1 Here we Go!!!!!!!!

2 Obama is a scoamf

3 For those of you interested in Reagan's own writings, I'd recommend this book:

Reagan, In His Own Hand: The Writings of Ronald Reagan That Reveal His Revolutionary Vision for America

4

Yep Reagan was a conservative ideologue. And yeah, thats a good thing.

5

... he defends the Diem regime in Vietnam, which is tough to do (despite that being US policy), because the Diem regime was marked, like most governments throughout history have been marked, by corruption and oppression.

 

Kinda like any Democrat-run city here in that respect.

6 I visited the Reagan library in Simi Valley only a few days ago.  Anyone who thinks Reagan was a buffoon is a colossally clueless fuckface.  Seriously.

And yes, I cried at his grave too.

7 so who do you want, Ace?

"none of the above" is a vote for Obama

8 So you want a Gingrich then?

9 Ronaldus Magnus, East Victor.

10 You can't spell Gingrich without grinch

11 Don't let anyone tell you that America's best days are behind her-that the American spirit has been vanquished. We've seen it triumph too often in our lives to stop believing in it now. "

That was the last thing I heard Reagan say in a video before I left the library too. 

12 So you want a Gingrich then?

Newt is Ronnie without the humility and self-deprecation.

13 Despite being the Conqueror of Europe, Ike ended up as kind of amiable dunce.

14 Finish this statement,
By the time the republicans and democrats are through with the USA....

15 There will never be another Reagan. His conservatism was pure and clear. When he said shit, you knew exactly where the fuck he stood. The closest mug to Reagan we have is Newt. All the other candidates suck canal water compared to The Gipper. That's all there is to it.

16 kinda on this topic, the Vietnam show just started on the HC.

17 Kennedys make me sick. All of them. Not just Teddy. All.

18 Reagan tripled the national debt. Reagan more than tripled deficits. Reagan sold weapons to Iran. The right needs a new poster boy. Other news; Hitchens' depressing take on the left's lack of interest in Cain's history of sexual harassment: "For liberals, Cain is no more than a ghoulish puppet of the Tea Party, a pathetic insurance against charges of racism, a lobbyist and a front-man devoid of ideas. The notion that there might be some wounded woman employee in his past is, to most American radicals, one of pure irrelevance." Depressing.

19 Eh. My blood pressure just can't take another Caining. See you folks in the morning.

20 Ace, morons, countrymen, lend me your ears;
I come to bury Herman, not to praise him.
The harassment that men do lives after them;
The good is oft interred with their bones;
So let it be with Herman. The noble Romney
Hath told you Herman was ambitious:
If it were so, it was a grievous fault,
And grievously hath Herman answer'd it.
Here, under leave of Romney and the rest -
For Romney is an honourable man;
So are they all, all honourable men -
Come I to speak in Herman's funeral.
He was my friend, faithful and just to me:
But Romney says he was ambitious;
And Romney is an honourable man.
He hath brought many donations home to us
Whose dollars did the general coffers fill:
Did this in Herman seem ambitious?
When the Tea Parties have cried, Herman hath wept:
Ambition should be made of sterner stuff:
Yet Romney says he was ambitious;
And Romney is an honourable man.
You all did see that on the Rasmussen
I thrice presented him a frontrunner's crown,
Which he did thrice refuse: was this ambition?
Yet Romney says he was ambitious;
And, sure, he is an honourable man.
I speak not to disprove what Romney spoke,
But here I am to speak what I do know.
You all did love him once, not without cause:
What cause withholds you then, to mourn for him?
O conservatives! thou art fled to liberal beasts,
And media have lost their reason. Bear with me;
My heart is in the coffin there with Herman,
And I must pause till it come back to me.

21 Well we're not going to find all of Reagan's qualities in  single candidate so we're going to have to pick and choose which ones are most critical.

And IMO not knowing (or having an interest in) policy basics is disqualifying. When regular moron commenters here can give a better and more coherent answer on these questions than Herman Cain, then something is wrong. Has the bar been lowered so far that this is the best we can do?

When did ignorance of policy become a sign of conservative authenticity?

22 I have not lost all hope as to think we won't see another Reagan. Maybe not this cycle, but I know it can happen again.

23 Who exactly is going around saying that Reagan wasn't smart - especially on the Right? Are you talking to the strawmen again, Ace? The politicians of that era were different - listen to Kennedy's speeches. I was doing some research on civil defense and listened to a speech Kennedy made telling people to build bomb shelters and whatever else you think about that guy, it was a smart speech, meant for an intelligent audience. Obama is supposed to be a soooper genius but his speeches are on, what, 8th grade level? To me he sounds like a dumbass. What is problematic is that he is widely regarded as such a smart guy, and he really isn't. I know this goes to your pet thesis that the conservatives are anti-intelligence but that simply isn't true. They (we) object to the elite not because they are smart but because they *think* that they are smart, are widely regarded as smart, and they really aren't - look at the hash they have made of everything.

24 Which begs the question: Which Extraordinary Everyman is currently running for the GOP nomination? Ron Paul? Buddy Roemer? Newt Gingrich? Herman Cain? Jon Huntsman? Rick Santorum? Michelle Bachmann? Rick Perry? Mitt Romney? YOU DON'T GET TO PICK ANYONE ELSE. This is all you get this time around. So who ON THAT LIST is your new Reagan?

25

I've been watching his "Time for Choosing" speech a lot lately. We'll only get one Reagan.

Also, WTF. I'm glad I wasn't around for William F. Buckley, he's an awful bore

26

Newt is Ronnie without the humility and self-deprecation.
Posted by: John P. Squibob





Newt is Ronnie -- if Reagan had stopped by the hospital to get Jane Wyman's signature on the divorce papers before jetting off with Nancy....

27 We need a Joe Pa "death watch," 'cause gauging by the op eds out there, he's going down. 

28 The right needs a new poster boy.

You're obviously quite young.  Reagan breathed life back into the shambolic zombie that the nation had become.

29 I have seen the Next Reagan™. His name is Marco Rubio.

30 I'm waiting for the post where Ace claims that supporting Herman Cain can cause problems with your bodily fluids.

31 They (we) object to the elite not because they are smart but because they *think* that they are smart, are widely regarded as smart, and they really aren't - look at the hash they have made of everything.

The concept is bien pensants and Ace has talked about it ad nauseum.

32 The left has the incredible ability to construct fables and ignore empirical fact.

Global warming
A benign Soviet Union
The Che mythos
Reagan as a bumbler
Obama as a genius
The Iraq War as an oil grab
Fast and Furious
Solyndra

Yeah, I'm going to vote for anyone but Obama, but that someone is not going to be Herman Cain if I can help it.    Ronald Reagan knew the enemies of the country and how to defeat them.  I don't believe Cain has the foggiest idea about even the basics of foreign policy and the world is still a dangerous place.

33 Cain could become a Reagan, theoretically. Romney could become Dukakis.

34

Ace, you're not wrong.

The problem is, I dunno if there is a reliable conservative amongst the current crop of Republicans with the kind of finely-tuned grasp of ideology and policy that Reagan had.  The closest we have in the 2012 field is Newt and even with all his smarts he's still problematic for several reasons.

As usual, the GOP rank-n-file has to go into the next war with the army they have, not the one they wish they had.

35 19 Reagan tripled the national debt. Reagan more than tripled deficits. Reagan sold weapons to Iran. The right needs a new poster boy.

So simplistic are you.  The reason why we had those debts was because a) the Soviet Union had to be taken care of and b) Congress failed to reign in rampant spending.  Furthermore, we didn't sell that much weaponry to Iran (and to Iraq as well) and during the 80's they were busy fighting each other, not expanding elsewhere into the ME and not threatening Israel (despite Osirak, but the IAF took care of that).

Who are the "poster boys" of the Left?  These days JFK would be labeled as a tax-cutting war-mongering traitor. 

36 Again, watch the whole debate from Saturday night.  Cain is not a dunce.

Certainly he could perform better than he has -- at this point in the cycle, he damn well should be performing better than he has.

His off-the cuff answers on questions he hasn't considered (and I agree that he should have considered them before now -- empty Guantanamo?) aren't conservative enough. 

But he's not the detail-free, clueless, effing tard you keep making him out to be.

37 19 Reagan tripled the national debt. Reagan more than tripled deficits. Reagan sold weapons to Iran. The right needs a new poster boy.

Other news; Hitchens' depressing take on the left's lack of interest in Cain's history of sexual harassment: "For liberals, Cain is no more than a ghoulish puppet of the Tea Party, a pathetic insurance against charges of racism, a lobbyist and a front-man devoid of ideas. The notion that there might be some wounded woman employee in his past is, to most American radicals, one of pure irrelevance."

Depressing.

Posted by: Jordan at November 08, 2011 09:11 PM (XJYf4)

Fuck off.

Reagan grew us out of malaise and sent us on a 20 year world wide prosperity binge.

Who gives a fuck about that complete syphillic asswipe piece of shit Hitchens. Fucking asshole isn't even human. Fucking creep.

 

38 31 I'm waiting for the post where Ace claims that supporting Herman Cain can cause problems with your bodily fluids.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at November 08, 2011 09:14 PM (AF1jB)

That's Marco Rubio.  And you lose bodily fluids.

Well, Ace does, anyway.

39 Man, the Gipper could think on his feet too.

"Are you saying that you approve of the activities of the Diem regime.  Do you approve that they put six million in forced prison camps, and that the American advisors did nothing but help them in this."

"I challenge your history again.  There is absolutely no record that six million people were put in concentration camps.  They only have 16 million to begin with."

The man had facts at his fingertips, and he knew how to use them.

40 But can we drag Newt over the finish line?

41

Maybe I don't hang out in the comments sections enough here and elsewhere, but I haven't really seen anyone arguing that for someone to be a credible authentic candidate, they have to have no foreign policy knowledge.

The corrollary does need to be stated, however, that having sound foreign policy knowledge does not necessarily make someone a good candidate.

42 Who exactly is going around saying that Reagan wasn't smart - especially on the Right? Are you talking to the strawmen again, Ace?

I guess Ace hangs out with a bad crowd.

43

 shambolic zombie that the nation had become.

somebody has been watching Shuan of the Dead

44 Now this is Reaganesque

We begin bombing in 5 minutes.

45 This is a character issue for me. Think about it. Suppose you have some critically important job. Like, say, you're going away for a business trip, and you need someone to care for your special-needs toddler. Something important. You have five applicants. One of them shows up without having even done a Wikipedia search on your kid's special-needs condition. What do you think? I'd say as a character matter you think, "How awful, he shows up for a critical job without having done the most basic homework about it. Apparently my kid's well-being is not very high on his list." I know Cain has fans. But I cannot get past this idea that we are talking about the presidency here, and he simply doesn't seem to care about basic questions he'd have to face as president. So what's he running for?

46 Eureka College annihilates Harvard College. 

47

We need a Joe Pa "death watch," 'cause gauging by the op eds out there, he's going down. 

There are factions who've wanted JoePa out for years. They're going to use this for the force play. Then house will be cleaned. If you're the PSU towel washer, I'd dust off the resume.

48 Also, people, for the love of fuck, stop feeding the roll. Just scroll beyond their comments. Don't respond to them. It's what they want.

49

Cain could become a Reagan, theoretically.

Just like I could become a dodo, theoretically.

50 When did ignorance of policy become a sign of conservative authenticity?

Posted by: Mætenloch at November 08, 2011 09:13 PM (pAlYe)

Around the time Hollywood went full-on commie

51 Yes, Reagan was great. But no amount of wishcasting will bring him back. Ace, I love you like a brother, but this constant need to put Cain down is odd, bro.

52 >>>"I challenge your history again. There is absolutely no record that six million people were put in concentration camps. They only have 16 million to begin with." Pretty good. You know what I thought? Take that clip out of context -- "there is absolutely no record that six million people were put into concentration camps." Now make a video out of it. Bang! Reagan = Nazi Holocaust Denier.

53 Reagan tripled the national debt. Reagan more than tripled deficits. Reagan sold weapons to Iran. The right needs a new poster boy.

RON PAUL _{(that glittering empty suit of libertarian ideals and empty platitudes and a pretty undistinguished and undistinguishable lengthy career of self-importance and self-enrichment)}!

54

Reagan grew us out of malaise and sent us on a 20 year world wide prosperity binge.

There was one major downside to that.  Reagan's leadership and polices gave us such a bounty that after the Soviet Union fell, the country basically took a decade-long vacay from its responsibilities as a superpower.  This is proof that success can test the meddle of a person (and of a people) even more than the strongest foe. 

55

I'd much prefer an amiable Extraordinary man.

Yeah, but I'm not running.

56 No post on the dc circuit ruling of ocare?

57

>>>I do not see how we're to have all these changes in policy with a leader who is so uninterested in policy he doesn't know the basics of it.

Oh, we won't. Cain's not actually trying to win the nomination. So, you know, the whole question about the viability of his campaign is kind of moot.

^{(just wait untill he endorses Romney, lol)}

58 Reagan would be labeled a RINO and would never be elected by all you True Conservative idiots if he were running today.

59 But I cannot get past this idea that we are talking about the presidency here, and he simply doesn't seem to care about basic questions he'd have to face as president.

ace at November 08, 2011 09:16 PM (nj1bB)

Yeah.  I'm not really cool with that, either.

60

Reagan Obama tripled the national debt. Reagan Obama more than tripled deficits. Reagan Obama sold weapons to Iran Mexican drug cartels. The right Communist Party needs a new poster boy.

FIFY.

61

why do people pointing out Cain's shortcomings have to produce a better candidate?

 

62 So ace, Any opinions about this Cain thing?

63 why do people pointing out Cain's shortcomings have to produce a better candidate?

So you're not planning to vote?

64

No post on the dc circuit ruling of ocare?
Posted by: Flapjackmaka





Probably in the same place as the post about today's elections in some crucial swing states like Virgina and Ohio....

65 On the other hand, Romney seems to be looking to become the Republican candidate for whom every statement has an expiration date.

Shit.  They all do in our lineup.

66 ace, I think that it is probably untrue that Cain is as unprepared as you keep saying that he is - you keep pointing to articles that say Cain said something that he didn't, and saying, see! And note - I ruled out Cain long ago, he's not my candidate - I don't even have a candidate, now. But I would guess that many conservatives are more prepared to back a candidate that has an unformed opinion on a topic, than they are to back one that has two or three on each topic.

67

It meant the power to communicate clearly, and forcefully -- sure, it meant that. But implicit in that was the power to communicate ideas and, yes, details of policy, and details of history.

Ace

------------

I agree. Now show me a candidate in this race who does both of these things? You can't find one. And don't give me Romney. The guy couldn't articulate the values and principles of conservatism if given all day to do so. He communicates bullshit, not conservatism.

But the other guy I'm inclined to want to vote for talks like he may or may not have graduated from highschool.

Cain doesn't know policy. Perry can't communicate clearly. Both are CIRITICAL. Now, tell me why I should take Perry more seriously than Cain?

68 "Reagan would be labeled a RINO and would never be elected by all you True Conservative idiots if he were running today." Of course he would. Republicans only insist on fiscal responsibility when they are not in office. This Congress is a great example; they were elected to cut spending, but the House broke every spending record. Eat that, Pelosi!

69 The right needs a new poster boy.

you're an idiot.

70 That is pretty creepy that ace knows conservatives that think Reagan was a dunce. I wonder how long they've been conservative? 5 minutes? Little late to the party, Bro?

71 When Reagan gave his valedictory speech at the 88 convention I wept.  Actual tears.  A grown man weeping over a politician leaving office.

He meant that much to me.  I had almost lost hope after LBJ, Nixon and that Cocksucker Carter.  Reagan gave it back to me.

72 Kennedy couldn't shit right for a week after that.

73 "Clint Eastwood likes Herman Cain"

Well there you have it, you're on the wrong side of history Ace!!

74 OK Ace...

I get it. You don't like Cain.

But we all agree that there isn't a Reagan waiting in the wings somewhere. Gingrinch has too much baggage. (He lost me while sitting on a park bench with Pelosi.) Perry is teh Fred, without teh charisma. Bachman is just plain crazy. Palin never really had a chance, what with the lawsuits driving her out of office and the McCain Machine stabbing her in back. Christi is a one term Governor who could only pull off "conservative" in New Jersey.

So who *do* you support?

Romney?

Really?

Cause I sorta see a big down-side to nominating the architect of the Massachusetts Mandate  to run against Obama.

75 A full transcript of the Reagan vs. RFK debate: http://reagan2020.us/speeches/reagan_kennedy_debate.asp

76 Reagan on abortion: http://tinyurl.com/cccukaw Brilliant. From the article: Abortion concerns not just the unborn child, it concerns every one of us. The English poet, John Donne, wrote: ". . . any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind; and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee." We cannot diminish the value of one category of human life — the unborn — without diminishing the value of all human life.

77 Wow, I really hadn't noticed it before, but Robert Kennedy also seems to be a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure as well.

Seems the leftist shitbrained fuckwagons like Barry Sotero are just emulating the Kennedys.

78 Who gives a

wasn't one of Hitchens' bones that he couldn't let go of Mother Teresa or as we Catholics know her Blessed Teresa of Calcutta.

Yeah run down one of the most selfless human beings ever to exist. Way to win credibility in my book.

79

why do people pointing out Cain's shortcomings have to produce a better candidate?

So you're not planning to vote?

Yes. I'm voting for Perry.

Will you vote for the person Herman Cain endorses when he drops out?

80 59 No post on the dc circuit ruling of ocare?

It's probably in the works, just settle down a bit. 

Here's something else to ponder - the Buckeye state has just voted to continue killing itself slowly:

Ohio's Issue 2 Collective Bargaining Law Fails

81 Ohio:

jamiedupree Jamie Dupree Ohio voting 64-36 to repeal union bargaining law, but also voting 63-37 to block Obama individual mandate

82 "I'd much prefer an amiable Extraordinary man." And who would that be of the choices before us?

83

Btw isn't there a important vote in Ohio today?

----------

No. I feel bad for anyone who has just recently been reading up on issue 2 and thinks today meant something. That issue has been dead for months and months. Been polling nearly 20 points to bad side since it's inception. So, today was mere formality than anything worth paying attention to. The important part has been the fact that Ohio has clearly shown itself to be a blue state over these last 6 months.

84 Read "Reagan, In His Own Hand" and tell me he's dumb.

85

Posted by: USA at November 08, 2011 09:23 PM (6Cjut)

Sounds almost like "it should be illegal and a family decision."

86 Reagan only got the nomination due to a grassroots revolt; the party establishment preferred Bush, even though Reagan had come in second four years earlier and thus it was, by the bigwigs' own tradition, his "turn." The establishment needs our votes, but they have to be dragged, kicking and screaming, into doing anything to earn them.

87 That was awkward.

Oh, my ribs hurt.

88 Okay. I had to stop the Firing Line vid at the 1:55 mark for a moment to remark that the criticisms launched at Reagan, are the same which were launched at Teh Fred.

89 Oh, and fuck Hitchens.

90 Of course he would. Republicans only insist on fiscal responsibility when they are not in office. This Congress is a great example

Congress has two houses. One of them is your sack of ass.
Seems like we shut down government *twice* to try and gets cuts. What did Pelosi do? Oh that's right triple the deficit. ..

91 Boy, the campaign to derail Cain is very plain here.

92 When Reagan gave his valedictory speech at the 88 convention I wept. Actual tears. A grown man weeping over a politician leaving office.

He meant that much to me. I had almost lost hope after LBJ, Nixon and that Cocksucker Carter. Reagan gave it back to me.

Posted by: toby928© Perrykrishna with tattooed knuckles at November 08, 2011 09:23 PM (GTbGH

Rightious dude!

93 75 That is pretty creepy that ace knows conservatives that think Reagan was a dunce. I wonder how long they've been conservative? 5 minutes? Little late to the party, Bro?

Posted by: dagny at November 08, 2011 09:23 PM (nwxHD)

No - no one comes right out and says it but many commenters are quick to declare  their candidate Reagan-esque just for giving rah-rah conservative speeches even if they fumble the policy details. But really that's an insult to Reagan since he could give stirring speeches AND get down to policy nitty gritty.

Reagan-esque has been defined down.

94 The Herman Cain press debacle shows us that the media will not allow us to elect a conservative. They want Mitt.

95 "Reagan only got the nomination due to a grassroots revolt; the party establishment preferred Bush, even though Reagan had come in second four years earlier and thus it was, by the bigwigs' own tradition, his "turn." The establishment needs our votes, but they have to be dragged, kicking and screaming, into doing anything to earn them." The day fiscal conservatism died. When Reagan won the nomination, the party embraced deficit spending, baseline accounting, and an ever-growing national debt. They've never looked back.

96 Oh, and God less WFB Jr.

97

We lit a prairie fire a few years back. Those flames were fed by passionate ideas and convictions, and we were determined to make them run all-burn, I should say, all across America. And what times we've had! Together we've fought for causes we love. But we can never let the fire go out or quit the fight, because the battle is never over. Our freedom must be defended over and over again-and then again.

98 God Bless

99

So Ace,

Since Cain is too stupid to breathe, which one of the other super geniuses are we supposed to support?

Perry (who is "my guy") has shown nothing to be impressed over

Romney : don't worry if you don't agree with his position, it will change soon enough

Bachman, Paul : Whackjobs

Newt, Santorum : Raelly?

Huntsman : The only one I'd support Romney over

Cain : Damaged beyond repair with help from our own team

Who do you reccommend?

100

I'll say this again, we are fucked. Ohio, my state, is the perfect example. It has nothing to do with policy, and everything to do with knowledge.

Example: At my law school last week we had a formal debate, Oxford style. Guess what, the pro-issue 2 side won. AT A LAW SCHOOL!!!! Now how does that happen? Because once people heard the issues spoken clearly, they suddenly came to their senses.

Problem..the vast majority of the people in this country can't be bothered to take a minute and consider serious issues facing the country (and in this case, the state). All they need and all they get are the latest TV ads and maybe the front-page hit piece from the local paper.

We are fucked because we are ignorant and choose to be so.

101 Hitchens after accusing Mother Teresa of unspeakable crimes wrote a book called "God is not great". He's a piece of shit.

102 Barack Obama went to Harvard too.  Not only has Barry put the death peg in affirmative action I posit that Harvard has suffered a concussion at Barrys hands as well..

103 Will you vote for the person Herman Cain endorses when he drops out?

Don't know. Depends on whether I like them or not. Not being and idiot, who he does or doesn't endorse is irrelevant to me.

104 Get away, Jordan.

105 Reagan? Playoffs? Playoffs? We can't field a decent candidate and you're talking about--playoffs?!

106 I loved Ronnie, but he was clueless about the evil that is the Federal Reserve. 

It is standard operating procedure for the left to call the conservative a dunce.  Funny, GW Bush's grades were better than John Kerry's.  Didn't matter.  Obama's grades are secret.  Doesn't matter.  He is the "smartest guy in the room."  Now they pick on Rick Perry. 

I may not like Romney, but I will vote for him in the general election.  Obozo must be defeated or it is the end of the Republic.

107 The Herman Cain press debacle shows us that the media will not allow us to elect a conservative. They want Mitt. knew Cain was amateurish and couldn't handle a simple forward attack on his past. Thankfully they tanked him now rather than in the general.

FIFY

108

Also, Reagan could speak about religion without pandering or scaring non-religious people.

109 As for Perry, he called a special session of the legislature this year, in part to force consideration of his Sanctuary City elimination legislation.  Or -- more to the point -- to make it seem like he was doing something about sanctuary cities.

Try spending some time in a meeting with him asking him why he has done NOTHING to encourage the House to even take the legislation up and having him respond by throwing his hands up and stating, "Well, what can I do?"

Then you'll get an idea of why some people think he's not quite "all that."

They all kind of suck.

110 "Hitchens after accusing Mother Teresa of unspeakable crimes wrote a book called "God is not great". He's a piece of shit." He also wrote a biography of MT called "The Missionary Position," which asked the question why the millions of dollars she raised never found its way to the needy.

111   110 Will you vote for the person Herman Cain endorses when he drops out?

Don't know. Depends on whether I like them or not. Not being and idiot, who he does or doesn't endorse is irrelevant to me.
He's going to endorse Romney, but he's a true conservative.

112 Man, nothing quite gets the trolls' squeakholes itchin' like the mention of Reagan, eh? Posted by: Soap MacTavish at November 08, 2011 09:25 PM

Fuckin' a.  Apparently, that's the formula for getting the page view numbers up.

113 Speaking of Hitchens, has anyone else noticed that so many of the seething aggressive evangelical atheists are British?  It seems to me if they're real dickbags, its even odds they're Brits. 

114 They've never looked back.

Until they won the congress balanced the budget and produced a surplus.

FIFY

115 Reagan is friggin' awesome in that first video.  No candidate today has the depth and breadth some one like him held.

116 He's going to endorse Romney, but he's a true conservative.

If he endorses Romney it will mean I underestimated him as a politician.

117 Fuckin' a.  Apparently, that's the formula for getting the page view numbers up.

Posted by: rdbrewer at November 08, 2011 09:33 PM (nrinZ)

Could you run that formula by me again.....

118 Could you run that formula by me again.....

1. Stop banning your readership.
2. Stop..

119 incase anyone cares there is a big vote in Georgia today............ will we be able to buy beer on Sunday in a store for the first time ever? some of us votes yes on this one............

120 Yeah, none of our team can compare with Ronnie, but with the current state of the country, I'll still stick with Perry's and his hispandering as long as he keeps up the drill, baby, drill act.

121

"I'd much prefer an amiable Extraordinary man."

Reporting for duty!

122 Ace is a shill for Romney - you realise that a huge number of evangelicals are NOT going to vote for a mormon dont you?

123 at least Perry's hispandering will help in the generals. Cain's philandering won't be as helpful.

124 He also wrote a biography of MT called "The Missionary Position," which asked the question why the millions of dollars she raised never found its way to the needy.

Posted by: Jordan at November 08, 2011 09:33 PM (XJYf4)

Except that it did. He's a liar and a demon. She spent her life loving and helping the poorest people on earth.

125 125 He's going to endorse Romney, but he's a true conservative.

If he endorses Romney it will mean I underestimated him as a politician.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Camellia Sinensis Operative at November 08, 2011 09:35 PM (0q2P7)

Seeing as how Romney is the only other candidate Cain has really had glowing praise for, I'd say that endorsement is a shoe-in.

126 #102: Are you saying Poppy Bush was a better conservative than Reagan? Pardon me if I don't dignify such buffoonery with a response.

127

Ace is a shill for Romney

Posted by: Floral Bumhole at November 08, 2011 09:37 PM (HD6Li)

WRONG!

128 "Yeah, none of our team can compare with Ronnie, but with the current state of the country, I'll still stick with Perry's and his hispandering as long as he keeps up the drill, baby, drill act." ...increased Texas spending by almost 90% in ten years. During the same time period, Bush doubled the national debt.

129 "Ace is a shill for Romney - you realise that a huge number of evangelicals are NOT going to vote for a mormon dont you?" Being one, it has nothing to do with Romney being a Mormon, it has everything to do with him being an untrustworthy RINO.

130

"I'd much prefer an amiable Extraordinary man."

Reporting for duty!

I guess Gumby qualifies in some ways as *ahem* extraordinary. Did you ever consider that maybe you are too flexible?

131 The Shining.  I guess that happens to all bloggers

132 ...increased Texas spending by almost 90% in ten years. During the same time period, Bush doubled the national debt.

Posted by: Jordan at November 08, 2011 09:38 PM (XJYf4)

What does the first statement have to do with the second?

133 Of course Ace is a shill for Romney. he's talked about how we need a "moderate" to win over the "middle" for years. Are you new here?

134 He's going to endorse Romney, but he's a true conservative.

Itchin' for a fight aren't you? I'm not a Cainiac but feel free to live in the fantasy world of your choosing.

135 Mitt will protect our right to choose.

136 No I didn't, moron. Close to a ban, just making shit up. I am plainly in favor of Perry, though I am soft-pedaling that support. Fucking idiot. Why don't you disappear now so I don't have to formally ban you.

137 "What does the first statement have to do with the second?" Two Texas governors who promised to be fiscally conservative turned out to be spenders, just like Ronald Reagan.

138 Ace has been talking about "who could win" for years now.

139 Also, Reagan could speak about religion without pandering or scaring non-religious people. Posted by: Ben at November 08, 2011 09:32 PM

That's one thing I'd really like our guys to learn how to do.  It's great, f/x, that Perry is a religious man, but he's not running for preacher.  He needs to respect the fact some people out there aren't Christians.  Yeah, be a Christian. Fine. Just don't do those threatening, annoying things Christians who aren't running for president can do from time to time that non-Christians hate.

140 Mitt will address the urgent issues like global warming

141

Posted by: Floral Bumhole at November 08, 2011 09:40 PM (HD6Li)

We asked him in the previous thread. Romney seems to be choice no.4 

142 I guess Reagan should have not spent any money and let the Soviets take over the world? O, that's right, the tards would have liked that!!!

143 increased Texas spending by almost 90% in ten years. During the same time period, Bush doubled the national debt.

And Obama added the same amount in what? 3 years? Over achiever he is.

144 Mitt will push for Cap and Trade

145 Two Texas governors who promised to be fiscally conservative turned out to be spenders, just like Ronald Reagan.

you are still an idiot.

146 Perry, open borders you're heartless if you don't support in state tuition for illegals? Meh, he's not nearly as objectionable as Romney but damn we need someone to close the border not keep throwing it farther open.

147 Funny to think that Ronaldous was once governor of California. How the mighty have fallen

148 Just don't do those threatening, annoying things Christians who aren't running for president can do from time to time that non-Christians hate.

rdbrewer at November 08, 2011 09:41 PM (nrinZ)

That's an impossible task.  Non-Christians get the vapors over everything.

149 I guess Reagan should have not spent any money and let the Soviets take over the world? O, that's right, the tards would have liked that!!!
Posted by: dagny
........
Reagan did the right thing.  But let's not kid ourselves into thinking we have the same situation as Reagan faced.  We don't.  We have nearly doubled our defense spending over the last decade to no avail. We are mired in skirmishes with desert rabble.. and if ten years without a "win" means anything, we are losing.

150 "And Obama added the same amount in what? 3 years? Over achiever he is." Source? Obama hasn't come close to doubling the debt (as Bush did) or tripling it (as Reagan did). Give him another four years and he might double it, but it hasn't happened yet.

151 #145: Are you saying that W. and Perry claimed to be fiscal conservatives and turned out to be big spenders? Bush always said he was a "compassionate" conservative, not a fiscal conservative, and we haven't seen Perry's spending record as President yet.

152 "Source? Obama hasn't come close to doubling the debt (as Bush did) or tripling it (as Reagan did). Give him another four years and he might double it, but it hasn't happened yet." Bush debt for 8 years 4.9 trillion (horrible!) Obama has 4 trillion in just 3 years source: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20095704-503544.html

153 God I miss Ronald Reagan. He was my Commander-In-Chief for my entire stint in the US Marine Corps. I have never been prouder to be an American than the time I spent serving my country under him.

154 Troll uses slippery math of 'doubling' vs. real dollar increases to assert false equivalence.  Sorry, Jordan.

155 Two Texas governors who promised to be fiscally conservative turned out to be spenders, just like Ronald Reagan.

Okay,

1. Bush didn't promise to be a fiscal conservative.  That was the whole idea behind compassionate conservatism.  You might have hoped he would be, but his actions were completely predictable from the get-go.

2.  Reagan didn't have Republican control of the House, which last time I checked writes the spending bills.  He also did cut deals to decrease spending.  The primary tax increase that critics of him always cite was part of a deal that was supposed to be matched by 3 dollars in spending cuts for every 1 dollar of tax increases.  It wasn't his fault Democrats reneged on the deal.

156 "He was my Commander-In-Chief for my entire stint in the US Marine Corps." Lucky SOB, I entered the Army in 87, got the last bit of Reagan but then I had that SOB (still hate him) Bush41.

157
Oh, and fuck Hitchens.
Posted by: nickless




Don't worry.  I am all over this guy. He better put Rodger Ebert's cancer doc on speed dial right -- about -- nowish.
Posted by: God

158 Source? Obama hasn't come close to doubling the debt (as Bush did) or tripling it (as Reagan did). Give him another four years and he might double it, but it hasn't happened yet.

Posted by: Jordan

Obama has added more to the debt than did Bush in 8 years.

159 Listening to Reagan talk about the dangers of socialized medicine and how Democrats are pushing for it is chilling. All you have to do is change some names and it could have been said yesterday.

160 "Obama has added more to the debt than did Bush in 8 years." Source it. We're up about three T in four years. Bush upped the debt by 6T in eight. Obama is no model to emulate, but he's certainly no bigger a spender than Bush or Reagan.

161 Here a just a few of the STUPENDOUSLY COMMON putdowns of Reagan, from 1980 on: Shoots from the lip. Simplistic. Simple-minded. Anti-science. Unelectable (from Republicans) Irrational. Extremist. Ideologue. Uninterested in policy. Detached. Insulated. In denial of reality. Naive. War-monger. Dangerous, Dangerous, DANGEROUS!! Tool of the millionaires. Tool of the military. Tool of his staff. Provocative (to the USSR) Fascist. Hates the poor/homeless/minorities/women/young /old...hell, just an all-round HATER! DIVORCED! [that one was true] Radical. Won't run for re-election cause he knows he'll lose. [all-time Reagan "expert" Lou Cannon peddled that one for a whole year, 1983] Anyhoo, for a guy who was in actuality incredibly insightful and principled, he sure did attract a lot of vitriol. Hmmmmmmm...

162 "Plus this bonus, zero job growth for August." A hell of a lot better than Bush's record: -1.75 million private sector jobs. + 1.8 million public sector jobs.

163 "Source it. We're up about three T in four years. Bush upped the debt by 6T in eight. Obama is no model to emulate, but he's certainly no bigger a spender than Bush or Reagan." Already been sourced by me. See post 160, though Obama hasn't beat Bush yet, but it's dang close and he's only in year 3. By the end of his last year (next year) he will have passed Bush's total in half the time.

164 Whether we like it or not, Cain is done....toast.....it's over for him.  I'm not sure I would vote for him in the primary or not.  Newt.........well, Newt is Newt.  I'm sorry, but he's no Reagan - not by a long shot.  Newt is a thinker not an executive.  He sounds great in the debates and is probably the only candidate on the stage with a brain capable of critical thinking.  However, he would make a lousy president.  Romney (omfg) - unfortunately, he'll be our next candidate.  I see no path for anyone else at this point.  We'll just have to keep electing Tea-Party house members to keep him somewhere near the right path.  God help us all.

165

Step one: Get all us dweebs to believe we must find a Ronald Reagan lookalike to be the nominee.

Step two:  Get everyone to understand that our next great hope, in order to get elected in the general election needs to have been a democrat at some point in their past, just like Reagan.

Step three:  get us dweebs to support Perry, because like Reagan he is not a racist (well, against Mexicans anyhow) and our great Reagan also supported complete amnesty for illegal immigrants, and by the way, was a democrat like Reagan himself.

Step four:  Remind us that the democratic party of Reagan and Perry was the party of slavery and segregation so it is important that as a party we should sympathize with our newfound heroes and not even consider voting for a black man.

Step five:  Attack Cain all day, every day, presuming the guilt of any accusation flung at him until dweebs realize that he can't be trusted within 100 feet of our wives, sisters and daughters.

166 It is interesting that, from where I stand, a lot of the conservative movement has bought into the left's take on Reagan as an amiable empty-head.

Stop standing over there, I don't see that, I guess I hang around a different sort of conservative.

167 >>Source it. We're up about three T in four years. Bush upped the debt by 6T in eight. Obama is no model to emulate, but he's certainly no bigger a spender than Bush or Reagan.


The only way that's close to being true is if you attribute the 2009 deficit to Bush, but of course you can't since congress passed no budget, only continuing resolutions until the golden boy got into office. So add another $1.5 trillion to Obama, he was president wasn't he?

168 Obama hasn't come close to doubling the debt (as Bush did) or tripling it (as Reagan did). Give him another four years and he might double it, but it hasn't happened yet.

BTW, if you want to blame Reagan for the debt, it's worth pointing out federal revenue doubled in the '80s.

Link

The reason we still ran up a deficit was not because of tax cuts, but because no matter how much the government collected, it spent more.  Again, who was in charge of the part of the part of Congress responsible for writing the budget bills?  Answer: Not Republicans.  (And before you blame defense spending for this, the only way to eliminate the deficit that way would have been to get rid of the entire defense budget.)  In fact, Republicans lost control of the Senate in '86 because they tried to reign in Social Security.  So, it's a little hard to criticize the Republican record in the 80s vis-a-vis the Dems when it comes to fiscal matters.

Sure, I know it won't stop you.  Just warning you it's a little difficult, that's all.

169 The only thing Obama has done well is kill brown people and he had to lie his way into office so he could do it.

170 Oh look, it's Jordan the troll who exists only to try to get under the skin of conservatives.

Let me make this easy for you, Jordan.

Are Republicans big-spenders?  Yes.

Are Republicans in favor of fiscal conservatism?  Yes.

How are these two statements reconciled?  Because not all Republicans are identical.  Some favor spending a lot of money on things we don't really need, while some do not.

But here is the difference.  There is a large constituency on the right strongly in favor of fiscal conservatism.  Sometimes they get their way and sometimes they don't.  Notably, this constituency was extremely critical of W. Bush and his big spending ways.

So yeah, the fiscal hawks don't always get their way, but there is a dedicated band of people out there on the right continuing to apply pressure to Republicans to cut spending and get our fiscal house in order.

Where is the similar constituency on the left?  Where are the leftists who want to reduce spending and trim the deficit and stop us from going into bankruptcy and leaving a legacy of nothing but debt for our children?  About the only spending that liberals want to cut is defense, and then only based on some paranoid reading of Eisenhower's farewell speech, not based on any desire to avoid debt.

So yeah, we conservatives as a group are imperfect when it comes to reducing spending.  But we are a damn sight better than Team Blue, that's for damn sure.

You know this, of course, and yet you still attempt to needle conservatives into knee-jerk defense of individual Republicans rather than on the broad philosophy of fiscal conservatism.  Because you aren't here to debate issues.

So, in other words: GFY

171

Reagan was unusual.  He had an actor's training and talent for communication, a (true) democrat's respect for the working man and woman (in contrast to the entreprener), support for the entrepreneur's creativity and productivity, a Republican and Conservative desire for fiscal prudence, and a fundamental American belief that what the U.S. had to offer the world (and had offered) was a beautiful gift of freedom through strength.  He also had a bountiful optimism, not only of his character, but his time in history.  We remained affluent at the time; we had not spent our savings and destroyed the limit-setting fundamentals of a prudent financial system.

Today it is not the same.  Today we need someone who can say "no"; someone who has a record of saying "no".  I think Rick Perry is the only who has the credentials, plus the years of identifiable practice, to do this.  He, or someone like him, will have to stand the anger, resentment, and the hatred.  There is no way out of these reactions.  I trust him over anyone else whose history I have observed. 

The optimism needs to come with transition plans.  How do we get from massively in debt.  To poor.  To waiting for natural energy resourcs development to unleash entrepreneurial possibilities.  To a return to affluence. 

President Perry must use his executive power at the beginning to decrease the number of workers and funding of as many of the executive departments as he can.  And get energy resources developed.  And begin a balanced budget amendment process.  Bring sanity (if possible) to the financial sector.  How to transition with so many thrown out of work?   If we vanquish socialism, then there will be a massive number of government employees (including elites) who will need to transition. This is a plan that must be developed. Unemployed, hapless enemies are not a good thing.  (Imagine wanted here.)

For young people -- the art, sociology, political science, basket weaving majors with massive educational debt -- Perry might envision a boot camp of sorts.  Twelve hours per day rise-and-shine, exercise, breakfast, four hours of science and math classes for their future jobs, lunch on their own, four hours of community service, go home.  There should be many schools, preschools, nursing homes, public landscaping, all sorts of public jobs that our municipalities will be too poor to fund anymore.  How much better than Occupy WallStreet nonsense.  Let "them" have a choice.

I need more wine while I ponder the amazing President Reagan and wisdom he might offer us.

172 Yeah, Ace, no embedding of Reagan's A Time for Choosing?

Jeff: Being one, it has nothing to do with Romney being a Mormon, it has everything to do with him being an untrustworthy RINO.

Fuck, you guys are annoying. Reagan would be considered a "RINO" -- another fucking annoying term that needs to die.

Reagan was a former democrat that just within his first term as governor of California, he raised taxes and was an outspoken part of a "Stop Nixon" movement to undermine his support among the southern conservatives that was purely political and selfish; but that's the game and I respect him for it -- never-mind the most likely outcome was to boost Rockerfeller. Within 4 months he had signed the 'Therapeutic Abortion Act.' What do the arch-conservatives think of the fact that no-fiction divorce was first enacted in any state in CA, under Reagan? Got to love lowering that barrier, eh?

But, in my opinion, to a smart and objective student of history and biography, these positions are merely part of a remarkable thinkers evolution. It takes some contextual understanding of the time and circumstance the positions were staked in to understand why he made that decision, at that point in his arc through history. Many of these positions are sort of relativistic: they are dependent on not just the statesman's temporal, political, geographical  (etc) position, but the observers position.

And when you look over enough history, of enough people, of enough groups, you find patterns -- individual traits that are important and hold vastly more predictive power than other transient positions that are relative: things like intelligence and wisdom, dedication, motivation and articulation.

Now, apply that to 2012...

173 According to this gummint chart, Fed employment did not go up by 1M+ under Bush, Jordan, even including uniformed military. Only about 300K.

174 Reagan was unusual.  He had an actor's training and talent for communication, a (true) democrat's respect for the working man and woman (in contrast to the entreprener), support for the entrepreneur's creativity and productivity, a Republican and Conservative desire for fiscal prudence, and a fundamental American belief that what the U.S. had to offer the world (and had offered) was a beautiful gift of freedom through strength.  He also had a bountiful optimism, not only of his character, but his time in history.  We remained affluent at the time; we had not spent our savings and destroyed the limit-setting fundamentals of a prudent financial system.

Agreed. Very well put.

175 How long have folks here been predicting Cain's exit, only to look slackjawed at poll numbers thinking "how can this be" and wondering what the hell is up with their preferred candidate?

I'm pretty sure Perry's out looking around for someone who he possibly sexually harassed in the past.

176 Another reason Reagan made an exceptional president?

He wasn't an egotist, in it for the fame like so many other pathetic politicians are.  He was famous already.  If he''d just wanted to be famous, he could have stayed in Hollywood.
.
A narcissist like Clinton gravitated to politics for his vanity.

177 So I guess lil Jordan has slunk back under his rock?

178

So Ace:

How is you're approach different than Andrew Sullivan's?

He was for Bush when there was a glimmer of hope that Bush would approve gay marriage.

Guess Perry/Romney are for what.. exactly?

They both agree that Cain sucks?

You've nailed it !!!

179 Uriah Heep: I'd love to hear how Romney is a conservative. This should be amusing. And please be sure to post his waffle for any position he has stated a conservative view on. Lets face it, he talks a nice game but when he was Governor his actions did not meet his claims he is making now.

180 Cain just bumbled himself into 30 minutes on national TV, speaking clearly and forcefully to The Highest Media, with a background of bright American flags behind him. Remember what they used to say about Reagan's imagery? That Cain, whatta foooool.

181 According to this gummint chart, Fed employment did not go up by 1M+ under Bush, Jordan, even including uniformed military. Only about 300K.

The thing that always amazes me is that, when guys like this have it pointed out to them that their facts are wrong, at no point does it occur to them to quit trusting the people who gave them those facts in the first place.

Jordan, doesn't that bug you?

Doesn't ever occur to you that if the people you listen to are bullshitting you, maybe 1.) you should stop listening to them and 2.) they're on the wrong side of the argument?

182 Let's just assume it's a Cain-bashing post unless otherwise stated. Should be a real time saver.

183 I think I recognize that Brit punk--his name was Kim Philby!

184

And yet you were also an early basher of Sarah Palin because she was somewhat inarticulate. Do think these rhetoricians come fully formed from brow the brow of fuckin Zeus?

Review what Regan wrote and said early in his GOP career. He was welll to the right of Goldwater for the Christ's sake. You remember Golwater "Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice" in other words fuck it if we have to nuke some commies. 

Would you have had the guts to stand up to CCR  and the rest of the popular culture assholes when they sang things like "Ronnie the popular says it's communist plot"and turned Regan into a joke. Or would you have said "well they say he's unelectable so let's go for that nice Bob Dole he seems more stable than crazy Ronie" in 76. Like you did with the Tina Fey parodies of Sarah Palin.

This is not a one time thing with you Ace. You go weak tea establishment every fuckin time. Your a nice guy Ace but when it comes down to it you don't have the guts to fight, fear drives you, you are whenit comes down to it more afraid to lose than anything else.

In other words you are a coward.

 

 

 

 

Fear drives you, at heart you are a coward.

185 Late to  the party, but want to address Ace 's earlier post about having no "great conservative candidate". Reagan was clearly a great conservative candidate. So I assume that Ace meant no "great conservative candidate" in this cycle. But the main point is that we want to elect "committed" conservative candidates. We would be happy to have a great one like Reagan, but we love Reagan because he was committed to conservatism. His communication skill is just the icing on the cake even though it was important. The "great" candidate syndrome led to Chris Christie instead Bob McDonnell for example. No one was mistaken that Algore or Kerry was great liberal candidate. But we knew that they were committed leftists. Maybe it is more accurate to say that it is easier to find committed leftists than committed conservatives because of the corruption of power. Just like the ring of Sauron. Only a few can resist its lust for power.

186

"I'd much prefer an amiable Extraordinary man."

 

Lol, let us all know when you find that man Ace!  Regan is dead and if he was alive he probably couldn't help us.  He may be a once in a lifetime president.

I don't understand your PANIC! Hermain Cain has a weak political machine and he is inexperienced.  Mark Block is an idiot and should be fired after his baseless accusations, see any irony there.  So why go all in on what appears to be a hatchet job he said she said.  I am not convinced he will be the nominee, but I won't savage him about events a decade ago without real evidence. 

187 Expect nothing less from Perry's fairies spreading their imaginary pixi dust of disdain.

188 Breaking News: Reagan STILL Dead (And After All These Years) Also, I give that "Ryan As Policy Wonk" meme a year at most. The Ryan Budget should never have been put up in the House for a loyalty test; it should have been a real vote for real policy or it should have been left alone. The DC Appeals Court decision is being spun like a crazed neutrino, but these are the facts: 1. the single most conservative judge on the entire court upheld the mandate, based strictly on existing case law binding on every federal court below the Supreme Court; 2. another conservative judge agreed with #1, but with very short reasons emphasizing the general view that there are in fact limits to the federal power over interstate commerce, but that the court just didn't have one of those before it in this case; and 3. a third conservative judge dissented but only on jurisdiction, preferring to see the mandate as an expression of Congress' taxation power, which, due to existence of another law called the Anti-Injunction Act, cannot be challenged by any one until he or she is actually called on to pay that tax - in other words, he punted. Over at Volokh Conspiracy, which is always the go-to site for the full range of legal beagle boy reactions ranging all the way from centrist to conservative, a) lead blogger Orin Kerr, a (maybe I should say "the" centrist) is dancing an "I told you so" jig, which is fair, because he did in fact told us so right from before the first challenge to the mandate was filed; but even as he continues to double down on his win streak by saying he expects either Scalia or Kennedy is going to write something very like what Silberman has written, Kerr concedes the SCOTUS is of course different, in that, unlike all the courts below it, it is not strictly bound by its own prior opinions), while b) ultracon puisne regular blogger Randy Barnett got so upset he chose not to allow any comments, while c) wonky mediumcon puisne regular blogger Ilya Suriakin, uh, Somin, IS allowing reader comments, but while he says he mostly agrees with Barnett, ach, he's heding. In a follow-up, Kerr dove into the (technical) dissent, that the whole case was "premature", which opens an entirely new tin of salty sardines: that if a majority of the SCOTUS were to pluck this line of reasoning from all the choices that are going up to it for next spring, then that means the whole issue of the mandate under the interstate commerce power could get ducked, and forever, on the basis that the Congress definitely DOES have the taxing power to impose the mandate. All of which suggests the Obama administration and the previous Dem Congress CHOSE to put this as an exercise in interstate commerce rather than get attacked for raising taxes at a time when Keynes would say is the worst of all possible times to raise taxes, namely in a recession. And can I just speak briefly to my admiration for the way in which Governor Haley Barbour was able to escape that stupid "personhood" trap? I'm quite serious about this: Barbour came out with a statement a little while back saying the dang thing was a dangerous trap (It's a trap!), then when the opposition started using his statement in a robocall, he went after that and got them to stop using it while making a kinda backhanded endorsement of the dang thing, which in the end got the message out and the trap was avoided. I got to say that, leave aside anything else you might want to say about Haley Barbour, that is one smart, wired-in dude, and a hell of a lot smarter than the whole bunch of the GOP presidential candidates currently running combined.

189

Today it is not the same.  Today we need someone who can say "no"; someone who has a record of saying "no".  I think Rick Perry is the only who has the credentials, plus the years of identifiable practice, to do this.  He, or someone like him, will have to stand the anger, resentment, and the hatred.  There is no way out of these reactions.  I trust him over anyone else whose history I have observed. 

Posted by: pyromancer76 at November 08, 2011 10:09 PM (i0aYq)

I like Perry too.  One problem: when is he going to start running an actual campaign?

Perry needs to provide evidence that he's going to win the nomination before anyone should talk about what President Perry will do.

Same with Romney: the last best evidence we have of his electability is that he failed to beat John McCain even when the entire weight of the "Anybody But McCain" sentiment swung behind him.

Same with all of the GOP candidates.  Before we select a presumptive nominee and set to work cutting down all the other contenders, maybe we should see who actually gets real, countable votes in the initial caucuses and primaries.

190 The best policy is to obtain consent before groping the midriff or genital area.

191 I'd love to hear how Romney is a conservative. This should be amusing. And please be sure to post his waffle for any position he has stated a conservative view on. Lets face it, he talks a nice game but when he was Governor his actions did not meet his claims he is making now.

Oh come on. Lets be intellectually honest: He is clearly a conservative, but as is crystal clear, just not as conservative as you'd like.

In terms of positions, lets set up the generalized framework so you can stop with the insentient 'RINO' comments. Modern conservatism (post-Goldwater, as embodied by the measuring stick of Reagan) are adequately measured with three variables, on three axises: social, defense and economics.

Romney is a strictly defense and economics axis proposition; and frankly, he rocks it. To look at him via any other paradigm is to lead you to the types of sexual frustration you currently feel.


People here want another Reagan, 'who is our Reagan?' is all you hear. Lets be honest, Ronald Reagan was the ultimate solution for the problems of the 1980s, and his positions on those three variables mapped to what the United States needed and desired. What we, in 2012, need isn't another Ronald Reagan, but the next Reagan, for the problems of our period.

The landscape has changed in the last 30 years,even if you haven't. The solution to our time needs to fix our economy, our countries finances, our nation-states hierarchy and stabilize the defense of state. Period.

I'm sorry to tell you this, but the social aspect is currently a losing proposition: big time. The polling and demographic data show it. The smart play, for anyone who thinks strategically and desires social change, is to realize that societal change will not happen by presidential fiat: no matter how eloquent a speaker, no matter how deeply they embody your beliefs. People will rise up and rebel: look at Obama in 2010. Societal change today happens in the judiciary, it happens in the Congress. I don't think Romney will disappoint in terms of naming replacements.

He is conservative where it matters in our decade:

(1) His business and economic background, at Salt Lake City 2002, at Bain Capital is first rate. There is nothing to say here: nobody compares. His recent plans for entitlement reform are stellar.

(2) His defense policies outlined in his book and speeches (ie. most recently at the Citadel) are inline with mainstream modern conservative policy and thought. NMD policy, Russia and Chinese containment are all first rate, especially in regards to Chinese far-east ascension. Israel is strong, border security is strong.

His weakness are in Massachusetts healthcare, which is a non-starter as most of us are Federalists who believe that nationalized programs are generally less efficient than more distributed solutions which can map closer to the underlying population.

Romney's national plans for leading the country differ from the solution he came up with for a single state -- which the obvious way a federalist would approach the problem. Why this is even a problem still baffles me. Any true federalist would understand this division.

I don't care about the rest. Polling shows, 300+ electoral votes don't either.

192 Progressives have been calling conservatives stupid since forever.  To wit:

"A conservative is a man who sits and thinks, mostly sits."  Woodrow Wilson.

193 Yada yada yada. Ace h8s Cain. Ffsakes, we get it. Fu*k you, Ace. Any grownups concerned with broader views have anything interesting to say about something relevant, like, umm, Iran and their Bomb? Y'know, like the rest of teh WORLD is talking about?

194

Romney invented Obamacare, isn't that enough for you, Uriah?  What kind of person thinks it is okay for the government, whether it's federal or a state, to force someone to buy something?

Here are some clues:  A Marxist, A Dictator, A Fascist....

Romney is a non-starter, if he is the nominee, he will be just as bad as Obama, a President that thinks he could run us over with his mandates. 

 

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196 Ace, It seems to me that you're coming (perhaps unconsciously) around to Gingrich. And I think that's a good thing. Thoughts? Hangups?

197 "…if (Romney) is the nominee, he will be just as bad as Obama…" Posted by: doug at November 09, 2011 12:04 AM (gUGI6) Dear lord are you really that stupid? He's not really my guy (I don't have one yet), but wow. You think Romney (who's promised he's going to be a conservative president—whether he's to be believed or not), is going to be as bad as one of the most Marxist, dictatorial president we've had? If Romney ended up being president you really think he'd govern 180 degrees from what he's promising in every debate? You think he'd get away with that? I know why Ace is pissed. It seems like the whole world's gone fucking apeshit crazy.

198

The lies about Romney just will not die.  I do not know how this will end--when there is just a huge number of people who have totaly bought into the lies.  No matter how much, or how often, the truth is shown them, they are completely blind to it.  It is willful blindness when it comes to Romney.

Redstate and the like, are like programmed, brainwashed borgs or something.  The truth just does not matter to them.  They just WANT the lies to be true, so badly, that they have created this whole other Romney that doesn't exist!  And they hate him. 

But the real Romney, the flesh and blood one that doesn't kill with his stare... that guy, could use their help and support.

How can these people like Erick Eicksen be deprogrammed?  There must be a way.  Maybe this country really can't be saved.

Reagan was Reagan, one man, he can't be recreated, that time is over, gone, not coming back.

But Romney will be a very decent President.  He may even be great.  This is our time.  Romney's time.  Let the ghosts go.

It is a shame, we could be on the verge of one of the greatest times in history, yet, there is a segment of this party that will totally miss it, because they have been brainwashed into hating Romney.  What a shame.

199 Romneycare folks, as Governor he mandated that his constituents purchase healthcare or pay a fine.

200 Romneycare folks, as Governor he mandated that his constituents purchase healthcare or pay a fine. Posted by: doug at November 09, 2011 01:46 AM (gUGI6) Did he say somewhere that he'd install 'Romneycare' as President? Did I miss that? As far as the debates I've seen he's said that he'd destroy Obamacare as one of his first priorities. I get it. It was romneycare was a bad idea & one of the reasons I'd have to work a little to come around on him. But how is that worse than Cain saying abortion was a personal choice? Both bad statements, but Cain is the second coming of Palin (Praise be unto her) & Romney is the antichrist. Cain's never governed anything. His statements have me wondering (& not in a good way) about how he'd govern.

201 Posted by: pyromancer76 at November 08, 2011 10:09 PM

Before Perry got sidetracked, he was saying all the right things.  For example, he said he felt like his job would be to make the federal government as small as possible in our daily lives.  Or something like that.  He had a cool way of saying it.  But I only heard it once or twice.  Whatever, it was, it was a great message.  THAT is the plan.  Not this energy thing.

Just cut and paste from the Reagan playbook.  The Bush's were too arrogant to do so.  They knew better.  They were kinder and gentler.  I want to be kinder and gentler too.  That's why I give kids all the cake they want.  Because the important thing is not what's good for them or, say, the the country; it's people thinking I'm kinder and gentler.  At least I'll go down in history as kind and gentle.  To heck with the Constitution and what this country was founded on; I want to be seen as kind and gentle.

Anyway.  It's time to get back to what Reagan started.  And the fact is, Reagan was kind and gentle. Those qualities have nothing to do with bigger government.

I was listening to Reagan the other day and wondering why another conservative can't sound like that.  Why can't they pick up those themes?  Hell, steal them. Own them.  Proclaim them to the heavens. Is it that hard?  Do it!  It's been over 20 years, and no one has picked up the Reagan playbook. 

Seems like a no-brainer.

Reagan won-over moderates, and he never once pandered to them.  He just lead.  And what did the moderation of Bush 41 and 43 buy them?  Look what it did for Bush 41, for example.  Nothing. Republicans can't buy votes.

Finally, Reagan didn't alienate people by hitting them over the head with his Christianity.  Perry needs to understand that not everyone wants to hear about his religion.  It makes non-Christians nervous.  People will know anyway by his words and deeds.  Also, there's something undignified about wearing it on one's sleeve to secure votes.

It's sitting right there.  The Reagan playbook.  It worked.  Pick it up. 

202 Goddamn it, Ace. I don't object to you preferring someone other than Cain, but you consistently underestimate him. I'm not impressed by him on foreign policy and he tends to over-complicate simple questions due to what is probably a fear of being misunderstood (I have the exact same problem with my communication abilities). But he is, in fact, very intelligent. I defy anybody to disagree after watching his epic takedown of Bill Clinton in this televised 1994 health care town hall.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WP5dYfBBzU

My opinion on why he performed so very well in 1994 and yet appears poorly prepared today is in fact that he is poorly prepared for the situations he has been in of late. Personally that doesn't mean very much to me though; the Trivial Pursuit nature of modern political debates plus the relentlessness of the liberal media as it goes through its death throes has all of absolute dick to do with evaluating a candidate's positions or their suitability as president, c.f. Barack Obama.

But when Cain is prepared? He made a "charismatic" sitting president appear like a fool on national television, and displayed an ability to relate very clearly why central planning is the ruination of an economy.

Please note that he did this without a smile, without any folksy charm.

Cain is hardly an amiable everyman.

203 We asked him in the previous thread. Romney seems to be choice no.4

Behind Huntsman no less.

204

(1) His business and economic background, at Salt Lake City 2002, at Bain Capital is first rate. There is nothing to say here: nobody compares.

Posted by: Uriah Heep at November 08, 2011 11:40 PM (YW11a)

I always roll my eyes when I read something like that, about Romney OR Cain. Being a businessman, successfull or not, doesnt make you a conservative, it makes you a pragmatist. A pragmatist is not a conservative. I like it when politicians had real jobs, worked in the private sector. Its a plus in general and especially in questions of experience and competency. But its not a surrogate for having an ideological foundation. Reagan was great because he had such a foundation, knew and understood his political positions and was ready to fight for them. You cant say anything like that about our "conservative" businessmen Cain and Romney.    

205 But this idea that "authenticity" means "lack of detailed policy knowledge" is risible. Hey, guess what? Mitt Romney has a lack of detailed policy knowledge, interest, and vision. Anyone from Massachusetts already knows that.

206 I can't help but notice no one's been linking any, none, ever, videos of Mitt Romney, or any examples, to make the case for the sharpness and fluency that are prerequisites for a nominee, which are always lacking in the everymen. And it's not like we have to reach back forty-five years into the dark ages of media.

207

Some of Ace's better stuff.  Still not impressed with a single charge against Cain the predator.

Block is an imbecile.

208
220

Some of Ace's better stuff.  Still not impressed with a single charge against Cain the predator.

Block is an imbecile.

Posted by: icepick at November 09, 2011 06:05 AM (o0Uno)

If block is an imbecile , why does Cain keep him. And it was block who walked back the accusations against Perry , while Cain were still insisting it was perry behind the "smear" attacks.
This is amateur circus.

209

It's sitting right there.  The Reagan playbook.  It worked.  Pick it up. 

Posted by: rdbrewer at November 09, 2011 02:33 AM (nrinZ)

Fake or for real , Palin tried.

210

Posted by: BuddyPC at November 09, 2011 05:59 AM (JjjnQ)

 This place isnt exactly crawling with Romneybots.

211

I ask again whether Ace has taken the trouble to listen to any of Herman Cain's speeches or better radio episodes linked by verum serum last week.  If he had, he would know that Cain is not an amiable everyman, he has a unique understanding of the founding, Constitution, Declaration of Independence and the role of the Federal Government AND an ability to clearly articulate these things.  These are the important things one must understand to perform the role of Chief Executive, not the policy minutiae that Ace keeps harping on.

I also note that Ace has dedicated this post not to any discussion of the charges against Cain, which he apparently accepts at face value w/o factual basis, but to further argue against Cain's qualifications.  In other words, this is a dedicated post focusing on a gratuitous slam on Cain. 

This blog has become Johnsonesque in its fixation on delegitimizing Herman Cain.  Ace is unfamiliar with either the facts of the allegations against Cain, or Cain's background, but that won't stop him from taking him down.

212 Ace, your Cain obsession is ruining the blog. Obviously, it is your blog, and you can go as Charles Johnson as you want, but I'm disappointed.

213 I still find it sad that the "Perry can't communicate" meme is still going strong.  Wrong - Perry may not perform well in the American Idol debates - but if some of you would take the time to watch his recent interviews you would find that he does communicate quite well and sounds - well - Reaganesque.  Google and watch his recent ABC interview with Christiane Amanpour for some proof.  Also the whole "Perry needs to start running a real campaign" meme is equally stupid.  The man is doing just that.  Cain's feckless behavior the past couple of weeks has taken the spotlight off everybody else - but enough with this nonsense about Perry.  Again - why is Mittens running ads against him?  When slicky-boy starts running them against Cain I might give a little credence to the notion that Cain is a threat. 

214 Why repeat the video?

215

yomomma,

How is Romneycare different than Cain saying abortion is a family's choice? 

Let me count the ways:  Romneycare is an edict by someone who thinks he alone can force you to do something.....evidently that is what you want in an emperor.  Cain's statement, even if you hear it as you do, completely out of context, still says that you have the choice and the President cannot force you to do something or not to do something.

So, yomomma, would you rather have a President that thinks he can force you to do something, or one that knows he cannot?  To me it's a no brainer, Romney CANNOT be a President, but only an emperor and that is not for the U.S.

216

"I do not see how we're to have all these changes in policy with a leader who is so uninterested in policy he doesn't know the basics of it.

"Reagan understood policy -- perhaps not down to the wonkish detail of Paul Ryan, but more than just the basics."

How many policies will be changed with someone -- whose name I shall not repeat but whose initials are Slick Willard -- who has no beef with the policies, and thinks he can "make them work?"

If I must choose one or the other, I choose the one who at least sees that things as they are have gone off the rails.

217 "According to this gummint chart, Fed employment did not go up by 1M+ under Bush, Jordan, even including uniformed military. Only about 300K. The thing that always amazes me is that, when guys like this have it pointed out to them that their facts are wrong, at no point does it occur to them to quit trusting the people who gave them those facts in the first place. Jordan, doesn't that bug you? Doesn't ever occur to you that if the people you listen to are bullshitting you, maybe 1.) you should stop listening to them and 2.) they're on the wrong side of the argument?" Chart doesn't show state hiring, which is where most of the bloat occurred. Most of the added government jobs were security-related, and paid for by a flood of federal money post-911. Thanks for playing.

218 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

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