August 23, 2012

Irregular Mid-Week Book Thread
— Ace

So, here's what I've read lately.

Scaramouche. Ehhhh... I kind of liked it but can't recommend it unless you are keenly interested in the French Revolution. It's interesting, but it's not a full-on swashbuckler, or anything close to one. There isn't a lot of swordplay, and unless I'm forgetting something, all but one swordfight (early in the book) takes place off-screen. It's also from that period where novelists seemed to just sort of churn out chapters without worrying about the central narrative arc. Like they just were struck by this idea, then that that one. So the book sort of resembles the haphazard meanderings of real life... which isn't a good thing, necessarily.

Still, it's okay. Maybe Captain Blood will be better.

The Forever War. A classic I'm just now reading. I'm only like six chapters in. Seems good. At the moment it seems to be an update of Starship Troopers but I'm 99% sure, based on what I've read, that there's more to it than just Mobile Infantry suits. Oh, and government-issued pot, and male and female soldiers sleeping together as a common thing. Like, who's sleeping with who tonight? Okay, you'll do.

I'm only on Charon here so don't spoil it.

The Count of Monte Cristo. Supposedly there's this amazing recent translation which re-inserts the censored material (like light Victorian lesbian theming) and scuttles the archaic, stilted English in favor of a vigorous modern prose more like the French Dumas actually wrote in.

It's okay. It's extremely long. I put this down like a month ago and it hasn't beckoned me back. I find myself thinking about the long digressions about post-Napoleonic politics which the Victorians had taken out, but which the fresh translation put back in, and am sort of in favor of the Victorian judgment on this.

It's also a little contrived, and that's despite the fact that something like this really did happen. Dumas ripped the idea off from a policeman's true-crime book he'd read. But his version of the story seems fake.

Maybe any version of the story would seem fake. It's pretty unbelievable.

I'm told that the Count is just major awesome (and it served as the inspiration for The Stars My Destination, of course) but so far I'm not up to the awesome parts. I just got into jail with Dantes, who, by the way, is so naive and dopey I want to punch him in the brain. I don't know if I'm going to wind up finishing this one.

Oh: Over the winter I read Jack Vance's Planet of Adventure tetraology. It's four books, with odd titles, like "The Phnume" or "The Wiggle-waggles."

It's basically got a terrific premise, but then peters out. First he sets you up by describing how awesome a Scout is. A planet trailblazer, a man of action, but also a Renaissance man with training in fifteen different sciences and survival skills.

Then the Scout crash-lands on this planet which is occupied by four different alien races -- none of whom are indigenous to the planet. And each of these races has its own human servitor race -- "sub-men" -- which due to some kind of rubber science not explained, adopts some of the physical characteristics of the alien race they serve.

The great set-up goes almost nowhere, because the only thing he tries to do over four novels is steal or build his own spaceship, to return to earth. After he fails to steal one in the second book, he tries building it in the second two books, and then those books become largely about haggling about prices with engineers, laborers, and bureaucrats. He does move from place to place -- chiefly seeking to build up a cash pile to spend on a spaceship -- but it's pretty episodic and random.

There is a Planet of the Apes type subplot -- the "sub-men" are all convinced by their alien overlords that they were created by the aliens, though there is an occult, suppressed religion that claims humans originated on an entirely different planet -- but the hero actually doesn't really care about this. There is no "Get your stinking paws off me you damn dirty alien" sort of rebellion plot. At least not in foreground.

Just a really fun premise, a sci-fi swords & sorcery sandbox for our scout to play in, but doesn't deliver. I guess I have to give it a marginal recommendation because there is scattered fun in it.

I think this premise is so good it must be ripped off and done right.

Posted by: Ace at 03:56 PM | Comments (295)
Post contains 769 words, total size 5 kb.

1 HA

Posted by: jeremiah Gosh Darn Amerikkka Wright at August 23, 2012 03:57 PM (ovpNn)

2 I'm still reading The Wheel of Time.  Yeah, yeah I know.

Posted by: Adam at August 23, 2012 03:58 PM (/YJYi)

3 not first

Posted by: wierd flunky at August 23, 2012 03:59 PM (tlhtD)

4 Yeah! Book thread!! Oh, and Obama is a stuttering clusterf%#k of a miserable failure.

Posted by: Jade Sea at August 23, 2012 03:59 PM (ki40s)

5 The Forever War is Haldeman's best novel -- it's all downhill from there. Definitely his catharsis after returning from Vietnam.

Posted by: joncelli at August 23, 2012 04:00 PM (CWlPF)

6 Trying to get back into William Faulkner, but the guy doesn't write novels; he writes 200 page run-on sentences that have flashbacks-in-flashbacks-in flashbacks. Ponderous, man. Fucking ponderous. (as Casey Kasem would say)

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:01 PM (akGKT)

7 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:01 PM (6o4Fb)

8 Will you do the fandango?

Thunderbolt and lightning
Very, very fright'ning meeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Posted by: least at August 23, 2012 04:01 PM (GW/GR)

9 Counte of Monte Cristo with Luis Guzman is the best. Also, Jesus and Guy Pierce are in it. And some titties.

Posted by: wooga at August 23, 2012 04:01 PM (vjyZP)

10 Oh, and what I'm reading: The Thirty Years War: Europe's Tragedy. Big and fat and detailed, but well written.

Posted by: joncelli at August 23, 2012 04:01 PM (CWlPF)

11 I think I have a dog-eared stack of Puritan and Beaverhunt somewhere around here...

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:02 PM (akGKT)

12 Watcha readin' for?

Posted by: Waffle Waitress at August 23, 2012 04:02 PM (9tluB)

13 The Forever War is the left wing counter to Starship Troopers.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:02 PM (6o4Fb)

14 The Count of Monte Cristo is kind of like Doctor Jekyll and Mr. Hyde: part of the fun of the book is the mystery. You aren't supposed to know who the Count is. Of course now everyone knows, just like everyone knows Jekyll = Hyde.

Posted by: Trimegistus at August 23, 2012 04:02 PM (mkv9V)

15 speaking of classics (JJ mentions Faulkner)... I've never actually read Moby Dick. I was supposed to in high school but (keep this on the down low!) bluffed it with Cliff's Notes. So: Anyone want to commit with me over reading this sonofabitch over, say, four weeks? Check in with a thread, say, every Monday night, to talk about it? Because without some incentive I don't think I'll ever actually read it. I did start it again. Got about as far as I did in HS.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:03 PM (fxHyG)

16 I just finished Rendezvous with Rama, the first Arthur C. Clarke book I've ever read. I thought it was pretty excellent.

Posted by: AndrewR at August 23, 2012 04:03 PM (8bsRB)

17 >>>Of course now everyone knows, just like everyone knows Jekyll = Hyde. how could you not know?

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:03 PM (fxHyG)

18 Oh, and I started As I Lay Dying, while on the subject of Faulkner. Then I put it down. Then I went a little further, then I put it back down. Multiple perspectives are a brain freeze.

Posted by: joncelli at August 23, 2012 04:03 PM (CWlPF)

19 Captain Blood was very anti Catholic,even though iirc the title character is a Catholic.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:05 PM (6o4Fb)

20

I'm still reading The Wheel of Time.

 

Take your time.  I fear it'll be another year  before Sanderson gets it wrapped up... he's taking his sweet fucking time.

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 04:05 PM (9tluB)

21 "The Law" by Bastiat and "Candy Hits" by ZaSu Pitts.  Sure, I'm in for a "Moby Dick" thread.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at August 23, 2012 04:05 PM (0Db2g)

22 >>>Rendezvous with Rama, this is superficial but I've never had any interest in that based on the title. I'm not psyched about a rendezvous, and I don't know who Rama is. Sounds ethnic.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:06 PM (fxHyG)

23 My late mother was an English teacher at one of NYC's worst high schools, but somehow she managed to motivate her students to do the work. One day, when she was expecting book reports on "A Farewell to Arms" she was pissed as almost the whole class blew off the assignment. "At least read the Cliff Notes or the Monarch Notes!" she cried, exasperated. So the next week she got reports with titles like "A Farewell to My Arms, by Cliff Hemingway." Still the funniest was when she gave a kid an A for a report that started "That Lady Macbeth was a real bitch!"

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:06 PM (akGKT)

24 What I've been reading:

Redshirts, by John Scalzi. Yeah, his politics suck, but the book is very entertaining. It's about the background people on an Enterprise-ish starship, who start wondering why things are so weird on board.

Songs of the Dying Earth, by various authors. It's a collection of short stories by big-name authors set in Jack Vance's Dying Earth world. Each story comes with a little essay by the author about how they first discovered Vance's work, and they are all nearly word-for-word identical. The stories are . . . not that great, actually. They're very well-done fan fiction by extremely skilled professional writers.


Posted by: Trimegistus at August 23, 2012 04:07 PM (mkv9V)

25

Ok, I just read "Prince of Thorns" by Mark Lawrence, and then bought the sequel, "King of Thorns".

 

Also just read and really liked Lois McMaster Bujold's latest "Captain Vorpatrill's Alliance".  I so wish she was more productive, and I would like to see the novel that follows "Cryoburn".

Posted by: Jack at August 23, 2012 04:07 PM (wUFaM)

26 The early Frank Yerby books are great, imho.  Odor of Sanctity, for example.

Posted by: clcritchlow at August 23, 2012 04:08 PM (bSIlC)

27

 (JJ mentions Faulkner)...

I've never actually read Moby Dick.

 

Borgnine  did a fantastic one-man show of that in the late 80's. 

 Off-off Broadway kinda  thing.   You know the deal, a one man re-telling from an off-character's perspective.

I have to say, I went in skeptical, but he was very convincing as the White Whale.

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 04:08 PM (9tluB)

28 Ace, I'm your huckleberry about Moby Dick. I'll play.

Posted by: Trimegistus at August 23, 2012 04:08 PM (mkv9V)

29 I just read Dreams from my Father.

That Bill Ayers sure knows how to write some damn good fiction!

Posted by: jeremiah Gosh Darn Amerikkka Wright at August 23, 2012 04:08 PM (ovpNn)

30 Recently finished "The Secret Knowledge" by David Mamet. Nobody rips liberals like ex-liberals. And Mamet is razor sharp and acid-tongued brilliant.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:09 PM (akGKT)

31 all right, if we have three or four, maybe we'll do this Moby Dick thing. I see myself bailing. But I'll try.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:09 PM (fxHyG)

32 I'm reading some Dostoyesky shorts right now.

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 04:09 PM (9tluB)

33 Ah, The Forever War. Let us know if you tear up at the end.

Posted by: JohnW at August 23, 2012 04:09 PM (44mmh)

34 The Count of Monte Cristo You should check out the Japanese's take on it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OaXvyrQv_5M Great opening: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CeAZyUs5ww And an even better closing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OnNd5XVFKOM

Posted by: ザ 政治的 帽子 at August 23, 2012 04:09 PM (sZTYJ)

35

i]maybe we'll do this Moby Dick thing

 

I'm your huckleberry.

Posted by: Jeff Stryker at August 23, 2012 04:10 PM (9tluB)

36 I'm not psyched about a rendezvous, and I don't know who Rama is. Sounds ethnic.

No, it's cool...Rama is actually a 40km-long cylindrical spaceship that shows up in the solar system out of nowhere. A giant space wang, basically. And then a bunch of scientists land on the space wang and go inside it and there's fake gravity and shit.

Okay, now that I read that it does sound pretty dumb.

Oh, and I'm in on the Moby Dick thread if it happens.

Posted by: AndrewR at August 23, 2012 04:11 PM (8bsRB)

37 I thought Richard Basehart did a credible job as, well whomever he did a credible job as. And then he became Admiral Nelson on "Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea." Makes perfect sense, no?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:11 PM (akGKT)

38 >>>Rendezvous with Rama, this is superficial but I've never had any interest in that based on the title. I'm not psyched about a rendezvous, and I don't know who Rama is. Sounds ethnic. Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 08:06 PM (fxHyG) It's one of Clark's better works. The name "Rama" comes from the "fact" that in the future we've run out of Roman and Greek gods to name heavenly bodies after, so we move on to other mythologies. Only "Rama" isn't your typical heavenly body...

Posted by: The Political Hat at August 23, 2012 04:12 PM (sZTYJ)

39 Ace I tried Moby Dick as an adult also, I just couldn't do it. Sorry but I can't do it, MD just sux.

Posted by: wierd flunky at August 23, 2012 04:12 PM (tlhtD)

40

Oh, I read Scalzi's "Red Shirts" as well, but it was a copy from the local library.  I liked the "Old Man's War" series.

 

But I think Scalzi want's to be invited to all the A list parties.

 

He still has to learn that some people, actually most people are never sexually attractive.   Hard lesson.

Posted by: Jack at August 23, 2012 04:12 PM (wUFaM)

41 [iSongs of the Dying Earth, by various authors. It's a collection of short stories by big-name authors set in Jack Vance's Dying Earth world. Each story comes with a little essay by the author about how they first discovered Vance's work, and they are all nearly word-for-word identical. The stories are . . . not that great, actually. They're very well-done fan fiction by extremely skilled professional writers.[/i]

I have a book like that around here. "The Last Continent". These were fanfics set in Clark Ashton Smith's Xothique and I'm not sure exactly how professional the authors were.

But... it has been signed by all the authors. . .

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:12 PM (QTHTd)

42 37 He played Ishmael.I oved Voyage as a kid,especially those flying Manta subs.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:13 PM (6o4Fb)

43 Recently finished Dinesh D'Souza's "The Roots of Obama's rage". Highly recommended. The movie, "2016", will make it to my market August 24th, according to the 2016themovie website. I started right in on Mark Steyn's "After America: Get Ready for Armageddon". Great stuff! Highly witty (paraphrasing... "add some pustules to the escutcheon", for example)! The content, however, is so serious that I've had to self-medicate on a few occasions. Long term, though, I expect to investigate ammo storages.

Posted by: Thorvald at August 23, 2012 04:13 PM (1V6Pv)

44 36 Posted by: AndrewR at August 23, 2012 08:11 PM (8bsRB) I seem to recall that "Rama" was either in development at some studio or was optioned. But that was years ago. May still be. Supposedly the asshole James Cameron is doing a remake of "Forbidden Planet." Prick stole my idea.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:13 PM (akGKT)

45 Oh, and I'm in on the Moby Dick thread if it happens. Posted by: AndrewR at August 23, 2012 08:11 PM (8bsRB) Oh! Me too!!1!

Posted by: Barney Frank at August 23, 2012 04:13 PM (sZTYJ)

46 I think the internet causes ADD--hence --the classics? Ponderous.

Posted by: tasker at August 23, 2012 04:13 PM (r2PLg)

47

If you do the 'Moby Dick'-fest, maybe start with a post that touches on the ways of  getting a free copy onto your kindle?

I'd like to know how to get classics on the kindle w/out having to use my computer.  Because I'm kinda slow at that sort of thing.

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 04:13 PM (9tluB)

48 42 37 He played Ishmael.I oved Voyage as a kid,especially those flying Manta subs. Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 08:13 PM (6o4Fb) A model kit company called Polar Lights has re-issued the kit, in case you get the urge to sniff some glue!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:14 PM (akGKT)

49 Now...Ethan Fromme that's do-able--cuz it's like thinner than a mint.

Posted by: tasker at August 23, 2012 04:14 PM (r2PLg)

50 31 all right, if we have three or four, maybe we'll do this Moby Dick thing.

I see myself bailing. But I'll try.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 08:09 PM (fxHyG)

I'm in.

Posted by: baldilocks at August 23, 2012 04:15 PM (6kWFm)

51 I'll read "Moby Dick" with you and Trimegistus, Ace. I didn't enjoy all of it when I first read it, but maybe it will have grown on me after 25 years. However, "Bartleby the Scrivener" by Melville I think is one of the best short stories every written. Could we decide on a definite time to discuss MD? Monday? I preferred the novel "Ahab's wife" .

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 23, 2012 04:15 PM (/f+n8)

52 no edith wharton

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 04:15 PM (9tluB)

53 I am disappointed in Scalzi. "Old Man's War" was marketed to internet geeks - particularly Instapundit libertarians (the only reason I bought his book was because of Reynolds). It was the Right that got him where he is today.

How long's his ponytail?

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:15 PM (QTHTd)

54 I loved Scaramouche. Lots of witty quotables in there.

Posted by: Rafael Sabatini at August 23, 2012 04:15 PM (I70cm)

55 It's free till midnight! Cold Pulp Trio http://amzn.to/PFyh0I

Posted by: ER White at August 23, 2012 04:15 PM (OJa6r)

56 48 Yeah Polar Lights remakes all sorts of old kits. 44 Oh no.Cameron?It will be left wing somehow.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:15 PM (6o4Fb)

57 So are we group reading and discussing "Moby Dick?" Sheesh, this Akin putz has really messed us up...

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:16 PM (akGKT)

58 I read Count of Monte Cristo in high school and loved it - to the point where I stayed home from school one day to finish reading.  The edition I read was long, but it must have been abridged.  I tried to read an unabridged translation a few years ago and couldn't make it through it.  There were long, boring sections that did little to advance the plot.  I think I'll try to find the abridged version I read in high school.  I was totally caught up in the book and read it in two or three days.

Posted by: Biancaneve at August 23, 2012 04:16 PM (UaBrT)

59 Rama needs to be a series, not a movie. imo

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:16 PM (QTHTd)

60 47
If you do the 'Moby Dick'-fest, maybe start with a post thattouches on the ways of getting a free copy onto your kindle?
I'd like to know how to get classics on the kindle w/out having to use my computer. Because I'm kinda slow at that sort of thing.



Did someone say dick?

Posted by: Flukey Fluke likes to Fluek at August 23, 2012 04:16 PM (/YJYi)

61 I think I just sat through the French movie version of The Count of Monte Cristo. So.. I just got into jail with Dantes, who, by the way, is so naive and dopey I want to punch him in the brain. I don't know if I'm going to wind up finishing this one. I think the urge to kick Dante's naive ass goes away. He turns into a pretty twisted Frenchie.

Posted by: tasker at August 23, 2012 04:16 PM (r2PLg)

62 Forever War is quite good.  I reread it every so often.

I won't spoil it, but the concept is pretty neat.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 04:16 PM (dX4hn)

63 Just reread Treasure Island. Still very enjoyable. Finally getting into The Girl Who Kicked the Hornet's Nest. All those Scandi names give me a headache and I find I keep going .. wait, who, what .. and having to go back and put the characters back together. Ponderous.

Posted by: JackStraw at August 23, 2012 04:16 PM (TMB3S)

64 <i>I seem to recall that "Rama" was either in development at some studio or was optioned. But that was years ago. May still be.</i>

It would make a great movie; the one big issue I see it having is that there's not any people-blowing-shit-up type action, so I'm not sure how that would play. A lot of its ideas have also been stolen by other sci-fi too (Stargate Universe, I'm looking at you).

Posted by: AndrewR at August 23, 2012 04:16 PM (8bsRB)

65 Oh look, new computer, new hash.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 04:16 PM (dX4hn)

66 My mom always read me the kids illustrated classics version of book when I was little.I was so disappointed when I read Moby Dick later,the kids version took out all the useless fluff.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:17 PM (6o4Fb)

67 I tried to read an unabridged translation a few years ago and couldn't make it through it. There were long, boring sections _____________ So basically like the front half of Dune which you have to get through for the set up.

Posted by: tasker at August 23, 2012 04:17 PM (r2PLg)

68
I know this whiny liberal puke.
What kind of book would recommend to beat the the shit out him?

Posted by: Ask the Ace of Spade Book Wonks at August 23, 2012 04:18 PM (Z3bkC)

69 i didn't have to read moby dick....i'll read it though....when does this start?

Posted by: phoenixgirl, team dagny at August 23, 2012 04:18 PM (Ho2rs)

70 "I'm still reading The Wheel of Time. Yeah, yeah I know"

And you will never finish.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 04:18 PM (dX4hn)

71 I added in a review of Planet of Adventure, a book that seemed like awesomesauce and then just turned into a grind.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:19 PM (fxHyG)

72 70 Neither will Jordan.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:19 PM (6o4Fb)

73 After being forced to read "Billy Budd", I'll never read Moby Dick. Melville's writing style is horrid.

Posted by: The Political Hat at August 23, 2012 04:19 PM (sZTYJ)

74 *tugs braid*

Posted by: Nynaeve al'Meara at August 23, 2012 04:19 PM (9tluB)

75 Finally getting into The Girl Who Kicked the Hornet's Nest. All those Scandi names give me a headache and I find I keep going .. wait, who, what .. and having to go back and put the characters back together. _____________ Just do the Swedish movie versions. The pornish eclipses the ponderous. Although you might have to scrub your brain for months. Speaking of ADD and I know you were-- the Danish movie-- Flame and Citronis not too bad.

Posted by: tasker at August 23, 2012 04:19 PM (r2PLg)

76 64 Posted by: AndrewR at August 23, 2012 08:16 PM (8bsRB) I also recall the "Space: 1999" did a rip-off of "Rama" in an episode. It had midgets and they had to be sacrificed, if I recall correctly.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:20 PM (akGKT)

77 Personally, Scalzi is a nice guy, he's a good writer, and he's been a very effective President of the Science Fiction Writers of America, rescuing the organization from irrelevance.

But his politics are pure "I'm smarter than you" liberal assholery. And unfortunately he has enough regular blog readers who agree with everything he says that he basically has a liberal thought bubble made of 18-inch face-hardened steel armor.

Posted by: Trimegistus at August 23, 2012 04:20 PM (mkv9V)

78 Irregular Mid-Week Book Thread

I hate you, ace. I am now butt-hurt.

Posted by: OregonMuse at August 23, 2012 04:21 PM (xm1A1)

79

Our tenth grade english teacher was supposed to cover Melville in the Early American writers.  His opinion was that it was a waste of time.  After trying to read Moby Dick twice, I agree. 

 

Thank you, Mr Erickson. 

Posted by: rd at August 23, 2012 04:21 PM (9sUlj)

80 After Wheel of Time got up to about 1000 characters, I got lost and gave up.

Someone should have gone to jail for fraud for it.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 04:21 PM (dX4hn)

81 I wrote my 25-page senior essay on Moby Dick in college. Can I just scan and upload it, rather than reading the book again?

Posted by: jakeman at August 23, 2012 04:21 PM (96M6e)

82 Someone told me to read Bartleby the Scrivener. I would prefer not to. No, actually, I read it, really liked it. Silly. Fun. Short.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:22 PM (fxHyG)

83 I kind of liked it but can't recommend it unless you are keenly interested in the French Revolution.

We're living the French Revolution.  That's enough for me.

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at August 23, 2012 04:22 PM (X3lox)

84 And you will never finish.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 08:18 PM (dX4hn)


I'm afraid you're right.  I just got book 5 in the mail the other day and if the books really get as bad as a lot of people say, there's no way I'm going to be able to force myself to get through books that long.

Posted by: Adam at August 23, 2012 04:22 PM (/YJYi)

85 ace: it seems to me that Vance would have been a kickass designer of a D-amp-D / Pathfinder campaign setting with maybe a few adventures tacked in.

IIRC, Gygax stole Vance's magic system wholesale

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:22 PM (QTHTd)

86

Irregular Mid-Week Book Thread

 

aka - Literary spotting

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 04:22 PM (9tluB)

87 You know who's writing style is even more boring than Melville?Conrad.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:22 PM (6o4Fb)

88 68
I know this whiny liberal puke.
What kind of book would recommend to beat the the shit out him?

Posted by: Ask the Ace of Spade Book Wonks at August 23, 2012 08:18 PM (Z3bkC)


See if you can find a volume of the circa 1950 edition Encyclopaedia Brittanica. Good and sturdy. Don't make 'em like they used to.

Posted by: joncelli at August 23, 2012 04:22 PM (CWlPF)

89 "Don't quote me on this but I find Milton a bore. So did Mrs. Milton. But that does not excuse you from knowing this material!!" Prof. Jennings from "Animal House"

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:22 PM (akGKT)

90 oregon, I was trying to say that this is the *unscheduled* book thread. Sorry to step on your thread. To be honest, I just don't feel like reading any more news today so this is what I came up with.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:23 PM (fxHyG)

91 52 no edith wharton Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 08:15 PM (9tluB) _______________ oh come on, it's short, it's got a beat and you can sled to it.

Posted by: tasker at August 23, 2012 04:23 PM (r2PLg)

92 >>>His opinion was that it was a waste of time. After trying to read Moby Dick twice, I agree. Dude, reading Moby Dick teaches you the discipline of reading long boring stuff that you don't want to read, iow, preparation for college and adult life in general.

Posted by: Hurricane Isaac at August 23, 2012 04:23 PM (2Srxr)

93 Another cool sci-fi book that I reread recently was Neal Stephenson's Anathem. Had some similarities to Rama but also more pure NS craziness.

Posted by: AndrewR at August 23, 2012 04:23 PM (8bsRB)

94 I'm re-reading one of my favorites from when i was a kid, Weaveworld by Clive Barker (of Hellraiser fame). It's not quite as good as i remember and the Author's Note, which i don't remember being on the copy i had as a kid, kind of takes away a little of the mystery of the book, but i'm still enjoying it.

Posted by: booger at August 23, 2012 04:24 PM (HI6wa)

95 What's the classic sci fi where the humans are scared animals on a planet full of giant spiders and such?Finally one human finds a way to lift his people out of it.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:24 PM (6o4Fb)

96 68 Posted by: Ask the Ace of Spade Book Wonks at August 23, 2012 08:18 PM (Z3bkC) "Mein Kampf" duct taped to "A People's History of the USA."

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:24 PM (akGKT)

97 I am reading "Photoshop Elements 10 the missing manual" and it is a real page turner! It is the book that should have been in the box! No seriously, these "missing manual" books are really very good at getting one jump-started. O/T I am so glad that they are going to try to  get that little bastard in Colorado with premeditation and try to  squish any  kind of  insanity defense.

Posted by: and irresolute at August 23, 2012 04:24 PM (Q492A)

98 94 I read that,my dad got a copy free somehow and brought it home for me.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:24 PM (6o4Fb)

99 Stop the presses!
Actual common senses about the Akin idiocy at American Spectator: http://is.gd/v8vmuy

Posted by: Gerry at August 23, 2012 04:24 PM (kycA/)

100 95 Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 08:24 PM (6o4Fb) Jeez, you're not thinking of "Watership Down?"

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:25 PM (akGKT)

101 Sorry to step on your thread.

Sorry, it won't work. I am still butt-hurt. My lower lip is sticking out to *here*.

Posted by: OregonMuse at August 23, 2012 04:25 PM (xm1A1)

102

>>What's the classic sci fi where the humans are scared animals on a planet full of giant spiders and such?Finally one human finds a way to lift his people out of it.

 

Riptide.

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 04:25 PM (9tluB)

103 93 AndrewR, I recently read Snow Crash for the first time and loved it. (Yes, sort of embarrassed I hadn't read it before.) Will need to look into Anathem.

Posted by: jakeman at August 23, 2012 04:25 PM (96M6e)

104 We're living the French Revolution. That's enough for me. Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at August 23, 2012 08:22 PM (X3lox) At least we use soap...

Posted by: The Political Hat at August 23, 2012 04:26 PM (sZTYJ)

105 You know who's writing style is even more boring than Melville?Conrad.

Conrad wasn't a native English speaker. He was a Polack.

And even given that I'm going to have to disagree with you. "Heart of Darkness" was harrowing.

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:26 PM (QTHTd)

106 100 102 No,damn it I need to remeber this.Was it something by Piper maybe?

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:26 PM (6o4Fb)

107 87 You know who's writing style is even more boring than Melville?Conrad.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 08:22 PM (6o4Fb)


Heart of Darkness was okay, but then that's all the Conrad anybody ever reads.

Posted by: joncelli at August 23, 2012 04:27 PM (CWlPF)

108 I chuckle every time I think about the French Revolution. What a bunch of fuckups! It's not like they didn't have a good role model, i.e., US. No, they had to go on a killing rampage and fucking up the calender and then installing a dictator who wanted to take over Europe and Russia.

Posted by: Hurricane Isaac at August 23, 2012 04:27 PM (2Srxr)

109 >>>Stop the presses! Actual common senses about the Akin idiocy at American Spectator: http://is.gd/v8vmuy This siren song is old to me by now; I've heard it with Angle, O'Donnell, Paladino. Why is not old to you at this point? How many times can you be wrong without ever acknowledging error? Is that conservatism now? Pigheadedness masquerading as principle?

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:27 PM (fxHyG)

110 105 Yes,the story is good,the writing awful.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:27 PM (6o4Fb)

111 I read "Charlotte's Web," but it was a long time ago and I don't remember much of it. It was pretty good, though.

Posted by: Joe Biden at August 23, 2012 04:28 PM (IoNBC)

112 When you grow up in New England, you read Moby Dick. It's either a birthright or a curse. If you haven't read it you might like In the Heart of the Sea. It's the true story of the whaling ship Essex that was rammed and sunk by a whale. It was also the inspiration for Moby Dick.

Posted by: JackStraw at August 23, 2012 04:28 PM (TMB3S)

113 104 the political hat they won't let us eat cake!!!!

Posted by: phoenixgirl, team dagny at August 23, 2012 04:28 PM (Ho2rs)

114 >>>You know who's writing style is even more boring than Melville?Conrad. no way! I read conrad years and years ago but I loved Heart of Darkness! I thought it was exciting an moody. Now that's all I read, and it was a long time ago, but he can't be bad based on what I read.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:28 PM (fxHyG)

115 Ace, Do you think RR Martin will finish writing "A Song of Winter" if Romney is elected? I heard he stopped writing when Boooosh was president.

Posted by: Max Power at August 23, 2012 04:29 PM (q177U)

116 I'd like to know how to get classics on the kindle w/out having to use my computer. Because I'm kinda slow at that sort of thing.

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 08:13 PM (9tluB)



Go to Amazon, Kindle books.....search it....it's free.


http://tinyurl.com/cvd899n

Posted by: Tami at August 23, 2012 04:29 PM (X6akg)

117 Jakeman,

Yeah, Snow Crash was good too. As is pretty much everything he's written, with the exception of The Diamond Age. Couldn't quite get into that one.

Also, I think I read somewhere that Snow Crash is going to be made into a movie, which could either be awesome or atrocious depending on how it's done.

Posted by: AndrewR at August 23, 2012 04:29 PM (8bsRB)

118 One of the best school-assigned books I ever read was Red Sky at Morning. I've read it about 10 times since then, and it always makes me laugh and cry.

Gout! Housafallen!

Posted by: Hobbitopoly at August 23, 2012 04:29 PM (d6TfZ)

119 As much as I loathe the man for being a Pali-slurping lib, 'The Flounder' by Gunter Grass is worth reading.

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 04:29 PM (9tluB)

120 112 Posted by: JackStraw at August 23, 2012 08:28 PM (TMB3S) Grew up in Flatbush. "A Tree Grows in Brooklyn" was de rigeur.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:29 PM (akGKT)

121 MD just seems like a whale too far to re-attempt reading it. 

If there is beer and sammiches to go with the reading group,  I will at least start, but due to a lot of personal conflicts cannot guarantee I will be there at the finish (if there are any finishers). 

A Monday night interlude from the political madness seems like a good idea.

Posted by: Hrothgar (Dagny Aficionado ) at August 23, 2012 04:30 PM (Cnqmv)

122 Can one of you morons help me out here?

There was a sf short(?) story that I read years ago (late 60s - early 70s) in which the protagonist was sole survivor and therefore winner in a fight-to-the-death, Hunger Games-like proxy war between two societies that settled upon this solution in lieu of fighting full-blown wars. Contestants were chosen from each side and set upon each other in a combat arena -- and this comprised the major part of the story -- but, despite being a hero to his people, the survivor was more or less despised because, for him, there no longer were any rules. Whatever he wanted, it was his right to take.

I'm hazy on further details, but can anyone tell me the name of the story and / or the author? It may have been in one of Ellison's Dangerous Visions anthologies... kthnxbi

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars at August 23, 2012 04:30 PM (0AClR)

123 PLANETS OF ADVENTURE!That's it,by Lenster.Available free at Baen btw.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:30 PM (6o4Fb)

124 That's why ace reminded me of it with the similar title.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:31 PM (6o4Fb)

125 Kind of cool trivia.

If you remember Piers Anthony's Split Infinity, I have the original of the cover art on the wall next to me.

Book was pretty poor though.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 04:31 PM (dX4hn)

126 a really good history on the French Revolution-- "Citizens," by Simon Schama. I woudln't say he's right-wing, exactly (but he might be). But what he definitely is is angry at the left-wing mythmaking about the revolution, the cover up of the orgy of violence. His book is written as a corrective to that. So, apart from the political take (which I don't even think is a political take -- you can't translate the politics from one age to another) it's a zingy bloodbath from one outrage to the next folly. Heavy, thick book though. But really solid.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:31 PM (fxHyG)

127 I wrote my 25-page senior essay on Moby Dick in college. Can I just scan and upload it, rather than reading the book again? Posted by: jakeman

Get an account with Scribd.com and put the URL in your comment URL slot.

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at August 23, 2012 04:31 PM (Q/1Jp)

128 At least we use soap...

Posted by: The Political Hat at August 23, 2012 08:26 PM (sZTYJ)



We'd be restricted to one square of toilet paper if the left get their full revolution.  Sure, still one more than the French use, but ...

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at August 23, 2012 04:31 PM (X3lox)

129 When you grow up in New England, you read Moby Dick. It's either a birthright or a curse.

Why slog through Melville when H P Lovecraft was right down there in Providence?

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:32 PM (QTHTd)

130 Do you think RR Martin will finish writing "A Song of Winter" if Romney is elected? I heard he stopped writing when Boooosh was president.

Posted by: Max Power at August 23, 2012 08:29 PM (q177U)


Even if he doesn't stop he'll probably die from a heart attack or a stroke before he finishes the series.

Posted by: Adam at August 23, 2012 04:32 PM (/YJYi)

131 Geek admission: I liked all the TTA illustrated space novellas. Great art. Stories sucked the big one.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:32 PM (akGKT)

132 Books?

Posted by: charlie gibson at August 23, 2012 04:32 PM (QupBk)

133 Joyce's Ulysses is extraordinary, but, like the Bible, you might want a book of notes to go with it. Seidman & Gifford's book is the standard.
I read four or five of Thomas Hardy's novels. Jude the Obscure, if you want to try one.
Dickens? No thank you. And I found Joseph Conrad too dry.
Faulkner's As I Lay Dying is worth reading, so long as you can follow the shifting point of view.
I have twice tried to get through Dostoyevski's The Idiot -- the problem was mostly not having the time to finish.
I never got that Catcher in the Rye was so brilliant, but if you liked it, read Franny and Zooey.
Try Philip Roth's My Life as a Man. Portnoy's Complaint is pretty funny
If you dare, try to get through Malcolm Lowry's Under the Volcano. It took me three weeks.
I only had time for a few dozen pages, but Mark Steyn's After America is worth the effort. Ditto anything by the great Thomas Sowell.

rats. I wanna go home now.

Posted by: mallfly at August 23, 2012 04:32 PM (bJm7W)

134 "Farenheit 451." We burn the books.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at August 23, 2012 04:32 PM (akGKT)

135

Even if he doesn't stop he'll probably die from a heart attack or a stroke while jerking it to kiddie-porn  before he finishes the series.

 

Posted by: fixed for accuracy at August 23, 2012 04:33 PM (9tluB)

136 Will need to look into Anathem.

Posted by: jakeman at August 23, 2012 08:25 PM (96M6e)


As a confirmed devotee of Stephenson, I read Anathem in its entirety, but felt it was akin to Moby Dick.  Snow Crash is good but Cryptonomicon is better.  Loaned my copy to an Army buddy and rather than give it back, he bought me a replacement copy.

Posted by: Hrothgar (Dagny Aficionado ) at August 23, 2012 04:33 PM (Cnqmv)

137 >>>Grew up in Flatbush. "A Tree Grows in Brooklyn" was de rigeur. Posted by: J.J. Sefton I remember: *catching the Christmas tree with her little brother *getting her dad's shaving mug after he died *pouring the acid on her leg (which seems harsh but did psychologically heal her)

Posted by: Hurricane Isaac at August 23, 2012 04:33 PM (2Srxr)

138

Ace,

 

Try Robert A Heinlein for good Science Fiction.  His juveniles were very good, if a little short on themes that required sex, profanity and violence.

 

H Beam Piper's Fuzzy novels are good too.  Little Fuzzy, etc. 

 

IF anyone wants to read a Distopian novel of the US future, try Caliphate by Tom Kratman. 

Posted by: rd at August 23, 2012 04:33 PM (9sUlj)

139 Lowry has it all over Joyce.

Posted by: Lit Troll at August 23, 2012 04:34 PM (9tluB)

140 138 Caliphate is also available free at Baen.The resistance was very far fetched though.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:35 PM (6o4Fb)

141 Moon is a Harsh Mistress by RAH is an enduring classic, IMO.

Posted by: Hrothgar (Dagny Aficionado ) at August 23, 2012 04:35 PM (Cnqmv)

142 I woudln't say he's right-wing, exactly (but he might be).

Schama really, really hated George W Bush over the 2000s: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/nov/03/george-bush-legacy-dubya

And if you google further, you'll see him offering advice to Obama.

Schama is best described as a "sucker of cock".

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:35 PM (QTHTd)

143 The Forever War Read Rimrunner, or Downbelow Station.

Posted by: toby928© Cherryh shill at August 23, 2012 04:35 PM (QupBk)

144 Monte Cristo is brilliant, one of my favorites of all time. I read the "modern" translation with the lesbian drug orgies and all that, and it's well done. Keep going from where you are, it picks up,

Rendevous with Rama is a classic. Its sequels are among the worst books I've ever read (they weren't written by Clarke, despite his name being on the cover). Don't touch 'em.

Everything Neal Stephenson ever wrote is great. His books are profoundly conservative in many ways, though I don't think he necessarily intends it. Cryptonomicon is a revelation, and as a bonus you can use it to beat down wild dogs when you're done.

Posted by: Matt at August 23, 2012 04:35 PM (abV4l)

145 >>Why slog through Melville when H P Lovecraft was right down there in Providence? My English teachers were somewhat less progressive.

Posted by: JackStraw at August 23, 2012 04:36 PM (TMB3S)

146 boulder, copy that. Okay, well, he is at least annoyed at the leftwing coverup of the full crimes of the Jacobins. And he details them.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:36 PM (fxHyG)

147 I don't think "Bartleby" was silly. The poor character had a nervous breakdown and his old boss wants to help him and can't. But it was fun in that everyone has times where they'd like to say "I would prefer not to" about things in a job but can't. I also liked it because when I was in high school we had an short film of it which was good along with "Dr Heidegger's Experiment" by Hawthorne. Also, the friendship between Hawthorne and Melville that disintegrated was and interesting story probably because Melville was a gay in the closet and too intense for Hawthone.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 23, 2012 04:36 PM (/f+n8)

148 T-T-T-T-Triple post on the sidebar!

Posted by: Brother Cavil, New Caprica Sanitation Department at August 23, 2012 04:37 PM (x8wJs)

149

"but I'm 99% sure, based on what I've read, that there's more to it than just Mobile Infantry suits"

Uh, never mind. You're not done yet.

Posted by: truth fairy at August 23, 2012 04:37 PM (ue2Nm)

150 That Heinlein guy might be a jew. I'm not positive, so don't quote me on that.

Posted by: Joe Biden at August 23, 2012 04:37 PM (IoNBC)

151 Can't say I was impressed with The Forever War.  There wasn't much in the way of a story there.  It's not badly written, but I don't think it rates all the praise heaped upon it.  Still, different strokes.

Posted by: Darth Randall at August 23, 2012 04:37 PM (mV8sg)

152 Ace, think of "The Count..." in the Victorian translation as the greatest Seinfeld-style everything is connected / revenge fantasy book ever, and stop overanalyizing it.  There's so many MacGuffins and plot gaps it's ridiculous, but if you give it an honest shot, you'll love it.  It's best consumed in large chunks, as opposed to reading a bit and coming back.  If you're unsure whether you care for Dumas, the Oxford translation of "The Three Musketeers" is a shorter and more action-packed start.  If that doesn't work for you, move on.  You'll be missing out, but at least you gave it a fair shot.

Posted by: StPatrick_TN doing the obligatory thing at August 23, 2012 04:38 PM (RRlac)

153 on N Stephenson - His books are profoundly conservative in many ways, though I don't think he necessarily intends it

"The Big U" was conservative to the point of preachiness. Yes, he intends it. He's just gotten better at "show, not tell". Bless his heart - and I mean this in the good way (since I am English, not Southern)

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:38 PM (QTHTd)

154

I read Moby Dick, all the way through, voluntarily. It wasn't bad as I recall. Fortunately, I remember being fascinated by all of the detail about whaling. And there was detail.

 

Moby Dick was "The Deadliest Catch" of its' time, except about whales and in book form.

 

But I'm looking at an unread 'War and Peace' over on the shelves....

Posted by: Stateless_Infidel at August 23, 2012 04:38 PM (8UijS)

155 Ace,

Why is it that you attract all of the Aspy trolls?

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at August 23, 2012 04:38 PM (Q/1Jp)

156

I want to know what is up with Patrick Rothfus.

 

The King Killer Chronicles.   I want to read part three.  Which I've been waiting for, for a long time now.

 

Did Patrick Rothfus kill the actual author?  And now he can't finish? 

 

Well, if so, and I'm not saying it is, but fuck you Pat, if you did that.

Posted by: Jack at August 23, 2012 04:38 PM (wUFaM)

157 136 As a confirmed devotee of Stephenson, I read Anathem in its entirety, but felt it was akin to Moby Dick. Snow Crash is good but Cryptonomicon is better.
Posted by: Hrothgar (Dagny Aficionado ) at August 23, 2012 08:33 PM (Cnqmv)

Agree on all counts. Anathem was the first ebook I acquired and extremely tough to slog through. I flew through the other two and enjoyed them immensely.


Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars at August 23, 2012 04:38 PM (0AClR)

158 >>>I don't think "Bartleby" was silly. I meant silly in a good way. You don't think it's a little silly? When he just keeps saying "I would prefer not to?" Was I not supposed to laugh? Becuase I did.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 04:38 PM (fxHyG)

159 Schama certainly did suck Obama's cock. He did a documentary maybe a book on Obama early in 2008. He did a doc on the French Revolution that was very good. Unfortunately, they also included this fat disgusting commie NYU professor who kept going on and on praising the murders. I bet this guy would suck Stalin's cock. I started Schama's book but haven't finish it.

Posted by: Hurricane Isaac at August 23, 2012 04:39 PM (2Srxr)

160

@115 I am convinced Martin hates his readers....

 

That and he has the series branching in so many different directions he has no idea how to tie it up and move it forward.

 

I am still not over being pissed about  the end of the last book.

Posted by: Finn McCool at August 23, 2012 04:39 PM (R/8dI)

161 AndrewR, it seems like rumors have been floated about a Snow Crash movie forever, but no one's ever had the cojones (or CGI) to pull it off. Maybe this one, announced this summer, will: http://preview.tinyurl.com/cwpgw3m Hrothgar, will add Cryptonomicon to the (ever-growing) need-to-read list!

Posted by: jakeman at August 23, 2012 04:40 PM (96M6e)

162 I also shill for Frederik Pohl. I think all his stuff is pretty good.

Posted by: toby928© Cherryh shill at August 23, 2012 04:40 PM (QupBk)

163 --Everything Neal Stephenson ever wrote is great. His books are profoundly conservative in many ways, though I don't think he necessarily intends it.--

Yeah, I was actually thinking the same thing about Simon Schama after Ace mentioned him. Even though they're both political liberals (actually, I don't know that about Stephenson; I'm assuming) some of their themes and, in Stephenson's case, the things he has characters say come from a place that, if not overtly conservative, is at least definitely not liberal.

I think this goes back to Ace's theory of politics-as-social-signifier.

Posted by: AndrewR at August 23, 2012 04:40 PM (8bsRB)

164 Oh, I mean I'm reading Citizen - not his Obama shit.

Posted by: Hurricane Isaac at August 23, 2012 04:40 PM (2Srxr)

165 Way better and way more exciting than Forver Warr is John Steakley's Armor.His book Vampire$ is also awesome.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:41 PM (6o4Fb)

166 Monte Cristo is brilliant, one of my favorites of all time. I read the "modern" translation with the lesbian drug orgies and all that, and it's well done. Well, looks like that one is going to the top of my "to read" list...

Posted by: The Political Hat at August 23, 2012 04:41 PM (sZTYJ)

167


The King Killer Chronicles

 

There are some funny reviews of that on amazon.

 

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 04:41 PM (9tluB)

168 Ctrl+F Fritz Leiber 0 of 0 Get on my level, Ace.

Posted by: sithkhan at August 23, 2012 04:41 PM (EjtN/)

169 For a neat spy novel that could have been written yesterday I would recommend "Jihad" by Iser Harel (1973, I think).  Harel was a former director of the Mossad who turned to writing spy novels after he left.  "Jihad" is a good one. 

Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at August 23, 2012 04:42 PM (X3lox)

170 Lots of good stuff available free here. http://www.baenebooks.com/default.aspx

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:42 PM (6o4Fb)

171 Ace's theory of politics-as-social-signifier.

Yeesh, this is my day for posting links I got from Foseti, apparently . . .

But, yes, leftism for many is about social climbing. http://james-g.com/2012/08/how-yglesias-works/

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:42 PM (QTHTd)

172 O.K. I agree. I think you are supposed to laugh. because it's bizarre and then he doesn't eat and keeps hanging around his old office. But its laughing at someone who 's really off his rocker.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 23, 2012 04:43 PM (/f+n8)

173 As I recall, The Forever War was the post-Nam, hippie version of StarShip Troopers. Didn't like it as much.

Posted by: nickless at August 23, 2012 04:43 PM (MMC8r)

174 Anybody else read the Patrick O'Brian Jack Aubrey series that became Master and Commander? If you like that kind of thing they are awesome.

Posted by: JackStraw at August 23, 2012 04:43 PM (TMB3S)

175 If President O-Four-Putt gets another 4 years, I might have to get a POOR IMPULSE CONTROL tattoo.

Posted by: jakeman at August 23, 2012 04:44 PM (96M6e)

176 174 Yep,he wrote it as a direct answer to the politics of Starship.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:44 PM (6o4Fb)

177 How come nobody ever mentions Clavell's books, besides maybe Shogun? Taipan was excellent, Noble House interesting. I even liked Whirlwind.

Posted by: toby928© Cherryh shill at August 23, 2012 04:44 PM (QupBk)

178 >>> Anybody else read the Patrick O'Brian Jack Aubrey series that became Master and Commander? If you like that kind of thing they are awesome. First, I have to watch Cabin Boy...

Posted by: Hurricane Isaac at August 23, 2012 04:44 PM (2Srxr)

179
It's been a while since I read it, but Luc Sante's Low Life is well worth reading. In it, he tells the story of New York's Lower East Side, circa 1840-1920 using conventional sources as well as contemporary ones.

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars at August 23, 2012 04:44 PM (0AClR)

180 Yes, I really liked the Patrick O'Brian series but I think I missed reading the last couple of them.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at August 23, 2012 04:45 PM (/f+n8)

181 Monte Cristo's good shit starts when he gets OUT of prison...stay with it.

Posted by: Sgt. York at August 23, 2012 04:46 PM (Q+6UT)

182 Rendezvous with Rama is a great fun book. AVOID THE SEQUELS.

Posted by: nickless at August 23, 2012 04:46 PM (MMC8r)

183 >>>178 How come nobody ever mentions Clavell's books, besides maybe Shogun? Taipan was excellent, Noble House interesting. I even liked Whirlwind. When you live long enough, you see writers go out of fashion. Happened to Heminwgay and Fitzgerald, too. Remember Michnor? Leon Uris?

Posted by: Hurricane Isaac at August 23, 2012 04:47 PM (2Srxr)

184 Monte Cristo's good shit starts when he gets OUT of prison...stay with it.

See, this comment is the sort that will get me to side with Dumas's naysayers.

If your story isn't about escape, but about revenge, then that's where all the text should be. Keep the early stuff, about how bad prison life was, to the early chapters; and keep that stuff short and to the point.

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:48 PM (QTHTd)

185 Not gonna lie, I don't do any heavy, deep reading. Enjoy the hell out of some fantasy series though. LOTR, song of fire and ice, WoT, all the Shannara books, Sara Douglas writes decent stuff, Jennifer Roberson's Tiger and Del series was good and so is Tad Williams

Posted by: BCochran1981 at August 23, 2012 04:48 PM (GEICT)

186 "The Big U" was conservative to the point of preachiness. Yes, he intends it. He's just gotten better at "show, not tell".

Ah, I haven't actually read that one yet. That's his first, and he himself thinks it's awful.

Looks like there's a lot of mixed feelings here about Anathem. I loved it, but it is true that it takes about 200 pages to really get going. The conclusion doesn't really make sense either if you think about it too much. But it's a great ride and brings in a lot of very interesting ideas.

One of the other things I like about Stephenson is his appreciation for marginalized groups - and I mean marginalized as in "looked down upon by the SWPL zeitgeist". Among the heroes of his last few books have been entrepreneurs, Victorians, monks, and 17th century Puritans. And he does it without being preachy or hitting you over the head.

Posted by: Matt at August 23, 2012 04:48 PM (abV4l)

187 I know it's possible for people not to enjoy Dumas, but I cannot understand it at all.  Universal themes, people.

Posted by: StPatrick_TN at August 23, 2012 04:49 PM (RRlac)

188 I don't think Fitzgerald ever went out of fashion, though.

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:49 PM (QTHTd)

189 Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 08:05 PM (9tluB) Did someone say Wheel of Time? There is a scheduled release date for the last one, you know. As someone who lived the achingly slow rollouts and has done at least a dozen re-reads of the entire series (I'm a wicked fast reader), I have to say that it's not so annoying when you can read them all at once and see that there is a still a basic structure to the whole story. I was surprised by just how coherent it all is at my lastest rereading. Sanderson is a suckier writer than Jordan, and he absolutely destroys several characters, but he's good enough to finish it up. Supposedly Jordan wrote the ending to the entire series already before he died.

Posted by: elizabethe at August 23, 2012 04:49 PM (9MyQd)

190 ace, try "Eifelheim" by Michael Flynn. Or a cool magic/technology mix can be found in "Empire of the East" by Fred Saberhagen (sp).

Posted by: eman at August 23, 2012 04:51 PM (Wp4rQ)

191 One of my favorite books is Pohl's Gateway.  Not the sequels so much, but I loved the premise of a story being told through a guy's therapy sessions with a shrink.

If Pohl had balls he would have left it as a single book, with its disturbing ending.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 04:51 PM (dX4hn)

192

When I was little my dad used to read to me before I fell asleep. 

Chaucer,  Henry Miller, Charles Bukowski. 

You know, the usual  bedtime stories.

Posted by: Rory Reid at August 23, 2012 04:52 PM (9tluB)

193 >>Rendezvous with Rama

I read it back in the 80's when I was in the science fiction book club.

Posted by: sTevo at August 23, 2012 04:52 PM (VMcEw)

194 Dave in Fla- agreed. Gateway was a breezy read with a real sense-of-wonder about it. The Blue Event Horizon was boring; couldn't finish it.

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:52 PM (QTHTd)

195 oh, i'm tentatively in on Moby Dick, too. I've never read it.

Posted by: elizabethe at August 23, 2012 04:52 PM (9MyQd)

196 Not gonna lie, I don't do any heavy, deep reading. Enjoy the hell out of some fantasy series though. Cherryh, Cherryh, Cherryh.

Posted by: toby928© Cherryh shill at August 23, 2012 04:53 PM (QupBk)

197 Now that I think about it, I had the same problem with Herbert's Dune.  It was great as a single book, sucked as a series.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 04:53 PM (dX4hn)

198 Best sci-fi out there now: Peter Hamilton (Pandora's Star and Judas Unchained) and Iain M. Banks (everything).

Posted by: truth fairy at August 23, 2012 04:53 PM (ue2Nm)

199

 >>Supposedly Jordan wrote the ending to the entire series already before he died.

 

and still, we wait.

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 04:53 PM (9tluB)

200 That L. Ron Hubbard was quite the writer.

Posted by: T. Cruise at August 23, 2012 04:54 PM (MMC8r)

201 Best sci-fi out there now: Peter Hamilton (Pandora's Star and Judas Unchained) and Iain M. Banks (everything). Posted by: truth fairy at August 23, 2012 08:53 PM (ue2Nm) Indeed.

Posted by: eman at August 23, 2012 04:54 PM (Wp4rQ)

202 Krebs: That sure sounds like "Arena" by Frederic Brown. It was the inspiration for the famous Kirk Vs. The Lizard Guy episode of Star Trek.

Posted by: Trimegistus at August 23, 2012 04:55 PM (mkv9V)

203 >>>189 I don't think Fitzgerald ever went out of fashion, though. Posted by: Boulder Hobo I got stuck watching that Woody Allen movie Midnight in Paris. Cute gimmick but still a Woody Allen movie. He's too old and creepy to star in themselves. He always hired the latest ingenue so he could stick his tongue down their throats. Now, he has Owen Wilson doing an impression of himself (Allen). This one actually made some money.

Posted by: Hurricane Isaac at August 23, 2012 04:55 PM (2Srxr)

204 Honestly, I kind of liked some of Hubbard's Sci Fi.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 04:55 PM (dX4hn)

205 What's the classic sci fi where the humans are scared animals on a planet full of giant spiders and such?Finally one human finds a way to lift his people out of it.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 08:24 PM (6o4Fb)

 

................................Starfire series by David Weber and Steve White.

 

I love anything by David Weber. Working on his latest Safehold book.

 

I love Wheel of Time. I'd be happy if it never ended.

 

I'd rather take a beating than read Moby Dick.

Posted by: Invictos at August 23, 2012 04:56 PM (OQpzc)

206 Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 08:53 PM (9tluB) You can read the prologue and part of the first chapter. Go to Dragonmount or Tor. Release date is Jan 8.

Posted by: elizabethe at August 23, 2012 04:56 PM (9MyQd)

207 198 You can just stop with Dune and imagine what happened after.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 04:56 PM (6o4Fb)

208 *smoothes skirt*

Posted by: Egwene al'Meara at August 23, 2012 04:56 PM (9tluB)

209 I read through a lot of Pandora's Star - wasn't able to finish.

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 04:56 PM (QTHTd)

210

146 jimi ray

 

You're a college sophomore, correct? And studying one of the Liberal Arts, correct?

Posted by: Arbalest at August 23, 2012 04:57 PM (/bHNF)

211 197 Not gonna lie, I don't do any heavy, deep reading. Enjoy the hell out of some fantasy series though. Cherryh, Cherryh, Cherryh. Posted by: toby928© Cherryh shill at August 23, 2012 08:53 PM (QupBk) Holy crap. That's a lot of titles. Suggestions?

Posted by: BCochran1981 at August 23, 2012 04:57 PM (GEICT)

212 Can I smack the shit out of Egwene?  Please?

Oh hell, just line up all 1000 characters so I can smack them in the mouth.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 04:57 PM (dX4hn)

213 *smoothes skirt* Posted by: Egwene al'Meara at August 23, 2012 08:56 PM (9tluB Tugs Braid.

Posted by: Nynaeve at August 23, 2012 04:58 PM (9MyQd)

214 Fifty Shades of Gay by B. Fwank

Posted by: A. Sullivan at August 23, 2012 04:58 PM (MMC8r)

215 Worship me!  (And don't forget to leave your $50,000 check by the door when you leave)

Posted by: Xenu at August 23, 2012 04:58 PM (/YJYi)

216

whoops, forgot to clear out that old sock and fucked up the Amyrlin's sock.  Oh, well.

>>Release date is Jan 8.

 

I know.  Though it was already pushed back once...

Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 04:59 PM (9tluB)

217 >>How come nobody ever mentions Clavell's books, besides maybe Shogun? Taipan was excellent, Noble House interesting. I even liked Whirlwind.

Posted by: toby928© Cherryh shill

King Rat is my favorite Clavell. Maybe because they ate dog.
Whirlwind is in the que.

Posted by: sTevo at August 23, 2012 04:59 PM (VMcEw)

218 Schama's "A History of Great Britain" is pretty good, though I actually prefer the BBC series to the books. Simon is definitely a progtard, unfortunately.

Posted by: A Balrog of Morgoth at August 23, 2012 04:59 PM (qZXps)

219 "Liege Killer" by Christopher Hinz is pretty good. Good writing, very interesting concepts. The two later books not so much, especially the last one.

Posted by: eman at August 23, 2012 04:59 PM (Wp4rQ)

220 215 *smoothes skirt* Posted by: Egwene al'Meara at August 23, 2012 08:56 PM (9tluB Tugs Braid. Posted by: Nynaeve at August 23, 2012 08:58 PM (9MyQd) *broods*

Posted by: Rand al'Thor at August 23, 2012 04:59 PM (GEICT)

221 You're a college sophomore, correct? And studying one of the Liberal Arts, correct? Posted by: Arbalest at August 23, 2012 08:57 PM (/bHNF) Coming out to your parents is the hardest part, I hear.

Posted by: nickless at August 23, 2012 05:00 PM (MMC8r)

222 Holy crap. That's a lot of titles. Suggestions?

Posted by: BCochran1981 at August 23, 2012 08:57 PM (GEICT)

 

...............................Faded Sun series, Morgaine Saga, Chanur series. My favorites.

Posted by: Invictos at August 23, 2012 05:00 PM (OQpzc)

223 A while back I got into a mood and went back to read Sherlock Holmes in order.  It was pretty cool to get all the references.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 05:01 PM (dX4hn)

224 Dude,

You did The Forever War? Read Old Man's War and the sequels.  It rocks.

Also read Wool by Hugh Howey.  The omnibus edition. It's already be optioned by Fox Films and Ridley Scott.

Posted by: TRO at August 23, 2012 05:01 PM (ad/F8)

225 Anyone read the Crosstime Engineer series?

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 05:02 PM (dX4hn)

226 Hubbards scifi short stories were very popular,part of the "Golden Age" of scifi short stories.

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 05:02 PM (6o4Fb)

227 I came across links to the original Charlie Chan stories on Gutenberg AU, but I haven't gone to get them yet.

Posted by: nickless at August 23, 2012 05:03 PM (MMC8r)

228 Anyone read the Crosstime Engineer series? Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 09:02 PM (dX4hn) Negative. Never heard of it. Is there any math?

Posted by: eman at August 23, 2012 05:03 PM (Wp4rQ)

229 Anyone read the Crosstime Engineer series?

Posted by: Dave in Fla at August 23, 2012 09:02 PM (dX4hn)

 

 

..............................At least six times.

Posted by: Invictos at August 23, 2012 05:03 PM (OQpzc)

230 >>>anyone know of any modern-day fiction authors who still write like that? No. I stick to nonfiction, too.

Posted by: Hurricane Isaac at August 23, 2012 05:04 PM (2Srxr)

231 I read *The Forever War* as a teen, and I liked it. I should re-read it as an adult and see what I think now. It is definitely a response to Heinlein's *Starship Troopers*. Heinlein wrote a book that was intended to glorify the lowly infantry soldier, the guys who go out in harm's way and take or hold ground. His book assumed a competent military organization operating under a competent and very limited government. *The Forever War*, if I recall correctly, assumed a more screwed-up Catch-22 sort of military situation. John Steakley's novel *Armor* is *Starship Troopers* with a completely screwed-up military situation. The military is run by incompetent people, the military medics are incompetent, the military engineers are incompetent, the government is incompetent, the soldiers get killed so much that few of them are competent. The prose is full-tilt gonzo and you have to read it to believe it. Definitely recommended. John Steakley also wrote a novel called *Vampire$* that is also worth reading. There is a pretty unbelievable plot twist (in all the centuries that people have been fighting vampires, nobody ever tried an obvious thing to try that turns out to work). Aside from that plot twist, it is a full-tilt gonzo vampire hunting novel and also definitely recommended. (By the way, *Vampire$* was turned into a movie, and the movie doesn't live up to the book, at all. If you have seen the movie, don't let it put you off the book.)

Posted by: mr_jack at August 23, 2012 05:04 PM (TMG3G)

232 John Steakley - will have to add that to the list.

Posted by: Boulder Hobo at August 23, 2012 05:05 PM (QTHTd)

233 >>>220 Schama's "A History of Great Britain" is pretty good, though I actually prefer the BBC series to the books. Simon is definitely a progtard, unfortunately. I like David Starkey who is akin to Schama - he also does BBC series and writes books. He definitely is conservative. Got into big trouble a year ago for blaming the riots on, gasp, black gangster culture.

Posted by: Hurricane Isaac at August 23, 2012 05:06 PM (2Srxr)

234 There's a really good book (the name escapes me) about a future mercenary with a sentient Sig weapon. Draws you in like the smell of bacon.

Posted by: eman at August 23, 2012 05:07 PM (Wp4rQ)

235 I hated hated hated Midnight in Paris. I thought it was slow, unfunny, and extremely formulaic. I couldn't care about the hero because he was such a dope. The past characters came off as caricatures, and the modern-day characters were all just annoying. I cannot understand why that movie made money.

Posted by: Trimegistus at August 23, 2012 05:07 PM (mkv9V)

236 Holy crap. That's a lot of titles. Suggestions? Do you like hard sci-fi or fantasyish better? I'm partial to the sciency stuff stuff set in the Earth Company War period. The aforementioned Chanur Series, Heavy Time, Rimrunner, Downbelow Station, Pell, and Cyteen. Cyteen could easily be made into a great movie. 40,000 in Gehenna is a bit lame.

Posted by: the invisible hand at August 23, 2012 05:08 PM (QupBk)

237 I love the poetry of Robert Bly

Posted by: Anderson Cooper at August 23, 2012 05:09 PM (9tluB)

238 dammit

Posted by: toby928© at August 23, 2012 05:09 PM (QupBk)

239 Do you like hard sci-fi or fantasyish better? I'm partial to the sciency stuff stuff set in the Earth Company War period. The aforementioned Chanur Series, Heavy Time, Rimrunner, Downbelow Station, Pell, and Cyteen. Cyteen could easily be made into a great movie. 40,000 in Gehenna is a bit lame. I def lean way more toward fantasy

Posted by: Rand al'Thor at August 23, 2012 05:10 PM (GEICT)

240 The Forever War is a great book. I have read it many times. Good fun read

Posted by: Thorisin at August 23, 2012 05:10 PM (xMq47)

241 >>>237 I hated hated hated Midnight in Paris. I thought it was slow, unfunny, and extremely formulaic. I couldn't care about the hero because he was such a dope. The past characters came off as caricatures, and the modern-day characters were all just annoying. I cannot understand why that movie made money. Paris looked good though they did something to saturate the color yellow which was weird. Allen lives in a bubble. To me the most annoying thing was hearing Owen Wilson's Woody Allen impression. It's the same shit in every movie. I could even do one.

Posted by: Hurricane Isaac at August 23, 2012 05:12 PM (2Srxr)

242 Does anybody read what I post? 166 Way better and way more exciting than Forver Warr is John Steakley's Armor.His book Vampire$ is also awesome. Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 08:41 PM (6o4Fb)

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 05:14 PM (6o4Fb)

243 Ever since Demonoid went on its most recent hiatus, it being probably the best torrent I know for downloading pretty good books, I'm stuck with Pirate Bay. This torrent site is okay, if you really must have the Des Moines Register or the billionth upload of Harry Potter/Hunger Games/That Horny Old Broad S&M series. Yet Pirate Bay is still lacking in anything interesting...I figured their seeders/up loaders/reprobates would pick up the slack and fill the Demonoid void (heh). Anyone out there know of better torrent sites? Forgive me if this is outside the boundaries of proper Book Thread discussion. I just figured fellow morons would have some suggestions.

Posted by: Bruce Strang at August 23, 2012 05:14 PM (R1591)

244 I know. Though it was already pushed back once... Posted by: garrett at August 23, 2012 08:59 PM (9tluB) sigh. The long suffering. At least WoT is actually going to end. I feel sorry for the Martin readers. I have no confidence that that will ever end in a good resolution type way.

Posted by: Nynaeve at August 23, 2012 05:14 PM (9MyQd)

245 It's not science fiction but fantasy, but one of my favorite novels is Declare, by Tim Powers. It's like a cross between John Le Carre, Kim, and the Arabian Nights.

And get this: Kim Philby and the Soviets are the bad guys. Not just wrong but actively, theologically evil.

Posted by: Trimegistus at August 23, 2012 05:15 PM (mkv9V)

246 Scaramouche? Scaramouche? Will you do the Fandango?

Posted by: Farrokh Bulsara at August 23, 2012 05:16 PM (/FDVW)

247 Has anyone read The Fountainhead by Ayn Rand?

Posted by: lothar at August 23, 2012 05:18 PM (+BKQh)

248 yes, toby, Cherryh shill, do you have any recs? I lean towards fantasy. I've read those Fortress Books.

Posted by: Nynaeve at August 23, 2012 05:21 PM (9MyQd)

249 Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 08:41 PM (6o4Fb)

Posted by: steevy at August 23, 2012 09:14 PM (6o4Fb)

 

 

...................................Hey, I answered your spider question and you blew it off.

Posted by: Invictos at August 23, 2012 05:21 PM (OQpzc)

250 based on the recos, I'll give The Count another try. I did read that the initial plan was to start with The Count. It was Dumas' assistant/uncredited co-writer who suggested the backstory come first.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 05:21 PM (fxHyG)

251 I'm not a big fan of "fantasy" but The Morgaine Stories seemed good to me.

Posted by: toby928© Cherryh shill at August 23, 2012 05:25 PM (QupBk)

252 trig, speaking of Tim Powers, I read 1/2 of his Stranger Tides book. I sort of gave up because I didn't care. It was okay, I just didn't super-care. I guess I need to finish that. I liked the idea of it. But then... like I said, it wasn't bad. But for whatever reason I stopped (and by the 1/2 way point I usually finish).

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 05:25 PM (fxHyG)

253 Stumbled upon a trailer for a big-budget crime flick, "Killing Them Softly," that will be released this October. Noticed it was based on a George Higgins book, "Cogan's Trade," and bought a copy. Thumbs down, I'm afraid. I loved "The Friends of Eddie Coyle" (the Higgins book, not the so-so film), but "Cogan" was pretty flat and tired. I am thinking the screenwriter must have done a major overhaul to convert this into a story sexy enough to attract Brad Pitt, as there is not a lot of obvious excitement or drama on its pages, other than very familiar crime fiction moves. I recently finished a trio of books by George Pelecanos (of The Wire fame), the Derek Strange-Terry Quinn trilogy: Right as Rain; Hell to Pay; and Soul Circus. Really good stuff, thoroughly enjoyable. I've read about a dozen by Pelecanos. His stuff is uneven, but when he's on he is damn good. These three are consistently good. Moron caveat: P's lib tendencies intrude *a bit* in each of the books, but for the most part not to the point of annoyance. One place where they did become annoying is a police officer shooting that is a major part of the backstory in Right as Rain. [italics test]

Posted by: John at August 23, 2012 05:25 PM (9196u)

254 241 Do you like hard sci-fi or fantasyish better? I'm partial to the sciency stuff stuff set in the Earth Company War period. The aforementioned Chanur Series, Heavy Time, Rimrunner, Downbelow Station, Pell, and Cyteen. Cyteen could easily be made into a great movie. 40,000 in Gehenna is a bit lame. I def lean way more toward fantasy Posted by: Rand al'Thor at August 23, 2012 09:10 PM (GEICT) Off sock

Posted by: BCochran1981 at August 23, 2012 05:26 PM (GEICT)

255 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Morgaine_Stories

Posted by: toby928© Cherryh shill at August 23, 2012 05:26 PM (QupBk)

256 a cute-ish book I *also* put down, but seems okay, is called "The Throne of the Crescent Moon." It's fantasy, but rather than being European, it's set in an Arabian type setting. Seems cute enough. I didn't mind it. Didn't really hook me though I guess.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 05:27 PM (fxHyG)

257 Posted by: Trimegistus at August 23, 2012 09:15 PM (mkv9V) Tim Powers is awesome. I like Kage Baker as well, though I haven't read much of her stuff, what I have, I liked. I've tried reading Gene Wolfe, but only made it through the first two in the Book of the new Sun series. I couldn't even finish "the Knight". ugh.

Posted by: Nynaeve at August 23, 2012 05:27 PM (9MyQd)

258

 I feel sorry for the Martin readers. I have no confidence that that will ever end in a good resolution type way.

 

If the feds ever get a good look a that guy's hard drive, it's over.

Posted by: Sansa Stark at August 23, 2012 05:28 PM (9tluB)

259 If you're interested in a new take on zombie apocalypses, try Cities of the Dead by William Young. Twenty interconnected stories featuring twenty different POVs and twenty different points-in-time. Written in a literary style.

Posted by: prismatic_ghost at August 23, 2012 05:28 PM (pDRpv)

260 The thing I like about Cherryh is that she doesn't change humans very much. Even the Science is not that amazing. She sort of just posited some advance, like star-jumps through hyperspace, and then let human nature take it's course. Of course, the aliens one encounters have a completely different view of things.

Posted by: toby928© Cherryh shill at August 23, 2012 05:29 PM (QupBk)

261 one book that's really fun, which you've probably read, is The Crying of Lot 49. If not, check it out. Not only is it great, but you can cross Pynchon off your list (and this is a short, zippy Pynchon book) and you can also cross The Illuminatus Trilogy off your list, because it's about an oddball conspiracy. So, by reading one 230 page book, you cross off thousands and thousands of other pages.

Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 05:30 PM (fxHyG)

262 off sock. Thanks toby, I'll try those.

Posted by: elizabethe at August 23, 2012 05:30 PM (9MyQd)

263 Fox News new poll goes from RV D+9 to LV D+4, and puts Romney up one over SCOAMF.

Posted by: nickless at August 23, 2012 05:34 PM (MMC8r)

264 Oh, for those who dislike the Forever War, yes it was the anti-Starship Troopers. Also know that Haldaman was pacifist (a faiied one in his words) and fought in Vietnam. With that information reread the book. It makes a lot of sense.

Posted by: Thorisin at August 23, 2012 05:34 PM (xMq47)

265 Yeah, Forever War is pretty openly a liberal push-back on Starship Troopers, which lefty writers apparently found both maddening and influential enough to try to counter.

Adam:  I stuck with Wheel of Time, and I'm really liking the ghostwritten/outlined books from after Robert Jordan kicked it.  I think Jordan just really needed a co-author or a stronger editor to make him focus on the main plot and characters. 

I think he wouldn't have even lost anything in the end.  He could have (theoretically, except for dying) revisited the side plots and characters later, and the tighter writing on the main arc would have kept some goodwill for those.

I tried reading David Drake's complete Hammer's Slammers recently and had to give it up.  Its well written, but maddening.  The "heroes" go around killing absolute innocents (literally, infants, women and children) at least every other story, maybe every two of three, and the only nod to morality is some of their opponents are even worse.  Its like they're everything the democrats ever accused US soldiers of being, but somehow its taken as pro-soldier because Drake was in Viet Nam and writes about war more skillfully than a civilian.

Posted by: Dave R at August 23, 2012 05:36 PM (ttZkD)

266 Posted by: ace at August 23, 2012 09:30 PM (fxHyG) Damn, I didn't even know pynchon was supposed to be ON my list.

Posted by: elizabethe at August 23, 2012 05:38 PM (9MyQd)

267 Biography and history - that's where it's at. I just finished 1776 (again) and Catherine; Portrait of a Woman (Catherine the Great) Plot spoiler: Catherine hired John Paul Jones (yes the 'have not begun to fight' Jones) to fight the muzzies. He kicked Ottoman ass.

Posted by: Jade Sea at August 23, 2012 05:47 PM (ki40s)

268 The Forever War is Haldeman's best novel -- it's all downhill from there. Definitely his catharsis after returning from Vietnam. Posted by: joncelli at August 23, 2012 08:00 PM (CWlPF) I agree it is by far his best, but "Buying Time" and "Tool of the Trade" are better than most others can pen (despite TooT's wishcasting lefty ending).

Posted by: hindmost at August 23, 2012 05:47 PM (ZWODX)

269 The Forever War was a decent read. I'd heard it to be some huge sci-fi classic but I didn't get that. The Count of Monte Christo. Yeah, its a trudge. I liked it just because I like reading classical lit every now and then but if you're not into such a huge read, all of the movie versions I've seen are pretty decent though the Richard Chamberlain late 70's made-for-tv version is the closest to the narrative. @2: Yeah, I've been reading the WoT novels since 1990. I'd heard the last novel publishing got pushed back - again - to sometime next spring or early summer. Currently reading Liberal Fascism again, A Song of Fire and Ice (Game of Thrones, Book 1) and Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix.

Posted by: catmman at August 23, 2012 05:48 PM (C8XlI)

270 I hate my lack of ability with the i

Posted by: hindmost at August 23, 2012 05:48 PM (ZWODX)

271 Moby Dick has kicked my ass the couple of times I tried to read it and I'm not inclined to try again. But I am intrigued by it, specifically this notion: "Melville's entire artistic contrivance in Moby Dick is his own esoteric and cabalistic commentary on God. All talk of whales (Moby Dick, above all) is God-talk." (source: http://goo.gl/OyX0U)

Posted by: John at August 23, 2012 05:49 PM (9196u)

272

I just finished Richard Miniter's book about Obama, "Leading From Behind" today.

 

Wooooooow.

 

Basically they knew for over a year where Bin Laden was. SCOAMF hemmed and hawed around until Wikileaks leaked the name of the courier they'd captured who'd led them to Bin Laden's location and they were pretty much forced to act. Stunning, stunning stuff. Just as well-researched and sourced as anything Miniter's done in the past. The Fast and Furious chapter is pretty damning as well.

Posted by: Emile Antoon Khadaji at August 23, 2012 05:50 PM (rKvZm)

273 >>>263 one book that's really fun, which you've probably read, is The Crying of Lot 49. Did they every try to adapt that to the screen? I also like V for some reason.

Posted by: Redd at August 23, 2012 05:50 PM (w062R)

274 Are we talking about the fucking Forever War here still? That book blows so hard. I thought Starship Troopers blew after a good 2/3rds of the book was a middling description of hierarchical politics and an incredibly rote retelling of the making of an Army officer, but the Forever War is the Vietnam-era counterculture backlash to Starship Troopers. Basically it strives to undermine every good and true attribute that Heinlein wanted to print. And the counterculture bullshit is strong with this one. Female troopers are mandated to put out like futuristic soda sex fountains? Yeah fucking right. Shame on Joe Hadleman or Haldeman or whatever his name is.

Posted by: Yoshi, Aggrieved Victim of the White Man at August 23, 2012 05:52 PM (csi6Y)

275 Any AoSHQ Morons will enjoy The Last Centurion by John Ringo. The link is to a free copy of the book that is actually legal: Baen from time to time releases CDs that have the license "you can give away copies of this CD but you can't sell them", and the link is to a web site hosting images of all the Baen CDs. The Last Centurion is a near-future novel that assumes the USA has to go to war against Iran. The President of the USA, "President Warrick", is a thinly-disguised Hilary Clinton. Then a pandemic hits and drastically thins out the population, and President Warrick makes things worse by making truly bad decisions. The narrator/protagonist ends up in charge of a small group way out on a limb by themselves, and the adventures are epic. It's free, and again I say Morons are guaranteed to like it. You can download in all major ebook formats, or just read HTML. What are you waiting for? Go read it!

Posted by: mr_jack at August 23, 2012 05:57 PM (TMG3G)

276 >>>267 Yeah, Forever War is pretty openly a liberal push-back on Starship Troopers, which lefty writers apparently found both maddening and influential enough to try to counter. exactly, and another thing, it somehow managed to be more boring than Starship Troopers. Now when you consider the only "bug hunting" action in the entirety of Starship Troopers occurs offscreen while the nubby protagonist is out fucking cold on his duff, this is no mean accomplishment. I used to like the idea of military sci-fi. But if the two greatest classics are those books, well, it just confirms what I've always feared. Which is that military fiction writers only know how to bloviate about the burdens and politics of command and nothing about actually fighting in a war.

Posted by: Yoshi, Aggrieved Victim of the White Man at August 23, 2012 05:58 PM (csi6Y)

277 Someday I will figure out how to make links that work in the comments section of this web site. The promised link to the free edition of the book: bit.ly/kLXu5o

Posted by: mr_jack at August 23, 2012 05:58 PM (TMG3G)

278 278 : Yoshi, Aggrieved Victim of the White Man, I suggest you try reading Jerry Pournelle's books about Falkenberg's Legion. The original classic is _The Mercenary_, but _West of Honor_ is available in the Baen Free Library (i.e. it's free to download or read online). http://www.baenebooks.com/p-577-west-of-honor.aspx

Posted by: mr_jack at August 23, 2012 06:01 PM (TMG3G)

279 Thanks. I'll try to get that on my Kindle. I did pick up Old Man's War as well, and hopefully that will be more interesting.

Posted by: Yoshi, Aggrieved Victim of the White Man at August 23, 2012 06:04 PM (csi6Y)

280 For Vance, I'd recommend the Demon Princes books, particularly the fourth one.

Araminta Station is excellent; the rest of its series blows. A nicely done portrait of California-style politics on an alien world. Any novel with villains known as the Life, Peace, & Freedom party* is a winner in my book.

* The name might be a little off, but yeah, evil social-justice fanatics/environmentalists.

Posted by: Bobby Shandy at August 23, 2012 06:21 PM (b1iOR)

281

Yoshi, Also try the Sten series by Alan Cole and Chris Bunch. Bunch was a Vietnam vet as well. It is NOT a lefty book

 

Posted by: Thorisin at August 23, 2012 06:21 PM (xMq47)

282 Personal Memoirs of U.S. Grant Free online at http://www.bartleby.com/1011/

Posted by: toby928© Cherryh shill at August 23, 2012 06:21 PM (QupBk)

283 @175: O'Brien's books in the Aubrey/Maturin series are excellent.  I had read the first two, and then took the next fourteen with me on vacation back in 1995.  Read in the jacuzzi, read by the pool, read at the beach, read at cocktail hour.  Finished 'em all, plus a few others.  Best.  Vacation.  Ever.  My recollection is that the movie Master and Commander was actually a mish-mash of the plots of a couple of the earlier books...I seem to remember those being Desolation Island and The Far Side of the World.

Posted by: TH at August 23, 2012 06:22 PM (1EJIj)

284 A bit late to the game, but I like Jack Vance and would recommend: "The Dying Earth", (1950) A handful of related stories set in the far future, (as in millions of years), involving magic and science. Put Vance on the map. "Big Planet", (1957) A 'stuck behind enemy lines, and gotta get to friendly territory' novel. A space crashes on a big planet, far from friendly territory. Gotta deal with various strange folks, friendly, neutral, and hostile. Added bonus, contemporary with Vance is Poul Anderson. Lot to like but I'll mention: "The High Crusade, (1960) Alien spaceship lands in medieval England, locals kill aliens and fly away, thinking to go to Jerusalem and take it back from the Ottomans. Instead they end up on the aliens' home world.

Posted by: jbarntt at August 23, 2012 06:43 PM (UNFot)

285

Forever War is older then most of you seem to realize.  It was originally three novells published in Analaog Magazine.  Spaced over about 2 years.

 

Posted by: Mycroft at August 23, 2012 07:53 PM (qDICb)

286 Military Sci-Fi = John Ringo

Posted by: hindmost at August 23, 2012 07:59 PM (ZWODX)

287 Regarding Planet of Adventure, I totally agree about not delivering on the premise. Though the first book, City of the Chasch, was really good as a standalone book. You can get that one for free from Jack Vance's website, jackvance.com (he's still alive and writing, though blind). The Dying Earth and Cugel the Clever (aka Eyes of the Overworld) were books where Vance did Space Opera adventure really right.

Posted by: stonesoupnovelist at August 24, 2012 02:39 AM (8Ikna)

288 Just finished with The Drawing of the Dark by Tim Powers. Awesome fantasy/historical fiction. Just started The Athena Project by Brad Thor. Decent so far.

Posted by: BornLib at August 24, 2012 03:06 AM (zpNwC)

289 Re: not finishing books . . .  I tried three times over several decades to read The Maltese Falcon by Hammett.  Kept getting bored at the same point each time.  Then, after watching the Bogart film version yet another time, I said, "One more shot --!"  and sat down with it.

I enjoyed it this time!  Yes, having the movie in my recent memory made it easier, since Huston, the director, had used so much of Hammett's actual dialog, and changed almost nothing of the plot.  But what I finally "got," when I hadn't before, is Hammett's technique.  At no point does he delve into any character's head, including Sam Spade's.  He only relates what people did and said -- but in such a way that their inner emotional state can be revealed.  It was too sophisticated a technique for me when I was younger.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius at August 24, 2012 04:42 AM (exvgC)

290 An epic encompassing a Nephilim timeline would be awesome. Antediluvian civilization, Solon & Atlantis legends, the building of the Great Pyramid, Enoch, all the way through the ages to include Alexander the Great and his UFO sighting, Columbus and his sighting, Nazi Germany and their pursuit of human hybridization until the present day UFO sightings and abductions. Portray the "aliens" as the fallen angels seeking to claim that they created us and people would have a new angle to consider.

Posted by: i like anchors 2012 at August 24, 2012 04:59 AM (nBE5A)

291

55 It's free till midnight!

Scrambled Hard Boiled was awesome. I bought Cold Pulp Trio but haven't read it yet. Got distracted by dystopian stuff and Reacher type books.

Posted by: i like anchors 2012 at August 24, 2012 05:10 AM (nBE5A)

292 Quick suggestions for the easily-bogged-down...

Jack Vance's best early novel is Big Planet. That will justify much of the hype.

Faulkner's The Bear is where to begin with him. It's a short novel, it's one of the three best written in the 20th century, it's a hunting story, and the hair will literally lift off the back of your neck when the Bear is taken.

Don't read Moby-Dick unless you like the density of genius. Most readers today do not -- see comments about Faulkner -- but, friends, whose fault is that? "I would strike the Sun if it offended me!" 

Any day when you run across a reference to Stars My Destination is a good day.

Posted by: herbork at August 24, 2012 05:17 AM (ZNwHw)

293 Most people don't know this, but Faulkner also wrote some crime/detective stories.  They focus on a lawyer named Gavin Knight who lives and practices in Faulkner's mythical Mississippi county.  The collection is called Knight's Gambit, and they're fascinating and readable short stories.  The first, "An Error in Chemistry," is a good 'un that appeared in the Forties in Ellery Queen's Mystery Magazine.

Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius at August 24, 2012 09:02 AM (exvgC)

294

I'm not sure what version of Monte Cristo you are reading, but years ago the penguin classics release I read was excellent. I don't know if the lesbian plot got more explicit than in that translation, but it was pretty blatant.

Anyway, it sounds like you are still early in the novel. It is indeed long, and can seem like it drags at times but it is certainly worth finishing. I have never felt that most so called classics live up to their reputation but The Count of Monte Cristo most certainly did.

It picks the pace up significantly during the final half of the story as well.

I noticed someone mentioned the anime rendition of it, Gankutsuou. Actually quite a good, much darker and more intense version of the story that is worth watching. Unfortunately the ending falls short(as many anime endings do), though the level of intensity going from episode to episode is just amazing making the destination lackluster but the journey wonderful.

Posted by: John at August 24, 2012 01:24 PM (q/HSz)

295

I finished reading Ulysses last month, took a break by rereading the Chronicles of Narnia, and have started in on War and Peace.  Finished Book 1 of that, so am taking a brief break and reading some Shakespeare (As You Like It).

Haven't read Forever War since high school or college... I might pick it up for a reread at some point.

Posted by: malclave at August 24, 2012 02:14 PM (OCRaO)

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