1 quick way to end the great socialist experiment of Europe.

2 What are you implying Monty? That God cursed socialists might be poor economic managers? Perish the thought, along with the EU.

3 They now said: “Come on! Let us build ourselves a city and also a tower with its top in the heavens, and let us make a celebrated name for ourselves, for fear we may be scattered over all the surface of the earth.”

4 I didn't think it would last.

5 Sorry, Dudes, I'm out.

6 does this mean that Virginia can disengage itself from California money?  sort of?

7 Good..... I hope it happens tommorrow with these Euro-Idiots. And then maybe Goat Boy Obama will STFU.... I am tired of hearing that Fuck-Stain on TV. Is anyone else tired of listening to his Shit ???? Always someone elses fault. Tell what has he done to help the country????

8
When Europe goes into an economic crisis,  they start killing each other.

It's all very nuanced.

9 jack, really.  don't you like Obama?  he is a healer.  har har

10

7 KiV,

I wish, the fact is EUtopia was trying to replicate about 230 years of US history in at most 5 decades....

"good luck*"

*to both sides of the pond

11 Prodi, who served two stints as Italian leader and ran the EU Commission from 1999 to 2004, said the “crisis isn’t unexpected. It came much later than I thought.”

Perhaps Milton Friedman was right;

We're in the midst of a wonderful natural experiment. You have a really different arrangement with the euro than we've ever had historically. We've had many cases in which a number of countries have used the same currency. That's when they've used gold or silver as money. But each individual country has been able to control the content of its own money. So while they were using the same commodity as currency, they were always in a position to determine what the terms of exchange were between their own currency and the other currencies.But the euro is a very different arrangement. For the first time in history, we have essentially an independent central bank for a considerable number of distinct political entities. I, in advance, was very negative about it and have been very negative & pessimistic about it. We'll see how the Europe plan does on the one hand and on the other, how the other countries of the world, the UK, the United States, Japan, which are linked together by flexible exchange rates, we'll see how they do.

12

IÂ’m kinda thinkin this isnÂ’t all just European debt levels doing this.

Sure the dollar is up against the Euro, but thatÂ’s because there is nothing else out there.  If India werenÂ’t between Pakistan and China, the Rupee would be the world currency.

I seem to remember Barry giving a great “I fixed the economy” speech yesterday. 

I wonder if he reads the news.  And his (and ReidÂ’s) numbers are up.  How is that happening?

For a Friday, I just hate these feelings of impending doom.  Hell, IÂ’d even prefer the feelings I have after having the shit beat outta me and being left to die in the gutter. 

Someone should ask Barry what is this hope he speaks of because I pretty sure it doesnÂ’t mean what he thinks it does.

13 No surprise here.

14 The basic problem in the Eurozone (as the article points out) is that there was no mechanism to handle extreme-stress situations, nor to accurately vet members states who manipulated their numbers to get in (like Greece). Once in the Eurozone, there was no mechanism to punish a member for failing to live up to the rules (as we have seen). The whole structure of the Eurozone pretty much guaranteed that any serious financial downturn was inevitably going to turn into a sovereign-debt crisis because none of the member nations could devalue the currency. It's why skeptics like me knew the project was doomed right from the start: it presupposed good financial behavior among nations that had no history of good financial behavior.

15 Good... Maybe the Frogs will destroy the Euro. Sarkozy says France has had enough of this crap... Greece...Spain....Portugal. Merkal got her ass reamed lately also....Germany again our the idiots of Europe because of her....Duhhhhhhhh !!! 

16 I'll bet the Lord Humongous would straighten out that EU currency in short order....we might get to find out.

17 Does this mean we will start seeing illegal Eurotrash immigrants here now too?

18 a year later, banknotes featuring generic architectural symbols and embossed with Greek lettering went into Europe-wide circulation.

Ha, I had almost forgotten about that. Fake buildings because putting real ones on the money would tweak someone's nose out of joint.

19 Deutschland uber alles!

20
17 I'll bet the Lord Humongous would straighten out that EU currency in short order....we might get to find out. Posted by: maddogg

Well he does rule the wasteland.  Do you think he'd see ruling Europe as a demotion?  I think there'd have to be a cut in pay.

21

12 Prodi, who served two stints as Italian leader and ran the EU Commission from 1999 to 2004, said the “crisis isn’t unexpected. It came much later than I thought.”

Posted by: Kratos (missing from the side of Mt Olympus) at May 14, 2010 09:28 AM (9hSKh)

The Euro was always built on a mush foundation.  There was no way that Europe was ever at parity with the U.S. as far as productivity goes, what with eurosocialism.  Of course it should be closer to parity no, and it is.  Not because the Euro is any weaker, but because the dollar is.

Again, this isn't just about the Euro.  It is about being in a deep hole and continuing to dig.

22 While on the subject of failed socialist states, it seems Comrade Zero's asshole buddy Hugo Chavez is having a slight problem with economics.

23 No s@$t.

You can't link the economies of Germany and Greece and France and Kosovo and Slovakia (etc) with their totally different public and private sectors, gov'ts, tax rates, and inability of workers to freely move between States (to act as a competitive release valve), and not expect economic problems.

24 Has Bush been blamed yet?

25 #7

In our system, any workers unhappy about the tax/business/employment situation in CA can just pick up and leave CA to go someplace better with literally no gov't barriers. 

And that's exactly what *IS* happening.

Consequently, the economy of CA contracts, while others (eg Texas) expands.

26 25 Has Bush been blamed yet?

No, but just wait.  Also blame "climate change" - it does everything else, why can't it cause the dissolution of the Eurozone?

27 uh...I blame my predessessor.

28 Has Bush been blamed yet?

Posted by: eman at May 14, 2010 09:35 AM (ONBbr)

Bush is always at fault. 100 years from now they will still be blaming Bush

29 The Euro project had another fundamental flaw: they wanted to duplicate the flexible labor-market of the USA and thought that they could accomplish it by establishing a common currency. What they forgot (or chose to ignore) was the inherent barriers to a highly-mobile workforce in Europe: lack of a common language, rigid work-rules and highly-unionized workforces, and chronic structural employment problems due to bloated public work sectors. An American worker in Ohio can haul stakes for Texas for work at any time; in Europe, workers are far less mobile.

30 24 No s@$t.

You can't link the economies of Germany and Greece and France and Kosovo and Slovakia (etc) with their totally different public and private sectors, gov'ts, tax rates, and inability of workers to freely move between States (to act as a competitive release valve), and not expect economic problems.

Posted by: looking closely at May 14, 2010 09:35 AM (6Q9g2)

So I'm guessing a closer look at the Mexico would reveal a solid, vibrant economy.  (joking - i know what you mean.)

31

I feel confident that the true villians will be revealed.

The Jooooooosssss.

32

 An American worker in Ohio can haul stakes for Texas for work at any time; in Europe, workers are far less mobile.

That explains the "Welcome to Texas, now go home" bumper stickers.

33

When they went to the euro, it was only a matter of time before they would have problems.  To some extent there are parallels between what is happening there and what is happening here within our states -- we're a bit luckier imho, as our states are not that comparable to EU member nations -- there is more cohesiveness; that's something the Euros seemed to get wrong with their modeling; our states are set up much along the same lines -- theirs aren't.

They're stuck -- if some of the countries are sloughed off of the euro, then they actually can become a bit more marketplace competitive by underselling the euro states and thus exporting more manufactured goods (the euro is still grossly overvalued); if they are kept then there will be more crisis; if a country like Germany decides to get out -- then the engine driving the EU is gone.

 

It'll be an interesting summer.

34
It's all because of the Joos poisoning the wells!

35 ...so, I've got like 20€ from my last trip to Germany sitting at home...mostly coins, because I kept forgetting the 2€ coins could be used like real money, unlike quarters.  I had ecided to hold onto them for my next trip (September, employment and Eyjafjallajökull willing), but now...is it better to trade them in the next time I'm at DTW and hope there's enough for a beer, or give them to my niece and nephews as souvenirs?

36 The Dow is down over a hundred points right now, by the way. Some of this is the European troubles, but a lot of it is the crummy numbers turned in yesterday by the US retailers. American consumers aren't unlimbering their wallets much, it turns out. Unexpectedly.

37

Then we have this bullshit.  People are boycotting Arizona because Arizona is a little upset about a huge number of illegalÂ’s who love Mexico that they came here illegally and an even bigger number of jackasses around the country think that that attitude is pretty cool.

We are really pretty screwed.  Have I mentioned that?

38 23 While on the subject of failed socialist states, it seems Comrade Zero's asshole buddy Hugo Chavez is having a slight problem with economics.

Posted by: maddogg at May 14, 2010 09:34 AM (OlN4e)

Great article.  Thanks for linking it.

39 Europe tried to have its cake and eat it too.

40 weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee............................................

41 In our system, any workers unhappy about the tax/business/employment situation in CA can just pick up and leave CA to go someplace better with literally no gov't barriers. 



...and companies unhappy about the tax/regulation situation in the USA can go to China.

42 ...so, I've got like 20€ from my last trip to Germany sitting at home...mostly coins, because I kept forgetting the 2€ coins could be used like real money, unlike quarters.  I had ecided to hold onto them for my next trip (September, employment and Eyjafjallajökull willing), but now...is it better to trade them in the next time I'm at DTW and hope there's enough for a beer, or give them to my niece and nephews as souvenirs?

Posted by: HeatherRadish at May 14, 2010 09:40 AM (mR7mk)

should have traded them in a couple of weeks ago and then waited till the trip to convert money then

43
Europe tried to have its cake and eat it too.
Posted by: eman

Let them eat shit.

44 Well, I'm sure another tongue lashing from Brother Obama about how they're spending too much should fix things . . . .

45 Dow down over 135 early.

46

Great article.  Thanks for linking it.

Posted by: conscious, but incoherent at May 14, 2010 09:41 AM (YVZlY)

Hey, no problem. Ace "borrows"posts from Hotair, I steal from JWF...

47 The EU Commission estimated May 5 that the overall economy will grow 0.9 percent in 2010, not enough to create jobs, after shrinking 4.1 percent in 2009. It predicts unemployment will climb to 10.3 percent in 2010 from 9.4 percent in 2009.

What's all the fuss about? Those are pretty good numbers for Europe.

And starting in 2009, for America, too.

48

"Do you think he'd see ruling Europe as a demotion?  I think there'd have to be a cut in pay."

Barack Ayers next best seller will shore up the gap.

49 Maybe Captain Fantastic will read a speech off the Teleprompter and save the Euro-Zone. Then all the European cuntries can then form break-out sessions to discuss the issue and report back to Captain Fantastic on a solution ......And do nothing and say it is solved!!! Of course we can start by blaming Bush for the Euro-Zone being so screwed up and that Bush was sighted in Greece also. Then Captain Fantastic will propose higher taxes in Europe to fix the problem and when the economic numbers fall agian, blame the republicans in congress, evil insurance companies, and BP for blocking his brilliant idea. And the storey goes on...another BS Obama speech and breakout session........

50 What the EU needs to do is set up a blue-ribbon commission to get back to them in no less than thirty days with solutions.

That always solves problems here in the US.

51 When Europe goes into an economic crisis,  they start killing each other.

Traditition!

52 Monetary union without political union is the equivalent of allowing multiple drivers to use the gas pedal, brake, and steering wheel of the bus simultaneously.

53 It's why skeptics like me knew the project was doomed right from the start: it presupposed good financial behavior among nations that had no history of good financial behavior.

Bingo.

54 should have traded them in a couple of weeks ago and then waited till the trip to convert money then

What's awesome about the 21st century is I never had to convert dollars--my ATM card from my little bank in rural Iowa worked at the Munich airport.

55 Didn't the CIA predict about ten years ago that the EU wouldn't last past 2015?

56 This sucks, cuz the Euro is really pretty.

57 Think this one is cool? Wait til the kaka hits the fan here in CA.

58

And oh yes--everything will be fine since the President warned Spain about the perils of out-of-control deficit spending this week.

Apparently with a straight face.

59

So excessive debt will destroy a currency. Good thing we're not in that situation....wait.. 

60 58 It's why skeptics like me knew the project was doomed right from the start: it presupposed good financial behavior among nations that had no history of good financial behavior.

Bingo.

Posted by: GulfCoastTider at May 14, 2010 09:48 AM (9BMyr)

good financial behavior?

61

I am Barack Obama and, Blah....Blah...Blah.....Blah....Blah...Blah.....Blah....Blah...Blah.....And another thing Europe...Blah....Blah...Blah.....Blah....Blah...Blah.....Goddamn Bush....Blah....Blah...Blah.....Fucking BP  ...Blah...Blah.....Blah....Blah...Blah.....and that is what I propose....

 

62 Wait til the kaka hits the fan here in CA.

Posted by: eman at May 14, 2010 09:49 AM (ONBbr)

Wha?

What's wrong with California?

63 Even the cocksucking commies at the New York Review of Books realized at the onset that the EU was lax on insisting that the joining countries have their financial houses in order.  When those fuckheads are hinky about anything that is counter to US goals you know there's a giant turd floating in the punchbowl.

64 What's awesome about the 21st century is I never had to convert dollars--my ATM card from my little bank in rural Iowa worked at the Munich airport.

Posted by: HeatherRadish at May 14, 2010 09:48 AM (mR7mk)

should have gotten dollars and then went out of the airport and hit up a place, you always get shittier rates in the airports. At this time, you might as well hold onto the euros and hope they are still around or keep them as souvenirs of an era gone bye

65 There are some big political battles ahead for Europe that have lessons for us here at home. The EU bureaucrats have always worked against the notion of democratic rule, but this is even more obvious now -- they are simply ignoring existing rules or making new ones up without regard to the what the citizens of the various countries have to say about it, all to "keep the euro afloat". But the average Jose, Pierre, Gunter, or Sven is wondering what in the hell they are trying to save the Euro for. There is an element of the absurd about the Greek bailout as well: no one -- no one -- expects the Greeks to stick to the draconian austerity measures laid out for them. It's pure fantasy to expect it. The Greeks are striking and rioting before the harsh measures have even begun to bite; can you imagine how they're going to be a year down the road? Bailout out Greece is simply throwing good money after bad, but the ECB bureaucrats apparently fear humiliation more than societal breakdown and chaos. The obvious solution -- the cheapest solution -- is simply to either dissolve the Eurozone or shrink it back to the core Western European countries, thus allowing the weaker states to default, devalue, and begin the process of digging themselves back out. But Europe seems bound and determined to turn a fiscal crisis into a social and societal one. There is little hope for a good outcome. Californians in particular should be watching and taking notes, because many of the same scenes are going to be playing out in LA, San Diego, and Sacramento this summer.

66

When Europe goes into an economic crisis, they start killing each other.

Job opportunity!

67 #63 And oh yes--everything will be fine since the President warned Spain about the perils of out-of-control deficit spending this week.

Apparently with a straight face.

He does that a lot.  Such as when he chides his political opponents for not being civil while he calls them "teabaggers", tells them to go play with their self, and flips them off on camera.

68 Markets are down, Unexpected!

69 Wha? What's wrong with California? Posted by: Jim in San Diego Nothing, nothing. Go back to sleep.

70 Obama is a liar and sit down and STFU little man-child !!!!! Christ I am actually beginning to beleive that Hillary should have been elected then this little weasel... She has more balls then this eunich....

71 #67  What's wrong with California?

Just a personal observation, but when I visited there a few weeks ago, I swore I saw a hand write mene, mene, tekel, upharsin on the hotel wall there.  Too bad I'm not fluent in Aramaic. 

72 Gee what a surprise, the lazy do-nothing countries try and hitch a free ride on the backs of the productive do-something countries.  The only surprise is that France is counted as a productive country.  Things must be worse than we know.

73

I would say that it saddens me to see the Euros make total fools of themselves, yet once again, but it only saddens me that the obnoxious, arrogant pricks took this long to finally collapse - moralizing to us and pushing the Indonesian Imbecile on us during the time (Germany should have disallowed an American politician from even thinking of holding a campaign stop there).  That said, if the Euro falls without a few million dead it will be an improvement for them.  Of course, we all know that the retarded Euros are just going to replace the idiotic Euro (and EU) with something even dumber, because that's what Euros do.

Clearly, the Euroweenies will need help through this tough time, so I, on behalf of the US, do hereby give (for eterenity) the Indonesian Imbecile to Europe.  He's all theirs (and they cannot return him).  I cannot think of a better match.

Good luck, Europe, with your stuttering messiah.  You guys love him, now he's yours.  Don't call us.  We'll call you ... maybe. 

74 In related news, Estonia has ditched its plans to adopt the Euro in 2011, opting instead to peg its currency against the more stable Argentine peso.

75 Nothing, nothing.

Go back to sleep.

Posted by: eman at May 14, 2010 09:53 AM (ONBbr)

Oh good. See, I knew there was nothing wrong with California.

I mean we are like totally the 5th largest economy in the word, dude.

76

Wha?

What's wrong with California?

Posted by: Jim in San Diego at May 14, 2010 09:51 AM (oIp16)

Nothing that a nuke aimed right at the San Andreas fault can't fix.

77 still waiting for the left to bring back the "We need to become more like the enlightened Europeans" meme that's been running these past 15 or so years

78 #82  Reminds me of this.

How Superman Should Have Ended.

79 Time to start cutting back? Ground Air Pelosi and save over $1 million a year. http://tiny.cc/udtw9

80 I can't find the article on Roubini's site, but he explains how Greece (or any one of the other free-spending Euro members) faces not a liquidity crisis, but a solvency crisis.  Samuelson notes that what TARP did for us, the IMF bailout of Greece did for the Eurozone.  It gives them a little time to try to address the lack of fiscal discipline.  What makes anyone think the political courage to impose discipline exists anywhere on the planet?

81 Blame Bush or pin it all on the "failures of capitalism". That's a nice lie/excuse for them too.

82 Prediction:

Germany will withdraw from the Euro at 1PM EDT, after European markets have closed for the weekend.

83

I always blame Bush too.




The beer.

84 Cheap Scandi Blondes for everyone !!!

85 Just a personal observation, but when I visited there a few weeks ago, I swore I saw a hand write mene, mene, tekel, upharsin on the hotel wall there.  Too bad I'm not fluent in Aramaic. 

Posted by: Kratos (missing from the side of Mt Olympus) at May 14, 2010 09:54 AM (9hSKh)

That means "keep up the good work" if I remember my anchient Aramaic from high school Spanish.

86 Ronald Reagan's European Polices have failed us. I will save Europe by sending Chewy, I mean Michelle to Europe to fix the problem. I am Barack Obama savior of the world...thank you.

87 90 Cheap Scandi Blondes for everyone !!!

Posted by: Barbarian at May 14, 2010 10:02 AM (EL+OC)

Where does the line start?

88 Just a personal observation, but when I visited there a few weeks ago, I swore I saw a hand write mene, mene, tekel, upharsin on the hotel wall there.  Too bad I'm not fluent in Aramaic. 

Posted by: Kratos (missing from the side of Mt Olympus) at May 14, 2010 09:54 AM (9hSKh)

 

I think it means "replica Gucci handbags at discount prices"

89 Doesn't America have an obligation to help?

90 It gives them a little time to try to address the lack of fiscal discipline. It gives them time to squander more money without making hard decisions. It's Mexican Standoff time the world over: public-sector unions vs private-sector taxpayers, rent-seeking businesses vs investors, politicians vs the citizens. No one wants to have their entitlements cut; they're only willing to talk about someone else's. I'm becoming increasingly certain that total collapse is the only way that structural reform will be possible. The modern welfare-state has bred an entire world full of selfish children.

91 DJIA is off 166+ points UNEXPECTEDLY

92 Samuelson notes that what TARP did for us, the IMF bailout of Greece did for the Eurozone.  It gives them a little time to try to address the lack of fiscal discipline. 

Posted by: GulfCoastTider at May 14, 2010 09:59 AM (9BMyr)

I'll have to check out the Samuelson piece, but I am a bit annoyed that people keep talking about TARP as if it did something.  TARP was a joke, really.  It was the Fed swapping (i.e. buying up) 2 trillion in toxic, worthless assets and printing over a trillion that really had the effect on us (and it was only temporary, and very, very expensive).  That's why TARP was left without a job and became nothing more than a huge slush fund at Treasury, being used for all manner of things totally unrelated to monetary concerns.  TARP was never used to purchase one toxic asset - beyond GM and Chrysler, themselves.

93 I'm becoming increasingly certain that total collapse is the only way that structural reform will be possible. The modern welfare-state has bred an entire world full of selfish children.

If Kratos were here, I'm sure he would agree with your assessment of the cathartic and therapeutic effects of Chaos.

94 Check the LIBOR rate: it's right back to where it was a year ago (.34). A month ago it was .25. This means credit is tightening again as banks become less willing to loan money to each other without a very high vig. Ignore the stock market except as an indicator of the public mood. It's worthless as an indicator of the state of the economy. Watch the bond and credit markets. The news there is not good. At all.

95 Not that I blame the French for pulling out. At least they've always had sense enough to look out for their own best interests. THAT'S French diplomacy for you.

96

The obvious solution -- the cheapest solution -- is simply to either dissolve the Eurozone or shrink it back to the core Western European countries

The problem with this solution is that so many countries in Old Europe are strapped with unmanageable debt. Italy, Germany, Spain, Portugal, France, Austria, Denmark, Belgium, Holland, Britain and Ireland all have a day of reckoning on their planners.

97 At least they've always had sense enough to look out for their own best interests. THAT'S French diplomacy for you.

Posted by: maverick muse at May 14, 2010 10:11 AM (H+LJc)

I wish the French would look out for their own best interests.  Usually, it seems that they derive some perverse thrill just out of stabbing allies in the back, for no real payoff.

"I'd rather have a German division in front of me than a French division behind me." -- things Patton could have said ...

98 I beleive the "FRENCH DECISION HAS COME PREMATURELY". I will save France again as I did in WW II. Because I am Barack Obama and when my teleprompter is working I will give a speech on the situation.

99 The answer is that we should boycott Arizona to fix the Euro-Zone problem. Obviously it is white cracker racism that has caused this problem in Europe!!!!

100

That's okay.  The muslims will show them how to unify Europe.

 

Submission!

101 #99  If Kratos were here, I'm sure he would agree with your assessment of the cathartic and therapeutic effects of Chaos.

Even out of Chaos, Order can arise again.

102 The problem with this solution is that so many countries in Old Europe are strapped with unmanageable debt. That situation will not change regardless, and will actually get worse if the countries stay in the Euro. Why? Because no one nation can control their own monetary policy. Devaluation is very good for one country (Greece) but very bad for another (Germany), and vice-versa. You can't solve any structural problems because there is no way to "target" the medicine -- what helps one country puts the hurt on another. Moreover, the citizens of these countries are going to get fed up sooner rather than later. Thrifty Germans are already upset that they're taking a financial hit to bail out their spendthrift Mediterranean cohorts (who, let us not forget, lied to get into the Euro in the first place). If this age has a single meme that will persist beyond our own age, I think, it will be that we saw the death of "moral hazard" as an economic principle.

103

I  think the name of the currency was the problem. 

I think it's the design. They should've portrayed Kraftwerk, Laurent Garnier and Iron Maiden on the notes.

104 Ignore the stock market except as an indicator of the public mood. It's worthless as an indicator of the state of the economy.

How true Monty. The news blatherers have used the DJIA as an indicator of the economy since the great depression. It got that way because the government of FDR did not want the public to understand that the stock market crash in 1929 really didn't cause the depression. It was the government action of tightening the money supply, raising taxes, and increasing spending that caused it.

Exactly what they are doing right now as we speak.

105 Chavez's soialist paradise is collasping as well.

Sounds like 'other people's money has ran out'.

106 They can save the Euro by giving it a more appropriate texture.

107 Exactly what they are doing right now as we speak.

Posted by: Vic at May 14, 2010 10:24 AM (6taRI)

Well ... we're certainly not tightening the money supply, but the anti-capitalism, anti-growth policies and over-expansion of federal government are killers, for sure.

108 Everyone should note all the rioting and unrest in Greece that is going on as they tighten the belts of government.

Take note because the same thing will happen here as the federal government slush funds to the urban areas are cut.

109 Barry will be looking into appointing a Euro czar

110 does this mean that Virginia can disengage itself from California money?  sort of?


California has money???

111

I think it's the design. They should've portrayed Kraftwerk, Laurent Garnier and Iron Maiden on the notes.

It is a scientific fact that no note adorned with the image of Bruce Dickenson may ever be intrinsically worthless.

112

I think it's the design. They should've portrayed Kraftwerk, Laurent Garnier and Iron Maiden on the notes.

I liked the money in The In-Laws (the original - I never saw the crappy remake).  Tits on bank notes can never lose!

113

http://tinyurl.com/2fh5poo

114

At least Obama has his priorities figured out here in America. First he spends Trillions bailing out our banks so our system doesn't collapse and they can start lending again. Then he publically berates the banks, next he crimminalizes them and now he overregulates them so they will never loan again.

He must love it when his plan comes together.

115

http://tinyurl.com/2fh5poo

Posted by: Entropy at May 14, 2010 10:36 AM (IsLT6)

Yeah ... that cover looks the way the Euro feels.

 

116

109  But the Germans themselves are partially to be held responsible for this fiasco.  They have an almost predatory, export driven economy -- that did not help matters at all.

I have relatives in Italy -- one of the ways that country has always managed to muddle through (in spite of their horribly corrupt and ineffective government) has been to capitalize on the devaluation/low value of their currency.  Italians may not be good at government or have an infrastructure that gives them a competitive heavy industrial base, but they make some nice stuff; nice stuff that is even more attractive when it comes at a nice price.  The euro pretty much blasted the crap out of that (same thing happened to Ireland).  Portugal, Spain, and Greece I don't know enough about to comment on, but people in the two I's have their own beefs with the euro (it was not very popular in discussions around the family table that's for sure).

117 Comprehensive Legislative Reform Package

"Like it or not," the buck stops @ Obama, Bill Ayers'  & Globalist Co., Inc. hide and pockets.

We demand the citizen taxpayer voices be honored by Constitutional governance. Referendum. Bail-Outs are taxation without representation, not to be funded with tax dollars. 

If enterprise fails, it fails. Period. Wall Street and the Federal Reserve can die. It isn't as if "Wall Street" is a prerequisite to industry, as if no other system exists to fill the "void". Either invest in something, or abstain from investing in something. Survival of the fittest rather than survival determined by "investor" sharks betting against success, growing corruption and failure like cancer, suffocating entrepreneurs. 

If people choose to privately contribute to a bail-out, that is their choice to make.

Legislative or chief executive demands for  taxes to fund any bail-out should be grounds for immediate dismissal from office, holding the culprits demanding redistribution of wealth via taxation personally accountable for the entire amount they request taken from their own corporate interests and private and personal estates, collateral for their own personal debt because there are NO FUNDS FROM TAXES FOR BAIL-OUTS.

Dump the parasitic Federal Reserve and obligations to the UN. Chips fall where they may in free trade. It isn't as if postponing the inevitable, printing fake valued paper money, is making anything better for those who work producing goods for a living rather than pencil pushing fraud from the Federal Reserve and Congress, progressively eliminating what grounds for stability still exist. Seems so, IMHO. Given secure national borders, let industry produce goods again without government "aid" --eliminate tax funds for socialism, the train from agribusiness and welfare "entitlements" through ObamaCare and the whole caboose.

118 9
When Europe goes into an economic crisis,  they start killing each other.

It's all very nuanced.

Posted by: Dang

So then, the only question remaining is "Who do we sell the guns to?"

119 unknown jane

On Italians muddling through despite all, a scene from Catch-22 came to mind.

120 I think I'm taking things down to a micro level so I can maintain some sanity.  Knowing things are rotten at the top across the world isn't helping, so the best thing I can do is take steps to ensure that my family is prepared and protected when the inevitable consequences of this bullshit start to come about.  I may not be able to do very much, but I can at least prepare for meeting their needs in a prolonged crisis.

None of this is going to end well, but when it does, I want me and mine alive to help rebuild it.

121 If Germany and France pull out of the Euro, the remaining countries can let the Euro devalue since they are basically in the same stew.

122 126  One thing about my sorta, kinda, halfway people: they usually come through despite their leaders.  At least they always have; I suppose they will again because a healthy disdain for government and authority seems to be part of their genetic makeup.

123 It almost seems time for some sort of alternative hard money; like a mixed metals fund that you can spend using a credit card.

124

When Europe goes into an economic crisis,  they start killing each other.

It's all very nuanced.

Posted by: Dang

Let's hope!

So then, the only question remaining is "Who do we sell the guns to?"

Posted by: sTevo at May 14, 2010 10:52 AM (3ohH7)

To who ever will pay in dollars, gold, or Czech girls.  And isn't muslim.

125 When Europe goes into an economic crisis,  they start killing each other.

It's all very nuanced.

Posted by: Dang

So then, the only question remaining is "Who do we sell the guns to?"

Posted by: sTevo at May 14, 2010 10:52 AM (3ohH7)

Sell to the French.  Their guns are always worth more at the end of the war.

126 If the Euro-Zone follows my leadership model then this would not have happened. Just goes to show Capitalism doesn't work and socialism does. George Bush against has screwed over the Euro-Zone.

127 None of this is going to end well, but when it does, I want me and mine alive to help rebuild it.

Posted by: grognard at May 14, 2010 10:55 AM (v0kvW)

That's a heavy burden for a family man to carry - I don't envy those who have such worries.  As a single man, if we go into a prolonged crisis (one in which I have to become poor/desperate) I'd prefer to check out early.  I'll just want to make sure that a fellow conservative gets my guns and ammo when that time comes.

 

128 Come on Herr Morgenholz - not the french, the money is always in spare parts. You need someone who will use them, but not do basic PM -- Russians or Italians.

129 Whhhheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee...

130 He [Papantoniou, 60, Greek finance minister] responded to the German’s outburst in Verona by offering him “an appointment in two years’ time to check this out and you’ll change your mind.”

When driving along a road, and a road that sign says "BRIDGE OUT" is encountered, and there are no other roads of any other type seen, anywhere, at least stop and think about what a road sign that says "BRIDGE OUT" could possibly mean.

131

-173.90  (-1.61%)

Wait for meeee!!!!

132

There's a strange article from Portugal. The nation that put the "P" in "PIGS" is still running a deficit, and none of the public sector is taking a hit. The government raised taxes, and they've been getting much bailout cash. After all that they are now touting an improved economy - "economic miracle" in fact.

My guess is that anybody can claim an "economic miracle" when someone else is paying for it.

133 If the "Republican Minority" in Congress backed my plan to save the Euro, None of this would have happened.

134 The government raised taxes, and they've been getting much bailout cash. After all that they are now touting an improved economy - "economic miracle" in fact.

Posted by: Zimriel at May 14, 2010 11:19 AM (9Sbz+)

Sounds like the White House is renting out TOTUS for some extra cash.

135

Such as when he chides his political opponents for not being civil while he calls them "teabaggers", tells them to go play with their self, and flips them off on camera.

He seems to have a thing about male genitalia.

I mean, we do that here too, but at least we toss in a few boobie comments here and there.

136 135  Raises hand.. bring them here; how much do you have and how good?

137

Funny how the Daily Mail, just yesterday wrote, in their idiotic "Whos' Running Europe" article:

"The U.S. President has also been credited with helping to save the Euro, after giving advice to European leaders on how to handle the debt crisis."

Europe are such dopes.  They deserve the Indonesian Imbecile, and the rest of their muslims, too.

138

We live in interesting times.

139 I'm not an economist, but doesn't it make sense to address the problems (ie Fannie and Freddie and the pustules in Congress who aided and abetted) before spending more of our hard-earned money??

140 Any guesses on when we hit EUR/USD parity? It's beginning to look like it might happen within the next few weeks.

141 76 #67  What's wrong with California?

Just a personal observation, but when I visited there a few weeks ago, I swore I saw a hand write mene, mene, tekel, upharsin on the hotel wall there.  Too bad I'm not fluent in Aramaic. 

Posted by: Kratos (missing from the side of Mt Olympus)

That's rich.

142 Bwaahahahahaha!!

143 I'm concerned about USD / peso parity.

144 When Europe goes into an economic crisis,  they start killing each other.

It's all very nuanced.

Posted by: Dang

So then, the only question remaining is "Who do we sell the guns to?"
Posted by: sTevo

All of 'em.

145 All of 'em.

Posted by: jwpaine at May 14, 2010 12:07 PM (g4J4S)

Meh.  Let the Euros bite each other to death.

146 148 Any guesses on when we hit EUR/USD parity? It's beginning to look like it might happen within the next few weeks.

And, as a follow-up question, will the event look like co-linear lines, or a point where two lines intersect?

147 #1, no end of euro won't end du or socialism but it might make certain truths harder to ignore. In any case, EUROPE IS DEAD.

148

And, as a follow-up question, will the event look like co-linear lines, or a point where two lines intersect?

What? You think Danica McKellar reads this blog?

149 Did some commenter give you shit for writing long, analytical posts?

150 progressoverpeace

When in France, French first despite whatever "brotherhood" fraternity spiel they'vid pay lipservice to Algiers. I'll never forget De Gaulle fucking the US via Kissinger no thanks to the numb-chuck progressive Nixon forking over all our Treasury's gold on demand.

151 47 minutes to Morgenholz's prediction deadline.

152  
When Europe goes into an economic crisis,  they start killing each other.

It's all very nuanced.

Posted by: Dang

...in a nutshell

153 "Put a fourchette/forchetta in it, the Euro is done...

154

I'll never forget De Gaulle fucking the US via Kissinger no thanks to the numb-chuck progressive Nixon forking over all our Treasury's gold on demand.

Don't hate the player, hate the (Bretton-Woods) game, mon ami.

155

Posted by: maverick muse at May 14, 2010 12:14 PM (H+LJc)

Yep.

156

I've got a bad feeling about this.

9. Dang
When Europe goes into an economic crisis,  they start killing each other.

It's all very nuanced.

 

You (We) guys haven't seen the anti-Americanism yet.  The Bush 8 years are nothing to compare with what is coming.

157

“You have the great problem of a potential disintegration of the euro,” former Federal Reserve Chairman Paul Volcker, 82, said yesterday in London. “The essential element of discipline in economic policy and in fiscal policy that was hoped for” has “so far not been rewarded in some countries.”

Why wouldn't the same be true for the economic union known as the USA?

158

Germany will withdraw from the Euro at 1PM EDT, after European markets have closed for the weekend.

Any word from 99 Kriegsminister yet?

159 Any word from 99 Kriegsminister yet?

Wir halten uns fuer Captain Kirk.

160

Germany will withdraw from the Euro at 1PM EDT, after European markets have closed for the weekend.

Any word from 99 Kriegsminister yet?

Posted by: FireHorse at May 14, 2010 01:02 PM (cQyWA)

Remember that I'm the guy that predicted I'd get in Donna Smith's pants at the after-prom, too.

161 Did some commenter give you shit for writing long, analytical posts? Yeah, I know...I never use one word when twenty will do the job. It's a sickness. This post was the equivalent of the one-cheek squeak you'd let go in Math class. I'll be back to my logorrheic normal self before long.

162 Meanwhile Barry's home state is screwed seventeen ways to supernova. Mish's site (globaleconomicanalysis dot blogspot dot com) notes: For 35 years, frail senior citizens in southern Illinois could turn to the Shawnee Development Council for help cleaning the house, buying groceries or any of the chores that make the difference between living at home or moving to an institution. No more. The council shut down the program Thursday because of a budget crisis created by the state of Illinois' failure to pay its bills. ... Illinois isn't bothering with the formality of issuing IOUs, as California did last year. It simply doesn't pay. and Prisons refused bullets Illinois' deadbeat reputation has created some embarrassing situations. A supplier refused to sell bullets to the Department of Corrections unless it got paid in advance. Legislators have gotten eviction notices for their district offices because the state wasn't paying rent. One legislator said he had to use campaign funds to pay the telephone bill after service was cut off at his office. So you see, we can't cut anything because the old folks will starve and the prisoners will run riot. Hope and change!

163 If only Europe could've gotten it together in Copenhagen, none of this would be happening right now!

164 I blame Napoleon.

165 I just gave a speech to myself regarding the Euro-Zone and I have decided the problem is solved.

166 Yeah that whole "Socialism" things working out so great that our wise and humble leaders B. Hussien Obama, Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid wants us to follow in their footsteps.   MORONS!

167

Californians in particular should be watching and taking notes, because many of the same scenes are going to be playing out in LA, San Diego, and Sacramento this summer.

Hey Monty, you touched on this the other day in response to a question that I asked you about the "terrible cuts".  I did see your response and appreciate the insight.  In the end don't you think the obama and the feds will come flying in to rescue CA when the shit really hits the fan their?

168 The end of the eurozone and the EU would be the best thing for europe, really... what they really need is a free trade zone WITHOUT the bureaucracy in Brussels. The euro was never a matter of necessity, just a French grab at recapturing long-lost glory.

169 In the end don't you think the obama and the feds will come flying in to rescue CA when the shit really hits the fan their? It's the best way to buy votes for 2012 and 2010, for that matter. While my fellow asshats in Clownifornia cannot be expected to vote widely for a Republican, they can stay home and not vote. A bailout bribe from Barry could help get the scum in this state into the voting booth, early and often.

170 The euro was never a matter of necessity, just a French grab at recapturing long-lost glory.

Posted by: CoolCzech at May 14, 2010 01:53 PM (9IHmo)

More directly, it was a pathetic attempt to attack the dollar.  Back in 2003, I was arguing with an annoying Germna journalist who was lecturing me on why the US shouldn't invade Iraq.  I asked him what decisions of great import anyone in Europe had made over the past 100 years.  His answer: The Euro - to which I laughed.  Then, I asked him what so great about the Euro.  His response was that it was an assault on the dollar, to which I said, "Exactly, numbnuts."

171 176  Except the French fudged it again, as usual, and the Russians are the only ones who will get any advantage from it, as usual (but they'll eventually flub it because of some internal problem, as usual).

172 Good. I'm shorting the Euro.

173
"the Europeans are starting to realize that their common-currency experiment isn't working out quite the way they'd hoped it would."

Sorry, The One will bankrupt this country ten times over before he allows European socialism to fail.  I understand that the Fed is already diverting quite a bit of money right now.

174 In the end don't you think the obama and the feds will come flying in to rescue CA when the shit really hits the fan their? No, and I'll tell you why: we're broke. Collectively. If the feds bail out California, then they're also going to have to bail out Michigan and New Jersey and New York and Connecticut and Rhode Island and.... Well, you see what I mean. The amounts involved would dwarf the $1T we sneezed off on TARP. And there are limits to what the feds can do, legally. I realize that Bammer's appreciation for federalism is quite a bit lower than my own, but even so there are Constitutional limits to how and where the federal government can intervene in a state's affairs. (Remember, it's not just a debt problem where Uncle Sugar can just cut a check; it's a structural deficit and spending problem due to lots of factors: entitlements (mainly public-sector pensions and retiree healthcare), explosions in government services that are not offset by tax revenues, and generally crummy financial performance by the municipalities. The only way to "save" California is to beggar everyone else, and I don't think that even Obama is that stupid. It would be a repeat of the Greece debacle in Europe -- you don't want to cut off the gangrenous foot, but you risk killing the patient if you don't. The choice for California, as for Greece, isn't whether they are going to default, but whether they are going to do so in a controlled or uncontrolled way.

175

The only way to "save" California is to beggar everyone else, and I don't think that even Obama is that stupid. It would be a repeat of the Greece debacle in Europe -- you don't want to cut off the gangrenous foot, but you risk killing the patient if you don't.

I'm not disagreeing with you here but can't you just hear it now "why can we give Greece 50bil but for CA it's tough shit"?  And yeah they "acted stupidly" to borrow a phrase but so did GM and Chrysler and look what happened to them - rescued by the lord and savior himself.  I see your point about where would it end but I think that is my point as well. 

I hope your right though - not about the misery but about them having to go it alone.  And yeah of course at the end of the day I would put my money on your analysis and not mine.  Good work btw - Glad you got a set of keys dude.

176 And yeah of course at the end of the day I would put my money on your analysis and not mine. Well, bear in mind two things: 1) I'm as full of shit as anyone, and probably more so than most; and 2) I'm notoriously cynical about the ability of politicians to make hard choices. I would be very happy to be proven wrong.

177 And yeah they "acted stupidly" to borrow a phrase but so did GM and Chrysler and look what happened to them - rescued by the lord and savior himself.  I see your point about where would it end but I think that is my point as well.

GM and Chrysler were not "saved".  They were given to the unions. There is a big difference. The unions were, who caused all the problems, were what was bailed out.

They will be back at the trough for another filling before Obama is out of office. Hopefully we will have a Repub congress by then so that they will be allowed to go down the tubes.