1 The bigger question: If it is, do I care enough to stop eating it? No, I don't think so.

2 Makes sense but it also makes you surer that you can't believe "settled science".

3 I consume a LOT of protein!

4 So cancer cells that develop from cells with insulin receptors also have insulin receptors. This is unexpected?

5 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable tyrant.

6 "60 MINUTESHigh joblessness in the home of U.S. space flight1 of 860 MINUTESEven in tough times, contemporary art sells2 of 860 MINUTESIs sugar toxic?3 of 860 MINUTES OVERTIMESugar and kids: The toxic truth4 of 860 MINUTESSergio Marchionne: Resurrecting Chrysler5 of 860 MINUTESEvidence of Innocence: The case of Michael Morton6 of 860 MINUTESNovak Djokovic: From war to Wimbledon7 of 860 MINUTESSpaceX: Entrepreneur's race to space8 of 8
April 1, 2012 7:07 PM
PRINT TEXT"
====================

Most other sites would have left this part out, but Ace gets under the skin of a story like few others can!

7 Wait... Cancers are evolving now? How? Any adaptations the Cancer cells form to survive in a particular host aren't passed on are they?

How long until Cancers become sentient and start demanding rights? How long until Cancers rise up and take over?

8 Only non-organic sugar is toxic. Fair-trade sugar is good for you.

9 But this doesn't actually say it causes cancer, merely feeds cancer as #4 says above.  Sounds like another "crisis"!

10 Of course, if you don't consume anything, your risk for cancer goes way down.  Your risk for malnutrition and starvation go way up, but those are risks, right?

This is freaking stupid- it's more nanny-statism.  Worse, it's not even advocating a Nanny State because they believe in a Nanny State, but because they see a pay-day in it for them.  Nevermind the affects on your personal Liberty.

11 In the Church of Me, we eat scientist. They provide all the nutrients Meist need. It's the New Age Brawndo!

12 Anything taken to excess is toxic. Life causes death. The older I get the more I realize it. Something is going to get me.

13 Shut up and eat your peas.

14 I am suspicious when the entire medical community has thus far missed this critically important aspect of the effects of one of our ubiquitous foods.  I'm not saying it can't be true, but I'll need a lot more evidence.

15 We have determined that FLOTUS' ass is therefore more dangerous than the Chernobyl site.

16 You guys get that the old meme that the cheeseburger is "death" is dead? The bun apparently does more damage. A whole wheat bagel and fruit are worse for you than an egg and a piece of bacon. It's a whole new way of thinking.

17

>>If it is, do I care enough to stop eating it? No, I don't think so.

 

If you are feeling good and not too worried about the long term, maybe not.

 

I changed my diet last year and I feel sooo different. In a good way, that is. Worth missing certain foods, most definitely.

18 So fruit is toxic now?

19 Something is going to get me.

As opposed to?

20 18 So fruit is toxic now?

Chimpanzees hardest hit.

21 I intend to continue my "seefood" diet.
I expect it will eventually kill me.

22 Science first:

I was told there would be no science.

23 Gary Taubes, pep. Two books full. The second one is an easier read, the first has more technical details.

24 So, in other words, Skittles killed that poor youth....

25 I expect it will eventually kill me.

I'm right there with you.  But it'll taste good until then, right?

26 good thing I don't believe a damn thing that comes out of "scientists" mouths these days.

27

How long until Cancers become sentient and start demanding rights? How long until Cancers rise up and take over?

Cancer unite, you have nothing to lose but your host!

28 Everything is bad for you..

29 Speaking of- if things go as I hope, there will be banana bread waiting for me at home this evening #winning.

30 Everything gives you cancer There's no cure...there's no answer.

31

>>If you are feeling good and not too worried about the long term, maybe not.

Heh, I'm 18. Should I be feeling any differently?

32
So their argument is that if I cut out most of the fat and sugar in my diet, I'll live longer.

My question is WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO LIVE LONGER UNDER THOSE CONDITIONS????

Of course, the really big takeaway from this is that the noted icon of television journalism 60 Minutes is getting their stories from youtube videos. *snort*

33 Fruit isn't toxic but replacing cheese with jicama is the wrong thing to do. But fruits are much higher in sugar than vegetables and should be looked at as "sugary". They also don't do much for hunger.

34 Sugar will soon be illegal under the new ObamaCare health is commerce clause Mmmkay?

35 IIRC, he is not an MD or a PhD.  Again, not saying it isn't true.  As with Trayvon, I want to see the data, over many trials.

36

With all the government-grant  cancer research that's going on, they feel they have to blame it on something.   The timing is suspect because of Moochelles tyranical  behaviour on food. 

 

The sugar theory will also be disproven.   Just like in the medicine,  when the government gets out of the agenda-driven government grant business, we'll start seeing some serious research done.

37 No one gets out of here alive!

38 Everything gives you cancer There's no cure...there's no answer. Posted by: Joe Jackson at April 02, 2012 12:37 PM (96M6e) --------------------------------------------------- Did you read it in the sunday papers?

39 Im ready to jump on board this anti-sugar campaign but Im waeary that the science is agenda driven like GW and second-hand smoke. 

40 I feel tons better too Mama AJ. Completely different.

41 I'm starting to suspect a return of Sumptuary Laws is in the offing.

42 I, for one, look forward to every foodstuff being dictated and managed by Our Congressional Overlords.

43

>>>So their argument is that if I cut out most of the fat and sugar in my diet, I'll live longer. My question is WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO LIVE LONGER UNDER THOSE CONDITIONS????

*slow clap*

44

If it's on 60 Minutes, it's pushing an agenda.

45 No sugar tonite in my coffee.

No sugar tonite in my tea.

No sugar to stand beside me.

No sugar to run with me.

Dat'n doo dow dow.

46 Anything that can be reduced to a white powder is not that good for you.
Kind of like heavy petting, it's unsanitary, but then, you don't do it for your health.

47
So fruit is toxic now?

Posted by: polynikes at April 02, 2012 12:34 PM (kg7Iv)

Fruit are just vegetables that fool you by tasting good.

/old hunter's joke

48 Sugar bad for you? Fat not so bad? Less sugar, more starch, fiber, and fats? So those folks back in the 1800's were on to something?

49 Alar is toxic too.  Just so you know.

50 40/40/20 percent Calories from quality, less refined Protein/Carbohydrates/Fat.

You need them all.  But I do think that there is something to the refined sugars being killers. Though it may be that some are far more sensitive to it than others, much like some people are lactose intolerant, or have to stay away from gluten.

Personal diet experience anyway.

51 Sugar is powered whore. Don't let your daughter have it.

52

I don't put much stock in what doctors and nurses say. And frankly, half the time it sounds like they're talking out of their asses when they blurt out whats supposedly bad for you.

53 But how do they blame the Jews for this? I don't see the connection.

54 Dang.  This thread is making me hungry.

Time for lunch.

55 Here's the thing, I feel different with no sugar and no carbs other than dark vegetables. If I didn't feel great, I wouldn't buy into it. All the reflux, acid, and joint pain are gone. No headaches, no stomach aches, no pain. More energy.

56
Sugar is powered whore. Don't let your daughter have it.

Posted by: Ben at April 02, 2012 12:41 PM (wuv1c)

Okay, that made me laugh.

57
Ya know..... studies have shown that divers breathing pure O2 have a higher incidence of lung cancer.

EPA regulations banning oxygen in 5....4....3....2....

58 The sugar theory will also be disproven. Just like in the medicine, when the government gets out of the agenda-driven government grant business, we'll start seeing some serious research done.

Posted by: Soona at April 02, 2012 12:37 PM (TRGoi)

 

---------------------------------------

 

Badly written.  When researchers get away from  the  agenda-driven government grant business, we'll  once again start seeing serious research on cancer. 

59 worst news i've seen all week

60 Everything in moderation...including moderation.

61 You know what's really toxic?  GM trucks.

62 brb, gettin another hit of high fructose corn syrup....there's a dealer I know that is usually hanging out in the alley behind 7-11

63 From the same outfit that brought you "Alar on apples is going to KILL you and YOUR KIDS!!!*"

Oh, I'm quite sure their ethics have only gotten better in the 25+ years since then.







*If and only if you drink it by the barrel. Otherwise, a quick rinse with water removes all Alar from the apple. But, fuck you Washington state apple growers, our ratings are more important than your livelihood.

64 Fat, sugar, salt and caffeine.  The four basic food groups.

65 I heard that eating carrots lead to death. Or at least the fact that everyone who eats carrots will eventually die.

66 If this turns out to be bullshit, I want to be the one to break that story.

67 Dear Ace Your excessive sugar consumption is costing everyone now and is an undue burden on the rest of the citizenry. You must cease and desist at once. Will be sending the ObamaCare Health Patrol to your neighborhood on their scheduled route next Tuesday.

68 I have a health book from the early 1900's, and some of the stuff described as "good for you" back then was pretty rediculous. The one thing I remember was the section on DDT powder for head lice.

69 64Everything in moderation...including moderation.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (NJConservative) at April 02, 2012 12:43 PM (nEUpB)

 

 

Ever see that Kids In The Hall skit with Scott Thompson in the role of the flamboyant Buddy Cole talking about safer drug use?  Hilarious....

"my credo is moderation....within reason!"

70 Eventually, life will kill me... so what's the point again?

71 Am I right to be concerned when Russian leadership inserts itself in American politics and endorses one presidential candidate over another? It's almost like the Russians see an advantage FOR THEM by supporting a certain candidate {{{{{ cough-Barack Obama-cough}}}}. That's not anything for me to lose sleep over is it?

72  I, for one, look forward to every foodstuff being dictated and managed by Our Congressional Overlords.

Posted by: jakeman at April 02, 2012 12:39 PM (96M6e)

 

-----------------------------------------

 

This.  This is the real end-point to all of this.  Just think how things are going to be if Ocare survives.

73 Actually there is quite a bit of science behind this idea already, mostly basic cellular physiology. Many of us in the fitness and nutrition community realized a long time ago that it was not fat that was the bad guy, but sugar. And the government, as usual, had its head up its ass and got on board with the wrong regulations. This study is the equivalent of an economist coming on 60 minutes and saying, "y'know, we've thought about it, and we may be realizing that socialism just doesn't work!"

74

Mmmmm.  Just ate 20 Chocolate M&M's.  I think I'll go grab another handful and chase it with a Coke.

75 Nothing to see here.

This is like Big Pork funding a study on how chicken is bad for you.

76 Posted by: dagny at April 02, 2012 12:42 PM (CMM9V)

Wow! A study with one subject. Stop the presses!

Yes, I am being snarky, but we are supposed to be the rational ones. The people who need data and appreciate the scientific method and understand that there is huge variation in the human genome.

Studies describe populations; they don't describe individuals. Your diet might make you feel like you are 20 years old and ready to run a marathon, and it might make your next-door-neighbor feel like he has a perpetual case of the flu.

We are immensely complicated organisms, and the simple answer is rarely the correct answer.

77 3 I consume a LOT of protein!

Posted by: Sandra Fluke at April 02, 2012 12:30 PM (H84UO)

Actually, there's very little protein in semen.  It's mostly carbs for the little swimmers making the long journey to find the fabled egg of legend.

78 69Fat, sugar, salt and caffeine. The four basic food groups.

Posted by: toby928© at April 02, 2012 12:44 PM (GTbGH)

 

 

 

Booze isn't a food group?

79 I have a health book from the early 1900's, and some of the stuff described as "good for you" back then was pretty rediculous. The one thing I remember was the section on DDT powder for head lice.

Cocaine was recommended for a while.

80 dagny at April 02, 2012 12:34 PM (CMM9V)

Purely as a result of a stomach problem I changed my eating pattern. I now drink 16oz of V-8, and eat a citrus fruit, an egg and four ounces of protein for breakfast. I eat very little carbohydrates the rest of the day. Not the Atkins, just slowly adding back the food that makes me feel good.  I've lost 40 pounds in five months. It's leveld off at about a pound a week.

81 I thought it was corn syrup and other cheap additives/substitutes that your body doesn't process the same way as glucose, fructose, and whatever.
This could also be one of those 'eggs are bad for you/no, they're healthy' or butter vs. margarine deals where the science keeps flip-flopping.

82 79 Mmmmm. Just ate 20 Chocolate MM's. I think I'll go grab another handful and chase it with a Coke. ********** Arrest this burden on society at once!! Have you no decency-Sir!

83

Also my old health book recommends only weekly showers, but in between you would do a dry towel bath, where you rub a dry towel all over your body. To put a good shine on the funk, I guess.

84 Cigarettes are still OK, right?

85 Mmmmm. Just ate 20 Chocolate MM's. I think I'll go grab another handful and chase it with a Coke.

Beer.  The alcohol neutralizes the sugar.

86 80Nothing to see here.

This is like Big Pork funding a study on how chicken is bad for you.

Posted by: Lord Monochromicorn at April 02, 2012 12:47 PM (6IwWE)

 

 

Or those Chick-Fil-A ads with the cows....I wonder when they'll figure out that those are dairy cows, and probably won't find their way into a burger.

87 Posted by: CDR M at April 02, 2012 12:46 PM (Mv/2X)

I just perfected my caramels coated in bittersweet chocolate recipe.

There is a two pound box ready to go for after the Seder.

Needless to say the candy is much more exciting than the prospect of listening to my idiot liberal aunt wax poetic about the progressive agenda.

88 Purely as a result of a stomach problem I changed my eating pattern. I now drink 16oz of V-8, and eat a citrus fruit, an egg and four ounces of protein for breakfast. I eat very little carbohydrates the rest of the day. Not the Atkins, just slowly adding back the food that makes me feel good. I've lost 40 pounds in five months. It's leveld off at about a pound a week. Posted by: Quilly Mammoth at April 02, 2012 12:48 PM (sl3x6) ********* Please sell CDR M a fat ass credit at once-that's an order!!

89 Actually, there's very little protein in semen. It's mostly carbs for the little swimmers making the long journey to find the fabled egg of legend.

-------

Then.... why does it taste so salty????

90 "Actually, there's very little protein in semen."
====================

Yeah, but I take in A LOT from ALL COMERS! Get it?

91 Ace, you missed the part about sugar promoting formation of especially bad cholesterol.  That was at least half of this piece.

The part about cancer was a bit more dubious, but the first part about sugar calories promoting bad cholesterol where other calories (fat, etc.) did not was pretty convincing.

92 brb, buyin' carbohydrate credits

93 Mmmmm. Just ate 20 Chocolate MM's. I think I'll go grab another handful and chase it with a Coke.

Coke 'n' chocolate.

Blecch.

94 High fructose corn syrup is not the same as sugar.

Unless you're an American Corn Farmer. Then they're totally like the same.

95 I just perfected my caramels coated in bittersweet chocolate recipe. There is a two pound box ready to go for after the Seder. Needless to say the candy is much more exciting than the prospect of listening to my idiot liberal aunt wax poetic about the progressive agenda. Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (NJConservative) at April 02, 2012 12:49 PM (nEUpB) ****** My head is going to explode!!1 Would someone get the Swiss Army guards over here and arrest these people!

96 Beer. The alcohol neutralizes the sugar.

Posted by: jwb7605 at April 02, 2012 12:49 PM (Qxe/p)

 

Well then Happy Hour can't get here soon enough then!  I wonder if the boss will allow an earlier Happy Hour to support my health concerns to counteract my sugar intake?

97 I'll eat when I'm hungry,
I'll drink when I'm dry.
And if I stay lucky,
I'll live 'till I die.

Worrying about all this sh*t will kill you.

98

90 Cigarettes are still OK, right?

-------

Turns out it was the use of matches  that  was  causing  the  cancer.

99 model_1066, no kidding. The sh*t will hit the fan when they come after my demon rum. (Didn't we already run that experiment once?) Except this time, I think they're going to do it by taxing it For The Children like they do with cigs. When we lived in Canada back in 2009, we survived by making our own wine in one of the little DIY shops you can find in some of the provinces. It was awful, but got the price down to $6/bottle.

100 I've lost 33 pounds so far on a diet of high fat, medium protein, low carbs -- no sugar, grain, starch except on special occasions (I find the best carbohydrates for a "cheat night" are to be found in microbrews). reddit.com/r/keto has a good FAQ with links to lots of useful info. Oh, and guess whose fault it is that millions of Americans are fat and diabetic? George Fucking McGovern. As Rosie would say, "Google it!"

101

This is an area where you'd expect 'progressives' to emulate Eurotrash...from what I recall, they enjoy actual food and aren't interested in changing that.

102 yeah, I got on this Train last Summer:  Stopped eating candy and cut back on soda, etc. 

Three months ago I Stepped it Up:  Cut back on bread and stopped eating pastry, chips,  etc

Some weight loss, but like The Dude I am a lazy man.......

103 Please sell CDR M a fat ass credit at once-that's an order!!

Posted by: Justice Breyer at April 02, 2012 12:50 PM (r2PLg)

 

Don't need it.  My metabolism is through the roof.

104 brb, smokin' a sugar-free Kool

105 Posted by: toby928© at April 02, 2012 12:44 PM (GTbGH)

Wrong. Where the hell did you learn that crap?

The four food groups are: Cheese, bacon, booze, steak and chocolate.

Yeah, that's five. So sue me.

106 Sounds suspiciously like Atkins was right. 

107 Many of us in the fitness and nutrition community realized a long time ago that it was not fat that was the bad guy, but sugar. And the government, as usual, had its head up its ass and got on board with the wrong regulations.


Yep....been reading about this for at least the last 5 years from fitness and nutrition specialists.  It's new because it's now mainstream.


Coconut oil and butter are really good fats.  I was just watching a video about a doctor whose husband was diagnosed with alzheimer's.  She did some research and put him on coconut oil which has some properties to clear out the gook that accumulates in alzheimers patient's brain.  Within 3 weeks his tests where much, much better.


Here's the video if you're interested:  http://tinyurl.com/87hf3ow

108 ummm, but no cutting back on Jim.  Water of life, and all that

( all Things in moderation )

109 High fructose corn syrup is not the same as sugar.

Unless you're an American Corn Farmer. Then they're totally like the same.
Posted by: Darth Chipmunk
........
They are exactly the same as far as your body is concerned.

110 Say.. those of you who have cut out sugar..  Do any of you use sugar substitutes?

111 Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (NJConservative) at April 02, 2012 12:47 PM (nEUpB)


Oh, cut it out.

 I said that I feel much much better having eliminated all the sugar including carbs. The point was that having tried it, if I hadn't seen results, I would have cried bull shit and gone about my day. My point is that if you have reflux or gerd or a lot of indigestion or joint pain, try the no carb/sugar thing for a week and see how it goes. It won't hurt you. The government is in bed with the lobbyists who created the pyramid that doesn't work for anyone. I'm happy to try solutions that don't cost money and don't hurt anything. It's illogical to react so violently against something that clearly isn't a bad idea. It certainly may not be a good idea for everyone. Hell, my son needs to be bigger for football. He should have bread.

112 They are exactly the same as far as your body is concerned.

They metabolize at different rates.
That is useful information when "sugaring up" the grandkids.

113 "They are exactly the same as far as your body is concerned."

Untrue

114 116 Truvia. However, there isn't much call for using it since I don't know what to put it in or on other than plain yoghurt.

115 Except the coconut diet thing was a hoax, according to various alzheimers associations.

116 "60 Minutes" still is being broadcast??

117

I wonder where whiskey ranks of the good for you scale. I'll just assume its way up there.

118 A Princeton University research team has demonstrated that all sweeteners are not equal when it comes to weight gain: Rats with access to high-fructose corn syrup gained significantly more weight than those with access to table sugar, even when their overall caloric intake was the same. 

In addition to causing significant weight gain in lab animals, long-term consumption of high-fructose corn syrup also led to abnormal increases in body fat, especially in the abdomen, and a rise in circulating blood fats called triglycerides. The researchers say the work sheds light on the factors contributing to obesity trends in the United States.

"Some people have claimed that high-fructose corn syrup is no different than other sweeteners when it comes to weight gain and obesity, but our results make it clear that this just isn't true, at least under the conditions of our tests,"

119 >> Say.. those of you who have cut out sugar.. Do any of you use sugar substitutes? I use Sucralose (Splenda) drops called EZ-Sweetz. Seems pricey until you realize a single bottle will last months. Two or three drops in a cup of coffee is all you need. I generally try to avoid Aspartame (NutraSweet) partly because it sometimes gives me headaches and partly because it tastes like semi-sweet monkey butts.

120 Many years ago, through personal research, I discovered that excessive carbohydrate consumption does, indeed, assist cancer growth. The government has been encouraging us to poison ourselves for decades with their upside down food pyramid. The good thing is that they are now discovering what our taste buds have told us forever; bacon is good for us.

121

I'm not believing any of this horseshit.  It'll all change in another two or three years anyway, with another "expanded" study.  It's like people are already waiting on pins and needles find out what the  govenment researchers will let us eat next.

 

Sorry.  Not falling for it.

122 Posted by: dagny at April 02, 2012 12:57 PM (CMM9V)

There is a well-known artifact in these studies that confounds them. Any change that makes people feel better (whether it is the placebo effect or a biochemical effect) tends to make them feel better about everything. So a diet that makes you feel better generally will also make you feel like your knees don't hurt as much, or your reflux isn't as bad, etc.

I'm really not trying to fight, especially with a Papist. Don't you folks still have armies?

123 Let me take a wild shot at the reason(s) behind the increases in heart disease, diabetes, high blood pressure, etc....

We are all working ourselves to death.

Our careers, or the results thereof ($$$), drive us to work ever more hours with our health, family, and mental stability taking a very distant backseat.

The exhaustion, frustration, and guilt that comes with it gnaws away at us.

Modern humans are not meant to work 12-16 hour days, every day, weeks in a row without a break. We are not supposed to come home and drop from exhaustion after eating the closest thing we can get our hands on (if at all). We are not supposed to derive our sense of self-esteem from whether or not we work ourselves into a grave faster than the guy in the office next to us.

I grew up with grandparents who survived the depression and thus valued work for the sake of work. So, no matter how badly I was treated at a job I took the approach "What can I do to improve/survive the situation" and drove myself even harder.

Eighteen years later, with the same company, after several promotions.... after setting up new departments from scratch.... after watching my talented and dedicated co-workers be screwed over time and time again.... after 18 years without a single black mark on my file, my newly-hired boss has decided that I am unable to perform in the job I have been doing for 5 years and I have about 30 days to "please her" or I am out of a job without a severance.

The stress of my job has now resulted in a Pavlovian response to the sight or mention of anything associated with my company: heart palpitations and pain in the chest. Not good signs in someone with chronic, progressive heart disease.

Kids.... do not make the same mistakes your elders have made.

Live your life. DO NOT make your work your life. It will never return the love and commitment you have entrusted it with.

Trust me on this.

124 I'd like to recommend to all of these so-called health experts who are trying to convince folks that food is killing them to go on a fast. Permanently.

125 Don't need it. My metabolism is through the roof. Posted by: CDR M at April 02, 2012 12:53 PM (Mv/2X) (Bastard.) Still -I'm about to hit you with the Commerce Clause so hard, you people will be sucking your Aunt Jemima syrup through a straw!

126

There be good news on the food front as well:  From Insty:

 

“The component that gives cayennes, jalapenos, habaneros and other chili peppers their heat, capsaicin already has an established role in medicine in rub-on-the-skin creams to treat arthritis and certain forms of pain. Past research suggested that spicing food with chilies can lower blood pressure in people with that condition, reduce blood cholesterol and ease the tendency for dangerous blood clots to form.”

 

And I love me some spicy food.

127 Sugar used to be classified as a 'drug'.....and was recommended for ladies during their 'monthlies' to help ease cramps.

128

"Dr. Sanjay Gupta: So with the best of intentions, they say, "Time to reduce fat in the American diet?"

Dr. Robert Lustig: Exactly. And we did. And guess what? Heart disease, metabolic syndrome, diabetes and death are skyrocketing."

Yeah.  We do exactly what they tell us to do.  Don't we?  I call two steaming fistfuls of bullshit.

129 Reflux symptoms are what caused me to cut out bread and such. Some fruits still are good for me though.

130 >> I wonder wherewhiskey ranks of the good for you scale. Potential liver trauma notwithstanding, distilled liquors are fine for a low-sugar diet. They still contain calories, but the body burns alcohol calories before it burns carbs or fat. Scotch and soda, gin and diet tonic... plenty of options!

131 Bullshit.

“Sugar and high-fructose corn syrup are nutritionally the same,’’ said Dr. Jacobson, who has a doctorate in microbiology. “I don’t know if ‘corn sugar’ is the best term, but it’s better than ‘high-fructose corn syrup.’ ”

High-fructose corn syrup, which came into widespread use in the 1970s, isnÂ’t particularly high in fructose, but was so named to distinguish it from ordinary, glucose-containing corn syrup, according to a report in The American Journal of Clinical Nutrition. High-fructose corn syrup and sucrose (also known as table sugar) contain about the same amount of glucose and fructose. In fact, one commonly used version of the ingredient known as HFCS-42 actually contains less fructose (42 percent) than table sugar, which has 50 percent fructose, according to the report.

“The name is confusing, and consumers don’t understand that it has the same calories as sugar,” said Ms. Erickson, of the Corn Refiners Association. “They also think it’s sweeter tasting. That’s why the alternate name provides clarity for consumers when it comes to the ingredient composition and helps them better understand what’s in their foods.”

132 I don't trust any info that comes from 60 Minutes of Horseshit or Ralph Nader.

133

There's a study where they gave birds a choice between  regular fertilized bird seed or organic. The birds chose the fertilized, but about 20% chose the organic. OK I lied about the 20%, there aren't any liberal birds. 

134

If it was on 60 minutes, it's pretty much guaranteed to be bullshit. However, the good Dr. has a point - after 50 years of following "heart-healthy" guidlines, heart disease is more prevalent than ever.

So something needs reexamining. As far as doctors 'missing" this, my experience is that today's medical science can work wonders if you have smashed a bone or have a hole in you somewheres. Anything more suble than that, and the doctors are pretty much clueless.

 

135 I'm leary over the sugar - cancer connection; but am sold on the HFCS - over sweetened angle. I cut sweeteners hard, cold eff'turkey, and have lost 40+ lbs.

136 128 Divisions and divisions. I'm a convert from pure Wasp so I have an episcopalian's restraint without the ghey sex.

That effect would make sense if I had known it was going to make my stomach problems or my aches go away. It didn't. In fact, I expected the opposite with the stomach. I always figured I needed bread/starch to soak up the acid, not that it was causing the acid production.

137
Say.. those of you who have cut out sugar.. Do any of you use sugar substitutes?

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at April 02, 2012 12:56 PM (f9c2L)

Depending on the meal, single malt scotch or 2 Buck Chuck.

138 well, N's dead horse, I know a lot of people who hardly work at all, and they're overweight, unhealthy, etc

maybe it's just a Cali Thing, but I live in Florida part of the year and there are many slackers in the Sunshine State, too. 

'early retirement', my ass;  some of These People never really did work much

139 There is a well-known artifact in these studies that confounds them. Any change that makes people feel better (whether it is the placebo effect or a biochemical effect) tends to make them feel better about everything. So a diet that makes you feel better generally will also make you feel like your knees don't hurt as much, or your reflux isn't as bad, etc.

****

I'm not sure that the placebo effect works in the scenario you've put forth.

Common benefits of losing weight are reduced strain on the joints and a reduction or elimination of acid reflux.

140 Do I have to turn in my man card if I admit that I love salads and vegetables?  I have been known to eat spinach out of the can, with lots of pepper.

141 Live your life. DO NOT make your work your life. It will never return the love and commitment you have entrusted it with.

Trust me on this.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 02, 2012 01:02 PM (piMMO)

I see we have similar backgrounds.
I began taking my morning "fuckitall" several years ago.
Health improved measurably.

142 I did Atkins hard core about ten years ago. Lost a ton of weight.

The only problem was that I couldn't sustain the regiment. Damn it, I like carbs; I like sugar.

And as soon as I reintroduced those things, all the weight came back, seemingly overnight.

143 I don't think most fats by themselves are bad for you at all. It's eating fats in combination with carbs and sugar that kills people. We eat a low carb diet around here - mostly lean meats, eggs, some cheese, fruit and veggies, nuts. Great way to stay thin and not be hungry.

144

129..... and I have about 30 days to "please her" or I am out of a job without a severance.

 

Damn, that sucks, NDH. ....Sorry to hear that. No pressure, right? .....Did she give out the criteria by which 'pleasing her' might be accomplished?

145 "Do I have to turn in my man card if I admit that I love salads and vegetables? I have been known to eat spinach out of the can, with lots of pepper."
==============

You don't say!  ARK! ARKARKARKARKARKARKARK!

146 last week the Wall Street Jerkoffs had an article on a study showing that eating chocolate made you lose weight.  -

-Also, somewhere recently I read that if a dude was drinking 'moderately' before heart surgery, continuing to Drink Moderately after the surgery will .......prolong life

up is down....

147 Well, isn't that something *puts 1/2lb sugar in coffee cup*

148 Posted by: IllTemperedCur at April 02, 2012 01:06 PM (tQoT4)

About 10 years ago I was in a restaurant in Georgetown. Their wine list was so outrageously priced (6X retail) that I stuck with martinis for the whole meal. That was a revelation -- that hard alcohol has its place alongside food!

149 perfecthealthdiet dot com. These are real scientists (not "nutritionists") dealing with these issues and trying to find answers in honest and straightforward ways and scientifically accurate ways. They like, actually engage in debates with people who claim they are wrong, and talk about studies and evidence, and stuff. If you want any clarity at all on nutrition this is the best place to start. (they have a funny post on the stork theory of birth at top right now, just scroll down -- or buy the book). IMO, the combination of the relative infancy of nutrition science, a culture that highlights weight and appearance, and the fact that the drive-by-media and the bestselling book industry are more interested in selling papers and books than making well-grounded and careful scientific claims has done massive damage to American health over the past 50 years. We've en masse replaced butter (not bad) with poly-unsaturated vegetable oils (pretty damn near toxic on its own), and sugar (the combination of the two is almost demonstrably toxic in clinical trials). And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

150 Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 02, 2012 01:07 PM (piMMO)

I'm not talking about weight loss (of course you are correct) but changes in diet that affect general perceived well being.

151 Except the reflux and the joint pain go away within days of de-carbing, not due to weight loss. I don't mean that it would remove the symptoms for people with mechanical issues but it might help. They're starting to think heart disease and other diseases; lupus, diabetes, arthritis, etc are caused by inflammation. Gluten, for those sensitive to it, and possibly sugar can cause inflammation.

152

Shakedown.

153 I came out of long-time lurk mode yesterday in the book thread. While I'm sitting here recovering from my second knee replacement in five months, I decided to read the Gary Taubes book "Why We Get Fat...". Instapundit has pushed the low carb/no sugar/ more protein and fat diets for a long time and recommended this book, so I bought it and found it to be quite persuasive.I see that some of regulars here have referred to this eating philosophy in a few posts above, so there may be something to this new-fangled research condemning sugar. The designated spouse and I may try the Paleo diet for a month this summer to see how we feel. I have a whole herd of ailments (RA, asthma, osteoporosis, GERD, high blood pressure) and it would be interesting to see if any symptoms go away or if we lose weight.Minimizing carbs is mighty tough.

154 Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 02, 2012 01:02 PM (piMMO)

Eesh, i was in a similar situation a few years back when our company hired a consultant to make things more efficient, just keep your nose to the grindstone and you should be fine.

155 137 Bullshit. “Sugar and high-fructose corn syrup are nutritionally the same,’’ ------ They're chemically the same (in terms of the molecular formulas - elements present and their ratios), but I when I read up on HFCS a while back I found that there was a different distribution of isomers that are produced during the manufacturing steps. (IIRC something to do with high temps used in processing the corn starch.) So the 64 million dollar question seems to be whether or not those isomers are metabolized differently. From what I could glean from the literature, the jury is still out on that. We're omnivores. I think we can handle a wide variety of food sources and, frankly, I think we do best when we ingest a varied diet. If I had kids, I would look at the labels and make sure they were not consuming tons of processed foods, including watching their intake of HFCS, but I wouldn't run and snatch a popsicle from their hands if there was HFCS in it.

156 Posted by: dagny at April 02, 2012 01:06 PM (CMM9V)

But no guitars and cymbals in church?

157

Pretty much everything that the 'medical community' once thought was true....has been later proven wrong.

 

Give it enough time, and these things that they are telling us today....will someday be 'revised' to reflect the opposite of what they're pushing right now.

 

I think the Greeks had the right idea with "nothing in excess".

158

My body usually tells me what it wants for food...like when I have a hangover, its practically screaming "greasy and spicy!!" so I get the huevos rancheros.

159

So, basically, these quacks have admitted that they have no idea what they're talking about. None.

 

This comes as no surprise to anyone who has to read the biomedical literature, which is pretty much crap. Few papers in that literature would ever be published in scientific (e.g., physics or chemistry) journals, where the central question asked of reviewers is whether the data support the conclusions. "Support" - not "fail to emphatically contradict."

160

Keep your laws off my body!!

161 I did Atkins hard core To be serious for a moment I and a friend of mine did Atkin's hardcore we both lost weight but we both came down with auto immune diseases. Could be pure coincidence and it's a smile size of exactly- two which is ludicrous but... Don't say i didn't warn you all. (It bugs me every time Ace or a commenter mentions it.)

162 163 I have to miss the early mass since they have guitars and the noise level from the "folk choir" is unreal. I keep expecting them to break into "rock me till the dawn, love me til the morning, then I'm gone...". Makes me really curmudgeonly. I don't know why I associate guitars, long hair and libs?

163 and it's a ^small sample^ size.

164 169163 I have to miss the early mass since they have guitars and the noise level from the "folk choir" is unreal. I keep expecting them to break into "rock me till the dawn, love me til the morning, then I'm gone...". Makes me really curmudgeonly. I don't know why I associate guitars, long hair and libs?

Posted by: dagny at April 02, 2012 01:19 PM (CMM9V)

 

 

Is that the same association demonstrated in Animal House?

 

165 I think the problem is it is probably unnatural for your body to be exposed to a diet that is overly concentrated on one thing.

166 Wish there were some way to eat like my farm living grandmother. Vegetables from the garden, eggs and chicken from the henhouse, no additives, no preservatives, probably raw milk, real bacon, self-canned fruit, etc. She put sugar in her pie but I bet other than the little piece she probably had, that was all the sugar she had all day.

167 160....I have a whole herd of ailments (RA, asthma, osteoporosis, GERD, high blood pressure) and it would be interesting to see if any symptoms go away or if we lose weight.Minimizing carbs is mighty tough.

 

Posted by: Terrified Lurker at April 02, 2012 01:13 PM (iKZTY)

 

Welcome, Lurker.

 

One of the dirty little secrets of the medical diagnosis arena, is that meds for allergies/asthma and for blood pressure.....cause drying of the joints, and thus create arthritis symptoms.

 

So if you have allergies or asthma....you take stuff to dry you up and enable you to breathe....those meds often cause your blood pressure to go up. ....You go to the doctor, he puts you on meds for the blood pressure. ....Next thing you know, you've got pain and inflamation in your joints.

 

It's a med-side-effect merry go round. 

168 That video link I posted @113 was not the video I remembered watching and of course, I cannot now find the one I wanted.  Damnit!

169 172I think the problem is it is probably unnatural for your body to be exposed to a diet that is overly concentrated on one thing.

Posted by: Justice Breyer at April 02, 2012 01:22 PM (r2PLg)

 

So what you're saying is that I should have a Manhattan with lunch, instead of the margarita?  I'll tough it out.

170

Posted by: Justice Breyer at April 02, 2012 01:22 PM (r2PLg)

Yeah, exactly.

171 This comes as no surprise to anyone who has to read the biomedical literature, which is pretty much crap. Few papers in that literature would ever be published in scientific (e.g., physics or chemistry) journals, where the central question asked of reviewers is whether the data support the conclusions. "Support" - not "fail to emphatically contradict."

Posted by: Jay Guevara at April 02, 2012 01:16 PM (iDKmH)

 

-------------------------------------------

 

It's like many of us know in the medical profession.  Medical research has been taken over by agenda-driven politics.  That's right, POLITICS.  Most of what one finds in medical journals anymore is statistically cooked data and, well, bullshit.

 

Perhaps once a year one finds  an article or paper that could be deemed serious research.

172 Um, wasn't I just reading the other day a couple of scientists complaining that 3/4 of the research being done is just made up bullcrap that can't be replicated?

173

173Wish there were some way to eat like my farm living grandmother. Vegetables from the garden, eggs and chicken from the henhouse, no additives, no preservatives, probably raw milk, real bacon, self-canned fruit, etc. She put sugar in her pie but I bet other than the little piece she probably had, that was all the sugar she had all day.

 

Where my folks live up in northern Wisconsin, one can do just that.  Lots of small farms around that sell eggs, dairy and meat from pigs/cattle they butcher on the spot. Great soil for gardening, more than enough blueberries, raspberries and blackberries growing wild (remember to share with the bears). Plus, you can supplement with hunting deer, turkey and other birds, and get fish out of Lake Superior.

174

27
How long until Cancers become sentient and start demanding rights? How long until Cancers rise up and take over?
Cancer unite, you have nothing to lose but your host!

 

Don't give the lefties any ideas, or they'll start agitating for Onco-American rights.

175 Damn, that sucks, NDH. ....Sorry to hear that. No pressure, right? .....Did she give out the criteria by which 'pleasing her' might be accomplished?


****

Yep. A six week schedule of deadlines that have to be met. The problem is that about half of what I do on a weekly basis wasn't incorporated into the schedule, so there's simply no way to accomplish everything even with all the hours that I work.

She's been with the company for four months. In that time she has yet to request to see the systems we work with or any processes associated with the production of our work, thus has no idea what it takes to perform our jobs. The folks in my department are the best and all are seriously struggling right now. It has taken me down first because of my heart condition.

As the stress has intensified, so has my condition. A couple of months ago I started experiencing pains in my chest. Then I ended up having two TIAs inside of two weeks (at which time I worked from my hospital bed). Then I ended up in the E.R. thinking I was having a heart attack. My cardiologist came in and gave me a huge hug and a kiss on the head and assured me I was not having a heart attack but rather suffering the effects of many different stress hormones being released into my system. He kept me in the hospital overnight, drugged, so that I could get a good nights sleep.

Truth be told, it seems the new gal has her sights set on getting rid of the old-timers and replacing us with her own hand-picked staff. The company will eventually catch up to her, but by then I will be gone.

This week, I am out because I started cracking under the weight. I met with my H.R.department last week to ask how in the world, after all my service, I can be denied my severance, which includes continued health benefits for seven months. His response was that he himself could not judge whether I am performing on the job well enough to meet expectations, that only my director could do that. Then, for the third time in the last several weeks, he spoke to me about my health benefits which includes 6 months of full-paid leave to recuperate from health issues.... and encouraged me to take advantage of the benefit. I think he believes I am about to snap.

So, I am out of work this week, getting even further behind, as my family doctor starts me on two different medications: One to make me sleep at night and a second to control anxiety before I destroy what is left of my already weakened heart.

This is not what life is supposed to be about.

176 Nobody's mentioning that it isn't the sugar that's really bad for you, it's the insulin spike that causes health problems. Anyone that works out a lot is familiar with these issues. Of course, if they do go the route of saying sugar is bad for you, they'll have to restrict any form of fast absorbing carbohydrate since they're all broken down into glucose to be absorbed into our cells. Even whole wheat bread is bad for you because of its additives. We're going to be restricted to an agrarian diet of green vegetables and brown rice with 1 scoop of protein powder to get our necessary body mass. Isn't life in this utopian society going to be grand.

177

173 Wish there were some way to eat like my farm living grandmother.

 

There are still people living that way, dagny. ....It's doable. ....But it's time consuming. ....So unless you are wealthy enough to pay people to do all that labor-intensive stuff for you, you will have to do all that gardening, livestock-tending, slaughtering, canning, etc....yourself.

 

There's a reason why people used to have a dozen kids. ....Free labor.

178 We're going to be restricted to an agrarian diet of green vegetables and brown rice with 1 scoop of protein powder to get our necessary body mass. Isn't life in this utopian society going to be grand.


*****

Start stocking up on arugula, STAT!

179

Perhaps once a year one finds an article or paper that could be deemed serious research.

 

Posted by: Soona at April 02, 2012 01:26 PM (TRGoi)

 

You mean like with positive and negative controls, reproducibility, and everything? Wow.

 

Seriously, though, I pity you having to read that stuff. I have to read it sometimes, and it drives me wild. I used to do a LOT of reviewing in academia (several papers a week), and can't stop writing mental reviews of papers I read. My poor wife hears my rants about flawed logic, flawed experimental design, and alternative mundane explanations overlooked by the authors (invariably in favor of more glamorous ones).

 

Researchers in these fields seem to think that biological variability relaxes the restrictions on scientific rigor and reproducibility, when in fact it tightens them. If your data are not reproducible, then you've got uncontrolled variables, and need to do more work to sort them out until your data ARE reproducible.

180 <<Im ready to jump on board this anti-sugar campaign but Im waeary that the science is agenda driven like GW and second-hand smoke.>>

I'm not saying you're right, but the long lecture video that has two million hits...the guy gets political at about the twenty minute mark when he blames Nixon for his "war on poverty".

So, seriously.

And then the good "doctor" claims that "everything has corn syrup in it" and then claimed they went to a store and looked at all the loaves of bread and only found one without corn syrup as an ingredient.

Yeah, see, I just checked all the loaves of bread in my house...none of them have corn syrup. I'm not saying there's no corn syrup in any bread. I'm saying the guy's credibility takes a hit when he makes stupid claims like that.

Not to mention he insists on calling obesity an "epidemic". No scientist worth his "science" would ever repeatedly use an incorrect term like this.

It's not science. It's "science"

Of course, the constant "subscribe to our upcoming series" ads throughout the video don't exactly lend credibility either. This guy's just looking for publicity.

181

182....Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 02, 2012 01:31 PM (piMMO)

 

Aw man, I'm sorry to hear that. That's some major suckage. ....I hope you can get some good rest, and hopefully find something else.....something with a lot less stress. {{{hugs}}} 

182

180 Where my folks live up in northern Wisconsin, one can do just that. Lots of small farms around that sell eggs, dairy and meat from pigs/cattle they butcher on the spot.

 

-----------

 

Can't imagine how they think they can get away with affecting interstate commerce like that.

 

183 Okay.

For the first time in a long I turned over to the Martha Stewart show.

She started out with white dinner plates, painted them red, and then applied gold-leaf to them in order to have a "solid gold" plate.

Has she never heard of Homegoods?!

Who the hell has time for that bullshit?!

184 The problem is that about half of what I do on a weekly basis wasn't incorporated into the schedule, so there's simply no way to accomplish everything even with all the hours that I work.

What if you asked her "X, Y and Z aren't on the schedule, did you want me to stop doing those things?"

185

186....What you have is systemic inflammation throughout your body, on a cellular level, that is causing all sorts of problems from insufficient mineral absorption to insulin resistance to a chronic auto-immune response.

 

Also..... Meds that have a drying effect on the body.....can also cause chronic intestinal problems, constipation, inflamation. ....The intestines are where the body absorbs nutrients. If they are out of whack, your whole body suffers. 

186 Most of medical research is wrong. But that's not due to any grand conspiracy. It's due to the pressures of the academic career. And the statistical illiteracy of most people, even working scientists.

If you use a 5% threshold for statistical significance that still means 1 in 20 results are bullshit.

But what people don't see are all the data that gets thrown out because the result wasn't publishable.

I can easily do 20 bullshit studies. Does eating one tomato a day reduce cancer? How about two? How about one in the morning? One at night? Two, but without the skin. Three mixed with banana.  Etc, etc.

Pretty soon one result will be "significant" and I can publish that. Hell I can just do the same test 20 times and get one publishable result.

And most working scientists aren't consciously engaging in fraud. If the data comes back wrong their self-interest makes them conclude -- oh, I must have screwed up the test. Bad data. Throw it out.

When the data comes back "correct" they just assume everything went perfect and publish.

It's a game with huge rewards. Lifetime tenure. That's worth millions. People respond to incentives. Sometimes consciously, but often times unconsciously.

187 Posted by: runninrebel at April 02, 2012 01:36 PM (N/1Dm)

That's all I was trying to say.

(This stupid skylander won't glue back together)

188 Really sorry to hear about your work problems, NDH. Can you use this week to start putting out some feelers for a new job? What's your field?

189 Have we mentioned that our brothers, Tran, & Sat are out to kill you, but you can totally trust us?

190 What if you asked her "X, Y and Z aren't on the schedule, did you want me to stop doing those things?"

*****

I did, but she has no intention of permitting me to get through the process. Last week I made it through the deadlines but had to compromise on the quality of my work to do so. So, this week, she inserted several new, undocumented tasks into the mix.

One of my co-workers was out several weeks with a serious health issue. She was on FMLA and using our company's very generous short-term disability program. Four days after she returned to work, her job was deemed unnecessary and was abolished.

191 I watched part of that show and I can tell you professionally that it was a complete load of crap.

192 >>Posted by: Sgt. York at April 02, 2012 01:39 PM Most of these folks out there marketing miracle diets and cures while simultaneously denigrating traditional western medicine based on research strike me as doing it for either the money or the cult following, but mostly the money.

193 What food staples are that packed with table sugar, anyway? Its no surprise to anyone that gorging on sweets isn't healthful. I personally rarely touch the stuff, but even modest consumers shouldn't be getting a double-digit percentage of their daily calories from sucrose.

194 Really sorry to hear about your work problems, NDH.

Can you use this week to start putting out some feelers for a new job? What's your field?

***

Thanks.

I've been in transportation for more than twenty years and have been marketing for the past 5 years.

Oh! And did I mention that I dropped out of school repeatedly to attend to last minute projects and business trips?

Yeah. So no degree.

195 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

196  
   I think Ynot hit on something with the omnivore statement. Becoming omnivores indicates that type diet is helpful for survival of the species, a primal urge for any life form.

   To me, it suggests that a varied diet would be the best method, in our lives, to prolong said life.  A caveat would be that moderation is important in any diet. 

   I pay no attention to what is considered proper diet, bur simply don't go crazy about amounts.  Seems to have worked for all 70 years of life to date.

197 60 minutes interview + youtube video != science

Truth is, any one study doesn't prove a damn thing.

It's a really hard problem. It's only when a large body of studies accumulate that we can have much confidence.

Also, diet and nutrition topics seem to make people crazy and paranoid and start talking of government and corporate conspiracies.

It's all a lie, but only I can see through the corporatist government lies!!!11! I now know the secrets to health and longevity!!11! Follow me good citizen!

198 It's already been mentioned, but everything is poisonous, depending on the dose.  Drinking too much water can kill you.  Breathing too much oxygen can kill you.

That being said, a change in diet will not change your lifespan significantly.  Depending on what you do, you may gain two years, tops.  But dying at 93 as opposed to dying at 91 is probably not that much different.

Everything in moderation.  Except alcohol.  And chocolate.  And bacon.

199 >>Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 02, 2012 01:57 PM My husband has had to do major reorgs at his various jobs over the years. It's a stressful process and usually takes at least 6 months, not the weeks you're describing. He has a background in compliance (and is just a very above-board guy anyway), so he works closely with HR to make sure that people are treated fairly. One thing I remember from his past couple of reorgs is that they've checked to make sure that the age distribution of the people whose positions were changed (or in a couple of cases eliminated) was balanced. In other words, he had to makes sure older workers weren't being overly represented. It sort of sounds like your boss is targeting the "old timers." Your HR department sounds like it's being too hands off in this process. It seems like they don't know how to stop what this new director is doing, but they are pointing you to a pathway wherein you might protect yourself some. Is there anyone higher up in the food chain you can talk to?

200 That being said, a change in diet will not change your lifespan significantly. Depending on what you do, you may gain two years, tops. But dying at 93 as opposed to dying at 91 is probably not that much different.


****

Egad! Have you seen those folks who are on the starvation diet? They've concluded that eating enough to survive but not to enough to prevent hunger, is the key to longevity.

Who the hell wants to live with the gnawing of hunger for 100 years?

201 What state are you in, Niedermeyer?

202 The "sugar is heroin" kooks have been providing us with mirth for decades.  It's a refreshing break from the usual "Coast to Coast" nuttery.

203 <<This is not what life is supposed to be about.>>

Agreed. I think it sucks what's happening to you, but if you believe in silver linings, it may be that your life needs to be about reduced stress. No job is worth what you've gone through. I hope everything works out for you.

204 Your HR department sounds like it's being too hands off in this process. It seems like they don't know how to stop what this new director is doing, but they are pointing you to a pathway wherein you might protect yourself some. Is there anyone higher up in the food chain you can talk to?


****

The new gal is a crony of the AVP for our department who, himself, is taking steps to undermine his boss, the VP.

I've already decided that, at this point, I am leaving...one way or the other. I will no longer allow then to suck the life-blood out of me. My top priority for now is to get healthy again or I won't be any good to any organization.

205
Agreed. I think it sucks what's happening to you, but if you believe in silver linings, it may be that your life needs to be about reduced stress. No job is worth what you've gone through. I hope everything works out for you.

****

thank you.

I passed a sign at a church the other day which read "When you're down to nothing, God is up to something."

My dream job could be waiting for me out there or, perhaps, an actual personal life. I do believe very strongly that everything happens for a reason and have wondered in the past if God wasn't trying to tell me something. Perhaps his whispering didn't get through to me, but his shouting certainly is.

206 My top priority for now is to get healthy again or I won't be any good to any organization. --- That sounds like a good plan. I really feel for you. I had two really bad work experiences in quick succession when I moved to California and it really shattered my confidence. It's one reason I haven't gone back to work. It's kind of humiliating with all the qualifications I have, but I am just not up to being put through the wringer a third time.

207 Fuck you Dr.Lustig,you can pry the sugar from my cold dead fingers.Fucking health nazis.

208 I feel your pain NDH, (except for the ones that feel like heart attacks).

Got a similar situation here but I've decided to mellow out and ride the burning wreckage into the ground unless they decide to kick me out prior to impact.  Ready to retire anyway,  I don't care and you can't make me.

209 The new gal is a crony of the AVP for our department who, himself, is taking steps to undermine his boss, the VP.

I've already decided that, at this point, I am leaving...one way or the other. I will no longer allow then to suck the life-blood out of me. My top priority for now is to get healthy again or I won't be any good to any organization.

Sounds like a snakepit. There might be some things you could do, but if your health is at stake you're probably best off to keep your head down as much as possible and work on getting out.

210
I really feel for you. I had two really bad work experiences in quick succession when I moved to California and it really shattered my confidence. It's one reason I haven't gone back to work. It's kind of humiliating with all the qualifications I have, but I am just not up to being put through the wringer a third time.


****

Ding!Ding!Ding!

My confidence is now for crap. The good thing is I have made some good contacts and I know I'll find something. And, I'm willing to take something making quite a bit less in exchange for not working myself into the grave.

I was very happy when I made half as much so there's no reason I can't be again.

211 Every time folks tell me we should put everything in the hands of the business sector claiming market forces make companies behave rationally, I think about all the nightmare job stories I've experienced or heard about. The fact of the matter is, businesses are just as flawed as governments or non-profits. Some people are just assholes and all too often that assholery is rewarded and those folks are put in charge.

212 Next week on 60 minutes, all food is bad for you, and you should just f'in die...you know, to save the planet.

213 Pretty soon one result will be "significant" and I can publish that. Hell I can just do the same test 20 times and get one publishable result.
--

Clubber Lang, do you work in a statistics-related field?  No need to answer if you don't feel comfortable - I'm just curious because I work in a related field and agree with your comment.  (In fact I need to get back to work now!)

214 The irony in all of this, of course, is that Dr. Atkins suggested that sugar was far more dangerous than fat, and recommended severely reducing simple (as opposed to complex) carbohydrate intake in order to lose weight. If I remember correctly he was pretty well excoriated by the press when Atkins became popular in the early 2000's.

215 Every time folks tell me we should put everything in the hands of the business sector claiming market forces make companies behave rationally, I think about all the nightmare job stories I've experienced or heard about. The fact of the matter is, businesses are just as flawed as governments or non-profits. Some people are just assholes and all too often that assholery is rewarded and those folks are put in charge.


*****

Yep. On paper, I work for a terrific company with great pay and outstanding benefits. I am fully vested in my pension, which is quite secure, and includes retiree health benefits.Unfortunately, it's also a company that allows its executives to run amok.

I've worked at a number of large and small companies over my career but there is something quite unique about this company and its ability to get its hooks into you. I've seen incredibly talented employees have their self-esteem torn asunder to the point that they don't believe they can do any better and thus continue to work harder out of fear they'll be left with nothing. When the truth is that everyone I have known to leave the company has done far better for themselves somewhere else.

If I ever write a book about the experience, I'm going to title it "The Psychology of the Damned"

216 BTW,  I am not unique in my experience with this company. Our own dear Velociman experienced the same fate just a few short years ago.

217 Back in the early eighties I was a chemist for the state of Colorado health department. 60Minutes interviewed my boss about some guy in the mountains who was recycling his own waste. My boss said the idea was interesting but could have inherent dangers because of a lack of regular testing which would determine routine effectiveness of the guy's purification process. This warning was edited out. All that was left was the director of the health dept saying what a cool idea it was. The report was so slanted that any possibility of fact never entered the heads of 60Minutes. Also, within months, the guy with the recycled waste nearly killed himself with it, as my boss had warned and been summarily dismissed, improper ability to test the purification let nasty (and I mean NASTY) water be consumed.

60Minutes does a bit on the harmful nature of sugar. Really? Guess I'll eat more sugar. Operating on the idea that what 60Minutes says is a reverse barometer is the safest way to go.

218 There are only three sources of calories --- sugars (carbohydrates), fats and proteins.  So what they have told us now is that sugar and fat will kill us.  That only leaves protein and you can't get all of the nutrients you need eating only protein.  I am sure there are downsides to eating too much protein as well.  Same goes with exercise, or sitting, or any other damn thing.  They all have their downsides and they all contribute to the destruction of our bodies in one way or another.

So you know what kills us all in the end?  Living!  If we could just stop that we would be golden.

219 I gave up sugar for lent. I have lost 15lbs to date and my blood pressure is WAY down. Every carb works the same way:

1. Eat carbs
2. Pancreas secrets insulin to turn said carbs into energy
3. What you need is placed into the liver and muscle, excess is converted to heat, if you have the metabolism, else it becomes fat.

Here's the problem:
4. Sugar that can't be turned into glycogen, because your pancreas is out of insulin starts to literally pickle you damaging the blood vessels.
5. Cholesterol is the scab that goes over the damage. Cholesterol by itself is no danger.

Eat less carbs. The carbs you do eat, eat smartly and you'll be fine.

I been eating a traditional 1950's diet. And I am killing it in the gym and I feel great. Instapundit highly recommends Why We Get Fat by Gary Taubes. I just bought it.

220 I been eating a traditional 1950's diet. And I am killing it in the gym and I feel great.


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Details, please.

221 I lost 14 lbs over 4 months going to a low carb diet, and I've kept it off for 6 months so far.   It was nearly effortless, too. 

I switched from oatmeal and cereal in the morning to eggs, bacon and sausage.  

No bullshit, I'm eating mostly meat, am at my lightest weight in ten years, and feel better than I have in years. 

This is anecdotal, but yeah. . .Atkins was right.

One more time. . .I eat bacon every morning and have lost 14 lbs. My triglycerides are also down over 100 points and my total cholesterol is also DOWN.

To be honest, if you had told me a year ago this was going to happen, I'd have told you you were full of it. 

222

Atkins called this, what, 30 years ago?

South Beach Diet discusses it at length, and that was out something like 15 years ago.

Humans weren't designed to eat a lot of sugar.  Other than honey, what intensely sweet things are found in nature?  Fruit?  OK, fruit - but how does a slice of even the sweetest pineapple stack up to a glass of cola?

As Atkins pointed out again and again, we WERE designed for fat.  We eat a lot of fat.  Meat, olive oil, butter - all common, even to our ancestors.  We can handle natural fats.

Hydrogenated oils?  High Fructose corn syrup?  Even cane sugar... none of this even existed until recently. 

What makes you think that your body is designed to digest it, and use it, indefinitely?

223 So imagine, for these healthy young people, drinking a sweetened drink might be just as bad for their hearts as the fatty cheeseburgers we've all been warned about since the 1970s. [/] ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Yeah, that seems about right. When you consider there is actually nothing wrong with a fatty cheeseburger in the first place. Chalk that up to yet another in a long line of government failures in understanding anything close to health and nutrition

224

Dagny - you are right the joint pain is due to the inflamation that the starches and sugar cause when the insulin is released... I can see how inflamed my face is from eating all the starch and sugar I do, plus the retention of water due to the insulin. And the bad thing is how addicting it is - worse than alcohol or heron - because no one ever says to a heroin addict: oh, just have a little, or just have some in moderation.

Just because it is in 60 minutes, doesn't mean it's wrong - even a broken clock is right twice a day.