1

So, how long do the MA Dims need to keep Brown from his seat now.

Gettin betta & betta

2 Why not just say any plan held by a Democratic contributer is exempt?

3 So Harry "The Ball Less Wonder" Reid won't use the nuclear option in the Senate? heh...putz

4 Of course he will, torabora

5

"I definitely think thereÂ’s increasing support in the caucus for some kind of a tax on plans that executives and wealthy people have," said Rep. Jared Polis (D-Colo.).

Or maybe members of Congress.  But that's just crazy talk.

 

6 More examples of government picking winners and losers...that is exactly what the problem with Washington is.

7 I'm not falling for that again.  I'll wait until nOcare is buried with Hoffa.

8 2  That is a great idea!!  Thanks.

9 At this point I'm not sure I trust this whole "HC bill is in jeopardy, we're going to put it off for a bit" schtick.  What I fear will happen is that suddenly there will be a "Eureka! We've done it!" announcement and the dems will ramrod everything through in a flurry of activity.

On the other hand, it does appear to be quite problematic for the dems.  Stupak et al is rumored to not be on board for the Senate bill's abortion language, and he's got a solid 12 with him.  Add the ones whose union backers are calling them and saying "get that cadillac plans thing out of that bill or we'll support your opponent in November".....

Still, I don't trust any of them.

10

Hopefully Brown will win and end this catastrophe.

It might be that Democrats actually want that to happen. At this point they might prefer to lose, so long as they can blame Republicans.

Why?  What were they doing up until now, blaming themselves?

11

"I definitely think thereÂ’s increasing support in the caucus for some kind of a tax on plans that executives and wealthy people have," said Rep. Jared Polis (D-Colo.).

 

That lie has already been debunked. The overwhelming majority of these so-called plans are by unions and government workers. The numbers are also not inflation adjusted.

 

Ah. Union-negotiated health care plans would be exempted from the excise tax. How novel -- buying off a specific constituency. This is only the thirtieth time they've done this in the bill.

 

Are you sure on this Ace? I downloaded both the House and Senate versions of the bill and could find no exemption in it for the Unions.  It doesnÂ’t make sense that the unions would be fighting this if they were exempted.

12

In any case this is all bluster for the cameras. Every time someone has predicted the death of this POS it has squeaked through via a few sellouts like Nelson.

 

13 Do I need to say it?

14 Sweet, sweet news.  Puts me in the mood (again) for Ray Steven's "We The People".  Over 2,000,000 views, now,  and counting ...

LINK

15

Help me to follow this logic (surely I have this wrong!):

If Union Negotiated Health Care Benefits are exempted as a special interest group, and only Union and Government Workers would qualify for the tax then the tax is only for show in the first place. Because SEIU as a Union would also exempt MOST of the Government Workers wouldn't it?

16 It might be that Democrats actually want that to happen. At this point they might prefer to lose, so long as they can blame Republicans.

I've been thinking along these lines for a few weeks.  That Reid, Pelosi et al would be willing to throw Coakley under the bus to protect their own political skin come November.

Reid would do it to help get re-elected as Senator.  Pelosi would do it to ensure Democratic control of the House and her leadership position; if she lost the House don't think for a moment that she would lose the position of Minority Leader.

17 I'm no lawyer, but surely there are some equal protection problems with writing legislation that exempts certain groups from costs that every one else is expected to pony up to.

18
Hopefully Brown will win and end this catastrophe.

Please please please please......

Speaking of which..... anybody see the video of the reporter from the Weekly Reporter that got roughed up by one of Coakleys entourage???

19 Speaking of which..... anybody see the video of the reporter from the Weekly Reporter that got roughed up by one of Coakleys entourage???.

errr typo....

Weekly Standard

20

I don't give a Rangle's ass who they blame it on, just kill the damn thing. Then if they want to credit the GOP with saving the country from socialism, so be it!

21

As I said earlier, I could find NO exemption in either the House Bill or the Senate Bill for unions.

Of course the House Bill doesn't have a cadillac tax in it, it just added a surtax to anyone making over $1,000,000 a year.

 

22 I'm no lawyer, but surely there are some equal protection problems with writing legislation that exempts certain groups from costs that every one else is expected to pony up to.

Yeah, you'd think.  I can't remember all the states but there are a number of R Senators asking the AG for their states to investigate precisely that due to Nelson's deal. 

23 #18  Dave in SD.   The Dems will not give up ANY seat, House or Senate without a fight to the death. Any dirty trick to win is always required. It's in their DNA. There moto is never give up!

24 Rangel could tell me it's Wednesday and I'd still check my calendar.  I wouldn't rust one single word a Demonrat tells me on any topic at any time.  THEY LIE.

25 Lets see how long Rangel lasts after they promise to drop all IRS charges and allow him to remain head of the Ways and Means. These people are just plain old fashioned thieves! There is no shame in DC any longer and we need to clean the place out. I agree that this not-until-Feb. is probably a ploy to make everyone relax and then Obama will find the solution to their problem and become the towering figure that he is within his own head.

26 I thought there was supposed to be an exemption for police, firefighter & longshoremen's union plans from the Cadillac tax?

27

*mimics motion for male self-satisfaction*

Yeah, yeah.  I hear ya talkin.'

28

We're all Amish now.

*Looks around for hat*

29
Over at NRO's "Doctor Doctor" blog it says this:

Feingold: Cornhusker Kickback Will Be Stripped   [Daniel Foster]

Sen. Russ Feingold (D., Wis.) has joined fellow Senate Democrats Sherrod Brown (D., Ohio) and Blanche Lincoln (D., Ark.) in telling constituents that Nebraska's sweetheart Medicaid deal will likely be stripped from health-care reform in conference negotiations.

Feingold told constituents in Wis., today that Nelson's provision will probably be stripped.

“Well, whether that provision was legal or illegal, it shouldn’t have been done,” Feingold said, referring to the lawsuit being brought by a number of state attorneys general. "I understand that Sen. Ben Nelson has already indicated he knows he’s probably not going to get it in the end. I think it’s going to get stripped from the bill."

Really? hmmmm.

30 24

As I said earlier, I could find NO exemption in either the House Bill or the Senate Bill for unions.

Posted by: Vic at January 13, 2010 01:25 PM (QrA9E)

 

Then Amish it is. 

Me think an "Amish for Idiots" self help book would rake in big $$$, just saying...

31

I thought there was supposed to be an exemption for police, firefighter & longshoremen's union plans from the Cadillac tax?

Section 6001 of the Senate bill provides for an "increase in the amount considered an "excessive coverage" for hazordous professions. The theory being that their insurance will cost more than normal professions.

They also increase the amount for "high cost states".

They do not define what the high risk professions are but neither do they totally exempt them from the tax.

32 Ah. Union-negotiated health care plans would be exempted from the excise tax. How novel -- buying off a specific constituency. They just might get their revolution afterall. Just won't be the one that they were hoping for.

33
Sen. Ben Nelson has already indicated he knows heÂ’s probably not going to get it in the end.

I really wish I could say the same.......

34 Rangel is full of lies as he is obviously not a light-skinned Negro, not clean and speaks with a Negro accent.  Unless he doesn't want to, of course.

35 At this point they might prefer to lose, so long as they can blame Republicans.

I don't know about the "can". They are going to blame Republicans, no matter what, and they'll demonize Republicans even if they pass this hulking, smelly, un-Constitutional POS. The Dems have the chutzpah to claim that they have been open throughout this process (of one short-term deadline which would preclude reading current legislation after another and one vote for "bills" that bare no resemblance to what is offered at the next step ...).

The left has no shame, no brain, and knows no limit to their depravity and prevarication.

36

They love the American people so much that they want to shove this down our throats no matter what. Tell any lie, break any promise, ignore public opinion, ignore the Constitution, pay any bribe, just shove, shove, shove.

Because they care.

 

By the way, will unemployed people be subject to arrest for not having insurance? That would get the prison guard unions on board.

37 I don't trust that it isn't already a done deal and this is all bluster.  I suspect the day after next weeks election they will announce a breakthrough.  Its all for show to get some union members not to vote for Brown.  Yes, I am getting paranoid.

38 By the way, will unemployed people be subject to arrest for not having insurance? That would get the prison guard unions on board.

Prison.  Like in free room and board, free cable, three meals a day, lifting weights and laying around?  Sounds pretty good.

39

38 At this point they might prefer to lose, so long as they can blame Republicans.

Hahahaha.  The pubbies would be heralded as heroes!

40

Let's just cut to the chase and make it official that only Republicans or conservative-leaning independents have to pay higher taxes or have their health-care rationed. Because that is what they are attempting, after all, with all these exclusions for protected allies.

A+

41 What about the Amish exemption? No phone, behind on my utility bills, I figure I am only one paycheck away from being Amish right now.... OK, I'll lose the zippers.

42 I am soooooo fucking Amish.  Just try me. 

43
So unions will be exempt - but the rest of us will get hit even harder with taxes, increased costs, penalties and fees.

Seems fair.

44

Rangle: Yes little Sheeple, go back to sleep... don't worry that we had a closed door meeting in the Whitehouse today about this...

Look, over there... American Idol...

and Connan is mad at NBC!

/Rangle waits for the news cycle to "spin"

45
I don't believe it for a second. I have every expectation that I'll wake up one morning to hear Rangle saying, "All your bodies are belong to us" - and really meaning it.

46 From NRO:
"Unions to be Exempted from Cadillac Tax?   [Daniel Foster]

Congress Daily is reporting that union lobbyists on Capitol Hill today scored a tentative deal that would exempt "collectively bargained healthcare plans" from the so-called Cadillac Tax on high-cost policies.

As the American Spectator's Philip Klein notes, this means that two Americans receiving identical health-care benefits could be taxed differently if one happened to be a member of a union and the other not. 

01/13 2:42pm"

http://corner.nationalreview.com/

47

30

*mimics motion for male self-satisfaction*

Yeah, yeah.  I hear ya talkin.'

Posted by: Moron #259872

I've changed my nic, this isn't me. 

Way to steal somebody's bit, jacknut.  Come up with something on your own.

48
Amish Jack, I looked into form 4029. To be eligible for this waiver, you have to be a member of a religious group that meets the following criteria:

"It is conscientiously opposed to accepting benefits of any private or public insurance that makes payments in the event of death, disability, old age, or retirement; makes payments for the cost of medical care; or provides services for medical care (including social security and Medicare benefits.

"It has provided a reasonable level of living for its dependent members.

"It has existed continuously since December 31, 1950."

So, you can't just opt out of Social Security or Obamacare: you have to drop out of the system, including private insurance - and you have to be a member of a religious group that will look after you and has been in existence for at least 60 years. And you're also not eligible if you or any family member has ever accepted a Social Security benefit.

By the way, it's not just Amish or Old-Order Mennonites who meet these criteria: Muslims do, too, since orthodox Muslims, like the Amish, reject insurance as a form of gambling. So, if you have no objection to becoming a Muslim, you're good to go. Otherwise, all your bodies are belong to Obama.

49
THERE ARE TWO AMERICAS!

Job-killing/anti-competitive union/big juicy government America-- where thugs at the top pull congressional strings and all sorts of unfair dealings happen behind closed doors....
-and-
The rest of us who get the invoice - America.

50

Charles Rangel.  Light skinned, no hint of Colored dialect, thin lips, straight hair, doesn't pay his taxes.

Excellent candidate.

51 This is at the Weekly Standard:
Mass. Update by William Kristol
IÂ’m told reliably:
1. Internal Democratic polls have the race close, with a small and fading Coakley (Dem) lead.
2. One Republican poll, and one poll for an independent group, now actually have Brown (Rep) up by a few points.
3. The Democrats are pouring everything in—one report is that the buy behind this DSCC ad against Brown is close to a million dollars.

52

Lenin was clear: 'from those according to their abilities, given to those who are politically connected'.  Either that, or 'I am the walrus'.  One of the two.

53 What will the membership dues be for the Amish Union?

54 They id'd Coakley's thug, that purple sweater under the suit screams SEIU thug. http://tinyurl.com/ybv8c5z

55

Posted by: Brown Line at January 13, 2010 03:03 PM (VrNoa)

 

Sorry, nothing will induce me to point my ass skywards five times a day.

56 No worries.  They'll put an open-ended tax on gasoline and all petroleum products to cover any budget gaps.

57

Ah, you may want to rethink the whole "going Amish" thing: most of the Amish around here are getting regulated and fined to the point of not being able to turn a living -- USDA came in and shut a bunch of Amish home industries down...state regs on food safety, and then there's the animal ID tax -- lotta Amish can't afford to pay it, so they'll get their chickens and cows taken from them eventually, even their horses (guess they've still got bicycles and inline skates...).

The Amish are in the early stages of getting marginalized out of existence.

58 I'm thinking this is a smokescreen too -- they're probably set to push this thing through in spite of a Brown victory (I don't know how, but I know I don't trust them not to).

59 At this point they might prefer to lose, so long as they can blame Republicans.

Naturally!  The Party of No.  Ignore the fact of who has a majority in both houses.  And don't look for them to go back to the drawing board to 'get it right' a second time.  They've got it the way they want, they just can't sell it in an election year.

60

Rangel lied: Health Care Negotiations Face "Serious Problems;" No Bill Until February

-

Its a lot easier to fugure out what they're going to do by what they say they're going to do.

"No bill until Feb"

Translation - bill 1st day of the new congress.