1 There is enough time.

2

I don't mean very good on some Perry Curve but objectively very good

Oh, nice clarification.

Sad that we need it, but here we are.

3 First? First! My first! Suck that BO, ya stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure you!

4 Perry will win a three man race.

5 Can you turn people off when they're not on?

6 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

7

There is always enough time - until the vote at the convention.

8 Saturday's debate might have had the most viewers- it was the first one held on a major broadcast channel-I'm pretty sure ABC has more viewers than the cable news networks. Plus it was one of the first ones that people I know were off work and could watch. I know people that vote in every Republican primary election that haven't watched a debate yet.

9 Maybe if the beat the hell out of each other Perry will rebound.

10 With a pair of soundbites both Newt and Romney managed to demonstrate why neither of them should be the nominee. Kudos, fellas.

11 There's plenty of time for Newt to lose his front-runner status, and now that Mittens has lost some of his formerly-so-stalwart support (didn't I hear at least one poll with him finally below 25% last week?), Perry could, indeed, win this thing.

Which I'll believe when I see- but, I'm still a Perry man.

12 Rick Perry ... dawg!!!! Word!

13

So now we're back to Perry wishcasting?  Or is it that we never left?

14 I really haven't been watching the deabtes, just a little here and there. I just don't care, I'm voting for who ever comes to the stop, and doing my part to see obama go down in fucking flames.

15 Perry is spending alot of time Iowa, on the ground. If does well, while being anti-ethanol ...

16 um...debates. deabtes? wtf is that?

17

i've stopped watching the debates, it's pointless when all of them are moderated by dems/libs/progs/socialists.

 

18

If Newt takes himself out but manages to take Mitt out in the process, then we still can call Newt a hero to the Republican cause.

That's the mystery of Newt...he did what the republican voters wanted him to do and in the process he stepped on the toes of the GOP establishment so now the establishment hates him.

If he takes out Mitt, again he will do what the republican voters want him to, but again, he will step on the toes of the GOP establishment.

Seems to me that Newt will be unstoppable...the voters (by that I mean the majority of the GOP primary voters) want what he stands for and does, while the establishment is against him. 

And Perry cannot get by on his meme the other day explaining away his lack of knowledge of who the Supreme Court members are....dude, I would expect the President and President wannabes to know who they are, heck, my Jr. High kid just last week was tested on naming them all.

19 Newt is the "First Teat Partier"  ... the DNC said so, so it must be true

20 Aaargh!  Nice to see our two front runners doing Axelrod's and the DNC's work for them.  Damn.

21 Well, consider the words of John Drew, a man whom writer Paul Kengor calls “Obama’s Missing Link.” A contemporary of Obama’s at Occidental College three decades ago, Drew says that he himself was a Marxist at the time — and part of Obama’s inner circle. And what does he reveal?

Obama was an “ardent” “Marxist-Leninist” who “was in 100 percent, total agreement with [his] Marxist professors,” said Drew.

In fact, Drew states that while he was a more nuanced Marxist who tried to convince Obama that old-style communist revolution was unrealistic in the West, the future President would have none of it and considered Drew a “reactionary.”

22 In before we hear how Obama beats them both in the latest Disney poll.

23 So who won this? I didn't watch.

24 I'm sick of all the hustling for Mitt Newt Perry  Bachmann Paul bacon on this blog.

25 23 So who won this? I didn't watch.

Barack Hussein Obama.

26 Posted by: Minnie Rodent at December 12, 2011 12:07 PM

...or not ;--)

27 The 2008 guy right until the end, noone attacked and everybody said nice things about because of his low polling numbers........John McCain.

28

how about we have a debate moderated by someone from the Heritage Foundation or the staff of Human Events or even Reason Mag. for christ's sake!

 

29

I want a bumpersticker that says "I'd pick the sea-sick crocodile in 2012" with a Obama/Grinch pic.

/self-denouncement for comparing him to a person of color

30 Perry . . . sadly, no. I had this little dream this morning that Newtie and Mittens hugged each other and said, "Well, that was fun, but the USA is going down the toilet and a Marxist SCOAMF is flushing it. Let's focus on STOPPING HIM."

31 There's enough time for Perry. He's been doing some very solid groundwork in IA. And the pics I'm seeing on Twitter leave people standing in packed rooms to see him. He just needs to lay off the constitutional amendment nonsense. Stat.

As for Mittens, that $10,000 bet comment may have just ended his ride.

32 @28 - Amen, brother.

33 BUDDY ROEMER!

34

Newt is the "First Teat Partier" 

I can't for the life of me figure out if you made that mistake on purpose.

35 Newt's remark about an invented people ... off the hook ...

36 Double Amen to #28.

37

It's sad when Rick Perry is the best choice, but he's certainly looking like it.  Honestly, I think Rick Perry would have a hard time in the next Texas gubernatorial primary.  It's just his competition wouldn't have national name recognition, such as those who didn't have state wide name recognition in the last gubernatorial primary.

Unfortunately, with Rick Perry's flaws, he still looks better than Newt and Romney.  Cain will never come back.  Ron Paul is getting the same lack luster traction he always get.  I'm not sure if any of the other Not Romney's could get a national draw.  Then, I never thought Cain would.

38 He just needs to lay off the constitutional amendment nonsense

I don't even necessarily agree with that.  I like that he's picking some things that he feels strong enough about to say, I'd fight for a constitutional amendment on this.  And he's more-or-less right about all of them.

I think more even than in legislation, the People realize that a Presidential Candidate talking about constitutional amendments is saying "In a perfect world I would..." and therefore can say, "This guy believes the way I do about..." without having the resulting disappointment when it doesn't happen (provided he actually tries to make good on the promise).

39 28

how about we have a debate moderated by someone from the Heritage Foundation or the staff of Human Events or even Reason Mag. for christ's sake!

 

Posted by: shoey at December 12, 2011 12:08 PM (jdOk/)

Nope. Next one will be moderated by the editorial board from Mother Jones: "So tell us, Mr. Gingrich, why do you want to feed the poor to ravenous alligators?"

40 Eh I don't think the thing hurting Perry's chances at this point is time. His problem is that he was evaluated and failed terribly to live up to expectations. His entrance was so disappointing that he'd have to really do something astounding to get people to reevaluate. So Newt and Mitten's lame attacks on each other aren't going to drive people back. We already know they are both not ideal.

41 This won't hurt Newt a bit. It's not as visceral as flubbing answers or insulting your base.

This inept use of populism is daft for the reasons DrewM. lists but I'm at a loss as to why one of the other candidates hasn't gone full blown Teddy Roosevelt. It's a target rich atmosphere; Corzine, Blago, Freddie Mac / Fannie Mae, etc. There's a lot of milage to be made with the base and angry independents by going after TBTF. The first candidate to stand up and shout "TARP was a gigantic clusterfark and people need to go to jail!" would lock in the nomination overnight.

42 In a two-person whack-a-mole contest, it's those doing the spectating who will win. however, for this case, I have to defer to a former colleague who, years and years ago, who insisted the game was called "whack-a-weasel".

43 Oh and Perry lucked out to have a "good" night on Sat (conversely disastrous for Mittens). It was the highest watched debate pulling in 7.57 million viewers.

44 Cain will never come back.  Ron Paul is getting the same lack luster traction he always get.

Cain never should have been there in the first place.  Objectively he was weak on just about everything except populism.

Ron Paul is crazy, and shouldn't be elected dog-catcher, let alone President of the United States.

45 how about we have a debate moderated by someone from the Heritage Foundation or the staff of Human Events or even Reason Mag. for christ's sake!

Because everybody would back out except Newt.
Then they would all call Newt arrogant and professorial.
Which would also be correct.

46 Bain's executives had a duty to make money, indeed.  It wasn't even an option.

So they laid off workers and I am sure did many other creative things to get profit coming in, and frankly, this is good.  One thing Bain also did was outsource to China.  They call themselves a 'pioneer' for doing this, and I'm sure that is quite profitable.  Take manufacturing that used to be American, in thirty industries, and move that to China.  It's cheaper.  The product is generally crap, but it's cheaper.  And Bain's execs had a duty to do make money, so they did.  They had no duty to this nation's long term prosperity.  There is no patriotic duty... just a fiduciary duty, and that's what Romney represents with his Bain record.

That's America's fault... we want cheap cheap crap, so we are telling CEO  with our purchases that they should do anything to bring costs down.

Anyway, it is wrong to hold this against Romney, yet I also do not give him much credit for this success, as it's not really so brilliant or awesome.  It's not the kind of miraculous leadership the huge profits suggest Romney had.  He simply fired American workers and hired Chinese ones.  Of course over time that saved a ton of money.  Big whoop.

47 BUDDY ROEMER!

Don't take my shtick, man

48 And now's the time for T-Paw to come riding in like the cavalry at the end of an old western.

49

It's my time to shine!

Ever notice that the burning twin towers look an awful lot like a menorah?

50 The whole GOP field leaves me depressed.  I think our best hope for 2012 is Rogue Asteroid.

51 His entrance was so disappointing that he'd have to really do something astounding to get people to reevaluate.

Yeah, like show up in Iowa.  If he does well in the caucuses (say, 2nd or 3rd), and then again in NH (again: say 2nd or 3rd) I think things will pick up for him in SC and FL.  Then he'll start gaining some traction again.

If, as some are saying he is, he's doing well on the ground in IA, I wouldn't completely discount that scenario.

52 If Rick Perry can manage third place in Iowa, that could give him some momentum. Based on introspection as someone who is on the evangelical fringe, I think some evangelicals in Iowa will flow away from Newt if they see Perry as credible, so every percentage point that Perry gains in pre-caucus polls should have at least a small feedback effect that benefits him. You know, it may be neither here nor there, but Rick Santorum also had an objectively good debate. That can't help Perry, though it might not hurt him much.

53 Maybe if we actually voted for who we want instead of believing what the polls tell us, we could have the best candidate. Tell me again why we are going with the worst of two when the better, third option is still there?

54 50 The whole GOP field leaves me depressed.  I think our best hope for 2012 is Rogue Asteroid.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at December 12, 2011 12:16 PM (i0App)

Hey, don't count us out!

55

>>>>I want a bumpersticker that says "I'd pick the sea-sick crocodile in 2012" with a Obama/Grinch pic.<<<<

 

I would SOOO buy one of those....

56 And I do very much hope Perry pulls a rabbit out of a hat by winning this thing.  He's much better than the alternatives.

57

Nope. Next one will be moderated by the editorial board from Mother Jones: "So tell us, Mr. Gingrich, why do you want to feed the poor to ravenous alligators?"

Posted by: joncelli, too stressed by half at December 12, 2011 12:13 PM (RD7QR)

 

 

exactly!

58 @39  "So tell us, Mr. Gingrich, why do you want to feed the poor to ravenous alligators?"

"Because they're a good source of protein."

59 39 Nope. Next one will be moderated by the editorial board from Mother Jones: "So tell us, Mr. Gingrich, why do you want to feed the poor to ravenous alligators?"
Posted by: joncelli, too stressed by half at December 12, 2011 12:13 PM (RD7QR)

"Because you are heartless and hate Gaia if you would let ravenous alligators starve."

60 And now's the time for T-Paw to come riding in like the cavalry at the end of an old western. Posted by: joncelli,

You mean while waving Romney's flag, right?

61 Hey, don't count us out! Posted by: The Mayans at December 12, 2011 12:17 PM (RD7QR) Count you out? Hell I'm betting the house on you

62 Let's get this straight.  Fannie Mae paid me $1.8 million because I knew a lot about history, and they got their money's worth.  Period!

63 So it's down to scum or slime then?

64 Perry will win a three man race.

Possibly, but will he remember who the 3rd person is in that race?

65 That picture of Kevin James in a judge's robe and makeup is back on Drudge...

66 I'm fine with Constitutional Amendments, but I'm not so cool with codifying social conservative stances in the US Constitution.  For instance the FMA, marriage has a long history as a religious sacrament.  We don't need the law of the land to define marriage, we need the law of the land to stay out of religion.  If we need an amendment, then it needs to define rights that can be shared between two or more people.  This could be useful to families and businesses arrangements regardless of sexuality.

67 Speaking of Perry, I keep seeing snippets here and there about some TV ad of his that's getting people's panties in a twist.  Has it been mentioned here yet and I missed the discussion?

68

Good fucking lord, Mitt vs Newt?

 

How the fuck did this happen???

69 39 An alligator gots to eat.

70 Romney's problem it that he is selling himself as an even tempered manager in a time of political warfare. Many folks would prefer a fighter. As the saying goes, "When they get in trouble they send for the sons-of-bitches”.

71 So now we're back to Perry wishcasting?  Or is it that we never left?

Never left, it seems. For some reason, people desperately holding onto Palin is bad; while people desperately holding onto Perry is good. I'm still trying to figure that one out.

72 It is on like muthafuckin' Donkey Kong!

Andrew Breitbart: Glenn Beck is a ‘coward’ and a ‘snake’

73 For some reason, people desperately holding onto Palin is bad; while people desperately holding onto Perry is good. Because Perry is actually still in the race, and not a single vote has been cast. Palin supporters, meanwhile, kept up the fantasy that she was running even after it was apparent she wasn't and even after she said she wasn't. It's not the same thing.

74 48And now's the time for T-Paw to come riding in like the cavalry at the end of an old western.

Posted by: joncelli, too stressed by half at December 12, 2011 12:15 PM (RD7QR)

 

i laughed so hard I almost had a heart attack :-o

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

75 Governor Goodhair is done.

76

There is still time for Perry to rebound.

Fuck all these states that have these early fuckin primaries. ....Fuck them for trying to pick our candidates ahead of the rest of us.

77 Ron Paul is getting the same lack luster traction he always get. That's because Ron Paul is a douche that blames the U.S. for 9/11, and said that President Bush was happy for the attacks because they now had a reason to invade Iraq.

78 For some reason, people desperately holding onto Palin is bad; while people desperately holding onto Perry is good. That's because Perry is a far better candidate than Palin ever was...

79 I'm still trying to figure that one out.

Two differences (about the general populations of those groups- I'm not addressing specifics, here).

1) No one is claiming to "know what Perry is going to do."  He's an actually announced candidate for office, and is doing things toward that end (with varying degrees of success).  We're not saying, "political ju-juitsu" or such things.

2) No one is claiming that Perry "WILL WIN," we're admitting he's a flawed (perhaps fatally so, at this point) candidate, and simply stating our preference.

In contrast, the Palinistas:

1) Claimed to KNOW that she was going to run, and all those moves that shouted "I'm not running" were just super-smart, non-traditional campaign moves.

2) Claimed that, despite repeated evidence to the contrary, Palin was much more popular with voters than she was.  Especially by the end.

80 39 Nope. Next one will be moderated by the editorial board from Mother Jones: "So tell us, Mr. Gingrich, why do you want to feed the poor to ravenous alligators?"
Posted by: joncelli, too stressed by half at December 12, 2011 12:13 PM (RD7QR)

"When will you cease with your constant hatred of ravenous Gators like Tim Tebow? Have you no shame, sir or madam? Have you no decency?"

81 Never left, it seems. For some reason, people desperately holding onto Palin is bad; while people desperately holding onto Perry is good. I'm still trying to figure that one out.

Consider the possibility that since there hasn't yet been a single official vote cast in any caucus or primary, writing someone off at this stage (that hasn't dropped out on their own) is completely premature and more than a little impatient.

Plus, Palin was never a candidate.  People seriously wishing that she would jump in at this point are engaging in wishcasting a full order of magnitude greater than those wanting Perry to stay in it and try to rebuild.

82 Perry will win a three man race.

Ha ha ha. HA HA HA!

ummm

No.

Without a majority going to convention. You will have two voting rounds at convention, there will be big press about the deadlock, the delegates will get released and be free to vote for whom they want, then the establishment will pick who they want. That = Romney.

83 ExceptRomney gets kind of weird when he is pressed-no? the Ted Kennedy remark had him super defensive-and then there is that chuckle he does-it's worked in the past-but in the last debate it seemed pretty forced. Romney could potentially be great against Obama if he could admit he was - wrong. RomneyCare has swamped Massachusetts in debt. He could jiujitsu Obama with that. He refuses to. Just like he refused to admit that he admired or learned anything from any of the other candidates in response to one of the last questions-another weird moment where he seems like Obama- arrogant. Could have been one of Romney's weakest moments during that debate-actually.

84 Good fucking lord, Mitt vs Newt? How the fuck did this happen??? ---- WE let it happen. We wasted our time wishing for Palin to run and letting her string us along. Then we went with a whole bunch of horrible candidates like Bachmann and Cain, and now we are wasting time with a progressive Republican like Newt.

85 That's because Perry is a far better candidate than Palin ever was...

Since he is an actual candidate, yeah, I guess that's true.

86 Over on NRO, Mona Charen sums up my reasons for not backing Newt..." The trouble is that Newt Gingrich is convinced that he can apply smart management techniques to government instead of business, and voila, Leviathan will work beautifully. "

I'm sorry, I just cannot pull the lever for someone who thinks government is the answer, as long as he is in charge.  The amnesty/local panel fiasco was the reminder I needed, as I was starting to warm back up to him. 

The same can be said of Mittsy and there is no way I vote for him. 

So, I need Perry to surge back, or I'm writing in EWOK on my general ballot. 


There will be blood. 

87 OT: For those interested (and if you're interested, why aren't you subscribed to it?) I have a new post up on my blog.

88 "When will you cease with your constant hatred of ravenous Gators like Tim Tebow? Have you no shame, sir or madam? Have you no decency?"

I'm drinking coffee, I have a wireless keyboard, and those things are expensive.
Stop that!

89 Never left, it seems. For some reason, people desperately holding onto Palin is bad; while people desperately holding onto Perry is good

People aren't being desperate. They can acknowledge his obvious flaws. Her most rabid supporters in the minority could never do that. Perry people will move over w/out a collective meltdown and start running ads begging him to stay in even if the handwriting's on the wall....unlike some.

90
I have a bad feeling about this.

91 Tell me again why we are going with the worst of two when the better, third option is still there? Because for reasons that are lost in the mists of time, we let a gaggle of retards in Iowa physically shuffle around in a high school gym - "Oookay! Eeeverybooody who wants Noooot staand over there!" like they're playing fucking Red Rover. Then they eat cotton candy and jump in bouncy castles. And then we go to New Hampshire where a bunch of liberal fuckpots bearing no resemblance to the majority of the GOP do their damndest to pick the most Democrat-like candidate. And that, little Jimmy, is how the Republican party selects our nominee to the most powerful office on the planet.

92 And, Romney really is not good going on the offensive-that was another thing that the last debate exposed. And, Romney will have to go on the offensive if he wins the nomination.

93 In a minute there is time for decisions and revisions which a minute will reverse.

(Yes, there's enough time: On December 12, 2007, Giuliani led with 23.6, but his lead over a surging Huckabee at 19.4 was dwindling. Romney had 13.7, Thompson had begun to fade at 11.6, and eventual winner McCain was in fifth place at 11.3.)

94 I brought this up last night: what made Newt do that "we can solve it" commercial with Pelosi? What parts of the Green movement does Newt support? www.wecansolveit.org does not exist, specifically, but put that address in your browser and see what you find. Those commercials with Pelosi were sponsored by Al Gore. Yes, Newt said he regrets appearing in those spots, by why? Did he change his mind on substance or did he change his mind on the method?

95 I could give a damn about debate performances moderated by the enemy.  The debates serve two purposes:

- They allow undecided Americans who haven't sat down and figured out where each candidate stands on the issues audition the candidates, using personality and veneer as the deciding factor; and
- They serve to provide "gotcha" moments that the enemy can use in the general.

I'm with Perry until Perry says he's out.

96 I think hoping for a slow burn Perry comeback is counterproductive and would benefit mittens. I'm saying he needs something astounding to happen, and soon. If it doesn't happen soon Perry diehards should think about cutting bait

97 58 @39  "So tell us, Mr. Gingrich, why do you want to feed the poor to ravenous alligators?"

"Because they're a good source of protein."

"And because they are good with ketchup". 

98 obama with maliki throwing away all we sacraficed in Iraq. No bases, No influence, No oil, No nothing.

99 Had some gay friends on facebook very angry about a Perry add.   Checked here, hotair, and NRO but story not covered... still waiting for conservatives to break it down.  I had hoped to find a good fair discussion off it that I could post as rebuttal to the far leftists ranting rag they were on about.

I get why Ace wouldn't cover it he is still holding an ember for Perry but assumed Allahpundit would have by now.

100

Still stuck on Perry, wow.  Gingrich sucks.  Romney sucks.  And Perry sucks even more.  Any candidate that has to spend all his time making excuses for his past, either personal, professional, or political, is a bad candidate, period.

Perry would be making excuses right now too if he weren't such an idiot, he can't even get that far.

When Obama is re-elected for another 4 asshats like you will be to blame.

101 Oooh looky it's Andrew the Ron Paulian!

102 I brought this up last night: what made Newt do that "we can solve it" commercial with Pelosi? What parts of the Green movement does Newt support? www.wecansolveit.org does not exist, specifically, but put that address in your browser and see what you find.
Those commercials with Pelosi were sponsored by Al Gore. Yes, Newt said he regrets appearing in those spots, by why? Did he change his mind on substance or did he change his mind on the method?

I've always had the impression Newt wanted in on the issue to put some sand in the gears.
Without some sort of inside opposing (or even questioning) view, that freightliner won't turn.

103 When Obama is re-elected for another 4 asshats like you will be to blame.

Okay, the rag is lit, let's see if he'll throw the bottle...

Who's your candidate?

104 Oh and gay patriot was the other conservative site I checked but no coverage...not sure what to think...they usually cover such things with any substance.

105 Remember the Alamo Rick.
Fight to the bitter end.

106 49% of GOP voters think Gingrich is strongest candidate to go up against Obama to 24% who say Romney. wasn't Mitten's whole argument "i've got the best shot at beating Obama."? looks like that went to shit.

107 Posted by: Andrew at December 12, 2011 12:32 PM (WSj9U)

Who is your candidate of choice, then?  I'm betting Mittens.

108 94 Because for reasons that are lost in the mists of time, we let a gaggle of retards in Iowa physically shuffle around in a high school gym - "Oookay! Eeeverybooody who wants Noooot staand over there!" like they're playing fucking Red Rover. Then they eat cotton candy and jump in bouncy castles.
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at December 12, 2011 12:30 PM (vzFJV)

De-howdy, de-howdy, de-howdy, EoJ. Wouldja mind if we settled matters by playing a round of winner-take-all dodgeball instead?

109 Remember the Alamo Rick.
Fight to the bitter end.

I'd rather he recreate San Jacinto.  That's just a personal preference.

110 When Obama is re-elected for another 4 asshats like you will be to blame. So who are you for, dear Andrew? Are you still holding out for the super awesome conservative pony to show up, or are you just going to pout about all the candidates sucking without, you know, manning up and actually supporting someone in particular?

111 68 Good fucking lord, Mitt vs Newt?

How the fuck did this happen???

Newt was judged to be the best Not Romney, even though he is similar to Mitt in some ways. But people forget the similarities because Newt is eloquent and tells them what they want to hear.

112
...and the giant Mittromney will come into your homes at night and eat your pets and spill coffee on your carpets.

113

Ever notice that the burning twin towers look an awful lot like a menorah?

That is so fucked-up. I heartily approve.

114 We are letting the MSM pick our candidate. The same MSM that we laugh at for their obvious liberalism is smarter than us. We have the mind of a bunch of guppies. We will go from one shiny object that they dangle in front of us to the next. The fact that Herman Cain was ever a "serious" candidate boggles the mind. Thank God for his scandals. I have a feeling that even though he was showing signs of not knowing what the fuck he was talking about, if there were no scandal, he'd still be frontrunner. What does this say about us? What does this say about our determination to repeal Obamacare when we have the choice of Mitt or Newt? How are we going to save this country when we willingly go along with our (apparent) betters in the MSM?

115

Here's why The Newt can't win:  ....Calista Gingrich.

You think that a majority of conservative women are going to vote to have her as our First Lady? .....She fucked around with her married boss!

This is not being brought out now, by the media.....because they are saving it for the general. ....Then they will bring out the "Calista the Homewrecker" meme and pound it on us every damn day.

I want to beat Obama. ....And Newt cannot do that.

Newt wouldn't even be able to have a decent woman for his VP pick. ....What decent, credentialed woman would want to attach herself to the Cheater/Homewrecker ticket? .....So we wouldn't even have that going for us like we did with the McCain/Palin ticket in 2008.

 

116 I've consulted with former Enron consultant and Nobel Prize for Economics winner, Paul Krugman, to see how he managed to argue away any damage from his former employer who went “financially unstable,” Enron.  He tells me that I should say that they were handing out money and I would be a fool to turn it down.  Hey, who wants a fool for a President ?

117 Both political parties are working against the general welfare of the nation. We should remove the consent of the governed and work to bring the beast down.

118 Shiggz, Gabe already covered it last week in a morning thread.

119
The evil Mittromney monster will drink all your milk and return the empty carton to your fridge.

What a bastard.

120 Regardless of who becomes the Republican nominee, if they cannot win in the face of all the self-made campaign ads that Barrack himself provides, then perhaps we deserve all the hell in store for us as a nation if Obama is reelected.

Obama:  "The true engine of economic growth will always be companies like Solyndra". 

121 I've always had the impression Newt wanted in on the issue to put some sand in the gears. Without some sort of inside opposing (or even questioning) view, that freightliner won't turn. What gives you that impression?

122
Mittromney is not only just like Obama, but Mittromney won't wipe his feet before walking into your house!

123

it's Newt or Romney

Perry is no longer top-tier, he's 4th behind Ron Paul w/ 6%-8% average in National Polling depending on the day. The comeback is not gonna happen. Everyone here can live in delusion until he drops out, the amount of hope i've seen that he's gonna surge is incredible and flies in the face of reality. I like Perry, I donated money to him, but he's not gonna be the nominee.

So it's down to the Speaker who drove Clinton to the right or the Romneycare guy. The guy who gets in a tiffy in an interview w/ Bret Beir or the guy not afraid to fight Obama. The guy who has both establishments from the left and right against him or the guy who has the right telling us to sit down, shut up, and take the Romney nomination. The guy who owes up to mistakes or the guy who keeps telling us Romneycare was awesome.

I pick Newt, join me when you guys are done wishcasting w/ Perry.

124 asshats like you will be to blame

Let's put blame where blame is due. Not one of these candidates is very good. That's not our fault. That is the Republican party establishment. And to our credit we have done our level best to kick them in the nads over the last three years to the point of losing very winnable races in an effort to get them to provide better candidates. They don't get the picture. So unless you think throwing  the election over a Whig-Republican third party war is the way to go, or you support one of these jokers and hope for the best; it ends with another 4 years of Obama not because of us, this time, but because we can't give the Republican party the real shakedown it needs without tossing the election.

125 Shoot, Drew, Newt is allowed to defend himself, right?

126 No "Andrew" is the "Spec-War Vet" that is for- Ron Paul!

127 @eoj thanks, must of missed it somehow.

128 What gives you that impression?

What he said at the time was that he wanted Conservatives to have a seat at the table.  He believed the discussion was going to be had (by which he meant an "AGW Exists, what do we do about it?" discussion), and that Conservatives needed to be there to mitigate the damage.

Given his premise, I have to agree.  And, at the time, a lot of people believed in it (more the fools they).  However, I rejected that premise even then.

Oh, and he's said fairly recently that he still believes in AGW.  He's just not sure of "the extent."

129
follow me on blabber

130 What gives you that impression?

I agree with all the folks that he's a sneaky bastard.
He'd have thrown some "yabbuts" in to the inside game, and made a ton of money doing it.  Hell, that's his current stance.

131

How the fuck did this happen???

Posted by: Truman North at December 12, 2011 12:21 PM (I2LwF

The same reason we got Sharron Angle and The Witch. That's how.

132 The guy who owes up to mistakes Depends. Did he explain why it was a mistake to appear with Pelosi? Did he explain any of his mistakes? It sounds to me like he's an opportunist and a bandwagon-jumper. Kinda like most conservatives, it seems.

133

If Newt beats on Romney and Romney beats on Newt, and the Yen does this and the dollar does that, maybe, just maybe, the person whose only talent is getting elected in Texas could come back strong.

It wouldnÂ’t be so ironic if the same people saying this hadnÂ’t spent months telling everyone that the possibility of the public suddenly waking up with a whole new perception of a candidate is “wishcasting”. 

NewtÂ’s riding high right now, but heÂ’ll kill the buzz in short order by saying something that wonÂ’t sit well with most of the base.  RomneyÂ’s supporters are solid but not enough to lock up the nomination.  The others will continue on because theyÂ’ve seen how quickly things can change and theyÂ’re willing to do it on a shoestring.

Brokered convention – catch the fever.

134 @97

Yeah, it almost looks like Gingrich was trying to "Grow Out of Office" so to speak. He always has reminded me of Mr. J. Thaddeus Toad of Toad Hall, full of wild enthusiasm for the latest new toy or fad, and running into a ditch in its pursuit.  If this enviro nonsense had occurred twenty or more years ago, I would just put it down to youthful (or middle-aged) exuberance.  But it was only a few years ago.

And the other guy is no exemplar of constancy or consistency, either.

Once again, it's going to be "Hold Your Nose and Vote Against Obama",  I'm afraid.

135 Brokered convention – catch the fever.

I ride again. 

136 If it doesn't happen soon Perry diehards should think about cutting bait

Why?  It's my vote and my money.  I'm a SuperTuesday voter so unless Rick pulls a Fred and drops out right before his most fertile territory, I'm going all the way with the guy I think would make the better President.

ABO in the end though.  Embrace the Suck.

137 About the media telling us what to do.  FTR I was backing Mitch Daniels for about 18months then never backed anyone else, but was fine with Perry and had no animosity for Bachmann and Cain.. I didn't jump in for Newt until it was down to him and Romney.

But yea I do get your point about media hypes up one candidate and conservatives follow... one after another.  I have faults times many... herd animal I aint.

Now if you will all excuse me I want to get back to watching Azumi.

138

I pick Newt, join me when you guys are done wishcasting w/ Perry.

Posted by: AuthorLMendez Is On The Newt Train Whether Beck Likes It Or Not at December 12, 2011 12:39 PM (3XDPM)

I will, if it shakes out that way.  In the meantime,  I just prefer not to base my decisions on "consensus" and "electability", but rather on record and character. 

There's no legitimate reason for me, or any other Perry supporter, to jump ship until he hangs it up.  The only reason I can think of is that everyone who already made the decision to get on a bandwagon needs everyone else to do it too in order to feel validated.

I'm done with bandwagon politics.  This sort of bullshit has really damaged our nation and party.

So, not going to happen. Everyone who is impatient needs to get a grip and let the process work.

139 The same reason we got Sharron Angle and The Witch. That's how.


Effin Primaries!!  How do they work?!?

140 Once again, it's going to be "Hold Your Nose and Vote Against Obama", I'm afraid. Why? Why are we letting the MSM do this? If you have personal doubts about Perry or think his debate flubs will affect the way he governs, I can respect that. But if the reason you're supporting Mitt or Newt is because they are polling better, I question your ability to think for yourself.

141 wheatie Technical foul-five yard penalty-he didn't have the guts to boff his own aides- He boffed the aides from Oklahoma....

142 Still pining for Perry, eh? Yeah ... whatever. Ain't gonna happen, and by all measures, we lose independents if we nominate him, or Bachmann, or Santorum, or ... Yeah, we need independents. They don't dislike Mitt. They don't seem to dislike Newt. Cain imploded. Sarah never got in. She saw the train wreck and stayed out to her credit. The Donald is being an ass. I don't like Mitt, and I like Newt's fearlessness and intelligence. But he needs to tamp down on the back and forth to keep him likable and electable. Perry and the rest of the dwarves are simply not acceptable to the bulk of the people whom decide. So nominate him if you wish, and thats whom I'll vote for if you do. But don't fucking come crying to me or the rest of us when BHO starts dancing at his second inaugural. The only mission we should have is to front someone to hand BHO his walking papers. That is our only mission. And that means you gotta make some sacrifices. I've made mine, my candidate 1st and 2nd choice are out. 3rd choice kinda sucks, and I want to see if I can replace him with Newt. If Newt is electable, we should back him. There's a collection of candidates whom aren't electable, and the crap they bring up, and the attacks they launch to get attention are only helping the enemy. Do you really want to be enabling this? Pawlenty did the right thing. Lets see whom else has the balls to do this. Most of them don't.

143

Andrew Breitbart: Glenn Beck is a ‘coward’ and a ‘snake’

I have a number of issues with Beck, but Breitbart represents everything wrong with modern-day conservatism.  The guy has no morals whatsoever.  He's a kind of political version of Howard Stern.   

 

144 AuthorLMendez: Do you really think Perry's debate performance will affect his administration?

145

@ 143 I'm done with bandwagon politics.

No you're not.  You're just on Perry's bandwagon instead of somebody else's.

146 Well wait a minute... He coulda boffed his own aides but Callista worked for an Oklahoma Congressman.

147

>>>>Speaking of Perry, I keep seeing snippets here and there about some TV ad of his that's getting people's panties in a twist. Has it been mentioned here yet and I missed the discussion?<<<<

 

Yeah - he mentions gay people and Christmas in the same commercial, and the drama queen arm of the Gay Liberation Army is up in arms about it.

DD#2 - who is gay, but fairly conservative in most ways - sent me a link to that over the weekend, asking me how I could POSSIBLY support a candidate with that viewpoint.

After watching the ad, I wrote her back and asked her to watch THE WHOLE THING and analyze what it was SAYING (basically that members of a minority group have more rights than members of a majority group, rather than them all having EQUAL rights).

I still don't think she quite got what I was trying to say - she's only 20, and still learning - but at least it made her think..... 

148

141....I'm a SuperTuesday voter so unless Rick pulls a Fred and drops out right before his most fertile territory, I'm going all the way with the guy I think would make the better President.

Me too, toby.  .....Steady as we go, fellow diehards.

149 Btw, our illustrious President is having a joint press conference with Iraqi PM Maliki.

Here is some of the wit our intelligent and "Spock-like" CinC:   Obama says he and Maliki agree there is a problem in that Syrians are being 'killed' - 'even though there are tactical disagreements'.

Oh that's right, we can't interfere in Syria as we did Libya - there would actually be a foreign-policy benefit for the US in helping overthrow Assad. 

150 HOLD   FAST

151 He's a kind of political version of Howard Stern.   

 

Posted by: Andrew at December 12, 2011 12:46 PM (WSj9U)

I agree. Fuck Brietbart with Ann Coulter's cement dildo.

152 The only mission we should have is to front someone to hand BHO his walking papers. That is our only mission. Horseshit. Our "job" is to elect someone that is capable of being the best President. We need someone that is conservative. We need someone that is smart enough to not support a mandate. We need someone that has a proven record of job growth.

153 Perry people should be begging the Bachmann/Santorum people to get them out of the race.  At that point we will know if Perry still has legs.  That three way social con vote split... = definitely all 3 lose. 

Amazed at how many ways this race looks like 08.

154 I have a number of issues with Beck, but Breitbart represents everything wrong with modern-day conservatism.  The guy has no morals whatsoever.  He's a kind of political version of Howard Stern.      Posted by: Andrew at December 12, 2011 12:46 PM (WSj9U) Yeah. Next he'll be trying to tell us that he is a "specwar vet" and that the entire military is backing Ron Paul. What an asshole, huh?

155 AuthorLMendez: Do you really think Perry's debate performance will affect his administration?

Posted by: Joffen at December 12, 2011 12:47 PM (zLeKL)

I think it has effected why he's at where he is in polling, no nomination, no general election win, no administration

 

I have a number of issues with Beck, but Breitbart represents everything wrong with modern-day conservatism. The guy has no morals whatsoever. He's a kind of political version of Howard Stern.

 Posted by: Andrew at December 12, 2011 12:46 PM (WSj9U)

no, it's about time someone called Beck out

156 Who is your candidate of choice, then?  I'm betting Mittens.

Nah, it's obviously a paul-bot.

157 I pick Newt, join me when you guys are done wishcasting w/ Perry.


You can pick Newt all you want.
He sucks. Much the way Romney sucks.
The only reason I favor him over Romney is because the establishment pick is Romney, and I hate them with a white hot burning hate of a thousand suns and don't want to see them get something they want.

I would still rather Perry get the nom over Newt.

158

@ 157 We need someone that has a proven record of job growth.

Would that be job growth for illegal aliens or for American citizens?

159 153 141....I'm a SuperTuesday voter so unless Rick pulls a Fred and drops out right before his most fertile territory, I'm going all the way with the guy I think would make the better President.

Me too, toby.  .....Steady as we go, fellow diehards.

Same here.

160

@ 143 I'm done with bandwagon politics.

No you're not. You're just on Perry's bandwagon instead of somebody else's.

Posted by: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus at December 12, 2011 12:47 PM (+inic)

better reply then I could have done

161

"Had some gay friends on facebook very angry about a Perry add."

Give them some white whine and put them to bed.

162 @145 - My point was just the opposite.  I can't really get worked up about either Mitt or Newt, poll numbers be damned.  And I'm lukewarm about Perry.  I do like Bachmann, but she needs more seasoning; I 'd like to see her in a governorship or something of that nature first. Same with the rest of the field --Not quite ready for prime time. (Except Ron Paul, who is hovering out there in the Mother Ship and is ready to govern Zeta Reticuli.)

And my point was, I will vote for whoever pulls it out of this mess.  Just don't demand I be madly in love with whoever our candidate will be.

163

146 wheatie

Technical foul-five yard penalty-he didn't have the guts to boff his own aides-

He boffed the aides from Oklahoma....

Really? ....Back when that was all happening, Calista was referred to as "his aide". So that is what I was going by.

Doesn't matter though. The fact remains that Calista fucked around with a married man. ....So that will still get her labeled as a 'homewrecker' by the liberal media who usually don't give a shit about such things, but that won't stop them from pounding us with it.

Suppressing the conservative vote is the best strategy that the Dems have. ....And they will go into overdrive with it.

164 I think it has effected why he's at where he is in polling, no nomination, no general election win, no administration That's not answering my question. You're just stating the obvious. Of course it affected his polling. My question is why do you think Newt would make a better President than Perry?

165 and by all measures, we lose independents if we nominate him, or Bachmann, or Santorum, or ... Yeah, we need independents.

I'm so freaking tired of this "argument" (to give it such a lofty title is to denigrate true arguments).  There is simply no way to know what will happen with "independents" until an election begins.  Those independents aren't paying attention yet, so even asking their opinion at the moment is pointless.

Here's the problem as I see it:

The Republican party drifted too far to the Left.  And we (well, people older than me, mostly, but I've been around long enough now that I have to own some of it, too) let it happen.  It kind of culminated in 2006 and 2008 with the Democrat resurgence and the election of Barack Obama (who is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure). 

At that point, we had roughly three options: give up, "retake" the party, or form a new party which would actually be conservative.  Give up really isn't in my nature, so let's take that one off the table.  Of the two remaining, the one that seemed to make the most sense (and still does, really) is to attempt to retake, or reform, the Republican party.  The Tea Parties started doing that.  That culminated in the 2010 "Red Wave" or whatever we're calling it.

However, time marches on, and such changes are slow.  Right now we're having what you might call withdrawal symptoms.  Republicans had become just as addicted to privilege as Democrats, they only wished to drape it in a Conservative veneer.

Now we're staring an election in the face, and we have what appear to be two options: select another RINO (of some degree) who "can win" and give back most or all of what we "won" in the 2010 election season (as far as gains within the party), or select an actual Conservative who may not win and (in that case) see possibly give BHO 4 more years.

I honestly don't know which would be worse.  Newt believes that Government is the answer- that's as bad as Obama, even if he believes more in the "free" market (free as long as they do as they're told, right?), than Obama.  Mittens still stands by "I like mandates.  Mandates work."  I do not believe either Newt or Mittens will do anything more than "manage the decline."  On the other hand, Perry seems to be a no-go (I'm still a Perry guy until he drops out, or my vote for someone else is required to stave off Mitt Romney), and "conventional wisdom" says we should write him off.

166 Would that be job growth for illegal aliens or for American citizens? Well obviously Mitt has a great record of providing jobs for illegal aliens, that is until he fired them because he was running for office.

167 We need someone that has a proven record of job growth.

Sure. But there is a limit to the number of imported landscapers and restaurant staff the national economy can support.

168 "Without a majority going to convention. You will have two voting rounds at convention, there will be big press about the deadlock, the delegates will get released and be free to vote for whom they want, then the establishment will pick who they want. That = Romney." Sounds like a real possibility.

169 Our "job" is to elect someone that is capable of being the best President. We need someone that is conservative. We need someone that is smart enough to not support a mandate. We need someone that has a proven record of job growth. So after you are done pontificating over the importance of this one particular battle, are you willing enough to lose the war in order to win this battle? Talk about horseshit ... "we want ... we want ..." Yeah. You can't have what you want. You have a limited range of choices, and most of them are bad. Some are completely unrealistic choices. Lets see what you do.

170 On the bright side I do think Perry will do the honorable thing and bow out early if it isn't working. Say by SC/FLA. That will free up his diehards to hopefully stop the Mittens Menace. It would be nice if Bachman and Santorum did the same, but i get the feeling they will both pull a Ron Paul and stay in to the bitter end.

171

My question is why do you think Newt would make a better President than Perry?

Im not sure who would make a better Prez, probably Perry but again if you cant win the nomination or the general the question is mute. Perry is polling behind Ron freaking Paul, he's polling worse against Obama then Newt. Newt can win and Perry cant. If you wanna live in a fantasy world that who can win doesn't matter, then that's okay. But im living in reality. I dont want Romney and Newt is the only guy left who I think can beat Obama that isn't Romney. Meanwhile, Perry cant remember blog names, what dept he wants out, calls voters heartless, thinks you still have to wait to be 21 to vote, and cant figure out a Supreme Court Justice's name or how many there are in the Court. Yep, he'll beat Obama/s, give me a break.

I wish record mattered too, but that's not the world we live in.

172

No you're not.  You're just on Perry's bandwagon instead of somebody else's.

Posted by: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus at December 12, 2011 12:47 PM (+inic)

Choosing a candidate is not the same as bandwagoning.

Unlike others I could name, I've at least stuck with Perry since he got in, based on his record.  Others apparently place the greatest priority on the perception of their candidate by others, and whether there are lots of people that agree with them according to the polls.  They've completely neutered their own judgment about the candidate in favor of the judgment of a few thousand other poll respondents. This is why the process is fucked up.

I stick with my guy instead of jumping ship and endlessly pimping the polling flavor of the week.

Have I told anyone supporting another candidate to just give it up and get with the program, before a single vote has even been taken?

What possible purpose does it serve to tell Perry supporters to give it up, except to make those saying it feel a little bit better about making choices based on extremely shallow criteria?

173 Personally, I want the meanest, snarkiest, most agressive, nastiest son of a bitch possible.
Newt is the George Patton this time around.

My dad drove a jeep for Patton, hated him, and admitted Patton probably kept him alive.

174

"So who are you for, dear Andrew?"

Paul. 

I know you guys can't get past your anti-Muslim brainwashing, but try looking at things in another way.  What's the single most important issue to you?  Actually downsizing govt or attacking Iran?  Neither Gingrich or Romney are going to downsize govt.  They may change the rules a little but will ultimately play the exact same game.  Perry's no better, he's been playing that same game in TX for the past decade.

You are wilfully sacrificing everything at home over that one issue.  And your differences with Paul on that issue really aren't even that different.  Paul would respond to an attack against us, as his record in Congress shows, he's simply not going to be the agressing actor.

175 "we want ... we want ..." Yeah. You can't have what you want. You have a limited range of choices, and most all of them are bad. Some are completely unrealistic choices. Lets see what you do.

FIFY.

176 You have a limited range of choices, and most of them are bad. ---- Ok, so feel free to choose between a mandate-loving, AGW-believing nut and Obama. Hope you like your government-run insurance.

177 Just don't demand I be madly in love with whoever our candidate will be. That's what pisses me off about election season. Otherwise rational people become so emotionally invested in their chosen candidate that a repudiation of him is taken as a personal rebuke. Get over yourself. You are hiring an employee, not a leader. What I look for in an employee: 1. Do what the fuck you're told. When you stop doing that, or if you don't agree to it from the start, I discard them and look for a new employee. With as much emotional investment as I put into my toenail clippings.

178

So after you are done pontificating over the importance of this one particular battle, are you willing enough to lose the war in order to win this battle?

+1, you just captured the purists mindset, damn advancing ideas and getting the most electable right-center guy, we'll lose and allow 4 more years of Obama and be damn proud of ourselves

179 better reply then I could have done

Then you're more full of crap than he is.  There is no Perry "bandwagon."  A bandwagon specifically refers to a phenomenon of preference by popularity.  That is, "everyone else is doing it."  As y'all so gleefully point out, Perry is poling in the single digits- so obviously everyone else is not pulling for Perry at this point.

What we're left with in the Perry camp are (mostly) those who have really looked at all the candidates and objectively prefer Rick Perry. 

What, objectively, draws you to Newt?  What policies has he implemented that show his conservative roots?  What policies, since leaving office, has he advocated that have done the same?  Why, in short, is he better than Rick Perry in any way other than "he's polling better."

180 I had a very interesting conversation with my dentist about an hour ago.  He was taking a long while to come in and give me the thumbs up following my cleaning, so the hygienist went to look for him.  He came in and profusely apologized.  He was in the back talking with a "very high up official from Europe" about the impending collapse of the Euro.  I asked if he was on the phone and he said, no, the man was there in the office.  The official was telling my dentist that there is very, very bad stuff coming down very soon about the coming collapse.  He said that "they" are planning on each country going back to their currencies prior to the Euro....and said that, at this point, they are working on a timing plan on how to lessen the impact for all countries involved, and the world.  He said that countries like Greece are going to be in very, very bad shape once it's all said, done and finished.  They're at the stage where they're trying to lessen the calamity coming.

When I was at the front desk checking out, a tall man was leaving right in front of me.  As he left and said goodbye to the office staff, I had no doubt it was the "official" my dentist was talking to.  And I have no doubt he was German.

181 My Dad was in the Bloody Buckets during the Battle of the Bulge-hated Monty-the Romney of generals-loved Omar.

182 Rick Perry once kicked a fart back into an ass.
When Rick Perry goes jogging at dawn, it's to get the earth spinning for the day.
Rick Perry doesn't flush a toilet. He simply scares the shit out of it.
Rick Perry does not do push ups. He simply pushes the earth down.
American Express issues a very limited number of Black cards to high rollers. Rick Perry issues American Express his own card.
Rick Perry isnÂ’t lactose intolerant. He just doesnÂ’t put up with lactoseÂ’s shit.
Peanuts have an allergy to Rick Perry.
When you die, Rick Perry's life flashes before your eyes.
Rick Perry will bring a gun to a knife fight.  That's my kind of candidate.
Rick Perry drinks gunpowder milkshakes in the morning and pisses live ammo at night.
Rick Perry never climbs into bed. It kneels to his feet lest he should become angry.
The only reason Rome wasn't built in a day is because Rick Perry couldn't make it.

183

"My dad drove a jeep for Patton, hated him, and admitted Patton probably kept him alive."

That's funny, but the problem is while Newt may be a fighter, what is he actually fighting for?  By his own admission in recent interview with Beck, he's still for individual mandate.  The guy really isn't different than Obama in any meaningful (read decrease size of govt) way.

184 What, objectively, draws you to Newt? What policies has he implemented that show his conservative roots? What policies, since leaving office, has he advocated that have done the same? Why, in short, is he better than Rick Perry in any way other than "he's polling better." Yeah, good luck getting a real answer. Most of these idiots just enjoy throwing spitballs.

185 IMO - I still think big picture, our anti-radical left priorities starting most important

-throw out Obamas legal firewall Holder
-expand conservative media
-hold house
-take senate
-no state bailouts
-agenda of turn as much back to the states as possible
-win white house
-reign in fed (their loans have enabled most of Obamas spending spree)

If we did all those but lost the white house  I think we would be in much better shape long term. even with scoamf in the oval.

186

Posted by: runninrebel at December 12, 2011 12:58 PM (XW40d)

yep

187 You are hiring an employee, not a leader.

Yeah.  Wouldn't it be nice if, say, the Government believed the same thing?

188 Omar Bradley-The Soldier's General.

189 127
So it's down to the Speaker who drove Clinton to the right or the Romneycare guy. The guy who gets in a tiffy in an interview w/ Bret Beir or the guy not afraid to fight Obama. The guy who has both establishments from the left and right against him or the guy who has the right telling us to sit down, shut up, and take the Romney nomination. The guy who owes up to mistakes or the guy who keeps telling us Romneycare was awesome.

^This

190 Yeah, good luck getting a real answer. Most of these idiots just enjoy throwing spitballs.

Posted by: Joffen at December 12, 2011 01:03 PM (zLeKL)

*facepalm* the irony of you calling folks idiots is delicious

191 Im not sure who would make a better Prez, probably Perry but again if you cant win the nomination or the general the question is mute. So you think Perry is more likely to be a better President? Sounds like you'll be voting for him since that's the whole point of a primary! Oh, wait. I just woke up. Now I have to argue with someone who will not choose the best candidate because the MSM tells him not to.

192 http://is.gd/RGInwD

The link is to the Legal Insurrection blog.  It is an article about the electability of Romney.

193 My Dad was in the Bloody Buckets during the Battle of the Bulge-hated Monty-the Romney of generals-loved Omar

Mine was in the 273rd Field Artillery.
Got drafted when he was 35.
Changed the life of a perfectly good cowboy.

194 Allen, Perry is the best choice,  BUT He has a problem selling himself.

195 Let's see who is still running.

Mr. I love me my Romney Care and nothing you can ever do will get me to admit is was a bad idea.

Mr. I love me some Medicare Part D and nothing you can ever do will get me to admit is was a bad idea.

Mr. No short term memory that can't debate Obama, whom doesn't understand why a lot of his base doesn't want to incentivise illegal immigration.

Mrs. I can't keep the crazy bottled long enough to get through a campaign.

Mr. I loves me some social issues and can't stop talking about them.

196 I either dreamed or read a recent column by Bill Kristol saying that (wishing) by Valentine's Day (which is when the real deadlines are??) Paul Ryan and my Senator Marco Rubio could save us all from a fate worse than death (Obama's second term).

I still remain ABO 2012 and would vote for anyone vs SCOAMF.

197 remember it isn't Us that decides at least that's what I've been told for the last 2 years, It is the independants and moderates that have to be convinced to Vote for the best guy. He has to sell himself we can run ads? telling of His experience but what else?

198

185 Lady in Black,

Thanks for that report. ....It's in keeping with what was said this morning on FBN by the Euro-watchers.

There is a sell-off of Gold going on today.....which is another indicator.

199 Perry is the best choice,  BUT He has a problem selling himself.

What, are you buying a TV where "they're all pretty much the same?"  Indeed, I bet even then you pick the one that is objectively better now matter how good, bad, or indifferent their commercials are?

And, my understanding is that he's done much, much better in the debates (wait, now it's not that he's bad at debates, it's that it's "too late."  sorry, I'll try to keep up), and he's still packing them in quite impressively at campaign stops in Iowa.

I get that he needs to be very good on the campaign trail, but since I"m not hearing anything about how he is on the campaign trail (despite a good number of capacity stops), I don't believe that talking-point either.

200 remember it isn't Us that decides at least that's what I've been told for the last 2 years Don't be a coward. Choose who you think the best candidate is and not who you think other people might pick.

201 Allen. Yes He does much better in discussions , he did better this last debate, He is the best for us. How does one convince those that we need to vote with US that He really is better?
I want Him to win, but how?

202

201  Posted by: ChristyBlinky at December 12, 2011 01:08 PM (baL2B)

 

The only thing Bill Kristol isnÂ’t thinking about is why Rubio would take second place on the ballot.  If we look to a late entry, or better yet a brokered convention, Rubio could be the candidate (almost) everyone could agree on.

On top of that, Rubio has the persona to generate the enthusiasm needed for a sweeping victory.

203

*facepalm* the irony of you calling folks idiots is delicious

Posted by: AuthorLMendez Is On The Newt Train Whether beck Likes It Or Not at December 12, 2011 01:05 PM (3XDPM)

Hey, he's not the one making value decisions for the entire country based on a few thousand anonymous poll responders.

204 Oh, wait. I just woke up. Now I have to argue with someone who will not choose the best candidate because the MSM tells him not to.

Posted by: Joffen at December 12, 2011 01:06 PM (zLeKL)

no the voters in respectable, accurate polls tell me who they'd consider to replace Obama, blame the msm all you want, if voters aren't feeling them their not winning. You can deny polling all day, I see youven't learned from 06, 08, and 2010 polls

205

I have a bad feeling about this.

Yup. All these people want Newt now because he's going to "crucify Obama in the debates" and "articulate conservative principles" to the public. Maybe true, but so what?

The vast majority of voters in the middle - ie. the barely-informed ones who truly determine the outcome of general elections - care about one thing this election cycle: fixing the frigging economy. Oh, and they hate Congress. Given that, I don't see how tossing aside the guy with the proven business background for the consumate Washington player is a winning move here.

And don't even get me started on the fact that Newt has enough personal baggage to bring down Santa's sleigh.

 

206 maybe He needs new  staffer someone new to work with Him debating?

207 #189 Joffen:  You're right to some extent.  Too bad we can't get Perry to do a Newt during the campaign but the problem is that of experience.  Newt is an experienced debator - he's been fielding hostile questions almost his entire career.  He ENJOYS the battle.  Most of the other candidates recognize that a certain amount of controversy is necessary, and will probably handle it competently most of the time, but they don't relish conflice.  I think Newt likes conflict for the sake of conflict - good in a campaigner but, perhaps, not so good in a President.

208 I guess Author is gone now. Idiot.

209 Joffen, certainly for the primaries

210 Isn't it amazing how when elections roll around we get a host of brand new posters with brand new hashes?

211

Hey, he's not the one making value decisions for the entire country based on a few thousand anonymous poll responders.

Posted by: grognard at December 12, 2011 01:14 PM (NS2Mo)

yeah based on the most accurate pollsters in the Nation, are we really gonna keep up this "polls don't matter' bullshit? didn't we learn from the last elections? oh well, I know Perry wont be the nominee and when he drops out probably after SC or FL don't cry that you didn't see the obvious. Time to get behind the most electable none-Romney. You guys wanna make a messiah out of a guy and not see who can serve as a hirable employee, go ahead.

212 "197 http://is.gd/RGInwD The link is to the Legal Insurrection blog.  It is an article about the electability of Romney." Uh oh. Worth a look. Apparently Romney is not some miracle pubbie in blue Mass. Many other pubbies have governed that state, and Romney lost that Senste bid to The Swimmer in a year otherwise highly successful for the GOP.

213 I guess Author is gone now. Idiot.

Posted by: Joffen at December 12, 2011 01:15 PM (zLeKL)

no dumbass Im still here

214 Vic, yeah , i try to focus on people that i know and understand their sincerity  in this type of discussion.

215 Posted by: AuthorLMendez Is On The Newt Train Whether Beck Likes It Or Not at December 12, 2011 01:16 PM (yAor6) --- Glad to see you didn't leave. Why don't you think for yourself and choose the best candidate? Would you vote for Obama is it were popular to do so? I think you would.

216 however, i admit i hate these discussions.

217 My major objection to Romney is that this election is going to be raw cagematch.  One Republican against the entire MSM and a billion dollar-nothing to lose by lying, Obama.

Romney is the clean cut boyscout in lord of the flies.

218 in fact maybe i'll check out craigslist i need a couple of new dining chairs.

219 You guys wanna make a messiah out of a guy and not see who can serve as a hirable employee, go ahead. ---- Perry isn't the messiah. I support him because I have looked at his record and like what I see. Yes, I also see flaws but then I go and look at the other candidates to see if I can find someone better. That's why I still support Perry. Did you support Cain when he was frontrunner?

220 Wow, Drudge's headline made my heart skip a beat there for a second.  "Kagan Recuses."  But it's only about the AZ Immigration case.

221 How does one convince those that we need to vote with US that He really is better?

I don't think there's much he can do during the primaries.  Primary voters are, by definition, "motivated voters."  They're going to vote anyway, and (at a guess) 95% are going to vote for the eventual nominee no matter what.

However, those same "motivated voters" are often guilty of thinking of the Primary as the General.  They think they should be listening to what all those "independents" are saying- when the fact is probably 20% (at best) of those independents will ever cast a vote.

Don't worry about the independents, yet, worry about Republican voters.

Unfortunately, that means they have to start making their own value judgements.  There's not much Perry can do that he isn't doing.

222 Glad to see you didn't leave. Why don't you think for yourself and choose the best candidate? Would you vote for Obama is it were popular to do so? I think you would.

Posted by: Joffen at December 12, 2011 01:18 PM (zLeKL)

it was popular to vote for Obama in 08, I got a nominee I didnt want, I voted for McCain knowing he was probably gonna lose. Dont acusse me of being weak-kneed because I want to win and present nominees that can win and advance my ideas. I think for myself by disagreeing w/ the GOP on many social issues, I think for myself when I dont join the Perry messiah bandwagon on here, I think for myself when I refuse to jump in on w/e the talk show hosts are telling me to do. Im sorry Im just not gonna go for someone who'd make a good prez but can't win. If he gets the nom (I doubt he will) i'll proudly vote for him over Obama and I gurantee you it will probably not be popular to do that if Perry is the nom (he won't be).

223

215 Vic,

I don't understand this hash thing. ....You're referring to that little group of characters inside parentheses, at the end of our post....right?

Mine used to change every time I came here. But lately it's stayed the same. I don't know what that means.

224 Mine was in the 273rd Field Artillery. Got drafted when he was 35. Changed the life of a perfectly good cowboy. Mine lied about his age-he was 17 and trying to get out of running numbers for the mob in Pittsburgh. ...during the Battle of the Bulge he decided to get "his ass in a can in the air..." IOW become a pilot. In the pilot program the other guys called him "Gramps" because he was one of the oldest-at I think-27. He did Korea after the conflict and flew in Vietnam-"taking pictures" as he says... He doesn't talk about any of it-much at all.

225 Unfortunately, that means they have to start making their own value judgements. ---- Sometimes that is just too hard for people to do. Which is why we have certain people here that jump on the bandwagon. It's too much work to vet the candidates yourself. Too much work to use your brain.

226 Romney is the clean cut boyscout in lord of the flies.

Posted by: Shiggz - Newt (Warp 7) at December 12, 2011 01:18 PM (RfvTE)

 

This. 

If I am forced to pick between Newt and Romney, I'm going with Newt.  He's meaner and nastier, and that's what I've been craving for years.  Neither of the Bushs, nor McVain, would attack like men.  It made me sick.  I want someone who's willing to wade in there swinging, kicking, and biting. 

227

no the voters in respectable, accurate polls tell me who they'd consider to replace Obama, blame the msm all you want, if voters aren't feeling them their not winning. You can deny polling all day, I see youven't learned from 06, 08, and 2010 polls

Posted by: AuthorLMendez Is On The Newt Train Whether Beck Likes It Or Not at December 12, 2011 01:14 PM (yAor6)

Translation: You're on the bandwagon because all of those people told you who to support.

You originally supported someone based on criteria other than polling numbers.  You even sent money.

Then, you bailed because others bailed too.  God forbid you be the last one into a lifeboat.  The kicker is that the ship hasn't even hit the iceberg yet.  There hasn't even been a real vote.

Let me put it this way:  Obama still polls higher than most of the GOP hopefuls in most major polls.

Are you going to place the opinions of those people higher than your own value judgment?  Of course not.

So why the fuck are you doing the same damn thing in the primary?

228

Did you support Cain when he was frontrunner?

no, and no. You can stereotype me all you want. I was an undecided. I backed perry but he became embarassing to watch and started losing electability, I backed Romney and I couldnt last 1 week defending his BS, I defended Cain but didnt want him as the nominee period, Im on the Newt train now. I wish my 1st choice (Perry) had done better.

229 Mine used to change every time I came here. But lately it's stayed the same. I don't know what that means. Yeah me neither. I also don't understand how people can know who's who by their hashtag. When "curious" posts, people instantly know who she/he is.

230 Isn't it amazing how when elections roll around we get a host of brand new posters with brand new hashes?

This is the go-to site for in-depth political discussion and titties, so it's not that surprising.

231 212:  conflice = conflict

232 I wish my 1st choice (Perry) had done better. I understand we're all on the same team (I hope) and I know these debates can get heated. That's why I love 'em. My question to you: isn't Perry doing a hell of a lot better now? If so, why is it too late?

233

You originally supported someone based on criteria other than polling numbers.  You even sent money.

I backed perry because at the time he was polling well and was the most electable none-Romney that has changed. Now it's Newt. The only None-Romney flavor I refused to support was Cain because I thought he would have made a horrible nominee. I want to win to adavance my ideas, not lose, watch things get worse.

234 Mine used to change every time I came here. But lately it's stayed the same. I don't know what that means.

I think it's an MD5 hash based on your IP address and e-mail address.
I have one hash from this (home) PC, and another from my work PC, same e-mail address.  I might try using my "other" e-mail address from this PC and see what happens.

235 isn't Perry doing a hell of a lot better now? If so, why is it too late?

Posted by: Joffen at December 12, 2011 01:25 PM (zLeKL)

no, he's getting worse, his polling is worse, the gaffes are worse, and I see no comeback any where near in sight as Ive been promised for months.

236

234 Mine used to change every time I came here. But lately it's stayed the same. I don't know what that means.

Yeah me neither. I also don't understand how people can know who's who by their hashtag. When "curious" posts, people instantly know who she/he is.

------

Yeah, Joffen....I don't understand how they check for that. It's cool though. ....I'm glad mine is staying the same now, so that people will be able to tell that I am Me.

237 Mine used to change every time I came here. But lately it's stayed the same. I don't know what that means.

Some service providers use a floating ISP for people. Your ISP is what determines your hash. I am on my third hash in about 4 years.

238 Posted by: tasker at December 12, 2011 01:22 PM (r2PLg)

We have great fathers.
I'm glad yours is still with us. 
Mine would be 106 if he were still around.

239 A big part of the reason I detest Mitt and Newt is their support for a mandate. I feel I have a unique perspective on this, being from Canada and living in the States for only four years. I know what it's like living in a country with universal health care. It's a fucking Holocaust. That's why I hate Obamacare and all it's parts. Mandatory health insurance is a huge part of Obamacare, so any candidate that supports it raises a HUGE red flag to me. Trust me, America you do NOT want to go down this path. I want someone who is consistent. I don't want to support a candidate if there's a good chance they have no problem with mandates.

240 Stop scapegoating. It's pathetic. The reason the field is weak this year is because there were few potential leaders on the right in the first place, and among them, there were even fewer willing to step forward and take the chance and fill the role. The right is crippled by the PR/ consultant class in the GOP and the Party establishment is still timid, weak, and corrupt. There is only a long road to reform ahead. What's important is that we empower the House with an R senate and Executive next year. Then we will have to turnover members who don't get their shit together.

241 no, he's getting worse, his polling is worse, the gaffes are worse, and I see no comeback any where near in sight as Ive been promised for months. ---- How is he getting worse?

242 I know you guys can't get past your anti-Muslim brainwashing Yeah, I pretty much ignored everything you said after that. Grow up and think for yourself, moron.

243

no, he's getting worse, his polling is worse, the gaffes are worse, and I see no comeback any where near in sight as Ive been promised for months.

Posted by: AuthorLMendez Is On The Newt Train Whether Beck Likes It Or Not at December 12, 2011 01:26 PM (yAor6)

In other words, he has to stage a comeback before you'll vote according to your original criteria.

Again, you are following the tide, not defining it.  You've put yourself in a position where your entire decision base is composed solely of the perceptions and decisions of others. 

That's your right, but I personally am sticking with who I think would be the best man for the job, and I don't appreciate the "give it up already" style comments that encourage others to forfeit their decision making to bandwagon politics.

244 *facepalm* the irony of you calling folks idiots is delicious Dude, when you learn how to actually fucking spell or use proper grammar then you might have some kind of authority to imply that others are idiots.

245 We have great fathers. I'm glad yours is still with us. Mine would be 106 if he were still around. Mine didn't get around to having kids till he wa 42-and gawd-I really don't want to do the math-I think he's 88. He grew up during the Depression-so I paid my way through college-and wasn't allowed to accept "charity" for that-as in loans... And he married a French Canadian-liberal...gawd. My Dad can still whip us all at chess-and some of those victims are Academy grads...

246

...but I personally am sticking with who I think would be the best man for the job, and I don't appreciate the "give it up already" style comments that encourage others to forfeit their decision making to bandwagon politics.

Thank you Grognard.  This needed to be said. 

247 There is only a long road to reform ahead. What's important is that we empower the House with an R senate and Executive next year. Then we will have to turnover members who don't get their shit together. Exactly. +1. You don't get a chance to get the right people in if you don't start getting the control together. Most (all?) of our current choices suck to one degree or the other, and some are clearly completely unelectable in a general view. Yet we still have folks pining for them. I've said it before ... get control of the house, senate and executive. Then primary the hell out of anyone not being sufficiently conservative for us in the 2014 cycle. Get rid of the idjits, and get more TPers in there. Yeah, this will be a slower coup to take over the Repubs, and it means we have to put up with a bit damaged goods president for a while. But its still infinitely better than the alternative.

248 He was the guy who refused to attack the other candidates but focused on Obama and debate moderators.

And that's a winning strategy. That's what he should focus on, and ignore Romney's sniping. Who cares what your opponents say? Stay with what has been winning for you until it stops winning, stay on target.

249 Newt cares because of two reasons: he has tremendous baggage which will come up. His wives will emerge, it's only a matter of time. Secondly, and vastly more important to him, he's something of a narcissist in the classical (not DSM-IV) sense. Some comment will hook him and the rest will be positively Howard Dean-esque.

Romney and Perry and the only two with a chance of winning against Obama due to having the money and ability to put together the campaign hierarchy to win. They find themselves in the odd position of now being each others strange bedfellow -- all it takes is enough chumming the water and someone will get a few barrels in Newt.

250

The point about Romney's tenure missed was it has no significant bearing on the job of creating jobs.  Yeah, it is experience learning new operations but that's just reason to include the sucker in one's government.

The real issue tho is he's a creep and I'd just as soon he retired from public life.

Speaking of which--Hey Urkel, resign, GTFO and leave the silverware.

251 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

252 255 Shit,if he GOES he can HAVE everything he can carry.

253

242 Mine used to change every time I came here. But lately it's stayed the same. I don't know what that means.

Some service providers use a floating ISP for people. Your ISP is what determines your hash. I am on my third hash in about 4 years.
-------

Ah. .....Thanks, Vic.

254

Wow i really found this to be an interesting read; thanks for sharing

255

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256 Took me time to read all the comments, but I really enjoyed the article. It proved to be Very helpful to me and I am sure to all the commenters here! ItÂ’s always nice when you can not only be informed, but also entertained!

257
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