November 17, 2010
— Monty Apologies for the lack of posting recently. I was colonized by a virus of the family Orthomyxoviridae, which had me lying on my humble pallet alternately sweating with fever and then shaking like a scared dog. Apparently I was in the "give this chump a placebo" control group when I received my influenza vaccine a couple of weeks back. At any rate, my immune system finally got off its lazy, goldbricking ass and drove off the invaders, so once again...DOOM! Acting Man points out that even the very best jugglers cannot keep the balls in the air forever. Sooner or later, they're going to fall. I don't know that I'd say that "businesses are doing great" (a lot of those "profits" they're making are coming from reduced headcount and tightened internal processes, not increased sales), but it is true that the government is still a bloated and inefficient mess. Ireland might get another bowl of porridge from the IMF. Pride doesn't fill an empty belly, as my mom always said. EU exposure to Irish debt? A nice round $650 billion. I'm still amazed that people think that this can end in any way other than a default. Oh, the EU or the IMF can "bail out" Ireland, but what they're really doing is bailing out German and French banks. As with the Greeks, there may be a level of austerity the citizens will simply refuse to tolerate simply to make sure that foreign bondholders don't have to take a haircut. If I had to pick the very choicest morsel from this banquet of bitter rage, it would have to be the phrase "wanker-banker buddies". Things fall apart; the center cannot hold. Hamtramck, MI seeks bankruptcy. You're going to see more of this in the coming year, count on it. Headlines like this are why British newspapers are better than American ones: "Austria tells Greece to get stuffed". Who would have thought that a nation full of layabouts, tax cheats, and public-sector leeches would lie about a thing like their finances? Saddle up, boys! We're going to find the Bernanke gang and put things a-right. Dow 14,000 in 2012, baby! Sometimes it's hard to tell cockeyed optimism from pure insane dementia. Though I guess if Helicopter Ben gets the inflation he's been working so hard for, it's not out of the question. (And it is just possible, you know, that sad old bears like me are wrong. Sometimes it's good to hear from the optimists just to remind myself that there's an alternative point of view. An insane, nonsensical, reality-denying, alternate point-of-view.) Three reasons the G-20 talks hit a dead end. Actually, you don't need three reasons. You only need one: nobody wants to take the hit. It's a game of musical chairs, and everybody is jostling and shoving to make sure that they're close to an empty chair when the music stops. If the Bowles-Simpson deficit-reduction plan was at least a serious attempt at solving the various intractable problems involved with shrinking America's colossal indebtedness (and reducing our liabilities), what would you call the Schakowski plan? I think I would call it the "Squeeze 'Em Until They Pop" plan, because it's composed mostly of taxes on businesses and "the rich". It's basically another chorus sung straight out of the Democrat hymnal. LEAVE BEN ALONE!!!ONE Editorial Comment: I don't believe this "it's not Ben's fault" line a single bit. Bernanke has wide latitude as to what he can and cannot do, and he is choosing to do some fantastically stupid stuff. No, Bernanke is not at fault for all of it; but he bears a significant portion of the blame. And QE2 sits on his shoulders alone. If it works, he'll be the hero of the hour; if it fails (as seems likely), his legacy as a dimwitted chump will be sealed. His rep in the global financial world is probably already damaged beyond repair. Ben Bernanke is not a helpless victim who only acted under orders and mandates, remember that. He chose the path he has taken. He could have chosen a different one. Judge him on the basis of choices he has made -- in that light alone, he has failed. Deny it though they may, the Federal Reserve is a politcal entity; there fore any action they take is political as well as economic. It's inherent to their mission. To complain that the Fed is getting pulled into "partisan politics" is silly; the myth that the Fed is above such things is (and has always been) nonsense. Father: "Son you'd better get that barn door closed!"
Son: "But paw! The horse done run off already!"
Father: "Don't back-talk me, son. If your mother finds out that her horse is gone and that I left the door open, a certain amount of unpleasantness will ensue. Maybe the kind of unpleasantness that calls for stitches and leaves a scar. But if the door is closed, it will simply be a mystery that cannot be explained, like those crabs I caught from the carny gal who ran the Tilt-A-Whirl at the county fair last year."
Son: "What are crabs, paw?"
Father: "Never you mind, son. Just get that door closed." "He had to be told by the French and the Germans that his socialism was too far left for them to deal with.” When the French are telling you that you are too socialist, you have got some serious fucking issues, dude. I'm just saying. V. I. Lenin was not "too socialist" for the French. China's economic miracle is over? Thomas Friedman will be crushed. (My own take? China has built up enough forward momentum to racket along at a good speed for awhile yet -- maybe even for another decade. But the juice is used up, and the train will inevitably begin to slow down. It's all over now but the physics of the situation.) Alas, poor California; I knew her, Horatio, a state of infinite jest, of most excellent fancy. ---------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by: Monty at
06:54 AM
| Comments (78)
Post contains 1014 words, total size 8 kb.
Posted by: Cheri at November 17, 2010 07:07 AM (oiNtH)
And so will George Soros, who thinks that China has better functioning government than U.S.
Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at November 17, 2010 07:09 AM (9hSKh)
Glad you're back in the saddle, Montague.
Little Tommy Friedman's tears will be particularly sweet when we don't have to listen to his insane Keynesian ramblings anymore. I've forgotten more about economics than he'll ever know, and I'm a designer.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy at November 17, 2010 07:10 AM (3jxR/)
Posted by: maverick muse at November 17, 2010 07:10 AM (H+LJc)
Posted by: Gold at November 17, 2010 07:11 AM (gQ+XA)
Posted by: Vic at November 17, 2010 07:12 AM (e4sSD)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 07:15 AM (4Pleu)
Or you got the newly mutated subtype and yet survived. Congratulations,
Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at November 17, 2010 07:16 AM (9hSKh)
On the economy, how's the airline business profit margin?
A Ryanair flight took off late for Paris, and the airport nearby was closed when they arrived, so the flight diverted for a Brussels landing and the passengers refused to disembark. The pilot and crew locked the toilets but left the cockpit unlocked when they disembarked, abandoning the plane and passengers who stayed seated four hours before accepting a bus trip to their destination.
Airports near Paris close after business hours?! Those union demands.
Posted by: maverick muse at November 17, 2010 07:17 AM (H+LJc)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 07:17 AM (4Pleu)
Got the flu after getting a flu shot, eh?
Another data point to add to my "I ain't getting a shot, cuz I did once and got the flu" dataset. My wife will not be pleased.
I guess I'm just one of those who sneers at science.
Posted by: rockhead at November 17, 2010 07:18 AM (RykTt)
Mostly, I think the elderly and the very young should get the shots, and then I think it's still a crap-shoot.
Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) at November 17, 2010 07:19 AM (8y9MW)
It's not just mild. It's dead. It can't infect you. But any different live strain that's floating around can. Glad you're feeling better.
Posted by: The Mega Independent at November 17, 2010 07:19 AM (CinaY)
And five or six years back, did taking the shot precede that bout with the flu?
Posted by: maverick muse at November 17, 2010 07:20 AM (H+LJc)
You know, I haven't heard AA or Southwest or United or any of those talk about what they think about the new TSA regs. I wonder what the TSA Porn Patrol is doing to their bottom line?
Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) at November 17, 2010 07:20 AM (8y9MW)
And none of the passengers thought of flying it to Paris at that point?
Posted by: John Galt at November 17, 2010 07:22 AM (F/4zf)
Someone needs to throw that little clue-bone to Janet Napolitano.
Posted by: Ambiguously Gay Richard Simmons at November 17, 2010 07:23 AM (nR7pG)
I've said it before: All the money they have spent, the government could have bought up every single one of the "bad" mortgages that were supposedly the cause of the crisis (blame the poor, how convenient). When, in reality, the losses are all paper-losses that the banks would have to eat, and it would destroy them--not our country, not our economy, just them fuckers. But, they are already dead, they know it, but they are going to drag us down with them.
Anyone want to tell me how our economy would be worse if we closed down and broke up Bank of America, Wells Fargo and a few of the other "too big to fail" financial firms?
We busted up AT&T and Microsoft--but for their billions in campaign contributions to the establishment, we'd be busting up all of the top 10 financial firms in America.
Posted by: Jimmuy at November 17, 2010 07:27 AM (ImAna)
Posted by: Alice's Clone Army at November 17, 2010 07:29 AM (DjCjS)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 07:32 AM (4Pleu)
Posted by: Radioactive Satellite Of LOVE at November 17, 2010 07:34 AM (LdYLm)
I always got the impression that the derivatives were like insurance policies. So if they all vanish into thin air, I understand that businesses will have to do business in very different ways, but will businesses actually collapse? How and why?
Posted by: Josef K. at November 17, 2010 07:45 AM (7+pP9)
Brown likely to retain most of Schwarzenegger's administration
As the gov.-elect's transition effort got underway Tuesday, aides said he isn't looking to restaff every department in the state.
Los Angeles Times November 17, 2010
Brown advisors say the governor-elect is focused on the budget; filling a couple of thousand government posts with new faces is not his priority now, they say. Even on financial matters, Brown may not bring in a new top-level advisor. He has praised Schwarzenegger's budget director, who people close to the transition say may be invited to keep the job.
Brown had consulted the budget director, Ana Matosantos, for insight on state fiscal matters during the campaign. At one point he showed up at her office unannounced and without any entourage, and the two sat down and drilled deep into budget policy.
Another prominent official who could easily hold over would be one of the state's top environmental regulators, Schwarzenegger appointee Mary Nichols, who heads the Air Resources Board. She worked for Brown when he was governor three decades ago.
California officially a one party state. We're all Democrats now...
Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at November 17, 2010 07:48 AM (rgL27)
Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at November 17, 2010 11:48 AM (rgL27)
All cattle in the stockyard, waiting for the killing floor.
Posted by: Radioactive Satellite Of LOVE at November 17, 2010 07:50 AM (LdYLm)
That's been our experience as well.
It isn't as if everything the pharmaceutical industry produces or promises is right for everyone.
First, flu-like symptoms do not equate to a case with the flu virus.
Next, given the last fraud of a 2009 pandemic for profit, critics have strong evidence to base arguments given the contaminated vaccines. Gerald Ford deja vu.
Finally, the rush to produce and disseminate vaccines in order to corner the market spreads misery as with the first federally supported polio vaccine.
It wasn't that long ago that this history was detailed in a PBS broadcast.
Posted by: maverick muse at November 17, 2010 07:51 AM (H+LJc)
Posted by: texette at November 17, 2010 07:52 AM (o38K+)
Yeah, bottom line vs. federal strong-arming. As is, the gubnit's to blame for a catastrophe from terrorism, not the airlines. So long as it isn't their ass being probed, Airlines will go the way of McDonalds and get their employees special consideration with a Presidential exemption from security checks. And travelers? Well, dhimmi status for America's citizenry is Obama's point.
Posted by: maverick muse at November 17, 2010 07:59 AM (H+LJc)
If that derivative vanishes, then a business could be badly hurt if it has to pay more for raw materials that the derivative called for. That much I understand.
What I don't understand is how much material damage will occur. I see banks collapsing, and their assets being bought for pennies on the dollar. I see some businesses having to pay more for supplies, and a wave of adjustments rippling through society, starting with farms, mines, and other primary sources having to pay more, and thus charge more, and so on ...
But how does that get us to Mad Max land? Or to Argentina in 2000?
I think a clear, succinct description of this could open a lot of eyes, and perform a real public service.
Posted by: Josef K. at November 17, 2010 08:02 AM (7+pP9)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 08:03 AM (4Pleu)
Posted by: KG at November 17, 2010 08:06 AM (DeCj1)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 08:07 AM (4Pleu)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 08:10 AM (4Pleu)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 12:03 PM (4Pleu)
Bad? Yes. Inevitable? Also yes. The way I see it, we let the shit hit the fan now, or we just delay the SHTF moment, making the eventual day of reckoning even worse.
One other thing. The people who assumed - and the ones who signed off on and allowed the assumptions of 8% returns - should all be fired, and maybe prosecuted for financial misfeasance, malfeasance, whatever. And that goes for the fools at the Lehmans and AIGs of the world. These people knew just what they were doing, and what risks they were taking with the economy of the world. If they didn't, they were such fools and idiots they never should have had those jobs to begin with.
And as for California, this is why some judge somewhere is going to have to strap on some balls and a sense of reality, and release the state and its municipalities from its pension obligations. GM bondholder screwing proved we no longer have the rule of law in place. We might as well profit from that sad fact before we reinstitute it.
Posted by: Josef K. at November 17, 2010 08:15 AM (7+pP9)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 08:22 AM (4Pleu)
Oh please. Buying protection on a MBS or a corporate bond, whether or not you own the underlying security, has nothing to do with the default of that bond. Either the issuer can meet its debt service obligation or it can't. Giving me the ability to buy insurance on your car wouldn't make you crash into a bridge abutment. What blew up the MBS market was the inability of borrowers to maintain their payments when real estate values collapsed. You're making this far more complicated and sinister than it really is.
Posted by: Ted Kennedy's Gristle Encased Head at November 17, 2010 08:29 AM (+lsX1)
Posted by: Unsk at November 17, 2010 08:33 AM (P2osf)
_____________
Given the Prop. 8 fiasco, can't a judge just rule that part of the constitution to be unconstitutional?
Posted by: Anachronda, lobbing a Molotov cocktail at November 17, 2010 08:33 AM (FzhYM)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 08:34 AM (4Pleu)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 08:35 AM (4Pleu)
But what about when the SHTF? What then? Care to blue sky what happens then? I'm really thinking buying silver coins, gold chains, (2 or more of the sake kind of) pistols, shotguns, rifles and ammo is no longer a worst case strategy - more like a most-likely strategy.
Posted by: Josef K. at November 17, 2010 08:36 AM (7+pP9)
Posted by: Josef K. doesn't type well at November 17, 2010 08:39 AM (7+pP9)
RE: the flu shot. One has to remember that the WHO/CDC makes a WAG (Wild Ass Guess) a year in advance to determine which variants of the flu virus are gonna be in the flu shot we get. I believe there are 4 different ones this year. They do a pretty good job of this most times, but you need to remember there are other varieties out there and you may still be exposed to one of those.
Also, flu has an incubation time of around 7-10 days, so if you get exposed prior to the shot, you're boned anyway.
My guess is that happens a lot and folks blame the shot for giving them the flu.
Thanks again.
Posted by: GrumpyUnk at November 17, 2010 08:40 AM (i/RqL)
Not sure how that works in practice. The state pension funds. California Public EmployeesÂ’ Retirement System (CalPERS), the California State TeachersÂ’ Retirement System (CalSTRS) and the University of California Retirement System (UCRS) made bad investments and, with increasing civil service salaries and early retirements, is seeing increased payouts, so now they're underfunded.
The funds go to the state to refill the kitty, but the state is even more broke than the funds are. So the state goes to the Feds, who are even more broke than the states.
Don't see being "vested" as much of a guarantee at that point.
Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at November 17, 2010 08:46 AM (rgL27)
Posted by: Ted Kennedy's Gristle Encased Head at November 17, 2010 08:46 AM (+lsX1)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 08:59 AM (4Pleu)
Posted by: SJR2 at November 17, 2010 09:07 AM (oCbCP)
[Category: Buffoon]
[Description: Uttering the phrase "financial derivative" will replace necessity for actual knowledge.]
[Effect: The mouth will shoot out waves of contempt while croaking "conspiracy!"]
[Dispel: Can easily be dispelled by "Fact" spell or "Common Sense" charm. -3 Enervation to the entire group.]
[Spell Class: Financial Fiction]
[Spell Level: 1]
[Spell School: Absurdity, Olbermann, Conjuration]
[Cost: Time and aggravation]
[Cooldown: At least 3 followup posts]
[Target: Area]
P.S. It was sad and a little bit creepy/funny the first time you posted this weeks ago. This time it's kind of pathetic. Although I will admit to being curious about the other bits you have saved in your "scathing Ted comebacks" file.
Posted by: Ted Kennedy's Gristle Encased Head at November 17, 2010 09:09 AM (+lsX1)
Posted by: Something Wicked This Way Comes.. at November 17, 2010 09:12 AM (GOG1H)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 12:59 PM (4Pleu)
So why can't we control this situation? Instead of passing the idiotic laws they are currently working on, why can't we require that, going forward, leverage on any derivatives issued after a certain date should be at a manageable level (like maybe what it used to be 50 years ago). I don't know what that level is, but I'm sure it can be determined fairly easily.
As for currently issued derivatives with > 20-to-1 leveraging, well, I don't have an answer, beyond lynching the fools who perpetrated this nightmare. Which may well happen, anyway. If this country actually collapses, I bet there will be boatloads of financial types who don't get out of the country to their hidey-holes in Costa Rica in time. It will certainly suck to be them.
Posted by: Josef K. doesn't type well at November 17, 2010 09:13 AM (7+pP9)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 09:13 AM (4Pleu)
Posted by: SJR2 at November 17, 2010 09:21 AM (oCbCP)
Since the benefits of the robbery at the hand of the government went to the unions and not the company or the shareholders and bondholders I would say that this is closer to communism than it is to mercantilism.
In any case what it really is pure out corruption when in the old days the government created laws that favored the railroad barons (BTW the idea of robber barons is a progressive myth anyway).
It is the same thing now. It is out and out corruption that they create laws that favor some companies at the expense of others. What gives them the power to do that is called Fascism. That is where they have accumulated the power to "regulate" anything they want.
In any case, at all boils down to the same thing. An all powerful government that has long ago abandoned any pretense at capitalism and is now working on elimination of contract law and private property.
Posted by: Vic at November 17, 2010 09:29 AM (e4sSD)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 09:30 AM (4Pleu)
Economic theory and policy influential in Europe from the 16th to the 18th century that called for government regulation of a nation's economy in order to increase its power at the expense of rival nations. Though the theory existed earlier, the term was not coined until the 18th century; it was given currency by Adam Smith in his Wealth of Nations (1776). Mercantilism's emphasis on the importance of gold and silver holdings as a sign of a nation's wealth and power led to policies designed to obtain precious metals through trade by ensuring "favourable" trade balances (see balance of trade), meaning an excess of exports over imports, especially if a nation did not possess mines or have access to them. In a favourable trade balance, payments for the goods or services had to be made with gold or silver. Colonial possessions were to serve as markets for exports and as suppliers of raw materials to the mother country, a policy that created conflict between the European colonial powers and their colonies, in particular fanning resentment of Britain in the North American colonies and helping bring about the American Revolution. Mercantilism favoured a large population to supply labourers, purchasers of goods, and soldiers. Thrift and saving were emphasized as virtues because they made possible the creation of capital. Mercantilism provided a favourable climate for the early development of capitalism but was later severely criticized, especially by advocates of laissez-faire, who argued that all trade was beneficial and that strict government controls were counterproductive.
Posted by: Vic at November 17, 2010 09:31 AM (e4sSD)
This part I agree with. But the existence of CDS did not cause the collapse of their associated MBS, it was the other way around. The problem with the institutions that got in trouble wasn't access to CDS, it was incompetent risk management. This is the difference between Bear Stearns and Goldman Sachs or Citi and JP Morgan. Competence vs. incompetence.
Nick Leeson blew up Barings Bank 15 years ago by mishandling Nikkei futures. Daiwa Securities, Societie Generale and countless other firms have taken massive hits due to poor risk management. This is part of capitalism. It happens to companies just like it happens to individuals. Our problem was in socializing the losses due to this fiction that the whole world would collapse if we didn't. If there is any conspiracy in all of this it's that somehow the global economy would cease to exist if we didn't bail out the morons that bankrupted their companies.
Posted by: Ted Kennedy's Gristle Encased Head at November 17, 2010 09:31 AM (+lsX1)
To illustrate further -- Iceland was faced with the prospect of indebting every one of its citizens -- including babes in arms -- by $16,000 in order to "make whole" the foreign banks that its government and banks had overborrowed from. Last I checked, they said, "no", and their currency collapsed.....but they may have ended up being better off because they still had their homes, their farms, and their cars even if their currency was worth zilch.
Ireland has 4.44 million people. If they're talking $650B, that's over $100,000 per person. If you were to ask, how many people would forfeit all their cash-on-hand and have everything that collateralizes debt repo'd for $100,000?
Posted by: cthulhu at November 17, 2010 09:34 AM (kaalw)
Monty,
Hamtramck has asked for bankruptcy already.
http://detnews.com/article/20101117/ METRO01/11170365&template=printart
(remove space before METRO)
Once in banko, a municipality has some wiggle room. City of Vallejo is a great example, but one that undercuts your theory of quick collapse. They will get 5 years to put things back together.
http://www.timesheraldonline.com/news/ci_16635113
With California, the state can issue bonds. Sure the rates are going to have to be astronomical, but on a 20 year bond and some creative repayment schemes, the current set of assholes will be long dead and gone before those come due.
It's going to come down, but in slow motion. Lights aren't going out yet.
I agree that the whole thing is systemically unsustainable, and it WILL collapse, but I think you underestimate the durability of momentum and inertia in this context.
Posted by: s'moron at November 17, 2010 09:37 AM (UaxA0)
Posted by: Jean at November 17, 2010 09:37 AM (Ja6pC)
Ted (one of my favorite nics, too)
This part I agree with. But the existence of CDS did not cause the collapse of their associated MBS, it was the other way around. The problem with the institutions that got in trouble wasn't access to CDS, it was incompetent risk management. This is the difference between Bear Stearns and Goldman Sachs or Citi and JP Morgan. Competence vs. incompetence.
I respectfully disagree. The problem with MBS and CDS on them was the initial rating of lower-tranche mortgages as AAA. Moody's and S&P were asleep at the switch, and people made profit off that. Typically at the expense of sovereign investment funds or union pensions. Once the horrid mortgages inevitably defaulted, the whole contraption spun apart. TARP was a massive wealth transfer to foreign entities to avoid the repercussions of such a monumental assfucking by private US firms. In a way (and only in this way), I support QE2 for that reason. Make the trillion we gave away to the rest of the world into worthless crap.
Posted by: s'moron at November 17, 2010 09:42 AM (UaxA0)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 09:42 AM (4Pleu)
Posted by: Jean at November 17, 2010 09:43 AM (c3oPV)
I just noticed that Harrisburg PA and San Diego CA are making grumbles aboout muni banko, too.
Preference cascade.
Posted by: s'moron at November 17, 2010 09:46 AM (UaxA0)
That's really not how it works. Nations have been defaulting on debt since forever. Hell, Latin America has almost perfected it over the last 200 years. Paraguay has defaulted seven times since 1827. Last year, the new President of Ecuador declared obligations owed to foreign lenders "illegal" and defaulted. This was Ecuador's 7th default since 1832. I guarantee you that the day after this default there were lenders lined up with checkbook in hand to provide capital to the new government. Ireland will default, the cost of borrowing will rise, it will be rough for a while, but life will go on.
Posted by: Ted Kennedy's Gristle Encased Head at November 17, 2010 09:49 AM (+lsX1)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 09:49 AM (4Pleu)
And why have they been willing to do that? Because nations like the U.S. have been willing to underwrite those loans so that the bank would get their money even if the other country defaulted.
That is what has to stop.
Posted by: Vic at November 17, 2010 09:52 AM (e4sSD)
California might make it for as long as ten years...but I don't think they have that long. Five years, maybe, if the economy stays in the dumper.
We're on the same page. Hell, same stanza. Probably playing the same bar, too.
Posted by: s'moron at November 17, 2010 09:53 AM (UaxA0)
O/T
GO REP DUNCAN!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xH-dpkJZiOM
calling out Chertoff as a corrupt profiteer. Well done, sir!
Posted by: s'moron at November 17, 2010 09:55 AM (UaxA0)
No question about the ratings agencies, but this is still a risk management failure for the SIV's and pension fund managers that relied on these ratings. I'll bet you that not a single one of their investment committees agonized over the question of "who pays for the rating?" Pension funds and large foundations, in my experience, possess less risk management sophistication than a Pinay whore.
Posted by: Ted Kennedy's Gristle Encased Head at November 17, 2010 10:07 AM (+lsX1)
Posted by: Ted Kennedy's Gristle Encased Head at November 17, 2010 02:07 PM (+lsX1)
Then they deserve whatever happens to them. I say we start letting institutions, banks etc. - right up to states - fail. Cut the gangrenous fingers and toes off before they cost us an arm and a leg.
Posted by: Josef K. doesn't type well at November 17, 2010 10:09 AM (7+pP9)
Posted by: Monty at November 17, 2010 01:30 PM (4Pleu)
Actually, while this is astoundingly distasteful, I would prefer a regular retail sales tax to VAT. VAT is too easy to hide. Sales tax is right there on the receipt. Also, VAT as normally practiced taxes every stage of domestic production, not just consumption by the end user, and requires a lot of work to administer properly.
A regular, overt sales tax would fill the people with rage, which is what we need.
Posted by: Reactionary at November 17, 2010 10:11 AM (xUM1Q)
"had me lying on my humble pallet alternately sweating with fever and then shaking like a scared dog."
Glad to see ya got the bathtub Crank I sent ya. Good shit, heyna?
Posted by: hutch1200 at November 17, 2010 10:31 AM (s/mcJ)
Posted by: Ted Kennedy's Gristle Encased Head at November 17, 2010 01:49 PM (+lsX1)
I know that it doesn't literally work that way, but it very much seems that the concept of "debt slavery" is alive and well and popular-as-all-get-out in banker and public employee circles. And the thought that they'll just pop $100K onto your future tax bills in order to guarantee their success in life is oh-so-attractive to them. But what if people decide they don't want to put their neck in that yoke? What are you going to threaten them with that compares to $100K/person of public debt?
Posted by: cthulhu at November 17, 2010 10:42 AM (kaalw)
<a href="http://www.topusbdrive.com">Branded usb drive </a>
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Posted by: DSTTi at December 23, 2010 06:14 PM (KgoFi)
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Posted by: Radioactive Satellite Of LOVE at November 17, 2010 07:03 AM (LdYLm)