1

Graphtastic

2 Has anyone mentioned Obama is a SCOAMF?

3 Those maps are as big as the knockers on this female staffer that I never harrassed.

4 I am actually going ahead and saying this- if I waited another week after the scandal, Cain's map would be about as bad as Perry's.

5 Check the legend on the Cain map, I think you have a goof there.

6 I think I'm stupid; can't understand the map, particularly the keys. If the first is Cain vs SCOAMF, why does it say Romney?

7 is this before of after the current news cycle?

8 Why do my map notes say Romney? Fix this immediately or I will harrass your mom!

9 CAC is people, my friends!

10 In the Cain map, Romney STILL gets 190 electoral votes?

He's the MAN!

11 Check the legend on the Cain map, I think you have a goof there.

Bah.  Fixing...

12 And are you saying RINOmney will kick SCOAMF's jug-eared ass? That doesn't sound too plausible.

13
Herb Cain's Pickup Lines #254

"Would you mind if I submitted my proposal for a joint venture?"

14 So, when can we expect to get a projection for Nov 2012?

15 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

16 Herb Cain's Pickup Lines #255 "Right by the hair of my chinny-chin-chin."

17 I am actually going ahead and saying this- if I waited another week after the scandal, Cain's map would be about as bad as Perry's. Posted by: CAC
.........
That was going to be my comment..  Thanks for these, CAC!

18 The red states stay red. The blue states get bluer when Cain's the candidate. Racists!

19 Obama is a MFSCOAMMFF. But I'm still having 2008 deja vu... summon the meteors.

20

Virginia is having House of Delegates & STate Senate elections next week.  that vote will be helpful in predicting what Va. does next November.  Gov McDonnell (R) still has 65-70% approval rating & he is going to work hard for the R nominee.

so I would like to think that Virginia goes back to solid red.

21 Damn, I'm for Romney.

22 I wonder how much "none of the above" would outpoll both SCOAMF and the GOP field. Posted by: LibertarianJim at November 03, 2011 02:07 PM (PReJ3) Generic R leads in NV, IA, CO, OH, FL, NC, VA, IN, PA, NH, and ME-2. Unfortunately Gen Eric Republican didn't throw his/her hat into the ring.

23 The legend is perfect now: 'Strong/Likely Cain, Strong/Likely Romney, Weak Obama"

24 Johnny need to fix that last Romney error in the Cain map- "Weak Romney"

25 Your giant maps confuse and scare me.

26 Why do we allow blue states to go first in the primaries?
This is how we get Rino's.

The establishment gets to make those sorts of decisions. Guess what kind of candidates they like.

27 20 The red states stay red. The blue states get bluer when Cain's the candidate. Racists!

Posted by: t-bird at November 03, 2011 02:08 PM (FcR7P)

We're OK with Halfrican-Americans; it's African-Americans we're afraid of.

28
Losing VA and IN in 2008 is unforgivable. The GOP and McCain campaign should be ashamed of themselves.

I don't care how hated Bush was and how lousy the economy was, we should never have lost VA & IN to a Barack Hussein Obama.

29 Those are some big ole maps, yessir.  Big maps.

30 I don't know I think Herb picks ups the taxi ho contingent and swings NY.

31 Have you seen Nate Silver's latest analysis?

http://tinyurl.com/3wr3ut3

32 John E.: You fucked up again! You left off 7 states, dude? WTF?!

33 CAC, I think you should go back to the plaid instead of the stripes in the toss ups.

34 How's about a projection with sidekicks a la Barky/Biteme vs. Romney/Turd Sammich?

35 So even on the Cain vs. Obama map, the red stands for 'Strong Romney"?


I think we get the racist message pretty darn clear.

Amerikkka just ain't ready for a straight black president!

36 Cain gets 191 red votes and 237 blue votes! Whoo-hoo! That's gettin' on the Cain Train!!!!

37 Why do we allow blue states to go first in the primaries?
This is how we get Rino's.

The establishment gets to make those sorts of decisions. Guess what kind of candidates they like.

Oh and why do we let them? Because being a permanent part of the Republican power structure would eventually lead to permanent scarring from all the scalding showers.

38 Well the only thing I can say is that it sure sucks that CA has 55 electoral votes

39 what's up?

40

New Rasmussen poll shows Cain still leading in SC by wide margin

95% say the allegations are similar to the Anita Hill smear. Surprising 23% for Romney and only 9% for Perry. Perry needs to get some ads out detailing Romney's gun grabbing record in MA as well as his other liberal shit.

41 Mitt is shit. I want a thread about  this meeting he had in 2002. It's to break from these cain threads.

42 Unfortunately Gen Eric Republican didn't throw his/her hat into the ring.

Yes, he did.

Also, map fixed.

43

Nice graphics, as usual.....thanks John E.

This early though, these numbers will change a hundred times before we vote next year in the general.

I hope Perry's numbers start getting better. It would really be a bummer for me to have to vote for Romney....moreso for his being forced upon us by the manipulations of the primary process, than for his cronic vacilations on core issues.

And I am really not sure that Romney has what it takes to energize the voters to drag their asses to the polls. It will be like what we went through with McCain....or worse.

44 Perry needs to get some ads out detailing Romney's gun grabbing record in MA as well as his other liberal shit. Perry just needs an ad flashing the coverage of his coyote shooting incident. At the end, he can be like Cain's smoker: "Let's go for a run, pussies." He's really got to ditch his inner McCain.

45

I call BS on all these numbers.  I think Republicans rally to the eventual nominee and give the SCOAMF the electoral spanking he deserves.

But maybe that's just my wishful thinking...

46 I am actually going ahead and saying this- if I waited another week after the scandal, Cain's map would be about as bad as Perry's.

Posted by: CAC at November 03, 2011 02:03 PM (JEVge)

Well, at least according to Ras the allegations haven't made any difference. I think what will make a difference is when the candidates start some ads detailing Romney's record in MA before 2007.

47 w  i  d  e     s  t  a  n  c  e

48 It really is sad it is this close with this dumbass in the WH.  Any good solid candidate would have over 300 easy.

That said, its a long way to go, another poll not to long ago had 50% of the people not knowing one R candidate, so even tho we pay attention, most aren't yet.

49 is this factoring in the dead and after polls close fraud?

50 I am feeling harrassed by those big scary maps!

51 I'm calling bull on the mitt map too. There wont be much of him left after the media goes through with him if he is the nominee.

52 I'm guessing the Romney map assumes that his nomination won't depress turnout?

Not saying that I want that to happen. We've all seen plenty of elections where voters simply decline to change the status quo if they have even the slightest doubt about the challenger.

I'd sure like to believe that the Republicans can rally regardless and kick the SCOAMF out, but Cain's poll numbers don't reassure me.

53

Ha ha ha.  This assumes we'll let you peons even vote.

Remember when we, the Left, were saying that Bushitler McHalliburton was going to do that?  We always telegraph what we want to do by accusing conservatives of it.

Why do you think I'm pulling out of Iraq?  I'll need those troops to maintain order.

54  I think what will make a difference is when the candidates start some ads detailing Romney's record in MA before 2007.

Posted by: Vic at November 03, 2011 02:19 PM (YdQQY)

I doubt we will see any such thing from the Cain camp, is Newt even running any ads?  Perry will probably hammer him on it.

55
Gov Perry bought a bunch of ad time on local talk radio stations in MA.

The ad is pretty good but it's sad how Perry squandered his instant frontrunner status and is now forced to pander himself as the "real" conservative candidate.

56 OT, from the Herminator on Twitter,

A few years ago, Joe Therrien, a graduate of the NYC Teaching Fellows program, was working as a full-time drama teacher at a public elementary school in New York City. Frustrated by huge class sizes, sparse resources and a disorganized bureaucracy, he set off to the University of Connecticut to get an MFA in his passion—puppetry. Three years and $35,000 in student loans later, he emerged with degree in hand, and because puppeteers aren’t exactly in high demand, he went looking for work at his old school. The intervening years had been brutal to the city’s school

http://t.co/RJjM6DyN

57 but Cain's poll numbers don't reassure me. Are you kidding me? I "poll" well.

58 CORRECTIONS: A previous version of this story mentioned that a source witnessed Cain and the woman entering a taxi together. This was incorrect. (oops, our bad)

The previous version also mentioned that the woman awoke in Cain’s bed — the source only claimed that the woman awoke in Cain’s apartment. (better to pass out vomitting at the boss's apt then in front of the parents - oops, our bad)

The previous version incorrectly attributed comments from one source to the other source. (we're a fucking blog, what do you want)

59 Posted by: The Robot Devil at November 03, 2011 02:23 PM (136wp)

Wait, there are degrees in puppetry?

60 32 Have you seen Nate Silver's latest analysis?

http://tinyurl.com/3wr3ut3

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at November 03, 2011 02:11 PM (f9c2L)

This analysis shows that, unless there is marked improvement in the economy, the proverbial pile of dogshit in my backyard could win the presidency. If it gets better, Barky is unbeatable. There, I saved y'all 5 minutes of reading.

61

41 what's up?

Fair to partly cloudy Primary suckage. With a 50% chance of shit showers.

62 Mitt + DeMint or Mitt + West is my choice. West would do the most wrecking of the leftist infrastructure. Conservative GOP Congress is best assured by Romney, my friends!

63 I'm guessing the Romney map assumes that his nomination won't depress turnout?

Polls do not measure turnout. You would think people would have learned that in 2010.

64 Are you kidding me? I "poll" well.

Posted by: Herman Cain at November 03, 2011 02:23 PM (FcR7P)

Heh, I meant that his high poll numbers don't reassure me that voters are thinking straight.

65

As long as Romney does not come close to the white house I'm all good.

A bit too rosy of a map. He'll be depressing a lot of turnout. He is not favored here in my Philly collar county a lot.

66 he set off to the University of Connecticut to get an MFA in his passion—puppetry You can get a Masters of Fucking Arts in sock-puppetry?!

67
That's a good point.

Why isn't the GOP busy right now making
John Corzine the Face of the Democrat Party?

68 That Obama is even remotely electable is one of the saddest indictments of my country (Which I love) that I've ever seen.

I guess a lot of that is greed for goodies, and fear of making your own way.  It's not the America I want (which is why I live in Texas, where people are keenly aware that government is not the solution to most problems).

But Obama's got to go. 

I don't think Romney is electable because of 1996 style issues.  The GOP is fractured today.  The Tea party is much better than The Reform party in many respects, but the same core issue prevails, and the GOP will be challenged to hold together in 2012 if our nominee is too much like Obama.  Too many people see this as a long term fight for the existence of the country.

Thus, it looks like Cain is the best shot, and he's being destroyed, though personally I do not blame a conspiracy for this.  It really looks like he can't handle this kind of campaign so his being the best shot is illusory.

I think Perry remains the best chance of beating Obama because I think the left is clever enough to impose some fake Tea, or even just prop up some legit third partier to spoil the whole thing.  That seems to be Obama's best chance, and it only really works if Romney is the nominee.

69 67 Mitt + DeMint or Mitt + West is my choice. West would do the most wrecking of the leftist infrastructure. Conservative GOP Congress is best assured by Romney, my friends!

I'm a believer in downstream vote conservative. I wonder if Mittens is strong enough to withstand the pressure from the creeps in Washington.

70
passionate for puppetry

that's a joke, right?

71

I hope Perry and some others start hitting Romney. The robot can easily be flustered. You just have to play his greatest hits as governor.

Conservatism dies - Mitt 2012

72 While Perry and Newt remain ahead of Romney as choices for me, I think Obama will be enough to energize GOP voters. I just don't see possible indifference to Romney cancelling out the abject hostility to four more years of Obama. We shall see.

73
CAC = Lord Humungous Grafix!

(you did warn us, tho)

74 I feel threatened by these maps.

75 Wait, there are degrees in puppetry?

Posted by: KG at November 03, 2011 02:24 PM (LD21B)

yes, even

Master of Puppets

76

I call BS on all these numbers.  I think Republicans rally to the eventual nominee and give the SCOAMF the electoral spanking he deserves.

But maybe that's just my wishful thinking...

I don't think it's wishful thinking.  What you're seeing now is the heat of the primary season.   People who cling to their candidate and claim they won't vote for any other GOP nominee next November are kidding themselves.   We'll all realize that beating Obama is the only thing that matters.

77   @62  Holy Crap.   Even PJ media.

78 CAC,

Any reason you have CT a lighter shade of blue on your Romney map than NJ?  CT is a good 5 points more Dem than NJ on the presidential level.  Especially considering there's been a GOP trend in NJ in the past three years, and almost none in CT

79

But of course for most of the delusional internet, Romney is the enemy.

Hot Air and Ace of Spades commenters are fine with Obama.  In fact they love him so much they try to destroy Romney everyday.

What's really important is that Mitt Romney never get to the Whitehouse right?

Because "conservatives" love socialism, as long as Mitt Romney is destroyed.

 

80

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at November 03, 2011 02:11 PM (f9c2L)

That is a great analysis

One more reason to think about Romney

81 People who cling to their candidate and claim they won't vote for any other GOP nominee next November are kidding themselves. We'll all realize that beating Obama is the only thing that matters.

Posted by: Mike at November 03, 2011 02:28 PM (NH9Y5)

Try me. Mitt WILL depress turnout. He is scum

82

One more reason to think about Romney

Posted by: chemjeff at November 03, 2011 02:29 PM (OoiW1)

Ok, I'm thinking about Mitt, Here's what I'm getting, "bland, bland, bland,bland. bland, bland, bland, bland, *boobies*, bland, bland...."

83

Where this idea that Rick Perry is a champion of all things conservative and is uniquely qualified to be the leader of our cause came from I'll never know. 

He's a second tier candidate and he runs three points behind Gingrich in the hypothetical matchup against SCOAMF for a reason....

He isn't ready for primetime in the slightest.  He seems utterly bewildered and out of his element in a national campaign.  He obviously didn't seriously think about running for national office until relatively recently.  That is a recipe for electoral disaster next year.

It's between Romney, Cain, & Newt.

 

 

 

 

84 89 Honey? Get back to work.

85

I hope Perry and some others start hitting Romney. The robot can easily be flustered. You just have to play his greatest hits as governor.

Conservatism dies - Mitt 2012

Posted by: Flapjackmaka at November 03, 2011 02:27 PM (HvPlb)

====

Nope, conservatism is already dead.  Remember the 11th commandment?  That is gone, it is much more important to destroy Romney, he is too close politically to Reagan.  Conservatism has already died a horrible death.

86 Because "conservatives" love socialism, as long as Mitt Romney is destroyed.

Want some cheese with that wine?

You know what this is?

♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫♪♫

You guessed it.

87

85....Hot Air and Ace of Spades commenters are fine with Obama. In fact they love him so much they try to destroy Romney everyday.

Petunia....how are you able to type with Mitt's dick in your mouth?

 

88  I am actually going ahead and saying this- if I waited another week after the scandal, Cain's map would be about as bad as Perry's.

Posted by: CAC at November 03, 2011 02:03 PM (JEVge)

Worse.

89 A Republic, madam, if you can keep it... Oh? Well, never mind, then.

90 A lot of you need to upgrade your intuitive and psychological software. With The same conservative platform, you get more conservative voters caring about Congress (because they don't trust Mitt) and more independent and Dem voters who aren't turned off by the usual GOP cultural baggage.

91 "

Because "conservatives" love socialism, as long as Mitt Romney is destroyed.

Posted by: petunia at November 03, 2011 02:29 PM (hgrmi)

"

 

Um, no, it's the romneybots who overlooking that we have socialized medicine in usa because the blueprint is romney's signature piece of "governance"

-

that said, if Mittens is the nominee I will vote for him.  But he is a turd.

92 I always hated it that Clinton's approval rating was untouched by his scandals. Now the same is happening to Cain ... so far. This may be the "wisdom of crowds" at work. You may view the electorate as "the masses are asses" or as "bitter clingers" but strangely they often collectively get things right. Maybe this is an example of such.

93 I'm smarting even more from some moron's newsflash yesterday on here that Pence was reconsidering a run for POTUS.  My heart skipped a beat....and then skipped more beats when reality smacked me upside the head.  That was a major down twinkles!

94 I was going to do Perry as well, but to be frank, you guys don't like that much blue.

Heh, no shit.  Ricardo Peré would probably lose McCain states.

Washington ought to be a darker shade of blue than that under the Romney scenario.  It will never, ever go Republican for President.  Oregon's probably too light blue too.

Otherwise, Romney could bring states back into the fold that have been astray for 20 years.

95 99 A lot of you need to upgrade your intuitive and psychological software...

Got a link for a site to download the upgrade? I lost my bookmarks when last FiAF

96 A few years ago, Joe Therrien, a graduate of the NYC Teaching Fellows program, was working as a full-time drama teacher at a public elementary school in New York City. Frustrated by huge class sizes, sparse resources and a disorganized bureaucracy, he set off to the University of Connecticut to get an MFA in his passion—puppetry. Three years and $35,000 in student loans later, he emerged with degree in hand, and because puppeteers aren’t exactly in high demand, he went looking for work at his old school. The intervening years had been brutal to the city’s school

http://t.co/RJjM6DyN Posted by: The Robot Devil at November 03, 2011 02:23 PM

Hey, I told him not to do it.

97 What's really important is that Mitt Romney never get to the Whitehouse right?

Could really see myself getting and staying behind Mitt Romney...until the wind shifts.

98 but strangely they often collectively get things right.

Maybe this is an example of such.

Posted by: MaxMBJ at November 03, 2011 02:38 PM (deaac)

I don't know about "often"....

99 A lot of you need to upgrade your intuitive and psychological software.

AVG identifies RomneyWare 2012 as a Trojan.

100

Try me. Mitt WILL depress turnout. He is scum

Posted by: Flapjackmaka at November 03, 2011 02:30 PM (HvPlb)

Then you are weak and you will die.

101 Sorry for that "joke"  Lady.

102

Ok, I'm thinking about Mitt, Here's what I'm getting, "bland, bland, bland,bland. bland, bland, bland, bland, *boobies*, bland, bland...."

Posted by: The Robot Devil at November 03, 2011 02:31 PM (136wp)

Boobies always find their way into the mix. 2,742nd look at Palin?

103 These maps are part of the giant conspiracy by the establishment to hand Romney the nomination. All of our plans are coming together.

104 I think part of the Mitt hate is that he is actually smarter than most of us--not true of most politicians--and that skews things in the minds of many.

105 Petunia has me convinced that I must vote for Obama if Romney is the nominee.

106 Petunia has me convinced that I must vote for Obama if Romney is the nominee That may in fact be her intention.

107 Sorry for that "joke"  Lady.

Heh.  My bad for being gullible...but only for a nanosecond. 

I'm so flustered at our candidates.  It's absolutely stunning to me that we're narrowing it down to a scumball (Romney) and, sorry, Cain, a likeable, but buffoonish not-ready-for-prime-time (by a long stretch) player.  I can't believe Perry's apparently become so toxic.  What a wasted golden opportunity.  I don't see much indication of him turning things around.  Jesus, can't we have one candidate whose needle isn't flying off to the right of the suck-o-meter? 

108 113 I think part of the Mitt hate is that he is actually smarter than most of us--not true of most politicians--and that skews things in the minds of many.

Posted by: ParisParamus at November 03, 2011 02:42 PM (/jwWy)

You are really full of yourself, aren't you?

109 Would a Christie VP pick be a net gain or loss or EVs?

110

Exactly how large would an earthquake have to be for us to eliminate California and the rest of the Left Coast from the entire question?

 

_{(....just asking....)}

111 Petunia has convinced me that being one of the .1 % pf the Romney supporters on this site causes butthurt to the other 99.9%.

112 You are really full of yourself, aren't you? Just telling it like it is. And since he's likely smarter than me, how so? Smarts, beyond a point are meaningless, but they threaten people who are insecure

113 @119

I tried that with a reprogrammed nuclear missile.  Didn't work out too well for me, though.


MISS TESSSMMAACCHHEERRR!!

114

I'll tell you what, I'm getting sick and tired of all these "true conservative" types out there.  Clearly, 75% of the Republican primary voters don't like Romney.  But then they piss and moan and disqualify every other not-Romney candidate for flaws that are probably less signifcant than their hatred of Romney.

They can't make up their mind which not-Romney candidate to support, so they jump on and off bandwagons every two to three weeks.  In the mean time, they trash every candidate except for Romney or Obama, and are just serving to piss off other Republican voters and make all our candidates look bad.

Can't these jackasses stop taking everything so personally, make up their minds based on the merits, and try to get the SCoaMF out of the whitehouse!?

/end rant

115 "Remember the 11th commandment?  That is gone

Posted by: petunia at November 03, 2011 02:33 PM (hgrmi)"

Naw.  Reagan hit Ford like crazy in the primaries.  There is no 11th commandment against conservatives criticizing RINOs.  That's just something RINOs say to avoid the debate.

Perry hitting Romney is exactly what Reagan did, and would do, in Perry's shoes.

----

That said, I am disturbed that my guy is so weak in polling in the general.  I won't vote for Perry in the primary if I am not convinced he can beat Obama.  I also won't vote for Romney in the primary under any circumstance, obviously, since I'm conservative.  So for me, if Cain can overcome this BS, despite my problems with him, he's under serious consideration.

116 And since he's likely smarter than me, how so? 

Posted by: ParisParamus at November 03, 2011 02:49 PM (/jwWy)

What evidence do you have that he is highly intelligent? My dislike of Romney (aside from the political) is his inability to convince me that he isn't lying. That isn't the mark of an intelligent man.

117 Out, damned sock!

118 "I think part of the Mitt hate is that he is actually smarter than most of us--not true of most politicians--and that skews things in the minds of many. Posted by: ParisParamus at November 03, 2011 02:42 PM (/jwWy)"

See why I say some of these guys sound like a cult of personality?

And sometimes they get very weird in their level of hostility to the truth.  Some even threaten violence.

There is something deeply weird about some of Romney's fans.  I'm not even really talking about Paris, though the 'he's a genius' thing is silly enough.

Romney's the guy who thinks Asia is a country, and is gaffe-tastic when illegals on his lawn are mentioned.

119 These maps are a bunch of nonsense.  There's no way Cain beats Obama in North Dakota.

120 I'd rather have a rock-ribbed uber-conservative Repub. But priority #1 is to fuck Obama sideways and prevent another 4 years of leftard Obama-scum destruction. If that means Romney I'm cool with that.

He does do better in the midwest. A shock since he's ... from a famous midwest political family. The Perry, Cain, and Gingrich accents don't do as well there. It's prejudice, but it's a real issue.

And I do think the evidence is that Romney will bring in more swing voters than he will alienate hard-core conservatives -- and the states he alienates the hard-core crowd most in will still vote Republican. While his strengths in the midwest put in play states that Democrats rely on.

Maybe a Paul Ryan VP slot to seal the deal.

121

EVERYONE lies about embarassing sex stuff.

oh wait, it's a repbulican?

buuuuurrrrrnnnnnnn hiiiiiiiimmmmmmm

122 128 These maps are a bunch of nonsense.

You mean the infographics? 

123 Maybe a Paul Ryan VP slot to seal the deal.
Posted by: Clubber Lang
..............
Yeah.. that's how I feel.  Although I think a Rubio would do better nationwide for us than Ryan.

124

Did I just read the the Dems are wanting to extend unemployment benefits YET AGAIN???

Do we need to point out to the current Republicans in  Congress that continuing to bankroll Obama's handouts to his favorite voters will only make the economy and financial situation seem LESS severe.... to the Democrats benefit next year?

125 What evidence do you have that he is highly intelligent? My dislike of Romney (aside from the political) is his inability to convince me that he isn't lying. That isn't the mark of an intelligent man. Top things: 1. Top of class at BYU 2. Has JD and MBA from Harvard 3. Has done phenomenally well in public and private realms 4. Speaks a foreign language pretty well 5. Can beat Rick Perry in debate over Romneycare

126 I fear that Romney would govern weakly and be bullied by the press. And that he would appoint moderate weasels to the Supreme Court -- and history shows the "moderates" always swing Left after years on the bench, they have to be rock-ribbed to withstand the insane pressure to shift leftward.

The potential downsides of Romney are very significant. But the known downsides of an Obama 2nd term are 10x worse.

127 "And I do think the evidence is that Romney will bring in more swing voters than he will alienate hard-core conservatives"

Maybe.  Maybe not.  It's instructive to look at the 1996 and 1992 elections, IMO.

I think Romney will lose tremendous support from the right, and I also think he's going to lose with the middle after the flip flop thing is really demonstrated, showing low info voters that Romney is not a huge change from Obama anyway.

I don't think the GOP can out-promise Obama on goodies.  We do better when we present a clear choice, IMO.

128 What's the polling numbers on the Ham Sandwich?

129 "Top things:
1. Top of class at BYU
2. Has JD and MBA from Harvard
3. Has done phenomenally well in public and private realms
4. Speaks a foreign language pretty well
5. Can beat Rick Perry in debate over Romneycare

Posted by: ParisParamus at November 03, 2011 03:03 PM (/jwWy)"

Most of these are true.  When did #5 occur?  Romney has not managed to discuss Romneycare successfully, IMO.

130 BTW, Paris, Obama and Romney both have law degrees from Harvard.  It is their most impressive academic credential, and I think it is not evidence of intelligence.  We're told it is.  We're told it's a super competitive law school.  I'm not seeing this produce good leaders.

Frankly, all the huge clusterfarks in this country emanate from the top three ivy league's grads.

If Romney were so smart, he wouldn't have doomed MA to bankruptcy with the enormous money pit that is Romneycare.

131

BTW, Paris, Obama and Romney both have law degrees from Harvard. 

One was an affirmative racism baby and a commie prof's pet, and one decidedly was not.

I want someone other than Mitt, but if it is Mitt, I will fight for him and the best congresscritters we can elect. A good GOP House and Senate will push Mitt rightward.

 

132 I'm still not buying it with Rubio. And I think his Cuban heritage isn't that helpful with the bulk of American hispanics who are overwhelmingly from Mexico and Central America. Spanish fluency is a plus, though.

In the near term - next 10 years -- I think Repubs benefit more from midwesterners as the face of the party.

Long term the Repubs are gonna have to find some right wing Mex-Americans to feature.

It sucks that we have to play the race game, but people are fucking racist. There's no point fighting for the black vote, we'll never win that, but the Mexi vote is not set in stone yet.

I think by 2030 nearly every candidate is gonna have to be mixed-race. It's gonna be a half-black, half-mexican Dem vs a half-white, half-mexican Repub. Full-blooded single race identity will become a negative.

133 "One was an affirmative racism baby and a commie prof's pet, and one decidedly was not."

That's true.  And it's not like I think Romney is stupid.  I just don't think he's a genius.  I don't think he's anywhere near Cain's intelligence level, or Newt's.  I think Romney is about as smart as Obama.  Romney has that last name, after all.  That name is carved into buildings at BYU, and also very powerful in the NE among elites.  I have no huge problem with that, but Romney without the last name would probably be a completely different entity.

"I want someone other than Mitt, but if it is Mitt, I will fight for him and the best congresscritters we can elect."

Good.  I have a hard time agreeing to actually campaign for Mitt, because I don't want to work with people who resemble some of the Romney fans online, so I'd just focus on campaigning for congressmen.  Obviously we all need to vote for the GOP nominee because Obama is terrible.  But he's not terrible because he's stupid.  Ideology is the problem here.

134 Some of the weirdness is purely a response to the false things and just ad hom. Attacks about him on the conservative web. But yes, he will win at least two states almost purely because of his faith UT and NV), and apparently a lot of LDS folk have a certain persecution complex , or at least feel sufficiently discriminated against to be his cheerleader. Well, such is political life. By the way, I think he is a great conservative, but do you really see Rubio being a firebrand campaigner as VP? I like Alan West as VP for this reason.

135 Long term the Repubs are gonna have to find some right wing Mex-Americans to feature.

I heard a rumor that there is one somewhere in San Diego, CA.

136 "How many Connecticut independents would even consider voting for Perry? Or Cain?"

That state went for Kerry by double digits.  Who cares?  Kerry lost.  Any politician that CT likes a lot is probably going to lose the rust belt in 2012.

137 "apparently a lot of LDS folk have a certain persecution complex , or at least feel sufficiently discriminated against to be his cheerleader. Well, such is political life."

Yeah, that's just politics and we can't pretend that doesn't exist for evangelicals or black liberationists or whoever. 

I did see one guy last night use Romney being a Mormon as an argument.  And then he threatened me with violence, right here on this blog.  He also claimed he wasn't Mormon, so I'm not sure I understand the guy, but he wasn't being very honest.

Regardless, Romney's best argument is that he's electable.  Not 'I HATE YOU IF YOU CRITICIZE ROMNEY AND I HOPE YOU BURN IN HELL!!!!'  His fans should work much harder to show that conservatives can be happy with Romney, and a lot less hard to suggest their ideology or arguments are actually sinister.

We know this is the same Romney as Romneycare.  We know we're not making that up.

I realize this leaves Romney's fans with a tough, tough sell.  But the anger is actually proving the point that Romney is too divisive.

138 I like Alan West as VP for this reason.

That would make the Presidential candidate look weak. I don't know how that would work out.

139 @145 Right, Romney's appeal is that he makes a good case he can win the rust belt. And we have to win some of it (Ohio, Indiana) and if he can win more (Penn, Mich, Wisc) then the election goes from a close call to a blowout.

140 Yes, Clubber, that is a remarkable advantage Romney has.  That's because his family is known as liberal, pro-union, Republicans, but hey, it is a political advantage.

If Romney can hold the GOP together, and there's no third party challenge, of course he will do very well.  Except I worry that he will suffer both the flip flopper thing, and some kind of third party crap.  It is just too obvious a move.  Bob Dole should have won in 1996 because he was so centrist.  If you just grant him the right, he wins in a blowout, but he was unable to hold the right together, and frankly, Dole was not nearly as tough a sell as Romney is in the wake of Obamacare.

141 Frankly, all the huge clusterfarks in this country emanate from the top three ivy league's grads. Sorry, but Obama is an affirmative action fraud. And no, academics aren't sufficient, but they are necessary. And Harvard Law PLUS an MBA, actually done concurrently is very impressive. Especially when done in the 1970s before things has gotten so BSy in academia.

142 #151 I'm not for a mandate at the federal or state level.  But his ability to contain the damage from this is impressive.  Or, everyone else is pathetic.

143 "Sorry, but Obama is an affirmative action fraud."

Sure, but did Romney get some kind of legacy advantage?  I don't know.  Anyway, it's not like I think Romney is stupid.  I just greatly doubt he's brilliant.  I think a harvard degree is not a sign of great wisdom.

"academics aren't sufficient, but they are necessary."

I disgree.  At least to the point I think you're making, that we should see ivy league degrees as even equivalent to a normal education, given how many ivy leaguers are directly involved with the enormous problems our country has today.

I would take someone with Palin's academic background, or someone who paid for school with the GI Bill, a real self made man, over someone who was born in a very elite family and went to all the right schools, some of which had buildings named for the kid's dad.

Not a class warfare thought here, just I'm not very impressed with the elite academic argument.

If you want to show that Romney is brilliant, talk about Bain or the Olympics.  Those are arguments that make sense to me.  His Harvard law degree is actually a minus, and that's why he barely mentions it.

144 "But his ability to contain the damage from this is impressive.  Or, everyone else is pathetic.

Posted by: ParisParamus at November 03, 2011 03:41 PM (AkYTo)"

OK.  I'll grant you this one.

145 I just don't think he's a genius.

No one said he is, and I don't want a President to is.  In fact, I pretty much detest "geniuses"

146 and more independent and Dem voters who aren't turned off by the usual GOP cultural baggage.

Posted by: ParisParamus at November 03, 2011 02:35 PM (/jwWy)

Hey, you agree with the SCOAMF! 

Hey everyone:  If you can't see how condescending and arrogant this statement is, you might be a Mitt Man.

147 113 I think part of the Mitt hate is that he is actually smarter than most of us--not true of most politicians--and that skews things in the minds of many.

Posted by: ParisParamus at November 03, 2011 02:42 PM (/jwWy)

Go. Fuck.  Yourself.

Seriously, you fetch the guy's dinner once in the 08 cycle and now you feel obligated to suck his dick?

148 Sure, but did Romney get some kind of legacy advantage? 

He was the son of a Governor, and had some $ by the time he went, so no, he wasn't a boy from the ghetto.

149 "No one said he is, and I don't want a President to is.  In fact, I pretty much detest "geniuses"

Posted by: ParisParamus at November 03, 2011 03:46 PM (AkYTo)"

I'm glad we're on the same page there.  IMO, the 'brilliant' leaders tend to be micromanagers who see a problem and want the government to solve the problem.  These guys are actually idiots.  And they are leading wrong.

Leadership requires discipline and setting standards, and requiring they be met.

Perry actually did that for a very long time.  He set standards, such as agency performance and budget cuts, and he required the be met, and thus, TX's government hasn't been ballooning in size at all.  This is sometimes easy.  This is sometimes very, very hard, such as with education spending, with Perry froze to enormous screams and lawsuits in 2006, and then even cut because we just plain didn't have the money due to the downturn.

As a result, government is not intruding too far.  Prosperity in TX flows naturally, organically, as businesses flee states with 'brilliant' leaders.

In my opinion, Romney saw violence as a problem, so he taxed guns and banned some, and this made things worse.  He saw health care as a problem, so he solved it by forcing people who don't want health insurance to buy terrible policies that amount to redistribution of wealth (a large pool with more healthy people in it), and also loses money anyway, bankrupting the state.  Romney also governed a state gov that was far larger per capita than it should be, and he made it a little larger (that's if you ignore Romneycare... if you don't, Romney made it MUCH larger).

I don't want the next President to see every problem as a reason to use the government.

150 "He was the son of a Governor, and had some $ by the time he went, so no, he wasn't a boy from the ghetto.

Posted by: ParisParamus at November 03, 2011 03:55 PM (AkYTo)"

Though I disagree with George Romney's liberalism and union stuff, I have no problem with someone's kids having some rewards because their parents and a few generations beyond did well in life.  I kinda resent political dynasties (Romney's got so many politicians in his family it's not even funny), but whatever.

My point is that I respect someone who had very little, and served in the military, and used the GI Bill to improve himself and succeeded as a professional very much.  Or someone who worked their way through school from humble roots, and succeeded.  That stuff shows me character.

Nothing wrong with how Romney got educated.  It's just not awesome or anything.

151

Posted by: grognard at November 03, 2011 03:52 PM (NS2Mo)

Seriously, I am depressed at how, like 80% of the commenters on this site, as well as others grab onto the the "real conservative of the week" and don't get how amateurish they or, or don't get how difficult it is to unseat a sitting President.  I think Romney will win as much because of his strengths as Perry's and Cain's weaknesses. 

152 I don't want the next President to see every problem as a reason to use the government.

I'm betting he doesn't, and won't; and Congress won't, in any case, let him.  Guess we're going to find out.

153

These maps are soooo not my generation, I don't see the relevance here.

Ooooh theres Cuntessa!!

Later ya old wingers.

 

154 "I'm betting he doesn't, and won't; and Congress won't, in any case, let him.  Guess we're going to find out.

Posted by: ParisParamus at November 03, 2011 04:07 PM (AkYTo)"

Perhaps.  I know there's that Althouse argument that if Mccain had been president, the right would be marginalize, and a center left position would be the 'mainstream' right most position.

It turns out that Obama is so freaking bad that anyone rejecting Mccain for that calculation was deeply misguided.  This seemed obvious enough before the 2008 election.  It's obvious enough today.  We do need a more conservative Senate, in particular, if Romney is to be constrained.

But the winds blow clearly against a serious reform to entitlements.  I think you have to ignore almost everything Romney says to think he will stand tall and do what 100% must be done in order to prevent a fiscal disaster.

It is worth a somewhat elevated risk in the general if it means a chance of actually reforming spending by electing a better leader who can stand up against harsh political conditions.

Romney's Ohio flip (the one back to the right, I mean) shows he still just can't do that.  He perceives he made the wrong 'move' and swiftly corrects, every single time.  That is great following, terrible leading.

155 BTW, with Ace's new Romney post, talking to liberals about how they need a guy like Romney to rise to prominence in the GOP in DC, I feel like maybe he's not trustworthy from a conservative POV, and intends to help the left.

I mean, he did tell the left he's going to help them if he rises to DC.  What did he mean?  Of course, to do so, he had to reinvent himself on some issues, but if he promised to help the left if he became a national Republican, and he'd have to reinvent to be plausible, doesn't that mean he's probably a liberal at heart?

Richard Nixon took the government wildly to the left on domestic issues, and he made LBJ's mistakes into much worse problems.  That's why Social Security is unsustainable today.

We probably should reject Romney in the primary because we don't know what he really stands for.  Sure, maybe he's electable, but what then?

And IMO, 2012 is a year the GOP can win with a couple of the other candidates.

156 I would like to see Romney confronted with the abortion thing during a debate.  I want this all out and vetted.

157 OK, time to choose Cain/Palin or Palin/Cain or of course Obama/Biden if you're visiting :-)

158 Enjoyed the conversation, Paris.  It's nice having a good faith difference of opinion about Romney without a Romney supporter pretending I said something I didn't say or threatening me with violence.

159 "OK, time to choose

Cain/Palin or
Palin/Cain

or of course Obama/Biden if you're visiting :-)

Posted by: DaMav at November 03, 2011 04:57 PM (QNU76)"

I choose Newt!

No, I still like Perry, strictly because presidentin' is tough and he's got the most experience running a massive government seriously and properly.

But Perry/Newt or Newt/Perry or either with Paul Ryan would be great.

I don't take Cain or Rubio very seriously.  Rubio needs more experience.  Cain does not appear to even want my support.

160 Maps that big should show the full 57 states mentioned in the Bible -- Jay Carney

161 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

162 A political post by a guy who believes in ghosts. great.

163

Color Michigan a very light pink, which may turn a bit darker in the next few months.

Republican insiders think they can deliver the state, with the right candidate. Romney is a homeboy, but some still hold a bit of a grudge over his comments about the auto bailout. Cain may also have a good chance.

 

164 175 A political post by a guy who believes in ghosts. great.

Posted by: Floral Bumhole at November 03, 2011 06:10 PM (DvOak)

Hey, now. Go easy on the guy. Those were rape ghosts, and rape and politics are like peas and carrots.

165
That is useful information and its quite easy to come a croper if you are not vigilant.

166 Yep! I was agreed, I'll keep in touch to your blog.

167

Just checked. Yep, Romney still sux.

(And O-bah-muhh is a Stammering Clusterforce Of A Miserable Failure)

168 Nice commentary. last thirty days I uncovered this internet site and desired to permit you be conscious that iÂ’ve been gratified, heading via your siteÂ’s posts. I should certainly be signing equally as much as the RSS feed and can wait around for another post.

169
That is useful information and its quite easy to come a croper if you are not vigilant.