1 Yep.  I see no point in the Republicans participating in a sham negotiation for the cameras. 

2 Memo to the republican leadership:  You have less than 9 month left to convince me not to vote straight ticket libertarian like I did in 2008.

Your doing it wrong.

3 Rove must be on Botox. 

4 Hey, it's called the stupid party for a reason.

5 How much influence does our "non-partisan" press hold in reality?  Karl must think it holds some because the only reason I see for stepping into the trap is that the Republicans will get hammered on every "news" channel except Fox for not going along.

6 This whole idea that Karl Rove is some sort of political genius drives me nuts!  He beat two absolute idiots in Presidential elections then blew up the republican party in the process.  Prescription drugs anyone?  Amnesty?  Enormous deficits?  He's an idiot.

7 It's a trap! Stay far, far away.

And you know he'll just insult them to their faces, anyway, so what's the point?

8 What is he going to say other than throw accusations and blame on them and then ask them to accept his shitty premise that we must pass his shitty bill that noone in their right mind wants. If they were smart none of their objections would involve the bill, just the amount it costs and the taxes it raises on small in an economy with 10% unemployment.

9 This whole idea that Karl Rove is some sort of political genius drives me nuts!

The genius thinks that the Republican ideas will get fair play and some kind of reasonable analysis in the MSM

10 Sample question: "Last time you spoke to us you called a Republican congressman a liar for pointing out the fact you tripled the deficit in your first year in office. I now have a print out of the Congressional Budget Office's numbers on your first year. Can you please point out where the Republican official was lying and if not would you issue an apology?"

11

Paul "Forehead" Begala is a piece of shit.

There was a sketch on SNL years ago with Hammond doing Chris Matthews on Hardball. One of the "guests" was Paul Begala, played by Chris Kattan. At one point Matthews tells Begala to "go back to Fraggle Rock."

Fucking hilarious.

12 If the GOP goes through with the dog and pony show, they had better make damn sure Barry does not hog the camera, but I don't see how they can prevent it. They need to be on offensive, and point out with dates and names how every attempt the GOP made to introduce market reforms were rebuffed by Demotard leadership. They need to point out with figures and details how every presumed saving in the Senate and House hellcare bill is utterly fictional and based on ludicrous assumptions. Above all they need to talk about how Barry did not live up to his own standards, and cut sweetheart deals for drug companies and certain insurers in return for fat monetary support of Barry's agenda, effectively handing over medicine in this country to large corporations... the only ones that could manage the bureaucratic nightmares Barry's dream of socialized medicine would create. Handle it and handle it badly... but certain businesses would be guaranteed swollen contracts from government.

13 "Mr President your healthcare bill allowed exceptions to Nebraska, Florida, and gave a multi million dollar handout to Louisiana to buy the vote of Mary Landreiu. During and after this became public you voiced your support for this bill. One question for you. Why?

14 Hmmm. Looks like you have to subscribe to that site to see what Rove had to say on this. Oh, well.

15 I'd go to the meeting and then I'd go to every small news outlet in my home state, since the nationals won't cover it neutrally, and I'd tell them it was political theater by the president and the democrats and why exactly I won't vote for it.  I'd hold twenty hours of phone interviews with every podunk tv station and weekly newspaper I could drum up and I'd keep beating that drum every week until the election.

16 If these dipshits don't take a stand against O they could perhaps squander one of the most favorable political climates in a generation. The media still retains a lot of stopping power, but they need to see through the nonsense and realize 3/4 of indepents favor the tea party message. Hammer the prez twice a day every day until elections; attempt to brand him as 'hyperpartisan,' or a leftist or something.

17 OT Planet-Iran seems to be off

18 Just so you know, there's universal health care in Heaven.  And Jesus isn't a community organizer up here, he's a pro-choice activist.

19 Show up. Be polite. Push your own plan.  Do nothing.

20 This makes me think - How does he get Sasha and Malia to take their Children's Tylenol?

If he tries to administer it the way he's been trying to pass this Healthcare bill, he'd get arrested for child abuse.

21 If the American people are saying 'no,' the smart thing to do is to be The Party of 'No.'

22 We told everyone the corpse wouldn't stay in the ground... Lemon Kitten posted this on another thread; Hellcare is alive and well, if a bit moldy: Pelosi Aide: Democrats Have Settled on Reconciliation [Daniel Foster] Via Washington Examiner and Life News.com: "In comments reported by Congress Daily, House Speaker Nancy PelosiÂ’s top health care aide Wendell Primus admitted top Democrats have already decided on the strategy to pass the Senate's pro-abortion, government-run health care bill. "Primus explained that the Senate will use the controversial reconciliation strategy that will have the House approve the Senate bill and both the House and Senate okaying changes to the bill that the Senate will sign off on by preventing Republicans from filibustering.

23 Yeah, I don't see Mitch McConnell doing anything good with this.  The President is a goddamned liar, and his doofuses in the Senate GOP are too wimpy to say so.

24 Or they should just say "fuck off, we're not sitting down with you until that traitor Holder is gone."

25 Show up. Be polite. Push your own plan.  Do nothing.

Posted by: kansas at February 10, 2010 08:29 PM (kG2DU)

Ding, ding.  Why is this so complicated?  They have a chance to show that Bambi is talking out his ass about bipartisanship and negotiations.  What is wrong with getting things like tort reform, or insurance sales across state lines, shot down by the President on national TV?  Those things will cost close to zero while saving hundreds of millions if not billions.

26 Posted by: chique d'afrique


That's French, right?

How YOU doin?

27 Just so you know, there's universal health care in Heaven.  And Jesus isn't a community organizer up here, he's a pro-choice activist.

Posted by: Zombie Ted Kennedy

Bullshit, Ted.  You haven't even gotten a glimpse into that area of the afterlife.  Hand me that pineapple and assume the position.

28 I think the best approach is to "sit down with them," but slam down the proper gauntlet of NO socialist, market-killing legislation.  And the Dems will run away, and November will be a little bit closer.

29

Boehner knows what's going to happen. He'll make the appearance at the White House, listen to Obama's bullshit, thank him for the opportunity and then leave.

Afterwards, Boehner can give the "Hell No!" press conference and let the media go into conniption fits over it.

Life goes on. We cannot give the cocksuckers any quarter whatsoever.

30 You're no idiot, DiT.  DrewM pointed out (below) that even the Dims are withdrawing from this mess:

It's funny but all those lamenting the death of bi-partisanship seem to ignore the cross aisle interest in killing these civilian trials. It's almost as if bi-partisan means Republicans caving into Democrats and not the other way around.

Rs should obstruct like crazy.

16 If these dipshits don't take a stand against O they could perhaps squander one of the most favorable political climates in a generation. The media still retains a lot of stopping power, but they need to see through the nonsense and realize 3/4 of indepents favor the tea party message. Hammer the prez twice a day every day until elections; attempt to brand him as 'hyperpartisan,' or a leftist or something.

Posted by: MRI at February 10, 2010 08:26 PM (cPFyh)

This!

31

Any cooperation with the treasonous Dems is a recipe for disaster.  They don't have one damn positive thing to offer in their entire agenda.  The primary policy principle of the Reps should be "No, and HELL No."  No surrender, no negotiation, no acccomodation, no appeasement.  Fight and resist everything they want to the final, bitter end.  Oppose everything, and everyone, that the administration wants, and stall the operation of the government to the maximum possible degree.  Show no mercy, and attack relentlessly and ruthlessly. 

People fear change (rightly so) and anything done to resist change will be welcomed.  They're not looking for the Republicans to usher in some brilliant, world-saving legislation.  They want stability, and as much of it as possible.  They want their taxes to stay at the current abusively high level and go no higher.  They want an end to hare-brained schemes that only make things worse or waste money with no good effect. 

Every inch of ground given over to the Dems does nothing but serve their vile interest - not one bit of good can be gained by compromise. 

32 When Barry loses the AP...

WASHINGTON (AP) -- It's a bipartisan jobs bill that would hand President Barack Obama a badly needed political victory and placate Republicans with tax cuts at the same time. But it has a problem: It won't create many jobs.

Even the Obama administration acknowledges the legislation's centerpiece -- a tax cut for businesses that hire unemployed workers -- would work only on the margins.

As for the bill's effectiveness, tax experts and business leaders said companies are unlikely to hire workers just to receive a tax break. Before businesses start hiring, they need increased demand for their products, more work for their employees and more revenue to pay those workers.

The Republicans should just sit back and watch Barry self-destruct

33 They need to be on offensive, and point out with dates and names how every attempt the GOP made to introduce market reforms were rebuffed by Demotard leadership.

The trouble is that the media will frame whatever the GOP does as personal (=racist) attacks on the President and obstructionism. 

Quite some time back I started noticing that the progressives all used the same tact against any criticism of the Dem's health care reform in discussion boards: to a man/woman they'd say "what's your solution?" (Of course, salted in with that were ad hominem attacks and accusations that critics of the Dem's plan must be rich and/or have never had a seriously ill family member.)  But here's the problem: their premise is so out of whack (with respect to the numbers they use to describe "the problem" such as costs or number of uninsured people) that how can any right-thinking person suggest a realistic solution.  And, what is their goal (aside from any nefarious goals of expanding government and reducing liberty): are they honestly trying to tell us that if one single person ever has devastating illness that leads to his or her financial ruin the system is "broken?" 

These are the same folks who see every street person as verification of the evils of capitalism, but, you know what, these same folks cannot clean up their own back yards on an issue as simple (comparatively speaking) as homelessness.  Just go to San Francisco if you need confirmation of that fact. 

So I still say, don't go GOP.  Instead, focus on proposing good solutions for the unemployment and the deficit - those are the problems on peoples' minds right now.

34 My personal opinion is that the Republican strategy should hold as a first step that any plan to be considered MUST include a provision that it apply to all members of Congress.

How could that not be a game changer?

35 this is really make or break time for republicans. they fuck this up, they really are dead for a couple of generations.

36

They should go on the air, and state that before they attend any meeting, they want a detailed answer to all the questions (Boehner & Cantor) previously submitted to the Admin.

They also reserve the right to ask for clarification, with all due respect to the seperation of powers, when they decide an answer is non-responsive or unclear.

And, to have those questions fully answered at least 24 hrs before the meeting.  So it can be posted on the Congressional website, available for all Americans to see.

37 Do you suppose its coincidence the stock market tanked just as this corpse rose from the dead?  People want to blame that on europe, but I think the un-dead ObamaCare Zombie did it.

38 37 Do you suppose its coincidence the stock market tanked just as this corpse rose from the dead?  People want to blame that on europe, but I think the un-dead ObamaCare Zombie did it.

Posted by: Purple Avenger at February 10, 2010 08:37 PM (idxCa)

probably some of both. the EU is about to implode in a spectacular fashion

39 Its only a half day conference.  I say they go and talk about tort reform over and over and over.  And selling across state lines over and over and over.  Make the dems defend being against these things.  They should interrupt the Prez when he is bloviating and make him take a side.  They should also start out saying no way are they voting for a 2700 page socialist healthcare bill that Americans hate, right off the bat, just kill the idea, and make the dems defend each and every silly thing in that bill.

I disagree that the goal of the conference is to get a political point that the repubs won't work with them, the goal of the dems is to try to attach the bill to them also, thereby transferring public anger to both parties.  They should reject the bill in its entirety first thing.

40 Implode is right, Uncle.  Greece is about to take it up the pooper, and Spain isn't far behind.

41 I'm not afraid of the GOP caving here.  The TOTUS is simply not persuasive any more and the GOP knows that they win by saying no.  So even the most squishy Republicans know that their bread is buttered by obstruction.

The meme is really simple here: The president is as persuasive with the Republicans as he was with...the Olympic committee...the global warming summit...the mullahs...etc....etc.

42 When it comes to bipartisanship, I'm with Rush...all it means is someone is going to have to sacrifice their principles just so the other side isn't as mean to you, which means dick to me.  I know it's horrible when the other side is in power, but damn I wish our side would think a little more along those lines when we're in power.  Partisanship is what separates our parties, and we sure as hell need separation right now - who the hell wants to be bipartisan with a bunch of commies??

In other news, these funnel cake sticks from Burger King are hella good.  Thought that you should know. *munchmunchmunch*

43 Dave,
My dad always taught me not to try to convince people that I was an idiot. He said that if it was the truth, it would shine through. On the other hand, trying to convince people that you were joking or being sarcastic might be more of a challenge.

Now, back to the future, I think that the only way Rove is right is if the Republicans act like the British Parliament at this dog and pony show and holler out things like 'liar' 'say that to me outside' and ' that has to be the most shit for brains thing you've said since you been here!' every time he starts in on his rants. They can't stand back and hope the media gives them a fair shake like they did at that stupid retreat they invited his stupid ass to. The last thing they need is to give him more sound bites that look like he spanked their cur asses.

Being the opposition isn't all bad if you're on the right side, let alone the popular side, don't give away the only thing you have going for you.

44 Posted by: Satan at February 10, 2010 08:32 PM (lLqRQ)

Who're you gonna believe, me, or the Prince of Darkness?  AKA The Prince of Lies.  I'm telling you, I'm in Heaven, there's universal health care, Jesus is a pro-choice activist, and drunk driving is like the coolest thing you can do.

45 The playing field is opening up for us again. We've parlayed the Tea Party card just long enough and the Roves of the team have spoken. Now we slide right past and let ourselves in to the cool kids club. Good times are here again!

46 40 Implode is right, Uncle.  Greece is about to take it up the pooper, and Spain isn't far behind.

Posted by: Winston Smith, Unicorn Wrangler at February 10, 2010 08:40 PM (BFqyO)

Indeed.  I bet the Germans are really crying in theis beers today.  They're the ones who are going to have to do most of the bailing-out that will inevitably come to pass.  But the Krauts have always wanted to run the show over there.  Now they'll get their chance.  Be careful what you wish for...

47 I'm not dead yet.

48 The Rs should go to the meeting and then afterwards hold a press conference saying how its grossly inappropriate to be focusing on health care while people are still losing jobs.

49 It's a trap!

This is only a sorry attempt to hang some blame on the GOP is the thing goes to hell, which it will. They are out of enemies and they need to gin up some hatred of something again for their plans to work.

Liberalism always needs an enemy.

50 44 Posted by: Satan at February 10, 2010 08:32 PM (lLqRQ)

Who're you gonna believe, me, or the Prince of Darkness?  AKA The Prince of Lies.  I'm telling you, I'm in Heaven, there's universal health care, Jesus is a pro-choice activist, and drunk driving is like the coolest thing you can do.

Posted by: Zombie Ted Kennedy at February 10, 2010 08:41 PM (1fanL)

Hey teddy, that big red barbed thing behind you, isn't an angry saguaro cactus...

51 I'm really rooting for the Jerries to tell 'em to shove it.

52 Liberalism always needs an enemy.

Emmanuel Goldstein was George Orwell's way of describing this.

53

The trouble is that the media will frame whatever the GOP does as personal (=racist) attacks on the President and obstructionism. 

Forget the national media.  They belong to the dems.  Speak to the in-state media.  Local newspapers, tv and radio stations are thrilled to have a chance to talk to the big boys.  This is one time to really concentrate on their district or state and let their constituents know what the deal is and why they aren't going along. 

54
I think what we all fear is the R's developing a galloping case of Grahamnesty-itis and going along with everything Pelosi, Reid, and Wee Wee want.  Remember his "need to accomplish something" interview a few weeks back? 

We need to hammer our reps so they know not to drop to their knees.

55 Greece is about to take it up the pooper

Uhm.  Isn't that what "I know Greek" means?

56

If the GOP had any brains, they'd agree to meet and not show up.

57 hm.  Isn't that what "I know Greek" means?

Posted by: Captain Redundant at February 10, 2010 08:44 PM (1fanL)

I think you'll need to take that up with your provider, dude.

58 Posted by: TheGhostWhoWalks at February 10, 2010 08:40 PM (nmg4C)

I would also be okay with the Rs saying the following...

http://bit.ly/12goPi

59 Hey, I was right about the New Tone, wasn't I?  That really paid big dividends for Bush.

60 Who're you gonna believe, me, or the Prince of Darkness?  AKA The Prince of Lies.  I'm telling you, I'm in Heaven, there's universal health care, Jesus is a pro-choice activist, and drunk driving is like the coolest thing you can do.

Posted by: Zombie Ted Kennedy

I have a better record for telling the truth than you, Ted.

61 "Pelosi Aide Admits Bipartisan Health Care Summit Is a Trick"

62 51 I'm really rooting for the Jerries to tell 'em to shove it.

Posted by: Winston Smith, Unicorn Wrangler at February 10, 2010 08:43 PM (BFqyO)

Heh heh.  Me too, but don't hold your breath.  Next they'll have to let the Portugese, the Irish, and the Spanish go down.  If that happens the whole vile EU "superstate" comes crashing down as everybody figures out that the union exists only to benefit certain select members.  The French and Germans love being the Euro Overlords - they don't want to lose it.

63

If the GOP had any brains, they'd agree to meet and not show up.

The disembodied consciousness of the internets has found the perfect solution.

64

Engaging the Democrats on health care while they "own" both houses is a no-win.

Because they don't care about doing what's best for Americans. They care only about taking over health care so everyone becomes their bitch.

It's like negotiating with the Soviet Union. They wanted to destroy us. We wanted to be left alone. There was nothing they could give us, or would give us that they wouldn't later cheat or reneg on. Meanwhile, we were held to the Alinsky standard of our "own rules."

We should obstruct, fight, and undermine until we get control again. Then bulldoze them.

65
"Pelosi Aide Admits Bipartisan Health Care Summit Is a Trick"

Hmmmm...

66

Let me see if I can iterpret Rove.

You're putting Pelosi, Reid, Hoyer and Schumer in a room with Boehner; Cantor, McConnel and McCain.

Mediated by The Professor and aired live.

The dems are going to look like a bunch of monkeys in a shit fight.

67 Send a carboard cut out of dog the bounty hunter.

68 61 "Pelosi Aide Admits Bipartisan Health Care Summit Is a Trick"

Posted by: curious at February 10, 2010 08:46 PM (p302b)

She deliberately lied to us? THE DEUCE YOU SAY

69 I liked someone's suggestion that the Republicans send one guy.  One guy with his proposals in hand, ready to deliver.  One guy to go mano a mano with Apophis. 



Preferably in a metal lacework dome filled with bungy cords and pointy things.

70
Send a cardboard cut out of dog the bounty hunter.

And Chewbacca.  Or Worf, whichever is available.

71

The dems are going to look like a bunch of monkeys in a shit fight.

Posted by: Roman Polanski at February 10, 2010 08:49 PM (aEp/v)

RAAAAAAACIST

72 Dave, you are SO fucking hawt when you talk all smart like

73 It's a trap!

74 And Chewbacca.

Posted by: Dang Straights at February 10, 2010 08:51 PM (jqmf1)

Psst!  Chewbacca is on The Professor's side.

75 The dems are going to look like a bunch of monkeys in a shit fight.

Raaacist!

Oh, and I understand what Satan is saying (re going to local news outlets) but I just don't think that the local outlets are much better, at least, not in the markets where the districts are blue or purple.  Plus, that's a really labor-intensive process that would have the Rs tied up for days. 

For instance, this morning in the local (L.A.) entertainment news segment, the mediabeing inserted some comment about "Sarah Palin's teleprompter" when he was trying to find a list of names to read off. 

Sarah Palin's teleprompter... ? 

76 Forgot to undo the polanski puppet.  Not trying to scare Lacy.

77
Chewbacca is on The Professor's side.

Gamesmanship, my friend.  You don't think he'll break into a cold sweat seeing Chewie on the oppo?

78 yep, every single local "news" channel hereabouts is staffed by Obama loving assholes.

79 Rove, you magnificent fucking idiot!

80 OT....

Didn't see it mentioned yet, but Capt. Phil Harris (from Deadliest Catch) has passed away.

http://captainphilharris.com/

81 Preferably in a metal lacework dome filled with bungy cords and pointy things.

That's an idea I could get behind!

Or, Scott Brown in a loin cloth with a knife between his teeth. 

82 Dave right
Rove wrong
Dems desperate
Obama flailing

There's a scene in ' Saving Private Ryan' when that blockhouse on Omaha Beach is finally taken and a GI hoses it with a flamethrower.  As the German soldiers jump out, a soldier on the beach says, "Don't shoot; let 'em burn!"

The hard cord left is set on ruining a major portion of this economy; they've been defeated ( for now ).  Don't help them destroy us.  Let 'em burn......

83
One guy to go mano a mano with Apophis. 

Jack O'Neill! 


_{i'm watching s4 right now heh}

84

I only had to go as far as #26 to find the correct answer.

You show up with tort reform and purchase across state lines. When Barry shoots it down, you hold a presser and say, "We proposed a plan that would cost the citizens of the United States absolutely nothing, and would have saved every American family [x dollars] per year on their health insurance costs. The President shot it down."

Of course, this requires a minimum of brains on the part of the Republican leadership. Instead they will probably ignore the meeting, and it will be Clinton vs Newt on the government shutdown all over again. How'd that work out for the GOP?

85

BTW, this Professor thing is over blown.  It's about his lecturing and scolding.  If  " The Professor" offends them, may I suggest we call him "The Mother".

Let's see how that plays out. 

86 schizuki, STOP TALKIN SENSE SON!


you're only going to confuse the republican leadership

87 Greece is about to take it up the pooper

Yeah, and France is looking a little down in the mouth.

88 the EU is about to implode in a spectacular fashion

"Spectacular' is not the word.  Grotesque; horrendous; miserable-inducing

Unfortunately, some of the shit-spray will spatter us

89 I already call him mother...

course there's more to that but you get the drift

90 "'A lot of what’s fueling the Ford thing is Chuck’s donors, who are furious at him,” says a political consultant. “They feel he’s walked away from them.'"

The guy says he can't be defeated but rumor has it that WS says "oh yeah, why not?"

91
DeMint should organize a Tea Party and invite Barry to come see him there. In front of cameras. Let's hash this out in front of the American people. Don't forget your teleprompter.

92 Right now on Politico:

Obama to GOP:  Work with Me

He says he's seen few signs that Republicans are willing to support any of his policies.



Uhhhh...that would be because your policies suck dead donkey dicks, Professor.

93 89 I already call him mother...

Hush your mouth!

94

O/T  In case you missed it in the comments section of Gateway, a practicing psychiatrist analyzes the Precedent.

http://tinyurl.com/y86tzn4

 

95 BTW, was this Iran's smashing blow against western capitalism?

Iran to Suspend Google's Email

96 93 89 I already call him mother...

Hush your mouth!

Posted by: Isaac Hayes at February 10, 2010 09:04 PM (T0NGe)

I'm just talkin' about the Prof!

97

89 I already call him mother...

Shut yo mouth...

98 "Spectacular' is not the word.  Grotesque; horrendous; miserable-inducing
Unfortunately, some of the shit-spray will spatter us
Posted by: SantaRosaStan at February 10, 2010 09:00 PM (JrRME)   Personally, I plan to sit back and revel in the schadenfreude.  Finally those smug eurobastards pay for their hubris.

99 Iran shut down google?

awesome!

100

One problem in war is fighting the last one.

Bush/Rove strategy of reaching out to the other side was to deal with the perception that the Republican Congress allegedly overreached in the 1990s, as repeatedly asserted by the Government Controlled Media.

Rove's idea for the Republcan leaders to meet Pres. Obama is more of the same--reaching out to the other side.  He ignores the fact that the Democrats have gone with a scorched earth policy for the last 8 years to destroy Republicans, including the President for which he served, as well as the traditional American way of life for the last year.

I don't know if Rove will ever update his playbook.

 

101 52 Liberalism always needs an enemy. Emmanuel Goldstein was George Orwell's way of describing this. You read my book, you magnificent bastard!

102 The Spirit of Radio...

103 Found this on the interwebz and it speaks volumes about what this kabuki theater is all about to the Marxists.

According to Alinsky, the main job of the organizer is to bait an opponent into reacting. “The enemy properly goaded and guided in his reaction will be your major strength.”

The Party of Stoopid is being goaded and the must resist.

104

Plus, that's a really labor-intensive process that would have the Rs tied up for days. 

Don't they have another break coming up? 

105 Right now on Politico: Obama to GOP: Work with Me He says he's seen few signs that Republicans are willing to support any of his policies. Politico: Putting the "less" in "clueless" since Al Gore invented the internet

106 Posted by: tdpwells at February 10, 2010 08:46 PM (Ei3oZ)

That works too!  They just need to make sure everyone knows they are there to do the WILL OF THE PEOPLE! Not placate or make themselves more palatable to the MSM. This could be the time for these (god, it's hard to not say bad things,) people to differentiate themselves from the rest of the sheep herders and put themselves in with the PEOPLE. 

The worst part, is are they coming back home, or are they just pulling the new scam to get in power? Time to come clean, dirtbags!

107 Heh.  EPW Hearing postponed due to snow.

The Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works will hold a hearing entitled, "Global Warming Impacts, Including Public Health, in the United States." 

Once the hearings are rescheduled, information will be posted at www.epw.senate.gov

108

Iran shut down google?

awesome!

Is it a media blackout maneuver ahead of the "Big Punch" we're going to receive?

109 According to Alinsky, the main job of the organizer is to bait an opponent into reacting. Precisely. A smart opposition will not react but will attack. Don't play defense. I suppose the GOP may have to attend this face-saving exercise designed to shift blame from Obastard to the GOP, but they don't have to take it lying down. And Bill Kristol can go blow chipmunks. Kristol called Boehner's letter "silly." Oh really, Bill? As silly as a stunt "summit" on socialized medicine? Kristol hasn't been right about much lately and shows no sign of breaking his stride.

110

This shit about ‘Stay away lest it hurt our poll numbers’ bugs the hell out of me.

 

The only reason we wouldnÂ’t take them on is if: 1. WeÂ’re afraid our ideas arenÂ’t as good as theirs, or 2. WeÂ’re afraid our guys canÂ’t sell our ideas without a script.

 

If that's the case, winning an election won't help. (See: America, 2000-200 .

 

Play it safe because weÂ’re winning? Winning what? So we eek out a victory over government health care this time, in large part because the Dems panicked and because the number-one issue is the economy. It will be back. The Dems will always run on ideas like this. We can offer a clear alternative now, or always play defense. Playing defense is for losers.

 

The Right has plenty of great, cocky blogs like this that make strong cases for conservatism every day. They eviscerate liberal talking points daily. Now itÂ’s time to leave the comfort of cyberspace and test it in the real world. Time to put up or shut up.

 

My ultimate goal is not electing Republicans. My goal is implementing conservative ideas. That means not running away when youÂ’re called out.  

 

111 98 Posted by: Reactionary at February 10, 2010 09:07 PM (4nbyM)

Yes, die Schadenfreude stimmt doch--whenever people get what they've deserved for decades.  But when a major trading partner does a swan dive into shit, some of the Airborne shit-spray will hit others

Meanwhile, in Greece, Everyone's getting jiggy

112
Hail AZGON, Lord of the Hash!

113 Update [PA] Virulent, teabagging racist declares Obama "clueless" and proclaims we're "doomed".... Paul Krugman? Yep. I can't bring myself to visit his noxious blog page, but... Swingin' Jeebus on a jungle gym, when the most leftist president in fifty years loses Krugman, the guy may need to consider retirement to Tristan da Cunha.

114

Why is this so complicated?  They have a chance to show that Bambi is talking out his ass about bipartisanship and negotiations.  What is wrong with getting things like tort reform, or insurance sales across state lines, shot down by the President on national TV?

Answer: We either don't believe in those things, or we don't think our guys have the brains to sell them on TV.

115 I agree with that "professor" thing.  He wasn't even a lecturer.  He was an adjunct.  Law school is different, in most fields they wouldn't let you near a classroom without having written a proper dissertation on original research.

An adjunct is a guy who comes in during the evening to earn a little extra money.  He's unprepared and his classes are usually lousy.

116

Obama and the Dems are begging.  Id she could pass the senate bill she would.  She's floating it.

Unlike alot of you, I think the Repubs have done a good job of holding this off and are not as stupid as they were.

Of course, the credit goes to the TEA party for gobing them the time.

117 shoots beneath deep snow Potomac winter beckons Manbearpig, eat shit

118 An adjunct is a guy who comes in during the evening to earn a little extra money. He's unprepared and his classes are usually lousy. Wow. Didn't know that. This clown Barry is even more airheaded than I thought.

119 Note to myself, look at palm where I wrote,  proof read.

120 Showing up late, but:

Obama's found nothing that will stick to Republicans (successfully) in this fight and all that would happen here is to give him the opportunity to redo that and repackage his plan.

All Obama needs is one guy from our side.

If Obama gets just one guy from our side, is there any chance that this bill will represent something you like?

No.

As far as the meat of Obama's bill, nobody wants this thing, so outside of the DC bubble, there's no pressure on Republicans to do anything.  We're just giving him a completely needless chance to take a mulligan.  What this does do, though, is keep this in people's minds so that they don't forget he tried to pass all this, which, since they hate it, is good for us, so let him talk all he wants--but unless the current bill is rendered dead with stake through it (and even then only maybe, because I just don't trust them here), don't touch this thing.

121 Kneel before AZGON!

122 O/T  In case you missed it in the comments section of Gateway, a practicing psychiatrist analyzes the Precedent.

I didn't like this stuff when they did it to Bush and I can't say I like it now.

The fact is that a psychiatrist cannot diagnose a person based on observing their public persona.  You can use it to talk about certain psychoses and how they manifest themselves, but nothing more.

123 The Republicans don't show up the Dems use reconciliation and say it was because the Republicans didn't show up.  The Republicans show up and don't cave to everything the Dems use reconciliation and say it was because the Republicans are the party of no. Either way its a ruse to use reconciliation and blame the Republicans.

124

Krugman? The clueless moonbat socialist economist? Pot meet Kettle.

 

/then rotates 180 degrees and smacks Rove across the face until he regains his senses.

125 Krugman bailed on Barry-Fuckin'-Zero. We have arrived.

126 Republicans are used as an excuse not to pass a turd nobody wants anyway? So, whats the problem?

127 Krugman bailed on Barry-Fuckin'-Zero. We have arrived.

I thought Nobel Laureates were supposed to stick together. *Cry*

128 George, I should say that regular academia is very different from law school, but that's the idea.  Obama was paid by the course.  He wasn't even a full-time lecturer, who is given several courses and paid a salary.

In most fields of academia, an adjunct is somebody who is paid (badly) by the course and is usually not paid to teach necessary courses, but to teach narrowly-focused technical electives and who is expected to have some additional experience.

Think of a manufacturing engineer teaching an evening course to Juniors and Seniors about how engineering works in a real company.

129 My bipartisan solution is shove a motion to recommit down Nancy's throat with instructions for a low cost reform bill that picks off the low hanging fruit.  It should be moderate enough to pull 20-30 Dem votes.

Send it to Harry and scream bloody murder when he doesn't allow it on the floor.  You wanted bipartisanship - you got it.

130 An adjunct is a guy who comes in during the evening to earn a little extra money.  He's unprepared and his classes are usually lousy.

The best prof I ever had in grad school was a part timer who taught a grad level computer architecture class at night.  During the day he worked as a real computer architect for Burroughs.  I've only taken two night classes over the years though, so my experience may not be typical.

131 'health care reform' dies
Rahm and Gibbs wail and spin, badly
America smiles

132 To Democrats, bipartisan means giving their opponents a chance to support them. Compromise is something Republicans or others have to do. Democrats are "principled" so they cannot give anything. They can only stand fast and demand others give them what they want. You'd have better luck negotiating with a rabid badger than a Democrat.

133 CJ
I'm with you on the goals. But we have to bring those goals to a viable party to retake the government. If you think we can do it by being torries or independents or Bolsheviks or Tea Partiers, I'd like to see your plan.  I think we all need to channel our efforts into changing the R brand back to what we want it to be.

If we don't have a block, we're still out in the woods.

134 O/T From earlier

135 AmishDude, in my experience the adjunct professor was always non-academic professional who was working part-time at the Uni - not for the money, but for either access to research facilities or a tuition discount for their kids.  A step above the starving grad students, but not in the clique.

136 The only reason we wouldnÂ’t take them on is if: 1. WeÂ’re afraid our ideas arenÂ’t as good as theirs, or 2. WeÂ’re afraid our guys canÂ’t sell our ideas without a script.

CJ, sorry, I disagree.  I'll answer that.  Not in a way I like to answer it, but I'll answer it.

Yes, strictly when it comes to congressional Republicans and the current leaders of our party, I'm damned afraid that our guys can't sell their ideas, with or without a script.

I'm not talking about us. I'm not talking about our intellectuals. I'm not talking about the people who take up this fight on regular basis in all forms of media.  However, after the last few years, I have no confidence in our leaders at the party level and I just don't want to take a gamble on our leaders vs. their right now in a fight as crucial as this.

I don't like it.  I had zero respect for people I knew on the left in school who weren't willing to go head-to-head in political debates.  Of course, this is also one reason I don't have much respect right now for the current leaders of our party--they don't have the heart, the gut, or the inclination for ideological fights.  Send some professors or economists in a room against Obama and I'll be comfortable.  Our leaders?  I just don't have confidence in them.

137 The best prof I ever had in grad school was a part timer who taught a grad level computer architecture class at night.

Most of my graduate professors were dicks. Except this one old dude who just didn't give a shit about anything. He wrote steel code for AASHTO or something.

138 I think we all need to channel our efforts into changing the R brand back to what we want it to be.

That's a 20 year long term effort, that will require a number of removals (i.e. deaths by natural causes) to fully effect.  Some of the worst won't go down without bitter expensive fights, it might be easier to just wait those out until they leave feet first on their own. 

139

The Repubs shouldn't go because Barry won't change anything anyway. The TOTUS plans to release the combined 2,700 page bill at the get together "summit" and tell the Repubs that the Dems have the votes to shove it down our throats so why not get in on the glory of the new Healthcare Reform.

The Republicans should hold an Economic Forum at the same time with leading supply side economists and talk about getting the ecomomy going again. They should get Fox News to cover their event live and have conservative bloggers there as well. Let TOTUS have C-SPAN and will take Fox Cable.

 

140

All the Republicans have to do is defend themselves in a common sense way against an over-aggressive liberal platform.

That's it! It's not fucking rocket science, just defend common sense!

141

RE: Reconciliation.

First, Pelosi has to pass the senate bill, mostly intact.  I don't think she can get the votes.  Even of the left comes on, I think the "moderates", and I use that term lightly, are unlikely to come back.

Second, This is not really a new idea as much as one they are going to try again.  The problem. I'm not sure the senate can get the 51.

They need a real bump in support which they think they can get if the repubs don't show.

The only poll in their favor is that people want more kumbaya.  That doesn't mean health care.

The Repubs sing a verse or to and then walk out asking the Dems if they want to join them in making smores.  Then, shit fight among dems.

142 In defense of adjuncts, they can be tossed out on a whim, so they either need to know the dept 'chair' or else be GOOD.  As an adjunct prof, my classes of 40 were full while--early-- some tenured faculty couldn't get the minimum enrollment of 10

143 Actually I can't say that. There was this one adjunct guy who designed nuclear subs. He was a cool dude.

144 142  put the 'early' in the wrong place but you all get the point. 

145 135 AmishDude, in my experience the adjunct professor was always non-academic professional who was working part-time at the Uni - not for the money, but for either access to research facilities or a tuition discount for their kids.  A step above the starving grad students, but not in the clique.

From the university's POV, Obama is an adjunct.  Paid by the course.  Fundamentally, they don't care what he does.  If he teaches a lousy course, he doesn't screw up the program.  If he teaches a great course, good for the students, but it also doesn't effect the program too much.

146 Barry is in a collapsing labyrinth with his Health Care bullshit. It's all Noh Theater now. Should be interesting to watch.

147 As Rush has said.. dont be the party of NO.. be the party of HELL NO.

148 Barry was an adjunct in the Chicago machine.  Nuff said.

149

Speaking of intellectualism, I probably won't find any of you folks at the forefront of changing the country.

You're too involved in being the smarter person in the room.

150 I hear Barry was a subadjunct.

151 Most of my graduate professors were dicks.

Yep.  Major dicks..they all pushed their own shitty (very expensive) books on us, even when there were vastly superior tracts elsewhere (which was almost always).  Phil Diamond was the only one I'd even remotely consider sitting down with over a beer, but he was a horrible presenter in a classroom.

152 From the university's POV, Obama is an adjunct.  Paid by the course.  Fundamentally, they don't care what he does.  If he teaches a lousy course, he doesn't screw up the program.  If he teaches a great course, good for the students, but it also doesn't effect the program too much.

 If an adjunct--especially if he teaches an intro class--is lousy, students tend to think that all the profs and courses in that dept will suck.  Depts need enrollment and lousy profs /  adjuncts will scare off potential students.

153 96 93 89 I already call him mother...

Hush your mouth!

Posted by: Isaac Hayes at February 10, 2010 09:04 PM (T0NGe)

-------------------------------------

I'm just talkin' about the Prof!

Posted by: Unclefacts, Summoner of Meteors at February 10, 2010 09:06 PM (erIg9)

97

89 I already call him mother...

Shut yo mouth...

Posted by: Shaft at February 10, 2010 09:06 PM (aEp/v)

Then we can dig it.

154 I think the Republicans should sit in the room and say, "As soon as you Democrats come up with a unified position, we'll start talking."  And then just sit quietly while the Democrats tear each other apart.

155

You right..........Rove wrong.

Sarah hot...........Pelosi not.

156 Yo, kids!  Marco Rubio is still a little bit short of his stimulus bomb goal, in case anyone hasn't hit it yet and has a few sheckels to spare.  Because a "fuck you" to Charlie Crist is a "fuck you" to Barry & Co.

157 Speaking of intellectualism, I probably won't find any of you folks at the forefront of changing the country.

Fuck your intellectualisms mang. I spend the whole day designing steel structures. I just want to be scurrilous and surf for pr0n for twenty minutes. Leave me the fuck alone.

158

Intellectualism, you say?  Check out the "unidentified DC man shovels out of second snow"  http://tinyurl.com/ygfjl3e

159 RushBabe, that's classic!  LMAO

160
158

Now that's comedy!

161 Writer at IBD shreds Krugman's article.

"In 2003, Krugman lived in Panic City: “The accident — the fiscal train wreck — is already under way.” He worried that when “the government reduces saving by running a budget deficit, the interest rate rises.” So why won’t the current deficit drive interest rates up? Krugman doesn’t explain. But a key difference, of course, is that now there is a stimulus package — i.e., government spending — to defend. As Krugman said in an earlier column, “What we need right now is more government spending.... Now is not the time to worry about the deficit.”"

162

Speaking of intellectualism, I probably won't find any of you folks at the forefront of changing the country.

You're too involved in being the smarter person in the room.

ErikW, in the words of Jonah Goldberg "don't just do something, sit there."  Not caving in and making deals with this guy helped bring us victory.  So, to everybody, Dem or Republican, who complains about me sitting on my a--, you're welcome!

163 As an adjunct prof, my classes of 40 were full while--early-- some tenured faculty couldn't get the minimum enrollment of 10

It helps if you're teaching a "fun" class.  If you're teaching a basic, boring, core course, it needs to be done.  It also helps if you are good, take it seriously, are enthusiastic and aren't burned out.

164

You're too involved in being the smarter person in the room.

Posted by: ErikW at February 10, 2010 09:44 PM (uWlTI)

Here's how I can tell if I'm the smartest person in the room:

Q: Am I in a room?

165 PA,
Should we bitch about how long it will take to change the Republican party, or should we take the John Galt path and vote for people that can't change the course at all?  I see those as our choices.  I don't begrudge people that want to stick their fingers in the eyes of the established elites, but if it has no effect, haven't you given your vote to our opponent? I guarantee that Mickey Mouse, Ron Paul , and Captain America will never be our president. Am I more righteous to vote for them, or am I just another ostrich, jamming my head in the sand and asking everyone else why they can't have my courage?

Now is the time to fight and win, not fight and imagine. Make the lesser of two evils into the one with virtue. We don't have to settle for less. We can take back the R party and nominate and vote in the candidates we want and need, but not if we wait until they decide to do it on their own, we have to get involved and change the debate.

If you don't want to make things happen, shut up and practice bitching.  But not too loud, it might become illegal.  

166 Posted by: ErikW at February 10, 2010 09:44 PM (uWlTI)

I have no idea what your point is.

167
Here's how I can tell if I'm the smartest person in the room:

Q: Am I alone in the room? 

168 Here's how I can tell if I'm the smartest person in the room:

Am I still in California?

169 I'm in love.

Mary Katherine Ham just showed a Facebook status update that reads: 
is watching the game and engaging in the historic Ham tradition of Heel hatin'. Fun times, everyone!
Right now it's Duke vs. Carolina, and I am a (reasonably) proud Blue Devil alumnus. 

170 163  The only things that 'work' are being good and being fair.  Students know who Sucks and who Doesn't Suck, and word gets around fast.

'Fun' had nothing to do with it:  I taught.......poli sci.  Not Fun, but worth knowing if it's taught without the leftoid rancor it usually comes with.  Most of the tenured and tenure-track profs were, as noted above, dicks--so Not Being A Dick was a major advantage

171 Mary Katherine Ham is so hot, she should be Mary Katherine Bacon.

172

 

CJ
I'm with you on the goals. But we have to bring those goals to a viable party to retake the government. If you think we can do it by being torries or independents or Bolsheviks or Tea Partiers, I'd like to see your plan.  I think we all need to channel our efforts into changing the R brand back to what we want it to be.If we don't have a block, we're still out in the woods.

 

Ghost, IÂ’m not talking about third party. My whole point was changing the R brand by having the balls to enunciate the conservative values weÂ’ve been yakking about for years. Cripes, weÂ’ve been writing/talking about health care regularly for two friggin decades, and we still canÂ’t find a group who can fill, what, two hours on the subject?

 

This is all about winning, in the long run. We donÂ’t need another 2002 Congressional victory where we won solely on 9-11 and had nothing to stand on when the shock wore off. Even more, I am concerned that the reluctance to debate on TV really means we donÂ’t think we have the soldiers to do it. The Dems, even at their low point, have a bunch of members who can sell the liberal line, any day any time. For us, we only do it online.

173 The republicans are showing signs of "battered women syndrome".  Since women, who are often independents, can easily recognize this, I think they and the men are waiting to see the republicans "grown a pair", "get a backbone and stop being jelly fish" ....you know what I mean.  If the republicans, after the public spectacle that BO and the dems have made of them over this past year, go quietly into that television extravaganza with nary a word and allow BO to be the PT Barnum that he is and leave a little stunned saying "what happened did someone slip me a date rape drug?"  Well then they will have lost the little bit of good will and gravitas that they have with the American people.  Also, the American people will become profoundly depressed as a nation since what now 70% plus don't want any part of the health care bill.  And they won't blame it on the dems anymore, they will blame it on the scardy cat republicans who didn't save them.  The problem is, republicans are predictable.  The boy and girl scouts can't resist "doing the right thing", "turning the other cheek", "negotiating in good faith" and the dems are unpredictable so they laugh, they know, just how to pick the republican candidate and manipulate the republicans and the republicans can't see to grow a pair.

174 I like that one, Amish.

Mmmm...bacon....

175 Well, I should say that I'm a mathematician and we don't want adjuncts coming in cold and teaching graduate real analysis.  But they can teach the mathematics of air manifolds if they're from an aerospace company.

Adjuncts also (generally) don't do the other things that need to be done -- committee work, student advising, etc. 

176 Some of the worst won't go down without bitter expensive fights, Did someone call me?

177 174 I like that one, Amish.

Mmmm...bacon....

It was 100% moron approved.

178

That's a 20 year long term effort, that will require a number of removals (i.e. deaths by natural causes) to fully effect.

So it is, so it will be done.  See Kennedy and see Murtha.

Hey, I get to vote to don't  I.

179

 I'm not talking about us. I'm not talking about our intellectuals. I'm not talking about the people who take up this fight on regular basis in all forms of media.  However, after the last few years, I have no confidence in our leaders at the party level and I just don't want to take a gamble on our leaders vs. their right now in a fight as crucial as this.

AD,

 

Then we have much more serious problems than this health care bill. We canÂ’t hide the GOP weakness forever. The Left will never stop trying, and will win eventually if we decide we can only battle outside the halls of Congress and the two major parties. If the GOP isnÂ’t ready for two hour debate after two decades of preparation, weÂ’re done. Just pass Obamacare and be done with it.

180

Posted by: curious at February 10, 2010 10:01 PM (p302b)

Well said.  The R's have got to learn to embrace their inner bad guy.  The media will tar them as satan worshipers no matter what they do.  The only thing that makes any sense in D.C. is to maintain a constant feeling of bitter cynicism, and to distrust our thrice damned enemies and all of their works.  Fight to win, take no prisoners. 

181

Speaking of intellectualism, I probably won't find any of you folks at the forefront of changing the country. You're too involved in being the smarter person in the room.

Don't assume. I just fought my way onto our county GOP Committee and won a school board seat. We can do stuff.

182

Just read at Gateway Pundit that this health care summit showing bipartisanship is a sham.  One of Pelosi's aids says they are going to use reconcilation to get it through.

 

183 Posted by: CJ at February 10, 2010 10:06 PM (JQtNT)

There a plenty of republicans ready for any debate but why should they grovel to the dems, allow the dems to run the table?   What is in it for the republicans?  Nothing, particularly if, after PT Barnum's show, he announces "a sucker is born every minute", we passed the bill and i'm signing it.  How will your republicans look then?  They have got to start thinking for themselves.  Real Americans want to see if they are the same as the dems or not.  If they go along with the show, most will conclude that they are the same.  If that's what you want, then you are a dem trying to pick the republican candidate and message?

184 I was in engineering, so all our grad stuents didn't speak English.  Or smell very good.

185 CJ,

We're on the same page. I too think we have to get the R's to stand up for what we think. But if they can't get control of the debate and make sure what they say is seen by the masses, it will be just like when Barry got to mold the ass whoopin' he got at the Republican retreat into him telling the children where the bear shits.

Being inaccessible but consistent is better than malleable and obliging.  

186 How about the R's calling Narcissisco out on his own, personal "old" and "tired" policies?

Have you all seen Wehner's Commentary piece on "Our Sophist in Chief"?

http://bit.ly/i13sV

187

There a plenty of republicans ready for any debate but why should they grovel to the dems, allow the dems to run the table?   What is in it for the republicans? 

What's in it? Standing up and telling the country what the conservative approach to health care is, that's all.

Why grovel? Why pass a bill at all? Different from the Dems? Show America why. Running away shows lack of conviction.

188 They let him into the Republican retreat and the ladies on line in the grocery store were telling me that he gave them a piece of his mine.  Before they do anything they have to do something in Washington that they aren't used to doing, they need to think about the future and the consequences of their actions and how the spinners will spin it and whether they can get their message out.  They must be doing fine up until now cause he wouldn't be begging them to come to the show if they weren't.

189 Some of you are a bit mixed up about Obama's position at the U of C.  Here's the University's official statement:

From 1992 until his election to the U.S. Senate in 2004, Barack Obama served as a professor in the Law School. He was a Lecturer from 1992 to 1996. He was a Senior Lecturer from 1996 to 2004, during which time he taught three courses per year. Senior Lecturers are considered to be members of the Law School faculty and are regarded as professors, although not full-time or tenure-track. The title of Senior Lecturer is distinct from the title of Lecturer, which signifies adjunct status. Like Obama, each of the Law School's Senior Lecturers has high-demand careers in politics or public service, which prevent full-time teaching. Several times during his 12 years as a professor in the Law School, Obama was invited to join the faculty in a full-time tenure-track position, but he declined.

I loathe the guy and think his appointment was purely an affirmative action hire, but he was courted for a tenure-track position and did in fact serve as a Senior Lecturer. 

190

Speaking of intellectualism, I probably won't find any of you folks at the forefront of changing the country.

Okay, then I'll take Byrd.  I should have taken a long time ago but, he looked like an angel when he was wearing sheets.  My mistake.

191 Massachusetts voters were warned that voting for Senator Brown would potentially gridlock the Senate, and Massachusetts voters happily voted for Brown. The country has seen the Democratic agenda, and they are prepared to derail it. Gridlock by the "Party of No" is the best change the American people have to prevent President Obama and the Democrats from driving the country off the cliff. The GOP needs to say "No" to crippling debt that threatens to destroy the country. The GOP needs to say "No" to crippling taxes. The GOP needs to say "No" to new entitlement spending. The GOP needs to say "No" to new regulations that undermine individual freedom and send more jobs overseas. The GOP needs to say "No" to crazy plans that undermine our national security. Just say "No".

192 Here's the reason they have to continue to be the party of hell, no:

Tea Party folks, Republicans, Conservatives, "Social" cons, "Neo" cons, Religion-based Cons, and Libertarians (Randians, Rothbardians, Objectivists, whatever) are all wanting very much to end this horrible experiment with radical leftist economics.

Fine.

But what is not being mentioned is the difficulty, pain, and suffering  that it might take to dig us out of Obama's massive debt.  It's going to be mighty hard for elected officials to endure the taunts of the waning MSM while they attempt to slash spending.

"They're cutting school aid!"
"They're killing social security!"
"They are heartless cruel bastards!"

You know that's gonna be the drill. So any attempt to show a willingness to go along with the Dems on this is just going to make a very tough job even more difficult. They not only need to show an unwillingness to cooperate, they seriously need to show that they are fighting against it with every ounce of sweat, blood, treasure, craftiness, anger, and determination that can be mustered.

To this end, the old Rockefeller and Beltway types are not to be trusted, nor to be aided.  This beast must die.

193

K-Bob,

You've just explained why it won't get fixed until after it collapses.

194 Then we have much more serious problems than this health care bill. We canÂ’t hide the GOP weakness forever.

CJ, see, I agree with that statement.  We haven't been able to hide this and it's haunted us since the late 90s (whatever I think of Gingrich, before he went soft he would have been up for this; now I don't think so, but the mid-90s Gingrich I would have trusted with this sort of thing).  My idea is to buy time until for a few years until we get new blood in the party--the new blood that we might have had if we hadn't spent time propping up Specter, Chafee, etc.  It's looks like we're starting to get some people who can handle themselves in front of a camera and Obama's schtick and they are where my hope lies.

195 Posted by: Y-not just in the interest of accuracy at February 10, 2010 10:16 PM (sey23

Can't let go of the Inner College Administrator, eh?  I was the one who referred to him as 'faculty', but then I know just How Low poli sci / law profs can Go

As Lenny Bruce liked to say, "Emmis"  Obama's past doesn't matter to me; his future does.  I want his future to be a rapid well-deserved downhill slide

196 193

K-Bob,

You've just explained why it won't get fixed until after it collapses.

Posted by: Rodent Freikorps at February 10, 2010 10:22 PM (dQdrY)

Heh. That means it'll be our turn to say "never waste a crisis."

197 Just one thing about adjunct professors.  Yeah a lot of them are underpaid academic grunts.  But a lot of universities - especially prestigious ones, like the University of Chicago - hand out adjunct professorships, or lecturer positions, or whatever - as favors to those in positions of political power.  Like, say, state senators who have the power to direct government goodies back to the university.  It looks good for the university to have influential (and black!) state senators on their faculty, and it looks good for the state senator as one more peg in their resume as they are ladder-climbing.  So I don't really believe that Obama's appointment at U. of Chicago was some fine example of meritocracy.

198 (whatever I think of Gingrich, before he went soft he would have been up for this;

Oh, and before you jump on me for that, I define "Gingrich going soft" as a much earlier time than anybody else, the '97 budget fight.  We couldn't pull this sort of thing off then and we had control of Congress.

199

Rove has a point: make the effort, keep the Democrats off balance, and perhaps still fighting internally, and look good to the public. There is some merit to pushing the Republican agenda.

The problem is that this may be, and very likely will be, impossible. The session could devolve into a few senators being allowed to ask a few 30-second questions, with BO then responding with 3-5minute answers. Who will tell the President of the United States to stop talking?

Do the math: 15 Q&A cycles looks like 60 minutes. Throw in a couple of BOÂ’s proposals and discussion, and this is 2 hours: a half-day meeting at the White House.

Result: BO answers all questions, makes good-faith proposals and Â…Â…Â….

The report to the public via the MSM is a picture of Republicans being antagonistic to a work-oriented and bi-partisan President. This is the beginning of a Democrat rally.

It looks like the Republicans need to just say "no".

200 In the end, we have to communicate to the people that the government is just OUR voices being sent to a central location. They aren't magic, or special, or PERMANENT! 

There should be term limits to any elected government position. Even if you said that they could come back after a term, they would get the point that they can't just float and not be held accountable.

I can't believe I just said that. The whole point in term limits is to not breed career politicians. We should be able to have our voices heard by our peers, not people that think they are our betters.

201

More importantly, the Republican position needs to be: "meetings to decide upon legislation and the pass legislation are the purpose of Congress. We have a special building just for this. This is where we should meet, where we all can meet, where the public expects us to meet, not somewhere else, out of sight."

202 There are people like me out there who saw old newt sitting on the couch with Nancy P and said "never ever, never ever will support or vote for that guy"  The republicans have to prove they aren't the democrats with an "r" next to their name because right now, if they are honest, that is what the American people think.  They think that the bunch of them are the DC elites and the rest of America are the plebeians, pedestrians, people who are too stupid to think for themselves and know what is good for them.  Most Americans have lost all trust in their politicians and it didn't start with Pt Barnum, it was starting during GWB's term too, only no one saw it until PT Barnum parachuted in and shocked everyone to their shoes with his well executed campaign on the internet.  Then his old buddy Johnnny McC endorsed him in the middle of the campaign and sealed the deal.  You guys think the American people didn't see and remember that?  Why do you think Sarah Palin is so well liked?  Cause she made it known that Johnny's little endorsement of his adversary wasn't her bailiwick.  

203 Posted by: chemjeff at February 10, 2010 10:26 PM (Gk/wA)

yes, one of my fellow-adjuncts ( for one semester ) was the former governor of the state.  His signature was on one of my diplomas

204 The republicans say they were kept out of all the meetings in the back rooms and had no say in the crafting of the bill whatsoever.  So, the American people heard this.  What a bunch of losers they will look like if they go to the show, the American people will get totally disgusted.  And they will wonder if it is true that they were kept out or if BO and Nan and Harry saying they weren't is the truth.  People are basic.  They expect certain behavior from fellow humans and when the behavior doesn't meet their expectations, well they think, they think a lot and they talk and maybe the republicans will have the short end of the deal in the eyes of the American public.  Cause when someone rubs your face in it in real life, you don't let them do it again and you certainly don't put yourself in a position to be made a fool of.  But maybe that's just the walmart crowd and the elites see things more cerebrally.

205 Bingo curious!

You have stated the obvious to me as only a true genius,(that being defined as one who states exactly what I think,) can do. When that ass of a hero told everyone what a great american and potential CiC BHO was, I realized why the left was so rabid for him to get the nomination. I always wondered why someone that could blow off the first caucus of his party (Iowa) could then be declared the winner a few weeks later. Seems funny that the no nothing winner of the Dem side of the Iowa Caucus turned out to be the worthless, tone deaf cretin in office now.

206 And of course, by no nothing, I meant, 'know nothing'.

207 (Of course, salted in with that were ad hominem attacks and accusations that critics of the Dem's plan must be rich and/or have never had a seriously ill family member.)

I get this once in a while as well, to which I respond "My wife has lung cancer and my father in law had to have quadruple bypass surgery when he was 72."
I generally get a second or two of stunned silence and then a "Why aren't you in favor of (single payer) heath care then? Aren't the medical bills killing you?"
I then explain that while the bills are high, with the employer-sponsored health care insurance and Tricare (which I paid for with 20 years of service, thank you very much) we are staying ahead of them.  Under Obamacare, both father in law and wife would be dead.  FIL would have been told his cost-to-benefit ratio was not favorable, and the wife would have gotten pain medication instead of treatment.
The subject generally gets changed soon afterwards.

208 An adjunct is a guy who comes in during the evening to earn a little extra money.  He's unprepared and his classes are usually lousy.

You're including an awful lot of people with this broad brush.

Including some fellow morons.

209 Posted by: GreenGasEmissions at February 10, 2010 11:01 PM (jpf1B)

You sir are a freakin genius.  You brought us right back to the reason 70% of Americans are against this bill.  But, if we get bogged down in the politics and the showmanship of it and "the fight", we will forget exactly what we are fighting about.  The is what is happening.  Now it is a human cock fight, not a debate that the American people aren't really interested in hearing right now.  The "if it ain't  broke, don't fix it mentality" is alive and well among the American people.  I can't tell you how many times I have been draw into a discussin of health care on line somewhere and almost everyone, to the man, rich or poor says "if it means I have to pay for another family to have health care I would do it just as long as they leave me and my plan alone".    It would be so easy.  Government sends out a voucher, all insurance companies are required to participate, person checks off which insurance they would like to have and sends it to the company who bills the government.  Done.  simple.   But no, nothing can be simple can it?

210 No sentient being is going to view this as anything but Obama theatre. Great time to promote tort reform, portability, cross-state insurance policy sales, and free market principles. Gonna have to do it to win elections.

Keep in mind that President Obama has lowered support for his side every time he opens his mouth. Let the Donks blame the 'Pubs, and then the 'Pubs cite the American voters' opinion of Obama's piece of crap. This approach is going to be essential for winning the independent vote in '10 and '12.

211

Posted by: ErikW at February 10, 2010 09:44 PM (uWlTI)

I have no idea what your point is.

 

Stop being fucking dorks for a minute and communicate to the general populace

Here's news, not everybody speaks dork!

 

212

The Republicans should just say they are ready to meet with the Democrats on television in Conference Committee. It is Obama's bypassing and ignorance of normal legislative procedures that make this "summit" necessary for him. In fact, the reason Obama, Pelosi and Reid are stuck in the position they are is because they DO NOT want Republican input and amendments on the bill.

Also the Republicans should point out that this whole "summit" idea is a corruption of the political process set up by the Constitution, just like the "czarification" of executive branch.

 

213 Point is: Obama can't save himself on TV. Grow up.

214 195 Posted by: Y-not just in the interest of accuracy at February 10, 2010 10:16 PM (sey23

Can't let go of the Inner College Administrator, eh?

Was that supposed to be an insult?

Actually, I was on the faculty first, in biophysics.  And I'm a U of C alumna. 

I hate Obama and have no respect for his supposed intellectual chops, but the University issued a very clear statement about this a long time ago.  It's irksome to see the adjunct thing thrown around inaccurately.  It muddies the waters of the real criticisms of the guy. 

215 If me and my friends are a barometer and I think we are, we feel that in the greatest country in the world, no one should be homeless, no one should lose their house, no one should go to bed hungry. and no one should be denied health care.  I'm not a republican or a democrat I'm an independent who is disgusted with both parties.  It's hard to see a hundred million go to Haiti when you know there are people stuck in this freakin blizzard who have no place to go and no food to eat.  Enough with the save the world, save Americans first and if there is anything left over, then save the world. 

216

I'm not a republican or a democrat I'm an independent who is disgusted with both parties.

Good luck with that.

It won't work.

217 Grow up?  The man got in office by selling a new type of snake oil on TV, and made sure they were there every time the swooners were on deck. And now you
're saying not to worry about him saving himself on TV?
Dial me in, oh great one?

218 Now is the time to fight and win, not fight and imagine.

Rome wasn't built, or destroyed in a day.  If you win where you can, and compromise where you must due to local conditions, you've moved the ball forward. 

This is where the Gingrich crew stumbled -- they stopped moving the ball forward relentlessly and started banging cheerleaders and celebrating the victory before the game was over.  By the time Bush came along, congress had lost sight of the goal line and was lurching around the field like a dusted tweaker who just dropped 10 hits of blotter.

I don't believe a non-violent 2nd American Revolution can happen overnight.  I do believe it could happen over the span of 10-20 years if the public saw continuous economic gains and improvement. 

219

I'm with you, with one caveat.  It wouldn't be a bad idea if we could count on the Repubs not to get used and tossed like Lindsey Lohan by her butch strap-on driver.

220 Enough with the save the world, save Americans first and if there is anything left over, then save the world.

Right, good luck with that. 

Previous bouts of isolationism bought us two world wars we were unprepared for.  The problem is this -- if we disengage (because we are now the defacto world police, like it or not), bad shit will invariably follow because nature abhors a power vacuum.  The chances of a Fred Rogers filling that vacuum are a lot slimmer than an Idi Amin, Saddam, Hitler, etc.  5,000 years of recorded human history shows us that.

You can only ignore the bad shit for so long before it comes knocking on your door looking for trouble.  5,000 years of recorded human history also shows us that.

221 "216

I'm not a republican or a democrat I'm an independent who is disgusted with both parties.

Good luck with that.

It won't work.

Posted by: ErikW at February 10, 2010 11:23 PM (uWlTI)"

Well I took some flack for being an independent when I first came here but overall everyone has been very nice and gracious.  The liberal blogs, changed my posts, refused to post them, etc. so the fact that people here, really really brilliant people listen to what I post and comment is very nice actually.  And as far as the independent thing not working, as I said months ago, independents are the fastest growing segment.  The parties, like the churches are feeling the growing independent populations, the coffers, contributions and collection boxes are down, big time and, may not come back.

222 Posted by: Purple Avenger at February 10, 2010 11:37 PM (k/RJs)

no I know intellectually you are right Pa but really emotionally seeing some of the people in the cities asking you for five bucks while holding a child in their arms is heart wrenching.  I mean a lot of people who are working are carrying around a roll of dollar bills and five dollar bills in their pockets to hand to these people cause it is hard to see, PA, hard to see.

223

Repubs should make a big show of handing out white lab coats beforehand and have Joe Wilson deliver the first question. Or have every member hold up a big packet of papers simultaneously every time O accuses them not bringing any ideas to the table.

224 I know intellectually you are right Pa

Of course, there is one way out, but most don't want to consider it because it would seem barbaric and heavy handed...

...that being the issuing of nuclear ultimatums to loons like the Norks.  If we had the guts to say to them "do as you please internally, but if so much as a single tank crosses the 38th parallel, we will turn Pyongyang into a glazed parking lot within 20 minutes", our options increase dramatically.  We could draw down virtually all the ~30,000 troops we have stationed there.  The thing is, with threats like that, they can't be idle; they have to be promises you are willing to follow through on.

At the moment, I don't see our government as being serious enough to project the necessary gravitas to issue such a threat and have it be believed.  Too many decades have passed since we nuked anyone. 

If we took the training wheels off Europe, we could bring another 70,000 or so home.  That essentially blows up Nato, but Nato is largely ineffective these days anyway.

This approach has great appeal to be because of its cost effectiveness.  Yes, we would probably have to lay a small tac-nuke on some punk ass cretins as some point just to prove we're serious, but in the long run it would allow administration of Pax Americana at much reduced cost.

225

Posted by: Purple Avenger at February 11, 2010 12:05 AM (k/RJs)

you forget that the money spent by our troops and gov't in places like Germany and S. Korea probably generates more influence than the military protection does.

226 At the moment, I don't see our government as being serious enough to project the necessary gravitas to issue such a threat and have it be believed.  Too many decades have passed since we nuked anyone.

PA, at the moment we're more likely to just sell off Taiwan, Japan and South Korea and consider it a fair trade for our debt instruments held by the Chinese. "All's fair in war, just make sure you hit the car plants."

227 More bang for the buck, I always say.

228

Oh yeah. Fuck NATO.

Time to end it. They won't fight.

229 Kill the bill now!!!

230 The HealthCare bill is DEAD. Unless the Republicans are stupid enough to get sucked into this televised 'show'. If they go, then all Obama has to do is say yes to tort reform and buying insurance across state lines -  with the details to be worked out later. Done deal!

No you dumb-f&*ks are stuck with a 2700+ page bill with 2! Republican items added on. Yea, I'll but that crap sandwich! No Thank You.

There is no win on this in this arena. Obama controls the agenda. IGNORE HIM! Go back to the House, get off your butts and INTRODUCE THE REPUBLICAN BILL !! Force Pelosi to refuse to admit it (no they are the party of NO) or let it become the new starting point for HealthCare.

IGNORE Obama - He doesn't have a bill. It is all talk and  he can just lie about the details. There is not going to be any HONEST debate at this televised meeting. CSPAN is in the HOUSE and will show what is really going on. Use it to unmask the Democratic leadership for the liars they are.

231 If they've lost Krugman... Well, actually, I see rats and sinking ships, here.

232 Oh, as for Rove? Call it 'The Normalcy Bias." Sorry Karl. Doing the same things the same old ways doesn't work anymore. Things have changed rather dramatically over the last couple of years. Life is no longer 'normal' and neither is politics.

233 "There's nothing to be gained by bipartisan cooperation with "clueless" dipshits who are "dooming" the nation." I'm rubbing my eyes. I'm actually agreeing with you all. So you're finally admitting it? Cool.

234 Just say no to the meeting. "Compassionate Conservative" is RINO bunk -When your  country's future is at stake it is time to be a "Passionate Conservative."

235

Ace is right the Repubs should not go to this meeting, there is no advantage to be had, but they will and because Obama will control the process the Repubs will look bad.

why will the Repubs go?

progressives control both Parties

236 Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.

237 BugZ, good one. I think the GOP should negotiate hard on the structure of the debate - i.e. round table with equal #'s of both sides, etc., so that the Dems reject it. Or if they agree to it, then they lose their advantage a bit. The GOP can always come up with a "Contract with America" for the 2010 elections, which include a HCR bill of our own. Sure, the media will not report it, but that is not new. The only advantage to this meeting would be if the GOP could test some non-Palin national leadership for 2012.

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