1 "Sweden is the Saudi Arabia of feminism,"

The one indisputable good that comes out of the entire Wikileaks enterprise is that it gives lefties spontaneous concussions.

2 But her eyes said yes, yes, YES!

3

She says they had consensual sex but she woke up the next morning to find him having intercourse with her to which she had not consented.

He should have just told her that she fell asleep in the middle of consented-to sex the evening before but he'd gone on pounding away all night, and when she woke up, he was just finishing.

If the dick sticks, ya got to acquit!

4

"I am wearing you."

*reaches for trashcan*

This is truly nauseating.

5

Maybe some date-rape charges are a bit grey-area, but this charge doesn't seem gray-area, if true. It sounds like rape.

Rape-rape indeed.

But are these women still only seeking charges for "sex by surprise"?  Why aren't they going for all they can against this scumbag?

6 So, what is so bad about rape after you have convinced a little maggoty creep to commit treason and pissed off the entire world? Really. Why should he care?
The man is the walking definition of relativism.

7 Spit.

8 When she asked him if he was wearing anything, he had allegedly said: "I am wearing you."

And when I am done I will chuck you in the hamper with the rest of the dirty laundry.

9 I'm still stunned that the charges were brought by women.

10 Imagine my surprise to find my own personal cooter filled with the pulsating member of Julian Assange.

11 The more that is revealed about this, the more sickening it is.  Absolutely disgusting.

12 Instead of "Casanova," shouldn't that read "asshole?"

13 If I slept with someone and in the morning started up again and she fully woke up and yelled "Stop!" I would, mostly out of confusion. But I can't get behind the idea that lying naked in bed after consensual sex means the male has to ask formal permission before initiating any new sexual moves. I don't understand this new age moral code, dancer/prostitutes were so much simpler....

14 The ironic thing is that what Cassangenova is really complaining about is that Sweden is NOT Saudi Arabia.  If this had been Saudi Arabia, the prosecution would need four witnesses.  In Sweden, they don't.

15 "She came up to my hotel room.  What do you think she should expect?"

16 In the good old days Little Julie would die in a tragic accident, like getting hit on the head by a pallet of concrete bags that "accidentally" fell off a construction scaffold. Now he'll get a book deal and retire a rich man...

17 Are we sure he didn't say he was just hiding important secret cables in her coochie? Maybe she didn't want to get involved in international intrigue.

18 Meh - might be technically rape in the "withdrew consent mid-pump" sense, but it's still not the kind of rape that gets non-feminists all that worked up.  If it was Tom Brady, not many people who aren't Jets fans would get exorcised about it.  Perhaps my timeline is off, but didn't the accuser and Assange have friendly interactions after the incident? 

19 Totally off topic but, RDBrewer ?

"Waxman said. 'The next two years I expect all their ac-tions to be campaign ori-ented"

What's with this hyphen shit?

20 When she asked him if he was wearing anything, he had allegedly said: "I am wearing you."

MEH!...COPYCAT!!!...I used that line ALL the time!

21 Why is he so weird looking? What nationality is he? What kind of name is Assange?

22 I don't care how many filthy scandies Asswipe bones. They should be forced to bear his children as a sentence for extreme lack of taste or any semblance of brain waves.

23 This jackass maybe in trouble but he is currently living in a mansion with private grounds and thousands of the rich and famous fluffing him daily.

24 Close. She was already hiding them there and apparently he couldn't reach them. Now THAT'S entertainment! Well done sir.

25 could someone please remind me why I should care about this?

26 Of course, no blame is to be laid at the feet of the women who invited Assange into their apartment, their room, their bed and in their cooter to begin with. Only in the morning after, when they say stop, it's his fault.. not defending him but noting how fucked up the situation is.

27 24 Why is he so weird looking? What nationality is he? What kind of name is Assange?

Same nationality as Ben Assfleck?

He's an Asshole. 

28
Doesn't Enreekay Iglesias have a new song called Tonight, I'm Wearing You?

29 What I don't understand is why he is still alive?

30

Like his accomplice, Bradley Manning, Julien Assange is a very sick freak and a slimy low-life, and I would like to see him serving time in prison for espionage and for grand theft and for conspiracy (and for being an insufferable, obnoxious creep).

But in view of what you said, I've got to go with your "grey area" option with respect to the ambiguity of whether or not he raped that Swedish chick. Unless there is more to that story that we don't know about, I doubt that he will be found guilty of rape. 

That Swedish chick has to be a real loser to have gone to bed with that sick, slimy creep, and so I suspect that she is also a real pig, who has to wear a paper bag over her head to get laid. (Yeah, they have them in Sweden, too.)

31 Red Light Green Light Go Go Go
Red Light Red Light No No No
Green Light Stick it In
Red Light ya Gotta Go, cause No means No.

I guess Julian Asswipe just floored it at the yellow light and got busted by a traffic cam.

32 When the cougar asked Dick Cheney if he was wearing a condom, Dick Cheney snarled, slapped the cougar and said "I'm wearin you, BITCH", and went back to work on the mexican prostitutes.

33 Damned Jane Fonda-loving feminists not wanting to be raped in their sleep!

34 But her eyes were darting back and forth. She was giving me that come hither look.

35 They should be forced to bear his children as a sentence for extreme lack of taste or any semblance of brain waves.

They were hypnotized and rendered powerless by his jazz hands.

36
Europeons make me sick, btw.

37 I am not sure they can make the Rape charge stick, but what a cad to have unprotected sex these days.

38 Europeons make me sick, btw.

Posted by: Soothsayer Moribund at December 28, 2010 03:09 PM (uFokq)

Next time, wear a condom.  Trust me on that one.

39  This Assange reptile is getting on my nerves.

I don't know whether to punch him or pour salt on him and watch him dissolve.

Bring on the polonium house dressing for this slug.

40 Getting so you can't have passed-out sex with a trannie anymore.

41 Wouldn't such a stud have a huge supply of condoms at all times? 

42 >>Sweden is the Saudi Arabia of feminism If Sweden was the Saudi Arabia of feminism, Julian's little unit would still be in Sweden.

43 Yawn. "Hey, what's this?"

Sounds more like 4-bit with a floating point.

44 So... to recap...

she went to bed with Assange, let him stick his Europeon weinerschnitzel in her orifices, and then went to sleep next to him.

And then Assange, for some odd reason, feels he can put his little Europeon sausage in her again.

This makes her angry?

45

"But I can't get behind the idea that lying naked in bed after consensual sex means the male has to ask formal permission before initiating any new sexual moves. "

I know right? I don't know why guys alway get mad at me. It's just a strap-on, dude.

46 Meh, we pretty much packed it in after defending Bill Clinton.

47 Soothsayer, Her asking if He was wearing protection implies that was likely the deal for the  previous night moves.

48
Yeah, I get it, she was asleep.

Asleep for how long, five seconds until she felt him penetrate her disgusting Europeon vagina?

49 And then Assange, for some odd reason, feels he can put his little Europeon sausage in her again.
This makes her angry?

She sobered up.

50 What's all this consent business?

51 She should have gnawed her arm off and got out of there.

52 "The one indisputable good that comes out of the entire Wikileaks enterprise is that it gives lefties spontaneous concussions." Yeah, never mind the fact that Assange is 100% right about the political climate of Sweden. He makes leftists mad. High five. "Maybe some date-rape charges are a bit grey-area, but this charge doesn't seem gray-area, if true. It sounds like rape." These stories of rape sound like bullshit to me. It seems more of a case of buyer's remorse. Unless Miss A can prove that he ripped the condom, then her case should be dismissed. If she was so terrified that she may have got an STD from him, then why did she let him stay with her for a week? He wasn't her boyfriend or anything. And if Miss W was "rape-raped" then why did she buy him breakfast after he "raped" her? The fact that she only decided to seek legal advice, which ironically wasn't about rape but to force him to get tested for STDs, after talking to Miss A makes her whole story seem fishy. From the stuff I read about these women (and without revealing their names), they are both hardcore feminists.

53
I know right?

That's different, Joanie.

54 If that's rape, color me guilty.

55

this story sickens me.

watch this instead

(it's cute; I promise)

56 She should have gnawed her arm off and got out of there.

Ah, a wolf-trap morning.

57 Am i the only person who finds the suprising part of this story is that he was having sex with women?

58 Yeah, I get it, she was asleep.

Asleep for how long, five seconds until she felt him penetrate her disgusting Europeon vagina?

Posted by: Soothsayer Moribund at December 28, 2010 03:16 PM (uFokq)

First time, he had it sleeved.  The second time, no. 

I thought he was Australian?

59 In what alternate universe do the facts that, a) she was in your apartment, and b) you'd previously had sex with her, constitute any sort of consent?

60 I am wearing you, but first you blow me.

61 she wasn't raped until she found out that he was doing someone else Ace if you think that was rape your whole sense of what sex is is warped beyond repair lose 40 pounds and hit some bars

62 Hmmm..   Well, I prefer to keep them knocked out for the whole thing.. but, you know, shit happens.

63 "That Swedish chick has to be a real loser to have gone to bed with that sick, slimy creep, and so I suspect that she is also a real pig, who has to wear a paper bag over her head to get laid. (Yeah, they have them in Sweden, too.)" Both of the women are actually pretty hot.

64
I thought he was Australian?

Forget it, I'm on a roll.

65 Ben, nah,  also surprised me.

66 Fuck off douchebag.

67 A signed statement of intent per act, per occasion, prior to physical contact is required.

I just hope the notary and witness don't get in the way when I'm tryin to go downtown.

68 Yeah, never mind the fact that Assange is 100% right about the political climate of Sweden. He makes leftists mad. High five.

Pretty much.  As I'm in favor of his actual murder, a trumped up rape charge is fine by me.  The feminist part is just a bonus.

69

"That's different, Joanie."

Not really.  A finger the night before, a strap-on in the morning, what's the difference?

70

In what alternate universe do the facts that, a) she was in your apartment, and b) you'd previously had sex with her, constitute any sort of consent?

Oh I don't want to defend these bitch women, but....

Married women have been raped by their husbands.

So there goes your theory.

If a woman says stop, as one claims she did, then you stop

(with that said, I think all these people are disgusting and I don't care what happens to any of them)

71 is it wrong of me to hope that his ankle bracelet has GPS enabled, so as to allow the Hellfire missiles to be that much more accurate?

72
The difference, Joanie, is that I don't get penetrated.

That's the deal, 'member?

73 Also, I hope this androgynous albino motherfucker is publicly assraped in the most violent and degrading manner imaginable by big sweaty lesbians with strap-ons.

74

Lacey saif,"Married women have been raped by their husbands.

So there goes your theory.

If a woman says stop, as one claims she did, then you stop."

 

 

right.

 

75

"That's the deal, 'member?"

I forgot you don't like the finger.

76 As little respect as I have for anyone who would bed down with Assange, he shouldn't have finished up.Ya gotta respect the NO.

A rape charge is much worse than a case of blue-balls and TSB.

77 >>Both of the women are actually pretty hot. Ever been to Sweden? All they make in Sweden is dumb politics, Volvo's and hot women.

78 *boogers snuggles up close to girlfriend in bed*

boogers gf - Aww, i love it when we cuddle

booger thinking to himself - hey that's great, i just like the way my wang feels against your ass crack

79

If a woman says stop, as one claims she did, then you stop

You're obviously completely unfamiliar with momentum.

80

Posted by: laceyunderalls at December 28, 2010 03:21 PM (pLTLS)

Um, that was kind of my point.  Hence the "alternate universe" part.

81
You're disgusting.

And, yet, intriguing.

82 I guess filthy scandi didn't want sloppy seconds???

83

You're obviously completely unfamiliar with momentum.

Well if they were asleep they weren't familiar w/much of anything.

84

Well if they were asleep they weren't familiar w/much of anything.

AHA!  You were asleep.  You couldn't have said stop!

No more questions for this witness.

85 Zima's a powerful drug.

86

well i guess some  men wouldn't mind being woken up to a screaming child. or  and std, a while later. after a one night stand week of sex.

 She had said yes, right?

87 I'm available worldwide.

88
The Finger_^tm

89

"Only if you are helping to find my missing prostate."

It's okay. I'm just adjusting your dickmitten from the inside.

90 Having a hot European woman check your prostate is fine until she uses that finger to stir your coffee the next morning.

91 yikes sifty.

92
I'll bet you can braid Miss A's armpit hair.

93 and now we know how sifty likes it........!

94 In what alternate universe do the facts that, a) she was in your apartment, and b) you'd previously had sex with her, constitute any sort of consent?

They don't, but they do create a strong inference in the minds of reasonable people that whatever happened is more likely a misunderstanding or mistake than a rape-rape.

95 Couldn' t agree more when we've finished hanging drawing and quartering him for treaaon, they're welcome to have him on an iffy rape charge.

96 I just heard that on the internets...

97 69 she wasn't raped until she found out that he was doing someone else Ace if you think that was rape your whole sense of what sex is is warped beyond repair lose 40 pounds and hit some bars
Posted by: archie bunker at December 28, 2010 03:19 PM (0YS61)

Unless he specifically asked her if he could fuck her while she was sleeping (and she said yes), it was rape.  End of discussion. 

And please learn some fundamental punctuation and sentence structure if you're going to troll here.

98 Not that I give a rat's ass what happens to Assange...lock the asshole up and throw away the key but....doesn't this woman make a living advising other women how to bring charges against men in court?

99

Julian Assange is Andy Warhol's love child...

 

(... see, it all makes sense now)

100 Assange vs. Feminazis Pop some corn. I'm rooting for injuries.

101 Unless he specifically asked her if he could fuck her while she was sleeping (and she said yes), it was rape.  End of discussion.

Really?  I didn't think anybody bought that Antioch College bullshit anymore, but  .  .  .

102

Posted by: ol_dirty_/b/tard

Sorry, I read your post wrong. I concur.

103 Archie's comments are like farts - they befoul the air for a moment and then dissipate. 

104 Don't fall asleep in bed with anyone you don't want drilling you.

End of problem.

105 Well he is famous for fifteen minutes now, time to drop of the stage / gallows

106 In what alternate universe do the facts that, a) she was in your apartment, and b) you'd previously had sex with her, constitute any sort of consent?

Planet Neanderthal.

(Gruß Gott, Dumköpfe!)

107

Ah, Antioch College.

Home of the 'do I have your permission to kiss you?' pledge.

For those that have never had the (dis)pleasure of Yellow Springs, OH, lemme tell ya....

Whackadoodles.

108 If you don't trust the pussy, why are you f*cking the pussy?

109
I didn't think anybody bought that Antioch College bullshit anymore, but  .  .  .

heh, you remember that, too?

Can I kiss you? Can I put my hand on your left breast? Can I put my hand on your right breast? Can I put my erect penis in your...?

110 dam, if the guy wanted to have sex with a sleeping woman, he should have just married her, amirite?

111 Sam, you are missed. Come back.

112

Ah, Antioch College.

Home of the 'do I have your permission to kiss you?' pledge.

For those that have never had the (dis)pleasure of Yellow Springs, OH, lemme tell ya....

The problem is that a generation of Womyn's studies professors have misled college women that the Antioch College protocols are the law.

113 8 When she asked him if he was wearing anything, he had allegedly said: "I am wearing you."

I just vomited.  He is a singularly vulgar, disgusting, puke inducing piece of shit. 

114 Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 03:35 PM (r1OG3)

I've had women whom I've fucked in the past stay overnight, and I'm pretty sure had any of them woke up with my cock inside them I'd either be dead or incarcerated right now.

115 I don't have to worry about my wife sleeping through sex. Her crossword puzzle keeps her awake the whole time.

116

Her crossword puzzle keeps her awake the whole time.

You don't always need a puzzle.

We can always mentally balance the checkbook!

Multi-tasking!

117 The secret is being so damn good that they want seconds in the morning.

Amirite? Ladies back me up on this.

118 Well okay, but just this once.

119 I'm pretty sure had any of them woke up with my cock inside them I'd either be dead or incarcerated right now.

I would just muster my shocked face and blurt Wait, it was your idea!

120

Thank you, Ol Dirty for that clear and unambiguous explanation. It's rape.  Just because she consented once doesn't mean he gets free rides later. 

Here's a thought experiment if you can suspend your common sense: You give your one-week stand your credit card specifically to buy one thing and one thing only and s/he comes back with a whole bunch of other stuff you never consented to buying....is that theft? 

121

Ladies back me up on this.

Um, not quite.

If it's good it's certainly not 'seconds' in the AM. Jus sayin'.

122 Can we do it doggy-style? I wanna watch Monk.

123

Thank you, Ol Dirty for that clear and unambiguous explanation. It's rape.  Just because she consented once doesn't mean he gets free rides later. 

For God's sake man, just shell out and buy a season pass!

124 I could never rape my wife. Her bitch-fu is too strong.

125 Agree with lacey.  If it's good it would be fifths, sixths....and so on.

126 How do you tell when a married woman has an orgasm?

She drops her nail file.

127 Agreed Maddogg. Any attempt to rape my wife would constitute an elaborate suicide plot. Since I was the one who taught her how to shoot.

128

...this is why I stick to hookers, you pay your money you get what you want, no problems for anyone.

 

"but it's disgusting paying for sex, only losers pay for sex"

 

wrong, in our current culture, the "loser" is the guy who gets married, and works hard his whole life.

 

 

129

The issue of whether this is rape-rape is all tied up in the fact that Assmunch allegedly didn't stop bumping uglies with the alleged victim even after she'd allegedly told him to stop.  As far as I'm concerned, if one party tells the other party that they don't want to have sex and the other party persists, regardless of pre-existing factors or conditions, that constitutes rape.  The issue in my mind is did the woman really demand he stop?  Or was that something she concocted or exaggerated in later accounts?  That's what investigators have to determine. 

Now frankly, if this were America and not Sweden, I don't think the women would have a leg to stand on since they appear to have kept up convivial relationships with Asswipe after the alleged rapes without being coerced.  It would be different if they were married to him and couldn't escape an abusive relationship, blah, blah, fill in your Lifetime movie of the week here.  But these are two seemingly independent women who had no reason to stay with Asshole if he'd violated them, and who would have been in their rights to have him arrested.  To most people, this just reads like a case of caveat emptor where the buyer didn't beware enough and is suffering buyer's remorse times ten.  The only reason these women's claims are being given as much merit as they are is because they're in Sweden, the laws are different in Sweden, and Assfart is an internationally renowned dickhead.

Julian Assclown is a complete tool and a limp-wristed little git, and I don't care if he gets raked over the coals for this, because he deserves it.  But if he's not guilty then I hope he's found not guilty, because wishing a guilty verdict on a not guilty man - no matter how repellant and loathsome he may be - is just one step on the road to a complete breakdown of jurisprudence. It would be a terrible blow to any genuinely innocent men in Sweden who are accused of rape. 

If he's guilty, throw the book at him.  If he's not guilty, find him not guilty and then set him free so he can be hit by a grand piano "accidentally" dropped from a fifth story window, a fate he richly deserves.

130 wiserbud,

That's a Jewish woman who drops her nail file or her manicurist.

131 I just don't buy that he was already in before she woke up.

132 This thread has certainly devolved into depravity and decadence. 

May Assange meet his end at a ricin-pellet, or some polonium-laced tea.

133 Both Assange and the woman he slept with are annoying low lifes.  The only reason she sang "rape" is because she got played by a player.

134 May Assange meet his end at a ricin-pellet, or some polonium-laced tea.
Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta)

I would bake him some iridium 198 pellet cookies.

135 Drugs and booze explain an awful lot about this story. I bet we would have a whole different story to read if we had toxicology reports on these three people.

136 That's a Jewish woman who drops her nail file or her manicurist.

Yeah, I know.  I was just trying to stick with the overall theme.

137 Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 03:39 PM (r1OG3)

There's a pretty broad spectrum between kissing and fingerfucking a girl who's conscious and has the capacity to say no and sticking your dick in them when they're asleep.  By your standard, your college roommate could have stuck it in your poopar while you were passed out and it wouldn't have been a big deal.

138 This thread has certainly devolved into depravity and decadence.

Ain't it grand?

139

Strange.  All of this.  I've never had any woman complain of waking sex.  As a matter of fact, from my experience, they think it's when the best sex is.

140 Everybody has the Week Before New Year craziness.

141 I fucked who?

142 I've never had any woman complain of waking sex. As a matter of fact, from my experience, they think it's when the best sex is.

Ride the subways a lot, do you?

143

gah

144 I agree Soona. But I think we have probably slept with people who actually liked us and were not ashamed to be with us and of themselves.

145 Your honor these charges are complete bullshit.  Just look at me.  Does it look like I am into chicks.

146 This whole thing would have simply disappeared had he thought enough to buy her flowers...

147 >>I've had women whom I've fucked in the past stay overnight, and I'm pretty sure had any of them woke up with my cock inside them I'd either be dead or incarcerated right now. Assange is a worm who needs a good stomping but having an ex spend the night in your house is not the same thing as having sex with a woman who you banged the night before and is still sleeping in your bed. Naked. If she asked him to stop he should have. But a good rule of thumb for woman is don't sleep naked with a guy you just screwed if you don't expect him to have ... ideas.

148 This calls for diamonds!!!!

149 I don't know why guys alway get mad at me. It's just a strap-on, dude.

Posted by: Joanie (Oven Gloves) at December 28, 2010 03:14 PM (HaYO4)

I come for the most-of-the-time sort-of-right-of-center sounding posts. I stay for the moronettes.

150 I've had women whom I've fucked in the past stay overnight, and I'm pretty sure had any of them woke up with my cock inside them I'd either be dead or incarcerated right now.

But, you said this:

Unless he specifically asked her if he could fuck her while she was sleeping (and she said yes), it was rape.  End of discussion.

Nothing in the law requires a man to "specifically ask" for anything.  That's feminist brainwashing bullshit.  Consent can be manifest in ways that are neither verbal nor specific.

Here's a thought experiment if you can suspend your common sense: You give your one-week stand your credit card specifically to buy one thing and one thing only and s/he comes back with a whole bunch of other stuff you never consented to buying....is that theft?

In all practical effect, no.  It is perhaps exceeding the license that you granted to her and even theft from a moral perspective.  The Police will politely tell you that it is a "civil matter" and send you on your way.

151 This ass hanger guy does not interest me. Here is news.

152 <i> "Sweden is the Saudi Arabia of feminism," he said. "I fell into a hornets' nest of revolutionary feminism."</i>

In Saudi Arabia, the women are so hot they have to wear burkahs to keep men from going crazy; in Sweden, the women are so hot, men are automatically assumed to be rapists.

----

the 2nd woman's account does sound more like rape-rape though.

153

The sicker and slimier they are, the more heroic they are to liberals.*

If Ted Bundy hadn't been stupid enough to have whimsically said that he was a registered Republican, presumably just to be a smartass, he surely would have been acquitted by a jury of liberals, just like O.J. Simpson was.

So why am I not surprised that Manning and Assange are the new heroes of the lefties?

*Explains why Obama, Holder and Clinton are in office, doesn't it?

154 145 I just don't buy that he was already in before she woke up.
Posted by: dagny at December 28, 2010 03:48 PM (DS1Ec)

I can tell from AssPlunge's anger issues, and by taking one look at him, that his dick is about the size of an I-Pod headphone jack.  He could probably fuck a hamster without waking it up.

155 Nothing in the law requires a man to "specifically ask" for anything.  That's feminist brainwashing bullshit.  Consent can be manifest in ways that are neither verbal nor specific.

Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 03:56 PM (r1OG3)

Practice law in Sweden much?

156 Did he forget to leave a 5 Euro note on the Ikea?

157 Never got why womens like faggitts.

158 Your honor these charges are complete bullshit.  Just look at me.  Does it look like I am into chicks.

Posted by: Julian Assange at December 28, 2010 03:54 PM (54F2e)

 

That's been my question from the get-go.  Does Assang even have a dick?  Someone mentioned strap-ons upthread.   

159 If it's good it's certainly not 'seconds' in the AM.

That's right, ladies.

160 I just don't buy that he was already in before she woke up.

Posted by: dagny at December 28, 2010 03:48 PM (DS1Ec)

You never woke up with a mosquito bite you slept through?

161 Did he forget to leave a 5 Euro note on the Ikea?

Posted by: FlaviusJulius at December 28, 2010 03:59 PM (SJ6/3)

I thought the full story included the fact that he 1) carries no money and 2) has no credit cards.  Makes him more difficult to track, or so he claims.

162 Diamonds.  She'll pretty much have to.

http://tinyurl.com/24dgxq

163 Does Assang even have a dick?  Someone mentioned strap-ons upthread.  

Hence the Sex-by-Surprise! charge.

164
has the Taiwanese cartoon makers covered this, yet?

165 There's a pretty broad spectrum between kissing and fingerfucking a girl who's conscious and has the capacity to say no and sticking your dick in them when they're asleep.  By your standard, your college roommate could have stuck it in your poopar while you were passed out and it wouldn't have been a big deal.

Um, no. 

You can plug your ears and shout "rape" and pretend that having a recent history of consensual sexual relations with someone doesn't grant a certain implied license, but not a lot of people are going to buy it.  I don't have the permission of my girlfriend to playfully smack her ass in public, but I do - do you think I should be charged with what is potentially a felony in my state if she subsequently didn't like her Christmas presents?

166 "Making love all night" really just means until the chafing starts or the spurs slip and rip a sheet.

167 Never got why womens like faggitts.

Posted by: FlaviusJulius at December 28, 2010 04:00 PM (SJ6/3)

They can share blow job tips.

168 If she asked him to stop he should have. But a good rule of thumb for woman is don't sleep naked with a guy you just screwed if you don't expect him to have ... ideas.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 28, 2010 03:55 PM (TMB3S)

This!  I say it was a setup. 

169 Urgh, what a creeper. Reptiles and spiders aren't the only poisonous, disgusting things Australia exports, apparently.

I would be able to understand the guy thinking that because she consented once already, he was good to go--if he'd stopped when she said no, and if he hadn't uttered a line that makes me convinced he has a skin suit in his basement. But then, Assange reeks of ego, so I'm not surprised he kept going at it.

170 ace should really know better than to let a post like this go w/out another one for over an hour and a half.

171 Practice law in Sweden much?

No.  Nor does Ace nor any other identifiable member of the commentariat.  So - in that case - why are we here?

172 Assange makes the sheep and the herder nervous.

173 I'm wearing you.

174 Assange was just mangling a Ron Burgundy quote with his little squinty-eyed punch-me face.

The real quote is "I want to be on you."

175 If he wanted to fuck me, he should have woken me up and come to me like a fucking man!

176 When she asked him if he was wearing anything, he had allegedly said: "I am wearing you." Damn, if I was single I would so steal that line...

177 It's really a bad sign when women start asking a guy to put condoms on their strap-ons.

178 "Never got why womens like faggitts."

I never got why any woman would love your average man. We smell funny, we grow hair in weird places, we love bacon, we love guns, we love football and we scratch ourselves in public and grow boogers the size of tomatoes.

179 Every kiss begins with K.

180 Whoopie Goldberg will be here any minute to explain the whole thing.

181 He could probably fuck a hamster without waking it up.

Well, what fun would that be? The struggle makes my ass tickle.

182 I've been married or engaged now for the last 12 years. I didn't know they were even still making Swedish pussy.

183 I don't have the permission of my girlfriend to playfully smack her ass in public, but I do - do you think I should be charged with what is potentially a felony in my state if she subsequently didn't like her Christmas presents?

Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 04:04 PM (r1OG3)

Depends on what you do if she says "stop that" and "no."  Do you think you have a common-law easement to her ass?  Or that your right to play outweighs her right to decide what physical contact is acceptable to her and when?

184 the younger woman, Miss W, contacted Miss A and they realised he had been to bed with both of them in swift succession. They went to the police station together, apparently to seek advice. A policewoman who heard their stories is said to have suggested they could pursue criminal charges.

Note to self: Cancel trip to Sweden.

185

By law and common assent in Western countries, being actually married to a woman does not give a man the right to have sex with her without her consent to that specific instance of copulation. Yet Julian Assange feels heÂ’s being persecuted because he assumed that one act of consensual sex with a casual acquaintance gave him licence to have sex with her again anytime he wished without asking.

IsnÂ’t the belief that the Universe was created to accommodate oneÂ’s own individual desires called solipsism?

186 I really would like to say something smart and funny about this little dirt bag, but all I want is him dead. Does that make me shallow?

187 Damn it all, I'm starting to like the little effeminate little guy... I like the cut of his jib. And quite honestly: most of the Wikileaks actually show things that hurt the liberal cause than anyone else. Certainly NOTHING - of course - that would suggest Bush lied about Iraq, nothing to show "it's all about the oil," etc., but plenty of stuff showing Obama and liberals in Europe as duplicitous and easily showed around by crappy dictatorships like Syria. But just for the "I'm wearing you" crack... I vote we make him an honorary moron.

188 Also, I hope this androgynous albino motherfucker is publicly assraped in the most violent and degrading manner imaginable by big sweaty lesbians with strap-ons in men's bodies serving time in a maximum security prison.

Posted by: ol_dirty_/b/tard at December 28, 2010 03:24 PM (IoUF1)

189
"Went to the drug store and nearly lost my life
There I saw my girlfriends, one and two
Standing there together, I knew I was in trouble
But I'm a clever guy I knew what to do..."

190

IsnÂ’t the belief that the Universe was created to accommodate oneÂ’s own individual desires called solipsism?

Posted by: stuiec at December 28, 2010 04:13 PM (yY4uj)

 

Yeah, whatever. 

191 Depends on what you do if she says "stop that" and "no." Do you think you have a common-law easement to her ass? Or that your right to play outweighs her right to decide what physical contact is acceptable to her and when? Posted by: stuiec at December 28, 2010 04:12 PM (yY4uj) Au contraire! She was asleep and therefore could not possibly have said "no"! Therefore, under the established Rohypnol etiquette, Assange was at worst guilty of a minor traffic offense (going the wrong way in a one-way zone). But I do think this idea of a common anal easement offers possibilities for the enterprising moron.

192 Depends on what you do if she says "stop that" and "no."  Do you think you have a common-law easement to her ass?  Or that your right to play outweighs her right to decide what physical contact is acceptable to her and when?

I'll put to you a middle case - she says "stop that" and "no" while giggling and trying to ball tap me.  We make love that afternoon.  Can she rely upon the "stop that" and "no" to initiate a criminal prosecution three weeks later?  I suppose you would say yes, being the white knight that you are.

This shit is complicated and does not avail itself of easy, pre-fab, black-and-white answers like you and feminists are trying to posit. 

193 But just for the "I'm wearing you" crack... I vote we make him an honorary moron.

Nah. "30 more seconds and then you can get me a beer" would be a lot more honorarily moronic.

194 If this pasty fucknozzle is so hard up, doesn't this mean he'd be easy to assassinate? Just saying.

195

I like Occam's Razor in this case....

Is it more likely that two hardcore feminist harpies lied/stretched the truth because they were angry/scorned over finding out Asshat was a playa

or

They are telling the truth

I think I'll take the former. 

White Knighting about no means no aside. 

If being attacked and raped in a park is a 10 on the 1-10 rape scale, these charges, even if true are about a 3. And again, I don't believe it.

Would much prefer this scumbag be brought to justice the old fashioned way....the Russian way if you will.

Oh and the line, utter cheese/creepy....unless delivered by an alpha.

196 CNN says ex-Shell president says $5 gas by 2012.

Really going out on limb there.

197 I think our Moron Medal should have a motto on it.

What is Latin for Just The Tip?

198

they need to stop calling this 'surprise sex'

with the exception of father's day, all sex is a surprise

and yes, i'm married (wedding cake = birth control)

199 If this pasty fucknozzle is so hard up, doesn't this mean he'd be easy to assassinate? Just saying. Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at December 28, 2010 04:21 PM (mHQ7T) Is that a hint?

200 >>she says "stop that" and "no" while giggling and trying to ball tap me. We make love that afternoon Bow chicka wow wow. You needed a soundtrack.

201 142 ...this is why I stick to hookers, you pay your money you get what you want, no problems for anyone.

"but it's disgusting paying for sex, only losers pay for sex"

Depends on the timing. If you fork over money beforehand, you are a loser who pays for sex. But if you pay after, you are just paying her to leave you alone. That's just good business, as long as she doesn't steal your watch.

202 @213: Exactly. Besides - and I'm only semi-facetious - every male over the age of 16 knows bloody well there are times when girls will say no even as they're feeling you up and undoing your belt. I'm getting REALLY tired of the "No Means No" slogan as some sort of Panacea to the supposed problem of our "Rape Culture."

203 Some guy reading Soldier of Fortune could take this Assange fuckwad out.

Ronny Barnhart could take Assange out.

204 If we outlaw Ninja sex then only Ninjas will have sex.

205

Julian's pimp hand is weak

This is actually true.  Dude probably didn't have much success with the ladies until he achieved his fame.  I'm sure he made these womyn each feel they were special...the only girl for him.  When they realized he was full of shit, out came the vindictiveness only a feminist can deliver.

If he had presented himself as a world class player, with many options he probably would have gotten the sex anyway without all the messy stuff afterward.

206 To make a finer point - who thinks waking up with the girl you had sex with the night before deftly mounting your morning wood, cowgirl, is rape?

207 Iustus tip

208 "but it's disgusting paying for sex, only losers pay for sex" How about paying for a movie and dinner for sex? Let's not be naive or overly judgmental. Personally, I think paying for sex is no less disgusting than having 10 different sex partners before age 30.

209 I think, perhaps, dear Julian was just as surprised his dick was in her as she was.  I don't think he's really used to having sex with women.  It must have been a very confusing moment for him.

210 "but it's disgusting paying for sex, only losers pay for sex"

How about paying for a movie and dinner for a chance to MAYBE have sex?

FTFY

211 Heh. Payin for sex won the West. Saloon girls and pros built this nation.

212 My new line for this situation?  Murum aries attigit, baby.

213 How do you get a girl to stop having sex?

Marry her.

214 To make a finer point - who thinks waking up with the girl you had sex with the night before deftly mounting your morning wood, cowgirl, is rape?

Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 04:26 PM (r1OG3)

 

So you're speaking of the much feared "Helen Thomas moment".

215 Exactly. Besides - and I'm only semi-facetious - every male over the age of 16 knows bloody well there are times when girls will say no even as they're feeling you up and undoing your belt. I'm getting REALLY tired of the "No Means No" slogan as some sort of Panacea to the supposed problem of our "Rape Culture."

My point exactly.  Do we know what Ms. A did as she is alleged to have asked Assange to quit?  Do we know that she wasn't intermittently passionately kissing him between her protests?  Did she attempt to push him off of her body?  Do we know if she lay stunned at the prospect of being raped, or whether she was in her previous night's pique of wild abandon?  
 

216 228 To make a finer point - who thinks waking up with the girl you had sex with the night before deftly mounting your morning wood, cowgirl, is rape? Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 04:26 PM (r1OG3) Yeah, I would feel SO violated... NOT. If a guy tried to make that stick in court, he'd be laughed out of town. But women are supposedly such a fragile, defenseless, sensitive, vulnerable little bitty things the reverse "leaves them scarred for life." Gimme a break. Let's be honest here: all this BS about "No Means No," signed consent forms, agonizing over what is and is not consent... ALL of this became necessary when many, many girls began to behave like tramps, beginning in High School with alcohol and on thru college and beyond. Tell me that isn't so with a straight face. WHAT exactly was that women doing, naked in bed with an utter stranger she met the night before? And how is THAT behavior and less "disgusting" than a straight forward business transaction between two consenting adults to perform a sex act?

217 I'll put to you a middle case - she says "stop that" and "no" while giggling and trying to ball tap me.  We make love that afternoon.  Can she rely upon the "stop that" and "no" to initiate a criminal prosecution three weeks later?  I suppose you would say yes, being the white knight that you are.

This shit is complicated and does not avail itself of easy, pre-fab, black-and-white answers like you and feminists are trying to posit. 

Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 04:20 PM (r1OG3)

She says "stop that" and "no" while giggling and trying to ball tap you.  You assume, naturally, that she's interested in playing -- and then she says "stop that" and "no" without the giggles, and while trying to restrain your hand.  Do you have the right to disregard this second request to stop, given that she gave you a go-ahead moments before?  Do you have a perpetual and inalienable right to keep doing something to her if she consented to it once?

It's not black-and-white at all.  Sometimes "no" means "no," even if it follows "yes."

218 Do we know if she lay stunned at the prospect of being raped, or whether she was in her previous night's pique of wild abandon? Posted by: Alec Leamas What are you wearing?

219

Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 04:31 PM (r1OG3)

Of course we don't know.  So we have to look at her verifiable actions afterwards.  Which includes hanging arround for a few more days.

Which kindda cuts against the whole "no means no."

220 Au contraire! She was asleep and therefore could not possibly have said "no"! Therefore, under the established Rohypnol etiquette, Assange was at worst guilty of a minor traffic offense (going the wrong way in a one-way zone). But I do think this idea of a common anal easement offers possibilities for the enterprising moron.

Posted by: CoolCzech at December 28, 2010 04:19 PM (tJjm/)

If his lawyer is worth his salt, he'll get the charges reduced to following too close.

221

I don't have the permission of my girlfriend to playfully smack her ass in public, but I do - do you think I should be charged with what is potentially a felony in my state if she subsequently didn't like her Christmas presents?

Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 04:04 PM (r1OG3)

If your "Christmas presents" consisted of passed out fuckrapes, yes indeedy.

Asshole.

222

If your "Christmas presents" consisted of passed out fuckrapes, yes indeedy.

Is that a gift certificate you can get at "Best Buy" or "Good Vibrations?"

223 I think you can get those coupons at Bed, Bath, and Beyond.

224 245I think you can get those coupons at Bed, Bath, and Beyond.
That's pretty sweet.  But I'm gonna check Amazon.com first.  No face to face contact is a real selling point for a product like this...

225 If your "Christmas presents" consisted of passed out fuckrapes, yes indeedy.

Asshole.

Yeah, sorry if I don't stand four square behind sending someone to prison for thirty years because "It's a lady's prerogative" and all.

No more gray area in human sexual behavior - Ed Anger has reduced it all to a simple binary formula.  Have the Nobel people called yet?

226 Sounds like "he said she said", BULLSHIT.

Pissed off sluts are hard to handle.

227 He must have not had enough change left for the encore.

228 It's not black-and-white at all.  Sometimes "no" means "no," even if it follows "yes."

That's fine.  The question isn't whether Assange is a swell fellow or properly chivalrous, it is whether he deserves to be deprived of his liberty based on evidence of a morass of "nos," "yesses," "maybes" and subsequent behavior by the accuser which is, at best, confusing in light of her allegations. 

229 Sorry, but my bottom line on the whole " date rape" subject is, If we have to have Sophist- like debates about "But is she said," and "...she wanted sex before, but then," and "she taled with her girlfriend and decided she was raped," then we're talking about two copulating bimbos, not rape by any meaningful definition of the word.

230 Yeah, sorry if I don't stand four square behind sending someone to prison for thirty years because "It's a lady's prerogative" and all.

Friends, friends.  Don't lose sight of who we're walking about here.  I want Assange dead.  Sending him to prison on a trumped up rape charge might be a necessary backstop. 

Let's not overgeneralize this to real people.

231 or talking about

either or

232 Dont! Stop! Don't Stop! Frickin' broads.

233 In most states, after you start fucking, you can not change your mind in mid stroke and tell a guy to stop.  Sex that starts as consensual, can not be turned into rape.

A bitch who has already fucked a guy and is sleeping with him naked, would have no standing in the US to cry rape.

Just the facts.

Sluts are sluts.  The bitch paid for the asshole's train fare to come to her house.  Maybe he should be tried as a gigolo? He took money to fuck her.

234 @251: and I would say, NO, he does not. Rape is FORCED sexual penetration, either with violence or the threat of violence. I'm sorry, but if you get naked with a stranger all do like a wild kangaroo all night only to wake up and find the kangaroo came back for a little more... It's an INSULT to a real rape victim to pretend like you were. Honestly, WHO CARES? If you're so upset about it - don't be a tramp next time. How's THAT for a no-nonsense, cold-hearted and judgmental verdict?

235

Friends, friends.  Don't lose sight of who we're walking about here.

This is either the best typo of all time.  Or evidence of some sick "furry" role playing shit.

Eitherway, it fits in with this blog.

236 wild kangaroo

To the Urban Dictionary!

237 No? No? I'm out fiddy dollahs for that dinna I trew down your troat, sweethaht! No my ass! Little Andrew's standin' up for you, honey!

238 "235 How do you get a girl to stop having sex? Marry her." I Do Means No, Baby!

239 Posted by: CoolCzech at December 28, 2010 04:55 PM (tJjm/)

Our white knights have apparently given no thought to how an accused would defend accusations of "withdrawn consent mid-stroke" nor all the little acts of sexual assault they commit daily without the expressed, notarized consent of their fair ladies. 

The Duke lacrosse boys got lucky that the bitch was stupid and gave unnecessary and conflicting details that got them off the hook, albeit after hundreds of thousands of Dollars in attorney's fees.

240 See, this whole "withdrew consent mid-stroke" argument illustrates what I'm talking about. Imagine some poor woman beaten into submission, or drugged without her knowledge. Isn't it a total insult to these real victims when some bimbo decides that the perfect stranger she allowed to enter her didn't "vacate the premises" quite as soon as she wanted? I mean, where's the trauma of a real victim? Where's the COMMON SENSE?

241 @ CoolCzech and Alec Leamas:
You're the only two on this entire message board who have enough sack to say you're not drinking the feminist "it's rape when WE say it's rape, common sense be damned" kool-aid. The rest of you, keep putting the precious snowflakes on a pedestal and hand over every legal right you have...tell me how that works out for ya in the long run.

242 Where's the COMMON SENSE?

We don't need common sense, reason, or the benefit of a few thousand years of human experience and law. 

We have a slogan, which is "No means no." 

243 That's fine.  The question isn't whether Assange is a swell fellow or properly chivalrous, it is whether he deserves to be deprived of his liberty based on evidence of a morass of "nos," "yesses," "maybes" and subsequent behavior by the accuser which is, at best, confusing in light of her allegations. 

Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 04:49 PM (r1OG3)

Well, maybe he should go to Sweden and allow its legal system to determine what's at the bottom of that morass.  You seem to be claiming perfect knowledge of the circumstances and events and declaring that there is no way that Assange could possibly have committed the crime of rape under Swedish law.  Do you know something the rest of the world doesn't, other that how your girlfriend behaves?

244 You're the only two on this entire message board who have enough sack to say you're not drinking the feminist "it's rape when WE say it's rape, common sense be damned" kool-aid.

One of my best friends in college took a co-ed home (to a house that she rented with other sorority sisters) from a bar. She supplied E, which they both took.  They swam together naked in the house's pool in full view by her friends.  They had sex.  She had a boyfriend back home.  She told everyone whom he knew that he was a rapist and was considering reporting the matter to Law Enforcement.  Luckily, she did not, but he sweated it out for a few months where it could have gone either way.  It was not fun for him, to say the least.

245 Well, maybe he should go to Sweden and allow its legal system to determine what's at the bottom of that morass.  You seem to be claiming perfect knowledge of the circumstances and events and declaring that there is no way that Assange could possibly have committed the crime of rape under Swedish law.  Do you know something the rest of the world doesn't, other that how your girlfriend behaves?

Do you apply your "Sweedish Legal Expert" standard to this?:

...but the second woman claims she specifically told him to stop after she awoke to find him on top of her, and he didn't. So, he hadn't had consent -- I guess a sort of implied consent in his mind, but not actual consent -- and even if you give him a pass on that, that non-consent was followed up with an affirmative denial of consent. But he kept going and, um, "finished up," despite that.

Maybe some date-rape charges are a bit grey-area, but this charge doesn't seem gray-area, if true. It sounds like rape.

Or only to the statements with which you disagree?  I was under the impression that your "No means no" slogan - to which so much that I have written was in reply - was to be applied to the United States as well - am I missing something?

246 To make a finer point - who thinks waking up with the girl you had sex with the night before deftly mounting your morning wood, cowgirl, is rape?

Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 04:26 PM (r1OG3)

As Joanie pointed out, who thinks that waking up with the girl you had sex with the night before deftly penetrating you from behind with her strap-on is rape?

Trick question -- we all know you can't rape someone who went to bed with you voluntarily.

247

As Joanie pointed out, who thinks that waking up with the girl you had sex with the night before deftly penetrating you from behind with her strap-on is rape?

Trick question -- we all know you can't rape someone who went to bed with you voluntarily.

If she ass-banged you with a strap-on the night before when you loved it and then you lovingly made her french toast, chances are it's "not rape." 

You might want to brush all of that straw off your shoulder there, Lancelot.

248

"Sweden is the Saudi Arabia of feminism," he said. "I fell into a hornets' nest of revolutionary feminism."

Back it up, back it up, beep beep beep.

What the hell does that mean? When people say that Arizona is the Saudi Arabia of solar energy, they're talking about an alternative to oil, which is what Saudi Arabia is primarily known for. So I get that.

But "the Saudi Arabia of feminism"?

Is Sweden's attitude progressive towards women and women's rights like Saudi Arabia is? (No, that can't be it.)

Are Swedish women covered in oil? And by that I man oil oil? How would the clean-up efforts go? Do volunteers pick them up off the beach and wash them off with dish soap under a gentle spary of water? (Still sounds nasty.)

Or is feminism as abundant in Sweden as oil is in Saudi Arabia? That's probably what he meant, but it's a horrible analogy.

Alas, he's a hero in some circles so I might as well embrace the turn of phrase, keeping in mind that Jordan doesn't have any oil:

Julian Assange is the Jordan of conscience.

249 If you fall asleep next to me naked, you might as well be wearing a sign that says "Party in My Ass". Amiright!?

250 I think the point that I'm trying to make together with CoolCzech is that there is certain behavior in the sexual realm that is caddish, impolite, inconsiderate, dishonorable, and ignoble, but not rape.  There are also situations in which the application of the standard set forth by stueic et al. should not be enforced in a reasonable society because of the likelihood of unilateral or mutual mistake and the difficulty of proofs upon which we should not deprive a man of his liberty for upwards of thirty years.

You may carry on accusing me of being a "rape apologist," but you might want to defer to the masterful work of Amynda Marcotte on the subject.

251 *Trick question -- we all know you can't rape someone who went to bed with you voluntarily.   stuiec*

as long as there is an absence of any clear and compelling corroborating physical evidence in support of the claim...yeah. You're finally startin' get it, son.

252 If you fall asleep next to me naked, you might as well be wearing a sign that says "Party in My Ass". Amiright!?

To complete the analogy, wouldn't it depend upon whether the person invited to to penetrate his or her ass in the past, from which you could derive the notion that he or she generally finds ass penetration pleasurable?  Doesn't it depend upon the fact that you have a relationship with that person (or not)?  How about the reaction (positive or negative) that he or she expressed the last time that you tried the assplay?  You know, what the kids these days call "context."

253

By the way, to answer the above question: Yes, one can commit rape, regardless of recent, consensual sex between the (now) victim and (now) rapist.

If I read this right ...

She says they had consensual sex but she woke up the next morning to find him having intercourse with her to which she had not consented.

... he started having sex with her while she was asleep. Not sexual stuff, but actual sex-sex. That's beyond creepy.

(Thirty years' worth of creepy? Maybe. Let a court figure it out.)

254

I think by the "Saudi Arabia" comment he was trying to imply that Sweden is the inverse of SA...kinda like the bearded Spock or something, but with feminists, or something.

I fail to see how you can rape somebody you had consensual sex with a few short hours before -- I thought it was just sorta common sense that people who have done the boing boing once, might be up for another go in a few hours -- an agreed upon double header if you will.  Then again, I fail to see how a woman can be that sleepy that she wouldn't have woke up immediately when, you know, a somebody came rapping at the chamber door (dang, that doesn't say much for old Julie there does it?).

Nonetheless, if it causes Jazz Hands grief I'm all for it (God knows dear leader isn't going to do any grief causing to be done).

255 By the way, to answer the above question: Yes, one can commit rape, regardless of recent, consensual sex between the (now) victim and (now) rapist.

I don't think that anyone said that a recent sexual partner cannot rape the other, only that not having the expressed, verbal consent of a woman does not equal rape.  (see 109)  Further, that confusing circumstances warrant leniency, rather than the strict application of "no means no."  If a woman is naked and in bed with a naked man with which she has recently previously had sex, subsequent allegations of rape are particularly suspect and worthy of particular scrutiny and skepticism, as the incident is likely to be the result of a unilateral or mutual mistake or miscommunication, for which a man should not pay with his liberty on the order of thirty years.  Lastly, that women can and do verbalize their lack of consent or withdrawal of consent while physically acting in a contrary manner.   

256

Then again, I fail to see how a woman can be that sleepy that she wouldn't have woke up immediately when, you know, a somebody came rapping at the chamber door (dang, that doesn't say much for old Julie there does it?).

I don't know. He might be pretty skilled at alternative bartending.

257 Then again, I fail to see how a woman can be that sleepy that she wouldn't have woke up immediately when, you know, a somebody came rapping at the chamber door (dang, that doesn't say much for old Julie there does it?).

Appears to the application of experience and reason to the issue.  Haven't you ever heard that "no means no?"

258 Joanie, that is a dumbassed argument you're making. The issue is can i go and charge you with rape when i LET you do the very thing the night before?  How can I prove this happened? What evidence, dear? Just my say so? Why should an impartial person believe me over you? The answer is: they shouldn't! I have nothing to support my claim.

259 Joanie, that is a dumbassed argument you're making. The issue is can i go and charge you with rape when i LET you do the very thing the night before?  How can I prove this happened? What evidence, dear? Just my say so? Why should an impartial person believe me over you? The answer is: they shouldn't! I have nothing to support my claim.



It's possible, but highly improbable.

260 Alec, how 'bout this rule? Get some kind of response from a woman before you penetrate her. Is that really a lot to ask? Too much work to wake them up first?

261

Alec @ 278: I get that -- all of it.

But if they did it not that long before, then he already knows how strict she'd be about condoms. And if she's asleep, then putting one on wouldn't exactly ruin the moment for her. By his own account, he got sex from her that he most likely knew she was unwilling to give him.

I don't know what the laws are about such stuff in Sweden, but that'd be the standard.

(And I'll bet he's wishing by now that he did it with her in Saudi Arabia. She'd have already been executed.)

262 wuzrobbd, I was responding to the people who said if you fall asleep naked next to a man, morning penetration should be expected, not reason for a second greenlight.

263 273 I think the point that I'm trying to make together with CoolCzech is that there is certain behavior in the sexual realm that is caddish, impolite, inconsiderate, dishonorable, and ignoble, but not rape. Sex is one kind of human activity. There are many other kinds, too. If you promise a girl the coffee you give her is decaf but its really regular, you're a jerk - but you're not a rapist. If you spend all night screwing a girl and go back for seconds or thirds or teens in the morning while she's asleep... you are a jerk. But you're not a rapist. It's silly to pretend otherwise, and again - really a denigration of the trauma suffered by TRUE rape victims.

264 Alec, how 'bout this rule? Get some kind of response from a woman before you penetrate her. Is that really a lot to ask? Too much work to wake them up first?

'Tis a fine rule!  Tug on her bodice first - chivalrous indeed!  I just don't think it is necessarily the standard of what constitutes rape. 

And I think we're all suspending disbelief when we pretend that she was in deep REM sleep, laying like a dead fish for the first two minutes of the morning coetus. 
 

265 And if she's asleep, then putting one on wouldn't exactly ruin the moment for her. By his own account, he got sex from her that he most likely knew she was unwilling to give him. I can't help thinking... somehow, the Poor Thing got over it and was busily screwing some other guy by next week. There is no real victimhood here, hence no real rape. This is silly.

266 Julian, baby--- Your technique sucks. Call me, I'll give you a few pointers.

267 @287: pretending she somehow didn't awake when he pulled the blanket off of her, rolled her over on her back, spread her legs, mounted her, and penetrated her makes the whole "rape" scenario even sillier.

268 Good Lord, so if tomorrow morning I try to screw my wife while she's asleep I'm actually a rapist? I don't know what the people that say these things are on, but I wish I could get some. Sounds like pretty good shit.

269 39 Europeons This spelling I am so stealing

270 " I just don't think it is necessarily the standard of what constitutes rape. " No, I don't think it's rape-rape. I just can't believe how many of you think it's perfectly okay to fuck someone who's asleep without trying to wake them up first. I just think it's sick. That's all!

271 No, I don't think it's rape-rape. I just can't believe how many of you think it's perfectly okay to fuck someone who's asleep without trying to wake them up first. I just think it's sick. That's all!

I think it's in bad form as well - on that we agree.  I just don't think it's "thirty years in state penitentiary" rape.

272 Neither do I, Alec. 30 years is ridiculous. Just do what I would do and kick him in the dick!

273 "...but the second woman claims she specifically told him to stop after she awoke to find him on top of her, and he didn't."

That is NOT what the article you linked to says! Nor is it stated in any account I've read anywhere of this allegation. Your link says "she woke up the next morning to find him having intercourse with her to which she had not consented." Meaning: she was asleep when it began and thus could not possibly have consented. It does NOT say she subsequently objected!!!

If people can't or won't read carefully, and stick to the facts of what is actually alleged, then it's pretty ridiculous to even be writing commentary about it.

The most detailed account in the Guardian (dec 17 article, referencing the leaked police report) was that she "couldn't be bothered" to remind him of her condom rule. IOW she made no objection to what he was doing once she awoke, instead just said "you better not have HIV." IOW she had a condom preference, not a condom rule. And yet she's so paranoid about HIV she's going to the police about it? What is wrong with this picture? The point is not to "blame" but how to effect positive outcomes. If you are that paranoid about HIV but still inclined to have casual sex, and yet 'cant be bothered' to object to a guy getting ready to unload sans condom and enforce your requirement otherwise, something's wrong with the female end of the equation, regardless of what's wrong on the male side.

If women think they can solve this sort of problem by running to the police after the fact (she might already have HIV at that point!), rather than learning how to assert themselves in the moment, they are damn fools. My friends and I learned this by the time we left college after dealing with countless creeps. It really wasn't that complicated.

274 Good God, Joanie, you act like fucking somebody is punishing them.

275 I think the point that I'm trying to make together with CoolCzech is that there is certain behavior in the sexual realm that is caddish, impolite, inconsiderate, dishonorable, and ignoble, but not rape.  There are also situations in which the application of the standard set forth by stueic et al. should not be enforced in a reasonable society because of the likelihood of unilateral or mutual mistake and the difficulty of proofs upon which we should not deprive a man of his liberty for upwards of thirty years.

You may carry on accusing me of being a "rape apologist," but you might want to defer to the masterful work of Amynda Marcotte on the subject.

Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 05:41 PM (r1OG3)

I think you're not allowing that Sweden has laws that define what constitute rape in that country's system of justice.  I think you're arguing that the Swedes have no right to set their own standard, which in fact may make Assange's behavior illegal in that country.  I think you are arguing that since you don't think Assange was anything more than inconsiderate, he ought to be allowed to thumb his nose at Swedish law.

I think the Swedish authorities believe that there is probable cause under their law to issue a warrant for his arrest to face charges.  I think he ought to surrender himself to the Swedish authorities, face his accusers and plead his case in court.  Or do you agree with Assange that Sweden is the kind of place where he can't get a fair trial and none of his rights will be respected?

276 113 Unless he specifically asked her if he could fuck her while she was sleeping (and she said yes), it was rape.  End of discussion.

Really?  I didn't think anybody bought that Antioch College bullshit anymore, but  .  .  .

In my state at least, the law is even stricter than that -- "advance consent" is not recognized.  If you fuck someone who's asleep, even if she told you beforehand that you could, it's still rape in the eyes of the law.

277 CoolCzech, what are you talking about? Just wake the person up first, jeez.

278 Do you apply your "Sweedish Legal Expert" standard to this?:

...but the second woman claims she specifically told him to stop after she awoke to find him on top of her, and he didn't. So, he hadn't had consent -- I guess a sort of implied consent in his mind, but not actual consent -- and even if you give him a pass on that, that non-consent was followed up with an affirmative denial of consent. But he kept going and, um, "finished up," despite that.

Maybe some date-rape charges are a bit grey-area, but this charge doesn't seem gray-area, if true. It sounds like rape.

Or only to the statements with which you disagree?  I was under the impression that your "No means no" slogan - to which so much that I have written was in reply - was to be applied to the United States as well - am I missing something?

Posted by: Alec Leamas at December 28, 2010 05:25 PM (r1OG3)

I'm sorry -- I just saw this and I can't make heads or tails out of it.  First, you're not quoting me, you're quoting Ace, so why are you asking me about it?

Second, the incident Ace describes sounds like a clearer instance of a woman saying "no" to a guy who started screwing her without asking -- that is, unambiguously telling him to stop, and him refusing to do so.  Does that sound merely unchivalrous to you?  Or are you really saying that a woman saying "yes" gives her bed partner a blanket all-access pass for as long as he stays in her room?

Third, whether that incident constitutes rape in Sweden is for the Swedish courts to decide.  Assange ought to make himself available to answer the charges stemming from that incident.  Do you disagree?

279

I'm sorry -- I just saw this and I can't make heads or tails out of it.  First, you're not quoting me, you're quoting Ace, so why are you asking me about it?

Second, the incident Ace describes sounds like a clearer instance of a woman saying "no" to a guy who started screwing her without asking -- that is, unambiguously telling him to stop, and him refusing to do so.  Does that sound merely unchivalrous to you?  Or are you really saying that a woman saying "yes" gives her bed partner a blanket all-access pass for as long as he stays in her room?

Third, whether that incident constitutes rape in Sweden is for the Swedish courts to decide.  Assange ought to make himself available to answer the charges stemming from that incident.  Do you disagree?

Ace doesn't practice law in Sweeden, however he gave a legal opinion regarding what would constitute rape.  You didn't cite Ace's lack of Swedish legal bona fides, yet you did for me.

I think we're all just spitballing because no one here is learned in Swedish rape law, and many of us would find Swedish rape law at odds with good sense, reason, and a bunch of other stuff.  I don't doubt that Sweden has the right to enact its Orwellian rape laws, however I get to criticize them here and comment on others' comments which seem to misstate U.S. rape law or agitate for similar standards in the U.S.

280 If both women were spending money on him the next day it wasn't "rape".  The accusations are a disgrace to actual rape victims.

Of course...  it couldn't happen to a less sympathetic P.O.S. and I hope he ends up in prison learning who is going to wear an Assange.

281 Second, the incident Ace describes sounds like a clearer instance of a woman saying "no" to a guy who started screwing her without asking -- that is, unambiguously telling him to stop, and him refusing to do so.  Does that sound merely unchivalrous to you?  Or are you really saying that a woman saying "yes" gives her bed partner a blanket all-access pass for as long as he stays in her room?

My objection was to the statement made up thread that you can't have sex with a woman who doesn't give her express, verbal consent.  Consent can be given in a number of ways, and by silence.  I do have a problem with the idea that a woman can withdraw consent while in the act of coetus and claim that a rape has occurred if the man does not pull out in the very instant.  I think that prior sexual partners, while naked in bed together, have a certain license to initiate conduct that between strangers and out of this context could be construed as assault.  And I think that "no" means "no" if and only if a woman's behavior conforms with her verbal statement.

282

280  Well I have heard of it -- and thought it was a pretty foolish thing for a woman to engage in (this speaking as a woman).  If you want "no" to mean "no"...don't go home with the guy, or take him home, or jump in the sack with him.  Men might get the idea that "no" really means "no for right now...but if you try and charm me I just might say yes" -- let's help them out by making it clear.  That also goes for if it was "yes" at 11 pm. but you really feel like "no" by 5 am the next day -- just go home or ask the fellow to leave -- otherwise they might get the mistaken notion that "yes" applied for the morning as well.  And if "yes" only applied for protected sex...then if he tries anything shady like this you punch him in the nuts and say "hey asshole, I didn't give you bareback priviledges...now get the frak out because I'm feeling kinda 'no' now".

Better yet, try your best not to sleep with slimy assholes, so you never wind up in that sort of quandary.

From what I'm gathering, she went ahead and did the deed...the time for being a bit more proactive should have been when she discovered him on top of her (and I still can't see how you wouldn't wake up before a guy got really far -- unless you're drugged or something).  Now, if she was drugged or intoxicated, that might be a different story -- but didn't this chick buy him breakfast or something?  I've never heard of rape victims taking their rapists out for coffee after the fact.

283 >>If you fall asleep next to me naked, you might as well be wearing a sign that says "Party in My Ass". Amiright!? Depends. Did the guy who fell asleep next to you naked let you fuck him in the ass with your strap on the night before? If yes, proceed until he says no. If no, don't until you ask permission. How is this even a question and what the fuck is so confusing? We all know the rules even if we don't always like them and they make are balls bluer than blue or your vagina dry. If you are sleeping next to a woman/guy you had sex with the night before you have a reasonable expectation you can do it again the next day ... until she/he says no. It doesn't matter if you are in Sweden or Uranus or his anus. These are the rules. There is no grey area. End of story.

284 JackStraw, comment number 300 is for you too.

285 Joanie- As it is highly unlikely that any woman could sleep through a man: 1. climbing on top of her 2. penetrating her without her waking up first unless she was drugged or dead I call bullshit on the story. No human sleeps that soundly and without being too graphic, just not possible. So the bigger question is does either a guy or a girl have a reasonable expectation that they can initiate intercourse when they had sex hours before without asking. I say yes. I guess you say no. I think we both agree that when either party says no it means stop and that's all that really matters in this case as the woman has stated she only cared about whether or not he was wearing a condom not whether or not he screwing her. Again. For the second time in a few hours. So whats the issue?

286 As it is highly unlikely that any woman could sleep through a man:

1. climbing on top of her

Get fucking real. How many people sleep lightly so at to guard against this scenario? The penetration is what she says woke her up.

287 pretending she somehow didn't awake when he pulled the blanket off of her, rolled her over on her back, spread her legs, mounted her, and penetrated her makes the whole "rape" scenario even sillier.

Posted by: CoolCzech at December 28, 2010 06:16 PM (tJjm/)

Maybe they were "snuggling" under the blankets all drunk from the night before with their limbs tangled together, and she realized that's not a finger.

288 A bitch who has already fucked a guy and is sleeping with him naked, would have no standing in the US to cry rape.

You would, if he might have passed on an STD to you after you asked for a condom the time you consented.

289 >>Get fucking real. How many people sleep lightly so at to guard against this scenario? The penetration is what she says woke her up. The defense rests. Asshat is going to walk on the rape charge.

290

Ummm.... is it rape if I'm asleep in bed and my wife/girlfriend/fuck partner gives me a blow job with out waking me up to ask permission first?

Because it sounds like some people seem like this is rape/forcible oral copulation/whatever.

I mean, I really, really liked it at the times it was happening.  To the point of a happy ending.

But now I realize I was a victim...

291 The Christmas day is coming, our asics shoes online store are wholesale the asics kayano at the discount. welcome to enjoy many kinds of fashion and newest Onitsuka Tiger Mexico.

292

"Maybe they were "snuggling" under the blankets all drunk from the night before with their limbs tangled together, and she realized that's not a finger."

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at December 28, 2010 11:05 PM (mHQ7T)

I'm sure the poor thing is traumatized for ever more!