1
John McCain '08 would make a great case study on this.

2 The real problem is that the women of the right media can't compete with Christiane Amanpour and Andrea Mtichell.

3
It was more than just a running gag that John McCain was eager to please the NYT, it was a reality.

It's that type of behavior by Republicans that is so befuddling.

4 Think we can consider the Tea Party Express as definitely an Establishment organization too?  Afterall, they get to host the next debate, with CNN.

5 I still don't understand why the Reagan Library agreed to have MSNBC/Politico moderate the debate.

Does anyone know the backstory on that?

6 0bama is a stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure.

7 Honestly the reason Huntsman got so many questions is because he is exactly what MSNBC wants from a Republican. Except that whole gay sex scandal thing. They they really want.

8 I think a lot of it is fear of the dishonest MSM. If even one blogger says one embarrassing thing, the whole GOP gets smeared with it.

Look at the Huckabee/Obama thing.  A nobody, Huckabee, gets fact-checked on a relatively minor statement.  Obama makes the same mistake -- in a primetime speech in front of a joint session of Congress, which should have merited some fact-checking -- and it's buried, ignored and excused.

9 Republicans are still probably using the rolodex.

10 It's ridiculous that we let the lefty media present our side for a debate. I seem to recall the left totally avoiding Fox in '08

11 >> I suppose that might be right, but it really wasn't the respectable right alt-media that, say, drove the Weiner story, and set the stage for what could very well be a remarkable changing of the guard in New York 9, was it? No shit. I was tweeting and emailing the NRO crew - especially the people who were posting in The Corner - over Memorial Day weekend when you, Breitbart and a handful of other folks were pursuing this story. Crickets. I think Jonah Goldberg was the only one of them that mentioned anything at all about it and even then only on Twitter.

12 Look, at some point, you have repeated enough that Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

But we aren't there yet.

13 I think the establishment right has problems with conservatives.

14 Ace, I have written about this over and over again. Until You and you're blogging Ilk take it full bore to Rove, Krathammer, Krystol and all of the rest of these establishment fucks whose sole purpose is to maintain their own positions of power, their abilities to financially profit and there abilities to shape the conversation, you will be a Red headed step child. If a Perry, Palin or Bachman gets into office their reign is over. They will do everything they can to stop Perry. You have already seen it and yet you blindly support and excuse the Washington beltway establishment. You and AP, EE, etc bring your exclusion from the GOP on yourselves.

15 The problem is that there really isn't a dime's worth of difference between the establishment right and the establishment left. That's why the Tea Party has had such a quick growth in power. People are sick of voting for the lesser of two evils.

16 5 I still don't understand why the Reagan Library agreed to have MSNBC/Politico moderate the debate. Does anyone know the backstory on that? ------------------------------------------------------- I think Establishment Republicans are embarrassed by Ronald Reagan. Hell, the DEMOCRATS mention Ronald Reagan(inaccurately and when it suits them)more than the Republicans do! So perhaps the Republicans agreed to let liberal media handle the debate to neutralize the spirit of conservatism that the venue should have highlighted.

17 set the stage for what could very well be a remarkable changing of the guard in New York 9

Thanks!

18 10 It's ridiculous that we let the lefty media present our side for a debate. I seem to recall the left totally avoiding Fox in '08

Absolutely agreed.  The left has completely bought into the notion that Fox News = Lies and Propaganda.  Why doesn't Team Red do the same AT LEAST insofar as it comes to MSNBC?

19 Too many big shot Repubs keep hoping the leftist Obama-scum will like them someday.

Why?

Because most of them grew up in upscale, left-wing neighborhoods. Often in the monolithically leftist northeast or west coasts.

But even in so-called red states, the elites often grew up or spent formative years near capital cities or university towns.

I lived in North Carolina, a pretty conservative state. But I lived in Chapel Hill where I was openly attacked whenever I said I was a Republican. I dated a chick who always apologized whenever people found out she drove her Dad's old SUV. She avoided giving other people rides because she didn't want the other grad students or faculty to know about her eco-crimes. She hid her SUV driving the way I hide my asian midget porn.

Texas is pretty right wing. But Austin and Houston local govts are dominated by hard-core left-wingers.

That's a huge advantage of the Left and there is no analogue on the Right.

It's be like if New York City was dominated by fire-breathing right-wingers and lefties were always afraid or apologetic to be openly liberal.

The Left controls the elite levels of power -- like education, the universities, the bureaucracies -- even in most right wing states.

The establishment Repub elite have to navigate these hard-core leftist controlled institutions. They learn to be fearful and apologetic. They learn to couch and soften their views. To make them acceptable to the leftists that control the gateways to power in our hyper-credentialed society.

20 12 Look, at some point, you have repeated enough that Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

But we aren't there yet.

Posted by: fluffy at September 10, 2011 03:12 PM (4Kl5M)

Nope.

21 13 I think the establishment right has problems with conservatives.

I think you're right, actually.  The left thinks we are uneducated inbred hicks, and so does the establishment right.

22

ace,

Maybe it's because the establishment right knows we don't like them very much?

23 This is largely driven by the fact that, in the liberal media, conservative grassroots are portrayed as crazy or corporate-financed. Hanging out with us is a liability. Whereas, prominent Dems can hang out with Trumka, visit YearlyKos, etc. and generally the media gives them a free pass. There is no "controversy" about how a Dem Pol was associated with a far-left entity, because the media won't report it as a controversy. And if we try to raise it, they accuse us of "guilt by association." This is a real double standard, designed to help Dems draw energy from the left, and to cut off Republican politicians from energy from the right. Remember the anti-war protests, and how the media always zeroed in on the normal people rather than the freaks, but for Tea Party rallies they are always looking for the one crazy Ron Paul supporter in order to paint a picture of crazy whack-a-doodle haters? That's this same double standard.

24 5

Lefty on the board of the Reagan Library.

25 Spiker: It seems to me that the establishment right should be embarassed that they've moved so far away from Reagan's politics.

26 Proposed debate question - do Holder or Obama bear responsibility for the deaths and murders that resulted from Fast and Furious and the other illegal weapons operations?

27 I think of the Rightwing Blogosphere like the American Militia in the French-Indian Wars. We're there to do the dirty work. ace would be our Daniel Day Lewis, our Long Carbine. or Bow. whatever. Kos would be Magwah. Screw him. .

28 Remember the anti-war protests, and how the media always zeroed in on the normal people rather than the freaks, but for Tea Party rallies they are always looking for the one crazy Ron Paul supporter in order to paint a picture of crazy whack-a-doodle haters? That's this same double standard.

Yup.

Antiwar rallies, 2003: "Moms pushing strollers"
Tea Party rallies, 2010: "FREAKS WITH GADSDEN FLAGS AND RACIST SIGNS"

29 CEO of The Politico, Frederick Ryan, is also the Board Chairman for the Reagan Library.

30 It's all about money anyway. Do you realize that NONE of the MSM can stand on their own feet these days? They are ALL propped up by a parent corporate daddy. The blogosphere lacks that kind of pull. The Repub's will always respect the money over ideology.

31 ace would be our Daniel Day Lewis
our Long Carbine.

Don't all us moronettes wish.

32 Rick Perry courted PJ media and Breitbart last year. He even took a big group of bloggers to the shooting range and taught them how to shoot. At the same time, he boycotted TX newspaper editorial board visits during the gubernatorial election because his campaign team's research showed that they were ineffective.

I think Perry gets it.

33

"The internet is a series of tubes"

That says everything right there...they're still living in the 50's.

I haven't watched broadcast TV or cable in over 5 years.

34 yeah I haven't owned a TV in about 2 years now

35 When I was younger and not the openly right-wing asshole I am today, I lived mainly among left-wingers. When I would meet somebody new (ie a vagina-american) that I wanted to like me, I'd have to soften my actual views.

The best way to do that was to bash a prominent right-winger. I constantly had to prove that I was a decent person. I wasn't a evil, nazi, fuck like all those other right-wingers. Maybe make a joke about some televangelist. Or Newt Gingrich. Do a Bush-is-stupid impression.

I had to establish my cultural bona-fides. That I was one of them. Cause I really wanted these vagina-americans to like me. And by like me, I mean I really wanted a 2nd date. And by 2nd date, I mean blowjob.

I think most establishment right-wingers went through similar experiences.

Once you learn that a well-timed Cheney-is-evil, Bush-is-dumb joke unlocks the door to the left-wing college chick blowjob store ... its hard to unlearn that lesson. Lot of positive reinforcement there.

36 in other news, Charles Blow said Obies speech was fapptastic!

37 Rick Perry spoke at tea parties in Texas too.

38 The stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure in the White House right now got his big break in politics from Bill Ayers, who was involved in terrorist activities that killed at least one person. Did he have to answer for that? No. Some crazy asshole schizophrenic who said Barack Obama and Yasser Arafat were his favorite politicians shot a moderate Democrat who had recently (1) voted against Nancy Pelosi for speaker; and (2) participated in the Tea Party-inspired reading of the U.S. Constitution that liberals were so angry about. Who got blamed? The SCOAMF who got his start in politics from a bombmaker, or Sarah Palin and the Tea Party? Left-wing union goons take HOSTAGES for HOURS, and no one gets arrested. Let's see the Tea Party try that. Let's take some hostages and see if we don't get arrested.

39 "3 It was more than just a running gag that John McCain was eager to please the NYT, it was a reality." And the Old Grey Whore, I mean Old Grey Lady, returned the favor by doing a hit piece on his wife. This article included such earth shaking tidbits as, Cindy gave members of his staff Arizona plants that died. She appeared thin, even fragile. She broke her wrist shaking hands. McCain didn't attend a lot of school functions. The whole article was aimed at making the McCains look small. It was pathetic in how hard the NYT people dug to find items that looked bad. There are things that I don't like about McCain, but that NYT article would have been disgusting if it had come from the National Enquirer. How anyone can take the NYT seriously is beyond me.

40

 "Markos "Screw them, I feel nothing" Kozantiopolous. (Note: that's not really his last name. I haven't bothered to learn it for the past ten years and I'm not starting now.)"

I call all Greeks "Snuffaluffagus".  It's easier.

41 It was more than just a running gag that John McCain was eager to please the NYT, it was a reality.  Posted by: Soothsayer G Robinson at September 10, 2011 03:05 PM (sqkOB)

Remember how badly the Slimes treated McCain with the false story about his "inappropriate relationship" with a younger (than his wife) blond lobbyist?  I'm sure his little feelers were hurt because they had always loved him best of all the repubs.

42 24 5 Lefty on the board of the Reagan Library. --------------------------------------------------------- My God they infest everything. Purposely even.

43 Right as rain, Ace.  The only thing that makes sense is that the GOP establishment is just as venal and crapweaselly as the left establishment and they don't trust us and they don't like the idea of having the pants pulled down.  I hope and pray that they are in for a major come-to-Jesus over the next 14 months.

44 The Left had a strategy. It was called the march through the institutions.

It worked.

45 It gets lonely here behind the lines in Jersey. Everyone at work, all of my relations, most of my acquaintances are hard-to-moderate left. I am constantly bombarded by how 'out of touch' or 'uninformed' I am. Facts just confuse them when 'feelings' are all they need. I need these blogs to remind me I'm not alone and should keep fighting. My own personal preference cascade.

46 >>>Ace, I have written about this over and over again. Until You and you're blogging Ilk take it full bore to Rove, Krathammer, Krystol and all of the rest of these establishment fucks whose sole purpose is to maintain their own positions of power, their abilities to financially profit and there abilities to shape the conversation, you will be a Red headed step child. I don't have the same emotion you do. I am not here to "take it full bore" to the Republican Establishment. In many cases, by the way, you're not even talking about the Republican establishment, but merely Republican *intellectuals.* Krauthammer is not really establishment. He's just learned. I know for many the REAL enemy seems to be the Republican Establishment but it's not my enemy.

47 I think Establishment Republicans are embarrassed by Ronald Reagan.

Posted by: Spiker at September 10, 2011 03:14 PM (4t9J5)

This is exactly right; the country clubbing Repukes were horrified by Reagan and did their best to neutralize him with that worthless fuck Poppy Bush.  They're determined that Reagan v2.0 will never happen again too; put some sodium pentathol in that fat turd Rove and that will come flying out.

48 And the Old Grey Whore, I mean Old Grey Lady, returned the favor by doing a hit piece on his wife.
Posted by: nerdygirl at September 10, 2011 03:30 PM (eMPxE)

Yes, and that was on the front page, in the week before the election. After they written glowing articles about Michelle. And it was preceded by the their false story of a McCain affair right after McCain nailed the nomination. They were so far up Obama's butt they should've suffocated to death long ago.

49

Majory Heather (lucky) Penny, another unsung hero of 9/11

http://tinyurl.com/3fnsp76

 

50 It has to be that they just don't trust us, and expect us to embarrass them.

A conservative might actually ask them a question whose answer they'd have to live up to. They much prefer to make the argument that they can't take too strong a position that agrees with us lest they upset the mythical persuadable middle. We should just trust them and mindlessly support whoever the various nomination processes generate (*cough* Scozzafava *cough*), they think.

The problem is they do not understand the nature of our relationship. We do not serve the government or the politicians. They are under our feet.

51 This is a two way street, IMHO. Some (note: not necessarily this one) blogs touted flawed Tea Party candidates (O'Donnell, Angle) over the establishment picks and it cost us two Senate seats. It's also unfair to lump all right bloggers together. Jim Hoft and Dan Riehl are batshit crazy. Allahpundit is a total RINO.

52 Remember how badly the Slimes treated McCain with the false story about his "inappropriate relationship" with a younger (than his wife) blond lobbyist?  I'm sure his little feelers were hurt because they had always loved him best of all the repubs.

Posted by: huerfano at September 10, 2011 03:30 PM (kD+se)

They also refused to print an op-ed response to the SCoaMF's garbage on health care.  And the senile shit still goes sucking up to them.

53 The stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure in the White House right now got his big break in politics from Bill Ayers, who was involved in terrorist activities that killed at least one person. Did he have to answer for that? No.  Posted by: Daryl Herbert at September 10, 2011 03:29 PM

Those terrorist activities you mention had a specific intent, to foment a race war in the US causing the collapse of the government and our betters, Ayers and his commie ilk, taking over to lead us to a socialist workers paradise.  They failed, but who is inciting racial strife these days?  It ain't the Tea Party.

54 Lefty on the board of the Reagan Library.

Well that explains it. Geez.

55

Remember how badly the Slimes treated McCain with the false story about his "inappropriate relationship" with a younger (than his wife) blond lobbyist? I'm sure his little feelers were hurt because they had always loved him best of all the repubs.

Posted by: huerfano at September 10, 2011 03:30 PM (kD+se)

This is what an endorsement from the Times will get you.  Really I can't wait for them to endorse Romney, and if he secures the nomination to see all the articles they write about how crazy his religion is.

56 Posted by: Peaches at September 10, 2011 03:31 PM (/ybwc) ------------------------------------------------- Did you see the pic of Biden and Boehner doing the bro hand clasp the other night? These bastards know they are the keepers of a rigged, corrupt system. We are lucky they even give us lip service. I can tell you this; Boehner and McConnell are just as anxious for the area Party to fade away as Harry Reid is.

57 I think there is a schism in the movement between those who seek political change and social change. A revolution seeks social change, in the sense that an entire social order is displaced in favor of a new dominant social order. I think many people in the movement have this in mind, a revolution of the "peasants," if you will, against the "aristocracy" of the "establishment." I don't really give a crap about that. for one thing, it's not going to happen. For another thing, I don't have the confidence in the would-be *new* dominant order that they have in themselves. Hate to bring this up again, but the would-be *new* dominant order tends to do things like push Christine O'Donnell and, worse yet, not even take a lesson from such errors.

58 I was in the car listening to the McCain/Oblamer debate when the biggest, fattest hanging curve ball came to McCain regarding the financial crisis.  Oblamer had just responded to the question with how he "wrote a letter."

So, I immediately came back with what I expected McCain to say: "You wrote a letter?  That's it, you wrote a letter?  Well, here is what I did ... "  Hell, McCain had actually introduced a bill -- and he had a fat one ready to crank right out of the park.  I had the data down cold and since I am nobody I was sure that McCain would be way ahead of me and just nail Oblamer with how pathetic it is to respond to a pending crisis by writing a letter.

Well, McCain answers with some completely pantywaist bullshit, and I turned the radio off.  I completely believed at that point that he was deliberately throwing the election.

What does all this have to do with R's allowing the stink of MSNBC anywhere near decent people?  Sometimes I just don't believe they are even trying to win.  I keep trying to think of one, but I just can't seem to find explanations that make more sense to me.  I wish I could.

59 "The problem is that there really isn't a dime's worth of difference between the establishment right and the establishment left. That's why the Tea Party has had such a quick growth in power. People are sick of voting for the lesser of two evils."

BINGO!

60 I know for many the REAL enemy seems to be the Republican Establishment but it's not my enemy.

The real enemy is Washington DC and the homogenizing effect it has on politicians sent there. Talking about the GOP establishment as if it exists in some kind of vacuum is nonsense.

61 Should have been TEA Party. Damn U-phone!!!!

62
2004: 'Two Americas' crap from the two gigolos

2008: How many houses do you own, Sen McCain?

63 The establishment RINO repubs are also great believers in credentialism.  The MFM are considered to be credentialed as demonstrated by their constant appearance on TV.  Faux News is an acceptable venue, but it is not the ultimate media exposure that pols crave.
Bloggers are obviously NOT credentialed because they wear pajamas while they type, have no political influence (except with fly-over country types), don't host really good parties inside the beltway, and don't really contribute significant amounts to politicians. 
Bottom line, why waste time with a blogger, when you might be able to score with the big-time media personality.
Personally, I would love to see a debate hosted by the Ace and the AoS co-bloggers!  We might actually learn something.

64 This is another reason why Sarah Palin is so smart to have waited on her decision. And when the time comes for her to commit, nobody will be better equipped to deal with the MSM than fully-vetted Sarah.

65

OT Drudge on Solyndra: "Report: Obama sat in on meetings..."

Followed the link (sporting a huge schadenboner, natch) and there is nothing in the story that I could see that has anything to do with such an assertion.

WTF?

66

60 I think there is a schism in the movement between those who seek political change and social change.

A revolution seeks social change, in the sense that an entire social order is displaced in favor of a new dominant social order. I think many people in the movement have this in mind, a revolution of the "peasants," if you will, against the "aristocracy" of the "establishment."

I don't really give a crap about that. for one thing, it's not going to happen. For another thing, I don't have the confidence in the would-be *new* dominant order that they have in themselves.

To be fair, it doesn't seem like the establishment is all that interested in a political change either.

67 Ooooooh boy....

68 49, I know for many the REAL enemy seems to be the Republican Establishment but it's not my enemy. If you are a conservative, it is your enemy. They are worse then the libtards because they damage from the inside. I don't have the same emotion you do. I am not here to "take it full bore" to the Republican Establishment. Then why are you here? what "IS" your purpose? Why do you work so hard? Does this make you rich? Get you Laid? I assumed you are the harbinger of truth. You cut through the shit. You look paste the shinet sparklys into the black goo. In many cases, by the way, you're not even talking about the Republican establishment, but merely Republican *intellectuals.* Krauthammer is not really establishment. He's just learned. They are the mouth pieces of the establishment. It's time to shut them up.

69 If there wasn't massive media bias, Republican politicians would be happy to hang out with us. Don't blame Republican politicians for doing what is necessary to get elected. They are useless to us if they can't get elected. We need to change the liberal media. To do that, we need a Republican Congress and a Republican in the presidency. Then we need to start passing laws designed to fuck over the liberal corprate-media alliance. FIRST NEW LAW: take away heightened libel protections (like NYT v. Sullivan) to the extent that a media source is part of a conglomerate (or owned by a parent company) that is invested in the same area as was covered. Meaning that if Fox News anchors libel Sony Pictures by saying something false about a Sony movie, they would not enjoy the special protections from NYT v. Sullivan. Since most media outlets are owned by conglomerates participating in thousands of different markets (MSNBC is GE, CNN is AOLTIMEWARNER, etc.) these media outlets would lose special libel protections. They would have to be very careful about reporting things truthfully, or they would go out of business. A media corporation NOT tied in to a conglomerate would have the freedom to report with heightened libel protections. This would reduce the incentive for big companies to conquer/acquire media outlets. SECOND NEW RULE: at press conferences, before journalists get to ask questions, they have to answer questions about their own coverage. The press secretary should point out examples of biased coverage and demand explanations from the journos. If the liberal rags won't explain their bias, then fuck 'em, don't let them ask questions. If the GOP can break liberal media bias, it will get a 5-10 point advantage in elections. That has to be the Republican candidate's first priority, even though they can't admit it while they are on the campaign trail.

70 The reason that the MSNBC debate was at the Reagan Library was probably because of Ron Jr.....who has some close ties to Politico.

71 I think the GOP is reluctant to embrace the blogosphere because they know the media would try to tie anything remotely provocative to a particular candidate (think SCOAMF) and attack relentlessly. The media, of course, lets the Democrats embrace the blogosphere while also giving them complete severability should Kos say something like "screw them". The GOP knows the media game.

72 I would love to see a debate hosted by the Ace and the AoS co-bloggers!  We might actually learn something.

Ace-have you suggested this to the RNC or its ilk?  I"m cereal.  It wouldn't have to be only AOSHQ, of course.

73 >>>The establishment RINO repubs are also great believers in credentialism. I'll tell you what is bothering me, though: the rise of an equal-but-opposite "anti-credentialism" notion. Look, I think credentialism, as practiced in an arrogant, privilege-protecting, vindictive, politically-biased, competition-squashing way is a bad thing. But you know, credentials also don't count for *nothing,* either. As I noted in an earlier comment here, I am not really an enthusiastic fan for this eternal "LET'S GET THOSE ARISTOCRATIC BASTARDS!" rah-rah that seems to mistake a lack of credentials or current dominance for virtue or wisdom. Virtue, cunning, and wisdom are to be always sought for, and not *assumed.* They are not to be assumed on the basis of credentials; and neither are they to be assumed on the *lack* of credentials.

74

WTF?

Posted by: sherlock at September 10, 2011 03:41 PM (CkxJi)

Our fresh revision of history will be ready in a minute, please call back later!

75 Hate to bring this up again, but the would-be *new* dominant order tends to do things like push Christine O'Donnell and, worse yet, not even take a lesson from such errors.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 03:38 PM (nj1bB)

Maybe, but the establishment right has a way of picking some lemons as well. Such as Dole, McCain or the establishment governor candidate in colorado that had all kinds of ethical problems.

The right needs a farm team and there doesn't seem to be much attempt at starting and maintaining one.

76 The establishment RINO repubs are also great believers in credentialism.

What's really funny about that is that Rove never misses a chance to disparage Palin's education.  But she has a bachelor's degree which he does not.  She also has an intact marriage which he's an 0-fer as well.

Btw, I think it's a mistake to include Kristol in the Repuke establishment category because he consistently is open-minded on the Tea Party and rarely dismisses anything as "too far fetched".

77 47 Trainer at September 10, 2011 03:33 PM (nWxhZ)

Where in NJ?  I'm in Ocean County, and we're pretty red.  Granted, I'm next to the Naval Base/Fort Dix/McGuire AFB complex.  But, Ocean always votes R.  My neighbors are former military and can't stand the "SOB" in the WH. 

78

Hate to bring this up again, but the would-be *new* dominant order tends to do things like push Christine O'Donnell and, worse yet, not even take a lesson from such errors.

Ace,

     Hate to point out the obvious. This is a form of perfection fallacy. With the old order, we wouldn't have won 63 seats in 2010. Between the two imperfect choices, I have enough with the establishment. To be honest, most of them are very deferential to Obama while savagely "criticizing" conservatives. Whether they want to win the cocktail favor with Beltway Insider or they truly hate the real conservatives more, the end effect is the same. I have enough of them. They are not the real enemies, but they are more an enabler or useful idiots at best.

79

Maybe, but the establishment right has a way of picking some lemons as well. Such as Dole, McCain or the establishment governor candidate in colorado that had all kinds of ethical problems.

Charlie Crist...

80 I don't think the Dems are really any more interested in the left-o-sphere either.  It's just that the leftosphere is full of delusional idiots who think they are important, whereas the right-o-sphere has a more skeptical view of the perspicacity of their politicians (i.e., we know they suck at understanding new stuff).

81 Just wanted to add that advertising is heavily left-leaning as well - and if anything permeates the culture, even more than the creative "content" - it's ads. It's just everywhere, Trainer, I feel ya. And it's so quick, how you can get blacklisted as a creative if you say something wrong (or don't say something "right"). I wish I were independently wealthy!

82 The basic question is why the Republican party keeps having the "enemies" moderate our debate. It doesn't inform the public and it undermines our position. This is beyond stupidity now.

83 Perhaps one day you're realize they are actually in cahoots with (i.e., are) the enemy.

Speaking of which, how's the rigged debt 'deal' working out?

http://tinyurl.com/3oxx9of

Surprise, everyone's ass is covered.

84 Arlen Specter...

85 It's not DC that creates RINOs.  It's Austin, and Raleigh, and Atlanta, and Nashville, and Des Moines, and Northern Virginia, etc, etc, etc. It's the Left controlling the gateways to power throughout America, even in red states. It's campuses and law schools of every state in America. And establishment types navigating those gateways.

86 37 in other news, Charles Blow said Obies speech was fapptastic! ----------------------------------------------------------------- Would it hurt ya Charles to polish a caucasian's knob once in awhile? What are ya, racist or something? In other news, Maxine Waters says the American Slobs Act has CBC fingerprints all over it! Really? Obama isn't even taking their calls.

87 Bad cop to the good cop.

88 The basic question is why the Republican party keeps having the "enemies" moderate our debate. It doesn't inform the public and it undermines our position. This is beyond stupidity now.

Posted by: LAI at September 10, 2011 03:48 PM (iVem0)

There isn't any choice, if you are going to go on network TV you are going into enemy territory. Even fox in the debate they moderated were so interested in proving their unbiased street cred that they were as bad or worse than MSNBC.

89
This is a good time to mention that I drive a motorcycle.

90

It really makes me gag to see the establishment Elephants reveling in having control of the House.....while continuing to look down their trunks at the Tea Party folks.

From what I understand about Rick Perry, he got tired of the Bush dynasty treating him like "the help"......when he was/is the one who was even more conservative than they are.

The story I heard, is that GWB kept calling Perry after Perry took over as governor.....to give him 'advice' on what he should do about this or that......and Perry finally very politely told him to fuck off.

91
I'll tell you what is bothering me, though: the rise of an equal-but-opposite "anti-credentialism" notion.

Oh c'mon, Ace.  Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.  The left has much more invested in the concept of credentialism.  Attacking this harms them much more than harms us.  Just recall the "dumb people like Bush don't get into Harvard" story you commented on the other day.  We're not about to start strangling intellectuals with their own entrails yet, and if we ever approach that point, we'll worry about it then.  But it is entirely right and proper for us to point out, all the time, over and over, that there are plenty of stupid people who are credentialed.  And I say that as a guy who actually is credentialed.

92 I'll tell you what is bothering me, though: the rise of an equal-but-opposite "anti-credentialism" notion.

Credentials are credentials when they credential something credentiable.

But "has a Harvard law degree" doesn't make one an ubermensch expert in everything and that's what

And "expertise" is not a synonym for "genius" or "competence".

93 I don't really give a crap about that...

You may not care but that's one of the major differences between the lesser people of the GOP establishment and the citizens whose votes they need. What your post really comes down to is the establishment's comfort with people who think like them, at the Times and MSNBC, for example, who will reinforce their beliefs that city values are the way to go and we just can't be having actually conservative policies put in place. You bloggers are trusted to be sufficiently correct-thinking because by and large the GOP establishment doesn't know you-whatever your preferences, you are not institutions they know to be sufficiently corrupted.

 for one thing, it's not going to happen.

Well, no, the international banking conspiracy is likely to blow itself all to hell before we see another election, and if we vote, we'll be voting on who's gonna put the tiny pieces back together into ... something.

Hate to bring this up again, but the would-be *new* dominant order tends to do things like push Christine O'Donnell and, worse yet, not even take a lesson from such errors.


That's because there was no error, unless 'Senator' O'Donnell was your only victory condition. I'm 60% sure even you acknowledged there was valued in defeating the establishment's candidate in order to keep the other 40 some senators in line.

We don't have any influence over these beasts except the threat of primarying them and the milder threat of staying home in the general election. We have to exercise that power as often as it takes to remind the politicians of their place.

94 I've already emailed Rice Pubics(sp) informing him 1)He's a fucking idiot 2) He ain't getting a fucking thin dime from me.

95 It's not DC that creates RINOs.  It's Austin, and Raleigh, and Atlanta, and Nashville, and Des Moines, and Northern Virginia, etc, etc, etc. It's the Left controlling the gateways to power throughout America, even in red states. It's campuses and law schools of every state in America. And establishment types navigating those gateways.

This is a good point. This is what Mark Steyn called the left 's march through the institutions of America (and the West in general). In the long term, we need to have a similar march through the institutions. But in the short term, why do we let the enemies attack our nominees as debate moderators. Why does the establishment in the Rep party keep doing this stupid thing over and over again?

96 And I say that as a guy who actually is credentialed.

Posted by: chemjeff at September 10, 2011 03:51 PM (s7mIC)

Of course, I take your POV to 11.  For instance, I regard success in law school as a negative indicator of intelligence.

But as I say above, we don't use credentialism.  If we did, then we'd say that current or former members of the bar should be forbidden from legislative office because of their conflict of interest.

97 Funny that this discussion should occur just as I receive a fundraising letter in the mail from the NRCC.

At least the RNC stopped sending me crap, after I so rudely hung up on their telemarketer a while ago.

98 That's because there was no error, unless 'Senator' O'Donnell was your only victory condition. I'm 60% sure even you acknowledged there was valued in defeating the establishment's candidate in order to keep the other 40 some senators in line. Thank God somebody else gets it. I feel very alone sometimes.

99 The people with credentials who claim to know what is best for everyone, are just arrogant fuckwads.  They would be arrogant fuckwads even if they had never been to school. 

100 I think we are alien to the senior leadership of the GOP's staff.  Not this site in particular, though Ace I must congratulate you on your work on HOTDOG! because left to their own devices I think Boehner would have shrugged.  We need to volunteer for the local GOP and slowly build influence.

Ace I think you should try to find a Congresscritter, Senator, or state Republican to do some work for.  We need to volunteer for local GOP operations and dpread word of the right blogsights and sooner or later the sites will break trhough into the mainstream.  We are already the background noise for RedEye at times, and if Limbaugh and Boortz don't pop their heads in or their staffers' heads anyway I miss my guess as our points are usually made in PG-13 form as is our analysis.

The only other thing I could thing of is to try to go the Jim Treacher route and get picked up by one of the big league's farm teams.

Have you considered a formal alliance with A Breibart Ace?

Enough of us join together and make real points and are seen to sway a portion of the party we gain tangible influence and some peripheral access.

101 Credentialism is so embedded in our society that there is little damage we can do by attacking it a bit.

And the credentialing process is so corrupted by the Left that weakening the respect we have for it harms the Left much more than us.

Just look at ClimateGate to see how for the Left is willing to go.

I think we defer to experts more now than at anytime in the past -- how's that working out? Maybe a little more skepticism would be a good thing.

102 When you consider the government as the ultimate mother or father, and expect it to take care of a person's every need in exchange for loyalty, it is only reasonable to view government positions as high status.  Thus, liberals tend to send their best and brightest into the government, or institutions with close ties (non-profits for example).   The best and brightest among conservatives, on the other hand, go out and become successful.  The result is that the conservative political establishment is full of people who I would wager have some rather significant inferiority issues.  Not everyone, but enough.  These are the ones who couldn't hack it in the real world, so they worked their way into the bureaucratic system.  They've got a nice cushy position and they'd hate to lose it.  Because they work with many smart and ambitious people, the best and the brightest on the left, they can tell themselves that they are the best and the brightest on the right.

103

If the legacy Pubbies had any brains they would have a debate hosted by Pajamas or somesuch, and tell them to ask tough questions.  An honest tough question is no problem, it's the dishonest gotcha questions that have no answer that are a problem.  Then the Pubbies could start publicly drawing contrasts between the "journalism" of the left and right, and discredit the leftist media.

If they had any brains.  Oops.

104 Ace, you're a big swinging dick in the dextrosphere. Why don't you fire something off to some of the others and then approach Reince Priebus ??

The left has always made the claim that the right-leaning media coordinates with the RNC.

Hell with it, give them something to really cry about

105 Allahpundit is a total RINO.

Understatement of the day........

106 >>>That's because there was no error, unless 'Senator' O'Donnell was your only victory condition. I'm 60% sure even you acknowledged there was valued in defeating the establishment's candidate in order to keep the other 40 some senators in line. Very minor. The back up argument is always "Well we succeeded in losing an election." That is, we kept Castle out. Well, losing elections is EXTREMELY easy. If we're looking to lose, we don't really have to do a damn thing; inertia will take care of that for us. The Massachusetts GOP should be praised by this logic for losing so consistently and perfectly. No compromise of principles there. I think -- and I've pretty much said this before -- that a lot of people are viewing "savvy" and "strategic thinking" as dirty, underhanded concepts, and are clapping themselves on the back for, essentially, being strategically dunderheaded. As if being unrealistic, dogmatic, and smug while losing are somehow *good* things. The tension continues to be between those who basically view politics as a debating society with an occasional intramural match where the score doesn't really matter (just a scrimmage), and those who do think that "dirty" things like actually winning are the most crucial things. The very idea that continues to be pushed -- with no apologies or no modification -- that we "win" by losing is precisely why I'm not eager to see the Happy To Lose brigade sweep aside the old order.

107 For instance, I regard success in law school as a negative indicator of intelligence.

naw, there are smart lawyers out there.
the problem comes with the worship of credentials.

Idiots who don't know better will just follow the guy with the long list of degrees.

And the guy with the long list of degrees will arrogantly puff himself up and allow himself to become an object of worship. 

The word for this is 'demagoguery'.  That is what credentialism really is.

108

I've already emailed Rice Pubics(sp) informing him 1)He's a fucking idiot 2) He ain't getting a fucking thin dime from me.

Posted by: Barbarian



(Yet it remains a mystery as to why the GOP establishment acts so aloof towards us.)

109 MSNBC is much further to the left than Fox is to the right,

MSNBC is the furthest to the left of all the networks is a better way to word it. Fox is on the left as well. And Commie Wallace did as much gotcha BS as MSNBC did.

110 Just look at ClimateGate to see how for the Left is willing to go.

Or answer the question "Why do normal people respond to my credentials with mistrust?"

111 >>>Have you considered a formal alliance with A Breibart Ace? It's actually been discussed. I'm not sure how seriously. Yes, I am saying I don't know how serious a discussion was in which I was a participant. People on the internet "discuss" a lot of things. It's difficult to know a lot of the time how seriously such talk should be taken.

112 F the establishment GOP.  The EGOP enables the DNC. 

113 52 thanks for posting that.  

114

'Credentialism' depends entirely upon.....what your definition of 'credentials' is. 

The Dems seem to define it as 'Ivy League education-speaking ability-adherence to leftist ideology'.

The Republicans used to use the same definition....except insert 'quasi-conservative' instead of 'leftist' in the ideoloy department..... At least the Reoublicans are begining to rethink that definition, to include 'Executive Experience' which can be gained in the private sector, instead of just in elected offices. 

115 >>>The word for this is 'demagoguery'. That is what credentialism really is. That is also what anti-credentialism really is. We have gone through these populist passions before.

116 I'll tell you what is bothering me, though: the rise of an equal-but-opposite "anti-credentialism" notion.

What's bothering me is when you talk down to us as if we're some snot-nosed fucks that just make shit up for the hell of it.  I spent out the wazz to send my daughter to Columbia and she told me that it was wildly overpriced and she probably could've gotten an equal value for much less elsewhere.  Before you jump over me with a recitation of the "intangibles" that were included, I realize the value of being in a network through an institution like that; but it still seems like a huge price to pay.  And there's no guarantee that it will pay off in any given field; which in her case it has not.

117
Lawrence ODonnell is boiling inside. You can see the anger in his face. Can't wait to see him blow a gasket.

118 It may just be me, but I see the Establishment Right as being much more go-along-to-get-along in spirit than the Establishment Left, who are much more driving and combative. I mean, they (the EL) passed a near-trillion Keynesian stimulus AND Obamacare.

119 The establishment "right" isn't interested in the alt-media because they're part of the permanent political/institutional class: large, remote, unaccountable organizations public and private, that collude to arrange matters to their own advantage -- it ain't all Democrats that live in those seven counties around DC (seven of the ten wealthiest in the country). There is no constituency among the establishment right for decentralization of power or otherwise restoring small-r republican virtues.

120 110 "For instance, I regard success in law school as a negative indicator of intelligence."

naw, there are smart lawyers out there.

I think all three of them would still agree with my statement.

121 Thank God somebody else gets it. I feel very alone sometimes.

That's exactly what the beast of DC wants.

But you are not alone. And we outnumber them.

122 When credentials cease to be credible signals of ability to perform, one ought expect an anti-credentialist backlash.

123

117...*ideology department.......*Republicans....

Caaacaa. I can't seem to type for shit today.

124 I spent out the wazz to send my daughter to Columbia and she told me that it was wildly overpriced and she probably could've gotten an equal value for much less elsewhere.

You got her a diploma with "Columbia" on it.  I'd argue, depending on her major, she probably learned less than she would have at Podunk State University, but she has the credential and that works in a lot of fields.

It certainly works in the government-lawyer complex.

125
Ace, Andrew Breitbart, Ladd, and James O'Keefe should produce webnews^tm-- a daily half-hour show that mocks the Left.

You know, with skits or vignettes, and stuff.

126 WE need to discredit the Corporate Media.^TM

We need to stop referring to them as the MSM, etc., and start calling them the Corporate Media at all times.  We need to constantly remind people that Brian Williams takes $10 Million/year in GE paychecks to do what GE wants him to do, and have similar data at hand for all the other fuckers, too.  The only reason they still have any credibility is we have not deprived them of it.

Every article on AoSHQ that bitches about the latest dumbass thing so Corporate Media dope just spoke or wrote needs to include (if not focus) on where that asshole got his paycheck and what reasons that Corporate Media outfit might have for backing such drivel.

We don't have to see a conspiracy in everything, sometimes they are just filling columns/airspace and they truly are just that fucking stupid.  But there is always a reason why the Corporate Media hires the shitbags they do.

127 Thank God somebody else gets it. I feel very alone sometimes.

Posted by: Oldsailor's poet at September 10, 2011 03:55 PM (ZDUD4)

You aren't alone; far from it.  It just seems that way sometime.

128 This credential bullshit, Doesn't it depend on the credential. Thorasic Surgeon, I want a credential, Plumber, I want a solid work history and some references. Politician? As good as your last vote.

129

Barack Obama is credentialed.  David Brooks is credentialed.  David Frum is credentialed.  Paul Krugman is credentialed.

There is a reason for a backlash against credentialism.

130 114 Ace,

You should have dinner with him dude.  He's busy and I am sure you are as well, but some things need to be approached in person.  Your corner has a lot of lurkers, will up his traffic some although there is already cross pollination and numbers ARE power.

The only way the establishment will ever take us seriously will be for us to deliver manpower, exposure, or funds.  Breitbart is a known quantity, he engages in REAL journalism, he can issue credentials that would carry more weight than "Technical Director for Hobos with a Shotgun" and some of us would be in a position to provide some volunteer legwork or local political news lead generation up to him or someone as coordinator.  Zombie has a pretty good portfolio of activist journalism as well.

I think LGF flipping back and forth cost the blogosphere a lot of credibility in the establishment GOP not that he was ever formally "inner circle" but the potential for betrayal is high as would be a Agent Provocateur undermining or flipping assets.

Make no mistake the blogosphere and citizen journalism have most of the characteristics of an intelligence war and our side barely plays.

131 124 Methos,

dynamic disequilibrium will win....


they can't stop the chaos

132 >> The Massachusetts GOP should be praised by this logic for losing so consistently and perfectly. No compromise of principles there. Heh. Our town committee has a get-together tomorrow, and I'm using that.

133 Idiots who don't know better will just follow the guy with the long list of degrees.  And the guy with the long list of degrees will arrogantly puff himself up and allow himself to become an object of worship.

I always watch the end of a movie to see the guys who point cameras.  They all put stuff like asc at the end, like it's a PhD or something.  I think it stands for American Society of Cinematography or something.  Because I would enjoy the movie a whole lot less if I knew the camera guy wasn't properly credentialed.

134 "For instance, I regard success in law school as a negative indicator of intelligence."

There are a lot of very smart lawyers out there (as well as a whole bunch of dumbasses with a JD), and when you find yourself between a rock and a hard place, you'd better hope you can find one who is willing to help you out.

135 >>>Ace, you're a big swinging dick in the dextrosphere. Why don't you fire something off to some of the others and then approach Reince Priebus ?? There is also occasional talk about something like that. What I know about the online world is that discussions are primarily about future plans that will never actually happen. And I do this myself, too; I talk about things with no real expectation I'll follow through. I'm proud of pushing that 2010 Be the Wave thing, even if it came to nothing, because I did follow through, and something did come of it. This gets into another problem I have with the anti-aristocratic fervor. There are "sexy" attributes and un-sexy ones. In politics, the sexiest stuff is political fulminations against the government (on the right); somewhat less sexy, but still sexy, stuff is about practical policy. What is completely un-sexy, to most, is actual grunt-work level skills like organization, follow-through, etc. Patton's great talent was in logistics, for example, a non-sexy part of warfare, to the uninitiated. (It is said Amateurs speak of Tactics, while Professionals speak of Logistics.) A lot of the would-be revolutionaries do not have any talent with the un-sexy parts of politics. Many of those in the "establishment" due (or, if not *talent,* at least experience, because that's what they do all day). This idea that we can just charge about and win with no organization, no polling, no strategic communications strategy, etc. -- that we can just win with our moxie and blazing virtue and flinty integrity -- is a movie idea of politics. This isn't a movie. It has been pointed out too many times, if you try shit you see working in a movie, prepare for defeat and (often) death.

136

118.....We have gone through these populist passions before.

Yes, Ace....we have. Ross Perot tapped into these passions back in 1992 and cost the Republicans an election.  Then he did it again in 1996.

But Bob Dole is a classic example of why the 'His Turn' candidate should never be the nominee.

137 >>>You should have dinner with him dude. He's busy and I am sure you are as well, but some things need to be approached in person. I just did, on Monday. You know what Breitbart wants? He wants you guys. He wants some formalized way to swipe "my" commenters. That's not a joke. That's what he wants. Which is why there won't be a "formal alliance." He can't offer me enough to make that an appealing swap for me.

138
Me in particular?

139 I think this talk of credentials is a strawman. We've elected republican Ivy Leaguers and ones state schools. I am not sure anyone really gives a f*ck where they went to school as much as they do what they have done and how well you can relate to them.

140 That is also what anti-credentialism really is.

Eh - not really.  It can be, but not always.

The credentialist demagogue will say "do what I say because I have 500 degrees and that makes me smarter than you".  And the idiots will willingly turn over their liberty to this guy.

Sure you might have an anti-credentialist demagogue make the same type of arguments in reverse - i.e., "do what I say because I don't have degrees and so I haven't been corrupted by the liberal institutions".

But it is also anti-credentialist to just reject all of the appeal-to-authority fallacies and just decide what is best for you, despite the opinions of the credentialed (or un-credentialed) class.

So if we frame the argument not in terms of "vote against the guy with degrees because he's a tool of liberal academia", and instead frame the argument in terms of "the guy with the degrees doesn't necessarily know what is best for you any better than you do", then it can be a winner.

141 Hey Ace, Not that this topic isn't worthy, but could you at least say something about the Flight 93 memorial ceremony today? It was pretty damn great and it was significant that VP Biden gave great respect to President Bush.

142 You know what Breitbart wants? He wants you guys. He wants some formalized way to swipe "my" commenters. Fuck him, that's not going to happen.

143 The fat that the "establishment" Republicans are shit is proven by the continued shift of the country into socialism regardless of Party in power. That has occurred from 1900 on non-stop.

If they do not wake up soon the Republican Party will split. That is if the nation doesn't collapse first.

144 I think LGF flipping back and forth cost the blogosphere a lot of credibility in the establishment GOP not that he was ever formally "inner circle" but the potential for betrayal is high as would be a Agent Provocateur undermining or flipping assets.

Posted by: sven10077 at September 10, 2011 04:09 PM (AEIYh)

I hate to credit the pony-tailed ukulele player with any type of ethics but, before he completely jumped the shark and lost what little mind he had, he never claimed to be a conservative nor a Republican.  Unlike that dissembling bit of mince-meat fecal matter Sully.

145 You know what Breitbart wants? He wants you guys. He wants some formalized way to swipe "my" commenters. That's not a joke. That's what he wants.

How much is he offering us?

146 You know what Breitbart wants? He wants you guys.

Well you know, ace, you never did follow through with that BJ you promised... 

147 >> Me in particular? No. Everybody but you.

148 I knew it! Andrew Breitbart wants me!

149

To the origional Question? its pretty simple...

The Left believes they can organize the masses, and control them, just as they have with Unions, and Blacks, and the Enviro Lobby.

Republicans KNOW that their base is more stubborn, and less easy to control... thus those outside the Beltway country club set.. those Gadsen wearing people who really ARE a threat to big Government, are seen as uncontrolable Barbarians pounding on the Washington Gates...

They tried, fairly successfully to Co Opt the TEA party movement... note there have been no large scale protests this year, even after the Government continues to spend more and more money... but they also know that if they Embrace them, and give them more of a voice, then the Beltway insiders will be Toast...

150

Sometimes I just don't believe they are even trying to win. I keep trying to think of one, but I just can't seem to find explanations that make more sense to me.

Let me take a stab at explaining:

For decades, America has been going in the same direction. I forget who said that America isn't so much like a ship of state with the president at the captain's wheel so much as it's like a train, on a track going in one direction -- left. The president is like the engineer, with his hand on the throttle. He can drive the coutry leftward and closer to ruin fast or he can do it slow. I believe that to be pretty much the case.

Another thing I believe is that our country always elects the right person as our president. Obama, unabashedly leftist during the worst conditions for such nonsense, is failing so spectacularly at leading the Republic that the train of state may finally jump its tracks and genuinely change direction next year.

To try another analogy: Every president during my life has been like alcohol. Some are glasses of wine with dinner, some are drinks with friends, and some are benders that have you waking up with heaven-knows-who the next day with significant gaps in your memory. Obama is the bash that has your car in a river, your grandmother leaving you angry phone messages, and your Tampa Bay Rowdies t-shirt as the only possession they return to you as they let you out of jail. Now is when you figure it's time to swear off drinking for good.

151
You know who else needs commenters?

I have three.

152 Hey ace, offer him curious, currently going under "cantankerous".

153 Which is why there won't be a "formal alliance." He can't offer me enough to make that an appealing swap for me.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 04:13 PM (nj1bB)

Have him give you Drudge with all his traffic and start a huffpo of the right. Before long you guys can sell out for millions to AOL.

154 The banks told them to ignore you...

155 155, Curious, Jim, Geg and a troll draft pick to be named later.

156 Very minor. The back up argument is always "Well we succeeded in losing an election." That is, we kept Castle out.

It seems one of us is suffering from selective memory that would the busty crusader a run for their money. My recollection is that defeating Mike Castle was the central issue of the primary and the discussions surrounding it. It doesn't much matter since the GOP establishment didn't get the message and folks like you are pushing their argument in order to force voters in line rather than the forcing the politicians into correct positions.

Though it is neat, that like the average urban liberal, you feel you can win an argument by dismissing the feature of central importance to the other side.

157 You know what Breitbart wants? He wants you guys. He wants some formalized way to swipe "my" commenters.

That's not a joke. That's what he wants.

That will NOT happen, Ace.  I like Breitbart, a lot, but he's not fit to wash your skivvies, babe.  And I think I speak for the group here.

158 I think another event like the one in S Carolina--with intelligent questions and intelligent answers--would be a spectacular success with the electorate at large, so long as the 'intelligent answers' had a limit of 5 subordinate clauses/sentence or so.

IOW, why not let the electorate-at-large hear what the real questions and answers are?

Screw the MSM.  Get DeMint and a bright Lefty--even Feingold, who is that (as an example!!!!)--to ask the questions.  Allow a 2-minute response from each candidate, rebut from the questioner, etc.

159 Which is why there won't be a "formal alliance." He can't offer me enough to make that an appealing swap for me.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 04:13 PM (nj1bB)

You know what else he could do is give us some silver dimes.

160 You know what Breitbart wants? He wants you guys. He wants some formalized way to swipe "my" commenters.

Fuck him, that's not going to happen.

I don't know.  If he offered discount coupons for shoes or Disneyland tickets...

161 That will NOT happen, Ace. I like Breitbart, a lot, but he's not fit to wash your skivvies, babe. And I think I speak for the group here. You Do, I'll quit drinking and go back to American Thinker before that happens.

162

Ace....I think it would be great if the commenting thingys....here and on the Breitbart site....were the same.

I like Breitbart a lot....and I visit his site sometimes....but it is antiquated, and I have only made a few comments there over time.

The commenting thingy here, is well, um...not very idiot-friendly for people like me who do not spend a lot of time on computers or on the internet.

163
Ace, you ever consider creating an Ace of Spades community forum?

You familiar with the vbulletin forums? Lots of different sub-forums at one site. Something for everybody, so to speak.

164 I like Breitbart, but man, his Big* sites have some pretty crazee commenters.  Off the deep end.

I agree, offer him curious and Jim/Gerg in exchange for a case of Val-U-Rite.

165

Yes, Ace....we have. Ross Perot tapped into these passions back in 1992 and cost the Republicans an election. Then he did it again in 1996.

Posted by: ConservativeMenAreJustHotter at September 10, 2011 04:11 PM (1keYa)

But also managed to force a Balanced budget for a couple of years.. note, once the Reform party was no longer a viable threat to the Two Party Kabuki theatre of Power, they no longer felt they needed to balance the budget.

166 137 "For instance, I regard success in law school as a negative indicator of intelligence."

There are a lot of very smart lawyers out there (as well as a whole bunch of dumbasses with a JD), and when you find yourself between a rock and a hard place, you'd better hope you can find one who is willing to help you out.

Posted by: Peaches at September 10, 2011 04:11 PM (/ybwc)

====

All true, but that does not mean we have to over-represent them in the Congress by 180-200 times their percentage of the general population.  Especially since none of them are actually trained in solving problems and very few of them seem to have any skills in that direction.

167 The reason Breitbart wants the commenters here is that there is a community feel here which is primarily due to Ace and the Co-Bloggers constant interaction with those who frequent here. Each blogger has their own style, which all of us have come to understand and appreciate and it always fosters good discussions. Brietbart's family of sites is too haphazardly thrown together, with bloggers that don't participate in discussions under the articles. The result is that I couldn't pick out Breitbart blogger names out of a lineup and I have absolutely no idea what styles or subjects are particular authors' primary motivations for writing. I don't think Breitbart understands the distinction.

168 On the networking thing. I have some decent credentials. I have some college friends who now have some decent money and power. Useful people to know I guess.

The ones who have the most money and power are the ones who headed to NYC after college. They work on Wall Street. Been big successes. They have become much more liberal than back when we were good friends chasing women in college.

As they became more liberal I became more conservative. Our friendship continued, though. Mainly because I bit my tongue when they would say something insulting. I'd let it slide.

Then Obama happened. And I spoke my mind. I said, this guy is crazy left-wing. Buddies with left-wing terrorist. It was clear Obama was a leftist, anti-American, scumbag.

I had taken 8 years of constant insults to Bush and Cheney. I let it slide. These were my friends and had been for many years. I chose to overlook and ignore the insults. Which grew increasingly personal in Bush's 2nd term.

Took me about 3 conversations in 2008 with me saying a few bad things about Obama before I was cut off by my former friends. Before I was called a racist and ... shunned. Won't answer my calls or emails. Persona non grata. Down the memory-hole.

Possible I'm just the world's biggest asshole, of course, and deserved it.

But my experience is that the supposedly valuable network of friends and acquaintances I got from my time in the credential factory ... only lasted as long as I didn't stray too far from orthodox thinking.

There does seem to have been something special in the Obama cult circa 2008. I had been allowed to mock Gore and Kerry in the previous elections. But not Obama. The reaction was swift and severe. Relationships that had lasted well over a decade were destroyed in a few weeks.

169 #140, Ace if  Breitbart really wants the best commenters from here why doesn't he set up a forum for submitting material or direct comments to him? The third party interface seems to be a way of allowing a AoS to take the fall should some material or commenter cause trouble for him later down the road. The idea of the collective brain trust here being used for personal profit and then thrown under the bus, similar to the left's version HuffPo, is rather infuriating. AoS is great because of it being an informal volunteer news and commentary outlet. Monetizing it into a formal business operation, especially to a third party, seems to go against what you've got going here. Not that you shouldn't be able to make some money off AoS for all the work that goes into this blog, but the current advertising and donate model seems to have more integrity, with less of a direct impact on the creation of content.

170 Breitbart needs to purge the turds out of his punchbowl for it to be a moron friendly environment.  Truth be known, I stuck with Cahrsle Jhnsoon way too fucking long just because I liked the other posters who eventually did a diaspora here before finally leaving with no fanfare (ie I didn't get banned).

171 so Breitbart Does like my lip gloss shade? I knew it!

172

168 Romeo13,

Yep! I noticed that too. Heh.

 

173 chemjeff, as someone who occasionally dabbles in demagoguery (which, let's be frank, IS a part of politics), I can say that I have certainly felt like a populist demagogue in some of my own more-strident, less-nuanced rantings against "the Elite." This stuff is true. The anti-"Elite" stuff. But there are also elements of falsity in it, or, if not falsity, things that are not mentioned during a good anti-Elite rant. For example, look, the endpoint of "anti-Elitism" is of course "I don't care if a medical doctor who is also an eye-surgery specialist OR some random guy off the street does my corneal surgery," which is of course completely insane. So at some point, these things CANNOT be taken to their conclusion. It has to be admitted that not ALL credentials are fakey ones. In fact, almost all of them take some work, don't they? I would not say, for example, that journalists are not experts on journalism. I confess they are experts on journalism (or they had better be, after three years of grad school and ten years of working in the industry). What I say is that a journalism degree is not the General Expertise On Everything degree they seem to think it is. And it's not even a poli-sci degree, for god's sakes. Brian Williams' opinion as to politics means to me what any partisan amateur's means, which isn't a great deal. But yet the press is treated as if their journalism degree naturally affords them some special insight into public policy and political philosophy. For God's sakes, who gets interviewed on Letterman during a war, to give us "perspective"? Noted general and strategic genius Tom Friggin' Brokaw. At any rate, I will say I disagree with many of the revolution-minded folks out there about their savviness at communications and strategy. The experts -- the pollsters, the political establishment, the people they don't like -- actually are experts, or at least experienced, in the non-sexy grunt-work stuff of public persuasion. I believe the revolutionaries dismiss their words too easily, and with too much arrogance. The arrogance of the neophyte, the arrogance of someone who knows so little he doesn't know how much he doesn't know. I don't think, for example, the claim I've been told a thousand times, that any race in the country can be won with Reagan's 1984 playbook. I just get tired of hearing that. I know it's not true. I sort of even suspect the people saying it know it's not true. So why are we jerking each other off by saying silly shit?

174 114 >>>Have you considered a formal alliance with A Breibart Ace?

It's actually been discussed. I'm not sure how seriously. Yes, I am saying I don't know how serious a discussion was in which I was a participant.

People on the internet "discuss" a lot of things. It's difficult to know a lot of the time how seriously such talk should be taken.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 04:02 PM (nj1bB)

ace, JMHO, but you would disappear in the vast Breitbart empire. Unless you can use it to help monitize what you do here, it wouldn't have much value for you.

175 Seriously, when was the last time a Democrat was described in the MFM as "controversial"?

Conversely, when was the last time a Republican worth-a-damn was NOT described in the MFM as "controversial"?

176 You will be mine, oh yes, you will be mine.

177 140 Ace,

Heh I don't know you in person.  We'd either get along in real life or not.  The point is we are all two people maybe more and we have presences and in this "world" we are allies.

I guess what I am saying without trying to leverage your feelings is, that if you want a bigger presence and if Andrew can give it to you and what you "surrender" is us.....you aren't really "surrendering" anything so long as you gives you a good faith presence that makes the exchange near equal.

Moron nation is a cybertribe, and we have much untapped influence.  We can educate our low information center-right leaning real life community about the omissions and lies the newsies are engaged in running interference for the Progressives.  Our cybertribe is timeless, and our bonds in their way ARE tribal you'll always be at or near the head of the table but we all need perhaps a bigger more influential table.

I know I was ranting the other day on the advantages and flaws in the difference of the epistemology of left and right though on the best way and qualities of economic thought, but I was writing again.  I can teach this, NOBODY is arguing OUR SIDE'S best case which is that economics and wealth are best ran as private matters and that there is nothing more noble about 536 oligarchs throwing around massive concentrations of wealth than the progs say the corps are evil.  We have taken for granted for too long that people will "get it", but the bias at the academy and in the entertainment world is so stark I am not sure they are being expose to as many opportunities for that "damn I get it now" epiphany.

There is a Civil Servant/Infotainment/Academic Complex in this nation that is every bit as powerful as Eisenhower's Military-Industrial fears were and we need to start fighting it as we can.

This dismantling of their little power machine is going to have to start with out own little funhouse mirror version of it, and it will take alliances and coalitions and in all likelihood congress on a goal matrix.

You have the opportunity to try to guide one of the champion horses in the "known" side of our collection towards that table that people like you, he, and others will make something like what I said is needed work.

regards,
sven

178 Posted by: FireHorse at September 10, 2011 04:15 PM (RZRz9)
===
I don't disagree with anything you wrote, I just don't see how it applies to deliberately throwing elections.

179 This is related to the comment I made the other night, when Ace decided to jump ugly on it.

Conservative Media still lives in the same sort of box that the hard-left used to live in (say, with publications like Ramparts).  The difference is that the right side adheres vaguely to  the "journal" format, which comes from Old, old-school academia,  whereas the left is always (always) looking for the latest fashion trend in publishing, and has branched out more.

This left-side "need to be in the lead" causes a proliferation of new tricks to sell the same sauce.  More publications, more electronic media, more performance art, more pamphlets, more control over Hollywood, and more foundations and institutional money going into J-schools so they can teach the young'uns how to make more leading-edge propaganda. If they could monopolize cereal boxes, they would.

Hard-working, regular folks raising kids don't have time for any of that.  The ones that do are mostly those with some college education, working more white-collar type jobs.  A reasonable number of those folks are interested in internet-based media, but clearly not all.  The majority only have time for some talk radio, and their local news. These folks tend to become politically active later in life, when the kids are grown.  Looking at most Tea Party rally footage, you notice that, right off.

THIS is what made it easy for me to claim that this site attracts a lot of non-conservatives, which Ace wrongly interpreted as some bullshit way to call people here RINOs.  But Ace ignores the whole vibe of this place in being touchy about it.  I've got to think one reason for the appeal of this place is to show the folks hunting for, "what's new and cool," that the left doesn't have a monopoly on cutting edge humor, social networking, or deep analysis of economic and political events.

In other words, Ace has built a decent model for non-leftists to follow in breaking out of the Buckley-esque, cigar and cognac way of having fun, and stretches the boundaries of taste and propriety to give everyone plenty of mental elbow-room.

But the classic "Conservative" doesn't feel much need for that, and is often appalled at even slight hints of excess and debauchery.  Even though we all recognize that losing control is bad, some of us know that you can "go there" without actually "being" there.  Which, I think defines most Morons and Moronettes (of course, many of us have "been" there often enough to know not to "go there" anymore). However, the Moron Style doesn't broadly appeal to old-school Conservatives.  Especially out here in flyover land, where I would never tell anyone at the local church about an article at this site.

No. Effing. Way.

And those fine, decent, regular-Joe type Conservative folks vastly outnumber the potential Moron/Ette's out there.

You don't see a lot of them here.

And by "Conservative" I don't mean anything special, just the classic, Fiscal/Social/Defense type conservative, with no "modifiers." This site obviously attracts folks who are moderately to mostly conservative, and even a few cranky Paleocons.  But NOT a lot of plain, ordinary "Conservatives."

I am not a Conservative.  I'm not in agreement with regular Conservatives on several issues, so I don't lie and claim to be a conservative, and act like the definition of being a Conservative now includes me.  I respect them for what they are, and caucus with them to defeat the left.  But I'm not out to change them.

Ace interpreted my claims about this site as somehow being part of that whole "purity" bee that lives in the bonnets of a lot of folks on the right that aren't doctrinaire Conservatives. He then assumed I was claiming RINO status for the general batch of Morons who are anti-Palin (in the other night's anti-Palin thread of the week).  I'm sure as hell don't see any evidence that "Republican" is another name for Conservative, so I don't ever call anyone, anywhere, a RINO.

Obviously, a side effect from the success of this new model Ace has created is a tendency to feel like it's catching on really well with the general population.  Ace claimed there's 10% of folks like me (meaning Conservatives, which doesn't actually include me).  But looking at the Tea Party rally footage, you don't see a ton of younger, Moron types.  The good news is, they are present.  But if there's any group that is restricted to only 10%, it's far more likely to be us Morons, and not the majority of regular Conservatives.

All you need to do to see that is look at how well Huck did last time.

That's all I meant, and I stand by it.

180 Ask Harriet Miers about credentialism.

181

Tom Sowell, Dennis Prager and Victor Davis Hansen are "credentialed", and they are some of the best minds on the Right.

I won't be calling for them to be purged anytime soon.

182 From what I've seen, the Republicans are skilled at using social media but it's true that they ignore conservative blogs/websites outside of NRO, The Weekly Standard, Townhall, and the Washington Examiner online.

183 171 Clubber Lang,

The truth is the United States divided into a Net War back in 2000 with the recounts, and only one side is playing hard.

I'm sorry you got shunned, but the left leaning have been tribal for over a decade now, and we need to consider formally doing the same if need be.

184 I would not say, for example, that journalists are not experts on journalism. I confess they are experts on journalism (or they had better be, after three years of grad school and ten years of working in the industry).

Journalism's problem is that whatever their credentials, they don't live up to the credo of their profession.  It would be like all the scientists here ignoring the numbers and the data and writing publications based on their "feelings".  Sort of like most of the AGW community, and we see how that's turning out.

185
Anyway, I don't know dick-all aboot blogging but it is pretty obvious that the future of the blogosphere involves a more interactive community.

It's only a matter of (short) time before huffpo is hosting video chat rooms and shit.

In other words, commenting as we know it, I believe, will be done in the form of videoconferencing along with options for posting text and pics.

186 >>>My recollection is that defeating Mike Castle was the central issue of the primary and the discussions surrounding it. Yes I know. You elevated something easily done -- losing an election -- into some kind of grand strategy you would later chalk up as a victory. It's easy to lose elections. Very easy. So... hooray? You successfully achieved something easily achieved, losing an election. And you want to be congratulated about that. This is what really bothers me, that a year later, the idea persists, with no modification or reflection. And this is why I can't get behind the revolution-minded people. It's one thing to make an error. It's another thing to arrogantly, stubbornly refuse to learn from it, with some kind of Scots-Irish never-back-down machismo that must celebrate each loss as "really" being a victory. I have said this before, but I do not consider "idealism" a virtue. I think idealists are idiots, frankly. I'm about pragmatic, practical results. I don't care about people's hearts being in the right places; if I did, I imagine I'd be a liberal. I think idealism is a flight from reality and ergo something to be scorned, not praised. In the Delaware Election, if the Tea Party wanted a better candidate, they had a year to find one. Instead, they did no candidate-searching, and wound up, on the eve of the election, with guaranteed winner Mike Castle and guaranteed loser and perpetual fame-whore and professional candidate Christine O'Donnell. These weren't attractive options, but in the end, yes, you go for the win. If you want to praise yourself for losing, sorry, I can't get on that train. It's too easy to lose. easiest thing in the world. And those who grow accustomed to losing, who learn to celebrate it, even, are not the people I want making tough real-life no-perfect-options decisions for me.

187 Barack Obama is credentialed.  David Brooks is credentialed.  David Frum is credentialed.  Paul Krugman is credentialed.

No they aren't.  That's the point of my version of anti-credentialism.

Obama went to law school.  He has the credentials to be an assistant DA.  I would not deny him that.

But even the notion that he's a "constitutional scholar" is a joke, not just in his case but in everyone's.  The Constitution ain't long, it ain't complicated and it's in English.

David Brooks was a history major.

David Frum writes columns, what the hell does his expertise have to do with everything.

Krugman is actually credentialed as an economist.  That's the one exception.  But he's not credentialed in politics.  And what he is credentialed in, he's an epic failure at it.

188 There are a lot of very smart lawyers out there (as well as a whole bunch of dumbasses with a JD), and when you find yourself between a rock and a hard place, you'd better hope you can find one who is willing to help you out.

Posted by: Peaches at September 10, 2011 04:11 PM (/ybwc)

You are arguing that the practice of law is a protection racket.

189

It's only a matter of (short) time before huffpo is hosting video chat rooms and shit.

In other words, commenting as we know it, I believe, will be done in the form of videoconferencing along with options for posting text and pics.

Posted by: soothsayer at September 10, 2011 04:30 PM (sqkOB)

They'll have to expunge all their vile hate-filled violent racists in their comments first.

190 In other words, commenting as we know it, I believe, will be done in the form of videoconferencing along with options for posting text and pics.


Not me, man.  Give me pantslessness or give me death!

191 191 Amish Dude,

let's see...

environmental law, cargo law, and insurance law most certainly are.

192 This dismantling of their little power machine is going to have to start with out own little funhouse mirror version of it, (ack! bite your tongue, or mine ) and it will take alliances and coalitions and in all likelihood congress on a goal matrix.

You have the opportunity to try to guide one of the champion horses in the "known" side of our collection towards that table that people like you, he, and others will make something like what I said is needed work.

regards,
sven

Posted by: sven10077 at September 10, 2011 04:26 PM (AEIYh)

nice comment

193 195, Don't forget Criminal Law and Family law.

194

75I would love to see a debate hosted by the Ace and the AoS co-bloggers! We might actually learn something.

 

Ace, with this in mind, whatever became of the interview you did with Jamie Radtke?   

195
yeah, most people like their anonymity.

Me, personally, I'll point my cam on the Rocky poster on my wall.

196 Ace, I'm going to echo what others have said and point out that AoSHQ is what it is because of you. I agree that the commenters here are the best of the best, but I think that is because you are one of the best out there. What I appreciate about you is that you are so damn honest and methodical. This site differs from so many others because it is logical. Logic is often sorely lacking in political discussion. That's what sucked me in here, and it's what keeps me coming back. I know your analysis will be brutally honest, and that carries into the comments. Anyways that's enough of all that, but know that your commenters are the best because of what you've built here.

197

One problem with any politician in using the blogosphere is the difficulty in finding their target audience.

A Republican running for state office going onto NBC Sunday morning knows that even though it's a national audience, the affiliates airing the show in his or her state will reach 20,000 voters, for example. Those are the only people that politician cares about reaching. These are people in his or her state, very interested in politics and possibly open to his conservative message, even though they're watching NBC.

There's no similar place in the blogosphere that candidate can go to in order to reach so many people in his or her target audience. HotAir and Ace cover major national and international stories, don't often get into individual elections and have readers from all over the country and the world. Someone appearing on Ed's show at HotAir, even if 100,000 listened, might only reach 500 people in his or her state and those would be people already most likely voting Republican in the first place.

There's no state by state Ace of Spades, or HotAir or anywhere reaching a local market like the local MFM affiliates, despite their shrinking viewers.

198 >>>THIS is what made it easy for me to claim that this site attracts a lot of non-conservatives, which Ace wrongly interpreted as some bullshit way to call people here RINOs. But Ace ignores the whole vibe of this place in being touchy about it. I've got to think one reason for the appeal of this place is to show the folks hunting for, "what's new and cool," that the left doesn't have a monopoly on cutting edge humor, social networking, or deep analysis of economic and political events. I jumped ugly on this?! Well, if I did, sorry, I guess I was being a real dickbag.

199
1995

AOL chat rooms

The year my innocence was lost.

200 Ace is one of the last people I would eat if trapped in a snowy pass.

And I mean that from the heart.

201 Nobody is calling for purging all credentials. And that wouldn't happen anyway. Pushing back a bit, though, does some good.
Think on the margin. It's not an all or none situation.

When some PhD eco-fundie goes on about DOOM, DOOM, DOOM unless we dramatically raise the cost of coal, oil, etc, etc -- it's good to have people point out, hey this idiot nows jackshit about economics. And all these DOOM predictions are from climate models, not from experimental science or anything approaching the rigor of physics, chemistry, or even biology.

I don't think we have to worry about crazy Tea Partiers abolishing graduate schools and forcing everyone with a PhD to work on collective farms.

The Left works hard to delegitimize sources of authority they dislike -- like the Founding Fathers, the Constitution, business, the chamber of commerce, men, fathers, organized religion, etc, etc.

Why is it so horrible if we do a bit of the same to the sources of their authority?

202 For example, look, the endpoint of "anti-Elitism" is of course "I don't care if a medical doctor who is also an eye-surgery specialist OR some random guy off the street does my corneal surgery," which is of course completely insane.

Well that is not what I understand to be the endpoint of "anti-Elitism".  I don't think anyone with a brain in their head would doubt that someone who specializes in eye surgery should be the one who does corneal surgery.

For me, the endpoint of "anti-Elitism" is twofold: 1. that the elites have the humility and the honesty to tell people that their credentials do not give them a free license to talk authoritatively on all subjects; and 2. that the non-elites won't get swayed by demagogic nonsense and just blindly follow the guy with the impressive credentials.

What I say is that a journalism degree is not the General Expertise On Everything degree they seem to think it is.

I agree.  And they know it is true too.  Their sin is allowing themselves to be drawn into a situation where they are feted as the General Expert on Everything.  Because it strokes their ego.

203 soothsayer, i've heard tell they (aol)charged by the minute.

204
What better 'focus group' than the comment threads in the Dextrosphere?

Very convenient and handy resource for a GOP pol, I'd think.

205

No they aren't. That's the point of my version of anti-credentialism.

Obama went to law school. He has the credentials to be an assistant DA. I would not deny him that.

But even the notion that he's a "constitutional scholar" is a joke, not just in his case but in everyone's. The Constitution ain't long, it ain't complicated and it's in English.

David Brooks was a history major.

David Frum writes columns, what the hell does his expertise have to do with everything.

Krugman is actually credentialed as an economist. That's the one exception. But he's not credentialed in politics. And what he is credentialed in, he's an epic failure at it.

Posted by: AmishDude at September 10, 2011 04:32 PM (73tyQ)

Well I'm using "credentialed" in the way the media usually likes to.  In that these guys are credentialed and thus smart so we must listen to their ideas or vote for them, etc.  So its not really surprising when people start turning away from those with credentials.

Hell "Climate Scientists" are also pimped by the media as being "credentialed" so we should be listening to their warnings too. 

206 sifty, yet, i believe He would be particularly tasty with a rub of garlic and chile pepper after a marinate in Tequila.

you of course may have the worm.

207 >>>One problem with any politician in using the blogosphere is the difficulty in finding their target audience. >>>A Republican running for state office going onto NBC Sunday morning knows that even though it's a national audience, the affiliates airing the show in his or her state will reach 20,000 voters, for example. Yes, this is the big problem. There is no structure here to make sure that local and state bloggers get properly "fed" with traffic and links. State and local bloggers are actually MUCH more useful politically, and yet they don't get the attention the nationally-oriented blogs do, and there is no clever way yet discovered (or even a simple focus) on making sure those state and local blogs are always getting linked. This is a problem that often gets discussed. If anyone has a good idea of how to fix it, don't be shy about suggesting it. Ideas have been floated, for example, of some kind of composite blog masted by some heavy hitters, which would intersperse national stories with stuff churned out by state and local blogs, to guarantee coverage and exposure and hits (and a livable amount of ad money for the local blogs). Like I said, though, a lot of stuff gets "discussed."

208 OK so I started blogging on my own in 2007, with the intent to *help* but not sell out, either. Our congressman's media aide and offered to create my site for me, something better looking than Blogger, and offered to have conference calls with other bloggers here in the district.  I think we did this once...but their angle is always boring, not really bloggable stuff  unless you're a fucking shill.  They think they can *manage* us, you know.

My own party didn't give a shit, didn't support it or acknowledge it, and really only liked it if I went all Coulter or Malkin-mode to be their state/local attack dog.  I don't really get off on that.

The GOP does NOT get this stuff at all, even though they're always seeing we need more young people with all their Internet and facebooky stuff.   I built two websites for them but they were only barely aware of the fact, and those who knew did not want to give credit because it took away from themselves.

What they don't realize is that it's really the older conservatives who have the interest and the writing skills to do this sort of thing.  The young ones are mostly illiterate, historically naive or have nothing to say. And, they're Unsettled and always moving on.

/rant

209 Oh and Ace, I am a big fan of your site too, and if you ever find yourself in Missouri, I'll buy you a beer.  Or two.  Or whatever.

210 Oh, I didn't let the aide built my site, either.  The astroturf sites he did build all died a quick death. lol

211

I don't disagree with anything you wrote, I just don't see how it applies to deliberately throwing elections.

Sorry; I jumped my own track. I agree that McCain tanked it on purpose in '08, by the way.

As you said, McCain introduced a bill. Dodd would've seen to it that it got filibustered into oblivion. Things were going to get very bad in this country and around the world. I'm sure McCain knew that and a few other top Republicans knew it, too. If my theory is right, they wanted the other side to preside over this mess. It was kind of like letting your opponent score late in the game so you have the ball last -- a risky strategy, one that bring massive suck for four years, but perhaps a least bad option.

There was also the ultimate "First Black" position. No one wants to get in the way of that, and who knows? America might actually get this out of her system. (Yeah, that backfired, didn't it?)

So 2008 was a sacrifice, but 2012 is going to count big. If Obama wins the referendum on his first term, I'm afraid there'll be no coming back.

212 Thicker........thicker.

213
also: flying cars

214 I can't get past Brietbart being a GOPProud board member.

215 If you have a degree, are very successful (elite), have common sense, and don't think the sun rises and sets on your ass we like you.

If you have a degree, are very successful (elite), don't have common sense, and think the rest of us are little toys for you to play with, we don't like you.

It seems to me that's about as deep as the anti-elitism / anti-intellectualism goes around here.

YMMV

216 I think many people in the movement have this in mind, a revolution of the "peasants," if you will, against the "aristocracy" of the "establishment."

I don't really give a crap about that. for one thing, it's not going to happen. For another thing, I don't have the confidence in the would-be *new* dominant order that they have in themselves.

217 soothsayer, i've heard tell they (aol)charged by the minute.

I got automatically assigned to an AOL account from AppleTalk.
AppleTalk users got the service free, others had to pay.
I don't think it was by the minute, though.

After Apple dumped the II and IIgs line, I dumped Apple.  The assholes cost me $3000 in hardware/software development tools.

218

One of the really cool things about this AoSHQ site.....is that it explodes the myth of....."Conservatives are stodgy anti-fun curmudgeons who never cuss, drink or have sex".

This place is sort of like a 'conservative bar', or 'conservative pirate hangout'....with no-holds-barred conversations.

Which is what sets it apart from other conservative sites.

What the left has had going for it, is a general unification of their troops....something that has not been done on the right.

If there were to be some sort of 'consolidation' or colaborative site, between Ace and Brietbart.....the draw could be huge. So the power of it would be huge.... Talk about being able to affect the ongoing political discourse in this country --- that would do it.

I do think, however, that there should be an X-rated section in such a site, where people could speak freely....as they do here now.

Colorful language and cuss words make it harder to get online ads I would imagine.....But then there are a wide range of companies out there for which that would not be a problem.  ...There are companies which advertize in bars and auto shops, which are not squeamish about harsh language being spoken.

If the Fox Nation site were moderated, and had an X-rated section....it would be huge. It is not uncommon to see thread counts in the 4000 to 5000 range every day. .....Whoever does this first will have a mega-site on their hands.

219
I'll bet my leftnut you owned a betamax player, too.

220 On the other hand, Ewok mittens.

221 The assholes cost me $3000 in hardware/software development tools.
Posted by: jwb7605 at September 10, 2011 04:44 PM (Qxe/p

yikes.

222 >>>For me, the endpoint of "anti-Elitism" is twofold: 1. that the elites have the humility and the honesty to tell people that their credentials do not give them a free license to talk authoritatively on all subjects; and 2. that the non-elites won't get swayed by demagogic nonsense and just blindly follow the guy with the impressive credentials. But my contrary problem continues to be the demagogic suggestion that people with training and experience (and accomplishment) aren't in any better position to offer an opinion than anyone else. That is, I'm bothered by the radical egalitarian endpoint here, which has in years past been more associated with leftism. I do respect a soldier's opinion more than a non-soldier's in matters of war, for example. Here's the thing: I think most people have gotten sick of the establishment telling them "that isn't REALISTIC!" I think the suspicion is is that the establishment CRIES WOLF on this, often claiming "it can't be done" when the reality is they don't want to do it, or trying it would be too risky. I agree with that. I know for a fact the establishment does that. My problem, though, is taking this idea and extending it to infinity, and now making the equally-false claim that ALL things are possible, and the establishment is ALWAYS lying, and the establishment is COMPLETELY opposed to us. They're not. They're overly cautious. They're timid. They're also mostly socially a part of the liberals' world, which biases them. "The races intermarry," you might say. They are not to be *trusted* when they make assertions about what is and what is not possible, because they have a vested interest in not doing some things the grassroots want, and also, they are culturally apart from the grassroots in many cases. That said, while their claims are not to be taken at face value, neither should they be dismissed without consideration, especially when there exists polling data or relevant history to buttress their claims. As for the crying wolf charge-- yes, they cry wolf. But there are also wolves, too. To pretend there are no wolves is a good plan for getting killed by some wolves.

223 I'll bet my leftnut you owned a betamax player, too.

If that was directed at me, you should change your handle to "onepack".

224

Colorful language and cuss words make it harder to get online ads I would imagine.....But then there are a wide range of companies out there for which that would not be a problem.

 

yeah, specialty items like hobo skinning tools and do it yourself home moonshine kits...

225

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 04:41 PM (nj1bB)

One of the interesting problems the Internet has caused, is the inability to search for LOCAL resources... Local restraunts, local theatres... LOCAL Political sites.

They can be found, but not easily... because its too easy for an entity from outside an area to force you far down on Search criteria... becasue people don't know how to massage search terms...

Hmmm.... may be a business opportunity here... for a combined LOCAL DNS service, with a LOCAL search engine....

Its been tried... and failed... in the past by creating local links in a Local webpage... but I've never really seen it done well, with a dedicated Sales Force to go to businesses...

Gonna have to think on this one a bit...

226 One of the other problems the internet has caused is that often local hobos can search the internet and find the dates of upcoming hobo/hippy pogroms.

227 215  So 2008 was a sacrifice, but 2012 is going to count big. If Obama wins the referendum on his first term, I'm afraid there'll be no coming back.

Posted by: FireHorse at September 10, 2011 04:43 PM (RZRz9)

=======

So it seems kind of nuts to be allowing MSDNC anywhere near decent people doesn't it?

Any argument that Rs had to throw one election and it was all part of some grand plan looks pretty odd when the Rs start the 2012 race by sucking on the very same turds.

228 211 Ace,

Use the opportunity Ed Morrissey had, and blew.  Hell he had the opportunity to act as a clearing house and hub for an international set of bloggers when he was solo.  I'm glad he is doing well since Malkin got him but he actually helped bring the Canadian government down AS AN AMERICAN.

If there were a blog with an interlocking comment hub, that had political news broken down by region with footsoldier reporters keeping an eye on events coordinated through a clearing house, with poster driven editorial coordinated essays and analysis it would be a force.  It would be better than what HuffPo does for whoever and whatever the hell HuffPo does.  I had forgotten how much of Ohio political backstory I knew......

there is potential here, and we must all learn to be teachers for the things we hold dear.

Reagan didn't just happen 1980 was him finishing a relationship he had begun cultivating with the swayable electorate back in 1960.  Where is our politician who can give a speech like his nuking the feigned moral imperative for technocrat driven health care?  Who argues with economic analysis mentored by starts of the Hayek school's points about the economic model and why interventionism causes longer disruption and pain in many cases?

They need a forum to reach those who are interested and able to be swayed but we need to resharpen our wit, arguments, and delivery and be like Reagan's local and state operatives were in '68-'80.  I suspect we morons need to start looking hard at our local/state leadership and see who if anyone can fill shoes nationally and beat the collectivist pumpkin flat.

I dunno sorry I'm rambling but information that is too diffused is useless as is too concentrated, but what we have here is a small audience of national pols we are trying to influence with occasional exceptions, and not enough sway to make them notice us, but if we helped many parts of the smaller machines on our side our strength would grow and our presence would be magnified.

229

Click and embrace THE TRUTH!

 

http://tinyurl.com/3odd74b

230 Breitbart did great when he was pinch-hitting for Drudge.  I like his site when he just had Big Government and whatever else it was.  Now, it's just way too complicated for me and I rarely go there anymore, and then only if it's to dig a little deeper in something I've heard about elsewhere (the Acorn office stuff, for example).  I appreciate some of the stuff he's done, but it wouldn't surprise me one bit if his next iteration was Big Ego.  He seems to be getting a little megalomaniacal.  Sorry if this strikes anyone as blasphemy, it's just my personal opinion.  And he discounts the morons' personal loyalty to Ace and the cobloggers at his peril.

231 Yes I know. You elevated something easily done -- losing an election -- into some kind of grand strategy you would later chalk up as a victory.

This is a fine example of why the gutless rino socialist establishment types are held in such complete contempt by real Americans (have I checked all the appropriate boxes?)-you completely refuse to acknowledge the motivation of the people whose votes you need. In the moment, the issue was never the general election-except that you wanted to pretend it was and you put your point of view ahead of all others. The specific point of the Delaware primary was to send a message to the America's enemies in the GOP establishment that the rest of the wave was not in support of them but in opposition to Obama and his party's spending. The voters of that primary acted entirely within their prerogatives to make that choice, and while you have the speech right to bitch about it, you have no authoritative legitimacy to speak down to them. It wasn't your call to make.

Obviously it failed. in the larger sense as well. Members of the GOP supported the repeal of DADT and the passed the debt limit increase (for example). But there was no real loss incurred from the gesture, as nothing that has passed the senate since those elections would have been held back by Castle's presence (as he's exactly the sort that would always be the extra vote the Dems need).

if the Tea Party wanted a better candidate, they had a year to find one

Or, you know, the ubermensh of the GOP establishment could find a candidate that was acceptable to their primary voters, since they're the ones with poll-smarts and organizing ability and all.

232 I guess I don't understand the black and white absolutism of establishment/anti-establishment thinking. People on one side say "well, I guess you want Charlie Crist over Marco Rubio" and the other side says "you idiots gave us Christine O'Donnell". Can't we establish a reasonable level of discretion when pushing the anti-establishment movement? I realize hindsight is 20/20, but Rubio was a strong and viable alternative to an bad establishment candidate. O'Donnell was not. Had the Tea Party done any sort of honest investigation into her shaky credentials instead of trying to prove their ideological purity, we'd have one more GOP Senator and one less Dem. This is something we should be able to recognize at this point.

233 >>>What better 'focus group' than the comment threads in the Dextrosphere? You know I've said this when arguing with establishment-types or, actually, screaming on the blog that establishment-types should listen to me. I have said that every day on the blog I am conducting an ad-hoc focus group of motivated political partisans. I cannot use the blog to tell how a state would vote, but I can discover how the *primary electorate* in that state would vote, the most passionate/vocal/engaged parts of the base. The establishment has done some things I have screamed about, because I knew that the base would riot. It's annoying that I'm never actually asked about this shit. Not that I'm so smart, but because I read comments, I sort of at least have a feel for how the base thinks. It's not scientific enough to do make close calls, but on stuff where the base is absolutely *enraged* by something, why dont' they freakin' email me? Or note when I lay down a big threat to not support the GOP? Like I did when I think the NRSC was talking about actively supporting Charlie Crist. They backed down from that, but I have often thought the blogosphere is a kind of Distant Early Warning system for these dopes, if they would just USE it.

234 Big Breitbart is ripping us off reading the comments!

235 218 barbarian,

barbarian can I ask you something?

not calling you out....now that they have won their special interest social issues what are gay economics?

Gay foreign policy?

Gay tax theory?

There is not one....

the democrats are a cult of thugs and victims..... we need to shave off their victims class so there are more thugs and less sympathy from the idiot middle and the only way we can is through contact.

236 Breitbart did great when he was pinch-hitting for Drudge.  I like his site when he just had Big Government and whatever else it was.  Now, it's just way too complicated for me and I rarely go there anymore, and then only if it's to dig a little deeper in something I've heard about elsewhere (the Acorn office stuff, for example).  -------- I don't understand the force-opening of new windows with his links over there.

237 220 I think many people in the movement have this in mind, a revolution of the "peasants," if you will, against the "aristocracy" of the "establishment."

I don't really give a crap about that. for one thing, it's not going to happen. For another thing, I don't have the confidence in the would-be *new* dominant order that they have in themselves.

Posted by: King George III at September 10, 2011 04:43 PM (vOH26)

===

Would you settle for the folks who realized there are actually are laws of the universe that overrule all human bullshit and no longer want to believe the government is magic like Santa Claus?

238 It's not scientific enough to do make close calls, but on stuff where the base is absolutely *enraged* by something, why dont' they freakin' email me?

Guessing mostly because you might A) send them used pudding or B) say something they don't want to hear.
Guessing mostly B.

239 80 47 Trainer at September 10, 2011 03:33 PM (nWxhZ)

I'm in OC also...down by the SeaSide Bridge.  Yep, I know this area is as red as it gets in Joisey, but I still work up north, my kids are moonbats, and our inlaws and friends are mainly well off academics and professionals living in the liberal bubble that is Princeton.  I have one (1) friend in Princeton who is a business owner and conservative.

We go back to back like we are fending off orcs when there are get-togethers.  You could make a movie out of it..."When Weenies Attack".

240 On the issue of "experts" vs degree.

No college graduate is an "expert" in anything but going to college. You become an expert by getting into an actual field and performing work and gaining experience.

And journalism people? They are some of the dumbest SOBs I have ever seen in my life. Most of them simply do not have a clue about anything but sitting in front of a camera.

The old days of the streetwise reporter are long gone.

241 <sub>On the issue of "experts" vs degree.

No college graduate is an "expert" in anything but going to college. You become an expert by getting into an actual field and performing work and gaining experience.

And journalism people? They are some of the dumbest SOBs I have ever seen in my life. Most of them simply do not have a clue about anything but sitting in front of a camera.

The old days of the streetwise reporter are long gone.</sub>

Vic Johnson is right!

Hi Vic.

242 244 Vic,

they don't have to be if money is not the reporter's primary driving force

we have a lot of blank pages on the internet left

243 Hi Vic.

Posted by: sifty at September 10, 2011 04:59 PM (4CSeG)

You did NOT compare me to the ponytail man did you?

244

The "funhouse mirror" concept that Sven mentioned is spot-on.

In the upcomming year......we are going to see the left use every rotten trick in the book to try to get Barky reelected.... Hell, they are staying awake at night right now racking their little brains on what to do next.

One of Breitbart's strengths has been his alliance with those courageous young kids who went out and took videos....and are still doing it. That is the sort of thing that there needs to be more of......especially in this election cycle.

As far as the 'Local Link-UP' idea... Couldn't that be a featured section? ...Where people could post things/events/meetings that could be seen by others in their area? This could greatly reinforce the information-sharing as well.

245

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 04:53 PM (nj1bB)

Very good point.... Karl Rove makes a very good living off of Polls, and knowing what th BELTWAY want and think....

But he's clueless about the TEA party folks... or even how angry the populace is getting... because he is still inside the beltway.  He does not hear from normal 'folks'...

Right after Obamas speech Thursday, I hit the Grocery store for beer... in the check out line the I joked with the Guy in front of me that I'd just watched Obama's speech, and decided I needed a beer afterwords.... the checkout lady said "yeah, he must have given a speech, the stock market went down'... (this from a middle aged Hispanic Grocery store clerk, in Central California)...

Rove does not hear that kind of thing.... even via second or third hand stories.

246 ChrisR-- You commented on O'Donnell and Angle 'costing us Senate seats.'

O'Donnell might have been a flawed candidate. But Castle definitely was, if he couldn't win a primary.

Angle would have won Nevada, if she had enjoyed the traditional 90%+ support from the GOP. She WON among independents. She lost because the Establishment abandoned her and voted for Reid. Just like they did with Hoffman in NY-23.

That's the bottom line. When the chips are down, the Establishment wants 'their own.' Not a true Conservative.

And Ace, I disagree with you this far: The Establishment may not be the enemy. But they're fellow-travelers with them.

247 You did NOT compare me to the ponytail man did you?

Easy, Cowboy.

Blazing Saddles, not ponytail goofball.

248

Any argument that Rs had to throw one election and it was all part of some grand plan looks pretty odd when the Rs start the 2012 race by sucking on the very same turds.

That's my best possible explanation for the GOP running John McCain in 2008. I know he won the primaries, but I mean even letting this guy run in the primaries to begin with.

Remember in 2000 when he was going on TV talking about the "gooks"? For about four days straight, it was "gooks" this and "gooks" that and these people aren't "gooks" but these other people will always be "gooks"? Right then, I realized that John McCain would never be president.

Seriously, the notion that the Republicans threw the 2008 election is absurd. Equally absurd is the notion that the Republicans didn't throw the 2008 election. I won't say that John McCain or the Republican Party lost that one deliberately, but I will say that McCain-Palin was the biggest, most avoidable clusterf*ck I've ever seen in an election.

Hell, McGovern could've won in 2008.

249 Like I said, though, a lot of stuff gets "discussed."

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 04:41 PM (nj1bB)

AOL has what they call the patch. It shows up as a couple of sentence description of a local story when I check my email. They interview or write about local pols or other local news and I read it sometimes if it looks interesting. You could do the same by finding local bloggers to participate and an ad would come up on your page for people from their city or zip or whatever.

250 182 KBob,

I understand what you are saying but I suspect we can hit "moron nation" and the more straight laced.

This site is full of south park republicans.....

and Kbob they saved the 2dBush term because they saw Kerry as weak, effete, and like freedom.

251 As the years pass, I find it harder and harder to look at pictures of 9/11. It has gone from shock and horror to horror and great sorrow. Sorry Bloomberg. This really not O/T as it sort of melds into the main feature: Would any of you guessed we'd be here 10 years later, with this stuttering, clusterf*uck of a miserable failure at the helm: This idiot Islam endorser, this Israeli condemner, with the preposterous 10 million dollar (and counting) wife, a national debt that would probably reach to Mars by now? And nothing, nothing to show for it except the pom-pom girls that make up the MSM.

252 Posted by: Shawn at September 10, 2011 05:02 PM (/lltO)

Angle lost because of poor Republican GOTV in NV and the huge GOTV by the unions. That combined with the fact that NV has changed into a blue State because of the unions and CA exflow to NV.

253 Credentials. It seems like BA degrees have become the new high school diploma, while MA's are the new BA. I 've seen some of the work required for MA's from friends working on their various master's degrees, and it was almost childish. So I am less likely to be impressed with more recent degrees than I would have been even ten years ago. (Senior moment) Back when I was working on my Master's, twenty and thirty page papers were what you turned in for class, not for your effing thesis. We had to conduct research projects that took months to accumulate data, analyze it, rerun the project to ensure that the process was correct, and then write the paper, and present it. For one flipping class. Today's "educated" don't seem to be as diligent. So I think modern credentials don't seem to matter as much, because they don't seem to be worth as much, (cough, cough, Harvard law degree) save for skilled professions such as doctors, nurses, etc. But I could be wrong, and need to sit on my front porch, yelling at people to get off my lawn.

254 As for MD it is a deep blue State and in 2008 was highly unlikely to be winnable by any Republican, including the DIABLO who lost the primary.

255 "This time it will be different."

But it never will be. G. W. Bush never learned that. All his mistakes, like the Part D bill, No Child Left Behind, and screwing up the wars for five years, can be traced to one fault: a desire to be accepted by the ruling media elite, the belief that such acceptance is necessary to govern well.

Palin gets it, and now Newt gets it, too. His smackdown of the media was the shot across the bow.

256 Blazing Saddles, not ponytail goofball.

LOL, OK, sorry.

257 >>But he's clueless about the TEA party folks... or even how angry the populace is getting... because he is still inside the beltway. He does not hear from normal 'folks'... Eesh. I'm just not a fan of this "normal 'folks'" crap. I think he actually does know how you think, or broadly, what the Tea Party thinks. (Although that is a dicey proposition, as there are probably 10 or 12 major strains of thinking in what is called "The Tea Party." For example, it has a heavy Ron Paul contingent, and yet most in the Tea Party are not all about silver dimes and FEMA camps.) I think he knows something you don't want to hear yourself-- that a majority of the country thinks you are somewhat odd in your priorities and passions, and that's why the Tea Party has a 60% unfavorable rating. I think you don't want to hear this. So I think you assume he is lying, and the polls are fixed. I think there is a Pauline Kael effect going on ("I don't know how Nixon won, no one I know voted for him"). I think the sins of the establishment are smug satisfaction and presumption of dominance and assumption of superiority. But I think the tea party has sins, too, and they are a smug, off-putting self-righteousness, a casual dismissiveness of any talent, expertise, or virtue they don't possess (this is the anti-credentialism thing), and a "Community-Based Reality" effect (which we've seen on the left) where cocooning and repetition of group wisdom are too pronounced. Yes, it is true, the establishment will never win without the Tea Party, and needs to listen to it. But the Tea Party needs to listen too. My sense is that many (not nearly all) of the revolution-minded folks have decided that anything they don't want to hear is a lie or a misrepresentation. The left does this. Be wary.

258 249 Romeo 13,

and that type of guerrilla PR footsoldier work is part of what I am discussing by teaching/listening/sharing local intell on a national clearinghouse.

The GOP needs to learn to target the states' concerns we are at risk of either losing or potentially flipping and if we had a conduit to a director of low level soft intell it would help the GOP up top tune its message to what the low informations voters need to be hearing for us to close the deal....

we are the right we approach this like a war or a business, the left accept orthodox liberalism as religion since they drove the Scoop Jacksons out.....

the GOP needs an asymmetrical operations wing not in the 4th gen war sense but in the political data gatherer and operative one.

259 Time to re-read Codevilla.

260 But my contrary problem continues to be the demagogic suggestion that people with training and experience (and accomplishment) aren't in any better position to offer an opinion than anyone else.

When it comes to knowing how to do eye surgery?  Well of course, defer to the experts on the medicine of the eye.

When it comes to knowing what is best for me and my life?  They aren't.  No one is, except me.  Now, I may choose to consult an expert.  But maybe I won't.  It's my choice.

261 261 Ace,

There's merit to that point of course if Obama had the adjectives and motivations used to describe them broke out towards the DNC and Obama they'd be in the teens.....

no joke.

262 That's a good point. Ten years ago, on, say, 9/12, you could've made a LOT of money by betting on the longshot that in ten years the US president would be named Barack Hussein Obama.

263 The Tea Party: "RINOs. Tear down this wall."

264 I jumped ugly on this?! Well, if I did, sorry, I guess I was being a real dickbag.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 04:37 PM (nj1bB)

I figured you were all hepped up from the tweeter wars or whatever it is you kids do when not strapped in to the blog control station.  I didn't take it personally.  Besides, everyone's touchy in the candidate threads.

265 My sense is that many (not nearly all) of the revolution-minded folks have decided that anything they don't want to hear is a lie or a misrepresentation. The left does this. Be wary. Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 05:11 PM (nj1bB) So what's been truthful from the left? Examples, please.

266 But the Tea Party needs to listen too.

My sense is that many (not nearly all) of the revolution-minded folks have decided that anything they don't want to hear is a lie or a misrepresentation.

The left does this. Be wary.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 05:11 PM (nj1bB)

I hate it when I wander into the middle of a conversation. Those damn chili dogs better taste good.

267 259 PJ,

YES!

We do not want 85% socialism at 95% of the doneky price!

There are moral reasons why Bush's domestic policy was wrong.....

he destroyed our credibility on liberty and personal responsibility.

268

I can't wrap my mind around how 9-11 happened and then we moved left, weak and pro-muslim. It's mind blowing. 9-11 happened and we elected Barak Hussain Obama, communist, radical, and idiot and then went about destroying more of the country. It makes no sense.

Why would a country like the US go on a suicide mission or rather just lie down and die? For free cheese? Really?

269 If you'd known ten years ago that the US president in 2011 would be named Barack Hussein Obama, you probably would've thought we'd lost the War On Terror.

270 Posted by: tsj017 at September 10, 2011 05:13 PM (vOH26) Prolly, a considerable sum.

271

This idiot Islam endorser, this Israeli condemner, with the preposterous 10 million dollar (and counting) wife, a national debt that would probably reach to Mars by now? And nothing, nothing to show for it except the pom-pom girls that make up the MSM.

Yep, if Bush/Cheney had had real stones, they would have nuked Saudi Arabia for that.  That at least, would make the muz think twice before attacking Americans again.

272 264 ChemJeff,

experts are a data point and source....

I believe in the ability of people to act in their own interests and desires....

I don't need Michelle Obama or barack as a life coach

273 270 But the Tea Party needs to listen too.

My sense is that many (not nearly all) of the revolution-minded folks have decided that anything they don't want to hear is a lie or a misrepresentation.

The left does this. Be wary.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 05:11 PM (nj1bB)

I'll need more specifics.

Like when certain people said the Times Square inept bomber was probably a bitter clinger and no one agreed? Like that?

274 You know there is an allegory here.

Two guys in a Dodge Viper. The driver tells the passenger how he picked up a chick once and she gave him a BJ going down the freeway to Vegas. Then offers to let the passenger take his car around the block once.

The Driver is the Dems.
The Passenger is the Repubs.

Just because the Dems let the Republicans take their Viper around the block and wave at chicks from time to time, Republicans think their Jetta, and their Fiesta are just pieces of junk. They don't get it. They don't get to drive the Viper once in a great while because the owner is nice. They get to drive it, because the owner wants them to be jealous. They think they are due a Viper too. And while they can barely tolerate their Jetta, and throw rocks at their loyal Fiesta, both carry their ass every time they need to get someplace.

275 My sense is that many (not nearly all) of the revolution-minded folks have decided that anything they don't want to hear is a lie or a misrepresentation.

You lie

276 >>>When it comes to knowing what is best for me and my life? They aren't. No one is, except me. Now, I may choose to consult an expert. But maybe I won't. It's my choice. I specifically mean expertise on politicking and polling. I specifically mean that if every expert in the GOP says that Christine O'Donnell is doomed, maybe give that a listen. Something horrible happened in Colorado. An attractive, conservative Senate candidate (Jane Norton) was passed over for a candidate the Tea Party considered "one of their own," Ken Buck. Ken Buck was a disaster. Norton would have won the contest. I really don't like this identity-politics bullshit, not on the left, and not the new version on the right. Maybe because I'm sort of an outsider in the GOP anyway (a minority, culturally, I mean) I don't even expect to have "one of my own" running. But passing up good, attractive candidates with good records just to pull some identity-politics "I need someone from my tribe" kind of nonsense... well, it leads to bad results.

277 I know everything this adm says is a lie.

278 Posted by: soothsayer at September 10, 2011 04:13 PM (sqkOB) You.

279

Yes, this is the big problem. There is no structure here to make sure that local and state bloggers get properly "fed" with traffic and links.

State and local bloggers are actually MUCH more useful politically, and yet they don't get the attention the nationally-oriented blogs do, and there is no clever way yet discovered (or even a simple focus) on making sure those state and local blogs are always getting linked.

This is a problem that often gets discussed.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 04:41 PM (nj1bB)

Is there something specific everyone on the right side of the blogosphere sees the left doing and doesn't know how to copy?

Is the left getting local bloggers noticed and read? Is this translating into grassroots action in some way on the part of the left at a local level, entirely driven by the internet, and the right is looking to duplicate this phenomenon?

If there's nothing specific people on the right can point to and want to duplicate, aside from higher traffic numbers, then maybe it's just a fallacy that the left uses the blogosphere more effectively. They have more traffic, but if that's not translating into some tangible results you're looking to duplicate, maybe there's no real problem. It is what it is.

280 There are moral reasons why Bush's domestic policy was wrong..... ---------- If you think his domestic policy was wrong, you should see what his plans were before 9/11 derailed everything.

281 I thought it had been proven that the CO election was lost due to fraud.

282 >>>So what's been truthful from the left? Examples, please. I didn't say the left was truthful. I said the left has devolved into a Community-Based Reality in which only the things they wish to believe are true.

283 Christine O'Donnell is doomed

Give it a rest.  One first down in a season, doesn't make anyone a winner.

284 278 MtM,

there is something to that....

of course as a voter I want my politician to take a sledgehammer to the donk viper...

I don't want the $uper$tate driven by George W Bush for a spin I want the fiesta to carry the President to the ribbon cutting of a new factorry or mine made possible by a Federal govt that only takes 1.7 trillion to run.

One can dream that 14/15ths of our economy could be wages and wealth not servicing a black hole of destructive energy

285 what culture are you from ace? not trying to pry....

286 But passing up good, attractive candidates with good records just to pull some identity-politics "I need someone from my tribe" kind of nonsense... well, it leads to bad results.

It led to victory in the House.  And more victories to come.  Revel in the chaos.

287 272 I can't wrap my mind around how 9-11 happened and then we moved left, weak and pro-muslim. It's mind blowing. 9-11 happened and we elected Barak Hussain Obama, communist, radical, and idiot and then went about destroying more of the country. It makes no sense.

Why would a country like the US go on a suicide mission or rather just lie down and die? For free cheese? Really?

People were war-weary and tired of other Bush policies. Obama pretended to be a moderate who would restore hope by putting us on a different course. The 52%ers also wanted to be a part of history.

288

what culture are you from ace? not trying to pry....

The Southern Hemisphere Endorian Ewoks, of course...

289 284 Johnny,

I respected what his non 9/11 viosion foreign policy wise and was terrified enough of Pope Al to make the Faustian bargain....then all hell broke loose and the attacks on him forced me to back an agenda between he and K street I hated.....

2001-2008 was not a thrilling time for me as a voter

290 >>>Give it a rest. One first down in a season, doesn't make anyone a winner. That wasn't a first down; that was the next six years. And your "Give it a rest" proves that you intend to continue making the same mistake. You're proud of the mistake. You like to call that mistake a "victory." And I can't join the Happy To Be Losers brigade in this lunacy.

291 what culture are you from ace? not trying to pry....

Posted by: phoenixgirl at September 10, 2011 05:21 PM (eOXTH)

He's a connecticut string puller.

292 Damn you ace, I didn't get half the stuff done today that I wanted to, because I was dicking around on your blog all day.

Just for that I'm going over to Breitbart's place.

Plus I've heard they have a fellater on staff.  Granted, it's dum-dum, but beggars can't be choosers, right?

293 I am really surprised that there was only one mention of talk radio in this whole thread (182). What if the establishment Right thinks Rush, Sean, Laura, and the rightwing talk-radio universe is just more powerful and effective in courting their base that the right-wing blogosphere is? Or maybe they're just used to going there to communicate with the base first and foremost? It also happens to be a more one-way medium. Sure, callers can call in and maybe get a rant off, but it's nothing like the instant feedback you get on a blog. Maybe they're uncomfortable with that, and it keeps them from hearing stuff like "why are you debating on MSNBC?" in anything resembling real-time. Anyway, I think talk radio is the establishment Right's "alternative to the alternative."

One thing in the quoted article: MSNBC is more left than Fox is right? Without trying too hard to start a food fight, that is highly debatable, and ultimately perspective-based. Ask most righties, of course it is. Ask most lefties, they'd say the opposite is true. Ask me, I say they're mirrors of each other.

294 290 Ms80sBaby,

correct, McCain was so weak Barry ran left and right of him and without the 4th estate to call barack on the hypocrisy he attracted a lot of "now I will never be called racist again" crossover women.....

Barack is not making the GOP Swing gals happy with his attacks on their beliefs

295

Revel in the chaos.

Chaos is fair

296 297

just because you got rid of bathtub boy does not mean Chris Tingle does not openly court Barack to be his valet.

297 >>>It led to victory in the House. And more victories to come. Revel in the chaos. As I often point out, I didn't endorse any sure-loser candidates but I endorsed a lot of Tea Party winners. Losing CO, NV, and DE did not "win" you anything anywhere else. They were mistakes, pure own-goals, and while you continue to argue (to spare your ego) that in some indirect bank-shot-off-the-rail way your mistakes were really strategic brilliance, you continue expressing your strong intention to learn nothing at all.

298 299 Joker,

chaos is more fair than appointing "superleader" to engage in oversight of 300 million people's business choices and liberty and economic choices anyway

299 252  Seriously, the notion that the Republicans threw the 2008 election is absurd. Equally absurd is the notion that the Republicans didn't throw the 2008 election. I won't say that John McCain or the Republican Party lost that one deliberately, but I will say that McCain-Palin was the biggest, most avoidable clusterf*ck I've ever seen in an election.

Hell, McGovern could've won in 2008.

Posted by: FireHorse at September 10, 2011 05:04 PM (RZRz9)

=======

In my saner moments, I agree in all respects.  In my more curious moments, I still can't get understand why I was better prepared to be John McCain in the debate than John McCain was -- especially since  I did not even work on it very hard.

Further, I don't know why the Rs subject themselves to the Kabuki theater.  Do you remember that moment at the 2008 convention when the crowd started to chant NBC, NBC, NBC?  Why pretend anymore?

I know the rule about not picking fights with people who buy ink by the barrel, but isn't that superseded by the rule about fighting back when you are on your back and about to die in a strangle hold?

300 ace, you're like the guy that spikes the ball in the end zone, when he's down by 30 points. 

Your team won the 2010 season.  We had a few ugly games, but we got stronger.

There's no point in talking about the time your star quarterback was out and you had to put in the 3rd string guy with one arm.

301 One thing in the quoted article: MSNBC is more left than Fox is right? Without trying too hard to start a food fight, that is highly debatable, and ultimately perspective-based. Ask most righties, of course it is. Ask most lefties, they'd say the opposite is true. Ask me, I say they're mirrors of each other. ------ I think you're confusing straight news with commentators. MSNBC's news coverage is just as left as their commentators. Not so with Fox.

302

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 05:11 PM (nj1bB)

I"m 52 years old... and I've NEVER heard Politics discussed in a Grocery store before.  Especialy with a total stranger.  Dismiss it as anecdotal if you wish... but I've been seeing it at client sites as well...

When I hear secretaries starting to sound like the Morons here... its an indication that somthing is going on.

Also, your comment...  "they are a smug, off-putting self-righteousness, a casual dismissiveness of any talent, expertise, or virtue they don't possess (this is the anti-credentialism thing)" is painting with a pretty broad brush, and could as easily be said about Beltway insiders... the Left... The media... and some Internet Pundits.

 

303 294 Ace,

the stakes are too high....

too many TP HARDCORE! see this as a sprint....

we are trying to undo a 77 year march towards having a genuine "Dear Leader and the Politburo"

we call our Politburo "Tsars"

304 I have just one thing to say about polling...polls are only as good as whoever the pollster hires to sun the phone calls. At 16, I worked as a temp at a polling firm that had been hired by an Oklahoman Representative. My fellow employees could have been on an episode of intervention. I don't know what we told that politician, but whatever it was, it was bullshit. Sometimes those inside a campaign really are as stupid as you'd assume.

305 I would love to see a debate hosted by the Ace and the AoS co-bloggers!  We might actually learn something.

Great idea!  I can envision the questions:

"Governor Romney, do you like to be called Mittens?"

"Governor Perry, is it true your cock is bigger than Cheney's?"

"Congresswoman Bachmann, can we see your boobies?"

"RON PAUL!!!!!!!"

"Governor Huntsman, are you fucken on drugs?"

"Speaker Gingrich, how's Pelosi's ass taste?"

"Senator Santorum, are you still here?"

306 266 That's a good point. Ten years ago, on, say, 9/12, you could've made a LOT of money by betting on the longshot that in ten years the US president would be named Barack Hussein Obama. Posted by: tsj017 at September 10, 2011 05:13 PM (vOH26) This pretty funny (not ha-ha). Back when he first came on the scene, my brother-in-law (a huge gambler, and quite successful business man) laughed and laughed and laughed at the idea that Barack Hussein Obama would run for president. Just goes to owe you. I meant "owe" --How much do you owe the U.S. Government? And, where do you get your resources? We have highway signs to make, a very fast train to prepare, more golden-eagle slaughtering wind-farms to cultivate, more solar panels to blast out. Come on, "folks".

307

@302:  I agree, that's why I quoted the Joker.

Chaotic, self-organizing systems are vastly superior to top down, command and control systems in anything more complex than an elementary school.

That's what American used to be, a self-organizing system.

308 300 - ???? I don't get the joke. Is that an Olbermann reference?

I get your point, but have you see a Sean Hannity interview...ever? Not saying it's unfair (life is unfair), just that he's, you know, a friendly.

309 your mistakes were really strategic brilliance, you continue expressing your strong intention to learn nothing at all.

If you think anyone is going to front another COD in 2012, you are smoking some really good stuff.

310 One thing in the quoted article: MSNBC is more left than Fox is right? Without trying too hard to start a food fight, that is highly debatable, and ultimately perspective-based. Ask most righties, of course it is. Ask most lefties, they'd say the opposite is true. Ask me, I say they're mirrors of each other.

Posted by: A Liberal AoS Reader, Really! at September 10, 2011 05:23 PM (HmzSN)

--Shep Smith, Jerry Rivers, Greta: all lefties.

Who at MSNBC is as right as they are left?

311 One thing in the quoted article: MSNBC is more left than Fox is right? Without trying too hard to start a food fight, that is highly debatable, and ultimately perspective-based. Ask most righties, of course it is. Ask most lefties, they'd say the opposite is true. Ask me, I say they're mirrors of each other.

Posted by: A Liberal AoS Reader, Really! at September 10, 2011 05:23 PM (HmzSN)

Fox isn't close to being as far right as MSNBC is far left. Everyone of MSNBC opinion hosts are fringe leftwingers. Fox only has Hannity that fits in that catagory.

Just look at who is opposite of each other in their lineup.

Al Sharpton/Bret Bair-Bair at most is a squish republican

Chris Matthews/Shep Smith-Smith is a liberal

O' Donnel/O Reilly- O' Reilly probably votes republican but is far from being conservative.

Maddow/Hannity-a draw

Shultz/Greta-I have no idea who greta votes for but shultz is an all out commie.

312 I think the dude's last name is something like "Koulitsis"---which is Greek for "snarky little cocksucker from Berkeley".  That may not be the literal translation, but it's close enough for gubmint work.

313 Reagan didn't just happen 1980 was him finishing a relationship he had begun cultivating with the swayable electorate back in 1960.  Where is our politician who can give a speech like his nuking the feigned moral imperative for technocrat driven health care?


This is where I think it's necessary to pay more attention to ideology.  Yes, Reagan certainly had many escapades with pragmatism and had little aversion to it, but he was able to give an impassioned speech, he was able to beat people in debates, he was able to keep his support even when being pragmatic, because he knew the ideology of the right backwards and forwards.  By the time he became President, he had cultivated credibility among the right as being a guy who knew as well as anybody and had long supported this ideology.

This is why other actors don't match up to him when they enter politics and why most politicians don't match up to him when they enter politics.  He wasn't merely inclined towards one side of the aisle before deciding to run for office.  He had spent three decades reading up on political issues, meeting advocates, and debating people in his spare time.

Go watch his debate with Bobby Kennedy 13 years before becoming President.  Reagan had 20 years of experience as a political junkie before that debate and it showed.  Reagan destroyed him.  Give that guy 13 years more experience before debating Carter and another 18 years of experience before debating Mondale and of course he's going to do well.  There's no reason to expect otherwise.

Reagan was willing to be pragmatic when he needed to be while governing.  Long before that, though, he was willing to get in the middle of fights.  He was willing to take hard questions.  He was willing to spend hours at night boning up on the reasons for why you should support one position vs another.

When people who want to engage in politics are willing to put themselves in positions like this...

link

Of course they're going to perform well in debates 20 years later.

You can't expect a private citizen, an actor, a businessman to jump into an election (or a politician 10 years of experience in political office to jump into an election) and perform the way Reagan if that person hasn't jumped into ideological debates at a fraction of the amount that Reagan did.

314 America, not American

315 ace, are you serious? you seriously don't get why conservative candidates don't court conservative blogs...whereas liberal candidates court liberal blogs?

TAKE A LOOK AT THE CONTENTS AND COMMENTS on a conservative site (aceofspades, hotair, malkin) vs a liberal site (dailykos).

There is a complete difference of culture. On conservative sites, the comments section is filled with bashing, hate, etc. And on liberal sites, its often much more comments geared towards helping each other. Sure, there is bashing on liberal sites too, but on the whole, it is MUCH MUCH less than conservative sites. I don't think conservatives want to be associated with sites where Michelle Obama is constantly referred to as Moochelle, or obama is called a SCOAMF.

316 I'm all for being practical and knowing one's limitations, but every free citizen should immediately be wary of anyone who tells then they are too stupid (whatever pretty weasel words they use) to participate in their own government.

Plow hands and blacksmiths and shit-shovelers made this nation right alongside the lawyers and doctors and snake oil salesmen.

Seek advice when you have to, but don't ever let some asshole in a suit tell you that you'll just never understand.

317 The Democrat establishment doesn't do well on the leftosphere, the liberal left does. The Republican establishment doesn't do well on the rightosphere, the Tea Party right does. The one thing the two groups who do with bloggers is that they aren't part of the establishment. Either are bloggers. There might be a reason.

318 298 290 Ms80sBaby,

correct, McCain was so weak Barry ran left and right of him and without the 4th estate to call barack on the hypocrisy he attracted a lot of "now I will never be called racist again" crossover women.....

Barack is not making the GOP Swing gals happy with his attacks on their beliefs


This is one of the many dangers of voting based on your emotions, when rhetoric blinds you to the truth.
That happened with some races in the '08 congressional elections, too.

319

>> Ace: My sense is that many (not nearly all) of the revolution-minded folks have decided that anything they don't want to hear is a lie or a misrepresentation. The left does this. Be wary.

>> Bunny: So what's been truthful from the left? Examples, please.

Examples of factually true statements that the left has refused to accept:
-- Saddam Hussein financially supported international terrorists.
-- There were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.
-- The science supporting man-made global warming is flawed.
-- The detention facility at Guantanamo Bay is legal.
-- There was a feasible plan by terrorists to attack the Brooklyn Bridge.

These have all been confirmed, and the veracity of each is damaging to the left. Subsequently, these have all been firmly established as "lies."

320 309, great idea.  Would be a good thread.

321 or obama is called a SCOAMF.

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:31 PM (NadeK)

But Obama IS a SCOAMF. Sure as water is wet and hippies stink. He's a SCOAMF.

322 305 - I respectfully disagree. Watch the first 10 minutes of both networks' actual news coverage - it's what they choose to cover and not cover that makes the slant happen, on both networks. It's almost always two totally different leads.

323 Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:31 PM (NadeK)

--Yay!!!!

Dum-Dum has graced us with his presence!

324 Posted by: Romeo13 at September 10, 2011 05:27 PM (NtXW4) This is true. Never in my entire life have I ever heard a peep, out in public, regarding politics. Now it is everywhere, either under one's breath, or at times, very vocal and loud.

325 prou donkey your nic is missing something daily kos.....not filled with hate? you are kidding right? when are they not calling for war crimes against conservatives? when are they not hoping all conservatives/tea partiers die?

326 donkeymouth, And on liberal sites, its often much more comments geared towards helping each other.

You guys need lots of help.

327

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:31 PM (NadeK)

Then why don't you go to a liberal site and leave us the fuck alone Palin Steele.

328 And on liberal sites, its often much more comments geared towards helping each other.

Yeah, that vile sucker of cock Markos saying "screw them' when Americans are hung from bridges.

Maggot.

329 319 I go to those sites as well. Uh, there's plenty to go around, that's all I'm saying. And fuck it if anyone can't take a joke. The left and right both dish it out pretty good on the interwebz. As it should be.

330 >>>Also, your comment... "they are a smug, off-putting self-righteousness, a casual dismissiveness of any talent, expertise, or virtue they don't possess (this is the anti-credentialism thing)" is painting with a pretty broad brush, and could as easily be said about Beltway insiders... the Left... The media... and some Internet Pundits. I painted the establishment with a broad brush too, but that was okay?

331 My point was to alert you of your blind spots, and stop ignoring contrary voices simply because they are contrary.

332 Mr. President, have you read the bill that you insisted on being passed days ago?
 

333 you know what the lefty sites are missing? humor....there is really zero humor there......

334

And on liberal sites, its often much more comments geared towards helping each other

You're right, they are usually trying to help each other commit a murder.

335 One thing in the quoted article: MSNBC is more left than Fox is right? Without trying too hard to start a food fight, that is highly debatable, and ultimately perspective-based. Ask most righties, of course it is. Ask most lefties, they'd say the opposite is true. Ask me, I say they're mirrors of each other.

Posted by: A Liberal AoS Reader, Really! at September 10, 2011 05:23 PM (HmzSN)

Ok, who is Bob Beckel's equivalent on MSNBC?  Shepard Smith's equivalent?  Allen Colmes equivalent?  (Yes, I realize he's no longer on FOX but he was for a looooong time.)  Geraldo's equivalent?  Off the top of my head, I can think of  4 far lefties that are (or were) on Fox regularly.  Name me 4 far righties that are on MSNBC regularly.

336 My point was to alert you of your blind spots, and stop ignoring contrary voices simply because they are contrary.

That's the wife's job.

337 One big problem is our biggest media success -- talk radio -- is losing listeners among the younger generation. The iPod generation just isn't listening to radio.

And AM talk radio takes some effort to find. Every time I'm in a new city I have to spend a few minutes scanning the dial to find the local Rush station. People under 30 just aren't doing that.

On the plus side it means NPR is being increasingly ignored, too. But NPR is always in the 88.5-91.9 region on FM so it's a lot easier to find. And they always have good signal strength since the govt is paying their operating costs.

The best thing to happen for the Right in the internet age is Drudge. Even left-wingers can't and don't completely ignore Drudge.

Of course, Drudge being a one man deal. Who knows what might happen. He might go LGF one day. The increasing # of infowars/prison planet links I see on Drudge concern me because it suggests an instability of mind.

Once somebody goes down the infowars path there's no telling which way they'll go in the future. Hard to predict crazy.

338 317 AD,

indeed....

Reagan was built up by people who understood the Bluebloods were merely a slightly center right version of the $uper$tate as many of them were legacy holdovers from the GOP's own "progressive" days.

Moron nation  needs to find some rising start pol in a finely balanced state and report on them here, we also need to start slowly cultivating penetration of our ideas in minority contacts and special interest group types we know.

There is no "black business" or "gay foreign policy" there is business and foreign policy, any attempt by the demonized bigwigs to reach out is mocked but we all have the ability to slowly try to break up their bloc with reasoning humor favors and a lack of the decided hypocrisy of TV evangelist syle liberal millionaire poverty faith healers.

The GOP needs to get to the slow hard work of rebuilding the grass roots we were forced to face after FDR held sway for so long.

339 Two U-Hauls stolen last night in MD.    Just being reported.

340 Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:31 PM (NadeK)

Oh yeah, "Screw them" Kos is a real hotbed of gentility.

341 338 you know what the lefty sites are missing? humor....there is really zero humor there......

Posted by: phoenixgirl at September 10, 2011 05:35 PM (eOXTH)

Yeah, at Kos, when I heard something I liked, I'd comment that it made me happier than a Palestinian celebrating on 9/11. It was true. I thought it was clever. Them, not so much.

342 I can't name 4 righties who are news reporters on Fox.

And now that they have lost Beck, I am not sure if their pundits have become mostly left.

343 >>>One thing in the quoted article: MSNBC is more left than Fox is right? Without trying too hard to start a food fight, that is highly debatable, and ultimately perspective-based. Ask most righties, of course it is. Ask most lefties, they'd say the opposite is true. Ask me, I say they're mirrors of each other. How many Republicans are interviewed on MSNBC at night? Keith Olbermann famously never had a single Republican (except, of course, John Dean... haha) as a guest. Did not even want a contrary voice heard. Maddow does the same thing. Matthews rarely has a Republican on, and of course he is completely hostile to them. Further, the entire rest of the show is him interviewing liberal reporters like Finemann and that annoying black guy (Clarence Page?). MSNBC notoriously uses its hard-partisan opinion-mongers in straight-news roles (such as anchoring the RNC, or election night).

344

This announcement is only for you if you have a minimum of 20-30 lbs. to lose?

If so, Pass This Plan!

345 Two U-Hauls stolen last night in MD.    Just being reported.

The Methodists are restless.

346 315 That word fringe...I don't think it means what you think it means. Seriously, saying someone is fringe and someone else is not is not an objective measure.

328 I'd like to read that book someday and see the metrics. Thanks for bringing it up.

347 Sorry to have missed most of this and to not have time to read it ...

As for credentialism, expect to be hit with a wave of it from AlGore's Big Line O' B.S. Twitter and facebook stunt this coming week. If anybody with whom you are acquainted on either of those media take part in it, how will you respond?

For myself, as much as it reeks of playing the same game, I'd like to be able to respond by drawing from a battery of sources that debunk whatever claims the warmists make. Will citing such sources in response to their posts change their minds? Doubtful. But, to fight anti-science, which is the predominant characteristic of the warmists' arguments, I'd prefer to use science.

And, maybe, one or two people who read a rebuttal may begin to think for themselves. And two or three people who aren't in the warmists' camp will begin to speak up once they see others do so.

348 I think the dude's last name is something like "Koulitsis"---which is Greek for "snarky little cocksucker from Berkeley".  That may not be the literal translation, but it's close enough for gubmint work.

Posted by: Comanche Voter at September 10, 2011 05:30 PM (3ESDJ)

Actually that's pretty close but your translation was a bit off. "Little" should be "puny" but that's a minor point, etc., harumph.

349 Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:31 PM (NadeK)

Would you like me to direct you to the Kos or DU threads when Tony Snow died?  When Dick Cheney was hospitalized? 

350

And on liberal sites, its often much more comments geared towards helping each other. Sure, there is bashing on liberal sites too, but on the whole, it is MUCH MUCH less than conservative sites

Bullshit. This site alone is an example of how full of bullshit you are. Someone here intervened in a commenter's life and probably stopped his suicide. Others found out about a commenter who had cancer and was undergoing chemo and visited with him as he went through his treatment. Although that commenter passed away his family members still comment here because of the love and support everyone on this site showed toward him.

I could go on and on with examples of love, kindness and compassion that people here have shown toward others.

You only see what you want to see, what fits your narrative.

351 dum dum probably posted his brain turd on 100 different conservative sites while waiting for his girlfriend to inflate.

352 ^{you know what the lefty sites are missing? humor....there is really zero humor there......}

^{Posted by: phoenixgirl at September 10, 2011 05:35 PM (eOXTH)}

I actually totally agree with this...and this is the reason I frequent conservative sites more often.

353 The Methodists are restless.

Posted by: sifty at September 10, 2011 05:38 PM (4CSeG)

Given their position on a Palestinian State within the borders of Israel, I wouldn't be surprised.

I'm a former Methodist who parted ways just because of that.

354  Two U-Hauls stolen last night in MD.    Just being reported.

Well, that's certainly comforting.

355

The reason that people on the Left think that "Fox is a right-wing site" is because they have been so totally immersed in left-wing ideology their entire lives....from school/movies/media.....that anything that deviates from this is foreign to them.

They are so unaccustomed to hearing....or seeing....someone expressing anything other than the Leftist viewpoint that they see it all as 'right-wing'. 

356

You know what?   I don't give a shit about listening to a group of so-called experts that helped lead us to where we are today.

The only thing they've been experts at is promoting their own agendas, lining their pockets, sucking off anyone that will give them more power (no matter which side of the aisle) and bringing this country damn near to the brink.   Fuck 'em.

357 There is a complete difference of culture. On conservative sites, the comments section is filled with bashing, hate, etc. And on liberal sites, its often much more comments geared towards helping each other. Sure, there is bashing on liberal sites too, but on the whole, it is MUCH MUCH less than conservative sites. I don't think conservatives want to be associated with sites where Michelle Obama is constantly referred to as Moochelle, or obama is called a SCOAMF.

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:31 PM (NadeK)

ROFL

ROFL

ROFL

I thought the label "troll" was a little much before for someone who wanted to add an honest (if contrarion) viewpoint to the discussion, but this is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too much.  You are trolling.  Now hang your head in shame.

Tell me smart guy, when was the last time a conservative blog covered a fantasy snuff film starring President Obama in an even lukewarm tone?  Huh?

Fucking Time thought that was all well and good.  And that's just for starters.  I've heard Repubs compared to terrorists and worse on Swampland and other lib blogs ASSOCIATED DIRECTLY with the mainstream media.

What a cheap, throwaway provocation.  Start doing penance now.

358 MSNBC notoriously uses its hard-partisan opinion-mongers in straight-news roles (such as anchoring the RNC, or election night). ------ How about that ultra-moderate panel of Maddow, O'Donnell, Sharpton, Matthews and Shultz doing the post-GOP debate the other night?

359 355 PGiS,

the fish doesn't know it's wet...

Got Burro? is just exposing why no donk every apologizes for 8 years of "chimpymcbushhitlerhalibuertoneleventy!!!!!"

they don't see the problem....

hey donks....

Solyndra is gonna stick....

see you at the barricades

360 So why is the racist miscarriage-joking despicable banned twice and never rebanned again palin steele (proudonkey) not banned again already?

361 Lots of folks have asked for a righty on MSNBC: Joe Scarborough. They give him how many hours every morning? I know, "he's not really a right winger!!" That's how liberals (me included) feel about the lefties on FOX. And Colmes, ugh, don't even get me started...where did they even find him?

Beckel's a decent guy but far lefty? Come on.

And Doug Schoen and Pat Caddell, the "Democratic pollsters" who haven't run a Dem campaign in 30 years...having "Democrats" on is not the same as having sharp liberals on.

362 Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:41 PM (NadeK)

Fuck off to your oh-so-helpful leftard sites, you brain-dead "nonpartisan".

363

Given their position on a Palestinian State within the borders of Israel, I wouldn't be surprised.

I'm a former Methodist who parted ways just because of that.

Shit, and I thought they were just the annoying bake sale people. So many violent Christian sects to keep an eye on.

364 ace, don't confuse the stupid sh*t we write on blogs with what we do in the real world.  I make comments here in between letting the dog out, eating poptarts, farting, pissing, texting, talking on the phone, and watching football games.

In the real world, I am slightly more focused.

365 tami how can you throw that up in proudonkey's face? hahaha when ever i have gone there horrible things are in the comments.......in fact i looked something up on daily kos last night about the conservative running for phx mayor......and their was an article how he was mccain's campaign manager....one of the comments was about how "when drunk cindy came home from bangladesh with two kids......gullet took one of them off her hands"...........daily kos....feel the love.......

366 Would you like me to direct you to the Kos or DU threads when Tony Snow died?  When Dick Cheney was hospitalized?

I didn't say there was no hate on liberal blogs...but its much much less, and the fact that you have to point to 2 very specific events to show it proves my point. On conservative blogs, virtually every thread is a thread bashing liberals or the president. On liberal sites (like dailykos), while there are alot of threads bashing conservatives, theres alot of other types of threads that arent negative at all. Also, just random look at the comment section of 10 threads on a conservative blog vs 10 threads on a liberal blog...the difference is substantial.

367 I have a gig tonight in Charlotte NC - you can come throw tomatoes at me if you like. :-) But I gotta go. I'll read up later.

368 Ace it is Markos Xuniga CousCous

369

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:31 PM (NadeK)

Get back in the barrel, your shift isn't over.

370 Fight the Powers that BE!

371 Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:44 PM (NadeK)

Eat a bag of dicks somewhere else, dum dum, your act is stale and your clown suit no longer amuses.

372 ace, have you considered the possibility that the Venn diagram of what's politically possible and what's necessary to salvage the country has no overlap? That was my observation regarding the lack of resolution in your limited war thread a couple weekends ago, but was way late to the discussion.

A lot of the reason many of us aren't listening to what we perceive as excuses from the establishment is sheer panic at the circumstances facing us.

I know you're not a huge fan of Karl Denninger, but he's got an easy little 'experiment' anyone with a copy of excel can run. Start with GDP and national debt roughly equal at $15trillion, the budget at $3.8trillion, and figure out the effective tax rate that currently produces a $1.6trillion deficit (last year or wait until the actual numbers are out for this year). Grow the budget by 7% every year(or 6% for about the best budget cutting congressional GOP can agree on) and GDP by an extremely generous 4% every year for the next 60. Keep a running total of the debt and see what happens.

If you're feeling particularly adventuresome, toss in some 0s for GDP growth this year and a couple every 6 or 7 years for the recessions we all know always happen at least that often. Or figure out what happens to the interest payments on the debt over that time (when I did it, I found that the 7% budget growth rate isn't quite fast enough to cover the interest increase). And note that the results you then have assume that those interest rates stay at historical lows for the entire lifetime of anyone alive today.

I still wound up with a time I'll live to see where the interest payments leap past tax income. However, as Denninger points out, we will never get there. The whole scheme will collapse long before then, and as I've said, I expect it to be before the next election.

373

the fish doesn't know it's wet...

This would make a great secret phrase that spies use to identify each other!

374 ...i have never ever not one time ever seen a nasty thread or comments at the daily kos about bush or cheney.........ARE YOU KIDDING MY PROUDONKEY....you are insane or dishonest or both....i'm going with both because liberalism is A MENTAL DISORDER.....AND YOU ARE A LIAR

375 Ace, read the comments in this thread and you should find your answer on why conservative pols don't court conservative blogs. The vile, disgusting comments that are thrown at anyone who disagrees about even the slightest issue doesn't seem like a good thing for politicians to associate with.

376 How many Republicans are interviewed on MSNBC at night?

This is part of the reason Jon Stewart is likened to a serious newscaster.  He does serious, in-depth interviews with serious conservatives.  Now I'm not saying I subscribe to that viewpoint, given his clown nose on/off crap, but it is true he is much more bipartisan than the left-wing media establishment.

377 and the fact that you have to point to 2 very specific events to show it proves my point.

No, that she has examples and you have none proves her point, and makes you, as always, a fucking liar and too stupid to live.

Fuck off, idiot.

378 379

the fish doesn't know it's wet...

This would make a great secret phrase that spies use to identify each other!

Posted by: ParanoidStillAGirlInSeattle at September 10, 2011 05:45 PM (RZ8pf)

The response phrase should be "but the bird knows its flying."

379 STFU, dunce.

380 while there are alot of threads bashing conservatives, theres alot of other types of threads that arent negative at all. Also, just random look at the comment section of 10 threads on a conservative blog vs 10 threads on a liberal blog...the difference is substantial.

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:44 PM (NadeK)

Quick, troll: guess the party affiliation of the current occupant of the Oval Office.  Think that may have something to do with the vitriol in a partisan atmosphere?

Or maybe you're just very young and this is all new to you. 

381 Dum-Dum, Why is it you believe you are entitled to squat where you have been asked to depart?

382 ^{No, that she has examples and you have none proves her point, and makes you, as always, a fucking liar and too stupid to live.}

I have none? The comments on this very thread is all the proof I need.

383 Also, just random look at the comment section of 10 threads on a conservative blog vs 10 threads on a liberal blog...the difference is substantial.

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:44 PM (NadeK)

How do you even respond to such batshit ignorance?

384 and I can't believe you want to call Ace's attention to your fucking presence when your dumb ass is still under bannage.

Dunce.

385 Big Ace!!!

Now who wants to be our James O'Keefe. I'll go out looking for and interviewing for our Dana Loesch...cuz I'm giving, that way

386

The response phrase should be "but the bird knows its flying."

That's exactly what I was thinking! Get out of my head man, there's not enough room for both of us there!

387 371 Prouddonkey,

again bullshit...

do go on.

I love your side's troofers internal monologue....it goes like this:

WTC7 was not hit and was man detonated, BOOSH detonated the buildings faked the attacks to avenge his pa and steal oil and cause war endless war.....

yeah?

Really?

Okay you guys got Mocha Je$u$ in there who is unarguably the most Islam friendly PotUS thus far and he did not expose the criminal acts of BOOOOSH to calm American fears at Radical Islam and expose the real enemy?


Gun/Gangwalker and Fast&Furious make moderates sick to the point they refuse to look....

but your guy Vanta Claus Jones funneling half billion shits into Potemkin Solar Shops with Barry knowing?

yeah good luck explaining that away to the unemployed.

388 The Hammer of Sigmar couldn't drive a clue into Dum Dum's head.

389 381, donkeymouth, The vile, disgusting comments that are thrown at anyone who disagrees about even the slightest issue doesn't seem like a good thing for politicians to associate with.

I'll talk to you.  Now calm down.  Has you're Mom kicked you out? Or are you still living in the basement?  Everything's gonna be OK.  We are all friends here.

390
I didn't say there was no hate on liberal blogs...but its much much less, and the fact that you have to point to 2 very specific events to show it proves my point.

Specific events reveal true character. 

You are a delusional ass.   No, really...you are.  You can't see it because, well...you're delusional.

Gotta run....

391 371 Also, just random look at the comment section of 10 threads on a conservative blog vs 10 threads on a liberal blog...the difference is substantial.
Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:44 PM (NadeK)

The defining characteristic of leftist sites, as far as I can see, is that each commenter feels obligated to include an obscure quote as their tag line and the more obscure the quote, the deeper a thinker they believe they are. Would you please share your "deep thought" with us?

392 387 Dum-Dum,

Why is it you believe you are entitled to squat where you have been asked to depart?

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 05:47 PM (nj1bB)

Haha, watch that being the actual comment he responds to being dum dum because ace made it.  Every other comment made about him being dum dum he ignores hoping that by not addressing it no one will figure out that it is him.

393

Posted by: Methos at September 10, 2011 05:45 PM (sOXQX)

I think I'm already a subscriber to your newsletter.

394

336My point was to alert you of your blind spots, and stop ignoring contrary voices simply because they are contrary.

 

so, Jamie Radtke is contrary?    *ducks, runs for cover *, though, really would like to hear your opinion

 

395 The idiot who posts on the Whitehouse Facebook page just told everyone we should never forget 9/11/2011!

396

That's exactly what I was thinking! Get out of my head man, there's not enough room for both of us there!

Posted by: ParanoidStillAGirlInSeattle at September 10, 2011 05:48 PM (RZ8pf)

ok, I'll just head on down to your chest if that's alright with you...

397 Ace, read the comments in this thread and you should find your answer on why conservative pols don't court conservative blogs. The vile, disgusting comments that are thrown at anyone who disagrees about even the slightest issue doesn't seem like a good thing for politicians to associate with.

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:46 PM (NadeK)

The fact that you are still here proves the difference between liberal and conservative blogs.   How long does someone with a conservative viewpoint last at a blog like KOS?

398 I have none? The comments on this very thread is all the proof I need.

You fucking imbecile, you made a comparison that, in general, there is more "hate" on conservative sites than liberal ones, and you're going to use ONE thread to make that point?

Really, do you even understand the first fucking thing you type? You're so impossibly dense.

399

Posted by: lauren at September 10, 2011 05:50 PM (9cRmS)

Get a printscreen!

400 brb, gotta publish the next newsletter for the Happy To Be Losers brigade

401

ok, I'll just head on down to your chest if that's alright with you...

Sure, there's plenty of room there. Nicely padded too.

402

Dum-dum, bless his tiny black heart, may actually have a point, though his contention that left-wingers are nicer than rightwingers is pretty laughable. The comment sections of all blogs tend to be pretty aggressive and uncivil, and that might dampen some enthusiasm for them among establishment politicians on the right. Isn't it interesting, though, that folks on the left don't seem to have so much of a problem linking themselves to people like Kos and the folks at DU?

403 374
Get back in the barrel, your shift isn't over.
Posted by: chemjeff at September 10, 2011 05:45 PM (s7mIC)

And it's chemjeff FTW!

404

The idiot who posts on the Whitehouse Facebook page just told everyone we should never forget 9/11/2011

OK, paranoid me hoping that it was a typo and not foreshadowing there.

405 366 Lots of folks have asked for a righty on MSNBC: Joe Scarborough. They give him how many hours every morning? I know, "he's not really a right winger!!" That's how liberals (me included) feel about the lefties on FOX. And Colmes, ugh, don't even get me started...where did they even find him?

Beckel's a decent guy but far lefty? Come on.

And Doug Schoen and Pat Caddell, the "Democratic pollsters" who haven't run a Dem campaign in 30 years...having "Democrats" on is not the same as having sharp liberals on.

Posted by: A Liberal AoS Reader, Really! at September 10, 2011 05:42 PM (HmzSN)

There is some merit to this line of argument, but the far-rights on FOX are less far-right than the far-lefts on MSNBC's lineup, and the FOX mainliners are more liberal than MSNBC's anchors are conservative. 

I don't see many people here arguing FOX is a centrist outlet.  We all know it leans right, so yes, they have liberals who inadequately represent purist lefty thought nowadays.  But that is to be expected.  A lot of people on FOX are squishy.

406 378 Methos,

end the "miracle of baseline budgeting" where not adding a dime to the budget is a 7% cut, eliminate ANY Federal agency that overlaps the portfolio of state agencies, freeze colas on Federal pensions, social security, and foodstamps, quit the theft of the Child tax Credit and earned income credit, and raise the tax rate to a minimum of 15% starting at dollar one and we can work out of this....

15 trillion dollars is 50,000 apiece real entitlement reform has to happen and we need to get back to work using our resources and labor pool but this is not a magically DOOMED thing and sooner or later my solutions will happen...

you can decide if the math forces them to or if we choose to and tap the breaks instead of hit the wall.

407 Why do you guys increase your blood pressure by responding to dum-dum? I am offering you sound medical advice: Your lives will be happier and healthier if you do not engage cloying social-outcast imbeciles like dum-dum. If you want to engage a liberal, why not the "A Liberal AoS Reader, Really!"? Why interact with such a dullard?

408 401 Lauren,

he just misread the schedule for the reichstag fire

409

I could go on and on with examples of love, kindness and compassion that people here have shown toward others.

You only see what you want to see, what fits your narrative.

Posted by: ParanoidStillAGirlInSeattle at September 10, 2011 05:39 PM (RZ8pf)

Don't forget freindly, unthreatening stalking.

410

Shit, and I thought they were just the annoying bake sale people. So many violent Christian sects to keep an eye on.

Posted by: sifty at September 10, 2011 05:42 PM (4CSeG)

I know that's sarc but I seriously cannot maintain a relationship with a church that essentially advocates for the suicide of Israel.

I've explained my position with my pastor and she is fine with it, no hate, and I am done. I can worship the Lord by myself, thank you very much.

411

414 Why do you guys increase your blood pressure by responding to dum-dum?

Because he is wrong on the internet!

412 Why interact with such a dullard?

Less legal expense than punching a hippy in person.

413 Your lives will be happier and healthier if you do not engage cloying social-outcast imbeciles like dum-dum.

Yep.  A simple STFU, dunce would suffice.

414 384 379

the fish doesn't know it's wet...

This would make a great secret phrase that spies use to identify each other!

Posted by: ParanoidStillAGirlInSeattle at September 10, 2011 05:45 PM (RZ8pf)

The response phrase should be "but the bird knows its flying."

Posted by: buzzion at September 10, 2011 05:47 PM (GULKT)

You spies commenters are very, very sneaky clever.

415 I've been reading the AceOS for quite some time, and only just recently have begun posting. This is by far my favorite site. The comments are the BEST. Wit, humor, and political introspection. You make me laugh - which often times is tough- in this pitifull political scenario we are living.

416 If you want to engage a liberal, why not the "A Liberal AoS Reader, Really!"? Why interact with such a dullard?

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 05:54 PM (nj1bB)

Good words for us, Ace.  I must have missed the palin steele threads in my lurking time, so I wasn't sure if he was trolling or not.  Liberal AoS Reader is clearly a good-faith poster.

The funny thing is I seem to recall someone with the SN Palin Steele posting at Swampland...

417 I've explained my position with my pastor and she is fine with it, no hate, and I am done. I can worship the Lord by myself, thank you very much.

Yeah. I can't find a good church I can get into here in Burbank either.
Lots of whackaloons here.


We'll start looking again when we get to Idaho.

418 Further, the entire rest of the show is him interviewing liberal reporters like Finemann and that annoying black guy (Clarence Page?).

Ace, you're thinking of Eugene Robinson.  They guy that sounds like a dang muppet?

To be fair, Page has this annoying thing he does with his eyes when he speaks.  They widen 3 times their normal size.  It's odd...

419

This place sucks.  I hate you all.

Pass My Bill.

420 Screenshot of the White House idiocy.

421 And on liberal sites, its often much more comments geared towards helping each other.

HAHAHAHAHAHA

Here is a comment from one of your "Helpful" commenters at Daily Kos after the attempted assassination on Cheney in 2007:

So I, and therefore "we", do not 100% unequivocally condemn the assassination attempt. And I will not be inimidated into silence by you, the Taliban, or the right wing here in America. I will not rally behind Cheney because others are targeting him. I believe that Mr. Cheney is a usurper, a war criminal, a thief on a truly massive scale, and directly and indirectly responsible for hundreds of thousands of deaths and injuries. As such, I believe he should be tried for treason, and if found guilty, hanged on the Washington Mall at sunrise one really pretty spring day.

422 428 CJ,


but he's EVIL so it is all okay CJ....

//moonbat mode ON

423 >>> And on liberal sites, its often much more comments geared towards helping each other. This is Dum-Dum all over. This cloying, childish attention-seeking. Dum-Dum seems to be a 15-year-old. And also, a girl. Bear that in mind.

424

What people have to keep in mind also is that the blogosphere is far more is far more libertarian especially on cultural matters than is the Republican party even the establishment. The whole frat boy T and A act is cute and funny but it would be embarrassing for any politician to have to defend. Additionally, the strongest economic conservatives are also social conservative so it makes them uncomfortable to see how blase people like Ace and AP are about issues like gay marriage. 

Ask yourself are Ace and AP anymore soliticitous of the opinions of Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell (dated I know but the point stands) than the Republicans are of the blogosphere. Everyone can rail against the insider status of the Corner all they want but at the end of the day the Lopez lady and Ponnuru are the most outspoken supporters of the pro-life movement I can think of. Same with Maggie Gallagher on gay marriage. The left likes their blogs because they are always there for them on every issue; Mickey Kaus probally doesn't get to play much golf with the president . If Kos had views like William Jennings Bryan then Obama wouldn't really care what he had to say either. 

425 Trying to point out and link every example of liberal stupidity is like trying to point out the individual grains of sand on a beach.

Play the odds, assume they are crazy.

426 365 So why is the racist miscarriage-joking despicable banned twice and never rebanned again palin steele (proudonkey) not banned again already?

Posted by: buzzion at September 10, 2011 05:42 PM (GULKT)

--Search me.  He and Greg get cut waaaay too much slack, while normal commenters like me, nickless and GGE stay banned for weeks on end.

427 >>>If there were a blog with an interlocking comment hub, that had political news broken down by region with footsoldier reporters keeping an eye on events coordinated through a clearing house, with poster driven editorial coordinated essays and analysis it would be a force. It would be better than what HuffPo does for whoever and whatever the hell HuffPo does. I had forgotten how much of Ohio political backstory I knew...... Kind of the USAToday model, national paper but with regional inserts. But this would require an organization and a level of professionalism, including, especially, back-office invisible professionalism (the professionalism you tend to only notice when it's absent, like on this site) and paid staff.

428 They backed down from that, but I have often thought the blogosphere is a kind of Distant Early Warning system for these dopes, if they would just USE it.

Posted by: ace

 

I worked as one of the volunteers for the Allen West campaign even though it was out of my district as my father knew him personally.  I talked to the the super cute chica who was handling media exposure and gave her a list of blog sites including yours.  A bell rang loud and clear at the mention of Ace of Spades.  Your well known, you have some clout, reach out, push for a little more.

Do you actually ask for direct interviews with individuals such as West and Rubio?  If not, why not????

429

Don't forget freindly, unthreatening stalking.

Yeah, about that, I was sad to discover the prowler in my backyard last night wasn't you. Never ran so fast in my life. The dog cleared both steps in one leap and we made it in the house before the guy could react. Police responded but couldn't find him as he'd jumped the fence and run off through the neighbor's yard.

430

 a usurper, a war criminal, a thief on a truly massive scale, and directly and indirectly responsible for hundreds of thousands of deaths and injuries.

 

The sad thing is these people have degrees and believe themselves to be well learned.

431 >>>Ask yourself are Ace and AP anymore soliticitous of the opinions of Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell (dated I know but the point stands) than the Republicans are of the blogosphere. But we're not the only ones in the blogosphere, are we? What of the Anchoress?

432 434 Ace,

not to be repetitive...

you read me perfectly, and that is why if the price is bearable.....


you know the rest

433 frat boy

Since when did this become the IN phrase/insult?

This phrase means nothing to most people, yet people keep writing it.

434 I'm tired of all the purity-pushers. I'm so sick of seeing people like Allahpundit, who is - in most or all important ways - completely on my side, get endlessly bashed for being a RINO. Whatever the definition of *that* is this week. I'm tired of worrying that we will snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, and end up destroying the country, because of some little disagreement over a fringe corner of policy. There are several people running for the Republican nomination who would make fine Presidents and make the right decisions on things that matter.

435

That's exactly what I was thinking! Get out of my head man, there's not enough room for both of us there!

Posted by: ParanoidStillAGirlInSeattle at September 10, 2011 05:48 PM (RZ8pf)

ok, I'll just head on down to your chest if that's alright with you...

Posted by: buzzion at September 10, 2011 05:50 PM (GULKT)

who said there is no love and holding things dearly on this site?

436 438 Ace,

we're a different channel than Dr. Falwell, I don't choose to hang with him, I may not like his mix of our agendas parts, but I can be an ally with him without us having to have tea....

I think it is a false choice

437 But this would require an organization and a level of professionalism, including, especially, back-office invisible professionalism (the professionalism you tend to only notice when it's absent, like on this site) and paid staff.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 06:05 PM (nj1bB)

I don't think so ace, I think there must be programs for that. all you would have to do it seems is line up some bloggers by state and then the program would pop up the ad for your region. It happens on your site already with some of your ads.

Like woman in Kirkland, WA making 3 million a day working at home.

438 so what if I told you guys I actually have the right answer, but I am afraid of saying it?

439 We'll start looking again when we get to Idaho.

Posted by: sifty at September 10, 2011 05:59 PM (4CSeG)

Best of luck! In my experience, the non-denoms are a bit friendlier if you're a hardcore conservative.

If you just want to have a rip roaring time, visit a Pentacostal church!

440 >>>A lot of the reason many of us aren't listening to what we perceive as excuses from the establishment is sheer panic at the circumstances facing us. My view (or let us say -- my hope) is that this is our Last Plausible Chance. So while I appreciate the dire scenarios you're laying down, I think (or hope) we have one last chance to put this right in the next cycle or two (1-3 years). If we don't, it all falls apart. If you're right, and we've past the point of no return, then none of this matters anyway.

441 Police responded but couldn't find him as he'd jumped the fence and run off through the neighbor's yard.

Posted by: ParanoidStillAGirlInSeattle at September 10, 2011 06:06 PM (RZ8pf)

I've used the route before, it's a bitch the older I get.

442 >>> I've been reading the AceOS for quite some time, and only just recently have begun posting. Welcome!

443 441 Tennyson,

AP is on "our side" on maybe 45%-65% of issues, the price we pay for this is a constant preening that it is ONLY the AP wing that can save the GOP(and by extension America).....

the disdain cuts both ways....

trust me AP throws his elbows they just knock posters off his site.

Hot Air has evolved past the point of rhetoric that got me banned back in '09 and I pushed the envelope on purpose....

every movement needs a head and a tail, they are the "tail" as regards passion....

perhaps had the Hot Air wing of voters not tried to reign in our side and plead to "give the man a chance" we would not have had to have had Pelosi swing Whore's Hammer and give us barrycare.

444

 a usurper, a war criminal, a thief on a truly massive scale, and directly and indirectly responsible for hundreds of thousands of deaths and injuries.

 

The sad thing is these people have degrees and believe themselves to be well learned.

Posted by: garrett at September 10, 2011 06:06 PM (5Qbkf)

see I don't agree they Think they are well learned.

I believe they are just liars, they will say anything to get their readers and fellow travelers to the Right place.

why? because Obama ?is killing and murdering ? and they say nothing at all now.... collectively.

445 I do admit getting uncomfortable with some of the crap that gets thrown around in the comments at times.

I talked with one guy at Hot Air who seemed to believe that laws codifying God into our legal system weren't a violation of the 1st Amendment. 

progressoverpeace was hard to miss too.  Referring to Obama as "the traitorous Indonesian" is a bit much.  But I guess he eventually wore out his one-note song here.

446 I beg to differ with the numbskull's assertion that by participating in a service project this morning, I was honoring those who lost their lives in the attacks ten years ago. I will honor them tomorrow at a religious service and later a screening of a film about 9/11.

Don't presume to tell me what are my motives or aspirations, you arrogant WH twits ...

447 end the "miracle of baseline budgeting" where not adding a dime to the budget is a 7% cut, eliminate ANY Federal agency that overlaps the portfolio of state agencies, freeze colas on Federal pensions, social security, and foodstamps, quit the theft of the Child tax Credit and earned income credit, and raise the tax rate to a minimum of 15% starting at dollar one and we can work out of this....

sven10077 (@413), I might just have to quote your newsletter in my newsletter.

It's not that I think in the universe of decisions that can be made there are no possibilities left to keep the dollar in general use and therefore this country intact. It's just that ace is making the case that we have to limit ourselves to "what do GOP establishment critters think the mythical persuadable moderate voters will let them get away with," in which case there are no solutions.

The bottom line is the folks who switch from one party to the other from one election to the next don't do it because any of us were genius enough to persuade them (though that works for individuals in the long term-you can't stay a liberal when you understand mechanically how it must fail every time), they flip because they feel crappy about the way things are going and voting differently is the easiest thing they can change.

There are either enough people willing to walk away from captain Historic or there aren't. We have to make sure that a salvage option is available when they go to the table to pick something, or none of this is going to matter in the slightest.

448 >>>I don't think so ace, I think there must be programs for that. What? I'm talking about human intelligence culling the wheat from the chaff. A "program" can find keywords -- so what? What good is that? The only purpose of any news-aggregator is to at least do a first pass distinguishing between the stuff the reader cares about and doesn't; a "program" wouldn't do that. No, what I am talking about would require regional editors and so forth, each with a different blogosphere beat and different blogs he's keeping an eye on, to promote the most important and catchiest stuff and so on.

449 438 >>>Ask yourself are Ace and AP anymore soliticitous of the opinions of Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell (dated I know but the point stands) than the Republicans are of the blogosphere. But we're not the only ones in the blogosphere, are we? What of the Anchoress? Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 06:07 PM (nj1bB) Whoa, man. Get a grip. Do you fear residual association? I can't stand either one of them. And, who is the Anchoress? I'm lost.

450 Referring to Obama as "the traitorous Indonesian" is a bit much.

We saw his BC. Now we call him a traitorous American. And a SCOAMF.

451 >>The whole frat boy T and A act is cute and funny but it would be embarrassing for any politician to have to defend. You must have missed the Clinton presidency. But I do agree with some of your point. Once your guy wins, you are the establishment and your message machine usually mimics your message. Perry did court some of the rightoshpere when he announced and still does. He is the favorite of the Tea Party and conservative bloggers and he gets good support here and places like here. Obama did the same thing with much of the leftoshphere. Not all, Hillary's people most notably. If Perry wins, the same will happen on this side. Places like this will gain in prominence and places that are more "squishy" like NRO will take a step back. Then new bloggers will come up and accuse this place and places like it of being the establishment. Hobo hunting may go mainstream.

452 Food for thought: I know many people/friends who will only watch MSNBC, go figure. This gave them a chance to hear new and good thoughts and ideas that they are never exposed too in there closed world.

453 Ace does not have rules for how many pieces of flair we should wear.

I respect that.

The guys just have to get shirts.

454

319 ace, are you serious? you seriously don't get why conservative candidates don't court conservative blogs...whereas liberal candidates court liberal blogs?

TAKE A LOOK AT THE CONTENTS AND COMMENTS on a conservative site (aceofspades, hotair, malkin) vs a liberal site (dailykos).

There is a complete difference of culture. On conservative sites, the comments section is filled with bashing, hate, etc. And on liberal sites, its often much more comments geared towards helping each other. Sure, there is bashing on liberal sites too, but on the whole, it is MUCH MUCH less than conservative sites. I don't think conservatives want to be associated with sites where Michelle Obama is constantly referred to as Moochelle, or obama is called a SCOAMF.

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 05:31 PM (NadeK)

 

Donkey:

Aren't you bothered that the claims you post are publicly known to be untrue?

A study in 2007 (IIRC) compared the language used at several sites; Kos was very much worse than Ace. There's no indicationthat things have gotten better.

Kos: A site known for letting all kinds of whackadoodles post all kinds of, well, extremist crap, then disappearing the most egregious of it, and hoping than on one got a screenshot.

Michelle Obama: When finally publicized, her (Princton? Harvard?) thesis turned out to be bordeline high-school-graduate-level bullshit ... who lectures the nation about eating healthy while ... how big are her thighs now? ... who did such spectacular work at her last, mission-critical job, she received a 192% payraise (and yet no one has filled this mission-critical job in 2.5 years) ... who had, but no longer has, a law license (why?) ...

Seriously, you seem to be basically an honorable guy ... are you not bothered by the obvious untruths conained in your posts?

455 Hot Air has evolved past the point of rhetoric that got me banned back in '09 and I pushed the envelope on purpose....

every movement needs a head and a tail, they are the "tail" as regards passion....

perhaps had the Hot Air wing of voters not tried to reign in our side and plead to "give the man a chance" we would not have had to have had Pelosi swing Whore's Hammer and give us barrycare.

Posted by: sven10077 at September 10, 2011 06:12 PM (AEIYh)

I remember you posting there and I read the thread where you were banned, but I can't really remember what was said. 

I think it's a little unfair to characterize Hot Air posters by and large like Allahpundit.  A good lot of them only come for Ed and Tina, and whenever I read a socon thread there I can count on the majority of the posts being thoughtless stereotypes of conservatism.

456 Ace, I visit this site because I enjoy it. I like the bloggers, including you, and the wit you guys have. And the commenters here are also very funny and witty...far more so than the liberal blogs I've visited. But I will limit my posts to a minimum if you ask it, or even stop completely if you tell me so.

457 >>>Do you actually ask for direct interviews with individuals such as West and Rubio? If not, why not???? Actually, no, and I wouldn't. Politicians are too controlled in what they say. I don't find it interesting. Who I'd like to talk to, off-the-record, is the back-office people. Some things mystify me -- why are we not pushing an ObamaCare repeal bill every day? Now, if I could talk off the record to the strategy people, either they could convince me that this would be counterproductive or maybe I could convince them it would be productive. Either way I could stop slagging the GOP for not doing this. Either I would understand their reasoning, or they would accept mine. Okay, well, the third possibility is that I would hear their reasons and reject them, in which case it's status quo ante. But in a lot of cases there might be a useful exchange.

458 454 Methos,

I am being very serious by the way in the ford thread about "Rally Point" not to be DOOM courting or some kind of nut.

Every one of us needs to face the fact that if your default happens it means this is not the "chosen by the Mistress of Liberty to hold her gaze" spot on Earth anymore because the people gave it away for an attempt at a risk free freedom.

I am doing serious soul searching about how far my loyalty goes to a nation that I may never have left but may seriously have left me.

I love this nation, but I love economic freedom as mych as the fact I was born south of Canada and north of Mexico.....

the illegal immigrants may have the right idea just in the wrong direction.

459 I'm so sick of seeing people like Allahpundit, who is - in most or all important ways - completely on my side, get endlessly bashed for being a RINO.

That's candyass RINO, to you, Tennyson

460 He's banned you twice dumbass.  That's an idication to stop completely.

461 We saw his BC. Now we call him a traitorous American. And a SCOAMF.

Posted by: sifty at September 10, 2011 06:15 PM (4CSeG)

I know I'm being a stick in the mud, but screw it.  Traitor does not describe Obama in the serious definition of the word.

462 No, what I am talking about would require regional editors and so forth, each with a different blogosphere beat and different blogs he's keeping an eye on, to promote the most important and catchiest stuff and so on.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 06:15 PM (nj1bB)

Yeah well baby steps. You and I are still talking about two different things.

What I am talking about is picking in advance an influential local/state blog. You could have the morons give you suggestions. Then having a program like for me for example would bring up the blurb for say Sound Politics when I sign on to your site and the same for people from other areas. The local blogs could reciprocate with one of your headlines on their blog.

 

463 460 Ace does not have rules for how many pieces of flair we should wear.
I respect that.
The guys just have to get shirts.
Posted by: sifty at September 10, 2011 06:17 PM (4CSeG)

But not pants ("and that has made all the difference")!

464

--Search me.  He and Greg get cut waaaay too much slack, while normal commenters like me, nickless and GGE stay banned for weeks on end.

Posted by: logprof at September 10, 2011 06:05 PM (lh7Yc)

Hey, McFly!  I thought I told you to never come in here.

465 I'm tired of all the purity-pushers. I'm so sick of seeing people like Allahpundit, who is - in most or all important ways - completely on my side, get endlessly bashed for being a RINO.

Same.  Allahpundit is a good blogger (better than his coworkers), and he does troll his posters, but not maliciously.  A lot of people really do hate his guts, which is sad.

466 Food for thought: I know many people/friends who will only watch MSNBC, go figure. This gave them a chance to hear new and good thoughts and ideas that they are never exposed too in there closed world.

Posted by: jim at September 10, 2011 06:16 PM (JhPmv)

This must be the Jim y'all were talking about. I've been away for awhile.

467

Police responded but couldn't find him as he'd jumped the fence and run off through the neighbor's yard.

Posted by: ParanoidStillAGirlInSeattle at September 10, 2011 06:06 PM (RZ8pf)

 

 

 

On a serious note though that sounds serious. I hope you get it figured out and buy a gun.

468 >>> You could have the morons give you suggestions. This does not work. I can't cover 50 states, even with moron sugestions. Every single tip would need to be read and considered if I'm exercising any kind of wheat/chaff discrimination at all, and then how do I devote my standard 3.5 hours of work per day to blogging? Any model would have to be like ten main bloggers/editors, each having responsibility for 5 states or so.

469 or even stop completely if you tell me so.

The word BANNED is unknown to you, dunce?

470 Ace, You do a great job, a tremendous job; you sift through the shit thrown, and come to intelligent, brainstorming conclusions. It is simply amazing. Truly, amazing. Then....you start to question your own no-nonsense, first reactions (which are 98% prolly pretty accurate). But then, you sift through the shit one more time and become almost petrified. That's where the trouble begins.

471

That is very true, but the Anchoress doesn't seem that concerned with whether or not she has influence over the Republican party. Her "establishment" is in Rome. I don't mean to lump you with AP you are far more conservative.. But you asked a question and I am trying to think it through. For whatever reason the most popular sites on the right do seem to be those attached to the "alt" conservative print media and sites like yours that are at best skepitcal of traditionalist values. For this reason there is a real disconnect between the conservative grass roots who are largely affliated with the religious right and its web roots. That simply does not exist on the left side. I mean Mickey Kaus writes for the Daily Caller. This presents conservative politicians with a quandry that the left doesn't face. Bob Turner should be extremely grateful for you and Breitbart, but I don't see what Jim Demint could gain from each other.

Beyond that we on the right simply have to accept that since the cultural Long March Michel's iron rule of oligarchies has been reversed and any conservative politician is going to find it difficult to resist that current. Which is why from my perspective it just makes sense for even economic libertarians to make common cause with the religious right because Jim Demint wont get invited to cocktail parites no matter what he does.

472 I've never understood how the banning works. How do you even tell if you're banned? Does a message pop up?
Confuzzled.

473
Any model would have to be like ten main bloggers/editors, each having responsibility for 5 states or so.

Make sure to cover all 57 states.

474

Any model would have to be like...

Girls of the IDF.  

These will get you the hits you seek.

475 450 sven10077: "AP is on "our side" on maybe 45%-65% of issues..." - well I'm sure everyone's % differs but - are the issues you agree with the big, important political ones? Or your personal ones, whatever those might be? My perfect candidate has never run for office. So what? If we get the big stuff worked out (and right now that's The Economy) we'll have the luxury of sweating the smaller stuff. So I just can't focus on our differences now. And I have to say I agree with Ace that amateurs like me can learn a lot from seasoned political pros. I intend to, anyway, because I don't thing we can afford many mistakes at this point.

476 461 Yoshi,

it's complicated and I don't want to rehash it in full....

basically I started/helped start a few mems that AP and ED as well as Michelle were nervous about because self-admittedly they did push the edge of "decorum on race and civility"....

I referred to Barry as Mocha Je$u$ and his wife as Worf, Patricia Ewing, and a slew of others....

LGF sent Kilgore trout to Hot Air to N bomb the place repeatedly and several of us were enraged and called him on it....Media Matters because of their long term relationship w/Chuck just moved LGF to the "leftosphere" called out their whole community and "warned" us with no word on what the bounds were.

I felt they had in fact given Chuck the heckler's veto, further considering the shit they allowed leftists to nail Palin with on their site I have deep ethical issues with their editorial bent.

Long story short I metaphorically played Russian Roulette 'til "I won" and came here where I had also been a lurker.

I follow the rules here for the most part it is not about rules it is about AP and Ed's blatant duplicity on "decorum"....if I am to treat barry and the wife as icons....I can be spared the Palin chillbilly needin' raped flames I've seen there or the posts calling Trig her mutant retard

477 Proudonkey,

I didn't say there was no hate on liberal blogs...but its much much less, and the fact that you have to point to 2 very specific events to show it proves my point.

Okay, name two very specific events on our side.  There's the 50 trillion comparisons of Bush to Hitler in the 2000s, "Rethuglicans," accusations of us stealing elections from the beginning (if you had graduated from high school prior to 2000, you're aware that the talk of Bush's Presidency as being illegitimate from the beginning easily matched Obama's)...

Of course, seeing as you just showed up here a month ago and often talk as if you just started listening to conservative commentary a month ago, I really don't see what grounds you have to argue over the difference in tone between conservative and liberal blogs.

On conservative blogs, virtually every thread is a thread bashing liberals or the president. On liberal sites (like dailykos), while there are alot of threads bashing conservatives, theres alot of other types of threads that arent negative at all.

Seeing as you only show up here on threads discussing the President (in particular, his academic credentials for some reason), of course that's all you're going to see.

BTW, I'll put myself in the minority here and say I don't think poudonkey = Dum Dum.

Sure, he equals him in spirit and he's cut from the same cloth as him, but he's clearly ignorant of things Dum Dum learned during his time here and he tries out arguments that Dum Dum learned a long time ago would be swatted down.

Of course, this is beside the point that we were actually having an interesting discussion here before Dum Dum 2 showed up (that's what trolls do; they get in the way of that).

Can we go back to that?

478 479 I've never understood how the banning works. How do you even tell if you're banned? Does a message pop up?
Confuzzled.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at September 10, 2011 06:25 PM (QcFbt)

--Yes, you do get a BANNED! message.

(first-hand experience)

479 482 Tennyson,

I never said "kick" him out of the party but understand if there were Zell Miller types left on the left they are potentially as useful an ally.

That is to a large degree what has died, when they lost the house in '94 the DNC went on a bloodbath against the last of the social dove/foreign hawk dems

480

Every single tip would need to be read and considered if I'm exercising any kind of wheat/chaff discrimination at all, and then how do I devote my standard 3.5 hours of work per day to blogging?

Heh. You do good work Ace.

481 How long does the banning last when it happens? How do you get unbanned? I'm guessing I've gotten near the line a few times with an occasional nuke mecca rant.

482 488 How long does the banning last when it happens? How do you get unbanned? I'm guessing I've gotten near the line a few times with an occasional nuke mecca rant.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at September 10, 2011 06:29 PM (QcFbt)

--You have to e-mail Ace directly . . . and wait.  I did get multiple assists from fellow Morons, though.

483 472 Yoshi,

I disagree, Ed has actually accomplished real world results.  He has notches on his GOP gunbelt.  AP has the world atheist Palin Bashing Snark Championship Belt instead.

AP can be funny, the humor doesn't outweigh the selfforum-trolling.

He is where he is, and I am here that is "co-existence".....

I bear him little grudge other than the potential ground him being harder sooner versus Jugears may have saved.

484 The only thing that I can contribute is that the GOP-the general, not the establishment GOP- is unaware of the total dissatisfaction that many dems have with the DNC.  Pelosi and Reid, et al, do not speak for them, and what the DNC did to Hilary in order to nominate Obama, cost the DNC a lot of voters.  Those dems are a lot more likely to line up with us, than with the establishment GOP or estab. dems.  The malaise and anger among many voters with the establishment is palpable.  That is why I think 2012 will be a major chance to elect a
Repub president, and also to throw out many of the useless people already in office.

485

This does not work. I can't cover 50 states, even with moron sugestions. Every single tip would need to be read and considered if I'm exercising any kind of wheat/chaff discrimination at all, and then how do I devote my standard 3.5 hours of work per day to blogging?

I still think we are talking about two different things. What I am talking about is one of their headlines shows up in a block of your ad space, not as a main story on your blog. like any ad you click on it and it takes you to their blog. They have the same thing on their blog with one of your headlines..

It isn't perfect but I forget about sound politics for example a lot and I am sure you have people who read here from seattle who have never heard of it and people who read there that have never heard of you.

just a thought.

486 Alt media?  That would be the Huffington Post, wouldn't it?

487 I'm guessing I've gotten near the line a few times with an occasional nuke mecca rant.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at September 10, 2011 06:29 PM (QcFbt)

What the fuck would be wrong with that?

488 I am doing serious soul searching about how far my loyalty goes to a nation that I may never have left but may seriously have left me.

I love this nation, but I love economic freedom as mych as the fact I was born south of Canada and north of Mexico.....

the illegal immigrants may have the right idea just in the wrong direction.

Posted by: sven10077 at September 10, 2011 06:19 PM (AEIYh)

That hurts to read, emotionally, not physically. I'm there. I want everything to be alright with the next election but the nation is at a point where slashing of spending and government departments has to take place and I don't think any politician has the stomach to do what's needed. And if the electorate were told what's supposed to happen, I think they'd choose the slow cooking Greece route.

The United States does nothing half-assed. Sadly, that includes putting in place a massive government structure all with punative powers for one bureaucrat to make your life miserable. Gibson Guitars is the perfect example of what I've been scared of the last few years.

489

(first-hand experience)

Posted by: logprof at September 10, 2011 06:27 PM (lh7Yc)

 

You were non grata for a long time. 

490 do we get dental?

491 Posted by: sven10077 at September 10, 2011 06:26 PM (AEIYh)

Ah, now it's all coming back to me.  That Klingon zeitgeist was pretty damn funny while it lasted.  But it's for the better it's gone now.  Lots of different inferences a reasonable person could take away.

I remember Kilgore Trout's kamikaze run too.  That was about as dirty as you can get in the blogosphere.  For what it's worth I agree with you good old Chuckles pretty much got what he wanted out of that exchange. 

Never saw posts that nasty about Palin on there, though.  I'll take your word for it.

492 Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 06:23 PM (nj1bB) Ok. Here's a tip, Steve Jobs is still living. Actually, I am not being a snipe, I realize the immense amount of "head-lines" that make the news, trying to be ahead of the game. I have no ill wishes for Steve Jobs. I wish him the best and am hoping he has, at least, a comfortable time. I have no time for the likes of Hollywood personnel that dominate Yahoo with their inane adventures, suctions, life-styles or opinions. And, they're always "off to the races" with anything Obama.

493 The United States does nothing half-assed. Sadly, that includes putting in place a massive government structure all with punative powers for one bureaucrat to make your life miserable. Gibson Guitars is the perfect example of what I've been scared of the last few years.

True, but if you were to pack up shop, honest question...where would you go?  As far as freedoms go, we are still the last, best hope on earth.

494

OMG...... Tammy Bruce is on Fox right now, and just called Rick Perry a "bully".

Can I shoot her? Please....I'd really enjoy it. Can I, huh?

495 >>>basically I started/helped start a few mems that AP and ED as well as Michelle were nervous about because self-admittedly they did push the edge of "decorum on race and civility"....

>>>I referred to Barry as Mocha Je$u$ and his wife as Worf, Patricia Ewing, and a slew of others....

See, this is nothing to be proud of.  Lots of people who aren't liberals or independent squishes -- who are fully 'on our side' in other words -- find this sort of racial 'humor' to be disturbing and alienating, to say nothing of tasteless and politically self-defeating.  Are you genuinely surprised it wasn't greeted with open arms?  Ace doesn't allow that sort of talk HERE either, as I'm sure you well know.

496 So while I appreciate the dire scenarios you're laying down, I think (or hope) we have one last chance to put this right in the next cycle or two (1-3 years).

Uffdah, behind in comments as usual. I hope you're right. And I hope such a chance is actually in the cards here. I'm on the Perry bandwagon at the moment (I'm not waiting for another candidate, just trying to be realistic about his imperfections), but I don't *know* he's got the plan to fix it. Some of what he's said is encouraging to me but runs afoul of the establishment wisdom about what's possible. And a lot of his record is based on being an American state that can attract other American businesses (particularly when states like mine and CA are committed to driving them out), there are limits to how much of that will work nationally (I mean you could decide to mover your factory in China back here based on our policies, unless the Chinese would rather keep the factory where it is).

And I've covered my deteriorating regard for Romney in the SS thread earlier in the week. Which leaves any of the others I think most of us don't think are really factors anymore.

And even if we have the time, and whoever gets the nomination is willing (even if I don't see it today), the composition of Congress has to be amenable to large, and let's not kid ourselves, scary reforms.

497 498 Yoshi,

they were usually posted at 245-330 in the morning on the dedicated Palin threads...

I don't NEED the worf resets to hurt them, we need to be taught they could be hurt.

Considering Worf is in fact a black male with a lobster head and "arms wonderful arms that are strong arms"...yadda yadda yadda...

but "okay"

like I said here if the newsies would put the LSD down and accept she ain't a fashion model it'd be "okay".....

My favorite thread there I remember was the open thread where we all went over mocking the newsies regaling us about her arms....


my personal fave was: "of a plumber"......

I denounce myself

498 True, but if you were to pack up shop, honest question...where would you go?  As far as freedoms go, we are still the last, best hope on earth.

Posted by: Yoshi, Aggrieved Victim of the White Man at September 10, 2011 06:39 PM (8Zpuz)

--Well, speaking from experience, Canada is good.  By no means perfect, but at least going in the right direction.  At least my house is worth more than it was four years ago.

499 502 jeff. B,

yeah pity those same folks weren't bothered by the attacks on palin as Chillbilly etc etc....

there is little racial in the "n" bomb sense of what I posted and frankly if the news has to remind me they are in fact black every third sentence at times, why can't I notice?

500 501 CMaJH,

the fix is in...the pundits and "stars" want Mitt.

since I am not a perry zealot I may have to ponder whether or not I back a person I am angry at just to reduce the bloodying of our pick....

Tammy is not exactly a huge force on moving the GOP needle however

501 I disagree, Ed has actually accomplished real world results.  He has notches on his GOP gunbelt.  AP has the world atheist Palin Bashing Snark Championship Belt instead.

Not sure what you mean.  Was that when he was at Captain's Quarters? 

As far as blogging goes, AP has had the greatest influence on Hot Air through Headlines and discussion.  His posts have a lot more analysis and linking going on.  Ed is frequently Captain Obvious.  Good guy, though, and quick to pick up on the stories.

502 502 Jeff B.,

you know I am pretty sure Ace and I know each other, and we have discussed the "lines" at length....

thanks for the briefing though sincerely

503 508 Yoshi,

yes it was, further his posts are usually while bland more in tune with rational conservative thought even if soft....

AP on the other hand sometimes reminds me of the kid growing up who liked Minneesooota Gophers just to not cheer for the Buckeyes or Wolverines...not knowing anything about their lineup just being "different"

504

Posted by: logprof at September 10, 2011 06:43 PM (lh7Yc)

It is. It's a good country. Aside from the human rights commissions and lack of property rights, I don't know why I get all negative on it. I think everytime I came back to Canada, I recognised it less and less.

Like sven said, it kind of left me behind.

But as someone very concerned about Islam, the human rights commissions were a huge thing for me.

Yoshi, I've chosen South Korea. It's very conservative and pro-American.

505 We've got this troubled, "Proud-Donkey"---we all try to picture him, just like we try with an oil painting of ACE! He comes up with some true (most of the time, FUBAR moments when he can't even stand himself)...then he goes cockeyed. A liberal, through the heart.

506 Not Ace, of course. The donkey.

507 >>>yeah pity those same folks weren't bothered by the attacks on palin as Chillbilly etc etc....

Yes, more's the pity.  But the point is you should leave the hypocrisy to them, not go and seize upon it yourself.  Not merely for pragmatic reasons (i.e. the simple fact that liberals are allowed by the media to get away those sorts of hypocrisies in a way that conservatives never are, and shooting oneself in the foot to 'prove a point' still leaves you with a gaping hole in your foot), but for ethical and logical ones as well.  The logical fallacy of tu quoque holds in this situation -- just because someone else does something wrong and gets away with it doesn't mean that it suddenly becomes justified.  It just means that you sacrifice the moral high ground if you engage in the same behavior.

Also, it's worth pointing out that, however offensive "chillbilly" comments about Palin are/were, that is a cultural and not a racial insult.  It is a simple reality in American society that cultural attacks, although distasteful (and arguably self-defeating), are simply permissible in a way that racial attacks are not.  You can say that this shouldn't be the case, that cultural snobbery and condescension is equally as vile, but when you turn to racialist snark about Obama you are in fact stating the opposite: you're saying that racial attacks are (or should be) acceptable too. And they're not.

508 500 Yoshi,

Canada is more economically free than us right now and it is ostensibly overt socialist, I think a critical mass of motivated free market workers would have a cultural impact on canada and they will need the manpower when they have their energy rush in the west.

India will be a super power and a lot of Asia is more free market than we are.  The correct South American nation may be a way to go but they don't really trust us.  EUrope *might* welcome us but only after the EU collapses and the welfare riots start.....

the US is teetering on the edge of "command economy" paradise through deliberate misuse of regulatory power and crony capitalism....

ask King Putt which company HE'D put half a bill in today....

then avoid it since it is made of soda crackers and bunting

509

--Well, speaking from experience, Canada is good.  By no means perfect, but at least going in the right direction.  At least my house is worth more than it was four years ago.

Posted by: logprof at September 10, 2011 06:43 PM (lh7Yc)

I don't think any Commonwealth country is worthy of trust.  Freedom of speech and religion is hardly guaranteed to them.  It's more like a political fad there.  You see evidence of it all the time.  Pastors prosecuted for "hate crimes" because they said negative things about homosexuality or Islam.  Or video games and other works of media being outright banned. 

I mean, it's nice that they seem to be trending conservative now, but until they take being an "open and tolerant" society seriously enough to enshrine social freedoms in their Constitution, I wouldn't want to move there.

510

>> I referred to Barry as Mocha Je$u$ and his wife as Worf, Patricia Ewing, and a slew of others....

I too aspire to be as asinine as the Chillbilly league.

 

Good job.

511 515 Yoshi,

you think freedom of speech will last here once we are getting our "energy ration" and "food subsidy" in the event of the donks getting the reward for their efforts and our economy imploding?

We already lack free speech in many ways anyway.

You disagree too forcefully you're called the most toxic word in our culture at the drop of a hat....

the President of the United States called a joint session for a campaign commercial and scolded my representative like a dog....

you'll have to show me where that is "decorum"...?

I plan to treat the donks like I am a mirror 'til it is time to go if need be

512

Yoshi, I've chosen South Korea. It's very conservative and pro-American.

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at September 10, 2011 06:48 PM (GKQDR)

Hmm, okay.  I honestly don't no much about there other than the quality of their broadband (2-3 times as fast as here) and their national sport (Starcraft). 

513 517 D-i-T,

it is not needed anymore they ARE the joke....

I was trying to punch the state allied media in the face for trying to convince me he was to be universally beloved....

he was at near 75% approval for a while....he's at 38% or so...

"I won" now

514 >>>I was trying to punch the state allied media in the face for trying to convince me he was to be universally beloved....

>>>he was at near 75% approval for a while....he's at 38% or so...

>>>"I won" now

Yes, I'm sure your racialist snark against Barack Obama was a prime cause of his drop in the polls. 

You're a veritable Army of One, aren't you?

515 You're a winner sven.  *pins the medal on you

516 >>>Yoshi, I've chosen South Korea. It's very conservative and pro-American.

And it also could well functionally cease to exist if North Korea ever goes truly apeshit with its nukes or missiles. 

517

If only you had called him a cunt back in 2009.

 

If. Only.

518 514 Jeff.,

I'd love to have you spend the next five posts inferring I am more racist than Robert Byrd, but I have a blender I'd rather screw.

ANY mocking of Barack and Michelle is by liberal estimation racism, I am past caring.  I use different tools, and it was phased out by me by choice.  Rules are only rules if they are evenly applied, defined, and enforced.

If Barack needs to remind me he is black I can remind him it is his white half I hate I guess....

if you think the leftoids' casual use of the "r" bomb was not racism....

we'll just leave it at that, I have more black coworkers than Keefe Olberdouche m'kay.....

regards,
sven

519

see I don't agree they Think they are well learned.

I believe they are just liars, they will say anything to get their readers and fellow travelers to the Right place.

why? because Obama ?is killing and murdering ? and they say nothing at all now.... collectively.

Posted by: willow at September 10, 2011 06:12 PM (h+qn

I always wonder how someone "intelligent" can just cook up a lie, and shove it out there with no sense of irony, remorse, or even self-dignity getting in the way.

It's one thing when people interpret things horribly wrongly, like basing a critique on those execrable, phony Lancet figures on Iraqi casualties from 2004.  It's another when people garble the message, as in the old game of "gossip."  But the things we see today, where claims of jobs created and other easy-to-verify data turn out to be wholesale fabrications, where the perpetrators are supposedly Ivy-League educated and beyond reproach--that calls into question some major flaws in society, and in the University mindset.

520 Dave- Go gentle. Give him space. I haven't seen a good self-beclowning in a while.

521 you think freedom of speech will last here once we are getting our "energy ration" and "food subsidy" in the event of the donks getting the reward for their efforts and our economy imploding?

We already lack free speech in many ways anyway.

Well, yes, I do think it will fare better than a Commonwealth nation.  It takes a lot to change the Constitution (i.e., a hell of a lot more political will than exists in both parties) and its language is a hardcap even for activist judges.  We don't tolerate a lot of the kind of garbage you'd see overseas.  For example, Australian and British channels being outright banned from covering the royal wedding. 

you'll have to show me where that is "decorum"...?

I plan to treat the donks like I am a mirror 'til it is time to go if need be

Jeff phrased this better than I could, but whatever.  We have thick skins.  We can handle it.  SCOAMF is a fine return salvo. 

The first thread I posted here I got savaged for attacking the yellowface character in Breakfast at Tiffany's, so yeah, that's where I stand.

522 It comes down to pride, I think. The established right, when it comes down to the media, are so eager to please, so desperate for any crumbs of good will; they have little dignity and pride when it comes to the media and the media knows it. They have given the media all the power. Whereas the established and pinko left look down on everyone and everything elseÑthey fell all over Obama because of the air of contempt he has for them and everyone elseÑand the more he and other lefty pols act liek they are above them, the more the media will compliment the crease of his pants or get tingles up their spine, or cover for him. Conversely, both the established right and media don't view the Tea Party and right blogopsheres as equal to them in either decorum or intellect, so any contempt the Tea Party/blogs shows of them gets thrown back tenfold. The solution? Show the media little to any respect back, and keep being accurate on the issues or phrasing them in a ways that even libs can wrap their feeble minds around. (Like when Andy Levy called out Chris Brown; I posted it in a dead thread here one day, but his snark at Chris blew up lefty bastions of social media like Tumblr; people were like OMG I hate Fox News but this guy rocks. We need more of that.) Change the conversation in the zeitgeist and be part of creating it, and the new right will eventually succeed. We're not there yet but we get closer every year.

523 521 jeff B,

nah I should have and most people should have just madly embraced his agenda and let him do whatever he wanted it was "only fair"....

look Jeff I get it you are race Cop....it's okay officer I only break the law and throw hurtful elbows at Captain Hamptons every fifth day....

and not even really then....

the need to be a flamethrower is inversely proportional to the late night hosts' ability to treat him with 1/5th the humor and spite they treated Bush....

I got them there a while back with a lot of help...

if you'd like to use your heckler's veto for posts made over 9 months and more ago here why don't you PM Ace?

Otherwise I promise I will go mediate sitting in the lotus position and bathe in your disgust at me.

"promise"

524

This does not work. I can't cover 50 states, even with moron sugestions. Every single tip would need to be read and considered if I'm exercising any kind of wheat/chaff discrimination at all, and then how do I devote my standard 3.5 hours of work per day to blogging?

Any model would have to be like ten main bloggers/editors, each having responsibility for 5 states or so.

 

you've already got a load of commenters here who are well qualified, and if they don't already have full time gigs elsewhere....you guys should talk, really. They're already a part of the moron/'ette nation, so they're versed on the rules, so to speak.   vic, sven,pgis,miss80s,methos...the list goes on and on...

525 524 Dave in texas,

pointing out he is a fucking retarded hermaphrodite would be racist and misogynist/masculinist?

anyway in summary f**k the SCoaMF any tool I have any power, wealth, and will I have is for dismantling his "deeds and good works"

526 I like Jeff B!

527 And it also could well functionally cease to exist if North Korea ever goes truly apeshit with its nukes or missiles. 

Posted by: Jeff B. at September 10, 2011 06:59 PM (hIWe1)

They wouldn't do that because there would be nothing to gain. That creeper is wierd as hell but they aren't going to drop nukes on us for just no reason. 

That stupid asshole is the bully on his own block and that's it.

We could wipe him out if the order was given.

528 533 I like Jeff B!

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 07:09 PM (NadeK)

With friends like these...

529 I sure as hell don't want to see AoSHQ turning into another "Townhall" type site.  I don't even follow links to that place anymore.  I don't care how "must read" the article may be.

Besides, for all their trouble managing a site like that (and add Pajamas Media, and a few others), you can still find most of what you need to keep up by perusing a few sites that don't have all that overhead, and you'll find it faster, and with fewer screwed-up pages.

530 533 GotBurro'd,

and so do I....go get your shine box....

my humor and rage at barack being attempted to be coronated Barry Soetoro I-the untouchable by the M$M has little to do with how I treat people in the real world, and if you are not careful and want to accuse me of racism, and pretnd you guys are the arbiters and guardians of racial goodness....

well I can always dig out the treatment of the candidate I was backing for Condi Rice and prior to him turning on the GOP Kos and friends shat on Powell with racial heat as well....

Jeff if you'd like keep at it....

I promise I won't use gags I put away for the better part of a year if you just keep it up

531

Posted by: ErikW at September 10, 2011 07:10 PM (zyCNx)

Yeah, I'm more worried about Iran than North Korea, especially after reading more South Korean newspapers.

And it's hard to take an enemy seriously when their country isn't visible from space at night because of a lack of electricity. And also when their people are starving.

532 536 K-bob,


it wouldn't....the popularity of this site is largely because of a nice synergy between the staff, chosen open bloggers and the commentariat....

I don't see that changing

533 (Like when Andy Levy called out Chris Brown; I posted it in a dead thread here one day, but his snark at Chris blew up lefty bastions of social media like Tumblr; people were like OMG I hate Fox News but this guy rocks. We need more of that.)

Taking the Levy approach requires a well-honed sense of humor.  Coincidentally enough, that's one program that didn't get installed in a lot of conservatives in broadcast media (or blogging for that matter).

534 538 SI,

the NORKs are a problem but a limited one and one that is waning, Iran on the other hand....

535 @537

I never called you a racist. Don't put words in my mouth please.

536 >>>ANY mocking of Barack and Michelle is by liberal estimation racism, I am past caring. But you also blithely ignore the fact that it's often racist, or racially edgy, by conservative estimation as well. I have a big problem when I say "This racial stuff is making me uncomfortable" and instead of an end to I get people knitting flags about their constitutional right to offend.

537 >>>we'll just leave it at that, I have more black coworkers than Keefe Olberdouche m'kay.....

I'll bet they're some of your best friends, too.

538 It has to be that they just don't trust us, and expect us to embarrass them.

Generic Republican Campaign Manager: We've got room on the press bus for one more.  Who should we take?
Generic Republican:  Let's get one of these "bloggers"
GRCM:  Which one?  The guy with the "Ivy League, I fucked em" t-shirt, or his friend with the "Nuke em All, let Allah sweep em up".
GR:  No, they're not wearing pants.
GRCM:  What about the one gnawing a hobos leg and swilling Valu-Rite.
GR:  Pass
GRCM:  The one in the Star Wars outfit likes you and seems to think he's in charge.
GR:  Yeah, like a non-consensual, same-sex, different species relationship would help my socon ratings.

539 529 LizLem,

nice post and a valid one....

politicians are like bad actors with the power of life and death....they are all exposure addicts....

they view the old media as still too important to not placate....


the funny thing is I suspect Zombie Reagan would be all over the blogosphere

540

And it's hard to take an enemy seriously when their country isn't visible from space at night because of a lack of electricity. And also when their people are starving.

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at September 10, 2011 07:14 PM (GKQDR)

I think we should mount a full scale invasion of North Korea in order to liberate them.

541 Instead of fighting in a country where no goddamned Muslim wants us.

542 Thanks Ace!

543 Follow the money. Once upon a time the state political parties together with local reporters/anchors handled these debates. Including network anchors as moderators brought free airtime and wider coverage. Now the national networks sponsor and control the debates so it shouldn't be any surprise how they work out.

544 I can't for the life of me, wrap my head around the persistent use of race in criticism of Obama. There is so much to criticize without even needing to go there (assuming you felt the need to begin with). It's self-defeating and only helps garner sympathy when he doesn't deserve any.

545 544 Jeff B,

some others are just people working towards their goals with synergy....am I under a requirement to be every minority's best friend now?....I'm also ex-infantry...racists don't tend to last long....

should I tell my sister in law that jeff thinks I am a secret Klansman because I mocked an ugly woman being sold as gorgreous by comapring her to the toughest character in star trek, or that I called barack Chicago and Mocha Je$u$ because he was treated as a me$$iah and had folk fainting at his speeches like Benny Hinn?

Well considering she laughed and then scolded me for the "daddy why won't you plug that damn hole" //Malia resets I think she knows.

look if you can't understand the notion of resentment at being exposed to a nice multi-year racial passion play where the "r" card is shield and sword after the 8 years of beatings we in the  took on our culture, character, and goals from his party I can't help you.


95% of my rage is at his policies and party....5% is at his using his race as sword and shield and not band-aid the minute he got into trouble on Jerry Wright.

That you care to judge me while bothersome is not a reason I aim to flame you.

You want to say I am more racist than Kos, Charles Johnson, and the libs who called one of my heroes "Aunt Jemimah Rice" please do....

like I said Jeff if you feel the need to use the heckler's veto for old old gags e-mail Ace, he'll either ban me or he won't....

he and I already had this chat and when the rules were clear I complied.....

I have yet to be as hateful as the average DU, Huff Po, Kos, or current LGF poster was to Bush Cheney Palin, or many others....

when you spend 11 years fending off pieces of shit at some point if you aren't careful you're covered in shit and spreading the same....

I have, for the most part backed off from playing that hard in the cesspools.

This explanation is either good enough for you or not.

Please do let me know.

546 551 Johnny,

I agree...

I also helped craft and spread Sir Golfsalot, King Putt, Obamacles, Dr. Manhattan II, Keynesian Kommisar and a slew of others....

are those "acceptable"?

I altered course by the way and decided to mock the media adulation for Michelle Antoinette by being even MORE effusive than they were.....

you ought to try

547 sven, when did Obama himself use the race card?

548 >>Please do let me know. Ok. Stop. You're point was made long ago. You're just trying to see how close to the line you can dance now and being a douche about it.

549 Those are perfectly acceptable because they speak to his failure of policies, behavior and leadership. Like I said, there's plenty there to lampoon. Race is pointless and ultimately has the opposite effect you seek. Same as calling his mother a prostitute or criticizing his kids, etc.

550

554   Donkey

Sundays, sitting the pews at TUCC ... there's a 20 Year attendance history.

... pick a Snday ... or 50 ...

551 >>>I also helped craft and spread Sir Golfsalot, King Putt, Obamacles, Dr. Manhattan II, Keynesian Kommisar and a slew of others....

I find your attempt to take credit for all these memes to be amusing, and more than little revealing.  It's like the blog version of Confessions of A Dangerous Mind.

552 543 Ace,

and I agreed with you, encouraged others to stop and never broke out the 1st amendment ELEVENTY!!!!!111!!!! crap...

your blog, your rules boss....

Look trust me I look back and I am not thrilled I grew up in our suburb's government assisted housing, at the time it was a mix of Vietnamese, Blacks, Hispanics, and whites....

I am not thrilled I was slinging the devil's candy even if a mild form.....

I mean that sincerely.

I was home this morning getting my tags renewed and went back to the place.  Luckily out of my peer group none of us are still there.  Most of us joined the armed forces together over the course of a year to get out.

At some point we all have to look hard at how low we go when our backs are against the wall.

I am not proud I went as far as I did, I can't undo it gave my reasons I did and am so far as I know forgiven by you and in good standing.  I am not going to plead for some arbitrary forgiveness for my incivility towards a man I hate every time it comes up.  I didn't post why I left or who i was to sneakily work it in, I was honest and not looking for forgiveness pity or absolution by the poster in question.

I think all of us together in concert and barack showing the content of his character has his feet of clay crumbling, to me that was always the goal I chose better tools after you expressed your concerns to your reasers like a man and made it stick.

regards,
sven

553 ^{I also helped craft and spread Sir Golfsalot, King Putt, Obamacles, Dr. Manhattan II, Keynesian Kommisar and a slew of others....}

This is hilarious

554 558 Jeff,

"helped spread"....who knows who crafts memes?

I also help spread SCoaMF which is absolutely not mine....

the digs at the guy are not exactly hard no matter what Letterman, and leno say....

I am pretty sure I am the only poster who has ever mixed Barack's pronunciations, and FDR's together in a mishmash of the Pearl harbor day, Healthcare, first SotU to Boehner as speaker speeches....

the ONT thought it was funny....

is that permitted or am I on restriction now?

555 554 sven, when did Obama himself use the race card?

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 07:31 PM (NadeK)

Before you try to engage in another line of discussion, why don't you take the time to fight the good fight you mysteriously abandoned re: vitriol upthread? 

Of course, that would require you to not be a troll.  On the other hand, if this is your idea of an honest exchange of ideas, you need to get more life experience.

556 556 Johnny,

yeah I also apologize for when I called his wife a drunk driving murderer, his daughter blonde ho's looking for a booty call, oh wait I never said that the self-appointed decorum cops were on the Bush case for those at DU and Kos....

like I said I rolled in way too much shit and quit judging the limits I should stop at...

557 Sven, I was speaking generally, not *at* you.

558 ^{Before you try to engage in another line of discussion}

I'm not trying to engage in another line of discussion. But if you accuse someone of using the race card, you should back it up when asked.

Also, I never tried to fight the 'good fight'. Ace asked a question, and I answered with my opinion. In my opinion, this is a fantastic blog, with some fantasticly witty bloggers and commenters. It is a place where conservatives can vent and enjoy humor & comaraderie at the same time, nothing less, nothing more. It is not a site that politicians will want to be associated with, and there's nothing wrong with that. My comment was never intended to tell Ace to change the site, it was just to explain in my view why he saw the disparity he saw in regards to establishment republicans and the conservative blogosphere.

559

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 07:44 PM (NadeK)

You've been banned twice troll.  Take the hint you claim you will understand that your comments are not wanted here.

560 562 Yoshi,

no, no history began on Jan, 21 or so 2009 Yoshi

in answer to ProudBurro Barack doesn't often have to and he nibbles at the edges...

my personal faves were "typical white woman" really barack?

how precisely ARE "white women"???

I mean I am certain i would not be lectured by Jeff or ProudBurro for "typical black woman" when discussing Michelle "finally proud of my country" Obama right??

He also did some really nice gymnastics on the campaign trail with his "well er uh he uh doesn't look the Presidents on dollar bills and has a funny name"....

yeah real subtle....

I worked for Bobby Jindal's campaign in Louisiana, and I am pretty sure bobby is not stunt doubling for Abe Lincoln tomorrow.....

the color in barack that makes me angry is not his melanin it is his economic bent....

hints of red

561

>> Go gentle. Give him space.  I haven't seen a good self-beclowning in a while.

I haven't seen a self-delusional ego bigger than my ass in a while either.

 

So I'm runnin with it.

562 the color in barack that makes me angry is not his melanin it is his economic bent....

sven, barack has actually extended tax cuts and even in his 'jobs' bill has proposed more tax cuts. his liberal base thinks he's a corporate hack because he's done virtually nothing to increase taxes so far. But you're entitled to your opinion.

563 564 Johnny,

thank you I appreciate it and I largely agree.

I am ashamed at how far I went and I saw and heard people go much further it is counterproductive as is said.

We have the better arguments, and we have the moral high ground anyway.

Anger at how unfairly treated our candidates were, and how easy the media was on him is justified and useless at this point.

Any time you have with a swayable person is best spent on 1 joke, 1 scandal, and listening to what they say.

I wasted a lot of energy in anger, Ace helped me reflect on that and i sincerely owe him the gratitude I try to show.

regards,
sven

564 I'm not trying to engage in another line of discussion. But if you accuse someone of using the race card, you should back it up when asked.

If you accuse conservative blog posters of being more malicious and hateful than liberals, as well as less regarding of their fellow man, you should back it up when asked.

Also, I never tried to fight the 'good fight'. Ace asked a question...

You threw out a bomb and ignored the more thoughtful responses.  Ace doesn't have time to debate you unless he really feels like it.  So if you really like the community here, why not start treating them with more respect i.e. not ignoring them when they respond to you seriously?

565 569 Proudburro,

against his will, further his "payroll cuts" are a bitter counterproductive to social security and medicare joke....

he is the worst of all worlds PB no joke.....he is not trying to do anything but keep his job.

The "payroll taxes" thing is hilarious it is like I the owner buy us a 4 person steak dinner for 345 bucks and you offer to tip at half the socially acceptable tip or five bucks and keep ordering drinks if you factor in his out of control EPA and the terror he put in investors in screwing over preferred share holders.

His words, and crony capitalism says he believes in the direct intervention on a micro level of federal largesse and that he should make all the major economic decisions not the people....

ask louisiana roughnecks how "big business" he is....

He should have spurred investment by reducing capital gains or giving a holiday to all but the top 20% of investors and eliminated the estate tax as in 2009 he had the power to do so....

all of his solutions are command economy ones...

he doesn't nationalize TOO many businesses...other than 2/3d of our domestic auto....

he just threatens or tries to DoJ them into extinction....

guitars and coal mines....

you never do answer how you justify solyndra????

566 ^{So if you really like the community here, why not start treating them with more respect i.e. not ignoring them when they respond to you seriously?}

If you noticed, I have responded to serious comments addressed to me. I've only ignored the namecalling crap, and if you noticed, I do not resort to such.

I'll tell you this, personal opinion: conservative blogs (ace and hotair) are funny as hell, the bashing of president is mixed with a lot of sharp and biting humor...which I enjoy. Liberal blogs are much 'nicer', people talk about being jobless, being sick, etc in addition to politics. That's the truth. I myself prefer to read blogs such as aceofspades because of the wit and entertainment value.

567 569 the color in barack that makes me angry is not his melanin it is his economic bent....

sven, barack has actually extended tax cuts and even in his 'jobs' bill has proposed more tax cuts. his liberal base thinks he's a corporate hack because he's done virtually nothing to increase taxes so far. But you're entitled to your opinion.

Posted by: proudonkey

 

Perhaps you have a link the the proposed text of BHO's "jobs" bill? How well have his previous "jobs" endeavors worked ... and what have they cost?

BHO has tripled the deficit, and wants another $500Billion ... where do we get the money ... ahhhhh, investments in green hi-tech startups ... like Solyndra?

568 555 jackStraw,

Jack I am not....

look I am ashamed...I didn't come in like maverick muse and go as nuts as I was at my worst and I won't go on....I was asked I should have ignored the HA stuff.

I am sorry.

569 No worries, Sven You've always been civil and cordial with me, so I've responded in kind.

570 ^{you never do answer how you justify solyndra????}

Honestly, I'm ignorant on the subject. If there were misdealings, they should be investigated and the wrongdoers should be penalized.

btw, I'm open to a conservative president, as long as they are competent. In many areas I lean conservative (anti-immigration, prodeath penalty, probusiness, antiunion). I used to be a romney fan, but I actually were one of the few who was impressed by Perry at the debate.

571 574 Cheetos,

don't hit him with facts he'll run away....

heh

Obama is on pace to beat Bush's 8 years in one term...together they added more deficit/debt IIRC than the 20th century unadjusted for inflation.

572

I do not resort to such.

Calling people racists and full of hate is insulting you banned idiotic troll.

You've been banned twice in the past before.  Take that as the hint that your comments are not wanted by ace.

573 577 PD,

given your postings here I don't believe you but "okay"...

why do you suppose you don't know the President of the United States had 50 meetings with a 1-150,000 donor that he just happened to loan 554-575 million dollars to at reduced interest?

574 If you noticed, I have responded to serious comments addressed to me. I've only ignored the namecalling crap, and if you noticed, I do not resort to such.

That's a load of garbage.  For the benefit of those who are not as myopic/dishonest as you, I found these posts using that handy sifting tool known as Firefox Finder...

You should have got around to reading these before you started off on this low hanging fruit of race cards and tax cuts.  I've read your posts in this thread.  You threw out a bomb and ran.

Posted by: Arbalest at September 10, 2011 06:17 PM (KLCXX)

Posted by: ParanoidStillAGirlInSeattle at September 10, 2011 05:39 PM (RZ8pf)

Posted by: chemjeff at September 10, 2011 06:01 PM (s7mIC)

575 581 Yoshi,

it is what they do, I am starting to doubt it is Palin-Steele but who knows?

It may be an axelbot....

at any rate if he thinks when the man who sits at 1600 Penn aveneue lecturing Bush about not running up the debt or adding to the debt ceiling kicking in the blower once he got the chair is "moderate" what can I say?

and isn't that really the point?

I mean the off color jokes that with effort can be interpreted as racist, the pure venom all the time.....

it doesn't sway many and the venom is not converting the swayable towards our views....

no Ace and even jeff b were right and I knew it....

sorry to belabor the point and in saying "helped craft or spread" as i recall some of our memes are group efforts and grabbing what sticks....

I am more proud if I were speaking anyway and you would hear it of 'spreading it"....

one of my coworkers I sent here who doesn't know I am "sven" used SCoaMF the other day in an IM to me.....

I always have felt the humor here was a collective effort....sorry if I seemed unseemly

576 I can't believe the stuttering clusterfuck of palin steele fail is still typing, and that any one is still addressing his bootless, weightless accusations no-nothing kid posts.

577 582 Thrive Foods e-pub,

and now I have bored even the spambots....

578 Our spam contributes more to the conversation that PS.

579 584 Toby928th,

yeah...sorry I was gone for a few months...and by GOLLY I am so ego driven everyone noticed

//sarc

no I wanted to let Ace know I had reflected on it and if I hadn't said it to him I agreed w/him I was near the line if not over it.

580

577 ......
Honestly, I'm ignorant on the subject. If there were misdealings, they should be investigated and the wrongdoers should be penalized.

Posted by: proudonkey

 

Breaking: FBI raids Solyndra

Over at HotAir: First Column .... 12th picture ... yeah, it's from 2 days ago.

... heh ...

 

 

581 579 Buzzion,

if he is legitimately a donk he is a fish who doesn't know the water is wet....

they think the "r" bomb is "hello"

582 588 Cheetos,

yeah it is not like it hasn't been a subject here and on the conservo blogosphere for about a week or that it involves Van Jones and his 30 billion slush fund he had as "Sunpaneling with the Tsars" king....

nah no idea?

It wasn't on MSNBC!

//ProudDonkey


US: No kidding! *imagine that*

583 I was very happy to search out this web-site.I needed to thanks to your time for this excellent read!! I definitely enjoying each little little bit of it and I have you bookmarked to check out new stuff you weblog post.

584 591 Willpower Audio Book,

hey do I have a client for YOU!

585 @590

sven, while I enjoy conservative blogs as this, I don't use it for my news. And in the news sources I frequent (nytimes) I have not come across solyndra yet...but then again I usually only look at the major frontpage headlines so prob missed it.

586 Posted by: sven10077 at September 10, 2011 08:09 PM (AEIYh)

Meh.  My vote's still out on donkey.  We'll see, I suppose.

As for the rest, yeah, I gotcha.  No harm done.

587 593 @590

sven, while I enjoy conservative blogs as this, I don't use it for my news. And in the news sources I frequent (nytimes) I have not come across solyndra yet...but then again I usually only look at the major frontpage headlines so prob missed it.

Posted by: proudonkey at September 10, 2011 08:18 PM (NadeK)

No wonder you are such a braindead retard without a clue to anything and think Obama is Captain America.

588 So, he holds three positions: 1. There is no such thing as liberal media bias. 2. I get my news from the New York Times. 3. I have not heard of the Solyndra story.

589 590 PD,

the proof is in the pudding.....

had Haliburton gone bankrupt and such after a "loan" of half a billion.....

you think you would have had a hard time hearing about it?

590

Don't forget Obama has never played the race card.

Bet he knows nothing about Fast and Furious either.

591

577 ......
btw, I'm open to a conservative president, as long as they are competent. Posted by: proudonkey

Too many threads here at Ace reveal BHO's utter lack of competence, but these at HotAir have pictures for you.

Obama’s job-training program model in Georgia “nearly bankrupt”

Video: Porkulus II a “loser” as Wall Street yawns

... and yeah, they're all a couple of days old ... but D.C. Beltway insiders, of all political persuasions. have been laughing at BHO's titanic inability (even to be briefed!) for almost 10 months ... to the public's knowedge.

... double heh ...

592 596 Johnny,

it was a freak accident like many proud donkies I know when he was sprinting at 87.97mph he was starting to fall prey to the flux capacitor I had left on him and FWOOM the blinders I was using to ride him to 1972 were grafted to his face....

he doesn't see as much anymore, BUT as a useful byproduct he is a lot happier with the political situation these days.

593 599 Buzzion,

I fear even the swayable moderates will never hear about F&F even if we use a bullhorn....

went to the gunshow today in Dayton....

DHS was out in force and nobody was speaking about G/G R or F&F

594 598 Abuse of Power Ebooks,

TRUST US YOU WON"T LIKE THE ENDING!

//the Kulaks and many preferred share holders

595 It looks like Donkey is gone for a while, so I will retire with a refreshing beverage at a Table; number 9 I think, replenishing the power of my Orange Haze ...

596 Hate to bring this up again, but the would-be *new* dominant order tends to do things like push Christine O'Donnell and, worse yet, not even take a lesson from such errors.

Posted by: ace at September 10, 2011 03:38 PM (nj1bB)

Hate to bring this up again, but the current dominant order tends to do things like push Mike Castle and Lisa Mircowsky, and worse yet, not even take a lesson from such errors.

See how that works ace?

597 605 KG,

I have a question KG what precisely are your goals politically?

598 I have a question KG what precisely are your goals politically?

Posted by: sven10077 at September 10, 2011 08:43 PM (AEIYh)

Um, what? Like I'm a fucking Karl Rove or something?

I'm not even sure wtf you are asking because I've seen this question posed here before as a gotcha to try and pin some weirdo label on someone.

599 607 KG,

Look dude I just "gotchad" myself and hit my schlong with a hammer for thirty posts I am not "gotchaing" I swear....

I ask because mine is to get as many as conservative as a district will elect conservatives empowered to undo the new deal and great society

not being coy

600 Let's say the GOP is Freedom, and the Dem-Commies are, well, totalitarianism. And time after time someone in the GOP officialdom does something that redounds to the Totalitarian benefit. At what point do we lose doubt? Ian Fleming (who should know) put it this way: 'Once is circumstance. Twice is happenstance. Three times is enemy action.' Yeah, Alger Hiss WAS a Commie spy! Can you say 'infiltration'? I think you can. When do we send in the JDAMS and SEAL6. Our Freedoms are on their last gasps.

601 This is a mystery in search of archives. Go through the conservative blogosphere and search for posts about Angle, O'Donnell, Paul, Buck, Wilson etc., and you'll have your answer. The mainstream media at least pretends to like the GOP establishment candidates.

602 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

603 272

I can't wrap my mind around how 9-11 happened and then we moved left, weak and pro-muslim. It's mind blowing. 9-11 happened and we elected Barak Hussain Obama, communist, radical, and idiot and then went about destroying more of the country. It makes no sense.

Why would a country like the US go on a suicide mission or rather just lie down and die? For free cheese? Really?

Posted by: dagny at September 10, 2011 05:15 PM (k5cKv)

-------------

It's simple..... While Bush was emersed in the lofty goal of keeping our country safe from further attacks....the enemy within was busy waging a propaganda war against him.

Bush's success at keeping the homefront safe, and the daily news free of new attacks, provided the Left the opportunity to demonize him for that very success by attacking the things he did to achieve that success.

604 613 CMajH,

and while they were upbraiding him they were rubbing their hands together for the engine and precedents he had built and fought in court for....

they're scum

605 Again,  what ACE wrote is common sense and I doubt that most people would disagree with it. No one is disputing that we should ignore polling data or reality. The basic point is that the establishment MUST work earn our trust now. This is an old example. The left goes out of its way to promote a vain narcissist like Obama. The Rep establishment overall seems deferential to Obama. On other hand, they feel free to viciously attack the weaknesses of our nominees. In other words, they seem to deliberately undermine the ELECTABILITY of our candidates in order to use that as an argument against the candidates they don't like. That 's their problem. Go back to the point of this post: why do they continue to ask our enemies to moderate our debates? In a large movement like this a few mistakes are unavoidable. We should learn from them and I agree with ACE here. However, the bigger problem on our side is the ESTABLISHMENT. They need to learn a lot more. Another example to illustrate the point. Our side is not perfect (eg Bush 's deficit spending). However, the left is 10 times worse. Anyone withe common sense would solve the bigger problem first. We need to clean up the left first. They are the major source of garbage/destruction in this country right now. Similarly, the establishment is a much bigger problem our the right side. It doesn't mean that the Tea Movement or the non-establishment folks are perfect. It is a smaller problem of the two.

606 Remember how Erick at RedState overheard Trent Lott not only lambasting the Tea Party but openly mocking them as a bunch of backwoods hicks.  I would love to meet Lott in person.

607 Actually LAI, a lot of people are in fact arguing that we should ignore polling data and reality. Witness Palin's "polls are for strippers and skiers" remark.

608

No.  The explanation is simple.  Use Occum's Razor.  The establishment doesn't like the blogs because the establishment is not conservative.  The are slightly right of center believers in big gov't - like Romney or even W with "compassionate conservative" and No Child Left Behind, Amnesty, Medicare Part D and more concerned with working with Ted Kennedy than with what the conservative base thought.

This is why conservatives need to keep up the primary challenges and keep working to take control of the republican party.  The establishment tolerates us to the extent it can use us, but has no interest in us otherwise.

 

609 Actually LAI, a lot of people are in fact arguing that we should ignore polling data and reality. Witness Palin's "polls are for strippers and skiers" remark.

I agree with this to a large degree. There are a lot of junk polls. However, there is nothing intrinsically wrong with polling when done properly. However, the point is that we should consider reality etc... My problem is that the establishment is acting like a liberal enabler a lot of the times. They even use the liberal talking points sometimes to attack our side. The debate is the sore example rubbing our eyes in the open. Why does the Rep establishment keep trying to win the favor of the most stupid and insane of the left like MSNBC? Why do they keep having most of our debates with these people as the moderators? The bottom is that on the right side, the establishment is the much bigger problem that needs to be dealt with.

610

It has to be that they just don't trust us, and expect us to embarrass them.

No, not embarass them, but supercede them.  It was bloggers who first suggested people get active and drove the Tea Party movement.  Ace, I seem to remember a blogpost of yours a couple of years ago that said 'if you don't like what's happening go out there and get involved, take over the GOP local infrastructure' and that's exactly what people did. 

The GOP establishment count on the normal political rhythm of 'one party in power, people get sick of them and vote in the other party' to continue for ever and ensure their turn.  With the advent of the internet average citizens don't think that's good enough and want more say in the process, even putting up candidates they would prefer, not simply dutifully voting for the next in line.  That is a big change that rocks quite a few applecarts but unless they shut down the internet, and every other new communications technology, there is no turning back. 

611

The Problem:

 

Find a business model that capitalizes on the unique aspects of certain conservative opinion blogs and their communities to form an entity that has the depth and resources to become a force in national politics.

 

Analysis:

 

Turning opinion into money, power and influence on the internet is the holy grail of business models.  The trouble is, opinion is next to worthless.  However, opinion can generate cache and a community of individuals who wish to participate and be recognized within that sphere.  From this community, an organization can be constructed that produces the most valuable of commodities – information.

 

The Solution:

 

Use a select group of conservative bloggers to form an organization that uses their particular skills and communities to generate highly salable information. 

612 618 "The establishment doesn't like the blogs because the establishment is not conservative.  The are slightly right of center believers in big gov't."

"...This is why conservatives need to keep up the primary challenges and keep working to take control of the republican party."

Bingo.

613

The 'GOP establishment' are just the lap dogs of the Dhimmeroid ruling class. The Dims allow them to take the lead from time to time for the sake of looks and the GOP responds by toeing the line on more taxes and more spending. For that they get invited to the DC cocktail parties. It's kind of like a pig party in high school.

A pox on the entire Ruling Class. It's wa-a-a-a-ay past time for term limits. Six years and out. No cross over to the other house. Add to that, part time Congress. They meet for 90 days. That's it unless there's a real emegency like war requiring Congressional action/approval of something. If they don't have a budget signed by the end of the 90 days they all get impeached and go to jail on a felony.

Works for me.

614 11708550   p822686  p165675   131-8902+131-8903   600-311-8293