Ace of Spades HQ

October 08, 2012

Monday Morning Open Thread [Ben]
— Open Blogger

Here is some early morning reading for you all.

Cities and states around the country are shoring up battered retirement plans by reducing promised benefits to public workers and retirees. All told, states need $1.4 trillion to fulfill their pension obligations. It's a yawning chasm that threatens to wreck government budgets and prompt tax hikes or deep cuts to education and other programs.

The political and legal fights challenge the clout of public-sector unions and test the venerable idea that while state jobs pay less than private-sector employment, they come with the guarantee of early retirement and generous benefits.

The actions taken by states vary. California limited its annual pension payouts, while Kentucky raised retirement ages and suspended pension increases. Illinois reduced benefits for new employees and cut back on automatic pension increases. New Jersey last year increased employee retirement.

Posted by: Open Blogger at 04:22 AM | Comments (223)
Post contains 148 words, total size 1 kb.

1 Ah...someone finally fed the squirrel!

Posted by: Tami at October 08, 2012 04:38 AM (X6akg)

2 Gov. Brown takes emergency action to try to reduce gas prices ----- Shouldn't that read "Democrats hate the environment"?

Posted by: Up with people! at October 08, 2012 04:38 AM (kzFo5)

3 where is everybody?

Posted by: lurker_above at October 08, 2012 04:38 AM (Q9n+c)

4 I have no response to that.

Posted by: little miss spellcheck at October 08, 2012 04:39 AM (a5ljo)

5 $1.4 tril......chump change.

Posted by: BignJames at October 08, 2012 04:39 AM (rlFQ+)

6 comments haven't worked for me for about 5 minutes, this is the first time I could get the page to load.

Posted by: spypeach at October 08, 2012 04:39 AM (pwTow)

7 How in the world did it become CW that public jobs pay less? I hear this canard from lefties all the time.

Posted by: Truman North at October 08, 2012 04:39 AM (I2LwF)

8 where is everybody?

------

Out fixing the hamster wheel.

Posted by: Lady in Black at October 08, 2012 04:40 AM (lTVJy)

9 In before ten. And Obama is a stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure.

Posted by: Darth Randall at October 08, 2012 04:40 AM (mV8sg)

10 Yay, comments are back!

I've just posted analysis of the new Battleground poll on my blog (you know where the link is).

Slow and steady movement toward Romney in this poll. Obama is stuck at 49 and hasn't moved in weeks. Romney was at 46, then 47, now at 48.

It's a D+4 poll, which is generous in the current environment. Over samples both Dem and Rep.

It fits with Dick Morris' prediction. Obama has a level he won't exceed and the undecideds will break to Romney.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 04:40 AM (qigku)

11 Politico has a new poll.....O 49% R 48%

But there is this.....

Romney now leads among independents by 16 points, 51 percent to 35 percent. This is up from 4 points last week. But he still trails in the overall head-to-head numbers because of near monolithic support for Obama among minority Democrats.

WTFityF?!

Posted by: Tami at October 08, 2012 04:40 AM (X6akg)

12 Well, I was having issues getting to the comments for a while so everyone else may be stuck.

Posted by: Tired of the SCoaMF at October 08, 2012 04:40 AM (44PWr)

13 Oh, wait, lefties... I get it. Lefties. Nevermind.

Posted by: Truman North at October 08, 2012 04:40 AM (I2LwF)

14 It's sunny and cold in Philadelphia this morning.

Posted by: little miss spellcheck at October 08, 2012 04:40 AM (a5ljo)

15 Good Morning.

Posted by: Caunotaucarius at October 08, 2012 04:40 AM (6ll+l)

16 Dave, I like your analysis. It's good in general and I suspect it's good here too. You all know what I think of polls by now.

Posted by: Truman North at October 08, 2012 04:42 AM (I2LwF)

17 It's always sunny in Philadelphia.

Posted by: Truman North at October 08, 2012 04:42 AM (I2LwF)

18 Gallup is also reporting that since the debate, Romney and Obama have been polling even among RVs. Prior to the debate, Obama held a 5 point lead consistently.

I still won't include them in my averages though, until they start coughing up internals.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 04:42 AM (qigku)

19 Brr. Went from 87 to 47 degrees in two days.

Posted by: Mama AJ at October 08, 2012 04:43 AM (SUKHu)

Well, supposedly that report on how Obama wasn't using credit card security is out, on Breitbart. So it's basically a government report on how all the politicians are susceptable to this kind of thing, not just Obama. Well that's one way to sweep it under the rug.

Last I checked, Drudge didn't even have it. Sigh.

Posted by: Jaimo at October 08, 2012 04:43 AM (9U1OG)

21 Cap any pension programs as follows:

20 years - 50% base pay and max at $40,000
30 years - 75% base pay and max at $50,000
40 years - 100% base pay and max at $60,000

If they hold off on collecting their pension until 70, they get a 20% bonus, up to $10,000.

That would cut out most of the outrageous payouts that you see with these programs. Also cap government worker pay raises at inflation +.05% and maximum pay at $150k. Get back to the real tradeoff of lower pay plus nicer benefits.

Posted by: Alex at October 08, 2012 04:44 AM (HwgHt)

22 It fits with Dick Morris' prediction.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 08:40 AM (qigku)

Well, hopefully it will come true anyway.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at October 08, 2012 04:44 AM (TpXEI)

23 Another bad server day. le sigh

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 04:44 AM (LpQbZ)

24 Cold here, too. High of 53 today. Wednesday back up to 80. Welcome to a typical October week in South Carolina.

Posted by: Lady in Black at October 08, 2012 04:44 AM (lTVJy)

25 Jaimo, thanks for that heads up. Lucy pulled the football away again, I see. Dammit.

Posted by: Truman North at October 08, 2012 04:44 AM (I2LwF)

26 Did Ace forget to pay his electric bill again?? Jeeebus! WTF is wrong with the comments lately??

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at October 08, 2012 04:45 AM (UTq/I)

27
19

There was frost on my car's windshield this morning. Frost! Thank goodness that energy prices have plummeted under Obama's wise leadership.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at October 08, 2012 04:45 AM (L7hol)

28 Daily Caller's got this up on its headline: Claim: Obama campaign illegally solicited foreign donors via social media website http://tinyurl.com/9hc3gaz

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 04:45 AM (LpQbZ)

29 The real trick is that the article is just about current funding levels for retirement. The 1.4 trillion gap is current underfunded accounts. Unfunded liabilities for states, counties, and municipalities us somewhere higher. Orders of magnitude higher (probably 10+ trillion). Meaning the plans are underfunded by 1.4 trillion compared to what they are supposedto be, and looking forward, the governmental entities have no plans in place to fund 10+ trillion in promised payments. This is the problem created by defined benefit plans, vs defined contribution. And public sector unions.

Posted by: Hopeless at October 08, 2012 04:45 AM (TKpwb)

30 Darn it. I have a big diocese wide inservice today and I was looking forward to the Top Headlines/Vic's Morning Roundup thread. Oh well, time to go. Hopefully today will be good. The last election year, the keynote speaker turned out to be a "social justice/abortion is not necessarily bad" loon. Half the teachers walked out during her speech and the diocesan office issued a formal apology to all the attendees. Good times. Since then, the organizers have stuck to mostly motivational speakers and have avoided anything with political overtones like the plague. We're not your typical bleeding heart Catholics around here.

Posted by: Ruby at October 08, 2012 04:45 AM (vt4Ip)

31 Drudge: GALLUP: 5-POINT ROMNEY BOUNCE

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 04:45 AM (LpQbZ)

32 If Breitbart is to be believed, the new "scandal" surrounding Choom Boy and illegal campaign donations is: same as old scandal in 2008. His sites allow foreign donations and don't have the kind of security applied to all other online purchases/donations, thus leaving the way clear for foreigners and Great Americans like "Doodad Pro" to shell out for the Anointed One without restriction.

I'm sure the media will be all over this. Wait for it...5...4...3...2....

Yeah, I thought so.

Once again, the affirmative action president gets a pass. What law? What Constitution?

Posted by: MrScribbler at October 08, 2012 04:46 AM (ZgX/g)

33 2008 Hope 2010 Dope 2012 Nope

Posted by: JackStraw at October 08, 2012 04:48 AM (TMB3S)

34 Goo news, Dave.. thnks for the analysis..

I'm wondering what backwater polling outfit will be featured over at Daily Kooks today since the major ones are all showing Obama slowly tanking... lol

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at October 08, 2012 04:48 AM (UTq/I)

35 24 Cold here, too. High of 53 today. Wednesday back up to 80. Welcome to a typical October week in South Carolina. Posted by: Lady in Black at October 08, 2012 08:44 AM (lTVJy) I'm in the upstate....whereabouts are you?

Posted by: BignJames at October 08, 2012 04:48 AM (rlFQ+)

36 The Lib press has finally settled on a narrative to defend Obama's sad performance at the debate: Romney is a liar.

Posted by: katya the designated driver at October 08, 2012 04:48 AM (DoZD+)

I saw a PPP poll last night that is going to make troll heads explode, MR 50 - BHO 48. It was on Drudge earlier, can't find it now. Gallup is still using registered voters.

Posted by: Gmac at October 08, 2012 04:48 AM (IanLz)

38 Not surprised about the illegal voters story. Nothing sticks to Choom. Teflon Choom. The media would make sure of it by refusing to report on it....and even if they did, most of America would just yawn.

Posted by: Lady in Black at October 08, 2012 04:48 AM (lTVJy)

39 RCP average has the Choomer in Chief ahead by 0.9. But remember, that PPP Virginia poll means it's all over for Romney. Because jobs, and all.

Posted by: Ruby at October 08, 2012 04:49 AM (vt4Ip)

40 @35 I'm in Moore, just outside of Spartanburg. You?

Posted by: Lady in Black at October 08, 2012 04:49 AM (lTVJy)

41 I'm wondering what backwater polling outfit will be featured over at Daily Kooks today since the major ones are all showing Obama slowly tanking... lol

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at October 08, 2012 08:48 AM

Polls showed Hugo Chavez "tanking" in Venezuela, too.

Posted by: MrScribbler at October 08, 2012 04:49 AM (ZgX/g)

42 I think this news is about 2008's campaign not necessarily this election campaign. Is he really doing the exact same thing as in 2008, who knows. You would have thought the braintrust would have come up with a more undetectable way to funnel illegal donations to the choom boy by now.

Posted by: Jaimo at October 08, 2012 04:49 AM (9U1OG)

43 The idea that state and local jobs pay less than the private sector is complete hogwash (at least in my state and, I suspect, that is true in most other states as well). Some state and local gov't jobs pay less, when compared to the top-level private sector counterparts, such as attorneys, for instance. However, if you compare most state/local gov't attorney pay with the average attorney salary, the gov't attorney usually makes more. So, in other words, yes a gov't attorney is not making the same as a partner at one of the top 100 law firms, but is making more than the average attorney is making. The same is true across the board for most professional / semi-professional positions. If you compare it to the top of the line private sector person in that position, yes you are probably making less. But if you are comparing it to the average for that type of work, the gov't employee is almost always making more than the average.

For anything below a professional position, most gov't jobs pay far more than the private sector - i.e., garbage-man, secretary, clerk, etc. And, they usually have far, far better benefits (vacation time, holidays, sick time, health care) and usually have far less responsibility and accountability.

So, the idea that these workers deserve to be able to retire at 55 with 50% of their final salary as pension is absurd. The retirement plans of local and state gov't employees have been absurdly over-generous since the very beginning. State and local gov't's need to get rid of defined benefit pensions altogether and start using 403(b) plans [basically the local/state employer version of a 401(k)] with matching (some laws would probably have to be changed to allow employer matching).

I'm sick of this false narrative that local/state gov't employees are underpaid compared to private sector counterparts. Public school teachers, for instance, are wildly overpaid compared to private school counterparts. I'd like to see someone find a job as a garbage-man in the private sector making the pay a gov't employed garbage man does. Or road crews, or any other labor type job.

Posted by: Monkeytoe at October 08, 2012 04:50 AM (sOx93)

44 Posted by: Truman North at October 08, 2012 08:44 AM (I2LwF)

That's not all she pulled away....

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at October 08, 2012 04:50 AM (2b4yb)

45 I think Romney is giving a speech today at VMI.

Posted by: Tami at October 08, 2012 04:50 AM (X6akg)

46 40 @35 I'm in Moore, just outside of Spartanburg. You? Posted by: Lady in Black at October 08, 2012 08:49 AM (lTVJy) Woodruff!

Posted by: BignJames at October 08, 2012 04:50 AM (rlFQ+)

47 How in the world did it become CW that public jobs pay less? I hear this canard from lefties all the time. Posted by: Truman North at October 08, 2012 08:39 AM (I2LwF) ======== This is true of local state/city jobs. Some of the upper positions pay well, but a lot of the lower ones do not -- or, at least pay what they should imho. $36K pension sounds good -- the reason they get paid less, to pay for this. Which is how it should work. Their houses should be paid for by then, and very little bills. They also had their own option to invest in an IRA or some other form of retirement. There is no excuse for not having multiple retirement avenues and relying on the taxpayers/government to fund your retirement. Finally, they complain about medical care costs? They will be covered via whatever plan they have leaving the government, and no doubt supported by medicare. And, I just want to ask them very, very loudly: Isnt' Obamacare supposed to cover all of your earthly needs, now? Why complain.

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 04:51 AM (LpQbZ)

48 Where's Vic? I need my Vic, darnit.

Posted by: Liberal Warmists at October 08, 2012 04:52 AM (a0nis)

49 Alex, As long as you have defined pensions, you wi have massive state run investment pools that become centers of graft and corruption. The only way to ever make progress is to eliminate defined benefit plans for public sector employees, switching to defined contribution. Anything less will never work because the unions and the government both start raiding the stash, loaning each other money as "investments", etc.

Posted by: Hopeless at October 08, 2012 04:52 AM (VSfsH)

50 Sock off.

Posted by: JDTAY at October 08, 2012 04:53 AM (a0nis)

51 Obama illegally obtaining contributions from foreign nationals through his website? That's going to be enormous news. It is an impeachable offense if true. And no, it's not "old news."

Posted by: Interested Party at October 08, 2012 04:53 AM (RE+1w)

52 Exciting new product: Comment Hosiery.

Posted by: Lace Wigs at October 08, 2012 04:53 AM (IoNBC)

53 Rasmussen has Obama up 2 in Iowa in a poll conducted entirely yesterday. 54% favor repeal of obamacare in a D+5 female +10 poll conducted oct 5-6.

Posted by: VBJonny at October 08, 2012 04:53 AM (bED4B)

54 >>I think Romney is giving a speech today at VMI. He is. On foreign policy. Maybe he can make up for his "blunder" when he accurately called Obama out for his weak response on the Libyan debacle.

Posted by: JackStraw at October 08, 2012 04:53 AM (TMB3S)

55 Woodruff!

----

Well, I'll be. Howdy neighbor!

Posted by: Lady in Black at October 08, 2012 04:53 AM (lTVJy)

56 We're not your typical bleeding heart Catholics around here. Hey. My wife is probably at the same event. An informal poll of her fellow teachers would probably show a 10 to 1 advantage of conservatives over liberals. The loudest, most obnoxious liberal at her school has learned to STFU -- in the words of Ernest Hemingway -- gradually, then suddenly. Nothing like getting her pay cut, then suffering the uncertainty of a school closing to nip her 0bama grandstanding in the bud.

Posted by: A regular moron at October 08, 2012 04:54 AM (feFL6)

57 On Dave's blog: R+2.8 - Rasmussen Party ID What exactly is "Party ID"?

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 04:54 AM (LpQbZ)

58 45) he's also speaking at a rally in Newport News before that. I'll be there.

Posted by: VBJonny at October 08, 2012 04:54 AM (bED4B)

59 46, 40. The upstate, so beautiful this time of year. I'm in the Clemson area.

Posted by: LRBnSC at October 08, 2012 04:54 AM (Qp3K5)

60 So Gerg was over here yesterday crowing how the UE numbers were Barry's ticket back to the top and then Chuck Todd is on the Nightly News saying the UE numbers were not moving the polls like the debate did and it still was moving public opinion.
heh

Posted by: El Lobo at October 08, 2012 04:54 AM (+I8Mq)

61 For anything below a professional position, most gov't jobs pay far more than the private sector - i.e., garbage-man, secretary, clerk, etc.

http://is.gd/dW09qn

CapitolÂ’s four barbers and stylists made $22,000 to $30,000 last year with no benefits, manager Lynn Dang said. At the Senate barbershop, formally called Senate Hair Care Services, the top four barbers and stylists made more than twice that Â— $54,761; $70,349; $73,658; and $81,641 Â— plus they have a generous 401(k) plan, health care and paid vacation. In all, the government contributed $230,000 in benefits for the barbershop, said Eve Goldsher, a spokeswoman for the Senate Appropriations Committee.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ at October 08, 2012 04:55 AM (/kI1Q)

62 @52

I'm looking for the logic. 54% want repeal of Choomcare, yet the only way to repeal is to dump Barry.....yet Barry is up 2%.

Posted by: Lady in Black at October 08, 2012 04:55 AM (lTVJy)

63 Daily Caller report is basically what we already knew. The Obama campaign solicited donations online and did zero screening on donation sources.

Posted by: Hobojerky at October 08, 2012 04:56 AM (e7sjI)

64 $54,761; $70,349; $73,658; and $81,641...and the Democrat Senatrices' hair still looks like shit.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ at October 08, 2012 04:56 AM (/kI1Q)

65 The UE numbers are already baked in. Note that the Sept number of 8.1% did nothing--O increased his ratings after it was published.

Posted by: Interested Party at October 08, 2012 04:56 AM (RE+1w)

66 Public employee pensions should be illegal.

No legislature should be encumbered by a legislature of 30 years ago.

Ultimately, they could just say no. Why not? And politically, they could get away with it if they capped the amount people get.

Defined benefit contributions make more sense. The legislature could do a match at whatever rate they want and then have that match eliminated by the next one.

Posted by: AmishDude at October 08, 2012 04:56 AM (T0NGe)

67 51 Obama illegally obtaining contributions from foreign nationals through his website? That's going to be enormous news. It is an impeachable offense if true. And no, it's not "old news." Posted by: Interested Party at October 08, 2012 08:53 AM (RE+1w) Too hard to explain in sound bites. Not the hill to die on. Keep your powder dry. Etc. etc. Damn gutless republicans.

Posted by: Truman North at October 08, 2012 04:57 AM (I2LwF)

68 look at Instapundit's top story (atm) http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/ the chart the chart of Obama's failure (not Bush's)

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 04:57 AM (LpQbZ)

69 Oh, and Happy Thanksgiving to our friends up north.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ at October 08, 2012 04:57 AM (/kI1Q)

70 Social media allows them to say they didn't know...

Posted by: Hobojerky at October 08, 2012 04:57 AM (e7sjI)

71 59 46, 40. The upstate, so beautiful this time of year. I'm in the Clemson area. Posted by: LRBnSC at October 08, 2012 08:54 AM (Qp3K5) I'll be in Clemson tonight for a concert @ the Brooks Center.

Posted by: BignJames at October 08, 2012 04:58 AM (rlFQ+)

72 CARACAS, Venezuela -- President Hugo Chavez scored a comfortable election victory that could extend his rule to 20 years and vowed to deepen his self-styled socialist revolution after a bitterly fought race against a youthful rival who has galvanized Venezuela's opposition.

If re-elected Barry will promise the same thing

Posted by: TheQuietMan at October 08, 2012 04:58 AM (1Jaio)

73 Well, supposedly that report on how Obama wasn't using credit card security is out, on Breitbart. ==== It's on the Daily Caller (lead story), too. I didn't see it at Breitbart, yet. Will go back and look.

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 04:59 AM (LpQbZ)

74 This poll led me to find a small error in my model. Doesn't shift the numbers much in any other polls, but I'll update.

I was using (1-(independent preference/.5)) should have been using (1-(.5/independent preference)).

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 04:59 AM (qigku)

75 Not surprising that state and local governments finally are waking up and reining in the gravy trains to public sector workers. Also not surprising that so much of it is being done by Democrats (CA, Ill., etc.). The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money and outside of media and college campus circles most liberals morph into conservatives as soon as they're mugged by reality.

Posted by: Tsar Nicholas II at October 08, 2012 04:59 AM (r2PLg)

76 LRBnSC....SC is beautiful this time of year. Of course, I'm from Cincinnati, so it never gets quite cold enough or snowy enough to suit me. But the people are way more hospitable!

Posted by: Lady in Black at October 08, 2012 04:59 AM (lTVJy)

77 Illegal contributions is definitely old news. He's been doing it for AT LEAST 6 years now. Also it isn't a scandal because there is no such thing as a scandal relating to him. There are only racist attacks on him. Nothing more.

Posted by: Up with people! at October 08, 2012 04:59 AM (kzFo5)

78 It is an impeachable offense if true. And no, it's not "old news." Posted by: Interested Party at October 08, 2012 08:53 AM

What alternative universe are you living in?

"Impeachable offense?" Choom Boy has committed several of them -- including violating his oath of office, giving aid and comfort to America's enemies and being an accessory to hundreds of cases of Murder One.

What he gets for it is silence from the MFM, inaction from Congress, polite, "nuanced" criticism from most conservative pundits and, most devastating of all, "Obamateurism" posts from Poppin' Fresh.

I don't see any pigs cruising past the window at FL 30, so my guess is he'll skate through his "troubles" today, as he does every day.

Posted by: MrScribbler at October 08, 2012 05:00 AM (ZgX/g)

79 54 >>I think Romney is giving a speech today at VMI.

He is. On foreign policy. Maybe he can make up for his "blunder" when he accurately called Obama out for his weak response on the Libyan debacle.

Posted by: JackStraw at October 08, 2012 08:53 AM (TMB3S)

Do you know what time the speech is, Jack?

Posted by: Tami at October 08, 2012 05:01 AM (X6akg)

80 Rasmussen Monday. Tied at 48. Romney up 1 before leaners. Romney pulls indies 47-44.

Posted by: VBJonny at October 08, 2012 05:01 AM (bED4B)

81 Hey, Ruby - are you going to be at St. Elizabeth? Come sit with me!

Posted by: CLP at October 08, 2012 05:01 AM (qvv56)

82 75 Not surprising that state and local governments finally are waking up and reining in the gravy trains to public sector workers.

==============================================

You really believe that? Wisconsin and Ohio (limited success) made some inroads, but the rest of these states are playing the same hide-the-salami games they've been playing for 35 years.

Where do you suppose most of that ridiculous "stimulous" package went?

Posted by: IdowhatIwant at October 08, 2012 05:02 AM (DzvS7)

83 ANOTHER OBAMACARE LOOPHOLE: A former insurance executive has sounded the alarm about how small businesses are likely to avoid the expensive burdens of Obamacare: self-insurance. This is when an employer offers a policy to employees, administered by a traditional insurance company, but the employer bears the risk of loss (costs exceeding premiums) itself. And the kicker is that self-insured plans generally buy Â“reinsuranceÂ” (aka, Â“stop lossÂ” insurance) that kicks in when losses exceed a certain level. Most large employers are presently self-insured (to get out from under expensive state health insurance mandates), but until recently, self-insurance was relatively rare for small employers because of the inherent risk involved. Ah, sweet loopholes! heh. Sweet Justice, more like it. h/t instapundit

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 05:02 AM (LpQbZ)

84 66, I have wet dreams of Romney being elected, announcing an anti-corruption program, and starting a top-to-bottom audit of all federal, state, county, and local government entities. The public sector unions must be broken and defeated no matter the cost.

Posted by: Hopeless at October 08, 2012 05:02 AM (5g2Fy)

85 Not surprised about the illegal voters story. Nothing sticks to Choom. Teflon Choom.

But like a cut-rate nonstick pan, the teflon is peeling off in chunks. This isn't 2008.

Also, Insty has a cover from the new Newsweek with the assertion "Heaven is Real" and a picture of a hand reaching skyward. Take this together with the recent New Yorker cover of Obama as an empty chair. They are most definitely hedging their bets now. Amazing how "flexible" they become when their jobs are going extinct.

Posted by: pep at October 08, 2012 05:03 AM (6TB1Z)

86 Polls showed Hugo Chavez "tanking" in Venezuela, too. Somehow I doubt that an honest election, free from fraud, would precipitate the necessity of putting tanks in the streets. One report says he won by 6 points while another report said he won by almost 20 points. That's a lot of dead people, even by DNC standards.

Posted by: A regular moron at October 08, 2012 05:03 AM (feFL6)

87 "That's a lot of dead people, even by DNC standards."

Posted by: A regular moron at October 08, 2012 09:03 AM (feFL6)

Give them a chance to catch up.

There will be rampant voter fraud this November. The only question is whether they will be able to move the swing states enough.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at October 08, 2012 05:05 AM (2b4yb)

88 Tami- I'm looking for the exact time, they often stream them on CNN. In any case, here are some of the excerpts. http://tinyurl.com/9dlv7nd

Posted by: JackStraw at October 08, 2012 05:05 AM (TMB3S)

89 7 How in the world did it become CW that public jobs pay less? I hear this canard from lefties all the time. Posted by: Truman North at October 08, 2012 08:39 AM (I2LwF) ******************* Once upon a time it was true. Dad was a construction engineer for the state DOT starting back when it was the Highway Dept. He made a bunch less than his friends that worked for the private contractors. But he had a kickass retirement program that still pays Mom as much as I make after 20 years in IT. Thank goodness

Posted by: Boomer Redneque Wireless Edition at October 08, 2012 05:06 AM (/QHeU)

90 "80 Rasmussen Monday. Tied at 48. Romney up 1 before leaners. Romney pulls indies 47-44." Which means Romney lost Sunday's sample, as well.

Posted by: Greg at October 08, 2012 05:07 AM (wKkyv)

91 Breitbart's main headline makes it seem like Obama's campaign is being attacked by uncontrollable, illegal campaign donations.

Posted by: Lady in Black at October 08, 2012 05:09 AM (lTVJy)

92 Exciting new product: Gerg Polls.

Posted by: Lace Wigs at October 08, 2012 05:09 AM (IoNBC)

93 @90 Damnit, thread's over. Time to move out, folks.

Posted by: JDTAY at October 08, 2012 05:10 AM (a0nis)

94 Posted by: Greg at October 08, 2012 09:07 AM

Never fear -- Choom Boy Junior is here!

At least we know where some of Doodad Pro's cash is going....

Posted by: MrScribbler at October 08, 2012 05:10 AM (ZgX/g)

95 Wow, I didn't realize how much the Battleground poll was hiding a giant shift toward Romney. Independents moved toward him in large numbers, but because of the massive undersample of Ind that they use, it is hidden.

If you normalize to *2008* turnout, Obama is barely ahead.

I've updated my analysis.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 05:12 AM (qigku)

>>There will be rampant voter fraud this November. The only question is whether they will be able to move the swing states enough.

I'm thinking the lack of enthusiasm for Obama will include those who might commit fraud.

If you think there's a good or even decent chance Romney will win, why risk going to jail for Obama?

Posted by: Mama AJ at October 08, 2012 05:12 AM (SUKHu)

97 hi all ever have one of those mornings when it's just difficult to do anything? ugh

Posted by: chemjeff on the phone at October 08, 2012 05:13 AM (yFJm8)

98 67 Very easy. Obama is getting illegal foreign donations from his website. One sentence, and make them defend it.

Posted by: Interested Party at October 08, 2012 05:13 AM (RE+1w)

99 US military aims to prevent suicides by taking soldiers' private guns away from them.....HOLY SHIT..... Pentagon and Congress to back policies encouraging the separation of at-risk soldiers from their private weapons Suicide rate among U.S. military staff rising again in 2012, almost half of those committed with personal firearm Likely to spark opposition from gun rights groups such as National Rifle Association Pentagon and Congress to back policies encouraging the separation of at-risk soldiers from their private weapons Suicide rate among U.S. military staff rising again in 2012, almost half of those committed with personal firearm Likely to spark opposition from gun rights groups such as National Rifle Association Pentagon and Congress to back policies encouraging the separation of at-risk soldiers from their private weapons Suicide rate among U.S. military staff rising again in 2012, almost half of those committed with personal firearm Likely to spark opposition from gun rights groups such as National Rifle Association http://tinyurl.com/92zdytd article from dailymailuk

Posted by: phoenixgirl what did huma abedin know? team dagny at October 08, 2012 05:14 AM (Ho2rs)

100 VBJ - Ras still using that D+4 sample?

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 05:14 AM (qigku)

101 Obama: illegal foreign campaign donations.

Posted by: Interested Party at October 08, 2012 05:14 AM (RE+1w)

102 97 hi all ever have one of those mornings when it's just difficult to do anything? ugh just about every morning

Posted by: BignJames at October 08, 2012 05:15 AM (rlFQ+)

103 Romney is rolling now. The Dems and the media will be throwing all sorts of shit in his way (he's a murderer, he's' Snidely Whiplash, etc.) but I don't think any of it will work. Obama has been exposed, nobody who watched him collapse in a puddle of a flop sweat during the debate will ever think of him as CinC material again.

Posted by: Lincolntf at October 08, 2012 05:15 AM (HethX)

104 Drudge has new Gallup poll ... 5 point bounce for Romney among registered voters ... was 50-45 Obama . Now tied at 47 using registered voters. And Romney maintaining his lead on the weekend, up 1 before leaners, that's not good for Obama.

Posted by: Honey Badger @robfit at October 08, 2012 05:15 AM (cDwCa)

105 10 I've just posted analysis of the new Battleground poll on my blog (you know where the link is). DiF has a blog? Next thing you know someone is going to say AllenG has a blog.

Posted by: rickb223 at October 08, 2012 05:15 AM (GFM2b)

106 Here's a great way to come home to your family after serving. This will put a smile on your face. Well done USC! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUkKhRtk8VU&sns=em

Posted by: Dripdripdrip at October 08, 2012 05:16 AM (AHwsB)

107 devil's advocate: Are Public Sector Workers Undercompensated? But according to a new study published by the Center for State & Local Government Excellence and the National Institute on Retirement Security, these aggregate compensation comparisons are misleading. The authors, University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee economics professors Keith A. Bender and John S. Heywood, assert that state and local government workers are better educated and have more work experience, on average, than do private sector workers, so it is natural that their overall average compensation would be higher. "Thus," they conclude, "the fact that public sector workers receive greater averÂage compensation than private sector workers should be no more surprising than the fact that those with more skills and education earn more." Furthermore, after attempting to control for such variables, they find that state and local government workers actually earn less than their private sector counterparts. According to the analysis, state government workers earn an average of 11.4 percent less than private-sector workers of similar education and work experience and local government workers earn 12.0 percent less. Due to the greater benefits received by public sector workers, the gap narrows when these benefits are factored in, to 6.8 percent and 7.4 percent, respectively. (Even this appears to underestimate the cost of the benefits provided government workers, as discussed below.) The piece says that on the surface, it does look like public > private, but if analyzed by experience and education, private makes more; even when benefits are factored in. They also go on to say, it's hard to compare apples to apples with public v private compensation.

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 05:16 AM (LpQbZ)

108 Gallup tied with registered voters. Not good news for Obama.

Posted by: Honey Badger @robfit at October 08, 2012 05:16 AM (cDwCa)

109 US military aims to prevent suicides by taking soldiers' private guns away from them.....HOLY SHIT.....

Are they going to take their belts and shoelaces away, too? *snort*

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ at October 08, 2012 05:16 AM (/kI1Q)

110 Posted by: phoenixgirl what did huma abedin know? team dagny at October 08, 2012 09:14 AM (Ho2rs)

You can say that again!

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at October 08, 2012 05:17 AM (2b4yb)

111 *link http://reason.org/news/show/public-sector-private-sector-salary

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 05:17 AM (LpQbZ)

112 If you think there's a good or even decent chance Romney will win, why risk going to jail for Obama? Posted by: Mama AJ at October 08, 2012 09:12 AM

Hah! We're talking about Democrats here, those knee-jerk, mindless followers of li'l tin gods like Choom Boy. They seem to feel that committing felonies is a matter of the Greater Good, a noble task to keep the country from falling (back) into the hands of patriots, Christians, and common sense.

Besides, they know the Anointed One can issue mass pardons.

Posted by: MrScribbler at October 08, 2012 05:17 AM (ZgX/g)

113 BignJames it sucks gerg, fuck off

Posted by: chemjeff on the phone at October 08, 2012 05:18 AM (yFJm8)

114 Nearly mid-October and the incumbent is still under 50% nationally. Damn. Sad.

Posted by: Honey Badger @robfit at October 08, 2012 05:18 AM (cDwCa)

115 Posted by: phoenixgirl what did huma abedin know? team dagny at October 08, 2012 09:14 AM (Ho2rs)

I've had to bring soldiers into the barracks and make sure that they didn't have access to their privately owned weapons while they cooled down or got help. It's necessary tool for commanders to prevent more Joseph Dwyers. I didn't like doing it, but sometimes it was necessary. I also was able to restrict them from alcohol if necessary.

Posted by: Alex at October 08, 2012 05:18 AM (HwgHt)

116

Are they going to take their belts and shoelaces away, too? *snort*

If a guy is suicidal, or if we were worried that he may be suicidal, then yes his bootlaces and belt did get taken away.

Posted by: Alex at October 08, 2012 05:20 AM (HwgHt)

117 107 They also go on to say, it's hard to compare apples to apples with public v private compensation. No shit. I lean on a shovel all day in the private sector, I'm fired. I lean on a shovel all day in the public sector and I get promoted!

Posted by: rickb223 at October 08, 2012 05:20 AM (GFM2b)

118 Dear state workers affected by this,

Talk to anyone in the military who did their 20 and make sure you complain about how hard your life is. I'll upload your beating to YouTube.

Posted by: NR Pax at October 08, 2012 05:20 AM (6I+f5)

119 Very easy. Obama is getting illegal foreign donations from his website. One sentence, and make them defend it. ----- He doesn't take federal matching funds so its aiight. Last time around McCain was audited over petty shit. Zero on the other hand skated on serious charges.

Posted by: Up with people! at October 08, 2012 05:20 AM (kzFo5)

120 Drudge has new Gallup poll Heh. Looks like the intimidation is wearing off. Guess that noise heard backstage at the debate was the sound of the spell breaking.

Posted by: Brother Cavil presents at October 08, 2012 05:21 AM (GBXon)

121 Is Gallop ever going LV?

Posted by: Kwame at October 08, 2012 05:21 AM (q6+GR)

122
I'm looking for the exact time, they often stream them on CNN. In any case, here are some of the excerpts.

http://tinyurl.com/9dlv7nd

Posted by: JackStraw at October 08, 2012 09:05 AM (TMB3S)

Thanks Jack!

Posted by: Tami at October 08, 2012 05:21 AM (X6akg)

123 So what happened with the big 'Campaign Finance' story????

Posted by: Portnoy at October 08, 2012 05:21 AM (Kgrin)

124 Hey, anyone seen Greg lately? How did those UE numbers work out for him and Barry?

http://tinyurl.com/8wy4nxh

Willard, FIVE POINT Bounce.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at October 08, 2012 05:22 AM (wR+pz)

125 WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney stayed within striking distance of President Barack Obama in a Reuters/Ipsos poll on Sunday, coming in two points behind the Democrat for the third straight day after winning last week's debate in Denver.

If Reuters is admitting it's this closer it must be even better for Romney

Posted by: TheQuietMan at October 08, 2012 05:23 AM (1Jaio)

126 @REALStaceyDash is a Hollyweird Actress & Black & she is voting for R/R

Posted by: Evilpens at October 08, 2012 05:23 AM (ck76k)

127 If you think there's a good or even decent chance Romney will win, why risk going to jail for Obama?

Oh, don't be so sure:

http://preview.tinyurl.com/8ol4u9l

That goes to The Blaze's collection of recent Romney death threats on Twitter. My favorite is the woman who says he has to die because he's going to ban tampons, which is a... unique interpretation of events.

Posted by: Ian S. at October 08, 2012 05:23 AM (rPA5/)

128 Dave in FL ... great work on that battleground poll. Thanks. More evidence of Mitt momentum.

Posted by: Honey Badger @robfit at October 08, 2012 05:23 AM (cDwCa)

129 Isn't this some Yankee holiday? Oh, yeah Columbus Day.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at October 08, 2012 05:24 AM (wR+pz)

130 85% of the Battleground Poll was conducted before the debate. Not a good sign for Obama, and voter enthusiam and extremely likely voters favor Romney pretty significantly.

Posted by: tofer732 at October 08, 2012 05:24 AM (2zM0P)

131 but it must be close as close can be in VA cause they are all here all the time. even the wives.

if you know anyone in VA whom you can visit NOW for the next month, come!

Posted by: kelley in virginia at October 08, 2012 05:24 AM (HNwOT)

132 Columbus Day....
Man, that show was so popular it has its own day? wild.

Posted by: El Lobo at October 08, 2012 05:25 AM (+I8Mq)

133 113 BignJames it sucks If I didn't have to work to support my vices (food,shelter,clothing) I'd stay in bed.....but hey, at least I've still got a job....I'm blessed.

Posted by: BignJames at October 08, 2012 05:25 AM (rlFQ+)

134 100) I believe so. He doesn't publish the sample for some reason but I can crunch the numbers against the sample he's been using to see if it equals 48-48.

Posted by: VBJonny at October 08, 2012 05:25 AM (bED4B)

135 Tami- Appears the speech is at 11:20 am. The link should be on CNN at some point

Posted by: JackStraw at October 08, 2012 05:26 AM (TMB3S)

136 Anyone have any idea how Democrat voting dropped between 1976 and 1980?

The similarities are enough to make some mild assumptions.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at October 08, 2012 05:26 AM (2b4yb)

137 Today's polling averages:

O+1.40% - Current RCP Average
O+1.01% - Average using the 2008 turnout model
R+3.75% - Average using the 2010 turnout model
R+3.82% - Average using the 2004 turnout model
R+5.40% - Average using the Rasmussen Party ID turnout model

Slight softening for Romney from Rasmussen, but balanced by the strong Battleground poll. Romney maintains a strong lead.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 05:27 AM (qigku)

138 Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at October 08, 2012 09:24 AM (wR+pz)

It's called "Indigenous People's Day" in Berkeley.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at October 08, 2012 05:27 AM (2b4yb)

139

The authors, University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee economics professors Keith A. Bender and John S. Heywood, assert that state and local government workers are better educated and have more work experience, on average, than do private sector workers

------------------------------

The idea that you need a master's degree to be a state worker in the department of transportation is silly & ridiculous. Therefore, it is silly in ridiculous to pretend the level of compensation is justified.

Posted by: Jay at October 08, 2012 05:27 AM (3LaGb)

140 What? They told us the pockets of the tax payers were a bottomless well of money! Look again! Or at least get longer arms.

Posted by: HtP at October 08, 2012 05:28 AM (jx2j9)

141 . 76 LRBnSC....SC is beautiful this time of year. Of course, I'm from Cincinnati, so it never gets quite cold enough or snowy enough to suit me. But the people are way more hospitable! Posted by: Lady in Black at October 08, 2012 08:59 AM (lTVJy) ******************** No kidding? So am I! What part of Cincy? Mmmmmmmmmmmm. Skyline. LaRosa's. Graeter's

Posted by: Boomer Redneque Wireless Edition at October 08, 2012 05:28 AM (/QHeU)

142 This will end as well as Obama at a debate!

Posted by: HtP at October 08, 2012 05:29 AM (jx2j9)

143 Find the lawmakers that promised these untenable pensions and hold them as traitors. You can do that for the union leaders as well.

Posted by: Mekan at October 08, 2012 05:30 AM (T/L2Z)

144 "Anyone have any idea how Democrat voting dropped between 1976 and 1980?"

I don't. I saw historicals yesterday, but they only went back to 1984.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 05:31 AM (qigku)

145 Another good link for salary discussion. (And, for the record, I thought gov workers always made more than private. Esp when factoring in benefits. But, I do know some FL gov workers who really make sh*t for salary, but my heart does not bleed because of the pension and medical care. This piece is Virginia -- and shows some pretty good stats as well. http://www2.timesdispatch.com/news/2010/nov/28/sala28-ar-680206/ For rank-and-file state workers -- the people who patch potholes on the interstates, guard prisoners, crunch numbers, and keep the governmental gears greased -- job satisfaction is quite influenced by their salary, which is on average 20 percent lower than for a comparable private sector job, according to DHRM data. In fact, the biggest reason that people leave Virginia government is for a better salary at their new job, according to a 2008 study by the Joint Legislative Audit and Review Committee, Virginia's watchdog agency. ... A 2009 study by DHRM of 25 occupations revealed wide discrepancies in average salaries between the public and private sector for many jobs. With the exception of medical lab technicians and physical therapists, who earned about 5 percent more, state jobs paid less. The greatest differences were for truck drivers and lawyers. Truck drivers for the state averaged $19,242; in the private sector, they made $27,500, a difference of nearly 43 percent. Lawyers for the state earned an average of $59,984, compared with $109,300 in the private sector -- a difference of nearly 93 percent. ... The Richmond Times-Dispatch requested salary information from state agencies using the Freedom of Information Act. The average salary for 100,978 state workers in 212 agencies is about $50,410. That includes top university executives and coaches, who inflate the average amount with their six-figure salaries. The median salary is lower, about $42,130 -- half of all state workers make more, and the other half less -- and a better descriptor of rank-and-file workers' pay. It seems some top earners skew the data, as they would in the private sector.

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 05:31 AM (LpQbZ)

146 Posted by: Alex at October 08, 2012 09:20 AM (HwgHt)

So this is for guys who are on active duty, and their units realize they need help?

Makes sense, then. For some reason, I was reading "separation" as "when they leave the service."

MOAR CAWFEE.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ at October 08, 2012 05:31 AM (/kI1Q)

147 Thanks for the kind words everyone

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 05:32 AM (qigku)

148 46, 40. The upstate, so beautiful this time of year. I'm in the Clemson area. I'm in the Midlands (Columbia), enjoying the cooler weather. Of course this being SC, I have a sunburn from going to the coast just 2 days ago.

Posted by: LP at October 08, 2012 05:33 AM (pR8WM)

149 80 Rasmussen Monday. Tied at 48. Romney up 1 before leaners. Romney pulls indies 47-44. ========== People who respond to Rasmussen polls on the weekend seem to be more liberal.

Posted by: edl at October 08, 2012 05:34 AM (+QKfp)

150 Appears the speech is at 11:20 am. The link should be on CNN at some point

Posted by: JackStraw at October 08, 2012 09:26 AM (TMB3S)

Thanks again, Jack. The Keydets will give him a good reception.

Posted by: Tami at October 08, 2012 05:34 AM (X6akg)

151 My penis--it seems to be shrinking. I have no idea why.

Posted by: Gergle at October 08, 2012 05:35 AM (IoNBC)

152

Who thought Chavez was not going to be 're-elected'?

Silly rabbit, tricks are for commies.

Posted by: polynikes at October 08, 2012 05:36 AM (m2CN7)

153 Well I see the coaches and Harris poll got it right and brought K-State in at #5. AP just couldn't bring themselves to put a "hick school in flyover country" in the top 5.

Posted by: teej says go K-State at October 08, 2012 05:37 AM (QbKVX)

154 It looks like its D+2 or 3. Obama is up 1 in Colorado in a poll taken entirely yesterday.

Posted by: VBJonny at October 08, 2012 05:37 AM (HJwkC)

155 I still don't understand why they are doing this , but they are: Libya coverup: http://tinyurl.com/8q7u3vc

Posted by: HtP at October 08, 2012 05:37 AM (jx2j9)

156 This is rich (from the Daily Caller piece) Obama.com was registered in September 2008 to Robert Roche, an Obama campaign bundler living in Shanghai, China, according to GAI. and, then Starting in late January 2010, Obama.com redirected to a page gathering email addresses and continued to do so through 2011. Sometime during 2012, the webpage began sending visitors to a donation page on the Obama campaignÂ’s website. The campaignÂ’s donation page loads an affiliate number to track the traffic and donations coming via the website. It continues to do so today.Â” According to GAIÂ’s report, RocheÂ’s name was removed from the domain registration of Obama.com on Oct. 4, 2010, and replaced with Â“an anonymous registrationÂ” provided by an affiliate of GoDaddy.com. Obama.com was subsequently moved to a server company based in Utah and its administration was transferred to Wicked Global, Â“a small company with only four employees listed on its website,Â” and led by a 25-year-old Harvard dropout. These guys are filthy crooked.

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 05:37 AM (LpQbZ)

157 "People who respond to Rasmussen polls on the weekend seem to be more liberal."

Been that way for as long as I've been tracking polls, back to 2000.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 05:38 AM (qigku)

158 Well I see the coaches and Harris poll got it right and brought K-State in at #5.

Don't get too comfy there.

Posted by: CyRadish at October 08, 2012 05:38 AM (/kI1Q)

159 OK, I went to my folder with the blog links and now, somehow ace has his logo on the file that before just said ace.

Pixy?

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at October 08, 2012 05:38 AM (wR+pz)

160 I will eat my hat if Obama brings out a higher turnout than 2008.

No. Way.

Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 45% more DOOM! at October 08, 2012 05:38 AM (xAtAj)

161 I went to Xavier U. Still can't understand the fascination with Skyline chili. Blech.

Posted by: Lincolntf at October 08, 2012 05:39 AM (HethX)

162 160 I will eat my hat if Obama brings out a higher turnout than 2008. No. Way. Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 45% more DOOM! at October 08, You like Tabasco with your hat amigo?

Posted by: La Raza at October 08, 2012 05:40 AM (dKV5k)

163

Some said that people would vote for Obama even if he were caught on live TV fucking a chicken. They were proven right last Wednesday.

Posted by: polynikes at October 08, 2012 05:41 AM (m2CN7)

164 http://tinyurl.com/8ocmf5v 9 out of 10 scots live off the dole......

Posted by: phoenixgirl what did huma abedin know? team dagny at October 08, 2012 05:41 AM (Ho2rs)

165 I'll eat my hat dry if I'm wrong, but first you blow me.

Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 45% more DOOM! at October 08, 2012 05:42 AM (xAtAj)

166 Remember folks, debates don't matter. -Gerg

Posted by: Highsmith at October 08, 2012 05:42 AM (uwaMU)

167 So did NewsWeak wimp out on the donor story?

Posted by: CDR M at October 08, 2012 05:43 AM (dKV5k)

168 "Don't get too comfy there". Oh, not to worry Cy. I'm not. Lots of tough games to go. My guys really need to get past this not playing well in the first quarter or they'll liable to get too far behind in some of the games they have left to come back.

Posted by: teej says go K-State at October 08, 2012 05:45 AM (/tk/V)

169 163 Some said that people would vote for Obama even if he were caught on live TV ... a chicken ======== What, another move to excite his base?

Posted by: edj at October 08, 2012 05:45 AM (+QKfp)

170 This campaign finance thing is going to turn out to be a non-issue. Suspicious, but we knew all this in 2008. No proof of anything.

Romney's speech today will be more important.

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 05:46 AM (qigku)

171 That debate?

What debate?

Employment numbers that's what counts.

Posted by: Greg in his mom's basement at October 08, 2012 05:46 AM (wR+pz)

172 MOAR CAWFEE.

PUT that coffee down. Coffee is for closers.

Posted by: Blake from downtown at October 08, 2012 05:46 AM (z9HTb)

173 If it looks like every single dem on the planet has adopted the strategy of lying about e v e r y t h i n g, they have. And it appears to be working: http://tinyurl.com/8uzrvfk

Posted by: HtP at October 08, 2012 05:46 AM (jx2j9)

174 where s Vic the /cobs anybody? Whats going on?

Posted by: Thunderb at October 08, 2012 05:47 AM (Dnbau)

175 Oh I agree Dave but I'd still like to see what they have. If only we had a well placed mole in the organization.

Posted by: CDR M at October 08, 2012 05:47 AM (dKV5k)

176 http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-4473-1.pdf Have a look at question 11f. Now imagine yourself a soldier contemplating ending it all but knowing that just seeking help could easily result in the de facto loss of your Second Amendment rights.

Posted by: FRONT TOWARD LEFT at October 08, 2012 05:48 AM (ogdab)

177 The AP report on Chavez is a disgrace. They actually say that he won in part because he is so charismatic.

Posted by: mr.midnight at October 08, 2012 05:48 AM (Kv/xV)

178 They'll? Ahem, they're. I blame Bush. And not enough coffee. But mostly Bush.

Posted by: teej says go K-State at October 08, 2012 05:48 AM (M7Cfv)

179 169 163 Some said that people would vote for Obama even if he were caught on live TV ... a chicken

There is some truth to that. My wife was at the beach with some girls watching the debate and there were two of her HS friends there that thought Obama won the debate and they were going to vote for him AGAIN.

These are your limousine liberal girls with nice rich daddies.

Wife almost threw them out of the house.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at October 08, 2012 05:49 AM (wR+pz)

180 I've had to bring soldiers into the barracks and make sure that they didn't have access to their privately owned weapons while they cooled down or got help. It's necessary tool for commanders to prevent more Joseph Dwyers. I didn't like doing it, but sometimes it was necessary. I also was able to restrict them from alcohol if necessary. Posted by: Alex at October 08, 2012 09:18 AM (HwgHt) It is hard to turn around a suicidal thought. Tough job for you on top of everything else.

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 05:49 AM (LpQbZ)

181 Chavez appeared to want to be re-elected. He's on his 4th term?

Obama doesn't even want a 2nd.

Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 45% more DOOM! at October 08, 2012 05:49 AM (xAtAj)

182 Chill in the air the q-tips are returning.

Posted by: Drunk in East Mesa at October 08, 2012 05:49 AM (hiWet)

183 This was a jarring "before coffee" wake up picture.. http://tinyurl.com/9a4t4n6

Posted by: pray for peace at October 08, 2012 05:50 AM (oZfic)

184 Oh I think he understands as well as anyone possibly can, but it is a good argument to make nonetheless. http://tinyurl.com/962vawr

Posted by: HtP at October 08, 2012 05:50 AM (jx2j9)

185 @174

It's Columbus Day, they are drinking cheap Chianti and eating pasta with big titted wenches.

Location unknown. Little Italy?

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at October 08, 2012 05:51 AM (wR+pz)

186
# 167

NewsWeek is busy counting all the millions of dollars they suddenly found in an old box under the desk of a retired secretary, and don't have the time, or the people to chase down old stories about Obama.

I'm pretty sure they still have a reporter or two on staff, and will be covering the creditable accounts of Mitt Romney, the Mormon, personally gutting Christian babies, and roasting them on the spit to feed his many wives.....you know...when he's not busy trying to enact a federal ban on the tampon, or as his cultist church refers to it....."The Devil's Coochie Plug".

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at October 08, 2012 05:51 AM (L7hol)

187 I thought Vic had a lot of tests to do for the next couple of weeks.

Posted by: El Lobo at October 08, 2012 05:51 AM (+I8Mq)

188 I am interested to see what Romney covers on Fo Pol speech. Wonder who he has on that team giving him input? Re the sudden departure of Greg, he probably needed a minute to continue laughing about dead Americans in Libya per last nights thread.

Posted by: Honey Badger @robfit at October 08, 2012 05:53 AM (fdnD9)

189 FTSB: Nine in ten Scots 'living off state's patronage' On the other hand, the Scots who left Scotland have been a blessing to the world.

Posted by: Purity of Essense at October 08, 2012 05:54 AM (QupBk)

190 Sean Bielat's team of useful idiots is canvassing my town. I can't decide whether to go along for the networking possibilities or stay home because I hate his guts.

Posted by: Truman North at October 08, 2012 05:55 AM (MqU+D)

191 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable tyrant.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at October 08, 2012 05:55 AM (5DR1j)

192 Never gets old.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at October 08, 2012 05:55 AM (QupBk)

193 186: I'm pretty sure they still have a reporter or two on staff, and will be covering the creditable accounts of Mitt Romney, the Mormon, personally gutting Christian babies, and roasting them on the spit to feed his many wives....

You see?! Mormons really are Israelites! Nothing so good after a hard day's exploiting poor people like a big dish of Chuchulent...

Posted by: mallfly at October 08, 2012 05:55 AM (bJm7W)

194 Thanks to Obama administration efforts in Libya, Stevens sent a cable the morning of the attack warning State that their support of a Libyan candidate for Prime Minister threatened to alienate the militias that protected the Benghazi consulate: @ Hotair The folks at the State Dept are leaking stuff like crazy. They can't be happy about what happened and are fighting back.

Posted by: Highsmith at October 08, 2012 05:56 AM (uwaMU)

195 161 I went to Xavier U. Still can't understand the fascination with Skyline chili. Blech. Posted by: Lincolntf at October 08, 2012 09:39 AM (HethX) I had a niece who went to Xavier, and she came out spewing all kinds of liberal propaganda. I would have thought a private judeo-christian school wouldn't be so brainwashy... Was she just a rare case?

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 05:57 AM (LpQbZ)

196 Bing: Romney wants US involvement im Syria. Translation: Republican warmonger!

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at October 08, 2012 05:57 AM (uzj/t)

197

I see that David Lettermen repeated Reid's slander and called Romney a felon for not paying his taxes.

I think Romney would be able to sue Letterman. Any sharks in the house?

Posted by: polynikes at October 08, 2012 05:58 AM (m2CN7)

198 164 http://tinyurl.com/8ocmf5v 9 out of 10 scots live off the dole...... Posted by: phoenixgirl what did huma abedin know? team dagny at October 08, 2012 09:41 AM (Ho2rs) ----- good lord

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 05:58 AM (LpQbZ)

199 163 Some said that people would vote for Obama even if he were caught on live TV ... a chicken ======== What, another move to excite his base? Posted by: edj at October 08, 2012 09:45 AM (+QKfp) The very definition of progressive.

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 05:59 AM (LpQbZ)

200 I would have thought a private judeo-christian school wouldn't be so brainwashy...

In the 21st century, a lot of Catholic universities aren't.

Dagny should be here.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at October 08, 2012 06:00 AM (/kI1Q)

201 @195 God willing, they are starting to feel the chill of an early fall and the January arrival of the STACHE!!

Posted by: traumakitty at October 08, 2012 06:00 AM (c/Glr)

202 Wonder who he has on that team giving him input?

Isn't the 'Stache one of his FP advisers?

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at October 08, 2012 06:01 AM (5DR1j)

203 Greg did disappear awfully fast. He was all geared up to gloat about Rasmussen. I guess he wasn't prepared for Gallup and Battleground.

He really is pitiful.

What a sad life to be living. You are so tied to your partisan desires that you can't see the tragedy of 4 people dying violently. How does someone get to such a point?

Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 06:01 AM (qigku)

204 Romney's speech today will be more important. Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 09:46 AM (qigku) As long as it gets the coverage it deserves. If smart enough, if the talk is foreign affair, he might be able to slip in the foreign donation thing, but it would cheapen the speech if not done correctly. My point is, though, if this is real, with solid evidence (which I haven't see so far), Romney is the guy who could make this a big issue. McCain could never have.

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 06:02 AM (LpQbZ)

205 I would have thought a private judeo-christian school wouldn't be so brainwashy...

I've heard such things about Boston College, which is a Jesuit school.

Remember, you got this info from some guy on the internet.

Posted by: fluffy at October 08, 2012 06:02 AM (z9HTb)

206
Remember, you got this info from some guy on the internet.

So it must be true!

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at October 08, 2012 06:05 AM (/kI1Q)

207

I think the real headline should be "28% of the population should be shipped to Venezuela":

http://tinyurl.com/98eewdr

Posted by: HtP at October 08, 2012 06:06 AM (jx2j9)

208 The public employees got to write the rules, with the help of the politicians they bought and elected. I've heard that being a cop is hard, and I would not want to dis them, but retiring policeman game the system everywhere. They are almost always able to spike their last few years pre-retirement pay with outrageous overtime so as to get retirement pay up to way beyond top schoolteacher and adminstrators and principals pay. And I'm not talking about police chiefs here, just the down-office captains, detectives, lieutenants, etc.

Posted by: The littl shyning man at October 08, 2012 06:06 AM (PH+2B)

209 hi catpiss troll (ozfic) still feel threatened by a monty python skit?

Posted by: phoenixgirl what did huma abedin know? team dagny at October 08, 2012 06:06 AM (Ho2rs)

210 I would have thought a private judeo-christian school wouldn't be so brainwashy...

There are very, very few truly Christian schools left. Indeed, the only Church of Christ university I can think of that's left is Harding University in... Arkansas? Alabama? I can't remember.

TCU? Should be "Theoretically Christians University."
ACU? Should be "Almost Christian University."
Pepperdine? It's in CA.

Outside of that, you get Baylor, which has gone all secular, for all they still have morning chapel. SMU, the same. Notre Dame is all in for the Social Liberalism. Heck, even Harvard started life as a Christian University.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at October 08, 2012 06:07 AM (5DR1j)

211 misc, it was pretty bad.
I was elected Freshman Class VP, and attended exactly ONE Student govt. meeting, after which I told the Pres. that he was on his own. The entire hierarchy was built around "social justice" garbage, ranging from getting people to sign "Amnest Int'l" petitions to free that cop killer from Philly, to running "register to vote" drives in Over the Rhein. Fuck that noise.

Posted by: Lincolntf at October 08, 2012 06:08 AM (HethX)

212 In the 21st century, a lot of Catholic universities aren't.

Dagny should be here.

Posted by: HeatherRadishÂ™ needs a beer at October 08, 2012 10:00 AM (/kI1Q)

Let's see if I can channel Dagny. Over the past 50 years, Catholic universities and Catholicism in general has been overtaken by the "Spirit of Vatican II" crowd who thought that they could simply follow the dictates of their consciences and everything would be okay. IOW, what I like is good. Turns out, that was a load of crap put forth by lousy theology and let run rampant by the Concilium, which was the body created to implement the documents of Vatican II.

Luckily, along comes Pope Benedict XVI, who is now calling for a Year of Faith, during which we will beat the Spirit of VII out of every corner of the Church, including the universities, some of which has already occurred. It will be a tough job, but basically what PB16 teaches is that without faith, there is no love, and without obedience and humility, there is no love, so faith can be found where there is obedience and humility. Thou art God and I am not, sort of like that.

So, there's hope for Catholic institutions yet.

Posted by: tcn at October 08, 2012 06:08 AM (VLG62)

213 From 'The City of Brotherly Love'... Last Friday was dress-down day at Charles Carroll High School in Port Richmond Â— a day for students to leave their uniforms at home and wear whatever they liked. One young woman chose to wear a shirt showing her support for Gov. Mitt RomneyÂ’s presidential candidacy. Her geometry teacher didnÂ’t like it, the girlÂ’s father said on a radio call-in show on IQ 106.9 FM today. The teacher allegedly told the girl to take off the shirt, saying it was like wearing a Ku Klux Klan sheet. The teacher allegedly threatened to use a marker to cross out RomneyÂ’s name and that of Rep. Paul Ryan, his running mate. The teacher also allegedly tried to throw the student out of class. http://tinyurl.com/cg4up4a

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat at October 08, 2012 06:09 AM (feFL6)

214 Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 45% more DOOM! at October 08, 2012 09:52 AM (xAtAj) ====== CNN pushed hard against Romney in this. Sickening. I like how they said "food stamps and no medical care." I'm sorry, but they would have been able to get medicaid -- or go into the free clinics in the city that offer not just medical but dental and vision care for free. He showed CNN that is was self-perseverance and self-responsibility that won in the end. This was a good story for the man in the piece, but I wanted to slap that CNN reporter...

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 06:10 AM (LpQbZ)

215 What a sad life to be living. You are so tied to your partisan desires that you can't see the tragedy of 4 people dying violently. How does someone get to such a point? Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 10:01 AM (qigku) I really think he is just a kid, spouting immature stuff. New thread btw, if you haven't noticed.

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 06:19 AM (LpQbZ)

216 Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 08:54 AM (LpQbZ)

I'm not sure if anyone answered this for you, but DiF explains it in either his first or second blog post.

Basically, every month Rassmussen calls something like 15,000 households (a huge sample) and asks them to self-Id re: Party. Then they compile a 3 month rolling average.

They do not use that same number in their own daily-tracking polls (for some reason).

So when DiF re-weights the polls, he uses: a 2008 turnout model, a 2010 turnout model, a 2004 turnout model, and a turnout model assuming that the Rassmussess 3-mo rolling average is the correct partisan breakdown.

It gives a range of result. The idea I've been taking from it is that when 3 of the 5 (he also uses just the RCP average for comparison) all show the same final result (0 win or R win), that we can be relatively certain that it's really leaning that way (that would require the two most favorable for one party, and the most "average" which actually happens to be 2010, ironically enough, to agree).

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at October 08, 2012 06:23 AM (5DR1j)

217 What a sad life to be living. You are so tied to your partisan desires that you can't see the tragedy of 4 people dying violently. How does someone get to such a point? Posted by: Dave in Fla at October 08, 2012 10:01 AM (qigku) (Public Schools + Mom's Basement)*Cheetos= gErG

Posted by: 98ZJUSMC in Johnson County laughing at Cook County at October 08, 2012 06:28 AM (rWVv1)

218 Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at October 08, 2012 10:23 AM (5DR1j) Thanks, Allen.

Posted by: misc at October 08, 2012 06:36 AM (LpQbZ)

219 1 - Repeal TFG-Care 2 - Keystone Pipeling 3 - Defang the EPA 4 - Lower tax rate to 25% 5 - ?????? 6 - Profit! No, really. PROFIT!!!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at October 08, 2012 06:53 AM (vCK/R)

220 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

Posted by: steevy at October 08, 2012 07:59 AM (6o4Fb)

221

Cities and states around the country are shoring up battered retirement plans by reducing promised benefits to public workers and retirees. ...

The actions taken by states vary. California limited its annual pension payouts.

Next stop, at least for CA: reaming out union retirees, with the (tacit) complicity of active union members. From the government's perspective, why pay people who used to do the work, and stiff the ones who are now doing the work?

But more importantly, from the unions' perspective, why go to the mat for people who (I presume) no longer pay dues?

So when push comes to shove, retired union members will go ass up over the kitchen table in preference to working union members.

The first sign that this is coming, the canary in the coal mine? When the media start running stories about CA public sector union members retiring to low tax states (i.e., anywhere else), where they live high on the hog on their pensions paid for by strapped CA taxpayers.

You heard it here first.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at October 08, 2012 08:08 AM (U+DUu)

222 Well, they discovered when they first had income taxes back during the time of the First World War that as you raise the tax rates, more and more people no longer pay them because they put their money in tax exempt securities primarily. And so the, the amount of money in tax exempt securities rose at one point to where it was more than half the size of the national debt and several times the size of the federal governmentÂ’s annual budget Â–so huge amounts of money went into hiding. And so even though the tax rate that rose at one point to 73 percent, 73 percent of nothing doesnÂ’t bring in any revenue to the government.

Posted by: Obama's tax planner at October 08, 2012 08:59 AM (e8kgV)

223 Just read on the daily caller that stacy dash endorsed mitt romney on twitter. http://tinyurl.com/8o924kz

Posted by: pray for peace at October 08, 2012 09:15 AM (oZfic)

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