1 And that's why Uncle Ron should never be president.  In some ways, he'd be worse than Obama.

2 We have nothing to fear of the Iranians

3 Boom!

4

Uproared!!!!

5 oh and Russia is still rattling the sabers that they might retaliate if something where to happen to Iran

6 And of course, Israeli intel has been saying this all along. And the rest of the world blew them off. Their just war mongers etc. ya know. I need Beck's duct tape.

7 Might also explain our haste to reduce our troop footprint in Iraq and AStan.

8 And we continue to dismantle our inventory...

9 Things tend to go BOOM in the night. Especially in the desert. BOOM

10
We have nothing to fear of the Iranians


http://tinyurl.com/7a34fru

11

This is worrisome. Israel can't stop Iran's nuclear program.

People are looking for a replay of what Israel did in 1981 with the Osiraq Reactor or 2003 with the Syrian Reactor.

It's not that simply Iran is a massive country with fortified nuke sites spread all around. Some are near heavily populated areas. Also, in order to get to Iran, Israel would have to fly over several unfriendly Arab countries.

Israel can't do this. Only one country can do this and we're not going to do it.

12 Ann Coulter said " we have the worst intelligence services in the world." I think she hit that nail on the head.

13 "...the collective judgement of the US intelligence community..."

...Was to say what they were told to say by their political masters.

And if it means the deaths of a few hundred thousand Israelis? Big fucking deal. They're only Jews. It's not as if they are Muslims.

14 Last night batchelor did an extensive segment on this.  He scared the crap out of me when he said "of course, if you think we aren't telling you everything we know you are right, it would be irresponsible, watch the news"

15 They're ... yikes

16 *simple

17 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

18 Oh and fuck the people who did the 2007 NIE. We could have solved this problem then and possibly destabilized the Iranian gov't enough for the green revolution to take over.

19 Iran is a tiny country.  We have nothing to fear from them.

20 5 oh and Russia is still rattling the sabers that they might retaliate if something where to happen to Iran

Russia is acting as Iran's Godfather when it comes to circumventing sanctions and providing Iranians arms and nuke technology.

Russian FM warns against any military strike on Iran

21 Also, in order to get to Iran, Israel would have to fly over several unfriendly Arab countries. Israel can't do this. Only one country can do this and we're not going to do it. Jeherico III and "Popeye Turbo"

22 If Iran wants a nuke, why don't we just give the a few IYKWIMAITYD

23 And that's the kind of dipshit foreign policy illiteracy that excludes Ron Paul from being considered a legitimate candidate, really, for any office higher than he already has. Its almost impossible to imagine someone with a worse grasp of foreign policy than the SCOAMF TOTUS, but Ron Paul for the win.

24 cat piss and human feces......you might want to clean that up.......

25 The CIA has always been a shitty organization.  We should go back to the OSS.

26 22 I like how you think!!!

27 OK.

Israel and Pakistan are not "on the threshold".

They have nuclear weapons.

They both have religious elements that welcome doomsday.

Any questions?

28

[12Ann Coulter said " we have the worst intelligence services in the world."
I think she hit that nail on the head. ]

No, I think the phrase is "willfully ignorant." 

29 It's from DEBKA *insert standard disclaimer here*, but here's some general info RE: Iranians and nukes:

How the US and Israel let Iran get a nuclear arms capability

30 This is almost certainly a cover for the Zionist warmongers in DC to start yet another war for oil ...

Democrat president?

Never mind.

31

Some are near heavily populated areas

 

Civilian casualties are not our concern, dude.

32

Well...just make friends with them!

DUH!

 

33
Has a nice ring to it, "the glass flats of Iran".

34 Chuckit - the difference being Israel can deliver theirs by ballistic missle, submarine cruise missile, bombers, or UAV; the Pakistani's are hiding theirs in delivery vans.

35 They both have religious elements that welcome doomsday.

Posted by: Chuckit at November 07, 2011 10:31 AM (/hAyA)

Really? This analysis is based on your vast knowledge of the various orthodox religious sects in Israel?

Fucking idiot.

36
If China gets them, we'll really be f*cked.

37 Any questions?

Posted by: Chuckit at November 07, 2011 10:31 AM (/hAyA)

 

Why do you wear red suspenders, anyway?

38

Posted by: Chuckit at November 07, 2011 10:31 AM (/hAyA)

 

oh, and fuck you you anti-semitic bastard.

39
Glass parking lots are shovel-ready projects. I'm just sayin'.

40 31. No, just call it very late term abortion The leftys will go for it then

41

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at November 07, 2011 10:29 AM (9hSKh)

yeah, they've got so much shit that they're not supposed to be selling in that country. Same with France on a lesser extent

42 1 They were promoted to higher rank in the State Department (Van Deepen shows up in the wikileaks, 'surprised about Chinese missile proliferation) ando other sgencies..The NIE didn't include Mousavian's letter to the Ayatollah, that told them how they had fooled the quarter.

43 nope she said worst "Gee, that's weird -- because I remember being told in December 2007 that all 16 U.S. intelligence agencies had concluded that Iran had ceased nuclear weapons development as of 2003. At the time of that leak, many of us recalled that the U.S. has the worst intelligence-gathering operations in the world. The Czechs, the French, the Italians -- even the Iraqis (who were trained by the Soviets) -- all have better intelligence. Burkina Faso has better intelligence -- and their director of intelligence is a witch doctor. The marketing division of Wal-Mart has more reliable intel than the U.S. government does."

44 meant "India", but there are several other choices... 

Nuclear weapons aren't going away.

45 Any questions?

Does that crayon up your nose hurt?

46 Printing my Obama lied, People died poster.

There is no doubt that the Iranians would be pursuing nukes, same as Saddam wanted.  How far along they are is the question and whether their progress is really the point.

This has the smell of the same IAEA that manipulated reports on Iraq and in now doing the same as Iran.  I would rather just see them say ok these people are bad and have the ability to destabilze the world, lets get em nukes or not.  Which is the real truth. But I guess govts need fancy reasons.

47 Posted by: Chuckit at November 07, 2011 10:31 AM (/hAyA)

Actually, Israel doesn't have that big a sect that "welcomes doomsday."  Israel is one of the most secular "religious" countries in the world.  I would be surprised if they had a much larger percentage of people who "welcome doomsday" than we do here in the States.

Also, attempting to equate Israel with Pakistan (let alone Iran) is obtuse, at best, and positively revolting in any case.

48

@NavyCopJoe

IKWYM

I still like the idea someone on here had a few years ago -- pick a desolate mountaintop somewhere near Tehran and just hit it with a MOAB -- not even a nuke, just a MOAB -- then, remind them we have a few thousand nukes many many many times more powerful.

Just for the record.

My thought is that Israel should THEN say, "Hey, nice Mecca and Medina you have there, Musselman world. Be a shame if anything were to happen to them..."

Why we continue to play games with these savages in the name of "diplomacy" is beyond me.

49 OT: yo Garrett, the mini-her has discovered prong She can do snap your fingers snap your neck My pissed off rocker

50 I guess all that's left to ask is, "What did Holder know about Project Nukerunner and when did he know it?"

51

I think this would be an appropriate moment to pause and remind ourselves that the collective judgement of the US intelligence community is that Iran stopped developing a military track to it's nuclear program some years ago.

All one has to do is remember who was President then. That assessment was an obvious hit job and nobody with a grain of common sense believed it.

52 I have this relative, complete Paulian, Buchananite, etc. loon. I don't he has ever actually met a Jew and known it - but the hate was there. He has come to realize the mythical "Jew" he hates - also hates Israel - WOW - he now has realized he hates rich, liberals who want to manage the world, regardless of their professed religion (or actually, their grandparents faith). Thanksgiving might be tolerable this year.

53 Tehran is actually located in a geographic bowl. that's the type of terrain that is ideal of a nuke to go off.

54 Why no flaming skull thread on Cain's FOURTH accuser coming forward and making a statement in a little while?

55 Has Barry called Iran's Supreme Leader to congratulate him on getting nukes?

56 Vic, All one has to do is remember who was President then. That assessment was an obvious hit job and nobody with a grain of common sense believed it. Also recall, that assessment was part of the ABMs in eastern europe goat rope. Lots of people did not want an Iranian bogeyman.

57 So much for the leftist drumbeat that Iran is "years away" from making this happen.

Funny, huh?  They start with "such-and-such is years away," and then, before you know it, "such-and-such" only months or weeks away.  Almost like time moves, or something.

Though the left never seems to figure this out.  It's like (from when they started talking nearly 10 years ago) that Iran was "years away" from having nukes, that they'd never get closer than "years away."  As if Iran would treat it's search of nuclear weapons like the left treats drilling for oil domestically (that is: it's "years away," so there's no reason to pursue it now).

58 56 he's planning on hugging him.....

59 he's planning on hugging bowing deeply to him.....

fixed.

60 Why no flaming skull thread on Cain's FOURTH accuser coming forward and making a statement in a little while?

Because when the first "accuser" wimped out last Friday, it pretty well cleared Herman Cain.  She'd have to have some mammoth evidence to get the speculation moving again.  That, and most people with enough neurons to form a synapse realize that Gloria Allred is media whore of the first order, and that facts are secondary to sensationalism in the people she represents.

61 Gonna be hard to blame the Jews on this one I think But knowing the MFM, they'll give it a shot

62 Obama and Ron Paul know what we have to do facing such disastrous developments: Making sure that Israel isnt hurting anybody.

63

I for one, will welcome our new Iranian overloards.

A friendly bunch, they are.

 

64 And you've already used the "Doom" title for the day.

65 OK, here's the deal.  We let Iran have Iraq and nuclear weapons then they won't hate us anymore.

66 This is where I lose Ron Paul, I want to pull troops out of places like France, and Germany, and Japan, I also want to rebuild those bases here in America along our own foreign borders especially around (New York, Michigan, California). And be open to the fact that Israel, while certainly our ally, has a corrupt government same as everywhere else. That said, his leftists pre-obama view of the middle east and his associations with anti-Israel groups is why I no longer donate money to him. His son Rand, as far as I am aware, seems to be a better balance.

67 Did anyone actually BELIEVE the intelligence that Iran wasn't developing nukes?  And by "anyone" I of course mean, "anyone with an ounce of functioning brain matter and a body temperature above 85 degrees Farenheit." 

68 But knowing the MFM, they'll give it a shot

Well, those noble Iranians wouldn't feel the need to pursue nuclear weapons if the could be sure of the peaceful intentions of those hyper-expansionist Jews.  If the Jews would just accept a Palestinian State- and cede them Jerusalem plus half of the current territory of Israel, we would have peace and flowers and rainbows and unicorn-farts in the Middle East.

69

 

61 Why no flaming skull thread on Cain's FOURTH accuser coming forward and making a statement in a little while?

 

She'd have to have some mammoth evidence to get the speculation moving again

Oh... I got the mammoth evidence alright! 

70 Maybe it would be better if we weren't everyone's enemy. 

Wouldn't it better if we turned Russia into everyone's enemy?  How hard would that be?  Wouldn't that save us thousands of lives, and billions of dollars?

71 Did anyone actually BELIEVE the intelligence that Iran wasn't developing nukes?

I didn't.

72

Oh... I got the mammoth evidence alright! 

Posted by: Accuser #4 at November 07, 2011 10:48 AM (8ieXv)

I doubt that. BUT she has Gloria Allred!

73 Did anyone actually BELIEVE the intelligence that Iran wasn't developing nukes?

Me, neither.

74 61 Why no flaming skull thread on Cain's FOURTH accuser coming forward and making a statement in a little while? worse she's represented by Gloria Allred that destroys all the accusers credibility. that woman's a political hack of the highest order. or lowest i guess.

75 Notice the Western media stopped reporting much of anything on Iran after we dropped stuxnet on them.  Because they've given us every indication since that they will obtain offensive nuclear weapons capability or die trying.

I've always believed that one of the reasons the Japanese Empire was so brutal is that they were just barely holding on to half their own populace, especially their young.  Iran has the same problem, and internal problems are quite often the catalyst for external warfare.

If there's an upside to any of this, it's that nobody likes Persians.

76 Why no flaming skull thread on Cain's FOURTH accuser coming forward and making a statement in a little while?

Hiring Gloria Allred isn't exactly a credibility boost.

77 I wouldn't bet against Israeli when they are backed into a corner.

78

Wasn't there some rumor that Israel was going to be doing a little something something tomorrow after this report comes out?

Gimme an M!  Gimme an E!  Gimme a T!  Gimme an E!  Gimme an O!  Gimme an R!  What's that spell?  METEOR!  Goooooooo meteor!

Speaking of, isn't there an aircraft carrier sized asteroid that's within the moon's orbit but totes won't be hitting the Earth zooming by tomorrow night?  Maybe Israel can blame those wee splosions on that.

 

79

No need to panic, Preznint 5-Iron's got it covered.

 

80 How hard would that be?

Well, first, we would have to stop being the worlds biggest economy and the worlds most powerful military force.

I'm stopping right there, because I'm not willing to pay those prices.

81 We are everyone's enemy ????????? Holy uproared much be I ...

82 I heard an interview with Ron Paul this morning on the local talk radio station. Ron basically said that our dealings with Iran should be just like those with Canada. The fact he can equate the two is just more proof of why he shouldn't be pres.

83 Israel and Pakistan are not "on the threshold". They have nuclear weapons. They both have religious elements that welcome doomsday. Any questions? Posted by: Chuckit at November 07, 2011 10:31 AM (/hAyA) What are you a moron or something? Is that you Ron Paul?

84 83 buzzsaw oh boy....maybe we can let them have a mlb baseball team and we can play their anthem before games.....

85 She can do snap your fingers snap your neck

My pissed off rocker

Posted by: Navycopjoe at November 07, 2011 10:38 AM (9IFxO)

 

That's awesome.  She'll be needing an axe with some EMG's in it soon enough, now.  Those prog players love them some active pups.

 

86 80. Ummm, O'dumbass is coming here for a week and then Australia for another vacation He won't do shit

87 I don't think the u.S. running a joint military exercise with Israel is going to cause any reaction in Tehran except belly laughs. Face it, this is the strongest reaction we'll get from Bambi.

88 Interesting that the focus of the joint US-Israel exercise in ballistic missile defense and urban counter-terrorism, not stopping Turkish navy incursions, Egyptian tank columns, or Syrian air strikes. Those tea leaves are flashing neon.

89

...oh, shit.  You said ProNg, not Prog.

Better still.  Less art, more hate.

90

OT: From an article in the Daily Mail(UK) about the Bin Laden raid:

In the official photograph, he looked every inch the commander in chief. Strain etched on his face, Barack Obama watched as the raid to kill Osama bin Laden played out on a television in front of him. According to a new book, however, the President was not nearly that engaged – and was actually playing golf until 20 minutes before the operation began in earnest.Only then did he down his clubs and return to the White House to watch what he later trumpeted as a great success of his presidency.

I am so fricken reassured with this SCOAMF to handle Iran or anything else well on our behalf.  I wouldn't let him run a hot dog stand.

91 "Everyone" correction = troublemakers with nukes = Nork, Iran, Paki

92

In the official photograph, he looked every inch the commander in chief. Strain etched on his face, Barack Obama watched as the raid to kill Osama bin Laden played out on a television in front of him. According to a new book, however, the President was not nearly that engaged – and was actually playing golf until 20 minutes before the operation began in earnest.Only then did he down his clubs and return to the White House to watch what he later trumpeted as a great success of his presidency.

It's called ACTING!

93 88 I don't think the u.S. running a joint military exercise with Israel is going to cause any reaction in Tehran except belly laughs. Face it, this is the strongest reaction we'll get from Bambi.

Posted by: long toss at November 07, 2011 10:56 AM (J6a22)

HAH!  I will not be surprised if, by the end of the day, Obama orders the US military to withdraw from these joint military exercises with Israel because they're "inflammatory."  Just you wait. 

94 I don't think the u.S. running a joint military exercise with Israel is going to cause any reaction in Tehran except belly laughs. Face it, this is the strongest reaction we'll get from Bambi. Posted by: long toss at November 07, 2011 10:56 AM (J6a22) Which is why, although I like President Bush not matter what his faults, I am a little mad that he did not take action before he left Office. But that is just History now. Sigh

95 A buddy who is an Eagle driver says some Israeli F-16s were out at Red Flag last year and they spent a lot of time working on hitting really small targets with bombs.

96 91. I don't know He's from Chicago, a pickle slice, some tomato, a real bun with those black seeds.... Chitown folks can make a good hotdog

97 91 ... a hot dog stand is pretty complex ...

98 long toss - Teheran has to know the US-Israel ties go deeper then the WH. Exercising now to identify deficiencies; which would be filled in time for Feb 2013 is a reasonable timeline and would provide the President Next with options that go bang in the night.

99 Which is why, although I like President Bush not matter what his faults, I am a little mad that he did not take action before he left Office. But that is just History now. Sigh

The country never would have gone for it.

100 Which is why, although I like President Bush not matter what his faults, I am a little mad that he did not take action before he left Office. But that is just History now. Sigh

I don't think GW realized exactly how disastrous a presidency O'barky's would be.  I think he believed the same thing McCain did- they had ideological differences, but the realities of Office would force Obama's hand.

I don't think they realized exactly how much of an ideologue he is.

Given that, I think GW believed that Iran would temper its pursuit of nukes for fear of reprisal.  Of course, that was a flawed assumption anyway, but not one that would be completely out-of-bounds if we had a President who felt the same way about America as most Americans do.

101 Which is why, although I like President Bush not matter what his faults, I am a little mad that he did not take action before he left Office. But that is just History now. Sigh The country never would have gone for it. Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at November 07, 2011 11:02 AM (FkKjr) Which is why actions like that, doing the RIGHT THING are usually called PRESIDENTIAL!

102 Which is why, although I like President Bush not matter what his faults, I am a little mad that he did not take action before he left Office. But that is just History now. Sigh

Posted by: nevergiveup at November 07, 2011 11:00 AM (i6RpT)

Well, our CIA pretty well pre-empted that with the notorious, false memo regarding Iran's efforts. I would like to see the authors of that memo drawn and quartered. 

103 99 91 ... a hot dog stand is pretty complex ...

Posted by: Honey Badger at November 07, 2011 11:02 AM (GvYeG)

I think it would take the idiot SCOAMF a total of three minutes before he managed to plunge himself headfirst into the boiling hot dog water and drown, just through sheer incompetence.

Speaking of which, I don't think it's been said yet, so allow me:

Obama is a STUTTERING CLUSTERFUCK OF A MISERABLE FAILURE.

104 would provide the President Next with options that go bang in the night.

I've have credentials on my "bang in the night" capabilities SO vote for me.

105 OT: hey Philly fans, I await your sweet sweet tears tonight

106 104 here, here!

107 Well, our CIA pretty well pre-empted that with the notorious, false memo regarding Iran's efforts. I would like to see the authors of that memo drawn and quartered. Posted by: long toss at November 07, 2011 11:03 AM (J6a22) yes I'd like to know who exactly those assholes were

108 To think that someone complained about the DOOMiness of Monty's post.
 
This is a hot DOOM sundae with extra down twinkles.

109 damn where is my brain today ... hear, hear!

110 Speaking of which, I don't think it's been said yet, so allow me:

Did I miss posting: Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure?

<<looks>>

Nope.  Right there @17:
"Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure."

111

long toss - Teheran has to know the US-Israel ties go deeper then the WH. Exercising now to identify deficiencies; which would be filled in time for Feb 2013 is a reasonable timeline and would provide the President Next with options that go bang in the night.

Posted by: Jean at November 07, 2011 11:02 AM (WkuV6)

Point taken.

112 the whole CIA should of been fired after 9-11 anyway.

113 Which is why, although I like President Bush not matter what his faults, I am a little mad that he did not take action before he left Office. But that is just History now. Sigh

This is why you never have a VP that's not interested in the President's job.

114 This is a hot DOOM sundae with extra down twinkles.

Posted by: GnuBreed at November 07, 2011 11:05 AM (ENKCw)

Dammit, now I need ANOTHER new keyboard.  I have to remember to stop drinking soda when I'm reading the HQ...

115 Did anyone actually BELIEVE the intelligence that Iran wasn't developing nukes?

Intelligence? Never heard of it.

116 hey Philly fans, I await your sweet sweet tears tonight

Not something I say, very often:  Go Bears!

And, as a Cowboys fan, let me say how disappointed I am in the Patriots for that less-than-stellar performance yesterday.

117 Intelligence? Never heard of it.

Posted by: Charles Gibson at November 07, 2011 11:08 AM (nZvE6)

We know, Chuck.  That's why we're never surprised at how stupid you act.

118 Nope.  Right there @17:
"Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure."

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) says 'No' to RINO Romney at November 07, 2011 11:06 AM (8y9MW)

Well darn it, Allen, do you expect me to read the comments or something?  Pfft!  Who do you think I am, Andrew Breitbart?

Anyway, it really can't be said enough.

119 Well darn it, Allen, do you expect me to read the comments or something?  Pfft!  Who do you think I am, Andrew Breitbart?

I actually think I did miss one on Friday, so you can't be too careful.

And, as you say, it can't be said enough.

120

Nope.  Right there @17:
"Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure."

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) says 'No' to RINO Romney at November 07, 2011 11:06 AM (8y9MW)

Anything worth saying once is worth saying twice.

121

I bet that Philly kicks the ball to Hester.  Because they are just.  that.  smart.

Dammit, now I need ANOTHER new keyboard.  I have to remember to stop drinking soda when I'm reading the HQ...

Rules For Morons No. 5:  Do not eat/drink anything while reading the comments (See Rule 4 - no one reads the blog) that you do not want on/in your monitor and keyboard.

122 I see no reason why anyone should be concerned about this. Iran should have nukes if it wants because We Do (Ron Paul). If we treated Iran fairly it would be our friend.

This might be a possibility : if Obama went in, There would be no question (as with lybia, yemen, or anywhere these days)from the usual suspects about protecting our ass-ets, because He is a Dem President in the image of JFK or wonderous like the other Dem President Lincoln, or some such.
 so I'm just going to  snark at everything because i can think of nothing note worthy to say. we're a mess on foreign policy
 sigh

123 I think Iran at this point has shown incredible restraint. Just suppose a foreign nation sent its agents to America to murder our nuclear scientists. Would we consider that an act of war? Just suppose a foreign nation developed a crippling computer virus to disable our nuclear program. Would we consider that an act of war? These things, and more no doubt, have happened to Iran and they haven't retaliated or invaded anyone. If the Iranians were hellbent and crazed towards destruction they have had plenty of reasons to light that candle. They have not done so. The development of the atom bomb by the United States was not to deter anyone. It was a secret offensive weapon of war. All subsequent development of nuclear weapons by other nations have been defensive and deterrent related. There is no crazier regime in the world than North Korea. We have not gone to war with them because they have nukes. Why not? Why are they to be trusted but not the Iranians? Just throwing some thoughts out there. I think if you filter out the propaganda and war mongering you might get a clearer picture of things.

124

91, 94....

I figured that the SCoaMF held off giving the 'go-ahead' on the Bin Laden mission until he really needed something big to change the subject with.

He had just released that bizzare looking birth certificate.....and people were asking him to un-seal his other records. ....Then, voila! ....He 'got Bin Laden.

He had known where Bin Laden was for eight months. They could've gotten him months before. So it's like he was saving it for something.

Lord only knows what he will save till right before the election next year.

125 I think Iran at this point has shown incredible restraint

I think what Iran has shown, at this point, is an inability to project force. 

I could tear down your entire comment, but it's really not worth my time.  Short version: if you're trying to equate the country that could have made a good go at really taking over the world after WWII, but chose not to, with a some out-house of a country that has said it wants to wipe one of our allies off the face of the Earth, I think you've got a screw or two loose.

126 Iran has instigated attacks from lebanon to iraq,  and priactically has a hand in any terror across the mideast. so BAH!

127 -i

128 Dueces Wild, start with 444 and 241, then add in a couple of hundred other Iranian provocations -- our restraint preserves them, not "deterrence".

129

111 damn where is my brain today ... hear, hear!

Its confusing about which to use these days. 'Here here' or 'hear hear'.

Traditionally, it was correct to use 'hear hear' because it was used when one has just heard something that they agree with.

But with the advent of the internet, where we engage in written discourse instead of audible discussions.....the use of  'here here' is often used intentionally, to mean "Here is something I agree with, well said".

So....like I said, its confusing now as to which is the 'correct' spelling to use.

130 Just throwing some thoughts out there. I think if you filter out the propaganda and war mongering you might get a clearer picture of things.

Posted by: Deuces Wild at November 07, 2011 11:16 AM (ucERL)

 

Those aren't thoughts.  They are fantasies made up out of whole cloth.

131

At this point the issue with Israel is not about who was/is right or wrong.  Long-term Israel is screwed.  It's a simple matter of population, numbers, and money.  They are a socialist state that only survives on foreign-aid handouts.  They have a tiny population that is growing ever more outnumbered.  All of its financial backers are going down the economic toilet.  It doesn't matter how many guns and bombs they have, they can't fight off everybody.  They are surrounded by hundreds of millions of people that want to see them go away.  Their absolute only long-term option is to find some type of peaceful co-existence with the Palestinians...  justifiable or not, fingers pointing all over the place, they have not been able to do this. 

Now we are supposed to start a war that has the very real potential to literally destroy us economically because of Israel?  And in so doing that will end up hurting Israel even more long-term.  You guys don't see how utterly stupid this all is?

Seriously, people need to start thinking about relocation.  This is all very amazing to me... it's like armageddon is to be a self-fulfilled prophecy.  We are literally fighting over a worthless plot of land, just because some ancient temple ruins happen to be there.

 

132 Let's think about this a moment. Although worrying, this is not the end of the world. Iran is a nation-state, and nation-states are deterred from using nuclear weapons through threat of retaliation. We deterred the Soviet Union for 50 years, which was no less expansionist and aggressive than Iran.

The real worry is that the crazy mullahs would give a weapons to a proxy like Hizbollah to use against the West. But this flies in the face of experience, which is that governments tend to keep very tight controls on nuclear weapons, since the consequences of screwing up are catastrophic.

I can't imagine that any nuclear attack by a terrorist, particularly a Muslim terrorist, wouldn't prompt a pretty swift retaliatory attach on the territory of Iran. In fact, this would be a good policy to declare on the day that Iran is assessed to have an operational nuke.

In addition, we might also quietly inform the Saudis that such an attack would also prompt an missile with ground zero being the Kaaba in Mecca.

133 Let's think about this a moment. Although worrying, this is not the end of the world. Iran is a nation-state, and nation-states are deterred from using nuclear weapons through threat of retaliation. We deterred the Soviet Union for 50 years, which was no less expansionist and aggressive than Iran.

The Soviet Union was a relatively rational state with at least some roots in Western traditions.  Iran, not so much.

Seriously, it amazes me how often people insist on assigning Western value and logical structures to non-Western societies.  It just doesn't work that way, and it never ends well...

134 18 Oh and fuck the people who did the 2007 NIE. We could have solved this problem then and possibly destabilized the Iranian gov't enough for the green revolution to take over.

Posted by: Ben at November 07, 2011 10:28 AM (wuv1c)

That "report" was no different than "reports" we get from, say, the SPLC or PETA.  It wasn't based on actual intelligence, and this was pretty obvious at the time.

135 A limited nuclear war that included massive American casualties and carnage would stimulate the economy via new job openings as well as new infrastructure repair programs.

136 But this flies in the face of experience, which is that governments tend to keep very tight controls on nuclear weapons, since the consequences of screwing up are catastrophic.

Oh yes. That's why Pakistan is using full size vans to move their nukes around instead of the less reliable minivans.

137 Stupid sock.

138

At this point the issue with Israel is not about who was/is right or wrong.  Long-term Israel is screwed.  It's a simple matter of population, numbers, and money.  They are a socialist state that only survives on foreign-aid handouts.  They have a tiny population that is growing ever more outnumbered.  All of its financial backers are going down the economic toilet.  It doesn't matter how many guns and bombs they have, they can't fight off everybody.  They are surrounded by hundreds of millions of people that want to see them go away.  Their absolute only long-term option is to find some type of peaceful co-existence with the Palestinians...  justifiable or not, fingers pointing all over the place, they have not been able to do this. 

Now we are supposed to start a war that has the very real potential to literally destroy us economically because of Israel?  And in so doing that will end up hurting Israel even more long-term.  You guys don't see how utterly stupid this all is?

Posted by: Andrew at November 07, 2011 11:36 AM (HS3dy)

If Israel goes, the Islamists will control that whole area, including North Africa, and, before too long, most European countries with lax immigration regs. Do you want to wait till that happens and half a dozen Islamist countries have nuclear capabilities? North Korea is a different breed of cat. Their ruling class is very realistic and survival oriented. They're content to blackmail.

139

that intellegent estimate, during GWB's administration, downplaying the threat of Iranian nukes was a political ploy by Clinton shadow government moles inside the intellegence community and it was designed to take the wind out of the sail of any buildup to attack Iran's nuclear sites. 

sad for the US and for the rest of the Middle East, it worked.

140 Posted by: Arms Merchant at November 07, 2011 11:40 AM (hW3KZ)

Let's think about this a moment. Although worrying, this is not the end of the world. Iran is a nation-state, and nation-states are deterred from using nuclear weapons through threat of retaliation. We deterred the Soviet Union for 50 years, which was no less expansionist and aggressive than Iran.

Two different animals. The Soviets, however horrible they were, were rational actors. Their first priority was still self-preservation. To them, death was the final end. The Iranians don't give a shit about that, because to them death is the path to a big cosmic orgy with lots of virgins.

In addition, we might also quietly inform the Saudis that such an attack would also prompt an missile with ground zero being the Kaaba in Mecca.

The Saudis would be no happier to see Iran get the bomb than the US or Israel would, because the Sunnis would be their next target after the Zionist Entity was gone. In fact, if Israel attacks Iran you can expect covert Saudi assistance. Something along the lines of: "A junior Saudi civil servant was reprimanded after it was discovered that the official Saudi condemnation of Israel's recent raid on Hamas targets in Gaza was sent to the Israeli government printed on the back of a map showing the locations of remote Saudi military airfields stocked with jet fuel, along with decryption keys and frequencies for Saudi military air-traffic control".

141

Posted by: ol_dirty_/b/tard at November 07, 2011 12:33 PM (IoUF1)

Yep. If Iran gets it's nuke, gird yer loins for the godawfullest nuclear arms race in Sunni country. Then, it is just a matter of time till some jihadi loonie gains control of the red button. 

142 Aside from religious differences, SA also has all that lovely oil which would make Iran the really big dog on the block and SA is keenly aware of this.

143

"If Israel goes, the Islamists will control that whole area, including North Africa, and, before too long, most European countries with lax immigration regs. Do you want to wait till that happens and half a dozen Islamist countries have nuclear capabilities? North Korea is a different breed of cat. Their ruling class is very realistic and survival oriented. They're content to blackmail."

Actually, I don't agree with this. 

Israel's existence won't in any way stop so-called Islamists from controlling all these other areas you speak of.  Has it so far?  It has made the situation worse.  Organizations like Hamas, Hezbollah, and the Muslim Brotherhood exist ONLY because of Israel.  They were created to oppose Israel.  What started out as simple "resistance" movements with popular support then swell with time into these hugely oppressive entities that end up strangling the local governments and people.   Tell me... why has support for groups like Al Qaeda GROWN post-911?  Because in response to 19 guys with boxcutters we start multi-trillion-dollar wars and kill hundreds of thousands of Muslims that had absolutely nothing to do with 911.  We support regimes that oppress their people... like in Saudi & Yemen. 

You also make the false assumption that an Islamic state is bad... bad for whom?  We have never been threatened or attacked by any Islamic state.

144 Andrew,

It's pretty obvious by now it doesn't matter where or if the Jews relocate.  Muslims, Pagans, Marxists, and most homosexuals are always going to be at war with them.

And if Israel were still a socialist country, their defense would still be one of the primary causes of the left. 

How do I know that?  Because I was a lefty back then, shitbird.

145 How about an "exercise" to produce smoldering, radioactive craters at key locations in Iran?

146 Wait, you mean when the IAEA was headed by a guy named Mohammed, they didn't put a stop to this? Well, color me shocked and surprised.

147 136 Seriously, it amazes me how often people insist on assigning Western value and logical structures to non-Western societies.  It just doesn't work that way, and it never ends well...

Too true.

The liberals' assumption that, deep down, people are the same the world over is naive and dangerous. Conclusions drawn from a false premise can prove disastrous.

148 @ 150, 143, 136

Yeah, I've heard the arguments that the mullahs aren't rational and nuclear deterrence doesn't work with them and I find them unconvincing. There were all sorts of "experts" during the Cold War assuring us that the godless Soviets believed that they could fight and prevail against 10,000 nuclear warheads. It was all bullshit.

No, Iran doesn't have western traditions but so what? These guys love their pink (tan?) asses as much as you love yours.

If you still don't believe it, read the Quran. Mohammed himself was very deliberate about living to fight another day.

Now, if they thought they could slip a nuke to Hezbollah without getting caught, I wouldn't put it past them. That's why the declaratory policy of, "We don't care, Iran will be held responsible" is an important piece.

149 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

150 What makes me truly despair that the Obama Regime would do anything to stop Iran is the combination of these 2 things:

We know that Obama listened to the anti-Semitic hate rants of Jeremiah Wright for 20 years.

We have recently been informed that Obama "gets off on" killing people. According to Ulsterman's "Insider":

"The only thing Obama has taken a real interest in [military-wise] are the drones.  Apparently he loves those drone attacks.  Thinks theyÂ’re cool – how they fly in and just blow the sh-t out of people.  No fuss. No muss.  President Obama gets off on it. The same guy who was so concerned with giving those GITMO fellas a nice citizen trial because he was concerned with their rights – he loves blowing the hell out of people.  A real power trip for him apparently.  So much so the military brass are becoming increasingly uneasy."

I fear that only God can save Israel now.

He has done it before....

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