December 18, 2012

“Eat Local” Is Anti-Globalization Stupidity [CharlieBrown’sDildo]
— Open Blogger

One of the more irritating things that spews from the mouths of foolish, overpaid and undereducated celebrity chefs and their touts in the MBM is the unchallenged assumption that eating local is in all respects better: for the planet, for our health, for our refractory periods (look it up…and yes, it is sexual), for our foreign policy, and dozens of other feel-good reasons that are suspiciously light on, you know, icky data. Presumably -- and help me here because the theory is so dumb it is difficult to explain –- buying locally produced foods decreases the “carbon footprint” of the consumer, improves his health (because local is confused by the patchouli oil set with organic), and provides meaningful jobs for, um, locals.

I can drive to my local Costco, which is about 1.5 gallons of gas for the round trip, and in 30 minutes buy enough fresh food for one week, and enough frozen food to fill my freezer several times over. For instance, I will pay $2.39/lb. for excellent quality, beautifully trimmed St. Louis cut pork ribs, straight from Iowa. Those ribs were produced from hogs raised on large (evil) corporate farms that are incredibly efficient. They are butchered, then packed and shipped by train to the East coast, where they are moved directly from the intermodal facility to a distribution point. I am going out on a limb here, but Swift or Armour or the other big producers donÂ’t do this at a loss, so somebody is actually making money on that incredibly inexpensive pork. The American freight train system is amazingly good, and stunningly inexpensive. Freight adds just a few cents/pound to that pork, and since the trains are almost always pulled full, the carbon footprint (if anyone gives a ratÂ’s ass) is tiny. The trucks that move the trailers are also pretty efficient.

Contrast that to Mr. Hippy Douchebag Organic Farmer. He runs a much less efficient farm, probably doesnÂ’t manage the waste as well, and hauls his butchered pigs to your local farmerÂ’s market in an old Ford panel truck, belching oily smoke the whole way. His transportation costs, and the attendant carbon footprint, are astronomical compared to a Burlington Northern train (4x4,000hp locomotives pulling 40 TOFC cars with 175 trailers is an incredible sight) and a few minutes of tractor time. And the best part? Mr. HDOF charges about $12/lb. for the privilege of risking trichinosis when eating his pork, because he feeds his pigs table scraps.

But thatÂ’s only the first stop on the long road to get enough food for one week for the locavore hipster. That 1994 Volvo (or 2012 Suburban) is going to be running for hours, going from one cluster of local food purveyors to the next. That small carbon footprint? A myth. And the quality of food? Another myth. Some things grow nicely locally. But not everything, and these fools are too stupid to realize it. IÂ’ll take produce from the Central Valley and peaches from Colorado and avocados from Mexico and lobster from Maine and Shiraz from Australia and lamb from Utah and Ahi tuna from Hawaii and tahini from Israel andÂ…Â…

The reality is that these people are modern-day Luddites, who would have us eating gruel in the dark – all for the sake of preserving some ephemeral, unrealistic ideal of the earth, and replacing real religion with a feel-good animist view of the world.

Spare meÂ…I want economies of scale and technology to push food costs down and quality up. If they want to live in the 12th century, they should move to Yemen or Afghanistan and commune with natureÂ….until they get their heads removed from their necks for being so damned irritating and pompous.

Posted by: Open Blogger at 09:44 AM | Comments (330)
Post contains 630 words, total size 4 kb.

1 Chris Christie endorsed by labor union.

Who wants to put money down on the date he switches parties?

Before or after 2014 midterms?

Posted by: jeremiah God Damn Barack Obama the Mother Fucking SCoaMF wright at December 18, 2012 09:46 AM (ovpNn)

2 We have a good local farmer's market here where I am, long-term institution, some good deals to be had. But no way I'm making it my primary source.

Posted by: Brother Cavil, keeper of the Orbital Mind Control Lasers at December 18, 2012 09:48 AM (GBXon)

3 Good points. I think there is a sound niche economy for local farm goods. Hard to beat local produce for freshness, and for getting key ingredients to local restaurants that are willing to pay for them. But be damned if I'll pay more than I will at Walmart or Costco for grains, milk, eggs, meats, etc..., just because it is "local".

Posted by: krakatoa at December 18, 2012 09:49 AM (l7H1O)

4 My argument for local and seasonal foods are the taste. There is nothing like picking your own strawberries, or visiting your local orchard for fresh apple cider. Plus, I have my own garden each year... I never have to buy herbs, all year round. And, yes, I shop at Costco, too, but mainly for meat.

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 09:50 AM (LpQbZ)

5 I always eat local. I'm not of the Hollywood elite. I can't afford to jet off to Paris for dinner.

Posted by: rickb223 Let. It. Burn. at December 18, 2012 09:50 AM (GFM2b)

6 And, milk from a local dairy... yum...

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 09:50 AM (LpQbZ)

7 Such vanity. Especially in large cities. What will you eat that is local in Los Angeles? I promise you virtually everything will be shipped in from one hundred miles away, at least. Also, how do precious Manhattanites eat "local" strawberries and tomatoes and starfruit in December? Shut up, that's how.

Posted by: George Orwell what knows being American means free rubbers and gun control at December 18, 2012 09:50 AM (LyF0H)

8 Roast Libtard is local.

Just sayin'.

Posted by: Kristophr at December 18, 2012 09:50 AM (wYVte)

9 We have a decent farmer's market at our local high school every Thursday, we do regular business with a local dairy that delivers good quality food at a good price and no hipsters to be found anywhere.

Posted by: NR Pax at December 18, 2012 09:50 AM (1ml8s)

10

Jersey tomatoes are the best reason for us to eat local. Blueberries too. But if we strictly followed a local diet we wouldn't be able to eat oranges or other citrus that are important sources of Vitamin C.

 

Posted by: kallisto at December 18, 2012 09:51 AM (jm/9g)

11 Perpetual campaign.  Use their arguments against them (if you're on the 'other side'.)

Image w/caption:

"Want local food without the evil multinationals?  You'll love Somalia!"

Posted by: Tonic Dog at December 18, 2012 09:51 AM (X/+QT)

12 Roast Libtard is local. In some areas. Elsewhere it's an import, though usually it migrated on its own.

Posted by: Brother Cavil, keeper of the Orbital Mind Control Lasers at December 18, 2012 09:51 AM (GBXon)

13 Grass skirt. Mud hut stacked 10 high. Bamboo ladder or maybe a hemp rope. I too dislike your pseudonym.

Posted by: DM at December 18, 2012 09:51 AM (+UrNT)

14 Did someone sound the clarion call for hobo hunting, aka, long pig?

Posted by: rickb223 Let. It. Burn. at December 18, 2012 09:52 AM (GFM2b)

15 Dude  --  I don't even read Ace's posts when they're that long.

Unless it's a movie review.

My argument for local and seasonal foods are the taste.

I always assumed that was the point.

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 09:52 AM (KXm42)

16 I remember James Lileks snarking about this after eating a steak at a restaurant that boasted its local food buying efforts: Mmm. You can taste the proximity.

Posted by: Pug Mahon at December 18, 2012 09:53 AM (K+mtQ)

17 Just out of curiosity.
But isn't the price of two similar items generally indicative of the amount of energy put into it and thus the carbon foot print? (Generally here.)

I mean it's not like they ship these avocados for free.  That costs money, but they can afford to do it for less than the local nuts because they've made efficiency improvements elsewhere (which likely result in a lower overall carbon footprint.)
Furthermore, some of this is stupid.  Yes my giant harvester runs on diesel, nifty fact though, employing 20 people to hand pick (who among other things have to drive in) likely has an overall higher carbon footprint (although in fairness that's because the carbon footprint is a horrible measure of anything.)

Having said that, I get local tomatoes whenever I can.  But then, I live in the Mississippi River valley.  Tomatoes are kinda a thing here (my grandparent's family owned a tomato farm).  We ship them out to the rest of the country.  So when I can get them, it means they're in season, and in season stuff tends to taste better than hot house stuff.  (Or to put it differently: buy stuff where it grows best, not just in 100 miles of you.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 09:53 AM (Vt/hU)

18 Local, organic foods have improved my health greatly. I had IBS so bad it was seriously impacting my life in a negative way, but eating local, organic foods has led to a huge improvement in my life. I like organics, I just don't like the people I have to deal with, the hippies and hipsters who run and shop in those places.

Posted by: BlueStateRepub at December 18, 2012 09:53 AM (7ObY1)

19 Roast Libtard is local. Libtard foie gras isn't too bad. But the best part is force-feeding them fattening food.

Posted by: George Orwell what knows being American means free rubbers and gun control at December 18, 2012 09:53 AM (LyF0H)

20 The environmental argument for buying locally is bullshit and those making it should be honest about that. Having said that, I frequent some local produce stands and such during the summer. It is a pleasant experience and the food is fresh.

Posted by: Ken Royall at December 18, 2012 09:54 AM (x0g8a)

21 That 1994 Volvo (or 2012 Suburban) is going to be running for hours, going from one cluster of local food purveyors to the next.
---
Well the solution to this problem would be to combine all the types of food being purveyed into a single market location - perhaps to be known as a supermarket. /

Posted by: RioBravo at December 18, 2012 09:54 AM (eEfYn)

22 My wife orders in from the local chinese restaurant. How does that figure into global warming? I know it does my wallet no good?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at December 18, 2012 09:54 AM (79ueO)

23 My super-religious brother and sister-in-law have become evangelical organic food snobs. They rant on about the evils of Mansanto like liberals rant about Halliburton.

Is Mansanto really evil, and intent on poisoning the US with genetically-modified food? Doesn't seem very profitable.

Posted by: Pyrocles at December 18, 2012 09:54 AM (cv5Iw)

24 It's impossible to argue with idiocy as grandiose as this. BTW, I guess local businesses can go to hell in favor of Costco.

Posted by: libfreak50 at December 18, 2012 09:54 AM (hpPAv)

25 The reason local food is better is mostly because (presumably) its fresher.

Expanding, products can be sold locally that simply won't survive long trips intact (eg like heirloom tomatoes).   I buy tomatoes and other produce at the Farmer's market grown locally that are better than anything in the supermarket, and at less cost.

But I don't believe any of this "carbon footprint" nonsense.  Small locally grown crops are probably LESS efficiently grown, and therefore take up a LARGER carbon footprint, than mass grown commercial crops.



Posted by: looking closely at December 18, 2012 09:54 AM (6Q9g2)

26 Clemenzas rule to fine dining , Eat Nothing but US produced edibles, that includes Mountain Oysters...

Posted by: Clemenza at December 18, 2012 09:55 AM (ILM+d)

27 combine all the types of food being purveyed into a single market location - perhaps to be known as a supermarket. Super? Sounds too exclusionary, like you're superior to everyone else. Let's call them diversitymarkets. Instead of clerks, we'll staff them with "transaction counselors."

Posted by: George Orwell what knows being American means free rubbers and gun control at December 18, 2012 09:56 AM (LyF0H)

28 "Icky" is Dildo and food in the same sentence.

Posted by: marcus at December 18, 2012 09:56 AM (GGCsk)

29 BTW, I guess local businesses can go to hell in favor of Costco.

I have to agree with the damn liberal on this one.  Produce in supermarkets sucks ass.

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 09:57 AM (KXm42)

30 CBD, their argument is that by locally produced products that the polluting transportation to bring it from the mid-west of Mexico to NJ is more.


I have never seen the slightest attempt to produce in real evidence of this, but there you are. It is just more feel-good bull shit.


But from a local stand point, I do know that if I go out to the farmer's market here and get fresh peaches, tomatoes and beans, they will in fact they will be fresh and better tasting than the ones shipped green from Mexico or CA.

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 09:57 AM (53z96)

31 The hipsters may promote this crap but the Govt they voted for blocks it at every step. An old guy in the little town near me used to sell eggs through the local bar. They were a good price and I thought they tasted better (though that may be in my head cause I got to know and like the old guy). Well low and behold the Health department swooped in to save me and he can no longer sell his eggs (legally). They also have rules on potlucks and every f%$king thing else.

Posted by: Buzzsaw at December 18, 2012 09:57 AM (81UWZ)

32 Except ironically for Fiesta.  Their produce is excellent.  YMMV.

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 09:58 AM (KXm42)

33 Can you change your username, some of us aren't thrilled by the abject juvenile perversity that, on a rare occasion, occurs around here.

Posted by: Someone on the wrong blog at December 18, 2012 09:58 AM (/YJYi)

34 I buy tomatoes and other produce at the Farmer's market grown locally that are better than anything in the supermarket
----
Tomatoes are the only (well, maybe some sweet corn too) justification for local markets. In a life-long quest I have yet to find a decent tomato in a supermarket. (I did enjoy a fine tomato in a famous Brooklyn steakhouse once. It only cost $20.)

Posted by: RioBravo at December 18, 2012 09:58 AM (eEfYn)

35 Hey, hippy douchebag farmer, I'm going to put my carbon footprint up your methane ass.

Posted by: WalrusRex at December 18, 2012 09:58 AM (hyB08)

36 What will you eat that is local in Los Angeles? The local Farmer's Market (I lived in the beach cities -- Manhattan, Hermosa, Redondo) always exhibited who and where their farms were. Also, how do precious Manhattanites eat "local" strawberries and tomatoes and starfruit in December? Shut up, that's how. So many ways to answer this. And, seasonal local crops is key. Seasonal. Strawberries in summer. Apple cider in the fall... etc... I guess your idea of "local" is around the corner... which is not the definition. To each his own. Local and seasonal taste superb. If you have a Trader Joe's in the area, they try to buy local wherever their stores are located. Nothing to do with climate, just taste and nutrients.

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 09:59 AM (LpQbZ)

37 Conspicuous virtue like the local food crap is part of post-moderns religion. Little thought and a whole lot of dogma.

I'm certain that the majority of those that claim these goofy  things to be important would never practice them if they couldn't tell anyone.


Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at December 18, 2012 09:59 AM (AsRy8)

38 Expanding, products can be sold locally that simply won't survive long trips intact (eg like heirloom tomatoes). I buy tomatoes and other produce at the Farmer's market grown locally that are better than anything in the supermarket, and at less cost.

Ahhhh how I love living in the middle of the Midwest.
Where our supermarkets actually stock local heirloom tomatoes if I so choose (I actually like "Big Beef" Tomatoes as a variety, so I'm good anyway.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 09:59 AM (Vt/hU)

39 No one should force anyone to eat anything. Let's be free to choose. Meanwhile the USDA regulates the shit out of organic food driving up the cost. They also have rules on raw milk that limit innovation. I like both. Sometimes I pay more for ribs organically grown, pastured and cut by a local butcher. They taste a heckuva lot better than the mass produced ones. But, with transparency I can choose to pay for what i perceive as better pork. Every time I get in an argument with these Luddittes it comes down to their controlling me, and global warming is an excuse to do it. Free to Choose. Why is that so hard to understand?

Posted by: pointsnfigures at December 18, 2012 09:59 AM (EBPRt)

40 Eat Local is cool if you live in California where you can grow almost anything and the growing seasons are long. Other areas of the country don't have these luxuries, so overall it's stupid.

Posted by: Eddie Baby at December 18, 2012 09:59 AM (DK/dd)

41 Think your better than a third world farmer across the globe, sounds kind of racist..

Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at December 18, 2012 09:59 AM (NzBQO)

42 As with everything else about these people, it boils down to a class argument and their desire to distance themselves from the herd.  In the old days, only the rich ate asparagus.  Now, at Costco, everyone can afford it, and where's the fun in that?  So, local just becomes the next class discriminator. 

When these people start eating locally grown Twinkies, I'll listen to what they have to say.

Posted by: pep at December 18, 2012 09:59 AM (USJNU)

43 In a life-long quest I have yet to find a decent tomato in a supermarket.

The tomatoes are escpecially bad, but it's alot more than just that.

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 10:00 AM (KXm42)

44 I hear this loca-vore shit all the time. 

First thing I try to ask the hipster douchebags is just how much distance it takes before something isn't local.  I get varying answers, but the average is around 200 miles.  That's a fucking staggering distance if you think about having to walk or bike that.  A 200 mile trip to the furthest-most "local" source means a 400 mile round trip for the buyer.  How the fuck is that reasonable?  I'm sure as shit not going 200 miles out of my way to get some "local" cheese and meats when I can get better from my "local" grocery store.

The more hardcore loca-vores say that they only eat what's produced "locally" forsaking anything past their arbitrary boundary.  That's fine, but I happen to like citrus fruit which is only grown in very specific parts of this country, all of which are greater than 200 miles away from me.  Am I to give up citrus just because it's not grown "locally"?  This is where the whole philosophy breaks down into illogical bullshit.  The same logic then spans to things like seafood, exotic food, foreign food, etc.  If it's further than 200 miles away, I'm not supposed to want it anymore.  Fuck that shit.

This whole "local food" movement started in CA where a lot of dogooder liberal fucksticks looked around and said "thank god we live here in CA where our state can grow all sorts of shit all year round, not like those other stupid backward states that only have a fraction of the growing season we have!"  They started this because they have the advantage of growing all sorts of produce at various times of the year, using arable land not found equally in the other 49 (56) states.  CA has an advantage of being geographically blessed with extremely favourable farming land and weather.  These liberal fuckwads are being completely egocentric with respect to their preaching.

One last thing, and maybe the most important.  Processed foods have an extremely long shelf life when compared to organic foods.  My can of soup or box dinner or frozen chicken can last far longer than your organic meat and vegetables.  Your locally grown, organic foods must be picked/selected, shipped, and consumed within a short span of time.  My Kraft dinner or hamburger helper can sit on my pantry shelf for weeks before I eat without suffering from botulism or worse. 

Posted by: EC at December 18, 2012 10:01 AM (GQ8sn)

45 And yes, sometimes local DOES taste better.  But lots of common folk can't afford that luxury.  Again, class.

Posted by: pep at December 18, 2012 10:01 AM (USJNU)

46 Think locally, eat globally.

Posted by: WalrusRex at December 18, 2012 10:01 AM (hyB08)

47 #37

My local supermarkets do stock *some* locally grown vegetables (including/especially locally grown peaches), but for whatever reason, I've never seen local tomatoes.   

Not sure why.  Maybe its because the local growers don't want to deal with supermarkets.

Posted by: looking closely at December 18, 2012 10:02 AM (6Q9g2)

48 Oh by the way anyone who shops at Whole Foods is a sucker and has way to much disposable income

Posted by: Nevergiveup at December 18, 2012 10:02 AM (79ueO)

49 Nothing to do with climate, just taste and nutrients.

And price.

Posted by: pep at December 18, 2012 10:02 AM (USJNU)

50 Supermarket tomatoes are almost all from Mexico. Florida also grows a lot in the Winter but they can not compete with Mexico.

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 10:03 AM (53z96)

51 vegetables are for fags...

Posted by: D. Hopper at December 18, 2012 10:03 AM (AVfT8)

52 I guess your idea of "local" is around the corner... which is not the definition. If in Los Angeles I eat strawberries from Nipomo, is that local? That's nearly 100 miles away. This dissolves the definition of local into nothing. If Nipomo berries are local, then a local gas station includes anything within a two hour drive. Locavore = preening about your freaking food. Eat what you want. Until Michelle says otherwise, of course.

Posted by: George Orwell what knows being American means free rubbers and gun control at December 18, 2012 10:03 AM (LyF0H)

53 Yeah local in California includes the whole state. It's like someone in Maine buying something grown in Pennsylvania.

Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at December 18, 2012 10:03 AM (NzBQO)

54 In Atlantic City, for example, coastal engineer Cyril Galvin says the tide gauge data may be too sensitive to local and regional activities that aren’t ultimately related to “natural” changes in sea level — including any that might be related to greenhouse gas-induced global warming.

In examining sea-level changes for 100 years or more from stations on the Eastern Seaboard, Mr. Galvin could not find any acceleration in sea-level rise. University of Florida professor Robert Dean and Army Corps of Engineers analyst James Houston have independently reached this same conclusion.

While examining tide gauge records from Atlantic City's Steel Pier, Mr. Galvin discovered a remarkable effect apparently caused by spectators who came to watch horse-diving between 1929 and 1978. From old photographs, it was estimated that there must have been about 4,000 spectators who would come to watch. Given that this crowd probably weighed about 150 tons, the pier was subject to significant loading and unloading cycles. The initial 1912-1928 data showed the sea level rising at a rate of 0.12 inches per year. The rate tripled around 1929 when the horses began diving. When the shows were suspended from 1945 to 1953, sea level fell at a rate of 0.06 inches per year. When the diving resumed, the sea level rose again at a rate of 0.16 inches per year.

Posted by: Debbie Weaselwords Schultz at December 18, 2012 10:04 AM (e8kgV)

55 The "best" tomatoes are ones you grow in your own bushes in pots on the South side of the house. But that is more trouble than stopping at a road side stand and buying a few.

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 10:04 AM (53z96)

56 I am normally fine eating locally raised food...  But occasionally, I might want Chinese or Mexican.



Oh well, it the end, it's all Bwrains.....Bwaiiins!.....BRWAAAIINS....

Posted by: Zombie Cannibal at December 18, 2012 10:04 AM (HqpV0)

57 California needs high-speed trichinosis.  Quick, float a bond sale.

Posted by: Wm T Sherman at December 18, 2012 10:04 AM (w41GQ)

58 Organic is just another word for "19th century farming." It's like these jerks have never heard of the Irish Potato Famine or Wheat rust. We should convince the libs that modern agriculture is very green. Most city dwellers have no conception that 90% of land is undeveloped and can be used for either wilderness or farming. Have them zoom out halfway in Google maps and scroll around the country if they don't believe you. The higher yield per acre of farmland, the more land we can let grow wild. Nothing razes forests faster than food scarcity, and starving people don't give a damn about biodiversity. Seeing as how the greenies are against all the foundations of human wellbeing (e.g. electricity, motorized transport) they'll probably shrug and say, "No food for you, Gaia rapists."

Posted by: xuyee at December 18, 2012 10:04 AM (/QiO2)

59 brb....goin glocal.

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 10:05 AM (KXm42)

60 Eat local? Isn't that hard in New York City?

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 18, 2012 10:05 AM (QupBk)

61 Oh and BTW, "organic food" is a bull shit rip off.

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 10:05 AM (53z96)

62 But from a local stand point, I do know that if I go out to the farmer's market here and get fresh peaches, tomatoes and beans, they will in fact they will be fresh and better tasting than the ones shipped green from Mexico or CA. Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 01:57 PM (53z96) And, hopefully, you won't get the feces and urine that go along with food grown, picked and shipped from ... abroad. I don't trust the food from Mexico.

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 10:06 AM (LpQbZ)

63 Woah! Such harsh vibes man! You need to toke some of my organically grown medical "herb" and slap on some patchouli oil and get in tune with like the universe and stuff!

Posted by: Mr. Hippy Douchebag Organic Farmer at December 18, 2012 10:06 AM (sZTYJ)

64 "It is a pleasant experience and the food is fresh. "

Posted by: Ken Royall at December 18, 2012 01:54 PM (x0g8a)

Works for me. In fact, that may be the only rational reason.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 18, 2012 10:06 AM (GsoHv)

65 7 Such vanity. Especially in large cities. What will you eat that is local in Los Angeles? I promise you virtually everything will be shipped in from one hundred miles away, at least.

Also, how do precious Manhattanites eat "local" strawberries and tomatoes and starfruit in December? Shut up, that's how. Posted by: George Orwell what knows being American means free rubbers and gun control at December 18, 2012 01:50 PM

The hipsters eat "locally grown" from rooftops in the East Village or across the bridge in Brooklyn. Don't ask what was in the water, fertilizer, or what the pigeons and rats have dropped in with it

I reserve my biggest laughs for the "Fair Trade Coffee" hipsters and those who actually believe Ben & Jerry use only the most righteous ingredients before Unilever distributes it

Posted by: kbdabear at December 18, 2012 10:06 AM (wwsoB)

66 Eat local? Isn't that hard in New York City? Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 18, 2012 02:05 PM (QupBk) Well I usually tell most of the liberals I run into in NYC to eat shit?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at December 18, 2012 10:07 AM (79ueO)

67 I just want a tomato that doesn't tast like a wax version of what an alien thinks a tomato should taste like.

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 10:07 AM (KXm42)

68

Just so. Charlie Brown.  My family is in the commerical egg production business. Maybe you can do another post about commerical animal agriculture, what HSUS-animal rights zealots call 'factory farming'.  There are 2% Americans producing food for the rest of us (this includes farming and agri-business). The 'buy local' and 'organic' movements reduce the quality of our food and drastically raise the costs. Commerical agriculture has become very efficient and is excellent at food safety.  The local and organic "hippie" producers do not need to meet USDA or FDA requirements.  And if any of you saw the movie "Food, Inc." - it is pure leftist anti-capitalist propaganda aimed at corporate agriculture.

Posted by: Liberty Lover at December 18, 2012 10:07 AM (encrR)

69 The reality is that these people are modern-day Luddites, who would have us eating gruel in the dark – all for the sake of preserving some ephemeral, unrealistic ideal of the earth, and replacing real religion with a feel-good animist view of the world.

Environmental extremism is more a manifestation of some deep-seated psychological defect than a rational response to objective facts.  These people see the mass population as inferiors who can be deprived of affordable fuel, warmth, and comfort, not to mention working toilets, effective dishwasher soap, functional light bulbs, personal transportation, grocery bags and a slew of other harmless conveniences.  The point is not to "save the Earth" but to validate the supposed superiority of those who are enlightened enough to understand the "big picture" that eludes the lumpenproles.

Fuck them.  I don't take advice from people who are mentally unsound.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 18, 2012 10:07 AM (QKKT0)

70 All the fast food joints i go to are local, so... But on a different note, I think eating local gets conflated with localism in general. It's definitely a boon to your community to visit local stores and emphasize and empower local governance for local issues that require government, for instance.

Posted by: Truman North (D) at December 18, 2012 10:07 AM (zE7QH)

71 The whole of left wing food culture amounts to bourgeois self-indulgence. That alone makes me amenable to tax increases.

Posted by: Zippity Doo Dah at December 18, 2012 10:08 AM (E55AK)

72 Hey, why are you picking on me?

Posted by: Patchouli at December 18, 2012 10:08 AM (sZTYJ)

73 The "best" tomatoes are ones you grow in your own bushes in pots on the South side of the house. But that is more trouble than stopping at a road side stand and buying a few. Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 02:04 PM (53z96) As we've discussed many a mornin', Vic, it's the critters we have to deal with at times. I really want a green house, now.

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 10:08 AM (LpQbZ)

74 My local supermarkets do stock *some* locally grown vegetables (including/especially locally grown peaches), but for whatever reason, I've never seen local tomatoes.

Not sure why. Maybe its because the local growers don't want to deal with supermarkets.

Posted by: looking closely at December 18, 2012 02:02 PM (6Q9g2)


I think it varies depending on what supermarkets you have to deal with.

St. Louis has a bizarre make up of grocery stores whereby 2 of the 3 major chains are HQ'd here and basically only Local but also strikingly large corporations (and the 3rd is HQ'd here but a wholly owned subsidiary of a larger company.)  There's not a kroger for hundreds of miles, and only like 2 Costcos.

Part of that means they try to specifically work out relationships with local distributors (and being local themselves gives them an edge.)  And like I said, we're a Tomato powerhouse anyway.  (Us and Arkansas which isn't that far.)

Plus Peaches and Apples.  The Eckhert farms produce more than enough apples and peaches in season to provide for at least one of those chains (usually 2).  The end result is decent produce (onions tend to be a problem, but I think I'm just picky.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 10:08 AM (Vt/hU)

75 Yeah, because Canadians and northern state Americans don't need fruit and vegetables all year round or (counter-intuitively from their professed goal) use carbon-fed greenhouse-grown fruits and vegetables.

Scurvy: everything old is new again.

Posted by: andycanuck at December 18, 2012 10:08 AM (jPVBi)

76 An individual isn't legally allowed to butcher their own animals. Google up ethical slaughter. There is a strong argument for local, on the farm slaughter, as producing better tasting meat. But the government demands that all meats be processed at a slaughter facility. Which increases the stress and adds negative flavor fear and stress hormones.

Posted by: Mike Hunt at December 18, 2012 10:08 AM (G6kli)

77 My wife and I joined up a local CSA program this past year, it was pretty great but we had too much stuff for just the two of us and a lot went to waste. It was nice to try some new things that we had normally avoided. I had never had brussel sprouts before because the were "gross". Ended up being pretty tasty. I think in general eating local in season stuff is a good thing, I think the pretentiousness of the whole organic food movement may be what drives people nuts. Our CSA farm was not organic though, just a major farm in NJ that happened to have a local pickup, we could have chosen some more diverse options, but it was less convenient to go pick up the box each week.

Posted by: dr. shatterhand at December 18, 2012 10:09 AM (n/ogz)

78 Lotteries are a tax on stupid, local/organic food is a tax on gullible.  Kobe beef ordered outside of Japan is a tax on the stupidly gullible.

Posted by: Joe at December 18, 2012 10:09 AM (9r3GM)

79

We eat local. That doe did not stand a chance. She's in the freezer now.

Posted by: Cicero Kid at December 18, 2012 10:09 AM (1+QgF)

80 And speaking of "celebrity chefs" et al.  I find it humorous in their cooking shows and in the magazines like Bon Apatite the recipes all have tons of crap you will never get short of a deli in NYC or LA.  Totally worthless for someone who lives in the middle of the country or the South.

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 10:09 AM (53z96)

81 Unlike the hippies, we don't use patchouli oil. Now, back to smashing all these evil computers that rob people who have made a living counting on their fingers...

Posted by: The Luddites at December 18, 2012 10:10 AM (sZTYJ)

82 My biggest gripe is in getting fresh seafood... The entire seafood industry is a mess... unless you live somewhere like Charleston -- yummy fresh crabs... etc.

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 10:10 AM (LpQbZ)

83 Still, there there are a few good conservative reasons for liking local food when it's reasonable to do so.

1. If we get to the point where It All Burns, it's better not to depend on a farm on another continent. Local food can in principle act as a hedge against global supply disruption.

2. It builds community in the real sense - on friendship and mutually beneficial trade.

3. Your local gardener is less likely to be employing truckloads of illegal immigrants.

And so on. Don't be a hippie about it and don't pretend you're saving Gaia, but you're not a Bad Conservative by eating local food.

Posted by: Matt at December 18, 2012 10:10 AM (+huLH)

84

This post could be summed up in two words:  Agenda 21.

 

It's not a hoax cooked  up by Beck to sell books.  It's here and it's been established in the minds of so many people (just try to talk to someone who thinks Whole Foods is the shnizzle).

 

Although everything pointed out  in this post is absolutely true, there are  even conservatives out there who've been caught up in the organic/whole food agenda.   And I'll repeat.  It is a  leftist agenda.

Posted by: Soona at December 18, 2012 10:11 AM (uLirs)

85 I loves me some Jersey tomatoes in the summer time. Must be the chemicals in the ground.

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at December 18, 2012 10:11 AM (YmPwQ)

86 As we've discussed many a mornin', Vic, it's the critters we have to deal with at times.


Yep, its hard to grow tomatoes here without the damn bugs eating them up.  With my apple trees its the bugs AND the birds.  Mockingbirds are hell on apples.

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 10:11 AM (53z96)

87 And speaking of "celebrity chefs" et al. I find it humorous in their cooking shows and in the magazines like Bon Apatite the recipes all have tons of crap you will never get short of a deli in NYC or LA. Totally worthless for someone who lives in the middle of the country or the South.

Stick with America's Test Kitchen.  That is teh shizzle.  Everything they make makes me want to eat my TV.

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 10:11 AM (KXm42)

88 We eat local. That doe did not stand a chance. She's in the freezer now. Posted by: Cicero Kid at December 18, 2012 02:09 PM (1+QgF) hehe, yes. My brother bags at least one deer a year, and the venison lasts a very long time from just one deer. He has fed a family of 5 on his hunting and fishing quite well.

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 10:12 AM (LpQbZ)

89 And so on. Don't be a hippie about it and don't pretend you're saving Gaia, but you're not a Bad Conservative by eating local food.

I'll eat local food if it's priced better and of similar quality than what I can find at the local big chain supermarket.  I'm not paying $12/lbs for chicken no matter how organic or free range it was.

Posted by: EC at December 18, 2012 10:12 AM (GQ8sn)

90 Lets just cut the power to San Francisco for a couple of years, block all the freeways and bridges heading out of town and see how long they last on their local economy.

Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at December 18, 2012 10:12 AM (NzBQO)

91 .... and Rod Dreher writes on a so-called "conservative" site

Posted by: Gerry at December 18, 2012 10:13 AM (DJIo7)

92 There is only one way to get "fresh" sea food.  Go to the beach and buy it straight off the boats.  But that limits what you can get.

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 10:13 AM (53z96)

93

The reality is that these people are modern-day Luddites

 

Say it with me:  REGRESSIVES.  

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at December 18, 2012 10:13 AM (4df7R)

94

Well done CBD!

I am in the food business- production agriculture.  I cannot tell you how much I agree with your righteous anger.  Food, its production and distribution, have become another victim of leftist theology.  The frustrating thing about food issues is that not only are the basically uninformed affected, but also people who are otherwise intelligent and well informed are often clueless in regard to modern farming, food production and distribution.

Posted by: Alamo at December 18, 2012 10:13 AM (m/tN9)

95 Chris Christie endorsed by labor union.

Who wants to put money down on the date he switches parties?

Before or after 2014 midterms?

Probably never.  The (R) label is advantageous to him.  Plus, he's running against Cory Booker. who the Dems see as a rising star and won't dump for Christie (who, let's face it, is hated by the public employees and their unions).

Despite his pathetic performance with Sandy, he'd be dumped overboard in 20 seconds by the Democrats.  And now he doesn't need other Republicans per se, he has his own power base.

Oh, and if the rich should pay their fair share, how about rich NY and NJ paying for their own cleanup.  I don't get to live an hour from the beach, why do I have to pay for others to have that privileged.  Don't like hurricanes?  Move to Iowa.  It'll be balmy with a high under 30 for the next 2 weeks or so.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 18, 2012 10:13 AM (xSegX)

96

60 Vic- Especially organic eggs.  My company actually provides both 'organic' and 'non-organic' eggs to our customers (grocery stores in the Mid-Atlantic from NYC to Washington DC).  But 'organic' eggs are produced by free range chickens who peck around in their own manure.  Organic chickens cannot use antibiotics in any form, they are riddled with worms and parasites, but their eggs are 'organic'.

Posted by: Liberty Lover at December 18, 2012 10:13 AM (encrR)

97 Yesterday NPR was on this, and boldly stated that it's the carbon footprint, not the proximity, that needs to be the determining factor. They said that fresh tomatoes in Baltimore in February are a sin. They also said that apples trucked 50 miles have a worse footprint than a shipload from halfway around the globe. That would be Chinese apples, I reckon. Apparently their apples walk from the quay to you.

We're in tomato country, and every little town used to have its own canning operation, back when the mere existence of such things was considered the marvel of the goddamned age. Most were just everyday quality, so got driven out by those who knew how to manage cheap labor better, or distribute to chain stores better. There are a couple that I miss because their recipe was a little different. One is hanging in there, and we cherish it.

Every couple of years I make a whopping big iron kettle of ketchup here on the property, outside, with our own fruit and a coal fire, just to piss off the relatives and neighbors. It's a lot of fucking work. Pearl-clutching cityfolk are so used to Heinz that they are convinced there is something wrong with it (it's the sugar, and Red #5).  After the apocalypse, I will have ketchup. Don't come begging to me.

I have a really good idea. Why doesn't everybody put the guns away and stop telling me where and how to buy my food. You are not going to win this. I'm armed to the teeth, and I have tomatoes.      

Posted by: comatus at December 18, 2012 10:14 AM (qaVK+)

98 I grew up in the "country" in Northern New Jersey, and the roads that the "city people" took for their weekend trips to the country were lined with roadside fruit and veggie stands

Sweet corn was popular with the city folk since they actually saw corn growing in the fields. Few of them knew that the corn they saw was silage for the livestock

The big laugh was that the little veggie stands got most of  their tomatoes, corn, and zucchinis from the same warehouses in Hoboken that their supermarkets got them from, and the city folk were none the wiser

CBD, I believe you have lived in NJ. Hope you weren't naive enough to pay more for those tomatoes just because the Manhattanites are just so much smarter than those country rubes in Jersey



Posted by: kbdabear at December 18, 2012 10:14 AM (wwsoB)

99 We visit our farmer's market in the summer for a few things that we can't get anywhere else. Heirloom tomatoes for one, local honey for another (supposed to be good for allergies). We are also members of our local food co-op and damn if they don't have some uppity hipster assholes shopping there - and we haven't bought anything there in months because of it.

Posted by: shinypie at December 18, 2012 10:14 AM (Kz85k)

100 Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 01:57 PM (53z96)

And if I could get SC produce magically delivered to my roadside stand for a reasonable amount of money, I'd jump at it.

But Vic, you really need to spend some quality time at one of these farmer's markets, especially the Union Square Market in NYC.

$6 peaches, $10 loaves of bread, $25/lb pork chops.

And the people? Think back to your time in the Bay Area, and add disposable income.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 18, 2012 10:14 AM (GsoHv)

101

"...tons of crap you will never get short of a deli in NYC..."

 

Why hasn't somebody franchised an honest-to-god deli so that they could be duplicated across the country?

 

Do you have any idea of what some assholes think a Reuben sandwich is?

Posted by: jwest at December 18, 2012 10:15 AM (ZDsRL)

102 I like eating at my local Der Weinerschnitzel.

Posted by: wth at December 18, 2012 10:15 AM (wAQA5)

103 California avocados make the best guac, great for cooling of mexican food.

Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at December 18, 2012 10:16 AM (NzBQO)

104 My fava beans started flowering this week so I gots that going for my localism.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 18, 2012 10:16 AM (QupBk)

105 Who needs the alphabet networks when you can get your information from CharlieBrownsDildo.

God, I do love this Smart Military Blog.

Posted by: Lurking Flaneur at December 18, 2012 10:16 AM (ay6+/)

106 Posted by: kbdabear at December 18, 2012 02:14 PM (wwsoB)

Bergen county. Still here. And I never buy that crap. My local supermarket gets fresher corn than any of those stands, and the tomatoes are usually awful.

But you get the point. It's fashion and politics...pure and simple.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 18, 2012 10:16 AM (GsoHv)

107 For the record my wife buys the food, cooks it, and shoves it in front of me. I eat it no matter what. If it's good great, if it's not, enough butter and cheese usually makes it, if not good, at least edible. I have learned to pick my fights

Posted by: Nevergiveup at December 18, 2012 10:17 AM (79ueO)

108 Do you have any idea of what some assholes think a Reuben sandwich is?

I saw one at a bar selling without the sauerkraut and rye bread.  That wasn't a Reuben, it was just a corned beef sandwich with cheese.

Posted by: EC at December 18, 2012 10:17 AM (GQ8sn)

109

Buying local is good in a very, very narrow band of instances.  

 

1) When you live in a Third World (or Second World) region with   little to no refrigeration    or electricity.  In those cases, buying local is pretty much your   only option.

 

2) Certain locally   grown    produce, depending on the time of year.  

 

But I live in New England.    They ain't exactly growing pineapples and peaches in    Colebrook.   Tomatoes and cucumbers?  Sure.   They tend to have more flavor if they're home grown, or locally grown.   But I'm not going to spend that much more money on them if I can get commercially grown produce for half the price and   fine flavor.  

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at December 18, 2012 10:17 AM (4df7R)

110 These same localvores can't bring themselves to buy a Ford; they must have a Saab or Suburu.  Me, I grow my own vegis and put 'em up for winter and drive a Ford.  Local produce and meats often taste better.  Organic is a con.  The problem isn't the notion of eating local for its quality.  The problem is the dimwits that act as if they are doing the world a favor. 

Posted by: sophistahick at December 18, 2012 10:17 AM (UhXzR)

111 ""Jersey tomatoes are the best reason for us to eat local.""


Yeah I have no clue what makes our tomatoes so good. Any retard with a patch of dirt and seeds can grow small asteroid size tomatoes here, and they do.

Posted by: Berserker at December 18, 2012 10:17 AM (FMbng)

112 C'mon Mayans.  Or SMOD.  Either one.

Posted by: © Sponge at December 18, 2012 10:18 AM (UK9cE)

113 One of the most outrageous Leftist Sect policies to date is shutting off the water to farmers in California due to minnows... "California's Central Valley is considered by many to be the richest and most productive farmland in the nation. But this land is being threatened by the small, harmless-looking minnow called the delta smelt. Recently, it has landed on the endangered species list, causing a federal court to shut down vital pumps to farmers to help preserve it." h/t newsbusters 2009 FNC: Drought-Stricken Farmers Lose Fight for Water to Endangered Fish total bs

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 10:18 AM (LpQbZ)

114 Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 18, 2012 02:14 PM (GsoHv)

Something is awry.
The Farmers market around her is roughly equal to or less expensive than the grocery store in my experience.
And they sell live chickens! (Clearly you New Yorkers just don't know what an actual farmers market it.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 10:19 AM (Vt/hU)

115 When the Apocalypse comes, I will miss dairy products the most. Cows are just too tasty and stupid to be preserved in the short time horizon of the zombies. Goat's milk is a poor substitute.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 18, 2012 10:19 AM (QupBk)

116 inorite......I ordered spaghetti and I got egg noodles with ketchup.

Posted by: Henry Hill at December 18, 2012 10:19 AM (KXm42)

117 Stick with America's Test Kitchen.>>

I caught a little of that show the other day and they were making F-ing tater tots. A whole lot of prep and dirty dishes for a F-ing tater tot was what I went away with from that episode.

Posted by: Buzzsaw at December 18, 2012 10:19 AM (81UWZ)

118 I like buying locally sourced stuff for stuff that grows locally. However, until such time as the Cheetos fields bloom across the land, fuck being a localvore.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Tick tock tick tock. at December 18, 2012 10:19 AM (VtjlW)

119 I always eat local. Raiding a neighbor's fridge just seems rude.

Posted by: t-bird at December 18, 2012 10:20 AM (FcR7P)

120 I prefer organic because silicon-based food is too crunchy for me...

Posted by: The Political Hat at December 18, 2012 10:20 AM (sZTYJ)

121 But Vic, you really need to spend some quality time at one of these farmer's markets, especially the Union Square Market in NYC.

$6 peaches, $10 loaves of bread, $25/lb pork chops.



If I was to visit NYC (unlikely now) I could find a lot better places to spend time than a farmer's market selling peaches from SC.

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 10:20 AM (53z96)

122

" That wasn't a Reuben, it was just a corned beef sandwich with cheese."


 

Posted by: EC at December 18, 2012 02:17 PM (GQ8sn)

 

If there was justice in this world, bands of roving Jews would be busting up these shit sandwich shops with baseball bats.

Posted by: jwest at December 18, 2012 10:20 AM (ZDsRL)

123 I killed an elk 6 miles from my house a few weeks ago, but our freezer was probably built in Ohio or maybe Kentucky so I'm not sure if it still counts.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at December 18, 2012 10:20 AM (+lsX1)

124 toby928, And goats are good for other purposes, so you don't go killing them for meat.

Posted by: Fahhed who fs goats at December 18, 2012 10:21 AM (UhXzR)

125 #85  Vic,  you know what my son says about gardening pests?

"Better living through chemistry."

Posted by: Miss Marple at December 18, 2012 10:21 AM (GoIUi)

126 The only place I can think of to get into the "buy local" fetish is Lancaster County, Pennsylvania

Best growing soil in the world grown by people who've farmed the old fashioned way because it's their religion, not bien passant hipsterism


Posted by: kbdabear at December 18, 2012 10:21 AM (wwsoB)

127 And these local tomatoes have electrolites....

Posted by: village moron that works at local market at December 18, 2012 10:22 AM (UhXzR)

128 Do you have any idea of what some assholes think a Reuben sandwich is?

Posted by: jwest at December 18, 2012 02:15 PM (ZDsRL)

 

 

-----------------------------------------

 

 

Best Reuben sammiches I've ever eaten came from an original Jewish deli in, of  all places, Las Vegas, NV.

Posted by: Soona at December 18, 2012 10:22 AM (uLirs)

129 Well said, true dat

Posted by: Billy Bob in airpo at December 18, 2012 10:22 AM (3gtD5)

130 California avocados make the best guac, great for cooling of mexican food. Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at December 18, 2012 02:16 PM (NzBQO) And, they grow like weeds in Cali, yet they are so expensive. One of my favorite foods, avocados.

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 10:22 AM (LpQbZ)

131 You just made the 'list', Mr Comatus.

Posted by: theresa heinz-kerry at December 18, 2012 10:23 AM (jPVBi)

132 #116  One time my husband and I were watching Food Network and got a recipe for making our own egg rolls.

They came out just like the restaurant's.  Of course,  it took us 3 hours of prep time and about $45 in ingredients,  so we only did it once.

Posted by: Miss Marple at December 18, 2012 10:23 AM (GoIUi)

133 Best growing soil in the world grown by people who've farmed the old fashioned way because it's their religion, not bien passant hipsterism


Posted by: kbdabear at December 18, 2012 02:21 PM (wwsoB)


They do    have some damn good foodstuffs down there.  

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at December 18, 2012 10:23 AM (4df7R)

134 What will you eat that is local in Los Angeles? I know! You have no idea where that hobo came from.

Posted by: t-bird at December 18, 2012 10:23 AM (FcR7P)

135

My argument for local and seasonal foods are the taste.

We buy our meat from a local farm. We get better quality meat. The carbon footprint never entered our thought process.

Posted by: fluffy at December 18, 2012 10:23 AM (4pSIn)

136 "Better living through chemistry."

Posted by: Miss Marple at December 18, 2012 02:21 PM (GoIUi)


Yeah, I do do that but it is a continuing war.

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 10:23 AM (53z96)

137 BTW, WTF is 'chili'?

Posted by: theresa heinz-kerry at December 18, 2012 10:23 AM (jPVBi)

138 As to the argument that processed foods last a lot longer...ask yourself WHY they last so long. Is it worth the trade-off, willfully filling yourself with chemicals and poisons just so your stuff lasts longer than foods were meant to last? There is a ton of crap in our foods that the FDA doesn't even require to be listed on the label. I have to stand with the damn liberals on this issue. Just wish I didn't have to stand behind them in the organic food markets.

Posted by: BlueStateRepub at December 18, 2012 10:23 AM (7ObY1)

139 I just returned from grazing the local Sam's Club.  Had to restock the canned goods I ate down while sick. 

I might shop local for cucumbers and tomatoes, if they were available in winter locally.  But they aren't.  So guess who wins again - Wal-Mart and Sam's Club.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 18, 2012 10:23 AM (QdVWw)

140 I always smoke the loco-weed.  It's so fresh and skunky!

Posted by: local stoner at December 18, 2012 10:24 AM (UhXzR)

141 The only non-organic foods I eat are water and salt.

Posted by: Jean at December 18, 2012 10:24 AM (+8t8s)

142 I wonder what the hipsters who grow their rooftop veggies will do when the DHS datbases they voted for designates anyone who grows their own as "anti government survivalists" and a threat to domestic security and Archer-Daniels Midland (big Obama donors)

Posted by: kbdabear at December 18, 2012 10:25 AM (wwsoB)

143

"Best Reuben sammiches I've ever eaten came from an original Jewish deli in, of all places, Las Vegas, NV."

 

Las Vegas was (and still is) a Mecca for Jews.  The lobby cafe at the old Sands Hotel had a Reuben to die for.

Posted by: jwest at December 18, 2012 10:25 AM (ZDsRL)

144 They came out just like the restaurant's. Of course, it took us 3 hours of prep time and about $45 in ingredients, so we only did it once.

Posted by: Miss Marple at December 18, 2012 02:23 PM (GoIUi)

 

That's the thing with cooking shows.   It's great that they show how to make these really delicious meals, but for the most part they're only something you'd make    for special occasions or dinner guests because they just take so long and are so EXPENSIVE. 

 

I'm all about cheap and cheerful myself.   If a recipe requires more than six ingredients, my eyes start to    glaze over.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at December 18, 2012 10:25 AM (4df7R)

145

"That wasn't a Reuben, it was just a corned beef sandwich with cheese."

Posted by: EC at December 18, 2012 02:17 PM (GQ8sn)If there was justice in this world, bands of roving Jews would be busting up these shit sandwich shops with baseball bats.

Hahahahaha!!!

Posted by: fluffy at December 18, 2012 10:25 AM (4pSIn)

146 I will admit to frequenting our local farmers market because I can get ostrich and some really amazing cheeses. Of course, a few weeks ago some really really really annoying hipster douchetools were next to me at the stand where I was buying ostrich and the girl goes "oh I'm so happy to see you support buying locally!" I looked at her and replied perfectly deadpan "Yes. I far prefer the taste of the native North Carolina ostrich". She just blinked at me, the guy selling the stuff starting choking trying not to laugh and the guy she was with looked torn between sticking up for her and laughing.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Tick tock tick tock. at December 18, 2012 10:25 AM (VtjlW)

147 It suddenly occurred to me that EVERYTHING is a sort of religion. Even politics, where we hope to be saved by a politician of our own party.

Posted by: Eaton Cox at December 18, 2012 10:26 AM (q177U)

148 The only non-organic foods I eat are water and salt.

And Iron.  And Calcium. And......

Posted by: Internet McPedantypants at December 18, 2012 10:27 AM (KXm42)

149 The only non-organic foods I eat are water and salt. Good point. Our water is chloraminated, and I'm supposed to worry about chemicals in my food?

Posted by: t-bird at December 18, 2012 10:27 AM (FcR7P)

150 E. Cox, I'll have what you're smokin'

Posted by: local stoner at December 18, 2012 10:27 AM (UhXzR)

151 FYI, the Japanese internment camp Manzanar.  In Spanish it meant apple orchard.  Then Los Angeles in the 1920s required more water so the water that fed the valley was diverted.  And when the first internees showed up in March 1942, the valley was a cold desert.  All because of Los Angeles.

So the Angelitos might eat local if they have not for the past 80 years been so busy killing all the farms to slake their thirst.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 18, 2012 10:27 AM (QdVWw)

152 I'm all about cheap and cheerful myself. If a recipe requires more than six ingredients, my eyes start to glaze over. Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at December 18, 2012 02:25 PM (4df7R) Should I repost my fail proof recipe for pizza?

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Tick tock tick tock. at December 18, 2012 10:27 AM (VtjlW)

153 "Every couple of years I make a whopping big iron kettle of ketchup here on the property, outside, with our own fruit and a coal fire, just to piss off the relatives and neighbors. It's a lot of fucking work. Pearl-clutching cityfolk are so used to Heinz that they are convinced there is something wrong with it (it's the sugar, and Red #5). After the apocalypse, I will have ketchup. Don't come begging to me." Man, I tried my hand at Ketchup because I had so many tomatoes from the CSA, what a pain in the ass, and it was pretty good, but I still like the Heinz better. I don't think I will bother again, but it's good to know I can do it if I needed too.

Posted by: dr. shatterhand at December 18, 2012 10:27 AM (n/ogz)

154

"Yes. I far prefer the taste of the native North Carolina ostrich".

 

*snicker!*

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at December 18, 2012 10:27 AM (4df7R)

155 Eat Locally Govern Globally.

Posted by: The UN at December 18, 2012 10:27 AM (81UWZ)

156 125 That's where I am, making eggs that we send to your cities. We always grew our own produce and sold the extra from our own roadside stand.  Its how my Dad allowed us to earn money (we received no pay or allowance). Along with great produce and meat, we also produce the most snacks here in South Central PA - pretzels, potato chips and chocolate. 

Posted by: Liberty Lover at December 18, 2012 10:28 AM (encrR)

157 I can think of one huge reason to buy local, and it probably doesn't enter the leftist train of thought

I shudder to think how much of our processed foods were processed in China.

Posted by: kbdabear at December 18, 2012 10:28 AM (wwsoB)

158 Should I repost my fail proof recipe for pizza?

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Tick tock tick tock. at December 18, 2012 02:27 PM (VtjlW)

 

I wouldn't say no!

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at December 18, 2012 10:28 AM (4df7R)

159 Yeah, I do do that but it is a continuing war. Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 02:23 PM (53z96) same here add to my dilemma the squirrels, raccoons, chipmunks, groundhogs, birds, rabbits... they all mock me take a bite out of this, steal a flower off of this, and laugh, and laugh and laugh at me

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 10:28 AM (LpQbZ)

160 Anyone who serves a sammich with Thousand Island dressing and calls it a Reuben needs to hit upside the head with a baseball bat.  That is all.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 18, 2012 10:28 AM (QdVWw)

161 There is only one way to get "fresh" sea food. Go to the beach and buy it straight off the boats. But that limits what you can get.

That's not the only way to get fresh sea food buddy. Fishing rods, crab rings, clam shovels, shrimp guns, etc. Just add water.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at December 18, 2012 10:29 AM (+lsX1)

162

Las Vegas was (and still is) a Mecca for Jews.

Wait, what?

Posted by: Mahmoud Ahmadinnerjacket at December 18, 2012 10:30 AM (4pSIn)

163 I eat at my local McDonalds, my local Five Guys, my local Jake's, my local Chick-fil-A, ...

Posted by: rickl at December 18, 2012 10:30 AM (zoehZ)

164 Then Los Angeles in the 1920s required more water so the water that fed the valley was diverted. Really? That is the bleakest deserty-desert. Hard to believe there has ever been water there.

Posted by: t-bird at December 18, 2012 10:30 AM (FcR7P)

165 Las Vegas was (and still is) a Mecca for Jews. The lobby cafe at the old Sands Hotel had a Reuben to die for.

Posted by: jwest at December 18, 2012 02:25 PM (ZDsRL)

 

 

-------------------------------------------

 

 

LOL.  That was the place I was talking about.  There  was also a good deli (I don't know if it's still there)  in a shopping center behind the Sahara Hotel.

Posted by: Soona at December 18, 2012 10:30 AM (uLirs)

166 A buddy of mine's BIL is an "organic farmer"...but he's not the Douchebag Hipster type...in reality, he's just a good ole boy redneck with a farm that figured out how to rake in money from snooty Atlanta restaurants. 

Posted by: Country Singer at December 18, 2012 10:30 AM (L8r/r)

167 Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Tick tock tick tock. at December 18, 2012 02:25 PM (VtjlW)

Soulard Market here is huge.
And also currently open in December. How many hipsters do you think are currently there thinking they're buying "local" grown stuff?
(to be fair, I was there once in the winter, it has an excellent spice shop.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 10:30 AM (Vt/hU)

168 Balls.Of.Steel.

@BloombergNews
Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder is considering signing a bill to allow concealed guns in public schools | http://bloom.bg/UP5jOz

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at December 18, 2012 10:30 AM (AsRy8)

169 I shudder to think how much of our processed foods were processed in China. Posted by: kbdabear at December 18, 2012 02:28 PM (wwsoB) In one supermarket close to me, they sell garlic from China. Usually, I have two choices of garlic, there. One from China, the other from California. Why China ffs? I would never buy it, of course.

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 10:31 AM (LpQbZ)

170 I live near the Heinze plant.  Since I found W Ketchup, I haven't bought any of Thereza's crap.  I buy it on the interweb by the case, cheap.  And better tasting than Thereza's with no money finding it's way to her and her soon-to-be Secr. of State Horse face.

Posted by: Pittsburgh local stoner at December 18, 2012 10:31 AM (UhXzR)

171 Beach'in, a raised bed with a cold frame converted to netting can help.

Posted by: Jean at December 18, 2012 10:31 AM (S08dG)

172 "Organic" food is a bullshit myth that only retards fall for. It is no healthier. There aren't even standards for what the fuck it is. Whenever I meet somebody who's a proud "organic" eater I realize I'm dealing with an ignorant, anti-science, mouth-breathing dumbshit.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 18, 2012 10:31 AM (ZPrif)

173 Does HDOF accept SNAP?

Posted by: RWC at December 18, 2012 10:32 AM (fWAjv)

174 Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder is considering signing a bill to allow concealed guns in public schools Let a thousand flowers bloom!

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 18, 2012 10:32 AM (QupBk)

175 Organic isn't just a con, but rather more like ethonol. It's a pricey affectation in the US, and results in misery elsewhere in the world in varying degrees.

Posted by: Lazarus at December 18, 2012 10:32 AM (q4ggw)

176 I do not have problems with varmints or birds because I have Maggie,  my trusty English shepherd,  who absolutely will not allow squirrels, rabbits, chipmunks, cats, or birds in the yard.

The English shepherd is very territorial,  and she takes it as her solemn duty to clear the yard of all invaders.  Even birds,  which I have given up feeding as I do not want to lure them in only to have her harass them.

Posted by: Miss Marple at December 18, 2012 10:32 AM (GoIUi)

177

This post is exactly right.  Price captures carbon footprint, as well as every other inefficiency and efficiency.  Efficiency=environmentally friendly=cheap.  Win win win.

Posted by: Ripley at December 18, 2012 10:32 AM (PPcR4)

178 i think this post is reading too much into this it's just "support local business" or w/e, it's not an ideology where you're not allowed to ever go anywhere else.

Posted by: JDP at December 18, 2012 10:32 AM (8HhF2)

179 Up the Laboratories of Democracy!

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 18, 2012 10:32 AM (QupBk)

180 Organic food, now with carbon-based molecules!

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 18, 2012 10:32 AM (ZPrif)

181 Balls.Of.Steel.

@BloombergNews
Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder is considering signing a bill to allow concealed guns in public schools | http://bloom.bg/UP5jOz

Posted by: weft cut-loop at December 18, 2012 02:30 PM (AsRy

 

NICE.  

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at December 18, 2012 10:33 AM (4df7R)

182 i mean maybe some people take it that way but i doubt it's tons

Posted by: JDP at December 18, 2012 10:33 AM (8HhF2)

183 [Insert generic Federalism here!]

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 18, 2012 10:33 AM (QupBk)

184 Las Vegas was (and still is) a Mecca for Jews.
-------------
Word.

Posted by: Moe Green at December 18, 2012 10:33 AM (ay6+/)

185 I looked at her and replied perfectly deadpan "Yes. I far prefer the taste of the native North Carolina ostrich". She just blinked at me, the guy selling the stuff starting choking trying not to laugh and the guy she was with looked torn between sticking up for her and laughing.

That's awesome.

The greenies are often right with one regard- the organic / local stuff often does taste a lot better.  The most economical way of farming and transporting food often comes at the expense of taste.

But buying organic/local usually comes at a price.  How many people would they see starve in exchange for going back to less efficient "organic" farming methods?

Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 18, 2012 10:33 AM (SY2Kh)

186 Eat  from  my  WH  garden,  serfs!   I  provide  abundance  and  you  can  rely  on  me!  No  need  to  do  for  yourselves.   Soon  off  on  $4  million  vacation  at  your  expense.  Thank  you  drones!  LOL! 

Posted by: Queen Michelle at December 18, 2012 10:34 AM (msPO3)

187 AtC, if you wouldn't mind, could you email me that recipe? Link at nic

Posted by: Sean Bannion at December 18, 2012 10:34 AM (sbV1u)

188 t-bird, that is how a book on Manzanar opens.  Describes how it used to be green until Los Angeles needed water.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 18, 2012 10:34 AM (QdVWw)

189 Certain locally grown produce, depending on the time of year.

North of I-80, the only locally-grown produce you're going to get this time of year is hipsters.

The drought really fucked up my local farmers market (which are increasingly becoming flea markets...pies, jewelry, T-shirts...). Apparently irrigation makes the baby Gaia cry or something.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ at December 18, 2012 10:34 AM (/kI1Q)

190 162 I eat at my local McDonalds, my local Five Guys, my local Jake's, my local Chick-fil-A, ... Posted by: rickl at December 18, 2012 02:30 PM (zoehZ) --- Mom & Pop run a little restaurant that's over-priced and ends up run out of business by McDonald's, good. Mom & Pop close little failing restaurant and open McDonald's franchise, bad. Evil corporate blah blah blah

Posted by: Not Ready To Unsock at December 18, 2012 10:35 AM (BgIBZ)

191 Fishing rods, crab rings, clam shovels, shrimp guns, etc. Just add water.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at December 18, 2012 02:29 PM (+lsX1)


And where is that "water" at?  Sure as hell isn't in Kansas Toto.

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 10:35 AM (53z96)

192 it's just "support local business" or w/e, it's not an ideology where you're not allowed to ever go anywhere else.

Posted by: JDP at December 18, 2012 02:32 PM (8HhF2)

 

Speak to a     hipster douchebag and see what his   or her reaction is to that.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at December 18, 2012 10:35 AM (4df7R)

193

From the article:

 

Churches and businesses could post signs prohibiting guns to exempt themselves from the law.

 

Thank God we can still paint targets on ourselves!

Posted by: Lurking Canuck at December 18, 2012 10:35 AM (BrQrN)

194 Tomatoes are always best local but it's the nature of the fruit. Mine are too thin skinned and ripe for transport. The stuff in the stores has been specially bred to be picked greenish and shipped.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 18, 2012 10:35 AM (QupBk)

195

We have a decent farmer's market at our local high school every Thursday, we do regular business with a local dairy that delivers good quality food at a good price and no hipsters to be found anywhere.

 

 

 

 

Just little old ladies ready to beat your brains in with their walker if you get in their way.

Posted by: katya the designated driver at December 18, 2012 10:35 AM (DoZD+)

196 The fact that this "organic" bullshit took off among our supposed best-educated grad student crowd shows just how stupid people are. It's just a status marker. It's a way of saying, "I spend more money on food then you. Because I'm richer than you." Organic food = antlers on a deer. It's a status marker. Look how rich I am that I can be this much a fucking idiot.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 18, 2012 10:35 AM (ZPrif)

197 So where are all these hipsters and leftists growing the wheat and other grains for breads, cereals, flour

Topeka Kansas and Sioux City Iowa don't strike me as hipster havens

Posted by: kbdabear at December 18, 2012 10:35 AM (wwsoB)

198 Beach'in, a raised bed with a cold frame converted to netting can help. Posted by: Jean at December 18, 2012 02:31 PM (S08dG) I have raised beds, but it's the zucchini and so forth, that grows far out and away that I have trouble protecting. I watched the squirrels, one day, literally picking off the flower buds... and laughing at me. I just do not have enough room to cordon off the vine growing plants. /sigh I wish I did.

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 10:36 AM (LpQbZ)

199 Hypocrisy.  The left pushes "eat local" while driving organic food prices so high that many are left with the high-carb and sugar foods that crowd the shelves as their sole option.  I'd love to eat better. It's almost impossible for me to afford it.

Posted by: Captain Whitebread at December 18, 2012 10:36 AM (cVfX0)

200 186 AtC, if you wouldn't mind, could you email me that recipe? Link at nic Posted by: Sean Bannion at December 18, 2012 02:34 PM (sbV1u) Or just post it please. I'm interested as well.

Posted by: RWC at December 18, 2012 10:36 AM (fWAjv)

201

it's just "support local business"

 

I'm on board for that to a reasonable degree.  But I'll be damned if I'm gonna go out of my way to spend more for the same stuff.  Some things actually are better if you buy them from a big box.  For example, poison laced dog food and lead based painted toys.  Oh, never mind.

Posted by: local stoner at December 18, 2012 10:37 AM (UhXzR)

202 "Organic" food is a bullshit myth that only retards fall for.

It is no healthier. There aren't even standards for what the fuck it is.

Whenever I meet somebody who's a proud "organic" eater I realize I'm dealing with an ignorant, anti-science, mouth-breathing dumbshit.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 18, 2012 02:31 PM (ZPrif)

 

 

----------------------------------------------------

 

 

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Posted by: Soona at December 18, 2012 10:37 AM (uLirs)

203

They tend to have more flavor if they're home grown, or locally grown.

 

This is the thing. The food is pretty tasty and it's nice to get some variety, what with the thousands of oddball cultivars instead of one mono-crop.

 

It's not worth paying 3 times as much for the food - I'd rather go to the 'ethnic' grocers and farmers markets where it is good and DIRT cheap - but sometimes you can make something yourself easy enough to beat the living shit out of anything you can buy commercially.

 

It's like McDonalds kind of. McDonalds thing is consistency, you know what you're going to get. It won't beat some hole in the wall with a fantastic chef, but also you won't have to take a risk on a terrible chef, McDonalds is McDonalds is McDonalds.

 

I think the major companies engineer a 'consistency' of taste (and where applicable, do a lot of blending to get that exact taste) and it's somewhat focus-grouped to be widely appealing, somewhat bland, inoffensive, and consistent.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 10:37 AM (TULs6)

204

There's a place for everything - I love the local Farmer's Market that runs all year round with mostly Amish Farmers selling. I'm glad to patronize them so that they will still be selling if for any reason trucks aren't replenishing the grocery store 10 times a day.

Susan Lee

Posted by: Susan Lee at December 18, 2012 10:38 AM (GR7A8)

205 These fucking dipshits want their food "whole," and their weed pumped full of fertilizers, steroids, and unholy nutrients.

Until they start talking about getting rid of the FDA and the USDA, the only acknowledgement they get from me is a leather boot in their ass when they're in my way.

Posted by: Fritz at December 18, 2012 10:38 AM (K/NRd)

206 [Insert generic Federalism here!]

I have a similar tattoo above my hoo-hah!

Posted by: Sandra Fluke at December 18, 2012 10:38 AM (JACEX)

207

That whole "Think Globally, Eat Locally" bit always chaps me, too.  There's only two places I like to "eat locally:" New England has fabulous microbreweries and wineries, and there's a dairy farm about a 40 minute ride from my house where I go every 2 weeks to stock up on milk and ice cream.  Mrs P made me drink 2%, which I hated it until I tried theirs - it tastes just like full-strength stuff and you'd never know the difference.

 

Shaw Farms in Dracut, for you Massholes.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at December 18, 2012 10:38 AM (zF6Iw)

208 You get an exemption for buying wheat from Kansas if you use it to make "artisan bread."

Posted by: Miss Marple at December 18, 2012 10:38 AM (GoIUi)

209 It's just a status marker. It's a way of saying, "I spend more money on food then you. Because I'm richer than you." Would you say that I have a plethora of shibboleths?

Posted by: El Guapo at December 18, 2012 10:38 AM (QupBk)

210 Correction: They would have THE REST OF US eating gruel in the dark. The choice cuts and electric-lighted, insulated comfort? That will be reserved for the enlightened, i.e. themselves.

Posted by: tiger7_88 at December 18, 2012 10:39 AM (RSEYz)

211 Remember in the novel 'Lucifer's Hammer' where Hugo had an epiphany.  Spending so much time every day picking the bugs off the plants in their pesticide free organic garden.  And still the bugs won.  The 'Eat Local' crowd are the people who think like Hugo but won't bestir themselves to actually grow the food.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 18, 2012 10:39 AM (QdVWw)

212

and it's somewhat focus-grouped to be widely appealing, somewhat bland,inoffensive, and consistent.

 

Reporting for duty sir!

Posted by: Gen. Eric Republican at December 18, 2012 10:39 AM (BrQrN)

213 Can you say "Whole Paycheck" I mean WholeFoods.

Posted by: local stoner at December 18, 2012 10:39 AM (UhXzR)

214 I love idiot who don't want to eat "chemicals". Which is the same as saying you don't want to eat "atoms". Personally I try to avoid food that contains protons, neutrons, and electrons. Anything with a "tron" is bad. I might have a sub-atomic particle allergy, not sure.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 18, 2012 10:39 AM (ZPrif)

215 I always eat local...if I didn't, the wife would kill me.  Oh, we're talking about lettuce and stuff.  Nevermind.

Posted by: Ammo Dump at December 18, 2012 10:39 AM (YYyqq)

216 The thing is a lot of these locally grown people don't shop locally. I support my local pizza parlor because it has amazing pizza. I'm not the one going in their and asking where they get their pepperoni from. Your not going to see hipsters at the local burger place.  Anyways a cash only pizza place sounds like a great way to make a lot of money.

Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at December 18, 2012 10:39 AM (NzBQO)

217 new one

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 10:39 AM (53z96)

218 new thread and, I'm hungry now

Posted by: beach'in at December 18, 2012 10:39 AM (LpQbZ)

219

"The most economical way of farming and transporting food often comes at the expense of taste."

 

 

 

And texture. The reason local veggies taste so good is because those varieties grown for shipping must be able to withstand the rigors of automation. Therefore, the cell walls and overall structure must be tougher. My home-grown maters cannot be shipped fresh. So, into the salsa jar they go! Ha Ha Ha hA HAAAAA! (evil laugh).

Posted by: Cicero Kid at December 18, 2012 10:40 AM (1+QgF)

220
   It's MY choice to eat local or not.  So I'll exercise that choice--freely.

   The rest is just background noise.

Posted by: irongrampa at December 18, 2012 10:40 AM (SAMxH)

221 DISGUSTING: New Military Judge In Ft. Hood Terror Trial Will Allow Nidal Hasan To Keep His Beard During Proceedings… God forbid we offend al-Qaeda. FORT HOOD, Texas (AP) — The Army psychiatrist charged in the deadly Fort Hood shooting rampage will be allowed to keep his beard during his military trial. The new judge overseeing Maj. Nidal Hasan’s case told Hasan during a Tuesday hearing that the beard is a violation of Army regulations. But the judge, Col. Tara Osborn, said she won’t hold it against him. Hasan answered her questions, saying he grew the beard voluntarily. He previously said his Muslim faith requires it. Hasan faces the death penalty if convicted in the 2009 rampage that killed 13 and wounded more than two dozen others on the Texas Army post. His trial date hasn’t been set. A military appeals court recently ousted the former judge and tossed his order requiring Hasan to be forcibly shaved before his trial.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at December 18, 2012 10:41 AM (79ueO)

222 I have no problem if somebody wants to pay extra for their food. I don't even have a problem if its mainly just a status marker. My problem is when they try to pass laws and regulations forcing the rest of us to buy needlessly overpriced food that is not any healthier or more nutritious.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 18, 2012 10:41 AM (ZPrif)

223 @130, Ninety per cent of your Heinz stock comes from my county and the next one over. This would be a good time for you to look to your foundation grants.

@81 Seafood, don't get me going. Kroger has no US origin seafood. It's all farm raised in China, Vietnam or Thailand. Vets of a certain age, chime right in here with what you think is in that pondwater. The US fisheries on the east coast have been shut down because "we" were overfishing them, and the Portuguese weren't getting their fair share. George Clooney drowned in vain.

Now, Ohio has bought out the licenses of the last of the Lake Erie commercial fishermen, so if you buy perch or walleye in a restaurant, it has come frozen through Detroit from Canada. It's still okay for the Canadians to net them. We often wonder if the fish know what side of the border they're on. It's a tricky one.

You can catch your own fish of course. Boats have been a pretty good buy lately, but remember that balance sheet about free firewood and wood heaters? It goes like that. I have the best investment possible on that one. My sister owns a boat.

 

Posted by: comatus at December 18, 2012 10:42 AM (qaVK+)

224 Anyone want some of my Cherokee Crab with Tomato Mayonnaise Dressing?

All locally grown of course!
 

Posted by: Lizzie Jack Warren at December 18, 2012 10:42 AM (wwsoB)

225 Organic food = antlers on a deer. It's a status marker. Look how rich I am that I can be this much a fucking idiot.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 18, 2012 02:35 PM (ZPrif)


That sounds fairly accurate.  Even though Soulard Market is huge, has been around for decades (possibly a century?) We have weekly pop up markets appearing in libtard places (sadly said libtard place is a delicious microbrewery, but I digress.)

I stopped in once.  The product is more expensive, and doesn't look as good as what I can get either a) at Soulard or b) at a grocery store.

Yet you can't find parking within 5 blocks when the "farmer's market" tents go up.  It's moronic.

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 10:42 AM (Vt/hU)

226 New England has fabulous microbreweries and wineries

They're not using hops grown in New England, of course.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ at December 18, 2012 10:42 AM (/kI1Q)

227 >>>And, milk from a local dairy... yum...

You know what milk from local dairies tastes like? milk.
You know what local grown tomatoes taste like? Tomatoes.
The advantages that you think come from "local grown" are more how, rather than where they are grown. I live in California. We've got local produce coming out our ears. Some of it is good, most of it is meh. I will guarantee all of the precious local grown tomatoes that go into Campbells Tomato Soup would not knock your socks off.

But I live in an agricultural mecca so yeah local grown means squat to me. If it means something to you, you are confusing the benefit of a method of growing with the very illogical idea of where it was grown being some sort of real factor.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 18, 2012 10:42 AM (0q2P7)

228

For Reubens in the Great Lakes area, either Corky & Lenny's in Shaker Heights (near Cleveland) or House of Reuben in Detroit (8 Mile and Gratiot).

 

Zingerman's in Ann Arbor makes one that's acceptable, but it's not as good as House of Reuben.  Stick with the pastrami on rye there.

Posted by: jwest at December 18, 2012 10:43 AM (ZDsRL)

229 Why the fuck isn't anyone serious seriously talking up Rick Snyder as a potential candidate for 2016? This guy's conservatism...well, it just feels Right!

Posted by: Rob McNeece at December 18, 2012 10:43 AM (YesJa)

230

>>There is only one way to get "fresh" sea food. Go to the beach and buy it straight off the boats.

 

I don't have to go that far...for crawfish.

Posted by: Mama AJ at December 18, 2012 10:43 AM (SUKHu)

231 And where is that "water" at? Sure as hell isn't in Kansas Toto.

My basic rule of thumb is, don't eat seafood more than one state inland. Nobody in Kansas should be eating any seafood more exotic than a McD's Filet O' Fish.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at December 18, 2012 10:44 AM (+lsX1)

232 comatus, two words - 'night soil'

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 18, 2012 10:44 AM (QdVWw)

233 You just made the 'list' too, Pittsburgh local stoner. I hope you boys enjoy camp all year round.

Posted by: theresa heinz-kerry at December 18, 2012 10:44 AM (jPVBi)

234 Also, you can't judge by "taste". It's been proven (by actual scientific experiments) that food that is higher status tastes better to us. If you convince yourself that a McDonald's hamburger is some insanely high status food -- it will taste great. If you convince yourself that same burger is low class sludge -- it will taste horrible.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 18, 2012 10:44 AM (ZPrif)

235 Re: Whole Foods,

Am I the only person whole solely shops there for 2 things.
1) Obscure spices/ingredients I can't find other places sometimes (for the longest time I couldn't find coarse ground cornmeal in grocery stores
2) Their deli food.  It's good. I especially love the curry chicken salad.  But I treat it like a restaurant when I go there.

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 10:44 AM (Vt/hU)

236 By popular request, I give you alexthechick's fail proof pizza recipe. 1. Sit on couch and stare into kitchen, willing food to make itself. 2. Should this fail, sigh loudly and flop back on the couch and begin interior dialogue about being a grownup and responsible and not having the eating habits of a frat boy. 3. Decide that driving to get the pizza as opposed to delivery totally counts as cooking. 4. Call local pizza place, no, not the one you called two days ago, the other one, no, not the one with the cannolis because you are a responsible adult and are not going to eat an entire pizza and cannolis too. 5. Drive to get pizza. 6. Realize that you must drive past Chick Fil A to get the pizza and that this is clearly a sign that God wants you to have a hate shake since you're being so responsible and not getting the cannolis. 7. Nomnomnom. Repeat throughout the week as needed.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Tick tock tick tock. at December 18, 2012 10:45 AM (VtjlW)

237

It's impossible to get a good deli sandwich here.

 

Posted by: Mama AJ, quietly sobbing at December 18, 2012 10:45 AM (SUKHu)

238 Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 18, 2012 02:31 PM (ZPrif)

Completely true.  My best friend is a farmer (840 acres) and I asked him if was considering "organic".  He told me he had looked into it based on the higher prices for the product.  Turns out, technically his products (corn and soybeans) already meet the criteria, but the certification process was such a pain in the ass and expensive that it didn't make sense unless you were growing small plots of specialty crops.  He also said that virtually everything grown in the U.S. meets the specs to be considered "organic".

Posted by: Country Singer at December 18, 2012 10:45 AM (L8r/r)

239 This was a huge pet peeve of mine when I was a restaurant owner. Fuck Alice Waters in the pee-hole for starting this bullshit trendiness. Prior to 1900, 90% of the population was involved in producing food, you dizzy bitch. If you want to go back to those days then ditch Chez Panisse, whore. Yeah, I didn't think you were that serious about it.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at December 18, 2012 10:46 AM (XfTMw)

240 I support my local pizza parlor because it has amazing pizza.

fucker

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 10:46 AM (KXm42)

241 Is Monsanto really evil... They created Roundup, for which I am eternally grateful. But they also have a weird idea that if they create a crop which is resistant to Roundup and sell the seed, that the farmer can not then use the resulting seed from that crop in a future harvest. Seems a little God-like on their part. Now the entire idea of eating food which has sprung from soil which has been treated with Roundup doesn't appeal to me in the least. Call me a hipster douche-bag but I don't want any part of that stuff in my stomach. I have my gardens and some are for flowers and some are for food, and Roundup is fine for one, and not the other.

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat [/i] at December 18, 2012 10:47 AM (feFL6)

242 I don't have to go that far...for crawfish.

Posted by: Mama AJ at December 18, 2012 02:43 PM (SUKHu)


Crawfish are freshwater.

Posted by: Vic at December 18, 2012 10:47 AM (53z96)

243

I eat local all the time.

In the spring we plant our own garden.

In the summer we pick strawberries at a local farm.

In the autumn we visit an apple orchard and stock up.

In the winter we buy meat and root veggies at the local farmers markets.

We do these things because they're cheaper and obviously more efficient than buying from the supermarket.

We don't buy local meat because I'm not going to pay $15/lb for beef when I can get a tenderloin at WalMart for $10/lb.  And I'll happily buy chicken breasts there for $0.88/lb instead of $3/lb from the farmer.  Pork is $1.99/lb for a slab of meat that I can slice into pork chops.

I don't eat local.  I eat cheap.  If the two happen to coincide sometimes, great!

I also have a sneaking suspicion that price closely correlates with carbon footprint.

Posted by: egd at December 18, 2012 10:47 AM (XVGEg)

244 Why the fuck isn't anyone serious seriously talking up Rick Snyder as a potential candidate for 2016?

Why the fuck would anyone seriously start talking up the 2016 election? Give it a rest for a few months champ.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at December 18, 2012 10:47 AM (+lsX1)

245

Liberals love their little slogans, don't they.

 

They've been sloganeering for so long...that they're getting all tangled up in them.

 

Since the early cattle drives in the 1860's, supplying cheap food to city-dwellers was seen as good thing.

It was used as the 'big reason' why people had to surrender portions of their land for Railroad Right-of-Ways.

 

Railroads...we were told...were an absolute necessity, not just for transporting people, but for supplying food to the cities.

The trucking industry also sprang up, in large part as a way to get food to the cities.

 

I wonder what the Teamsters union things about the "Eat Local' slogan, if they've even stopped to think about it?

 

This "Eat Local" slogan is not only stupid...it relies on people being stupid enough to fall for it.

It's just a marketing ploy.

 

Of course it's good to avail yourself of locally grown food.

But it is not a practical way of supplying a wide variety of foods to large populations at affordable prices.

 

Posted by: wheatie at December 18, 2012 10:47 AM (K4wCe)

246 >>>that the farmer can not then use the resulting seed from that crop in a future harvest. Seems a little God-like on their part.

So you want open pollinated genetically engineered plants? We'll just release into the wild genetically engineered lifeforms. GREAT IDEA!!!

What
Could
Possibly
Go
Wrong?

Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 18, 2012 10:49 AM (0q2P7)

247

>> ditch Chez Panisse

 

LOL. Haven't thought about that place in a while.

Posted by: Mama AJ at December 18, 2012 10:50 AM (SUKHu)

248 You know what local grown tomatoes taste like? Tomatoes.

You what I really miss?  Tomatoes that taste like tomatoes.

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 10:50 AM (KXm42)

249 Which is the same as saying you don't want to eat "atoms".

---

Atoms?  That's the stuff they make bombs out of.

Posted by: WalrusRex at December 18, 2012 10:50 AM (hyB08)

250 243 Why the fuck would anyone seriously start talking up the 2016 election? Give it a rest for a few months champ. IDK, maybe because the current resident of the Oval Orifice started his re-election campaign before he was inaugurated? Maybe because the DNC is already actively planning and recruiting for who follows in his footsteps? Maybe because we need a full fucking 4 years of getting his name out in front of the LiVs in this country, and not just "the period after the RNC, and the nominee has finally been chosen"? IDK, maybe because this side *actually* wants to win a national election - you know, for a fucking change?

Posted by: Rob McNeece at December 18, 2012 10:51 AM (YesJa)

251

The advantages that you think come from "local grown" are more how, rather than where they are grown.

 

And what. Don't forget what. Any tomato is not any tomato. Hell, some tomatoes are yellow or orange and shaped like pears. Different strains or cultivars will produce different tastes.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 10:51 AM (TULs6)

252 Personally I try to avoid food that contains protons, neutrons, and electrons.
A moment on the lips; a lifetime on the hips!

Posted by: liberal douche at December 18, 2012 10:51 AM (jPVBi)

253 The little orange cherry tomatoes shaped like pears are freaking awesome.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 10:52 AM (TULs6)

254 4. Call local pizza place, no, not the one you called two days ago, the other one, no, not the one with the cannolis because you are a responsible adult and are not going to eat an entire pizza and cannolis too.

I larfs u.

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 10:52 AM (KXm42)

255 You sound like my husband, CBD. I basically agree with you. Having lived in many different parts of the country, I get some pleasure out of eating locally, in the sense of learning what the area's specialties are and enjoying them. But that's an aesthetic thing, not a health thing and certainly not a carbon-footprint thing. Chacun a son gout.

Posted by: Y-not at December 18, 2012 10:54 AM (5H6zj)

256

Crawfish are freshwater.

 

Crayfish you hillbilly redneck mouthbreather.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 10:55 AM (TULs6)

257 >>>that the farmer can not then use the resulting seed from that crop in a future harvest. Seems a little God-like on their part.

So you want open pollinated genetically engineered plants? We'll just release into the wild genetically engineered lifeforms. GREAT IDEA!!!

What
Could
Possibly
Go
Wrong?

Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 18, 2012 02:49 PM (0q2P7)


This, plus a few other things including the fact that large farms don't reuse seed anyway (it's not that cost efficient. And it doesn't guarantee the presence of the roundup gene in the seed.)

And people reusing seeds aren't paying to use roundup in the first place (and aren't buying RRR seed.)  That mess is a story concocted by liberals to push the MONSANTO IS EVIL line. (I know, it's a local company, we're the first line of attack by those fuckers.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 10:56 AM (Vt/hU)

258 Couldn't agree more.  I will agree on one item that should always be consumed locally - within 20 miles of your home in fact.  Honey.  eating local honey allows you to ingest local pollens so you build up a tolerance to them.  staves off most allergies if you're eating local honey.  Otherwise - bring on the Alaskan King Crab!

Posted by: Abby at December 18, 2012 10:56 AM (W5aNt)

259 Mudbugs

Posted by: AoSHQ Stylebook at December 18, 2012 10:56 AM (QupBk)

260 So you want open pollinated genetically engineered plants? We'll just release into the wild genetically engineered lifeforms. GREAT IDEA!!! What Could Possibly Go Wrong? I see the point, believe me. If they are intelligent enough to make a crop resistant to a chemical, why can't they make it impossible for it to seed? And by the way, the wind is gonna blow seeds around no matter what anyone thinks of Monsanto. My point is that they seem to think they have elevated themselves to God-like status by proclaiming they now hold exclusive rights to the seed of the first crop.

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat [/i] at December 18, 2012 10:58 AM (feFL6)

261 Chacun a son gout.

Posted by: Y-not at December 18, 2012 02:54 PM (5H6zj)

Chacun a son bêtise.

[not directed at you, but at the willing fools....]

 

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 18, 2012 10:59 AM (GsoHv)

262 41 As with everything else about these people, it boils down to a class argument and their desire to distance themselves from the herd. In the old days, only the rich ate asparagus. Now, at Costco, everyone can afford it, and where's the fun in that? So, local just becomes the next class discriminator. ---- Good point.

Posted by: Y-not at December 18, 2012 10:59 AM (5H6zj)

263 The one argument I've heard is that mass farming packs the earth, and then tilling creates runoff which makes the way of farming unusable after a while.


Not sure if that's even true.

In response I just hope we get plant-planting spider robots that do it very precisely. People are working on those types of things as we speak. Would keep food costs down, and environmental effects to a minimum.

Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 45% more DOOM! at December 18, 2012 10:59 AM (xAtAj)

264 Posted by: Schrödinger's cat at December 18, 2012 02:58 PM (feFL6)

Genetics would like to speak with you about how Monsanto can do that.

But also, Monsanto isn't the only one with weed killer resistant corn.  Several companies make it (and they match to their own weed killers)
Liberty corn jumps to mind.
Monsanto is just the biggest (and some would say best.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 11:02 AM (Vt/hU)

265 3. Your local gardener is less likely to be employing truckloads of illegal immigrants. --- Really? I guess you never lived in California.

Posted by: Y-not at December 18, 2012 11:03 AM (5H6zj)

266 When I hear Monsanto I think of the 360° theater at Disney World. But I'm like that.

Posted by: Dr. Varno at December 18, 2012 11:03 AM (YgF3N)

267 Posted by: Schrödinger's cat at December 18, 2012 02:58 PM (feFL6)

Wait,
Also that's what they did.  They made it impossible for the seed to germinate.  That's why farmers can't use it to reseed.
So in essence they did exactly what you described.
The copyright and patent complaints are actually a different animal (conflated by anti-monsanto Luddites.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 11:04 AM (Vt/hU)

268

Honey. eating local honey allows you to ingest local pollens so you build up a tolerance to them. staves off most allergies if you're eating local honey.

 

Also, any commercial honey you buy is liable to be a blend of honeys (again, to make for consistent taste and brand identity). Even the unblended honeys mostly all come from a couple of nectar sources. Oddball honey can have complex flavors you're just not going to find anywhere on a store shelf anywhere.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 11:06 AM (TULs6)

269 But also, Monsanto isn't the only one with weed killer resistant corn. Have you seen anyone else enter the legal arena to try to prevent their second generation seed from being re-used? To me, it's beyond weird. Shit happens, the wind blows, seed spreads. If they don't like those rules they're in the wrong business.

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat [/i] at December 18, 2012 11:07 AM (feFL6)

270 @125 The Amish. You know of course, that for years now the government has blamed the failure of the Chesapeake Bay oyster beds on the manure that the Amish till into their soil? They're on the hitlist, with me and the stoner.

@252 Cherry tomatoes. They come up like weeds in my garden. I have to hoe them down. For several years I was growing a "sport" (accidental hybrid) where some pear-shaped Romas got it on with the little grape-sized ones, oh lordy. But, it wasn't a dominant trait, I don't gene-splice, so Mendel ended up winning that one.

They're great in a salad, sure, but even in season, I can only eat about two salads a day. For all the other tomato stuff they just suck. Right now I'm working on pickling a batch of them. You can at least leave them whole, and not have to pick the seeds out of the Squeeze-O.

I farm organically almost exclusively, because I am a cheapskate. I spray the fruit trees with an oil emulsion, and use marigolds and sunflowers to keep several bugs out of the vegetables. Rabbits won't cross garlic, so I have a margin of garlic around the one big patch. I just don't need other chemicals. My leaves and grass get vacuumed and composted and plowed back in to the field. No shit.

Squirrels confuse baby peaches with walnuts. They take a bite out of the peach, then throw it down. I have two solutions for this, .17 and .22, but I also have a city government now. I have not found a spray that works on either the squirrels or the government. 

Posted by: comatus at December 18, 2012 11:08 AM (qaVK+)

271 I used to live a few blocks from a large organic market. The real markets by me were too long a walk so I would frequently shop there. And as far as the fresh produce was concerned, I never really noticed a difference. But the processed stuff was horseshit. Whatever one thinks about the food from large ubiquitous companies, the "organic" culture has it's own smaller-scale ubiquitous companies and their food tastes like shit due in large part to the things they leave out.

Posted by: Zippity Doo Dah at December 18, 2012 11:09 AM (E55AK)

272

Have you seen anyone else enter the legal arena to try to prevent their second generation seed from being re-used? To me, it's beyond weird.

 

Dude, half of it is natural.

 

In many cases hybridized super-cultivars cannot reproduce by virtue of hybridization (and this is before genetic engineering). In many other cases a hybrid can reproduce but will lose it's desirable hybrid qualities after the first generation.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 11:10 AM (TULs6)

273 I like a good rant so I won't nitpick too much. And i agree in part. There's nothing wrong with transporting food per se. I look for local foods if taste is supremely important. But a potato? It doesn't matter. But it does when it comes to heirloom tomatoes and the like. However, there are a number of "organic" farms that are more productive than monocrop operations- see The Polyface Farm model. And the monocrop system is unsustainable as of now and will result in disaster unless something changes. There are, in fact, health benefits to some organic foods and feeding grains to livestock is a really bad idea. Grains make people fat and sick and they make cows really fat and sick. Lastly, there are some serious potential health and sustainability issues from the use of hormones, antibiotics, and GM foods.

Posted by: runninrebel at December 18, 2012 11:11 AM (CMftU)

274 129 California avocados make the best guac, great for cooling of mexican food. Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at December 18, 2012 02:16 PM (NzBQO) And, they grow like weeds in Cali, yet they are so expensive. One of my favorite foods, avocados. Avocados are thirsty trees. With the cost of water and less supply from farmers just not growing them due to the high cost, it's just passed on to consumers. Paying for water during the summer to keep them alive is expensive, plus they produce a good crop only every other year. Most groves just break even in So Cal these days outside of years when a bad crop in Mexico jacks the prices way up.

Posted by: Big D at December 18, 2012 11:13 AM (wKauL)

275 In many cases hybridized super-cultivars cannot reproduce by virtue of hybridization (and this is before genetic engineering). In many other cases a hybrid can reproduce but will lose it's desirable hybrid qualities after the first generation. Hence the need for lawsuits to prevent the use of second generation seeds. Got it. Dude.

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat [/i] at December 18, 2012 11:13 AM (feFL6)

276 Posted by: Schrödinger's cat at December 18, 2012 03:07 PM (feFL6)

I'm not saying Monsanto's PR strategy has been fool proof.  And it probably would have been easier just not to enforce the patent and hope they make money in the long run. And they got over aggressive.
 But, it's a catch 22 for Monsanto.  When they put in the "stop germination" genes everyone freaked out.  So they removed them and enforced using licensing agreements, and everyone freaked out.  The counter argument though is that Monsanto should just allow people to buy their product once and never buy it again?  Where's the incentive to develop? (Although I suppose I could see a counter argument in which they give the see away then charge crazy fees for roundup.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 11:13 AM (Vt/hU)

277

They're great in a salad, sure, but even in season, I can only eat about two salads a day. For all the other tomato stuff they just suck. Right now I'm working on pickling a batch of them. You can at least leave them whole, and not have to pick the seeds out of the Squeeze-O.

 

I will just eat them like an apple, maybe with a bit of salt.

 

The little (cherry sized) orange pear kind, those things I just pop them whole. Screw salad. They are actually very sweet and good to eat plain.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 11:14 AM (TULs6)

278 Eating local generally works if you're in a place that supports it -- generally, that would be those backwoods "Jesusland flyover Hicksville" places. That even goes for eating out: I live in a small exurban city -- a large town, really -- out in the middle of a fire engine-red part of Northern Virginia. Somewhat predictably, the farmers' markets are good -- and if you don't like one there are others within reasonable distance -- but somewhat ironically there's no shortage of good places to eat out and more than a few ethnic food markets. (Even if you're not keen on ethnic foods, the freshly butchered meat there is even cheaper than the discount grocery chain) Meanwhile, in the blue counties to the east, the farmers' markets are anemic -- and if one doesn't have what you're looking for, you have to travel a considerable distance to get to the next one, hence negating the whole "Eat Local" ethos -- and the dining choices are pretty limited. (The richy-rich lobbyists insist on bedroom communities where there's no infrastructure to "spoil the view", so a car is mandatory for just a trip to Harris Teeter. How's that whole "reducing your carbon footprint" working out, fellas?) To accomplish what the "Eat Local" slogan is supposed to accomplish, the organic hipsters would have to move out here to Cracker Barrel Land. Not that I in any shape, manner, or form wish them to. We have a handful and that'our quota before the view starts getting spoiled. But the other thing to keep in mind is that that "organic food" industry is massive, and more than a few "organic" companies didn't start from a passion for "naturally-grown" food; "organic" is primarily a marketing term these days. But even the ones who did still end up having to ship their products the same way that regular old food is. Your average Santa Cruz hippie can't get Annie's Goddess Dressing otherwise.

Posted by: The Ghost of Flannery O'Connor at December 18, 2012 11:16 AM (WE5bx)

279 Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 03:14 PM (TULs6)

For a change, try tossing them in a hot pan with some olive oil and a pinch of salt. Just enough to brown them slightly.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 18, 2012 11:17 AM (GsoHv)

280 Is Monsanto really evil...

They created Roundup, for which I am eternally grateful.

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat at December 18, 2012 02:47 PM (feFL6)







Roundup is really useful stuff. Especially during election season.....late at night.....when you visit your idiot leftard neighbor's front lawn.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at December 18, 2012 11:17 AM (TIIx5)

281 I can grow potatoes if I have to, but the Michigan and Ohio varieties don't keep well and are no match for Maine and Idaho potatoes. Plus there is the USS O'Bannon http://tinyurl.com/cvr8yxk

That's why James J. Hill built the railroad. 

Posted by: comatus at December 18, 2012 11:17 AM (qaVK+)

282

Hence the need for lawsuits to prevent the use of second generation seeds. Got it. Dude.

 

What I am saying is that the idea of buying superseeds that will grow super-crops but will not be able to be re-seeded, and need more seeds each year, that is not something Monsanto invented. It's just an existing market dynamic that they are in this case exploiting. They're not doing anything un-natural or unholy.

 

If you don't want to buy seeds from them every year, don't. Use a different crop. Monsanto spent a lot of time developing those strains to be super-strains worth buying seed every year for.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 11:18 AM (TULs6)

283 tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 03:13 PM (Vt/hU) Here's what Monsanto has to say: ''Since 1997, we have only filed suit against farmers 145 times in the United States. This may sound like a lot, but when you consider that we sell seed to more than 250,000 American farmers a year, itÂ’s really a small number.'' If the problem is that small, then why take a PR hit and bother with a second generation seed which is of limited value? It sort of reminds me how the IRS always publicizes the hell out of a tax evasion case right before April 15th. It smacks of the same sort of intimidation.

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat [/i] at December 18, 2012 11:23 AM (feFL6)

284 Best post I've read in a while.  Good work.

Posted by: Phoenix at December 18, 2012 11:24 AM (2wx8J)

285 This reminds me of the awesome Penn & Teller Bullshit episode where they cut a store-bought apple in half and marked half of it organic. The hippies reliably said the organic half tasted better and was fresher. Placebo is a hell of a drug, for all y'all upthread who think there's any taste/freshness advantage to local foods.

Posted by: Ian S. at December 18, 2012 11:27 AM (B/VB5)

286

I farm organically almost exclusively, because I am a cheapskate.

 

I'm on the same page with you there. It's not that I hate the plastic bottles of chemicals, I just don't want to have to buy the plastic bottles of chemicals. I prefer free.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 11:29 AM (TULs6)

287 Posted by: Schrödinger's cat at December 18, 2012 03:23 PM (feFL6)

No one said it wasn't intimidation. I'd argue it's more complex than that though.
If Monsanto didn't defend it's patent no one would respect it.
I think this would lead to 2 major problems.
1) Monsanto would sell significantly less RR corn.
2) Some (theoretically upwards of 50% growing rapidly with each generation of corn) would case being RR, which is going to have a negative backlash on Monsanto. (I don't think most farmers understand the specific mechanism that make this stuff do what it does.)
So Monsanto seems to be taking the up front PR hit to defend their patent and avoid a PR hit down the road.

Now I think in specific cases they've been far to aggressive (the dude who found RR corn growing on the side of his road probably should have been offered some settlement of free/discounted corn to quietly remove it, etc. etc.) but criticizing their strategy writ large is a bit much.

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at December 18, 2012 11:31 AM (Vt/hU)

288 The problem with some long distance foods isn't "freshness" it's that they have to be harvested early and the taste suffers. It doesn't matter with apples because they have a long shelf life. But I'm about to do a 20 minute rant on tomatoes so ill stop. I think you get a better quality food by eating seasonally rather than locally. And you get much better quality when the stock comes from a region that is more natural to the product, no matter how far it has to travel.

Posted by: runninrebel at December 18, 2012 11:33 AM (QRf5S)

289

Placebo is a hell of a drug, for all y'all upthread who think there's any taste/freshness advantage to local foods.

 

You can't tell me freshness is not a potential issue. You can't get more fresh than "I just picked this shit and wiped it on my shirt".

 

At any rate, placebo effect is certainly real. But everybody's tastebuds are different. Very few people can taste cyanide, but a few people can taste it.

 

I know some people who swear they can't tell the different between coke or pepsi, or regular or diet.

 

Lots of people will swear this or that diet cola doesn't taste like diet. I can taste artificial sweeteners a mile and a half away, tastes saccharine, always tastes like shit. I hate diet. It's not a placebo.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 11:33 AM (TULs6)

290 I don't care much about carbon footprints but I do like supporting local, family farms over Monsanto-owned mono-crop machines. Culturally, family farms are better for society and they're pretty much dead or dying off. Anything I can do to help keep them afloat, I'm going to do. Now, I'll still buy meat and such at Costco but I buy my milk local from the Smith Family farms. They even deliver to my front door. That's worth a couple extra bucks to me.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at December 18, 2012 11:35 AM (3Znbm)

291 I know a real tomato doesn't feel and taste like a wax approximation of a tomato.

Or maybe I'm just living a lie.  That must be it.

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 11:37 AM (KXm42)

292 >>Culturally, family farms are better for society Why?

Posted by: Y-not at December 18, 2012 11:37 AM (5H6zj)

293 "Contrast that to Mr. Hippy Douchebag Organic Farmer."

Most farmers probably aren't hippie douchebags, they're trying to keep their farms going in the face of some fairly severe challenges, to include the EPA and death taxes. Calm down. Maybe try to frame your argument without such a huge dollop of 'beggar thy neighbor'.

Posted by: Mike James at December 18, 2012 11:41 AM (cgDgK)

294 Local for me means no oranges or kiwis or peanuts or avocados or coffee.
I prefer think locally, but eat globally. Local when it suits me, global when not.

Posted by: fb at December 18, 2012 11:42 AM (JVEmw)

295 One product I'm crushing on right now is the Hawaiian purple sweet potato. They're sometimes referred to as Okinawan or Korean. You can find them in Korean or Pacific groceries. The quality is a bit spotty becuse capitalism hasn't caught on to them yet. They're unreal though. I like to peel them and roast them with butter and coconut oil until they caramelize a little. Then I pour some coconut milk and cinnamon on them. Heaven.

Posted by: runninrebel at December 18, 2012 11:43 AM (3j24r)

296 "I'm on the same page with you there. It's not that Ihatethe plastic bottles of chemicals, I justdon't want to have to buy the plastic bottles of chemicals. I prefer free." Many backyard farmers have been doing this for years. Suddenly, due to a single marketing term we're "organic" rather than "I can't make my own pitchfork, so I'm stuck MaGyvering homemade insecticides and rabbit repellent."

Posted by: The Ghost of Flannery O'Connor at December 18, 2012 11:44 AM (WE5bx)

297

If you convince yourself that a McDonald's hamburger is some insanely high status food -- it will taste great.

 

It does taste pretty damn good. It's not fillet, but fuck for $5 in 5 minutes that shit is almost amazing.

 

And a humble little cheeseburger would have been virtually impossible to produce for any amount of money 100 years ago. It is ultra-status food, with  ingredients coming from all over the world.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 11:45 AM (TULs6)

298 I like to peel them and roast them with butter and coconut oil until they caramelize a little. Then I pour some coconut milk and cinnamon on them. ----- That sounds excellent!

Posted by: Y-not at December 18, 2012 11:45 AM (5H6zj)

299 Hey, folks, let's enjoy eating our food (and talking about it). Maybe after Friday this will only be a fond memory, when we may indeed be eating long pig. I think I'll make some pork/potato stew for supper. With cornbread. And real butter. None of it produced here in East Texas, but tasty regardless.

Posted by: EROWMER at December 18, 2012 11:46 AM (kxlCQ)

300 I can tell the difference between Coke and Pepsi. Coke's more acidic, Pepsi's sweeter and rounder.

I had a big vegetable garden before we moved (gotta get the new one going), and there is just plain nothing that tastes better than fruit and veggies straight from the yard.

I buy local because it supports the farmers in my community. My area (San Diego environs) has the largest number of small family farms in the country. I think this is a good thing, and I want them to keep their jobs and keep providing me with tasty food. And I get unusual and very delicious produce, which I love.

I have a contract with a local farmer who produces some of the best meat I've ever had -- in fact, I'm picking up a batch from them today. I like working with them because I get unusual cuts of meat, and also because their chicken is so damn good that it smells good enough to eat *raw*. Not that I would do that, but you get the drift. When was the last time you had a batch of chicken that made you salivate over eating it ... raw?!

Do I buy non-local food? Sure. Awfully hard to source locally-grown cherries in southern California. (; It's also hard to source grains, and goodness knows I bake a lot. Ditto milk.

The local foods that I buy, I buy purely because of the quality of the food and because I like keeping the money in my own community, and having a relationship with our farmers.

Posted by: Jishin at December 18, 2012 11:52 AM (uk04h)

301 That's just crazy talk.

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 12:00 PM (KXm42)

302 Since no one brought it up I'd be remiss if I didn't post a link to the Portlandia skit, "Is it local?" http://tinyurl.com/cfzr7f5

Posted by: Chairman LMAO at December 18, 2012 12:05 PM (9eDbm)

303 It's important that your restaurant be able to present you a file on life of the chicken you are about to consume. lol

Posted by: Chairman LMAO at December 18, 2012 12:07 PM (9eDbm)

304 302 It's important that your restaurant be able to present you a file on life of the chicken you are about to consume ---- I've actually had someone tell me in earnest about their loathing of "anonymous meat." Apparently, it's better to eat someone you know. People should eat what they want, but not use pseudo science or politics to demonize perfectly legitimate - and as it turns out incredibly important - industries. Unfortunately, as with most "movements" the Left is enamored with it's not enough that individuals pursue it -- they have to proselytize. And when that doesn't work, they legislate. Scratch a food crank and you usually find a conspiracy theorist or totalitarian, sometimes both.

Posted by: Y-not at December 18, 2012 12:16 PM (5H6zj)

305 I always thought "eating local" meant going to locally-owned diners & restaurants instead of national chains. I didn't realize it went to "buy only locally-sourced food" as well. I would definitely miss having clementines around Christmas and New Years. So no, not going local-only shopping. Screw that.

Posted by: Paperwork Ninja at December 18, 2012 12:19 PM (J991N)

306

It doesn't matter with apples because they have a long shelf life.

 

I will not eat the bananas until they start to get brown all over with black spots. Yellow bananas suck. You have to buy them and then wait like a week and a half before you can eat them. If they are partially green, two and half weeks.

 

Freshness is not a problem there. Bananas don't taste like bananas until 15 minutes before they rot to mush.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 12:31 PM (TULs6)

307

CBD, I live in a big "eat local" area outside DC, and some of the craftie organic folks (who don't pay property tax except on their house for having one ac out of ten in "land use" for organic heirloom peppers or some such, and actually support themselves with a job in DC--and a 60-mi roundtrip commute every day) don't ever tell that the dirty little secret of all these cottage businesses is that the consumer comes to them--it's part of the cachet of KNOWING your farmer (can only eat what you trust, right?), and TEACHING your children that food doesn't come from the store, and it's ECO TOURISM (so they REALLY shouldn't pay taxes).  So the picturesque dirt roads they don't want improved (because OTHER people shouldn't be commuting) are clogged sometimes quite dangerously with lines of folks coming out to pay way too much for a pint of berries they had to high step through the weeds to pick.

Sometimes I think we're still a bit close to Y2K, and teh crazy hasn't fullu sibsided yet--I mean among most of the consumers.  The pitchpeople/proprietors definitely know there's one born every minute.

Posted by: barbarausa at December 18, 2012 12:32 PM (WWeoI)

308 . Am I to give up citrus just because it's not grown "locally"?

Embrace the scurvy.

Posted by: @PurpAv at December 18, 2012 12:35 PM (INNvP)

309 There's nothing wrong with going to Costco and loading up on frozen food, but many people believe fresher food tastes better. Farmers, ranchers and home gardeners have known this all along, but the rest of us forgot it. People are willing to pay more to eat local because they think it tastes better. Sometimes they're right. Sometimes not.

Posted by: Jordan at December 18, 2012 12:37 PM (Hz1zc)

310 308 There's nothing wrong with going to Costco and loading up on frozen food, but many people believe fresher food tastes better. ---- Have you ever BEEN to a Costco because it sure sounds like you haven't if you're equating Costco with frozen food.

Posted by: Y-not at December 18, 2012 12:42 PM (5H6zj)

311 Organic means grown in pigs**t ! I had a friend who grew up on a farm, he said you ate whatever was in season on the farm. Got tired of it soon. When I was in Canada we looked for stuff in season all the growing season. Rhubarb, strawberries, cherries, tomatoes, pears, apples.Lived rural but not on a farm. Raised chickens for a while, nothing like fresh brown eggs. Neighbor said his mother (Farmer) canned rhubarb and served it every meal.

Posted by: Bill at December 18, 2012 12:45 PM (QUjCg)

312

When I was in Canada we looked for stuff in season all the growing season.

 

The whole 2 weeks?

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 12:47 PM (TULs6)

313 Re the bananas, thats what a visting African minister told my dad when he was young.

Posted by: Bill at December 18, 2012 12:48 PM (QUjCg)

314 Ironically, I think Costco has better meat than my local Kroger-affiliated grocery. But out here in ranch country, everyone knows the beef (either corn or grass-fed) produced and sold locally is much better because it's fresh. I eat some grocery meat, but in dishes where the flavor is in the forefront, I buy from a ranch up the valley.

Posted by: Jordan at December 18, 2012 12:50 PM (Hz1zc)

315

There's nothing wrong with going to Costco and loading up on frozen food, but many people believe fresher food tastes better.

 

Believe?

Posted by: eleven at December 18, 2012 12:52 PM (fsLdt)

316 Apparently, India farmers who could barely scrape by were giving up and committing SUICIDE until economic globalization opened markets to make it possible for them to sell their produce via cold chain/supply chain management. So, TAKE THAT, eat local/save a farmer evangelists. Globalization saves lives!

Posted by: Crowley at December 18, 2012 12:53 PM (3wa9V)

317

It's quite true. If the skin is solid yellow, the bananas are blander and a bit starchy. You have to wait until they're at least solid freckled and starting to get the mushy brown spots. Then they taste great and have a much stronger banana flavor.

 

I think some people throw them away just when they're getting ripe.

Posted by: Entropy at December 18, 2012 12:55 PM (TULs6)

318 It is obvious that you all need to attend reeducation camps and memorize this quarters New Speak as you are seriously wrong.

Posted by: ALL_IS_LOST at December 18, 2012 12:59 PM (T/L2Z)

319 "many people believe fresher food tastes better. " "Believe?" Taste is subjective. I'm 100% confident the vegetables from my garden taste better than the ones at Costco, but that's just my opinion. For every guy like me that eats mostly local, mostly fresh food and enjoys it, there's a hundred who cook and eat delicious, healthy meals from food they buy at the grocery and love it. To each his own.

Posted by: Jordan at December 18, 2012 01:00 PM (Hz1zc)

320 Made banana bread last night. Only works with brown bananas.

Hey Entropy, we had almost 3 months between last frost and first frost.

Posted by: Bill at December 18, 2012 01:08 PM (QUjCg)

321 we had almost 3 months between last frost and first frost. Heh. I think the Inuit diet is like 99% meat for a reason having something to do with that.

Posted by: entropy at December 18, 2012 01:37 PM (YUttk)

322  Last week of May until 21 Sept, 20 miles north of Toronto.
Start tomatoes indoors 6 weeks before May 21

Posted by: Bill at December 18, 2012 01:53 PM (sT1u7)

323 "Start tomatoes indoors 6 weeks before May 21" Here in Colorado, land of legal weed, I know several people growing hydroponic tomatoes with their marijuana crop. I wonder what the going rate on a fresh tomato is in January? Yummy.

Posted by: Jordan at December 18, 2012 02:24 PM (Hz1zc)

324 Several years ago I noticed a lot of places selling hydroponic equipment in the nearest big town. I had no idea tomatoes were that popular in January /s

Posted by: Bill at December 18, 2012 03:17 PM (sT1u7)

325 Let tomatoes be the first sign unto you. http://preview.tinyurl.com/c886v4s Then try a recently harvested, organically-grown carrot. No comparison with the bitter, tough industrial product. The tricky part comes when it is hard to taste the difference. Take milk. I'm old enough to remember what milk used to taste like. I've had milk warm from the teat into a cup. Four species to date. (Imho, a human mother's milk belongs to her offspring. Just sayin'.) The milk from ruminants that have grazed on grass has more conjugated linoleic acids than that of non-grazing ruminants, and that CLA may be really good for you. I am still working on this. The mystery deepens when you take soil microbiology into account. Suffice it to say that when Gourmet Magazine describes the first step of making Parmesano is "letting the heavy cream settle out", just ask your Grandma (if she grew up on a farm). She may steer you wrong, but she loves you. Food NaZis love only control.

Posted by: Thorvald at December 18, 2012 05:08 PM (1V6Pv)

326 To each their own.

My biggest issue is that on a "corporate/factory" farm, they take shortcuts. And in processing, they add stuff I just don't want. Again, it's a personal reason.

I prefer to go to a farmer, plop down 1-2 thousand, and get a quarter or half a slaughtered steer that will last me an entire year and that I know what went into it. If there are no steers, then there's always the old cow for a little less (about $750 for half an old cow).

After that, I grow most of my own vegetables, because I know what is in it. The only major thing I go to the grocery store for are for milk, cereals, and certain indulgences that I choose to partake in.

For me, it's more about what's in the food I eat rather than the ease in which I can get it. I don't want to give more of my money to the drug companies for stuff that's going to extend my life or cut it short.

Posted by: Picasa Tucasa at December 18, 2012 05:19 PM (fAQUS)

327 I like to hit the farmer's market for fresh vegetables. There is really a big difference when it comes to items that have been shipped and bumped around a bit and have probably been off the vine for awhile and something you've grown in your backyard garden so I like me some fresh local produce from time to time. Also, if I live in Texas I'm going to eat me some Texas barbecue and Texas beef, not something shipped cross country, thanks much. There was an interesting article in Cooks Illustrated (I read that, it's a good cooking magazine if you care to get into the reason why you do certain things when you cook without taking a cooking class) and they had a taste test where they suggested that the best chicken is free range and air chilled. Most mass produced chicken isn't free range and they kill it in water which tends to bloat them up and makes the meat spongy. I decided to check it out for myself since there are some truly excellent grocery stores around here (and a Costco too) and I had the free range air chilled available. I was quite pleased to learn that the chicken was very good and held up well to reheating. I find most other types of chicken tends to get a weird gamey taste in the refrigerator after it's been cooked. I also buy Organic milk but that's mostly because it has an insanely long shelf life compared to the non-organic milk. There are practical reasons to eat local or organic but I wouldn't recommend it for everything.

Posted by: Becky at December 18, 2012 10:01 PM (Xqyhu)

328

Conspicuous virtue, good term. Buy local, fine by me, put a bumper sticker on your car declaring it, it's like those insufferable "I brake for animals" bumper stickers from the 70's

Posted by: Arrgghhh at December 19, 2012 04:24 AM (FxBCF)

329 How do your really feel about the topic?

Posted by: Gunga at December 19, 2012 09:43 AM (lDgIe)

330 Well said, Sir. Will not be comprehended by hipster db's because ...economics / geography / reality...

Posted by: Dang Redneck Farmer at December 20, 2012 04:13 AM (l1oyw)

Hide Comments | Add Comment | Refresh | Top

Comments are disabled. Post is locked.
282kb generated in CPU 0.0712, elapsed 0.3152 seconds.
64 queries taking 0.2501 seconds, 458 records returned.
Powered by Minx 1.1.6c-pink.

Support





Donate to Ace of Spades HQ!


Contact

Change the At to "@" and the DOT to "."




Intermarkets' Privacy Policy
Support


Donate to Ace of Spades HQ!


Search Thingy



Archives

Monthly Traffic

  • Pages: 204234
  • Files: 1874
  • Bytes: 6.3G
  • CPU Time: 209:12
  • Queries: 6238160

Content

  • Posts: 22824
  • Comments: 5930392

Feeds


RSS 2.0 Atom 1.0