1 Christ, we don't NEED this shit this close to November. I have a feeling that if Murkowski pulls this out we will hear incessant screams (some perhaps warranted) that she stole it by Miller. If Miller wins, we will hear many similar ones from Murkowski. Pathetic, just count the fucking ballots and whoever wins from that count- "rigged" or otherwise, just gulp down and move on. Thanks a lot Alaska, you make South Carolina look politically rationable.

2 Pull up a chair.

3 Surprised?

4

great

5 Oh, quit whining. If our side can't out-cheat the bad guys, we don't deserve to win.

6

I said in the last flame war on this topic that Murkowski is going to win. It is a Republican machine state and Papa Murkowski is a big cog in that machine.

they will find votes, strike vote,  or count the votes of moose if they have to.

He sees this senate seat as a family heirloom to be passed down. He won't let them take it away from his daughter because she got less votes.

 

Obviously, there is still a chance she can win it legitimately with the absentee ballots, but i have a feeling they will favor Miller over Murk, so she needs to do everything she can to close the 1,600 vote gap.

 

 

7 I should add, if they count the absentee ballots and she wins, we should support her because it is better than the alternative, but if she wins because of found and strcuk ballots, i can't emphasize how pissed i will be

8 Is Alaska our Concord?

9 But has anyone considered the environmental damage these recounts could cause?  What is their combined carbon footprint?

10 How many thousands of votes did the 'won' send to Ak with the 'lawyer' he dispatched?

11 Read the PDF letter.  They are fucking around with fire.

12 Whoever is messing around with that computer is pretty fuckin stupid.

13 Gah this just needs to be over with already.  I really hope we don't fuck Alaska up and it costs us a shot at the Senate.  NRSC needs to pull it's head out of it's ass and push to get this wrapped up quickly.

14 Unless it is a pasting, who knows who really wins an election. Where are the folks who said (paraphrased), "All the NRSC did was send one teeny tiny little lawyer to Alaska. Stop whining!" ?

15 We should be handing out 20 year mandatory sentences for anyone convicted of vote tampering. It's that important.

Our very survival as a republic depends on people having confidence in our elective process. Right now, that confidence doesn't exist.

16 WTF are the Alaskan election officials doing giving anybody access to the computer data base?  How can you fuck up that badly with what has been entrusted to you?  It's way past time to start throwing any cocksucker who leads to compromising elections in jail for a long time.

17 Murky is a ginger, nuff said.

18 After reading the .pdf document, I'd say there is enough of a problem to require a hand recount. Which may be exactly what Murkowski's people were after.

19 Hmm, this is troubling......i think the best way to deal with this is to raise taxes and give government more power. Yes, that should solve the problem.

20

Read the PDF letter.  They are fucking around with fire.

i just did. i want to amend my comment at 7. i don't think we should support murkowski.

this is fucking unbelieveable (profanity called for).

This is like Sandy Berger stuff documents in his socks.

tried to access the ballot room with a  fucking bag? a bag? why would he need a bag in that room?

is this stuff on security cameras? Can they get an IT guy in there to see what this guy took off the computer. My guess is that he took the addresses and contact information of people who requested absentee ballots but did not send them in. I would think he would then contact them and tell them to fill them out for Murkowski and send them in, and then they would try to get them counted.

21

If you can't keep republicans from cheating, defrauding and disenfranchising the voters how THE HELL DO YOU EXPECT TO STOP THE LIBTARDS? Who allowed them access to the computers and will this person allow democrats in to the machines like they do in most urban centers in the US?

 

22 I have been following the Miller rhetoric in the AK paper for the past few days and I think he should tone it down until he has something a little more concrete.

We are doing nothing but feeding the MFM and the Dems new meme of Republican civil war with this crap.

What should be going on is when the Miller team finds stuff like the above it needs to be discussed with the election commission and NOT the papers and MFM.

If we get left out too bad, it is for our own good.

23 Based upon the allegations made in the letter, it appears as if we may never know who actually won this election.

24 Psst., the person who let him have access to a secure computer has their agenda showing.

25 He sees this senate seat as a family heirloom to be passed down.

The feudal attitude of the ruling class disturbs me more and more.

26 Where are the folks who said (paraphrased),

"All the NRSC did was send one teeny tiny little lawyer to Alaska. Stop whining!" ?

Posted by: eman

 

Good point. Now that the NRSC is in state, any stupidity that occurs happens on their watch. There is now another player for the blame game.

 

Also, Has she forsworn the prospect of a third party betrayal yet?

27 Posted by: Vic at August 30, 2010 10:42 AM

Amen, Vic.

I'm afraid the next step will be for Murkowski's campaign to trot out similar charges against Miller election observers. An excess of zeal is standard equipment in virtually all campaigns. Sometimes, that leads to crossing the legal lines, but most often the offenses are in the eye of the beholder.

Meanwhile, the Democrat candidate for AK Senator is sitting quietly by, watching and laughing.

28 Sounds perfectly legit to us.

29 I have been following the Miller rhetoric in the AK paper for the past few days and I think he should tone it down until he has something a little more concrete.

We are doing nothing but feeding the MFM and the Dems new meme of Republican civil war with this crap.

What should be going on is when the Miller team finds stuff like the above it needs to be discussed with the election commission and NOT the papers and MFM.

If we get left out too bad, it is for our own good.

Posted by: Vic

 

I disagree. Now is the time, and in public is the venue. if we waits, or if he reports it only to the election board, then they will have the opportunity to spin it and it will a fait accompli. If the press does actually do their job, there will be pressure on these people to answer, while it still matters.

30 Every ATM in the world can immediately and securely handle an electronic transaction far more complex than registering a vote. Why is it that voting machines/computers are so unreliable?

31 Over the Miller Campaign's objection, Mike was allowed to use the state computer for 20 minutes before Division Director Gail Fenumiai fortunately ordered him off the state computer.

Who allowed this asshole access to the database to begin with?

32 Sometimes, that leads to crossing the legal lines, but most often the offenses are in the eye of the beholder.

Yep, she very well may be trying to steal the election in the style of "found ballots" and tinkering but that needs to be kept between them and the election officials.

33

What should be going on is when the Miller team finds stuff like the above it needs to be discussed with the election commission and NOT the papers and MFM.

I disagree. This needs to be out there in Alaska, the people need to know

 

Honestly the MFM is going to say we are in a civil war no matter what. And let's be frank, this time they would be right. This election is  party of a civil war that has been going our crushing defeat in 2008.  I've picked my side, and I don't care if the fight is out in the open.  There is nothing the MFM can do to stop what is going to happen in November. The only people who can stop it or ease the crushing blow are the establishment republicans. In this case Murkowski.

When Bennett lost he went to the media to decry the right win, same with Inglis.  Crist and Specter abandoned the party. The fact is the media will cover anything that makes us look bad or week, and even make things up if they have to.  I think we are beyond the point where they can do real damage to us.

This is an important battle, and if it needs to be fought out in front of the alaska public, then so be it.

Whoever wins this race will be the senator for Alaska, and if one side is cheating, then it needs to be known.

 

34 Meanwhile, the Democrat candidate for AK Senator is sitting quietly by, watching and laughing.

That just about sums it up.

35 What the hell? This is so ridiculous. Here's the GOP, once again snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. Unbelievable.

36 Both these campaigns have inside info we will never be privy to. Murky's, as the pros and the establishment, is doubly privy.  For her ops to be pulling this right out of the gate says only one thing. Her campaign has crunched the numbers and statistically there's no way for her to get there. All of this is exactly why Murky must go, and also why term limits are needed. It's an entitlement mentality. I am sure there isn't one slim doubt in Murky's head that Miller victory was solely due a lack of turnout because no one thought Murky would lose. Maybe it's true, but I don't think so. The numbers were the same as for 2008, a presidential election year. They rejected Murky.

37 If the press does actually do their job, there will be pressure on these people to answer, while it still matters.

The "press" as it currently exists in the U.S. is not going to do any "job" other than to attack Republicans, and conservatives in particular, at every opportunity.

We are just giving them opportunity here.

The election commission is the one who needs to their job and the press should have no part of that. If the election commission doesn't do its job then the courts need to get involved.

38  Every ATM in the world can immediately and securely handle an electronic transaction far more complex than registering a vote. Why is it that voting machines/computers are so unreliable?

Posted by: Lincolntf

 

Because ATMs are driven by networks that encrypt the traffic and secure the ATMs. Some ATMs don't even have local journals anymore; it's the verified online traffic that matters. Also, they aren't trotted out, set up, run and then stowed away again like these are. That compromises the designs that are available. Images on ATMs are usually loaded remotely, and seldom change. Finally, ATMs are run by companies that must answer to cardholders, institutions and the government. The voting machines and whatever network that may exist are wholly part of the government.

39 I blame Al Gore for the "Third World-ification" of our election process. I know (believe me, I've seen Boston pols in action) that voter fraud has always been around, but Big Al and his media pals "mainstreamed" it.

40

41 Popcorn!  Beer! Snowcones!  Get your Snowcones here!

42 31 Every ATM in the world can immediately and securely handle an electronic transaction far more complex than registering a vote. Why is it that voting machines/computers are so unreliable?

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2010 10:49 AM (I+0qc)

They were designed that way.

43 What should be going on is when the Miller team finds stuff like the above it needs to be discussed with the election commission and NOT the papers and MFM.

If we get left out too bad, it is for our own good.

Posted by: Vic at August 30, 2010 10:42 AM (/jbAw)

And who controls the election commissions? The 2 parties. The first rule of doing this stuff? Document it everywhere. I agree about the rhetoric but only Miller personally. Let the campaign handle this stuff.

44 Sorry for the blank post, Getting real tired of these people who think they have some hereditary or marriage right to public office.

45 I'm back, baby!

And I'm DIGITAL!

46 Also, they aren't trotted out, set up, run and then stowed away again like these are.

Not necessarily true. I have a buddy who runs a franchised business where he sets up "portable" ATM machines at public events such as festivals and concerts.

47 Every ATM in the world can immediately and securely handle an electronic transaction far more complex than registering a vote. Why is it that voting machines/computers are so unreliable?

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2010 10:49 AM (I+0qc)

There isn't anything unreliable about electronic voting machines. At least not anymore than any other electronic machines. What do you think the ATM network would look like if you had 2 competing entities in control?

48 Every ATM in the world can immediately and securely handle an electronic transaction far more complex than registering a vote. Why is it that voting machines/computers are so unreliable?

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2010 10:49 AM (I+0qc)

They were designed that way.

Posted by: Johnnyreb

 

P.S. Some of the best ATMs available are made by Diebold. Unfortunately, the voting machines have far more in common with the cheap ATMs you sometimes see in bars or low volume places. They're often referred to in the industry as cash dispensers rather than as an ATM. They are cheaply made, cost much less than a standard ATM, and do far less. And they have a limited life, usually through a combination of poor maintenance, vandalism, beer spills and whatever else the average idiot cardholder or site owner can think of.

49

O/T, here's the latest e-mail I got from Kos.  These guys are hysterical, in every sense (links not included):

"Burn the Witch,

President Obama has appointed a bipartisan commission to develop recommendations to balance the budget. For whatever reason, the commission is loaded with Blue Dogs and Republican opponents of Social Security. For example, the Republican co-chair of the commission, Alan Simpson, recently insulted an advocate for women's rights by saying Social Security is like a welfare "milk cow with 310 million tits." Seriously.

And that's not all Simpson has said. The Progressive Change Campaign Committee (PCCC) has put together a website with Simpson's most offensive quotes. The website has a game where you try and tell Simpson's real quotes from fake ones. Play the game, and join the fight to protect Social Security, here:

Click here to see what Alan Simpson said about Americans who depend on Social Security.

Many members of the deficit commission are multi-millionaires and corporate CEOs who are out of touch with America. Some members of the commission have suggested cutting health care for veterans in order to preserve expensive weapons deals for defense contractors. A majority of the members of the commission favor gambling some, or all, Social Security funds on Wall Street.

In November, the commission will make its recommendations. In December, Congress is expected to vote on the recommendation without allowing any amendments. Before the commission releases its recommendations, we need to defend Social Security recipients from Wall Street, and veterans from defense contractors, by discrediting Alan Simpson's campaign to cut those vital programs.

 

To do this, click here to learn more about Alan Simpson, share his quotes with your friends, and join the fight to protect Social Security.

Thanks for all you do,

Markos Moulitsas

Founder, Daily Kos"

/end idiocy

50 Send in the UN blue hat crew. Not only bwill they end up finding 70000 new ballots, but they will rape half of Anchorage.

51

Yep, she very well may be trying to steal the election in the style of "found ballots" and tinkering but that needs to be kept between them and the election officials.

WTF?

You know that's actually illegal.

And beyond that I think voters have the right to know.

Pathetic, just count the fucking ballots and whoever wins from that count- "rigged" or otherwise, just gulp down and move on.

Or, even better, why bother with counting. Just burn the ballots and declare a winner.

52 Jeebus. It's been over 10 years since the Florida debacle, and we still can't get this shit right.

I'm starting to think that pols want this shit to stay fucked up, so they can let the lawyers do their thing in a close election.

53 I like ONE of my Senators but it looks like time to burn up the phone lines for both.

What the hell are you people doing, fer cry-i eye?

54 Baked Alaska election. Mmmmm, mmmmm, mmmmm.

55 Every ATM in the world can immediately and securely handle an electronic transaction far more complex than registering a vote. Why is it that voting machines/computers are so unreliable?

Posted by: Lincolntf at August 30, 2010 10:49 AM (I+0qc)

Forget ATMs.  There's something much closer to home, for the States.  Every State runs a lottery that uses the exact same mechanism as "voting".  These lotteries tabulate votes that determine the distribution of tens of billions of dollars, and there has never even been a case of any mistabulated "votes" in lotteries and we never see any court cases of anyone claiming to have had their "votes" misread.

We treat our electoral processes as if they were worthless (with no real penalties being levied against anyone who abuses the system, even in the most intentional and egrigious ways - such as with those ACORN criminals not even losing their votes though they were known to have double registered) ... and so, our electoral processes are, indeed, worthless.

But, all this is even far beside the point - and that point, as I first made in the discussion over this whole fiasco, there should be no court cases or legal minutae brought into play for vote-counting in GOP primaries.  Any GOP candidate who starts trying to treat GOP primaries as if they were general elections against democrats, needs to be immediately tossed out - and this includes sanctions against the NRSC for being the dipshits they are and aiding and abetting the screwing up of everything they possibly could.

56 Also, they aren't trotted out, set up, run and then stowed away again like these are.

Not necessarily true. I have a buddy who runs a franchised business where he sets up "portable" ATM machines at public events such as festivals and concerts.

Posted by: Soap MacTavish

 

And they are a bitch and a half to bring up and keep running. They need an uninterrupted power supply and phone line. If the outfit is good at what they do, and they aren't stupidly cheap, then they can and do work. Otherwise, the time in service is poor. The sheer number of moving parts causes problems. If the site owner complicates things like hooking other items to the power or phone line (examples: coin counting machine, ear piercing kiosk, vending machines, telephones, slurpee machines)

57 53, ....pols want this shit to stay fucked up, so they can let the lawyers do their thing in a close election. Posted by: taylork Um, yup.

58 I see dead people voting.

59 Give me 20 minutes with the election computers and all would be put right in short order.

60 The NRSC should demand that Murky concede

61 "Finally, ATMs are run by companies that must answer to cardholders, institutions and the government. The voting machines and whatever network that may exist are wholly part of the government." That is my thought as well. Of course, I'd trust a private company over a Gov't agency most of the time, but in this case (where essentially nothing more complicated than third-grade level counting is going on) I wish nobody was in charge. I think I'm an electoral Luddite. I'd like to see people drop their anonymous ballots into a big box at their ward/precinct office and then have volunteers count them and read them off in real time, starting the moment voting closes. Put in a turnstile to record the number of people who enter the voting area so that the number can be checked against votes cast, record every second of the process (outside the actual booth), keep every ballot for years, and post running tallies throughout the count.

62

Daddy, did you get me my Senate seat back yet?

/@Lisa

63

Mallamutt,

also, consider the fact that the democratic party will not give ANY money to the Dem Senate Candidate from Alaska. They have a ton of close races on their hands, they won't blow any money on a seat that is essentially a Republican sure thing.

64

Why is it that voting machines/computers are so unreliable?

The common denominator.

Why is marking a paper ballot and counting it so unreliable? It's not rocket science. Why is authenticating the identity and eligibility of a voter so unreliable?

We have the technology all right. It's not that difficult. It could be foolproof.

It's the people running the show.

65 Tampering with free elections is one of the surest signs that a republic is in big trouble. Yes, I know it's standard fare in Chicago, but it would seem the idea has become more palatable elsewhere in this country. 

66

These Snow Kennedys  really want to keep their seat, don't they?

Must be scared of the job market.

67

 The NRSC should demand that Murky concede

after the mail in ballots are counted, if she has less votes.

she shouldn't attempt a recount if she is down more than 1500 votes when all the mail in ballots are counted.

And if she jumps to a third party, the NRSC should disband, because they can't even ensure Republican Senators and Candidates can remain republicans.

68 You may now commence your "yea, well fuck that, if I am a Miller voter, and he loses after this, I would not vote for her" rant.......now.

If Murkowski cheats to win the primary, it is perfectly reasonable to not vote for her.

69 . Every State runs a lottery that uses the exact same mechanism as "voting". Thank you. Much better example than ATM's.

70 Of course, the problems extend much further than merely the electoral processes, as no one was ever found guilty of much of anything for the auction of the Indonesian Imbecile's Senate seat (which the Imbecile, OBVIOUSLY, had much to do with - as he can't keep his dirty third-world fingers out of anything, especially things that he had some personal contact with) and ROland Burris is STILL in the Senate, even after it was clear that he had perjured himself (twice) in the statements he made in trying to get into the Senate.  We value these positions so little that we allow this sort of bullshit to fly through, then no one should be surprised that the whole of the feral government, and the fraudulent and criminal tactics that people use to get positions in it, have made it a joke of an institution.  Great work, there, America.  Good stuff.

71

. Every State runs a lottery that uses the exact same mechanism as "voting".

we'll see what Nick Perry has to say about that.

72

You know that's actually illegal.

And beyond that I think voters have the right to know.

Fine, once credible evidence of vote fraud is found and an actual charge is made, then it becomes a matter for the press.

Right now all this internal bickering is hurting the Republican cause.

73 If we can have motor voter laws and essentially unlimited access to absentee ballots -- why can't we have ATM voting by people with bank accounts.

74

as of now Miller is the winner ...  after the recount maybe not ...  given the small number of actual votes I don't see any way to pull a Franken and put her over the top  ... 

 

75

53 I'm starting to think that pols want this shit to stay fucked up, so they can let the lawyers do their thing in a close election.

 

I think you've nailed it on the head, the two parties have the states divvied up, and they each control their little fiefdoms jealously.  Those of us who want honesty, transparency, and good government (small government!) to win out will have to take over one of the two major parties, and since the dems are too far gone that means the republicans.  Going third party will just hand every election to one of the D or R candidates.

76 "Right now all this internal bickering is hurting the Republican cause."

Huh? How is that?

77 If the outfit is good at what they do, and they aren't stupidly cheap, then they can and do work.

I don't know the details, but he's a former senior supervisor for one of the 'armored courier' companies. I'm assuming he knows what he's doing, but ya never know. ;-)

78

The NRSC should demand that Murky concede

But, but, last week everyone said the NRSC should stay out. Now you want them in. Oh, my head.

Posted by: Moron with Memory

 

Yup. But the rep is there now. How about, "either the jerk from the NRSC should demand that her Murkiness drop out now, or pack his trash and get the Hell out of there before the NRSC gets smeared as being an accomplice in sabotaging the voting system for an entire state?"

chain of events:

1. primary

2. close vote results.

3.Her Murkiness grumbles, and threatens a third party bid, complete with a bribe to the Libertarian party.

4. She whistles up the NRSC.

5. She gets an NRSC rep; Miller gets a phone call, with a promise of help IF he wins.

6. A observer from the miller campaign claims that a Murker gained access to the voting system of the state of Alaska.

 

Never mind. That rep might as well stay and go whale watching. He/she/it is implicated now, due to proximity and timing.

79

Right now all this internal bickering is hurting the Republican cause.

Sucks for the Republican cause.

80 I am so far beyond enraged at this kind of shit.

That POS "Mike" and whatever mook allowed him access to that computer need to be in JAIL, right now, handcuffed to the fucking bars, until this gets sorted out.

If a campaign official backed that move, that asshole needs to be in jail, too.

This is ALREADY being archived by the MFM to use as an excuse for Democrat vote tampering in November, not to mention the fact that IMHO vote tampering is a buryable offense in the first damned place.

OMFG this is just almost too stupid to actually be believed. I mean, at this point, if it's true as described, how can ANYONE have confidence in this fucking vote? The only sensible thing to do is a full-on FBI investigation of those involved and a runoff election, but you can't practically do a runoff until the investigation is over, and who's gonna trust the DOJ with this?

What a colossal fucking mess. I mean, seriously, these people are making the Gulf Cleanup look like the fucking Apollo Space Program.

81 Another thing to bear in mind is that there is no automatic recount, except in a tie, in Alaska. Either candidate can request one but the state will only pay if the difference is .5% or less. Right now Murky isn't there and if she doesn't get there then I think you will start to see prominent Rs come forward and suggest she concede. One thing is for sure the Alaska R party or the NRSC is not going to pay for a recount with over a .5% difference. Right now Murky's crew isn't trying to win this election they are trying to get a recount. If they can get that then the real Shenanigans can start.

82 76, How is demanding that elections be honest and fair hurting Republicans? What is hurting the GOP is the GOP leadership and folks who do not see that.

83

Right now all this internal bickering is hurting the Republican cause.

Posted by: Vic at August 30, 2010 11:11 AM (/jbAw)

There is really no "internal bickering", Vic. There are only the RINOs launching an unprovoked assault on everyone else in the GOP, trying to lie, cheat, and steal their way to holding onto power, at the expense of everything and everyone around them.

It takes two to tango, but only one to launch an attack.  The RINOs are attacking the rest of us and that's the whole of the situation.

84 If the outfit is good at what they do, and they aren't stupidly cheap, then they can and do work.

I don't know the details, but he's a former senior supervisor for one of the 'armored courier' companies. I'm assuming he knows what he's doing, but ya never know. ;-)

Posted by: Soap MacTavish

 

That's how I got my start. They've changed a great deal in the last 20 years, but most of the principles are the same.

85 NICE SHARON ANGLE AD!!! _{Fuck Lisa Murkowski}

86 Well done, Murkowski; you've outdone even Levi Johnson in becoming the most insufferably self-centered POS in Alaska.

87 OT: why does Obama ride a girls bicycle?  And what is the bell for?

88 Just to clarify - something apparently did happen here, we probably won't know for a while actually what. At a minimum, there appear to have been at least two complete, utter, fatheaded, destructively arrogant ASSHOLES involved, but the number could be larger.

But unless this is all an internet fabrication, and as long as one dickhead did in fact allow another access to the election database system, then the integrity of the system is in doubt, and that's Just Fucking Great, Just Really Fucking Great.

Damn, this was stupid on a level way above the pay grade of everyone involved.

89 OT: why does Obama ride a girls bicycle?  And what is the bell for?

Same reason he wears mom jeans and can't throw a baseball.

90 NICE SHARON ANGLE AD!!! _{Fuck Lisa Murkowski}

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane

 

You first.

91 It's clear that Murky should resign.  Then we should re-read the article, double check our facts, then have an investigation.  That's the American way!

92

Right now all this internal bickering is hurting the Republican cause.

Posted by: Vic at August 30, 2010 11:11 AM (/jbAw)

Normally yes but not in an anti-incumbent year it isn't. If anything it's helping. The one thing keeping this year at a likely Red Wave and not a Bloody Tsunami is the gnawing suspicion that the Repubs might not have learned there lessons for 06 and 08.Concerned only with incumbency and controlling who gets the money instead of how much. Nothing says there is a chance for real change in the party then a good bloody battle of proxies. Miller win's a slug fest and tens of millions of independents say to themselves "You know, maybe the Republicans WILL be different this time?"

93 How do you spend that much on such an important system, and have it be so vulnerable?  And knowing how vulnerable it is, how do you give  one side access to that known vulnerability?

It does sound like they WANT a hand recount to give themselves another chance to play "find the hanging chad".

Recount only if Miller loses ...and arrest the clown that was involved.

94 Meet Mr. Moose and kiss Alaska oil goodbye.

"I see Joe Miller align behind a Hummer with armed guards march through a family parade in Eagle River,"

95 The letter is damning - this Murkowski guy was an ass - and the election officials have him writing down voter info. 10 to 1 he was checking up on prominent Republicans to report back their loyalty to Murkowski machine.

96 The establishment republicans know not what they are doing, and it spells doom for them.

Can they not see what they are doing?

If Murkowski had any honor she would conceded.

97
/paraphrasing the dad from Braking Away

Recount?

Recount.

RECOUNT!

98
Yeah, there is no recount. Or there should not be since...
1) they haven't finished the original count
2) It's not close enough (percentage-wise) to warrant a recount

99 You are not doing it right. Madam Murkowski, if you're going to conjure me from the nether regions, please have the courtesy to abide my advice. I won every election by 95 point margins. Go forth and do likewise.

100
Yep, she very well may be trying to steal the election in the style of "found ballots" and tinkering but that needs to be kept between them and the election officials.

I couldn't disagree more.

Miller should be screaming about this from the rooftops. Establishment pols--Democrat or Republican--cannot be allowed to get away with this. They must be punished in every conceivable way, from prosecution to getting kneecapped in the general election.

No way will I ever excuse someone cheating their way to victory. I don't give a shit if they're a Republican or not, they're certainly not on my side.

Stealing votes makes you an America-hating tyrant, pure and simple. I'm not trading "our" fascists for theirs. No way.

There's a tide of reform coming. The establishment Republicans need to either get on board or get out of the way. One way or another, the status quo WILL come to an end.

It's time to draw the line.

101 I really don't get these calls for Murky to concede based solely on the numbers. She lost by .8% with the number of absentee ballots to be counted equal to 1/6th of all votes cast. Only a fool would conceded prior to counting the absentees.

102 For example, the Republican co-chair of the commission, Alan Simpson, recently insulted an advocate for women's rights by saying Social Security is like a welfare "milk cow with 310 million tits."

Maybe if he had a VAGINA and douched beforehand, he could get away that remark. Or wore a bear costume.

103 Maybe if he had a VAGINA and douched beforehand, he could get away that remark. Or wore a bear costume. I think he developed a vagina lately. He's willingly on Der Waffler's "Deficit Reduction Commission." The one that will give Der Waffler cover to set up a VAT. That's a pussy in action if there ever were one.

104 So essentially what you're saying is Murkowski is a Democrat, then?

105 Vic, I don't support cheaters. I don't support people commiting vote fraud and tampering with elections.

Murkowski's guy broke the rules being in there. The NRSC is choosing sides in a freaking primary. Neither of those things is ever supposed to happen, so, no, I'm not willing to give everyone a pass and cheer for Team R no matter who they are or what they do.

I'm not a mindless partisan Obama-swilling drone. How dare you ask me to act like one for the good of the party.

Screw the party. Party doesn't matter. Principles matter.

106 Sorry Murky is down by 1.8%, not .8% as I said. But I still think that is plenty close enough to wait for the absentees to be counted.

107 I didn't know Broward County's district lines went as far as Anchorage.

108 You first.

Blue Hen, With all this talk of chickens around here,  I admire your pluck!

109 Sorry Murky is down by 1.8%, not .8% as I said. But I still think that is plenty close enough to wait for the absentees to be counted.

If Miller were done by 1.8%, I'm pretty sure the NRSC would have called for him to concede for the good of the party.

110 That Miller guy beats up on me too.

111 Rocks @ 107, I'm calling for her to concede now because of the blatant cheating. Vote counts don't matter with cheaters. Vote counts can be manipulated.

112 Good God people are you even reading what I wrote? I am not supporting the RINO here who may or may not be cheating!

I am saying keep all the damn communications limited to the parties involved and the damn election commission. Once you have proof of cheating THEN file charges and let the press have it.

Before this shit even started the Dems were trying to fire up a meme of "Republican civil war" in order to distract the public from the fact that they and their policies were failing miserably.

By actually fighting a civil war in the press we are giving them that meme on a platter.

113 The one that will give Der Waffler cover to set up a VAT.

Geez, even gejas Spain is rethinking that one. PIGS are finding out people will quit spending money when you punish them for doing so, and that's over Obama's head. One term for this loser.

114 It's Miller Time!

115 "This is a close election. Even just a few ballots illegally tampered with could alter the outcome. How can Joe Miller, and the thousands of honest voters in Alaska who voted for him, have confidence in the result if a Murkowski observer had 20 minutes of unfettered access to the State's GEMS server? And the state's own report states tampering can be accomplished within a minute."
Stuff likes this creates, creates more independents like me.  People can read and observe, they aren't stupid.

116 Vic, you're saying to provide cover so the RNC doesn't get embarrassed and when Murkowski pulls out her little victory, R's can be shamed into voting for her to preserve unity.

No.

If this were a general, I would want these kinds of shenanigans announced early and often. Her guy was accessing the FREAKING VOTING DATABASE. Alone. For 20 minutes.

Okay, spin that. Tell me how primary voters don't have the right to know that right now. And, when, exactly, should they know it? Before or after it gets swept under the rug?

117 I am saying keep all the damn communications limited to the parties involved and the damn election commission. Once you have proof of cheating THEN file charges and let the press have it.

Read that PDF and tell me how any of that behavior can be innocently explained away.

Waiting for proof is too late. Elections get stolen while people wait for "proof."

There's credible evidence of some seriously illegal shit happening on behalf of Murkowski. Politicians must be discouraged as strongly as possible of any hint of election rigging, And that includes taking it to the press.

Miller is the outsider, here. He can't afford to be reactive.

118 Posted by: Vic at August 30, 2010 11:43 AM (/jbAw)

I hear what you are saying but in this new political climate once the victor is crowned it's really hard for the defeated to respond with charges of irregularity without being regarded as "the sore loser" "the one affecting the party" "the troublemaker"  "the agitator" "the one giving the dems exactly what they want to see"

119

Vic, read the post above this one. Just because the democrats think a certain meme helps them doesn't mean it actually does.

The truth is yes: there IS a civil war going on in the Republican party.

We're booting out all the bastards (like Murkowski) that nobody wanted in '06 and '08.

The democrats got in promising change, they aren't offering any real change. Over there it's nice and peaceful, stable, and same as it ever was.

 

120 If this were a general, I would want these kinds of shenanigans announced early and often. Her guy was accessing the FREAKING VOTING DATABASE.

If this was the general I would agree with you.

121 OK, how many know that Simpson was paraphrasing H L Mencken's criticism of FDR for treating government as ‘a milch cow with 125 million teats’

122 If someone can access the voter data base does that give them your name and how you voted?

123

Here's another point: if we (Republicans) let Murk get away with this, then next time there is fraud in an election, the talking-heads will pull their chins and say, well, everyone does it, how do we know the Republicans didn't stuff the ballot too and LOOK AT ALASKA.

124 Chances are that this whole thing will be looked upon by the media like Obama's school records case in Iowa and Murkowski will be discredited anyway.  Dumb move.  Rove, you magnificent bastard!

125 OK, how many know that Simpson was paraphrasing H L Mencken's criticism of FDR for treating government as ‘a milch cow with 125 million teats’ Didn't know that! Of course, Simpson is right. And Kos is a 'tard. Still, Simpson ought not to cooperate by being on this phony deficit commission/whitewash operation. I think he's lost in the ruling class mentality. If Simpson comes out with an unqualified recommendation against raising taxes and for cutting spending, I'll recant. But I won't hold my breath.

126 Vic, your position is indefensible. Cheating is not a) okay because it's a primary or b) okay because it's a Republican.

127 If someone can access the voter data base does that give them your name and how you voted?
Posted by: curious at August 30, 2010 11:53 AM

If I were conspiracy theory minded, I'd say that he was looking for certain individuals in the "questionable" category to see if there was some backstabbing going on -- supporting the Murks with the words but not with the votes.

128 I know what she is doing is calling absentee voters and trying to find out how they voted.  The Franken camp did this.  The idea is that you want to know which ballots to challenge.

129 The next thing that will happen is that when you find out your candidate didn't win you can strong arm you friends into filing "vote change forms" so that your candidate can win.

I know, I know but

130 Vic, your position is indefensible. Cheating is not a) okay because it's a primary or b) okay because it's a Republican.

Posted by: Ella at August 30, 2010 11:56 AM (DmnMk)

Ella, I give up. You can't argue with someone who can't or will not read.

131 If someone can access the voter data base does that give them your name and how you voted?

Posted by: curious at August 30, 2010 11:53 AM (p302b)

Only that you voted and if you are a member of a party.

132 Hmmmm.

As a computer programmer who loves technology all I can add to this about electronic voting is:

Are you out of your fucking minds!?

133 In fairness, Vic never said cheating is okay. However it may be asking too much to expect people to not observe, talk and speculate about this absurd ballot scavenger hunt. Even if every Republican shut his trap about it, the MFM nevertheless would be stirring it up as Teh Bloody Republikan Civil War! Snowbillies! Snowbillies!

134 Posted by: Ella at August 30, 2010 11:56 AM


The first word in politics is...  ah... ahem... poo...  ahem.

135 At this point, even if Murkowski wins the primary fair and square everyone will assume massive vote fraud on her part and the GOP. There is no way for her to remove the stink of corruption and criminality to her winning at this point. She should step down, be magnanimous, and save the state and the GOP some credibility. But that all requires her to be an actual human being who cares about the voters of Alaska, her country, the GOP. She's just a soulless power-hungry career politician who puts her gain over the good of the nation.

136 Here is the question of the day.

Who the fuck is Mike? 

What IS his background.  Is he an IT guy? 

If so, I would be in court immediately demanding an audit.

This smells worse than that tranny Ace picked up Saturday.

137 Hmmmm.

"Only that you voted and if you are a member of a party."

Actually it depends.  I've heard and read about some horror stories including that the database being used for some of these voting machine systems is ... Microsoft Access.

A single line of SQL could update the voting records easily and unlike serious database engines an Access database doesn't have any change record built in so that you can see when and where changes were made to data.  And of course Microsoft Access has all of the tools and interfaces needed for someone, anyone, with unfettered access to use that GUI to update the data.

Plus in this case I seriously doubt they went through the hassle of giving the guy his own user login so he probably borrowed one from someone on the staff.  Who could be anybody with any level of access so even securing the server isn't necessarily going to prevent anything.

138 146

And Kos is a 'tard

Well, finally something we all agree on.

Isn't the bastard a dirty Scandi also?

139

I can't believe they were stupid enough to let a supporter into the computer system.

140 Mike is also guilty, he tried to take info out even when told to stop ... more than once.  I guess it is better if the official was incompetent rather than complicit ... but not much, and how do you tell?  When caught they will feign ignorance, but Mike was deliberately breaking the rules, even after told to stop ... or is it breaking the law?

Arrest him if possible.

141 Vic, I'm reading you right. This behavior is objectionable to you in a general, but no biggie in a primary. I'm not seeing the difference.

(Okay, maybe that is reading comprehension. What's the difference?)

142

I hate to say it, but I think Palin and the Tea Party have screwed us here in Alaska.  While Murkowski is not perfect by any means, Miller didn't have a single commercial that told us what he would do - he just bashed Murkowski the entire time - which turned a lot of voters off of him. 

I voted for Miller and feel like I was a bit duped.  They have so broadly split the republican vote, and created such a bitter divide between the 2 camps, that I can see a Dem having the possibility of winning if this petty crap continues.  If there is one thing Alaska doesn't need - it's another Mark Begich. 

143 A single line of SQL could update the voting records easily and unlike serious database engines an Access database doesn't have any change record built in so that you can see when and where changes were made to data... Plus in this case I seriously doubt they went through the hassle of giving the guy his own user login so he probably borrowed one from someone on the staff. Who could be anybody with any level of access so even securing the server isn't necessarily going to prevent anything. Posted by: memomachine at August 30, 2010 12:09 PM (MwCol) At some point one reaches the conclusion that incompetence can no longer put a veil on malfeasance.

144

I hate to say it, but I think Palin and the Tea Party have screwed us here in Alaska.  While Murkowski is not perfect by any means, Miller didn't have a single commercial that told us what he would do - he just bashed Murkowski the entire time - which turned a lot of voters off of him. 

Hi, Lisa!

145 Exactly Kemp .. if they sent in a expert that had means and opportunity and motive ... lock him up.  Ignorance of the law is no excuse, but if he was fully aware that is much worse.

146 Hmmmm.

Here's something from WikiPedia about a movie about the 2000 elections "Hacking Democracy": http://tinyurl.com/yt5g3k

Money quote: "The first is through editing the database file that contains the voting totals. This file is a standard Microsoft Access database, and can be opened by normal means outside of the encompassing voting program without a password. "

sigh.

I need another cup of coffee or a blowjob. ... Ok looks like I'm going to get the coffee then.

147 148

I can't believe they were stupid enough to let a supporter into the computer system.

My level of confidence in poll workers is pretty weak.  I watched an "urban" precinct at the end of the voting day, and the head poll worker refused to give us the paper count of the votes for the day. I was with the former Head of Elections Board and the woman told us she didn't have to give Republicans anything.  A call the the Elections Board quickly made her "see the light"

They are crooks.

148 Can we not safely conclude on the basis of this latest development that going the Libertarian route is no longer going to be a viable option for Murk now?  If she somehow winds up pulling out the primary, it will be hugely "controversial" but the family machine can probably still eke out a win in the general given the weakness of Donk opposition.  But going the third party route after having (allegedly) tried and failed to steal re-nomination?  Wouldn't that drastically reduce the share of the GOP vote she could count on in November?  How many Alaska Republicans would conclude that Murk is already in the wrong party?

149

OK. folks... and I'm saying this as a Libertarian...

Its time for a NATIONAL ID Card, which is tied to your State drivers license, Passport, Citizenship status, Tax ID, and VOTER REGISTRATION.

Make it Free, and you can't Vote, or WORK without it.

We have to clean up the election process... there have now been 2 or 3 recent elections stolen...

150

OK. folks... and I'm saying this as a Libertarian...

Its time for a NATIONAL ID Card

What is wrong with this picture?

151 This behavior is objectionable to you in a general, but no biggie in a primary. I'm not seeing the difference.

First off, cheating is BAD, what I said was get the goods and file charges. Cheating is bad in both the primary and the general.

Second what behavior that I find objectionable about this vs the general is red on red fighting in the press. Even if Murk is a RINO she is still a Republican. Sure fight this out tooth and nail, but do it behind closed doors.

In the general election it would be a red on blue fight and sure the MFM will take the side of the blue but we expect that.

Besides giving the Republican Party a black eye, and feeding the "civil war" meme what good is all this in the paper actually doing?

Do you think having all these accusation flying in the paper is going to slow down the staffers? Not a damn chance.

Is it going to give Miller any more votes in the primary? Not a damn chance. Could it cause a lot of R's to sit at home in the general if Murk wins? Damn straight it could.

And as far as publicizing it so that we here at AOS can read about it, how does that effect the election in AK? Not a damn bit.

All this public airing of laundry has nothing but negative impact and not a damn bit of positive.

152
"Over the Miller Campaign's objection, Mike was allowed to use the state computer for 20 minutes before Division Director Gail Fenumiai fortunately ordered him off the state computer."

Enough with the passive voice: who gave "Mike" access to the computer? Name the person who did it. Hold his/her ass to the fire: it's the only way these "public servants" can be held accountable for this actions.

153 Hmmmm.

A couple things more.

1. A major danger lately is from people not necessarily hacking themselves but in employing technology that is set up to hack by a professional hacker.  A prime example is the beloved iPod.  iPods can be set up to completely vacuum up an entire harddrive or even to seek out specific files and copy them when connected to a computer through a USB port.  Or even seek out specific files and make alterations to them.

The user doesn't even have to have any computer experience or ability at all.  Everything is built into the iPod and it doesn't even have to be an iPod Touch.  Just a regular looking iPod.  The problem is that the iPod is really just a very small specific purpose computer.  But it is a computer. 

In this kind of situation the campaign worker could simply be told to get access to the voting server any way possible and connect the iPod and when you see a certain message appear on the iPod's display, disconnect and walk away.

This kind of vulnerability affects corporations, government and the military.  Modified iPods can be given out as prizes with the associated software CD encoded with vulnerabilities directly so they don't even come up as viruses.  Meanwhile the hacker sits back and waits for the data files to come on home.

Oh and firewalls will do nothing to protect you.  All the software has to do is use web technology to communicate and it'll bypass most firewalls.  This is because everyone has port 80 for HTTP open.  And it is simplicity itself to modify a program to act like a web browser and update data on a foreign web server.

154 #162
This is because everyone has port 80 for HTTP open.  And it is simplicity itself to modify a program to act like a web browser and update data on a foreign web server.


Great that made my day.

155 159

OK. folks... and I'm saying this as a Libertarian...

Its time for a NATIONAL ID Card

What is wrong with this picture?

Posted by: rdbrewer at August 30, 2010 12:21 PM (LutGd)

Nothing... most Libertarians are not really idealouges... we want the smallest Government that makes sense... and leaves us alone the most...

In this case, with the ability to both travel, and with mail in ballots in many states, we need a National system for voter registration... AND Citizenship.

156 iPods can be set up to completely vacuum up an entire harddrive or even to seek out specific files and copy them when connected to a computer through a USB port. Or even seek out specific files and make alterations to them. Those iPods I gave the Queen and others? I had Steve Chu put rootkits on them that will replace everything on your hard drive with copies of Rick Astley's greatest music videos. It's good to be the King.

157 Okay, Vic, I'm reading you right.

I don't care about red-on-red violence if one of those reds is a cheater. (And she's really not red enough to be a hill worth dying on, but cheater would trump even a great voting record.)

Screaming bloody murder about vote tampering isn't a general election ploy to try to tip close elections. It's something that actually matters. Even in a primary.

There is NO DEMOCRACY as long as there is cheating. Because votes don't matter if the government blesses cheating - you may as well save the money and just have the party hacks wrangle it out among themselves.

Then again, I'm not a partisan. I changed my registration to Independent after TARP.

158

Enough with the passive voice: who gave "Mike" access to the computer? Name the person who did it. Hold his/her ass to the fire

It's "feet."  Hold their feet to the fire.  But I think you may be onto something.

159

Posted by: Alaskan at August 30, 2010 12:12 PM (ViRFH)

By reading that we all have just dropped in IQ. You do not pass go, you do not collect 200 but you are in running for Troll of the Day.

160

Ha ha ha, I love it!  I'm not a 'troll', just giving you guys a viewpoint of someone who actually voted in this race (FOR MILLER).  I don't want to see us get stuck with another Dem senator, and all this in-fighting is not good for any conservative. 

But, I guess I'll just keep 'trolling' away...  Hilarious! 

161 Then again, I'm not a partisan. I changed my registration to Independent after TARP.

Posted by: Ella at August 30, 2010 12:36 PM (DmnMk)

 

LOL... we need a Name for folks like us...

hmmm.... POXR?  Pissed Off eX Republican?

162 "Who the fuck is Mike and who let him in?" is a good question.

163 and this includes sanctions against the NRSC for being the dipshits they are and aiding and abetting the screwing up of everything they possibly could.

Possibly yes...

164 Hmmmm.

@ Kemp at August 30, 2010 12:31 PM (AQxTm)

"Great that made my day."

Sorry man but this is why highly secure buildings refuse to allow people to carry in even a simple thumb drive.  Anything with a USB connector can be modified to hack any computer it is connected to.  Even flash drives can be modified to do much more than simply store data.

The only way to absolutely ensure security is to build in a Faraday Cage, physically isolate the computers & network and absolutely ensure that nobody brings any electronic devices whatsoever.

165

Iranian Air Force seeks return of F-14 bombers from U.S.
Tehran Times Political

TEHRAN – A top general declared on Tuesday that the Iranian Air Force is seeking a return of fighter jets it bought from the U.S. in the 1970s.

The United States sold 80 F-14s to Iran in 1974. However, it refused to deliver them to Iran after the Islamic Revolution.

“We want to take back bombers blocked by the U.S. because it is our legitimate right. However, this issue must be pursued by relevant organizations through relevant channels,” Hossein Chitforoush, the Air Force Deputy Commander, told the Mehr News Agency

166 Hmmmm.

"Iranian Air Force seeks return of F-14 bombers from U.S."

I say we give them to the Iranians ... but in the form of 2,000lb bombs.

167

Ha ha ha, I love it!  I'm not a 'troll', just giving you guys a viewpoint of someone who actually voted in this race (FOR MILLER). 

Right.  I know I'm convinced.

168 Hmmmm.

Oh and a last point before lunch:

Windows machines employ something called "windows scripting" that allows developers and administrators the ability to create macros that usually do mundane kinds of things.  However this shouldn't imply that you can't do more than that.

Basically a "script" is a text file that uses a specific programming language that is then "hosted" by the computer.  So you do *not* have to have a compiled program.  A familiar example of this would be the coding of a web page to provide more interactivity than simply refreshing.  Yahoo.com is an easy example.

With windows scripting the prospective hacker just needs access to a text editor.  The code is fairly simple and can be either created on the spot or simply written beforehand and then uploaded to the computer from a flash drive.  The script file would run, access and/or modify the data in a Microsoft Access database and then remove all traces of itself.

With the code on a flash drive it could be done in under 30 seconds, and that is if I were drinking hot coffee at the same time.

Writing the code by hand from memory?  A couple minutes.  Maybe 5 minutes tops.

Since the machines are Diebolds it would be very easy to find out beforehand the structure of the database used by Diebold.  Really the hardest thing is understanding how the database is structured.  Once you're past that the rest is pretty easy. 

All that you'd need to do is to change 20,000 Miller votes to Murkowski.

After that, amusingly enough, it's Miller time! (beer joke)

169

I voted for Miller too.What he stands for has not changed one iota. Why would you feel duped by his actions? If Murkowski somehow pulls this off and is the republican nominee there is no doubt in my mind she will trounce McAdams.

 

170

RDBrewer - I really don't care if you think I'm real or not.  I was born & raised in Alaska, do you really think I am a Dem?   I'd be glad to tell you the other folks I voted for as well, that you  haven't heard of:  Miller, Carl Gatto, Mead Treadwell, Bill Walker, and Yes on Prop 2.  Look them up, you will see that I am, indeed, a Republican, and I have no problem telling you that I voted for Miller - whether or not you choose to believe me is on you. 

Lisa was a lame duck, which is the reason I didn't vote for her.  We need someone who will go fight the feds for us the way good ol' Ted did, not another Begich, or placeholder like Lisa has been. 

171 I haven't had time to read all the comments.  I am outraged by this and have fired off emails to the governor, and senator, and representative of our district expressing my outrage.

Miller Campaign: Murkowski "Observers" Are Screwing With Vote-Counting Computer Servers
Dear Senator Stedman,

I am traveling and had to vote absentee in the primary, and am now VERY upset and distressed about the integrity of our election and concerned I have been disenfranchised as a voter.

I am copying below an email I just fired off to our governor, and I am OUTRAGED that something like this has been allowed to happen in Alaska.  I expect CRIMINAL CHARGES of election tampering to be filed immediately, and a closely monitered, extremely honest and open  HAND COUNT of the ballots as now our election computers have been tampered with and can not be trusted!

I expect YOUR immediate attention to this matter, as it now appears that the corruption from Washington DC is now interfering with our elections!

Byron


Governor Parnell,
I have just read online that your administration has allowed someone from the Murkowski campaign to illegally access the election computer database to "check the voter records"!  THIS HAS NOW ALLOWED OUR ELECTION COMPUTER TO BE QUESTIONED AS A PERSON COULD INSTALL MALICIOUS SOFTWARE TO SKEW THE RESULTS, AND THIS WOULD ONLY TAKE ONE MINUTE TO DO!

WHAT IN THE HELL ARE YOUR PEOPLE THINKING OF??

You have now made a hand recount the only reliable way to determine votes and impugned the honesty of our election!

If I feel YOU or YOUR administration is involved in voter fraud, I WILL BE VOTING FOR YOUR OPPONENT IN NOVEMBER. 

IF I FEEL YOU OR THE "REPUBLICAN MACHINE" HAS ALLOWED MURKOWSKI TO BE ELECTED BY CORRUPTION AND CHEATING, I WILL BE VOTING DEMOCRAT IN NOVEMBER AND URGING ALL I KNOW TO DO THE SAME.

I am sickened by the corruption in Washington D.C., and now sickened that it appears to be in Alaska, and you and the Alaska republicans are involved in this! 

You need to understand something. CORRUPT AND DISHONEST FEDERAL INCUMBENTS, WHO DON'T FOLLOW THE CONSTITUTION ARE GOING TO BE REPLACED, AND THIS ALSO INCLUDES ANY CORRUPT INCUMBENT IN ALASKA.

WE ARE WATCHING THIS ELECTION VERY CLOSELY AND ARE NOT GOING TO ALLOW CORRUPTION TO THWART THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE.

I am extremely upset and disappointed by this matter and expect you to do the right thing to assure ALASKANS AND AMERICANS that our elective process is honest.

172 Van Flein is Palin's lawyer if I remember correctly.

173

RDBrewer - I really don't care if you think I'm real or not.  I was born & raised in Alaska, do you really think I am a Dem?   I'd be glad to tell you the other folks I voted for as well, that you  haven't heard of:  Miller, Carl Gatto, Mead Treadwell, Bill Walker, and Yes on Prop 2.  Look them up, you will see that I am, indeed, a Republican, and I have no problem telling you that I voted for Miller - whether or not you choose to believe me is on you. 

Lisa, I'm sold.  Relax.

174 So, now we're going to join the Al Gore "vote fraud" loons?

Okey-dokey.

175

This issue makes me sick.  I knew Liberal Lisa thought the seat was her birthright, but to knowingly allow a staffer to participate in an illegal activity is shameful to say the least.  And the fact that the staff at the division of elections didn't hold his feet to the fire, but rather allowed him to walk out after 20 minutes of unfettered access to the voting database, does not give me a warm and fuzzy about the outcome of this primary.

 

176 8  Is Alaska our Concord?  Posted by: eman at August 30, 2010 10:31 AM (BK24x)

Minnesota should have been Concord....

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If America parallels the Roman Empire and we do get a Caesar, hopefully *not* Caesar Obama, is it wishing for too much that comment spammers have a live snake shoved up their ass?

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