1 Not voting for Romney, no way...

2 How does this jibe with his plan to issue a waiver to every state on his first day in office?

3 Let's make sure we have a GOP majority in the House and Senate.  No guarantee of good times, but prolly a better bet than a RINO or loose cannon in the White House.

4 Guess we know what his Replace portion is based on this video.

5 This lineup up of candidates reminds me of playing a real bad hand of poker. I keep shufflin' my 5 cards and looking at them over and over thinking a better hand will appear.

6 And this is why I won't vote for this ass in the general.

7 How does this jibe with his plan to issue a waiver to every state on his first day in office? By acting like he never said it and that if he did, it only means UNTIL they "fix" Obamacare.

8 Michele Bachman hates silver dimes!

9 Mitt Romney => Wanna be SCOAMF

10
What's for breakfast?

Re-hash.

11 John Scarne: When people ask me to recommend a reliable system for winning at roulette, I always advise them to take up some other game..."

12 Which is what I've said all along: If Mitt is President, we will never get rid of Obamacare. He will do what he can to keep it. Because he has a constituency, it's the same people he has been running for and has been courting for the last 4 years: The Cocktail GOP and the media.

While Kevin DuJan's political instincts aren't always right, he is absolutely right that the Cocktail GOP is nothing more than lazy Democrats who didn't want the trouble and effort of working their way up through the party ranks.

13 Funny thing about Romney is that he's not being elected to anything anytime soon, by anyone. So its really a waste of time to even discuss what he says or does. Sort of like Santorum and Cain and Bachmann and Palin etc

14 Political expediency is a bitch who should bite you in the ass on the flip or the flop when there is a video record of what you say.   There is always a video record of what you say.

15 Wisdom?
The real mother would "repeal the bad and keep the good."
That will be 666 talents of gold, tyvm.

16 So, if you had to point to the single biggest issue Republicans and the public have with Obama is Obamacare. And our standard bearer supports most of it? This is ridiculous.

Give the public a choice, not a echo.

17 Oh, and here come the Mittbots saying it's nothing but a cheap smear to . . . quote the candidate's own words.

18 Romney will not repeal Obamacare. Newt will not repeal Obamacare. Even Perry will not repeal Obamacare. It takes congress to repeal Obamacare. That includes a 60 R Senate. It is impossible to elect a 60R Senate in this election. In fact, if I am not mistaken we have not had a 60R Senate since the later 1800s.

Our only hope of getting rid of this POS is SCOTUS, so pray Kennedy is on the right side of the bed.

19 I will not for Mitt Romney. America needs a leader, not some dude who spends more time on his hair than the average woman. Remember Romney's strong statements regarding the Gov shutdown, or the Iranian protests, or the Honduras shit with the US on the side of dictators. Mitt is a middle of the roader at best. Not good enough. Doom.

20 Hell, Obama says it isn't perfect - so he'll probably change it, too.

Romney won't repeal the mandates or fines, because the damned thing won't work without 'em.  And if Bambi comes back in, he'll fix the quaint little "Constitutional problem" by just eliminating premiums and instituting higher taxes instead.  Then you don't have to buy anything you don't want - you just have to pay for it.

They're just different places to sit under the same tree.

In order to fix health care, you have to think about economics: you know, supply and demand.  To reduce costs, you'll have to find a way to increase the supply of services (like expanding the field of providers), or to decrease demand (like making people actually pay for services).

21

Oh gawd. .....Are we really going to be forced to have Romney for our nominee?

Nooooo. The establishment squishes think they can just force this on us and think that the threat of 4 more years of Obama will be enough to ram Romney down our throats? .....Did they learn nothing from 2006 and 2008? 

22 Oh, and here come the Mittbots saying it's nothing but a cheap smear to . . . quote the candidate's own words.
Posted by: Jimmuy at December 17, 2011 12:21 PM

Works for me!

^{Also, racist.}

23 If Congress repeals ObamaCare in 2013, President Romney will veto it. He will call full repeal too extreme. He will demand a fix instead of a repeal. He is not just a RINO, he is RINO incarnate.

24 Could someone PLEASE send this to the sell-outs Ann Coulter, Nikki Haley and Dick Morris.

25 We have to elect Mitt Romney to find out what's in him, you know!

26 Newt 'Single Payer' Gingrich BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA ALL YOUR HEALTHCARE ARE BELONG TO US

27 Isn't anybody learning anything from CA?
When faced with decaf or regular, nobody goes with decaf.

Tea is never an option.

28

Ok let me ask this.  All of his "good" stuff that he claims in Obamacare that he wants to keep.  And his bad is that its raising taxes which Romneycare didn't.  But Romneycare didn't raise taxes because of a massive slush fund from either medicare or medicaid from the federal government.  The federal government can only get a "slush fund" from the tax payers.  So can you actually keep any of his claimed "good stuff" without the bad?

Because isn't he saying that the good stuff would be everybody gets a Porsche.  The bad stuff is that they have to pay for it.

29 2 How does this jibe with his plan to issue a waiver to every state on his first day in office?

Posted by: huerfano at December 17, 2011 12:15 PM (lXi+d)

It jibes because he flip flops more than a seal on the beach. Mitt fucking sucks.

30 It takes congress to repeal Obamacare. That includes a 60 R Senate.

I disagree. If the Republicans wanted to functionally repeal Obamacare, they could do it now.

Pass a budget in the House with no funding for it. Refuse to modify it.

With the barest majority in both houses and the presidency they could formally repeal it - again if they were willing to fight for it.

Will Romney do it? No
Newt? Probably not.
Perry? Maybe.

31 I told you he's a commie.

32

Romney's political statements have achieved a state of quantum uncertainty. 

What Mitt said, and what Mitt says he said, depends on the whether there was an observer present.

33 Screw it, I'm voting Perry regardless. I'll write his fking name on the ballot if he's gone by the time I vote.

34

Nooooo. The establishment squishes think they can just force this on us and think that the threat of 4 more years of Obama will be enough to ram Romney down our throats? .....Did they learn nothing from 2006 and 2008? 

Posted by: wheatie......who still sez ConservativeMenAreJustHotter at December 17, 2011 12:22 PM (HvKWW)

Hey we will never win the presidency if we run some extreme right wing conservative! And isn't getting rid of the failure in office now highest priority anyway?

35 In the primaries, I mean.

36 I could live with RomneyCare--as long as he gives me a waiver and doesn't change his mind. To hell with the rest of you beeyotches.

37 What Mitt said, and what Mitt says he said, depends on

the meaning of what is is at the moment,

which depends on the state of mind.

Just ask the lawyers.

38

Hey we will never win the presidency if we run some extreme right wing conservative! And isn't getting rid of the failure in office now highest priority anyway?  Posted by: The Republican Establishment in 1980 at December 17, 2011 12:28 PM

McCain Mitt is the only one who can beat Hillary Obama.

39
This one issue is why Mitt is very last on my preference list.  Even behind Ron Paul. 

40 Ben Domenench also has an article out in the Daily Caller on Romney and RomneyCare:
 
“Cronyism.” That word has been thrown around a great deal in the Republican primary battle. It’s bad when it’s done to lure companies to locate in a particular state, or to reward a political ally, but it’s worse when it’s used to increase government intrusion into people’s lives. That’s what happened when former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney pressed to get support for his health care reform, the widely acknowledged model for Obamacare.
 
There's much more there.

41

Romney is how the Republicans lose.

The Dems are smart enough to know what effect this will have on many in the base, and will make sure it becomes well-known during the campaign.

The base did not stay home in 2008, contrary to the popular myth, but with Romney, I'm really afraid that some (too many) will in 2012.

42 I guess he decided that "repeal the bad and keep the bad" wasn't going to work in his real television responses.  Because most of what else he says is the same canned answer that he gave at both DeMint's and Huckabee's candidate forums.

43 This one issue is why Mitt is very last on my preference list.  Even behind Ron Paul. 

Posted by: Guy Mohawk, self declared 4th best commentor ever at December 17, 2011 12:31 PM (JYheX)

I agree, but it's not just a health-care issue: it is the philosophy that government can fix an economic problem that needs to be solved in the private sector.

44 We just don't know which Romney we will get. He has the potential to be a great alternative to Obama if he can stay on a consistent conservative course.
My recurring nightmare is him debating Obama and pretty much agreeing with everything SCOAMF says, with that stupid shit-eating grin.

45 So let's look at some presidential election results...

Last election that someone seen as a conservative Republican lost: 1964.

Last election that someone seen as a moderate Republican won: 1972.

Since 1972 results:

Seen as conservative: 5W 0L
Seen as moderate: 0W 4L

I would struggle to find a clearer pattern.

46

This one issue is why Mitt is very last on my preference list.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk



At least with Huntsman, you're with someone who knows enough Chinese to order the good stuff that's not on the menu...

47 Imagine a debate between Just the Tip Mitt and Ebola on EbolaCare. What would Mitt say? Mitt: "Um, you did what I did, but you did it to everybody, so there's no way to hide how shitty it all is."

48 So I await the ringing defense of this via NRO.

49 Ben Domenech - discredited and lost his job a while back, as I remember.  Just like the candidates themselves, on the right, we keep recycling discredited rejects, and expecting a different result each time...

50

Hey we will never win the presidency if we run some extreme right wing conservative! And isn't getting rid of the failure in office now highest priority anyway?

Posted by: The Republican Establishment in 1980 at December 17, 2011 12:28 PM (3aXbg)

Yeah, well......fuckabunchathatshit. .....I will just join all those other folks who are staying home and getting drunk on election night.

Rick Perry is the one who will do the most towards getting rid of Obamacare, and hog-tying Fedzilla. .....So I am still hoping for a Perry miracle.

51 25 Could someone PLEASE send this to the sell-outs Ann Coulter, Nikki Haley and Dick Morris.

Posted by: Old Coach at December 17, 2011 12:24 PM (qhDb6)

Don't forget about me or I'll hex ya.

52  "the widely acknowledged model for Obamacare."
Except of course that we know that the massiveve behemoth of a bill foisted on us by Nancy Pelosi had been in the works for decades, dating to before Hillary's attempt at "reform".

53 Repeal by "cutting funding" will not work because it still will have all the mandates.

issuing waivers will not work because the bill itself and the law contain no provision for waivers until 2017. The Dems are actually violating the law by issuing waivers. You can do that when you have no opposition Party. Watch what happens when the Republicans try it.

There is a slim chance a Republican majority Senate could go with repel using he nuclear option, however that will require Senators like the ME sisters to go along with using that.

54 Alvin Toffler, whatever else you think of him, got it right when he said there is only one party in America, the DemoPublican Party...

55
So I await the ringing defense of this via NRO.
Posted by: Rob





Sorry, but can't possibly manage to find the time this morning to post.  This afternoon is Muffin's Winter Cotillion, and we simply must dash if we're going to beat the traffic out to The Hamptons.

NRO Writer

56 Among all the GOP candidates Romney is best suited to successfully manage the decline and collapse of the United States.

57 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

Just felt it needed to be said.

58

Are some of those Obamacare waivers expiring soon? ....Is that why they're saying that "Obamacare is set to kill hundreds of thousands of jobs in February"?

 

59 Among all the GOP candidates Romney is best suited to successfully manage the decline and collapse of the United States.

Posted by: eman at December 17, 2011 12:41 PM (kEKwc)

Mitt Romney, our last, worst, hope.

60 It's amazing how full of hatred DrewM. has become.  The campaign season seems to have genuinely deranged him, to the point where I hope it ends just so he can go back to being sane again.

Incidentally, Drew, running down Romney -- and trying to suggest that he won't repeal Obamacare, which is pretty fucking dishonest -- doesn't make Newt Gingrich any more acceptable or electable.  If we were to actually get your wish, and Newt as a candidate, it would lead to the most disastrous loss for conservatism and the GOP in generations.  And would you stand there, smug, dancing in the wreckage, pleased with yourself?  Or would you say "gee, I guess it might have been better to beat Obama with a guy I don't like that much than reelect him -- and lose all those winnable House and Senate seats -- with Newt"?

61 Repeal by "cutting funding" will not work because it still will have all the mandates.

If there is no budgeting to enforce a law, does it functionally exist?

62
Ben Domenech - discredited and lost his job a while back, as I remember.  Just like the candidates themselves, on the right, we keep recycling discredited rejects, and expecting a different result each time...

Posted by: M. Murcek at December 17, 2011 12:37 PM (ToZXn)

So you attack the messenger. Try watching the video, dumbass,

63 Rick Perry is looking better every day.

64 Well, if they can make a new run of Mark Donahue Javelins, I wish them well

65 Posted by: Jeff B. at December 17, 2011 12:43 PM (hIWe1)

I posted a video and quoted his own words. This makes me "full of hate" and "deranged"?

How exactly does that work?

66
Serenity now!

67 Try watching the video, dumbass. So you attack the messenger.  Sheesh...

68 Are some of those Obamacare waivers expiring soon? ....Is that why they're saying that "Obamacare is set to kill hundreds of thousands of jobs in February"?
 
The insurance companies are having to cut sales reps to get their overall spending ratios down to the mandated 80/85% levels required in OCare. The 100,000 figure is an estimate, but not unreasonable.
 
The real goal, as I'm sure you know, is to run all the insurance companies out the HC business entirely.

69
"mitt" means "my" in Swedish

70 Perry supporters need to support Newt early on so Newt can boot out Mitt. Once done, the Perry folks need to switch to Rick.

71

63.....If there is no budgeting to enforce a law, does it functionally exist?

Until it is repealed by Congress, it will still be on the books and causing us problems. ....Insurance companies will still use it as a reason to keep raising our rates.

72

Well Newt was for the mandate in May of this year so who do we have left?

Gregory: "You agree with Mitt Romney on this point."

Gingrich: "Well, I agree that all of us have a responsibility to pay -- help pay for health care . And, and I think that there are ways to do it that make most libertarians relatively happy. I've said consistently we ought to have some requirement that you either have health insurance or you post a bond...."

Gregory: "Mm-hmm."

Gingrich: "...or in some way you indicate youÂ’ll be held accountable."

Gregory: "But that is the individual mandate, is it not?"

Gingrich: "It's a variation on it."

http://tinyurl.com/d5prxy9

 

73 DrewM - It's hateful to let Truth overwhelm Narrative, dontcha know. That's what I heard anyway.

74 "I guess we'll just have to elect him to find out what he'll do! What could go wrong?"

That's almost as dumb as passing a bill to find out what's in it!

75 The exchange in #76 is collectivism all the way.  Fuck that shit...

76 Doesn't matter.  I know of ONE person that I KNOW loves this country.  Loves freedom. Loves life. Hates corruption.  The last is why all the "elites" hate her.  She's not dirty so they can't control her.  She gets in, the congressional  and media gravy train that parties and grows wealthy on our dime comes to an end.

You vote for who you want.  The R nominee will win my state but,,,,
I'm writing in Sarah!!

77 Posted by: robtr at December 17, 2011 12:52 PM (MtwBb) Newt is moving in the right direction.

78 Awww boo hoo Jeff Santorum is upset.

79 Don't worry, kids. I'm on this.

He's getting coal in his stocking. As well as some Midol and Tampax.

80 Collectivism works SO well for ants and bees, and even termites, it seems.  Want to be an ant, bee or termite?

81

Anybody know offhand how much a $1 Million health insurance bond would cost? I buy a lot of performance bonds. Depending on your credit they are usually 2 to 4% per year. That's $20 to $40 thousand per year per person for the Newt Bond.

82 Awww boo hoo Jeff Santorum is upset.

Oh that reminds me....

*adds Ex-Lax to list*

83 Once done, the Perry folks need to switch to Rick.

Posted by: eman at December 17, 2011 12:50 PM (kEKwc)

Santorum?

Yeah that will be fantastic. The guy who looks like Andy from Toy Story, except has the incredible ability to whine out phrases through his anus.

 

 

I will be stoned and drunk for much of October when I am not at work.

84 47 So let's look at some presidential election results...

Look to CA for that pattern.
How Anohld got elected was being a celebritard.
We coulda had McClintock, a proper conservative.

Other than that, perfect recent examples are Whitman and Fiorina. When faced with decaf or regular, the squishy middle will always pass on decaf.

And yet the GOP seems to think Tea is not an option.

85 Eesh, it would take a lot, and i mean a whole lot, to make me vote for Newt yet Mittens is just about this > < far from making me do it.

86 You vote for who you want. The R nominee will win my state but,,,, I'm writing in Sarah!! Posted by: teej at December 17, 2011 12:53 PM (WHmDb) I, too. But, I live in CA, so my vote doesn't count for much anyway.

87

72 --- Thanks, GnuBreed.

I remember something about them saying they weren't going to issue any new Obamacare waivers after September 2011. .....So I was wondering if some of the first ones were set to expire.

But they could probably still give them 'extensions' to the old ones. ....They're Dems. They don't even follow the rules that they make for themselves.

88 Time to be RickRolled.

89 Perry supporters need to support Newt early on so Newt can boot out Mitt.

Once done, the Perry folks need to switch to Rick.

I don't really care which of those two get top spot.
As long as they're both on the ticket at the end.

90
Darling, nobody goes to the Hamptons in the winter.
Posted by: Muffie




These are trying times.  One must dock one's yacht wherever one can manage to find a slip.

91 Santorum? Yeah that will be fantastic. The guy who looks like Andy from Toy Story, except has the incredible ability to whine out phrases through his anus. I will be stoned and drunk for much of October when I am not at work. Posted by: CAC at December 17, 2011 12:55 PM (v2kiV) Perry, not Santorum. Flog thyself.

92

I will be stoned and drunk for much of October when I am not at work.

Posted by: CAC at December 17, 2011 12:55 PM (v2kiV)

 

Why wait? It's going to suck all the way up til then and beyond.  Might as well get an early start to numb the rage. That's my plan.

93 Other than that, perfect recent examples are Whitman and Fiorina. When faced with decaf or regular, the squishy middle will always pass on decaf.

And yet the GOP seems to think Tea is not an option.

Posted by: Clutch Cargo at December 17, 2011 12:55 PM (Qxdfp)

Whitman's implosion in October took out Cooley and Fiorina.

All three were polling neck-and-neck or edging their Democratic counterparts.

 

Then Gloria Allred Will Folks'd her way in.

 

The biggest tragedy of 2010 in Cali was having Cooley fucking lose. We were so close to a good conservative Attorney General, but the implosion of Whitless took everybody with an "R" next to their name on out.

 

Still, was nice to see San Diego back to Red, along with San Bernardino AND Riverside County for a Senatorial race- first time in years.

94 90 But, I live in CA, so my vote doesn't count for much anyway.

Gives ya that warm fuzzy feeling that O is going to be at 60%+ here, huh?

95 Romney is a two-faced lying bastard only a level or two above the SCOAMF we have now.  If he's elected we can kiss off repeal of Obamacare and the Socialists win.  I'm already depressed.

96

So... in his opiniom Governent being involved with and in control of a Large part of the Economy, is a GOOD thing?

 

97 If there is no budgeting to enforce a law, does it functionally exist?


Yes it does. In any case we are about to find out with the lights.

98 heh, Good job ruining your approval among tea partiers nikki.

99 81 Newt is moving in the right direction.

Down?

100 Perry, not Santorum.

Flog thyself.

Posted by: eman at December 17, 2011 12:58 PM (kEKwc)

Ughk. I will, promptly.

101

Why wait? It's going to suck all the way up til then and beyond.  Might as well get an early start to numb the rage. That's my plan.

Posted by: Ms Choksondik, hoping for a Rick Perry miracle at December 17, 2011 12:58 PM (fYOZx)

I am getting married in mid-September. I'd like to have a good year at least through that. Afterwords though, bombs away.

102 You don't have to wonder. Of the fruntrunners, Newt will repeal it. Romney won't.

103

Mitt said in SC that the tea party will turn on Newt because of Fannie and Freddie.  Does that delusional fuck think we'll turn to him? I'm so sick of these pandering assholes trying to claim to be the tea party fave. We're not all bots Mitt, we'll vote for whomever the fuck we want to vote for and in my case that's not you.  Honestly, he's turning me off more and more. I don't know if I can even hold my nose and vote for Mitt at this point in the general.

104 Is it possible that an (R) could win CA?  RR won CA after 4 years of Jimmah Carter malaise.  What are the possibilities after 4 years of JEF?  Serious question.

105 I toyed with the idea of adopting Rick-Roller as a term for Perry supporters, but nixed it because of Santorum.

106 Gives ya that warm fuzzy feeling that O is going to be at 60%+ here, huh? Posted by: Clutch Cargo at December 17, 2011 12:59 PM (Qxdfp) Don't get me started. Although, my dentist, who seems a good model for a typical CA Squishycrat, told me a sorrowful tale about many of his friends who fell for the Ebola bs and now much regret it. Maybe Ebola will get only 55%.

107

102 heh, Good job ruining your approval among tea partiers nikki.

I hope the tea party primaries her in the next election.

108 98 90 But, I live in CA, so my vote doesn't count for much anyway.

Gives ya that warm fuzzy feeling that O is going to be at 60%+ here, huh?

Posted by: Clutch Cargo at December 17, 2011 12:59 PM (Qxdfp)

I don't know about that... I live in the Central Valley, and I've NEVER heard people in Grocery store lines cracking jokes about a President before... but I'm hearing them now...

Heck, even my VERY Liberal Brother, who actualy is working on the High Speed Rail funding here in Cali, is talking third party (he will never vote for a Repub).

109 So he will be repealing all of it then?

Please, kind sir, point out to us the "good" shit in this shit sandwich.

110 Posted by: robtr at December 17, 2011 12:52
The problem Gingrich, Romney, etc. will continue to have when explaining what they'll do re: health care "reform" is that people have forgotten why some changers were necessary in the first place. Uninsured people are already receiving health care they don't pay for (you and me do, directly or indirectly), and the money has to come from somewhere or the care must necessarily cease to be given.
Not my prob, though. I'm headed to the local brewery for lunch, so all the politicians can just suck me.

111

Hatin' McHaterpants from Hatersville posting haterific hate video clips!  Damn you DrewM!!!   .....   bwahahaaaaaaaa

 

Perry is the answer if he can only get a second chance with some folks and a first with others.  I don't trust Newt or Mittens to derail ANY of Barrys initiatives like I expect Perry will. ( GOP House and Senate may be required for assembly as pictured on box)

112 the implosion of Whitless took everybody with an "R" next to their name on out.

Why conservatism has to decouple from the GOP.  Here in PA we have what we call Elsie Hillman Republicans - well to the left of Mitt Romney...

113 >>>Is it possible that an (R) could win CA?  RR won CA after 4 years of Jimmah Carter malaise.  What are the possibilities after 4 years of JEF?  Serious question.

No, it's not possible.  The state has changed massively -- both demographically and politically -- since the Reagan era.  It's no more possible that a Republican could win in CA in 2012 than a Democratic presidential candidate could win in Alabama.

114 It's only 1:00 and I'm already exhausted.

A bit heavy for a Saturday morning, eh?

115 #104: You know, a drink does sound really good right now... I think I'll have some red wine, so I can pretend I'm drinking so early for health reasons.

116

I am getting married in mid-September. I'd like to have a good year at least through that. Afterwords though, bombs away.

Posted by: CAC at December 17, 2011 01:02 PM (v2kiV)

 

Congratulations! I love weddings- that and having kids are the most optimistic things I can think of.  I don't have kids but I love being married.

117 #109 NoWayNoDay.  Caliphornians are smahter than us yokels everywhere else.  They won't be voting rationally in your or my lifetime...

118 114 So he will be repealing all of it then?

Please, kind sir, point out to us the "good" shit in this shit sandwich.

Posted by: Kristopher at December 17, 2011 01:03 PM (Z3y1K)

Well, ya know what they call that little White Speck on the top of a piece of Chicken Shit?

Chicken shit...

119 Is it possible that an (R) could win CA? RR won CA after 4 years of Jimmah Carter malaise. What are the possibilities after 4 years of JEF? Serious question. Posted by: Truck Monkey at December 17, 2011 01:02 PM (jucos) Well, look at the CA electoral maps. It is mostly red with huge blue spots over SF, LA, and a few other places. Also, drop by and visit for a few days. Talk to folks. There is a Democrat drug in the water here.

120 Not my prob, though. I'm headed to the local brewery for lunch, so all the politicians can just suck me.

Posted by: Lincolntf at December 17, 2011 01:03 PM (Qjh0I)

 

I'm right behind you!

121 That's the key to a shit sandwich.  The more bread you have, the less shit you have to eat.  Now, ask again why so many rich people vote democrap...

122 Me on Mitt Romney: "I'm not voting for anyone whose first act as President is NOT repealing ObamaCare."

Bye-bye Mr. Romney.

123 An extra quarter million in taxes?  No problem.  An uncomfortable moment at a cocktail party?  Now THAT'S a problem...

124
dear, there are no marinas in the Hamptons.
Posted by: Muffie




You use a public marina?  How charmingly quaint!

Most of us at National Review have vacation homes on the water with private slips -- or at very least belong to one of the clubs.  But your weekends spent shoulder to shoulder with tugboats and sardine fishermen sound utterly fascinating.

NRO Writer

125 #127: Tribalism. Deep down, they're subconsciously thinking, "I'm part of an exclusive group, and the Republicans want to open up that group for more hillbillies and yokels to join us. That simply won't do!"

You can see it all the time in other parts of society, like gloomy teenagers who stop liking a band when other people start liking it. You know, because the band "sold out."

126 Ace's credibility diminishes by association with Ben Domenench.

127 Ace's credibility diminishes by association with Ben Domenench.

You would make for quite the interesting lab specimen.

128 I guess we'll just have to elect him to find out what he'll do! What could go wrong?

That's about the size of it. 

129 I used to like Obamacare, just like you folks, but then I took an arrow to the knee.

130 #131GT, you are correct.  I think us conservatives need to wait out the collapse and re-constitute our own tribe out of the Dakotas and southern Canada and ride hard.  I always wanted to go around all day long in a loincloth...

131
T - 26: 53: 00

132 Jeff B doesn't care

133 Why is it,exactly, that I'm supposed to vote for this guy over Obama?

134
T (minus) 26 hours, 52 minutes until...


Tebow Time!

135 @11
You're really not helping. 

136
Tee-bow

Time

137 Tebows beat both longbows and crossbows!

138 Hatin' McHaterpants from Hatersville posting haterific hate video clips!  Damn you DrewM!!!   .....   bwahahaaaaaaaa

You know you could post all the clips of Romney talking about Obamacare and his Massachusetts healthcare shit sandwich and no one would really care, as if everyone doesn't know about it already. What gets me is the massive blindspot  and double standards a lot of conservatives like DrewM have when it comes to Gingrich. If the idea of the GOP nominating someone that may not do everything is their power to repeal it is so distasteful how can you turn around and back Gingrich? It makes no fucking sense, you should be backing Bachmann then. Oh no can't do that, she's got crazy eyes while Newt debates so good.
That what I hate about elections, everyone's ideology goes out the window and they just become mindless cheerleaders for their favorite candidate, someone the latched on to for no real reason.

139
the Denver Tebows are getting 7 and a half points...at home.

the New England Bradys have a stinky record at Mile High Stadium

so...take the Tebows and the points.

140 Fuck: Gingrich, Romney, Santorum, Bachmann, RonPaul, Domenech

etc...

141
prediction for tomorrow's game: interceptions

Lots of picks.

Brady: 2 picks
Tebow: 4 picks

142 the Denver Tebows are getting 7 and a half points...at home.

If I was a betting man I'd take some New England action. You could have New England favored by 7 and a half and I'd take them, no way Denver would cover that spread.

143 Too bad Newt said the same thing.

144 prediction for tomorrow's game:

Mosque burnings and gay beatings when Denv goes ahead with 59 seconds left in the game...

145 Brady: 2 picks
Tebow: 4 picks

Posted by: soothsayer at December 17, 2011 01:28 PM (sqkOB)

No way on Tebow, that's 50% of his passes.

146 so...take the Tebows and the points. Posted by: soothsayer at December 17, 2011 01:26 PM (sqkOB) Yeah, but what about Brady's hair? Is it long, cut short, moused?

147 Domenech has been caught plagiarizing, and is a known Perry operative and all-around douchebag.

148 I'll take Tebow and ten thousand points.

149 Compassionate Conservatism II: Competent Communism

150
Mosque burnings and gay beatings...

and murders of abortionisits.

151 153 Domenech has been caught plagiarizing, and is a known Perry operative and all-around douchebag.

Posted by: Winning at December 17, 2011 01:30 PM (ozpOn)

How can you see anything beyond mitt's thighs?

152
which reminds me...

153 Personally, I'm hoping the game turns into a shootout, because I'm a Broncos fan but I have three Patriots in my fantasy foobmall lineup. It could happen, too, because the Patriots' defense is turning out to be a little on the soft side this year.

Go, Broncos! Win with a score of something like 41-38!

154 HERE is the reason I'd vastly prefer Newt on the top of the ticket.

155 How can you see anything beyond mitt's thighs?

Remember, Mitt boosters are on the up and up, no ad homonem smears from them...

156 Pats win, 10 to 3. *ducks*

157 Speaking of football, I'm trying to decide which two WRs to play tomorrow.

Steve Smith, Michael Crabtree, or Demaryius Moore.

Something is telling me to go against the grain and play Crabtree and Moore.

158 Ummm.....

159
Tomorrow's game will be more about Brady vs Bailey than Tebow.

160

Mitt Romney On ObamaCare: "Repeal The Bad And Keep The Good"

How about we throw this baby out with the poopy bath water instead?

161 153 Domenech has been caught plagiarizing, and is a known Perry operative and all-around douchebag. Posted by: Winning at December 17, 2011 01:30 PM (ozpOn) How exactly does that rebut a video of Romney's own words?

162
Steve Smith (panthers) had disparaging words about Tebow's ability.

Said he wouldn't want Tebow on his son's flag football team.

163 This is the dream game for the Patriots, look for a score like 35-10.

164 Betting Mr. Bundchen will dissappoint tomorrow.  Not betting money, mind you...

165 I wonder what Mitt's position is on the "Salamander Letters."

166 Lets see if Domenech and DrewK have the balls to do a blog on this: http://tiny.cc/qtv8w. Try to stir things up where nothing exists. Romney haters are getting desperate. Yawn.

167 Steve Smith (panthers) had disparaging words about Tebow's ability.

Said he wouldn't want Tebow on his son's flag football team.

Posted by: soothsayer at December 17, 2011 01:39 PM (sqkOB)

Is that the 4 and 9 Panthers or a different one?

168 Yap - that last part repeal the bad keep the good - that was bad.

The beginning where emphasized state solutions over federal - that was good.

What will Mitt do?  For those that say Mitt is a squishy politician than have no fear because the public is very much against Obamacare.  Romney has said over and over since that time that he will repel it - fully, not just waiver it. Thus it would be political suicide (read my lips no new taxes) to go against what he has stated.

But that last part, that was bad and goes against the first part about state rights and what he has since said.   So was he overstating or mispeaking - possibly.  Why do I spin it that way (I'm a fanboy duhhh - but not a shill that offends me)?  He has stated so often over and over that he will fully repeal Obamacare, and his actions thus far.  Mitt worked very hard to get Scott Brown into office so that he could be - what should have been - the vote that stopped Obamacare.  Mitt is basing his whole argument on state rights - saving any of Obamacare goes against that core argument. 

Summary from a Mitt supporter.  That was bad what he said at the end and goes against everything else has said in his campaign.  Fully should mean fully.  Will he keep his promise to fully repeal, based in his actual record of follow through on campaign promises - yes.  His switch on prolife is the only area that I have seen where he totally went back on a pledge - he left the prochoicers hanging.

169 Anyone playing College Bowl pick'ms has about 15 minutes to pick the Temple/Wyoming game.

170 #163: I don't think much of Carolina's chances of moving the ball effectively on Houston's defense. The Texans are very strong against both passing and the quarterback sneak. That's why I'm starting Tom Brady instead of Cam Newton at QB.

Of course, I'm also having doubts about the Raiders' ability to move the ball effectively on anyone right now, so take my advice with a grain of salt.

171 Romney haters are getting desperate

1) Never love or hate anyone / anything that can't return the favor.  Safe bet mitt's in no danger of being able to do either.

2) Why would anyone need to be desperate over Romney's lukewarm chances?

172 Ummm.....

The lip-liner and mascara improve his looks.

173 I'm totally a conservative, for realsies. I only promote communism at the state level, that's like, the very definition of conservative.

174

..153 Domenech has been caught plagiarizing, and is a known Perry operative and all-around douchebag...  OUch

I didn't know about Domenech's background.. had to Wiki it. I guess I'm going to have to give him another chance to show maturity and grow from his past. The All-around douchpart was unsubstantiated, but I don't think his exgirlfriends put anything on there..

 I have appreciated his current daily email subscription news roundup and the podcasts I've listened to.  He appears bright enough and I have to give him credit for trying to come back from an appauling character flaw in his budding days.  So we'll see.

That he is a shill for Perry..  well, that ok by me.

175 #164: You know, that's actually kind of cool! Now you can walk into a department store, see one of those mannequins, and immediately know that you'd rather spend your money somewhere else.

176 Mitt Romney is Barack Obama's white half, which he had extracted and congealed into a mormon.

177 This is why, at this time and place, he is the best choice for the nomination.

178 Mitt Romney is Barack Obama's white half, which he had extracted and congealed into a mormon.

Posted by: Entropy, and if you disagree you hate America and want Obama to win at December 17, 2011 01:52 PM (TLNYf)

You owe me a monitor and a coffee mug.

179

1) Never love or hate anyone / anything that can't return the favor.  Safe bet mitt's in no danger of being able to do either.

He hates my type.

180 Republican / conservative candidates are in for an out and out media smear job unless squeaky clean.  Why should Republican / conservative commentators expect to be treated more, uh, liberally?  Domenech defenders, got anything to add there?

181 #180: Agreed on all points!

182 #186: Ben has worked hard these past few years to redeem himself. I'll opt to trust Ace's judgement on this matter.

183 Oh, hell, just bring back Jason Blair and Stephen Glass.  All is forgiven, guys...

184 172 Lets see if Domenech and DrewK have the balls to do a blog on this: http://tiny.cc/qtv8w.


The fact that Newt has also said he wants to keep parts of ObamaCare does not somehow help Romney.

185 186 Republican / conservative candidates are in for an out and out media smear job unless squeaky clean.

FTFY

186 When a libtard journalist lies, it's panties in a twist time, but if a Ben Domenech crosses the line, well, no big deal.  H Y P O C R I T E S

187 When are people going to quit jerking off Romney? Perry is the real deal that will kill ObamaCare as well as many other big government programs and depts. Romney and Newt will keep expanding the social net to ensnarl as many people as possible.

188 #189: I'm not familiar with Stephen Glass, but I think I remember Jason Blair. He made up stories, and then was shown to have been rushed through every level of his career by affirmative action, right?

Totally different situation. For one thing, Domenech is a political commentator, an opinion journalist, while Blair was an "objective, non-partisan news journalist," a dealer in hard facts, man.

189 153 Domenech has been caught plagiarizing, and is a known Perry operative and all-around douchebag.

Posted by: Winning at December 17, 2011 01:30 PM (ozpOn)

 

It's not like he's a vice president or something. It was college- he apologized. Chill the fuck out.

190 The fact that Newt has also said he wants to keep parts of ObamaCare does not somehow help Romney.

Posted by: Miss'80s at December 17, 2011 01:58 PM (d6QMz)

No it shouldn't, Since Romney and Newt both like the mandate it should help Perry, Newt just doesn't seem to get much attention on his views about it though.

191

The whole idea of government run health care must be scrapped into the Pelosi dust bin of really bad ideas.

In order to succeed, we must partake in free markets, healthy competition, and a health care insurance industry that has ZERO attachment to government. Instead, we have  a corrupt government who vilifies the health insurance industry at every turn. Now look - ObamaCare has passed and all of our health care costs and premiums are GOING UP in price.

We must get back to the real reason we buy insurance. Not for the little things but for the BIG things. The government should never force us to buy a product the goverment provides.

192 Oh good, another anti-Mitt piece from DrewM that, shall we say, "shades the truth".

Mitt didn't say incentives = mandates.  That is putting words in his mouth.

And besides, I too favor "incentives" for people to get health insurance, and I'm sure you do too Drew M.  It's called A JOB.  If people have money, then they can buy their own health insurance.  Incentivize employment --> incentivize health insurance.

Look I  understand that a lot of people are upset with Mitt and don't think he is a reliable conservative.  I get that.  But can we keep our criticism of Mitt in the realm of fact?  Or is that asking too much?

193 Is that the 4 and 9 Panthers or a different one?

HA!

194 The fact that Newt has also said he wants to keep parts of ObamaCare does not somehow help Romney.


Agree 100%.  Using the defense - well the other guy, he sucks and he said it too - is a bad defense.

My view, when someone speaks over and over and people are recording - you are going to have gotcha moments.  What Mitt said was bad.  One statement at the end of a clip that contradicts what was said at the start of the clip - and what Mitt has been promising - is not a deal breaker for me.  It falls more in the catagory of hand slap to forehead followed by a "DOHH!"

Perry supporters can relate to what I am feeling.

195 The whole idea of government run health care must be scrapped into the Pelosi dust bin of really bad ideas.

Fine.  Then your candidate is Ron Paul.  Seriously.  He is the only one who proposes getting government entirely out of health care.

I am by no means a Ron Paul fan.  But if this is your single-issue hill to die on, then the choice is clear.  No other candidate wants to get government entirely out of health care.

Personally I am in favor of a limited government role in health care - much more limited than we have now, certainly.

196 Totally different situation

Sigh.  "I don't have a problem with tainted goods, as long as it's only certain kinds of goods."  Is that what you are saying?

197 FYI: Rick Perry isn't calling for getting government entirely out of health care either.

198 There are some good things about Obamacare. I can't think of a reason why we shouldn't allow people to buy insurance from an out-of-state provider. Some health care markets are effective monopolies. In Alabama, for example, one company (BC/BS) has 97% market share. It's very difficult and expensive to get independent insurance. Those of you stuck paying out the ass for Assurant know what I'm talking about. More competition would be great.

199 Newt / Paul 2012

So we can have Pinky & the Brain trying to take over the world for realz.

200
Jordan, get back under the stairs.

201 204 FYI: Rick Perry isn't calling for getting government entirely out of health care either.

Of the two, which is more likely to expand or maintain FEDERAL programs? 

202 Oh, well, I guess I'll just have to support Rick Perry then.

Hmm.

Naaaahhhhh. 

203

Incentives are not bad things. One way to get prices down is to encourage everyone to buy into the system. The problem is - is the system is run by the government? Than answer should be ...NO. Like most things run by government, they become debt ridden bundles of unsustainability.

If we can figure out a way to incentivize people to buy health insurance instead of jet skis and snow mobiles, that would be a good thing.

204
Of the two, which is more likely to expand or maintain FEDERAL programs?

Oh, Mittens is, no doubt.  But only if we have a squishy Congress that sends the President such a ridiculous bill.  I want a solidly conservative Congress.

205 If national heath insurance won't work without an individual mandate... then national health insurance won't work!

206

No it shouldn't, Since Romney and Newt both like the mandate it should help Perry, Newt just doesn't seem to get much attention on his views about it though.

Posted by: robtr at December 17, 2011 02:04 PM (MtwBb)

It might have something to do with Romney actually enacting Romneycare, and Newt merely talking about it.

207 #203: When it comes to mere opinions that I can read, and then choose to agree or disagree with? Yeah. Especially if I generally agree with the guy. And if he's not plagiarizing anymore; that's important, too.

I did a lot of dumb, shameful things within a couple of years +/- the age of 20, and I'm inclined to forgive someone else who also did dumb, shameful things around the same age if I think he's learned from his experience. And I do think Ben has learned his lesson.

208 I don't think Obamacare allows people to buy across state lines. obama care is all about state run health care. -or- forcing our states to pay for things they cannot afford. It doens't spread open the system, it tightens it up and makes prices high and access more difficult. Remember grandma doesn't need that new knee. Just take a pain pill.

209 If national heath insurance communism won't work without an individual mandate. a gun to your head, then national health insurance communism won't work!

There, that's better...

210 To be honest I would rather have a guy like Rick Perry as Speaker of the House, instead of President.

211 If we can't get a candidate to bring our fiscal house in order and by repealing Obamacare, then we may as well let BHO keep his job. Once the significant portions of O'care kick in, we really don't want a Repub in office. And, BHOwould do more to destroy the Left from within than either Mittens or Newt would do from the center left.

212

It might have something to do with Romney actually enacting Romneycare, and Newt merely talking about it.

Posted by: buzzion at December 17, 2011 02:12 PM (GULKT)

 

And Newt successfully fighting Hillarycare.

213

If we can figure out a way to incentivize people to buy health insurance instead of jet skis and snow mobiles, that would be a good thing.

Posted by: whatever at December 17, 2011 02:10 PM (O7ksG)

It's pretty simple to do, that's why politicians won't do it.

If someone doesn't have health insurance the government will go ahead and pay for their care. In return for that they get a loan from the government similiar to a student loan that can't be discharged in bankruptcey. So if you choose not to have health care you have your wages garnished for the rest of your life or you pay your bill.

We would have medicade for the poor but I don't know how to get around that.

214 Then there's this.

215

203...  I dont' know where you got the purity of conservatives meme, but I'll tell you, that redemtion and second chances are ours, individually to grant and sometimes are warranted and sometimes not.

It's not a one-strike and you're out kind of thing.  Especially youngsters deserve chances to learn from errant and poor judgement. 

So far, so good, but something tells me you really could care less about Ben and plagerism and more about pithy slams and calling people out for "inconsistencies!"

216 I'm trying to compare the long term value to the nation of having a fucktard Romney one-termer who would be blamed for the coming perma-recession versus a disastrous 2nd Obama term that would leave a bad taste in people's mouths about Dems for decades.

We're fucked either way, but I'm starting to think the republic's long term interests may be better served by a smoking crater.  People remember real pain for decades.  PEople wouldn't remember Romney 10 years after he was gone.

217 No doubt this will draw ire, but about a thousand things less than with another Obama presidency. Just by not being Barack Obama, Mitt ameliorates a dire scenario. I know it's not much to cling to and that the same can be said for most of the rest of the (R) choices, but there it is.

At almost any other moment in history I would want the most conservative candidate. Now, I'll settle for anyone who isn't Obama. If it's Romney, then we already know we can control him with the polls.

218

And Newt successfully fighting Hillarycare.

Posted by: Ms Choksondik, hoping for a Perry miracle at December 17, 2011 02:15 PM (fYOZx)

whatever, while Newt was fighting hillarycare he was calling for an individual mandate to replace it.

219 If the primary gets as far as my state, so far as it stands, I'm voting for Romney. Here comes the hate pile on.

220 #214GT, I have to go after this, but consider:

If you put a teaspoon of wine in a barrel of sewage - you get sewage.
If you put a teaspoon of sewage in a barrel of wine - you get sewage.

221 Posted by: whatever at December 17, 2011 02:10 PM (O7ksG)

Hey! That's my moniker.

I have dibs on As If! too!

222 BHOwould do more to destroy the Left from within than either Mittens or Newt would do from the center left.

Precisely.  The idiot Dems have no idea how damaging a 2nd Obama term would be to them in the decades out long term.  If they did, they'd be trying hard to throw this election so all the coming economic turmoil could be blamed on a Republican.

223 WHERE THE F@CK are the oppo research operations of all the other Repubs, when a Mitt/Obamacare blockbuster like this has sat all unnoticed until almost the end of the campaign? Are they all just a bunch of lazy/incompetent pantywaists?

224 Uh, it's pronounced "Rombley", rubes.

225 We're fucked either way, but I'm starting to think the republic's long term interests may be better served by a smoking crater.  People remember real pain for decades.  PEople wouldn't remember Romney 10 years after he was gone.

Posted by: Purple Avenger at December 17, 2011 02:16 PM (AUlMP)

Yeah we would remember Obama everytime for the next 20 years that a liberal supreme court makes a ruling.

226 Are they all just a bunch of lazy/incompetent pantywaists?

Ummm...yes?

227 202- No. Not voting or supporting Ron Paul. I too agree with some of his ideas, but he's coocoo. And his foreign policy is beloved by the far left. No thanks.

228 FYI: Rick Perry isn't calling for getting government entirely out of health care either.

I know all of you smart people have big ideas about health care and such but nothing's ever really going to change in this country until we have a part-time Congress.  It's the biggest issue facing us today.  Crippling taxes and regulation?  Part-time Congress.  Energy production?  Part-time Congress.  Iranian nukes?  No-fly zone over Syria Part-time Congress.  The college football ranking system?  Part-time Congress.

In order to fasilita facillyta facili get to the change we so desperately need I will write up and sign into law the 37th through 186th Amendments to the Constitution, one for each member of Congress who needs to be relegated to part-time status.  It'll be good for 'em because I hear the private sector is doing great these days, at least it was when I left it back in 1984.  Vote for me, and I'll set you free.  Thank y'all kindly.

229 #224: Actually, people would remember a President Romney for a long time to come, just like they still remember Herbert Hoover.

230

Supreme Court is life on the bench.

231 On the same wavelength, Purple Avenger. BHO can't help himself. He'll blow another $6 Trillion in 4 years, and we'll have another downgrade. 4 mores years of class warfare and funemployment should turn the masses against the donkeys for decades.

232 dangit. Dan C. woke up late and posted links at the end of the dead Wisconsin thread.

233 It might have something to do with Romney actually enacting Romneycare, and Newt merely talking about it.

Yes Romney got it done - had a lot of support to do it as well.  Conservatives were behind him, the people supported him and so did the majority of the dems.

No one has yet to answer the question I keep putting forward - what would you have done to solve the problem in MA of freeloaders abusing the ERs?  That is a mandate by the way - free health care for anyone who shows up at a hospital.

Not to get sidetracked (I did not like that statement at the end of the clip), but too many folks are on the bandwagon of "Romneycare is horrible".  Where were you in 08 and what is your solution?

234 If it's Romney, then we already know we can control him with the polls.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at December 17, 2011 02:17 PM (piMMO)

---

I don't know that that's true.

The guy has been running below 25% the whole time, but I see no effort that he is trying to votes from the garner conservative base.  So when it comes to polls, he certainly feels free to ignore ones that show conservatives don't trust him.  And many of us wanted to trust him.  Even here, there were a lot of us early on defending Mitt as a viable choice and spelling out how Mitt could win our votes. 

All it would have taken for me to be on board - and probably for Perry to not have jumped into the race - was for him to dissect in gory detail the flaws in Masscare, show me that he rejects Obamacare, and present to me what his free-market solution was for health care cost and access.  He refused to do that, so I started to look for other candidates. 

Then Perry jumped in - a guy will a solid record of governing as a conservative and a true believer in Federalism - and it was game over.  I'm not going to settle for someone based on the tea leaf reading of the political class who gave us McCain when I have a successful conservative governor to vote for. 

235 Soap, thought you were a goner at the start of MW3. Glad you pulled through. Of course, I'm only a few missions in right now. Hope you make it. :-)

236 Then Perry jumped in - a guy will a solid record of governing as a conservative and a true believer in Federalism - and it was game over.  I'm not going to settle for someone based on the tea leaf reading of the political class who gave us McCain when I have a successful conservative governor to vote for.

I'm in it for Perry for the long haul, just as I was in it for Fred. But by the time the Florida primary rolled around, Teh Fred was history, and I voted for Romney.

I'd do the same today.

237 @244...heh

238 1) Is there a way we could automatically have the first two comments in any primary thread be "Damned dirty RINOs, didn't you learn anything from Whitman/McCain?" and "Damned dirty Purists, didn't you learn anything from O'Donnel/Angle?" It would save some people a little time. 2) There is no reason to believe that what comes out of a "smoking crater" will be early America rather than late North Korea. History trends toward the latter.

239 #243 - look at all the posts above that say "I like hearing what I want to hear, even if it's coming from someone who lied to / been dishonest with me before..."  Why would they expect more of their candidate?

240 Oh and there is more to the Romneycare story than what is commonly known.

During the time that Romneycare was being debated and implemented, in 2005, the typical libtard activists in the state were campaigning to get a universal health care ballot initiative in 2006 if the legislature didn't do something about it by then.  And considering that it's Massachusetts, it is no surprise that such a ballot initiative would have passed easily.  Romney took the wind out of their sails by implementing "universal coverage" without the single-payer bullshit.

This isn't to justify the mandate or to seek to excuse any of it, only to point out that there is more to the story.

241 There is no reason to believe that what comes out of a "smoking crater" will be early America rather than late North Korea. History trends toward the latter.

I don't really see anything in the future that's good anymore.  I don't be believe the united states will exist in its current format 50 years from now.

242 I'm not going to settle for someone based on the tea leaf reading of the political class who gave us McCain when I have a successful conservative governor to vote for.

Oh, I've been very successful indeed.  I've earned this pension over 27 years in government, and no one's ever going to tell me I can't take it.

243 LEAVE MITTENS ALONE!!111!!!!1!!!!M

244 usher in an era of anarchy

You say that like its a bad thing.  A period of chaos might be a great opportunity to thin the herd.

245 234 Yeah, that may suck, but it seems the SC is less relevant now that the Pres can simply bypass legislation altogether by Executive Order. Plus, when they uphold the individual mandate, they'll be nothing the government can't do, and the SC becomes totally unnecessary.

246 @248  I don't think some people understand just how bad Obama is for this nation.  Also four more years of Obama picks on judges will cement a libral strangle hold of the courts for years to come - judges last a lot longer than politicians.

Many folks need to wake up to the fact that this is not just a popularity contest or another football game where we hope our team wins it.  This is a nation on the brink of sliding down into that long dark night.

I thought the one thing Obama had going for him is that he woke up America - but sometimes I wonder if enough people woke up.

247 Stand aside, I'm going to shoot your kids.  Their long-term interests will be better served by giant sucking wounds in their chests, because people remember real pain for decades.

248 I don't really see anything in the future that's good anymore. I don't be believe the united states will exist in its current format 50 years from now. Posted by: Purple Avenger at December 17, 2011 02:34 PM (AUlMP) Forgive me if I don't run up the white flag *just* yet.

249 Posted by: chemjeff at December 17, 2011 02:34 PM

I don't care how Masscare came about.  I understand the realities that governors face, which is why I call it Masscare instead of Romneycare.  But looking at Mitt's record and the totality of the positions he's espoused over the years, I do not think he's that unhappy about Masscare.  He's a "centrist" (at best) who believes in a much bigger government than I do. 

He's had plenty of time to show me how smart he is when it comes to health care, which was the main issue he ran on last time, and he hasn't done it.  Instead of leading the charge in developing conservative solutions to health care (prices, access), he spent the past three years laying low as much as possible and bolstering his chances by spreading his PAC money around. 

I'm not impressed.  He doesn't strike me as a conservative guy who has been force by circumstances to do some unconservative things.  He strikes me as a guy who believes in government solutions to lots of things who is a Republican more by birth than anything else. 

250 248 I hear ya', but "conventional wisdom" brought us to BHO.

251 Yeah, that may suck, but it seems the SC is less relevant now that the Pres can simply bypass legislation altogether by Executive Order.

Like I said earlier, they are already doing that. There is no provision in the law for individual waivers. That is a poewr that they gave themselves by "interpreting" a provision in the law loosely. Waivers are intended for States, and not until 2017.

When Republicans get in office and try to issue waivers for all the States the Dems will scream (unlike the Repubs)and take it to court.

And hint to people, the President can not repeal a law. He can ignore it as long as congress lets him get away with it, but that only works for Democrats.

We will need 60 Rs to repeal it. We will not have 60 Rs. It simply is not possible.  If we didn't have half a dozen RINOs and DIABLOs in the Senate we may be able to invoke the nuclear option. But that is slim.

Our ONLY chance is the court.

252 I love the "scandals" on Rick Perry.  The latest one being he made a wise financial decision for his family that was - shocka - perfectly within the rules!  Eleventy! 

253 @253 - Yes I see the sarcasm, but I still can't resist.

Leave "Mittens" alone - no way.  I come to this site because it is full of Romney haters (and ACE has the best cat vids and Star Wars trivia).  Drew probably has little dolls on his desk where play acts Perry actually beating Romney in a debate and looking smart (flash to seen in Spaceballs with Dark Helmet playing with dolls).

I want my guy to get vetted!  One of the things that drove me crazy was all the Newt supporters who seemed to be pretending that Newt was great - no baggage here just move on!

So vet away Drew and others - you are a patriots.

254 Forgive me if I don't run up the white flag *just* yet.

True.  Stuff that's behind us and we've survived it:  Hitler, Tojo, Stalin, the USSR, Jack Reed, Walter Duranty, Camelot, the Clintons, Jimmuh Carter, and so on and so on.

Don't bet against a better future just yet...

255 Okay, in view of the all-too-serious tone the stream of Saturday posts has taken, I give you this seriously WTF moment.

256

Posted by: Evan at December 17, 2011 02:26 PM (O3OlP)

Pretty simple... BILL THEM FOR THE VISITS!

The problem is the Government intruding into the Free Enterprise system with a Mandate that said they have to see people at emergency rooms... so now the only option seems to be MORE Government control, and less Freedom?

Life sucks. But when the Government intrudes, the suckage factor increases, it does not decrease.

Somehow people think the Governments over riding job is to somehow make life Fair, and Easy... problem is that Life is inherently not Fair... so you are now giving the Government more power, taking away Freedom, but the goal will NEVER be met because it is just a universal truth that 'Shit Happens'....

So, I'm glad you are willing to give up YOUR Freedom for Saftey... problem is you are also taking away MY Freedom, for YOUR saftey.

257 Hey Mittens, wanna ride. If you're not comfortable in your own skin, we can see how it fits on me.

258 I give you this seriously WTF moment.

I love ewe.

259 I love the "scandals" on Rick Perry.  The latest one being he made a wise financial decision for his family that was - shocka - perfectly within the rules!  Eleventy!

Of course I did.  A guy like me who's spent his entire adult life in government has earned the right to make Wise Financial Decisions for My Family.  All those dudes in Washington whose salaries I want to slash, not so much, but me?  I'm golden.

And hell, after all this time at the public trough who wouldn't deserve a nice house, too?

260 Drew: Team Romney quickly knocked it down but base on this video, you have to wonder.

... wonder how ridiculous you and your posts have become?

Honestly, this is what it has come down to? Posting criticism based of your inference of his conceptualization of what's "good" and "bad."

There are many ways these types of incentives can be enacted that don't constitute a mandate. Basic economic teaching includes the curve shifting that happens by creating a new optimum state due to fiscal policy. We already incentivise a tremendous number of things in this manner through the tax code.

Ace, your posts have been exemplar lately. Hell, Rick Perry has been vastly improving and I can't even make a case against your posts in supporting him in good conscious anymore. That said, Drew's posts are an intellectual disaster.

261 Okay, Murcek; I get what you're saying; I get that you're absolutely proud of everything you did around the age of twenty, and wouldn't change a single moment of it, because you're the perfected man, and thus can't grok normal folks who aren't proud of everything they did years ago while they were still growing as people.

But as for me, I believe we're all sinners who can learn from our mistakes and become better people for the experience.

True, some people don't learn from their misdeeds (see: Ted Kennedy), but that's no reason to look down on everyone who's made a mistake, even a pretty big one.

There are limits to what I'll forgive. For example, I believe in the death penalty. But that's more about closure for the victim's loved ones, preventing recidivism, and discouraging others from going down that dark path, than just punishing the killer.

You can't say that Ben hasn't been punished; his influence has been greatly diminished. He had to give up running Red State and work his way back up to cob-logging for readers who proudly call themselves Morons and Moronettes.

262 Oh, I've been very successful indeed.  I've earned this pension over 27 years in government, and no one's ever going to tell me I can't take it.

Posted by: Rick Perry at December 17, 2011 02:35 PM (nt0Ks)

---

You left out the horror of the fact that it was his years of military service that helped qualify him for this program. 

Unless you're a Ron Paul supporter, I really have to wonder why. 

263 269 Great in principle, impossible in execution. The fucking bleeding hearts in congress will put a "progressive" pay scale in place, and the "poorest" 51% will not pay a dime. It will continue to fall on the "wealthiest" 49%. Everywhere I turn, I pay for more for services to supplement the our "poor". I think our "poor" have a misconception about what "poor" really means. They need to be enlightened.

264 So is the theory that Ben used CGI to make the Romney video? 

265

So Perry is not turning down a monthly bit of retirement money? ....So what? BFD!

Perry is not filthy rich like Romney and Gingrich. ....So what if he is not turning down a monthly check from his retirement. ....He has done things that have brought in billions in additional tax revenues from businesses investing in Texas.

266 277 - LOL. I think Romney might be all CGI.

267

Unless you're a Ron Paul supporter, I really have to wonder why. 

Romneybot.

268 #278: Yep! Perry definitely earned his pension, unlike, say, Mel Martinez.

269 It's horrible how Rick Perry used the U.S. taxpayer to have fun in the military... all the while Mitt was shitting in a bucket in France. 

270 You left out the horror of the fact that it was his years of military service that helped qualify him for this program.

Nope, sez here in the paperwork that it's a state employee retirement annuity that was calculated according to combined time in military and government service.

I served in the military for five years; I've been in state government for 27 years and counting.  You figure it out; I've got a check to deposit.

271 You mean to tell me Gov Romney has been running around the country for almost 2 years, plus ~12 nationally televised debates, in which he's maintained that he did NOT in any way shape or form support Obamacare...knowing that this sh!t was out there on video?! You Perry fanatics, how can you justify your hero not strangling Mitt w/this sh!t in every single debate? The man is a governor for 11 years, he's been thinking of running for Prez for a long time, where the f@ck is his research team? Don't you think this wd have been a little stronger than "your lawncare dudes didn't fire their illegals fast enough," or "you edited out a sentence in your book that I can't recall right now?" You got a f@cking loaded double-barreled elephant gun right there, but you pick up the BB gun instead? Good lord, Casey Stengel had it right:"Can't anybody here play this game?!" I just hope it isn't too late to choke the Mittster on this.

272 Mitt Romney: The 21st Century's Herbert Hoover!

273

Look at this though:

There are many ways these types of incentives can be enacted that don't constitute a mandate.

I read it and it says to me: "I know you don't like the mandate. So trust us, there's lots of other totally different non-mandate ways we can dick with the market and your choices, and end up with the same effect anyway".

Like it was just the method, not the end, under objection.

And this is exactly the way Romney would think. Romney is the sort who could not fathom how we could reject all his top-down big government solutions, and no matter what - even if he starts off trying to please us - he'll turn on us, because he will conclude that we are unrealistic obstructionists won't ever be happy with anything.

Because he can not imagine anything other than socialist-lite solutions.

A guy like Romney is fundementally incompatible with classical liberalism. Every single thing he 'fixes' will be just as broken as with Obama, it will just be broken in a different way. Romney will make the Big Government work more efficiently.

274 Mitch Romley is the Devil!

275

283....Posted by: Rick Perry at December 17, 2011 02:59 PM (nt0Ks)

Oh fuck off, whoever you are.

The Texas governors mansion got burned up by some crazy liberal, iirc. .....So what if Perry was living in a rent house for a while.

Like I said upthread -- Perry has fostered a boom in the Texas economy. It can afford his little pension check.

276 Nope, sez here in the paperwork that it's a state employee retirement annuity that was calculated according to combined time in military and government service.

I served in the military for five years; I've been in state government for 27 years and counting.  You figure it out; I've got a check to deposit.

Posted by: Rick Perry at December 17, 2011 02:59 PM (nt0Ks)

You're attacking a guy because he is drawing his pension legally? You are looking pretty weak there champ.

277

I served in the military for five years; I've been in state government for 27 years and counting.  You figure it out; I've got a check to deposit.

Which one of our candidates hasn't made absurd amounts of money in politics?

And don't you try to weasle out of that corner by naming one of our politicians who were already filthy rich before they became a politician - they were already rich, so it's hard to tell, but they tend to make even more money in politics.

278

284....You Perry fanatics, how can you justify your hero not strangling Mitt w/this sh!t in every single debate?

Perry doesn't seem to like to attack other Republicans....members of the same team. ....Which is probably why he sucks at it when he has tried to do it. ....His team has put out some attack videos tho.

279 Attacking Perry for drawing a merited pension..    =  WEAK SAUCE!

280

It's just that as a self-proclaimed "student of history", I see all of the classical indications of a societal entity in decline.

Yup.

281 Anyone who believes that Romney will expend any time or energy to repeal Obamacare is a complete idiot.  Period. 

IF congress puts a bill on his desk repealing Obamacare, Romney would likely sign it.

but, b/c republicans in the house probably won't have the stones to really push the issue and because we are unlikely to have 60 votes in the Senate, the only way a repeal bill gets passed is if there is strong, effective and determined leadership from a president for a repeal bill.

And that Romney will never do.  He will never put forth the effort it would take.  He will simply say "I would repeal it if congress passed a repeal bill, but they won't".  Thus, he isn't "breaking" a campaign promise b/c there is no repeal bill for him to sign or veto.

I've been saying this from the get-go.  Romney will be less conservative than G HW Bush and more "big gov't" republican than W Bush.  He will be THE tax collector for the democrats. He will tinker with Obamacare and claim it is "fixed" and then we will have that enormous albatross entitlement program bankrupting our country and destroying health care forever b/c it will have been cemented by a republican president.  And, b/c a republican president does it - congressional republicans will line up and get on board too.  Just like they did for all of W's idiotic ideas (e.g., No Child Left Behind).

That is the danger of a Romney presidency.  He will solidify all of the gains the left has made in the last 4 years by giving such gains a bi-partisan veneer.  That is why I honestly believe that a Romney presidency is worse long-term than a second term of Obama.

282 With efforts by Senators Graham and McCain and their esteemed Democrat compatriots across the aisle we have arrived at a bipartisan solution to fix the broken healthcare law.  This will ensure that the law will work without having to go through the long process of repealing it and drafting an entirely new bill for approval.  I thank Senators Graham and McCain for their efforts and urge the House to not hold up this bill for partisan reasons and allow a vote to be held on it.

283 Oh fuck off, whoever you are.

I like it!  Can I use that in Iowa?


The Texas governors mansion got burned up by some crazy liberal, iirc. .....So what if Perry was living in a rent house for a while.

Agreed!  Who hasn't fallen on tough times lately and been forced to search under the sofa cushions to make their $25,000 monthly rent?  Okay, okay, I don't have to do that; the state of Texas ponies up the dough for this little hole-in-the-wall, but still!  I've earned it, and it's a Wise Financial Decision for My Family.


Like I said upthread -- Perry has fostered a boom in the Texas economy. It can afford his little pension check.

Heh, that's what I've been trying to tell people lately.  Of course, the Texas economy was booming long before I inherited the governor's mansion, and will be long after I leave it (and my advisers are telling me not to make plans to stick around after another two years, but I don't know what they're talking about), but it kept going along under MY administration and gosh darn it I'm going to take the credit!  Because that too, is a Wise Financial Political Decision for My Family.

284 I don't know if there's any sort of actual arrangement between Romney and Bachmann, but I have noticed that she always tends to go after whoever threatens Romney, the not-Romney frontrunner.

I'll give her and Romney the benefit of the doubt on any sort of semi-official arrangement in this regard, but I will point this out...

Also-ran candidates tend to run up a fair bit of debt for their vanity campaigns, debt that the eventual nominee usually offers to retire for them in exchange for their endorsement and support.

Well, this year's field is actually wide-open. So, if you're just looking to get your vanity campaign debt retired, why not dedicate your energy to attacking anyone who threatens the richest guy in the race? Whether he wins or loses, he'll be in a good position to pay off your debt.

That, I think, is what's really going on with Bachmann. She never expected to win the nomination, and doesn't really expect to get the vice-president nod, but is just calculating her best chance to break even while promoting herself.

285 Yeah, I feel really good about my endorsement. 

286 That is the danger of a Romney presidency.  He will solidify all of the gains the left has made in the last 4 years by giving such gains a bi-partisan veneer.  That is why I honestly believe that a Romney presidency is worse long-term than a second term of Obama.

And, the reason I believe this is that at least w/ 4 more years of Obama, the GOP congress would be able to oppose the idiocy and continue to point out the failures and continue to educate america on the idiocy of liberalism, rather than simply adopting it all.  Then in 4 years maybe we can get a decent candidate to run and try to roll this stuff back instead of having simply adopted it all under Romney.

Yes, I know, I know.  Supreme Court nominations.  but - so what?  If we lose on Obamacare the supreme court ceases to even matter.  Assuming that Obamacare is not overturned this term, then congress will have the authority to do anything to anyone at anytime under the claim of "interstate commerce".  At that point, what real difference does the supreme court make?  yes, perhaps to abortion and a few other things.  But the left will have won the major battle by giving congress the authority to control everything and instituting a program that gives a rational for doing so (i.e., controlling everything to reduce health care costs - what you eat, how you work, how you play, everything will have an effect on health care costs and the federal gov't will need to control it).

so, to me, SCOTUS picks just aren't as important as this fight.  Which means that Obama is preferable to Romney for the reasons outlined.  It is terrible to say, but 4 more years of epic failure by liberalism is better long term for the country than a moderate technocrat such as Romney.

287 Whoops! In #299...

I don't know if there's any sort of actual arrangement between Romney and Bachmann, but I have noticed that she always tends to go after whoever threatens Romney, the not-Romney frontrunner.

I don't mean Romney is the not-Romney frontrunner, because that would be stupid to say. I meant...

I don't know if there's any sort of actual arrangement between Romney and Bachmann, but I have noticed that she always tends to go after whoever threatens Romney. Whoever is the not-Romney frontrunner, that's who she attacks.

I only hope M. Murcek can forgive me such an egregious sin.

288

I don't know if there's any sort of actual arrangement between Romney and Bachmann, but I have noticed that she always tends to go after whoever threatens Romney, the not-Romney frontrunner.

I don't mean Romney is the not-Romney frontrunner, because that would be stupid to say. I meant...

Well you know, depending on the day, he sort of is.

289 Now Newt on the other hand he KNOWS who has been visiting the Bachelor pads of the rich and sanctamonious Repunks and he knows which ones escorted Debbie Blabbermouth Schultz home after Jello shots at Hooters.
newt, the grizzled old owl, may even still have the remote to Nasty Pelosis Rabbitt.
Newts got Cheney on speed dial and Bolton as his backup! Newt and BIBI are friends and Margaret Thatcher has his home phone.

Posted by: Concealed Kerry or Submit at December 17, 2011 03:20 PM (tHnoW)

I don't know if this is facetious or not, but my strong dislike of Romney for President does not mean that I love Newt.  I see Newt as flawed as well, but much preferable to Romney.

290 It's just that as a self-proclaimed "student of history", I see all of the classical indications of a societal entity in decline. 

Yep.  And the problem now, is we're fresh out of the standard "quick fixes" that always worked in decades past.  Our shields are down and our quiver is empty.  We have no means to fight off what's coming with anything less than a brutally crushing regime of massively higher taxes, which in reality will only hasten the inevitable, but you know that's the final straw politicians will grab at.

291 #304: Okay, you have a point there, Buzz!

292

I'll say it for the umpteenth time - I AM NOT VOTING FOR THIS JERK.

I'd much rather have King Putt in the White House when the country tanks than "a Republican". The GOP will wear that stain for decades if we let this clown get the presidency.

@305 monkeytoe... I have the same thoughts. Newt is not what we need, but he's probably what we've got.

293 298.....Of course, the Texas economy was booming long before I inherited the governor's mansion, and will be long after I leave it...

Posted by: Rick Perry at December 17, 2011 03:16 PM (nt0Ks)

Perry has been governor for a decade. ....You slam him for being in public office for 27 years. .....Lets do the math on that.....that means he was helping to create that booming economy for 17 more years, before he was governor.

Like someone else said........Weak sauce. Very weak.

 

294 283 You left out the horror of the fact that it was his years of military service that helped qualify him for this program.

Nope, sez here in the paperwork that it's a state employee retirement annuity that was calculated according to combined time in military and government service.

---

Learn to read. 

295 Like someone else said........Weak sauce. Very weak.

I'm still waiting for the scandal bomb JackStraw's been helpfully assuring us would come on Perry to drop.


They have nothing. 

296

They have nothing.

They really don't, Y-not. ....All they can come up with is weak-ass snark and innuendo. ....Or just making shit up out of whole cloth.

297 #308: That's why I'm calling Romney the Herbert Hoover of today. Hoover was a Republican who took over the Presidency in the middle of a recession, and then turned it into the Great Depression with his New Deal plan. FDR ran on the promise of turning things around, but then expanded on the New Deal and made the Depression worse. But he was really smart about the way he spread the wealth around, and got big money to just the right people to keep him in office forever.

I think President Romney would be just like Hoover, and give way to a dictator even worse than Obama in 2016.

298

 I see Newt as flawed as well, but much preferable to Romney.

OK, but given that Perry was last entry, and possibly least prepared entry by virtue of the fact he was practically half-drafted into this race, and has been consistenly improving his debate performances while kicking ass in interviews and in his ground game....

Why is Newt preferable to (a Joe Arpaio endorsed) Perry? 

299 that means he was helping to create that booming economy for 17 more years, before he was governor.

That's right!  As a crusading state representative from Drywall and later, Agriculture Commissioner I was Cranking.  This.  Bitch.  Up.  Of course, now I'm running for president on the notion of making government as inconsequential in our lives as possible, which kind of screws with that narrative, but that's why I'm counting on my legions of supporters to make it for me.

300 #298: So, what you're saying is... Perry merely inherited a Bush economy. Well, guess what other candidate inherited a Bush economy? That's right; Obama.

Who did a better job after inheriting a Bush economy? This is definitely NOT a weak point for Perry.

301 302 I like how you think.

302

The GOP will wear that stain for decades if we let this clown get the presidency.

I can't imagine the GOP would survive if that happened (and it probably will with Mittens).

I should hope it doesn't, at any rate.

303 Learn to read.
Posted by: Y-not at December 17, 2011 03:30 PM (5H6zj)


State employee retirement annuity, darlin'.  Combined military and government service.  Five (5) years in the military, Twenty-seven (27) years and counting in government.

It's a pretty sweet deal, I do admit.  'Course, I'm going to want to be running Washington's gravy train off the rails (at least that's what I'm saying now), but I don't mind riding this one 'cause like you say, I earned it.

And thank you kindly for the suggestion, but Anita taught me to read when I was seventeen and I've never looked back.

304

running for president on the notion of making government as inconsequential in our lives as possible, which kind of screws with that narrative

Look how they attack Perry.

Screws with the narrative eh? Making government inconsequential won't put the economy in overdrive?

What does that attack say about the attacker? No wonder he doesn't like Perry. Perry's a fiscal conservative!

305 Which are the good parts?

306

Maybe one of those 'fiscally conservative, socially liberal' people.

You know, the ones who think redistributing 5% less wealth than Nancy wants to is 'fiscally conservative'.

Like the mandate! Staunch, Heritage Foundation endorsed, fiscally conservative health reform.

307 I always wondered what a pig in a poke looked like.

308 315 that means he was helping to create that booming economy for 17 more years, before he was governor.

That's right! As a crusading state representative from Drywall and later, Agriculture Commissioner I was Cranking. This. Bitch. Up. Of course, now I'm running for president on the notion of making government as inconsequential in our lives as possible, which kind of screws with that narrative, but that's why I'm counting on my legions of supporters to make it for me.

Posted by: Rick Perry at December 17, 2011 03:37 PM (nt0Ks)

----------

No, dumbass. .....That's how you get a booming economy --- by getting the government off people's backs.

Perry has been consistent about that, that's what he's been saying for years.....even when he was a conservative Democrat in the Texas legislature.

309 IF congress puts a bill on his desk repealing Obamacare, Romney would likely sign it.

but, b/c republicans in the house probably won't have the stones to really push the issue and because we are unlikely to have 60 votes in the Senate, the only way a repeal bill gets passed is if there is strong, effective and determined leadership from a president for a repeal bill.

Sorry I don't accept the premise.

Congress sets its own schedule.  If Congress fails to send the President a repeal bill, then Obamacare isn't repealed, regardless of who the president is.

And if there are 40+ liberal D senators determined to filibuster an ObamaCare repeal bill, then again there is virtually nothing any president can do.  Not even the purest of the pure conservatives can coerce a Democrat into voting like a Republican.

Incidentally, you've made the argument in favor of getting as conservative of a Congress as possible, so as to guarantee that regardless of who sits in the Oval Office (ABO), that ObamaCare does in fact get repealed.

310

Sorry I don't accept the premise.

Congress sets its own schedule.  If Congress fails to send the President a repeal bill, then Obamacare isn't repealed, regardless of who the president is.

Oh, you are not that naive.

Bush had nothing to do with NCLB, congress did that, would have done it with anyone else?

Probably the Iraq war too. Congress passed that. Presidents don't actually do anything.

This isn't 1803. I don't care how it's suppose to work, you and I both know how it does.

311

How can Mittens promise to repeal OR replace obamacare if Congress sets it's own agenda?

Oh poor Mitt, it won't be his fault if Congress never sends him a repeal. Congress sets it's own agenda! Not his fault.

312 No, dumbass. .....That's how you get a booming economy --- by getting the government off people's backs.

That's right!  And that's why I've spent 27 tireless years on people's backs, including 11 in the weakest governor's office in the nation; because without me Texas would be Zimbabwe.

(Oh shit, I forgot my bank was closed on Saturdays.... knew I should have set up direct deposit....)

313 I've been reading this blog long enough to guess that you have some people here who live in Massachusetts.  Why, then, is the mandate still being referred to as a "fine"?  It's not a fine.  It's not a penalty.  It's a tax deduction.  In other words, Romney most certainly DID raise taxes because of the way the state tax return was changed after the mandate was put in place.  Having health insurance in Massachusetts is like having kids.  You have a kid?  You get the deduction.  There is no way around it without committing fraud on your tax return.  This thing has been in place since 2006.  Stop calling it a fine.  You don't a choice as to whether you will pay it or not.  You have no choice.

314 If I can forgive Ann Coulter for having sex with Bill Maher, I can forgive Ben Domenech for plagiarism in college.

Really, though... What's up with Ann? I mean, she could've had... me, for example! Mind you, I'm not saying she can't now. Give me a call, Ann!

315 Entropy, that's not what I'm saying.

Of course NCLB was Bush's idea.  But if Congress had decided to reject NCLB, what could Bush do?  He can't coerce Congress into adopting his platform.  No President can.

Of course the President can influence and try to persuade Congress to go along with his wishes.  But at the end of the day, it is up to Congress.

Incidentally, if changing the status quo will require D cooperation on some level (i.e., breaking a filibuster), who best do you want to attempt to persuade a wavering D to break the filibuster?  Honest question here.  I can tell you right now, if I was an R senator and we had, say, President Michael Moore (shudder) haranguing me to try to vote his way, there is no force on this planet that could convince me to do that, just because I personally loathe and detest the guy.

316 And, the reason I believe this is that at least w/ 4 more years of Obama, the GOP congress would be able to oppose the idiocy and continue to point out the failures and continue to educate america on the idiocy of liberalism, rather than simply adopting it all.  Then in 4 years maybe we can get a decent candidate to run and try to roll this stuff back instead of having simply adopted it all under Romney.

Except that, in two years they will argue that the obstructionist Republicans held them back and people will have forgotten all about 2008. Then we might be facing even MORE of the bastards in D.C.

317 Oh poor Mitt, it won't be his fault if Congress never sends him a repeal. Congress sets it's own agenda! Not his fault.

So instead of a squishy Congress that won't send President Whomever a repeal bill, let's get a conservative Congress.

318

I have been told by several people that if Paul is the nominee, they will vote Obama, or 3rd party, or stay home.

So now that last fall's Leaving The Plantation has become this years Highest Form of Patriotism, if Romney is the nominee, I am voting for Obama.

Romney delenda est.

319

So instead of a squishy Congress that won't send President Whomever a repeal bill, let's get a conservative Congress.

I have a better idea.

Lets get a sky that rains skittles that if planted, grow into unicorn trees.

Are you going to primary Boehner? Is McConnell even up this year? These are the same dickheads we had 02-06. That kind of thing takes a decade or more, we've been at it 2 years only.

I've been telling deluded Tea Partiers all along, a wacky Weekend in Washington will not retake and reform government.

320 Leave Perry and the public sector, including thode poor Wisconsin teachers, alone. They earned and are entitled to their lavish taxpayer funded pensions, vacation days, and cadillac health care plans. Signed, A working class stiff with no pension, paid vacation days, and no health plan who pays for the pensions of "noble" public servants. Now excuse me as I get back to the ignoble work of providing people with food and homes, so fatcat pols can live in luxury.

321

332.....I can tell you right now, if I was an R senator and we had, say, President Michael Moore (shudder) haranguing me to try to vote his way, there is no force on this planet that could convince me to do that, just because I personally loathe and detest the guy.

Even if he and the Dems were poised and ready to cut off pay to our military if you didn't vote their way? ......That's what the Thug-in-chief and his thugs in the Senate have been doing.

322 I think ironically, one of the things that brought down Meg Whitman in CA was that she campaigned as a successful businesswoman who could turn the economy around. Now Mitt is campaigning on the exact same thing. Whitman ended up losing because people perceived her to be an out of touch rich woman. Rich does not sell to an electorate (unless you're the Kennedy's)

323 How bout no ObamaCare, you Progressive RINO twat?

324

What has your uber-conservative Tea Party!!! Congress done for you?

Jack shit.

"Oh, but they are only 3/5ths of 1/2 of the 1/3 of the government".

They didn't even fight. They kept promising a fight to keep you marching, next time, next time, and then led you straight to surrender.

325 Posted by: Entropy, and if you disagree you hate America and want Obama to win at December 17, 2011 04:07 PM (TLNYf)

So let me see if I understand your point.

Congress is unreliable, they are full of squishes and "dickheads", so we need a strong conservative warrior President who will whip Congress into shape to do things that they are otherwise not inclined to do?

I really think that is asking too much of almost any President.  Reagan may have been able to pull it off with a D Congress, but that is when the D's weren't entirely composed of full-on progresso-weenies.  Not to mention that I don't think any of our current candidates are up to that magnitude of a task.

Yes we will likely have Speaker Boehner and Majority Leader McConnell in 2013.  That doesn't really excite me (although I have a little more confidence in Boehner than in McConnell).  But if you don't believe they are truly willing to repeal ObamaCare when it is clear there is a mandate to do so from the election, what difference does it make who is elected?  Why support any of them?

326

By and large this is the same congress that would not filibuster and obstruct Obamacare in the first place.

They came running out the gate promising to keep and fix it.

I suspect most of them want it.

I wonder if most of the GOP isn't talking about it because they feel safe most of you have fogotten about through all the union fights and debt issue.

It goes into effect in force in 2014. By 2015, most of the market instituions that provided healthcare will be co-opted or bankrupted, the Government will have a monopoly on HEALTH CARE for the masses, and it will be Too. Fucking. Late.

Unless you're planning to become way way more radical than even I am entertaining at the moment.

327 Right, so the Republicans are all in on it.  Gah you sound just as bad as those idiot Dems who complain that Obama is a "corporate sellout". 

Unless you're planning to become way way more radical than even I am entertaining at the moment.

Does your radical solution involve the words "Ron" and "Paul"?

328

Leave Perry and the public sector, including thode poor Wisconsin teachers, alone. They earned and are entitled to their lavish taxpayer funded pensions, vacation days, and cadillac health care plans.

Signed,

A working class stiff with no pension, paid vacation days, and no health plan who pays for the pensions of "noble" public servants. Now excuse me as I get back to the ignoble work of providing people with food and homes, so fatcat pols can live in luxury.

Those Wisconsin teachers are marching in the streets, to not only keep their pension but get it raised.

Perry is running on a platform of making them part-time.

Is anyone who excepts a social security check, but thinks there shouldn't be social security, a hypocrit? Welfare? Food stamps? Affirmative action?

I say they're doubly principled, because they can honestly advocate for what they believe is in the best interest of the country, even if it's against their direct personal interest.

Everyone takes the check. Everyone takes the check. If you give back money, you're a fucking dumbass.

329

I'm not going to turn down money because I have an ideological disagreement over where it came from. It's money.

Don't be stupid. If you advocate otherwise, you should expect to be in a permanent minority.

But I don't let (or try not to let) the income seduce me into lying to myself about whether or not I should get it.

I will take it either way. But I will be honest, that I probably should not have been given money I didn't deserve. I'll still take though. Mine now. Call it an educators reimbursement for teaching you a lesson.

330

Does your radical solution involve the words "Ron" and "Paul"?

Not necessarily. If he had a shot  at winning, sure. But I will admit, I am a terrifyingly pragmatic radical.

331

Right, so the Republicans are all in on it. 

Not all of them. Just the majority of them who give every indication of being all for it and offering only the thinnest veneer of lip-service to the oppisition. Why that is so often enough, I cannot say.

You know, all the ones that ran out of Congress the day they elected not to obstruct it screaming, in essence: 'We will keep the parts the Welfare Class likes and repeal the parts the 'moderate' dems inserted to keep it from being rediculously unstable and obliterating the entire country's health service industry almost overnight'.

Woohoo!

332 Of course, now I'm running for president on the notion of making government as inconsequential in our lives as possible, which kind of screws with that narrative, but that's why I'm counting on my legions of supporters to make it for me. Of course, what Perry has often said is that he wants to make WASHINGTON as inconsequential to your life as possible. But, of course, you have to twist Perry's stance to attack it, because you have nothing else. Look, Austin is a liberal Mecca, look what happened to Tom Delay. Perry lives with as much scrutiny as any candidate, and probably more, because he is hated by both the Dems and the Establishment. The bad with Perry is out there, and frankly, it isn't so bad.

333

Romney is Squish Republican, end of story.

The specific instance I was recalling when I wrote my last above post, was Mitch McConnell (though he was hardly alone).

He came out saying he wanted to keep the popular pre-existing coverage mandates for the insurance companies, but repeal the unpopular personal mandate to buy insurance.

He is the GOP Senate Leader.

Then I recall the actual title of the post I am making comments on. Mittens saying the same thing, essentially.

Our leadership is Squish, end of story.

The higher up the ranks you go, the more Squish it gets. Many of them have been there for decades.

The Squish position on this is "replace". They mouth repeal, they mean replace. By replace they mean fiddle with the details to suit their own liking. Like maybe it won't cover abortion or something. Or gay people.

That is the Squish-faction Republican plan to deal with Obamacare.

We cannot, must not, put them in charge. Our leadership is saturated with the squish faction. The only slot open and the matter of our debate today, is the POTUS position, who is obviously, high leadership. A sitting President is the de-facto head and face of his party. But if we cannot take that seat, we will have no seat at the table in determining what a GOP majority would do.

If we elect Mitt Romney and expect him to push McConnell, we may as well elect McConnell and expect him to push himself.

Another candidate may not ultimately be successful, either at winning the election or at enacting his agenda, but with Romney, I would know it was all over alot earlier, basically the moment you all nominated him.

Romney is basically the 'let's surrender now and not put up a fight' option. If I'm to die, I intend to die fighting. Not because US-NHS has denied me a kidney transplant or something because I'm a naughty smoker, or maybe because I don't have any 'carbon-years' left in my account. 

334 Shorter Entropy- blah blah blah blah bleh blah

335 A working class stiff with no pension, paid vacation days, and no health plan who pays for the pensions of "noble" public servants. Now excuse me as I get back to the ignoble work of providing people with food and homes, so fatcat pols can live in luxury.

I have to ask: What kind of work do you do and how long have you been with a company that clearly doesn't deserve you?

336 Mitt Romney will do nothing to decelerate our collective Gramscian march to the death camps.  I myself have seen them building the boxcars at an abandoned railyard out by the edge of town.

But they won't catch me, for I am too clever and fleet of foot for them.  While the rest of you are languishing behind the barbed wire of the camps, I'll be doing somersaults in front of your faces and shrieking "SUCKS TO BE YOU!" before I merrily dance away to freedom.

337

Interesting that RAWN PAULTROPY's first choice for president isn't even Ron Paul.

338 Get rid of it all. Once they have their foot in the door, they will slowly expand it until we are completely socialized. Therefore, kill it. Shoot it in the head. Burn the fucker down!

339 I wanted Bachmann and Perry, in that order. I'm disappointed that both have shown temperaments that I don't consider Presidential. I am not super-conservative. For that matter, I'm also an atheist. But I tend to vote for a candidate who is more conservative than I am, personally, because I'm not about finding a candidate who is "like me." I'm actually very Libertarian in my own beliefs. I'd vote for Gary Johnson if he were on the Libertarian ticket largely because I'm in a state so blue, my vote won't matter either way. I never believed Romney was the "most electable." Now that it's down to him and Newt and a dark horse (Palin??) I say he's the most electable for a number of reasons. PLEASE, everyone, after you vomit a little and get the taste out, consider voting for Romney anyway. I don't care if he's a squish or not conservative: consider what's at stake here. Romney will appoint Reaganomics people to economic posts. SCOAMF will appoint more Van Jones and Anita Dunns.

340

dandoz, are you the kind of libertarian who thought Obama would legalize pot?

These 'fiscal conservatives' are not even fiscally conservative. They just call it that when they advocate soft-socialism.

Romney has been very explicit throughout his campaign about preserving the nanny-state benefits and entitlements. He has explicitly promised not to do, and in fact, to obstruct, the kind of reforms I believe are necessary, and short of those reforms, who is Captain while the ship sinks is moot.

341 dandoz... if Mittens is the GOP nominee, I think most morons have said they'd support him over Obammy.  He's just not my ideal GOP nominee that's all....     

342 I want to thank all the pragmatic conservatives who helped get us to the point where Romney is a likely nominee.  Great job, guys and gals!

343 @263 - You might have a point except - Obamacare is very unpopular, as in toxic.  Politicians are mostly politicians and not iron spined highly principled folks.  I do not see with the collapse of Obama's presidency and majorities in both houses that dems are going to stick to Obamacare.

Give it time though and that will change.  It has to be killed as soon as the new pres is in

344

359

 

We'd like to thank the pragmatic RINOs who have attacked the true conservatives in favor of faux conservatives like Perry, McCain, Daniels, Dole and the rest.  So how about a compromise.  We keep the good parts of Mitt and cut up all the rest.

This would equal a horrible Newt. amnesty seeking Perry or a double sized Ron Paul.   Course this would equal 1% of Santorum or Bachman.

 

345 Sounds like a sound and pragmatic approach.


Mark these words.  Super conservatives, social conservatives and Rushbots will doom the Republican Party.


n.b.  Barry Goldwater was pro-choice.

346 This web site is my breathing in, really fantastic pattern and perfect subject matter.

347 Wow this is soo helpful I have been trying to figure this out on my own for a long time now. Hopefully making this change will help encourage discussion on my blog.

348
Mark these words.  Super conservatives, social conservatives and Rushbots will doom the Republican Party.

Good riddance. May it rest in pieces.

349 I donÂ’t usually add my comments, but I will in this case. Nice work. I look forward to reading more.

350 Goldwater was once asked years later what his abortion position had been in 1964, and his answer was, "Well, I didn't have one. It wasn't an issue."

@364

Try again and read the whole book this time. Liar.

351 I was very happy to search out this web-site.I needed to thanks to your time for this excellent read!! I definitely enjoying each little little bit of it and I have you bookmarked to check out new stuff you weblog post.

352 I am going to buy Google so videos of my past me's will go away permanently.

353 Liar is a strong word SS.

Maybe this is made up,,,,  who knows?

"A lot of so-called conservatives today don't know what the word means. They think I've turned liberal because I believe a woman has a right to an abortion. That's a decision that's up to the pregnant woman, not up to the pope or some do-gooders or the religious right. It's not a conservative issue at all."
- Barry Goldwater, 1994 Los Angeles Times interview.

354 Well gee, if "Ben" says incentives=mandates, it must be true. Ben knows all.

355

Wow i really found this to be an interesting read; thanks for sharing

356 371 Well gee, if "Ben" says incentives=mandates, it must be true. Ben knows all.

Posted by: Pete_Bondurant at December 17, 2011 09:57 PM (Q4jrq)

What incentive is there beyond if you have health insurance you don't have to pay that large fine on your taxes for not having it.

357 Yes we will likely have Speaker Boehner and Majority Leader McConnell in 2013.  That doesn't really excite me (although I have a little more confidence in Boehner than in McConnell).  But if you don't believe they are truly willing to repeal ObamaCare when it is clear there is a mandate to do so from the election, what difference does it make who is elected?  Why support any of them?

Posted by: chemjeff at December 17, 2011 04:20 PM (s7mIC)

Because, of course, history has clearly shown us that congress takes on the tough issues without any leadership from the president.  The history of the U.S. is litereally litered with such examples.  Particularly pursuing conservative policies.  And the republican house and senate have been just tremendous in pushing forward conseravtive policies.  Why, that happened under W so it will clearly happen under Romney.

Please.  At least use reason and logic and not wishing and naivete.  It is completely dishonest to claim that congress is going to tackle repeal without leadership from a president.  The only reason you even try such a dishonest argument is that you know I am right that Romney will never, ever, never pursue repeal.  

History is pretty clear that the House and Senate GOP follows a GOP president.  To claim they are going to do something without leadership of the president - particularly something that is going to be as contentious as repeal (and no, polls don't show huge majorities favoring repeal, and by the time the media/democrat machine gets fighting on the issue after the election, I will put any amount of money polls will show it at 50/50 or worse for repeal) is simply not remotely honest or based in any historical evidence whatsoever. 

to claim "it doesn't matter who the president is - the congress is going to do it" just ignores all evidence.  You may as well be arguing that the sky is green and that water is made of cheese. 

358 So yes, Romney is likely a deal-breaker for me.  I only vote GOP b/c it is the more conservative of the two parties - not because I have allegiance to the GOP.  So everyone out there crying about how I JUST HAVE TO vote for the GOP nominee - suck it.

359 McCain was a "maverick", and Mitt's a metamorph.  I sense deja vu' all over again.

360

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