September 20, 2010

Mike Pence. Oh Yeah, He's Running
— Dave in Texas

Speech delivered today at Hillsdale College.

I rise to pay a debt of honor and a debt to history. My subject today is the presidency, and my hope is that you see that institution in a new light and never despair of the republic.

Good speech. I did not know the story about Calvin Coolidge's son.

Also this:

A president who slights the Constitution is like a rider who hates his horse: he will be thrown, and the nation along with him.

History, context. Purpose.

With commanding hair.


tip via Yukari

Posted by: Dave in Texas at 07:45 PM | Comments (134)
Post contains 103 words, total size 1 kb.

1 Nice!

Posted by: whatmeworry? at September 20, 2010 07:48 PM (SyIZ+)

2 Don't envy the Hair so much that you can't fully appreciate the man

and he is The Man

Posted by: SantaRosaStan at September 20, 2010 07:49 PM (dPcmp)

3 fucking rhino- i aint voting for that establishment piece of shit.

Posted by: buzzby at September 20, 2010 07:50 PM (I5Yh1)

4 How tall is he?

Posted by: Serious Cat at September 20, 2010 07:51 PM (bAySe)

5 He needs a Tsar Putin-style photo spread. Sprinkle a few cheerleaders around, too.

Posted by: eman at September 20, 2010 07:51 PM (JhkcT)

6 Without proper adherence to the role contemplated in the Constitution for the presidency, the checks and balances in the constitutional plan become weakened. This has been most obvious in recent years when the three branches of government have been subject to the tutelage of a single party. Under either party, presidents have often forgotten that they are intended to restrain the Congress at times, and that the Congress is independent of their desires. And thus fused in unholy unity, the political class has raged forward in a drunken expansion of powers and prerogatives, mistakenly assuming that to exercise power is by default to do good.

Posted by: whatmeworry? at September 20, 2010 07:51 PM (SyIZ+)

7

Ace wants to know:

Has he been properly vetted?

Posted by: Log Cabin at September 20, 2010 07:52 PM (e+tWj)

8 He has been my choice for the last 2 years. I could ride that train all the way to the White House, if you know what I mean!

Posted by: pforeman at September 20, 2010 07:57 PM (S7Xpi)

9 Pence's hair. Bolton's stache. Palin's rack. We are so Golden in 2012. Is a three-way possible?

Posted by: eman at September 20, 2010 07:57 PM (JhkcT)

10 Pence/Palin?

Palin/Pence?

Pence/O'Donnell?

I think I could go for any combination ...

Posted by: Bomber at September 20, 2010 07:59 PM (d88g9)

11 Yukari Ryle for the win!  Love you Yuki

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:00 PM (HLGCA)

12 Do you think Niki Haley will be too green run the ticket as VP?  All her political exp. has been legislative, right?

Posted by: Serious Cat at September 20, 2010 08:01 PM (bAySe)

13 yeah, Pence must be getting important cause i heard two republican conservative talking heads say something about him being arrogant and demanding saying they are quoting his peers....and that mitch is not happy that he's not signing along....(that one's from my gram!)

Posted by: curious at September 20, 2010 08:02 PM (p302b)

14

I had to write a short paper on a current events issue, and relate it to Machiavelli's The Prince.  Props and apologies if I cribbed anyone's lines directly.

Appreciate any snark/edits/suggestions/snark

Wither the TEA Movement? and other questions.

Sen. Lisa Murkowski (R-AK) will run for re-election as a write-in candidate after losing her bid for renomination, according to sources briefed on Murkowski's decision.

Murkowski's decision will set up a 3-way battle between the incumbent, Miller and Sitka Mayor Scott McAdams (D), potentially turning the race on its head. Private 3-way polling has shown Miller leading, but by a narrow margin.

Murkowski had been mulling her options after losing to attorney Joe Miller (R) by 1.8% -- or about 2K votes out of 110K cast.

Certainly, a slap in the face to the voters of one of our various states, coming from the hand of an entrenched Washington politician on the Republican side of the aisle.  Senator, you can't be accused of "quitting" now-- you've been fired by the electorate!

This is the latest, but not the only, incumbent Republican to put his personal power over the wishes of his constituency. 

Charlie Crist, the formerly-popular governor of Florida, left the Republican party after it was clear he could not beat the GOP voter's choice, Marco Rubio, in the GOP primary.  He has since changed his position on any number of red-meat fiscal issues especially important to voters this cycle, supporting public unions and increased government transfer payments, to name two, presumably to garner Democrat votes.

Mike Castle, the 40-year incumbent liberal Republican was ousted by newcomer Christine O'Donnell in true-blue Delaware in the GOP primary.  Castle has not, one full week later, endorsed O'Donnell-- nut he has had long conversations with the President and the Vice President.  Many of the entrenched Washington elite Republicans have not, either.  Karl Rove and Charles Krauthammer have come out scathingly against O'Donnell, with personal attacks and a blunt dismissiveness that neither could muster against a Democrat.

Bob Bennett, Senator from Utah, was eliminated from consideration at his party's convention.  Bennett called the political atmosphere "toxic" and said it's, "Clear some of the votes I've cast have added to that toxic environment, looking back with one or two minor exceptions, I wouldn't cast any any differently, even if I knew it would cost me my career."

The three-term senator was targeted by Tea Party activists and other groups for supporting the first launch of the Troubled Assets Relief Program.

Even here in the People's Republic of Massachusetts, Former nude model Scott Brown beat sure-thing successor to Ted Kennedy's throne, Martha Coakley, by promising to derail the Democrats' agenda with regards to socialized medicine.

In any of these cases, Machiavelli's advice would be the same to the candidate:  Save yourself for another day.  For when your "usurpers" fail, there will be many in the population who will turn against them.   They will look back to you for new leadership.  Flailing about for power after being removed by the ultimate Sovereign, the People, puts a target on your back by making you look weak, and keeps you from the business of rebuilding your army (in cash and volunteers) for the eventual turn of tide.

Especially in the case of Murkowski, who is a legacy candidate who is a "big wheel" in Alaskan GOP politics, waiting until the next Senate election (in 2014) would have been the smarter move.  She could stay active in state politics, keep her volunteer network intact, raise money, and return rejuvinated for another bite of the apple.  As it is, she's thrown away her Republican bona fides, GOP money, and her big claim to relevance:  the ability to milk the legislative process from well within the GOP inner circle for more pork for Alaska!

It has become clear that the TEA movement is not a movement of Republicans, but rather a movement against entrenched, comfortable, powerful politicians of both parties.  The Republicans are feeling the bite of the TEA movement in the primaries, and the Democrats will likely feel it in November.  If the movement was against only Democrats, then the TEA movement may have waited in some part until general elections.  No.  This is an insurgency.  It has been conducted upon the soap box, and to a limited degree, at the ballot box.  And it has been created through the actions of the President, and the inaction of the minority party against him.

Machiavelli clearly instructs those who are princes to destroy all adversaries completely, down to the destruction of their blood relatives.  He instructs the Prince to consider himself the ultimate authority in all things, and never waver in his decisions.  While this is a good instruction for a principate, it is useless in a republic, where the people hold Sovereign power.

The mistake that entrenched Republicans and most Democrats are now making is to believe they are the root of power, as well as inhabiting it's seat.  I often hear, especially from Democrats, that this or that legislation needs to be "explained," or that the people need "reeducation" on this or that topic.

The People have Sovereign power.  Our word is final in these matters-- ones that can be remedied at the ballot box, anyway.  In this sense, those politicians who are frightened by the TEA movement have forgotten who holds the ultimate power over our Legislative and Executive branches.

Had these politicians remembered that this is not a principate, but a republic, perhaps they could have listened closer when they still had a chance to save their necks!

But the hour of decision in this most mild of revolutions is at hand, and there is nothing within the structure of our republic which can save legislators who have repeatedly and gleefully gone against the will of the people.

Murkowski's bid comes despite both public and private pressure from top Senate Republicans to accept Miller's victory.

"The Republican leadership, the NRSC and the RNC support the Republican candidate period," said a senior Republican aide. "She knows that."

Bitch McConnell, Senate Minority Leader, on Murkowski: "I have accepted her letter of resignation from Senate leadership."

Not good enough, McConnell!  Allowing a new enemy to make her own rules on your turf shows effeminate weakness.  Machiavelli would have instructed Mitch not to accept her resignations, but rather to remove her affirmatively from all positions of authority within the Grand Old Club.  Furthermore, it would have been wise to move her to a bare basement room-- perhaps a broom closet in the farthest reaches of a satellite Senate building-- in order to strip her of any remaining trappings of dignity.  To do less than this allows her to continue to fight you with more resources than are absolutely necessary to grant.  Since actually killing her and her family off is not possible, exile and shunning are the next-best thing.

 

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:02 PM (HLGCA)

15 Pence/Beck

Posted by: curious at September 20, 2010 08:03 PM (p302b)

16

Ace/Bacon

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:03 PM (HLGCA)

17 Pence is easily my #1 choice if he throws his hat int he ring. Pence/Thune would be astounding.

Posted by: hueydiamondpooty at September 20, 2010 08:04 PM (aQ8uK)

18 slights the Constitution and the Declaration.

Posted by: Have Blue at September 20, 2010 08:06 PM (mV+es)

19 RCP have Blanche Lincoln down by 25.

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:06 PM (HLGCA)

20 Nothing on Blanche's campaign page about being a Democrat.  Hmm...

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:07 PM (HLGCA)

21 "and the nation along with him"? What's with the doomsday shite?

Posted by: arhooley at September 20, 2010 08:11 PM (Ue2Ct)

22 Truman I knew  Machiavelli and Mich Mconnell is no  Machiavelli .

Posted by: LOYD BENSON at September 20, 2010 08:11 PM (eHP4n)

23 Pence/Barbour - gotta have a front man and an inside man (or woman); if it looks like Hilary is going to run, then you need to think about Palin or Brewer. I believe he gave that speech without a telepromter and took questions.

Posted by: Jean at September 20, 2010 08:11 PM (CPefM)

24 Jesus, copying and pasting from an email I sent myself (don't ask) makes allt he fonts change size.  At least it's all Times New Roman.  Ecch.

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:13 PM (HLGCA)

25 Truman, hat-tip here -- whenever you have to write a paper on Machiavelli, include a reference to one of his works beyond the Prince. Instant grade inflation.

Posted by: Jean at September 20, 2010 08:14 PM (CPefM)

26 Wow, even KKKarl Levin is now saying he'd vote to extend tax cuts for the wealthy.  Isn't his seat as safe as Ted Kennedy's?

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:14 PM (HLGCA)

27 Great speech and yep he's running....for vice president. I think it's a good fit for him. Even a loss will give him national stature.

Posted by: Rocks at September 20, 2010 08:14 PM (ivAmM)

28 Do you think Niki Haley will be too green run the ticket as VP?  All her political exp. has been legislative, right?

Posted by: Serious Cat at September 21, 2010 12:01 AM

-----------

Come now, save a few conservatives for the governorships and legislatures.

Posted by: arhooley at September 20, 2010 08:15 PM (Ue2Ct)

29 Thanks Jean, that's great advice.   But this one is only supposed to reference the Prince.  It's a 200-level class.

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:15 PM (HLGCA)

30 Trust me Truman, the Profs and grad students love the Discourses. They think The Prince is a Cliff Notes, USA Today level book. Just one pull and your golden.

Posted by: Jean at September 20, 2010 08:18 PM (CPefM)

31

You know, I just read over O'Donnell's short position statements. 

She sure sounds like a normal person to me.

http://tinyurl.com/2ebnjnq

 

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:19 PM (HLGCA)

32 What area of the country is Pence from?

I always feel you need a governor on the team if you have a congressman or a senator.

Guess mcshame agreed with that theory.

Posted by: curious at September 20, 2010 08:19 PM (p302b)

33

If you were suppose to do only the Prince

maybe you should have shown the diff between Idealism and Realism more and compare it to Conservative vs Moderate

Posted by: LOYD BENSON at September 20, 2010 08:20 PM (eHP4n)

34

Thank you again.  BUT... next time, can you add some snark?  I start falling asleep when people aren't insulting me or comparing Ace to an ewok

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:21 PM (HLGCA)

35 Pence is from Indiana.

Posted by: Rocks at September 20, 2010 08:21 PM (ivAmM)

36 I saw Mike Pence coming out of Blockbuster with an armful of Harry Potter videos.

Posted by: Bill Maher at September 20, 2010 08:23 PM (Gj9v8)

37 Wow. Just wow. Starting immediately, that speech should be taught in every class related to civics, history, economics, and politics from K- PhD.

Sigh... Alas, we instead have "Dreams of my Father" (a book that strangely has nothing to do with the author's father and everything to do with himself, with the notable exception of actually having written it himself) as required reading in many universities.

I suppose we can count on the next generation of college grads to fully appreciate the value of affirmative action, doing coke, and vacationing in 'Pockeestan'. That's so much more beneficial than anything in Pence's speech, right?

Posted by: Damiano at September 20, 2010 08:24 PM (PA722)

38 Oh, yeah, well I heard he taped every episode of Charmed — in VHS!

Posted by: Bill O'Reilly at September 20, 2010 08:24 PM (Gj9v8)

39 Tonight we're going to party like it's 1499.

Posted by: The Prince at September 20, 2010 08:26 PM (lBmZl)

40

This just in:  Mexico killed in drug violence.  Border fence "seems superfluous now," says senior White House aide.

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:26 PM (HLGCA)

41

ok no problem

Ewoks were Idealism Lucas wanted something cute to sell more tickets

Princess laya's brass bra in the desert scene was a good example of Realism

because her tits sold more DVDS

Posted by: LOYD BENSON at September 20, 2010 08:26 PM (eHP4n)

42 Scorpio You'll achieve your life's goal of becoming sex on wheels only to realize what a poor locomotive choice wheels are for someone who wants to have a lot of sex.

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:26 PM (HLGCA)

43 Lisa Murkowski: Let's make history

Worse campaign slogan ever.  The voters already made history Lisa. They made YOU history.

Posted by: Rocks at September 20, 2010 08:27 PM (ivAmM)

44 Report: More Colleges Offering Dick-Around Abroad Programs

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:27 PM (HLGCA)

45 Shit, this isn't the ONT

Posted by: Truman North at September 20, 2010 08:28 PM (HLGCA)

46 I suppose we can count on the next generation of college grads to fully appreciate the value of affirmative action, doing coke, and vacationing in 'Pockeestan'.

That is not so bad.  At least I won't feel so sorry when I let them go.

Posted by: John Matrix at September 20, 2010 08:29 PM (lBmZl)

47 "Band of ThugsÂ… Obama Administration Exposes Conservative GroupÂ’s Tax Information"

This kind of stuff is just creepy....not sure what this business is or who these guys are but I always thought my tax information was a private affair.

Posted by: curious at September 20, 2010 08:31 PM (p302b)

48 51 "Band of ThugsÂ… Obama Administration Exposes Conservative GroupÂ’s Tax Information"

Heck, it worked on Joe the Plumber. Oh, wait... that never happened either.

Posted by: Damiano at September 20, 2010 08:34 PM (PA722)

49 ChOD as VP is pretty god damn silly. That said, Pence is quite awesome. He needs to grow a Joe Miller beard. Although he may need to use Just for Men.

Posted by: yambles at September 20, 2010 08:43 PM (rxaXW)

50 Pence/Palin?

Palin/Pence?

Pence/O'Donnell?

I think I could go for any combination ...

Posted by: Bomber at September 20, 2010 11:59 PM (d88g9)


What about Palin/O'Donnell?

I'd vote for that.  I'd vote for that ticket three times a day.

Posted by: Robert at September 20, 2010 08:44 PM (4ixH5)

51 He mentions Reagan, Lincoln, Washington, Truman and Coolidge directly.

By implication he mentions Franklin (A republic -- if you can keep it).

Sinse the Guy Who Says En Fuego! is not around:  En Fuego!

Pence, Palin, Christie and De Mint are making the most successful noise.  You also have Romney, Jindal and Barbour, though Jindal made good noise during the oil spill.  Did I miss anyone?

Can we keep from eating each other alive between now and the end of the primaries in 2012?

Posted by: Mojo Nixon at September 20, 2010 08:47 PM (+L32i)

52 Out, out, damn sockpuppet!

Posted by: John P. Squibob at September 20, 2010 08:48 PM (+L32i)

53 That hair aint no Shatner Turbo 2000 either.  Its the real deal.

Posted by: MAJHAM at September 20, 2010 08:49 PM (GqGQo)

54

Pence/Beck

O'Delay!

 

Posted by: garrett at September 20, 2010 08:50 PM (xOV24)

55 2006 amnesty plan.  No go.

Don't forget this shit.

Posted by: someone at September 20, 2010 08:50 PM (DfAwB)

56

CHESTER MARCOL!!!!!

 

Talk amongst yourselves.

 

Posted by: gus at September 20, 2010 08:51 PM (C02p4)

57

I would have loved to have heard that speech live.    Maybe, the best description of the presidency, and what it should be, that I've heard in a very long time.

May be one of the best ass kickings that the O has received, lately, without even using his name.

 

Posted by: Steph at September 20, 2010 09:01 PM (nbzzk)

58 Appreciate any snark/edits/suggestions/snark
Posted by: Truman North

It's brave of you to ask for responses here so allow me to offer my recession devalued $0.02.

Is is a Journalism project? Your style seems a bit closer to that of a newspaper column than an reification of the elements of The Prince. For college papers that weren't related to journalism I tried to avoid the editorial style and just stick to the facts.

The grammar and phrasing need a little work.

"Bitch McConnell" Um, really?

I'd recommend three point plan of revision:
1. Watch the passive voice. It's easy to fall into this trap, but you should try to reduce the number of passive sentences.

2. Parentheticals. I'd recommend revising to eliminate these entirely. The caveat is that it depends on how your prof grades. Some like seeing unnecessarily verbose text simply for the sake of complexity. However, clear, concise text wins the day outside the Ivory Towers.

E.g.; Castle has not, one full week later, endorsed O'Donnell-- nut he has had long conversations with the President and the Vice President.

How about:
While Castle has found time to discuss his defeat with President Obama and Vice President Biden, he has refused to endorse O'Donnell.

Short, simple, direct. Your mileage may vary.

(Pet peeve: 'either' at the end of a sentence. Yearrg!) 

3. If the assignment is supposed to focus on a discussion of The Prince rather than current events, I'd think about eliminating some of the current news and include more material from the novel.

Good luck.

Posted by: Garbonzo the Garrulous at September 20, 2010 09:03 PM (23kaI)

59 Truman North,

P.S.

If you're spending more time on The Prince, I'd recommend finding Michael Ledeen's book, Machiavelli on Modern Leadership.

Posted by: Garbonzo the Garrulous at September 20, 2010 09:13 PM (23kaI)

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Posted by: cq at September 20, 2010 09:18 PM (Fa5Xd)

61 @62: very, very funny.  I've written a few of those myself.

Posted by: HT at September 20, 2010 09:31 PM (d6iMX)

62

31 Great speech and yep he's running....for vice president.

Yes, probably for a Palenty or Romney who would annoy the base. But remember that I think a guy in 2008 was running for VP and managed to take the prize.

Posted by: AmishDude at September 20, 2010 09:35 PM (3wPsb)

63 Mike Pence has voted with a majority of his Republican colleagues 94.9% of the time during the current Congress. This percentage does not include votes in which Pence did not vote.


A Republican presidential candidate that actually votes with the Republican party might make a refreshing change.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at September 20, 2010 09:48 PM (OIw0R)

64 59 2006 amnesty plan.  No go.
Don't forget this shit.
Posted by: someone at September 21, 2010 12:50 AM (DfAwB)

Let's nominate Christine O'Donnell. 

Posted by: The War Between the Undead States at September 20, 2010 10:14 PM (F5Gxy)

65

Auntie Zetumi gives and interview, her arrogance is astounding, just like nephews. She says, "The system took advantage of me."

http://tinyurl.com/2djo9k7

Posted by: madamex at September 20, 2010 10:41 PM (dXGcy)

66 326-1641,326-1643,326-1644

Posted by: cummins filter at September 20, 2010 10:46 PM (8xxdk)

67 Interesting. Haven't given him a lot of thought but we need some additional choices and fresh blood. I still think it's gonna be hard for him to give up the post of majority conference chairman or deputy majority whip but we'll see.

Posted by: Chris in Va at September 20, 2010 11:29 PM (oj52M)

68 I hope that Ace covers the new Lisa "Morekawski " YouTube ad on how to write in her name. It's splendiferous! ;-)

I tried to post a comment on it and the comments are being moderated just like the liberals always do. So obviously, Ms. Lisa is only interested in hearing  from those few people who work for her and can post glowing recommendations for her ad and candidacy.

But, of course, everyone knows that the REAL quality candidate in this race  is JOE MILLER. You know, the guy who is a bronze-star-Westpoint graduate and a Yale-Law-School-educated attorney who became a federal magistrate judge. JOE MILLER is QUALITY personified!

And Ms. "Mookawski's" claim to fame? Her dad appointed her to the seat.

I guess some people have no shame at all. How sad for her.

Posted by: Jon at September 20, 2010 11:36 PM (Df2WR)

69 Mike Pence; don't know a whole lot about him but his ACU rating for both 2009 and 2008 was 100 and he has a lifetime of 99.5. You just can not get much better than that.

He has one big problem though; tradition and "conventional wisdom". I don't think a House member has ever been elected President. But as I have been saying for 2010, conventional wisdom is out the window. It remains to be seen what the status will be in 2012.

He is a fresh face and definitely not just another RINO squish who's turn it is.

Posted by: Vic at September 21, 2010 12:38 AM (/jbAw)

70 Checking the "on the issues" web site he is damn near perfect.

He would make the base very happy I think as a candidate. Maybe we could do a "reverse" of what the Party leadership normally does. Have a Pence/Romney ticket in 2012 with the conservative being the lead and the liberal squish being VP to round out the ticket.
 

Posted by: Vic at September 21, 2010 12:46 AM (/jbAw)

71 Vic, he talks the right way these days, and for the most part he's been solid.  But let's time warp back to 2006, and a gigantic blunder of both political calculation and (lack of) principle...  Well, let's hear how Ace put it:

he Pence "touchback" plan [was] often floated during the immigration fight, which immediately grants amnesty so long as an illegal immigrant just returns to his home country for a few days and then comes back to sign up as a new US citizen. All through the immigration debate the Amnestias would push this idea as somehow making their amnesty plan a non-amnesty.

Obviously it's still amnesty. It's just amnesty with a minor bureaucratic headache thrown in which accomplishes nothing except for annoying the newly amnestied US citizen.

The demand for a home-country "touchback" would be soon repealed anyway, with the Amnestias arguing it's an empty gesture that accomplishes nothing at all. And on that score, of course, they're right.

So why bother with the fiction in the first place?

Kaus also nailed it on the head at the time.

Posted by: someone at September 21, 2010 01:17 AM (DfAwB)

72 Ah crap, everything between "Ace put it" and the mention of Kaus should be in italics, since it's quoted from the AoS Classic (tm) post.

Posted by: someone at September 21, 2010 01:18 AM (DfAwB)

73 On to the news

http://tinyurl.com/3967gc9

Wow, today is the 21st anniversary of Hurricane Hugo hitting SC. It doesn't seem like it has been that long ago. I lost shingles from my roof and the fence around my pool. The actual eye of the storm passed about 20 miles from my house.

And you know what? I didn't get a dime from the feds.

Posted by: Vic at September 21, 2010 01:18 AM (/jbAw)

74 Obviously it's still amnesty. It's just amnesty with a minor bureaucratic headache thrown in which accomplishes nothing except for annoying the newly amnestied US citizen.

If I remember that "plan" he had some stuff in it to make it a "poison pill" for the two assholes who were pushing amnesty again. My take on it was that it was something to throw out there to make it look like a "compromise" but was actually there to kill any possible agreement between the sides.

The ones who were really pushing that round of amnesty were McCain and Kennedy.

Posted by: Vic at September 21, 2010 01:22 AM (/jbAw)

75 If you look at the "on the issues" web site he is listed as being firmly in the "anti-immigration" camp.

Posted by: Vic at September 21, 2010 01:22 AM (/jbAw)

76 "If I remember that "plan" he had some stuff in it to make it a "poison pill" for the two assholes who were pushing amnesty again. My take on it was that it was something to throw out there to make it look like a "compromise" but was actually there to kill any possible agreement between the sides."

No, read the Kaus (and check out the contemporaneous interviews).  It was absolutely an earnest and extremely poorly-calculated attempt to burnish his national "statesman" credentials by crafting a workable amnesty plan that conservatives could fall back on to claim victory over full amnesty.  Don't gloss over this:  instances where politicians come out of the woodwork to really stick their necks out are rare, and revealing.

It tells us two things:  (1) he thought the passage of amnesty was inevitable, and (2) he believed conservatives could be convinced that his compromise was an acceptable outcome.  Remember:  the beatdown of amnesty attempts of 2006 and 2007 were the first explosions of the populist anti-DC wave that's about to wipe out the Dems.  Pence didn't see it, didn't understand it, and his instinct in a crisis was to pull a DC "statesman" stunt rather than stand on conservative (and EXTREMELY POPULAR) principle.  He gets it better now, I'm sure, but I wouldn't trust him as a leader after that until he's shown better reactions in an executive job (preferably governor).

Posted by: someone at September 21, 2010 01:38 AM (DfAwB)

77 I guess I forgot to note that both (1) and (2) turned out to be very, very wrong.  The right -- and only acceptable -- choice was to fight until the end.  It's doubly sad for Pence since he was pretty early in picking up on blogs (he's had one for a while):  just a single look at AoS during those days would have made the intense (almost Obamacare-level) sentiment about this on the right incredibly obvious.

Posted by: someone at September 21, 2010 01:44 AM (DfAwB)

78 I am trying to find the stuff on it from that time frame. I do remember there being some stuff at the time, including a call for him to try to broker a compromise from President Bush who was also on the damn amnesty bandwagon.

Posted by: Vic at September 21, 2010 01:51 AM (/jbAw)

79 I don't believe it, F&F taking Bambi to taking over his speech comments.

Posted by: Vic at September 21, 2010 02:06 AM (/jbAw)

80 Looking at a couple of columns from 2006 after he had offered the plan it looks like some of what you say is true but there is more to it than that.

At the time, all of the DC power brokers, including nominal conservatives of the time were lining up behind another round of amnesty. Bush was for it as well as a lot of the big name Republicans such as McCain. The Senate had another bill very similar to Amnesty I which would go the same route. Blanket amnesty for 12M illegals and unenforceable border safeguards. 

The House was opposed to this plan and they had reached a block where neither side was going to budge. Bush called for a compromise and Pence provided it. All the Republican big-wigs supported it. Some of the squishes like Kemp thought it was too tough. Some of the hardliners like Bucannon thought it was a sellout. According to Bucannon the "fix" was in and amnesty was going to sail through as you said and Pence wanted something out of it.

What was considered to "hard line" was the requirement that the President and the head of homeland security certify that the border was secure and under control before any plans were adopted. Also, there were more controls than just go away for a week and come back for amnesty.

In any case this was about the time that the people rose up and Bush's poll numbers started dropping like a rock. The people blocked Amnesty II but if you look at what has happened they have tried to back door it every year since then.

Net result, the Republicans thanks to their stone ears lost control of congress in that next upcoming election.

Posted by: Vic at September 21, 2010 02:46 AM (/jbAw)

81

the guy is one heck of a communicator. check his speeches on the house floor from the healthcare debate, about israel, about fiscal policy.... he understands what is going on, and how to deal with it. with plenty of passion to spare.

if i had the monopoly money to do it, i'd give him the individual max.

"pence makes sense"

Posted by: knob at September 21, 2010 02:46 AM (5aQhL)

82 Nah... Mike Pence is running for Governor of Indiana.

Posted by: Timbo at September 21, 2010 03:04 AM (ph9vn)

83
woo hoo!

“I didnÂ’t take advantage of the system,  the system took advantage of me.Â’Â’

Posted by: the unknown comic at September 21, 2010 03:07 AM (zgaoG)

84
“You can take that house. I can be on the streets with homeless people. I didn’t ask for it. They gave it to me. Ask your system. I didn’t create it or vote for it. Go and ask your system.’’


Posted by: the unknown comic at September 21, 2010 03:08 AM (Fe3ZO)

85
Thank you Illegal Aunt Zetuni!

Thank you for giving an interview 42 days before the election.

This is huge. Remember September 20, 2010. It was Obama's worst day as our theoretical president.

Posted by: the unknown comic at September 21, 2010 03:13 AM (Wzli+)

86
"If I come as immigrant, you have the obligation to make me a citizen."

Posted by: the unknown comic at September 21, 2010 03:15 AM (Wzli+)

87
The vid is not up at yootoob, yet.

You can watch it here.

You know who's giving all this to Aunt Zetuni? The Lord.

Posted by: the unknown comic at September 21, 2010 03:17 AM (gt3o0)

88
oh, and like Jimmy Carter, Aunt Zetuni refers to Obama as just Obama.

Isn't that weird? I think that's weird.

Posted by: the unknown comic at September 21, 2010 03:19 AM (gt3o0)

89
one more thing: Glenn Beck made an excellent montage of the commies in the Obama admin.

Posted by: the unknown comic at September 21, 2010 03:20 AM (gt3o0)

Posted by: cummins filter at September 21, 2010 03:22 AM (8xxdk)

91 actually, a good article and warning not to be complaisant HERE

Posted by: ms. docweasel at September 21, 2010 03:27 AM (QLE5H)

92 99 actually, a good article and warning not to be complaisant HERE

well I think the article underestimates potential GOP pickups, but it's essentially right - we have to work for it, polls don't vote, we vote

actually at this point, the D's know they are boned - so look for them to start launching their dirty tricks right around election day

Posted by: chemjeff at September 21, 2010 03:31 AM (E97ku)

93

If not for what happened to Coolidge's son, we might have seen a second Coolidge term instead of Hoover's big-gov't prescriptions, and the Great Depression, the collapse of the Weimar Republic, WW II and the Cold War might all have been avoided or greatly minimized.  We might be enjoying a GDP per capita of around $70-100K instead of $40K.

And all because of a blister.

Posted by: TallDave at September 21, 2010 03:41 AM (lNW+B)

94

Auntie Zetumi gives and interview, her arrogance is astounding, just like nephews. She says, "The system took advantage of me."

http://tinyurl.com/2djo9k7

Posted by: madamex at September 21, 2010 02:41 AM (dXGcy)


Holy crap..... What an arrogant nut.  We owe her?

Why isnt Obama helping her? 

Posted by: Timbo at September 21, 2010 03:41 AM (ph9vn)

95 Auntie Zetumi gives and interview, her arrogance is astounding, just like nephews. She says, "The system took advantage of me."

it is strange how much liberals believe in "the system" - they blame "the system" for keeping the little guy down

Posted by: chemjeff at September 21, 2010 03:45 AM (E97ku)

96 They love the system when it gives them something and complain about it when it doesn't.  Their circumstance of the moment determines which of the two excuses is most convenient.

Posted by: Annabelle at September 21, 2010 03:50 AM (pWgNR)

97 It says that the president should never forget this; that he has not risen above us, but is merely one of us, chosen by ballot, dismissed after his term, tasked not to transform and work his will upon us, but to bear the weight of decision and to carry out faithfully the design laid down in the Constitution and impassioned by the Declaration of Independence.


B to the O, you've been tagged and I think you're bleeding. 

Posted by: The Hammer at September 21, 2010 03:53 AM (32ubA)

98 I don't know much about Pence other than what I've read about him on AoS.

At this point, getting amnesty wrong is a deal-killer for me.  But I'd have to hear more about it from him and get a sense of where he's at and why.

Nationally, it may not be as big a liability if he's found the right stance now...remember, The Big Donut is for soft amnesty, which is a misnomer.  Amnesty is amnesty.  But my point being, if Pence would discuss a strong, very strong, IRON-CLAD borders first policy, he could probably overcome this "mistake".

In fact, I think a large portion of the enforcement crowd could be led to a reasonable compromise, IF enforcement, security, penalties and mechanisms to prevent future amnesty were real and in place and working.  That type of approach could allow him to take a leadership position and turn this into a strength. 

Posted by: The Hammer at September 21, 2010 04:03 AM (32ubA)

99 Why isnt Obama helping her?

The million dollar question.  For a man who goes on about charity he doesn't seem too willing to give it to destitute members of his own family.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at September 21, 2010 04:03 AM (FkKjr)

100 Pence is not running for President.

He's running to take Mitch Daniels's spot for Governor, when Mitch Daniels decides to run for President.


Posted by: Pipe Barackage at September 21, 2010 04:09 AM (Gwfoy)

101 honor is what allows us to do what is right despite the cost. Even greater honor is required to do what is right in the face of superior power. And the greatest honor is to stand strong even if it means standing alone.

Great opener, Pence. Great challenge for that audience in particular, receptive to commitment.

Posted by: maverick muse at September 21, 2010 04:14 AM (H+LJc)

102 The Roman Empire was built on loyalty to a city, not to an idea other than obligation to the city. Whereas, America was created from IDEA, for love of ideas, founded upon The Great Cause as Washington always wrote.

you have fought for love of ideas that did not come in dreams, or as Reagan said, did not "spring full bloom" from your brow, but "came from the heart of a great nation," rose in a time of unprecedented stress and genius,

Excellent point.

Posted by: maverick muse at September 21, 2010 04:18 AM (H+LJc)

103 Whatever Pence runs for, he certainly can elucidate while motivating.

Posted by: maverick muse at September 21, 2010 04:20 AM (H+LJc)

104 107Why isnt Obama helping her?

The million dollar question.  For a man who goes on about charity he doesn't seem too willing to give it to destitute members of his own family.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at September 21, 2010 08:03 AM (FkKjr)

 I think he likes them just fine under the bus because it would remind people of his questionable birth. How many people know that he has about 10 step-brothers and sisters via his dissolute father?

Posted by: PoconoJoe at September 21, 2010 04:26 AM (KOIXa)

105

I like Pence and yeah, this is a good speech.  #2 on my depth chart for 12 and has to be on a ticket sometime down the road, I would think.

108--He's running to take Mitch Daniels's spot for Governor, when Mitch Daniels decides to run for President.

That strikes me as bass-ackwards.  What I've seen, Daniels isn't in Pence's league.  Not on the depth chart.

Posted by: louis tully at September 21, 2010 04:27 AM (K/USr)

106 Pence did dabble in which craft

Bet he makes a mean footlong on game night. Lotsa corned beef and pastrami.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at September 21, 2010 04:28 AM (mHQ7T)

107 Why isnt Obama helping her? The million dollar question. For a man who goes on about charity he doesn't seem too willing to give it to destitute members of his own family. Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at September 21, 2010 08:03 AM (FkKjr) I think it says all you need to know about his character!

Posted by: nevergiveup at September 21, 2010 04:30 AM (0GFWk)

108 How many people know that he has about 10 step-brothers and sisters via his dissolute father?

Posted by: PoconoJoe at September 21, 2010 08:26 AM (KOIXa)

Obama looks nothing like his father, though I have heard (I think) there is a half brother who looks like him.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at September 21, 2010 04:31 AM (mHQ7T)

109 He'll be a great candidate. He can appeal to the establishment, social cons and the tea party.

Posted by: Let Me Eat My Waffle at September 21, 2010 04:32 AM (kBLec)

110 107 Why isnt Obama helping her?

The million dollar question.  For a man who goes on about charity he doesn't seem too willing to give it to destitute members of his own family.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at September 21, 2010 08:03 AM (FkKjr)

Yes, but him helping her voluntarily would be charity, not "Fundamental Change".  "Fundamental Change" (as most of the electorate is slowly discovering) is when the power of the state is used to coerce YOU and ME into taking care of her!

And, of course, we know that this president is all about "Fundamental Change"*

* I wonder if, instead of "Fundamental Change", his election slogan had been the more truthful "Reparations for Slavery" would he have still won?

Posted by: Nighhawk at September 21, 2010 04:33 AM (OtQXp)

111 77--he Pence "touchback" plan [was] often floated during the immigration fight, which immediately grants amnesty so long as an illegal immigrant just returns to his home country for a few days and then comes back to sign up as a new US citizen. All through the immigration debate the Amnestias would push this idea as somehow making their amnesty plan a non-amnesty.

Obviously it's still amnesty. It's just amnesty with a minor bureaucratic headache thrown in which accomplishes nothing except for annoying the newly amnestied US citizen.

Ooh, thanks for the reminder.  I knew that then and had forgotten. I think I'd need a definitive statement from him forswearing all forms of Amnesty, including his touchback plan.

 Maybe I need more reminders onMr. Pence:  how did he vote on TARP?  bailouts?  I know he was a No on Porkulous and Maobamacare.

Posted by: louis tully at September 21, 2010 04:35 AM (K/USr)

112 Dave: - I did not know the story about Calvin Coolidge's son.

This is mentioned in Shlaes' The Forgotten Man, actually, though it may be easy to miss.

If you haven't read it, I strongly recommend it. She maps out the precursors, proximate cause and narcissistic ignorance leading to the Great Depression with remarkable clarity - including characters (and their backgrounds) which have been completely forgotten today, thanks to academia's whitewash of history.

The parallels with current events are more than just a little frightening.

Posted by: goy at September 21, 2010 04:37 AM (AfU1B)

113

Obama looks nothing like his father, though I have heard (I think) there is a half brother who looks like him.

I think his first name is Steve.

Posted by: PoconoJoe at September 21, 2010 04:39 AM (KOIXa)

114

With commanding hair.

It's alright.

Posted by: Rick Perry's Hair at September 21, 2010 04:40 AM (4rodh)

115 But, other than in a crisis of the house divided, the presidency is neither fit nor intended to be such an instrument.

That house divided crisis is exactly what Obama purposely created in order to usurp unjust authorities while in office. I question the premise, anyway, that the potus had the absolutist constitutional right to cause a civil war via military engagement against citizenry, to leave no means of life support in conquest.

Obama's declaration stipulated that he intends to build himself his own private army, every bit as well trained and funded as our nation's Military.

Posted by: maverick muse at September 21, 2010 04:43 AM (H+LJc)

116

Hey y'all, McRassHitler has Joe Miller up by double-digits over both Murcowsky and McAdams in Alaska.

Maybe Ace will post it up when he's done in his bunk.

Posted by: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus at September 21, 2010 04:48 AM (+tRwn)

117 Yes, but him helping her voluntarily would be charity, not "Fundamental Change".  "Fundamental Change" (as most of the electorate is slowly discovering) is when the power of the state is used to coerce YOU and ME into taking care of her!

Obama required others to pay his own way all along. Ex: purchase of his Chicago home, not to mention his living expenses and tuition in school. So long as he's able to hold the purse strings of others' earnings, there's that Fundamental Change thing happening. But doing it via government provides a bottomless pit to graft tax payers right into national bankruptcy.

Col. Adam West "American Producing Class" vs. Obama's ancient feudal order

Posted by: maverick muse at September 21, 2010 04:50 AM (H+LJc)

118 While the powers of the office have enlarged, along with those of the legislature and the judiciary, the framework of the government was intended to restrict abuses common to classical empires and to the regal states of the 18th century.

Rather than ultimately accepting as status quo the grotesque mutations that occurred through opportunism to illegitimately grasp more power than initially authorized, officials authorizing their own corruption as they go, the Tea Party movement would eventually cut back those enlargements of power that the three branches have usurped from states and the people. How else would the constitutional balance of powers be regained? The ideal is to encourage our nation's citizenry a Constitutional Renaissance to empower local governance.

As things stand, Obamarx Inc. is not at all satisfied with such 18th Century Enlightenment. Rather, this federal Marxism would return the world to the early Medieval feudal order.



Posted by: maverick muse at September 21, 2010 05:04 AM (H+LJc)

119 Vic, Hugo was fun - hellavu a hurricane party - the next six months of clean up sucked.

Posted by: Jean at September 21, 2010 05:08 AM (C7OIp)

120 Slightly o/t, watching Fox this morning, Gretchen was interviewing one of the young jobless Obamabots from yesterday's "town hall" who asked The One if the American Dream was over for him.

Sigh.  The idiot admits Barry didn't really answer his question, but he thinks he's done "great" things by bringing the combat troops home from Iraq.  Le sigh, again.  And he said he'd vote for King Barry again. 

I yelled at my TV, "You don't deserve a job, you idiot!!"  No one will hire your Princeton educated ass because first, you feel entitled, secondly, you're a whiner, and thirdly, you're dumber than a sack of hammers.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at September 21, 2010 05:11 AM (UOM48)

121 If he has learned his lesson on amnesty and gives up on is infatuation with banning internet gambling I could hold my nose and vote for him. 

Posted by: John Galt at September 21, 2010 05:25 AM (F/4zf)

122 128 ... you're dumber than a sack of hammers.
Posted by: Jane D'oh at September 21, 2010 09:11 AM (UOM4

Hey! Where do you live? You got some 'splaining to do!

Posted by: A Sack of Hammers at September 21, 2010 05:26 AM (yRrAd)

123 Pence/McCotter 2012.

That is all.

Posted by: citizen khan at September 21, 2010 05:31 AM (nwdIs)

Posted by: caterpillar filter at September 21, 2010 05:36 AM (8xxdk)

Posted by: caterpillar filter at September 21, 2010 05:37 AM (8xxdk)

126

That's not a good speech, that's a great speech. Our politicians should swear a blood oath to follow the principals that made our country great.

It's a slap at Obowma without the name calling and profanity that routinely passes for "intellectual" discourse from our betters at the White House.

Posted by: MWTexas at September 21, 2010 06:05 AM (N05oL)

127

Mike Pence?  Right, the guy who didn't have the balls to take on Evan Bayh.

 

Posted by: Tres at September 21, 2010 07:19 AM (xh3gA)

128

Mike Pence?  Right, the guy who didn't have the balls to take on Evan Bayh.

 

Posted by: Tres at September 21, 2010 11:19 AM (xh3gA)


There were polls out when before Bayh announced he was not running that had Pence up by 20 points.

He knew he would win..but,  he is running for Governor in 2012.

Posted by: Timbo at September 21, 2010 07:42 AM (ph9vn)

129

Nice touch dredging up old Cal - Reagan's favorite President - yea, I agree he is running, but he might really be running for Veep. I was trying to remember the last time someone came directly from Congress and was elected President, Ford was from Congress but he was appointed and went on to lose his election. Nixon and Bush #1 were both Congressman at one time but were both Veeps. We do better running GOP Governors and ex-Governors. And we have a lot of good choices right now.

 

Posted by: D. at September 21, 2010 09:50 AM (plSrP)

130 I think there will be 2 hoosiers running this time, Pence and Daniels.

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