1 please god no.

2

A after that wait, a Palin post?

3 too soon to threadjack?

4 ...at least post it twice.  Jesus.

5 This is futile since she will be run over by the juggernaut that is Mitt Romney.

6
in before the cocksuckery!

7
oh darn it, too late!

8 ...at least post it twice.  Jesus.

9

Meggy Mac is right...

Twinkies are delicious.

10 Holy fuck that is a stupid argument for/against Palin.

11
You know, with Bill Clinton being so chummy with Obama, I'm starting to think there's a plan to put Hillary on the ticket in 2012.

12 She needs to go back to her home on WHORE ISLAND.

13

Pfft...Megs, built like a fullback, dumb as a stump.

 

14 this is a double post?????

15 Republicans could go hunting at MSNBC, that the subliminal message I got ...

16 It's a TRAP--the media and Usual Suspects are setting her up

They'll play nice and do puff pieces, then as the election /  primary season gets closer they'll Shift Gears very quickly and tear into Palin

with the ferocity of a wounded-and-probably-dying beast

17 I'm still on the record as saying "No, she doesn't need antagonistic interviews" until she actually announces.

I would see it as a sign of weakness/cowardice if she actually announced and then didn't take any antagonistic interviews, but prior to that I see no harm in her staying with the conservative media. 

That said, I'm also sure, now that she's had a chance to get her feet under her, she'll do fine in these.

And then we'll see which side is right: YEAH She's teh Awesome! or Energizes the base, but still not ready for Prime-Time.

Of course, we'll argue about it all the same, but who expected any different.

18 cooperating with a host of neutral media outlets, notably The New York Times, TIME and ABC News

You keep using this word "neutral." I do not think it means what you think it means.

19 I know about shooting. I take the money shot regularly.

20
How did Gerald Ford become Veep? Legally, I mean.

He was, what, appointed or nominated? Then the Senate approved?

21

 I disagree with that part (should have been the Tea Party).

Nope should have been ME! 

 

22 Posted by: SantaRosaStan at December 17, 2010 04:03 PM (UqKQV)

I don't think they'll be able to restrain themselves for that long.  And, if I gave Palin more credit for deviousness than I do, I'd say that's actually part of her plan.

23 too soon to threadjack?
Posted by: laceyunderalls at December 17, 2010 03:58 PM

Yes. Please. I need my Palin fix.

24 A bigger share than 20% of the country is now conservative, but Ace and Allah can't keep their metrosexual hands off each other long enough to notice.

Someone tell Meggie that video games don't count as "shooting," mmmkay?

25 with the ferocity of a wounded-and-probably-dying beast Posted by: SantaRosaStan at December 17, 2010 04:03 PM (UqKQV) Then she can shoot, hopefully with a decent rifle this time.

26 too soon to threadjack?
Posted by: laceyunderalls at December 17, 2010 03:58 PM

How 'bout them Jets?!

27 I want Mike Pence or Christ 'Meatloaf' Christie to be Prez

( just clearing the air )

I'll be at home to receive messages / incoming fire, but mind the M-60 behind the camouflaged sandbags on your left as your turn into the long driveway

Sarah should be The Messenger, not the actual delivered package

28 OT (repost from last thread, in case anyone didn't see it)

Ace, check your mail.  I just forwarded an email for the head of the Chicago tea party whose (the tea party's) Christmas party was apparently the subject of an arson attack.  I only got a couple of google hits (will the MSM cover it) and this one, which is a cut and paste of part of the email I got.

29

Last night on The Last Word, Meghan McCain became the latest person to impugn Sarah PalinÂ’s hunting abilities. McCain explained that, while she had never killed an animal before, she had done her fair share of shooting. Ha! Clearly the woman is a GOINO. You know, Gun Owner In Name Only.

Yeah, shooting her mouth off

30 Jeebus.

31 This is an obligatory post

A "Mega Mac proven illiterate by accidental publication of draft article" post was obligatory, because the thread would be long and interesting. Going Frum-ass on Palin every day is merely tedious.

32 Sarah should be The Messenger, not the actual delivered package

Posted by: SantaRosaStan at December 17, 2010 04:07 PM (UqKQV)

Can't those guys talk on their own instead of letting a lady take the heat for them?

33
Interesting: Ford was confirmed by both the Senate and the House.

34

The public has the idea that Palin is unqualified, thanks to shaky answers during the 2008 campaign

 

I would add that some of the answers were invented. That isn't a problem that every politician has had to face.

35 Y-Not on a Palin thread   --- Who Knew Why Not ?????

36 MSM selected McCain. Looks like they want Palin. Nothing to do with her losing to Obama by 22 points in the latest polling I suppose. How long will they prop her up?

37 I'll have you know I graduated Smegma Cum Laud, H8ers.

38 25th Amendment (in part): "Whenever there is a vacancy in the office of the Vice President, the President shall nominate a Vice President who shall take office upon confirmation by a majority vote of both Houses of Congress."

39 >>How did Gerald Ford become Veep? Legally, I mean. Nominated by Nixon, confirmed by a majority vote of Congress.

40

I would add that some of the answers were invented. That isn't a problem that every politician has had to face.

Posted by: Blue Hen at December 17, 2010 04:09 PM (R2fpr)

Not the democrat ones, anyway.

41 32 Sarah should be The Messenger, not the actual delivered package

Posted by: SantaRosaStan at December 17, 2010 04:07 PM (UqKQV)

Can't those guys talk on their own instead of letting a lady take the heat for them?

Posted by: That guy on another thread at December 17, 2010 04:08 PM (z1N6a)

Bingo. Hiding behind a woman's skirts.

42 I came over here from HA to get away from the Palin posts.

43 @31

Oh c'mon, for pity's sake. 

It's an obligatory post because ace set a bar for Palin to reach and he is acknowledging that she is working on achieving it.  If he didn't cover this story, he would be "guilty" of criticizing her without acknowledging her efforts to overcome (what he perceives to be) a weakness. 


It's a good thing Palin isn't as thin-skinned as many of her supporters are. 

44 You know, with Bill Clinton being so chummy with Obama, I'm starting to think there's a plan to put Hillary on the ticket in 2012. Posted by: Senator Soothsayer (R-AoS) at December 17, 2010 04:02 PM Have Biden step down and add Hillary as VP, to (1) reunite the PUMAs with the base and (2) then set her up to run for President in 2016?

45 Someone tell Meggie that video games don't count as "shooting," mmmkay?

Posted by: Adjoran

But I'm an expert! I have a huugge set of guns! But I want to be known for my inisive anaylsis and wit.

46

Can't those guys talk on their own instead of letting a lady take the heat for them?

Posted by: That guy on another thread at December 17, 2010 04:08 PM (z1N6a)

You misunderstood; allow me to retort:

She should be The Messenger for CONSERVATISM, not just for Pence and Meatloaf

47
So when Joe Biden is told to fuckoff by Obama, Hillary will need to confirmation by both chambers.

That could be very interesting.

48 Where the fuck is the remote?!?  Jugears McFucktard and the Vice Fuckwit are on Fox.......

.....just threw an empty Valu-Rite bottle at the TV.  Problem solved (sorry lil' TV).

49 Posted by: Vashta Nerada at December 17, 2010 04:10 PM (hiFDo)

Then you came to the wrong place.

And we're far more "knock-down, drag out" here than over at HA.

50 At the moment, President Fuckwit is flapping his gums about the extension of current tax rates, which he's pimping as "tax relief." I'd be a happy boy indeed if the Mohammedan Mouthpiece would get over the idea that everything he does -- what little there is of it -- does not require a State Speech, especially when it's crammed full of evasions and outright lies.

As for Palin, I think she'd be a fine Vice-President. Better, at any rate, than Joltin' Joe, who is, I think, drunk today.

51 A hostile interviewer is one thing, Sarah can stand up to those But she has no control over an interview that is heavily edited to put her in the worst light.

52 >>How did Gerald Ford become Veep? Legally, I mean.

First the Democrats got rid of Spiro Agnew.  The rest is history. Somewhere in there Bob Woodward got famous.

53
Have Biden step down and add Hillary as VP, to (1) reunite the PUMAs with the base and (2) then set her up to run for President in 2016?

Yeah, I'm thinking she's still feels entitled to the presidency.

54

Sarah quit. I don't care why. She's on a reality show. She forced her kid to Dance with the Stars. She has a funny accent. She's a woman. She tortures animals. She 's on that scary religion video. She gave birth to a retard. Anyone who defends her even a little bit is a screeching Palinbot harpy who wants Obama to be re-elected. And she's a media-whore. That's right, I said WHORE.

 

Did I miss anythnig?

55 35 Y-Not on a Palin thread 

Well, my Christmas shopping is done and the weather's lousy here today. 

56

Bingo. Hiding behind a woman's skirts.

Posted by: davidt at December 17, 2010 04:10 PM (9Pzy7)

no, no Bingo for you -- you misunderstood

 allow me to retort:

She should be The Messenger for CONSERVATISM, not just for Pence and Meatloaf

57 How did Gerald Ford become Veep? Legally, I mean.

First the Democrats got rid of Spiro Agnew.  The rest is history. Somewhere in there Bob Woodward got famous.

Posted by: kansas

 

You forgot about my important skills and contributions.

58 Posted by: Senator Soothsayer (R-AoS) at December 17, 2010 04:11 PM (uFokq)

Nope, he could just choose not to nominate Biden for VP in the '12 election cycle.  She wouldn't have to be confirmed by the Congress in that case: Biden would be VP until Jan 2013, and (assuming my nightmare continues) Hillary would become VP on inauguration day 2013.

59 At the moment, President Fuckwit is flapping his gums about the extension of current tax rates, which he's pimping as "tax relief." I'd be a happy boy indeed if the Mohammedan Mouthpiece would get over the idea that everything he does -- what little there is of it -- does not require a State Speech, especially when it's crammed full of evasions and outright lies.

As for Palin, I think she'd be a fine Vice-President. Better, at any rate, than Joltin' Joe, who is, I think, drunk today.

Posted by: MrScribbler© at December 17, 2010 04:12 PM (Ulu3i)

I'll give him a pass because it has to stick in the craw of his base and the rump that will be left in Congress in January. The more he crows about doing deals with the GOP the better.

60
Obama's gonna say, "Look, Joe, you're great and everything, but we both know you'll never be president. I need a successor on the ticket with me for my second term."

61 Every single time I see/hear Plugs, I thank God we dodged that snowbilly Palin. 

/sarc, in case you were wondering.

Yeah, I wouldn't mind her as VP on a ticket. 

62 Now that he has saved the economy, isn't he due to fly to Hawaii for his 27th vacation?

63

Sarah quit. I don't care why. She's on a reality show. She forced her kid to Dance with the Stars. She has a funny accent. She's a woman. She tortures animals. She 's on that scary religion video. She gave birth to a retard. Anyone who defends her even a little bit is a screeching Palinbot harpy who wants Obama to be re-elected. And she's a media-whore. That's right, I said WHORE.

 Did I miss anythnig?

Posted by: Getting it out of the way early

 

Yes. She's not even a witch.

64

Bingo. Hiding behind a woman's skirts.

Posted by: davidt at December 17, 2010 04:10 PM (9Pzy7)

Are you projecting, my son?  Do women's skirts interest you in a sexual way?

65 Posted by: Jane D'oh at December 17, 2010 04:15 PM

Do you have a favorite(s) for the top slot yet, Jane? 

66 Better, at any rate, than Joltin' Joe, who is, I think, constantly drunk today. Posted by: MrScribbler© at December 17, 2010 04:12 PM (Ulu3i) FIFY.

67 Nope, he could just choose not to nominate Biden for VP in the '12 election cycle.  She wouldn't have to be confirmed by the Congress in that case: Biden would be VP until Jan 2013, and (assuming my nightmare continues) Hillary would become VP on inauguration day 2013.

Then, sometime in the late spring, Barry's decomposing body would be found in Fort Marcy Park.

68

Are you projecting, my son?  Do women's skirts interest you in a sexual way?

Posted by: Sigmund F M.D

 

Do ya know what site you blundered onto here Doc? Some of the skirt wearing women here are interested in women wearing skirts.

69 We need a Michelle Obama Hideous Fashions of 2010 retrospective thread.

70 Posted by: huerfano at December 17, 2010 04:17 PM (QgmBR)

No, my nightmare involves him completing a second term and a complete Republican melt-down in 2016 as well.

It's a bad nightmare.

71 Y-not, I'm warming up to a few.  I like the Fat Guy and a few others.  Col. Allen West in 2016 would be awesome.  He kicks ass.

72 We need a Michelle Obama Hideous Fashions of 2010 retrospective thread.

Boob belts and mixed prints.

73 Why have so may recent presidents been left handed? Ford, Reagan, Bush 1, Clinton, Obama. I smell conspiracy.

74
I think Obama and the Clintons have something cookin.

Here's the funny part: They're all trying to scam one another.

When it ends, and it will end, it will be like the standoff in The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly.

But in this case it'll be The Bad, The Bad, and the Bad & Ugly.

75

Do ya know what site you blundered onto here Doc? Some of the skirt wearing women here are interested in women wearing skirts.

Posted by: Blue Hen at December 17, 2010 04:18 PM (R2fpr)

Blundered?  Did you mean to say "blow job   Are you repressed, my son from Delaware?

Male college students calling themselves hens interests me; are the women students Lady Blue Hens?

76 Why have so may recent presidents been left handed?

Ford, Reagan, Bush 1, Clinton, Obama.

I smell conspiracy.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 17, 2010 04:20 PM (TMB3S)

You should have said it was a sinister conspiracy

77

>> She needs to go back to her home on WHORE ISLAND.

She's a smelly pirate hooker.

78 We need a Michelle Obama Hideous Fashions of 2010 retrospective thread.

Big, flouncy skirts to hide her ginormous ass.  And let's not forget Her Loveliness in shorts.

79 No, my nightmare involves him completing a second term and a complete Republican melt-down in 2016 as well.

It's a bad nightmare.

I was talking about the most likely scenario.

80 Engaging the hostile media? check Globe-hopping for foreign experience? check TLC paying Palin for a giant campaign ad that end up being the channel's highest-rated show? check A record of successfully playing kingmaker? check Taking on leftist lunacy and making solid policy proposals? check Mastering the new media that the press applauded Obama for using? check This and more means a a strong run in 2012. I will highlight one negative though. During her interview on O'Reilly yesterday she was countering more criticism from Krauthammer. He thinks the television show makes her seem not serious enough for President. While she made cogent arguments she failed to make the best one. Sarah repeat after me: Ronald Reagan was in a movie with a chimpanzee.

81 ....and do You People really call Newark   "New Ark" ?????

82 Col. West on Cavuto now.  Me likey.

83 Ugh, it gets worse.

Now Shuckabee is on Fucks News yammering like a drug-addled lemur about the tax-rate bill. He says Osama Obama deserves credit for this, and his "cooperation" bullshit is making McCain sound like a rabid ultra-conservative.

For me, Shuckabee is out for '12, and beyond. Ditto Mutt Romney, Jindal, Newt and anyone else who appears regularly on Hannity's shows.

Palin's a possibility, if she can replace the negative perceptions she has with decent policy initiatives. Ditto the Jersey Big Man, Bolton and Pence.

84 Sarah repeat after me: Ronald Reagan was in a movie with a chimpanzee.

Posted by: Chicago Jedi at December 17, 2010 04:22 PM (WZFkG)

That movie was full of well considered policy statements. Everyone knows that. That's why it was mentioned with approval by the media at the time.

85 Posted by: Jane D'oh at December 17, 2010 04:19 PM (UOM4

See, I don't know enough about Col. West, so he's a possibility, but Chris Christie is (so far) such a one-trick pony I'm not too interested.  My understanding is that he's both Pro-Life and Pro-Gun control (I could be wrong on those, but I think I've seen comments to that effect), and those are non-starters for me.

I've heard Liz Cheney's name mentioned- and I know she's got the International/National Defense chops, but I don't know where she stands on other issues important to me.

The short version is that I'm no longer going to vote for someone (in the primaries) who isn't close enough to my personal values.  If enough people agree with me, then my candidate (currently lean Palin, but that could change if any of the others turn out to be good on the issues I care about) will win.  If not, my candidate will lose and (failing another McCain) I'll vote for whoever won the nomination.

86 But she has no control over an interview that is heavily edited to put her in the worst light.
She should make her own video of every interview (with it being a condition of interviewing her) and (a suggestion from a Moron® here) that she wear an electronic clock/timer in her lapel so viewers could see and ask themselves, "Gee, why is there a three minute gap between asking her the question and her answer?"

87 Posted by: Jane D'oh at December 17, 2010 04:23 PM

In spite of Cavuto pressing him hard, particularly when compared to his toe-sucking of Shuckabee.

West is looking better and better all the time.

88 I'm deliberately opaque; it amuses me

89 "Palin and her staff have adopted elements of a more traditional media strategy, cooperating with a host of neutral media outlets, notably The New York Times, TIME and ABC News...."

Whoever wrote the above is a Democrat shill.  Anyone who really believes the NYT, ABC and Time are neutral is certifiably insane. 

90

How arrogant and stupid do you have to be to criticize the hunting abilities of a life-long hunter when you have no hunting experince? 

91 Frankly, I'm tired of all the republicans giving interviews with the MSM. If they screw one of us over, they should be dead to all Republicans.

92 Does anyone know why West is coming out of the gate (saw it on his FB posts) criticizing the GOP leadership for not having Congress in session long enough?  It's an odd thing to come out swinging with, imho. 

93 Sarah repeat after me: Ronald Reagan was in a movie with a chimpanzee. Posted by: Chicago Jedi at December 17, 2010 04:22 PM

Yes, long before his career as a Republican star and his two full terms as Governor of CA.

94 Posted by: andycanuck at December 17, 2010 04:25 PM (KHKnV)

Maybe so, maybe no.  It's a good bet, but not a sure thing.

The media could always just say "She declined to be interviewed" after they refused her requests.  And, while Team Sarah would push out the real facts, it's always possible not enough people would hear those and would only hear "Sarah Palin still refuses to be interviewed..."

95 neutral media outlets, notably The New York Times, TIME and ABC News Ist LOL of the day.

96

@27: "I want Mike Pence or Christ 'Meatloaf' Christie to be Prez"

Christie?  Say hello to amnesty and goodbye to any guns, then.  Might as well go the full Scott Brown as go with Christie.

- to give the man his due, he is good on budget issues, but he'd be godawful as a president.

97 Yes, long before his career as a Republican star and his two full terms as Governor of CA.

Posted by: MrScribbler© at December 17, 2010 04:28 PM (Ulu3i)

Yeah, that's why it was never mentioned by the MSM in the run-up to the election. Not once.

98 and do You People really call Newark   "New Ark" ?????

Posted by: Sigmund F, M.D. and uncle of Delaware grad

 

Indeed we do.

True story: A group of foreign grad students enroute to the Univ of Del, located in New-ark Delaware landed at Newark NJ airport. They asked for directions to Newark, and we're told,"you're there". A department chairman got a frantic call at 0-dark-thirty from this pack of befuddled grad students who were wandering around New-erk NJ in the middle of the night (not exactly a healthy pastime). A  rescue attmpet was then launched to recover these students.

99 Sarah repeat after me: Ronald Reagan was in a movie with a chimpanzee.

Posted by: Chicago Jedi at December 17, 2010 04:22 PM (WZFkG)

Yes, fifteen years before he ran for governor of California--back when Cali was the Golden State and creating new jobs like Crazy.  Reagan served two terms and presided over The Glory Days

You had to have been There to appreciate Cali in the late sixties and early-mid Seventies

100 Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2010 04:27 PM (IDL9N)

IIRC, there was a dust up recently between West and Boehner.  Basically Boehner was complaining that if they pushed something (the Tax bill, maybe?) back to the 112th, they wouldn't have enough days to get to everything else.  West basically said: "then take less vacation."  It may have escalated since then.

101

How arrogant and stupid do you have to be to criticize the hunting abilities of a life-long hunter when you have no hunting experince? 

Posted by: rdbrewer

 

Paging archie bunker.....paging archie bunker. You're needed in show and tell.

102 See, I don't know enough about Col. West, so he's a possibility, but Chris Christie is (so far) such a one-trick pony I'm not too interested.

--

Did you catch the story this week (or last) about Christie duking it out with the state legislature (Dems) over the judicial appointments?  They've been refusing to act on an appointment he made months and months ago and instead the crook in the court used some trickeration to go around Christie and appoint someone... so one of the justices on the court is protesting.  I'm getting the story garbled a bit, but the gist is that Christie is trying to reform their screwed up judiciary.  So he's not really a one-trick pony, imho. 

That doesn't necessarily mean he should be POTUS, but I'm a little irritated to read the MSM and some conservatives (who happen to be backing someone else) say that all he is is a YouTube bully.  ('Not saying you're doing that but it's just this line that keeps getting thrown around a lot.)

103  Remember she missed six times before dropping the hammer on the poor innocent caribou .
I'll leave out the part where her old man fell on top of her scope and knocked it off zero because the media is sure not  to mention that little fact .  Kinda like boobs McCain . Waaah Sarah can't shoot .  Now check out my cans .

104 Yeah, I spent a few Summers at Bethany Beach, aka the Delaware Riviera

gritty sand, cold water, but some of the wimmin wuz fine

105 West basically said: "then take less vacation."  It may have escalated since then.
Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) at December 17, 2010 04:31 PM

What? West thinks Congress ought to actually show up and do work to earn their pay? Kinda like regular people?

Jeebus Crisco, what a freekin' traitor. Integrity isn't going to sit well with the entrenched royalty in D.C.

106 Yeah, I spent a few Summers at Bethany Beach, aka the Delaware Riviera

gritty sand, cold water, but some of the wimmin wuz fine

Posted by: SantaRosaStan

 

Yup. That's the 'high' class beach. Seriously.

107

@81: "....and do You People really call Newark   "New Ark" ?????"

Nope, it's "Nurk".

108 Check out NRO today.

Palin on the START treaty, and the death of the Omnibus Monstrosity.

She is doing a two pronged PR attack.

ABC, TLC to reintroduce herself personally to America on her own terms, and Fox News, WSJ, NRO to further expand the policy opinions she has been doing on Facebook for over a year.

I think it is having a positive effect.

109 Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2010 04:32 PM (IDL9N)

Chill, dude, I wasn't attacking him.  I respect him a lot for what he's doing in NJ.  I'm just not sure I want him as POTUS.

I didn't say he was a You-Tube bully.  I was referring to the fact that his major policy accomplishment, to my knowledge, has only been on fiscal/budgetary issues.  That I didn't know where he stood on anything else.

And, no, I didn't catch that story.  You got a link?  Love to read it.

For the record, I love his You-Tube tear-downs of the Education Establishment.  I just don't know enough about where he stands on other things which are important to me, and I tend to think that some of that would be better known by now- especially if he was considering a Presidential run in any way.

110

click on my URL to see the cover of "Time" mag. The picture is half colored, the rest is "color by number" unpainted.  This implies not only is she unformed, but that she's simplistic.  Think I'm projecting?  Read the article, where they lose no chance to draw attention to her inexperience, call her use of the words "death panels" as misleading, and other crap like that.

111

@99: "You had to have been There to appreciate Cali in the late sixties and early-mid Seventies"

I'm hip to your groove.

112 Sarah repeat after me: Ronald Reagan was in a movie with a chimpanzee. Posted by: Chicago Jedi at December 17, 2010 04:22 PM


She already mentioned that once, and it prompted much wailing from Peggy Noonan and Joe Scarborough about how she was "trashing Reagan's legacy".

Remember that stupid Politico piece by Joe, Mr. Civility?

Certain elements of the Right are trying to join the left in setting up a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario for whatever she says or does.

It is failing.

113 Y chromosome . male  -- Y not, not male  --biology humor    very dry

( not dude, dude )

114

I'm hip to your groove.

Posted by: Charles Manson at December 17, 2010 04:37 PM (xy9wk)

Yes, that's the ticket:  All Californians in that era were Charles Manson-esque

but first you will blow me  ---- and our weather is better than yours, etc

115 Posted by: SantaRosaStan at December 17, 2010 04:39 PM (UqKQV)

Everybody is "dude."  I guess I could use the more Texan "partner," but I like the fewer keystrokes.

Dude.

116 Yeah, I wouldn't mind her as VP on a ticket. 
Posted by: Jane D'oh at December 17, 2010 04:15 PM

Have you read Going Rogue? She will never relinquish that much control again.

117 Nurk is in NJ.
New Ark is in DE.

118
Chill, dude, I wasn't attacking him.  I respect him a lot for what he's doing in NJ.  I'm just not sure I want him as POTUS.

I didn't say he was a You-Tube bully.

--

I know you didn't.  'Sorry if it came out that way.  I tried to make it clear I didn't think you were saying those things, just that the "one trick pony" thing is a common meme that I'm hearing from both the MSM and conservative opponents of Christie's. I apologize if it seemed I was directing frustration at you.  (I am frustrated by the spin about Christie that, oddly, is appearing from both the Left and the Right.  I'd like to see what he can do in NJ to see if he has legs as a national candidate someday.)

Anyhoo, here's a link re the judicial stuff.  Note: it's not the original story that I found and I don't know this source, but skimming the article it seems to hit the factual points.  I'm too lazy to find the original source... sorry! 

119 54 Sarah quit. I don't care why. She's on a reality show. She forced her kid to Dance with the Stars. She has a funny accent. She's a woman. She tortures animals. She 's on that scary religion video. She gave birth to a retard. Anyone who defends her even a little bit is a screeching Palinbot harpy who wants Obama to be re-elected. And she's a media-whore. That's right, I said WHORE.

Did I miss anythnig?

You left out the part about her wanting Alaska to secede from the Union, or something.

120 113 Y chromosome . male  -- Y not, not male  --biology humor    very dry


Yeah, that's been pointed out to me before... although honestly it wasn't intended.

It now has another significance, coincidentally enough.  I'm in the Provo-Orem area now, but not at The "Y". 

121 I know you didn't.  'Sorry if it came out that way.  I tried to make it clear I didn't think you were saying those things, just that the "one trick pony" thing is a common meme that I'm hearing from both the MSM and conservative opponents of Christie's. I apologize if it seemed I was directing frustration at you.  (I am frustrated by the spin about Christie that, oddly, is appearing from both the Left and the Right.  I'd like to see what he can do in NJ to see if he has legs as a national candidate someday.)


Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2010 04:43 PM (IDL9N)

Am I witnessing the birth of the Cult of The Fat Man?

Surely not.

122

Check out NRO today.

Palin on the START treaty, and the death of the Omnibus Monstrosity.

She is doing a two pronged PR attack.

ABC, TLC to reintroduce herself personally to America on her own terms, and Fox News, WSJ, NRO to further expand the policy opinions she has been doing on Facebook for over a year.

I think it is having a positive effect.

A positive effect on who?

NRO, Fox News, the WSJ, Facebook- that's little more than preaching to the choir.  A reality TV show where she goes camping isn't going to change many minds about her being a good fit for President.

Let's face it- everybody knows who she is, what she stands for, and already has an opinion about her.  For the majority, that opinion consists of "do not want".  This after years of campaign debates, speeches, interviews, columns, appearances, books and a reality TV show.  The occasional "Good Morning America" fluff or NYT piece isn't going to dramatically change that.

123 Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2010 04:43 PM (IDL9N)

Fair enough.

I'm just one of those (I think) rational Palin supporters who can (and will) admit when she does something cringe-worthy (hasn't happened in a while, thankfully) but often get lumped in with the crazies like the folks on C4P.  It makes one a little twitchy in these threads.

124 I'd like to see a President West.  Every time a liberal criticizes him, I want to be able to call that liberal a racist.

125 Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 17, 2010 04:46 PM (plsiE)


Yes, we all know how public opinion is chiseled in granite two years out from an election.

How did that Battle of the Century turn out, Hillary vs. Rudy '08?

126 122 - Hollowpoint, I think about 99% of all republicans who desire to become president someday would trade places with her in about .00001 seconds.  She has a very large, very loyal, very active base from which she can reach just as far to the middle as she wants to get first primary votes, and then general election votes.  Name me a single other figure on the right with that advantage.

127 Am I witnessing the birth of the Cult of The Fat Man?

I am intrigued by what he's doing in New Jersey, but I put more weight (ahem) on efforts to fix things from the inside than I do on attacks from the outside.  So I tend to gravitate toward people who are currently running things... which means that I accept that those pols may have to be pragmatists and might therefore be less purely conservative (especially in a place like New Jersey). 

But I am interested in learning more about several folks, including Pence, Ryan, and maybe even Perry.   I don't really have a front runner yet. 

128 Fox News, WSJ, NRO to further expand the policy opinions she has been doing on Facebook for over a year.

But she hasn't spoken a word about policies.  We have no idea where she stands on anything.

129

Did I miss anythnig?

You left out the part about her wanting Alaska to secede from the Union, or something.

--------------------
Missed the Sesame Street episode about the letter P and the letter F, thinks North Korea is our ally, tucked Levi and Bristol into bed together.

130 McCain explained that, while she had never killed an animal before, she had done her fair share of shooting.

This makes me laugh. First Sarah is evil because she guns down wolves from a chopper like a helicopter door gunner in the shit. Then she can't handle a weapon as good as Meggie? I'm sorry Ramba but hunting is a little more complicated than simple accuracy; oh, and all the people who would listen to your opinion about shooting and think it was remotely informed, they are voting for Obama already.

131 128 - that's pretty obviously not true.  She is clearly able to communicate her values to many, who all have a pretty good idea where she stands on, say, gun rights, abortion, states rights, the role of the government in making our decisions for us, and suchlike.

132 Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2010 04:44 PM (IDL9N)

Okay, I read the piece.

I don't know enough about NJ politics to have much of an opinion on it, though.  Certainly the easiest thing for him to do would be to back down and re-nominate the judge he refused to re-nominate, and I know he has the guts not to do that, but since I don't know anything about his nominee, or his reasons for picking that nominee, I can't have much of an opinion.

For instance, he mentioned he didn't like the "balance" of the NJSC, if that's his only reason for nomination someone who is (presumably- again I don't know) more conservative, then he'll stop when he get's what we have in the US Supreme Court- rough parity.  That's not what I want- I want to stack the court with as many strict constitutionalists as we can.

All in all, I'll give him an A for standing up to his senate for principle, but an Incomplete on explaining that principle.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 17, 2010 04:46 PM (plsiE)

Oh, look, the "She can never be good enough.  Ever" brigade has arrived.

133 @123

I was very excited about Palin as a VP pick.  She motivated me to donate to that campaign (I was a disappointed Fred! supporter initially).  I thought she was the smartest move McCain made... then he blew it by mismanaging how he used her. 

But I have become much less enthusiastic about her over the past year and now have her in my second tier of candidates (with folks like Romney).  


ps:  I sincerely want to thank you for acknowledging that there are some Palin supporters whose enthusiasm for their candidate makes it virtually impossible to have a productive discussion about the 2012 election. 

134 Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 17, 2010 04:46 PM

I imagine some of this fluff can at least humanize her for people who think she's Eva Braun. A conservative friend of mine said she overheard some lefty asses talking about Bush's appearance on Oprah: "Y'know I have to admit, he did have some convincing arguments about going into Iraq." That's what it takes to change some people's minds.

135 Name another person in the GOP currently who exposed corruption in her own party at the risk of her own career rather than cover it up which happens all the time? Name another person in the GOP who took on the corrupt oil companies (the most powerful companies in the world) when they were screwing Alaska. Did she demonize them and threaten them like Maxine Waters? NO! She got tough with them and brokered fair deals that kept production high and incentivized new production. She also made sure they were 100% compliant with all safety measures and watched them like a hawk. Gulf oil spill ring a bell? (that rig was given a safety award) She reduced earmark requests by something like 80%. She instituted a REAL NET CUT in the budget by approximately 9% year over year. That is not a slowing in the rate of increase. That is a real cut of 9% compared to the Murkoski budget she "inherited." The budget surplus was not spent. She saved it for a rainy day. Crazy huh? For 50 years people talked about a gas line. She got it done in 2 years and used the free market and competitive bidding to get it done. FREE MARKET SOLUTIONS, not government bureaucracy. It's construction and maintenance will create real sustained jobs, unlike fantasy green jobs. She tackled the pension problems and instituted a hiring freeze while taking a zero based budgeting approach to keep the budget under control. Sounds like a good resume for an executive. She has also given speeches from Hong Kong to Phoenix on everything from QE2, border security, defense spending, the size of the navy, oversight of oil companies while unleashing energy production, zero based budgeting, the beauty of life, and so much more. Merry Christmas to all.

136 Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2010 04:54 PM (IDL9N)

Hey, sometimes I cringe when I read a piece over at C4P.  That's actually the biggest negative I have against her: the same "cult of personality" seems to be arising around Palin that arose around Obama. 

I think she's immeasurably better than he is, but that still scares me a little.  I want even the supporters of a candidate to be somewhat skeptical.

That said, after some floundering immediately after resigning, I think she's done much, much better about image and message control, and she is right on every issue I care about.  All of them.  I'd say she's the closest politician to me politically who is currently on the national radar- including my own Governor (Perry).

137 Posted by: Dan at December 17, 2010 04:58 PM (1jzSs)

And, to folks like Hollowpoint, that will never matter.

138 ps:  I sincerely want to thank you for acknowledging that there are some Palin supporters whose enthusiasm for their candidate makes it virtually impossible to have a productive discussion about the 2012 election. 

Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2010 04:54 PM (IDL9N)

I will join in that. There are some who are hyper-sensitive, and jump to questioning your motives, and sometimes your lineage, almost immediately.

I find this tedious, and unproductive. Just because you may have a different view than I do does not necessarily mean you are a stealthy paid Obama/Romneybot troll.

139 131 128 - that's pretty obviously not true.  She is clearly able to communicate her values to many, who all have a pretty good idea where she stands on, say, gun rights, abortion, states rights, the role of the government in making our decisions for us, and suchlike.

Look here, sonny, I'm an A-list Beltway pundit.  You're not.  I know better than you, and I will let you know all you need to about what's-her-face.

Are we clear on this?

140 For instance, he mentioned he didn't like the "balance" of the NJSC, if that's his only reason for nomination someone who is (presumably- again I don't know) more conservative, then he'll stop when he get's what we have in the US Supreme Court- rough parity.


Yeah, I apologize.  That was a lazy link.

I originally stumbled into the story via a conservative website... I can't remember where though.  Maybe Patterico?  Or Le-gal In-sur-rec-tion?  My take from that article/analysis, was that he was trying to put people on the court who would be folks conservatives would like.  Balance in NJ means having some conservatives since it's so blue. 

Maybe I'll find the original article.


But, look, if you are against any kind of gun control and that's one of your top issues, I doubt Christie -- or anyone from the Northeast -- will measure up for you. 

I grew up in Maryland.  And, although my parents are/were very conservative, my dad worked in the criminal justice system (in DC) and from that experience we developed a "no handguns in the house" outlook.  Guns were simply not part of our culture.  Even now, I can appreciate hunting weapons (and have shot skeet a couple of times), but I don't have a problem with there being some sorts of gun regulation at the local level. 

Which makes me a RINO, I guess. 

But even if I accepted the constitutional arguments I've read on the subject, it would not be a big issue for me, particularly because I don't think Christie would push for federal gun regulation.  I think he's a creature of his environment and, locally, gun control (regulation, not banning) makes sense. 

It's the same thing as pro-life stuff.  I am a no-exceptions pro-lifer, but I would not vote against a candidate based on that issue... as long as he or she was not actively trying to promote abortions. 

141

122 - Hollowpoint, I think about 99% of all republicans who desire to become president someday would trade places with her in about .00001 seconds.  She has a very large, very loyal, very active base from which she can reach just as far to the middle as she wants to get first primary votes, and then general election votes.  Name me a single other figure on the right with that advantage.

That large, loyal, active base is her strength, but it's far too small to win a general election.

Her latest efforts might have worked in 2007 before she was well known.  Now, when 60% say they wouldn't consider voting for her in a general election, and would prefer a failed incumbent with a 40% approval rating?  Not so much.

142 It doesn't matter what question is asked by the liberal media and it doesn't matter what Sarah Palin says. It will be loaded as a STOOOOPPPPIIIIIID answer. And the average American idiot - many of whom couldn't even tell you who our Vice President is - will mindlessly nod their head in agreement - concluding that Palin's historically proven, common sense answer about lower taxes - in which they know nothing about - is somehow wrong . "Cause, you know, that episode of Family Guy said she was dumb, it must be true. Plus, did you see the SNL skit last night? Obviously that is more important than her record as Governor - in which I know nothing about".

So many people hate her and they don't even know why. They just see the negative press everywhere and don't even consider the agenda behind it. I've heard it all - mostly from younger people. "Palin celebrates teen pregnancies!" "No I don't like her, she hates teachers" "She's totally using her sexual appeal, she's like a slut!"

*sigh* Sometimes I just hate humans in general. So many people are so God damn stupid that it's amazing humanity has made it this far. If there's one thing I can give the democratic leadership props for, its that they recognize that while an individual is smart - groups of people are mindless sheep - and can be manipulated as such.

143 Besides, I worked for Walter Mondale.

I know a winner when I see one.

144

128 - that's pretty obviously not true.  She is clearly able to communicate her values to many, who all have a pretty good idea where she stands on, say, gun rights, abortion, states rights, the role of the government in making our decisions for us, and suchlike.

Preaching to the choir isn't going to change the minds of the non-political, independent squish voters.

Her role is best suited to rallying the base, which she does well.  After years of letting people know where she stands, the general public just isn't interested.

145 The same 60% who are indifferent to Obamacare, after the election, who don't understand why we're in Afghanistan, yes I rely on their sterling wisdom.

146 Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2010 05:03 PM (IDL9N)

True, and (unless he went full McCain) I would vote for Christie after the primaries- but I'd work to support my candidate (again, currently Palin, but someone else might surprise me) until then.

I've got no specific problem with Chris Christie, I just know that he and I disagree on some issues (which, as you point out, make him more palatable in NJ).  Given that the Primaries are when we get to hash out those differences, I'll use that chance to let him prove his mettle, should he decide to enter the race.

Unlike, say Romney, who I will actively work to defeat- until and unless he actually comes around on RomneyCare and admits it was a mistake not to fight it til the bitter end.  Or, at least, that it was a mistake ever to claim it as an accomplishment.

147 Which makes me a RINO, I guess. 

No, just naive; maybe stupid.

148 Posted by: JC at December 17, 2010 05:07 PM (bfRjR)

Dang.  Those Persians are just going to roll over us no matter what.  Maybe we should just stay home.

149 Dang.  Those Persians are just going to roll over us no matter what.  Maybe we should just stay home.

Posted by: King Leonidas at December 17, 2010 05:12 PM (8y9MW)

They DID. You got killed.

150 After years of letting people know where she stands, the general public just isn't interested


My crystal ball is broken, so I have no idea what Palin's future holds.  She does have an enthusiastic base and I confess I was surprised to discover recently that part of that enthusiastic group includes extremely wealthy, business-savvy Mormons. 

So that's interesting. 

But I still think that talk is cheap.  And, ultimately, she would generate a lot of traction with regular (apolitical) people if she ran something well.  And, the more I think about it, I think that "something" should be a charity.  Think about how powerful it would be if she was visiting Haiti as the CEO of the Red Cross or something of that nature.  It would allow her to further solidify her as a competent executive and permit her to show how she tackles problems of broad interest. 

So that's my advice to her... not that she's asking. 

151

Yes, we all know how public opinion is chiseled in granite two years out from an election.

How did that Battle of the Century turn out, Hillary vs. Rudy '08?

Public opinion about people they've not seen on the campaign trail, or those they're not familar with is far easier to change than for people like Palin who they're already very familar with on and off the campaign trail.

She might be capable of winning the primary, but not in the general election.  Someone you agree with 100% but is doomed to lose does no good at all compared to a candidate you only agree with 90% of the time, but can win.

152 No, just naive; maybe stupid. Posted by: Pelvis at December 17, 2010 05:11 PM

Not as stupid as someone who insults someone instead of trying to persuade them. 

But you know that already no doubt. 

153 And, the more I think about it, I think that "something" should be a charity.  Think about how powerful it would be if she was visiting Haiti as the CEO of the Red Cross or something of that nature.  It would allow her to further solidify her as a competent executive and permit her to show how she tackles problems of broad interest. 

So that's my advice to her... not that she's asking. 

Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2010 05:14 PM (IDL9N)

Every celebrity has a pet charity or foundation. Its not a big deal to "run" them.

Frankly, I don't think it matters a lot. If she runs and wins, the same ones who grumbled before will have always been on the bandwagon. Just like was the case with Reagan. I don't think crossing off the boxes on anyone's checklist will help.

154 Posted by: Oldcat at December 17, 2010 05:13 PM (z1N6a)

Yeah, but my people remained free and kicked their rears all they way back to Persia.  Then Alexander and his Medes kicked their rears again.

155

She might be capable of winning the primary, but not in the general election.  Someone you agree with 100% but is doomed to lose does no good at all compared to a candidate you only agree with 90% of the time, but can win.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 17, 2010 05:15 PM (plsiE)

Yes, she might be like McCain. Or she might not.

156

The same 60% who are indifferent to Obamacare, after the election, who don't understand why we're in Afghanistan, yes I rely on their sterling wisdom.

It's not a question of their wisdom, it's the fact that they outnumber us and vote.

Every election pretty much boils down to having about 1/3 of voters being Republicans, 1/3 Dems, and 1/3 independents who for the most part are not very politically active or aware- yet if you lose that demographic, you lose the election.  Palin scores badly with that group (for reasons that are irrelevant), and that's why she can't win.

157 Yeah, but my people remained free and kicked their rears all they way back to Persia.  Then Alexander and his Medes kicked their rears again.

Posted by: King Leonidas at December 17, 2010 05:18 PM (8y9MW)

Not your people - the Athenians did that. And Alexander was a Macedonians. Medes are the Persians.

158 Every celebrity has a pet charity or foundation. Its not a big deal to "run" them

I disagree with you.  Not all charities or foundations are the same.  Look at their books and the scope of their organizations and you can tell the ones that are essentially like small countries from the rest. 

159

>> And, to folks like Hollowpoint, that will never matter.

He's not the problem.  The 60% is the problem.  There's another factor too, were she to win the nomination, she'll face an opponent who actually has (will have) 4 years of experience as the President of the United States. Her resume will be half a governorship.

I'll grant you that's no more experience than Obama had going in, but it won't matter then.  Because it won't be the same then.

If it came to that, sure, you and I would vote for her, but we won't be enough.

160 Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2010 05:15 PM (IDL9N)

I think he was kidding.  I hope.

And, as this isn't a gun control thread, I won't pontificate on my opinion on that matter here.

Posted by: Oldcat at December 17, 2010 05:17 PM (z1N6a)

And that's depressingly true.  On both points.

Maybe if she and Todd bought some other fishing operations and set up PalinCo?  I dunno.  I really don't think anything except actually forcing people to pay attention will help.  Hollowpoint notwithstanding, "most" American people aren't even really aware of Sarah Palin at the moment, so when you ask about her, they're still remembering Tina Fey on SNL and her couple of TV interviews.

161

But I still think that talk is cheap.  And, ultimately, she would generate a lot of traction with regular (apolitical) people if she ran something well.  And, the more I think about it, I think that "something" should be a charity.  Think about how powerful it would be if she was visiting Haiti as the CEO of the Red Cross or something of that nature.  It would allow her to further solidify her as a competent executive and permit her to show how she tackles problems of broad interest. 

So that's my advice to her... not that she's asking. 

That's good advice; I agree.

Hit and run appearances, book tours and TV shows aren't going to be enough; she needs to start thinking long term.  2012 isn't going to be her year; in the meantime she needs to establish herself in some form of a leadership position.

162 However, that said, I do not believe Sarah Palin is un-electactable. Yes, her popularity is underwater, but that's because most people don't know anything about her. Everything they hear about Palin is negative - seen through the eye's of hollywood dopes and biased journalists. Most Americans don't read her posts, books, or colunms. And most don't listen to her speeches or her ideas. They hear about her - not from her. And usually - 9 times out of 10 - the source they hear about Palin is from the liberal dominated media.

When/If she runs for POTUS - that will all change. Yes, the media will still try to destroy her; But people will hear directly from her. Wether from debates, campaign speeches, interviews, ect. When she's standing next to Obama making the case for limited government, lower taxes, repealing government health care, stronger national defense, strengthening our bond with allies - who do you think the people will choose? The media can, and will, spin it all they want. But millions of Americans will watch those debates and see the difference for themselves.

163 Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2010 05:14 PM (IDL9N)

It's good advice. 

164

She might be capable of winning the primary, but not in the general election.  Someone you agree with 100% but is doomed to lose does no good at all compared to a candidate you only agree with 90% of the time, but can win.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 17, 2010 05:15 PM (plsiE)

In 2007-08, I swore up and down there is no way America would elect a community organizer who just showed up in the Senate, and whose middle name is fucking Hussein, in the middle of a war against Islamic terrorists.

Look what happened.

165 Sarah repeat after me: Ronald Reagan was in a movie with a chimpanzee.

History dodged a bullet with that one.  If Bonzo had eaten his face off, he never would have been elected governor, let alone president.  It's funny how much chaos theory affects our lives.

166 Posted by: Oldcat at December 17, 2010 05:20 PM (z1N6a)

The Athenians: Only with our help.  And better technology than we had, but I maintain it wouldn't have mattered.
The Medes:  Dang, you're right, I grabbed the wrong 'M' people.

167 But millions of Americans will watch those debates and see the difference for themselves.

Posted by: JC at December 17, 2010 05:23 PM (bfRjR)

Which again was what Reagan did. The Media had him in the box - Bonzo, Actor, Old. He used them to get out of the box and connect directly with the people, after which what the media said did not matter anymore.

Can Sarah do it? Maybe. But there's no use counting polls and surveys about it, because they don't matter. What was Obama's rank on these same polls in 2006? Zero, I'm sure.

168 After what I saw in 2009/2012 nationally and locally I firmly believe there are too many stupid people that vote. I have no confidence in voters to do what is good for America.

169 Out of curiosity I looked up the top foundations (U.S.) by assets.  Here's the list.  Most of them are liberal or too targeted in what they do (ie: lots of medical foundations) for Palin to be an appropriate CEO, I guess. 


Not a charity, but who runs the NRA? 

170 Cancel that NRA question.  Wouldn't help broaden her appeal.

Maybe the Nature Conservancy? 

171

I love free-market principles and look forward to a highly competitive primary campaign season-hoping Herman Cain joins in the competition. 

 I'd be happy with either Palin or Cain mixing up the stiff-necked Ruling Classers and their Corrupt Bastard's Club.

 

Oh, and time for stale and stiff-necked Krauthammer to LEAVE THE ROOM-his fucking regressive backwardness is as boring as Barracky's own pompous bullshit 

172 Posted by: Dave in Texas at December 17, 2010 05:21 PM (WvXvd)

See, I'm not at all sure about that- and you really shouldn't be, either.

Election season can do wacky things to politics.

I do think it'll be an up hill climb.  I think it may be more difficult than if we have a "less damaged" name.  But I can't think of any of the less damaged names who I agree with nearly as much (I'm reserving judgment on most of them).

The thing about that 60% is that they haven't been paying attention.  Not to Sarah Palin anyway.  Give it the Primary season when they'll see and hear from her every day, and that may change.  If it doesn't, then she'll probably lose the primary.

173

However, that said, I do not believe Sarah Palin is un-electactable. Yes, her popularity is underwater, but that's because most people don't know anything about her.

You're joking, right?

They've seen her debate and campaign.  They've seen her give speeches and interviews, they've seen her on TV, and you can't open a newspaper, turn on the TV news, or read a political blog without Palin being mentioned.

Yet you believe that more speeches, interviews, and debates would be somehow change the outlook of people who for the most part have already made up their minds?

What's that they say about performing the same action repeatedly but expecting a different result each time?

 

174

>> The thing about that 60% is that they haven't been paying attention.

Ninja please. She has red-hot name recognition.  She is known by "a whole shitload of the electorate", most of whom have already formed an opinion.

Otherwise her negatives in polls would be miniscule.  It would be "60%, no opinion".

175

What's that they say about performing the same action repeatedly but expecting a different result each time?

 

Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 17, 2010 05:35 PM (plsiE)

"Hollowpoint is posting again" ?

176

Sarah quit. I don't care why

 

 

If you are going to use this argument against anyone running for President then you've just taken Chris Christie out of game since he'd have to QUIT in order to run.

 

 

177 Something conservation-focused would be a good choice.

There are three factors that she would need to consider

size - It has to be big enough to gain national attention and demonstrate that she can handle a large project, but it has to be small enough that she has day to day operational input.  If it is too large, then she risks becoming a figurehead, or at least accused of it.

politicization - It has to be something that tracks with a conservative philosophy, but is non political. 

timeliness - It has to have an endstate, and one that can be achieved by early 2012.  Open ended projects, such as AIDS assistance for Africa, would either draw away attention during a campaign, or would become baggage if a scandal occurs after she leaves.

178

Can Sarah do it? Maybe. But there's no use counting polls and surveys about it, because they don't matter. What was Obama's rank on these same polls in 2006? Zero, I'm sure.

Except that's the point.  Obama was able to present himself to a public that didn't know much about him or have strong opinions towards him.  As such, he was able to hoodwink people into believing that he was a moderate "post-partisan" policy genius who could part the Red Sea and heal the sick with a wave of his hand.  The squishy middle who votes more on emotion than policy bought the act, and the rest is history.

Palin can't do that- for the most part people already have strong opinons about her, and for the majority that opinion is negative.  There just aren't enough "undecideds" out there to swing.

179 152 No, just naive; maybe and stupid. Posted by: Pelvis at December 17, 2010 05:11 PM

Not as stupid as someone who insults someone instead of trying to persuade them. 

But you know that already no doubt. 
FIXED   Try this:  No guns, no rights.  Too complicated?   Or, First registration, than confiscation. Eventually.   At least you got to work in the RINO thing. So there is that.

180 Posted by: Dave in Texas at December 17, 2010 05:37 PM (WvXvd)

I think you missed what I'm saying.  I'm not saying she isn't known, I'm saying that they stopped paying attention to her.  Probably right after she stepped down as Governor.

I believe (and, obviously, I have no way to prove this, but talking with people around me who have a negative opinion of Sarah Palin, I've got some anecdotal evidence) that when you ask an "approve/disapprove" question about Sarah Palin, people are still thinking of Sarah Palin as portrayed in the Primary ("I can see Russia from my House!"*) or right after her resignation (Quitter!!).

I think that if they actually see her on TV and hear her real positions, a lot of that negative feeling will go away.

Again, I could be wrong- but if I am , that will almost certainly be borne out during the Primaries.

* - Yes, I know she didn't say that, I'm referring to her image, not the actual facts.

Posted by: Oldcat at December 17, 2010 05:37 PM (z1N6a)

LOL.

181 The process of a Presidential primary campaign is itself transformative to the public.

Look at Obama and Huckabee. The narrative on them both changed drastically after each of them won the Iowa caucuses.

America loves a comeback story, and a winner.

Should she turn in a couple of good debates, have consistently packed events, grind it out on the ground in Iowa and come out on top, that mushy center will have a different view than they do today.

If she can't pull it off, then we need to know that too.

Run Sarah, go for it. It will be good for the country either way.

182 cooperating with a host of neutral media outlets, notably The New York Times, TIME and ABC News

I snorted out loud.

183 Posted by: Pelvis at December 17, 2010 05:42 PM (LlaBi)

How's this: STFU.

You went straight from no posts on this issue (since there hadn't been any on the thread until Y-Not's) to insults and sneering.  You didn't even try to have a discussion about the matter.

For your information, there are a lot of people who believe (and with some good reason) that guns actually cause more harm than they fix.  I disagree with them, and I think there is a lot of data to back me up (more in a Genie out of the bottle way than because I think they're intrinsically good, by the way).  But you don't win arguments by being a jerk.

Like I tell my 3 yr old when he tries to help me dress his sister (though I'm usually gently chiding him): Stop Helping.

184

Yes, long before his career as a Republican star and his two full terms as Governor of CA.

 

Is was sad that the GOP Ruling Class killed off Ronald Reagan's first run for the Presidency.

Now we all know how America ended up with fucking Nixon and Carter in the same fucking decade. 

 

Viva the Reagan Revolution-he conquered the fucking stiff-necked Ruling Class GOP  Corrupt Bastard's Club

 

 (while that stiff-necked boring as Barracky Krauthammer wrote speeches for fucking Democrat Walter Mondale)

 

185 They've seen her debate and campaign.  They've seen her give speeches and interviews, they've seen her on TV, and you can't open a newspaper, turn on the TV news, or read a political blog without Palin being mentioned.

Um, there's a difference from listening to a speech, and listening to a suit on CNN claim that her speech was meaningless and didn't provide substance. You're delusional if you think people's minds are made up based on honest critique. Every damn day there's a new "scandal" so insanely stupid as to defy all reality. "Is Palin's boobs real"? "Is Palin secretly cheating to help her daughter on dancing with the stars? Did Palin roll her eyes to that lady who was a teacher? Does she hate teachers?" Not just in blogs and TV, but on news channels.

If you think this stuff doesn't have any effect on the public then you don't understand basic propaganda.

186 Did I miss anythnig

Yawn. You forgot to mention you're a lonely loser troll.

187 Mrs. Palin is pretty savvy. I can see her gaining a ton of credibility on the dime and resources of the legacy media.
Payback in spades.

188

For those that say that Palin has only done Fox News interviews since Catty Curic, I think Palin has done a total of 8 interviews with Walters, Oprah, and Matt Lauer combined. EIGHT! How is that hiding from the main stream media.

It should also be noted that I believe Obama from the time he announced his  run for president in February 2007 through January 2008 did no more then 3 interviews nationally. Yet nobody complaigned about this unknown nobody not doing interviews. Although I remember Chris Mathews whining about him not going on MSNBC in December of 2007. Obama didn't even do interviews there.

A lot of amnesia out there.

189 PS,
Thanks Ace!

190

competent executive

 

Do you mean competent experience like Gov  Chris Christie shell-gaming the system by taking money from the NJ  RGGI (greenies program to fraud NJ big business) to use to fiill the massives holes in NJsover-bloated  budget?

 

Thanks to Chris Christie NJ's Fat Budget is addicted to fucking Tax and Cap Fraud.

 

Some fucking Fiscal Conservative he turned out to be-now we all know the reason why Chris Christie sucked Mike Castle's 'Cap and Tax' dick.

191 >>  I'm not saying she isn't known, I'm saying that they stopped paying attention to her.  Probably right after she stepped down as Governor.

I rather think Sarah and the hostile MFM are both making damned sure a lot of people continue to pay attention to her.  So no, I don't buy that at all.

192 "The proposed New START agreement should be evaluated by the only criteria that matters for a treaty: Is it in AmericaÂ’s interest? I am convinced this treaty is not. It should not be rammed through in the lame duck session using behind the scenes deal-making reminiscent of the tactics used in the health care debate. New START actually requires the U.S. to reduce our nuclear weapons and allows the Russians to increase theirs. This is one-sided and makes no strategic sense. New STARTÂ’s verification regime is weaker than the treaty it replaces, making it harder for us to detect Russian cheating. Since we now know Russia has not complied with many arms control agreements currently in force, this is a serious matter." I donÂ’t know, she seems pretty schooled to me, not to mentionÂ… RIGHT!

193

If you think this stuff doesn't have any effect on the public then you don't understand basic propaganda.

And all that is going to change 180 degrees if she runs for president?

It doesn't really matter why her approval ratings are low, or how they got there.  She's had over two years of very high exposure to turn it around, but she hasn't.

Had she dropped out of sight completely after Nov 2008 (and finished her term), she might have had a chance to re-invent herself in the eyes of the public.  I'm glad she stayed politically active, but between her resignation as governor (regardless of the reasons) and silly reality TV publicity stunts, the next year won't be nearly enough to get people to view her as a serious contender worthy of the presidency.

The members of her personality cult need to recognize the vast difference between desperately wanting a candidate to win and that candidate's ability to win.

194 Posted by: Dave in Texas at December 17, 2010 05:58 PM (WvXvd)

Like I said, all my evidence is personal and anecdotal, so I could easily be wrong.  I'm just going with what I'm seeing.

I mean, let's not kid ourselves.  Even with 6+ million viewers, her show on TLC is not exactly getting the word out to the masses.  Yes, that's a lot of people, but in the last election there were (I believe) over 100 million votes cast.  So that's roughly 6% of the voting population, assuming that every viewer is a voter.  If you then assume half of that is people who already like Palin, then you're down to 3% of people who would be the targets of any persuasive component to the show.

Not exactly the 60% who say they have a negative view of her, there.

And what the Media has done since then is actually to try to prevent people from paying attention to her.  By reporting on what she's doing (usually without anything but the barest of clips or excerpts) and then pontificating a great deal on what they'd like people to believe, what they're really doing is, as Ace says, "hit whoring" based on Palin's name.

I doubt that 1 in 10 people could tell you Sarah Palin's specific position on, say, the Scope and Size of the Federal Government.  Or illegal immigration.  Or whatever.  Or what was in her letter to the incoming freshmen Representatives.

During a campaign, they will be less able to do that (not unable, unfortunately, but less able).

195

AllenG love your work. Not being sarcastic, I think you may be smarter than myself.

Still: FYNQ.

I comment on what I want to.  I am not here to win anything.  My original comment was: naive, maybe stupid.

Return comment from Y, confirmed it for me IMO. Go play father to sombody else.

 

196 Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 17, 2010 06:07 PM (plsiE)

And the members of the "Oh noes! Not Sarah" cult need to figure out that they're just as steeped in fantasy if they think they can predict, with any great certainty, what will happen in a Presidential election in 2 years.

And, as has been said about other politicians, I'm done voting for someone "I think can win" just because I think they can win.  The one closest to my ideology gets my vote.  Period.  If she wins the Primary, so be it.  If not, I'll deal.

197 (There just aren't enough "undecideds" out there to swing.) First: I find it annoying when this subject comes up how anti-Palin people speak with a crystal ball - no other politician would be counted out like that, they just wouldn't. Even someone with a sex scandal can make a come back. So why not Sarah Palin? And there is really no way to measure who is undecided a year and a half out - polls are only about the moment, not the future.

198

There's a helluva lot of "decides" right now.  See "60% - No".

But she'll turn it around.  With Twitter and Facebook.

199

196=Great example.

I would add the "lesser of two evils", as well.

200 Heavy on the funny, morons. Remember, we have fans in Afghanistan.

201 An Afghani, a nun, and a goat, walk into a non-alcoholic bar.....

202

And the members of the "Oh noes! Not Sarah" cult need to figure out that they're just as steeped in fantasy if they think they can predict, with any great certainty, what will happen in a Presidential election in 2 years.

And, as has been said about other politicians, I'm done voting for someone "I think can win" just because I think they can win.  The one closest to my ideology gets my vote.  Period.  If she wins the Primary, so be it.  If not, I'll deal.

Those of us paying attention were easily able to predict "with great certainty" that Ron Paul wouldn't win the nomination or that Bob Dole was finished the moment he won the primary.

How well will you "deal" if we make the mistake of nominating her, only to hand Obama another 4 years?  Is satisfying your ego worth another years of Obama fuckupery?

Focusing only on ideology or only on electability is a mistake.  The most conservative candidate with a strong chance of winning is what we need to look for, and Palin simply doesn't meet the latter criteria, not for 2012.

Hopefully she can rebuild her image in time, but it's going to take more than interviews, books, Facebook posts or reality TV shows to do it.

203

How well will you "deal" if we make the mistake of nominating her, only to hand Obama another 4 years?  Is satisfying your ego worth another years of Obama fuckupery?

Focusing only on ideology or only on electability is a mistake.  The most conservative candidate with a strong chance of winning is what we need to look for, and Palin simply doesn't meet the latter criteria, not for 2012.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 17, 2010 07:15 PM (plsiE)

If AllenG is the only voter in the GOP primaries in 2012, this country will be in a very different place than I expect it will be.

Since there are likely going to be millions of votes for all the candidates, pretending that AllanG's decision is significant strains credulity.

204 Bear in mind, this is why we have competitive primaries. We try not to let the news media and the Democrats pick our nominees for us. If Palin succeeds beyond all measure, she will win and be the comeback story of 2012. She'll probably win the election, too, because right now, the press and the Democrats are throwing everything they can at her and she's still going. BTW, any national poll taken twelve months out of the first caucus of living humans using the 2008 turnout model is garbage. That's exactly what NBC and ABC did in both of their polls. Neither poll has any validity to it.

205 Hopefully she can rebuild her image in time, but it's going to take more than interviews, books, Facebook posts or reality TV shows to do it. The rebuilding proceeds at a pace, the while while the current occupant is sinking on his feet of clay. Since we're all speaking with certainty, I shall also: Nominate a Romney, or Huckerter type politico and count on more Obama. Thus far the only person I've actually seen taking it to Obama with any balls, is... Sarah Palin. She's also willing to take on the establishment. I see very little point choosing an establishment, wishy-washy candidate. Been there, done that - We got Obama. As for these "60 % Decides" let me float a theory, they really are not really decided. What they are is giving 1: An expected "right answer" and 2 being asked this outside the venue of an on going election where two or more candidates are trying to get elected. When the primaries actually start with declared runners/results shaping peoples views I'll take polls more serious. At the moment polls are meaningless to me for telling me anything important - for any undeclared candidate's potential to run and win, as its really only asking a hypothetical. And no, I don't assume how people respond to hypotheticals as telling as its all still abstract until you either enter the voting booth or watch an ongoing competition. Also don't discount the value of: Twitter, Facebook and an 8 week bit of face time to change and brighten one's image. Obama won with an even sparser foundation...

206
Answer:  a hollow point.

Question:  what is a description of Mitt Romney's head? 

Never entrust power to anyone not willing to surrender it.

207

Focusing only on ideology or only on electability is a mistake.  The most conservative candidate with a strong chance of winning is what we need to look for, and Palin simply doesn't meet the latter criteria, not for 2012.

You mean like that "Mike Castle is the best conservative we've got to win over Christine O'Donnell" stuff?   The same Mike Castle who's currently screwing over the GOP with his demotard votes?  Yep, we dodged a bullet with that witch babe.

208 The same Mike Castle who's currently screwing over the GOP

If you say his name three times, Tattoo will appear.

209 I want her to run,, if for nothing else, to have a Tea Party voice in the debates.

She can challenge the others on stuff we would say if we were up there (within reason), and help shape the direction of the campaign.

If she does that well enough, we may just wind up with her doing it to Obama on live TV with 70-80 million people watching. Maybe more.

That could very well be the moment when President Palin comes to life for real.

210

Read Palin's record and compare to anyone else you would like to see as President, then get back to all of us with facts, not sentiment, emotion and/or knee jerk reaction to any candidate of the moment (Herman Cain comes to mind).  Let's not get wrapped up in bs like "she quit as gov", the Katie Couric interview, her daughter got pregnant, then did DWTS, and all the other nonsense.  Look at her record as city council member, Mayor, Oil & Gas Commissioner (or whatever her title was) and her 2 1/2 years as governor....let's look at what she accomplished.  And as far as only serving 2 1/2 years as gov, I would go out on a limb and say she probably accomplished more in that time than other governors in 4 years.  Just a guess.

As far as how Palin handles the media, that is her call; I trust her judgment, not any one elses.  Whose to say she needs to be interviewed by all the liberal creeps?  I would like her better if she told some of them to "pound sand". 

 

211 In a way she should be on the hostile media, but on the other hand they will do everything to torpedo here the second they get in the same room with her. My compromise suggestion is let her agree to do an hour long interview on ABC with John Stossel , who would be tough but fair.

212 Why do you continue to give credibility to anything Miss Mac n Cheese says?

She is a rich kid who has done nothing.  She worked on the failed campaign of a guy who lost to a man with no accomplishments to his name.

If that's the new criteria for credibility, I'm going long on US Treasuries because we have discovered perpetual idiocy.

213 Obama should be the person of the year and under his cover picture it should say: "2010: The Year He Finally Started Listening To Us Instead of Lecturing Us, And Reading the Teleprompter To Us, And Calling Us All Stupid Racists"

214 http://www.typier.com