1 Oh, joy.  'Cause that's just what our economy needs.  You know what debt holders who are facing bankruptcy themselves tend to do first?  Call in all their debts...

Think about it.

2 #1  You know what debt holders who are facing bankruptcy themselves tend to do first?  Call in all their debts...

And here it comes...

I say we give the Chi-Coms California.  The value of that land mass should be enough to settle all our debts with China. 

/In the end, there will be only chaos.

3 China has never been the big economic powerhouse that everyone harped about.

4
Geoff is the go-to man for China and Charts.

5 I say we give the Chi-Coms California.

I say make them an offer. Either the "population" of SF and LA to be their slaves, or U. S. dollars. Both are about as equally worthless.

We will keep the land and the remaining sane population in the center of CA will fix the government.

6

All these people talking about "buying gold"... you can't eat it or turn it into a useful bullet.

Seriously.

7 Between Scylla and Charybdis indeed.

No, you only consider me your young apprentice.

8 The one-child policy is an important, though not the only, factor contributing to this enormous demographic transition. The consequences include slower economic expansion, and growing social problems as a result of chronic gender imbalance.

And given what I've seen in Asian fashion, the Chinese will look really ridiculous if they turn out to be the only gay superpower since Sparta, . 

In all seriousness, this massive gender imbalance might make the Chinese more aggressive if they have a huge surplus of young, single men eager for adventure.  For the majority of the PRC's history, they have been content with being a strong, yet aloof regional power.  For the past 10, 15 years though they have been building up their military strength.  Currently, they are testing their fortitude and power with some pushing as seen with this situation with the Japanese fishermen and their occasional forays with the US Navy.  They are even helping Iran attain nuclear capabilities, although not with the same magnitude as the Russians are. 

9 A free market economy only works in a......wait for it....... free society. Imagine that.

10 2 #1  You know what debt holders who are facing bankruptcy themselves tend to do first?  Call in all their debts...
And here it comes...

I say we give the Chi-Coms California.  The value of that land mass should be enough to settle all our debts with China. 

/In the end, there will be only chaos.

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at December 06, 2010 12:30 PM (9hSKh)

Throw in Hawaii, Round-Eye and you have deal!

11 China is the supreme intellectual among nations!  Anything we can do, China can do better!  China is the ultimate in moral, enlightened economic leadership!  So what if they harvest organs from political prisoners?

12 #10  Throw in Hawaii, Round-Eye and you have deal!

Done. 

13 I've got an idea that may be China's economic salvation:  Soylent Yellow.

14 Hmm, faltering economy, surplus of males, despotic regime.

However will China resolve this issue?

15
I say we give the Chi-Coms California.  The value of that land mass should be enough to settle all our debts with China.

And the lefties in CA would finally get their divorce from Jesusland...

16 I'm not worried.  The Chinese are scared of Pelosi .

17

"All these people talking about "buying gold"... you can't eat it or turn it into a useful bullet."

You can eat it, if you don't mind getting jaundice and pooping blood. 

18

I say we give the Chi-Coms California

 

They already own it

19 Hmm, faltering economy, surplus of males, despotic regime.

However will China resolve this issue?
Posted by: 18-1

The Carrousel of course!

20 I say we give the Chi-Coms California.  The value of that land mass should be enough to settle all our debts with China. 

/In the end, there will be only chaos.

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at December 06, 2010 12:30 PM (9hSKh)

 

Done and they can take Seattle too. In fact let them take all of the lefty areas. They love communism so much I'm sure they'd enjoy being under Beijing's thumb

21 #18 They already own it

Not if we have anything to say about it, Gringo! 

22

You can eat it, if you don't mind getting jaundice and pooping blood. 

It now seems possible-- even likely-- that gold is the "secret ingredient" in my mother's cooking

23 It will be hilarious when the Chinese secret police bust up the first Venice Beach drumming circle and turn them all into slave labor in the desert.

24 We've certainly batted these issues around here before, although it is interesting to see some of our doubts of the invincibility of China somewhat validated by numbers and circumspection by the big players.

A society imbalanced demographically toward men may be hot for war, but (and I know I've posted as much here before) we're talking about millions of families with just one son, a son who in centuries of tradition has been coddled, and I'm not sure how popular a war would be.  Well, maybe smaller regional wars could be stomached, but a long, multinational warof attrition?  Even authoritarian regimes can;t be completely ignorant of the popular will, and I can;t see a broad swath of the population wanting to sacrifice only children for cannon fodder thousands of miles away.

Maybe China is in Africa for not just mineral wealth, but babes?   I've sort of half-joked that war-torn countries like Angola with their shortages of males certainly can complement China demographically.  Even if the Chinese may harbor some racial attitudes that would seem to forestall intermarriage, horniness can overcome a lot of things.  Look at the history of the American South.

25

China is probably better positioned than any country on earth and here is why - they have the ability to make immediate course changes in politics and economics and have more natural resources and now own most of the earth's natural resources.  They are amassing stock piles of gold for physical hold and their citizens are used to austerity and used to a certain standard of living albeit emerging they are conditioned in many ways to accept a low wage scale.

China, if anything has been planning on a westernized economic collapse. They think long term and have been quietly amassing real assets while we piss away time. The chinese have even sold for the first time ever, debt on their own currency.

And the Chinese is a creditor nation as opposed to a lender nation. So for the Bank of Scotland to suggest buying credit swaps against a Chinese banking position is pure bullshit.  Bullshit when every U.S. bank is currently insolvent.

 

26 10 2 #1  You know what debt holders who are facing bankruptcy themselves tend to do first?  Call in all their debts...
And here it comes...

I say we give the Chi-Coms California.  The value of that land mass should be enough to settle all our debts with China. 

/In the end, there will be only chaos.

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at December 06, 2010 12:30 PM (9hSKh)

Throw in Hawaii, Round-Eye and you have deal!

Posted by: Hu Jintao at December 06, 2010 12:40 PM (5qJM5)

So...ummmmmmm, we'll then have only, uhhhhhhhhh, 55 States?

27 I say we trade them France.  Then the French youth torching problem goes away also.

28 This sentence is hilarious:

China is a big fish already in the information, low carbon, clean air, and automotive technologies.

What they really mean is that constructing "low carbon" energy generators, such as windmills and solar panels, are so environmentally destructive and energy-draining that China can build them because their environmental standards are exceptionally low. 

29 #24  Maybe China is in Africa for not just mineral wealth, but babes?

Good point, although if China was in the market for additional "babes", they'd more likely look towards their Asian neighbors, including Russia, for supply.  After all, the Chinese consider themselves the most enlightened amongst all the Asian nations.

/Gotta hand it to them - they have no cultural PC hang-wringing about seeing themselves as superior.  

30 China needs more gold farmers!

31
Women, children and Thomas Friedman hardest hit.

But I repeat myself.

32 Eat me.

33

I was hating on China before hating on China was cool.

 

34 Break out the comfy chairs.

Britain receives a European arrest warrant from Sweden for WikiLeaks' founder Julian Assange - BBC http://bbc.in/dLO86t

35

Hmm, faltering economy, surplus of males, despotic regime.

However will China resolve this issue?

If they can just be induced to kill the jihadist men and take their women...

36 37 Break out the comfy chairs.


Nice!
 I consider him an enemy combatant for all intents and purposes, so I couldn't care less what kind of procedural rights he has, I just want him picked up on the (probably bogus) "rape" charges so the authorities can bust his computer wide open and start digging. I'm guessing Julian has some interesting friends.

37

I was hating on China before hating on China was cool.

Me, too!!!  Me, too!!!

38 Gotta hand it to them - they have no cultural PC hang-wringing about seeing themselves as superior. 

I'd say they give Japan a run for their money.  As far as cultural hubris goes, Japan leads the pack.

39 Secretary Janet Napolitano and Walmart hardest hit.

40 Add to that that China has spent over $264 billion via direct purchase, company position, JV or loan-for-access on oil over the last 3 years.  They may not have the stability they've advertised but they have a handle on a substancial amount of the future global production. Additionally, it was purchased when oil was low. China has the ability to provide energy for their economy or be quite, pardon this, "liquid" in an essential market as prices are rising and the resources continues to become limited.

41

China is probably better positioned than any country on earth and here is why - they have the ability to make immediate course changes in politics and economics and have more natural resources and now own most of the earth's natural resources.  They are amassing stock piles of gold for physical hold and their citizens are used to austerity and used to a certain standard of living albeit emerging they are conditioned in many ways to accept a low wage scale.

China, if anything has been planning on a westernized economic collapse. They think long term and have been quietly amassing real assets while we piss away time. The chinese have even sold for the first time ever, debt on their own currency.

And the Chinese is a creditor nation as opposed to a lender nation. So for the Bank of Scotland to suggest buying credit swaps against a Chinese banking position is pure bullshit.  Bullshit when every U.S. bank is currently insolvent.

 

Posted by: journolist at December 06, 2010 12:55 PM (LwLqV)

--But in a global war, would not China be fairly easily blockaded and cut off from a lot of these resources, especially oil?

42 Would it be rude if I said "FUCK China!!"..?

43

--But in a global war, would not China be fairly easily blockaded and cut off from a lot of these resources, especially oil?

In about three minutes.  No west coast, you see.

44 Britain receives a European arrest warrant from Sweden for WikiLeaks' founder Julian Assange - BBC http://bbc.in/dLO86t

I don't remember if it was here or on another site that I read about the nature of the sex offense alleged to have been committed by Assange.  Even if it were here, well, I understand that this site is not totally opposed to double posting.  The allegation against Assange is that the girl consented but only if he used a condom, then he went bareback. 

45 Mr. Joe "Let's Return to Civility" Scarborough told certain critics of his to "kiss my ass" on his television show today. This after Michael Bloomberg publicly assumed the Times Square bomber was someone who "didn't like the health care bill" - as in all we morons at AofSHQ were suspects - and that the new batch of congressmen and women "can't even read". These are the civility mongerers. The new "No Labels" crowd. Let us all join them in their pursuit of higher politcal discourse by inviting these two douchers to go f*ck themselves.

46

 Put another way, there will only be 2.5 workers to support each older citizen, compared with ten today

Who will go pee- pee in all of those Cokes!?

47 As if that "protection" would actually pay off with a Chinese collapse. That's almost as funny as people who buy CDSs insuring against US default. As if monetary scrap would be left around the world ... It's just a variant on the old truism that your insurance is only as good as the company that issues it. The story of this global economic downturn is ultimately that of how badly everyone misjudged risk, and consequently overleveraged themselves. From the individual all the way up to the sovereigns: we were awash in easy credit backed up by a profoundly mistaken belief that we were adequately "hedged" against default. The ChiComs are in an even worse fix because, well, they're Commies. Their government rules by fiat, and you can use most of their financial numbers to wipe your ass when you run out of TP. I've been saying this for years. I cannot fathom why investors have rushed into a closed, centrally-planned, communist-led economy that has every reason to lie about their success and to hide the (ever increasing) evidence that their economy is overleveraged and overheating. Add to that the reality of the demographic time-bomb, and China is purely a sucker's bet. You cannot "hedge" against systemic sovereign default -- at least, not with fiat currency. Commodities -- particularly gold and silver -- are your only real fallback. (Silver just hit $30/oz, and gold is at $1420.)

48 Ace finally has a 100,000,000 post!

49 Zipperheads

50

Monty, I sense you are a Zero Hedge reader as well.  ;-)

 

51 44:  Yeah.  I've always believed that any US-China war that didn't end with a quick PRC victory would inevitably add a Sino-Russian front, as the ChiComs head for the Siberian resource areas.

The African play is partly about resources...but sooner or later the fact that many of the energy resources are more efficiently obtained from much closer territory will cause troubles.  The history's already there, it's a matter of time.

That being the case, we may get this scenario playing out soon.  They won't face a weaker foe than Obama, and they know it--their best chance at a knockout blow with minimal followup is in the next 2-6 years.  All you need is casus belli, and the PRC isn't quite so fastidious about that sort of thing; NK collapse could be the first domino that sets the whole tragedy in motion.

52 China can NOT "call in its debt".

That's not how bonds work unless they want to take huge losses. The penalty for early redemption is not insignificant.

53 China's economy and stability has long been grossly overstated, but then that's what happens when you believe the press of a brutal communist dictatorship. The left used to do it all the time with the Soviet Union; the military believed the Soviets were far more capable and dangerous than they really were.

54 We have their stuff.  They have our paper.

Tell me again how this is going to work out for them if they lose our markets? 

Those workers will just leave the factories and go peacefully back to the farms, where they can starve again when harvests are bad.  Or maybe they'll have another cultural revolution and kill all the educated people.  Cambodia, writ large, because that worked out so well.

They could invade North Korea and take the women.

They could produce a whole bunch of things for domestic consumption, but what will they do next month?

There is no way to win, and there are plenty of ways for everyone to lose.