March 16, 2010
— Gabriel Malor If you are so inclined to participate, the correct answer to Census Question 9, which asks about your race, is to check "Some other race" and fill in "American." We don't need no steenkin' official racialism from our government. The shameful division of Americans into skin-colored interest groups only encourages racial discord. And the use of Census data to apportion votes by drawing congressional districts is, in the words of Justice Thomas, political apartheid.
I was reminded of this today because I'm filling out my census questionnaire. I may or may not be filling out every question...
LATER: Alright, alright. The lawyers are crawling up my ass so, for liability purposes, go here to get the full skinny on what information you are required to provide on the Census and here to get Mark Krikorian's spin on it.
Civil disobedience sometimes comes with consequences. Otherwise everyone would be doing it all the time, or something like that. I know I'll see all you guys in the camps.
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at
05:03 PM
| Comments (290)
Post contains 177 words, total size 1 kb.
Posted by: Robert at March 16, 2010 05:05 PM (98ywz)
Posted by: Deathknyte at March 16, 2010 05:07 PM (e/J8k)
Posted by: Soap MacTavish at March 16, 2010 05:09 PM (554T5)
Posted by: LC at March 16, 2010 05:11 PM (Aaoov)
Posted by: di butler, superflybitch at March 16, 2010 05:11 PM (S3xX1)
Wonder if I shouldn't take it to the range and fill it out that way. See if that green laser is any good.
Waddya think, too much?
Posted by: Dang Straights at March 16, 2010 05:11 PM (+2v1H)
Posted by: Barbarian at March 16, 2010 05:12 PM (EL+OC)
Posted by: Donna at March 16, 2010 05:12 PM (6heFO)
Posted by: US State Department at March 16, 2010 05:13 PM (0GFWk)
Posted by: kbdabear at March 16, 2010 05:13 PM (sYxEE)
can I blow a census workers head clean off legally?
Might as well take no chances, don't answer and let them start crawling through a window first.
Posted by: Dang Straights at March 16, 2010 05:13 PM (+2v1H)
Posted by: nevergiveup at March 16, 2010 05:13 PM (0GFWk)
I'm thinking that a casual 3 MOA should take out most of the intrusive questions.
Posted by: Soap MacTavish at March 16, 2010 05:13 PM (554T5)
And, filled in "American" in the bottom boxes.
That made the most sense to me.
Posted by: franksalterego at March 16, 2010 05:14 PM (+6fgE)
Posted by: nevergiveup at March 16, 2010 05:15 PM (0GFWk)
Might as well take no chances, don't answer and let them start crawling through a window first.
I like it.
Posted by: Barbarian at March 16, 2010 05:16 PM (EL+OC)
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 05:16 PM (Mi2wf)
Posted by: Artruen at March 16, 2010 05:18 PM (L+dBi)
I may or may not be filling out every question...
Yes, you WILL answer every question we put to you or we will send people to your house, and if you still refuse to answer you will be fined and if you do not pay the fine you will be jailed.
Posted by: The United States of Obama at March 16, 2010 05:18 PM (F09Uo)
Posted by: Donna at March 16, 2010 05:19 PM (6heFO)
Posted by: mpfs at March 16, 2010 05:19 PM (QuP9W)
Posted by: Joe S. at March 16, 2010 05:19 PM (UsRyD)
Posted by: eman at March 16, 2010 05:20 PM (xJwcz)
Posted by: garrett at March 16, 2010 05:20 PM (XmEkh)
Posted by: nevergiveup at March 16, 2010 05:20 PM (0GFWk)
Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at March 16, 2010 05:20 PM (RZ8pf)
For discussion of potential legal liabilities, however, I commend to you the following from the Corner:
To Answer or Not to Answer the Census – That Is the Question
Our Race: American
Posted by: Troll Feeder at March 16, 2010 05:21 PM (j5yDX)
No, and in fact, you'll face a murder charge and rightfully so. The Feds are off limits as far as I'm concerned with all of these racial questions but one thing they are authorized to do Constitutionally is the census every ten years. Failure to answer the count is a crime on your part.
Posted by: Additional Blond Agent at March 16, 2010 05:21 PM (SHKl9)
Posted by: Jim in San Diego at March 16, 2010 05:22 PM (F09Uo)
Posted by: Joe S. at March 16, 2010 09:19 PM (UsRyD)
That's basically what I did too, Joe. They can use their fabulous public records to find out anything else they need to know.
Posted by: ProudinNC at March 16, 2010 05:22 PM (Edv29)
Posted by: Matt Harris at March 16, 2010 05:23 PM (AhnhA)
Posted by: RJ at March 16, 2010 05:25 PM (ADbI4)
Posted by: William at March 16, 2010 05:26 PM (77TeU)
lacey, I could go ghey for you. Or whatever, I don't know what I'm saying.
Posted by: mpfs at March 16, 2010 05:28 PM (QuP9W)
Posted by: eman at March 16, 2010 05:28 PM (xJwcz)
Not to mention that in doing so you're probably going to end up on the personal visit list of your area Census taker to "clarify".
Posted by: KSgop at March 16, 2010 05:28 PM (1B8Ua)
If I am reading what the guy over at National Review posted correctly, you can be fined for refusing to answer any of the questions on the form.
And, now that others have brought it up, I too am wondering if answering "American" will skew the racial counts of the country and then those numbers will be used in even more devious and evil ways.
I think I'll leave my census form on the table for a while and stare at it until calmer heads than I have solved all the debates.
Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at March 16, 2010 05:28 PM (RZ8pf)
Posted by: nevergiveup at March 16, 2010 05:29 PM (0GFWk)
The end result of millions of conservative Republicans choosing "some other race" and writing in "American" will simply be to reduce the "official" percentage of whites in the country, according to the Census. I don't really see the point.
---------------
The point is that it's the right thing to do if you don't believe in continued racial balkanization and identity politics.
And I'm at a loss as to what's the big problem with the "official percentage of whites" decreasing.
Posted by: schizuki at March 16, 2010 05:29 PM (VE5tZ)
Posted by: Jimmy the Greek at March 16, 2010 05:31 PM (0GFWk)
I'll just fill out my census form like Steve Martin would.
Like Steve Martin I was born a po' black child.
Posted by: Blazer at March 16, 2010 05:31 PM (t72+4)
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 05:32 PM (Mi2wf)
If you're a Constitutionalist, you must at least answer what's required for "enumeration." After that, it's all bullshit and your call how much you want to risk.
I was going to write "Information not required under [insert relevant Constitutional section here]", but thanks to the helpful link in #45, I'll have to decide if I want to shell out the potential fine money.
Posted by: schizuki at March 16, 2010 05:32 PM (VE5tZ)
No, and in fact, you'll face a murder charge and rightfully so. The Feds are off limits as far as I'm concerned with all of these racial questions but one thing they are authorized to do Constitutionally is the census every ten years. Failure to answer the count is a crime on your part.
Good point. I'll have to starve the dogs a few days before the visit. They crack and eat bones too. There's usually nothing left.
Posted by: Barbarian at March 16, 2010 05:33 PM (EL+OC)
Posted by: di butler, superflybitch at March 16, 2010 05:33 PM (S3xX1)
Gee Blazer,
I was going to write in Blazer's Bitch.
Posted by: mpfs at March 16, 2010 09:32 PM (QuP9W)
+ 10, ACORN
Posted by: Blazer at March 16, 2010 05:35 PM (t72+4)
Posted by: jwbs at March 16, 2010 05:35 PM (1UeH/)
Posted by: willow at March 16, 2010 05:35 PM (PtdKQ)
Posted by: mpfs at March 16, 2010 05:35 PM (QuP9W)
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Posted by: schizuki at March 16, 2010 05:35 PM (VE5tZ)
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Posted by: shape ups shoes at March 16, 2010 05:36 PM (3iGDt)
Do you have to supply transportation and your own body armor ?
Posted by: Barbarian at March 16, 2010 05:36 PM (EL+OC)
Posted by: tmitsss at March 16, 2010 05:37 PM (kSL5G)
Posted by: Che Pizza at March 16, 2010 05:38 PM (4iIhs)
Posted by: conscious, but incoherent at March 16, 2010 05:39 PM (Vu6sl)
I want them to come to my house so I can fuck with them. I'm thinking of going full retard like you di. BTW, Happy belated birthday.
Posted by: mpfs at March 16, 2010 09:35 PM (QuP9W)
Me too. And by fuck with them, I mean showing up at the front door drunk in my skivies with my pecker hangin' half way out.
No, scratch that,..... buck naked with it swingin'.
Posted by: Blazer at March 16, 2010 05:39 PM (t72+4)
Posted by: RJ at March 16, 2010 05:39 PM (ADbI4)
Posted by: Che Pizza at March 16, 2010 05:40 PM (4iIhs)
che, they might want to see how many deaths are needed for the health care to stay at cbo's expectations.
che pizza said
Why do they ask for current age AND date of birth? Can't the government do the math themselves?!?
Posted by: willow at March 16, 2010 05:40 PM (PtdKQ)
Posted by: eman at March 16, 2010 05:40 PM (xJwcz)
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 09:32 PM (Mi2wf)
You really do say some amazingly thick stuff from time to time Gabe.
Did it ever occur to you that if you chose "American" as a race the census can then call you anything they wish to call you? No, I bet you didn't even get that far in the thought process.
Posted by: Jim in San Diego at March 16, 2010 05:40 PM (F09Uo)
Awww, Gabe is a little butthurt tonight.
How that differs from any other night, I'm not sure...
Posted by: RJ at March 16, 2010 05:40 PM (ADbI4)
Posted by: ford at March 16, 2010 05:42 PM (Ki7fm)
What, no WASP in ethnic question? Damn racist bullhit!
Posted by: DT at March 16, 2010 05:42 PM (30KeT)
Posted by: mpfs at March 16, 2010 05:42 PM (QuP9W)
Posted by: eman at March 16, 2010 05:42 PM (xJwcz)
Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at March 16, 2010 05:43 PM (RZ8pf)
Actually, Jim, they tally the "other" answers. "American" received a plurality in several states during the 2000 census. So I bet you didn't even get very far in your thought process or whatever. Oooooh! Artard.
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 05:44 PM (Mi2wf)
Thanks, mpfs. But it isn't belated birthday yet. Still 2 more hrs and some change. I like putting chunks of Alka Seltzer in my mouth with a swig of Coke. That always gets a good door reaction.
Ok, most people refuse to come to my house now. I am winning. ;-)
Posted by: di butler, superflybitch at March 16, 2010 05:44 PM (S3xX1)
Hey, you guys who want to make sure whites get counted so you can get your "fair share" of the dole, fuck off. You're a DEMOCRAT.
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 09:32 PM (Mi2wf)
Gabe, thats horseshit, if whites actually got anything out of the deal from being counted they wouldnt ask you what the hell race and color you are to begin with.
Posted by: Blazer at March 16, 2010 05:44 PM (t72+4)
I think that's a great idea - what's the saying "imitation is the greatest form of flattery" ?? not sure if I got that right. If they deem this HCR as passed then I will deem my census form as completed and mailed.
I'm still trying to figure out because of my black irish blood if I am a Spainard under Other Hispanic or as am I African b/c in the other tread someone pointed out that black irish meant I was a cousin to the President.
Posted by: tank at March 16, 2010 05:46 PM (rt8WW)
Posted by: DirtyJobsGuy at March 16, 2010 05:46 PM (xlO3V)
I wonder if I can get a job as a census worker in Blazer's neighborhood?
Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at March 16, 2010 09:43 PM (RZ8pf)
Sure. But I get 75% of the profit and daddy doesnt like it when you dont turn a profit.
Posted by: Blazer at March 16, 2010 05:46 PM (t72+4)
From my typos I hope you can tell I'm already celebrating St. Patrick's Day.
Posted by: tank at March 16, 2010 05:48 PM (rt8WW)
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 09:44 PM (Mi2wf)
Now you are just making stuff up.
Please, enlighten me where you got that "plurality" info o wise one. More minorities = more FEDERAL SPENDING on minorities.
Posted by: Jim in San Diego at March 16, 2010 05:48 PM (F09Uo)
Posted by: mpfs at March 16, 2010 05:49 PM (QuP9W)
I tore it in half and deposited in the garbage. Twice I've done it. Intentionally to violate teh law.
Any Justice Department lawyers want to try to fucking prosecute me be my fucking guest.
The Constitution requires that you count me. For the record, I am one person. So, count me as one.
That is all the Constitution requires that I tell you about myself so fuck right off with your census form.
Posted by: someguy at March 16, 2010 05:50 PM (VRJIW)
Posted by: Soap MacTavish at March 16, 2010 05:50 PM (554T5)
Posted by: Che Pizza at March 16, 2010 05:51 PM (4iIhs)
Ah Blazer, I always knew you were a true capitalistic pig. I just want to make sure you pay for my STD meds. Deal?
Posted by: mpfs at March 16, 2010 09:49 PM (QuP9W)
You wont get any stds from me sweetheart. I am extremely clean and articulate, although I do tend to speak with just a hint of negro dialect from time to time.
Posted by: Blazer at March 16, 2010 05:52 PM (t72+4)
Now, if you are a Republican living in a Democrat-run state such as Massachusetts, you'd be stupid to fill out the census now wouldn't you? Why would you want Democrats to get that money? I'd rather the other Republican-run states get Massachusetts' share of my federal dollars.
Posted by: someguy at March 16, 2010 05:52 PM (VRJIW)
Posted by: eman at March 16, 2010 05:52 PM (xJwcz)
Posted by: Rat Patrol at March 16, 2010 05:53 PM (dQdrY)
Posted by: Christopher Taylor at March 16, 2010 05:53 PM (PQY7w)
Posted by: alaska trash at March 16, 2010 05:53 PM (hI3As)
Posted by: Reactionary at March 16, 2010 05:53 PM (4nbyM)
Posted by: eman at March 16, 2010 05:55 PM (xJwcz)
Since the Census is used to apportion the number of seats your state gets in Congress, that sounds like a winning plan.
Heh.
Posted by: Additional Blond Agent at March 16, 2010 05:56 PM (SHKl9)
Posted by: Annabelle at March 16, 2010 05:56 PM (8/gkX)
Posted by: tank at March 16, 2010 05:56 PM (rt8WW)
Now you are just making stuff up.
Please, enlighten me where you got that "plurality" info o wise one. More minorities = more FEDERAL SPENDING on minorities.
Why, I got it from Mark Krikorian at the Corner, as reported here at AOSHQ, O Sarcastic One. I will accept your apology now for claiming that I'm "just making stuff up."
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 05:57 PM (Mi2wf)
Come April I may not be an American. I will be a Texan still. I'll go with that.
Posted by: Rat Patrol at March 16, 2010 05:59 PM (dQdrY)
Posted by: Che Pizza at March 16, 2010 06:01 PM (4iIhs)
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 09:57 PM (Mi2wf)
I read your link and his "Other" makes no mention of "American". Go ahead and take a look. I'll wait.
Posted by: Jim in San Diego at March 16, 2010 06:01 PM (F09Uo)
Did it ever occur to you that if you chose "American" as a race the census can then call you anything they wish to call you?
-----------------
How so? Are they going to white-out "Other" and "American" and pencil in a minority of their choice? In that case, what's to stop them from whiting out the "White" box and calling you something else?
Posted by: schizuki at March 16, 2010 06:02 PM (VE5tZ)
This must be were census workers go to work after the census. I don't know how to put the link in but read this at American Thinker.
Posted by: tank at March 16, 2010 06:06 PM (rt8WW)
Hmm, I guess "human" would be too vague?
I guess I need to ask the Census for its guidelines on race, so I know what I'm required to answer.
Posted by: malclave at March 16, 2010 06:11 PM (W1Ndc)
Are you a lawyer? just wondering. I'd love to get a lawyer's opinion on this kerfuffle.
Posted by: Steve Martin at March 16, 2010 06:11 PM (7+pP9)
Posted by: Old Hippie Vet at March 16, 2010 06:15 PM (3IZGh)
Posted by: Iblis at March 16, 2010 06:16 PM (UQCPr)
Let's take a look in the 2000 Census Summary of Data (PDF). I'll cut and paste:
The number who reported
American and no other ancestry
increased from 12.4 million in
1990 to 20.2 million in 2000, the
largest numerical growth of any
group during the 1990s. [FN5 American was considered a valid ancestry
response when it was the only ancestry
provided by a respondent.] This figure
represents an increase of
63 percent, as the proportion rose
from 5.0 percent to 7.2 percent of
the population.
Also, if you go down and look in the data table you will find that "American" was the plurality answer in Arkansas, Kentucky, Tennessee, and West Virginia. It also took pluralities in many counties outside of those states.
Jim, you wrote: "Did it ever occur to you that if you chose "American" as a race the census can then call you anything they wish to call you? No, I bet you didn't even get that far in the thought process." and when I tried to correct you you wrote "Now you are just making stuff up."
In fact, YOU were the one who was making stuff up when you said that the census "can then call you anything they wish to call you."
No worries, though. I decided I don't actually want an apology. I got enough satisfaction from smacking you upside the head, you smug ignorant fool.
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 06:17 PM (Mi2wf)
Posted by: Bill R. at March 16, 2010 06:17 PM (EhlQq)
Posted by: Tiger Woods at March 16, 2010 06:19 PM (4iIhs)
That said, I agree there should be a choice for "American." The other choices are just there to support racial policymaking.
Posted by: Nemo from Erewhon at March 16, 2010 06:20 PM (Xlw/P)
Posted by: maddogg at March 16, 2010 06:21 PM (Su9wE)
Posted by: KZnextzone at March 16, 2010 06:23 PM (WAsYw)
Posted by: Tiger Woods at March 16, 2010 10:19 PM (4iIhs)
pssst- it's asking your ethnicity, not all your bitches and ho's ethnicity...
Posted by: Angry American at March 16, 2010 06:27 PM (PI/0J)
Congress, not so much.
Posted by: Zimriel at March 16, 2010 06:29 PM (HcHKY)
Posted by: Alexandre Dumas at March 16, 2010 06:32 PM (HcHKY)
Nice try Gabe, but your original link went to Krikorian's piece and then his only paragraph that even mentioned what you are aledging went to a map.
This map: http://tiny.cc/ajeju
Now look at the bottom under the "OTHER" section and tell me where you see "American".
You don't, but kudos on the sleazy attempt to switch the links. Now back to your chicken.
Posted by: Jim in San Diego at March 16, 2010 06:32 PM (F09Uo)
I'm not going to ask how that feels, but to give you a little different prospective: I was admitted to the bar in 1978. The last time I responded to the census was in 1970, and I'm no tough guy. Why all the hand-wringing about this nonsense, I mean aside from the obvious: you don't have enough to do to fill the hours in a day?
Anyway, apart from that, please carry on. I enjoy your work.
Posted by: Oldbrokedick at March 16, 2010 06:35 PM (3cvSa)
I don't give a frack what the lawyers say. Vietnamese, Chinese, Korean --- all identified as "races" on the form ---- are nationalities, not races. My nationality is American, and that's what I'm filling in for "Other".
Posted by: effinayright at March 16, 2010 06:40 PM (eDLXV)
Oh, you poor ignorant bastiche. Click Krikorian's link which takes you to a map. And then the link on that user-generated page to the SOURCE of the map, which is the Census summary that I pointed you to. Sorry I took out the middle man, I can see how that might have confused you.
But let's not obfuscate about how wrong you were when you said that the Census workers could choose whatever race they want if we write in "American." You weren't just wrong, you were embarrassingly wrong because you accused me of making stuff up. When it was actually you that made that up.
And it is just blindingly retarded that you continue to somehow...what? Are you trying to save face somehow? You were wrong. It happens. Just remember the next time you open your fat face to dog on someone about a subject you know nothing about.
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 06:45 PM (Mi2wf)
Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at March 16, 2010 06:46 PM (1B/ID)
Posted by: brak at March 16, 2010 06:47 PM (W5NBA)
gabriel. if you are still here i hace a question about an article and a comment at HA. Brookes wrotye article
In nearly every arena of political life, group relationships have replaced person-to-person relationships. The tempo of the Senate is now set by partisan lunches every Tuesday, whereas the body almost never meets for conversation as a whole. The Senate is now in the process of using reconciliation — rule by simple majority — to try to pass health care.
Reconciliation has been used with increasing frequency. That was bad enough. But at least for the Bush tax cuts or the prescription drug bill, there was significant bipartisan support. Now we have pure reconciliation mixed with pure partisanship.
Once partisan reconciliation is used for this bill, it will be used for everything, now and forever. The Senate will be the House. The remnants of person-to-person relationships, with their sympathy and sentiment, will be snuffed out. We will live amid the relationships of group versus group, party versus party, inhumanity versus inhumanity.
We have a political culture in which the word “reconciliation” has come to mean “bitter division.” With increasing effectiveness, the system bleaches out normal behavior and the normal instincts of human sympathy
this was a comment by another
He’s right. And what’s amazing is that if your couple this with Clyburn’s statement that the Slaughter solution demonstrates that the Senate is all that’s needed for “representation”, then reconciliation will in effect dissolve the Senate and the Slaughter solution will in effect dissolve the House. In other words, in order for Obama to get what he wants…one of the sides of the Capitol has to be sacrificed
Me:is a real possibility?
Posted by: willow at March 16, 2010 06:52 PM (PtdKQ)
Posted by: whatmeworry? at March 16, 2010 06:53 PM (37puw)
Posted by: willow at March 16, 2010 06:53 PM (PtdKQ)
Posted by: curious at March 16, 2010 06:58 PM (p302b)
Me:is a real possibility?
willow, I don't think it is. Look at how much fallout there is from these shenanigans. If it continued, it would be even more of a wedge issue than it already is, come election season. Democrats wouldn't just lose the House, they'd lose the Senate. People are paying attention now. And they're pissed. If this reconciliation and Slaughter Solution became business-as-usual, the Democras would be finished. And they know it, so don't worry about it. It's not "a real possibility."
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 07:02 PM (Mi2wf)
Posted by: schizuki at March 16, 2010 07:03 PM (VE5tZ)
Posted by: Eric at March 16, 2010 07:03 PM (Qc/s6)
Posted by: grognard at March 16, 2010 07:03 PM (Ep0Rz)
So I'm putting "mixed" and the drones at the Census Bureau can work it out for their own selves.
Of course the dumb bastards don't bother to ask about citizenship (even though the tally will be used for setting congressional districts).
I ain't givin' 'em my phone number. I get too many bogus calls already.
Posted by: Ray-man at March 16, 2010 07:07 PM (2J1Bs)
Posted by: Pelayo at March 16, 2010 07:08 PM (C8qIl)
I filled in American for all of us. Between my husband and myself we represent half of Europe and several American Indian tribes. If they come after me I'll calmly explain that "white" is not a race and that they didn't provide enough ethnic choices to adequately explain my family. That, and we don't appreciate being pawns in their racial politics. Screw 'em.
Posted by: lauren at March 16, 2010 07:09 PM (D2u6E)
Posted by: AbeFroman at March 16, 2010 07:11 PM (kSYD3)
Posted by: ErikW at March 16, 2010 07:11 PM (JS8/Q)
Posted by: Eric at March 16, 2010 07:12 PM (Qc/s6)
Posted by: polly at March 16, 2010 07:13 PM (t6Xs7)
I was out gardening last fall when the snoops with the gps asked me how many apartments were in the house. Since I was just the gardener, I said
" I dunno. Four?"
I now have four census forms to fill out. Hmmm.
At our little lake cabin, waaaaay up in a resort area of remote North Idaho, every seasonal cabin has a census form hung on the door. Anyone who knows anything about the area knows full well these are seasonal cabins. This is a make work project for the census worker. The staff should be able to hang around the lake for a year following up on why no one answered their census form.
What a buncha bullshit. And now I have 5 census forms.
Posted by: Derak at March 16, 2010 07:15 PM (pRJG8)
Posted by: Dookiestain LaFlair at March 16, 2010 07:22 PM (Q6g4u)
Question #9 for Person 1 has "Black, African American, or Negro" NEGRO? I thought that was as bad a word as "n***er."
Posted by: Pelayo at March 16, 2010 07:26 PM (C8qIl)
Posted by: Derak at March 16, 2010 07:27 PM (pRJG8)
171
Click Krikorian's link which takes you to a map. And then the link on that user-generated page to the SOURCE of the map, which is the Census summary that I pointed you to. Sorry I took out the middle man, I can see how that might have confused you.
But let's not obfuscate about how wrong you were when you said that the Census workers could choose whatever race they want if we write in "American." You weren't just wrong, you were embarrassingly wrong because you accused me of making stuff up. When it was actually you that made that up.
And it is just blindingly retarded that you continue to somehow...what? Are you trying to save face somehow? You were wrong. It happens. Just remember the next time you open your fat face to dog on someone about a subject you know nothing about.
First of all Gabe, back-off on the hysterical name calling. It just makes you look weird. I know your history of hating me goes back to all those gay marriage threads and now anytime I question you on ANYTHING you do a major flip out. You need to stop.
Next, I never said THE CENSUS WORKER could fill out anything they wanted. I did say that by answering Race: Other "American" you could be counted as anything THEY wanted, not implying the individual census workers, who in all likelihood could care less.
To summarize: You say something silly, I call you on it and ask for proof, you call me "atarded" you then misdirect, I say your link does not say what you say it says, you then claim you were "cutting out the middleman" and finally provide PART of what I asked for, and then make a strawman argument and call me more names.
Uhhh... yeah. I sure hope you have a better means of advocating a point when you are 'on the clock'.
Posted by: Jim in San Diego at March 16, 2010 07:33 PM (F09Uo)
Posted by: JohnTant at March 16, 2010 07:34 PM (4Nea+)
Gabe, I think Jim in San Diego is just jerking your chain for shit's and giggles.
He reminds me of a comment scam I once ran.
At some ace.mu.nu thread, the topic of which chain had the best burgers came up. Somebody nominated some chain in Texas. I can't remember the name, so I'll just call it "Red Joes."
So this dude mentioned that he loved Red Joe's burgers with mustard.
So I chimed in and said that he was mistaken, the Red Joe's didn't serve mustard with their burgers. I was just making this up.
This guy responds with "what the hell are you talking about, I ate plenty of their burgers with mustard."
So I respond that I was the grandson of the founder of the chain, in charge of all Red Joes in Texas and Arkansas, and that I knew for a fact that we didn't serve mustard with our burgers.
And this guy started to get all up in my grill, saying he goddamnit, ate Red Joe's burgers with goddamn mustard!
And I just responded to the thread in general, saying to pay no attention to the ramblings of this guy, that my grandfather never allowed mustard in his chain, his father didn't, and I, as his loyal grandson certainly wasn't either.
Then I just dropped the charade and let everyone in on my little joke / ruse and we all had a few cheap giggles.
Maybe that's what's happening here. Jim is just getting you all wound up.
Posted by: ed at March 16, 2010 07:35 PM (OCfDT)
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Posted by: shape ups shoes at March 16, 2010 07:42 PM (3iGDt)
#198, The Census mails a form to every unit in a dwelling. A fifty-unit apartment building gets 50 forms sent to each unit. A two-family house gets two forms, sent to each address or numbered unit. A one-family house gets..one form.
So you pissed in your whiskey by saying "four"; had you simply said "one" for your converted Victorian apartment building you would have got one form.
Actually it's usually the other way around, with big old houses converted into multi-unit condos. From the outside it's sometimes not easy to tell how many units a building has, especially if a condo-ized building has separate electrical meters for "common" areas, but only one address number externally..
You're also wrong about the lake cabins. What you call "seasonal" might have some year-round residents. The Census doesn't know who owns the cabins, who lives there year-round, or if some owners rent them out all year. All the Census bureau knows is that they are "dwellings". If a worker comes around for follow-up on non-respondents he will figure the situation out.
"Make work?" --- when I did a stint for the Census last year, they had us work for three weeks and then laid us all off, finishing a nationwide project three weeks ahead of schedule. As we were hired for a six-week gig, we were pissed! (We figure they over-estimated the number of people they would need)
As for "snoops" -- if you have some way for the Census bureau to carry out its Constitutionally mandated function to count "persons"without first determining where people live or might live, I'd love to hear it. GPS? Frankly, I never could figure out why they needed that info, except perhaps to make sure a mailing address matched a physical location, to minimize jiggery-pokery. Remember: the full-time Census people are professional statisticians, and they (as opposed to Rahm, ACORN et al) are zealots about accuracy.
The issue with the Census is not that it is taken, but the non-constitutionally mandated questions it asks, and the zeal to find and count illegals, who unfortunately have always been treated as "persons".
Posted by: effinayright at March 16, 2010 07:43 PM (eDLXV)
Posted by: ed at March 16, 2010 11:36 PM (OCfDT)
Now you are just making stuff up...
Posted by: Jim in San Diego at March 16, 2010 07:48 PM (F09Uo)
Posted by: Modgi at March 16, 2010 07:51 PM (c96aC)
Ya know how it gets in such an overtly racist society as this, one where half the space on a simple census is all about race, in lean economic times; too many recent newcomers who think they are special; deserve extra dollars because they just got off a boat from 'Shiitecumastan'; a uniter such as Obama might just have to pull those who self-identified as deserving special...
It's happened before.
Posted by: Druid at March 16, 2010 07:55 PM (Gct7d)
Posted by: spidly at March 16, 2010 08:06 PM (Q+4X0)
You said: "Did it ever occur to you that if you chose "American" as a race the census can then call you anything they wish to call you? No, I bet you didn't even get that far in the thought process."
You were wrong. Sucks to be you.
Then, when I tried to tell you, you said: "Now you are just making stuff up.
Please, enlighten me where you got that "plurality" info o wise one. More minorities = more FEDERAL SPENDING on minorities."
So I said I got it from Krikorian. I did. He wrote it in the post. But you didn't believe Krikorian's post and insisted that we look under the link Krikorian provided. So I did that. Which led me to the Census data, which I provided for you.Let's be clear. You have never been right about your ignorant claim that " if you chose "American" as a race the census can then call you anything they wish to call you." You have no evidence. You did what you accused me of doing: making stuff up.
On the other hand, I have well-documented that it's possible to answer "American", that it is recognized by the census, and that it took a plurality in several states and counties in 2000.
You're too easy for me, Jim.
ed, Jim has a long history of dogging me, as he referenced above. Don't worry about it. I'm not wound up. This was fun for me. Jim keeps violating the First Rule of Holes. I'm just kicking him while he's down there. I can stop anytime I choose to. Yeah.
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at March 16, 2010 08:32 PM (Mi2wf)
In the envelope, I am including this letter:
______
To Whom it May Concern,
Pursuant to Article I, Section 2, Clause 3 of the Constitution, the only information you are empowered to request is the total number of occupants at this address. My “name, sex, age, date of birth, race, ethnicity, telephone number, relationship and housing tenure” have absolutely nothing to do with apportioning direct taxes or determining the number of representatives in the House of Representatives. Therefore, neither Congress nor the Census Bureau have the constitutional authority to make that information request a component of the enumeration outlined in Article I, Section 2, Clause 3. In addition, I cannot be subject to a fine for basing my conduct on the Constitution because that document trumps laws passed by Congress.
Interstate Commerce Commission v. Brimson, 154 U.S. 447, 479 (May 26, 1894)
“Neither branch of the legislative department [House of Representatives or Senate], still less any merely administrative body [such as the Census Bureau], established by congress, possesses, or can be invested with, a general power of making inquiry into the private affairs of the citizen. Kilbourn v. Thompson, 103 U.S. 168, 190. We said in Boyd v. U.S., 116 U. S. 616, 630, 6 Sup. Ct. 524,―and it cannot be too often repeated,―that the principles that embody the essence of constitutional liberty and security forbid all invasions on the part of government and itÂ’s employees of the sanctity of a manÂ’s home and the privacies of his life. As said by Mr. Justice Field in Re Pacific Ry. Commission, 32 Fed. 241, 250, ‘of all the rights of the citizen, few are of greater importance or more essential to his peace and happiness than the right of personal security, and that involves, not merely protection of his person from assault, but exemption of his private affairs, books, and papers from inspection and scrutiny of others. Without the enjoyment of this right, all others would lose half their value.’”
Note: This United States Supreme Court case has never been overturned.
Respectfully,
A Citizen of the United States of America
Posted by: Orlando at March 16, 2010 08:33 PM (r9DeI)
We did put down our phone #.
But the handwriting was kind of sloppy.
Not sure I'd try to dial that #.
But if that info is that important to them, they can just look us up in the phone book...
Posted by: w'evver at March 16, 2010 08:48 PM (GkYyh)
I don't see the problem. I've never bothered with my damn genealogy; how the f*** do I know if great-great-grandma on my mom's side actually got freaky with a Cherokee? Oh, and would her "indiscretion" be listed in the family bible? I never met the broad, how do I know who she slept with? What, 1/16th is automatically Native American, right?
And for all I know, there's some history of other minorities in my past. How the heck do you mix & match that? Isn't there some racist idiotic "one drop" rule for some crap? Is that Neo-Nazi or Liberal (I can't keep their racist ranting and color/nationality-based categorizations straight).
For example, (I'm not, just an example) what if you were 1/4th Chinese, 1/4th Pakistani, 1/4th Pacific Islander, and 1/4th Mongolian... what the heck are you legally "supposed" to call yourself to avoid these fines? Wait, let me guess; Hispanic?
And why the heck do African, Asian, and Pacific Islander get global regions and all Europeans get is their damn skin color? Isn't that racist (by definition really)?
Screw it. I'm American. If you want better details, you go dig up my great-great-grandmothers, great-grandmothers, and grandmothers and ask them if they got freaky with the milkman and what race he was (I wouldn't recommend asking mom, dad was a construction worker and he's still got the arms of someone who could snap your neck if he was mad, or upset, or bored... yeah he's retired and he still kinda scares me a bit). I personally don't give a damn what the answer is, but if you're that damned curious you go do the research.
Posted by: Gekkobear at March 16, 2010 08:52 PM (jBr5Z)
If you call me, expect to get to deal with me; and if I don't like dealing with you, I can hang up. But I can explain to them that I don't know or bother knowing my race... somehow I doubt it's illegal not to have done a full family genealogy and workup. At least, not yet.
Posted by: Gekkobear at March 16, 2010 08:54 PM (jBr5Z)
Gabe, I think Jim in San Diego is just jerking your chain for shit's and giggles.
--------------
That's fun if it's creative. But just saying "Nuh-uh!" over and over is tedious.
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Posted by: Rat Patrol at March 16, 2010 09:00 PM (dQdrY)
I'm glad to see you are not worked up Gabe.
I mean just because you damn near typed enough for a manifesto and played the ad hominem card the first chance you got, you did avoid an emotional breakdown, so I guess you get credit there.
Yeah, you never get worked up Gabe.
Posted by: Jim in San Diego at March 16, 2010 09:02 PM (F09Uo)
As a genealogy guy, I am very familiar with past censuses. While they are not to be relied on as definitive, they do provide interesting insights into past relatives, and pin them down to being at a certain place at a certain time. The census bureau has an excellent record of keeping the data (on individuals) private (for 72 years). 100 years from now, it may be the only readily available record that you even existed.
Until 1850 they used to record the name of only the head of household, and then gave a count of how many in the household were in various groupings by age, sex, and race.
Since then, name, age, sex, race, and citizenship (for everybody in the household) have been standard. Usually they would also ask your occupation, and your country (or state) of birth. All great stuff! There's nothing inherently racist, or sexist, or nationalistic about it - that comes with what the govt chooses to DO with the info.
That being said, two things strike me as odd:
1) The bit about whether you're Hispanic.
2) They don't ask whether you're a citizen.
Posted by: Optimizer at March 16, 2010 09:16 PM (acVo8)
Posted by: Laura Castellano at March 16, 2010 09:31 PM (fuw6p)
This has me wondering about the legality of counting of illegal aliens.
Section 2 of the 14th Amendment actually has a mechanism for decreasing a state's representation, if legal citizens are denied the right to vote in Federal elections. But if illegal aliens are interpreted as "inhabitants" (and even allowed to vote, I suppose), the more you have, the more your representation! As an illegitimate part of "the whole number of persons", are they supposed to count? Probably this was not foreseen as a potential future problem, so it seems unclear.
Hey - at least it allows denying illegals the right to vote, without loss of representation.
Say - has anything weird transpired that can be traced to Obama's unprecedented step of seizing control of the census away from Secy of Commerce? Maybe it's too early for stuff to come out.
Posted by: Optimizer at March 16, 2010 09:37 PM (acVo8)
So if you fill it out on April 1 - the date they say it's for - you're not allowed to give joke answers and then say "April Fools!"?
Posted by: Gary Rosen at March 16, 2010 09:39 PM (9CzKK)
I'll confess that I filled in the names and ages. I do geaneological research and the census forms are like gold. In 72 years, I want someone to be able to trace this part of the family tree. By then, my name should be clear.
Posted by: Max Entropy at March 16, 2010 09:57 PM (Iz91/)
OK, the real stupidity with the "race" question is the lack of a "mixed race" category. It's so anachronistic! I mean - just look at the President, for cryin' out loud.
Say - speaking of His Majesty, why doesn't some reporter put Obama on the spot and ask him what "Mr. Post-racial" intends to put down for this. Funny how it's practically ASSUMED that the highly racist "just one drop" rule will apply. I guess calling attention to The One's white heritage just takes away from the racist leftist fantasy that "we're so great because we elected a black guy, and you're racist if you didn't vote for him."
( Newsflash for the Lefties: We elected a biracial guy, not a black one! Sorry!)
Posted by: Optimizer at March 16, 2010 10:12 PM (acVo8)
Here's the deal. I have in my possession 5 census forms that I must now fill out, for a family of 2 American human races and two canine mutts.
If I have 5 forms, I'm gonna guess some major statistical percentage of the population now erroneously have 5 or more census forms.
And their agendas are? Nahhhh. All honest as the day is long. Would never ever think to scam the system.
What, pray tell, is the likelyhood of an accurate census??
Make work. Steal elections. Hmmm.
What would best benefit me, assuming I'm a taker?
And If I answer all the questions in a politically correct way? Why would they ever, ever think to contact me again?
This is a giant farce.
Posted by: Derak at March 16, 2010 10:25 PM (sPWq2)
Posted by: chucko at March 16, 2010 10:31 PM (7Z9pp)
Posted by: GnuBreed at March 17, 2010 12:06 AM (h0RtZ)
Constitutionally speaking...I am an American. And 6.
That's all they are going to get from me.
Posted by: DefendUSA at March 17, 2010 02:48 AM (N69Wd)
I'm multi-racial.
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Posted by: Cobalt Shiva at March 17, 2010 03:51 AM (EIZuT)
Posted by: Roach at March 17, 2010 06:12 AM (tV40C)
Posted by: 765x53 at March 17, 2010 06:22 AM (8nFqJ)
They don't need to know if I own a home, rent, whatever. Why is that important to the function of government?
They also DO NOT need my phone number. Go ask the NSA if you really want it.
I put American as race for all people, but I should have put 'WASP' for myself.
Posted by: lemosley01 at March 17, 2010 06:25 AM (x7g7t)
Posted by: SarahW at March 17, 2010 06:37 AM (Z4T49)
Posted by: SarahW at March 17, 2010 06:46 AM (Z4T49)
I'm writing in "American." But weenies may write in "Mixed," which is almost always the correct answer anyhow.
Posted by: J. Moses Browning at March 17, 2010 07:18 AM (f/CWV)
There is no reason for the federal government to ask what the relationship is between those that reside at the address. They don't need to know your race or birthdate. There is no reason they need to ask the birthdates of children in the residence. Why would you give this out? I don't want any potentional pedophiles knowing I have children and what their ages are. They have no business asking your telephone number. Why is this needed? Report them to the Do Not Call List. I wrote in 1-800-Kissmyass. They only need to know how many residents legally reside at this residence. That is all I will disclose. Have they ever heard of identity theft? Here in Ohio a lot of people had their personal information stolen when a low-level guvment employee left this in his car and that was broken into. We have the right of privacy. They only need to know how many residents legally reside at the address.
Posted by: Desiree at March 17, 2010 07:19 AM (ObORb)
227 I seriously considered answering "Texan," but then I decided I don't want to deal with these people anymore than necessary...
"Texan" is what you write in the block asking what kind of Hispanic you are. After all, if you're a native Texan, then you were born in a place that used to be under Mexican rule, and before that under Spanish rule. If you had ancestors living there in 1836, you most certainly are of Mexican descent.
Posted by: J. Moses Browning at March 17, 2010 07:21 AM (f/CWV)
Sorry, I filled in total number of people and filled in #9 with "AMERICAN" on all of them. Come get me. Under law only the number of people living in the house need to be counted. Screw-em
Posted by: PAUL at March 17, 2010 07:27 AM (sDEdI)
Posted by: Pervy Grin at March 17, 2010 07:57 AM (OxKj2)
Posted by: Old Curmudgeon at March 17, 2010 08:01 AM (BbAfd)
RACE.
So indeed, we are NOT all created equal.
I am offended that i will have to list my chidlren as 'other' since i am white and my wife is asian...its a demeaning and more than just a little.
Any lawyers here? Im seriously thinking about a lawsuit to this racist piece of shit census questionnaire.
Posted by: metronil at March 17, 2010 08:10 AM (WUSks)
I only answered question 1 in 2000. I wasn't confrontational about it. I just stopped after the headcount question. There was no follow up.
Remember that the racial information is also used to help gerrymander Congressional and legislative districts into minority-majority districts to keep Democrats in power. A refusal to cooperate in such racial labeling on the census will compound the difficulties already arising from the fact that housing patterns are much more racially integrated than they used to be.
Posted by: NC Mountain Girl at March 17, 2010 08:10 AM (HwBga)
I listed both myself and my brother as AMERICAN. In big block capital letters. I'm curious to see how the census shakes out and how many people listed themselves as such.
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Posted by: Foamer at March 17, 2010 12:04 PM (zGCLY)
A bit off topic, certainly topical. I raise my glass of Val-u-Rite and wish ALL the morons a Happy St. Patrick's Day. As ALL days are now filled with Hope and Change, I do not want to offend anyone with my prior toast. As such, my legal team has advised this disclaimer: Please accept with no obligation, implied or implicit, our best wishes for an environmentally conscious, socially responsible, low stress, non addictive, gender neutral, celebration of this holiday, practiced within the most enjoyable traditions of the religious persuasion of your choice, or secular practices of your choice, with respect for the religious/secular persuasions and/or traditions of others, or their choice not to practice religious or secular traditions at all. We also wish you a fiscally successful, personally fulfilling, and medically uncomplicated recognition of the onset of the generally accepted calendar year 2010, but not without due respect for the calendars of choice of other cultures whose contributions to society have helped make America great (not to imply that America is necessarily greater than any other country or is the only "AMERICA" in the western hemisphere), and without regard to the race, creed, color, age, physical ability, religious faith, or sexual preference of the wishee. By accepting this greeting, you are accepting these terms: This greeting is subject to clarification or withdrawal. It is freely transferable with no alteration to the original greeting. It implies no promise by the wisher to actually implement any of the wishes for her/himself or others, and is void where prohibited by law, and is revocable at the sole discretion of the wisher. This wish is warranted to perform as expected within the usual application of good tidings for a period of one year, or until the issuance of a subsequent holiday greeting, whichever comes first, and warranty is limited to replacement of this wish or issuance of a new wish at the sole discretion of the wisher.
Posted by: sirsurfalot at March 17, 2010 03:26 PM (UPNlB)
At this point, please allow me to appologize to any persons who may have misconstrued my patently moronic views for not including the moronettes in my previous toast. So with your permission, allow me to rephrase: I raise my glass of Val-u-Rite and wish ALL the morons and moronettes a Happy St. Patrick's Day. Please note, no animals were harmed during this toast. Hobos.... not so much. Heh.
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Posted by: Darth Rove69 at March 16, 2010 05:04 PM (GfYt/)