1 As I said in the other thread all they have to do for SSDI is eliminate the 50% fraud in the system.

2 Yes, college is used as a sorting device to get around the stupid EEOC civil suits.

As for all those tenured professors getting other jobs that is a laugh. Some of them in the sciences may be able to but most are not fit to perform any real work.

3 I'm still fuming over the gubmint's trillion-dollar steaming pile of "loans" to fatcat banks, here and abroad. Guess that's how Osama Obama -- the stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure, in case you've forgotten -- keeps his campaign coffers full.

Hope Bloomberg follows through and looks at how much, if any, of that loot has been (or ever will be) repaid.

4 Some of them in the sciences may be able to but most are not fit to perform any real work.
Posted by: Vic at August 22, 2011 08:29 AM

This applies equally to our "servants" in D.C. and government employees in general. Combined, these two groups comprise the biggest welfare fraud scheme in human history.

5 “The Right to Vote: the Contested History of Democracy in the United States."

LOL, any time you hear someone refer to the "robber barons" of the 19th century you know you are about to get a load of communist propaganda.

The real robber barons were the people who made money sucking at the government tit in the railroads..

6 The "dismal" science link says it may take 10 years or more for recovery.  Don't these idiots realize Japan still hasn't recovered from its bubble, 20+ years later?   And were doing the same shit they did - extend and pretend.

7 I know we like our DOOM economic, but foreign policy will have its say also. Who are these Libyan rebels? How about Israel and Egypt shooting at each other, and don't forget the Unilateral Declaration of Independence (Abbas promises a newly formed Palestinian state will be free of all Jews!) The Koreans are shooting at each other too.

8 "...And Keynesians, as always, assume that the government will spend the money they borrowed wisely, which has not been the case...."

You wingnuts. He was born in HAWAII, not Kenya.

9 That ballistic missile analogy about productivity is great, Monty.

10 Really short of a nuclear war Doom is really on vacation this week. No one is at home in Washington DC. No major announcements on the horizon. Gaddafi missing in action. And my first patient just cancelled

11 Who are these Libyan rebels? How about Israel and Egypt shooting at each other, and don't forget the Unilateral Declaration of Independence (Abbas promises a newly formed Palestinian state will be free of all Jews!)....

Posted by: blaster at August 22, 2011 08:35 AM

It seems inconceivable that President Historic First© -- our president -- seems to be coming down on the side of Muzzie terrorists in these "conflicts." He doesn't give a shit about Korea -- perhaps because there are few, if any, of "his people" there.

And Robert Mugabe rules for another day, unmolested by the "democracy loving" West....

12 @2 I'm a computer guy. Starting with the dot-com boom, I developed a fairly harsh prejudice against young people. My biggest complaint has been out-of-control senses of entitlement that bear no relationship to abilities or willingness to work. About five or six years ago, I started noticing that my prejudice is mostly unfounded outside of the white-collar world. The young-punk-looking people working retail and traditionally blue-collar jobs do not behave like the twenty-something children I regularly encounter in my work world. After several pleasant surprises with salespeople, tradesmen, and deliverymen, I finally got it through my thick skull that not all young people are the same. As best I can tell, four-year colleges are the problem. These institutions are systematically poisoning young minds, and if the economy spends a few more years at what is now the new normal, these two-legged attitude problems will never be employable anywhere.

13 Monty: "Mr. President, hiring is a side effect of increasing profitability. If a business pays for more workers, with no additional revenue coming in, then the business owner is cutting his own pay. And pretty soon, he'll be out of business." Obama: *blink* *blink* *blink* "I'm not getting you."

14 You broke it, you bought it, bitch.  Now get out the super glue and tweezers, and do it for the children.

Hearts and minds.

15 As I said in the other thread all they have to do for SSDI is eliminate the 50% fraud in the system.

No, Vic.  Paying people not to work when they've only paid into the system for (on average) 10 years and will be living probably another 40+ is not sustainable.  Especially at the levels we pay them currently.

There are very few people who are truly disabled anyway- even if they're paraplegic.  They may have to learn a new set of skills, but that's something that can be done.

As best I can tell, four-year colleges are the problem. These institutions are systematically poisoning young minds, and if the economy spends a few more years at what is now the new normal, these two-legged attitude problems will never be employable anywhere.

Shorter FTL: People who have to work for a living realize other people "count" too.  Perpetual children who had Mommy and Daddy (or, better: the taxpayer) fund their existence for their entire lives are more than a little narcissistic.

16

Yup, I agree today anyway, we are bend over and back up boned to the max. And it any gonna get any prettier.

 

17
As best I can tell, four-year colleges are the problem. These institutions are systematically poisoning young minds, and if the economy spends a few more years at what is now the new normal, these two-legged attitude problems will never be employable anywhere. Posted by: FRONT TOWARD LEFT


I think that comes from having to take all the different social sciences as an undergraduate for a degree in computer science. 

Not knocking a well rounded education but it annoyed me when I was in college for electronics is that I had to study 5 other subjects to get to what I wanted to study..

18 Hmmm... wanna know why SSDI is in trouble?

That's an easy one.

19

you can get disability for a bad back, alcoholism & drug addiction.

meanwhile, there are those of us with moderate to severe neurological problems that the doctors can only guess at the root cause.  we can't get disability because there is no name to our disease.

meanwhile, i never counted on any social security in my retirement plans. 

20 Posted by: goy at August 22, 2011 08:57 AM (AfU1B)

See Also: Abuse, Fraud

The sad fact is that SSDI's initial reaction is to deny claims.  Much like the HMOs were accused of doing in the late 90's (the HMO's didn't actually, but that's another story) SSDI seems to believe that if you're not willing to appeal, then you can't possibly be actually disabled.

Now, they may actually have a point, but that does mean Disability Attorneys are a necessary evil.  However, actual disability cases are fairly rare, so those same attorneys (acting out of self-interest) have made an industry of securing SSDI benefits when someone isn't really disabled.

As Vic said, above, if you got rid of that fraud and abuse in the system, you'd fix a large part of the problem.  The model itself is still unsustainable, but you might be able to make it limp on another 25 or 50 years if you did that.

21 Warning for parents of college students:

In case you didn't know it,  your student can take out a college loan without telling you about it.  And since the loans don't kick in until after they graduate,  you might THINK you re getting them through without debt when they are amassing huge debt.

And they aren't just borrowing for tuition,  either.  The government will loan money for "living expenses" as well.

This explains the huge numbers of students making exotic spring break trips, chatting away on the latest smart phones,  and getting their nails done weekly.

Before you get too far along the college path,  do your best to make certain that your child understands about debt and why it is a bad idea.

22 Millions of people in this country suffer from anxiety.  The anxiety that comes from the uncertainty of not knowing whether one is an idiot.  As a public service, we at Moronia Labs have developed this free (for a limited time only) test to help you identify whether you suffer from the debilitating condition of idiocy.  The free (for a limited time only) test follows:

Problem: Massive, unsustainable debt
Source of problem: massive, irrational spending beyond means

Given the factors in this problem stated above, what is the solution to this problem?

A. More spending
B. Less spending

If you chose A then unfortunately, you are an idiot.  Reversal of this condition is rare and involves voluntarily reaching the conclusion that answer B is the only rational solution to the problem.  If you are unsuccessful in reaching the rational answer, your idiocy is terminal and you should refrain from voting as this is a proven transmitter of this dreadful condition.  You should also refrain from expressing opinions in public to minimize embarrassment to yourself, your family and those with whom you have inadvertent contact.  While some idiots are able to lead normal, relatively successful lives, this also is rare.  Absolute seclusion is recommended for the good of the community and society at large.

This has been a public service of Moronia Labs.

23 #17  I  had to take some ridiculous number of credits in "humanities" and "ethnic studies" to graduate (I think it was something like 42 credits total).  I was double majoring in genetics and bacteriology.  How does "the african storyteller" help me with genetics and bacteriology?
I also took something that was called "Clap for Credit".  I mean, seriously.  The humanities and ethnic courses were gamed by the science and engineering students.  Everyone knew exactly which classes to take for easy grades and to get the stupid requirements out of the way.

24

#14 - "Now get out the super glue and tweezers, and do it for the children."

"We're out of glue"

"#$^@@!  You used up all the glue...ON PURPOSE!"

25 Before you get too far along the college path,  do your best to make certain that your child understands about debt and why it is a bad idea.

This starts (if possible) in childhood.  Teach them to pay cash for everything (yes: everything.  That includes a car).  My wife and I took Dave Ramsey's "Financial Peace University" (recommended if you get the chance and have any more than a trivial amount of debt).  One of the main lessons I took away was that the model my parents used (of me just getting an allowance each week, that you need to have a good credit score, etc.) was just wrong, and the correct thing to teach your kids is "If you don't have the money for it right now, don't try to buy it right now."

26

Re the employment subsidy, that looked like a pretty dumb idea - patched together on the back of a napkin at some bar at 2 AM by a couple long-time bureaucrats.  It seemed to bear no correlation at all to the reasons that the unemployment exists in the first place.

However, while I understand the concept the employment is a side effect of business activity rather than the purpose, the real fact is that if our current system fails to provide enough opportunity for people to make an honest living the system will be destroyed.  There's no frontier any more.  You can't go out and take some free land and start up subsistence farming.  You have to participate in the modern economic system (whether legitimately or in the black market), or go on welfare, or starve.  Those are the 3 options.  People usually don't go along with that third one willingly, and desperation doesn't exactly spawn a lot of rational decisions. 

If we can't come up with a market driven solution to get employment where it needs to be, we may as well throw in the towel.  Obviously this administration will not do it - but does our side really plan to make the necessary moves?  And how massive a majority would we need in order to make those changes? 

27 You have to hand it to Fat Mittens--he's an AGW believer, and he doesn't give a damn who knows it.  (linked in sidebar)  No TPaw apawlogy for him.  He's Mitt Romney with atty-tood.

28 Not only is Harvard professor Alexandar Keyssar's piece stupid, but the comments of most of the readers are moronic as well.

All these assholes should get summer jobs as bellhops out on Martha's Vineyard, so they can get some face time with all those at the top, and see how they feel about sharing their personal wealth.

Maybe the conversations could result in some $100,000 tips.  You think?

Go for it!

29 Posted by: Reactionary at August 22, 2011 09:08 AM (xUM1Q)

The thing is, there already is a market driven solution: it's called "Get government out of the way."

Oh.  You thought we were in a free market economy?  How cute. (kidding).

The fact is there will always be those who are unemployed and those who are "poor" (for a given value of "poor").  You're never going to be able to stop that.  The question is: what is the best way to take care of those people?  I'm going to give you a hint: the answer isn't government.

30 I'm eagerly awaiting a long string of outraged comments saying "Hell, I've been yelling about SS disability since ____!"

It was pretty much an open secret, especially among federal law enforcement, that SSI and SSDI went off like a skyrocket immediately after "the end of welfare as we know it," away back in the Clintonian era.

Funding for supplemental benefits has been at the crisis point for over 15 years. I think it's great that someone has finally noticed, but for a term or two (as the Tea Party goes straight to hell), the only result will be a pH shift in our bitterness, and the tightness of our cling.  Potential recipients of largesse will confront this...when it confronts them.  Not before.

31 Not knocking a well rounded education but it annoyed me when I was in college for electronics is that I had to study 5 other subjects to get to what I wanted to study..

Posted by: Dave C at August 22, 2011 08:57 AM (gSWSm)

 

Many people are irked by this, and rightly so.  Most of us just wanted job training - not what passes for a "liberal" education these days.  It's not likely to change, though.  For one, the schools make more money by selling more classes.  Also, they use those classes to carry out political indoctrination.  They'll never willingly give up the revenue nor propaganda opportunities, so long as we allow Leftists to control the system.

32 This discussion got me thinking about Matt Damon's idiotic and ignorant comments about teachers' "shitty" pay. And that got me thinking: My God, Ben Affleck is "the smart one," isn't he?

33

you can get disability for a bad back, alcoholism & drug addiction.

meanwhile, there are those of us with moderate to severe neurological problems that the doctors can only guess at the root cause.  we can't get disability because there is no name to our disease.

...

Posted by: kelley in virginia at August 22, 2011 09:01 AM (VIqi1)

The trouble with you is, you're not thinking like a Moron.
Now, if your sever neurological problems were to cause you to drink...

(Q.E.D. ...)

34 And how massive a majority would we need in order to make those changes?  Posted by: Reactionary

We're reaching the point were we as a nation will need to shit or go blind.. 

If the Republicans ever get a majority in Congress and the White House, they will be so paralyzed with fear (with losing power) over doing anything they will fart and close one eye instead..

35 the real fact is that if our current system fails to provide enough opportunity for people to make an honest living the system will be destroyed

The main problem is not the private sector; it's the government. There's too much of it. There are too many regulations, too many taxes, and too much red tape and BS for small and medium-sized businesses to be successful. And the small-to-medium business is where most employment and wealth-creation really happens.

Too many people are blaming a failure of capitalism on things that are more properly blamed on a Brobdingnagian government. Capitalism is working just as it is supposed to work -- if people cannot earn a decent profit from the creation and operation of a businesses, they won't stay in business. No one works for free.

36 So the word is.... we're doomed?

37 Posted by: Reactionary at August 22, 2011 09:13 AM (xUM1Q)

It's also because people read "University" but thought "Trade School."

You don't need the kind of education Universities were originally designed to give (the first ones centered on things like philosophy and what we'd call the Humanities) to write software for a living (I'm a living example, in fact).

I often wonder what would happen if a school opened that was, essentially, a trade school for the white-collar careers.  Engineering courses that didn't bother with language beyond making sure you could communicate clearly.  Science courses that didn't bother with psych requirements.  That kind of thing.  First off, I bet you could cycle students through in 2 - 3 years (instead of the 5 or 6 it takes now).  Second, I bet you'd make a fair deal of money as people interested in those areas realized they didn't have to spend thousands of dollars, and hundreds (thousands?) of hours on courses they didn't need.

38

Many people are irked by this, and rightly so.  Most of us just wanted job training - not what passes for a "liberal" education these days.  It's not likely to change, though.  For one, the schools make more money by selling more classes.  Also, they use those classes to carry out political indoctrination.  They'll never willingly give up the revenue nor propaganda opportunities, so long as we allow Leftists to control the system.   Posted by: Reactionary

Trade schools are looking more and more attractive each passing moment..

39 The thing is, there already is a market driven solution: it's called "Get government out of the way."

The fact is there will always be those who are unemployed and those who are "poor" (for a given value of "poor"). You're never going to be able to stop that. 

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) is tired beyond tired of the trolls at August 22, 2011 09:11 AM (8y9MW)

 

I agree with both points.  My question is whether there are enough leaders on our side with the brains and balls to make this happen, if somehow we manage to secure a majority.

Also, while it is absolutely true that there will always be some measure of unemployment, there is a critical mass that we dare not approach because the system can't survive the consequences.  I can't say what that level is - I think it varies up or down according to how easy it is to survive without a job.  But policy should be formulated to minimize unemployment to the greatest degree possible.

40 Short gold, $1750 stop.

41 "Are there people out there who donÂ’t think weÂ’re heading for a student loan default crisis? ThatÂ’s a serious question. IÂ’m wondering if there are actual professionals out there who think that student debts are a safe bet? If so, can those people be exiled to one of the PIGS countries where they can breed in their natural habitat?" (from marty's link up top)

It's very tough.  If you got into a "good school", even with grants and stuff, your parents who listened to their financial adviser, still managed not to save enough, even when some of the parents I know claim to have saved 4 X's what the financial guy told them to save.  Therefore, most times, you are on your own for grad school.

The doctor's who are coming out have a system which makes sure they have jobs.  The lawyers are screwed.  A lot of longstanding associates have been "layed off" in the last three years, everyone has taken a pay cut to keep their job.  The system of funneling attorney's into the workforce only works if the firms are looking for people to hire.  Only the ivies are managing to keep the system working and not as well as before the downturn.  The masters and PHD folks I know are half way through and finding out that the 80 year old classical language professor plans to stay forever, ergo, since you only need one Dr. of classical languages, you are waitressing or driving a cab now

42 My question is whether there are enough leaders on our side with the brains and balls to make this happen, if somehow we manage to secure a majority.

No.

But policy should be formulated to minimize unemployment to the greatest degree possible.

No.  "Policy be[ing] formulated" is always a net negative to the economy.  The fewer regulations and policies you have in effect, the more employment you'll have.  It is not the government's job to provide for me.  It's not even the government's job to see to it that I am provided for.

43

Butt welded elbow

 

You waaannng?

44 43 Took me time to read all the comments, but I really enjoyed the article. It proved to be Very helpful to me and I am sure to all the commenters here! ItÂ’s always nice when you can not only be informed, but also entertained!

Heh.

45 I often wonder what would happen if a school opened that was, essentially, a trade school for the white-collar careers.  Engineering courses that didn't bother with language beyond making sure you could communicate clearly.  Science courses that didn't bother with psych requirements.  That kind of thing.  First off, I bet you could cycle students through in 2 - 3 years (instead of the 5 or 6 it takes now).  Second, I bet you'd make a fair deal of money as people interested in those areas realized they didn't have to spend thousands of dollars, and hundreds (thousands?) of hours on courses they didn't need.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) is tired beyond tired of the trolls at August 22, 2011 09:17 AM (8y9MW)

THIS!  My thoughts exactly.

46 "Your IP address (75.189.233.180) has been banned. If you feel this is in error, please contact the blog owner by email."
Like that's been doing me a fuck of a lot of good.

47 I often wonder what would happen if a school opened that was, essentially, a trade school for the white-collar careers.

That's basically what DeVry does.

48 Most of us just wanted job training - not what passes for a "liberal" education these days.

Don't disparage all those other courses. I concentrated on the engineering and math type courses at the expense of English etc. As I moved up in seniority I found that writing reports on projects was more difficult. In fact, it became such a problem that the bosses went out and hired an English teacher from a local college to come in and give us a refresher course.

49 Engineering courses that didn't bother with language beyond making sure you could communicate clearly. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAA!!! Yes! Because engineers are loaded down with unnecessary communication and people skills!

50

SSDI is probably one of the most abused programs we have.  I personally know about 5 people who are on disability and they have no perceivable disability.  At least 2 are family members who I know are not disabled in any commen sense meaning of the word.

We need to get back to the notion that being "disabled" literally means physically unable to work - i.e., people who are paralized or something similar.

We are granting disability now to people who are obese, have depression, have "chronic fatigue syndrom", and all kinds of other nonsense.  I'm not saying that depression can't be bad, but it is not a disability - you can be depressed and work.

SSDI should be only for extreme problems - people suffering from really, really bad disabling issues.  Not for run of the mill problems.  We need to tighten the regulations drastically, kick everyone off SSDI and make everyone re-apply. 

More than 50% of people receiving SSDI right now should not be receiving it.

51 I love Perry's line about making the Feds 'inconsequential in your lives'. It's a dream, but a nice one.
 
I've got a corollary for it. A vow to have the DC area experience the next housing slump.
 
1. Note that they didn't have one there.
2. It implies a huge cut in bureaucracy and regulation.
3. It is a kind of class warfare but very distinct from the JugEars version.

52 Posted by: Empire of Jeff at August 22, 2011 09:14 AM (lbo6/)

Those two shanty Irish hacks had the good luck to write one reasonably good screenplay. They have parlayed their mediocrity into successful careers -- but that is par for the course in Hollywood.

Although every time I watch Good Will Hunting and hear that asshole spout off about how wonderful Howard Zinn is I start frothing at the mouth.

53 Although every time I watch Good Will Hunting and hear that asshole spout off about how wonderful Howard Zinn is I start frothing at the mouth.

Matt Damon?

54

Monty, this is your best doom thread yet. All of these articles are extremely interesting and I'm only about half way through.

I'm starting to wonder if your doom threads are getting so good because we are getting closer and closer to actual doom.

55 My son is taking a course on the American Indian. Why? Because it was that or a course on african or women's studies.

56 That is a lot of DOOM; I guess because it's been piling up for three days.

57
  Possibly time to redefine "poor" as it applies in this country.  Seems the progressive liberals have co-opted another term to reflect their philosophy. It's no secret that poor in this land would be unimaginable wealth to most people living in 3rd world countries. Same way the progs have co-opted the definition of liberal--it bears no resemblance to classic liberalism, and y'all here know that to be true.

  Someone with a recogniseable voice needs to start hammering that one.

58 Posted by: Monty at August 22, 2011 09:22 AM (/0a60)

It's what DeVry used to do. Before I just gave up and said, "You know, I can figure this out on my own, and I will" I looked at DeVry. The cost was astronomical (hour-for-hour) compared to other schools, and they are loading you down with a fair amount of useless crap now (or, were trying about 5 years ago. They may have seen the light again since then).

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at August 22, 2011 09:22 AM (2tTzd)

No, they're not. However, "English Classics" is not going to teach them to communicate better. Neither is "History of Native American Literature."

59 Re: SSDI - How's about tossing diaper-clad 'adult' men off the rolls? And take that bloated cow in AZ whose goal is to become the heaviest woman ever with him!

60 "Your IP address (75.189.233.180) has been banned. If you feel this is in error, please contact the blog owner by email."
Like that's been doing me a fuck of a lot of good.

Posted by: GGE Of The Banned at August 22, 2011 09:22 AM (oprA9)

Oh no....still!? 

Are you sure you have the correct e-mail for ace?

61 I often wonder what would happen if a school opened that was, essentially, a trade school for the white-collar careers.  Engineering courses that didn't bother with language beyond making sure you could communicate clearly.  Science courses that didn't bother with psych requirements.  That kind of thing.  First off, I bet you could cycle students through in 2 - 3 years (instead of the 5 or 6 it takes now).  Second, I bet you'd make a fair deal of money as people interested in those areas realized they didn't have to spend thousands of dollars, and hundreds (thousands?) of hours on courses they didn't need.
Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) is tired beyond tired of the trolls

I wonder how that would work for medical school? 

My wife is a veterinarian and had to go through six years of college to get her degree..    But her Organic Chemistry class as an undergrade was taught by someome who knew jack shit about Organic Chemistry and was a psychiatrist student and treated the class as a social studies experiment..   He had one half of the class study for the final and the other half not study to see how that affected the grade for his thesis..  (My wife was in the group selected not to study but he was going to pass them anyway.)  

If it was my kid who failed that class.. I would be pissed.. 

62 I wonder how that would work for medical school? 
Posted by: Dave C at August 22, 2011 09:27 AM (vYdFh)

I'm not sure that would work as well, though they've got something similar for a lot of the "tech" positions (the folks who actually draw your blood, run the CT machine, etc), and Nursing Schools (that give about 2 years of schooling) have existed for as long as I can remember.

My brain surgeon, however, or diagnostician, I want to know has the kind of sharp and inquisitive mind it would actually take to get learn all the knowledge 6 - 8 years of school would (should, anyway) teach.

63

#27

 have to hand it to Fat Mittens--he's an AGW believer, and he doesn't give a damn who knows it. (linked in sidebar) No TPaw apawlogy for him. He's Mitt Romney with atty-tood.

Then he is a fucking moron and I don't mean in a good way.

64 Possibly time to redefine "poor" as it applies in this country.  Seems the progressive liberals have co-opted another term to reflect their philosophy. It's no secret that poor in this land would be unimaginable wealth to most people living in 3rd world countries. Same way the progs have co-opted the definition of liberal--it bears no resemblance to classic liberalism, and y'all here know that to be true.


A few years back at The Jawa Report, they had a link to an NPR story about a 'poor' family barely able to keep the family fed..   To hear it on the radio sounded horrible until you saw the picture accompanied with the story on the web site..

A very obese woman and her very obese daughter..  

Poor enough to have trouble fitting in through the front door.. 

65 On the ever popular topic of bitching and moaning, you know what really gripes me?  Everybody has to accept the consequences of our politicians' actions except them.  We may be heading into the depression to end all depressions because of our politicians' corruption and incompetence, bu7t they are going to be just fine with their government pensions and non-Obamacare medical plan.

66 The whole pushing of the college eduction meme has been the biggest drag on the spirit of entrepreneurial people. It's a push by the crony capitalists to create worker drones. Don't know who said it, "The problem is not too much capitalism, but too few capitalists"

67 Over the weekend one of my friends had a gathering and he invited a CPA cause he thought he was an "eligible" guy.  turns out no one cared how eligible he was.  I felt so bad for him, the first question he was asked by a newly minted doctor was "what do they mean when they say "cook the books"?  Heck we could have put the poor guy in a corner with a chair and a screen and he could have talked to everyone at the party individually.  I bet he wished he'd just gone to the beach alone instead.

68

Those two shanty Irish hacks had the good luck to write one reasonably good screenplay. They have parlayed their mediocrity into successful careers -- but that is par for the course in Hollywood.

I don't like Matt Damon when he talks politics, but I do believe he is a pretty talented actor and his non-political movies are usually pretty entertaining.

Ben Afflack, in the correct role, is o.k.

69

Are you sure you have the correct e-mail for ace?

Posted by: Tami at August 22, 2011 09:27 AM (X6akg)

I'm using the Gmail address that is posted.

70 Gosh, did AP forget to mention that the union ordered its Verizon members back to work right before the union became obligated to begin paying them millions in strike benefits?

71

My son is taking a course on the American Indian. Why? Because it was that or a course on african or women's studies.

Where is he going to school?  Is this college, or HS?

72 See?  This is how "welfare" should work.  And, no, Government should not be involved.

73 meow

74

I'm using the Gmail address that is posted.

Posted by: GGE Of The Banned at August 22, 2011 09:34 AM (oprA9)

have you tried Morontips AT the gmail email?

75 it's up to parents to explain to their kids that some degrees while seemingly wonderful are not practical...and getting in to the best school while good for the ego is again not practical.....and if you have to take out some kind of loan to go to a school that endangers your parents financial security and or your own........it's not a good bet........

76 Ben Afflack, in the correct role, is o.k.

Daredevil?

77 @AllenG - attorneys (acting out of self-interest) have made an industry of securing SSDI benefits when someone isn't really disabled. ... if you got rid of that fraud and abuse in the system, you'd fix a large part of the problem.

Not feasible, IMHO. It would be cost-prohibitive. The problem is that the fraud and abuse are an integral part of how a lot of disability works. Outside of the abuse inherent in a cottage industry of attorneys all living off of SSDI, this is mostly true in cases where some mental health "professional" acts as gatekeeper for an SSDI benefits recipient.

Numerous clinics have sprung up which live of off their patients' disability and (usu. State-funded / Medicaid) comp. health care claims. Many of these have their own in-house pharmacies and are ALSO doing the prescribing. Patients are put into group therapy (only), which does absolutely nothing to ever resolve their issue and drugged into a stupor on 8 or 10 meds (all filled in-house). Since the clinic determines when the patient is 'fit' to return to work, well... are you getting the picture yet? It gets better.

Someone who goes into this system, initially disabled by depression, grief or some other mental health issue isn't likely to EVER get out. The "winner" is the clinic with the conflict of interests.

78

have you tried Morontips AT the gmail email?

Posted by: Dave C at August 22, 2011 09:36 AM (vYdFh)

Nope, haven't tried that one.  Here's a tip for them...UNBAN ME YA BASTICHES! Do you think it will work?

79 My son is taking a course on the American Indian. Why? Because it was that or a course on african or women's studies.

If he want's to cruise through without raising a fuse, have him base all his answers on "It's The White Man's Fault". 

80

I'm using the Gmail address that is posted.

Posted by: GGE Of The Banned at August 22, 2011 09:34 AM (oprA9)

Did you put 'Banned-help!' or something in the subject so it catches his attention?  Did you offer him a freshly killed hobo and some valu-rite?

Maybe we should all e-mail him with your banned IP address.

 

81

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) is tired beyond tired of the trolls at August 22, 2011 09:17 AM (8y9MW)

 

Amen.  It would be great for those of us eager to change careers, as well.  The cost of getting re-educated (along with the overall horrible employment picture) is a major barrier to my getting out of a profession I have no love for.

Unfortunately I don't see the culture of credentialism changing any time soon.  People hear trade school, and are prone to think "borderline dropout." 

82 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAA!!!

Yes! Because engineers are loaded down with unnecessary communication and people skills!

Posted by: Empire of Jeff

Do you write for the Patron Saint of the technology cubicle, Scott Adams ("Dilbert")?  

83 Posted by: Monkeytoe at August 22, 2011 09:34 AM (sOx93)

I think that Damon is a reasonably talented actor. Certainly not great, but he can take direction from a director and parrot his lines without much difficulty. Afleck is actually a better director than he is an actor.

But...Damon is a hard-core leftist who truly believes that he is one of the intelligentsia. I find that attitude offensive in the extreme. Just shut the fuck up and read your lines.

84 " If Engineers built buildings the way programers program computers, the first woodpecker that came along would destroy civilization! "

85 He had one half of the class study for the final and the other half not study to see how that affected the grade for his thesis..

WTF?

86 Rut...roh

NRO tweet:

'She Will Run' Palin organizers say sheÂ’s getting into the race.

87 Posted by: DiogenesLamp at August 22, 2011 09:41 AM (t3mKS)

True.  Software developer, are you?

88 Monkeytoe, turn them in - profit

89

Ben Afflack, in the correct role, is o.k.

Posted by: Monkeytoe

Nailing Jennifer Garner like a loose floorboard?

90
But...Damon is a hard-core leftist who truly believes that he is one of the intelligentsia. I find that attitude offensive in the extreme. Just shut the fuck up and read your lines.

http://tinyurl.com/28z5nu

91

>>>>Those two shanty Irish hacks had the good luck to write one reasonably good screenplay. They have parlayed their mediocrity into successful careers -- but that is par for the course in Hollywood.

What in the world makes you think they wrote that script?

92

Did you offer him a freshly killed hobo and some valu-rite?

Posted by: Tami at August 22, 2011 09:39 AM (X6akg)

He says he wants TWO hobo pelts. Two!  I only got one, and he won't take an extra bottle of Valu Rite in it's place. Do you know how hard it is getting to be finding free-range hobos these days?

93 93 ben because matt damon's mom is a teacher!!!/

94 Oh.  And: Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

95 'm using the Gmail address that is posted.
Posted by: GGE Of The Banned at August 22, 2011 09:34 AM (oprA9)

The other email you can try is maetenloch  at the gmail thing.. 

96

What in the world makes you think they wrote that script?

I swear they did. What would make you think otherwise? Ask Bill Ayers...

97 He says he wants TWO hobo pelts. Two!  I only got one, and he won't take an extra bottle of Valu Rite in it's place. Do you know how hard it is getting to be finding free-range hobos these days?

Posted by: GGE Of The Banned at August 22, 2011 09:45 AM (oprA9)

Just cut the one you have in half and tell him it's two....he's too drunk to notice.

98 I've been seeing the acronym SCOAMF being used and I didn't know what it meant at first.

99 alleng you really can't say that enough about certain people.......

100 Just cut the one you have in half and tell him it's two....he's too drunk to notice.

Thou knowest the moron mentality well. Two moron-fu points!

101 To clarify: I was not talking about the education in and of itself. I was talking about something that specifically stokes an outsized sense of entitlement. I expect young, dumb, and full of piss and vinegar types at the entry level. I also expect them to temper their notions of "I can do better elsewhere" as they gain a sense of where they fit within the playing-for-money working world. This is the part that is broken among the four-year degree crowd, and there is a glut of job-hoppers fewer than five years out of school whose references will not give anything more than, "Yes. So-and-so worked here from March of 2008 to January of 2009 as a business analyst for accounting systems and left voluntarily." It's as if pissing and moaning is its own reward and whoever can act the most put-out wins.

102

This is a pretty good summary of a series of 3 essays Charles Murray wrote a few years ago about higher education, and how we ought to be doing it. 

Sounds like the Morons have been channeling Charles Murray.

Bottom line: too many people go to college who shouldn't. 

103 The other email you can try is maetenloch  at the gmail thing.. 

Posted by: Dave C at August 22, 2011 09:46 AM (vYdFh)

I'll have to try both of them out, thanks!

Just cut the one you have in half and tell him it's two....he's too drunk to notice.

Posted by: Tami at August 22, 2011 09:48 AM (X6akg)

Brilliant!

104 Posted by: phoenixgirl at August 22, 2011 09:49 AM (eOXTH)

About that person in particular... I'd say John the Apostle had it right when he said "Were the seas filled with ink and the whole sky a scroll, I do not suppose 'Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure' could be written enough.'

Okay, I may be paraphrasing, there.

105 It's as if pissing and moaning is its own reward and whoever can act the most put-out wins.

Works for me!

106 Well the cell card is starting to act out, and I've been up all night and get to do it all over again tonight (damn this working for a living!) so I'm out. Have a good day roonz and roonettez!

107 Posted by: Ben at August 22, 2011 09:44 AM (wuv1c)

Because the movie made money, and the real writers would have sued for their cut had it been ghosted.

108 He says he wants TWO hobo pelts. Two!  I only got one, and he won't take an extra bottle of Valu Rite in it's place.

You didn't hear this from me but if that pelt were to have Marco Rubio's autograph on it you'd be unbanned in no time.

109 About that person in particular... I'd say John the Apostle had it right when he said "Were the seas filled with ink and the whole sky a scroll, I do not suppose 'Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure' could be written enough.'

That's from the Jefferson Bible, right?

110 Ben Afflack, in the correct role, is o.k.

Gigli?????

111

That's from the Jefferson Bible, right?

The William Jefferson Clinton Bible, yes.

112 Posted by: The Robot Devil at August 22, 2011 09:54 AM (136wp)

Madison, I think.  But that's kind of like comparing the NIV to the New American Standard.  Sometimes I think they use different wording just because they can, not because it conveys the idea any better.

113 Meanwhile in Denmark:

http://tinyurl.com/3hql8qo

114 Maybe it has nothing to do with college. Maybe it's just that kids who opt for sixteen straight years of schooling nowadays never get a chance to work at menial jobs.

115   112 Ben Afflack, in the correct role, is o.k.

You mean like this?

116

Because the movie made money, and the real writers would have sued for their cut had it been ghosted.

How do we know they didn't get their cut?

117 113

That's from the Jefferson Bible, right?

The William Jefferson Clinton Bible, yes.

Posted by: Sean Bannion at August 22, 2011 09:56 AM (sbV1u)

That one's short a few commandments, if I'm not mistaken...

118

I've been meaning to read  Closing of the American Minid for years now but I still haven't gotten around to it.

 

119 Posted by: Ben at August 22, 2011 09:58 AM (wuv1c)

Because, for a writer in Hollyweird, credit is more important than money.  You get more gigs if stuff you've already written is well received.  If they had written the movie, they would have wanted their names associated with it.

120 I could get disability here in Massachusetts for being too obese to work or being diagnosed with some made up 'asthma', which never seems to have any symptoms outside of the quack doctor's office. Meanwhile my incurable genetically incurred autoimmune disease which causes chronic epigastric pain, neuropathy, tremors, and severe diet restrictions doesn't count.

Glad I work so hard all day, often in great discomfort or pain, so that these freeloading fucks can have a life time of vacation. Designing new or renovations for public housing for a living only adds insult to injury. But it's a paycheck in Obama's economy.

121 113

That's from the Jefferson Bible, right?

The William Jefferson Clinton Bible, yes.

Where's Obama when a man needs his morning cup of Joe?

122

That one's short a few commandments, if I'm not mistaken...

Posted by: Insomniac at August 22, 2011 09:59 AM (DrWcr)

Several.

But it does contain the parable of the whale and the cigar.

123 GGE's comment brings up another point: I'd short hobo futures and liquidate my pelt holdings if I were you. Pretty soon there's going to be a glut of new hobos on the market. The hobo bubble is about to pop. Get out while you can.

124 I think that Damon is a reasonably talented actor. Certainly not great, but he can take direction from a director and parrot his lines without much difficulty. Afleck is actually a better director than he is an actor.

But...Damon is a hard-core leftist who truly believes that he is one of the intelligentsia. I find that attitude offensive in the extreme. Just shut the fuck up and read your lines.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (NJConservative) at August 22, 2011 09:40 AM (LH6ir)

I agree that Damon is an idiot hard-core marxist.

but, I liked the first couple of Bourne movies, thought he was really good in the Talented Mr. Ripley, Rounders, Courage Under Fire, and I liked him on 30 Rock.  And, I actually thought Stuck On You was kind of funny.

B/c so many hollywood celebs are complete idiots and profess to be hard-core marxists (while living the capitalist high-life), I just ignore what they say and watch the stuff i watch regardless of how big an idiot the actor/director/producer is.

125

That one's short a few commandments, if I'm not mistaken...

There's only one commandment - Thou Shall Lie all the time

126 @51
zing!

127 Hey, the DOW's up! Happy days are here again!

128

My son is taking a course on the American Indian. Why? Because it was that or a course on african or women's studies.

Where is he going to school?  Is this college, or HS?

Posted by: Sean Bannion at August 22, 2011 09:34 AM (sbV1u)

WVU. He's ADHD and learning disabled (and a white male).That was our best pick for under $34,000

If he want's to cruise through without raising a fuse, have him base all his answers on "It's The White Man's Fault". 

He's good at that. He did well on the SAT writing portion which he said consisted of "Martin Luther King! Abraham Lincoln! Margaret Sanger!"

129 I think that Damon is a reasonably talented actor. Certainly not great, but he can take direction from a director and parrot his lines without much difficulty. Afleck is actually a better director than he is an actor.

But...Damon is a hard-core leftist who truly believes that he is one of the intelligentsia. I find that attitude offensive in the extreme. Just shut the fuck up and read your lines.

Ditto for Tim Robbins. I'm genuinely surprised that Morgan Freeman has done so many movies with him given their polar opposite political views.

130 123 113

That's from the Jefferson Bible, right?

The William Jefferson Clinton Bible, yes.

Where's Obama when a man needs his morning cup of Joe?

Posted by: William Jefferson Clinton at August 22, 2011 10:00 AM (136wp)

I'm having it sent to you by private jet.  Now let me get back to my round of golf, er, developing my sooper-seekrit sooper geenyus jobs creation plan.

131 Posted by: dagny at August 22, 2011 10:05 AM (z8+5D)

When I was in HS here in Texas, I used to half-joke that the way to pass the TAAS (our standardized test, at the time) was to "Always pick the politically correct answer.  I'm not sure how a quadratic equation has a politically correct answer, but if you see one- pick it.  It'll be the right one."

132

He's good at that. He did well on the SAT writing portion which he said consisted of "Martin Luther King! Abraham Lincoln! Margaret Sanger!"

Posted by: dagny at August 22, 2011 10:05 AM (z8+5D)

MAAAAAT DAAAAAMON.

133

>>>WVU. He's ADHD and learning disabled (and a white male).That was our best pick for under $34,000

Jesus Christ! How much does WVU cost? Are you an instate resident?

 

Thank god I'm out of college. I have no idea how people can afford it these days.

134 Monkeytoe, turn them in - profit

Posted by: Jean at August 22, 2011 09:42 AM (/FT0A)

turn them in for what?  the whole problem is that according to the system, they are "disabled".  My point isn't that they "defrauded" the system, but that the system is nuts b/c it classifies stupid things as "disabilities". 

Things that aren't even real.  Fibromyalgia (ohh, I have ches and pains).  Chronic Fatigue Syndrom (I'm tired!  Yeah, who isn't?). 

Things that are within your control - addictions, obesity.

Things that, while difficult, should not prevent one from working - depression, lupus (I know people with fairly mild symptoms, but they get total disability.  the disease does not prevent them from working).

Again, yes, these people are taking advantage of the system and are lowlifes for doing so, but they aren't engaging in "fraud".  they system is set up so that perfectly able-bodied individuals who can work are granted disability.

For hundreds of years people worked through these issues - back pain, knee pain, depression, fatigue, aches and pains of all kinds.  And, the work people had to do was much harder and more physical.  People used to work 6 days a week and 1/2 day on sundays and work 10-12 hour days doing significant physical labor, all with the same problems we give disability for today.

there is compassion and mercy and caring for those that need it and then there is what we are doing.  they are 2 very different things.

135 I think you have to give Christie a pass on the global warming thing.. OF COURSE he's always going to think it's way too hot!

136

The thing about Christie is that while he "believes in" AGW, I doubt very much that he would enact or sign any silly legislation to "deal with" AGW.  I just don't see him agreeing to such obviously economy killing policies.

Whereas, I can actually see Romney agreeing to pass some idiotic job-killing emissions laws.

137 An idea whose time is coming? Nuremburg style trials for those responsible for the economic destruction around and before us.

Because whilw Bernanke's couterfeiting operation may not have been technically "treason" it has been consequential.

138 Posted by: Monkeytoe at August 22, 2011 10:14 AM (sOx93)

Doesn't matter.  He also definitely wouldn't reign in the EPA (which has to be done), and, if he believes in it, he's believing in something for which there is less and less evidence seemingly every week.

It's out of the conservative mainstream.  And, as someone who may have to deal with rolling blackouts next year because of the EPA, it's a pretty big deal to me.

139

Thank god I'm out of college. I have no idea how people can afford it these days.

Posted by: Ben at August 22, 2011 10:09 AM (wuv1c)

In 1981 I started college at a small private Catholic school in the Northeast where the annual cost (with room and board) is now over 40K.

My tuition in 1981 was $6400.00.  My room and board was another $1500.00.  That totals $18,700.00 in 2010 inflation adjusted dollars. 

$18K vs > $40K

That rate of increase is ridiculous.

140 #139 Show trials are for Commies.

141

Jesus Christ! How much does WVU cost? Are you an instate resident?

Out of state. About $27,000/year including room and board.

142

Last year I paid in tuition for 3 kids (one college, one elem, one high school) $43,000. I was delighted to find out that the college tuition et al was tax deductible.

143

#139 Show trials are for Commies.

Perfect.  Because we've already demonstrated that they're commies, so they should be quite comfortable with the venue.

144 #139 Show trials are for Commies.

The Allies were all communists? Really?

Or are you taking the position that the banksters and their bought men in DC should get away with the looting scott-free?

145

>>>The thing about Christie is that while he "believes in" AGW, I doubt very much that he would enact or sign any silly legislation to "deal with" AGW. I just don't see him agreeing to such obviously economy killing policies.

He signed into law a ban on all coal fired power plants in New Jersey.

So, um...there's that.

146 The Allies were all communists? Really?

Winston Churchill just wanted to line up the NAZI leadership and shoot them. Truman was indifferent and didn't really want the trials either. But Papa Joe Stalin was all gangbusters for them, as such show trials had worked wonders against his political enemies.

147 dagny - shame hs and elem tuitions are not tax deductible.

148 Winston Churchill just wanted to line up the NAZI leadership and shoot them. Truman was indifferent and didn't really want the trials either. But Papa Joe Stalin was all gangbusters for them, as such show trials had worked wonders against his political enemies.

So your objection is to the trial, not the outcome? Fair, enough.

149 #150,

I don't want an expensive show trial so that the MFM and politicians can beat their ideological wood to death. I want an independent forensic audit of the financial leadership followed by closed to the media proceedings. These should be two week trials, not months long sagas of editorializing and playing to the cameras.

150 “The markets have highlighted a fundamental shortcoming in Keynes's ideas: He assumed that governments would always be able to borrow. If they cannot, then Keynesian economics is dead in the water.”

You know, this reminds me of the old gambling technique that says every time you loose you double your bet, and then when you win, you will be ahead. Theoretically, it works as long as you have infinite money to keep doubling during a losing streak.   The problem is that you don't have unlimited money, and no gambling establishment will allow you to do that without limit, so that when you try it, you are guaranteed to lose big.

151

So, I am onboard with the bursting of the higher education bubble, but what exactly is the outcome of the bubble bursting? Yes there is a lot of money tied up in it, but people can't escape it from Bankruptcy... So what happens? Schools have to change their business model? Is there a discernable shock to the economy?

152 I was getting all cranked up to regale you with How We Did It at Second-Rate State, but the topic slid a tad and I'll tell you this instead: I went to a university for five and a half years (but never lived on campus) and the total bill was well under $10K. I graduated in 1976.

There is no field of academic inquiry that does not have some heritage of a conservative or classical-liberal perspective -- even sociology and anthropology. Fields now dominated by pabulum-radicals were founded by conservatives. So, to contend now that these subjects are by their nature inimical and irrelevant is what we used to call a cop-out. Conservatives simply gave up, is all, and abandoned the field, and contemporary culture suffers by their lack of involvement.

It will take a whole generation, and a taste for unending conflict in a career, to win those fields back. Wish as you might, there will always be humanities majors, some of them will always find their way to positions of authority, and you will never be able to just round them up and send them to camps. If you give up now, you're conceding forever.

A few of us ought to just admit "I wasn't good at English" and stop trying to convince the world that there is no such thing as English, English is a communist plot, or you can learn it yourself from a pamphlet bought from the back pages of a comic book. 

153 I had a child at MIT who took "The American Folk Song" as an elective. For her final, she was required to sing "Camptown Races." If I told you how much that class cost you'd be banging your head on the desk.

154 "Conservatives simply gave up, is all, and abandoned the field, and contemporary culture suffers by their lack of involvement." Any substantive arguments about the merits of various disciplines is pissing into the wind. When Luevano v. Campbell put meaningful competency testing out of bounds under the insane doctrine of disparate impact, employers were forced to find an acceptable proxy for competency testing, and they settled on the four-year degree. The education bubble and the proliferation of basket-weaving majors is nothing more than yet another unintended consequence of social engineering by our betters.

155 Posted by: comatus at August 22, 2011 11:10 AM (W5ilH)

I agree with these sentiments. 

156 Programming, you know, was invented by a weaver.

In the morning, I shall be sober -- and, I will have a basket.

157 "Programming, you know, was invented by a weaver." Jacquard. I should have avoided the idiom and said simply, "_______ studies."

158 Southern Clowinfornia grocery workers vote to strike.
http://tinyurl.com/3tkwhf9

Didn't these tools learn anything from the last time they had a strike back in '04?

159

160

Wow, hey if people need a job they can scab and make pretty good money. I made 20 bucks an hour back in college when they did this last.

160 Monty, if you have an opportunity, could you please explain what an infrastructure bank actually is?  Over the weekend I had one too many libs tell me that this was the panacea.  My response was that I'd heard it is a too for corruption in third world banana republics.  Their response was to defend it like they defend everything else with no facts and telling me i'm unpatriotic.  I would point out that a couple of years ago mayor mike was telling anyone who would listen that we were becoming a banana republic.  Other than that, I didn't know enough about infrastructure banks and really neither did they.  TIA

161 160 Southern Clowinfornia grocery workers vote to strike.
http://tinyurl.com/3tkwhf9

Didn't these tools learn anything from the last time they had a strike back in '04?

Posted by: BraineaterBob at August 22, 2011 11:42 AM (ja5BY)

The folks who sell the "self check out" devices are salivating.  And all the non union workers are happy to come in after the store closes to restock.  Like they do in the mall for some retailers.

162

Their response was to defend it like they defend everything else with no facts and telling me i'm unpatriotic.

That sounds exactly like your typical sort of attack against people.  What a shock.

163 163 Yep, not to mention the proliferation of non union grocery chains like Fresh & Easy, TJ's, Cosco & places like Target offering groceries now. During the last strike I worked for a non-union grocery chain, the company's business almost tripled during the strike. I made out pretty well myself as well, pulling down between 12-16 hrs of OT during the strike.

Good times....

164 Monty, if you have an opportunity, could you please explain what an infrastructure bank actually is?

I've actually been thinking of doing a post on banking as part of my "Economics at AoSHQ" series. This might make a good sidebar.

In short: the idea is that the government would create a GSE like Fannie or Freddie with a one-time grant (HAH!), only with the mandate to loan money for infrastructure projects only. It's a stupid idea and would be prone to all the kinds of waste and fraud we've seen at Fannie and Freddie. The GSE would be a pinata for every grievance-monger and "minority business" operator in the world, and the money would get pissed away in extravagant amounts with precious little to show for it.

How well does the government do infrastructure? 9/11 was ten years ago, and the World Trade Center is still just a hole in the ground. Or look at the Big Dig in Boston, or the Tappan Zee bridge in New York. There was a time when the states and the feds could bring in infrastructure projects on time and on budget, but those days are long gone.

165 An observation:

The economically strong often bully the economically weak.

An example of that behavior:

When you open a checking account at a bank you become the banks creditor, and the bank becomes your debtor (they owe you money). However - because the bank is economically strong compared to you- they bully you; you are not treated as though they owe you money - they treat you as though you were the debtor. The bank establishes fees and sets all the rules for when and how you can extract your money.

A clarification of that example:

Imagine for a second that your economic equal attempted to behave in that manner. I borrow $100 from you and after a month I come back to you and say: "I have new rules about your account with me. It is costing me a lot to keep track of how much I owe people - so from now on I'll be charging each of you a $3.00 per month processing fee on your accounts with me." That would be an example of me attempting to bully you the way a bank does. I doubt that anyone would be stupid enough to let me get away with that. Yet that is exactly how a bank behaves. This sort of bullying behavior by the financially strong is so common that most people never think about it and recognize it for what it is.


Conclusion from that observation:

There are many people who view capitalism as an excuse for larceny. These people almost always are crony capitalists - who depend on government to rig the game for them.  These people destroy the public faith in market economies from the inside just as surely as the Marxists do from the outside.

166 "Yet that is exactly how a bank behaves." Banking is heavily regulated. Heavy regulation favors rent seekers. Rent seekers are not capitalists.

167 When you open a checking account at a bank you become the banks creditor, and the bank becomes your debtor (they owe you money).

This is a profound misunderstanding of how a bank works. I'll post more in an essay later, but a bank isn't "loaned" your money. It doesn't appear as an asset to the bank; it's still your money. It's your asset, not the bank's. They store it for you, and receive a fee for doing so (this legal situation is called a bailment).

Sigh. I'm gonna have to hunker down and writing an essay about what banks are and how they work. There is a profound level of ignorance out there about banks.

168 Banking is heavily regulated. Heavy regulation favors rent seekers. Rent seekers are not capitalists.

What we have here is an example of an academic trick.

The idea behind the trick is that if we can find something in what somebody says that is not technically perfect we can use that to discredit everything that person says. In fact that trick can be used to discredit virtually anything that anyone says.

The problem is that it is just a trick. The official name for the behavior is Quibbling. Why and how Quibbling became an accepted part of academia is an interesting question.

Here is the American Heritage dictionary definition of Quibbling:

"To avoid acknowledging the truth or importance of something by raising trivial exceptions or distinctions"

In other words a quibbler realizes the thing he is quibbling with is true or important - he just doesn't want to acknowledge it.

In other words you aren't trying to add information to what I had to say - you are attempting through academic bullshit to make what I had to say not be true.

This is not an academic institution - nobody here uses foot notes. This is the Ace of Spades comments area. That being true - there is only one proper reply to your smart ass post:

You and your academic tricks join president Obama as a stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure.

169 Obama is a stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failur

170 Obama is a stuttering clusterfuck of miserable failure.

171 "You and your academic tricks join president Obama as a stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure." You wrote: "There are many people who view capitalism as an excuse for larceny. These people almost always are crony capitalists - who depend on government to rig the game for them. These people destroy the public faith in market economies from the inside just as surely as the Marxists do from the outside." Crony capitalism is not capitalism. This is not a quibble. This is just the way it is. Crony capitalism is a corruption of capitalism whereby collectivists use their influence over the regulatory powers of the state to accumulate power by subverting the free market. Assholes like Chomsky run around calling "crony capitalism" capitalism. These assholes sit on the same end of the political spectrum as Obama and, apparently, you. It's not an "academic trick" or "academic bullshit" to bother to get your facts straight. Maybe if you'd pull Obama's cock out of your mouth long enough to read a book every now and then, you wouldn't condemn yourself to showing your ass like this in public.

172 This is a profound misunderstanding of how a bank works. I'll post more in an essay later, but a bank isn't "loaned" your money. It doesn't appear as an asset to the bank; it's still your money. It's your asset, not the bank's. They store it for you, and receive a fee for doing so (this legal situation is called a bailment).

Sigh. I'm gonna have to hunker down and writing an essay about what banks are and how they work. There is a profound level of ignorance out there about banks.


No, it is not a profound misunderstanding of what is going on in a bank. My original thesis is that the economically strong bully the weak. The economically strong set the rules (that is what the legal situation called a bailment is.) Who do you think created those rules? The economically weak depositors?

The money that the bank has in its accounts - both saving and checking accounts is not "stored" by the bank as though it were in a safety deposit box. The money in both savings and checking accounts is used by the bank as though it were there money to loan to its customers.

In point of fact the money is owed by the bank to the original depositors. When you owe somebody money it is called a debt. In the case of deposits in a bank the people making the deposits are the banks creditors because the bank owes them money.

The fact that from my perspective my checking account is an asset means that from the bank's perspective it is a liability.

If you really believe that banks charge fees for storing money in checking and savings accounts as though they were in safety deposit boxes you really don't understand banking at all.

173 I'm sorry typo their money  - not there money

174 The key difference between a safety deposit box - for which banks charge fees and a deposit account like a checking or savings account is that banks are not able to loan the contents of a safety deposit box out to a third party - while they are able to treat deposit accounts as though they are the bank's money and loan those deposit accounts out to third parties.

Safety deposit boxes are bailments - deposit accounts - not so much.

175 These assholes sit on the same end of the political spectrum as Obama and, apparently, you.

No, you are simply wrong. I hate both Chomsky and Obama. The difference between you and me is that you evidently don't want to admit that there are flaws in the free market system.

All economic systems have both strong and weak points. The strength of leftist economic systems is that they reward the politically connected - the weakness is that they punish those who aren't politically connected and thus provide a miserable standard of living for most people.

The great strength of a free market system is that it provides the highest standard of living for the greatest number of people of any system ever devised. The weakest point of the free market system is that it requires rules to make it work (for example - you have to pay for what you get - stealing is against the rules) those rules are open to being gamed - which is how we have wound up where we are. The simple fact is that the wealthy often game the rules in their favor, and leftists game the rules to try to bring about a leftist economy.

The real problem in a free market economy is that the question is when is a rule change reasonable and when is it gaming the system. That is what politics ought to be about. Unfortunately politics has devolved into one party games the system one way and the other games it the other - and that is a pile of crap since both are intent of enriching themselves (which necessarily brings on a leftist economic system and destroys the free market system) .

It is because of the fine line between necessary and proper rules and gaming the free market system that crony capitalism creeps into being. When do the markets cease to be free?

Pointing out that there are flaws in free market economies does not mean I am against them; there are a lot more flaws in every other system I have seen.

176

Semi O/T: Never underestimate the ability of government to fuck things up, vol. 737.

Tried to renew my CA car registration today. Used to be simple: type in your license plate number, along with a confirmatory number that appeared on the DMV form, pay, done.

Now, on CA DMV's "new user-friendly website" you've got to register, provide your name, your email (twice), your password (twice), select and answer several security questions (my fav: "who did you first vote for for President? Nice try, comrades.), your DOB, the last four digits of your SSI, your driver's license number, your favorite sexual position, whether you floss, which hand you wipe your ass with, and then provide some frivolous information less relevant to registration renewal.

OK, I get it. The comrades of the People's Republic want you to type all this shit in to help them create a database without having to pay some minimum wage schlubs to do it.

No sale. I sent my renewal in by mail. It was faster and easier than dicking around with the "new user-friendly website." Now they've got to hire a peasant to deal with my envelope. Way to go, CA government!

177 "No, you are simply wrong. I hate both Chomsky and Obama." Then why do you willingly carry water for them? Your original assertion was: "The economically strong often bully the economically weak." You then provided an example of how the *politically* strong bullied banks into a position where they are forced to collect fees on deposit accounts to make ends meet after the *politically* powerful Dodd-Frank arbitrarily capped fees for debit transactions to twenty-five cents per transaction. Knocking your central argument out from under you is not "quibbling." If you fancy yourself a conservative, then you are fooling yourself. Your so-called "observation" and the way you insist on framing it is a clumsy and factually challenged case for increasing government power at the expense of market freedom.

178 "The economically strong often bully the economically weak."

You then provided an example of how the *politically* strong bullied banks into a position where they are forced to collect fees on deposit accounts to make ends meet after the *politically* powerful Dodd-Frank arbitrarily capped fees for debit transactions to twenty-five cents per transaction.

Knocking your central argument out from under you is not "quibbling."

My comment to this is WTF??

In what way shape or form have you Knocked my central argument out from under me?

Banks were charging fees long before Dodd-Frank - it is to that historic fact that I was referring.

If you fancy yourself a conservative, then you are fooling yourself. Your so-called "observation" and the way you insist on framing it is a clumsy and factually challenged case for increasing government power at the expense of market freedom.

I repeat WTF??

I specifically do not want increased government power at the expense of market freedom - you sir are jousting at imaginary straw men of your own construction.

What I am saying is that conservatives need to be aware of flaws in free market systems which allow gaming of the system from both sides of the political spectrum. The problem is always gaming the rules to gain an advantage whether it comes from wealthy larcenists or statists.

Here is the bottom line point I want to make: The only way to protect a free market system is to always be on guard against anyone trying to game the rules.

179 Do I think that Caveat Emptor - let the buyer beware - is a good policy for anyone who is buying something? Yes I do.

However, anyone who bases their business model on Caveat Emptor has larceny in their heart.

180 "What I am saying is that conservatives need to be aware of flaws in free market systems which allow gaming of the system from both sides of the political spectrum. The problem is always gaming the rules to gain an advantage whether it comes from wealthy larcenists or statists." Collectivist rent-seekers appear on the conservative side of the political spectrum only in the fevered narratives of the collectivist left. That said, your example is pure bullshit. Except for my first checking account, I have always banked without fees. I get a crappy interest rate on the money I need to keep liquid, but that's because of FDIC premiums and spreading-the-cost necessitated by the legal limits on penalties charged to assholes who pass bad checks. Both of these are the result of *political* bullying by leftists. If you cannot find a bank willing to take your deposits without fees, then you are not looking hard enough.

181 "However, anyone who bases their business model on Caveat Emptor has larceny in their heart." Please tell me specifically: How are banks ripping-off their customers?

182 And, another thing: Walk into any bank branch and look at the Community Reinvestment Act statement posted prominently on a wall in the lobby. That's the law that accelerated this country's decline into DOOM over the last dozen years. The CRA was made law of the land because leftist shitbags successfully made the arguments that you are trying to make here about the economically powerful bullying the economically weak.

183 You really make it seem so uderstandable with your presentation but I find this topic before really hard to understand. It seems too complicated and very broad for me.

184 "Employment is a side effect of a business, not the purpose of it."

Close but not fully on target. Employment is a cost, and is to be avoided by any good businessman.

Any proposal that touts "Job Creation" as a benefit is a proposal that completely misunderstands economics. "Jobs" are a bug, not a feature.