lot of violence in it, as did f'n European culture, or native Indian culture, or whatever. We're violent primates. And sure you have more sick religious murders in Muslim cultures than in most for lots of reasons, including its very nature. But they were hardly unheard of in the west... they don't happen much within YOUR living memory... because of things like the Reformation and people like ME.

136 Not Reformation, duh. Enlightenment and Renaissance, duh. Although probably the Reformation too... wresting power from the grandaddy of the churches.

137 OK. Christoph has wandered back into the Atheist Utopia fantasy again.

Get the butterfly net.

138

"135 Look, progressoverpeace, the murdering you refer to is similar to murders that were often done in the name of religion, or motivated by religion, in the west.

As we SECULARIZE our culture and increase the reliance on reason and science, this violence goes down... as religion is marginalized. "

Dah, Comrade, as we showed once and for all in the good old USSR.

139

But they were hardly unheard of in the west... they don't happen much within YOUR living memory... because of things like the Reformation and people like ME.

Man, I don't even have time to start THIS history lesson.

140 Uh, this guy was apparently on his way to meet with an imprisoned al Qaeda member.

Doesn't that change the "mistaken/overreaction" story just a little bit?

141 "hy don't the Arab pussies stop being all "wistful" and "emo"and do something about it then?" Normal human apathy, to start with. And insha'Allah, which, yes, is very frustrating and annoying.

142 I'd prefer it if we had to look in history books for Muslim atrocities and not today's newspaper.

But I'm simple.

143 Hey Christoph, let me teach you about islam (which is just the formalization of desert arab culture, with an attendant mythology) in 5 easy steps:

1) Muslims must kiss the ground 5 times a day, showing how insignificant and worthless each person is.

2) Islam means "submission"

3) Apostacy is punishable by death

4) The islamic claendar was a step backwards in society and was a move back to a totally lunar calendar - unlike every other society on Earth, which were moving in the other direction.  Introduction of intercalaries are PUNISHABLE BY DEATH.

5) There are no days of rest in islam.

That's all you need to know about islam, and islamic cultures, to understand what they are really about.

144 35 million + babies and counting might have a different view than Christoph about the benefits of secularizing the culture.

145 "Atheist Utopia fantasy again." Atheists are still primates with instinctual interpersonal violence and the capacity for (again, instinctual) mass violence. The difference being we don't add religious violence on top of it. There is no atheist "utopia". It's simply the rejection of religion because it's counterfactual. It really is nothing more than using reason, science, common sense, or, yes, instinct, to make decisions, but not revealed religious texts and proclamations from others. It isn't an anti-violence panacea.

146

"Dah, Comrade, as we showed once and for all in the good old USSR.

Posted by: Stalin at April 08, 2010 04:19 PM (zQKSr) "

Copycat!

147

"145 "Atheist Utopia fantasy again."

Atheists are still primates with instinctual interpersonal violence and the capacity for (again, instinctual) mass violence.

The difference being we don't add religious violence on top of it. "

Anti-religious violence is still cool, right?

148 Lots of fancy words can't hide the fact that you are full of shit, Christoph.

I have a soul. My wife has a soul. My little two year old boy has a soul. I see it shining out of his eyes every time he smiles at me.

Fuck you and your "primates" bullshit.

149 Meh. I'm pro-life. As are others to at least a degree: (click link) Some religious people are pro-choice. The Bible doesn't mention abortion specifically (God must not have forseen it?) The REASON I'm pro-life is people only have one life, ever, and therefore it's infinitely precious to us. If innocent babies have souls and are blameless when they die (which they damn well should be! Or does Adam's "sin" of eating of the true of the fucking knowledge of good and evil of all things attach to babies in the womb???) then how is this even a big deal? God can just take them in his arms, bring them to heaven, and there we go. But that's nonsense, and we only get one life, so it's important that we protect the youngest amongst of... or they will never have anything. Yes, this is of course an instinct on my part to protect young babies. What's your point?

150 LINK FIXED

151 Hey you are are Kafirs, and deserve to die. 

I need a smoke.

Religion of Peace!

152 You wanna see a violent primate, tell a mother with a sick child that her child is some random accident of chemicals and evolution.

How much do you have to hate yourself before you try to negate your entire species' soul?

153 Arab women are often lovely.

Posted by: Christoph at April 08, 2010 03:38 PM (0fq7b)

 

Yeah, and they're often ugly, too, well, unless you want to expand that premise to include all Muslim women, in which case it can be said that many of the ones in Kroatia and Serbia are OUT-standing babes as a result of breeding with western Euopeans. 

154 Behead those who insult Islam.

155

"What's your point?"

Are you so dense as to be legitimately asking that, or are you ignoring the fact that abortion is strongly protested by religious people and supported by irreligious far more than vice versa?

156 I ought to accept, I suppose the perfectly rational, and really most likely rational scenario that the diplomat caused this scene "cracking wise". My intuition rebels and I'm not sure why. I guess that's what intuition is for. What if it WASN"T a "misunderstanding"? What would they do, how would they handle it? How would they handle a situation that is ambiguous, even? And now it's being reported that this guy's "mission" was to visit a jailed AQ sleeper cell operative, which isn't helping to shut up that nagging feeling that there is really more going on than diplomatic brattiness.

157 The infidel bitch set him up!

158 "Lots of fancy words can't hide the fact that you are full of shit, Christoph. I have a soul. My wife has a soul. My little two year old boy has a soul. I see it shining out of his eyes every time he smiles at me. Fuck you and your "primates" bullshit. I won't say "fuck you" just because you're wrong. I'm sure you love your life and your family greatly and there's a reason you believe what you believe. I'm sure your wife and child are lovely people, sifty. And I mean no offence to you or them to point out the truth, that we're mortal, and life should be taken seriously for that very reason. Including not limiting their pleasure for no reason with nonsense and guilt. Which may or may apply in your and in the future your family's case, but applies in a great many cases. I don't dispute that you have a "soul". I have nothing to base it on. I DO say that by all available evidence we ARE primates... and it isn't a particularly intelligent proposition to dispute this... or to teach it to one's children. If this fact is known now, it will be REALLY obvious in 20 years when science has made untold advances. As far as whether you, your wife, and your daughter have immortal souls or not, well, we disagree. It wouldn't bother me a bit to live forever. I'm not happy about the fact that I, and the person I love the most, will die and that her beauty will never ever grace this world again except as a memory for a while... and that she will feel fear and pain... and that her consciousness will be no more. That gives me no pleasure at all. However, the evidence supports this as the most likely conclusion, so I do what I can to make her, and my, life as good as possible in the meantime.

159 Chritoph, since you don't take my word for it, let me hit you with some Ibn Khaldun (Muqaddimah, 14th century), describing the arab cultures - which haven't changed much over time:

24. Arabs can gain control only over flat territory

Thiss is because, on account of their savage nature, (the Arabs) are people who plunder and cause damage. They plunder whatever they are able to lay their hands on without having to fight or to expose themselves to danger. They then retreat to their pastures in the desert. They do not at­tack or fight except in self-defense. Every stronghold or (locality) that seems difficult (to attack), they bypass in favor of some less difficult (enterprise). They do not attack it. Tribes that are protected against (the Arabs) by inaccessible mountains are safe from their mischief and destructiveness. The Arabs would not cross hills or undergo hardship and danger in order to get to them.

Flat territory, on the other hand, falls victim to their looting and prey to their appetite whenever they (have the opportunity of) gaining power over it, when there is no militia, or when the dynasty is weak. Then they raid, plunder, and attack that territory repeatedly, because it is easily (accessible) to them. Eventually, its inhabitants succumb utterly to the Arabs and then they are pushed around by them in accordance with changes of control and shifts in leadership. Eventually, their civilization is wiped out.

25. Places that succumb to the Arabs are quickly ruined.

The reason for this is that (the Arabs) are a savage nation, fully accustomed to savagery and the things that cause it. Savagery has become their character and nature. They enjoy it, because it means freedom from authority and no subservience to leadership. Such a natural disposition is the negation and antithesis of civilization. All the customary activities of the Arabs lead to travel and movement. This is the antithesis and negation of stationariness, which produces civilization. For instance, the Arabs need stones to set them up as supports for their cooking pots. So, they take them from buildings which they tear down to get the stones, and use them for that purpose. Wood, too, is needed by them for props for their tents and for use as tent poles for their dwell­ings. So, they tear down roofs to get the wood for that purpose. The very nature of their existence is the negation of building, which is the basis of civilization. This is the case with them quite generally.

Furthermore, it is their nature to plunder whatever other people possess. Their sustenance lies wherever the shadow of their lances falls. They recognize no limit in taking the possessions of other people. Whenever their eyes fall upon some property, furnishings, or utensils, they take it. When they acquire superiority and royal authority, they have complete power to plunder (as they please). There no longer exists any political (power) to protect property, and civilization is ruined.

Furthermore, since they use force to make craftsmen and professional workers do their work, they do not see any value in it and do not pay them for it. Now, as we shall mention, labor is the real basis of profit. When labor is not appreciated and is done for nothing, the hope for profit vanishes, and no (productive) work is done. The sedentary population disperses, and civilization decays.

Furthermore, (the Arabs) are not concerned with laws. (They are not concerned) to deter people from misdeeds or to protect some against the others. They care only for the property that they might take away from people through looting and imposts. When they have obtained that, they have no interest in anything further, such as taking care of (people), looking after their interests, or forcing them not to commit misdeeds. They often level fines on property, because they want to get some advantage, some tax, or profit out of it. This is their custom. It does not help to prevent misdeeds or to deter those who undertake to commit (mis­deeds). On the contrary, it increases (misdeeds), because as compared to getting what one wants, the (possible financial) loss (through fines) is insignificant.

------------------------------------------------------

Even the other muslims understood the truly savage nature of arab culture and not much has changed, at all.

160 >> Posted by: wherestherum at April 08, 2010 03:18 PM (gofDd)

Hey, I just sent you an email

161 I'm not ignoring it, Randy, and it's also a fact to say most Muslims, including jihadists, oppose abortion. I could go on about non-Muslim religions and other contradictions. People support a variety of good and bad positions. I often wonder if, on average, people's capacity for rational considered thought is a limited variable and that may explain why religious people are often quite sensible on certain issues, while believe in sometimes downright evil myths or histories in some cases (when they can be bothered to read these and seriously address them). And vice versa... that secular people, having figured certain things out, have only limited attention for other areas and so grossly oversimplify, leading to being liberals in the modern sense of the term.

162 Here is a bit of wisdom; the old saying Things are Not Always as They Seem does not mean Things are Never As They Seem Sometimes, things are damn well as they seem.

163 The funniest thing about arguing with atheists is if they are right, they're still fucked.

164 I know Arab culture stunts economic development, represses women, etc., progressoverpeace. I've only made the same point dozens of times myself over the years, often while talking with Arabs, including Arabs who like me and vice versa. I'm not talking about Arabs ability to manage crap. I'm talking about individual Arabs' (not all, some) essential humanity. How they treat their nieces, friends, and me. That sort of thing. And some are shitheads, sure. But I'm just doing the Martin Luther King thing and judging as individuals based on the content of their characters, not what some Imam in Iran or Saudi or up the street is saying.

165 Yeah. And when 37 dogs are tearing apart a rabbit, I'm sure the rabbit gives a shit about the 2 dogs licking their balls in the corner.

166

"161 I'm not ignoring it, Randy"

 Then his point that you were in fact wrong in your implications of relgion causing more violence than the absence of it [especially if one discounts islam] is not lost on you?

 "I often wonder if, on average, people's capacity for rational considered thought is a limited variable "

Highly over-rated, I agree, which makes the hubris of most athiests more than ... wistfully sad and downright deadly.

167 sifty--he's projecting his inadequacies onto the rest of us.  Feel sorry for him and move on to something important...

168 An excellent reference, progressoverpeace, and good reading. I don't say Arab culture is better. On the contrary, I have a crush on an Arab girl I've known for a couple years and vice versa. I don't like Arab culture and she doesn't like atheism. These 2 things are among the reasons we probably won't, but still talk about, forging a relationship. But, no, I don't want to live in an Arab nation and get killed for stuff I can say here and just piss people off. Further, the economy sucks compared to in the west and they -- all Arab nations -- can't even field an effective military to come close to protecting their borders against anything other than crappy Arab militaries. But there's still plenty of Arabs who are fine people.

169 Thanks Heather. i forget sometimes. not worth the effort to piss into the wind.

170 I'm talking about individual Arabs' (not all, some) essential humanity.

here's your first mistake.  You think in terms of individuals, since you are Western, but arabs think in terms of tribes and other collectives.  There is no sense of individualism among arab cultures, which is part of what I have been trying to tell you.  If you ever actually lived around arabs, you would know.  And I don't mean meeting some arab guy at the Starbucks, but in the middle east.  You do not understand their culture.  You project your own onto them and then assess it from there.

How they treat their nieces, friends, and me.

That sort of thing.

Again, you make a huge mistake, here.  You mistake cultural requirements of "hospitality" with actual friendship.  Many Westerners make this mistake, because they haven't overstayed their welcome (which is very easy to do and comes without any warning) to see the other side of all this.

Your personal relationships with arabs are not the same as arabs' relationships among themselves and how they act as groups.  I used to talk about this all the time, but there is a huge difference between the West and the middle east.  Succinctly, it comes down to:

Individualism/Guilt/Atonement versus Tribalism/Shame/Revenge

I don't think you understand how different a shame/Revenge based society from our guilt/atonement ones.  Most Westerners can't manage to get this, as it is very foreign.

Guilt is a private notion - I can only be guilty for things I have done.  I can feel guilt even if no one else knows what I did.  It is private and individualistic, which is why the individualistic Western cultures use it.

Shame, on the other hand, is the opposite.  It is a purely public notion.  I cannot be shamed if no one else knows what I did.  I can be shamed by the actions of others, without my input at all.

The differences in the antidotes for these are equally polar opposites.  Atonement is individualistic - I must make amends myself.  Revenge is public and must be taken out on others.  This is why Western cultures generate self-hating suicidal maniacs, while tribal cultures generate other-hating homicidal maniacs. 

And some are shitheads, sure. But I'm just doing the Martin Luther King thing and judging as individuals based on the content of their characters, not what some Imam in Iran or Saudi or up the street is saying.

Posted by: Christoph at April 08, 2010 04:42 PM (0fq7b)

No.  You are displaying an ignorance of arab culture and what that means.  You are judging it as if were just some tiny perturbation of our culture.  It is not.

171 I don't say Arab culture is better. On the contrary, I have a crush on an Arab girl I've known for a couple years and vice versa.

Posted by: Christoph at April 08, 2010 04:48 PM (0fq7b)

If you were in Gaza or Saudi Arabia, your interest in her could be tantamount to a death sentence for her - even if she didn't really show much interest in you, aside from looking your way once or twice.  That is what you seem to be missing.

172

Christolph, I think you are arguing against a strawman. No one is saying Arabs are less than human. Of course you can find examples of exemplary Arab or Muslim behavior (ther's a whole lot of them, after all), especially towards each other but even, now and then, I suppose towards outsiders.

But it is silly to say that you know nothing about someone if you know the culture they come from or the beliefs to which they subscribe, man's tendancy towards inconsistency not withstanding. You don't know for certain, but you could guess at several traits and attitudes that are quite harmful towards decent society and be right a large enough proportion to find a partial cause and effect relationship.

173 sifty, I am grateful for the religious people who are my allies in the fight against abortion. As I am for those whom I'm friends with, etc., usually the same group (as I'm more fanatical about abortion than I am about religion). Of course, I also have known plenty of religious people to be pro-life or have had abortions... or since men basically never talk about talking women into abortions, I've probably known some of those men too, without realizing it. In this case, you're correct: Abortion is more commonly practiced among secular people than religious, but the margins aren't as high as you think because religious conservatives may shun abortion, religious liberals don't always (Bart Stupak, anyone?).

174 Christoph and someguy. If shit could have bookends...
Posted by: sifty

Put Brad and Dianne in the middle of those bookends.

175 Putting it simply the Arab culture is barbaric and misogynist. Period.  Full Stop.

176 Chris, your head-patting condescension and elbow patches on the corduroy blazer intellectualism is wasted on me.

Just keep holding up those books.

177 "If you were in Gaza or Saudi Arabia, your interest in her could be tantamount to a death sentence for her." No, I'm not missing that. Thanks for pointing it out, though. That was decent of you.

178 Frankly I'm concerned about that even if she were to move to Canada.

179 However, the bigger reason she and I won't get together in the end is probably that she's into this whole lifelong monogamy thing... whereas I am not.

180 Now out on AP: The son of a bitch was going to meet a jailed al qaida operative. Well, what do ya know? Screw these assholes.

181 I am so happy that Christoph can be so tolerant of the Arab culture.  I don't have that well of tolerance.  It seems through the Arab worlds culture, statements and actions they would like nothing more than to wipe me and the rest of the Jews off the face of the planet.  So Christoph have fun with your friends until they come for you because my dear they will.

182 However, the bigger reason she and I won't get together in the end is probably that she's into this whole lifelong monogamy thing... whereas I am not.

Posted by: Christoph at April 08, 2010 05:03 PM (0fq7b)

Dude ... 

Okay. That was funny.

183 rawmuse, It certainly shows Mohammed (what else?) Al-Madadi was a cavalier asshole at a minimum. However, I SUPPOSE someone has to provide consular representation or whatever to detained terrorists... and I'm not sure where said terrorist was from. Qatar, maybe, or another country for whom Quatar provides representation? The most upsetting part of that article is that the U.S.A. is NOT going to declare Al-Madadi persona non grata. Hopefully they're just trying to save face for an ally and they've at least gotten Qatar to agree to shit-can that asshole tout de suite. But I'm not convinced.

184

However, the bigger reason she and I won't get together in the end is probably that she's into this whole lifelong monogamy thing... whereas I am not.

I feel ya, bro.

185 You play on, playa!

186

Put Brad and Dianne in the middle of those bookends.

Posted by: mpfs at April 08, 2010 04:54 PM (iYbLN)

 

Meow!!!  Ppfftt!!! Ppfffttt!!! Ppfffttt!!!!

 

_{(Psssst, mpfs, is their resident androngynuous intellectual here.)}

187 Word.

188

^{(secret note to any other trolls who happen to pass by here later:  GET BENT.)}

189

"The son of a bitch was going to meet a jailed al qaida operative. Well, what do ya know?"

There was a time in this country where this fact would cause him to be a little meeker than usual...

In the Age of Obama, this only emboldens the little puke.

190

However, the bigger reason she and I won't get together in the end is probably that she's into this whole lifelong monogamy thing... whereas I am not.

No worry, beef curry!

191 (Psssst, mpfs, is their resident androngynuous intellectual here.)

That will be news to my husband of twenty five years and my mother.

192 That will be news to my husband of twenty five years and my mother.

Posted by: mpfs at April 08, 2010 06:12 PM (iYbLN)

 

 

Aw geezez, you had to tell us that. Please convey our heartfelt sympathy to both.

(Psssst, she is also this site's resident androgynous yenta.)

193 You people are all just a bunch of faggots.

194 "193 You people are all just a bunch of faggots." Yeah, ya'll suck.

195 Obama missed another opportunity to show us the money... he could have a 5-8 point bounce, if he had managed the idiot smoker, a -hole, terrorists, comedy club wannabe "crisis"... and billed for the military jets. instead we all see Obama is weak.

196 PS Have you ever seen the way the "dips "park in NYC...over at Beekman Place... it's crazy, and they don't get a ticket because they have diplomat licenses.

197

Posted by: Vic at April 08, 2010 03:52 PM (QrA9E)

 

No, I think his smoking will be covered as part of his official duties because he was enroute to visit a fellow citizen in jail.  Presumably at the oders of his boss.

You can't say that the smoking wasn't covered because it was a crime, and thus not part of his official duties.  If that was the case, what is the point of diplomatic immunity?  You can't be arrested for anything official and hence legal, but you can be arrested for illegal acts?

Diplomatic immunity covers more than just espionage, which is about the only "official" act that is also illegal.

The purpose of diplomatic immunity is to keep nations from trumping up fake charges against diplomats they don't like, or for a simple criminal matter to gum up affairs of state.  Everyone accepts that abuses will occur, but that is just part of the cost of doing business.

I read the same chart you presented.  I read it on Wiki, while you went straight to the sourse at the State Dept. website.  Good on you.  But we seem to be interpreting it differently.

Official duties include going to visit a fellow citizen in prison, and cover crimes or arrests during these duties.

Something that would probably not be considered official duties is going down to New Orleans during a long weekend while officially off duty and getting busted for prostitution.

I agree with you that a nation can revoke the diplomatic immunity of one of their own.  However, you think it is common, and I think it is rare.

As far as our lavatory smoker, where did you hear that he was a consular official?  I see the difference in the chart and understand the difference.  But I think this guy was based in D.C., which indicates he was probably part of the embassy staff, and not some consulate in San Francisco or some other place.

198

Anyway, that Lethal Weapon movie with those South Africans was pretty much turned up to 11!!! in terms of hyping the whole "diplomatic immunity" thing, to stoke our collective outrage.

Which of course made this all the more satisfying.

All kidding aside though, yeah, you are right that there are different levels.

But, if the ambassador murdered someone, he could get away with it, if his government backed him.   Like if he was closely related to the countries dictator or something. 

199 Well , what do you expect. They have their guy in the White House who is decidedly pro Muslim and anti-Israel. Hell -they can do whatever they want and when Obama visits Quatar he will just bow to their leader as a good Muslim.

200 A Qatari diplomat who sparked a bomb security scare after sneaking a smoke in an airplane's bathroom will likely be sent home or transferred to another country, U.S. officials said Thursday. I hear that Zimbabwe is nice this time of year...

201 Remember, these state department clowns will give you a visa even if your father shows up and tells them that you're a terrorist asshole.

202 A Qatari diplomat who sparked a bomb security scare after sneaking a smoke in an airplane's bathroom will likely be sent home or transferred to another country, U.S. officials said Thursday.

Congratulations, Mr. Al-Madadi!!  You have been named consule of our new diplomatic outpost overseeing Qatar's interests in Antartica!  You are to assume your duties immediately, and take control of your office at the McMurdo station.  You are expected to attend to those duties for the next three years, year round.  Staff?  No, I'm afraid its only you.

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204 I remember in the '80s, the USSR mission to the UN had literally tens of thousands of NYC parking tickets they refused to pay on grounds of 'diplomatic immunity', and one righteous incident of rape where the Soviet diplomat got off scot free. 

205

This appears to be a dry run to me.  Terrorists using diplomatic emunity as cover.  Just an observation.

206

I hate to come across as a conspiracy nut, but this really does have dry run written all over it.

First of all, how the hell did he manage to light a cigarette?  With his fart?

Second of all, I'm a militant chain smoker and even I wouldn't be that arrogant and stupid on a flight as short as a run from DC to Denver.  Especially 30 minutes before landing. 

What happened to the 1 hour rule?

Nah, I'm not buying the smoke break story.

 

 

207

Just proves that the flight passengers should take this in to their own hands, before diplomatic immunity can kick in to protect these kind of jerks.  Diplomatic immunity only protects them from official U.S. government action, not from getting beaten half to death by an irate bunch of passengers.

Pretty soon, the job of the Air Marshals will be to keep these twits alive long enough to be repatriated. 

Then Obama can apologize for the "incivility" of U.S. citizens...it's what he seems to do best.

208 "Those passengers should file a class action suit against Qatar.  After all, diplomatic immunity for the individual means that that state is wholly responsible for his actions.  It makes sense to me."

It would be an individual suit on behalf of each of the passengers who chose to sue.  It's far too small and definite a number of people to certify as a class.

"That would be great but that'll get thrown out on immunity grounds.  I'm blanking on the exact name of it but there's a theory of law that US citizens can't pursue actions against foreign states due that mucking about with diplomacy."

It's the Foreign Sovereign Immunities Act.  Basically, and in very simplified terms, the only countries that aren't immune from suit in US courts are those that have no formal diplomatic relations with the US.  Hence, you can sue Iran or Cuba, and ultimately even get a default judgment or a jury award for some ridiculous amount of money, but you'll probably never collect most of it, since they don't have assets in the US for you to attach to satisfy the judgment and assets in other countries will likely be immune there.

209 Oh, and since this was apparently serious enough for air marshals to break cover, it would've been nice if they'd just shot him.  He's not immune from that.  Exigent circumstances, you know.

210

thank you ...

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211 It seems through the Arab worlds culture, statements and actions they would like nothing more than to wipe me and the rest of the Jews off the face of the planet.  So Christoph have fun with your friends until they come for you because my dear they will.

212 It seems through the Arab worlds culture, statements and actions they would like nothing more than to wipe me and the rest of the Jews off the face of the planet.  So Christoph have fun with your friends until they come for you because my dear they will.

213 Good post ! happy sharing ! thank you for sharing ! I hope see more here ...keep up with work......

214 Your blog is really very great i read your article and i found very great information and I would like to thank you for the efforts you have made in writing this post.I am hoping the same best work from you in the future as well.

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216 Very nice post! Congrats!

217 Well.... yeah.  Everyone knows that good diplomacy starts with a nuanced disdain for American laws and ways of life.

218 I would like to thank you for the efforts you have made in writing this post.I am hoping the same best work from you in the future as well.

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