December 10, 2012
— Ace Bigger than Wisconsin, Mike Flynn says, given that Michigan is the home of the UAW.
This is a big step for worker freedom. No longer will workers be coerced into joining a union. No longer will they be forced to see their earnings go to political causes and goals with which they disagree....
The fight against public sector unions in Wisconsin was important, in large part, because it was the first state to grant public sector unions collective bargaining rights. Michigan, home to the UAW, is almost a founding state for labor unions in this country. It has a higher percentage of unions members than almost any other state. If union power over individual liberty can be rolled back there, it can be rolled back in Ohio or Pennsylvania, where the GOP controls state government, as well.
President Permanent Campaign had something to say about that, of course.
What we shouldn’t be doing is trying to take away your rights to bargain for better wages and working conditions. … These so-called right-to-work laws, they don’t have to do with economics; they have everything to do with politics. What they are really talking about is giving you the right to work for less money. … We don’t want a race to the bottom. We want a race to the top. America’s not gonna’ compete based on low-skill, low-wage, no workers’ rights — that’s not our competitive advantage. … It’s also what allows our workers to then by the products that we make, ’cause they’ve got enough money in their pockets.
Just to note for Joe Scarborough -- this is the sort of winning "intellectual" message in America.
Again, I've got nothing against intellectualism. But I have got something against thoughtless puffery. And the sad fact -- fact -- is that it's not actually intellectual messages that win elections. It's stupid chains of nonsequitors like this.
I think the perfect candidate would be a man generally believed to be smart, who, while on the campaign trail, says lots of stupid things, but says these stupid things with "warmth."
Eh, I'm just being bitter (though I think I'm right). But honestly, Scarborough is just using "intellectual" as a synonym for "liberal," which is the whole problem in the first place.
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Posted by: Dr Spank at December 10, 2012 01:56 PM (b+jI9)
Posted by: not a union worker at December 10, 2012 01:56 PM (mjR67)
Posted by: dick cheese at December 10, 2012 01:58 PM (QupBk)
Posted by: Liberal at December 10, 2012 01:58 PM (a0nis)
Posted by: Jollyroger at December 10, 2012 01:58 PM (t06LC)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 01:59 PM (YUttk)
Posted by: WalrusRex at December 10, 2012 01:59 PM (XUKZU)
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 10, 2012 01:59 PM (XkWWK)
Posted by: kbdabear at December 10, 2012 02:00 PM (wwsoB)
Posted by: Liberal at December 10, 2012 02:00 PM (a0nis)
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 10, 2012 02:01 PM (XkWWK)
Posted by: somebody else, not me at December 10, 2012 02:01 PM (nZvGM)
Posted by: WalrusRex at December 10, 2012 02:01 PM (XUKZU)
Posted by: It WILL Burn at December 10, 2012 02:02 PM (1YIWv)
They are ramping up as we speak. They will descend on Lansing tomorrow.
As was pointed out on H2, some might be protesting in Detroit and Ann Arbor too, because that's where they believe the capital of Michigan is. It is professional protesters we are talking about here.
Posted by: Jay in Ames at December 10, 2012 02:02 PM (i2Lsf)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 02:03 PM (YUttk)
Nominated for Thread Winner.
I truly wonder if the electorate can put two and two together and note the cause-effect. Perhaps, after the inevitable city bankruptcies and civil collapse (see
Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 10, 2012 02:03 PM (eHIJJ)
Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at December 10, 2012 02:03 PM (+lsX1)
Yaknow, they still might be making cars there if they'd done this about 30 years ago. As it is, the Goonions priced themselves out of the market.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at December 10, 2012 02:03 PM (yiIja)
The thing is...'Right To Work' legislation has weathered the legal challenges in other states and become a standing law.
It boils down to the concept of a 'closed shop' being the thing that is unconstitutional and violates people's rights.
Posted by: wheatie at December 10, 2012 02:03 PM (CM59X)
Posted by: JDTAY at December 10, 2012 02:04 PM (a0nis)
Michigan is also poised to be the 1st right to work state with nobody working.
That's really funny.
Posted by: Decaf at December 10, 2012 02:04 PM (f88gl)
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 10, 2012 02:05 PM (XkWWK)
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 02:06 PM (TuW+p)
After Raping and Gutting The American Auto Industry, Union Locusts Move On To Public Sector, Fat Teachers Dues
Posted by: T. Hunter - let it burn at December 10, 2012 02:06 PM (EZl54)
Really? Tell that to the 1%. Then get ready to duck as he tries to cold-cock you, you disingenuous rat.
Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 10, 2012 02:07 PM (eHIJJ)
Posted by: JDTAY at December 10, 2012 02:07 PM (a0nis)
I think the perfect candidate would be a man generally believed to be smart, who, while on the campaign trail, says lots of stupid things, but says these stupid things with "warmth."
Didn't work for Sarah Palin in 2008 why should it work in 2016 for anyone else?
Posted by: Decaf at December 10, 2012 02:09 PM (f88gl)
Fuck you for saying something I agree with.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2012 02:09 PM (GsoHv)
Never surrender to emotional manipulation. Never back down in the face of nonexistent arguments and appeals to sensitivity and feelings. Embrace the cruelty. Meet each demand for submission by amping up the ridicule, jacking up the humiliation, and increasing the pressure of intellectual precision. Drive the Rabbit People out mercilessly whenever they show themselves; rest assured they are actively seeking to do the same to everyone who doesn't submit to their never-ending demands. Force them to expose their total inability to accept contradiction and criticism to everyone. Pull their triggers with all the angst-filled remorse of an ice-cold hitman.
I understand the intrinsically dictatorial nature of the Rabbit People. As I noted at AG, that is precisely why I give sensitivity-driven discourse no respect whatsoever. I don't care if you were raped every day of the year and twice on Mondays by the family cat, after which your father killed you with a knife and danced on your grave. Your personal victimization grants you neither moral authority nor intellectual credibility, much less any form of veto on what others are permitted to think, say, or feel. XXXXXXXXXXX will always be a bastion of heterotopic discourse; it would not be unreasonable to think of it and Alpha Game as the Wild Hunt for Rabbit People.
Posted by: Embrace the Cruelty at December 10, 2012 02:09 PM (ufLRj)
Chrysler was forced to hire those guys back...that got fired for drinking and smoking pot during their lunch breaks.
The UAW doesn't care if people get killed in Jeeps put together by workers who are stoned.
Unions are Anti-Consumer.
Posted by: wheatie at December 10, 2012 02:09 PM (CM59X)
It is only hypocritical when YOU do it!
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 02:10 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 02:10 PM (YUttk)
What we shouldn’t be doing is trying to take away your rights to bargain for better wages and working conditions. … These so-called right-to-work laws, they don’t have to do with economics; they have everything to do with politics. What they are really talking about is giving you the right to work for less money. … We don’t want a race to the bottom. We want a race to the top. America’s not gonna’ compete based on low-skill, low-wage, no workers’ rights — that’s not our competitive advantage. … It’s also what allows our workers to then by the products that we make, ’cause they’ve got enough money in their pockets.
That there's more cubic stoopid in one paragraph than I've seen in quite a while.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at December 10, 2012 02:11 PM (yiIja)
But honestly, Scarborough is just using "intellectual" as a synonym for "liberal," which is the whole problem in the first place.
That's always been the case, eg. David Brooks, Kathleen Parker, Peggy Noonan, David Frum.
Posted by: Decaf at December 10, 2012 02:12 PM (f88gl)
Yup, cause nothing makes you competitive like being overpaid, underworked, and stoned. And you would know.
Posted by: pep at December 10, 2012 02:12 PM (6TB1Z)
See, that's the thing. Abortion is an awful thing, but it will not be going away any time soon. So we need to be rational and accept that fact. If a candidate is fiscally conservative, pro-freedom, for limited government, but thinks that women should "have the right to choose," he will be pilloried by some. And that is just not smart.
If abortion is an issue with you, then work locally, but don't kill every viable candidate who isn't pro-life.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2012 02:13 PM (GsoHv)
Posted by: Fritz at December 10, 2012 02:13 PM (ZA675)
JeffB is back.
I have so missed the SquishyCon drama.
How's President Mitt doing these days , Jeffy?
Posted by: T. Hunter - let it burn at December 10, 2012 02:13 PM (EZl54)
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at December 10, 2012 06:11 PM (yiIja)
Can you imagine being asked to write this stuff in teleprompter format seven days a week!
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 02:13 PM (Cnqmv)
I truly wonder if the electorate can put two and two together and note the cause-effect.
===================================
No. See results, election 2012.
Posted by: USS Diversity at December 10, 2012 02:13 PM (85EaA)
Seriously tho, its the public sector unions that gotta go.
Wait....a new chant....Hey hey ho ho, the public sector unions that gotta go.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 10, 2012 02:14 PM (n/ubI)
"I think the perfect candidate would be a man generally believed to be smart, who, while on the campaign trail, says lots of stupid things, but says these stupid things with "warmth."
Chauncey Gardner to the white courtesey phone, please.
"That's my cue!" - Joe Biden
Posted by: Count de Monet at December 10, 2012 02:15 PM (BAS5M)
Rick Perry -- so far as I can assess -- is a smart guy, and he said a number of stupid things on the primary campaign trail, with plenty of warmth, and the GOP chain-whipped him off the scene.
Just sayin'.
Posted by: RamonAllones at December 10, 2012 02:15 PM (3lLli)
The fact that the UAW drunkards have been rehired was the final straw. I will buy no car from a UAW plant. Period. Sorry, Ford. I know it isn't your fault, but I cannot support these maggots.
Posted by: pep at December 10, 2012 02:15 PM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: I Choose Not To Run---Calvin Coolidge at December 10, 2012 02:16 PM (1YIWv)
He did that all himself.
Perry (my guy by the way) fucked up. There is no way to blame anyone else.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2012 02:16 PM (GsoHv)
Posted by: Pyrocles at December 10, 2012 02:16 PM (j/Uea)
How's President Mitt doing these days , Jeffy?
That's quite a lot of dickishness from a newbie. And your contribution to the election was what exactly?
Posted by: pep at December 10, 2012 02:17 PM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: Quiz1 at December 10, 2012 02:17 PM (cdgHW)
Posted by: JDTAY at December 10, 2012 02:19 PM (a0nis)
On the right-to-life tangent:
Federal judge rules that NC's "Choose Life" vanity plates are unconstitutional. (Drudge) Because ... FU that's why.
Posted by: Count de Monet at December 10, 2012 02:19 PM (BAS5M)
I happen to think that dead babies are pretty dickish, there pep.
But I am willing to learn from JeffB and pep , my veteran SquishyCon betters.
Posted by: T. Hunter - let it burn at December 10, 2012 02:19 PM (EZl54)
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 06:06 PM (TuW+p)
Seriously? Snyder is pro-life with exceptions, not pro-"choice".
Posted by: HenryMalredo at December 10, 2012 02:20 PM (2aiYI)
What a bunch of Santa Claus bullshit. Hey idiot, its either right to work for whatever wages you can command or no job at all.
I still can't believe the USA re-elected that dumbass.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 10, 2012 02:20 PM (n/ubI)
Sadly I suspect union membership in MI won't drop.
The unions will break out the beating chains. Anyone who wants out will have to do it old school style.
This is what this country has become.
I was forced to join a union once while I held part time work at a grocery store. They stole hundreds or thousands of dollars from me while claiming their negotiating got me...well..they never explained what it go me. The fancy healthcare and vacation only kicked in for full timers after 1 year (and part timers after 2, and everyone was part time.) The wage sucked (it was all I could get at the time.) I was making more several years ago at a McDondalds, I ran a staff of 50 at another job I had, but they couldn't do above Minimum wage because that's what the union started people at (so they could pay the old timers crazy amounts of money.) It's kind alike a pyramid scheme.
Then when I quit I think it was like after 18 months of working, I wrote to get my Job card so if I ever needed to come back (needed, not wanted.) I didn't have to pay the initiation fees. Except the union insisted I owed them $50 still (due to some fake month crossover on dues.) I told them to fuck off, it wasn't worht $50 to see if I ever needed to come back. They sent a letter expelling me from the union signed "Faternally yours." I burned it.
Meanwhile I have a cousin, so indoctrinated he doesn't even know what's up. The union gets him a few weeks work every couple of months just so he can stay on the best unemployment scale. Seriously.
Posted by: tsrblke at December 10, 2012 02:21 PM (GaqMa)
Posted by: HenryMalredo at December 10, 2012 06:20 PM (2aiYI)
He's making fun of Levin.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2012 02:21 PM (GsoHv)
Posted by: steevy at December 10, 2012 02:21 PM (9XBK2)
The disingenuous rat again spins. Right-to-Work just means you don't have to join a union but you can if you want. You can still bargain both in a union or outside as an individual.
Yeah, GOP, now might be a good time to unspin SCoaMF's yarn before he turns it to whole cloth the masses are ready to wear.
Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 10, 2012 02:21 PM (eHIJJ)
Posted by: pep
Don't feel at all bad about it.
Ford has and does take gov money in the form of gov 'loans.'
Boooosh signed the Advanced Technology Vehicles Manufacturing Loan Program in 2008, for one. Ford received almost $6 billion for supposed 'green' factory upgrades and fuel economy bullshit.
Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at December 10, 2012 02:22 PM (TtXjG)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 02:22 PM (aLLUm)
One of my (probably futile) hopes is that Demint and Heritage will coordinate some of the messaging so conservative candidates will know how to pivot away form media traps yet still give answers. I hate abortion, and I can't imagine the problems faced by many women carrying an unwanted child.
However, I think that if this nation's citizens all agree that partial birth abortion is the sacred solution to that problem, then this nation is way beyond any hope of redemption.
As a more minor point, if we do agree (and this does seem to be a rational consensus) that abortion in some form will never go away, then I cannot see why I should be taxed to pay for your abortion, and especially why I should be forced to give money (via taxes) to PP to help them give abortions.
It seems that if a few points like this were laid out, at least there would be a rational framework for discussion (but I know we are dealing with liberals).
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 02:22 PM (Cnqmv)
Well, then, that makes you unique and justifies your idiotic behavior, doesn't it. You earn your right to snark around here, boy.
Posted by: pep at December 10, 2012 02:23 PM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 10, 2012 02:23 PM (XkWWK)
Posted by: John Stark Dark at December 10, 2012 02:24 PM (iEtph)
Barky said:
What they are really talking about is giving you the right to work for less money.
Uh....but that's what raising taxes does -- forces you to work for less money.
Posted by: wheatie at December 10, 2012 02:25 PM (CM59X)
But that's my point. It's not going anywhere near the SCOTUS. No national politician in his right mind would touch abortion, except as a campaign point.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2012 02:25 PM (GsoHv)
Posted by: JDTAY at December 10, 2012 02:26 PM (a0nis)
Are you Tab Hunter, the gay movie star?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2012 02:26 PM (GsoHv)
Posted by: wheatie at December 10, 2012 06:25 PM (CM59X)
Isn't that also what enforced union dues collection does as well--make you do the same work for less money?
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 02:26 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 02:27 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: Stephen Price Blair at December 10, 2012 02:27 PM (QF8uk)
I suggest escaping by sneaking out to a Chinese restaurant and ordering a headless duck. And skip the Christmas carols.
Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 10, 2012 02:27 PM (eHIJJ)
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 10, 2012 06:23 PM (XkWWK)
Senator Obama voted for post-birth abortion. Don't you think that should be part of the Democrat Party Platform?
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 02:28 PM (Cnqmv)
You've never met my wife's family....they NEVER shut up.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2012 02:29 PM (GsoHv)
Syrian Rebels Debut The Latest In Cutting-Edge Jihadist Technology: The Sham II Homemade TankÂ…
Check out the controls.
Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at December 10, 2012 02:29 PM (TtXjG)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 02:29 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: ErikW on the damned phone at December 10, 2012 02:29 PM (DuynS)
Posted by: Daybrother at December 10, 2012 02:30 PM (+paCV)
Ford $693.12
Chrysler $699.60
Nationwide Union dues average is $377
Posted by: @PurpAv at December 10, 2012 02:30 PM (cHr8a)
Wait until they gets them some Egyptian M1Abrams' MBTs.
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 02:31 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: Dr Spank at December 10, 2012 02:31 PM (b+jI9)
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 06:28 PM (Cnqmv)
Did you miss their convention? Pretty sure it is.
Posted by: huerfano at December 10, 2012 02:31 PM (bAGA/)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 02:31 PM (YUttk)
Syrian Rebels Debut The Latest In Cutting-Edge Jihadist Technology: The Sham II Homemade TankÂ…
Sam and the Pharoahs calling their lawyers in 3...2...1...
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at December 10, 2012 02:32 PM (yiIja)
Posted by: eureka! at December 10, 2012 02:32 PM (HPRku)
Check out the controls.
They'd be better off chunking Yugo's in a trebuchet.
Posted by: rickb223 Let. It. Burn. at December 10, 2012 02:32 PM (d0Dmj)
Posted by: @PurpAv at December 10, 2012 02:33 PM (cHr8a)
Well, the truth is I was using stoned as an all-purpose sign of intoxication and disability. I'm willing to concede your point, though.
Posted by: pep at December 10, 2012 02:34 PM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: Daybrother at December 10, 2012 02:35 PM (+paCV)
I'm shocked, shocked, I tell you to find out that union goons have been stealing from the workers!
Posted by: Captain Renault at December 10, 2012 02:35 PM (Cnqmv)
Retweeted by Dana Loesch
Gee, almost half of our 57 states have just pissed on Obama.
Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at December 10, 2012 02:36 PM (TtXjG)
http://tinyurl.com/akvgmvr
I'll volunteer to siphon!
Posted by: rickb223 Let. It. Burn. at December 10, 2012 02:36 PM (d0Dmj)
Posted by: Truck Monkey at December 10, 2012 02:36 PM (jucos)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 02:37 PM (aLLUm)
Oh c'mon, this is the way the game of politics is played. Snyder says "oh noes, I don't think it's a good idea to make right-to-work an issue right now" back in 2011 (note that this was in middle of the Wisconsin conflagration) as a way of quieting fire on his flanks as he's trying to manage the 400 other fires burning in Michigan. Then the unions say "fuck you" and try to ram through that amendment to the state Constitution anyway. Now Snyder has a free hand to act 'more in sorrow than in anger', sign the bill, introduce right-to-work, AND still look like the reasonable, good guy. This is brilliant politics on our part, made possible by the fact that Snyder does a really good job of selling himself as a moderate "business first" guy AND by the ineptitude and venality of his opponents.
Seriously, Snyder could veto this shit if he wanted to. It would be easy. He's still taking a big risk in signing it, endangering his reelection. He's doing it because he wants to, and maneuvered into a position where he could get away with it with the least amount of political damage. I doff my cap.
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 02:37 PM (TuW+p)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 02:37 PM (YUttk)
Just sayin'.
Posted by: RamonAllones at December 10, 2012 06:15 PM (3lLli)
Perry exercised bad judgement, undergoing major back surgery and then attempting a grueling national-level primary campaign while under the influence of painkillers. His gaffe-ridden debate performances killed his candidacy, nothing else. No one chain-whipped him anywhere.
Posted by: troyriser at December 10, 2012 02:37 PM (vtiE6)
Posted by: USS Diversity at December 10, 2012 02:38 PM (85EaA)
Posted by: ErikW on the damned phone at December 10, 2012 02:40 PM (DuynS)
Bwaahahahahah!
Syrian Rebels Debut The Latest In Cutting-Edge Jihadist Technology: The Sham II Homemade TankÂ…
Check out the controls.
Posted by: weft cut-loop at December 10, 2012 06:29 PM (TtXjG)
If it's stupid but it works, then it's not stupid.
Of course, that bullet magnet isn't gonna last long once someone starts popping off RPGs at it.
Posted by: IllTemperedCur at December 10, 2012 02:40 PM (TIIx5)
Posted by: Daybrother at December 10, 2012 02:40 PM (+paCV)
90...One thing worse than an "unwanted pregnancy" would seem to be being conceived in an "unwanted mother," the sort of cunt who would murder you just because not murdering you for nine months seems like too much work and isn't what she "really wants" or "feels like"...
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 06:27 PM (aLLUm)
---------
Women don't become pregnant all by themselves.
It takes two.
Where is the disdain for all those men out there who participated in creating those 'unwanted' pregnancies?
Men have it within their power to stop all abortions...
Just keep their sperm to themselves until they are married.
Then, they will have some legal rights to the babies that they sire.
For the record, I am pro-life...and think that abortion is horrible.
But I am getting really sick of seeing women demonized for having abortions, as though they got pregnant all by themselves.
Posted by: wheatie at December 10, 2012 02:41 PM (CM59X)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 02:41 PM (aLLUm)
The left is plenty violent. I imagine most of those justices would like to keep breathing.
The past Breyer and Souter muggings are ample evidence that some segment of society doesn't consider supreme court justices untouchable.
Posted by: @PurpAv at December 10, 2012 02:43 PM (cHr8a)
Well, I hope Snyder did something the dems and libs always do, namely, lie your ass off to get elected in a place that wouldn't otherwise elect you.
We need more repubs like that in blue areas.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 10, 2012 02:44 PM (n/ubI)
No, there's no vast leftwing conspiracy. Why do you ask?
"Schools are closing for the protest in Lansing tomorow. We've got to find a way to get Obama to take Snydley's bridge money. It would really piss the ass off." --- DKos commentor
L. I. B.
Posted by: Count de Monet at December 10, 2012 02:45 PM (BAS5M)
Posted by: Daily Dish at December 10, 2012 02:45 PM (+b3dK)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 02:45 PM (YUttk)
They will end up like my ex-brother-in-law, a life-long member of the UAW, and an alcoholic.
He got caught drinking on the job, so they put him in an area sorting things when he had been drinking. He was allowed to leave the plant and drink at lunch hour. Numerous arrests for DUI, always sprung from jail by a union attorney. Numerous ineffective rehabs which he would leave early, paid for by unions.
He is now in a nursing home, having suffered a brain injury by falling down and hitting his head when drunk. My nephews have to go take him to dinner once per week and listen to him ramble and talk about people who are no longer living, but he has forgotten. He has tremors and cannot walk well.
So this is what the unions did to one guy. They enabled his destroying his life, his marriage, and his relationship with his sons. He will never recover.
If he had been docked pay and told to dry out when he was younger, he might still be working. Nice job, UAW.
Posted by: Miss Marple at December 10, 2012 02:45 PM (GoIUi)
Posted by: Paper at December 10, 2012 02:46 PM (8Zptr)
Posted by: Truck Monkey at December 10, 2012 02:46 PM (jucos)
Posted by: wheatie at December 10, 2012 06:41 PM (CM59X)
I do not intend anything I say to demonize women for having abortions, but I think it is a moral failing if the woman hasn't figured out that she is going to have an a abortion until nine months in, and I think it is an violation of my First Amendment Religious Freedom Rights to force me to pay for any abortion at any time!
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 02:46 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 02:47 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: joeindc44 wonders if anyone has any advice for the GOP at December 10, 2012 02:48 PM (QxSug)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 02:49 PM (YUttk)
Posted by: Paper at December 10, 2012 02:50 PM (8Zptr)
Posted by: The Political Hat at December 10, 2012 02:50 PM (XvHmy)
Just keep their sperm to themselves until they are married.
Then, they will have some legal rights to the babies that they sire.
For the record, I am pro-life...and think that abortion is horrible.
But I am getting really sick of seeing women demonized for having abortions, as though they got pregnant all by themselves.
Posted by: wheatie at December 10, 2012 06:41 PM (CM59X)...........
Wrap or fap. Problem solved
Posted by: simply put at December 10, 2012 02:50 PM (6AJ1R)
Posted by: soothsayer's super ego at December 10, 2012 02:50 PM (XwIUX)
Posted by: Ted K. at December 10, 2012 02:50 PM (WGggC)
Posted by: tsrblke at December 10, 2012 06:21 PM (GaqMa)...
.
.
I was forced to join a union once when I worked for a Company as a Security Guard. We were forced to pay full union dues even when we all got bumped back to part time status, it sucked. We tried to dissolve the union once and go to collective barganing, the lawyers came out in droves, and there were threats in abundance.
Posted by: Johnnyreb at December 10, 2012 02:51 PM (OH5k9)
Posted by: Jean at December 10, 2012 02:52 PM (duqON)
____________
But does he vote straight "D"? That's the only thing that matters to the UAW.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 02:52 PM (HDgX3)
Attempting to rebuild a 77 Trans Am and when I took the carpeting and sound deadener off, I saw painted on the bare floorboard "Vinnie ate here."
Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 10, 2012 02:52 PM (ZOf1l)
Now let's get back to obsessing over uteruses!
Posted by: McAdams at December 10, 2012 02:52 PM (SMxiG)
Posted by: Rick Moranis at December 10, 2012 02:52 PM (XvHmy)
Posted by: Paper at December 10, 2012 02:53 PM (8Zptr)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 02:53 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: Jean at December 10, 2012 06:52 PM (duqON)
We need to respect our friends across the aisle!
Posted by: Karl Rover at December 10, 2012 02:53 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: The Political Hat at December 10, 2012 02:54 PM (XvHmy)
You don't have to hit 'em all at once. Just start to bleed 'em.
Posted by: Iblis at December 10, 2012 02:54 PM (9221z)
Posted by: no good deed at December 10, 2012 02:54 PM (mjR67)
More DKos commentor pearls:
"Great rhetoric from Obama and I'm overjoyed to see it, but it can't stop there. If Dems want to stay relevant, we need a federal law that makes unionizing a basic human right. We need the feds to take this to court as soon as it's passed and signed -- in this case, perhaps trying to use the phony appropriation clause as a lever to throw the whole thing out. At the very least, we need a federal law that separates benefits won by union members from employees who refuse to join the union -- let 'em negotiate by themselves and see where that gets them."
L. I. B.
Posted by: Count de Monet at December 10, 2012 02:56 PM (BAS5M)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 02:56 PM (aLLUm)
Attempting to rebuild a 77 Trans Am and when I took the carpeting and sound deadener off, I saw painted on the bare floorboard "Vinnie ate here."
Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 10, 2012 06:52 PM (ZOf1l)
------------------------
Rolled up in a Coke can in the door were notes in 4 different hands talking about the rich fuckers who buy these cars. My Dad couldn't believe it. There were sandwich and fruit leftovers too.
Posted by: Truck Monkey at December 10, 2012 02:57 PM (jucos)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 06:56 PM (aLLUm)
Technically, I think it is infanticide, but murder will do!
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 02:57 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: steevy at December 10, 2012 02:57 PM (9XBK2)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 02:58 PM (aLLUm)
Women are the, um, gate keepers. They're also the ones murdering the babies (well, ok, hiring professional baby murderers to do the dirty work for them). And their choice in mates is not really my problem or fault.
(Aside from the fact that they tend to be low-IQ imbeciles, and are therefore ruining the gene pool, but we're not allowed to talk about genes. Because Science.)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 06:47 PM (aLLUm)
--------------
Gate keepers?
That's bullshit.
An unwanted pregnancy results from a hard on.
So you're saying that it's the woman's fault for engaging in consentual sex?
And the male partner is just the innocent lamb who was seduced into the wanton debauchery?
Just because a man gets to walk away from a pregnancy that he helped create...doesn't mean he is any less complicit in the murder of that fetus.
Posted by: wheatie at December 10, 2012 02:59 PM (CM59X)
Posted by: joeindc44 wonders if anyone has any advice for the GOP at December 10, 2012 03:00 PM (QxSug)
A key that unlocks every/most locks is called a Master Key.
A lock that unlocks for every/most any key is not valued or honored.
Posted by: Count de Monet at December 10, 2012 03:00 PM (BAS5M)
Posted by: soothsayer's super ego at December 10, 2012 03:00 PM (XwIUX)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:00 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: N.O.W. at December 10, 2012 03:00 PM (XvHmy)
Posted by: joeindc44 wonders if anyone has any advice for the GOP at December 10, 2012 03:00 PM (QxSug)
158 - I know picking on liberal "logic" is like shooting fish in a barrel (with a Bob Costas-approved gun, of course), but are liberals really so dumb that they can't see the stupidity of "a federal law that separates benefits won by union members from employees who refuse to join the union"? The employer will just give the benefits to the non-members out of the goodness of their hearts, and rub the union leaders' noses in it.
I work for a company that makes sure that all of our non-union plants have better benefits than our union facilities. Irritates the shit out of them.
Posted by: Ted K. at December 10, 2012 03:00 PM (WGggC)
We're not obsessing over uteri. We're talking about murder. But whatever... Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney
How many of these murders have politicians like Akin and Santorum saved?
How about we first focus on problems politicians can actually address and make a difference?
Posted by: McAdams at December 10, 2012 03:00 PM (SMxiG)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 06:58 PM (aLLUm)
Details, details!
I think infanticide is a particularly vile category of murder, and those that commit it deserve the lowest levels of Hades, but that is just me.
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 03:00 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: Barack Obama at December 10, 2012 03:01 PM (/YJYi)
Posted by: Paper at December 10, 2012 03:01 PM (8Zptr)
Posted by: soothsayer's super ego at December 10, 2012 03:01 PM (XwIUX)
Posted by: Kang at December 10, 2012 03:02 PM (XvHmy)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:02 PM (aLLUm)
I told this sad story because the unions are not really looking after the workers at all, just whipping them into a frenzy and using them. As far as the bosses are concerned, they are cannon fodder.
Posted by: Miss Marple at December 10, 2012 03:04 PM (GoIUi)
Posted by: wheatie at December 10, 2012 06:59 PM (CM59X)
Gee, I wonder if the impregnated female was aware that the impregnating male could just walk away. leaving her with the responsibility of the "lump of fetal tissue", or did she expect that he would be there for her and the child until death did them part?
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 03:04 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: 98ZJUSMC Waiting for the Sun at December 10, 2012 03:05 PM (MnllE)
At what level? Did we Kill Cristie? Brown? Kirk? Ok there was COD, but CODs problem wan't simply being a solid conservative other than being pro choice either.
So what are you saying. Don't try to make pro-life a plank I expect to see in a Presidential Candidate? If so pound sand.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 03:05 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: steevy at December 10, 2012 03:05 PM (9XBK2)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:06 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: Miss Marple at December 10, 2012 07:04 PM (GoIUi)
------------------
The UAW members are parallel Palestinians.
Posted by: Truck Monkey at December 10, 2012 03:06 PM (jucos)
Last time I looked, this is a smart military blog (hard to believe I know), NOT A POLITICAL CAMPAIGN VENUE.
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 03:06 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: Paper at December 10, 2012 03:06 PM (8Zptr)
That sort of "workman's note" is a time honored tradition going back thousands of years. Anyone who had worked on old houses or antique furniture has seen lots of them.
I've written them on sub flooring, tucked notes inside a wall I had opened up, etc.
Posted by: @PurpAv at December 10, 2012 03:06 PM (cHr8a)
Posted by: joeindc44 wonders if anyone has any advice for the GOP at December 10, 2012 03:06 PM (QxSug)
I'm sure you're a righteous guy, but some aren't.
Anyway i've read mle pills might arrive shortly on the cene g-d willing, I suggest men use them.
Posted by: ette at December 10, 2012 03:07 PM (nqBYe)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:07 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: Paper at December 10, 2012 03:09 PM (8Zptr)
Posted by: Whatev at December 10, 2012 03:09 PM (2t6Gz)
Posted by: Justamom at December 10, 2012 03:10 PM (Sptt8)
Yep, but had the small t-tops that I didn't like. 78 was my favorite year of that style, but couldn't find one.
Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 10, 2012 03:10 PM (ZOf1l)
I am sick and tired of intellectuals because they're so stupid.
Not just bien pensants, not just intellectually incurious, genuinely stupid.
They are manifestly stupid. You don't think you get a Ph.D. in something that ends in studies because you turned down an astrophysics career, do you?
You know what the hot thing is? "Different kinds of intelligence."
Yeah, yeah, keep thinkin' that.
Posted by: AmishDude at December 10, 2012 03:11 PM (T0NGe)
Posted by: Paper at December 10, 2012 03:11 PM (8Zptr)
Unfortunately, I think that the mantle of righteousness can be assumed by many that are not, but that doesn't mean any woman should not have a high level of personal responsibility regarding a potential child.
Even the innocent righteous can get hit by a bus on the way home!
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 03:11 PM (Cnqmv)
Look, you know I'm right, and are mostly wasting my time out of some peculiar sense of "sexual solidarity" (and perhaps personal animus).
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 07:02 PM (aLLUm)
----------
No sir.
I know that you seem to think that you are right.
It takes two to cause a pregnancy.
All I am saying is...that if more men took responsibility for the 'unwanted' pregnancies that they participated in creating, then we would probably have a lot fewer abortions.
There are more men out there who want abortion to be legal, than women.
Yet women are the ones that seem to get blamed.
Posted by: wheatie at December 10, 2012 03:12 PM (CM59X)
Posted by: Whatev at December 10, 2012 03:13 PM (2t6Gz)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:13 PM (aLLUm)
In order to have one, you have to go into labor and partially deliver a child, whereupon it is murdered and then completely delivered, dead.
If you are going to go through the labor and delivery, why not just give the baby up for adoption? Why have it killed?
I do not understand this. It seems to me either revenge on the father ("HAHA I killed your child!") or a psychotic desire to have the baby killed for some twisted reason.
And I am not even going into te types of doctors who would do this.
My uncle, who is a vet, used to get people who were moving and wanted their pets put to sleep, for no reason but convenience. So he would say "Ok," and charge them. Then the pets would come to live on my parents' farm. We had an English bulldog , a Manx cat, and a Springer spaniel (amongst others) who lived out their days in happiness.
I think we should set up partial birth abortion clinics which do the same thing.
Posted by: Miss Marple at December 10, 2012 03:14 PM (GoIUi)
Because the unionistas, already having bled the corpse of the US auto makers , didn't fight very hard for Wisconsin where Scott Walker (R) won a recall election? and subsequently reallocated UAW legal resources to fight for other fatter public sector Union dues-paying targets ?
just guessin..
Posted by: T. Hunter - let it burn at December 10, 2012 03:14 PM (EZl54)
Posted by: Whatev at December 10, 2012 03:14 PM (2t6Gz)
Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at December 10, 2012 03:15 PM (bxiXv)
Here we definitely agree, I think the abortion laws, and easy access to contraceptives are primarily driven by males that want to ensure that they have an easy out and a way to shift responsibility fro potential children!
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 03:15 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:16 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: Paper at December 10, 2012 03:17 PM (8Zptr)
(I agree with that and the final act most often rest on her shoulders) still men, if they have any decency should avail themselvs of the condom so as to not have their sex a thon cause the death of someone that didn't have a choice in the matter.
Even the innocent righteous can get hit by a bus on the way home!
(True)
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 07:11 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: ette at December 10, 2012 03:17 PM (nqBYe)
Posted by: soothsayer's super ego at December 10, 2012 03:17 PM (XwIUX)
Illegals doing sheetrock work do that now too. They just toss their lunch garbage in the walls and rock over it. If there's an empty 6-pack of beer bottles laying there, they rock over it and the wall will have a big lump in it. Dead animals - rock right over them.
They get paid by the sheet, not by the hour. Anything not involved in hanging rock is ignored. If cutting out for an electrical box is inconvenient or they're in a hurry - they rock right over it and there's a lump where the box ishiding underneath. Electricians hate sheetrockers.
Posted by: @PurpAv at December 10, 2012 03:17 PM (cHr8a)
How's President Mitt doing these days , Jeffy?
That's quite a lot of dickishness from a newbie. And your contribution to the election was what exactly? : pep
I've been here longer than most of you.
Hey, JeffB, how's President Mitt?
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 03:19 PM (UaxA0)
piss'd off ette
very very piss'd off ettte.
and today my just ette, I cannot decide if I'm angry or apathetic from moment to moment!
one thing i'm not feeling is willow-isha
Posted by: ette at December 10, 2012 03:19 PM (nqBYe)
This is why I would hope DeMint attempts to create a "strategy" that prevents this sort of thing from happening in an election venue. I hopt to God there aren't any potential conservative candidates commenting here, because if there are, then the country is screwed even worse than I thought, and I am convinced we are in the end times!
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 03:19 PM (Cnqmv)
Tonight's game is Texans (11-1) at Patriots (9-3) .
Probably the best game of the decade...potentially.
Posted by: soothsayer's super ego at December 10, 2012 06:50 PM (XwIUX)
________________
Why we lose and they win.
They call people about Fiscal Cliff issues.
We watch felons throwing a ball around.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 03:20 PM (HDgX3)
Yet women are the ones that seem to get blamed.
According to NRO/Gallup
Men 38% Pro Choice 53% Pro Life
Women 44% Pro Choice 46% Pro Life
Not trying to make a point. Just stick with the facts.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 03:20 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: Justamom at December 10, 2012 03:21 PM (Sptt8)
xxx
Last time I heard, there are more registered Michigan hunters than there are people in the Canadian army. And remember- Michigan elected a Republican house, senate and governor.
/as an aside, also heard that this is in response to the unions trying to shove their way into the Michigan constitution. They lost, and have empowered the right to work types.
Posted by: shibumi at December 10, 2012 03:22 PM (z63Tr)
Posted by: Whatev at December 10, 2012 03:22 PM (2t6Gz)
Gee, I wonder if the impregnated female was aware that the impregnating male could just walk away. leaving her with the responsibility of the "lump of fetal tissue", or did she expect that he would be there for her and the child until death did them part?
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 07:04 PM (Cnqmv)
----------
So you're saying that it's always the 'woman's fault'.
Did the 'impregnating male' warn the female in advance that he was going to be an asshole and walk away from any pregnancy that might result from their having sex?
I doubt it.
That's not something that people talk about in the heat of the moment.
I know first hand, that despite one's best efforts to prevent a pregnancy...one of those little swimmers can get through.
My husband and I had this happen to us, twice.
But we were married and didn't even think about having an abortion...and welcomed those children into our lives.
I can only imagine what a gutwrenching decision it must be for most women who opt for ending a pregnancy.
Or at least...it should be.
Posted by: wheatie at December 10, 2012 03:22 PM (CM59X)
Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 10, 2012 03:23 PM (ZOf1l)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 03:23 PM (YUttk)
Fuck you old man.
[Please....tell me I don't need a smiley face]
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2012 03:24 PM (GsoHv)
Posted by: ErikW on the damned phone at December 10, 2012 03:24 PM (DuynS)
Also, they may be complicit in the pregnancy but that doesn't make them complicit in the abortion. They may not even know about it. And they have no legal rights in the matter.
Yeah, this last part might have more than a little bit to do with teh blame part, wheatie.
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 03:25 PM (UaxA0)
Posted by: ette at December 10, 2012 03:25 PM (nqBYe)
Posted by: Whatev at December 10, 2012 07:22 PM (2t6Gz)
Priorities, comrade, priorities!
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 03:25 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:26 PM (aLLUm)
Think through the unintended consequences....they are pretty shitty.
But it's still a good idea.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2012 03:26 PM (GsoHv)
Posted by: soothsayer's super ego at December 10, 2012 03:26 PM (XwIUX)
What is best in life?
http://tinyurl.com/d2qplz
Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at December 10, 2012 03:27 PM (wR+pz)
Men 38% Pro Choice 53% Pro Life
Women 44% Pro Choice 46% Pro Life
Not trying to make a point. Just stick with the facts.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 07:20 PM (0q2P7)
____________________
Gallup? The same poll that said Romney was leading by 7% a week before the election?
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 03:27 PM (HDgX3)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 07:26 PM (aLLUm)
Mirror, we agree.and to help with that,wear condoms .
Posted by: ette at December 10, 2012 03:27 PM (nqBYe)
Posted by: steevy at December 10, 2012 03:28 PM (9XBK2)
Posted by: ette at December 10, 2012 07:25 PM (nqBYe)
I'm good, had my testes tube-tied back in '97. Still won't stop an STD so I'll just fap, condoms suck.
Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 10, 2012 03:28 PM (ZOf1l)
Or at least...it should be.
Yes, the decision between should I go through 9 months of pregnancy, and then put this baby up for adoption or should I kill it. Going with the latter should make you feel sick.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 03:28 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: dick cheese stirs the pot! at December 10, 2012 03:28 PM (QupBk)
Posted by: Butters at December 10, 2012 03:29 PM (NIZHJ)
Not me, but why does it matter anyway? Is this a dick-measuring contest?
>>>Hey, JeffB, how's President Mitt?
He'd be doing a much better job than the current asshole or any of the losers he ran against in the primary. People who make this attack don't seem to understand what Ace pointed out a couple weeks ago: it's intellectually bankrupt. Posit an alternative that was on offer that would have done better without making us all laugh our asses off, and then you've got the beginning of an argument. Until such point you're making no point at all, just lashing out. I don't regret my support for Romney one iota. (And besides, everyone conscientiously forgets that I was a Pawlenty supporter, then a Perry supporter, long before I got on the Romney boat.)
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 03:29 PM (/COnL)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:29 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: ette at December 10, 2012 07:27 PM (nqBYe)
Civilized men agree with you on that, but there are many uncivilized ones out there that I would not trust to walk my dog, let alone date my daughter.
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 03:29 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: Justamom at December 10, 2012 07:21 PM (Sptt
Think through the unintended consequences....they are pretty shitty.
But it's still a good idea.
It's around, but extrememly rare. Friends did this in a state where prisoners cannot get abortions, so they paid the mom for carrying to term. She openly stated that she would have had an abortion if she could have. It wasn't a rape or anything, and this woman had several other children. Just didn't want this one and couldn't dispose of it because of the state law.
It won't work, even if we tried. Nine months is too long for the FSA whores to wait.
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 03:29 PM (UaxA0)
I could pull other sources if you doubt the accuracy offer your own poll ass.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 03:30 PM (0q2P7)
Anyway i've read mle pills might arrive shortly on the cene g-d willing, I suggest men use them.
Would you trust men simply on their say-so? With condoms you can at least see them.
Posted by: Decaf at December 10, 2012 03:30 PM (f88gl)
vasectomy is great ,or tubal ligations for those that really don't want kids.
Posted by: ette at December 10, 2012 03:30 PM (nqBYe)
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 07:28 PM (0q2P7)
__________________________
What if that baby's father is a rapist? Or an uncle? Or the woman's father? Or the mother is 13 or 14? No biggie right just have the baby. It's only 9 months.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 03:31 PM (HDgX3)
Posted by: Justamom at December 10, 2012 03:31 PM (Sptt8)
Posted by: dick cheese stirs the pot! at December 10, 2012 03:31 PM (QupBk)
I have owned Pontiacs pretty much my whole adult life UNTIL 2009. Now I wouldn't care if all of GM died in a fucking fire.
Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 10, 2012 03:32 PM (ZOf1l)
So what? Mark Levin and true conservatives keep telling me that Gov. Rick Snyder is a RINO squish sellout. Who cares if he's introducing Right-To-Work into the ground zero heartland of unionism? He's pro-choice, so fuck him.
Until such point you're making no point at all, just lashing out.
do tell.
Posted by: T. Hunter - let it burn at December 10, 2012 03:32 PM (EZl54)
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 07:30 PM (0q2P7)
________________
Point is polls are useless. Bunch of people will say I'm pro-life in the abstract. But when it comes to elections, they're obviously not. Just like in the abstract most people want govt to cut spending, until it comes to elections and then the majority wants more spending.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 03:32 PM (HDgX3)
How about this. We lost. So badly we are pretty much giving away the farm. I have a hard time believing any other candidate would have left us in a worse position.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 03:32 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: RWC at December 10, 2012 03:33 PM (sqp6o)
double up isn't a bad idea.
Posted by: ette at December 10, 2012 03:33 PM (nqBYe)
He'd be doing a much better job than the current asshole or any of the losers he ran against in the primary.
I didn't forget he wasn't your first call, and there's little to recommend any of the other losers (saying this as a lukewarm Perryite and then a reluctant Santorumist).
Just don't like seeing the noobs getting pushed around for noobness.
The Free Shit Army was nigh-on unstoppable this time around, but picking the monopoly man didn't help.
I will say that teh idea we can win with a moderate candidate alone was well and truly debunked though.
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 03:33 PM (UaxA0)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:34 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 03:34 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: dick cheese stirs the pot! at December 10, 2012 03:34 PM (QupBk)
Treat it as an intellectual exercise (ACE! Look over here!)
Unrestricted baby buying in the U.S. means lots of well-off couples who want babies will no longer adopt crack babies and Romanian orphans and Chinese girls whose parents simply dumped them, etc. They will pay the middle class white girl from Wisconsin or California to go to term.
So what happens to the other kids?
See? It sucks.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 10, 2012 03:35 PM (GsoHv)
I don't even think that's the issue, so much as it is the fact that the term "pro-life" is being defined very differently by a lot of these respondents than the hardcore anti-abortion types would. A person whose view is "gosh, I don't like abortions, they're horrible, I wouldn't want to have one, but I can see why they should still be legal, perhaps in some limited cases" is almost certainly going to describe himself as "pro-life." But a lot of people here would froth and shriek and say that NO WAY could that person be "pro-life" because "pro-life" to them means no exceptions whatsoever, even for rape or incest or the life of the mother, etc. etc.
In truth, a very small minority of the population would support banning abortion outright, in all cases, with no exceptions. I'm guessing something around 35% as an upper-bound. A MAJORITY would support banning something like partial-birth abortion, however...so hey, let's start there instead of, instead of "rape babies are a gift from God."
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 03:35 PM (/COnL)
Posted by: Clemenza at December 10, 2012 03:35 PM (lewKL)
Posted by: steevy at December 10, 2012 03:35 PM (9XBK2)
Posted by: Paper at December 10, 2012 03:35 PM (8Zptr)
Posted by: Butters at December 10, 2012 03:35 PM (NIZHJ)
Posted by: ette at December 10, 2012 03:35 PM (nqBYe)
Posted by: Butters at December 10, 2012 07:33 PM (NIZHJ)
Please put it all in. No a promise is a promise, no more for you.
Oh, and I won't cum in your mouth, promise.
Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at December 10, 2012 03:36 PM (wR+pz)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 07:31 PM (HDgX3) "
What if you didn't suffer from grotesque ADD and a necessity to parrot Leftist talking points. You want a fucking answer? Fine, here it is: Murder the fucking baby, you fucking fucker. Happy?
_________________
Murder is murder? OK so if someone breaks into your house and you shoot him, off to jail you go. Murder is murder right Mr. Absolute? It's so sad knowing we will never win another election because of Akin type douches like you.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 03:36 PM (HDgX3)
I'm sorry, but that made me laugh. Sign me up for sex with the guy I can't trust to tell me the truth about his use of birth control.
Posted by: no good deed at December 10, 2012 03:36 PM (mjR67)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:36 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: dick cheese stirs the pot! at December 10, 2012 03:36 PM (QupBk)
Posted by: Justamom at December 10, 2012 03:36 PM (Sptt8)
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 07:32 PM (0q2P7)
Not so sure we lost badly enough to give away the farm, rather I attribute that to the stupidity of the House and Senate Republican "leadership", not Romney. Think about what it would have been like if we ran McCain again!
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 03:37 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: Zombie Rodney King at December 10, 2012 03:37 PM (jucos)
That's an asinine statement. People vote for the people they do for a whole number of reasons each issue falls in someone's personal priority. It doesn't invalidate my point that the statement that "more men than women want abortion to be legal" is false.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 03:37 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 07:35 PM (/COnL)
___________________
I agree. And yet 85% of so-cons just don't get this through their thick skulls and we keep ending up with Akins and Mourdocks election after election scaring away women from the GOP by the millions.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 03:38 PM (HDgX3)
Posted by: dick cheese stirs the pot! at December 10, 2012 03:38 PM (QupBk)
There, there, my dear, don't you worry about that "invisible: condom not being sufficient to protect your future!
Posted by: Hrothgar - LIB or SMOD (for the Children) at December 10, 2012 03:39 PM (Cnqmv)
Posted by: runninrebel at December 10, 2012 03:39 PM (je2hI)
Because shut up, that's why. Akin rulz!
Posted by: pep at December 10, 2012 03:39 PM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:40 PM (aLLUm)
Um...your attempt to string these comments together as if they prove something in contrast with one another is a non sequitur. My initial post was making fun of the crazy Mark Levin rants about how Rick Snyder is "just another worthless RINO" (which I have heard while listening to his show on my drive home, and am not simply imagining) when he's actually on the verge of accomplishing a truly historic conservative achievement in Michigan of all places.
Meanwhile, my second comment was about how dumb it is to mock people for favoring Mitt Romney when you can't plausibly identify anyone who would have done a better job. Newsflash: Romney ran ahead of literally every single statewide Republican candidate in every single state in the country, with the sole exception of Scott Brown. That means that it wasn't Romney who was a drag on the GOP, but (sadly) the other way around. And, as Imp points out, it may have been in part for reasons beyond our control (the "Free Shit" voting bloc), but I'm telling you that Todd Akin, Richard Mourdock, and the "War On Women" shit did not help.
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 03:40 PM (/COnL)
Because if they get elected THEY WILL PUSH THE BIG RED ABORTION BUTTON!!!1111!!!!1 BINDERS FULL OF ABORTIONS11!!11!!!!
or something....
Posted by: T. Hunter - let it burn at December 10, 2012 03:40 PM (EZl54)
What if that baby's father is a rapist? Or an uncle? Or the woman's father? Or the mother is 13 or 14? No biggie right just have the baby. It's only 9 months.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo
Listen Honey Boo Boo, when those exceptions become a live issue in electoral politics (meaning such legislation is on the table), how about you address the real travesty here, which is late term abortions and convenience abortions.
There is good reason to advocate against both, and many could speak from experience on one or both topics. Instead of saying Gov. Snyder is "pro-choice" which looks to be dishonest, say he's neither, and explain his position. This "pro-choice" claptrap is bunk of the highest order.
We are not in this position nationally because we have failed to prostrate ourselves on the sacrificial altar of baby-killing. We are in this position because we have not insisted on addressing the issue in terms of the possible. If all candidates said that "when and if the issue of abortion for rapes comes before me, we can discuss the issue. Until then, let's find a reasonable ground for policy decisions", then we'd have the makings of a good alliance.
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 03:40 PM (UaxA0)
Obama's message is a race to the bottom.
Unions kill economics. Just look at everything they touch.
Posted by: Fresh at December 10, 2012 03:41 PM (O7ksG)
Posted by: Paper at December 10, 2012 03:41 PM (8Zptr)
(Not that I'm necessarily accepting your concrete premises.)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 07:36 PM (aLLUm)
_________________
Yes give up on the insane idea that abortion should be banned 100% of the time.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 03:41 PM (HDgX3)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:42 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: steevy at December 10, 2012 03:42 PM (9XBK2)
Posted by: Steve Adams at December 10, 2012 03:43 PM (dXvEN)
Murder is murder? OK so if someone breaks into your house and you shoot him, off to jail you go. Murder is murder right Mr. Absolute?
That little embryonic bastard has a crowbar and a gat, he's going down. Until then, he might not deserve death.
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 03:43 PM (UaxA0)
are a gift from God."
>>>>I agree. And yet 85% of so-cons just don't get this through their thick skulls and we keep ending up with Akins and Mourdocks election after election scaring away women from the GOP by the millions.
NO ONE Started there. They stupidly let themselves get trapped there by the media. Akin had he said that dumb sh*t during the primary would have never have gotten past go. No one here is saying a candidate has to be "0 abortion all cases" to get a vote or support. So stop slaying the straw men.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 03:43 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:43 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 03:44 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 07:38 PM (HDgX3)
Not really trying to jump in to this (I'll just keep the tip in) but the reason we all groaned when Akin stepped on his dick is because we knew deep within the recesses of our minds that the almost majority of the electorate in this country is too stupid to breathe and that they would immediately jump to a conclusion that will never occur in my lifetime. That's my tip and I promise I won't cum.
Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 10, 2012 03:44 PM (ZOf1l)
I'm sorry, but that made me laugh. Sign me up for sex with the guy I can't trust to tell me the truth about his use of birth control.
By the same token, how many men have had sex with girls who said 'of course I'm on the pill' to later find out that it wasn't so?
Posted by: Decaf at December 10, 2012 03:46 PM (f88gl)
I don't get the argument that the FSA is so strong that we have to LIB but that a more conservative candidate would have won. Posted by: Paper
More conservative candidate might have won, might not, but the election makes clear that many Republicans won't go to the polls for anyone else.
McCain got a mil fewer votes than Romney. Obama got 5 million fewer votes. Yet Mr. NE Moderate could not get the numbers out on our side. Unless you appeal to actual conservatives, you're playing a guaranteed losing game with teh squishy middle.
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 03:46 PM (UaxA0)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:46 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 03:46 PM (YUttk)
Whatever replaces the US Federal government will have a new constitution and new laws.
Posted by: @PurpAv at December 10, 2012 03:46 PM (cHr8a)
***
Bullshit!!!! They give me the right as a good, highly skilled employee to get paid what I'm worth instead of basing my wages solely on seniority.
Posted by: Lemmiwinks at December 10, 2012 03:47 PM (SkyIE)
I wish the Akin wing of the GOP would learn a lesson or two from this. You want to have 12 kids? Go for it. Stop imposing your bullshit on the rest of society.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 03:47 PM (HDgX3)
Posted by: Butters at December 10, 2012 03:47 PM (NIZHJ)
A gat is a gun.
Short for Gatling gun, not that anyone had one. Used in mid-90s culture to denote a gangsta's weapon.
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 03:47 PM (UaxA0)
father? Or the mother is 13 or 14? No biggie right just have the baby.
It's only 9 months.
No it is a big deal. A REAL TOUGH LONG BIG DEAL emmotionally wrenching big deal. That lets an innocent person keep their life.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 03:48 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 03:48 PM (YUttk)
QFT
Well, you know the Christian Taliban has already infiltrated West Point.
Next stop - Abortion Banning THEOCRACY!!!
/sarc
Posted by: T. Hunter - let it burn at December 10, 2012 03:48 PM (EZl54)
>>>or something....
Um...you seem to be having difficulty in separating out the logical stupidity of the Democrat/liberal/media demonization of us conservatives with its effectiveness. Newsflash: Ace just wrote a massive post today explaining in great detail about how people by definition are on average not super-bright. And this is an emotional hot-button issue, especially for women. You can deplore that reality all you wish -- but mocking it doesn't suddenly make it less real.
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 03:48 PM (/COnL)
Posted by: Justamom at December 10, 2012 03:48 PM (Sptt8)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:49 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: steevy at December 10, 2012 03:50 PM (9XBK2)
Which suggests the harder the SoCons push absolutism, the more they lose...overwhelmingly so.
Posted by: @PurpAv at December 10, 2012 03:50 PM (cHr8a)
If this jugearred fuckwit wants a class war well next time I'm in the grocery line behind some fat-assed broad and her skinny tatooed up babys daddy (unmarried) of course I think I will video them paying for their pizzas, chips, ice cream and sodas with food stamps. If they say anything, I will say, well , look I am payin for it I just wanna see it before you consume it OK asshole?
Posted by: ConcealedKerry forgit Mitt! at December 10, 2012 03:50 PM (5WWzy)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:50 PM (aLLUm)
I think you're a pretty reasonable guy so don't take this as an attack, but I have to point out that quite a few posters in this thread are actually saying exactly that.
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 03:51 PM (/COnL)
Actually it goes way back.I've seen the term used in 30's gangster movies by no less than Humphrey Bogart.
Posted by: steevy
Hey, learned something new.
The more you know . . .
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 03:51 PM (UaxA0)
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 07:48 PM (0q2P7)
___________________
And what a great life that baby will lead with a 14 year old unwed mother or a rapist for a father.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 10, 2012 03:51 PM (HDgX3)
Posted by: Butters at December 10, 2012 03:53 PM (NIZHJ)
Posted by: Paper at December 10, 2012 03:53 PM (8Zptr)
elections away on guns.
They don't get hounded by the press at every encounter either. Our guys have to be damn near message perfect. Their guys get F*up after F*up. If Feinstein said she wanted to use force and confiscate all guns, it would never see the light of day.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 03:53 PM (0q2P7)
1. abortion
2. a baby-mama welfare queen with 8 children from 5 different fathers?
Posted by: Fritz at December 10, 2012 03:54 PM (ZA675)
Posted by: Lemmiwinks at December 10, 2012 03:54 PM (SkyIE)
Posted by: Butters at December 10, 2012 03:55 PM (NIZHJ)
o one here is saying a candidate has to be "0 abortion all cases" to get a vote or support. So stop slaying the straw men.
I think you're a pretty reasonable guy so don't take this as an attack, but I have to point out that quite a few posters in this thread are actually saying exactly that.
Posted by: Jeff B
Hey jeff, there is a difference between a philosophical/religious belief and what a candidate says.
Even if I believe in no abortions, we are fools if we are publicly goaded into demanding it or advocating it. It's just plumb foolish to advocate, but it's logically justifiable and indeed compelling to believe (since there is no need to delude oneself with rationalizations about viability, personhood, or false science.
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 03:55 PM (UaxA0)
>>>Binders Full of Strawmen!!
Like it or not, that's now a big part of our "brand." I'm as pissed about it as anyone else here (in fact, likely moreso), but you can't wave away the effectiveness of the liberal/MSM effort to brand us like that by repeating "straw man!" at the top of your lungs. Do you have a solid logical point? Yes. Does it matter one fucking bit in terms of how Joe and Janie Moderate are going to continue to think about the GOP, about conservatism, and their relationship to the ultra-socon right? No.
If you can't control the field, or the rules of engagement, the only solution is to play the game better and smarter than the other guy. We gotta be Robert E. Lee here, not Joe Hooker or George McClellan. (And I use that analogy as a diehard Lincoln-lovin' Unionist northerner)
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 03:57 PM (/COnL)
Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 10, 2012 03:57 PM (ZOf1l)
Posted by: phoenixgirl at December 10, 2012 03:57 PM (GVxQo)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 03:57 PM (aLLUm)
Which is more undesirable:
1. abortion
2. a baby-mama welfare queen with 8 children from 5 different fathers?
Posted by: Fritz
Margaret Sanger had a great answer to that question.
So did Eichmann.
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 03:58 PM (UaxA0)
Maybe at birth.
Once grown that's not necessarily true anymore...because we spend huge sums trying to execute the worst of our mistakes, or warehouse them out of polite society for long periods.
Posted by: @PurpAv at December 10, 2012 03:58 PM (cHr8a)
You're done with that statement right there. You have placed a value of a persons right to live based on their projected (not even actual) quality of life. I could go through a litany of adopted children who went on to accomplish great things but that is useless to someone in your mindset. You are progressive; that statement leaves no doubt.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 03:58 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: tasker at December 10, 2012 03:58 PM (r2PLg)
Posted by: Jean at December 10, 2012 03:58 PM (BNuW6)
>>>Hey jeff, there is a difference between a philosophical/religious belief and what a candidate says. Even if I believe in no abortions, we are fools if we are publicly goaded into demanding it or advocating it. It's just plumb foolish to advocate, but it's logically justifiable and indeed compelling to believe (since there is no need to delude oneself with rationalizations about viability, personhood, or false science.
I agree with every single thing you've written here.
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 03:58 PM (/COnL)
Posted by: tasker at December 10, 2012 03:59 PM (r2PLg)
While that may be true if we allow that idea to govern who we allow to live at the outset, we invite absolute inhumanity.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 04:00 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 04:00 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: Fritz at December 10, 2012 04:01 PM (ZA675)
Actually she said just that back when Clinton was in office. I think the quote (paraphrasing a bit) was:
"If it was up to me Mr and Mrs America, you'd have to give them all up".
Posted by: @PurpAv at December 10, 2012 04:02 PM (cHr8a)
Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 10, 2012 04:02 PM (ZOf1l)
I have to say that if Hillary runs I am not sanguine about our chances no matter who we nominate. Not after the demographic (and socio-cultural) shifts we saw in the 2012 election.
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 04:03 PM (/COnL)
Well Jeff, to continue the love fest then, it's right the we have been branded as the Akin wing of the nation, but we don;t have to go ahead an surrender the pro-life fight because of it.
We can advocate for "European style" restrictions for starters. Hell, start small and build on small gains. That was the strategy that got parental notification and partial birth bans in several states.
But "moderates" really can't do that. The have to kowtow to the pro-infanticide lobby for fear of looking like the wide-eyed, spittle-flecked zealots they abhor.
So I disagree about needing "moderate" candidates. We just need SMARTER ones.
Having long been past the age of fairy tales, I have forsaken that hope and now subscribe fully to the LIB camp.
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 04:03 PM (UaxA0)
1. abortion
2. a baby-mama welfare queen with 8 children from 5 different fathers?
My answer to this is the same as my answer to:
Which is more undesirable:
1. Dead two-month olds
2. a baby-mama welfare queen with 8 children from 5 different fathers?
Does yours differ and why?
Posted by: AD at December 10, 2012 04:03 PM (Ysek9)
236 I miss the old Toronadoes and Rivieras.
---------
I was told global warming was going to give us stronger Toronadoes.
Posted by: Citizen Anachronda is very disappointed at December 10, 2012 04:04 PM (NmR1a)
2. a baby-mama welfare queen with 8 children from 5 different fathers?
Posted by: Fritz at December 10, 2012 07:54 PM (ZA675) "
Good point... Fritz.
In the old days we took children from parents who had no hope in supporting them, not subsidized them. False choice. But if you force me to make it, it would be the non baby killing way.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 04:04 PM (0q2P7)
After that, she claimed to have given up the permit and got rid of the pistols.
Posted by: @PurpAv at December 10, 2012 04:04 PM (cHr8a)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 04:04 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 04:05 PM (YUttk)
A Republican that's actually getting shit done instead of pontificating about abstract SoCon nonsense.
I guess he's not a real conservative though like that Santorum who actually voted against right-to-work legislation.
After all, the true test of conservatism is one issue: making a impregnated rape victim give birth!
Posted by: Jeepers at December 10, 2012 04:06 PM (XDRsa)
Fritz, I took your comment to mean that you are in sympatico with those two great progressives.
If not, you might clarify.
Personally, I think they are abhorrent.
Posted by: imp at December 10, 2012 04:06 PM (UaxA0)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 04:07 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: Jean at December 10, 2012 04:08 PM (hjRtO)
Posted by: tasker at December 10, 2012 04:08 PM (r2PLg)
Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at December 10, 2012 04:08 PM (0q2P7)
Precisely. Why do we subsidize irresponsible, habitually bad behavior? Adoption is a wonderful solution, no?
Posted by: Fritz at December 10, 2012 04:08 PM (ZA675)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 04:08 PM (aLLUm)
Posted by: BumperStickerist at December 10, 2012 04:09 PM (RuUvx)
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at December 10, 2012 04:10 PM (aLLUm)
It's a big part of the GOP brand due to the tactical FAILURE of nominal conservatives who insisted on "reaching across the aisle" and compromising on basic IDEALS , rather than on policy.
Instead of firing back with " what has my running for office got to do with the fact that Roe v Wade is the law of the land? Also , what's your stance on gun rights, libtard?" , the party of stupid silently martyred itself to the Honey Boo Boo mob.
I believe that abortion kills innocent life but I don't paint it on the side of my house.
The FSA didn't win just because the GOP is a mob of squishes who for at least 20 years have been unable to clearly explain or defend what it believes or put the lefty enemy on the defensive.
The FSA won because they are too stupid to understand principles or anything beyond eating and excreting.
LiB.
Posted by: T. Hunter - let it burn at December 10, 2012 04:14 PM (EZl54)
Sorry, but I disagree. The left has made abortion all about a *woman's* right to choose what happens with *her* body, and just never mind the child she carelessly created or the man who helped her do it. A man has no rights at all. He doesn't have to notified of the killing of his baby. He can't stop it even if he is sobbing in court and begging for the right to raise his child - this has happened multiple times. Sure, most men in such situations don't care any more than the woman does, but when they *do* they have no recourse.
ps Pentangle is a fed-up woman. Fed up with other women.
Posted by: Pentan at December 10, 2012 04:15 PM (bGDzW)
Posted by: Mr. Me Me at December 10, 2012 04:15 PM (86/8G)
I think the perfect candidate would be a man generally believed to be smart,
I think the perfect candidate would be a man or woman generally believed to be smart,
me too!
Posted by: beach & a kindle at December 10, 2012 04:15 PM (LpQbZ)
Drives 'em nuts as they have no answer; at least none that makes sense. The cartoonist there tried to reconcile the irreconcilable by claiming that workers have "choice" about joining a union or not -- they can "choose" to work somewhere else.
Well, people who demand to be forced to join a union as a condition of employment can just move to Illinois or California or Paraguay or something.
Posted by: Flick's blistered tongue at December 10, 2012 04:16 PM (Xv7f/)
Posted by: Daily Dish at December 10, 2012 04:17 PM (+b3dK)
Not really. Each path has undeniable concrete long and short term monetary and social costs/ramifications involved. Wishing those costs and ramifications weren't there doesn't make them go away.
Chasing deadbeat dads, who are in no position to pay anyway seems inoperative, or at best highly optimistic. As a practical matter, the state is gonna shoulder that in a significant number of instances.
Once the kid has been popped out, someone is gonna have to be responsible and pay for its care for the next 18 years. That is the law.
I have no answer for the monetary cost aspect of putting 800,000 new "entitlement units" into the system each year. I've always hoped there would be some feasible answer offered, but I've never heard it promoted if it does exist.
Posted by: @PurpAv at December 10, 2012 04:18 PM (cHr8a)
Posted by: tasker at December 10, 2012 04:18 PM (r2PLg)
Honest question, do you think the GOP should push the "Akin" position on abortion (no rape exception)?
Posted by: Jeepers at December 10, 2012 04:26 PM (XDRsa)
Strawman though it may be, it IS actually pretty ironic that a number of the same socons who denounce Snyder for insufficient conservatism supported Santorum in the primary. When Snyder's about to sign right-to-work and Santorum, yes, voted against it in the Senate when he had the chance.
You're right that it doesn't prove all that much, however, since it wasn't like these two were running against one another.
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 04:27 PM (/COnL)
#letitburn
#SignUpForEverything
#Howtogetfreestufffromthegovernment
Posted by: Tocquevillian at December 10, 2012 04:31 PM (iuY0Y)
Two grandbabies born 5 months ago at 25 weeks, 1lb 10 oz and 1 lb 9 oz. 83 days in the NICU and $1.2 Million later. Both are normal, healthy, still fragile miracles. Anyone who thinks abortions are not murder should visit a NICU just once. Raw love permeats the air. Parents and Grandparents sitting quietly, praying and pleading with God. It is life changing.
Posted by: Daily Dish at December 10, 2012 04:31 PM (+b3dK)
No, it's a big part of the GOP brand due to the fact that we stupidly allow people like Akin to seize their nominations -- in part because of outside meddling by Democrats -- and then stick around to drag us all down.** (This, FWIW, is why Dana Loesch is basically dead to me for all time: her public and private support was critical in keeping Akin in the race when he was actually about to drop out. And she did it basically because Akin showed up to a couple of her events once upon a time -- thanks, Dana. Don't get me started on Huckabee.)
It has nothing to do with "reaching across the aisle," whatever that even means.
**Note that I'm actually more conflicted about Mourdock -- I disagree with his position, but he actually got jobbed by the media over it...and what fuckin' KILLS me is that in a world where Akin hadn't already weaponized the issue, I don't think he would've lost. Akin really needs a few firm kicks to the nutsack on behalf of conservatives everywhere. And pro-lifers, for that matter.)
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 04:32 PM (/COnL)
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 08:32 PM (/COnL)
Akin got as firm a kick in the nutsack as we could possibly give him.
Huckabee (and everybody else who enabled him) on the other hand...
Posted by: AD at December 10, 2012 04:40 PM (Ysek9)
therefore
JeffB = militant atheist AND militantly pro-abortion!
JeffB logikz winz!
So who are the single issue voters again?
Keep tilting at those windmills , champ.
Posted by: T. Hunter - let it burn at December 10, 2012 04:43 PM (EZl54)
also Akin? lost
Rep. Maxine Waters says vile stupid anti American thing after thing gets elected, re-elected and is next in line on the House Financial Services Committee succeeding cocksucker Barney " my boyfriend runs a homobrothel" Frank
maybe we should be more like them to get MOAR FSA winz!
LiB
Posted by: T. Hunter - let it burn at December 10, 2012 04:51 PM (EZl54)
But, see, I AM pro-life. That's the thing you don't get. I want to see Roe v. Wade repealed. I would oppose going hard in the opposite direction, mind you (i.e. no Constitutional amendment banning abortion, no SCOTUS ruling doing the same, etc.), but that's because I am a legal conservative as well -- a federalist. I truly believe that the only way we'll ever get any social closure on this issue is to let it return to the states.
Do I think there should be exceptions for rape, incest, life-of-the-mother, etc.? Yeah, I guess I do. It's a tough question. I'm not closing my eyes to the inescapable truth that an abortion is an abortion regardless of the reasons behind it, but prudential, emotional, epistemological, and pragmatic considerations all incline me towards favoring those exceptions. (The pragmatic angle is one least appreciated by hardcore anti-abortion folks: this is an issue you can only win one step at a time, by nibbling away at the margins and "shifting the Overton Window," so to speak.)
Does that make me a Planned Parenthood booster? In your eyes, apparently so. To me, that's a problem with your perspective, not mine.
Posted by: Jeff B. at December 10, 2012 04:51 PM (/COnL)
You referred to MANY posters on the thread who would be in favor of a 100% abortion ban.
I think that I might have seen one. I am probably (usually) wrong. Most were reasonable in discussing it but would not be backed down when it became a matter of principle.
My deep red state was a little redder because of the folks I led to the polls for Mitt. I had to bite my tongue in half but I voted for decency.
I no longer care. It's now me and mine and like minded neighbors vs the FSA . Better to let the left wingers explain their hypocritical principles. Their version of "America" simply isn't.
LiB
Posted by: T. Hunter - let it burn at December 10, 2012 05:02 PM (EZl54)
Posted by: pep
I live in Dearborn. I am very aware of what is going on. Please note that Ford is not part of the problem. If you are too stupid to understand that, how about this. Fuck you and any other anti-American commie bastards. FORD is an American company (that did NOT get request Taxpayer Bailout Money) and is on the cutting edge of new car technology. I am not asking you or begging you to buy their products. If you want to buy a Yugo, or whatever foreign car, go ahead. It's your right as an American. And my right as an American is to salute you and any other American haters with this middle finger. Again, in case you are stuck on stupid and cannot read sign language, I will spell it out for you real slow... ready? FUCK YOU.
Posted by: sirsurfalot at December 10, 2012 05:05 PM (U5SmI)
I mean, it's cost us countless elections and we have absolutely nothing to show for it. In fact, it's made America more pro-abortion. the latest surveys have shown a hue shift.
How about that concept, "no exception" pro-lifers have caused more abortions than pro-choice Republicans.
Posted by: Jeepers at December 10, 2012 05:18 PM (XDRsa)
I bought a Toyota built in America and none of the sales price went to a fucking Union.
Fuck you.
Posted by: Portnoy at December 10, 2012 05:21 PM (A5Abh)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 05:33 PM (YUttk)
Posted by: sirsurfalot at December 10, 2012 05:36 PM (U5SmI)
Posted by: Pentan at December 10, 2012 05:40 PM (bGDzW)
Posted by: sirsurfalot at December 10, 2012 06:00 PM (U5SmI)
Can you imagine the take from all of them?
Posted by: PJ at December 10, 2012 06:20 PM (ZWaLo)
Posted by: sirsurfalot at December 10, 2012 06:34 PM (U5SmI)
Posted by: sirsurfalot at December 10, 2012 06:43 PM (U5SmI)
Posted by: entropy at December 10, 2012 06:46 PM (YUttk)
.... I totally agree. If I might be as so bold, if you are so inclined as to volunteer at your local Community Emergency Response Team aka C.E.R.T. it is a great way to learn/train/network with other people who really care and want to help when the SHTF
Posted by: sirsurfalot at December 10, 2012 06:58 PM (U5SmI)
Good job MI!
Posted by: carolina at December 10, 2012 07:02 PM (dmqAl)
Without right to work, you have LESS FREEDOM -- you are mandated to be in a union. ONE choice.
Right to work gives you MORE FREEDOM -- you can choose to be in a union, or you can choose to not be in a union. TWO choices. You can choose to be in the union and spend money on dues in order to get the union to bargain for you, or you can choose to not be in the union and keep the dues money that would have been forcibly extracted from you and keep it in your pocket instead. Either way, no one's taking away your right to bargain -- rather, you're being given a new option: keep more of your paycheck.
Someone MUST hit back against the usual lies spilling out of Obama's mouth.
Posted by: aaa at December 10, 2012 08:34 PM (JFsQc)
Posted by: PJ at December 10, 2012 08:53 PM (ZWaLo)
Once we had union leaders that believed in voluntary associations. Read this comment and imagine whether the speaker would prefer a "closed shop" or "right to work."
“I want to urge devotion to the fundamentals of human liberty – the principles of voluntarism. No lasting gain has ever come from compulsion. If we seek to force, we but tear apart that which, united, is invincible….I want to say to you, men and women of the American labor movement, do not reject the cornerstone upon which labor’s structure has been builded – but base your all upon voluntary principles and illumine your every problem by consecrated devotion to that highest of all purposes – human well being in the fullest, widest, deepest sense.” Samuel Gompers, American Federation of Labor.
Posted by: Michael M. Keohane at December 11, 2012 03:02 AM (UCzBx)
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Posted by: dick cheese at December 10, 2012 01:56 PM (QupBk)