I think this might be the start of senility setting in.

I`m not joking.  How else can you describe his comments about Bin Laden yesterday ?   Even though a lot of people disagree with his policies, no one can argue that he isnt an intelligent person.  And that`s where the problem is - there is no way, any 1/2 intelligent person could have said what he did about OBL yesterday. 

>>How else can you describe his comments about Bin Laden yesterday ?

No kidding. Who in their right mind thinks our justice system is capable of convicting any heinous murderer? Maybe if OBL was a pot smoker or something

There's nothing particularly libertarian about Ron Paul.

Hmmmm....

Ron Paul: Huh? I am not a serial candidate. I'm a jerk. I once had wealth, power, and the love of a beautiful woman. Now I only have two things: my friends and... uh... my thermos. Huh? My story? Okay. It was never easy for me. I was born a poor black child. I remember the days, sittin' on the porch with my family, singin' and dancin' down in Mississippi.

These cans are defective!

Ron Paul: Well I'm gonna run for President then. And I don't need any of you. I don't need this stuff, and I don't need you. I don't need anything except this.

[picks up an ashtray]

And that's it and that's the only thing I need, is this. I don't need you or the GOP. Just this ashtray. And some votes, the ashtray and the votes and that's all I need.

Every now and then, someone from the world of sports decides his experience will translate to the political arena. HereÂ’s how that has worked out so far:

#1:  Announce I'm running

#2:  ?????

#3:  Get elected President!

7% Chocolate

11% Vanilla

82% RON PAUL

Also it should be noted that Ron Paul is running even though Gary Johnson is running. If Paul actually cared about libertarianism he would let Johnson run alone and not split up the 4-8% of the Republican/Libertarian vote.

I think Herr Doktor Paul just likes filling  up his campaign coffers every four years.

I hope Rand doesn't get involved in Ron's campaign. I don't want him overly tainted b/c he's one of my favorite senators.

"Paul is not anti-semitic.  This is just a smear that people keep repeating about him."

Posted by: progressoverpeace at May 13, 2011 08:29 AM (G/MYk)

I disagree. If Paul is unwilling to repudiate his many supporters who are explicitly anti-Semitic, then he approves of their message.

When you lie down with dogs, you get up with fleas.

When you associate with anti-Semites, you are, by association, an anti-Semite.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (NJConservative) at May 13, 2011 08:33 AM (LH6ir)

Is the vitriol for Paul really about his being worse than Obama? I think Paul's an idiot and I would still vote for him over Obama. Presidents really have a limited amount of power to do things unilaterally. I would trust Congress and the Public to keep Paul more in line than they do Obama any day.

Obozo and his handlers have ditched "Hope and Change" (so much fo that) and are now back in high school with a new campaing slogan. The only word missing is "unique"

"Respect. Empower. Include. Win."'

Unless, of coures, you do not give $$$ to the obama campaign.

Obama campaing slogan - the truth:

"Respect. teh  Empower. power. power. drunk on power. Include only those who show the $$$. Cheat to Win."

Posted by: Berserker at May 13, 2011 08:42 AM (FMbng)

I would vote for a windup toy monkey over Obama.

Ron Paul will never be president.

Marco Rubio will be president some day.

I don't think that one has to constantly repudiate his own supporters' views which differ from his.

Constantly repudiate? Nah...but this is not okay:

Ron Paul says he didn’t write these newsletters, and I take him at his word. They don’t sound like him. In my infrequent personal encounters and in his public appearances, I’ve never heard him say anything racist or homophobic (halting and uncomfortable on gay issues, like a lot of 72-year-old conservatives, but not hateful). But he selected the people who did write those things, and he put his name on the otherwise unsigned newsletters, and he raised campaign funds from the mailing list that those newsletters created. And he would have us believe that things that “do not represent what I believe or have ever believed” appeared in his newsletter for years and years without his knowledge. Assuming Ron Paul in fact did not write those letters, people close to him did. His associates conceived, wrote, edited, and mailed those words. His closest associates over many years know who created those publications.

The only upside to a Ron Paul presidency is that we'd finally get to see how Article II, Section 1, Clause 6 of the Consititution actually works in practice.

'Cause I'm expecting the Alzheimer's to kick in relatively soon after the Oath of Office is administered.

 he would eviscerate our standing in the world

Not sure there will be much 'standing' left by Nov. 2012.

Maybe some squating. Definitely bowing.

"Respect. Empower. Include. Win."'

"Respect Unions. Empower Unions. Include Unions. Win Unions."'

There, fixed that for ya.

Posted by: FlaviusJulius at May 13, 2011 08:38 AM (qIHlG)

How about Gus Hall?  He was a stinking commie bastard, but at least he was an HONEST stinking commie bastard!

Ron Paul - helping communists win since 2008.

Quit looking at all his others run, pay attention to how much he knows now.  That's the key. 

Sounds like the same argument a Romney supporter would use.  Well, until yesterday that is.

Do we have a fucking death wish in this country?

Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Just for clarification, NH people DO NOT stand on street corners chanting. Those are the idiots bussed in from other states by the candidates. NH people are neither loud, nor attention seekers, unless they are special need Middle School students.

Bingo!  *high fiving fellow NH-ite* 

122 ... or the power in large groups of stupid people ...

Honey Badger press release regarding Ron Paul candidancy announcement:

I just don't give a #$%@ !!!!!!!!

You know, a Ron Paul candidacy may seem crazy, but it's crazy LIKE A FOX.  See, here's the plan.  If we can dupe the media -- and thus the Dems -- into believing that our preferred candidate is this Texas twit, then they'll focus all their attention on HIM, taking HIM down, while the rest of us can get together and nominate a Republican candidate who's actually GOOD. 

I'll be sending out more information on this plan via the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy newsletter.  If you're not already a member, make sure to sign-up through Goldline, or by making a donation to the conservative candidate of your choice.  You'll receive your secret VRWC decoder ring and be taught the secret handshake at the time of the transaction, so make sure to wear your Koch-approved gloves!

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (NJConservative) at May 13, 2011 09:04 AM (LH6ir)

I know.  I suck at socking.  I had so much more to type, but I kept wanting to puke, so I quit. 

OT/

Why do they keep reporting Mitch Daniels is 5-foot-7?

Isn't he closer to 5-4?

I don't know, I'll got check his stats on his rookie card.

I can understand why you consider the issue of Presidential eligibility gobsmacking stupidity to be one of the most embarrassing around ...

There, fixed it.  I'm gonna go into the corrections business today.  I can't be any worse at it than the New York Times.

Just for clarification, NH people DO NOT stand on street corners chanting. Those are the idiots bussed in from other states by the candidates. NH people are neither loud, nor attention seekers, unless they are special need Middle School students.

If we keep sending our people over the border to live up there, you're going to have to refudiate these comments.

Oh yes and Bob Dole says Bob Dole can last for more than 4 hours!

I think the ads on TV tell you to consult a doctor if you're lasting more than 4 hours, Bob.

Posted by: Serious Cat at May 13, 2011 09:09 AM (bAySe)

No! He's 5'7" damn it! Somebody hand me the cans...

They probably don't even let Ron Paul sit at the adult table at Thanksgiving.

No, they do.  He just has to do it with a bib and in a highchair.

He loves him some mashed peas and applesauce too, lemme tell ya.

Oh yes and Bob Dole says Bob Dole can last for more than 4 hours!

I think the ads on TV tell you to consult a doctor if you're lasting more than 4 hours, Bob.

I remember the opening of one of the debates in 2008 where Obama walked in confidently from one side and McCain looked like a broken Weeble with Ken doll arms glued to each side.

I imagine Daniels would provide a similar moment at least a few times in the campaign, though I have no idea how much it hurts if at all.

Again, folks, priorities!  Wonder Woman isn't being picked up by NBC, dammit.  This is big news!  How will we be able to make fun of the actress' costume if it's not even on the air?

As impossible as it seems ... I give a $#%@ even less now that I did before ...

Do you think Ron Paul uses Ex-Lax?

@168.

SE Cupp's name is pronounced the same a "C Cup"

Coincidence?  I think not.

Doesn't it seem like all we really should have to do to stop Ron Paul is make a couple poorly sourced amateur internet videos talking about how he is really a Jewish puppet who wants international bankers to rape your children?

Honestly, the people who flock to him have more than often lost their minds and any sense of reality. Just throw them a new conspiracy, and they'll run to some other nutcase.

Just throw them a new conspiracy, and they'll run to some other nutcase.

No, because to them that would be a feature - not a bug

Posted by: The RNC at May 13, 2011 09:25 AM (sbV1u)

I have to be at the Clintons, they have nine dead today!

I think Herr Doktor Paul just likes filling up his campaign coffers pockets every four years.

"He's just throwing red meat to his truther fanbase.
"

I suppose it makes me a tinfoil hat guy, but it just occurred to me that that's kinda the reason Obama withheld the photo of Bin Laden. So the truthers will keep coming at him (ostensibly from the "Right"). 

Anyway, I don't care how you slice it, you don't spend ten years and countless lives hunting a guy far and wide, making him the most visible face (but invisible man) on the planet, finally catch up to him, kill him and then say "Nah, nobody wants to see that". 

It's just fucking bizarre that he doesn't let it out. At the very least on the grounds that it's a historical artifact and not his special binky to peek at under the covers. 

I used to have a nice outfit he could wear.

Posted by: The Warren Commission at May 13, 2011 09:27 AM (sbV1u)

Ron Paul sunk the Titanic!

Doesn't it seem like all we really should have to do to stop Ron Paul...

There's nothing particularly libertarian about Ron Paul.

Posted by: Truman North at May 13, 2011 08:07 AM (K2wpv)

If you want to vote for a libertarian, vote for Gary Johnson.  He walks the walk, was governor of a state and was truly libertarian as a governor.

He also has an outside shot of winning the nomination.

If you go to the Ames Straw Poll, you will see who Ron Paul's supporters are.  They're all lefties. Mostly black-clad hipster kids.

Ron Paul was in Hitler's bunker.

(Hmmm...come to think of it, that's not too hard to believe....)

#197

True. I guess just from the annoyance and the ridiculous validation of his views that the media gives to him.

Posted by: The Warren Commission at May 13, 2011 09:27 AM (sbV1u)

Ron Paul sunk the Titanic!

Posted by: The New York Herald News at May 13, 2011 09:29 AM (84oau)

Ron Paul attended "My American Cousin" on April 14, 1865

Ron Paul blew up the levees.

(And he canceled Airwolf, the bastard!)

If you want to vote for a libertarian, vote for Gary Johnson.  He walks the walk, was governor of a state and was truly libertarian as a governor.

He also has an outside shot of winning the nomination.

If you go to the Ames Straw Poll, you will see who Ron Paul's supporters are.  They're all lefties. Mostly black-clad hipster kids.

Posted by: AmishDude at May 13, 2011 09:32 AM (73tyQ)

Ron Paul blew up the levees.

(And he canceled Airwolf, the bastard!)

Posted by: Lincolntf at May 13, 2011 09:33 AM (xMT+4)

That's it, he's dead to me. Cancelling "Airwolf" - the bastard

Ron Paul attended "My American Cousin" on April 14, 1865

We took the rap for Ron Paul!

Posted by: A Professor-Scientologist at May 13, 2011 09:35 AM (MMC8r)

Do you fuckin' want to die? Where's that damn couch? I'm going to stand on it so I'm tall enough to give you a nuggie.

Posted by: song lyric at May 13, 2011 09:37 AM (NUvkm)

THIS SPAMMER IS RON PAUL.

#216

Rand Paul speaks like he could be written into Atlas Shrugged, which is pretty kickass most of the time.

Quick weld the spillways shut. Wire the levees.

And whatever you do, make sure Ray Nagin is in charge.  Anything we forget to screw up, he'll finish.

  How will we be able to make fun of the actress' costume if it's not even on the air?

And yet Ace has already written 15 pages of his review...

A friend of mine was once a press flack for a well-known, not-to-be-named Republican.  I used to ask him, "What makes guys like him think he can win the nomination?"  He said, "You need to understand, most of these guys quite literally wake up in the morning whistling "Hail to the Chief."

I think of that everytime I think of why Ron Paul is running.

Ron Paul told me just the tip

Ron Paul said he'd respect me in the morning.

Posted by: Rocks at May 13, 2011 09:34 AM (th0op)

Still better than Paul. Ron Paul's chances of winning the nomination are roughly the same as Ron Paul's chances of winning American Idol.

Ron Paul told me just the tip

Ron Paul said he'd respect me in the morning.

Ron Paul said I should probably get tested

Posted by: Ossama Bin Laden at May 13, 2011 09:38 AM (i6RpT)

Rand's crazy like a fox.  The slavery analogy gets attention. Then people point out that it may be a wild statement, but that in fact you get what you pay for and if physicians are treated like public employees, they will (like in Britain) turn from highly-trained, highly-skilled uber-professionals into postal workers.

Of course, my take is: "What if they tried all this with lawyers?" I think then our politicians would realize what a disaster it is because they at least understand lawyerin'.

...because they at least understand lawyerin'.

Well after seeing that abortion of a health care bill....that's a debatable proposition.

Ron Paul is his own grandpa.

Ron Paul's family tree is a stick.

Posted by: Ossama Bin Laden at May 13, 2011 09:38 AM (i6RpT)

I think his point is, how can you have a right to something that has to be provided by other people?  Saying healthcare is a "right" means others (in this case doctors) are obligated to provide their services because they owe it to you. 

Dr. Ron Paul told me to get undressed and he would be right back in.

We weren't in a doctors office

Ron Paul uses campaign cash to bet against himself winning the nomination on NTrade

Ron Paul probably has a post-Congress future in radio.  Why, I can't just hear his mellifluous voice now....

"WITE radio.  All white...all the time."

He should get started on that new career sooner rather than later.

Dr. Ron Paul told me to get undressed and he would be right back in.

You may of misheard him.  He told me to get undressed and "back in." 

My "favorites" link brings me to a "this page has been removed" blogger site. Curious to see if anyone else can get in.

I just tried a cold link.  Looks like she's been hacked.

Again.

Well after seeing that abortion of a health care bill....that's a debatable proposition.

Posted by: Sean Bannion at May 13, 2011 09:53 AM (sbV1u)

Oh, no.  The legislation is good from a lawyer's perspective.  They're benefitting just fine from it.

Posted by: Herb at May 13, 2011 10:03 AM (qU60n)

Herb smells like Ron Paul's middle finger.

Ron Paul sent Herb a link to AoS.

Gabe!  Ronulans decloaking off the port bow!  Battlestations!

Time to break out Da Yoopers:

Paul-Nuts of America
Stand up if you can.
Scratch that left Paul-Nut
And hoist that doobie in your hand.

Ron Paul probably has a post-Congress future in radio.  Why, I can't just hear his mellifluous voice now....

"WITE radio.  All white...all the time."

He should get started on that new career sooner rather than later.

Posted by: Sean Bannion at May 13, 2011 10:01 AM (sbV1u)

Hey!  Are they hiring?

Thanks, sean. As much as some conservatives don't like her, the Liberals absolutely hate her. Personally, I think she's got a great niche blog. 

NP.  I don't mind liberals you can talk to.  Unfortunately that rules out about 99.44445% of them.

I know she's not everybody's cup of Chai, but would someone try to go to Althouse's site. My "favorites" link brings me to a "this page has been removed" blogger site. Curious to see if anyone else can get in.

She's guest posting at InstaP and mentioned the Blogger problems.

Good luck with your Pawlentys, your Romneys, and your Huckabees.

I'll take Pawlenty and be happy if my choice is Paul, Romney, Huckabee and Pawlenty.

It could be worse. It could be Paul, Romney or Huckabee

No DOOM thread? Everyone have a great day and weekend.

I think his point is, how can you have a right to something that has to be provided by other people?  Saying healthcare is a "right" means others (in this case doctors) are obligated to provide their services because they owe it to you. 

Posted by: yinzer at May 13, 2011 09:55 AM (/Mla1)

Exactly.  Saying you have a right to healthcare means that a healthcare provider does not have the right to refuse.  So I could go to a medical practice for a check-up and refuse to pay, because it's my right to have healthcare.  What recourse would the provider have?  Providing services without the requirement of being compensated is either charity or, well, slavery. 

No DOOM thread? Everyone have a great day and weekend.

I'm not Monty, but anytime after Monday, the Treasury Department can force a default on our debt as the latest Treasury security offering will put us over the debt limit.

Good luck with your Pawlentys, your Romneys, and your Huckabees.

For some strange reason when I read that the tune to "One Night in Bangkok" popped into my head.

Hmmmm....

Posted by: HoneyBadger at May 13, 2011 10:11 AM (GvYeG)

I believe this one was with the Tijuana Ass.

It's a show down there.  Very popular.

I think his point is, how can you have a right to something that has to be provided by other people?  Saying healthcare is a "right" means others (in this case doctors) are obligated to provide their services because they owe it to you. 

check out the link on the side bar i put up, and stole from Ed Driscoll at instapundit.

He's not named Rand for nothing.

I agree with him. Doctors are in a bad position. They are required to treat everyone without the promise of pay. Don't get me wrong, they usually get paid, and paid fairly well, but under the Obamacare system, it is entirely possible they won't get paid back.

It everyone gets free healthcare, and doctors are required to treat everyone.. well that kinda is like slavery or at least a form of servatude.

And at somepoint, intellegent people who would normally become doctors will try their hand at something else. It's already coming down the pike. We're going to have a doctor shortage.

No DOOM thread? Everyone have a great day and weekend.

Posted by: Stateless Canadian Infidel at May 13, 2011 10:09 AM (GKQDR)

A DOOM thread on Friday the 13th?  Wouldn't that be like inviting the apocalypse a year early? 

How about a "Fluffy Bunnies in Fields of Clover" thread, but populated with DOOOOOM news? 

Romney is so done, he doubled down on his health care plan

Yup.  All he had to say was, "Yup, I screwed up.  Just look at that mess.  And that's why Obamacare has to be repealed."

Hubris.  Pure and simple.

Romney is so done, he doubled down on his health care plan. I don't see him getting through the primaries, I mean, he failed to back in 2008, how is he going to do it in 2012? He isn't, that's how.

I watched about 10 minutes of  it last night. It was bad.

His argument was this.

1.Obamacare is terrible.

2.Obamacare is implemented on the federal level.

3. Romneycare is Obamacare, but on the state level.

I believe this arguement and it's right in many ways, but he seems to neglect what this implies.

I believe this arguement and it's right in many ways, but he seems to neglect what this implies.

There aren't many colleges teaching logic anymore. 

Posted by: Cherry π at May 13, 2011 10:16 AM (+sBB4)

Can you imagine the malpractice premiums that loopy cocksucker pays; probably higher than YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAARRRGH's.

Posted by: Cherry ð at May 13, 2011 10:17 AM (+sBB4)

And the uprising of the Cult of Cthulu. 

As an educated conversationalist without an ignorant bone in my body, I can appreciate a politician who is willing to ask questions, and who refuses to celebrate the death of a questionably accused human being.  As a fellow independent thinker, he won't believe crackpot theories such as the idea that extreme heat can melt steel.  As a Steeler myself, I am at the forefront of this issue. 

Posted by: Lincolntf at May 13, 2011 10:28 AM (xMT+4)

I would vote for that candidate in a heartbeat over Barack Obama, and at least 85% of the current GOP field.

Posted by: dagny at May 13, 2011 10:28 AM (mQQMY)

There was a pothead debate?  Was this on the ONT?  Was it mildly coherent?  I like laughing at potheads.

Travelocity Gnome/Gingrich!

You have to have two people on the ticket.  You can't have the same person twice - regardless of their "stage name."

I would vote for that candidate in a heartbeat over Barack Obama, and at least 85% of the current GOP field.

Posted by: MWR at May 13, 2011 10:29 AM (4df7R)

I'd vote for a feces covered crack whore over Obama. However, I don't think the great numbers of the uninformed would.

Has anyone seen the Huckabee sponsored 'Learn Our History' videos? If you need any other evidence that he is a low-rent whore...

http://tinyurl.com/3tfbehd

Here's what I don't get.  If Ron Paul just announced his candidacy, why was he invited to that stupid debate last week?

I thought the rule was they only invited officially announced people, or that by accepting the invite, that that would be as official an announcement as oen would need.

[redacted],

We often don't know what's at stake in an election until it's too late. Fortunately, Republicans in DC have been up front with us. (I know, crazy, right?) Over the past month, they made it clear they will hand over Medicare to private insurance companies if they win the 2012 elections.

This is a good thing, because now we have another excellent reason to stand up and fight them. That's why we're sending John Boehner a cake, with the signatures of Daily Kos community members underneath it, thanking him for guaranteeing we will be fired up for 2012.

Click here to add your name to the petition that will appear underneath the thank you cake. [link removed]

Here's what happened:

That's about as straightforward as Republicans are ever going to be. They are going to slash and privatize Medicare as soon as they control the House, the Senate and the White House.

The rowdy reception Republicans received at townhalls last month was a sample of the blowback they are getting from this, but let's give them another taste—in cake form! Click here to thank John Boehner for finally being honest about the Republican plan to destroy Medicare. [link removed]

Keep fighting,
Chris [Cocksucker] Bowers
Campaign Director, Daily Kos

I thought the rule was they only invited officially announced people, or that by accepting the invite, that that would be as official an announcement as oen would need.

Posted by: Lance McCormick at May 13, 2011 10:36 AM (zgHLA)

The rule is that the sponsor of the debate invites whomever they want to invite.

#362

The videos as produced are already more embarassing.

There was a pothead debate?  Was this on the ONT?  Was it mildly coherent?  I like laughing at potheads.

Posted by: MWR at May 13, 2011 10:30 AM (4df7R)

It was in the "Business as usual" thread below the ONT.

I'm at work and can't watch the vid over at Real Clear Politics, but have any of you seen the clip of Rand Paul comparing the healthcare issue to slavery? It sounds odd, but my guess is that he made a great point in his argument.

God I hope he didn't screw up.

...The rowdy reception Republicans received at townhalls last month was a sample of the blowback they are getting from this,

Then we must be winning, because the "rowdy reception" Democrats got on the health care bill didn't seem to stop it now...did it?

Posted by: Lincolntf at May 13, 2011 10:28 AM (xMT+4)

That sounds like Mitt Romney

...The rowdy reception Republicans received at townhalls last month was a sample of the blowback they are getting from this,

Three union thugs.  Wait, no, two union thugs.  The third guy was just the first guy in different clothing.

Posted by: bskb at May 13, 2011 10:37 AM (+ZYb1)

Good luck!

Posted by: Ossama Bin Laden at May 13, 2011 10:41 AM (i6RpT)

You're just saying that because you're in desperate need of free healthcare.

Ah yeah that was a wildly stupid comparison in my opinion. And it will start to make him look as crazy as his father

Did you watch the viedo, or are you just going witht the blurb? Because Rand seldom, if ever, looks crazy.

Ah yeah that was a wildly stupid comparison in my opinion. And it will start to make him look as crazy as his father

Congrats.

Clap. Clap. Clap. Clap.

Clap. Clap. Clap. Clap.

Posted by: Ben at May 13, 2011 10:43 AM (wuv1c)

If that's a golf clap it's a bit too exuberant.

God I hope he didn't screw up.

Posted by: Clueless at May 13, 2011 10:39 AM (LyOUH)

I think he took the notion of "free" healthcare to its logical extreme. He used the "s" word to get attention but his basic point is very sound.

Posted by: dagny at May 13, 2011 10:43 AM (mQQMY)

The important thing is wigs.  Wear a variety of different wigs.  Fools 'em everytime.

...

Wait, should I not have said that?  Dammit, they're onto me!

With Huckabee's new income stream from his line of low budget history videos, he should be able to run for President and keep his house in Florida.

If this works, this would be the first time I would go on record as being anti-free market.

so are the daily ron paul threads going to supplant the Doom threads?

I think he took the notion of "free" healthcare to its logical extreme. He used the "s" word to get attention but his basic point is very sound.

Posted by: AmishDude at May 13, 2011 10:44 AM (73tyQ)

IF there is a right to healthcare, who will you force to labor and give it against their will?

I think he took the notion of "free" healthcare to its logical extreme. He used the "s" word to get attention but his basic point is very sound.

Whew! (wipes brow) because the boy has damned near got me hook, line and sinker. Frankly, I am more excited about his future at this point than I am about (don't shoot me) Marco Rubio.

Posted by: dagny at May 13, 2011 10:39 AM (mQQMY)

My dad and I had a discussion about this today.  He said that when Reagan reformed the tax code there was a provision where you could invest in a cattle feeding program and for every dollar you put in you got five dollars of deductions back.  He said the tax rate was 70% but no one paid it because of programs like the cattle feeding one and other weird deductions.  He said, in order to take away the mortgage deduction they would have to have way way lower tax rates or even a fair tax or a flat tax.  If he takes away the mortgage deduction it will kill the middle class.  Since the top deduction is a mil, then the very rich or even moderately rich will continue to buy mansions as they can only deduct up to a mil of their mortgage.  He said the middle class lives and dies by that deduction and it is a direct assault on them as the poor generally don't buy, but rent.  It will make us a society of the poor, living off government assistance and the uber rich and moderately rich.  He made a lot of sense.  He said if he takes away the deduction, the housing market may never come back, may just keep going down until finally all are under water and slaves to the bank.  He got pretty angry this morning.

I thought the rule was they only invited officially announced people, or that by accepting the invite, that that would be as official an announcement as oen would need.

Posted by: Lance McCormick at May 13, 2011 10:36 AM (zgHLA)

The rule is that the sponsor of the debate invites whomever they want to invite.

Posted by: AmishDude at May 13, 2011 10:38 AM (73tyQ)

Well, yes, touche.  It does point out the irrelevance of the official announcements, though, especially when candidates announce when they're going to announce.

I know there's red tape and campaign finance laws and other rigamarole about this, and I'm sick of it.  It's manufactured news, worse than polling.

Anyway, my larger point was that I guess I expected Fox News to be more responsible with their debate invitations and whatever.   (Why, I dunno.)

IF there is a right to healthcare, who will you force to labor and give it against their will?

Posted by: Rand Paul! at May 13, 2011 10:46 AM (1fanL)

Lawyers, of course.  Especially Ivy League lawyers, 'cause they know everything!

so are the daily ron paul threads going to supplant the Doom threads?

With the Doom, you need a bit of old coot to offset it.

Posted by: Rand Paul at May 13, 2011 10:46 AM (pW2o

Who has special obligations to all of their fellow human beings, and where did those obligations arise?

IF there is a right to healthcare, who will you force to labor and give it against their will?

Posted by: Rand Paul! at May 13, 2011 10:46 AM (1fanL)

If no one signs up to become a doctor, the government will simply go into the schools and pick the students who are best at biology, then take them to special medical schools and train them up to be super great doctors who work at the behest of the state in service of the proletariat people.

That... sounds oddly familiar...

Lawyers, of course.  Especially Ivy League lawyers, 'cause they know everything!

Posted by: AmishDude at May 13, 2011 10:47 AM (73tyQ)

I'm starting to like you even though I don't want to.

 It will make us a society of the poor, living off government assistance and the uber rich and moderately rich. 

That's the whole point, curious. That's what Obama, his minions and definately his puppet masters want. Then there will be only the poor and the elite and his job is done.

Have you all forgotten me already?

#413

This is a very good point. Sometimes, 'principled' politicians are more interested in creating their personal brands than fighting for policy. Ron Paul certainly seems to be in it for himself.

Revised Hippocratic Oath:

I will remember that I remain a member of society, with special obligations to all my fellow human beings, those sound of mind and body as well as the infirm as long as I'm paid in cold hard cash. 

Fine, let's have a hippocratic oath for every profession. If you are a lawyer you should have to take on a client if they request it and then it's your problem getting paid.

Same with engineers, restaurants, etc etc.

I know it sounds cold hearted, but so what? People don't have to become doctors and soon many people won't become doctors if they can't get paid.

If you're so excited about helping people, then you go college for four years, and then med school for five years and then residency for 2-3 more years. You give up 12 years of your life, take hundreds of thousands of dollars out in loans, begin your career in your early 30s and then be told you may or may not be compensated for your work.

#419

Zakaria has a television show and is strongly tied to the media. The media will help Obama win re-election, not his advisors, therefore:

Zakaria > Advisors

I'm starting to like you even though I don't want to.

Posted by: FUBAR at May 13, 2011 10:50 AM (1fanL)

I get that a lot.

#419

Zakaria has a television show and is strongly tied to the media. The media will help Obama win re-election, not his advisors, therefore:

Zakaria > Advisors

Posted by: Paper at May 13, 2011 10:54 AM (VoSja)

Yep.  Is it too early to begin drinking?  I'm thinking of moving up from wine to vodka.

So it's a double-lose because he makes himself (as a doctor) out to be a greedy blood-sucker while simultaneously setting up a really dishonest portrayal of the liberals' position on health care. 

Why is getting paid for ones services make one a greedy blood sucker? Why is seeking compensation or profit evil? People seem to be so generous with peoples labor simply because they are doctors.

Here's the logic and it's sound.

1. Because of the Hippocratic Oath, doctors have to treat anyone.

2. Everyone has a right to free care

3. therefore doctors have to treat everyone with the promise that the government will compensate them.

But anyone who deals with medicare or medicaid can tell you that the government often doesn't pay on time, pay the full amount or sometimes at all.

So essentially you as a doctor have to provide a service and then employ an office full of people to try to get paid for that services

IF there is a right to healthcare, who will you force to labor and give it against their will?

Posted by: Rand Paul! at May 13, 2011 10:46 AM (1fanL)

Lawyers, of course.  Especially Ivy League lawyers, 'cause they know everything!

Simple, Chinese peasants (aka Credit Card) until they get a blue-water navy. Its called exporting inflation and debt or Winning The Future.

So essentially you as a doctor have to provide a service and then employ an office full of people to try to get paid for that services

Posted by: Ben at May 13, 2011 10:57 AM (wuv1c)

See?  We told you our policies would boost employment! 

Posted by: curious at May 13, 2011 10:52 AM (k1rwm)

Don't whine.  You sound whiny.  Look, you didn't just have an unpopular position, you doubled-down on it and called people names who disagreed with you.

Fine.  This is AoS, we're adults here, we can take it and move on.  But if you're going to fight with knives, expect to get cut.

Ron Paul will have the same effect as he has had the other times he's run.  Except less this time.

I will remember that I remain a member of society, with special obligations to all my fellow human beings, those sound of mind and body as well as the infirm as long as I'm paid in cold hard cash. 

You dick! Let me guess. His years upon years of education, no doubt paid for out of the family pocketbook, now earns him the right to work for free, or damned near free?

I tell you what. Why don't YOU show up and work for free at your job? Donate your salary to a worthy cause.

Posted by: KG at May 13, 2011 11:01 AM (DeCj1)

You been on a 48 hour bender, bro?

Same thing with health care.  If the government (incorrectly) says I have a right to health care, then the assumption is that they are fulfilling that right.  They do it now by providing medicare payments to private doctors or they do it by having VA doctors. The logical extension of Obamacare (which is wrong wrong wrong, but that's not my point) is having civil service doctors. 

But Obamacare turns all doctors, private and not, into civil service doctors.

Or at the very least will if taken to its logical conclusion.

What do you think the government's response will be when all private practice doctors stop accepting medicare, medicaid or Obamacare patients because of delinquent or non payment?

Do you think a system can survive with competent and numerous private doctors and a group of small, less competent civil service doctors? Given that most patients will be forced into the second group by Obamacare?

Posted by: booger at May 13, 2011 11:02 AM (9RFH1)

so "el presbo" (rush) is with fareed and "spooky dude" is with christianne"...

fascinating..

Same thing with health care.  If the government (incorrectly) says I have a right to health care, then the assumption is that they are fulfilling that right.  They do it now by providing medicare payments to private doctors or they do it by having VA doctors. The logical extension of Obamacare (which is wrong wrong wrong, but that's not my point) is having civil service doctors. 

The thing about that is that a lot of private doctors are having to seriously consider accepting Medicaid or Medicare patients, because the cost/benefit analysis is hopelessly bad.  I see it as inevitable that the government would make it illegal for doctors to refuse Medicare, Medicaid, or other government insurance under Obamacare, while simultaneously doing nothing to account for the low or non-existent payments that these sources make in exchange for medical services.  So the doctors could either shutter their services, accept these patients at a loss or charge their other patients exorbitant fees to make up for those losses, become government workers, or break the law.  If they become government workers, how does that benefit anyone?  And how could they pay their staff?  They couldn't.  So they'd become government workers, their office staff would become government workers, their nursing staff would become government workers... All of them being paid with tax dollars from an ever-shrinking private industry.

I see your point, and I'm not a libertarian, but I agree with Rand Paul on this. 

 a ron paul, independent candidacy just might shock you with a win.

I know you are going to attack me for this.  Lately, you get called stupid and all kinds of names and wished dead....

Stupid is as stupid does. But I don't wish you dead.

cui bono, soothsayer?

Herb Kohl has had nothing to do with the department stores since the '80s. He sold them to BAT, who then sold them to the management team just before I started driving on the Kohl's account in 1988. I drove for them for 22 years.

If the government (incorrectly) says I have a right to health care, then the assumption is that they are fulfilling that right

I'm not picking on you, Y-Not, but you've exactly described the problem.  A government does not FULFILL a right.  Rather, a government does not INFRINGE upon a right.  If they want to say I have a right to healthcare (which I don't, but whatever) then they should not be looking at how they can enforce that right, but rather they should look at what policies are in place that make it difficult for individuals to access healthcare and then fix those policies by REMOVING government from the equation, not adding more in. 

I realize I'm preaching to the choir on this, but maybe a liberal troll will read it and take away some knowledge.  A girl can dream, yeah?

(Of course, I'm assuming that liberals know how to read...)

see it as inevitable that the government would make it illegal for doctors to refuse Medicare, Medicaid, or other government insurance under Obamacare, while simultaneously doing nothing to account for the low or non-existent payments that these sources make in exchange for medical services

It is going to become mandatory. It will have to. They passed a law that runs counter to human nature. People act in their own interest and giving your labor for a small chance at being compensated isn't in their interest.

I know a bunch of doctors, many of them already don't accept medicare and medicaid patients because they often lose money on it. You have to treat the patient, and then hire a staff to get the money.

The same will happen with Obamacare, and the government will have created a large group of americans who won't be able to get new doctors because the doctors won't accept them.

Keep in mind that MANY companies are dumping their private insurance plans and letting(read:forcing) their employees to enroll in Obamacare.

So we're going to have a large percentage of the population, perhaps a majority, on an insurance plan that won't be accepted by most doctors.

At that point the government will have one of two options. Scrap Obamacare or force all private practices to accept Obamacare patients under the threat of a penalty. Which do you think they will choose?

 a ron paul, independent candidacy just might shock you with a win.

I know you are going to attack me for this.  Lately, you get called stupid and all kinds of names and wished dead....

Stupid is as stupid does. But I don't wish you dead.

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at May 13, 2011 11:22 AM (YmPwQ)

someone already did that the other day and it wasn't pleasant to read.  It actually shocked and hurt me.  I was surprised that someone has that much hatred in them and posts here.  I actually prayed for the person.  If you have that much hate, eventually it will consume you and hurt you, that's sort of something a lot of people don't understand.  I'm not stupid either.  If you observe the people around you and read what your friends, from all over the country are saying, the patience of the American people is really really running thin.

Posted by: curious at May 13, 2011 10:52 AM (k1rwm)

I can't believe you're whining for sympathy after calling people bitches and then catching some blowback.  And LOL @ your twatty bullshit about "the opinion you are told to have"; what a fucking crock that is.  I give ace a good deal of shit for his opinions that I don't agree with and, unlike the lefty sites where your garbage might adhere to the prevalent views, I don't get banned.

I can't believe you're whining for sympathy after calling people bitches and then catching some blowback.  And LOL @ your twatty bullshit about "the opinion you are told to have"; what a fucking crock that is.  I give ace a good deal of shit for his opinions that I don't agree with and, unlike the lefty sites where your garbage might adhere to the prevalent views, I don't get banned.

Posted by: Captain Hate at May 13, 2011 11:28 AM (l3wWa)

OMG you are just like a liberal.  Why don't you prove everything you just wrote with my own words.  Or, did you hear it on TMZ and believe it is the absolute truth?

OMG you are just like a liberal.  Why don't you prove everything you just wrote with my own words.  Or, did you hear it on TMZ and believe it is the absolute truth?

Posted by: curious at May 13, 2011 11:32 AM (k1rwm)

You are such a brainless lying cunt.  Have a horrible life.  Let ace and the cobloggers deal with you and your ilk because there's no upside to responding to you further.

He is just a nutbar. but on the main stream propaganda machines they are saying he is the tea party. LORD!

Here Herman Cain kicked every ones ass in the first debate. but they are silent about him.

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