There is alien life and it was spotted the other night in Asheville sucking on some hickory smoked ribs at 12 Bones Smokehouse. Her brow ridges were stunning.

ID4's Locusts From Space won't bother plundering us unless they are sadists who think we're tasty. The problem here is the Gravity Well - Earth's, and also the Sun's.

Mineral resources are all over the asteroid belt between 2.3 AU and 3 AU out. Visiting alien ships will just dock with, say, Vesta and mine that. If they want water and other "volatiles", they can drill a big soda straw into Enceladus (probably not Europa; Jupiter has a gravity well too, and spews out a lot of radiation).

It would just cost too much energy to pull minerals out of a planet as heavy as Earth. Earth is also too close to the sun; I've already mentioned radiation as something Locusts From Space will want to avoid, and also if they want to move on to the next solar system, they'll not want to waste time planning slingshot flybys of Venus and the Sun just to get out again.

So, we're likely safe from Locusts From Space.

Is this an honest question? Because it is not formulated well.

I can answer a different question, how can naturalists prefer belief in naturally-evolving aliens over belief in a transdimensional Deity: Belief in aliens agrees with the laws of physics as we know of them. Belief in God requires the addition of laws outside our space-time. Belief in aliens is simpler.

 He goes from saying that there are likely billions of planets out there (read "resources"), but that aliens might target Earth because planetary resources are scarce.

Would locusts skip your garden just because there are other gardens?

Nobody has any f****** idea what the chances are that either intelligent aliens exist or that they can make it here, barring anyone who's actually been introduced and either hasn't told us or wasn't believed.

I'm on top of it.

If it weren't for the Normans, Hawking would be speaking Saxon.  Actually, he wouldn't be speaking much of anything, probably just propped up inside the mead hall.  Without the Norman invasion, Britain would be some tribal outpost off the coast of mainland Europe.   

All of history is marked by cultural interchanges; inward looking cultures fold up, outward looking cultures overwhelm.  All I hope for is that we're colonized by the Pleiadians instead of those fucking Greys.

If it weren't for Columbus, there wouldn't be Casinos, Ironsides.

Sure beats poking a pissed-off buffalo in the ass with a spear..

Native Americans were killed by disease, not cultural shock.

That's  little restrictive, Kemosabe.

In 1960 when I was in second grade, one of the other students brought a record to school with space songs on it. I still remember the lyrics to one because we had to learn and sing it for a presentation. The hook was, "There are many millions of galaxies, each of them with billions of stars: could it be that among all these, there's anothere planet like ours?"

Anyway, my point is, this is not a new argument.

Mineral resources are between...

Who says they want mineral resources?  Maybe they like air, water, and meat.

sufferin' socketash

Posted by: Gleek, the space monkey from the Super Friends at April 25, 2010 04:48 PM (kSbr6)

The coin toss came up the other way?

Who is it that said something smart about a "sample of one"?

Fermi's paradox comes to mind too. If the universe is so teaming with life, then where are they?

It's entirely possible (because determining any real probability at this time is futile) that we are either the only life out there, let alone the only intelligent life in the universe. I think that all life, eventually, has the prospect of becoming intelligent life. And so if the universe is teaming with life, it should therefor also be teaming with intelligent life. Eventually that intelligent life is going to figure out how to cover vast distances in a short or efficient (for them) period of time. If so, where are they?

Sure, there may be so much life that we are uninteresting, or conversely, there is so little life that we would be VERY interesting to anything and everything that could power up a space ship. If the latter is the case, then where are they? Sure, they could be hiding and we could be some big nature preserve, but I still think there would be some "leakage" of evidence of alien visitation. Sure, they may be so good at it that does not happen in any form that we would recognize, but I bet even aliens screw up from time to time.

I think there is a pretty sporting chance that we are it.

They would if my garden is at the bottom of a pretty inconvenient gravity well and there are other easily-accessible gardens out there.

There's no reason for you to assume our gravity would pose a problem, and you've forgotten how big space is.  Imagine a nearly infinite number of gardens separated by light years.  You would just go to the next garden.

Posted by: Gleek, the space monkey from the Super Friends at April 25, 2010 04:38 PM (kSbr6)

No, that's math.  And that type of math in Las Vegas would make one a very rich Moron.  The number of planets in the Universe is as near to infinite as there is.  No matter how small the chance of life, if you multiply that chance by infinity, you get a lot of life.  Will two intelligent life forms ever run across each other?  That depends on whether FTL travel is possible.  Tachyons never go slower than light speed.

They weren't exactly thriving pre-Columbus, were they?

That's an incrediby Euro-centric question.

It is intriguing that inherent in the nature of man is a drive to explore and let's face it conquer. It is a continuing quest, even today as we try to map the bottom of the oceans, as we explore space, even as we work to map and label every speck of land on planet earth.

Is the "explorer" gene something that only exists in humans, or could it be the same gene exists in aliens somewhere else, which will eventually drive them to our galaxy not for resources, but just because they can?

And another thing , there were no Native Americans.

You're wrong. Fuck you! There was no bridge from Asia or any other place. We were here first and it's all ours! Interlopers!

Posted by: Gleek, the space monkey from the Super Friends at April 25, 2010 04:35 PM (kSbr6)

Because belief in God is wrapped up in belief in God's judgment and God's standards for right and wrong.  Belief in alien life forms is wrapped up in belief in a kind of cosmic relativism that says there's no Divine standard that warm-blooded air-breathing bipeds are better or worse than cold-blooded aquatic cephalopods or any other form that sentient aliens might have.  Some people take comfort in the idea that God cares about us, and some people take comfort in the idea that there's no God to impose His values on us.

Of course, as I often tell my children, it is possible that God is the cosmic equivalent of a fifth-grader who created a universe as a science fair project and is keeping it in a terrarium on his dresser.  Perhaps we are not His beloved, but only His interesting specimens.

Posted by: Gleek, the space monkey from the Super Friends at April 25, 2010 05:03 PM (kSbr6)

The chance of life is nonzero.  That's all you really have to know.

Does anyone out there know what the percentage of stars out there are like ours in that they were formed from the remnants of previous stars that had gone super-nova? That may cut down on the number of potential life-forming solar systems significantly. (Neucleogenesis is needed to form elements of higher weight than hydrogen.)

We do have *one* resource that is apparently in demand and rare throughout the universe: cow anuses our women.

FIFY.  You don't watch enough scifi.

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at April 25, 2010 05:05 PM (7VvJB)

The math says they're there, so they're there somewhere.  Not sure it's possible to tell a wormhole from a blackhole.  You'd have to go through, and then you wouldn't be able to communicate back.

We're here, bitches. And it's because this is the only sector that has a Colonel Z'anders Earth Fried Hominid. Y'all some tasty monkeys, I gotta tell ya.

Posted by: bergerbilder at April 25, 2010 05:04 PM (S1Ttj)

I assume nucleogenesis includes fusion, then.

Posted by: pep at April 25, 2010 05:09 PM (0K3p3)

Can I have Chuck Norris's body?

Does anyone out there know what the percentage of stars out there are like ours in that they were formed from the remnants of previous stars that had gone super-nova?

Yes. 

It's annoying when people make pronouncements about things that simply cannot know.

Shut up.

I also would like to say that I hate the argument "things didn't turn out so well for the Native Americans after Columbus discovered America." Really? And things were rolling along just awesome for them before? And, if we are going to point fingers at Columbus for fucking up the natives, then I think we should also point out just how much the Spanish contributed to that as well.

Plus, this idea that the Native Americans were just a bunch of peace loving earth hugging simple people before we slaughtered them and raped their land is bullshit. The Native Americans were just as fierce (if not worse) toward each other. Do you think that white men were their first scalps?

They fought each other for territory, resources, and women, just like everybody else did.

And what's the rationale for dinking around with the Earth

More people to hunt.   More people to kill.

ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 05:15 PM (RZ8pf)

Right on. I remember taking a class on Indian culture and wanting to turn to my neighbor and say, "Doesn't all of this have the stink of failure about it?"

I kept my mouth shut.

Posted by: facefacts at April 25, 2010 05:14 PM (+ABdJ)

They got their revenge.  They sent syphillis back to Europe.  And the dreaded tobacco, which lefties will now tell you is the root of all evil ... until you explain that the white man picked it up from the Indians, just like the white man picked up the African slave trade from the arabs.  But it's still whitey's fault!!

Speaking of other-worldly happenings...  BHO is attending the memorial service of US coal miners. The same US coal miners he plans to put out of work or severely tax-gouge what they work so hard to produce.

"let us raid you email and snoop for your friends across the internet

WHAT? What the hell tool is this? And how do I know if I've been compromised?

No, the real danger from contact with intelligent extraterrestrial life is cultural. Finding out your kind is a late-developing and not very advanced one-of-many tends to derail your development.

If this planet's current appeasement and adoption to radical Islam/Sharia and Marxism/socialism is any indication of the Earth's population becoming subservient to a superior alien species dropping out of the sky I'd say our 'leaders' will have us shining their space boots and fetching their NY Times in short manner ... and taxing the hell out of us while we do it.

All I can say is watch out for vermicious knids.

Those motherfuckers will really ruin your day.

Posted by: mpur in Texas at April 25, 2010 05:23 PM (tr6Dy)

No one wanted to blog about the small illegal alien demonstration in Arizona that ended in violence ... though maybe Gabe got confused and thought that he was addressing that, here?

Been there, done that.

Kirk would just fuck their females. Sulu would fuck their males.

Here's why they haven't made contact:  We're made of meat.

All I can say is watch out for vermicious knids.

Those motherfuckers will really ruin your day.

Posted by: Willy Wonka at April 25, 2010 05:23 PM (P33XN)

Eh.  If your re-entry speed is high enough, they'll fry like bacon.

And, another thing (says the girl who studied Native American culture extensively in school) there were shortages of salmon and berries and other resources the tribes needed to survive long before Mr. Whitey came on the scene. They were due to crazy things like harsh winters, which sometimes happen—and have absolutely nothing to do with “global climate change.”

And, yeah, smallpox, our bad, but the Native Americans suffered from other illnesses that killed them off before that. Hence all the “naturopathic” medicine the liberals get their jollies with these days.

Not to mention the predators. And, as IÂ’ve already mentioned, the other tribes that wanted the prime waterfront real estate and the babes.

WHAT? What the hell tool is this? And how do I know if I've been compromised?

We should ALL learn from Pinback. It never ends well for carbon-based life forms.

http://tinyurl.com/2cfx6o5

Hmmm. People get fired up arguing for and against things no one has any proof of one way or the other. It could be a simple interesting conversation but there's a lot of vitriol for what is essentially a nerd argument. Maybe it's nerd rage, you really got to look out for that.

You're too dumb to engage in discussion, much less understand the arguments.

Posted by: Alex at April 25, 2010 05:28 PM (3TjEK)

You're stupid.  But seriously, is anybody on this thread engaging in these behaviors? 

Actually, we being visited by an alien technical civilization is as likely as the State department receiving the credentials of the envoy of Darius the Great.

Also, no more green Orion women! That last group wore me out.

Posted by: gringo at April 25, 2010 05:25 PM (Z0UBx)

And it could well be, we just don't know what to look for with our Johnny Rocket Space Patrol Telescopes.

Posted by: Dr Spank at April 25, 2010 05:35 PM (muUqs)

Traci Lords is a serious actress, you asshole!

>> He suggests that aliens might simply raid Earth for its resources

Utter sci-fi douchery.  The fuck would aliens need with cows?

Posted by: Drillanwr at April 25, 2010 05:37 PM (GkYyh)

Because everyone knew that Von Neumann and gang just couldn't be of this world.

 They're made out of meat! (click name)

Cincinnatus, did you see the animation I made?  Linked at #157.

Posted by: Gleek, the space monkey from the Super Friends at April 25, 2010 05:08 PM (kSbr6)

yeah because they were nomads. They followed the food and water. Something that humans still do to this day.

As for advances they made, they were a big breakthrough when it comes to plants and medicinal properties (on par with Asia) and they did do a lot of cross breeding with agriculture (which was almost non-existent outside of some remote areas in Asia and Africa) 

Posted by: Dave in Texas at April 25, 2010 05:37 PM (Wh0W+)

The same thing that horny 16 year-old small town Texas boys would.

Outer space is very lonely...

Posted by: Dr Spank at April 25, 2010 05:38 PM (muUqs)

A dirty, devious, alien whore.  And did you notice?  She's the Head Alien.

Posted by: Dr Spank at April 25, 2010 05:35 PM (muUqs)

Traci Lords is a serious actress, you asshole!

I also would like to say that I hate the argument "things didn't turn out so well for the Native Americans after Columbus discovered America." Really? And things were rolling along just awesome for them before? And, if we are going to point fingers at Columbus for fucking up the natives, then I think we should also point out just how much the Spanish contributed to that as well.

Not to be all PC or anything, but regardless of whatever problems they already had, it doubt that getting conquered was a real happy experience for them.

Yes, a lot of the deaths to natives were due to the inadvertant spread of diseases the Europeans had little understanding of, but dying of smallpox likely wasn't a big hit with the natives of the era, either.

I'm sure as hell not in the "Columbus was a genocidal murderer" camp that's prevalent on any college campus.  For all of human history up until WWII, "because we can" was a perfectly legitimate reason for conquering new territory.  Let's not pretend that things turned out just great for the natives getting conquered though.

Depends on what you mean by a sustainable birth rate. Obviously depending on the circumstances of the tribe a lot of babies died. Also, some babies were killed for various cultural reasons in the tribe. In some cases, tribes ended up intermarrying because of a lack of enough young to sustain the existing tribe and also as a way to make alliances.

When I studied the Northwest tribes medical records at Sand Point for the 1800s there were deaths because of small pox, but there was a lot of infant mortality as well and many other causes of death in school age children. An argument could be made, looking at the medical treatment that became available to them, that more children were saved by the encounters with ‘white men” then ultimately ended up dying. Of course the Northwest tribes are a small sample size.

Were we horrible to the Native Americans with our treaties and squeezing them out of their lands and the deliberate spread of small pox to decimate their numbers? No argument from me there. But are the tribes getting the last laugh on us? In a lot of cases these days yes.

The Mayans invented Poontang.

Everybody knows that.

I'm still debating Big Foot.

And how is the first lady in an argument?

Utter sci-fi douchery.  The fuck would aliens need with cows?

What if they're trying to plunder our bacon supplies, but haven't yet worked out which animal it comes from?

If time travel were possible, wouldn't someone have already done it and screwed up everything?

That might explain how Obama got elected.

Posted by: katya at April 25, 2010 05:42 PM (Gorqm)

If you're single, call Michael Medved.

Were we horrible to the Native Americans with our treaties and squeezing them out of their lands and the deliberate spread of small pox to decimate their numbers?

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 05:42 PM (RZ8pf)

Please.  The Europeans not long before had the Plague intentionally launched at them by the Mongols (who actually catapulted bodies of disease ridden people over the walls of Caffa to start it all off) and the Europeans did nothing of the sort to the Indians and don't bitch about it to this day.

Also, Europe flourished as a response to the devastation of the Black Death and that led into the Enlightenment and all the advancements of modern civilization.

Were we horrible to the Native Americans with our treaties and squeezing them out of their lands and the deliberate spread of small pox to decimate their numbers?

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 05:42 PM (RZ8pf)

Yeah, but at least we gave them a reach-around, the ingrates.

Posted by: ParisParamus at April 25, 2010 05:43 PM (0UFy6)

This all makes sense to you?

True Hollowpoint. But, part of the problem with the arguments is this idea that the Native Americans were just going along, minding their own business, peace loving, tree huggers and them “bam” whitey came along and conquered them and decimated their numbers.

I think that there are plenty of examples both of the people who came and settled in America trying to work with the Native Americans and also examples of the Native Americans horrifically slaughtering settlers to say that the argument isnÂ’t as simple as that.

Of course these days, the argument is reduced to “what the white people did was wrong, therefore whatever everyone else did was inherently right.” Are things ever that cut and dry, except in a liberal’s mind?

Posted by: Truman North at April 25, 2010 05:52 PM (FjC5u)

I'd walk a parsec for a camel.

Whiteman : 1
Native Americans : 0

Case Closed.

Au contraire.

Posted by: Dr Spank

The fact that he's lived decades past the life expectancy of his form of ALS makes me suspicious he's "one of them".

Posted by: Truman North at April 25, 2010 05:52 PM (FjC5u)

And they're also after our precious lunch meat, which can be proven by all the used condoms scattered around the picnic tables in remote state parks.

Posted by: katya at April 25, 2010 05:53 PM (Gorqm)

Yeah.  Things like that make me very resentful of public skool education and the liberals who control it.

Posted by: HeatherRadish at April 25, 2010 05:04 PM (OkT2m)

Maybe they'd come here for that Unobtainium that James Cameron invented

YOU LEAVE JAMES CAMERON ALONE!!!!

Besides, everybody knows unobtanium is caught in a matrix with trilithium and handwavium.

Posted by: Lunatic Fringe at April 25, 2010 05:56 PM (uFdnM)

Please don't mess with my cool 80's movie references, or you'll be forced to read "Diuretics".

Posted by: Dr Spank at April 25, 2010 05:51 PM (muUqs)

Seminole Tribe of Florida Bingo - $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

White hair old ladies -  Gazillions lost

Whiteman : 1
Native Americans : 0

Case Closed.

Au contraire.

I don't discount the possibility of aliens existing somewhere... but I don't discount the possibility that the probability of life forming is so remote that it doesn't exist except on Earth.

We still have no solid understanding of how life can spontaneously form by natural processes.  Even a single-cell organism is far too advanced for any chemist to cook up in a lab using only naturally-occuring chemicals as a starting point.  Outside the religious explanation, it might just be near-impossible for life to spontaneously form under even perfect conditions in any length of time.

Posted by: Ed Anger at April 25, 2010 05:57 PM (7+pP9)

Only if the advanced culture wants to win.  The modern Western world provides the first example of a clearly advanced culture that opts for suicide, as the US explicitly showed on Nov 4th, 2008.

White guilt is stronger than anything, and much more dangerous.

Posted by: FUBAR at April 25, 2010 05:57 PM (1fanL)

You know she's a porker, now.  It's sad, but true.

“To my mathematical brain, the numbers alone make thinking about aliens perfectly rational,” he said. </i>

By this same logic isn't the existence of Unicorns also "rational"?

Posted by: andi sullivan

ROFLMFAO!!

To my mathematical brain, the numbers alone make thinking about aliens perfectly rational,” he said

Maybe The Science Guy can put that mathematical brain to work and figure out how to build his own fucking wheelchair with his own fucking hands.

My mother always told me to never trust a man who uses a Simon to speak.

Three reds and two greens! Get the fuck out of here.

Except not. Because there ain't no aliens coming to visit. Even if you buy into the idea that extraterrestrial intelligences exist or will exist and that extrasolar travel is feasible at some level of development, the distances between stars are so incomprehensibly vast that interplanetary species aren't likely to come across each other within the lifetime of their species. The same "numbers alone" that Hawking hawks to infer the existence of life out there work against him when considering the possibility that some of that life will ever be in a position to make contact.

Anyone ever tell you you're a real killjoy Gabe?

Okay, all you 'time travel' morons, don't even get me started on the TV series "FlashForward". I don't see that series going past a couple seasons before viewers start getting pissed at it.

"V", on the other hand has your alien/human sex encounters already going on.

True Hollowpoint. But, part of the problem with the arguments is this idea that the Native Americans were just going along, minding their own business, peace loving, tree huggers and them “bam” whitey came along and conquered them and decimated their numbers.

Well, yeah- the "noble savage" mythology is absurd, one need not hold a PhD in history to figure that one out.

It's just that after years of being exposed to the PC bullshit, people sometimes get defensive and have a knee-jerk reaction when anyone mentions that, from the perspective of the natives of the era, European colonization sucked hard.

On the grand scale of things it was very much a net positive, but there's no need to pretend there were no losers in the deal.  Likewise, it's a mistake to suggest that the Europeans destroyed a utopian society comprised of the perfectly enlightened.

By this same logic isn't the existence of Unicorns also "rational"?

Posted by: Roman at April 25, 2010 06:04 PM (PxmHS)

Perfectly.  As long as those Unicorns don't violate any laws of physics.

I'm not buying that. Any species that has viable interplanetary travel isn't going to need any specific resource that's found only on Earth or that can only be made from elements found only on Earth (ain't no such thing).

Yeah, unless they want a bailout. Two words: "Obama's stash."

Well ProgressOverPeace, I understand what happened in Europe. However thereÂ’s no getting around the fact that the United States government deliberating used smallpox infected blankets on some of the tribes. Nor that the government made treaties with them forcing them onto reservations.

It happened. No value judgment on my part, I’ve studied Native American culture enough to be confident in my assertion that they are better off today having been “conquered” then they would have been left to their own devices.

Look, regardless of what is said about Stephen Hawking the fact still remains that this guy gets laid on a regular basis. If that isnÂ’t proof of alien life, I donÂ’t know what is.

The Native Americans failed to invent the wheel and the beast of burden, though there were found toys with wheels made by the Aztecs. These two invventions are probably the only thing that kept them from acheiving at least if not more than the Euros had up to that time.

What is the point of this kind of statement?  This about the fifth time someone's said, "Indians weren't as advanced as Euros."  So?  Euros hadn't spent the preceeding 10k years migrating across the world.  Give the natives a few hundred more years, and the might have had the wheel.  So?

Also, the great Aztec and Mayan civilizations were flat out emptied by disease, not to mention North American tribes.  Why the arguments that try to say Euros didn't introduce diseases they weren't well-equipped to handle?  What's the point?  It happened relatively recent Hawaiian history as well.  Civilizations import disease.  What's the argument here?

Is it:  Euros didn't have syphillis and smallpox--and if they did, they didn't bring it because of their advanced medical and quarantine procedures--and they only brought peace, happiness, and the wheel, therefore they were entitled to all the land they conquered? 

Posted by: Roman at April 25, 2010 06:22 PM (PxmHS)

Depends on what you're calling a unicorn.

FUBAR, OK, point taken. Whether it was deliberate or not, smallpox came from Europe. However, I think enough was known about the spread of smallpox at that point to give weight to the theory that it was done deliberately.  

 Regardless, smallpox did wipe out Native Americans. I can only speak for the Northwest Tribe records I studied, but it was one of the causes of death specifically recorded in the US territory records of the 1800s.

Seriously, I’m getting the feeling you guys think I’m arguing the “noble savage vs. evil European” side here, when everything I’ve said so far is meant to support the opposite argument. So, if I seem like a Native American apologist, well I apologize.

Is it:  Euros didn't have syphillis and smallpox--and if they did, they didn't bring it because of their advanced medical and quarantine procedures--and they only brought peace, happiness, and the wheel, therefore they were entitled to all the land they conquered? 

Posted by: Indian Casino Boss at April 25, 2010 06:23 PM (KfZeO)

No, it's: more advanced civilizations overrun less advanced civilizations and take what they want.  Until just recently, when we developed delicate sensibilities.

White guilt is stronger than anything, and much more dangerous.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at April 25, 2010 06:02 PM (N49h9)

 According to star mappers, Earth is a minor planet out in the "sticks" of the galaxy. It would be kind of like traveling hundreds and thousands of years just to visit Lubbock TX

How do you know that about Lubbock?  You've been there too?

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 06:25 PM (RZ8pf)

You damn Redskin Lover.  No, I think it was done deliberately, I just wonder what the thinking was. 

Nevergiveup, I suppose you could argue that right at this very minute he might not be getting laid. But he got laid in the past, seeing as how he reproduced, and I also believe he had a relationship with one of his nurses where she told her “exclusive” story to one of the infamous British tabloids.

You damn Redskin Lover.

How dare you imply that! IÂ’m faithful to my Seahawks!

Posted by: societyis2blame at April 25, 2010 06:28 PM (7ZyYf)

too much "science" is now based on theories w/ little to no evidence while scientists shout down and talk down to critics of theirs, their just like liberals, all talk and no evidence/facts

Seriously, I’m getting the feeling you guys think I’m arguing the “noble savage vs. evil European” side here, when everything I’ve said so far is meant to support the opposite argument. So, if I seem like a Native American apologist, well I apologize.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 06:25 PM (RZ8pf)

Not at all.  We know where you're coming from, but you are acting as an unwitting carrier of some of those themes. 

I mentioned earlier that the Indians sent syphillis back to Europe, so the disease score is pretty even, by my reckoning, anyway - though no one ever talks about that, and syphillis is so much worse than smallpox.  It attacks sex, which really sucks, it drives you insane over a long period of time, and you don't build up any immunity to it.  That is really bad.  I'd rather get the quick hit of smallpox. 

I also mentioned how it's interesting that lefties, today, see tobacco as the root of all evils, but they never bother mentioning that it came from the Indians - just as they gloss over the fact that the African slave trade was run by the arabs until the Euros picked it up from them.

Posted by: societyis2blame at April 25, 2010 06:28 PM (7ZyYf)

There can never be any proof.  By definition.  It is impossible to know anything about anything outside our universe.

They wouldn't have to know about germs just do "cause and effect" , such as Fleming did to establish innoculation for smallpox. Observe dairy people that had cowpox did not get smallpox. Use blankets from disease wards to cause epidemics.

Actually, that was done by the Brits during the French and Indian war.

The Northwest tribes didnÂ’t have anything to do with the French and Indian war, so at some point the US government picked up the trick. Of course, one could argue since Britain was in British Columbia that they couldÂ’ve been the ones. I guess I canÂ’t speak with 100% confidence as to where the Northwest tribes got smallpox from, just that they had it. Maybe its back in some of my research papers somewhere but that was a long time ago in a galaxy far awayÂ…

 According to star mappers, Earth is a minor planet out in the "sticks" of the galaxy. It would be kind of like traveling hundreds and thousands of years just to visit Lubbock TX

How do you know that about Lubbock?  You've been there too?

Welfare Forever!

In March, Monica Conyers, pleading insufficient funds, was granted a court-appointed lawyer to appeal her bribery conviction stemming from her work as a city councilwoman in Detroit. Conyers is the wife of John Conyers, the Michigan congressman who is chairman of the House Judiciary Committee. (Mrs. Conyers arrived in court on the day of her sentencing clutching what reporters said appeared to be a Louis Vuitton handbag that sells for $1,000.) [Detroit Free Press, 3-16-10; MLive.com (Advance Newspapers), 3-17-10]

Posted by: Monty at April 25, 2010 06:34 PM (O3eFQ)

Isn't a black hole a singularity?

Eeek! IÂ’m an unwitting carrier. I swear I didnÂ’t know I was infected!

Posted by: TexasJew at April 25, 2010 04:50 PM (PON03)

I just give Huma 'that look' and she sheds like a snake.

It would be kind of like traveling hundreds and thousands of years just to visit Lubbock TX Posted by: kbdabear

I see you've been there. Longest century I spent there one year.

I donÂ’t think so Guy Fawkes. In all the movies they seem like they either eat humans or weird goop.

Is it:  Euros didn't have syphillis and smallpox--and if they did, they didn't bring it because of their advanced medical and quarantine procedures--and they only brought peace, happiness, and the wheel, therefore they were entitled to all the land they conquered? 

Posted by: Indian Casino Boss at April 25, 2010 06:23 PM (KfZeO)

Wow, that strawman is like 200 feet tall and nuclear powered. Im-pressive.

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at April 25, 2010 06:36 PM (7VvJB)

Aliens ARE takeout food!

One thing I'm 100% positive about though- every story about alien abductions and/or alien spacecraft (UFO) sightings is bullshit.  All of them.

They're going to travel tens, hundreds or thousands of light-years for no reason other than to hover over a trailer park for a couple minutes, maybe probing an anus or two?  Not buying it.

Just imagine getting that passed by an alien committee.  "Let me get this straight- you want to take a ship on a 300 year journey to a planet 400 light-years away, at great expense, just to see how an Earthling will react when you stick a probe up his ass, then leave?  I don't care how funny you think it would be- motion denied."

But then again I believe that faster than light travel by a spaceship is almost certainly impossible, so what do I know.

Posted by: Gleek, the space monkey from the Super Friends at April 25, 2010 06:37 PM (kSbr6)

Ok, that's enough out of you, Dum-Dum.

The same "numbers alone" that Hawking hawks to infer the existence of life out there work against him when considering the possibility that some of that life will ever be in a position to make contact.

Yeah, Hawking is an idiot, just like those three stooges Fermi, Drake, and Von Neumann.

Just in case there was any doubt... /s

RE: Indians

Go online and look at pictures of an Indian reservation.

Then remind yourself that the Bureau of Indian Affairs and assorted other government agencies have been in charge of that mess since their inception.

Yep, that healthcare thing is gonna work out marvelously!

Eeek! IÂ’m an unwitting carrier. I swear I didnÂ’t know I was infected!

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 06:36 PM (RZ8pf)

I believe you, but what will people say 200 years from now

No, it's: more advanced civilizations overrun less advanced civilizations and take what they want.  Until just recently, when we developed delicate sensibilities.

So the genocide was a-okay?  In reality, then, it was the Euros who were noble.  Just doing their duty relieving the Indians of all that land they didn't need? 

Why all the wasted breath pointing out Indians weren't noble--as if reputable people consider that an important point--and the assertions Euros didn't wipe them out at least in part with disease?

But Hollowpoint, isnÂ’t that the equivalent of what Columbus did when he discovered America?

/sarc obviously.

It's a COOKBOOK!!! 

So the genocide was a-okay?  In reality, then, it was the Euros who were noble.  Just doing their duty relieving the Indians of all that land they didn't need? 

Why all the wasted breath pointing out Indians weren't noble--as if reputable people consider that an important point--and the assertions Euros didn't wipe them out at least in part with disease?

Posted by: rdbrewer at April 25, 2010 06:39 PM (7FagD)

The genocide was a-ok at the time, and I refuse to take even one iota of responsibility for it.  No, the Euros weren't noble, they were stronger.  I haven't made any assertions, but, the Indians weren't noble, and the Euros did wipe them out at least in part with disease.

Yeah, but Jeff Goldblum was awesome in Jurassic Park.

Eeek! IÂ’m an unwitting carrier. I swear I didnÂ’t know I was infected!

too much "science" is now based on theories w/ little to no evidence while scientists shout down and talk down to critics of theirs, their just like liberals, all talk and no evidence/facts

Wow, that strawman is like 200 feet tall and nuclear powered. Im-pressive.

I reducto ad absurdam I don't fool around.

Posted by: gomm at April 25, 2010 06:41 PM (73jUp) 

Gotta disagree.  The first (and still only?) example of using quantum mechanics and relativity together.  Physicists are impressed with that.

Well, I am a bit of a disreputable person it is true. But I do think it is important to point out that the Native Americans werenÂ’t noble because we have a helluva lot of revisionist history going on in this country right now. IÂ’d like to see at least some of the teaching go back to a little bit of the reality of how things were before whitey ruled America.

Yeah, but Jeff Goldblum was awesome in Jurassic Park.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 06:42 PM (RZ8pf)

The genocide was a-ok at the time, and I refuse to take even one iota of responsibility for it. 

But I want you to take responsiblity since I know you were there.

And here Blazer, I thought I was acquitting myself as a moronette with more than just a spectacular set of hooters.

Posted by: Monty at April 25, 2010 06:43 PM (O3eFQ)

I would just add that no infinities, or infinitesimals, can physically exist in our mathematical models of the universe.  The whole drive of modern physics is the finitization of everything.  If something isn't finite, we have no models that include it as a physical reality.  The only thing approaching this, from what I gather, is the claim that perfect randomness is able to be exhibited by certain quantum behavior, but I would tend to guess that that is more an artifact of a probabilistic model (as quantum theory) than anything connected to actual reality - as our universe is ordered and one can never get randomness from order without some exterior operation.

Of course, if there were an actual infinity, or infinitesimal, found to be physically existing, that would have some pretty big impacts on the foundations of mathematics and the constructivists would be ticked off, to say the least.  Cantor would have a good laugh, though.

Posted by: Monty at April 25, 2010 06:49 PM (O3eFQ) 

Yeah.  That marriage of quantum mechanics and relativity.  I've tried to tell my father than matter and anti-matter particles are constantly appearing in empty space.  He doesn't believe me.  He thinks modern physics is voodoo.

I do want to get back to a question that seems to undergird this thread though, why is conquering wrong? Obviously both the discussion of the Europeans taking over North America and the discussion of aliens coming to our planet hinges on a concept of the need to explore and possibly subsequently conquer. Is this urge wrong? If it is wrong, why has it not been evolutionarily engineered out of us by now?

 Kip Thorne Rip Torne has posited the concept of a "naked singularity", but the mechanism of such a thing is very complicated to describe using what we know about subatomic physics.

FIFY

We don't really know what a "singularity" is. It's the definition of a condition, not an object. When gravitational pressures scoot off to infinity, we don't have any way to describe what happens then.

You know what?  I've got this one. 

There is no singularity.  "Singularity" is our intellectual cop-out.  The stellar remnant is still there, it just recedes in time faster than anything falling in, so nothing ever reaches the remnant once the horizon forms.  Things fall "forever" from their point of view. 

IOW, the space between the remnant and the horizon, and all points in between, stretch faster than the speed of light, so nothing ever gets there.  It's the time distortion that creates "the appearance" of all that space.

The star never collapses to nothing.  It just recedes forever.

Admiral, the Earth is, what, maybe, um, 24,900 miles in circumference and, what, 8,000 miles in diameter? Would you say, Admiral? But if significant numbers of aliens, say, LAND here with their, you know, families, don't you thing the Earth will, you know, I'm just worried the Earth will tip over ... capsize, if you will. Don't you think so, Admiral?

 there wasn't a "big bang"; it was a "big pull".

Space doesn't suck; it blows.

Chix don't blow; they suck.

I'm with ya, man.

Most Native Americans were assimilated, not killed.

Because you say so?

I just don't think you should be able to write "Hawkings hawks" without playing something by Hawkshaw Hawkins.  http://tinyurl.com/22pssgr

What if they're trying to plunder our bacon supplies, but haven't yet worked out which animal it comes from?

Posted by: Hollowpoint at April 25, 2010 05:45 PM (plsiE)

This could have horrible consequences.  They could go around the galaxy, not knowing that what they believed to be bacon was actually pastrami.

nice, rdbrewer.

Which one, Gomm? 

I wonder what shows they like

I hear they're crazy about T.J. Hooker and Charles In Charge.

Well, all this conjecture seems to ignore that maybe the "resource" the star-hopping space bugs would be looking for is ...a protein rich environment.

I dinna think they'd be looking in asteroid belts for that. Cheery damn thought, eh?

In which case, Hawking's point stands.

IOW:

...How to Serve Man (On a Platter).

...with apologies to Rod Sterling. And David Weber (In Death Ground/The Shiva Option).

The holier-than-thou PC shit gets old really quick.

What pc shit?

I do want to get back to a question that seems to undergird this thread though, why is conquering wrong? Obviously both the discussion of the Europeans taking over North America and the discussion of aliens coming to our planet hinges on a concept of the need to explore and possibly subsequently conquer. Is this urge wrong? If it is wrong, why has it not been evolutionarily engineered out of us by now?  Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle

No, not wrong. But then, my father's people originate from the Huns, and my mothers from the Mongols. And my husband's from the Vikings. So, it's like scratching an itch for me.

Obviously Rep. Hank Johnson has been hitting the crack pipe too heavily.

Them's my kin.

You know the Borg really ruined the term ‘assimilated’ for me.

Posted by: Seven of Nine at April 25, 2010 07:07 PM (sYxEE)

You know the Borg really ruined the term ‘assimilated’ for me.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 07:09 PM (RZ8pf)

Yeah.  It's all those extra harmonics.

and btw, i hope this thread puts to bed the notion that men think about sex every 5 seconds

I didnÂ’t know that was a bad thing?

40 Would locusts skip your garden just because there are other gardens? 

They would if my garden is at the bottom of a pretty inconvenient gravity well and there are other easily-accessible gardens out there.

If the "others" have achieved FTL travel (or anythning even close to it) they wouldn't be too worried about any gravity wells.

Great subject... back to the comments

How come nobody bitches and moans to the fucking Chinese about them wiping out 1/3 of Europe with their pneumonic and bubonic plague?

Because there isn't any money in it.

93 True or false: things didn't turn out very well for the "Native Americans" after Columbus showed up.

OK.  But why pick that example?  Things didn't turn out very well for subsaharan animists after the Muslims showed up, either.  Aboriginal Australians and the British, Ethiopians and the Italians, dodos and the Dutch...

*********************************

The score thus far:

More advanced civilizations:  Infinity

Stone Age civilizations:  Dick

Posted by: The Colonists at April 25, 2010 07:01 PM

I wanna give a shout out to the colonists.  Thanks for all the money.

I just don't think you should be able to write "Hawkings hawks" without playing something by Hawkshaw Hawkins.  http://tinyurl.com/22pssgr

It surely was a different time...

Posted by: andycanuck at April 25, 2010 07:09 PM (ocax6)

It might, if left alone, but someone is probably going to throw smallpox laced comments on it and cut it down at 615.

Even if a much more advanced civilization existed on another planet, and interstellar travel were possible (and I doubt it is), how would they even know we were here unless they were from a relatively close planet?

Commercial radio transmissions didn't happen until 1920, and radio waves travel at light speed.  Even assuming another civilization was trying to monitor for extremely weak radio signals from Earth, the signal would've only travelled 90 light-years by now.  Anyone further than that wouldn't have recieved them yet.

So, will this thread reach 2001 comments?

WAKE UP, ACE!

Posted by: kbdabear at April 25, 2010 06:21 PM (sYxEE)

Funny you mention that. I drove to Lubbock just last month with the family and it actually seemed  like thousands of years.

Yes but Kung Fu Panda got made.

Not sure where that falls on the argument spectrum hereÂ…

Make sure to ask his permission before you post on the topic or you may be called Hitler.

Looks like we got us a genuine self-deceiving reality revisor.  Whatever floats your boat, turd.

Alan Guth once described it as "the Great Taffy Pull".

I read one of his book, but I don't recall that.  I'd like to see what he had to say...whether he dismissed the idea of a singularity too.  Because I thought I came up with that.

I can tell you why this happens too.  Care to guess?

Posted by: Vic at April 25, 2010 05:46 PM (QrA9E)

1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus presents the case many archaeologists and anthropologists have made that the pre-Colombian Indian societies in many places -- the Atlantic Coast, the Amazon Basin, the North American prairie -- (a) were far more populous than is commonly thought, (b) engaged in large-scale programs of changing the landscape to adapt it to human needs;  and (c) suffered massive die-offs in the few years immediately after first contact with European explorers.

The first Spaniards who survived a trip down the Amazon described riverbanks swarming with Indian settlements, but only a few years later, Spanish explorers found relatively few Indians.  Only recently have archaeologists uncovered the remains of relatively vast settlements in which the Amazon Indians built mounds to keep their villages above the seasonal floods, built causeways and roads between the villages, and created large-scale agriculture of such species as the peach palm by burying broken pottery with human manure to create fertile soil for the tree roots where there had been none.  It took very little time after the initial die-off from disease for the jungle vegetation to reclaim the mounds.

In what is now New England and the mid-Atlantic coast, the earliest explorers found the area very populous and the forest of hardwood nut trees well-cleared, with wide spaces between the trees.  Only a short time later, the coastal populations were very sparse and the forests -- due to a lack of Indian-set fires to keep the brush clear -- were thickly overgrown.

By and large, there wasn't any need for the Europeans to conduct military campaigns of genocide.  The Indians' simple lack of immunity to a few highly contagious diseases was enough to reduce their populations to the point that their societies could not continue to function as before.

As for the "noble savage," that was a different type of culturally-ignorant stereotype that certain Europeans wanted to push onto the Indians.  Some Indian societies had no qualms about completely transforming the landscape with construction projects as "ecologically unfriendly" as anything Europeans ever dreamed up.  Other Indian societies engaged in warfare and cannibalism -- evidence from the Southwest found in the firepits of some Anasazi homes some fossilized human feces containing human proteins along with human bones with butchering marks: an invading Indian tribe slaughtered the Anasazi villagers, ate them and crapped in their firepits.  No wonder the Anasazi moved to those remote and inaccessible dwellings on the sides of cliffs.

Posted by: kbdabear at April 25, 2010 06:59 PM (sYxEE)

Maybe when the Chinese finally ask for all the trillions we're "borrowed" from them and then stupidly pissed away on Obama's shit-for-brains Ebonomics, we'll just tell them that the Aliens came down  and stole it.

It may work...

Posted by: Ace's liver at April 25, 2010 07:13 PM (LtIsn)

We regard ourselves as pretty powerful, yet we still get mildew in our shower tile grout.  Why should God not be similarly afflicted?  The better question is, why does God not spray us with Scrubbing Bubbles?

Posted by: Blazer at April 25, 2010 07:21 PM (t72+4)

Abe Vigoda is like a god to them. And he's more than 1200 years old.

Posted by: Frank Costanza at April 25, 2010 07:21 PM (sYxEE)

Yeah, that chicken ain't gonna fuck itself.

I hear Barney Miller is a big hit with the Centaurians.

When the invasion comes, it'll likely be the result of replacing Wayne Rogers with Mike Farrell on MASH.

Alan Guth once described it as "the Great Taffy Pull".

Posted by: kbdabear at April 25, 2010 06:59 PM (sYxEE)

Posted by: Blazer at April 25, 2010 07:21 PM (t72+4)

Abe Vigoda is like a god to them. And he's more than 1200 years old.

Posted by: TexasJew at April 25, 2010 07:23 PM (PON03)

Correction: that's in earth years. In Centaurian years, he just qualified for his learner's permit.

When the invasion comes, it'll likely be the result of replacing Wayne Rogers with Mike Farrell on MASH.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at April 25, 2010 07:24 PM (P33XN)

All white men are bad, All Native Americans are good. And that's not racist, BTW. I get the message now.

Who the fuck ever said that, idiot?  I never did. 

and btw, i hope this thread puts to bed the notion that men think about sex every 5 seconds. just another of the self-aggrandizing assertions women and the therapy culture have proposed without challenge thereby sexualizing and feminizing society... we seem to skirt the issue.

let me assure you, when einstein developed his theory of relativity, implying the big bang and black holes, he wasn't actually thinking he wanted a relationship with a black hole for a big bang.

That's what you think.  They didn't have rock stars in my day; it was the Nobel Prize winners that got all the poontang.  If it weren't for all the ass thrown my way every time I published, I probably wouldn't have bothered. 

I mean, have you seen my hair?  Without being able to credibly use the "I know the secrets of the universe, baby, and Uranus is coming home with me tonight" pickup line, I'd never have gotten laid.

I hear Barney Miller is a big hit with the Centaurians.

When the invasion comes, it'll likely be the result of replacing Wayne Rogers with Mike Farrell on MASH.

Posted by: Gleek, the space monkey from the Super Friends at April 25, 2010 07:03 PM (kSbr6)

I'm his brother.  Now who's the dum-dum, stupid?

Posted by: andi sullivan at April 25, 2010 06:04 PM (sYxEE)

FIFY.

Posted by: The Colonists at April 25, 2010 07:01 PM

I wanna give a shout out to the colonists.  Thanks for all the money.

Posted by: Indian Casino Boss at April 25, 2010 07:12 PM (A8C+

Nah, there is no money, its just paper and we make it up out of thin air.

All white men are bad, All Native Americans are good. And that's not racist, BTW. I get the message now.

I just realized...  you re-wrote reality yet again.  Since you're a devout subjectivist, this will be my last response.  I've argued with perception morons so many times, I can script everything you will say from this point on.  Now it's just a game of defining terms and redefining for you.   Nailing you on a point is like trying to nail Jell-O to a wall. 

Go away now and believe whatever you need to believe.  And by all means, don't read my post at #380.

Look, you foolish breeders, we Raëlians have been all over this shit since the mid-1970s. Join our church, huh? All the sex and cloning your hearts desire. Just send us some church dues and it's all cool. You gals with big boobs can even become one of Rael's Girls or the Order of Angels. I'll bed down with ya at least once. You say you'd rather have Brigitte Boisselier, that's cool too. Maybe even a three-way? Anything goes with us Raëlians. We're all over the world. Just google us. We'll be waiting.

Well, frankly if it werenÂ’t for the drive in humans to explore and conquer weÂ’d still be sitting around fires wearing animal skins and picking bugs out of each otherÂ’s hair. So, I for one am glad that humans like to conquer.

I suppose I should have guilt about that. But, IÂ’m Greek and I got conquered a long time ago.

I personally prefer the barking squaw position.

Posted by: Ace's liver at April 25, 2010 07:31 PM (LtIsn)

She was the cute girl-next-door who was found to be a coke fiend, right?  Like the Sandra Buttock of the 70's.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it" ... indeed.

Posted by: Ace's liver at April 25, 2010 07:31 PM (LtIsn)

Wait until the aliens pick up Pink Lady & Jeff or The Ropers.

We're so fucked.

^{Although I always enjoyed Norman Fell breaking the fourth wall with his cheesy grin.}

I suppose I should have guilt about that. But, IÂ’m Greek and I got conquered a long time ago.

Wait until the aliens pick up Pink Lady & Jeff or The Ropers.

We're so fucked.

^{Although I always enjoyed Norman Fell breaking the fourth wall with his cheesy grin.}

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at April 25, 2010 07:38 PM (P33XN)

Let's quit arguing about the Indians and discover our common ground:

We all love firewater.

How many years did Europeans live in huts?

PuhLEEZE! After our bombers pounded the Euro-huts to shit the Euros (under the Marshall Plan) rebuilt the same damn huts. Just look at the before and after photos.

Actually at the Palace of Knossos, on Crete (1700 to 1400 BC), there is evidence of plumbing, not what you would call flush toilets by any means, but they had developed advanced mechanisms for getting rid of their human waste. Also advanced ways for bringing fresh water to the palace.

Let's quit arguing about the Indians and discover our common ground:

We all love firewater.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at April 25, 2010 07:42 PM (P33XN)

Actually at the Palace of Knossos, on Crete (1700 to 1400 BC), there is evidence of plumbing, not what you would call flush toilets by any means, but they had developed advanced mechanisms for getting rid of their human waste. Also advanced ways for bringing fresh water to the palace.

Yeah, but didn't everybody kind of forget how to do all that in the middle ages?

@ Blazer

I hear ya!

I just hope they get Starship Troopers instead. Receiving that would probably make a young alien kid piss his bed or hide in the closet.

Huh?  Was it scary?  I never bothered watching past the shower scene.

Actually at the Palace of Knossos, on Crete (1700 to 1400 BC), there is evidence of plumbing, not what you would call flush toilets by any means, but they had developed advanced mechanisms for getting rid of their human waste. Also advanced ways for bringing fresh water to the palace.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 07:43 PM (RZ8pf)

When did they invent luncheonettes?

Posted by: Ace's liver at April 25, 2010 07:42 PM (LtIsn)

Well in my experience, Cretans are assholes, so I think they had a lot of shit to dispose of.

535 - you didn't - 498 did. That's why the post says "498" right at the beginning.

Learn about the hash marks, dummy.  While you're at it, look at all the garbage you introduced ab nihilo...

--Why bother reading what was said before, just go with the knee-jerk racial bullshit.

--this is why no one can actually study or discuss whole subjects in history anymore. Too many modern "victims" want to bring their own baggage to the argument and don't even listen to what gets said.

--All white men are bad, All Native Americans are good.

--hat's not racist, BTW. I get the message now.--knee jerk racial bullshit

--holier than though pc bullshit

Ad my favorite:

--what makes you the "go-to conscience" guy for Native American issues ? Either let us know or take the chip off your shoulder.

Because of course, if I'm an Indian or part of some other racial group, you can plug in your pre-conceived notions and understand me better.

You invented this argument from your filtered, distorted perceptions of reality.  You're out of your depth, dummy. 

If aliens every do arrive, they're going to take one look around, make one statement, then leave.

"Shit.  You guys don't have flying cars yet either?  We were hoping you had some to sell; our engineers have been talking about them for eons, but do we ever get them?  Nooooo.  Screw it, we're outta here."

Posted by: trainer

Oh, shit. I knew it was too good to be paradise. It was that fucking "apple", wasn't it?

Posted by: Subotai Bahadur at April 25, 2010 07:48 PM (/gkzj)

I agree.  I don't think the Voyager missions were really well thought out ideas.  I know that the odds are so slim that a couple of little crafts in the vastness of space will amount to much, but just the idea of alerting someone to our presence before we know of theirs seems truly idiotic, from every angle one could think of.

I think Washington wiped his ass with British Pound notes actually.

Posted by: schizuki at April 25, 2010 07:52 PM (Xd9fe)

603

The winner ... LMFAO!

Posted by: schizuki at April 25, 2010 07:52 PM (Xd9fe)

His wood teeth.

Gojira, Japanese word for Godzilla made up of a combination of the Japanese words for Gorilla and whale.

With knowledge like this, I just donÂ’t understand why I canÂ’t get datesÂ…

Posted by: Jehu at April 25, 2010 07:45 PM (eKOT/)

And they invented the regular census - and did a better job at it 2000 years ago than we do today.  

At 2:30 am's when I'm pondering the universe, SG-1 seems to wrap it all up for me. 

Posted by: TexasJew at April 25, 2010 07:55 PM (PON03)

Oh heck, I forgot to return my census form. Some hippieÂ’s going to be on my doorstep any day now.

Posted by: ac

I take it you never saw "The Beach" with Al Gore's triple secret boyfriend Leonardo DiCaprio? There's a drug-addicted bum with a forbidden hand drawn map in alien Thailand.

Actually I think IÂ’d be terrified to meet Gojira fans.

With knowledge like this, I just donÂ’t understand why I canÂ’t get datesÂ…

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 07:58 PM (RZ8pf)

Exhibiting more Godzilla-knowledge than a man makes him feel castrated.

Same as "Godfather" quotes.

Monty, what would be interesting is if it was known what sort of, dare I say "religious" prohibitions against some of the developments there were.

I'm pretty certain Washington wiped his ass with Kenyans. Which was amazing because Kenya didn't exist at that time, but there you go.

Perhaps he had a premonition...

Oh heck, I forgot to return my census form. Some hippieÂ’s going to be on my doorstep any day now.

Posted by: kbdabear at April 25, 2010 07:57 PM (sYxEE)

I really don't want to see Ace's boobs.

George Washington took Immaculate Poops.

"Walkaways."

Posted by: Jones

No.

Oh heck, I forgot to return my census form. Some hippieÂ’s going to be on my doorstep any day now.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 07:59 PM (RZ8pf)

Maybe you'll be lucky and get a Roman, instead.  At least they know what they're doing.

Or maybe I should phrase that differently, what cultural influences were there on the people for or against developing and sustaining the development of tools etc.

I am a man of large appetites

Kinky. But OK.

here we go!

Actually, I like Doctor Who fans. But only of the Tom Baker/David Tennant variety. I donÂ’t care how cute the new redheaded sidekick is, Emo goth boy Who is stupid.

Posted by: kbdabear at April 25, 2010 08:04 PM (sYxEE)

I like the stuff that was done with the solar system, but I would have prefered something that just stayed local.  Like I said, a couple of tiny bits flying through space is unlikely to run into anything ... but if they did, it would almost certainly not be a good thing.  And we would benefit in no way from it.

Mr. Peabody already figured all this shit out 50 years ago.

And he's neutered.

 Even assuming another civilization was trying to monitor for extremely weak radio signals from Earth, the signal would've only travelled 90 light-years by now.  Anyone further than that wouldn't have recieved them yet.

***************************

I think it was Carl Sagan who used the theme from "I Love Lucy" to illustrate what aliens might first hear as evidence of our existence.

Heh

I think it was Carl Sagan who used the theme from "I Love Lucy" to illustrate what aliens might first hear as evidence of our existence.

Heh

Posted by: effinayright at April 25, 2010 08:14 PM (3sB5l)

Actually, it would have been Milton Berle. And that's not good.

then the Neanderthals might have come out on top

Ever taken a trip through the local Welfare village?

The Neanderthals are alive and well.

Maybe Hamlet said it best:

“There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.”

644 Our Solar System could be colonized right row RUTROE   and we'd never know it.

FIFY

Scooby Doo

684 Dang -

In my half-assed 'following' of hawking I've noticed he's had to 'walk back' (and forth) on a theory or two of his own. Unless I'm mistaken, he doesn't take well, either, to being challenged (or his theories) by fellow scientists. As scientists go, he's somewhat the narcissist's narcissist.

I just read Simon WinchesterÂ’s “Outposts” about his visits to the remaining colonies of the British Empire back in the 80s.  What is interesting about the British is how much they replicated "home" no matter where the colony was located.

Posted by: Anachronda at April 25, 2010 08:11 PM (LD+ZJ)

Ok, so that's not a photoshop?

I wonder if Gabe knew what kind of discussion he was opening up when he posted this, or if he was just trying to fill space on a Sunday afternoon.

Posted by: schizuki at April 25, 2010 08:21 PM (Xd9fe)

Fortunately part of every French explorer's kit was a nice big white flag.

18-1, follow the link at the link to the complete breakdown of the photograph. ItÂ’s kind of fascinating.

I donÂ’t think it necessarily argues against it being a time traveler, by the way. Who is to say that a time traveler wonÂ’t choose the clothing of the time that most resembles what he or she is comfortable in from their own time.

@ ParanoidGirlInSeattle

Apparently it's pretty much rainy and shitty over much of AoS nation.

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at April 25, 2010 08:25 PM (7VvJB)

I plan on eating liberals. A renewable resource I might add.

Weird it is sunny and nice here in Seattle. But, IÂ’m still working off the tail end of my stomach bug so IÂ’m indoors discussing time and space travel and the destruction of the natives instead.

I just read Simon WinchesterÂ’s “Outposts” about his visits to the remaining colonies of the British Empire back in the 80s.  What is interesting about the British is how much they replicated "home" no matter where the colony was located.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 08:24 PM (RZ8pf)

Gojira, Japanese word for Godzilla made up of a combination of the Japanese words for Gorilla and whale.

With knowledge like this, I just donÂ’t understand why I canÂ’t get datesÂ…

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at April 25, 2010 07:58 PM (RZ8pf)

Well, you're in the right place. That's a start.

You know some of this comes down to the good old “nature vs. nurture” argument. What is inherent in a human to drive him to switch to an agrarian culture and once the switch is made what continues to drive the human to civilize said culture. Versus the fact that some humans never have that same drive. The ant vs. the grasshopper fable.

Humans are humans, after all

EXACTLY!

Guy Fawkes, I think it would only help us if it created bacon.

See-Lincolntf is an explorer! Willing to boldly go where no one has gone before in the combination of fiddle faddle and beer. It is a human imperative, this need to explore.

Like a black hole, at what point does an Internet thread collapse into itself. And does the introduction of either boobs or bacon hasten its demise or prolong its agony?

Posted by: Ace's liver at April 25, 2010 08:36 PM (LtIsn)

Well, not so much. Between the fall of the Western Roman Empire and the collapse of the Mongol Empire the nomads were doing pretty darn well. 

The problem that the sedentary civilizations had is that while they might have more people, they couldn't convert them all to soldiers or they would starve...

Posted by: Ace's liver at April 25, 2010 08:48 PM (LtIsn)

Have you ever read Mary White Rowlandson's account of her time among the MA Indians as a captive? It is a pretty interesting view into contemporary Amerindian mores...

Posted by: eman at April 25, 2010 08:52 PM (6tqEs)

O/T  This is the second pix to show Shebacca sporting a "package."  Coincidence?  I think not.

http://tinyurl.com/2dlc4by

So to sum up, pussy is the driving force of group conflict.

Pithy. And irrefutable.

Would someone please convince Michelle Obama that one of the signs of being civilized is to buy clothes in the correct size. Jeebus, woman, you are the First Lady, IÂ’m sure you can get your pants altered so they fit right.

Since our world is full of examples of things that look real but arenÂ’t such as optical illusions, cgi, and blue screen,  it is thus safe using HawkingÂ’s reasoning that the universe itself that we can only see through telescopes might be fake.  On top of that mankind is full examples of scientist being wrong, from the earth being flat to the earth being the center of the universe.   So from that I include most scientists must be wrong. Combine the two and the odds are that there is nothing else out there in the solar system has a big fake lighted painting of the “universe” around it.

Posted by: schizuki at April 25, 2010 08:52 PM (Xd9fe)

Didn't the early Amerindians eat all the horses in the Americas? Or at least, they went extinct shortly after the Amerindians showed up...

And as for Northern Europeans and civilization, yes it was mostly a choice. The Romans did conquer England and France, but not Germany. The latter voluntarily romanized themselves for the most part. And the former mostly continued to live as they had under the Romans once they got rid of them. Though the British-Romans had a slight barbarian invasion problem that rather upended things for them.

Posted by: rdbrewer at April 25, 2010 08:56 PM (A8C+

The answer my friend.....is blowin' in the wind.....the answer is blowin' in the wind.

kbdabear, not just their tortures. The ceremonies for the rites of passage in some tribes were gruesome to the extreme.

Posted by: Monty at April 25, 2010 08:18 PM (O3eFQ)

Which is why one of my Five Pillars of the Stupidity and Primitive Nature of islam is:

3) islam moved to a totally lunar calendar, with the death penalty for anyone who inserted intercalaries.

islam was the first major ideology that intentionally moved backwards, from the solar adjusted calendars that agrarian societies needed back to the lunar calendar of the desert nomad who had no need for seasons and the rest - as all other civilizations came to rely on.

'Nam Grunt -

Never ... I repeat, NEVER do Walmart on Sunday. I don't care how badly you need toilet paper.

Posted by: kbdabear at April 25, 2010 08:54 PM (sYxEE)

It seems to me the notion that the Amerindians were some hippie peacniks while the rest of the world were playing out Mad Max for real is rather offensive. They were just like the people everywhere else, and when they had the opportunity to take by war they did so - exactly like the French or the Turks...

Posted by: Monty at April 25, 2010 07:59 PM (O3eFQ)

The Aztec, the Maya, the Inca were all large-scale civilizations.  There were others that were unable to survive even the very initial contact with European disease -- not to mention older civilizations wiped out by war with other Amerind civilizations.

What puzzles me is that the Amerinds don't seem to have domesticated many species of animals for use as beast of burden and ranched meat.  Replacing human labor with animal labor is a big help in freeing up time for inventive thought and tinkering, and making protein foods available in pens and pastures rather than as game also helps.

You know, IÂ’ve spent the better part of this entire thread mostly arguing some pretty knowledgeable stuff so I really donÂ’t think I deserve to have some stupid asshole toss shit my way for any jokes I might begin making since this thread is now close to 800 FUCKING comments.

jesus fucking christ.

i was excited to see the new series on History Channel about Americaa, and guess how it starts? Fucking Obama. Dear Lord, is ther any TV show that he hasn't appeared on?

islam was the first major ideology that intentionally moved backwards, from the solar adjusted calendars that agrarian societies needed back to the lunar calendar of the desert nomad who had no need for seasons and the rest - as all other civilizations came to rely on.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at April 25, 2010 08:59 PM (N49h9)

Heh, I can reuse something I posted last night. The response from the last Zoroastrian Emperor of Persia to the demand he submit to Islam;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yazdegerd_III

While we laid the foundations of philanthropy and righteousness and kindness in this world and held high the ensign of "Good Thoughts, Good Words and Good Deeds", you and your ancestors were desert wanderers who ate snakes and lizards and buried your innocent daughters alive.

You Arabs who have no regard for God's creatures, who mercilessly put people to the sword, who mistreat your women and bury you daughters alive, who attack caravans and are highway robbers, who commit murder, who kidnap women and spouses, how dare you presume to teach us, who are above these evils, to worship God?

Note that this is from a letter around 620 AD...

It seems to me the notion that the Amerindians were some hippie peacniks while the rest of the world were playing out Mad Max for real is rather offensive. They were just like the people everywhere else, and when they had the opportunity to take by war they did so - exactly like the French or the Turks...

Posted by: 18-1 at April 25, 2010 09:00 PM (bgcml)

Posted by: Dynomutt After Dark at April 25, 2010 08:42 PM (4aB5

In Israel, they had a project where they built new, beautiful, big houses for some bedoins, because everyone felt bad looking at them living in their shabby tents while modern civilization was growing right around them.  What happened?  The bedoins put their tents up outside their houses and still lived in the tents.  True story and that's not more than 30 years ago.