1 Content! Jess!

2 Most ventures fail. That's different. We didn't do those.

3 Maybe his whole "you didn't do this alone" spiel is simply a reference to crony capitalism. Sure, you paid the kickbacks, but we protected you!

4 And the ones the did do, we don't like to talk about....and neither should you.

5

But, but.....'Risk' is bad.

Emperor Barky is going to save us from that.

 

He calls it Social Darwinism.

Which is also bad...or something.

6 and yet they're winning the argument

7 If other people made those businessmen successful, let's talk to them.

8 It's far more complicated than that of course.  The other thing that those rants tend to forget is the purpose of building roads and such.  We engage in these products to build the infrastructure such that people can take risks and build an economy.  Thus when someone is successful this isn't a reason to say "great now pay for the roads you used in their entirety so we don't have to."  Rather it's a time to say "good gosh this is the reason we built roads so that I could get this awesome thing-a-ma-jig that that dude invented."  Then we need to realize that we benefit from the roads by getting those products.
Heck carry this to it's logical conclusion.  At that point, since I drove to work this morning I owe 100% of my salary to the government?  Because that's where the logic ends!

9 :Laura, I feel your pain.

10 On Fridays we have to write payroll checks - whether we make money that week or not. We respect our workers but while they are cashing their checks and taking the weekend to relax or do whatever they do with their families - we are trying to figure out how to keep everyone employed. It would probably be easier to be the person cashing the paycheck on friday. Presently, we have 70 employees - if we close up what then? Obama is an idiot who never operated anything!

11 I'm having a hassle with the effin commie dopers that run FannieMae concerning my refi. To wit: "Good Morning Mr Took I got your file back from underwriting and it looks like Fannie Mae is having an issue: You currently live in what could be a Water Tower Fall Zone- The appraiser could not verify if the water tower would fall on your home or not- We would be required to have a qualified city inspector make that determination. Please Advise if you already have information on this or if you would like to have a city inspector determine this? " Are there also building fall zones? Aircraft part fall zones? Effin Meteor strikes? I'm within a C-hair of telling them to shove it.

12 >>liberals have a sudden moment of piercing clarity about whose decision to go into risky business it was, and who actually fully owns the failure.

If government had just given them more, they wouldn't have had to put any effort out.

13 They want to say youÂ’ve rolled the dice, and youÂ’ve lost fair and square, and youÂ’re on your own, when you lose. But then they also want to say, you won and that's not fair, so pay us, when you win.

^^^THIS

X 1000

14
This whole "You didnt do that" thing is not even that complicated.

The only way for the SCOAMF to have what the business owners have is to just simply take it.

Which is why he's telling them its not really theirs to begin with.

15

 They want you to hand it over because they believe the public owns part of it? Ok then

 

They may say the public owns it, but they mean that they own it.  When is the last time you were allowed to do whatever you want on 'publicly owned' land?  The public supposedly owns the Naval Petroleum Reserve, Custer National Forest, and the Declaration of Independence.  I think I'll see if I can borrow one or more of those 'publicly owned' items for a few days.

16 Anything that fails is obviously Bush's fault!!!!

17 If *you* build it, *they* will come...


... for "their fair share."

18 Obama's cargo cult belief should be the centerpiece of Romney's campaign ads.

19

Yes..... business's do fail...

 

Exhibit 1:  Security Software Development Company, which I sunk my entire retirment savings into to try to save.... in two instances we were one meeting away from being bought out, with 3-5 Million going to Romeo's bank account... (which is why I kept things going long after I should have pulled the plug in hindsite).

 

Sooo.... retirement gone.... house is gone... and at age 53 credit is shot, and back to square one.... but no debt...

 

Glad I took the gamble.... (and I did this knowingly)... but where were the people Obama says was supposed to be helping me?

20 @5- Risk is awesome, stratego is o.k I guess.

21

Obama's cargo cult belief should be the centerpiece of Romney's campaign ads.

 

 

 

Hey man, I've got some bitchin cargo pants!  They're a big effin deal, man!  When I'm wearing those babies, well let's just say the thin walls in the Biden residence are a rockin'! 

22 The Ukraine is weak.

23 The other thing that those rants tend to forget is the purpose of building roads and such.

In particular, Democrats *really* want people to forget that the Interstate Highway System was originally built as a defense project after Eisenhower was impressed with the wartime advantages the autobahns gave Germany.

24 >>... but where were the people Obama says was supposed to be helping me?

Looking through your paperwork to make sure you've paid all the taxes, fees, permits, etc.

25

The worst part, the portion that leads to irrationally screaming at  a TV screen when mendacious statements by the Prez and Elizabeth Warren that business should crawl before them because they educated their workforce and provide policing ignores that our education system is berefit of trade schooling for those who prefer working with their hands instead of PCs, and that the schools are cattle pens for indoctrination to adhere to progressive utopias rather than learning for the sake of acquiring knowledge.  The businesses must also comply with the sorts of hordes of government officials imposing deadweight regulations that cause Thomas Jefferson and company to rebel against the world's superpower of the 18th century.  How much does it cost the economy to comply with regulations and tax codes?  Enough that it leads to large enough corporated entities to use fascist and crony tactics to fend of private competitors. 

Oblame-ah 2012! We need more Solyndras to show those evil rethuglicans who is boss!

26 Laura, you can rant anytime. Good stuff.

27 This is genius. Every employer who has to lay someone off due to the contracting economy, being unable to assess the risk of operating in the lawless and class-warfare driven Obama bureaucratic landscape, or correctly assessing that paying their "fair share" means they now have to do more with less should tell their unlucky ex-employee that the company didn't do this - government did.

28 Posted by: toby928© at July 17, 2012 12:06 PM (QupBk)

World record right there.  Only 22 comments into the thread before the first Seinfeld reference.  Well done, sir!

29 Yes, they let you own some percentage of the success, and all the failure. They want to win both ways. They want to say youÂ’ve rolled the dice, and youÂ’ve lost fair and square, and youÂ’re on your own, when you lose. But then they also want to say, you won and that's not fair, so pay us, when you win.

Thank you.  I've been saying for years, you want 35% of my profits?  Then how about also take 35% of my backache, ulcer, anxiety disorder?  No, you don't want that? 

I've never understood how liberals are considered compassionate, when really, they're as nasty as they come.

30 Like I said before, our Founders were successful businessmen who created this Government so Obama has it backasswards.

31 I owe every job I've ever had to people who took risks.

I despise people who hate the people who do the actual shit that makes this whole thing fucking run.

Hate them.

32 >> We are told by these geniuses that we are supposed to be building
>> busways and roads and bridges
...and a bridge to the 21^st century.

33 "Most ventures fail."

Yeah, I don't get why the wingnuts are all over me for Solyndra, Beacon Power, Abound Solar, Nevada Geothermal Power, Ener1, A123, SunPower, First Solar, Evergreen Solar, Solar Trust for America, Fisker Automotive, etc.

Business are hard! That's why you need Gubmint to help you.

34 and yet they're winning the argument Everybody wants theirs. They never stop to think where it comes from, though. Not even when it goes away.

35

Hmm, I see Laura is posting a day early.  I thought Hump day was tomorrow...

36 How true LauraW.  I read something somewhere where they said 95% of all new startup small businesses fail during the first year.  And that of the 5% that make it past the first year, 50% of those fail in the second year.


And the only damn thing the government does is make it harder to start one.  Hell the horror stories I have heard from NYC make you want to gasp.  It is a wonder that any survive.  I feel a lot of them that survive do so by paying off the gov through graft and corruption.  That is the Chicago way and Obama wants.


You should have heard Stuart Varney taking it to Obama.  He said those comments were the stupidest thing he had ever said and that he was going to be repeating them endlessly.

37 busways?

38 Electrical genius sock off.

39

Here's the thing....

 

If Barky wants to take credit for Business when it succeeds.

Then he must also take credit for when it.....fails.

 

The truth of it is....that most businesses which manage to succeed, do so in spite of the sabotage of government intervention.

Not because of it.

40 I thought Hump day was tomorrow...

Every day is hump day!

41

Yes... YES!! most Dentures FAIL!! Thats what I've been saying!!111!!

42 Everybody wants theirs. They never stop to think where it comes from, though. That's why I think, contra Reactionary on the earlier thread, that recovery must include pain, lots of pain, so that when we make it to the other side, no one wants to go back.

43 They never stop to think where it comes from, though.

Not even when it goes away.

Speaking of Greece.....

44 Glad I took the gamble.... (and I did this knowingly)... but where were the people Obama says was supposed to be helping me?

----

Oh we were rooting for ya all the way!!!

45 And if people don't believe that businesses some times fail, look at any competitor league to the NFL as Exhibit A. Then again I think only those living in a bubble actually believe that. Like politicians, academics or the bubble boy.

46 Obama thinks the government should be like Paulie Cicero: "Now the guy's got Paulie as a partner. Any problems, he goes to Paulie. Trouble with the bill? He can go to Paulie. Trouble with the cops, deliveries, Tommy, he can call Paulie. But now the guy's gotta come up with Paulie's money every week, no matter what. Business bad? Fuck you, pay me. Oh, you had a fire? Fuck you, pay me. Place got hit by lightning, huh? Fuck you, pay me. "

47 BTW, I love love love this analogy.  It's too easy to imagine a liberal saying something like

"Behold, through the mysterious and little understood magic called 'entrepreneurship,' America has become great!  We are only falling now because we don't have enough Entrepreneurship Temples!  Let us build some!"

48 You gotta admit, Laura "The Hump" W knows malformed progeny when she sees it.

49 Yes... YES!! most Dentures FAIL!! Thats what I've been saying!!111!! Posted by: Louise Slaughter Nice, and obscure. The casual visitor to this site of the lost meme would be perplexed.

50 30 "Like I said before, our Founders were successful businessmen who created this Government so Obama has it backasswards"

The founders were evil rich racists who built this wretched nightmare of a country entirely with slave labor and genocide.

What, did you miss 5th grade history?

51

"Yes, they let you own some percentage of the success, and all the failure. They want to win both ways. They want to say youÂ’ve rolled the dice, and youÂ’ve lost fair and square, and youÂ’re on your own, when you lose. But then they also want to say, you won and that's not fair, so pay us, when you win."

 

If you needed to boil the whole post down, this paragraph would suffice. 

 

Reminds me of my franchisor, who must be run by liberals.  They want to maintain their margins while I have to shrink mine, while I still absorb ALL of the personal financial risk on their behalf and on behalf of the State.  This risk I shoulder  just so happens to have been teetering on the brink crashing and burning and taking my family down with it for over a year now. 

 

Yet I'm told I didn't  get here alone and must sacrifice more as a business owner.

 

Fuck these mother fucking fuckers.

52 The people who build tent cities and beg for money are the ones who made Steve Jobs and the owner of your local Dunkin Donuts successful.

53 You still cling bitterly to the theory of economics.  Those policies have been tried and failed.

54 30 Like I said before, our Founders were successful businessmen who created this Government so Obama has it backasswards. Posted by: polynikes at July 17, 2012 12:07 PM (fdnD9) Like Obama gives a shit, his way of getting richer is growing what made him rich in the first place. Fucking den of thieves this government is, and it forever will be. The left has built a successful safety net of 30% pure moochers/leftist to ensure they will not go away. The rest are either right or in the middle idiots who think that this country can continue to exist w/ a 49% mooch 51% producer environment. They don't think about what will happen when that make/take ratio goes over.

55 >>Yes, they let you own some percentage of the success, and all the failure.

Except for certain classes of home buyers--you don't own your failure to pay your stupid ARM, the government will step in and save you from your stupid mistake*. If you belong to the correct demographic class.

And now student loans.  You borrowed a shit-ton of money to party for six years, but you can't be allowed to feel a pinch in your lifestyle when you try to pay it back with an entry-level salary...the government must step in and save you from your stupid mistake.


* They seem to fail at it more often than they "help" anyone, but that's the progg rhetoric, isn't it? Not reading your mortgage papers, or failing to develop middle-class characteristics of thrift and showing up every day, etc after moving into your middle-class house (THERE'S a primative belief system, that a person can take on the characteristics of the animal it dresses as)? You should feel no effects. 

56 Every successful business owner owes a debt of gratitude to the Peggy Josephs of America.

57 The policies of failure have failed, we must make them work again.

58 I can't imagine the average American reacting well to Obama's comments. Most Americans will hear the president threatening their employer and their job.

59 Warren, Obama, et al. are thieves.  All the rest is just glossing in the margins...

60 I can't say this enough.. and it needs to be hammered home as often as your great points, LauraW.

All the things Warren and Obama mentioned are NOT privided by the federal government.

They are provided by states and mostly by municipalities.

And all of these things - police, firemen, roads, schools - are all funded through property taxes.  And businesses end up paying the lion's share of property taxes!

Many communities work really hard to set up industrial districts to attract businesses just because of the contribution they make to the local tax base!

Whenever Obama and the rest of those libtards socialist want to pick your pockets, they always mention those police and teachers - people/services the feds are not responsible for!

61 Mad children....I like that.

In the absence of roads, schools, and other accouterments the President is so proud of, the American people have still built success. Tell me how the western miner, successful trapper of the Rockies, the frontier rancher and farmer, owed it all to government. Yes when government services provide a resource certainly it is used to advance success. But to pretend the American entrepreneur needs these things to find success is to discount 200 years of history where private entrepreneur built cities to support enterprise. When Virginia City Nevada was in boom was it government that made it happen? Or the Comstock Lode? America since its founding as a colony has always been about realizing the dreams of intrepid and brave entrepreneurs.  Remember WE LEFT ENGLAND BECAUSE KING GEORGE WAS GETTING IN OUR WAY.

62 Why are we even talking about bridges and roads? They are nothing more than a distraction from what Obama really wants our money for: power, handouts to cronies and people who won't work hard or take risks. Obama can't say that's what the money is for, of course. But it doesn't help us to get into the weeds with his distraction and debate the merits of bridges and roads. Nobody cares. This is a debate about collectivism. Let's keep the focus on that because the collectivists have no logical argument. Great rant, BTW.

63

What are these 'idiots' thinking !  They make is sound like the business owner never pays for anything.  'You might have had a good teacher'.  ALL business owners pay property tax on their business which pays for teachers !   'You had to drive on a road to get to your warehouse'.  Everyone (including business people) pay gasoline taxes.  (And if your company has trucks that deliver your product to stores & customers, the paid road taxes.)

All these are strawman arguments.  That is a load of crap !

64 59 I can't imagine the average American reacting well to Obama's comments. Most Americans will hear the president threatening their employer and their job. Posted by: gwelf at July 17, 2012 12:14 PM (nyxv/) Ya, after the fact. DEED I DOOO DAAAAT??? -Urkel fucknut voter...aka moderate.

65 My shovel-ready legacy:  Too big to fail!

66 As Rush pointed out yesterday. The money spent on roads, fire, police and teachers didn't magically appear. The Fed taxed the citizens and used that money to build roads. The Fed cannot create wealth they can only take it. Cluster-fuck jugears cannot understand that.

67 What an insidious and ignorant statement that these liberals make.  There would be entrepreneurs without government - look at any third world country for proof - but there is no government without entrepreneurs.  To suggest that government provides the resources necessary for businesses   to form and prosper   is like suggesting that you use  dividend income to provide the funds for an initial stock investment - there aren't any dividends until you purchase the stock.  There is an answer to the chicken and egg question when it comes to business and government, and business is the correct and only answer.

68 LOL, not all the founders of this country were "successful businessmen".  Sam Adams never succeeded at any buisness.  Paul Revere wasn't that good at business either.  When Thomas Jefferson died he owed so much money that creditors swarmed his estate and probably only got 5 cents on the dollar. (But there are a lot of different things that caused that).


The only one I know of who did well financially was George Washington. He got most of his money from Martha and he made money by making liquor.

69 No no, you don't understand. Prosperous societies have roads and high speed rail; thus, if we build roads and high speed rail, society will be prosperous. QED.

70

@ 18 - Obama's cargo cult belief should be the centerpiece of Romney's ad campaigns.

 

Sure, if 52% of the damned country wasn't so stupid they'd - as the joke in the thread went - confuse cargo CULT with cargo SHORTS.

 

Go channel surfing sometime.  Look at the shows that are out there - the Bad Girls Clubs and the American Idols, the Jersey Shores and the OWN crap - those are the majority of the voters in this country.  If Romney only had to talk to the AoS crowd, it'd be fine.  He's got to talk to the Snooki crowd, though, which is why we're doomed.

71 The only one I know of who did well financially was George Washington. He got most of his money from Martha and he made money by making liquor. And choom!

72 I can't imagine the average American reacting well to Obama's comments. Most Americans will hear the president threatening their employer and their job.

But that's the thing though.  This is basically the same line of attack the Flying Monkey party have been using my whole life.

And yet people still vote for this shit.  Maddening.

73 >>Paul Revere wasn't that good at business either.

He was an artist.  The government should have paid for his food and his birth control so he could have made his art without having to worry about earning money.

74 70 No no, you don't understand. Prosperous societies have roads and high speed rail; thus, if we build roads and high speed rail, society will be prosperous. QED. Posted by: Lefty logic at July 17, 2012 12:17 PM (RD7QR) Thus all of the cities built by the Chinese and are deserted.

75 Down with the Takers! Up with the Makers!

76 Think I'll take my Boss' ML home tonight, Heh..while I'm at it maybe I'll swing by his house and bang his trophy wife as well....Afterall I helped him earn it!!

77 You own your failure.

I own your success.

78

They may say the public owns it, but they mean that they own it.

 

I guess gangs and drug dealers and prostitutes are a success because they got help too.  I mean letÂ’s be clear Mr. President, if an entrepreneur doesnÂ’t do anything without someone being responsible for their success, I guess we canÂ’t get uptight about gang activity.  After all we facilitate it according to your argument.  Except business entrepreneurÂ’s pay taxes, pimps and hoes donÂ’t.

79

The thing that is so disgusting is that Obama and the Democrats are hollowing out the very core of what makes America great.  As they usurp more of our freedom and redistribute more of our wealth, they gin up class warfare and indoctrinate the masses to accept their new norm--shared misery and a complacency towards government intrusion.  Sometimes, I wonder if I still live in America any more.  The things that made us stand out were our freedoms and our independence. 

Under Obama, every day, we are less free, every day Americans are more accepting of being dependent on the government.  I worry about the kids today who are growing up under the thumb of the nanny staters, but they don't know anything different, so it's all normal to them. 

It use to be success was within reach to anyone who worked hard no matter from where they started.  In the future, Horatio Alger stories will not only be non-existent, they won't even be remembered. 

80 The Fed cannot create wealth they can only take it. Cluster-fuck jugears cannot understand that.
---

Bullshit.... I get 450k a year then retire at 200k a year for life... you dumb wingers.

81 JFK- "We can not negotiate with those who say 'what's mine is mine and what's yours is negotiable'"

Obama- All your success are belong to us.

82 Whoops.  Rant off.  Meant also to say - great post, LauraW.  If I weren't married, I'd ask you to marry me, just for that big, luscious, round, firm brain.

83 Doing a quick casual search, anywhere from 30% to 65% of small business startups fail within the first year. I guess those suckers forgot to take advantage of the free roads and utilities that practically guarantee their success. Or they failed to pay off a politico so that they got a gubmint grant.
 
I propose we go to the old Soviet style of commerce, where the waiting list to get a phone exceeded 2 years and getting a Trabant took 8 years. I really like the idea of standing in line for 4 hours to get a loaf of bread.
 
All this choosing shit in the supermarkets just makes my head dizzy anyhow.

84 The main problem with the Obama (and Warren) statements is the apparent degree of disconnect they see regarding the construction of infrastructure. Their statements basically say "hey business owner, you use these things, you never paid a dime for them, and you make mad profits as a result, which you should share". No mention of the taxes, local, state and federal which these businesses pay that helped to build this. Follow yesterday's thread on share of taxes paid by the top 20 percent of income and ask yourself "are those top 20 percent using these resources - roads, water systems - in proportion to the taxes they pay?" This just points out the general level of ignorance of how business works that pervades the soul of the post-DLC schism Democrat Party.

85 I have been looking for the story about an ice cream shop that wanted to open in the Cole Valley neighborhood of San Francisco (a very prosperous and trendy area). It took more that 18 months of waiting while permits were issued, meanwhile the business did nothing but hemorrhage money.

86 We live in a time when people's eyes glaze over when you start talking about the Founders. We'll never be successful politically by taking Glenn Beck's approach to winning over people. It sucks but that's the way it is. We need a new and better way to reach people because people are fucking stupid and lazy. Democrats understand this and they capitalize on it. We, however, do not.

87 "YouÂ’ve got a bunch of algae out there; If we can figure out how to make energy out of that, we'll be doing alright."

You see, while all of you "entrepeneurs" have been working your asses off and whining about hard work and risk, Obama came up with a great idea. Algae is free, it's everywhere. There is no downside, and no rich guy to pay when you get it.

Algae it an example of the great socioeconomic equalizer.

As a matter of fact, here's another idea. Why can't we make Olympic athletes wear uniforms made out of algae? Screw those Chinese. I bet we got more algae than they do. That's what makes America great!

88 83 Whoops. Rant off. Meant also to say - great post, LauraW. If I weren't married, I'd ask you to marry me, just for that big, luscious, round, firm brain. Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at July 17, 2012 12:20 PM (zF6Iw) Brains, BRAINS!

89 Whether I make any profit or not the Federal Gummint receives the soc sec., medicare and income taxes.

Whether I make any profit or not, the state still gets the income and sales taxes.

Whether I make any profit or not, the town still gets the property taxes.

End of story.

90 78 You own your failure. I own your success. Posted by: Government at July 17, 2012 12:20 PM (SwjAj) That sums up this country in a nutshell now, bunch of pansy puss populists that think they can take w/e cause they have the backing of the mob. As the occutards loved chanting, this is what Democracy looks like.

91 Didn't barry say that he could run his whole campaign by himself? "I don't need a Press Sect'y, or Chief Strategists etc..."? Ya, he's a self made man. In his MIND!

92 It took more that 18 months of waiting while permits were issued, meanwhile the business did nothing but hemorrhage money. Like domain squatting, there probably is a niche for a company that gets business permits and then sells them so businesses don't have the wait and uncertainty.

93 One of the things I love about this blog is the writing.  Short punchy paragraphs, and very clear point-making.

Superb job, Laura.

94 I can't imagine the average American reacting well to Obama's comments.
Most Americans will hear the president threatening their employer and
their job.

I think I have to disagree.  Too many Americans will hear Choomer promising to stick it to evil soulless corporations and evil fat racist sexist white men and give them more free stuff.

Shit, I'm working in a wholly-owned subsidiary of and evil soulless corporation, and I hear Obama-worship and snotty comments about wasting money on the "military-industrial complex" (which is our industry) from the young guys.  It's our employer and our industry and our health plan being threatened, but that's cool, because their out-of-work friends got "free[sic] healthcare[sic]".

95 It sucks but that's the way it is. We need a new and better way to reach people because people are fucking stupid and lazy. Democrats understand this and they capitalize on it. We, however, do not. Posted by: soothsayer at July 17, 2012 12:21 PM (9Q7Nu) If Obama is re-elected, no more Patron liquor or Ed Hardy clothing. You'll have to wear clothing from the local Gov't shop.

96 In the never ending battle between the farmer and the locusts, Obama just sided with the locusts.

97 It's.the.roads.bitches.

98 We need a new and better way to reach people because people are fucking stupid and lazy. Shock collars.

99

All the things Warren and Obama mentioned are NOT privided by the federal government.

They are provided by states and mostly by municipalities.

And all of these things - police, firemen, roads, schools - are all funded through property taxes. And businesses end up paying the lion's share of property taxes!

 

 

 

 

Bingo!  Which means that these things were already paid for!!!!  The people who built these things were not lacking in compensation.  The money came from taxpayers, not "The Gubamint"--which has no money on it's own.  The Gubamint doesn't create money, it only spends money. 

100 73 "And yet people still vote for this shit. Maddening."

It's called the triumph of hope over experience.

When they're in power, the GOP goes into its usual act of cozying up to big business, big ag, big pharma, big insurance, and the banksters. Both parties grow the Federal behemoth.

Dismantle the Welfare State? Hell, the GOP loves them some Welfare State, so long as it's their buddies that are getting the welfare.

We need a Tea Party Congress.

101

"Whether I make any profit or not the Federal Gummint receives the soc sec., medicare and income taxes.

Whether I make any profit or not, the state still gets the income and sales taxes.

Whether I make any profit or not, the town still gets the property taxes.

End of story.

 

Posted by: Flashbazzbo, s. e. at July 17, 2012 12:22 PM (i0rVe)"

 

And should you fail to provide the various gubmints their  divine  rightful income, your privilege of doing business will be handily revoked and you could face incarceration.

102 To people who work you say: Take a look at your withholdings. Here's what you're paying for run. To people who do not work you say: The Democrats are fucking you. They are giving you scraps; a mere subsistence. You will never get ahead in life and the Democrats are happy to keep you down and grateful to them.

103 >>In the future, Horatio Alger stories will not only be non-existent, they won't even be remembered.

It'll be illegal to read them to children. They might learn wrong ideas.

104 Take heart; what cannot continue, won't.

105 As the occutards loved chanting, this is what Democracy looks like. Posted by: cajun carrot at July 17, 2012 12:22 PM (UZQM And that's why we live in a representative republic to prevent mob rule, however, the GOP likes to turn turtle when confronted with melanin.

106 This is great laura. Nice job.

107

Posted by: navybrat at July 17, 2012 12:21 PM (+2lbb)

 

Sad story, but they were fucking idiots for starting a business in SF

108 Laura, another thing to consider is possible success ruined by the government. The story of a now successful ice cream parlor in San Francisco that made the rounds a while back is a great example--the regulatory and administrative nightmare the owner went through (which I doubt many people would have stomached) is a horror story of incompetence, obstruction, and laziness by the city. In such an environment, where you are leasing an empty storefront for **years** before you can open the doors, why even bother?

The O line can be turned around: Good for you being successful in spite of other people.

109 Barry: You can only succeed if the government helps you out. Look at the massive success that Solyndra and all of my other "green" companies have been!!

110

"We need a new and better way to reach people because people are fucking stupid and lazy. "

MOAR ROADS!

111 Quit yer whining and pay up, suckas!

112 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable tyrant.

113 Nice post.

So, I plan to ask my liberal friends - if (1) government roads are repsonsible for business success and (2) 90% of all startups fail, does that mean (3) government is a failure?

114 You know why we have roads and bridges and schools and government workers, O Douchetool On High? Because we chose to have them.

115
The Church of AGW is a cargo cult, too.

But you already knew that...

116 sure They want people to hold all the risk and build a prosperous business that they may tax, while they set the rules, the regs, and even to whom may be hired at at how much, and what insurance , unemployment, health, hours , and how much labor can be expected from a Human being, not including if you ask them to do something outside their job crieteria ,  (if they are a mason, don't dare ask them to actually clean up mess)and if you are allowed to fire them when they screw up.

117 In such an environment, where you are leasing an empty storefront for **years** before you can open the doors, why even bother? The Soviet moral to be learned: The first thing you buy for a new business is the bureaucrats. And that's the way the proggers like it.

118 >>>>  Does the public own part of your failure, too?  <<<<

Only if you are a bank or an auto company.  Or a solar company.

119 This all fits, especially when scoamf criticizes capitalism as " you're on your own"... as though it's a bad thing.

120 117 The Church of AGW is a cargo cult, too. But you already knew that... Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars at July 17, 2012 12:29 PM (Wqfrr) Also, The Church or "Every White Man is Racist" is a cult

121 you  get the headaches, they roll in the cash.

122 Excellent.

123 Contestant #1:

I'll take "Bankrupt Obama Green Projects" for $100,000,000,000, Alex.

Contestant #2:

Alex, let's try  "Government Motors Sales Projections" for $30,000,000,000

Contestant #3:

Let's go with "Mr. And Mrs. Obama's Travel Budget" for a $Zillion, Alex

OT:

Jeffrey Lord has a blog post up at the American Spectator titled:

"Romney Campaign Disses Palin:  Throws Party Unity Overboard"

LINK: http://preview.tinyurl.com/7w46gvy

124 Maybe his whole "you didn't do this alone" spiel is simply a reference to crony capitalism

It's Marxism.  http://bit.ly/MDZKNk

125 Nomenklatura: It's not just for Slavs anymore.

126 Think you're hot stuff, LeBron? Some local official sent the contract for your high school gymnasium to one of his cronies.

127 The only problem with the "roads are local" argument is the extent to which Congress through the annual Transportation omnibus has intruded on this space. Congresscritters take pride in psassing that bill because it means real construction in their district, and local pols are happy because it takes some to all of the pressure of having to raise their hand to vote for higher local taxes to pay for these improvements.

128 The ewok awakes.

129 Only mentally unstable people take unnecessary risks.  We should all play it safe and sit in our government provided homes, eating our government provided cheese, drive to our government provided cheese mfg jobs in our government provided electric vehicles.  When our fulling work is done in the gov't cheese factory, we can go home and enjoy our government cheese, free from the stress of pursuing risky ventures, singing songs about der leader, and we can sleep tight knowing that big brother is there to take care of us.

130 We need a new and better way to reach people because people are fucking stupid and lazy. That, or we just need to disabuse ourselves of the notion that you can give the wise and the foolish the same weight and expect it to end in anything but tears.

131 Just preaching to the choir here.  Such an easy concept to understand, I wonder why others don't get it.  Frankly it is common sense.  It would be nice if the concept of risk was discussed anywhere in the main street media - nightly news, today show, anywhere.  But it won't. 

132

I don't know how to import a jpeg pic from one site to another.  Can any of the asssembled morons go over to here and pull the "Poor President Obama" poster?  It fits in very nicely with the whole SCOAMFy mood today.

 

And give a hat tip to the Seraphic Secret blog.

133 Link in name to SF i.c. store story.

134 Fuck.  Linky no worky.  OK, go to www.seraphicpress.com and you'll see what I mean.

135 Great post Laura W.

136 Hmmm. The title sounds familiar... http://ace.mu.nu/archives/296251.php But the content is fresh and groovy!

137 Hardcore Marxists will tell you that "risk" only exists in a capitalist society and therefore isn't a problem once you transition to socialism and Communism. Or that the only type of risk you would face is something like the risk that a natural disaster hits. But the type of risk that comes from competition? Nope.

Yes, they are that detached from reality.

One other thing that bothers me about these claims is that any business which has been dealing with graduates of the public school system has, for years, if not decades, actually needed to spend additional money on training to make up for the failures of the schools. So, not only are they already paying for the education, they are paying again out of their own pocket to hire someone.

Last point is that any successful entrepreneur goes against the grain of society and its norms at the time. So, basically, every entrepreneur could have done just as well without "as much" society as people like Obama want to provide. I always laugh, for example, when the Left claims that if we just provided universal health care like Europe, we'd see a rush of entrepreneurialism as people became freed from the need to hold on to a job just for the health insurance. Yeah, cuz Europe's a freakin' hotbed of entrepreneurialism.

These people are deranged and have no business being involved in government at the Federal level. Let them fuck up their own states and localities (which their lesser brethren at those levels of government are also doing a fine job of).

138 I brought this cargo cult issue up yesterday.

Solyndra is a revealing peek into the belief system of Obama.  He thought that a spectacular building, expensive robots (that sing!), the best office furniture and a horde of well-paid workers in clean white coats equals SUCCESS.  The cargo cult business - make it look successful, and it is successful.  He never understood that (1) you can make any business LOOK successful, for a while, if you dump enough cash into it; or (2) in a truly successful business, the fancy trapping come after years of sweat, creativity and capital infusions, if it comes at all.  Those efforts usually take place in crappy digs with subpar equipment and workers who don't wear cool white coats.

A partner and I built a distributorship that started in my garage. We moved to a tiny industrial park warehouse, then a larger one, then a larger one.  We didn't pay ourselves for the first two years.  We had no singing robots or Aeron chairs.  But by working night and day, driving the trucks myself (and sometimes fixing them myself), personally guaranteeing loans and pouring far more of our own money into it than we ever intended, we built it into something that supported 30 employees with millions in annual sales.  It became attractive enough as a business for a big South American company to buy us out.  (And no, I didn't get rich.) Funny, but I don't remember the government doing anything besides harassing us and drawing on our bank accounts.

Obama has no clue about my story or the millions like it.  He's sucked at the government tit directly or indirectly for his entire miserable life.  And yet, this guy is making policy.

Amazing.

139 This community organizer in chief has spent his life blaming others and preaching envy to the masses. Envy is the mantra of the left.

140

One of the most insulting parts of Liawatha's little dismissal of actual hard work and success was her snotty "You' built a business?  Well good for you."

Really?  "Good for me?"  This is liberal code for "big fucking deal"

 

Well fuck you, you mousy little commie scrunt, lemme see YOU do it if it's so goddamn easy. Put your money where your 1/32 Cherokee bunghole is and let's see how easy it is to build an actual business with a payroll and products.

You and your boyfriend haven't clue one as to how to build a business.  Which is why you actually believe your magical government roads make it happen. You are that fucking stupid.

141

Risk is a big part of it but it isn't the most important point.

The key point is that the statists have it EXACTLY wrong.  Government SUPRESSES wealth for everybody but the government criminals themselves.

Until 1776 there was no economic freedom.  The govrnment controlled everything.  And there had been virtually no improvements in lifestyles for THOUSANDS OF YEARS.  Rich people used horses in -1000 BC and they still did.  You shit outdoors in -1000 BC and they still did in 1775.  You sent letters the same way, ate the same food, tilled the ground the same way, ad infinitum.

Since then, it's obvious, and it's because government was put on a leash, not the other way around.  I'm talking rocket ships, iphones, miracle drugs and tons more; but perhaps the greatest thing is that people now live to 90 instead of 45.

The clown-prince idiot obama's argument, as always, is EXACTLY wrong.

But of course, they know that.  They just want to gt back the same absolute power kings had in 1775.  That's what it's all about.

The rest of us?

Hovels...just like in 1775.

142 Barry: You cannot be successful on your own. If it weren't for my typical white people grandparents, being an affirmative action student and Billy Ayers writing my books I would still be in the choom van

143 Relying on liberals to fix the economy is like relying on a thief to fix your car. Oh, he may know a few things about the internal combustion engine, and he can certainly spout off all the buzzwords. But at the end of the day, you're going to wind up broke with a car that still doesn't run. Great post, Laura.

144 Only a blogger can pull the actual picture.  The rest of us have to use links:


Poor Ovomit

http://is.gd/7p8u3g

145

Most liberals don't even know what the term 'Cargo Cult' means.

 

The best way to illustrate what Barky said....is to use the 'classroom analogy'.

 

Classroom Analogy:

Teacher anounces to the class....

"Those of you who have earned an 'A' on your papers, will now be given a 'C'.

This is so that the students who received a 'D' or and 'F'....can be given your extra points, and have a 'C' too."

*The A-students look at each other in outrage and disbelief.*

 

One A-student says...."But I worked hard for that 'A'. I earned it!"

Teacher replies...

"You didn't earn that, it was given to you. So I can take it away!"

 

Another A-student speaks up....."So why should we even work hard? Why should we even try to make an 'A'...if you're just going to take it away?"

 

*The D-students and F-students in the back of the class break out in laughter* 

 

146 One of my favorite stories out of the Old Testament is the narrative of Jacob and Esau. The short version is that Jacob (or at least his mother) understood the long-term benefits of trusting in who God made us to be, and relying on Him for guidance and provision. Esau could only recognize his immediate need -- his hunger -- and gave away his inheritance for a pot of meat. "Surely I will die!" That is the liberal mantra. Feed me today or surely I will die. I do not trust in my abilities, my reason, my humanity that I was born with. I am willing to enslave myself and shed my dignity in exchange for the immediate, sure thing. That's what Obama is peddling. The exchange of our faith for the alleged "sure thing" that government will provide. He despises those who are willing to take a risk because he cannot control them. Entrepreneurs have an almost mystical faith that allow them to risk all they have -- but in the risking of it all, they embrace the freedom that nurtures their fullest potential. I forget who said it - St. Anslem? - "The glory of God is man fully alive." Liberalism perverts that declaration into, "The glory of the state is man fully enslaved." In the story of Jacob and Esau, God despised Esau. It does not say specifically why. But I imagine it is because Esau traded his freedom out of lack of trust. Obama is trying to destroy our trust in our God given abilities -- as exemplified by risk-taking entrepreneurs -- and place our faith in the State. All the State requires is that we surrender our very souls.

147 Posted by: Dave inTexas at July 17, 2012 12:38 PM (pUqSw) +1000

148

"Risk is nearly the whole game. The whole thing, this entire American enterprise, rests on people who are willing to take a risk."

 

And what motivates people to take the required risks?  I think you will find it is their drive to express their creativity, and the joy they find in innovation and discovery.

 

Yeah, that shit is rampant down at the DMV.

149 Nice job, Lauraw.

150 Obama has no clue about my story or the millions like it. He's sucked at the government tit directly or indirectly for his entire miserable life. And yet, this guy is making policy.

Amazing.

Posted by: Cicero at July 17, 2012 12:37 PM (zMouK)

That is exactly what Stuart Varney said this morning/

151

I dunno about all that stuff in the post, but I AM an Elder in the Cargo Shorts Cult.

152 "We have to remove the levers of power from the hands of these mad children."

Better yet, how about we just cut their hands off?  After all, isn't that what our brethren in Saudi Arabia do to thieves, and don't we want to be more multicultural?

153 Isn't one of the implications of the Obama/Warren position that there is basically no excuse for anyone to be poor? I mean, if people who created successful business did so only because they received a great deal of help from the government, and through little effort of their own, what's stopping the rest of us? (I'm not even that right-wing!)

On a very, very trivial level, what Obama said is true, people with successful businesses did take advantage of the already existing infrastructure and political/economic system. But that's a constant. We all live under that, so it explains nothing. It doesn't explain why some people are successful and some aren't. And sure, there is some luck involved, but are you going to legislate "luck"?

And of course, both Obama and Warren ignore just how much government can get in the way of successful businesses being created.

154 I really don't think that "liberalism" as practiced here in the U.S. can be classified as a "cargo cult".   The liberals are not out there building fake relics and praying to their "gods" to make those relics bring in prosperity.


The current cult of liberals in the U.S. is socialism which is well advanced, and more recently, communism which is advancing by leaps and bounds.

155 144

Yes, and these idiots like Obama and Warren probably think they can still live like it's 2012 and all the advances of civilization can be retained. What they fail to realize is that if the masses go back to living in hovels, even the elite will have to go back to living in drafty castles with no air conditioning and riding around on horses instead of in steel-reinforced Cadillacs and dying of TB instead of living to a ripe old age on their fat pensions.

That souped-up 747 called Air Force One Obama loves flying around on so much? Yeah, good luck building and maintaining such a magnificent machine with a bunch of engineers living on gruel without electricity.

Unless liberals have some stock of super robots who will replace every last engineer and be able to build and maintain the accoutrements of modern civilization without the labor of the masses. Which I highly doubt.

I know I used to be a liberal when I was in college, but my brain literally cannot process liberal "logic" without freezing up at the mindboggling stupidity of it.

156 There comes a time when there are enough businesses. Oh and by the way, and uh'uh, they need to uh start uh hiring workers in Amerikkka and stop uh sending uh money thy uh don't need to invest in uh other uh countries.

157 Who is John Galt?

We are getting closer and closer to that Atlas Shrugged moment...

158 On the "luck" part, what that turd fails to grasp is the fact that "luck" is the intersection of preparedness and opportunity.

159 Rush is playing a clip of Sununu bitch slapping Barry around

160 Incidentally, I first heard the phrase "cargo-cult liberalism" in a Joseph Sobran column sometime in the late 80s, back when he hadn't yet gone off the rails.

The phrase has always stuck with me.

161 ...failure is not fatal and success is not permanent......

162 Thanks, guys. Obama has no clue about my story or the millions like it. He's sucked at the government tit directly or indirectly for his entire miserable life. And yet, this guy is making policy. Amazing. One of the things I put in and then pulled from the post was a recurring line about how people shouldn't talk about things they don't understand.

163 Thanks, Vic.  I'm terrible at linkage.  I gave Insty a heads-up on that too, but he gets so many e-mails, I don't know if he'll see it.  Maybe the head Ewok can clue him in.

164 Every parent recognizes this:

When the other parent says "Do you know what your child did?" you can safely assume it isn't good.  But when they say "Do you know what my child did?" it's something good.  Success has a million fathers, and failure is an orphan.

When a business fails due to onerous legislation and regulatory fiat, Obama won't be taking credit for that. 

The only exception to this rule is if the failure is a member of an approved interest group.  Then suddenly failure looks like his son.

165 How many of you remember what was shown immediately after that? I'm speaking, of course, about "Bureaucrat Train" with its unctuous tax collectors, officious rule writers and the hand-cranked press they used to print handbills with each day's new rules set out thereon.


LOL I remember Wagon Train.  But didn't Father Knows Best come up afterwards?

166 Another problem with Obama's argument:

Suppose you own a shipping business.
Yes, your business is enabled by roads and other existing infrastructure, but you don't charge your customers for the roads your company uses.

Your customers -- not you -- are profiting from the roads and other infrastructure.


Airlines don't charge for use of the atmosphere, and Amazon.com doesn't charge for use of the internet (beyond their own ISP costs).

You charge customers for your costs, plus the value added by your employees and your own assets.
You don't charge for public assets (and you can't, because your competitors don't).

167 This reminds me of the old tale where the fleas explain that they not only provide for the dog, they actually created him.

168 Excellent rant, Laura.

169 PJ Orourke described it aptly when describing China's policy of building Potemkin cities (much like Obama's facsism), it's as if King Tut held up the top piece of the pyramid and waited for the slaves to build the pyramid beneath it.

170

Great note Laura. Thanks. What follows from their line of reasoning? if it really isn't your accomplishment then it really isn't your money. It's everybodys money. Act accordingly. I am as lazy as the next guy but I had to get off the dime every now and then. Some sucess followed. The president and Warren preach to those that never did get off the dime. And now that the credit bubble burst they can no longer get that new flat panel TV by extracting equity from their homes. This economy is putting the wood to a lot of hardworking people. However, this crap is a thinly veiled appeal  to slackers that the road will be better if we can just get some money out of those undeserving fat cats. It worked for a time in Europe....

171 Right, their line of thinking implies that business is the parasite not the provider. Another missing element from their configuration is the goods and services that other people gain when they interact with these businesses. Value to the consumer and by extension society, the improvement of their standard of living by being able to purchase goods and services, is never mentioned.

172

I just hope that if we win this cycle (oh please oh please oh please) that our duly elected representatives have the brains to acknowledge the truths this post and the commenters above address. 

 

 

Government is not the wealth creator, but it can be a great facilitator when it eliminates barriers.  The act of building useful roads is an example of eliminating a barrier to commerce.  The main barriers now are high taxes, expensive energy, and irrational regulation.  Our side could reap enormous success by attacking the many barriers to production our business people face. 

 

 

I'm worried, though, that the only thing they'll be able to come up with will be working toward a "balanced budget."  Folly, and waste of time.  Until the economy is put back on track there will never again be a balanced budget.  If they don't get us on the way to expanding REAL energy production, and crack heads in the EPA, and figure out how to rationalize the tax code, they're useless. 

173

This reminds me of a Zombie blogpost about Obama's being a cargo cult.  Goes into the history of what cargo cults are and how they arise.

 

http://www.zombietime.com/zomblog/?p=1649

174 Awesome post LauraW!!!!

175 "Risk is nearly the whole game" and THAT is quantifiable by the capital asset pricing model of all things which, in a nutshell, measures how efficient an investment is i.e. how much risk accompanies return. and guess what, a government bond UNDER pays (risk-adjusted) pretty much any other investment asset. And do you know why? Because human beings OVERPAY for safety (perceived or otherwise). Therefore, those people who take higher than average risk - and starting a business is a huge risk - are the exception. They should be lauded and applauded. Everyone can't and most importantly WON'T do it. Fortune favors the brave The fact that this fundamental truth has to be explained and defended, is 100 percent fucking bullshit!

176 Okay, it's official. I have a girl crush on Laura W.

That is all.

177 Re 148, let's update the grade analogy.

That A-student couldn't have gotten an A without books and especially the teacher.  Therefore, the teacher has a right to redistribute the grades.

/Logic even a liberal can understand.

178

I'm amazed how people are missing this assault on things far mor fundamental, and far more important than, "taking risks." It's an assult on:

 

1) Personal property rights, and

2) Rule of Law

 

Obama, in a less-obvious Joe the Plumber moment, is saying "I know you worked for that stuff you have, and own it, and the law says it belongs to you, but I'm going to come along with this absurd rationalization that it really doesn't belong to you, after all."

 

And it's a pretty lame rationalization, at that. It's like a farmer syaying "You'd be dead if I didn't grow your food, so you should be my slave now." Never mind that the farmer was paid for the food, and that all the rules were laid out ahead of time.

 

I give Obama the Chutzpah Award. He was a card-carrying member of a socialist party, almost every speech is about class warfare and assualts on private property rights, and he sneers at people who call him "socialistic" (while his supporters call such observations "mean spirited" and "racist".

179 Every employer should agree with SCOAMF and fire everyone on their payroll that is sporting an Obama bumper sticker. Let them pay for his idiocy (and their own).

180 #169

Which is a suitably creepy title for big government.

181 Is ENVY a four letter word? By god I believe it is,Imagine that.Which is totally fucktarded as this idiot is in the highest prestege job in the world and he still isnt fucking HAPPY! For christ sake Obama, figure it out and get a god damn life or something.

182 Notice how the Spender-in-Chief will give credit to everything and everyone for a person's success, except, of course, the Creator.

183 Every year childless little old me writes a freaking huge check to the local school district as part of my property tax assessment.  Not only do I fail to receive any benefit from it, but I have to put up with the epic failure of the public school system to actually educate these kids.  Can I get my money back? 

184

@177

 

I checked out your link, and it was well worth the read.  I think I may have seen it before, but had forgotten. Perhaps it explains the source of Obama's cult of personality, too.

 

Some say these things have gone away, but I'd say they have simply waned. Plenty of people are hanging onto the fantasy with both hands, and maybe that explains why Obama is still holding his own in the polls (I've really been wondering about that!).

185 Related: a pet peeve of mine is when the productive, successful entrepreneurs who support charities are spoken of as "GIVING BACK" to a community that didn't give them SQUAT in the first place.

186 Private property rights = Freedom.

This They know.

187

It seems to me like the govt is starting to unravel at the seams:

 

EXEC BRANCH: It started with Obama strong-arming BP into handing over their reparations fund for his goons to manage, when Obama's job is to enforce the law - which said that BP's liability was a fraction of that amount. Then there was the illegal war on Libya, where he consulted the UN, but not Congress. Then the recess appointment, when Congress wasn't in recess. Now there's the 1st Contempt of Congress of any sitting cabinet-level position, as Obama pisses on Congress's oversight authority.

 

LEGIS BRANCH: Senate hasn't passed a budget in 3 years; rolls over for Obama.

 

JUDICIAL BRANCH: Regardless of which way the decision went, the minority and majority opinions for the biggest decision in a generation were written, in large part BY THE SAME GUY. In addition, the court had already abolished private property rights (via Kelo), but now our personal spending decision are not our own either.

 

All this stuff is WAY outside anything America ever called "normal", and it has happened in a very short time.

 

188 ...just perfect. thanks.

189

@189

 

"Amen!!"

 

The phrase "GIVING BACK" implies that something was taken in the first place. It's offensive, and I don't understand why the people doing charity use it themselves. I even see it used in conservative circles. Wake up, people!

 

190 This whole meme sounds just like some "psychologists" I know: Patient gets better: We helped, couldn't have done it without us. Patient commits suicide: their choice.

191 The author is a toad. Both sides are guilty of cronyism. Also, banks get bailouts, as do investment firms. Their failures are pretty much taken care of by the taxpayers. Also, explain how transferring 90% of the country's wealth into the hands of 5% is good for the masses, or the economy for that matter. Certainly a person starting a business must work very hard and risk much. They own the success, initially. As time progresses they don't owe it to the government, they owe it to the employees that actually grow the company through sweat and sacrifice. 

192 Fortune favors the brave

MASSIVE fortune favors the greedy and the criminal.

193 Certainly a person starting a business must work very hard and risk much. They own the success, initially. As time progresses they don't owe it to the government, they owe it to the employees that actually grow the company through sweat and sacrifice. Marvel at this. The concept of Paid in Full is lost on so many people. I like that the face of our common enemy is becoming clear, I dislike that it is the face of people who are nominally my fellow citizens. Or it's AJ Either or.

194 Check out the article about Romney dis-inviting Palin to the Repub convention at AmSpec's blog, http://spectator.org/blog.  Obama's comments are economically illiterate, but he is no fool.  He moved sharply left, and Romney's campaign took it as a green light to move left themselves and sever ties with conservatives. Now whom do you think this will benefit in November?

195

Hey, maybe next January Obama can take over George McGovern's Bed and Breakfast.  Hire Lizzie as a maid.

We can only hope.

196 Excellent rant Laura: Thank you!

197 The Idiot in Chief and his idiot minions never got the memo that "Build it and they will come" was a Hollywood fairy-tale mantra, not a prescription for the real world!

198 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

199 Failure is an integral part of capitalism; it tells businesses what they are doing wrong and shows how the market and society have changed. If it wasn't for failure, the horse and buggy businesses would still be around.

200 In the grocery, 9 out of 10 new products fail within a year (that's from a bit ago but I'd bet that if anything it's even worse now).

201 This is all very silly. Yes the government built roads and bridges and provided (a poor) education and police and fire fighting. But they provided it to evereryone. So the people who have built successful businesses indeed did build them on their own. They had unique skills and aptitudes, a high tolerance for risk, and a unique work ethic. If they didn't do it then why didn't evereryone who had the advantage of these government programs become as successful. If the government programs made them successful, they should have made everyone equally successful. Liberals are actually very shallow and stupid people to believe such illogical tripe.