November 09, 2011

Our Transhuman Future: Muscles Grown From Pig Cells
— Ace

The therapy can be used to re-grow muscles in soldiers (or anyone else) who's lost a lot of flesh to wounds.

t isn’t quite salamander territory, but it’s astonishingly close. The Pittsburgh team’s research means that, within this decade, the thousands of soldiers who’ve suffered major muscle loss during this decade’s wars can overcome devastating impairment — a life sentence of chronic pain, disability and no viable treatment short of amputation — and experience at least a 25 percent improvement in physical function. For civilians, the impact would incalculable. The kinds of trauma and health problems that now cause amputation, from car accidents and fires to cancer or diabetic peripheral vascular disease, would no longer cause irreparable damage.

Plus, within 15 years, I might be able to get enough muscle injections that I don't have to fear Toure menacing me in a dark corner of a J. Crew outlet store.

Posted by: Ace at 02:56 PM | Comments (168)
Post contains 166 words, total size 1 kb.

1 That's discriminatory against muslims

Posted by: phoenixgirl at November 09, 2011 02:58 PM (w9Jgv)

2 One of my favorite authors had a pig valve heart. He didn't live long.

Posted by: Vic at November 09, 2011 02:58 PM (YdQQY)

3 And the president is a scoamf

Posted by: phoenixgirl at November 09, 2011 02:58 PM (w9Jgv)

4 Plus, within 15 years, I might be able to get enough muscle injections that I don't have to fear Toure menacing me in a dark corner of a J. Crew outlet store.

Ace, on point! Nice to see you back!

Posted by: Jeff Weimer at November 09, 2011 02:58 PM (uHxzO)

5

From pigs you say?

Posted by: Jihadi Jack! at November 09, 2011 02:59 PM (I/MzF)

6

phoenixgirl beat me to it!

Posted by: Austin in TX at November 09, 2011 02:59 PM (lKVc4)

7 The transhman future will last briefly.

Sooner rather than later, we will create artificial intelligences vastly exceeding our own, and so extinct ourselves.

Thought -- reason itself -- leads to negation of biological life (focussing on meme-propogation at the detriment of gene-propogation) and to technology, which will first fuse with and then quickly replace and supplant biologic life. The future belongs to machines, and not to our grand children.

There are advantages to this: less world(s) run by delusional apes, more run by reason and rationality. But yes, the cessation of our species.

Posted by: Random at November 09, 2011 03:00 PM (YiE0S)

8 Don't start with this transhuman bullshit here. That's why I don't read Instapundit anymore.

Don't you do it. Don't you. I got nowhere else to go. I got nowhere else to go.

Posted by: Leo Ladenson at November 09, 2011 03:00 PM (mAm+G)

9 With this and the "skin gun" you could suffer a serious injury and have almost zero sign of it after treatment. Wow.

Posted by: supercore23 at November 09, 2011 03:00 PM (ZUFNn)

10

wow finally a cure for Toure's symdrome

 

Posted by: Sonnyspats at November 09, 2011 03:01 PM (I/MzF)

11 How many Praxis points does this cost?

Posted by: EC at November 09, 2011 03:01 PM (R15UB)

12 Mmmm...bacon.

Posted by: Joffen at November 09, 2011 03:01 PM (zLeKL)

13 Pig tissue can be used for face replacements too, but I don't recommend it.

Posted by: Rep. Henry Waxman at November 09, 2011 03:03 PM (QKKT0)

14 OTHER NEWS:
http://tinyurl.com/6m9fbgh

Media is PISSED that some guy filed a flimsy petition to recall WI Gov Walker so they have named names and address and wife's name and contribution history. He's out hunting (MSNBC story) but his wife says she doesn't know what's up.

Journalistic integrity? Why don't they just print out maps for union goons.

Posted by: WheelmanForHire at November 09, 2011 03:03 PM (l8nIR)

15 J. Crew? It's Banana Republic, idiot.

Posted by: Toure™ at November 09, 2011 03:03 PM (H/kgP)

16 Hung like a horse will soon take on a whole new meaning...

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:03 PM (niZvt)

17 What can't the magical pig do? Bacon, heart valves, scaring Muslims.....fantastic.

Posted by: mpfs at November 09, 2011 03:03 PM (HZ1yL)

18 Hung like a horse will soon take on a whole new meaning... So will acting like a pig .

Posted by: Bill D. Cat at November 09, 2011 03:04 PM (npr0X)

19 Gentlemen, we can rebuild him...we have the technology. 

And this is one step closer towards obtaining the technology to create Space Marines.

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at November 09, 2011 03:05 PM (UR5vq)

20 Bacon!

Is there anything it can't do?

Posted by: John P. Squibob at November 09, 2011 03:05 PM (kqqGm)

Posted by: al-Cicero, Tea Party Jihadist at November 09, 2011 03:05 PM (QKKT0)

22 It's abercrombie

Posted by: phoenixgirl at November 09, 2011 03:05 PM (w9Jgv)

23 You mean... She really was a real pig?

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:05 PM (niZvt)

24

If we're part bacon, then cannibalism just came back in fashion baby!

I think I've solved our SS and Medicare crisis.

Hey Vic, want to come by the house for a southern BBQ?

Posted by: Ben at November 09, 2011 03:06 PM (UvdzB)

25 @2  My grandpa had a pig heart valve replacement in the '90s and it gave him another 15 years.

Posted by: ARL at November 09, 2011 03:06 PM (X4Pz8)

26 And this is one step closer towards obtaining the technology to create Space Marines.

Well, we're certainly working on the Power Armor to go with.

Posted by: Meiczyslaw at November 09, 2011 03:06 PM (bjRNS)

27 Toure's last name is Neblett.

For some reason he hates his last name.

Posted by: myiq2xu at November 09, 2011 03:06 PM (PrZ6X)

28 hmmm...

Posted by: Barry Bonds at November 09, 2011 03:06 PM (+lsX1)

29 Pork Vajajays, sizzling hot!

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:07 PM (niZvt)

30 But by all means let's cut the budget of the evil war-mongering military.

Posted by: Alice's Clone Army at November 09, 2011 03:07 PM (4GaxX)

31 29 Pork Vajajays, sizzling hot!



That's on the menu of the Chinese joint around the corner.

Posted by: Leo Ladenson at November 09, 2011 03:07 PM (mAm+G)

32

computer implants, pig muscles, genetic sequencing improvements, nano technology

=singularity

 

Posted by: Max Power at November 09, 2011 03:08 PM (q177U)

33

But I already ask the ladies if they'd like my sausage....

 

I don't really but wanted to use that.

Posted by: buzzion at November 09, 2011 03:09 PM (GULKT)

34

I know dick about medical science but those sort of claims make me nervous. Not like it's "Island of Dr. Moreau" shit but anytime anyone claims a breakthrough in modern medicine to revolutionize anything, it never seems to turn out well.

Remember Dolly?

Posted by: ErikW at November 09, 2011 03:10 PM (mY2Rq)

35 25 @2  My grandpa had a pig heart valve replacement in the '90s and it gave him another 15 years. Posted by: ARL at November 09, 2011 07:06 PM (X4Pz Well that's great until your schwang turns curly. BTW, when is Mister Ohashi finally going to throw that obnoxious little kid with the electric guitar and no hair straight thru the damned window?

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:10 PM (niZvt)

36 Now this a porkulus investment that I could actually back, particularly in the rehab of wounded vets.

Posted by: ontherocks at November 09, 2011 03:11 PM (HBqDo)

37 Can you imagine the delicious smells wafting from someone who had this type of surgery and then went to lay in the sun? There could be trouble.

Posted by: mpfs at November 09, 2011 03:11 PM (HZ1yL)

38

Call me when they start growing human penises.

Posted by: Truman North at November 09, 2011 03:12 PM (I2LwF)

39 mpfs....how's your mom doing?

Posted by: Tami at November 09, 2011 03:12 PM (X6akg)

40 There is the possibility that this might not work as the pig cells would still be targeted as "foreign" by the immune system and subsequently destroyed (unless the patient was under heavy immunosuppressants), but from this paragraph -

Surgeons start by implanting what’s called an extracellular matrix, a sort of “cellular glue,” whose key components are growth factor proteins from pig bladders. Those proteins trigger the body’s own stem cells to flock to the area and initiate the process of tissue growth and wound repair — which adult muscles normally wouldn’t do. Combined with an intensive rehab program to essentially “exercise” the nascent muscle, the body is able to restore not only basic muscle tissue, but the tendons and nerves that are necessary for function.

it looks like the extracellular matrix is only a primer to stimulate muscle growth.  Once the body starts the process of regeneration, the foreign material can be taken care of and all that is left is the nascent "self" muscle.

This is partly why Steyn is wrong about our technological process having "peaked" in the '70s.  We are making great strides in biotechnology. 

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at November 09, 2011 03:12 PM (UR5vq)

41 38 You need one?

Posted by: phoenixgirl at November 09, 2011 03:12 PM (w9Jgv)

42

Well that's great until your schwang turns curly.

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 07:10 PM (niZvt)

 

Win, right there.


 

Posted by: ErikW at November 09, 2011 03:12 PM (mY2Rq)

43 I expect that in the next twenty years, treatments for growing muscle and strengthening bones will become commonplace for recruits in the military. 

Posted by: Alex at November 09, 2011 03:13 PM (e/SJC)

44 My grandpa had a pig heart valve replacement in the '90s and it gave him another 15 years.

Posted by: ARL at November 09, 2011 07:06 PM (X4Pz

I was speaking of Louis Grizzard who died at age 47 from complications with his 4th pig valve replacement.

Posted by: Vic at November 09, 2011 03:13 PM (YdQQY)

45 Manbearpig is real!

Posted by: toby928© Perrykrishna with tattooed knuckles at November 09, 2011 03:14 PM (GTbGH)

46 It is *almost* amusing watching peeps who know nothing about science, technology or biology jump in on these discussions. *Almost*.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at November 09, 2011 03:14 PM (bxiXv)

47 31 29 Pork Vajajays, sizzling hot! That's on the menu of the Chinese joint around the corner. Posted by: Leo Ladenson at November 09, 2011 07:07 PM (mAm+G) Actually, they do sell frozen pork uterises (uteri?) at the Korean grocety in Assi Plaza, Flushing.

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:14 PM (niZvt)

48 43 I expect that in the next twenty years, treatments for growing muscle and strengthening bones will become commonplace for recruits in the military.

Space Marines!   

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at November 09, 2011 03:14 PM (UR5vq)

49 41 38

You need one?

Posted by: phoenixgirl at November 09, 2011 07:12 PM (w9Jgv)

 

No, I'm just sick of my wife pawing me all the time.

Posted by: Truman North at November 09, 2011 03:16 PM (I2LwF)

50 O/T : shopping.com partners with the commie thugs at Occupy Oakland

"In addition to bringing you targeted dynamic content, Occupy Oakland has also partnered with Shopping.com to bring the most comprehensive selection of products, prices and merchant information in an easy-to-browse format. This gives users a vast range of choices to compare products before making a final decision."

Posted by: kbdabear at November 09, 2011 03:16 PM (Y+DPZ)

51 Space Marines! 

Pretty much. 

Posted by: Alex at November 09, 2011 03:16 PM (e/SJC)

52 Remember Dolly? Yes, and...?

Posted by: supercore23 at November 09, 2011 03:16 PM (ZUFNn)

53 Hi Tami, Mom is....I can't really put it into words. She didn't have a good day today because I took her to a funeral of an old friend of our family. That was difficult to say the least. It seems to me as if she is slowly disappearing in front of my eyes but I have to accept it. As she tells me "it is what it is." Thanks for asking. Anybody heard from Peaches?

Posted by: mpfs at November 09, 2011 03:17 PM (HZ1yL)

54 Posted by: ErikW at November 09, 2011 07:12 PM (mY2Rq)

Talk about getting screwed!

Posted by: Hrothgar at November 09, 2011 03:18 PM (i3+c5)

55 HELLO

Posted by: Dolly at November 09, 2011 03:18 PM (w9Jgv)

56 I'm not saying Toure is gay, but he is excited about using this technology to grow an extra cock in a place where his mouth can reach it.

Posted by: Warden at November 09, 2011 03:19 PM (HzhBE)

57 53 Hi Tami,
Mom is....I can't really put it into words. She didn't have a good day today because I took her to a funeral of an old friend of our family. That was difficult to say the least. It seems to me as if she is slowly disappearing in front of my eyes but I have to accept it. As she tells me "it is what it is."

Thanks for asking.

Anybody heard from Peaches?

Posted by: mpfs at November 09, 2011 07:17 PM (HZ1yL)

She may be back around tonight or tomorrow.  I think when she said her mom passed away that everything would be done with by today.

Posted by: buzzion at November 09, 2011 03:20 PM (GULKT)

58 is it kosher?

Posted by: willow at November 09, 2011 03:20 PM (h+qn8)

59 Mom is....I can't really put it into words. She didn't have a good day today because I took her to a funeral of an old friend of our family. That was difficult to say the least. It seems to me as if she is slowly disappearing in front of my eyes but I have to accept it. As she tells me "it is what it is."

Thanks for asking.

Anybody heard from Peaches?

Posted by: mpfs at November 09, 2011 07:17 PM (HZ1yL)

I'm sorry mpfs.  It's tough to watch...very tough. 

Posted by: Tami at November 09, 2011 03:20 PM (X6akg)

60

Posted by: Dolly at November 09, 2011 07:18 PM (w9Jgv)

Telomeres.  That's all I say.

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at November 09, 2011 03:21 PM (UR5vq)

61 Alas, fellatio, I blew him well

Posted by: Truman North at November 09, 2011 03:21 PM (I2LwF)

62 mpfs, so sorry to hear.

Posted by: willow at November 09, 2011 03:22 PM (h+qn8)

63 Yes, and...?

Posted by: supercore23 at November 09, 2011 07:16 PM (ZUFNn)

It's your turn.

I already admitted that I don't know the details.

 

 

 

Posted by: ErikW at November 09, 2011 03:22 PM (mY2Rq)

64 When's the debate tonight, anyway? And what channel did the Brains of the GOP Establishment choose this time, Current TV?

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:22 PM (niZvt)

65 CoolCzech -msnbc. with larry O'Donell moderating

Posted by: willow at November 09, 2011 03:23 PM (h+qn8)

66

This is partly why Steyn is wrong about our technological process having "peaked" in the '70s.  We are making great strides in biotechnology. 

Did he really say that? Kinda dumb considering Moore's law and all that. Genetic sequencing technologies are going fucking vertical.

Posted by: Max Power at November 09, 2011 03:24 PM (q177U)

67 When's the debate tonight, anyway?

And what channel did the Brains of the GOP Establishment choose this time, Current TV?

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 07:22 PM (niZvt)

8pm....CNBC. 

Will there be live blogging?

Posted by: Tami at November 09, 2011 03:24 PM (X6akg)

68 Why don't the candidates do one on YouTube with intelligent non-media interlocutors?  Even the debate on Fox sucked!!

Posted by: Hrothgar at November 09, 2011 03:25 PM (i3+c5)

69

Kramer: If the pig-man had a car, he'd give you a ride.

George: What if the pig-man had a two seater?

Kramer: C'mon George, be realistic.

Posted by: USS Diversity at November 09, 2011 03:25 PM (t7IDU)

70

@1: "That's discriminatory against muslims"

And vat are ve, my little shicksa? Chopped liver?

Posted by: The Joooos at November 09, 2011 03:25 PM (jAqTK)

71 69 Why don't the candidates do one on YouTube with intelligent non-media interlocutors? Even the debate on Fox sucked!!

Posted by: Hrothgar at November 09, 2011 07:25 PM (i3+c5)

The only reason the debates on Fox don't rate as the worst to me is because there's still john king grunting away.

Posted by: buzzion at November 09, 2011 03:26 PM (GULKT)

72 Hey, mpfs... sorry about that. Yes, I know what you mean. The last Christmas I had with my Dad was in 2002, and his operation was coming up that January. All through Christmas Eve dinner - that's when central Europeans celebrate Christmas - I watched him especially closely, trying to memorize everything. But it was no good. I could just see him fading, just like you said. He was still there... but already I could sense a part of him was draining away. Like a faded photo.

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:26 PM (niZvt)

73 11 How many Praxis points does this cost? Posted by: EC at November 09, 2011 07:01 PM (R15UB) I didn't ask for this *shink*

Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 03:26 PM (dptRY)

74 Saving your bacon with bacon...   (sorry)

Posted by: s☺mej☼e at November 09, 2011 03:27 PM (oif6Y)

75 Confirmed: Highly intelligent, genetically engineered pigs work at Politico.

Posted by: Mark Block, International Man of Mystery at November 09, 2011 03:27 PM (Jl3Mu)

76 Talk about getting screwed!

Posted by: Hrothgar at November 09, 2011 07:18 PM (i3+c5)

LOL!

Hope she didn't get cross-threaded.

Posted by: ErikW at November 09, 2011 03:27 PM (mY2Rq)

77 Our military treats wounded jihadis. I say we try this out on them first, and make sure we tell them about the porcine part.
 
Then we tattoo the info on the fixed par(s)t and send them back to their comrades. Much hilarity and amputation, but mostly amputation, would result.

Posted by: GnuBreed at November 09, 2011 03:28 PM (ENKCw)

78

@25: "My grandpa had a pig heart valve replacement in the '90s and it gave him another 15 years."

Didn't work out so well for me, though.

Posted by: The pig at November 09, 2011 03:28 PM (jAqTK)

79

 

It is a hard way, the way of being a man. Sooner or later we all want a thing that is bad. To walk on all fours. To suck up drink from a stream. To jabber, instead of saying the words. To go snuffling at the earth, and to claw on the bark of trees. To eat flesh, or fish. To make love to more than one, every which way. These are all bad things. These are not the things that men do. But we are men, are we not?

Posted by: Sayer of the Law at November 09, 2011 03:28 PM (GTbGH)

80 Heh! I can finally tell a woman her ass looks like 2 pigs wrestling in a sleeping bag and not get slapped anymore! Full of win!

Posted by: Spiked at November 09, 2011 03:28 PM (vFVJi)

81 Sooo, when does House become less of an asshole?

Posted by: ravenshrike at November 09, 2011 03:28 PM (UIFJV)

82 Kinda dumb considering Moore's law and all that. Genetic sequencing technologies are going fucking vertical.

Posted by: Max Power at November 09, 2011 07:24 PM (q177U)

Moore's Law is not universally applicable to technological progress. 

Posted by: Hrothgar at November 09, 2011 03:28 PM (i3+c5)

83 This is partly why Steyn is wrong about our technological process having "peaked" in the '70s. We are making great strides in biotechnology. Steyn's a pretty sharp guy, but I don't get how he could say that. We peaked before the whole computer revolution thing?

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:28 PM (niZvt)

84

Did he really say that? Kinda dumb considering Moore's law and all that. Genetic sequencing technologies are going fucking vertical.

Yes.  There was a discussion about Steyn's assertion wrt technological progress on the blog, lead by Monty, a few weeks ago. 

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at November 09, 2011 03:29 PM (UR5vq)

85 40 This is partly why Steyn is wrong about our technological process having "peaked" in the '70s. We are making great strides in biotechnology.
____________

Indeed. In the brave new world, the poor and stupid will make money by renting themselves out as organ farms.

And your success will be determined by how far into debt your parents were willing to go to buy brain implants installed into you at birth.

There's an anime series in here somewhere...

Posted by: Anachronda at November 09, 2011 03:29 PM (xGZ+b)

86 Posted by: ErikW at November 09, 2011 07:27 PM (mY2Rq)

Ouch!!

Posted by: Hrothgar at November 09, 2011 03:29 PM (i3+c5)

87 It is *almost* amusing watching peeps who know nothing about science, technology or biology jump in on these discussions. Posted by: Merovign

Who died and made you the Nazi Science Ubergruppen-fuehrer ?

Posted by: weft cut-loop at November 09, 2011 03:30 PM (04aCI)

88 84 This is partly why Steyn is wrong about our technological process having "peaked" in the '70s. We are making great strides in biotechnology.


Steyn's a pretty sharp guy, but I don't get how he could say that. We peaked before the whole computer revolution thing?

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 07:28 PM (niZvt)

Isn't his thing that the microwave oven was the last great invention?  And computers and cell phones are just improvements to existing technologies?

Posted by: buzzion at November 09, 2011 03:30 PM (GULKT)

89

@40: "This is partly why Steyn is wrong about our technological process having "peaked" in the '70s.  We are making great strides in biotechnology."

Can't remember who the guy was, but he made a great observation:

The 19th Century showed the world the horrors of chemistry - high explosives, poisons, etc.

The 20th Century showed the world the horrors of physics - nuclear weapons, intercontinental delivery systems, etc.

The 21 Century will show the world the horrors of biology, and it will put the other two to shame.

Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at November 09, 2011 03:31 PM (jAqTK)

90 Sooner rather than later, we will create artificial intelligences vastly exceeding our own, and so extinct ourselves.

Your theory depends on one of two ideas.

Either an intelligence can envision an intelligence algorithm better than the one it uses.

Or

We can build a processing center of greater power than the human brain.


The human brain is estimated at being able to process at about 100 million mips.

Currently the top super computers are reaching about 4 million mips. That is 5 generations before processors could outperform the human mind.

That's 10 years folks....Except....That takes us past the "Ultimate Limit" of Moore's law where individual atoms make up transistors. Our processor density increases have already started to slow because of it.

You combine that with the fact that only a fraction of human intelligence has ever been imparted into any computer, such that they can intelligently perform individual tasks, but nothing even close to awareness.

So the human brain is likely to be the most capable computer around for a little while longer.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Camellia Sinensis Operative at November 09, 2011 03:31 PM (0q2P7)

91 Isn't his thing that the microwave oven was the last great invention? And computers and cell phones are just improvements to existing technologies? Posted by: buzzion at November 09, 2011 07:30 PM (GULKT) That's like saying a nuclear submarine is just an improvement on the Viking longship.

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:32 PM (niZvt)

92 @55: HELLO

Posted by: Dolly at November 09, 2011 07:18 PM (w9Jgv)

----------------------------------------

This is Louis

Posted by: Zombie Louis Armstrong at November 09, 2011 03:33 PM (jAqTK)

93 The 21 Century will show the world the horrors of biology deficit spending, and it will put the other two to shame. Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at November 09, 2011 07:31 PM (jAqTK) Added a twist to that, for ya.

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:33 PM (niZvt)

94 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

Posted by: steevy at November 09, 2011 03:33 PM (7WJOC)

95 #82...I waited for a House reference. Hope they work it into a future script.

Posted by: Marybel at November 09, 2011 03:33 PM (Hic+o)

96 You think a muslim would refuse pig parts?

Posted by: steevy at November 09, 2011 03:34 PM (7WJOC)

97 91 That's 10 years folks....Except....That takes us past the "Ultimate Limit" of Moore's law where individual atoms make up transistors. Our processor density increases have already started to slow because of it.

You combine that with the fact that only a fraction of human intelligence has ever been imparted into any computer, such that they can intelligently perform individual tasks, but nothing even close to awareness.

So the human brain is likely to be the most capable computer around for a little while longer.
__________

The obvious answer is a cluster of pig brains in jars.

Posted by: Anachronda at November 09, 2011 03:34 PM (xGZ+b)

98 97 You think a muslim would refuse pig parts? Posted by: steevy at November 09, 2011 07:34 PM (7WJOC) You mean Paris Hilton's? Nah.

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:34 PM (niZvt)

99 Steyn's a pretty sharp guy, but I don't get how he could say that. We peaked before the whole computer revolution thing?

He used the two examples for this point - that we haven't been on the Moon since the '70s and that we don't have large-scale projects such as polio immunizations.  Somebody much smarter than this dummy can comment on the first example, but as for Steyn's polio example, he's way off base.  The polio vaccine is low-hanging fruit in terms of bio-tech as the polio virus genome is DNA-based (not RNA based like HIV - this is why HIV is termed to be a "retro-virus") and thus more stable and more "easier" to undertake large-scale vaccination attempts against it. 

But my counter-argument against Steyn's bigger point doesn't negate Steyn's point that our tech progress has been hindered by over-regulation. 

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at November 09, 2011 03:35 PM (UR5vq)

100 Until they can genetically engineer the essence of applewood smoke right into the tissue, I'm not buying it.

Posted by: Fritz at November 09, 2011 03:35 PM (FabC8)

101 It's been coined as the "complexity break". All the low-hanging fruit are gone. The next things are exponentially harder to solve and gather the knowledge to solve.

Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 03:37 PM (dptRY)

102

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at November 09, 2011 07:35 PM (UR5vq

I'll stand corrected on Steyn then.

Posted by: buzzion at November 09, 2011 03:37 PM (GULKT)

103 102 It's been coined as the "complexity break". All the low-hanging fruit are gone. The next things are exponentially harder to solve and gather the knowledge to solve. Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 07:37 PM (dptRY) You wouldn't think it was so low hanging if it was YOU, asshole!

Posted by: Caveman with the First Stone Wheel at November 09, 2011 03:39 PM (niZvt)

104 I already admitted that I don't know the details. I thought you were intimating that Dolly somehow caused negative things to happen. My mistake.

Posted by: supercore23 at November 09, 2011 03:40 PM (ZUFNn)

105 102 It's been coined as the "complexity break". All the low-hanging fruit are gone. The next things are exponentially harder to solve and gather the knowledge to solve. Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 07:37 PM (dptRY) Well, isn't that where supercomputers and the Information Superhighway come in?

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:40 PM (niZvt)

106 We will never have true AI.  The Touring Test will never be passed.  In fact, I predict that human/computer integration will plateau at some point in the future, as douchebags of the Anonymous stripe demonstrate how dangerous it is.

Posted by: Alex at November 09, 2011 03:41 PM (e/SJC)

107 So if I get this pig tissue therapy, dogs will like me?

Posted by: Soona at November 09, 2011 03:41 PM (Ivlpp)

108

The next things are exponentially harder to solve and gather the knowledge to solve.

I'm ever the optimist on this stuff.  There is so much we haven't even started to develop yet because the seed of the idea hasn't even been thought of.

Posted by: toby928© Perrykrishna with tattooed knuckles at November 09, 2011 03:42 PM (GTbGH)

109 92 Isn't his thing that the microwave oven was the last great invention? And computers and cell phones are just improvements to existing technologies?

Posted by: buzzion at November 09, 2011 07:30 PM


That's like saying a nuclear submarine is just an improvement on the Viking longship. Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 07:32 PM

Is that like saying that the M-27 is just an improvement on the crossbow ?

Posted by: kbdabear at November 09, 2011 03:42 PM (Y+DPZ)

110 I'm waiting for the spam e-mail which promises 'Male Enhancement' using these methods.

Once more, that'll put a whole new meaning into "porking someone".

Posted by: West at November 09, 2011 03:42 PM (vn9Ye)

111 Isn't his thing that the microwave oven was the last great invention? And computers and cell phones are just improvements to existing technologies?

Posted by: buzzion at November 09, 2011 07:30 PM (GULKT)


That's like saying a nuclear submarine is just an improvement on the Viking longship.

Yeah and the µ-wave oven was just replacing the heating process in the already invented oven, with the SHF transmitter from the already invented Radar, via the already invented magnetron.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Camellia Sinensis Operative at November 09, 2011 03:43 PM (0q2P7)

112 108 So if I get this pig tissue therapy, dogs will like me? Posted by: Soona at November 09, 2011 07:41 PM (Ivlpp) Yes. Yes, we will!

Posted by: Caroline Kennedy at November 09, 2011 03:43 PM (niZvt)

113 All the low-hanging fruit are gone. 

Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 07:37 PM (dptRY)

Watch yose'f white boy!

Posted by: Touré X at November 09, 2011 03:43 PM (i3+c5)

114 mpfs.. I am going thru this with my mom.. watching her grow old and fade before my eyes is scary and heartbreaking.  Even in just a years time she has changed dramatically.  She doesn't have anything wrong with her, per se.. just growing old.

Posted by: jewells45..teapartyterrorist at November 09, 2011 03:43 PM (Z71Vg)

115

The 19th Century showed the world the horrors of chemistry - high explosives, poisons, etc.

The 20th Century showed the world the horrors of physics - nuclear weapons, intercontinental delivery systems, etc.

The 21 Century will show the world the horrors of biology, and it will put the other two to shame.

Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at November 09, 2011 07:31 PM (jAqTK)

Great fucking point.

We're headed for disaster if we don't clamp down on experimenting with biochemistry.

There are no ethics anymore.

We're headed in a very bad direction.

Posted by: ErikW at November 09, 2011 03:43 PM (mY2Rq)

116 Well, isn't that where supercomputers and the Information Superhighway come in? Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 07:40 PM

No, the Supertrain!

Posted by: Joe Choo-Choo Biden at November 09, 2011 03:44 PM (Y+DPZ)

117 We will never have true AI.  The Touring Test will never be passed.  In fact, I predict that human/computer integration will plateau at some point in the future, as douchebags of the Anonymous stripe demonstrate how dangerous it is.

Posted by: Alex at November 09, 2011 07:41 PM (e/SJC)

 

Well, damn.  I was really looking forward to a Cherry 3000.

Posted by: Soona at November 09, 2011 03:44 PM (Ivlpp)

118 "That's like saying a nuclear submarine is just an improvement on the Viking longship." Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 07:32 PM Is that like saying that the M-27 is just an improvement on the crossbow ? Posted by: kbdabear at November 09, 2011 07:42 PM (Y+DPZ) It's like saying the Sybian is just an improvement on a butt plug.

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:44 PM (niZvt)

119 97 You think a muslim would refuse pig parts? Posted by: steevy at November 09, 2011 07:34 PM (7WJOC) Yes, but the goal would be to fix them first and THEN tell them they're part pig-man. You know, for the laughs.

Posted by: Joejm65 at November 09, 2011 03:44 PM (JGnKE)

120 Never say never.

Posted by: steevy at November 09, 2011 03:45 PM (7WJOC)

121 106 102 It's been coined as the "complexity break". All the low-hanging fruit are gone. The next things are exponentially harder to solve and gather the knowledge to solve. Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 07:37 PM (dptRY) Well, isn't that where supercomputers and the Information Superhighway come in? Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 07:40 PM (niZvt) Computational oomph without real knowledge about how things work does nothing. Except give us prettier video games. Many basic combinatorial problems that we are concerned with are provably hard, and those are simply the building blocks of MUCH more complex problems.

Posted by: Herman Cain at November 09, 2011 03:45 PM (dptRY)

122 sock puppet off!

Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 03:46 PM (dptRY)

123 Babe!

Posted by: The Robot Devil at November 09, 2011 03:46 PM (GaIwz)

124

We're headed for disaster if we don't clamp down on experimenting with biochemistry.

There are no ethics anymore.

We're headed in a very bad direction.

Posted by: ErikW at November 09, 2011 07:43 PM

DENIALIST !!! If smart and credentialed SCIENTISTS have the technology, they should be able to rebuild me !

Posted by: Dr Charles Johnson, Scienceologist at November 09, 2011 03:46 PM (Y+DPZ)

125 Many basic combinatorial problems that we are concerned with are provably hard, and those are simply the building blocks of MUCH more complex problems. Posted by: Herman Cain at November 09, 2011 07:45 PM (dptRY) Herman... you don't even know what that means.

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:47 PM (niZvt)

126 Sooner rather than later, we will create artificial intelligences vastly exceeding our own, and so extinct ourselves.

Check out the book "What Technology Wants" by Kevin Kelly. Look, a hive needs to keep the ants alive, I think there will always be people of some kind or other to bring the nectar. Just like there will always be some type of combustion engine in use in the world.

Posted by: Max Power at November 09, 2011 03:47 PM (q177U)

127

Posted by: Herman Cain at November 09, 2011 07:45 PM (dptRY)

You post much better than you speak....

Posted by: The Robot Devil at November 09, 2011 03:47 PM (GaIwz)

128 107 We will never have true AI.
___________

I figure we will never have AI because if we understand it well enough to build it, it won't be considered AI.

"AI? No, it's just your average everyday run-of-the-mill positronic processor. Hardly intelligent at all."

Posted by: Anachronda at November 09, 2011 03:47 PM (xGZ+b)

129 I'm still waiting for true x-ray vision glasses to come out. Back in 1975, I really thought 2010 would be the year, man!

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:48 PM (niZvt)

130 Just a thought about the 21st century. I think our worst nightmare is genetic engineering in the womb. Selective abortion is another one that makes my skin crawl. CoolCzech, you phrased my thoughts about my mom perfectly.

Posted by: mpfs at November 09, 2011 03:48 PM (HZ1yL)

131 Haha, I was like "oops this is the worst sock puppet attempt ever" after posting.

Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 03:48 PM (dptRY)

132 My cat just pulled a cigarette out of the pack and is now running around the house with it in his mouth.  I guess he's looking for a lighter.

Posted by: Soona at November 09, 2011 03:49 PM (Ivlpp)

133 130 I'm still waiting for true x-ray vision glasses to come out. Back in 1975, I really thought 2010 would be the year, man!

For me, it was flying cars.. I'd even settle for a flying motorcycle...

Posted by: The Robot Devil at November 09, 2011 03:50 PM (GaIwz)

134 116 We're headed for disaster if we don't clamp down on experimenting with biochemistry.
_________

Nope, we have to go *through* the biochemistry disaster in order to get to the next big thing. You wouldn't want to give up all the stuff the horrors of the 20th century brought you, would you?

Posted by: Anachronda at November 09, 2011 03:50 PM (xGZ+b)

135 So,we will be kept around to serve our computer overlords?I can live with that.

Posted by: steevy at November 09, 2011 03:50 PM (7WJOC)

136 I'm in flavor country!

Posted by: Soona's cat at November 09, 2011 03:50 PM (JbKUU)

137 136 So,we will be kept around to serve our computer overlords?I can live with that. Posted by: steevy at November 09, 2011 07:50 PM (7WJOC) Especially if they're NEXUS 6 Pleasure Models...

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:51 PM (niZvt)

138 Ray Kurzweil is a SCOAMF

Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 03:52 PM (dptRY)

139 131 I think our worst nightmare is genetic engineering in the womb.
___________

There is nothing to fear.

BTW, you look like you'd make a nice axlotl tank.

Posted by: The Masters of Bene Tleilax at November 09, 2011 03:52 PM (xGZ+b)

140

So,we will be kept around to serve our computer overlords?I can live with that.

It's the moisture.  They don't like the wet so we can live in the sewers.  They'll never come down here.

Posted by: toby928© Perrykrishna with tattooed knuckles at November 09, 2011 03:53 PM (GTbGH)

141

The 19th Century showed the world the horrors of chemistry - high explosives, poisons, etc.

The 20th Century showed the world the horrors of physics - nuclear weapons, intercontinental delivery systems, etc.

The 21 Century will show the world the horrors of biology, and it will put the other two to shame.

Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at November 09, 2011 07:31 PM (jAqTK)

Great fucking point.

We're headed for disaster if we don't clamp down on experimenting with biochemistry.

There are no ethics anymore.

We're headed in a very bad direction.


The 19th century showed us the wonders of chemistry; The steam engine, batteries, internal combustion,

The 20th century showed us the wonders of physics; Nuclear power, transformers and power distribution, turbine engines, electromagnetic communication, air travel, extra terrestrial travel, the transistor...

The 21st century will show us the wonders of biology. What will they be?

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Camellia Sinensis Operative at November 09, 2011 03:53 PM (0q2P7)

142 136 So,we will be kept around to serve our computer overlords?I can live with that.

Read, "For I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream"

Posted by: The Robot Devil at November 09, 2011 03:53 PM (GaIwz)

143 Well, isn't that where supercomputers and the Information Superhighway come in?

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 07:40 PM (niZvt)

This is important, but they are basically just moving information around more and more efficiently.  Technological progress comes from assembling something in the real world that performs a previously impossible action.

Think about the advent of the steam engine, the flying machine, the telegraph, radio communications, air conditioning, nuclear weapons, GPS...  These are breakthrough technology advances.

The iPhone, on the other hand, is just a polished version of Marconi's radiotelegraph plus a miniature ENIAC.

Posted by: Hrothgar at November 09, 2011 03:53 PM (i3+c5)

144 For me, it was flying cars.. I'd even settle for a flying motorcycle... Posted by: The Robot Devil at November 09, 2011 07:50 PM (GaIwz) Yeah, I was standing in the Stop & Shop parking lot the other day, looking around, and it struck me things looked pretty much the same back in the 70's. Maybe that's what Steyn is carrying on about. What happened to that Jetsons future we were looking forward to?

Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 03:54 PM (niZvt)

145 FTL travel.  That's what I want.  Let's get off this rock.

Posted by: toby928© Perrykrishna with tattooed knuckles at November 09, 2011 03:54 PM (GTbGH)

146 We already have algorithm used in finance and elsewhere that are are so complex we don't even understad them. These are more "grown" then made through extensive simulations. AI is totally inevitable. Inteligence is baked into the cake of the universe.

Posted by: Max Power at November 09, 2011 03:55 PM (q177U)

147 The iPhone, on the other hand, is just a polished version of Marconi's radiotelegraph plus a miniature ENIAC. Posted by: Hrothgar at November 09, 2011 07:53 PM (i3+c5) Having the ability to instantly chat face to face with someone halfway across the world is a breakthrough, I'm sorry.

Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 03:56 PM (dptRY)

148 I really want flying cars! 
Based on the number of idiots that can't even drive on a winding but well-paved road surface, I am sure that things will be better when they have access to the airspace.

Posted by: Hrothgar at November 09, 2011 03:56 PM (i3+c5)

149 149 Based on the number of idiots that can't even drive on a winding but well-paved road surface, I am sure that things will be better when they have access to the airspace.
__________

Naw, it'll all be automatic. Just sit back and enjoy the scenery.

Posted by: Your friendly cat-brained robot chauffeur at November 09, 2011 03:59 PM (xGZ+b)

150 9 With this and the "skin gun" you could suffer a serious injury and have almost zero sign of it after treatment. Wow.

Big whoop.

Posted by: Robocop at November 09, 2011 04:01 PM (6TB1Z)

151 Having the ability to instantly chat face to face with someone halfway across the world is a breakthrough, I'm sorry.

Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 07:56 PM (dptRY)

Agree that this is a nice to have capability that never existed before, but it is heavily based on previously existing technology integrated in a most artful way.

The subtleties of the semantics make it tricky to isolate true technology advances that are unambiguously agreed upon by all of us.  Therefore, I would say that a Harpoon missile is not a simple extrapolation of the longbow.

Posted by: Hrothgar at November 09, 2011 04:03 PM (i3+c5)

152 Based on the number of idiots that can't even drive on a winding but well-paved road surface, I am sure that things will be better when they have access to the airspace.

Posted by: Hrothgar at November 09, 2011 07:56 PM (i3+c5)

 

I agree.  That's  why I'd want a flying car with a 20mm cannon.

Posted by: Soona at November 09, 2011 04:03 PM (Ivlpp)

153 BTW, when is Mister Ohashi finally going to throw that obnoxious little kid with the electric guitar and no hair straight thru the damned window?

Dude, check out Mrs. Ohashi.  He'll put up with a lot.  I don't know who was in charge of casting that commercial though.

Posted by: Observant fellow at November 09, 2011 04:05 PM (6TB1Z)

154 102 It's been coined as the "complexity break". All the low-hanging fruit are gone. The next things are exponentially harder to solve and gather the knowledge to solve.
Posted by: GergS at November 09, 2011 07:37 PM (dptRY)


Well, this sort of thing is inevitable if we're chasing epicycles. And we are in many fields.

Posted by: MetaThought at November 09, 2011 04:10 PM (aPNAn)

155 106 Well, isn't that where supercomputers and the Information Superhighway come in? Posted by: CoolCzech at November 09, 2011 07:40 PM (niZvt)


The biggest gains from the net will likely be political, not scientific.

Posted by: MetaThought at November 09, 2011 04:14 PM (aPNAn)

156

SOYLENT GREEN IS PEOPLE!!!  WHICH IS NOW BACON!!!  Which, now that I think about it, makes it not quite so objectionable.

 

Posted by: Rocketeer at November 09, 2011 04:22 PM (OQumW)

157 ' in a dark corner of a J. Crew outlet store' OMG, Ace, was that you?? Erk.......

Posted by: Fortunata at November 09, 2011 04:22 PM (90H1N)

158 But if we cure Dr. House how will modern medicine ever recover?!

Posted by: Princeton Plainsborough Hospital at November 09, 2011 04:25 PM (ijjAe)

159 I am not clear if I totally understand the full thought pattern behind this.

Posted by: Download ePub Blog at November 09, 2011 04:32 PM (hTd0z)

160 Hi Ace. If you'd like to follow up on your subject, check out Chuck Missler videos on youtube.

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Posted by: Epub ebooks for tablet at November 09, 2011 06:11 PM (kpPaf)

163 I suspect the underlying cause of Steyn's fallacy about technological progress is that we are so close to stuff that was formerly distant. Other than older versions of people like me, what portion of our society could tell you why the latest IBM mainframe was better than the model it replaced. By comparison, the average high school today, even in a crappy neighborhood, has a fair number of kids who can tell you at length why the Core i series is better than the Core 2 series it replaced. Just the same way a lot of high school kids could avidly tell you forty years ago what was different in the '68 Mustang compared to the '66 model year.

One of my brothers has been deeply into motorcycles since the 70s. He knows in very fine detail what has changed over the years. But he thinks his Toshiba laptop is just a tiny version of the machines that existed in the 70s. It's hard to make him understand how much more is involved than miniaturization. That there is a substantial amount of hardware there that didn't exist in any form back then. Try to tell a CS guy in 1975 that this chip had over a million transistor just for performing texture mapping operations and you'd have to first explain what texture mapping it just didn't exist yet then, nevermind as a real-time function.

So yeah, a lot of people not deeply interested in tech and science for its own sake can be hard put to understand how much has happened in our lifetimes. It can seem like the previous generation did so much more because things like moon landings are so visceral. But long term, how much more important is that we're now making real progress towards an era when more a tiny handful of government employees will ever move beyond Earth orbit.

To date, it's just twelve guys. It isn't that we cannot build far better space craft. Our motivation for doing so was the biggest problem. A big factor is we did it backwards for political showmanship. We should have been building a capacity for daily access to orbit and space stations before going to the moon. What we did is the equivalent of our distant ancestors setting out to cross the oceans before getting a handle on the vast territory to be exploited that was reachable on foot.

Posted by: epobirs at November 09, 2011 06:12 PM (kcfmt)

164
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Posted by: christine at November 09, 2011 08:13 PM (Dy/KL)

165 "This is partly why Steyn is wrong about our technological process having "peaked" in the '70s.  We are making great strides in biotechnology. "

Yeah, really.  There's that who Human Genome Project thing he may wanna look into.  Once the human genome can be sequenced for a few bucks in a few hours, forget about it: whole new game.

Posted by: JB at November 09, 2011 08:50 PM (7T+Mz)

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Posted by: doumaduo at November 09, 2011 10:26 PM (hsXs9)

168 Transhuman? Has Ace been to City 17?

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