Ace of Spades HQ

March 12, 2012

OK, here's a new Open Thread [OregonMuse]
— Code Red

The old one was starting to smell like ace's feet, so it's time to move on.

I got nothing, so here is that famous quote from Alexander Tyler. Every time I read it, I want to weep for our country:

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.

"Great nations rise and fall. The people go from bondage to spiritual truth, to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency, from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependence, from dependence back again to bondage."

Attributed to Alexander Fraser Tyler

Posted by: Code Red at 03:21 PM | Comments (85)
Post contains 179 words, total size 1 kb.

1 bama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

Posted by: steevy at March 12, 2012 03:22 PM (7W3wI)

2 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

Posted by: steevy at March 12, 2012 03:22 PM (7W3wI)

3 Woebama is a stuttering clusterf(ck of a miserable failure.

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at March 12, 2012 03:23 PM (Ec6wH)

4 I can't believe there are people here who hate Sarah Palin so much they are defending Steve Schmidt.

Posted by: steevy at March 12, 2012 03:23 PM (7W3wI)

5 Come on! That's just histrionics.

Posted by: vinman at March 12, 2012 03:24 PM (nEvyg)

6

This quote is actually not quite right. Only the first part is attributed to Alexander Tytler (and even that isn't for sure).

I made this same mistake a couple weeks ago.

Check this out:

http://www.lorencollins.net/tytler.html

Posted by: dan-O at March 12, 2012 03:24 PM (sWycd)

7 I woke up this am and there was pizza left over from last night. I love cold pizza in the morning.

Posted by: mike at March 12, 2012 03:24 PM (fCI3q)

8 So where is Ace?

Posted by: Pecos, Texas where women shoot their own snakes at March 12, 2012 03:24 PM (2Gb0y)

9 If you don't pay taxes you can't vote! Watch the Dems crap themselves over THAT!

Posted by: Txn4Evr at March 12, 2012 03:24 PM (oiyoj)

10 yeah whatever. deomocracy is not over until we say it is over.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 12, 2012 03:24 PM (Z9EHQ)

11 This quote has been attributed all over the place, but the closest thing anyone can come to it is in Democracy in America by DeToqueville. .

Posted by: Vic at March 12, 2012 03:25 PM (YdQQY)

12 I'd like to think that we're not going to go the way of the Hittites...or as the Babylonians called them, the Shittites.

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at March 12, 2012 03:25 PM (Ec6wH)

13 Where's Ace?

Posted by: Joe at March 12, 2012 03:25 PM (Y5I9o)

14 Tyler was riffing on Spengler

Posted by: Evil Midnight Bomber What Bombs at Midnight at March 12, 2012 03:25 PM (C3aqu)

Holy Shit.

Alexander Tyler is certaily a prophet. the 200 year thing seems a little convenient, and perhaps contrived.

Posted by: Gunslinger at March 12, 2012 03:25 PM (OyQf0)

If it cheers you up some, the quote is not from Tyler and is cobbled together from disparate sources.

http://tinyurl.com/4ktr4c

Also, it is not accurate. Athens fell when it lost a battle to Philip of Macedonia, The Roman Republic lasted several hundred years, and so on.

Posted by: Grey Fox at March 12, 2012 03:25 PM (qshfY)

Well, it seems that we outlived our "sell by" date as a prosperous and free people about, oh, twenty years ago.

Come on SMOD, I have a nice back yard all ready for you...

Here, meteor, meteor...

Posted by: BackwardsBoy with talent on loan from SMOD at March 12, 2012 03:26 PM (d0Tfm)

13 joe

washing his feet?

Posted by: phoenixgirl at work mourning andrew at March 12, 2012 03:26 PM (h8UT+)

19 The man who promises to rob Peter to pay Paul can depend on getting the vote of Paul.

Posted by: toby928© at March 12, 2012 03:27 PM (GTbGH)

20 Well, it seems that we outlived our "sell by" date as a prosperous and free people about, oh, twenty years ago.
---------------------------

Sad to say, our Constitution and freedom lasted a lot shorter than 200 years.

Posted by: Vic at March 12, 2012 03:27 PM (YdQQY)

21 >>Where's Ace?
Posted by: Joe

Bwahahaha

Posted by: Evil Midnight Bomber What Bombs at Midnight at March 12, 2012 03:27 PM (C3aqu)

22 the 200 year thing seems a little convenient, and perhaps contrived.

Posted by: Gunslinger at March 12, 2012 07:25 PM (OyQf0)

It is contrived. It wasn't part of the original quote.

Posted by: Grey Fox at March 12, 2012 03:27 PM (qshfY)

23 I'll gladly trade you a first round draft pick tomorrow for a hamburger today.

Posted by: Dan "Wimpy" Snyder at March 12, 2012 03:27 PM (/izg2)

Hmm.....are we in the 'apathy and dependence' stage right now? ....It sure seems like it.

Next step, bondage. .....Well, if Barky gets a 2nd term, then that's for sure what will happen. ....Starting with taking away our right to bear arms. ....Not sure how exactly he will do it, but he will find a way.

Posted by: wheatie at March 12, 2012 03:28 PM (aykLa)

25 lol look at my work hash.......

Posted by: phoenixgirl at work mourning andrew at March 12, 2012 03:28 PM (h8UT+)

26 Where's Ace?
Posted by: Joe

Ha!

Posted by: toby928© at March 12, 2012 03:28 PM (GTbGH)

27 Hola. So was there a thread about the army sgt who went wacko in Afghanistan?

Posted by: Y-not at March 12, 2012 03:29 PM (4Q04p)

28 StuckOnStupid, we're saving a seat for you.

Posted by: creeper at March 12, 2012 03:29 PM (gre5a)

29 The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.

My math is a little fuzzy but that means America has still got like, 1,800 years left.

Now what happened to that crayon I had up my nose?

Posted by: Joe Biden at March 12, 2012 03:29 PM (QKKT0)

30 I think Breitbart's death really affected ace and he needed some time off.

Posted by: steevy at March 12, 2012 03:30 PM (7W3wI)

31 I corrected the attribution a bit.

Posted by: OregonMuse at March 12, 2012 03:30 PM (Lnw7y)

32 60 Plus Launches $3.5 Million Ad Campaign Group highlights Independent Payment Advisory BoardÂ’s unchecked power ALEXANDRIA, VIRGINIA Â– The 60 Plus Association, nationally recognized as the conservative alternative to the liberal AARP, today launched a new ad campaign that highlights healthcare reformÂ’s impact on AmericaÂ’s seniors, including the creation of the Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB). Link: http://tinyurl.com/6qd2p28

Posted by: Miss80sBaby at March 12, 2012 03:30 PM (d6QMz)

33

Also, it's Tytler, not Tyler.

Posted by: dan-O at March 12, 2012 03:31 PM (sWycd)

"Sad to say, our Constitution and freedom lasted a lot shorter than 200 years."

Yup. Once the Prog/Coms got started disassembling our system back in the Roaring '20's, we've been on a downhill slide ever since, with the fall becoming steeper in the past three years than ever before.

We are so screwed...and we did it to ourselves by one of the things in the post quotes, apathy.

That, and smugness, the popular "well it can't happen here" fallacy.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy with talent on loan from SMOD at March 12, 2012 03:31 PM (d0Tfm)

35 27 No.

Posted by: steevy at March 12, 2012 03:31 PM (7W3wI)

36 200 years spans approximately 6 generations...if you think about a family business, it usually runs through 3 generations of family members before it goes tango uniform or the family sells it off. Perhaps the distance of time from founding to dissolution is ordained in some regard...based on what different generations value and reject.

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at March 12, 2012 03:31 PM (Ec6wH)

@27.....Not yet, Y-not.

Hey, how was your trip? Have fun? What was the deal with that jumper at the airport?

Posted by: wheatie at March 12, 2012 03:32 PM (aykLa)

38 "A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury.

Second look at the intellectual aristocracy?

Posted by: Socrates at March 12, 2012 03:32 PM (QKKT0)

ynot.....are you here?

Posted by: phoenixgirl at work mourning andrew at March 12, 2012 03:33 PM (h8UT+)

40 really, who cares? what is the point of the comment even? there ya go, time's up lay back and think of what was while the libtards and their minions have their way with you. seriously, nothing is over unless and until we say it is over. any fluketard can type some whining defeatist drivel but what is the point? oh yeah, it is neither prescient or original since de Tocqueville anticipated that two centuries ago. and another thing, when people refer to America as the last best hope or point out that democracy is the worst government except for everything else they are right. individual rights, free speech, self determination if you like those things you better double down on America because there is not anywhere else to get them in greater quality and quantity than here.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 12, 2012 03:33 PM (Z9EHQ)

41 Ah, it's a George Bernard Shaw quote I'm mutilating

"A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul."

Posted by: toby928© at March 12, 2012 03:33 PM (GTbGH)

42 Knoebels Amusement Resort in Elysburg Pennsylvania has the Alexander F Tyler quote prominently displayed on a walkway sign, inside the park. If you hate Disney's (Hollywood) politics, you would love a visit to Knoebels.

Posted by: Rocky at March 12, 2012 03:33 PM (l7aOc)

43 @27 & @35

I've been surfing the alphabets, looking at the comments on news stories covering the Afghan shootings. People are pissed and they want out NOW! Also, sentiment seems to be high for turning the shooter over to the Afghanis.

Posted by: creeper at March 12, 2012 03:34 PM (gre5a)

44
27 Hola. So was there a thread about the army sgt who went wacko in Afghanistan?

Posted by: Y-not at March 12, 2012 07:29 PM (4Q04p)

Is it my imagination, but I'm not seeing reports of bat shit craziness going on in Afghanistan since it involves women and children.

Posted by: YIKES! at March 12, 2012 03:34 PM (2TRSa)

45 There's no soldiers driven madness since BOOOOSH.

Posted by: Jodie code pink at March 12, 2012 03:35 PM (SEOs4)

46 Second look at the intellectual aristocracy?

Posted by: Socrates at March 12, 2012 07:32 PM (QKKT0)

Heck no. How would that be any different from what we have in Washington today? I'd prefer King George III over that - he was at least a decent man and a conscientious if inept monarch.

Posted by: Grey Fox at March 12, 2012 03:36 PM (qshfY)

47 Did you order the Code Red??

Posted by: Lt. Daniel Kaffee at March 12, 2012 03:36 PM (GTbGH)

48 Good trip. Bought a serigraph at the art fest walked alot ate well Flight is delayed tho so we are cooling our heels at the hotel. I havent been able to find an update re the jumper. I think thats even sadder... To commit suicide so publicly and have so little interest. Terrible news about our soldier losing it over there.

Posted by: Y-not at March 12, 2012 03:36 PM (4Q04p)

49 Knoebels has that?!?! wow!!! It's a great amusement park b/c you don't have to pay out the ash for admission - you pay just for the rides you ride. So my scaredycat kid didn't just cost me $45 for not riding anything but the log flume. and you can bring your own food!

Posted by: BlackOrchid at March 12, 2012 03:37 PM (SB0V2)

50 "A judge is a law student who marks his own examination papers."

Posted by: Henry Mencken at March 12, 2012 03:38 PM (GTbGH)

51 America was the first country to attempt a Constitutional Republic. The founders greatly distrusted a Democracy and made sure we did not have one. To quote Mel Gibson (who I am sure was quoting someone else) "Why should I trade one tyrant 3000 miles away for 3000 tyrants one mile away"?

The founders set up the federal government with a limited set of powers and even added the bill of rights after to assure that those powers could not grow. But it lasted only until Adams cooked up his scheme to have the Supreme Court determine what it meant and usurp all the power to the feds.

So, no we didn't lose it in the 1920, we lost it in the early 1800s shortly after it was written.

It was completely gone by the end of the FDR regime.

Posted by: Vic at March 12, 2012 03:38 PM (YdQQY)

52 Save the Soldier. Turn over the Generals and CiC.

Posted by: Pecos, Texas where women shoot their own snakes at March 12, 2012 03:38 PM (2Gb0y)

53 >>Second look at the intellectual aristocracy?

Um. No. Just no. zombieWFB jr agrees with me.

Posted by: Evil Midnight Bomber What Bombs at Midnight at March 12, 2012 03:39 PM (C3aqu)

54 Not that excuses him but I wonder if the shooter lost a friend or friends to Afghan treachery?

Posted by: steevy at March 12, 2012 03:39 PM (7W3wI)

"Democracy destroys itself because it abuses its right to freedom and equality. Because it teaches its citizens to consider audacity as a right, lawlessness as a freedom, abrasive speech as equality and anarchy as progress"

- Isocrates

Posted by: proudvastrightwingconspirator at March 12, 2012 03:39 PM (xoPDv)

56 We should not turn our soldier over to them. Our personnel should face military justice.

Posted by: Y-not at March 12, 2012 03:40 PM (4Q04p)

"It was completely gone by the end of the FDR regime."

Somehow, I don't feel any better.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy with talent on loan from SMOD at March 12, 2012 03:42 PM (d0Tfm)

58 Yes phoenixgal. I am in tempe waiting for my flt. We had a jam packed wkend. Exhausted now!

Posted by: Y-not at March 12, 2012 03:42 PM (4Q04p)

59 Mills in Tempe is like Bourbon Street! Lol

Posted by: Y-not at March 12, 2012 03:42 PM (4Q04p)

60 4 I can't believe there are people here who hate Sarah Palin so much they are defending Steve Schmidt.

Posted by: steevy at March 12, 2012 07:23 PM (7W3wI)

--You're shitting me. Right?

Posted by: logprof at March 12, 2012 03:42 PM (ykSKg)

61 "A tyrant is always stirring up some war or other, in order that the people may require a leader."

Posted by: Plato at March 12, 2012 03:43 PM (GTbGH)

62 That quote may have worked to a T in the past, but this time the good guys have better information, communication and an appreciation of individual rights and freedom, as well as what the commies' Cloward-Piven game plan is about.

....and did I mention the well armed populace part.

Posted by: ontherocks at March 12, 2012 03:44 PM (ZJCDy)

63
Probably wouldn't hurt waiting until the initial misinformation is discredited in regards to A-stan.

Some of the initial reports don't pass the smell test.

Posted by: irongrampa at March 12, 2012 03:45 PM (SAMxH)

64 >>>So, no we didn't lose it in the 1920, we lost it in the early 1800s shortly after it was written.

I agree there.
Â“But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist.Â”- Lysander Spooner

Posted by: Evil Midnight Bomber What Bombs at Midnight at March 12, 2012 03:45 PM (C3aqu)

65 The 300 tyrant quote was originally from Reverend Mather Byles of Boston, a loyalist.

Posted by: Vic at March 12, 2012 03:46 PM (YdQQY)

66 56 We should not turn our soldier over to them. Our personnel should face military justice. Posted by: Y-not at March 12, 2012 07:40 PM (4Q04p) do we have a sof treaty with afghanistan? I will bet someone in the white mosque suggested handing him over to the savages. I am sure the white mosque is mulling it over.

Posted by: yankeefifth at March 12, 2012 03:49 PM (Z9EHQ)

67 @ 66

Rest assured nothing will be done until the maximum political advantage to Obama can be assured.

Posted by: irongrampa at March 12, 2012 03:52 PM (SAMxH)

Well, if what happened with that misreading by the SC of the 14th Amendment was already happening for years before, then it's a fookin' wonder we've lasted as long as we have. I mean, I know what I've seen in my adult life (a slow motion suicide), but these past three years have been breathtaking in the speed and rapidity of our downfall at the hands of people we've stupidly elected.

And the worst part is, none of this ever needed to happen.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy with talent on loan from SMOD at March 12, 2012 03:54 PM (d0Tfm)

69 What do people think of the revelation that Michale Steele is responsible for changing the party rules, when he was RNC chairman, in order to increase the likelihood of a 2012 brokered convention?

This would suggest that if we're headed for a brokered convention, this may have less to do with the 2012 frontrunner's relative weakness (compared to past GOP nominees) and more to do with the game being rigged (by Steele) *in order to* result in a brokered convention. But I don't know enough about the numbers to conclude one way or another.

Via the Corner, from an article in Mother Jones:

<i>Moreover, the rules Steele bequeathed the party could yield an outcome in which Romney finishes with the most delegates, but not an outright majority, necessitating a brokered convention.

Â“I wanted a brokered convention,Â” Steele tells me. Â“That was one of my goals.Â” Why in the world would a party chairman desire apparent turmoil? To create excitement and shake up the party, Steele explains. Â…

Not all of the RNC officials at the time craved such creative disorder. Steele, recalls Doug Heye, then the RNCÂ’s communications director, Â“said in a few interviews that as a political junkie, heÂ’d like to see a brokered convention, and I counseled him that the party chairman may not want to advocate for chaos at a convention he has to manage.Â”</i>

Posted by: lael at March 12, 2012 03:57 PM (jvEwI)

70 I've gone and gotten myself far too completely bothered by the Rush Limbaugh Sandra Fluke/Bill Maher and others' Sarah Palin and other conservative women remarks. The hypocrisy of the whole deal just frosts me! Fine, it's their right to say that shit, but if you're gonna come down on Rush for saying what he said, you damn sure should also come down on everyone, even if they are a million dollar contributor to your campaign.

SCOAMF, incompetent f*cktard that he is, is "so concerned" about the world Sasha and Malia are growing up in, but only related to people like Rush. Why aren't more women besides ShePAC calling him out on this?

Posted by: Theresa knows the MSM are our enemy at March 12, 2012 03:58 PM (4/NHF)

71 Here's one of the reasons I so love Twitter, and also IowaHawk!

@iowahawkblog The president doesn't care about gas prices, but wants to help pay the cost of pumping Ethel.

Posted by: Theresa knows the MSM are our enemy at March 12, 2012 04:03 PM (4/NHF)

72 I love Iowahawk too. But he and Ace both are letting their blog slide.

Posted by: Pecos, Texas where women shoot their own snakes at March 12, 2012 04:11 PM (2Gb0y)

73 The name is Tytler, goofball. Tytler Cycle. Alexander Tytler.

Posted by: Warren Bonesteel at March 12, 2012 04:14 PM (MpJXw)

74 Speaking of Soledad. Am I missing something? Reading some of her bios she is described as bi-racial. In fact one claims that her parents could not get married in Maryland because at that time that state did not allow bi-racial marriages. If her Mother was Cuban and her Father Australian, what race is that and how does that qualify as an interracial marriage?

Posted by: Buffalobob at March 12, 2012 04:16 PM (qiFDD)

75 So we lose the morning Doom and then start sprinkling some around while I am relaxing before dinner? On a Monday? After a time change? Well if civilizations get complacent, we must have more than one in the US because that's not the one I am in.

Posted by: Lurking Through The Desert...the Slut Dried Up...Sock I'm Riding Needs A Name at March 12, 2012 04:19 PM (Q5fHc)

76 Greg is the kind of guy who tries to negotiate bulk discounts for Girl Scout cookies.

Posted by: Warden at March 12, 2012 04:21 PM (I1w2T)

77 In fact one claims that her parents could not get married in Maryland because at that time that state did not allow bi-racial marriages. If her Mother was Cuban and her Father Australian,what race is that and how does that qualify as an interracial marriage?

Is this a math question from the FCAT?

Posted by: no good deed at March 12, 2012 04:21 PM (mjR67)

78 In fact one claims that her parents could not get married in Maryland because at that time that state did not allow bi-racial marriages. If her Mother was Cuban and her Father Australian,what race is that and how does thatqualify as an interracial marriage? Posted by: Buffalobob at March 12, 2012 08:16 PM (qiFDD) Hispanic/Black ---White. No no in Maryland until 1967. Another reason that "liberal" state is a sham.

Posted by: CAC at March 12, 2012 04:26 PM (ty0yn)

79 @72
Pecos, unless you're hosting an award-winning blog I suggest you reconsider trashing Ace and the Iowahawk.

Posted by: creeper at March 12, 2012 04:27 PM (gre5a)

80 79. I just miss their input. No offense intended.

Posted by: Pecos, Texas where women shoot their own snakes at March 12, 2012 04:33 PM (2Gb0y)

81 To those lurking here for an update from StuckOnStupid, it's here:

http://tinyurl.com/7ylaqmr

Posted by: creeper at March 12, 2012 05:45 PM (gre5a)

82 Pecos @80

I hear you. I wish Iowahawk would post more often than every two weeks. At least what he puts up is worth waiting for.

Let's give Ace some time. I think he's had a rough couple of weeks.

Sorry about the lecture.

Posted by: creeper at March 12, 2012 05:48 PM (gre5a)

83 We're not a democracy, but a republic. ...and... We aint dead, just napping.

Posted by: subconch at March 12, 2012 06:12 PM (gmO6z)

84 We aint dead, just napping. http://www.raybanlunettesfr.net/rb9053s_180_87-2822.html http://www.raybanlunettesfr.net/rb4148_824_51_7-2823.html http://www.raybanlunettesfr.net/rb4148_824_51_7-2823.html http://www.raybanlunettesfr.net/rb2140_1091_51_1-2824.html

Posted by: tn requin pas cher at March 12, 2012 06:22 PM (279LY)

85 I didn't dot it ^

Posted by: subconch at March 12, 2012 06:32 PM (gmO6z)

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