Ace of Spades HQ

March 11, 2012

BountyGate (tmi3rd)
— Open Blogger

So NFL free agency begins on Monday, and itÂ’s already been a dramatic offseason as free agency goes. Peyton Manning is on the market, the Saints are struggling with a monster contract for Drew Brees while trying to re-sign core free agents, the Redskins mortgaged the farm to draft Robert Griffin III, and so forth.

So, as a Saints fan (in case you missed it), let me throw my opinion out there about the Saints and the program they had in place where players were paid to injure other players: They broke the rules, they were told to stop, they kept breaking the rules, they got caught, and they have to pay the price for that.

Now to the fine printÂ…

First of all, weÂ’ll find out as early as Monday what the punishment is, as far as I know. ItÂ’s likely to be a significant fine as well as loss of draft picks, and the possibility exists that Saints general manager Mickey Loomis and Saints head coach Sean Payton will be suspended (the length of any suspension is the subject of much debate). MLB Jonathan Vilma allegedly contributed $10K to a bounty on then-Vikings QB Brett Favre, and if true, it would not come as any surprise if he were suspended for as many as eight games. Many have called for the firing of Loomis and Payton, but Saints owner Tom Benson has indicated this will not be the outcome. Benson is reportedly pretty angry about this, as this has squandered a great deal of the goodwill the Saints had gained after Hurricane Katrina, and Loomis and Payton will be on very short leashes after this.

22 of 27 Saints defenders were implicated in this program, including LB Scott Fujita, DT Anthony Hargrove, and DE Bobby McCray (these players are no longer with the team). There is some discussion of trying to suspend essentially everyone who played defense for the Saints from 2009-2011.

Finally, now-St. Louis Rams defensive coordinator Gregg Williams is in a lot of hot water over this, as indications exist that he ran similar programs in Washington, Buffalo, Jacksonville, and Tennessee. Many have called for him to be suspended for at least a year, if not banned from the league entirely. Again, when it comes down to it, the Saints deserve whateverÂ’s coming to them. They broke the rules, and when told to stop by ownership, they ignored the directive, and have skirted a number of NFL rules administratively. ItÂ’s tough for me to watch as a Saints fan, but the rules are the rules.

Now to the reaction- weÂ’ve seen an amazing amount of yellow journalism from this. ESPNÂ’s Grantland.com has an article by Charles Pierce (who writes for NPR) that has all sorts of rending of garments about how America as a culture is moving away from the NFL (and tries to link all this to concussions)Â… Howard Bryant over at ESPN writes about how the NFL is out of step with societyÂ’s standards in the USÂ… and I wonÂ’t justify Jason WhitlockÂ’s existence at Fox Sports by linking to him, but any of you familiar with WhitlockÂ’s usual race-baiting tripe can figure it out.

My response is simple: What a load of crap.

I played football through the beginning of high school, switched to soccer for a couple of years, and wound up playing college hockey. My brother played four years of college football, and as mentioned before, we grew up playing organized football with the Mannings (to establish perspective).

There wasnÂ’t ONE TEAM that I was on in any sport that didnÂ’t have bounties out- spoken or unspoken- on other teamsÂ’ players.

Now, does that mean that we had an understanding to go out and try to hurt other players? Of course not- that's not something any athlete or coach that I've encountered would do- but the understanding was there that if you had the ability to put a punishing blow on another team's star player, you did so. This also assumes you'll do it within the rules.

As we learn more about concussions, I can understand more concern about injurious hits- in hockey, we have guys who are NFL-sized hitting each other at a combined speed of 60 mph on open ice. Getting hit by NFL linemen means having 400-pound guys who are astonishingly quick trying to take your head off.

But this garment-rending weÂ’re seeing in the media witch hunt is crap. WeÂ’re coached to play to the whistle with reckless abandon in all sports. Contact sports have an inherent amount of danger; collision sports even more so. Reading these egregious articles decrying the violence inherent in the system by these COWARDS who have never played a collision sport in their lives ignore both the traditions of the sports and the appetites of the people who play and consume them. These same jerks ooh and ahh over massive hits in football and hockey, over big wrecks in NASCAR, and so forth. The notion that they would attempt to impose their cocooned guilt upon us is laughable.

Anyway, as we ramp up towards the ONT, please feel free to discuss NFL free agency, the NHL, MLS opening day, or whateverÂ… weÂ’ve also got a hell of a finish shaping up in the AoSHQ fantasy hockey league.

In the meantime, please enjoy this picture that DaveInTexas tells me is his mom, via Twitter...

Posted by: Open Blogger at 02:30 PM | Comments (120)
Post contains 905 words, total size 6 kb.

1 I know people who own NFL teams.

Posted by: Mitt 'Top Dog' Romney at March 11, 2012 02:20 PM (c3mby)

2 Let me be the first to say that there are nice smooth elbows on that Redskins cheerleader

Posted by: kbdabear at March 11, 2012 02:22 PM (Y+DPZ)

3 OH my

Posted by: Max at March 11, 2012 02:23 PM (Mrdk1)

4 I played organized football and basketball through 13 seasons, including college.

10 seasons of baseball and soccer.

NEVER, EVER, ONCE, did I ever catch a whiff of bounties.

It was and is an abomination here to go out and intentionally hurt another.

Perhaps they do it differently where the Manning's grew up, but here in Nebraska, I have never heard of such a thing.

Posted by: Lt. York at March 11, 2012 02:25 PM (BArWe)

5 Can we talk NCAA brackets here too?

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 02:26 PM (ykSKg)

6 No bounty for hitting the 'Skins cheerleader. It's its own reward.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 02:26 PM (ykSKg)

7 Can we talk NCAA brackets here too?

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 06:26 PM (ykSKg)

Yes hurry it up.

The nation is waiting for my picks

Posted by: Barack Obama at March 11, 2012 02:28 PM (2TRSa)

8 >>the Redskins mortgaged the farm to draft Robert Griffin III<< The Redskins got a purty mouth.

Posted by: Henry Kane at March 11, 2012 02:30 PM (2+bRt)

9 I've suddenly got a hankering for fresh unpasteurized milk.

As to *other* contact sports, I'll just note that jousting is making a comeback.

Posted by: GnuBreed at March 11, 2012 02:31 PM (ccXZP)

10 You play hard and to the whistle, but you never INTENTIONALLY go out to hurt someone. I used to knock the snot out of QB's, but I always reached my hand down to help them up afterwards.

Additionally, if you knock out the other team's star intentionally, you have derived your victory from cheating. You haven't beat their best. How is that satisfying?

Posted by: Lt. York at March 11, 2012 02:31 PM (BArWe)

11 'Noles get a #3 seed. I was dreaming of a #2, but still a great way and I hope the season keeps going!

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 02:32 PM (ykSKg)

the Redskins mortgaged the farm to draft Robert Griffin III, and so forth.

You've got to wonder if this is Mike Shanahan's and the GM's idea or if its Dan Snyder going "We Must Get One of the Top Two Quarterbacks!!! Make it happen!"

Posted by: buzzion at March 11, 2012 02:32 PM (GULKT)

13 Lt. York, you'll notice I wasn't defending it, just saying that I never saw it not happen. On the NFL and major college teams I covered, nobody batted an eye at it. I can only assume that's why you're not hearing many players saying much about it.

Posted by: tmi3rd at March 11, 2012 02:33 PM (WRtsc)

14 Thank God the Packers lost the bidding war for Gregg Williams and hired Dom Capers instead.

Posted by: packsoldier at March 11, 2012 02:33 PM (qmorC)

15 "Baraka" is Kenyan for "bracket."

True story.

Posted by: Joe Biden at March 11, 2012 02:34 PM (ykSKg)

16 I don't mind talking about this stuff for a little while in between Walking Dead episodes.

Posted by: cherry at March 11, 2012 02:35 PM (OhYCU)

17 BTW, Charles Pierce is a raving leftist moonbat and a total asshole, to boot. His very presence at Grantland.com causes me to avoid that site.

Posted by: packsoldier at March 11, 2012 02:35 PM (qmorC)

18 Alan Grayson was after the GOP bus bounty

Posted by: cherry at March 11, 2012 02:35 PM (OhYCU)

19 Of course booing RG3 when he turns into Heath Shuler will prove the racism inherent in the system

Posted by: Soledad O'Brien at March 11, 2012 02:36 PM (Y+DPZ)

20 Packsoldier, that was the first I'd ever heard of him. Judging from his headshot, I'd say he could stand to take the stairs at work a few more times a day. Grantland has some interesting authors, but in general, it's sportswriters navel-gazing.

Posted by: tmi3rd at March 11, 2012 02:36 PM (WRtsc)

21 As a Redskins fan I approve of any trade that stops Rex fucking Grossman from starting.

Posted by: Mr. Pink at March 11, 2012 02:37 PM (swkkW)

22 The Saints!

The Saints who run up the score on teams!

The Saints who apparently take pleasure in injuring other players!

The Saints and their nauseating fans and the bullshit media narrative of an
uncaring President!

FUCK THE SAINTS! THROW THE BOOK AT THEM!

Posted by: McLovin at March 11, 2012 02:38 PM (l14aH)

23 20 I don't mind talking about this stuff for a little while in between Walking Dead episodes.
Posted by: cherry at March 11, 2012 06:35 PM

I hate zombies

Two weeks to Mad Men and Christina Hendricks' boobehs begging to be set free

Posted by: kbdabear at March 11, 2012 02:38 PM (Y+DPZ)

24 The first pic WAS fine print, the Helen Thomas cheerleader photo was gratuitous, injurious, and downright mean spirited.

Posted by: ontherocks at March 11, 2012 02:38 PM (ZJCDy)

25 Wait, you mean there is violence? In football? Well, we can't be having any of that now can we! I say from now on no more of this nonsense. No more having one player pushing another - sets a bad example. Nope, from now on we put a stop to all of that. And no more of this "playoff" or superbowl nonsense either. My goodness, what are we trying to do, lower the players self esteem? No, I say we eliminate all of that and just give every team a trophy at the end of the year. Just for participating. Sheesh.

Posted by: StuckOnStupid at March 11, 2012 02:40 PM (R5yLq)

26 The Redskins occasionally cause distraction from watching their cheerleaders.

Actually went to a game 25 years ago. Friend of family, sat on sideline right behind cheerleaders. There was apparently a game but I don't remember it.

Posted by: DaveA at March 11, 2012 02:40 PM (h7d02)

27 Carbonite just advertised on History Channel.

Posted by: cherry at March 11, 2012 02:41 PM (OhYCU)

28 NEVER, EVER, ONCE, did I ever catch a whiff of bounties.

It was and is an abomination here to go out and intentionally hurt another.

Perhaps they do it differently where the Manning's grew up, but here in Nebraska, I have never heard of such a thing.

Posted by: Lt. York at March 11, 2012 06:25 PM

Several Giants admitted after the NFC Championship game to headhunting Niners punt returner Kyle Williams with the knowledge that he'd had 3 previous concussions

Posted by: kbdabear at March 11, 2012 02:41 PM (Y+DPZ)

29 " Carbonite just advertised on History Channel." Rotfl... something apropos about that I guess. I have a feeling they are history, after all.

Posted by: StuckOnStupid at March 11, 2012 02:41 PM (R5yLq)

30 >>As a Redskins fan I approve of any trade that stops Rex fucking Grossman from starting.<< Well, yeah, there's that. We share the pain, brother. I've been a fan since Kilmer was driving cars off the road, and I"ve never been so discouraged. I'm surprised Snyder didn't sell a kidney (or a child) to get Manning. He's starfucked.

Posted by: Henry Kane at March 11, 2012 02:41 PM (2+bRt)

31 Aw fuck, they just said Baraka will be at the games Tuesday in Dayton.

Shithead can;t help himself.

Guess who'll pay for that little trip?

Posted by: Joe Biden at March 11, 2012 02:42 PM (ykSKg)

32 By the way, does anyone have any opinions on the 12-hour strike that Arena Football apparently attempted?

Posted by: tmi3rd at March 11, 2012 02:42 PM (WRtsc)

33 33 Carbonite just advertised on History Channel.
Posted by: cherry at March 11, 2012 06:41 PM

The Ancient Aliens are a long way from home and need data backup too you know

Posted by: Ancient Aliens wild haired guy at March 11, 2012 02:43 PM (Y+DPZ)

34 /retard VP sock

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 02:43 PM (ykSKg)

35 Yes, football is a violent sport and then there is the crap that Suh and Harrison do on the field.

There is no place for that!

Posted by: McLovin at March 11, 2012 02:44 PM (l14aH)

36 Sweep the leg.

Posted by: Sensei at March 11, 2012 02:45 PM (Y4H6x)

37 21 BTW, Charles Pierce is a raving leftist moonbat and a total asshole, to boot. His very presence at Grantland.com causes me to avoid that site.

Posted by: packsoldier at March 11, 2012 06:35 PM (qmorC)

--Never heard of him. Simmons is a lefty too (if not a raving one) but at least he's a decent writer. Still, his best stuff is still the ESPN and ESPN-style columns. It's also always fun to read him after the Patriots have a big loss.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 02:46 PM (ykSKg)

38 I'm surprised Snyder didn't sell a kidney (or a child) to get Manning. He's starfucked.

Posted by: Henry Kane at March 11, 2012 06:41 PM (2+bRt)

I'm almost betting that Manning has straight up said he would not go to the Redskins, Dallas, or Philadelphia.

Posted by: buzzion at March 11, 2012 02:46 PM (GULKT)

39 Dont worry Saints fans. As a Patriots fan I can tell you I expect spygate to wear off in another ten years or so in the national media so you guys should be fine around 2030.

Posted by: MAJHAM at March 11, 2012 02:47 PM (nEHQi)

40 >>Carbonite just advertised on History Channel.

One of the funnier comments I've read since this whole Rush/Carbonite thing started and their stock fell off a cliff: Guess they should've had a back-up plan.

Posted by: Retread at March 11, 2012 02:47 PM (joSBv)

I used to love playing organized sports (football, baseball) growing up and consequntly watching it as a young adult. But as the years have gone by, it really does sicken me how football and basketball is not really about the game any longer. Instead, it seems like a showcase for narcissistic, amoral lunkheads - players and coaches alike. (Not much hockey to enjoy down here is S. Texas, so I can't chime in on the state of affairs there.)

Regarding football, let's drop the pretense and give everyone what they want: No pads, no hits are illegal, and Vegas-style odds on all publicly posted bounties. I could get excited about that kind of action.

Posted by: wmac at March 11, 2012 02:48 PM (YXUaU)

42 And for the record, yeah, sure - I'm a hater.

Posted by: wmac at March 11, 2012 02:49 PM (YXUaU)

43 The Pittsburgh Penguins have won 9 in a row and they don't even have Crosby or Kris Letang in the lineup. When they arrive and hopefully stay healthy, they will be VERY hard to beat.

Posted by: stillers at March 11, 2012 02:50 PM (gVUg0)

44 I was watching the NFC champion ship game between the Saints and the Vikings and was screaming at the TV at all the late hits they were putting on Farve. They were "accidentally" falling on him every other play if he was knocked down. It was obvious even watching the game. They fucked up his ankle so bad it was still fucked up the next year, and they ended his career. Fuck them

Posted by: Mr. Pink at March 11, 2012 02:51 PM (swkkW)

45 Remember when QB Jim Everett was sacked so much in a playoff game and got so rattled that he started to just take a dive a few seconds after the snap? (I think it was the Rams vs 49ers.) There's a good reason to knock you opponent silly in football. I've never heard a coach tell a player to stop hitting so hard.

Posted by: fozzy at March 11, 2012 02:52 PM (FEzSe)

46 Mallamutt, you're right. I'll adjust my style guide. Thanks for clearing that up for me. Oh, and Mr. Pink? Most Saints fans I know were bewildered that the Saints weren't getting called for late hits in that game. Cold comfort to Vikings fans, I know, but... In any event, like I said, they broke the rules, they get what's coming to them. C'est la vie.

Posted by: tmi3rd at March 11, 2012 02:53 PM (WRtsc)

47 47 Regarding football,let's drop the pretense and give everyone what they want: ~~No pads, no hits are illegal, and Vegas-style odds on all publicly posted bounties.~~ Rollerball! ------ FIFY

Posted by: Anachronda at March 11, 2012 02:54 PM (6fER6)

48 I read a short blurb on the AFL strike. Strike was called like a half hour before game time. Teams had backup players ready. And a good portion of players immediately broke ranks and played. Union demanded like $1200 per game vs Arena $400 per game. These guys get paid crap. But that's because nobody wants to watch it. League already went under once and is always teetering on the brink. The players aren't trying to make a living anyway. They are just desperately trying to keep their NFL dreams alive. Most are delusional, but hey, there's a better chance and NFL notices you playing Arena ball than sitting on your couch or starting that Home Depot management trainee program. Strike was called off 1am saturday anyway. I think because the players refused to acknowledge the strike called by union leadership. Looks like a giant fuck-up with the union guys thinking they were playing big boy ball.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 02:54 PM (ZPrif)

49 Clubber, one of the things New Orleans-area sports fans are quietly lamenting is wasting one of the coolest logos ever- that of the New Orleans Voodoo- on an Arena League team.

Posted by: tmi3rd at March 11, 2012 02:56 PM (WRtsc)

50 52 Remember when QB Jim Everett was sacked so much in a playoff game and got so rattled that he started to just take a dive a few seconds after the snap? (I think it was the Rams vs 49ers.) There's a good reason to knock you opponent silly in football. I've never heard a coach tell a player to stop hitting so hard.

Posted by: fozzy at March 11, 2012 06:52 PM (FEzSe)

Well you know, there's playing hard to the whistle and giving a good hit right as the whistle blow or the QB releases the ball. And then there's "$3000 to the player that knocks the QB out of the game"

Posted by: buzzion at March 11, 2012 02:57 PM (GULKT)

You're a husker too?

I just learned the other day that the 'N' on their helmets stands for 'Nowledge'.

I learn a lot of stuff here.

Posted by: garrett at March 11, 2012 02:57 PM (zzEU+)

52 By the way, my contacts with the Saints tell me the NFL salary cap is $120.6 million for this year- roughly the same as last year.

Posted by: tmi3rd at March 11, 2012 02:57 PM (WRtsc)

53 56 I read a short blurb on the AFL strike. Strike was called like a half hour before game time. Teams had backup players ready. And a good portion of players immediately broke ranks and played.

Union demanded like $1200 per game vs Arena $400 per game. These guys get paid crap. But that's because nobody wants to watch it. League already went under once and is always teetering on the brink.

The players aren't trying to make a living anyway. They are just desperately trying to keep their NFL dreams alive. Most are delusional, but hey, there's a better chance and NFL notices you playing Arena ball than sitting on your couch or starting that Home Depot management trainee program.

Strike was called off 1am saturday anyway. I think because the players refused to acknowledge the strike called by union leadership.

Looks like a giant fuck-up with the union guys thinking they were playing big boy ball.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 06:54 PM (ZPrif)

--Kurt Warner made the Arena pipe dreams possible.

The NFL should stop being cheap-asses and start a bona fide far system. It would have the benefit of cleaning up college ball so that only players who actually want to learn will take the field, and players who are NFL material but want or need to get paid right away can get a paycheck and we can stop the charade that big-time college football as it is is an "amateur" sport.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 02:58 PM (ykSKg)

54 arenafan.com has some coverage. Mainly from a league perspective I think. Looks like the union called a strike, players didn't obey, so the union called it off 6 hours later to try and save face. Charge, men, charge! (men don't budge) Uh, um, Charge is called off! Do not Charge, men! I repeat, do not Charge! (men don't budge) Good discipline, men. Well done!

Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 02:58 PM (ZPrif)

55 The Redskins fucked up. They are gonna rue the day they gave away all those fucking 1st round picks

I say this as a born n raised on the Redskins former Marylander

2 phrases we learned early:

Hail to the Redskins! and

sorry-ass fuckin' REDSKINS!!!

Posted by: Jones in CO at March 11, 2012 02:58 PM (8sCoq)

56 64 The Redskins fucked up. They are gonna rue the day they gave away all those fucking 1st round picks

I say this as a born n raised on the Redskins former Marylander

2 phrases we learned early:

Hail to the Redskins! and

sorry-ass fuckin' REDSKINS!!!

Posted by: Jones in CO at March 11, 2012 06:58 PM (8sCoq)

--Snyder is managing an NFL team like a Fantasy Football manager. I like RG3 and thin he is worth taking a shot with the #2 pick, but not with 3 #1 picks.

Tony Mandarich is laughing at Snyder somewhere.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 03:01 PM (ykSKg)

57 You must have been on an interesting bowling team.

Posted by: Gerry at March 11, 2012 03:01 PM (Jbtz+)

58 Kurt Warner made the Arena pipe dreams possible.The NFL should stop being cheap-asses and start a bona fide far system. It would have the benefit of cleaning up college ball so that only players who actually want to learn will take the field, and players who are NFL material but want or need to get paid right away can get a paycheck and we can stop the charade that big-time college football as it is is an "amateur" sport.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 06:58 PM (ykSKg

They actually tried that with NFL Europe. But well, it was in Europe.

Posted by: buzzion at March 11, 2012 03:02 PM (GULKT)

59 I get a kick out of arena-fied indoor versions of outdoor sports. So I like Arena football. All those empty arenas looking for sporting events to put butts in seats. Indoor football, indoor soccer, indoor lacrosse. Surprised there's no indoor baseball or indoor rugby.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 03:03 PM (ZPrif)

60 College Hoops: 4 teams from the Mountain West make the cut!

SDSU
UNLV
CSU
UNM (who can ESAD)

Posted by: mpfs at March 11, 2012 03:03 PM (TlwCF)

61 They actually tried that with NFL Europe. But well, it was in Europe.

Posted by: buzzion at March 11, 2012 07:02 PM (GULKT)

--Yeah, that was half-assed. If hockey and baseball can do it, and do it profitably, the NFL can figure it out.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 03:05 PM (ykSKg)

62 Manning is one of those players who won't give it up. All it's gonna take is one ginormous hit and he will be lucky to get up and walk again. Stupidity knows now bounds.

Posted by: mpfs at March 11, 2012 03:06 PM (TlwCF)

63 According to an article at the WSJ the Saints had 18 injuries against them in the 3 seasons being discussed. They are also nowhere even close to the top for personal fouls, fines, and illegal hits yet somehow the Saints are "cheaters. " it is ridiculous. If the saints were purposely injuring players with illegal hits one would think the refs in the game and the officials who watch the games looking for illegal hits, etc, would've caught something yet there was nothing. Trying to knock a player out of a game with hard hits is what every single defense is trying to do. It is why defensive coaches always tell their players to "knock their heads off" "hit them till they quit" and quotes like that. Goodell is simply the worst commissioner in any sport, in a long time, and he is on a witch hunt against the saints because he is scared about litigation regarding player safety.

Posted by: Hueydiamondpooty at March 11, 2012 03:06 PM (e9oU6)

64 SDSU
UNLV
CSU
UNM (who can ESAD)

Posted by: mpfs at March 11, 2012 07:03 PM (TlwCF)

--Heh, I like SDSU: The Jackrabbits. Isn't that where Adam Vinatieri went?

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 03:06 PM (ykSKg)

65 Yeah, that was half-assed. If hockey and baseball can do it, and do it profitably, the NFL can figure it out.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 07:05 PM (ykSKg)

Even the NBA has a Development League.

Posted by: buzzion at March 11, 2012 03:07 PM (GULKT)

66 Furthermore if the saints get punished more harshly than the patriots, who actually cheated and attempted to gain an advantage over other teams by filming practices, it will be a travesty.

Posted by: Hueydiamondpooty at March 11, 2012 03:07 PM (e9oU6)

67 SDSU : San Diego State University Aztecs

South Dakota are the Jackrabbits

Posted by: mpfs at March 11, 2012 03:08 PM (TlwCF)

68 Posted by: Hueydiamondpooty at March 11, 2012 07:06 PM (e9oU6)

--I thought part of the story was that the NFL behind the scenes warned them to cut it the fuck out and they still kept doing it --which is the reason Goodell is pissed and it's more than just "everybody does it."

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 03:08 PM (ykSKg)

69 Even the NBA has a Development League.

Posted by: buzzion at March 11, 2012 07:07 PM (GULKT)

--They could do better, too, since there's still too much corruption in college basketball as well. One-and-done is also a joke.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 03:10 PM (ykSKg)

70 77 SDSU : San Diego State University Aztecs

South Dakota are the Jackrabbits

Posted by: mpfs at March 11, 2012 07:08 PM (TlwCF)

--Well damn, I missed the conference name.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 03:10 PM (ykSKg)

71 Arenas mainly rely on the local basketball and hockey teams for their business. But the other mainstays are. 1) The Harlem Globetrotters still do tons of business. Every city books them 2) MonsterJam (monster trucks) are everywhere. They do several shows every weekend spread around the country. 3) Ringling Bros circus 4) WWE 5) Ice Shows (Disney on Ice, several others) Every arena across the nation seems to book WWE, MonsterJam, the Globetrotters, Ringling Bros, and the touring ice shows. Then whatever musical acts are popular, of course. But those change from year to year.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 03:10 PM (ZPrif)

72 Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 07:10 PM (ZPrif)

--Heh, even Winnipeg is hosting what's billed as the Maple Leaf Monster Jam.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 03:12 PM (ykSKg)

73 Has there been any actual proof that there was a pool and money paid for injuries? Also, all the hits shown by the Saints on ESPN were clean and legal.

Posted by: Dick Nixon at March 11, 2012 03:12 PM (P50Rt)

74 But there's no money in the NBA D-League. I've watched some games. I had more fans at my high school games. Baseball and hockey started their minor leagues before college sports took off. They have long and deep roots. For better or worse NCAA basketball and football are the minor leagues for the NBA and NFL.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 03:13 PM (ZPrif)

75 Can't we get Obama to offer Dan Snyder an ambassadorship someplace? Preferably some third-world shithole with no phones, tvs or internets.

Posted by: NC Ref at March 11, 2012 03:14 PM (/izg2)

76 For better or worse NCAA basketball and football are the minor leagues for the NBA and NFL.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 07:13 PM (ZPrif)

--When you think about it, though, it's wrong that these private leagues are benefitting by using mostly state schools as their de facto farm systems. It's no wonder most of the scandals in college sports are overwhelmingly for football and men's basketball.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 03:16 PM (ykSKg)

77 All pro sports are rigged through the officiating. Too much money involved for them not to be.

Posted by: More than a Little Suspicious at March 11, 2012 03:16 PM (axc/z)

78 MonsterJam might put on more shows than anybody else. Cause the stars are the trucks. You could even have the same truck show up in two cities on the same night. The drivers get swapped out. This weekend MonsterJam had shows in: Reno, NV Tucson, AZ Grand Rapids, MI Toledo, OH Wilkes-Barre, PA Winnipeg That's 6 simultaneous shows spread across the US and Canada.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 03:17 PM (ZPrif)

79 60 Minutes trying to do a hit piece on the Mossad.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 11, 2012 03:17 PM (piMMO)

80 And as for the bounties, we would like to see our players hit hard enough...CLEANLY...to knock opponents out of the game. Football is a game of physical domination. Knock the crap out of your opponent, then reach down and help him up. Then do it again.

Posted by: NC Ref at March 11, 2012 03:17 PM (/izg2)

81 86 Can't we get Obama to offer Dan Snyder an ambassadorship someplace? Preferably some third-world shithole with no phones, tvs or internets.

Posted by: NC Ref at March 11, 2012 07:14 PM (/izg2)

--Elbonia sounds good.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 03:17 PM (ykSKg)

82 Well Goodell apparently did tell them to cut it out and they refused. I have no problem with the Saints getting penalized for ignoring a directive from on high but Goodell and most of the non~former player journalists are acting like this entire thing is unprecedented. One report had Goodell saying "this is earth shattering" when he learned about the program and now the saints will most likely be punished more harshly than the patriots for spygate and that is a travesty. Virtually every defensive player is trying to hit the other team as hard as possible and the saints were no exception. If they were paying for illegal hits, which would end up costing the player money as the fine would undoubtedly be more than the "bounty" reward, there would've been more fines and penalties against the saints and more injuries by the other team. The entire thing is being blown way out of proportion. I am a huge saints fan, born and raised in new Orleans, so I am clearly biased in my assessment.

Posted by: Hueydiamondpooty at March 11, 2012 03:17 PM (e9oU6)

83 I also love the fact that BYU wanted out of the Mountain West and they are gonna get their asses handed to them.

My pick overall winner: Kentucky.

Posted by: mpfs at March 11, 2012 03:18 PM (TlwCF)

84 The private leagues also benefit from all the junior high and high school coaching. Doesn't bother me. College sports are fun. A little corruption just makes it more exciting.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 03:19 PM (ZPrif)

85 Tony Mandarich is laughing at Snyder somewhere. I'm still pissed GB drafted him and passed on....Barry Sanders!

Posted by: (Original, Famous) My Sharia Moor at March 11, 2012 03:20 PM (KZi9D)

86 The FBI is looking at point shaving by one player at Auburn (I believe point guard) ahhh, that's a shame.

Posted by: mpfs at March 11, 2012 03:20 PM (TlwCF)

87 The G on Packers helmets stands for Greatness.

Posted by: Tommygun at March 11, 2012 03:22 PM (cb4oU)

88 The NFL really should put a team in Toronto and kill off the Canadian Football League.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 03:24 PM (ZPrif)

89 Unrelated sports thought. Australian Rules Football is pretty awesome. Too bad naming it Australian Rules Football means it'll never expand internationally.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at March 11, 2012 03:26 PM (ZPrif)

90 And as for the bounties, we would like to see our players hit hard enough...CLEANLY...to knock opponents out of the game. Football is a game of physical domination. Knock the crap out of your opponent, then reach down and help him up. Then do it again.

****

This. A thousand times, this.

I LOVE hard-hitting football. I love that those men will put it all on the line for the team and for the win. I detest any player or coach who forgets that his job is to play a great game, win one for the fans (and the owners), and watch all the players exit the stadium on their own two legs at the end of it.

Dehumanizing the players for the thrill of a good hit is fucking absurd.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 11, 2012 03:28 PM (piMMO)

91 Nice pic of Meghan McCain as a Cowboys cheerleader. It's actually pretty flattering.

Posted by: Ms Choksondik at March 11, 2012 03:30 PM (fYOZx)

92
Just softening up the 52%ers for when crunch time comes and King Barry totally abandons Israel.

***

Leslie Stahl was talking about the recent hits on Iran's nuclear facilities and on the scientists themselves and asked Meir Dagan, former head of the Mossad, if it wasn't killing him for the agency to not be able to take credit for it.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 11, 2012 03:30 PM (piMMO)

93 God believers, I forget, do you believe in evolution?

***

You're damned right I do. I believe that God created assholes and several millennia later, you were born.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 11, 2012 03:36 PM (piMMO)

94 Spent 11 years in EMS, and what that taught me about Central Nervous System trauma and brain injuries completely evaporated my tolerance for contact sports. Football, hockey, boxing, you name it. Basically it's the Roman Gladiator mentality covered with a thin veneer of social responsibility. Its popularity is just one of the myriad ways my countrymen disgust me. And so it goes...

Posted by: F.LeeBailout at March 11, 2012 03:37 PM (p1nKZ)

95 It's also always fun ~~to read him~~ after the Patriots have a big loss.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 06:46 PM (ykSKg)

FIFY

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (NJConservative) at March 11, 2012 03:39 PM (nEUpB)

96 As a Falcons fan, I say fuck the Saints. This kind of thing I'm sure goes on most places around the NFL, but New Orleans seems particularly sloppy with letting this get out

Posted by: UGAdawg at March 11, 2012 03:39 PM (WYOrt)

97 Posted by: Xq at March 11, 2012 07:34 PM (2AWJO)

Whose dog has diarrhea?

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo (NJConservative) at March 11, 2012 03:40 PM (nEUpB)

98 The G on the Packers stands for Gramsci

Posted by: Tony Gramsci at March 11, 2012 03:46 PM (kwAf2)

99 As a Falcons fan, I say fuck the Saints. As a Saints fan I hope the falcons never fire mike smith and keep matt Ryan as their qb forever.

Posted by: Hueydiamondpooty at March 11, 2012 03:50 PM (e9oU6)

100 It is a load of crap, that is for sure. Every single defensive player's goal, generally, is to knock the player they are hitting out of the game. PERIOD. Bounty or no bounty. The fact that there were paltry sums of money involved is really irrelevant. But regardless, sports journalists are one of the lowest forms of life on the planet. Oddly enough it seems as though they are just wannabe news journalists, complete with the same leftard progressive philosophies as any other "journalist".

Posted by: deadrody at March 11, 2012 03:53 PM (eOvu0)

101 Although most of the time natural selection will eliminate the unfit such as Xq and its progeny, there are occasionally periods in human history when the politically powerful benefit from the survival and support of the unfit.

Though the laws of nature can be denied short-term, eventually the unfit such as Xq and its progeny will be eliminated.

Posted by: Zombie Charles Darwin at March 11, 2012 03:54 PM (axc/z)

102 do you believe in evolution?

Posted by: Xq at March 11, 2012 07:34 PM (2AWJO)

I generally do. I'm willing to make an exception in your case, though.

Posted by: beancounter at March 11, 2012 03:56 PM (p18em)

103 Huey- Being a Metry native (brah), me too on the Mike Smith thing. Anyway, the Saints managed to be the team that got caught. The league seems to be trying to change its public image, and so they'll make an example of the Saints. From the perspective of Saints fans like us, it sucks, but as mentioned upthread by MAJHAM, the rest of the nation will get tired of talking about it by 2022. For the moment, per a Twitter chat I had with Jonathan Vilma, we'll have to settle for being the team that: 1) let the dogs out 2) shot the sheriff AND the deputy 3) caused the asteroid that killed the dinosaurs 4) was the fifth Beatle 5) (insert yours here)

Posted by: tmi3rd at March 11, 2012 03:56 PM (WRtsc)

104 Deadrody, great point- $1500 is a purse and maybe a pair of shoes for the player's wife. As has been noted, in most locker rooms, these guys are wagering $100 on shooting tape balls into garbage cans.

Posted by: tmi3rd at March 11, 2012 03:57 PM (WRtsc)

105 Tmi3rd, damn you're an eastbanker? I'm sorry. And yeah it sucks that the Saints got caught I'm just hoping we don't get hammered too hard. The funny thing about the entire situation is that our defense is horrible and the players apparently sucked at the bounty program.

Posted by: Hueydiamondpooty at March 11, 2012 04:02 PM (e9oU6)

106 Excellent post and realistic. Thanks for sharing.

Posted by: NJRob at March 11, 2012 04:02 PM (FVp26)

107 NJ, delighted to do so. Thank you for reading it! Huey, my dad used to be chief of surgery at West Jeff, and I used to play street hockey in lower Marrero, so I have some BestBank cred, yo. Holla. And yeah, it's amazing what might have been if the front four were a decent pass rush. One defensive stop in the last game, and who knows? Of course, one fewer turnover, and who knows yet again?

Posted by: tmi3rd at March 11, 2012 04:06 PM (WRtsc)

108 Did any of those PC Titty Pinkys take money for one of those devilish hits?

What a fuckin' farce.
More liberal media BS getting everyone to chase their tails while pretending to be above it all.
It's football for chrissakes. somewhere that was forgotten.

Hits? Bwaahaaa

Posted by: ontherocks at March 11, 2012 04:11 PM (ZJCDy)

109

This is ridiculous. Even if a player were to get $10k (Vilma offered this?) for purposely hurting an opposing player, the hit would probably result in a fine from the NFL much larger than the bounty payout.

As for players wanting to hurt opposing players - hell, just look at James harrison for Pittsburgh. That neandrathal would knock you unconscious and ass-rape you just cause he hates you. And he ain't the only one in this league by a longshot

Posted by: kdizzydaze at March 11, 2012 04:12 PM (rT/h3)

110 Several Giants admitted after the NFC Championship game to headhunting Niners punt returner Kyle Williams with the knowledge that he'd had 3 previous concussions Posted by: kbdabear at March 11, 2012 06:41 PM (Y+DPZ) --------------------------- This. So the issue isn't that they were trying to injure an opposing player, but that they got paid for it? Seriously? Because if it's the intent to injure that's the problem, then we need to see some of those thug Giants getting suspended. But instead they'll just get to be called champs. BS.

Posted by: NJRob at March 11, 2012 04:24 PM (FVp26)

111

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 11, 2012 04:24 PM (piMMO)

112 In the hockey world (and I can't speak to football, having not played at a high enough level), we were cautioned to be aware of everyone around us at all times. Yeah, we'd come to the aid of a teammate who got cheap-shotted, but ultimately, if you got KO'ed, the team was down a man. I never hit anyone intending to injure them, but I sure as hell delivered a few "keep your head up" hits. Particularly in college, if we wanted a guy out of the game, the easiest thing was to goad him into a fight, at the expense of knowing you'd be suspended for the next game as well. Conversely, in the minors, a friend of mine who was a very accomplished enforcer was in his first game back after having dental surgery to put his teeth back in. He goaded another guy into a fight, and then when the guy reared up to punch him, my buddy simply ducked his head. His opponent broke his hand on his helmet, and wound up being out for several games. I still think my buddy was crazy for doing that, but...

Posted by: tmi3rd at March 11, 2012 04:29 PM (WRtsc)

113 Posted by: tmi3rd at March 11, 2012 08:29 PM (WRtsc) Great story. Nothing quite like hockey players and the game itself. Only thing that remotely compares is a slot receiver in football. Really need to keep your head on a swivel.

Posted by: NJRob at March 11, 2012 04:36 PM (FVp26)

114 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

Posted by: steevy at March 11, 2012 05:07 PM (7W3wI)

115 "There wasnÂ’t ONE TEAM that I was on in any sport that didnÂ’t have bounties out- spoken or unspoken- on other teamsÂ’ players."
<br><br>
I beg to differ. I played sports, my brothers played sports, hockey, football, baseball, soccer, at highschool and college level and I have _never_ heard of this, the exact opposite of what you're saying. I can't even conceive of it, because I never heard anyone talking about intentionally hurting anyone, not serious talk. For one thing, it's not that easy to do and 1. not get hurt yourself 2. not get in a huge amount of trouble, risking your athletic career.

<br><br>
Playing the game with the intention to hurt someone instead of making a play will result in poor play. If you're talking about late hits and cheap shots after or out of play, you're not going to get away with that crap for long: you'll be penalized, suspended, then banned. We see that even professionals can't get away with it. I think this is a bunch of macho posturing. I've heard people run their mouth, sure, but not seriously. No serious, intelligent athlete would.

Posted by: ms. docweasel at March 11, 2012 05:36 PM (beBtw)

116

There wasnÂ’t ONE TEAM that I was on in any sport that didnÂ’t have bounties out- spoken or unspoken- on other teamsÂ’ players.

Then you had shitty dirtbag coaches who didnt know the first thing about sportsmanship or understand how athletics shapes personal character.

Posted by: MikeD at March 11, 2012 06:24 PM (p8QOg)

117 96 Tony Mandarich is laughing at Snyder somewhere.

I'm still pissed GB drafted him and passed on....Barry Sanders!

Posted by: (Original, Famous) My Sharia Moor at March 11, 2012 07:20 PM (KZi9D)

--Also could have had Derrick Thomas or Deion Sanders with that pick.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 06:33 PM (ykSKg)

118
--Yeah, that was half-assed. If hockey and baseball can do it, and do it profitably, the NFL can figure it out.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 07:05 PM (ykSKg)

Minor league hockey is not profitable as a whole. the AHL, the top 3rd of the teams in attendance are profitable. In the ECHL, the top quarter of the teams in attendance are profitable. All others barely break even or are losing their shirts.

Posted by: MrCaniac at March 11, 2012 07:32 PM (1grxW)

119

Bullshit.

Any player injured by a Saints player should 1) file assault charges and 2) sue the shit out of the Saints.

Posted by: RokShox at March 11, 2012 08:25 PM (pcly4)

120 Minor league hockey is not profitable as a whole. the AHL, the top 3rd of the teams in attendance are profitable. In the ECHL, the top quarter of the teams in attendance are profitable. All others barely break even or are losing their shirts.

Posted by: MrCaniac at March 11, 2012 11:32 PM (1grxW)

--and avoiding those costs is what the NFL and NBA teams are doing. I think, for one thing, the quality of backup quarterbacks would improve if the NFL had a bona fide farm system.

Posted by: logprof at March 11, 2012 08:52 PM (ykSKg)

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