1 Will bring about the return of the 12th Imam for food.

2

Holder is at it again

This has got to be the worst AG I have seen in my lifetime. Now immigration law can be set aside and ignored based on the latest PC bullshit that infests this administration like cockroaches in a 2 bit flop house in Queens.  But this shit is what really gets me wondering:

Holder set aside the Board of Immigration Appeals ruling allowing the deportation to Ireland of Paul Wilson Dorman,Â…Â…

So, the AG can overrule immigration judges now?

3 Fox now saying Herman Cain "won the debate". I slept through it.

4

So, the AG can overrule immigration judges now?

Posted by: Vic at May 06, 2011 07:07 AM (M9Ie6)

Yes, but only if it is in the best interests of the country president Progressive agenda!

And that is not the only thing I can do.

5 Holder set aside the Board of Immigration Appeals ruling allowing the deportation to Ireland of Paul Wilson Dorman,Â…Â…

Must be 'Black Irish.'

6 From the local Dem PR papers we have this on T. Paw:

FoxÂ’s moderators also got Pawlenty again to retract his position on MinnesotaÂ’s trial program to limit carbon emissions, also known as cap and trade.

“I was wrong. It was a mistake, and I’m sorry,” Pawlenty said. “It’s ham-fisted.”

That is good to hear, but I would rather have heard him say he initially believed that the data was correct but now he understood that it was fraud.

We have this from Herman Cain:

Cain said he supported the FairTax, a flat, 23 percent sales tax to replace income and payroll taxes.

That takes him off my list. The 'Fair Tax" is not fair and it is a disaster for most people.

7 "The 'Fair Tax" is not fair and it is a disaster for most people."

Vic, expound please.

8 Need to pick my wife a gift out for Mother's Day.. Gutsy call on my part, if I do say so.

9 2 vic  WTF?  He wants to deport an Irishman?  If your Mexican, open border.  But Irish?  Nope!  THEY gotta go.  The stoopidty of the Obama Asshole Administration keeps sinking and sinking and sinking.

10
That takes him off my list. The 'Fair Tax" is not fair and it is a disaster for most people.

I like the Fair tax.  Instead of punishing productive people, the people who get hit hardest by a consumption tax are people who consume a lot.  This way you can also control how much in taxes you spend and how much money you save.

At the very least the government would recoup some money when scumbags on SSI buy a high-definition TV.

11

So, the AG can overrule immigration judges now?

Posted by: Vic at May 06, 2011 07:07 AM (M9Ie6)

I think it should be pretty obvious to everybody by now that any high-level member of the current administration can break any law with impunity.  This is the most lawless administration of all time.  None of them are being held accountable for their crimes.  Nor will they ever be, given the cowardice of the Republican "leadership."  They could be setting up ad hoc firing squads on the White House lawn and killing political enemies and I doubt that there would be much resistance.  If conservatives in this country were not so well armed there would already be goons rounding us up and shipping us to FEMA camps to starve.

The state has become illegitimate.  If following the laws is fully optional for the politicians, or the law is re-written by their judicial allies to suit their needs, it holds no legitimate sway over the rest of us.  I believe that even in principle the law now applies only so far as the state can coercively enforce it.

12 FoxÂ’s moderators also got Pawlenty again to retract his position on MinnesotaÂ’s trial program to limit carbon emissions, also known as cap and trade. Is the trial program still in place? Will it expire?

13

So, the AG can overrule immigration judges now?

Um, yes, every AG since the creation of the BIA (and since long before there was a position called "Immigration Judges") has had that authority. See 8 U.S.C. sec. 1103(g)(2).

The BIA is a creation of regulation; it's not a statutory body. The statute simply says the AG can review immigration decisions. It also says he can delegate his authority. He delegated it to create the BIA, but retains oversight.

14 The Fair Tax would have to be implemented with massive exemptions,  unless the working poor and lower middle classes are to be destroyed.

In addition, it would be a pain to manage,  as retailers would have to charge it and  then send the money to the IRS. 

Garage sales and black market transactions would go through the roof.

Lack of home mortgage deduction would further depress the real estate market.

The benefit would be that we would no longer have a huge IRS network,  weird tax deductions based on needs of lobbyists and political movements, and people would pay as they purchased.

I don't think it is going anywhere because too many people are lined up against it.

15 Holder is worse then obama

16 And, lest you think that Holder exercising that power is unusual, AGs Mukasey and Ashcroft both did it several times, as did their predecessors.

17 "Fair Tax". More bullshit speak. 20-25% on top of the price, collected at the register? Any clue what this would do to retail business? Turn small businesses into collection agents, skimming and creative workarounds will skyrocket. Now, flat tax, makes sense. We could do our annual returns on a postcard. AGI times point one five; mail the check, done. When you see the size of the IRS building in DC, you'll know not a thing will be done. The IRS tumor is too large.

18 I'll ask again, was last night's debate to see which Republican would give Obama the best head?

19 Vic, expound please.

Posted by: Sukie Tawdry at May 06, 2011 07:20 AM (MPtFW)

This is not something you can cover in a short sound bite or in a single post. In order to fully understand the "unFair Tax" you have to read the actual bill that was submitted. You also have to read the supporting papers and calculations that purport to make it revenue neutral. Some highlights are:

It is actually a 31% tax on everything you buy.

It does not make taxes any "fairer" because once again groups of people are exempted via "kickbacks".

It is an unmitigated disaster for retired people. 

I did a series of calculations a few years ago and found that it was a tax increase for everyone up to a salary of about 500K. 

I think most people here about this tax and somehow get the idea that it is fair because it is a flat tax, it isn't and it is too damn high.

20 And, lest you think that Holder exercising that power is unusual, AGs Mukasey and Ashcroft both did it several times, as did their predecessors. Posted by: Gabriel Malor at May 06, 2011 07:29 AM (XVaFd) Yeah be we don't like Holder, so you gotta come up with some excuse to go on hating him. I mean fair is fair.

21 the people who get hit hardest by a consumption tax are people who consume a lot.  This way you can also control how much in taxes you spend and how much money you save.

At the very least the government would recoup some money when scumbags on SSI buy a high-definition TV.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at May 06, 2011 07:24 AM (FkKjr)

I like many elements of the Fair Tax concept.  I think we should phase it in slowly as a replacement for income tax so we can see how it goes.  That said, there are some weaknesses that need to be considered.

1.  Punishing consumption in an economy that is primarily consumption driven may not be entirely good.  Over-saving does exist - it's why Japan and China rely on exports to maintain their economies.  The wealthy can avoid the system by going off-shore to buy larger items, so that means we'd have to set up elaborate import taxes to compensate.  Smuggling of goods would be an issue as well, and property theft would become even more profitable.

2.  Because of the impact it will have on the bottom earners, it's pretty much a given that there will be an offset program - transfer payments to bottom income people.  The "scumbags on SSI" will still be buying their hi-def TVs and Uncle Sugar will be helping finance it.  After all - TV is a great tool for keeping people stupid and complacent.  The government loves that.

On the up side - garage sales would become far more profitable enterprises.

 

22 WTF?  He wants to deport an Irishman?

No, he wants to stop the deportation of an illegal Irishman because he is gay.

23

"At the very least the government would recoup some money when scumbags on SSI buy a high-definition TV."

 

My wife worked as a CNA in a retirement home for over 20 years. She has had 6 operations on her back because of the work load and now draws SSI. We have a high def tv, mostly because I want one but also because that is pretty much all that is being sold since the gov't mandated they all go to digital. Still feel the same way? Or maybe you decided to get hysterical before you put any thought into your post?

24 Hey Moonbat AG!  Why are you not charging Barrak Husien with Murder of a nice, innocent, old man in Pakistan the other day.  The guy framed by Prezidnt Booosh with the 9/11 fake attack.  It was Booosh that demolished the twin towers.The old man in Pakistan must have been a scapegoat to make mucho denero in the Military Industrial Complex.   http://tinyurl.com/4pbevtq

25 At the very least the government would recoup some money when scumbags on SSI buy a high-definition TV.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at May 06, 2011 07:24 AM (FkKjr)

Yes, that is just the kind of shit that a populist like Huck would favor. How about we go to a real fair tax that everyone pays; 10% income tax on all income regardless of source with no deductions and no minimums or maximums. 

26 Obama: Last night, we captured The King of The Leprechauns, King Brian.
Press: Sir, did he give you any wishes or gold or secrets to eternal life?
Obama: No, we threw him into the woods according to Leprechaun law.
Press: Why?
Obama: He might have been armed.
Press: Armed with a gun?
Obama: WeÂ’re not sure. He might have hidden behind a Fairy with a stick.
Press: A stick?
Obama: Maybe not.
Press: Do you have any photos of this encounter?
Obama: Yes, but we canÂ’t show them to anyone.
Press: Again sir, why?
Obama: We donÂ’t want to stir up the Irish. (does a drinking motion with his hand)
Press: Oh for ChristÂ’s sake!
Obama: He was there too.

27 Yippee-ki-yay, motherfucker.

28 Vic,
No surprise that the vested interests of FOX would make that determination in order to counter the CNN poll pitting Ron Paul beating Obama.

What I saw of the debate, Cain and Paul did well.

The New Mexican former Governor has a lax personality.

I won't support any candidate who promoted the obvious hoax of Global Warming, jumping on that bandwagon for personal gain at the nation's and every tax payer's expense. 

Yeller Santorum is a brow beating warmonger ranting at Pakistan that if they're not with us, they're against us. As if Pakistan couldn't yell the same thing back at the US. That doesn't even qualify as high school antics, but leaves Santorum stuck in the primary grades' sandbox representing "American Diplomacy".

Dr. Steve Pieczenick, who oversaw our nation's psychological warfare while serving 5 administrations for 30 years in the highest ranks directing our government's intelligence community, has made it abundantly clear this week that Pakistan has been America's ally, and this administration's current propaganda to the contrary is fraud that doesn't hold up under scrutiny.  Our CIA knew whatever Pakistan's intelligence knew. Also, today's CIA is over 70% contracted mercenaries rather than the former standard of human intelligence professionals on the ground, imbedded. So consider well that these contracted mercenaries are out for themselves and do not hold America's best interests at heart.

As Fred Thompson said, Policy Matters and we must look to the long term affects that will result from each policy before adopting it, before implementing it.

29 Fair Tax is just wrong.  Tax the income, not the outgo.  Elderly on a very small budget and no longer working and then having a 25% tax on top of their food bill isn't right.  It impedes commerce and fundamentally just doesn't feel right to me; once I've earned money, it ought to be mine.

30 Beto at May 06, 2011 07:38 AM

I'm still laughing.

31
25 10% income tax on all income regardless of source with no deductions and no minimums or maximums. ....

That's less than what I pay now with all my deductions since my house is almost paid for and I quit contracting.
There is no formula to offset a government that wont stop spending though.

32

May 6 (Bloomberg) -- The pace of hiring in the U.S. probably cooled in April as companies curbed spending in the face of rising raw-material costs, economists said ahead of a government report today.

Payrolls rose by 185,000 workers last month compared with a 216,000 advance in March, according to the median forecast of 86 economists surveyed by Bloomberg News. The jobless rate may have held at 8.8 percent.

Oh no, don't tell me that our super nova economy might have slowed down in April. "It probably cooled" "it may have held". Tremendous reporting from the State Media

33 Lack of home mortgage deduction would further depress the real estate market.

It is worse than that, not only would you lose the deduction, but you would pay 31% sales tax on a house when you buy it.

Think about that.

34 once I've earned money, it ought to be mine.
Posted by: dogfish

That's logical.

35 The Fair Tax would have to be implemented with massive exemptions,  unless the working poor and lower middle classes are to be destroyed.

I don't believe there really is any sizable segment of the population which faces an existential crisis like that.  I think the working poor and lower middle classes - who often times are net drains on tax revenue - would be forced to change their spending habits and stop buying crap they can't really afford.

Garage sales and black market transactions would go through the roof.

Quite a few states already use sales taxes, and the Federal government at one time collected income solely through tariffs on foreign goods.

36 Now, flat tax, makes sense. We could do our annual returns on a postcard.
AGI times point one five; mail the check, done.

Posted by: Pecos Bill at May 06, 2011 07:31 AM (j84s0)

The only problem here is that it would be a highly regressive tax.  The top income bracket pays the great bulk of income tax right now, if the published figures are to be believed.  For this to balance out under a "fair tax" that burden shifts downward. 

37 Think about that.

Given inflated prices, compounded by another third in cost! Credit will be hard to get, and the interest rates will go up significantly.

Damn.

38 I thought he was just doing it to mess up  the Marriage Act by causing a big stink with immigration.  My bad.  I did not read the whole thin.

39 There was a debate?

40 And, lest you think that Holder exercising that power is unusual, AGs Mukasey and Ashcroft both did it several times, as did their predecessors.

My problem isn't with any of them exercising authority that is granted by law. If these judges are not judges than so be it.

What I don't want to see, however, is the AG refusing to enforce the law or violating the law based on personal political opinion.

Politics is the collected action of choosing leaders and making laws. When people charged with enforcing the law perform acts that violate the law based on political opinion they have crossed the line, REGARDLESS of which Party they belong to.

From what was reported in the article this "Irishman" was here illegally. He was in violation f the law and should be deported. If this was his second time then it is a felony.

What gives the AG the authority to violate the law?

41 "This was an extraordinary measure by the Obama administration and demonstrates a clear commitment to nullify the Defense of Marriage Act,"  This is the part that caught my eye.  I stand corrected.

42 Elderly on a very small budget and no longer working and then having a 25% tax on top of their food bill isn't right.

As I aid, it is actually 31%.

43 would be forced to change their spending habits and stop buying crap they can't really afford.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at May 06, 2011 07:43 AM (FkKjr)

That has a bit of liberal think in it.  Their habit would be changed more properly by informing them that Uncle Sugar is no longer in the handout business so live within your means.  Solved two problems with one solution.

44 There is no formula to offset a government that wont stop spending though.

Posted by: Beto at May 06, 2011 07:42 AM (j5CHE)

That is why under my plan there would be a Constitutional amendment that included a limit on spending that equaled the previous year's tax revenues unless we had a declared war.

45 No, he wants to stop the deportation of an illegal Irishman because he is gay.

That's a new take on "Always after me Lucky Charms" and "Me boyo".

46 It is worse than that, not only would you lose the deduction, but you would pay 31% sales tax on a house when you buy it.

Think about that.

Posted by: Vic at May 06, 2011 07:43 AM (M9Ie6)

If current legislative proposals include that, then clearly it's a non-starter.  However, I assume it's similar to a state sales tax.  Certain categories of good could be exempted or capped.  I think that necessities of life, like food, shelter, medical care, and fuel, should be exempted from such a plan.  I would also suggest that automobiles under a certain price point should be exempt or enjoy a lower rate - in America you can't live/work very many places without a car.

One possible positive side effect is that high quality goods would gain in the market place, and poor quality goods would suffer.  People would have a less obvious delta in price between the two, and the higher overall cost would drive people to select more durable items and discriminate more carefully in buying.  This drives down waste, and kills cheap imports. 

47 Posted by: Mobius 1 at May 06, 2011 07:36 AM (p/11K)

Let me clarify my statement:

SSI is a program rife with fraud.  I was not saying that all people on SSI are scumbags, but that there are a lot of people that I am aware of personally with 'back disabilities' or 'depression' who are collecting checks who have no problems.  That is who I was referring to.

48 The only problem here is that it would be a highly regressive tax.

That is language right out of the Dem/commie playbook.

49 Does anybody else get the impression that Holder is an incompetent f*ckstick?

He's just thrashing around like some long-haired boob in a mosh pit thinking all the cool chicks dig his manly chops. (hip-hop/gangster comparison revised because, you know, racism and shit)

50 The top income bracket pays the great bulk of income tax right now, if the published figures are to be believed.  For this to balance out under a "fair tax" that burden shifts downward. 

Posted by: Reactionary at May 06, 2011 07:44 AM (xUM1Q)

It needs to.  Isn't it like 40% pay nothing and another 20% pay next to nothing.  It's easy to be live on Uncle Sugar when you feel none of the burden.

51 Certain categories of good could be exempted or capped.

A select few are, but as I recall, homes are not.

52 SSI is a program rife with fraud.

When you say SSI, I assume you mean SSDI??

53

That has a bit of liberal think in it.  Their habit would be changed more properly by informing them that Uncle Sugar is no longer in the handout business so live within your means.  Solved two problems with one solution.

Posted by: dogfish at May 06, 2011 07:54 AM (N2yhW)

Actually, if you are taking in public funds, the public *does* have the right to tell you what you can and can't spend on.  That's not a liberal viewpoint.  It's also part of the reason why having a 'public option' in Healthcare is so dangerous.

54 22 WTF?  He wants to deport an Irishman?

No, he wants to stop the deportation of an illegal Irishman because he is gay.

Posted by: Vic at May 06, 2011 07:35 AM (M9Ie6)

Hey, no fair. What about Patrick FitzMichael and Michael FitzPatrick? Must they be exported too?

55 Fox now saying Herman Cain "won the debate".

So FOX is pushing the "fair tax"?

As with the "Fairness Doctrine" to censor free speech, that this plan was given the label "fair" tax is a dead give-away requiring an immense bureaucracy to determine "fairness" since social justice must prevail.

Well, too bad for Cain not to have done more research. Perhaps he'll fall back on "I misspoke, and meant to say 'flat' tax."

56 When you say SSI, I assume you mean SSDI??

Posted by: Vic at May 06, 2011 08:00 AM (M9Ie6)

Yes.  I apologize for the confusion.  It's very early.

57 Agree Bevel and the reason why Uncle Sugar cuts that off.  Live within your means, means I don't care if you spend all your money on a big screen ...or you can eat   ...it is your choice.  Ahh freedom and responsibility, what's not to love.

58 Fox now saying Herman Cain  won the debate.

So Cain would give Obama the best blow job?  I mean that's how the media usually picks'em for us.

59 That is language right out of the Dem/commie playbook.

Posted by: Vic at May 06, 2011 07:56 AM (M9Ie6)

Oh OK, noble defender of conservatism.  Didn't realize I'd slipped into the role of the Red Menace there by stating the obvious - my apologies.  Just to get it out of my system, here's another - wealth stratification will continue even faster, and the media will be quick to point out that fact and club us with it.

You must know something that will make working voters and retirees at the lower income levels (who grow more numerous day by day) happy about the fact that they're going to take an effective 10% pay cut (probably more, as 10% is never going to be enough as a universal tax rate).  And let's not forget that middle class taxes will also have to rise, to offset the reduction in the upper class tax rates.  If you have succeeded in finding a way to make this palatable to them, I salute you.

I'm all for finding a way to drain dollars from the economy that is maximally just for people of all income levels.  But I don't see how that happens in a democratic republic like ours. 

60 unless we had a declared war.

Who would champion such an amendment?

/I wouldn't put anything past Obama or subsequent Chief Executives going to Congress to petition a declaration of war against "Terror". 

61 This discussion on taxes has brought up a question to me. Many experts claim that government cannot extract more than around 18-19% of GDP, regardless of whether tax rates are high or low. But this is Federal taxes. There are many other taxes (state sales, property, state income, etc.) that are NOT Federal. So how do those taxes affect the top line Federal grab? If they are higher, wouldn't the grab percent the feds can do be lowered?
 
Tax Freedom Day, or the guesstimate date of the year you have to work until just to pay ALL your yearly tax obligations is usually mid April to early May; i.e., around 30-40% of your income.
 
It just seems to me that this 18-19% of GDP extraction figure cannot be looked at in isolation.
 
As to whether a flat tax or VAT tax would cause a black market, just look at cigarettes. Around 1/4 of all NY's cigarette consumption is smuggled in. It's a booming business anywhere there is a large tax discrepancy between states. Beating the system by some is an inevitable outcome no matter what tax plan you enact.

62

It needs to.  Isn't it like 40% pay nothing and another 20% pay next to nothing.  It's easy to be live on Uncle Sugar when you feel none of the burden.

Posted by: dogfish at May 06, 2011 07:59 AM (N2yhW)

A fair point, and I have no problem making that contribution more than zero.  But remember - that's only federal income tax we're talking about here.  State and local income taxes must still be paid, as well as property taxes and every form of use tax buried in every product.  The poor do pay taxes - just not as much as the rest of us.  Hell - in Michigan we soak the poor good with the lottery tax.  And imagine how much they contribute in liquor and cig taxes. 

The only poor people who pay little or no tax, period, are the ones living off the government teet since their welfare pays the bill.  A major portion of that income comes from making babies, which in many places they are effectively paid to do, thus perpetuating the problem forever.  Yet when I suggest we do something to punish or prevent that behavior suddenly I'm the Sanger-loving baby killer.  If we are not willing to address the growing welfare blight problem, the rest of this talk is unserious.

63 I think it's against the law to use "government" and "logic" in any thought process.

64 Gabe I based my statement on this:

Holder set aside the Board of Immigration Appeals ruling allowing the deportation to Ireland of Paul Wilson Dorman, a gay man illegally in the U.S. Dorman wants to stay in the country with his male partner, with whom he celebrated a civil union in New Jersey.

How else are you supposed to interpret "set aside"?

65 Brave Obama, Obama,
He got in 9 holes on the day
The Navy Seals blew Osama away,

He then remarked it was his idea,
He instructed, He determined, and he made the sale,
In golf attire, as the Media sighed,
Blades of grass so sharp, he almost died,
Obama, Obama, Brave Obama,

Brave, Obama, Obama,
With steely eye, he faced the flash,
Of photographs so clearly staged,
With cold resolve, he watched and tisked,
As better men took actual risks,
Obama, Brave Obama

He then went on to say its me,
Look, he cried, such sharp golf tees,
And narrow fairways, bordered by trees,
Such a quick decision, in 16 hours,
The media cries, "He's the man of the hour!"
Brave Obama, Obama

66 9.0% funemployment - you're welcome.

67 48 The only problem here is that it would be a highly regressive tax. That is language right out of the Dem/commie playbook. Posted by: Vic at May 06, 2011 07:56 AM (M9Ie6) No it isn't, Vic. It's a fact. Come on.

68 Regarding Herman Cain:

Despite his Fair Tax support (which isn't ever going to be implemented so it's right there with Ron Paul's wanting us back on the gold standard) my daughter was impressed with him.

She voted for Obama because she isn't a news watcher and bought into the hopey-changey thing,  and she now says that he has not done anything he promised and she is really bothered by his Marxist friends (having run into Marxist professors at school who she says were the worst professors).

She was really impressed with Herman Cain because he was a easy to understand and made sense to her.  (That is what she told me.)

I am only reporting the views of one "sort of liberal but changiing her mind about Obama" person, and this probably has NO wider significance,  but I thought I would add this to the discussion.

69  9.0% funemployment - you're welcome.

Posted by: Barack "Natural Born Killer" Obama at May 06, 2011 08:32 AM (5cGDj)

Plus another 10% underemployment.  Thanks Barack!

70 Vic-


I posted a link yesterday that said the Feds (ICE) have been ordered to not arrest illegals at border crossings until they have been caught crossing at least 7 times.  I think it was at CNS News.  I go look it up.

71 No it isn't, Vic. It's a fact. Come on.

Posted by: Bugler at May 06, 2011 08:33 AM (VXBR1)

BS BS BS

"Regressive Tax" is a term invented by the Democrats/Progressives/Communists to push their redistribution scheme way back when the income tax was invented. The only fair tax is a flat tax on all income. 

They try to redefine terms. Regressive Tax would imply that lower income people pay more than higher income people. That is NOT a fact.

72 9.0% funemployment - you're welcome.

Posted by: Barack "Natural Born Killer" Obama at May 06, 2011 08:32 AM (5cGDj)

Have no fear - Recovery Summer Part Deux will be headed our way!!!!!!

73

Posted by: GnuBreed at May 06, 2011 08:18 AM (ENKCw)

I think that's an interesting subject, and I've been mulling it a lot lately myself. 

We currently are seeing such massive levels of per-capita productivity in developed nations that we can do all the necessary work with a fraction of the man power we needed before.  This means high unemployment may persist for a long time, and may be permanent and worsening if productivity gains continue.  Human labor is increasingly stratified into unskilled and highly skilled, and we need fewer of each.  Many people who want to work for an honest living will be unable to, simply because the demand for labor will be so low. 

How to properly deal with that is a big issue.   

74 Despite his Fair Tax support (which isn't ever going to be implemented so it's right there with Ron Paul's wanting us back on the gold standard)

This ultimately is true.  Unfortunately I don't think we'll ever get off our current taxation system, either for a Fair Tax or Flat Tax (both of which would be better).  It really is an empty promise when a candidate advocates for it.

75 By the way while I think the repeal of DADT was no big deal. However, when you couple that with this Admin's efforts to repeal DOMA, you are asking for alot of trouble in the Military. Once they recognize gay marriage the shit is really gonna hit the fan.

76 May 6 (Bloomberg) -- The U.S. economy added more jobs than forecast in April, easing concern that higher fuel prices are slowing the economic recovery.

See? Everything is great so STFU

“The labor market has finally moved into sustainable- growth mode,” Guy LeBas, chief fixed-income strategist at Janney Montgomery Scott LLC in Philadelphia, said before the report. “We can expect growth numbers to be positive.”

Guy has moved into sustainable stupidity mode

77

Recovery Summer Part Deux will be headed our way!!!!!!

The celebration is currently on hold, due to lack of funds...

78 Despite his Fair Tax support (which isn't ever going to be implemented so it's right there with Ron Paul's wanting us back on the gold standard) my daughter was impressed with him.

This is a disturbing trend that I have been seeing lately here. (Not that it isn't good that an Obama voter is seeing the light).

We are trying to excuse a politician for being in favor of a bad program (it was gun control in previous cases) because we think there is little chance that it will be implemented.

Never ever count on that. Being in favor of a program you disagree with should always be counted against a politician and weighed in just like any other program depending on what value you place on it.

To me "tax policy" is one of the high value items. The "fair tax" is a tax increase on most of the population who currently pay taxes so to me that is a major hit.

79 Here Vic:

Feds Allow Illegal Aliens to Cross Border 14 Times Before Charging Them With Felony, Sheriff Tells Congress

80   I think it was at CNS News.  I go look it up.

A number of people posted on that, including me from a different source.

81 BS BS BS That is NOT a fact. Posted by: Vic at May 06, 2011 08:39 AM (M9Ie6) "Regressive" and "progressive" are terms in common usage to describe the relationship of tax rates to income. They have no ideological component.

82 The Labor Department says the economy added 244,000 jobs last month. Private employers shrugged off high gas prices and created 268,000 jobs -- the most since February 2006.



Shrugged off? How about it didn't hit them yet. And I'm guessing that the jobs number got a spike from that big hiring day McDonald's had

83 It is impossible to talk fair taxes, when the you have headlines like this:

Uncle SamÂ’s Latest Line of Credit: $1,888,174,000,000.00 Spent Out of $1,900,000,000,000.00


It goes with the saying, 'I'll make sacrifices, but first the gov't must.'

84 To me "tax policy" is one of the high value items. The "fair tax" is a tax increase on most of the population who currently pay taxes so to me that is a major hit.

One proposal is a tax increase.  The basic idea of a Fair tax is a sound one, as evidenced by the fact that it basically was the model our country utilized until the income tax was created.

85

Attention Attention! Results of royal in-breeding are now apparent for all to see

The world has a shortage of water because Americans eat too much steak.

Teh stupid is epic

86 The basic idea of a Fair tax is a sound one, as evidenced by the fact that it basically was the model our country utilized until the income tax was created.

No it wasn't

Initially the federal government got most of its income primarily from tariffs, the States, and the sale of land. Some income was derived from excise taxes on liquor (another unFair tax)

Local taxes were primarily done through property tax. Sales taxes didn't come along until much later. (generally locally during WWI)

87 Bugler - Well.. anything other than a flat tax has ideology behind the policy.  You are favoring or punishing one group over another. 

I would prefer a progressive flat tax, personally.  Let's say 4 different bracket depending on income.  0-2% for the working poor and graduated up to a max of 17-20% for the wealthiest - with no deductions or loopholes.

For those who would argue that isn't a flat tax, I suggest you have to consider payroll taxes on lower incomes being more burdensome that on wealthier earners and the relationship of income to necessities like food and housing.

One thing I would eliminate is Earned Income Credits.  This is being abused by too many recipients.  It is welfare, pure and simple.  However, there is no enforcement or investigation of those fraudulently claiming it.  For example, a "single" mother making $25k per year with 4 kids can get a EIC even if the father of those kids lives with her and is making $50k.  As long as they don't get married, the gravy train rolls on!  Welfare should be applied for and need investigated and determined by a real person, not a claim to the IRS.

88 Initially the federal government got most of its income primarily from tariffs

Tariffs are ultimately sales taxes on foreign goods.  The effect is the same.

Some income was derived from excise taxes on liquor (another unFair tax)

Why is that any more or less 'fair' than an income tax?

Broad-based sales taxes didn't exist until the depression, but sales taxes on specific goods did exist.

89 I would prefer a progressive flat tax, personally.

hahahaha

I prefer an earned free money,  no calorie Boston Creme Pie, and dumb smart big titty blonds.

90 Why is that any more or less 'fair' than an income tax?

Because it targeted one small segment of the population, the "western farmers". Read up on the Whiskey Rebellion.

As for the tariffs they targeted the South and benefited the North. That was one of the leading causes of the war of 1861.   

91 JWF:

Pathetic: Sebelius Says Seniors Will Die Sooner Under Ryan Plan

Seriously, can these people be any more pathetic? In a sane world, her boss and her party would denounce her and have her removed from her job. Instead, they'll run with this nonsense.HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius said that the Ryan Medicare proposal will lead to early deaths among seniors.

During testimony before the House Education and the Workforce Committee, she said seniors “will run out of money very quickly.”

She continued, “If you run out of the government voucher and then you run out of your own money, you’re left to scrape together charity care, go without care, die sooner. There really aren’t a lot of options.”

92 98 Sorry about format fail.  It never did that in the old FF maybe I'll have to switch back (but this one is so much faster)

93 That's pretty much true, momma.  Of course, they are blowing it out of proportion, but essentially it is true.

Ryan has said himself that elderly would need to pay for more of their healthcare out of their own pockets.  It's the only way to "save" money.

What Sebelius doesn't say, is Obama's plan to have that panel (can't remember the acronym right now) start looking at benefits to cut, will likely kill as many elderly as any other plan.  it's "death panels" by another name.

94 Forget any sort of direct taxation.  Take the total federal budget, and require each state to collect a portion equal to it's percentage of the US population.  If California want's to implement a sales tax to pay it's share, while New York wants to impose an income tax, then so be it.  Any state which refuses to pay loses recognition of it's driver's  licenses, birth certificates, marriage certificates, etc.

95 Vic,  point taken about assuming something won't be implemented.

I should clarify that his tax position wasn't why my daughter liked him.  She liked him because he was pretty clear on his positions and didn't talk in 12-paragraph answers.

And she is realizing that Obama isn't at all who he said he was.  This is a big deal to me,  as I was afraid she was entrenched in her support.

Now I must leave and get on with my day.

96 HeeeHaww! It's- The Osama bin Laden Joke Book

97 I'd feel a lot better about the "This tax system is better than That tax system" argument if there was a nation-wide consensus to obliterate at least three federal departments.

98

Saw part of "The ED Show" last night, and even more over the top than usual.  Long tirade about Bush standing up Obama at Ground Zero because he was miffed about not "getting enough credit" for UBL takedown.  Next, he asked a guest about that, who said he thought Bush didn't join Obama because "he's been dead drunk for three days".  Then, time for everyone to text what they thought about that.

 

It frightens me that some people actually mistake MSNBC for news.

99 So on the Fair Tax model once again Warren Buffett would likely pay less in taxes than me, that bug eyed tightwad. Seriously, a fair tax does allow the tightwad billionaire to pay a lot less in taxes than the spendthrift millionaire.

100 So, Usama's bedside notepad reveals that he was planning attacks on American...passenger trains!

Trains are not "relevant." How often I have had to remind Atlas Shrugged reviewers that a story about railroads is not irrelevant as long as the Vice President wants a train set just like the Chinese are building.

Well, they're "relevant" now, all of a sudden. Usama B. Ladin, Ayn Rand reviewer. Hey, he's not dead: he's gone to Galt's Gulch, with that other rascally scamp, Ragnar Danneskold. Pass it on. Good for box office.

101 Income taxes themselves are the problem. Get rid of them.

102 Forget any sort of direct taxation.  Take the total federal budget, and require each state to collect a portion equal to it's percentage of the US population.

This.  If we want the states to find the solutions best for them in everything else, why make an exception here?

103 So imagine you get a chance to get Bin Laden. You know where he is. You've been scoping out his hideout for months. You've been eavesdropping on his conversation. Hell you even hacked his PS3 for fun and took out the whole network because you know he's been using it to communicate with Al Qaeda. Why just kill him immediately? And what's all this with a burial at sea? Just put a few stupid words in the mouth of Obama and everybody believes it - stupid people because they're gullible and smart people because they think they're smarter. 

C'mon. You don't get your mitts on Bin Laden just to kill him, and you don't have 40 SEALs who are too slow to tackle the dude. There's is no picture because he's not dead yet. They're twisting him on a spit and slow roasting him until he's so tender the secrets just drip off the bones. They've got him simmering in pentathol. 

By the way, does anybody think the exfil was done all in one swoop? There are still dudes back in the area slurping up traffic.

When I first heard the story break, I could have sworn it was a week delayed. But there was live tweeting going on by locals who heard the helo crash but didn't know what it was. They thought it was a drone attack. Anyway I was sure that there were networks to roll up in advance of the announcement. But it looks Obama had to speak fairly quickly about the 'kill' before the real-time world caught up with him. Still, our men in camo and blackface know how to get out of Dodge under the cover of darkness leaving no trail, so nobody knows exactly how they humped OBL out of the middle of Pakistan to 'the sea'. That's a dark trail - so dark that in fact OBL could be anywhere.

He's certainly not free or missing, that's for sure. He's never going to see the light of day. But is he dead at this very moment? You will never know.

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