1 FOIST! And I HATE drones!

2 It's for the children.

3 I don't think so, Skippy.....

4 Wasn't it "Give me liberty"? Sorry for semantics just curious...

5 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

6 Now the "black helicopter" crowd can say they are right,except it's UAV's not helicopters.

7 Thanks, Scottye_fl.  Fixed.

8 Nanny's are like addicts; they can't seem to stop.

9 Be right Back..... preppin the folks for the heavy hand of govt surveillance.

10

"Give me liberty . . ."

And this drone/camera/electronic eavesdropping shit is insane.   But now that it's in place, it will never, ever go away.

We no longer have  a free society.  Makes one wonder if it isn't better to be a socialist overlord than fight for something that's never coming back short of complete societal breakdown.

11 Drones? How bad can that be?

I'm sure these Americans operating these drones can be trusted.. right? right?

12 Screw Obama stopping it. Call your Congresscritter and ask him why the hell he isn't stopping it.

13

not in my airspace...

now, off to my garage to modify my spud gun.

14

It'll be sweet. 

Think about it -

I won't have to wait until Americans move to Yemen before I assasinate them!

15 The problem I have is the government not making the case for drones to the American people. It's almost like they don't have to answer to us. They just throw these things up in the air and don't have to explain it? You ever see those warning signs on the highway that state, " Speed Monitored By Police Aircraft"???? Where are the GUTLESS CONGRESSIONAL REPUBLICANS on this invasion of privacy?

16 Makes one wonder if it isn't better to be a socialist overlord than fight for something that's never coming back Sorry, but it doesn't me.

17

When a judge ruled against the police planting a GPS device on a drug dealers car, wouldn't this fall under the same purview?

18 Silly wingers..... these are not the drones you are looking for.

19 Explain why a piloted helicopter is ok while a remote control quadrotor (or other aircraft) is a attack on the Constitution and Liberty? In BOTH cases there's a human being in control. One is further away than the other. So? You can make coherent an argument that drones over America are bad. But if you don't apply the same argument to piloted helicopters - you're not making sense.

20 Just shoot the fucking drones down, nobody in them so you can't be charged with attempted murder of a LEO.

21 Hey PAUL RYAN, MARCO RUBIO, RAND PAUL, JIM DEMINT, AND MIKE LEE, how do you feel about drones in the sky looking up my ass for no reason?

22 But these drones are only gonna be used to monitor the borders and the illegals right? ...... Oh wait I just woke up. never mind

23 --but asking an illegal immigrant to show ID means the Third Reich is just around the corner.

War is peace.

Freedom is slavery.

24 Watch the video.

25 On the other hand, I am concerned about the safely implications. The skies are crowded over major cities and remote control aircraft SUCK at looking out for other planes.

26 Hey PAUL RYAN, MARCO RUBIO, RAND PAUL, JIM DEMINT, AND MIKE LEE, how do you feel about drones in the sky looking up my ass for no reason? Posted by: Sam I Am at May 14, 2012 08:57 PM (AzwZn) Do you walk around on your hands or with mirrors on your shoes?

27

Don't even think about flying them  over a mosque!

28 Also keep in mind that the far more restricted boundaries on phone taps (i.e., warrants required, only international calls) were met with outrage! from the Left, but now that their Man is in charge it's all good.

29  Watch the video.

Posted by: rdbrewer at May 14, 2012 08:58 PM (Iyg03)

 

Next you'll want us to read the post. 

Sorry, not falling for it.

30 Posted by: CAIR at May 14, 2012 08:59 PM (Br0dO)


I used to fuck goats in Indonesia.

31 I know this is more of a legal eagle concern.... .... but..... if those drones are assets of the DoD..... one would think posse comitatus comes into play.

32

Posted by: logprof at May 14, 2012 09:00 PM (ykSKg)

 

Did you have that baby swept for bugs before you brought him home from the hospital?

33 I don't mind drones on the border looking for invaders. Drones looking for my weed on the other hand ...

34 The next time the fuckin' drug warriors around here give me the ol " if you're not doing anything wrong , you got nothing to worry about " spiel , I'm gonna fuckin' lose it . The anti drug crusaders own this shit .

35 UAV's are worse because they have such long endurance.They will soon be capable of loitering for days at a time.A relay of helicopters is much harder to keep up and can only be carefully targeted.UAV's can cover huge swathes of territory.Constant police/government surveillance of essentially everyone.

36 Explain why a piloted helicopter is ok while a remote control quadrotor (or other aircraft) is a attack on the Constitution and Liberty? ----------------------------------------- I KNOW what piloted helicopters are looking for. I've seen the warning signs. They are looking for me exceeding the speed limit. What are these drones doing? I haven't seen a warning sign for them yet.

37 I used to think my next door neighbor the paranoid survivalist was off his rocker. Sadly though I'm starting to wonder if maybe he's the only one on the block with a clue. Scary stuff.

38 You, lady in the white!

Lookin' fine. That is all, citizen.

39 Just shoot the fucking drones down, nobody in them so you can't be charged with attempted murder of a LEO.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at May 14, 2012 08:57 PM (ZOf1l)

------

You'd first have to be able to see it, which I don't think you can. Hypothetically you'd need radar, and a plane. Plus whatever you use to shoot at it.

40 Maybe FOX will be the first network to have it's own Drone? Next time OJ takes off we can follow him from the drone

41

You can make coherent an argument that drones over America are bad. But if you don't apply the same argument to piloted helicopters - you're not making sense.<<<

 

What that fuckin guy said.

42 I know this is more of a legal eagle concern.... .... but..... if those drones are assets of the DoD..... one would think posse comitatus comes into play. -------------------------------------- I heard today that those drones are "invaluable assets to law enforcement". No examples were given to back that statement up.

43

You, lady in the white!

Lookin' fine. That is all, citizen.

 

Can I add a 'Get your Freak on Girlie!' to that?

44 Maybe FOX will be the first network to have it's own Drone? Next time OJ takes off we can follow him from the drone **** Can you just imagine what it would have been like had Shep been around back then?

45 You can make coherent an argument that drones over America are bad. But if you don't apply the same argument to piloted helicopters - you're not making sense. ------- Try this..... Who's doing the piloting, the observation, the maintenance, the funding???? The FED ??? - or your local sherrifs department.

46 Some of those drones fly to high to shoot down . At least with anything your average moron has to hand .

47 You'd first have to be able to see it, which I don't think you can. Hypothetically you'd need radar, and a plane. Plus whatever you use to shoot at it. A plane? Naahh.. I'll just wait till the ATF starts selling stingers to the drug cartels in Mexico, head for a gun store in Texas and pick a few up.

48 Refer to the movie Enemy of the State with Will Smith and Gene Hackman for more details. Though they didn't use drones in that movie.
 
Or you can read a lot more about the militarization of our police in this article by Radley Balko, formerly of Reason but this particular article is in the dreaded HuffPo, where he now works:
 
According to Eastern Kentucky University criminologist Peter Kraska, the number of SWAT raids carried out each year in America has jumped dramatically over the last generation or so, from just a few thousand in the 1980s to around 50,000 by the mid-2000s, when Kraska stopped his survey. He found that the vast majority of the increase is attributable to the drug war -- namely warrant service on low-to-mid-level drug offenders. A number of federal policies have driven the trend, including offering domestic police departments military training, allowing training with military organizations, using "troops-to-cops" programs and offering surplus military equipment and weaponry to domestic police police departments for free or at major discounts. There has also been a constant barrage of martial rhetoric from politicians and policymakers.
 
http://tinyurl.com/88koj5s (caution HuffPo linky)

49 UAV's used over the US will be operated by State and local LE not the military.FBI too .

50 You, lady in the white!Lookin' fine. That is all, citizen. Can I add a 'Get your Freak on Girlie!' to that? **** You failed to mention the milkshake.

51 If we're gonna let DOD Drones fly and snoop then I don't see any reason why we can't arm all our Military, especial Reserve Navy Dentists, and let us pack when we're in Uniform. Just a thought

52 I'm being run off the computer . bbl .

53 You there...

I saw you pick your nose during the 5th inning... You are disgusting, citizen.

54 EOJ, Arthur, both of you guys are wrong.  Thinking helicopters are just like drones.  You can hear a helicopter.  You can see it.  They're expensive to run.  You don't expect them to be watching your every move.

You know, the Supreme Court just decided vehicle tracking devices are not just like cops following you around in a car.

55 If we're gonna let DOD Drones fly and snoop then I don't see any reason why we can't arm all our Military, especial Reserve Navy Dentists, and let us pack when we're in Uniform. Just a thought And we would have gotten away with it too! If it hadn't have been for those damn Navy Dentists! Hmm.. nahh.. lol

56 -You'd first have to be able to see it, which I don't think you can. Hypothetically you'd need radar, and a plane. Plus whatever you use to shoot at it.


Well, there are a lot of smart mofo's here and I know how to shoot. That's at least a start. Also, I know where to look for the surveillance van.

57 It was only a matter of time.

58 Posted by: TSA Agent that sniffed your dido It's airline policy not to imply ownership in the event of a dildo. Use the indefinite article. A dildo. Never your dildo. Never say the dildo accidentally turned itself on. A dildo activated itself and created an emergency situation that required the evacuating of your baggage.

59 If you have an acreage and you like to walk around naked on your property, well, think again.  Some think you have no privacy from above.

Cuz helicopters can fly over.

60 You can make coherent an argument that drones over America are bad. But if you don't apply the same argument to piloted helicopters - you're not making sense.<<< What that fuckin guy said. ------------------------------------- Bullshit. I can SEE a piloted helicopter. And frankly, I don't see a whole helluva lot of them. So when i do see them, they tend to grab my attention. And when they grab my attention, I get curious and begin to ask questions. Can't do that with a drone can you?

61 Drones are the lowest scum on the face of the earth.

62 Cuz helicopters can fly over.

Posted by: rdbrewer at May 14, 2012 09:09 PM (Iyg03)

 

Flying over and targeted surveilence are two different things.  Sorry.

63 Hey,why not just make tv's 2 way so they can keep us all under surveillance relatively cheaply?

64 Remember Bush Derangement Syndrome?  "Bush wants a police state" and "Bush is going to cancel the elections" and so on?

Well, it was all projection.

What they accused Bush of doing is what they actively WANT their candidates to do and may very well be planing to do.  They WANT a police state with freedom only for chosen groups.

65 Can't do that with a drone can you? Posted by: Sam I Am at May 14, 2012 09:09 PM (AzwZn) Well you can buy the Drone Detector from Ronco for $29.99. Guaranteed or your money back. Shipping extra. MC, Visa, and Amex accepted.

66

As Charles Krauthammer said on Special Report this evening, drones are instruments of war.<<<

 

So is the Berretta 92 series, the M 16/M 4 family, and the Mossberg 500 shotgun.  And yet all are available for both civilian ownership and police use. 

 

Hell, YouTube will show you how to mod an RC plane into a drone.

 

They're cheaper and safer to operate than choppers, with longer loiter time.  Not every PD can field their own aircraft, but drone technology will put those capabilities within reach of a lot more cities, as well as the potential for SAR applications.

67 I dunno. This sort of thing doesn't bother me.

68 We do the work. Who gets the pussy?

69 Meanwhile, that Mara Liasson is one disturbing looking individual.

70 As soon as I first heard about military drones used in combat areas, I knew that it was only a matter of time before they would be used for domestic law enforcement. This isn't a Democrat or Republican issue. It's an issue of totalitarian statism vs. limited Constitutional government. Right now, both the D and R parties are firmly on the side of statism.

71 Why not just put closed circuit surveillance cameras everywhere?

72 43 eoj, I'll take a stab at your coherent argument request -- It's the difference between red light cameras and being ticketed by your local, live gendarme. First, you can talk to/argue with the cop. Second, he might just give you a warning. Third, he has to show up in court to defend his case against you. Fourth, you can subpeona his testimony and get it under oath.
 
Try doing any of that to a red light camera (or a drone).

73 I guess the real problem is that we don't have CLEAR right to privacy protected in the constitution but something unclear in a penumbra of an emanation. I agree that we have a right to privacy. But if it's not spelled out in the Con, there'll be endless arguments about what's allowed and not allowed. Drones, CCTV cameras - all because we don't have the right to privacy spelled out IN PRINT.

74

Why not just put closed circuit surveillance cameras everywhere?

 

Done and done.

75 Haven't some drones been shot down? I swear I saw that a few months ago. Also I believe there's an issue with private drone use. Now that is a fascinating legal issue if I keep the drone out of flight zones can I monitor my own land with it?

76 Why not just put closed circuit surveillance cameras everywhere? Brilliant!

77 Well you can buy the Drone Detector from Ronco for $29.99. Guaranteed or your money back. Shipping extra. MC, Visa, and Amex accepted. ***** And as an added bonus, we'll toss in the Pocket Fisherman FREE!. Simply pay the postage and handling of $49.95.

78 So is the Berretta 92 series, the M 16/M 4 family, and the Mossberg 500 shotgun. And yet all are available for both civilian ownership and police use.

Yeah, and you see pistols and shotguns invading people's privacy with streaming video all the time.  There was a dude the other day trying to rub one out in the walled privacy of his backyard caught on 9mm Beretta video.

79 34 Posted by: logprof at May 14, 2012 09:00 PM (ykSKg)

Did you have that baby swept for bugs before you brought him home from the hospital?

Posted by: garrett at May 14, 2012 09:01 PM (Br0dO)

--I hope someone did waste time and effort bugging him: They got nothing but crying, snoring, farting and burping.

80 Well you can buy the Drone Detector from Ronco for $29.99. Guaranteed or your money back. Shipping extra. MC, Visa, and Amex accepted. ----- Theres an app for that.

81 all your drones are belong to us!

82 No no You're thinking wrong about the airport nude o scopes If you could imagine my skinny ass naked...... Its like revenge on the tsa

83 79 Also I believe there's an issue with private drone use. Now that is a fascinating legal issue if I keep the drone out of flight zones can I monitor my own land with it? I don't have a problem with that, just as I don't have a problem with stores using closed circuit cameras to monitor the premises.

84 It is all bullshit. Even if I was cultivating marijuana in my acreage, I still don't think the local, state, feds have the right to fly over my farm to find it unless they got off of their lazy asses and did the required footwork necessary to get a lawful warrant. Once they have the lawful warrant, then do your worst. I say this as a 10 year law enforcement officer. I don't give a fuck what the feds say, my land is the same as the airspace above it. You can't use anything against it unless you have a lawful warrant. All flying over it means is that the cops have to start doing some buy-busts or a CI to be able to legally get a warrant.

85

EOJ, Arthur, both of you guys are wrong. Thinking helicopters are just like drones. You can hear a helicopter. You can see it. They're expensive to run. You don't expect them to be watching your every move.<<<<

 

Where did I say they are "just like helicopters"?

They are SIMILAR in that they can both be used as airborne surveillance platforms.

 

And can you see every surveillance camera that is currently installed in your area? I guarantee you don't. You may be under surveillance RIGHT NOW.

 

DUNH, DUNH, DUUHHHNH!

86 > 52 UAV's used over the US will be operated by State and local LE not the military.FBI too . Posted by: steevy Something like 40% of recent Calif budgets were paid by Federal money. It seems like EVERY stimulus bill has fed money for police. How do you think they have all the money for expensive SWAT gear?

87 They're cheaper and safer to operate than choppers, with longer loiter time.

And that's a reason for you to use them on US citizens?

Not every PD can field their own aircraft, but drone technology will put those capabilities within reach of a lot more cities, as well as the potential for SAR applications.

So?

88 Remember when SCOAMF threatened the Jonas Brothers with Predator drones, and everyone thought he was joking?

89 I agree with Dr. K, but I don't see how it is stopped.

Drone tech is going nowhere except better and better. It is already legal for a piloted aircraft to be used in law enforcement (speed check over highways, for instance).

90 I was promised flying cars. Fuckin' bait and switch.

91 "A watched citizen is a compliant citizen." Forward ! ! ! !

92 @61 He said Dido, dammit. Don't you recognize an Aeneid quote when you see it?

93

The drones will probably be flying over inner city hoods, that's where the crime is.

 

A drone flying over country farm land will find what? A farmer?

 

 

The drone program will continue but it will be accused of racism, blah fucking blah.

94 EOJ:  "They're cheap, so we should use them on US citizens."

95 SHOOT THEM DOWN

96 So personal star wars. You get your own armed drone to take theirs down. Hell on the birds.

97

Cheating wives and slutty daughters of law enforcement officers hardest hit.

98 M16 rifles are available for civilian use?

Whoa, that would be nice.

Alas, EJ is wrong. Automatic assault rifles are against the law, with a few grandfathered exceptions.

99 > 57 EOJ, Arthur, both of you guys are wrong. Thinking helicopters are just like drones. You can hear a helicopter. You can see it. They're expensive to run. You don't expect them to be watching your every move. Posted by: rdbrewer So a cop on the corner is ok, but a cop with binoculars on top of the police station is not? What about a cop with REALLY good eyesight? What about a drug sniffing robot? Bad? But we allow drug sniffing dogs! (see my other comment about needing right to privacy spelled out)

100 90 Absolutely.9/11 opened the floodgates,that's why evey little shit town has fully armored,SWAT teams.

101 You know what else is cheaper, EOJ?  Vehicle tracking devices. 

102 You can make coherent an argument that drones over America are bad. But if you don't apply the same argument to piloted helicopters - you're not making sense. Posted by: Comrade Arthur

"Amendment VI

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right [...] to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him ..."

I'm going to accuse you, citizen, of a crime. Do you know who I am?

103 >>The drones will probably be flying over inner city hoods, that's where the crime is.

First one gets some sort of court injunction because of the raaaaaaacism.

>>A drone flying over country farm land will find what? A farmer?

Pot farms.

104 Wait till Google gets it's own drone

105

Yeah, and you see pistols and shotguns invading people's privacy with streaming video all the time. There was a dude the other day trying to rub one out in the walled privacy of his backyard caught on 9mm Beretta video.<<<

 

You keep dry humping your strawman and you're going to get a rash.

106 And who says they have to fly over your property?
They can fly along state easements at altitude and see for miles on either side.

107 I would love to know what makes video autoplay when I'm reading the HQ on my Fire.

108 The other thing they won't be used for?  Enforcing the border.

109

Posted by: Samuel Adams at May 14, 2012 09:18 PM (ZOf1l)

 

Fuckin' A Right. 

Where are you drinking?  I'm calling right now and buying you your next round.

110 EOJ won't address cogent points, like the one about vehicle tracking devices.

And the recent Supreme Court case.

Because, hey, privacy doesn't really mean much to him.  That's where he's coming from on this.

111 94 I was promised flying cars. How about nano quadrotors hovering outside your bedroom window instead?

112 Wait till Google gets it's own drone ***** They already have one. It travels at street level.

113 I gotta get going on that video cloaking technology so my house and yard look like an open field from the sky.

114 Krauthammer was in rare form.

Skynet?  You're soaking in it.

115 The implication I get from the use of military drones over the US is the use of imaging technology that's currently only used against non-US targets. Not just the detailed imagery crap that movies like "Enemy of The State" blab about, but x-ray imagery technology that could let the operator see inside a residential home.

116 Yeah, and you see pistols and shotguns invading people's privacy with streaming video all the time. There was a dude the other day trying to rub one out in the walled privacy of his backyard caught on 9mm Beretta video. Rd, look, how many times do I have to apologize? I swear I thought the rabbit I was chasing went under your fence and the video my Beretta took was strictly accidental. How as I supposed to know you were having some "me" time.. lol

117 This isn't a privacy issue, it's an unreasonable search issue.  I don't care if drones and/or helicopters fill the skies, as long as an appropriate warrant is issued AND as long as coincidental data are not used.

118 >>A drone flying over country farm land will find what? A farmer? ....Yup.... selling unpasteurized milk and homebutchered ham at the Country Market. Wonder when the FDA is gonna get Hellfire's??

119 Discovery channel is gonna have a new show.  Redneck Drone Hunters from Middle Earth!  You can guess what it will be about!

120 They would have to have probable cause to fly over your farm etc. in theory. Of course they are supposed to have probable cause to point a radar gun at you too but they don't.

121 This February, private citizens shot down a surveillance drone operated by an animal rights group. From The Blaze:
 
http://tinyurl.com/6r3jw6v

122 Fuck. Satellites. Satellites have been capable of looking up your asshole for years. I don't care. I want my Sirius radio.

123

This is unusual, but you're going to have to go fuck yourself on this one, rdbrewer.

 

How about I give my own fucking opinion and you give yours?

 

 

 

 

 

124 Automatic assault rifles are against the law, with a few grandfathered exceptions.

There are many thousands of Class 3 full auto weapons in circulation.  FOPA 86' prohibited the manufacture of NEW ones for domestic sale. 

All you need to buy one is local LE approval and pay the BATF tax.

125 Discovery channel is gonna have a new show. Redneck Drone Hunters from Middle Earth! You can guess what it will be about! When and where can I audition?

126 all because we don't have the right to privacy spelled out IN PRINT.

Posted by: Comrade Arthur at May 14, 2012 09:14 PM (5H1lG)

In Alaska, we sure as hell do have a right to privacy, spelled out in as many words, in the state constitution. Feds be damned.

Of course, I doubt much of Alaska is likely to be under surveillance anyway, allowing as how there aren't that may Alaskans. But I will bet there are some freaky deaky tourists coming through this summer, yes I do.

127 I predict this issue is a loser, and here is why.

Arguments will be made that it is more efficient (cost per hour of operation) to use drones rather than piloted aircraft for purposes of airborne surveillance.

128 123 Yeah,there's no right to privacy in public but these can and will look into peoples homes.

129 EOJ, his mouth is much wider than his knowledge. 

130 How long until they are used by the EPA to monitor the heat coming from your house, monitor the pollution coming from a local power plant?

131 > 114 EOJ won't address cogent points, like the one about vehicle tracking devices. And the recent Supreme Court case. Posted by: rdbrewer -i- didn't answer anything about GPS tracking because this was a thread about DRONES. But if you must know, if the cops put a GPS on my car, then I have a right to sell it on Ebay!

132 When "Black Thunder" was looking into that woman's condo, you didn't mind looking.  Did you?

133 When "Black Thunder" was looking into that woman's condo, you didn't mind looking. Did you? Blue... blue thunder.

134 Can't wait until a few of these crash and kill people in the US.

135 Posted by: garrett at May 14, 2012 09:23 PM (Br0dO)


Southern Comfort on the rocks.

136 Blue Thunder.  Yes.  Thanks SoS.

137 How about nano quadrotors hovering outside your bedroom window instead?

Hobbyists are building these in droves using COTS technology.  With the new 2.4Ghz R/C radio gear, they could be flown almost anywhere successfully.

138 This is what I despise about Fourth Amendment and privacy arguments with non-lawyers and non-constitutional scholars.

But, hey, you have your opinion.  And it will be expressed without any recognition of the depth of the issue.  So, by all means, fill this thread with your wisdom.

139 When "Black Thunder" was looking into that woman's condo, you didn't mind looking. Did you? Blue... blue thunder. **** Black Thunder was my nickname back in the day.

140 > 132 I predict this issue is a loser, and here is why. Arguments will be made that it is more efficient (cost per hour of operation) to use drones rather than piloted aircraft for purposes of airborne surveillance. Posted by: navybrat True. But, in reality, the cost savings don't exist but the money will be spent on... more drones!

141 Hey Barrack!!!! Guess what !!! "Where is John Galt"...??? Our drone found him in Wyoming!!

142 All you need to buy one is local LE approval and pay the BATF tax.

Posted by: Purple Avenger at May 14, 2012 09:26 PM (Lo/y1)

 

...And a boatload of disposable income to go with a friendly CLEO, the latter of which is not guaranteed.

143 Did you see the youtube video of them flying in formation?

144 Blue Thunder. Yes. Thanks SoS. No worries - still remember that movie from years ago, saw it in the theaters. The plot, eh.. so so - but watching that monster cannon rip the cop car in half? Yup.. that was worth watching more than once - lol.

145

Okay, last comment for awhile.

 

I'm not getting drawn into a fucking banning because a co-blogger has his ass in his shoulders tonight.

 

Go ahead and take over my side of the conversation, rdbrewer.  You made a start of it already.

146 -i- didn't answer anything about GPS tracking because this was a thread about DRONES.

The argument was put forth, Arthur, that drones are cheaper and they can loiter longer.  They're convenient, in other words.  Just like the reasons for GPS tracking.

147 The U.S. is one of a handful of countries where police are generally respected and trusted.  They shouldn't take that for granted.

148 so where are all the liberal dickheads who go into a tizzy over police surveillance cameras? You know, those cameras that let the cops see crimes as they're actually being committed? (I have a good recollection of a news story out of Scotland, I get a daily news email from The Scotsman, which suggested that the police might not be able to prevent the crime, but at least they can get an ambulance to a crime scene in time to keep some young drunken laddie from bleeding to death after his new found friend kick the shit out of him.)
Oh, yeah, we're in BarkyWorld now, it's for yer own good. Zip it.

149 And a boatload of disposable income

I prefer to buy mine from the local Mexican cartel guys.  They get all that quality BATF stuff cheap and pass on the saving to their customers.

150

How about nano quadrotors hovering outside your bedroom window instead?

 

Come to My Window

http://tinyurl.com/ylx7hwa

151 Law abiding citizens should not be under near constant surveillance.No,security camera as they run their errands don't count.Policew UAV's or CC cameras do count.

152 I just realized what this thread reminds me of: Mac, Charlie, and Dennis from It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia. I'll let you guess as to who is who.

153

@70: "So is the Berretta 92 series, the M 16/M 4 family, and the Mossberg 500 shotgun. And yet all are available for both civilian ownership and police use....
They're cheaper and safer to operate than choppers, with longer loiter time. Not every PD can field their own aircraft, but drone technology will put those capabilities within reach of a lot more cities, as well as the potential for SAR applications."

 

That's still not much justification for police having drones, M-4s, etc.  Their jobs don't require them to have that kind of stuff.  It's one thing to have a specialized unit for high-risk hostage rescues and other serious bad-news situations.  That's what SWAT was originally for.  The problem is that it all of that stuff *will* get expanded use.  SWAT units have been used in conjuction with student loan collections, for example. 

It's all just incremental statism, anyway.  Get people used to police that are pretty well indistinguishable from soldiers.  Get them used to surveillance everywhere and all the time.  Get them used to every form of communication being subject to being monitored.  I mean, it's not like any of that could *ever* be turned against the law-abiding (or should I say the mostly-law-abiding, given the whole three-felonies-a-day thing.)

154 But don't they all have to be manned by Geordi LaForge virtually through his visor?

155 @117 video cloaking technology so my house and yard look like an open field from the sky.

You do realize that's right out of Atlas Shrugged, don't you?
And that new oil dome in NW Colorado, greater than all the rest of the world combined  -- right where Ellis Wyatt set off his Torch?

All I want to know is, how the fuck did she know?

I'd be watching out for ultrasonic sound beams, if I was us, which I am.

156 off sock

157 Hey Barrack!!!! Guess what !!! "Where is John Galt"...???

Our drone found him in Wyoming!!

Posted by: Janet Napolitano at May 14, 2012 09:29 PM (ffV1/)

 

That sneaky shit...our owner's manual said he'd be in Colorado!

158

Pot farms.

Posted by: HeatherRadish at May 14, 2012 09:22 PM (hO8IJ)

 

 

There is that.

 

It's huge in SE Ohio Appalachia.

 

I helped build a church in Vinton County and the grand opening was celebrated under and 80' x 100' tent.

 

An Ohio State Patrol helo became interested and damn near blew the thing over.

 

I guess they thought we were growing weed or something.

159 Go ahead and take over my side of the conversation, rdbrewer. You made a start of it already. Ok, not sure where or how all this got started, have been getting some work done around the house so I haven't had a chance to read back through the whole thread. But quick suggestion to all concerned, take a few minutes to read through what's already been said, and do so with the thought that maybe you are taking certain responses more personally than they were meant. Just a thought, I'll bow out of this now.

160 With respect, I disagree with the original post. Drones are just a tool, they're a cost saving measure to achieve a capability that police departments already have: aerial surveillance. Blocking a technology just because it makes the police's job cheaper is a non-argument. Were there protests about the police buying automobiles before cars became ubiquitous? "Why does the police state need to get from one place to another so quickly? The police have always been a-horseback and allowing them to gallavant at triple the speed will allow them to cover three times as much area... the beginning's of the kaiser's Germany!" It's ridiculous. The answer is that individual communities and states are going to have to put guidelines and restrictions on the police use of drones (or rather aerial surveillance) such that it does not become an undue burden on the privacy of the citizens of that community. Putting common sense restrictions on the use of aerial surveillance is a much more effective and less hysterical response that the banning of drones.

161 156 Ewwww,there's one window I definately DON'T want to look into.

162 So people are really worried about this? Geez, I'm not.

163 How many constitutional scholars  with surveilence drones does it take to screw in a lightbulb spot a tranny?

164 Home made stinger missile kits on Ebay?  You dont say?

165 @167 ^This.

166 I'd be watching out for ultrasonic sound beams, if I was us, which I am. Tinfoil hats. Problem solved.

167 153 The U.S. is one of a handful of countries where police are generally respected and trusted. They shouldn't take that for granted.

Posted by: LIGuy at May 14, 2012 09:31 PM (+usC4)

Those are just people who haven't had exposure to them yet. Give them time.

168

 But don't they all have to be manned by Geordi LaForge virtually through his visor?

 

It beats  having to look at Guinan.

169 167 Not the same,look at my post #37.

170 I agree with Arthur and EOJ (a first!!!) on this all the way Courts have ruled over and over that you have no right to privacy when actions are done in plain view This is meh at best

171 Ohio State Highway Patrol, as it were.

172 Posted by: mallfly at May 14, 2012 09:31 PM (bJm7W)


Private businesses have the right to install security cameras, public not so much. Even traffic cams used as a "public service" are bullshit. They are never used as a public service.

173 The dope farms show up on IR imaging.  I have a friend who works narcotics with the PBSO and he says people are always trying to hide their shit between the rows of sugar cane, but it shows right up on the thermal imaging.  Apparently pot has a different heat signature than sugar cane.

174 "Also, I know where to look for the surveillance van." If they can operate a drone over Pakistan from Nevada, they can operate a drone over your house from Nevada too.

175 Tinfoil hats. Problem solved.

Posted by: StuckOnStupid at May 14, 2012 09:35 PM (R5yLq)

 

We tried that on a goat, just for grins.  Your hat will totally protect you.

176 Posted by: Melissa Etheridge in the Library with a Turkey Baster of Crosby at May 14, 2012 09:32 PM (Br0dO)


Thanks, I just threw up in my mouth.

177 If they can operate a drone over Pakistan from Nevada, they can operate a drone over your house from Tehran too. ..... FIFY..... Inshallah!!

178 Helicopters are great and revolutionized the battlefield in many ways but UAV's are the 21st century revolution.They are far and away different surveillance assets than helicopters.

179 Yeah in what way could drones be used to collect revenue--because that's what most public "safety citations" are foranyway. **** Highway speeding

180 I agree with Arthur and EOJ (a first!!!) on this all the way
Courts have ruled over and over that you have no right to privacy when actions are done in plain view.

A lone time ago, I had a girlfriend that liked to do it in the either of our backyards.  Were we in plain view?

But it doesn't have be sex or something intrinsically private.  If I want to make mud pies and entertain my stuffed toys with a make-believe tea party on my property, I'm not in plain view.

End of story.

181 The other side of the argument is, if you have nothing to hide, then you have nothing to worry about. My answer is, I have everything to hide, fucker, especially from the government.

182 The only way I don't have a reasonable expectation of privacy is if my neighbor's window is looks over my property.  Maybe.

183 Yeah in what way could drones be used to collect revenue

Construction done without permits that's hidden behind a fence.  Issuance of citations for overgrown lots, hidden junk cars, etc.  The code enforcement nazis could have a field day with them and not have to get sweaty driving around in the heat.

184 How about some really big kites or home defense mini blimps?  Money!

185 My answer is, I have everything to hide, fucker,especially from the government. ------- Give it time Jimmah.... very soon you will have to hide everything you have from the govt.

186 Make no mistake,the sensors on those UAV';s can look into your house,into your car.They can zoom in to read your lips when you have a conversation.

187

 If I want to make mud pies and entertain my stuffed toys

 

** Sigh ** - I miss Reggie.

188 PULL !!

189 .They can zoom in to read your lips when you have a conversation. Posted by: steevy at May 14, 2012 09:43 PM (7W3wI) I mumble

190 Exact words from a TSA agent while going through security, kind of fucked up: "If you don't take this seriously, it can be very difficult for you." I didn't realize it was a crime to be kind of fucked up, smiling at a TSA agent.

191 197 PULL !!

Posted by: KZnextzone at May 14, 2012 09:44 PM (UXEgP)

 

Hope your trap gun has a 6-mile range.

192 "As Seen On TV":  Drone Defeating Cone of Silence only $29.95

193

@189: "My answer is, I have everything to hide, fucker,especially from the government."

 

Yup.  You call it your backyard vegetable garden.  The gummint calls it something else it can tax.

194

Apparently pot has a different heat signature than sugar cane.

 

Posted by: Purple Avenger at May 14, 2012 09:37 PM (Lo/y1)

 

 

I'm not gonna lie, I used to smoke that shit and it's interesting how far technology can come when one wants to grow and sell an illicit substance.

It's also interesting how far technology can come when law enforcement wants to try and curb it.

195 I'd like a drone... I'd be cruizing for awsome sweater puppies, especially in swimwear season a pic is worth 1000 words....

196 195 So can a cop standing there

197 ont up....fresh start, no flaming

198 Obama's War on Women: The Drones Part 1

199 So can a cop standing there.

Cops can tail you.  So GPS tracking is okay, right?

200 Hope your trap gun has a 6-mile range.

Posted by: StPatrick_TN at May 14, 2012 09:45 PM

 

I was just trying for the one delivering Tacos...

201 Actually, YOU are wrong. You can get automatic weapons permit. It cost $200 a year and is a federal permit. Class 3 http://tinyurl.com/buvfzxd Posted by: Billy Bob, the guy who drinks in SC at May 14, 2012 09:46 PM (hXJOG) almost, it is $200 once, when you purchase it. there is no annual renewal

202 204 Many police officers will be fapping to tapes of women around pools etc.Bet on it.

203

Heh, just wait until Homeowners Associations get permission to start putting up drones.  Unapproved bush in Lot 19!  The Andersons have laundry drying on a rack on their back patio!  That's a charcoal grill, not a green electric grill!

Fun on a bun.

204

Posted by: ErikW at May 14, 2012 09:46 PM (7duYd)

 

...and yet, meter readers, nosy neighbors and ex-girlfriends account for the majority of grow busts. 

205 205. Two people defending EOJ?!!!! What's next? The cubs winning the world series?

206

I hate Hotel internet

That is all...

207 Cops can tail you. So GPS tracking is okay, right?


Only with a lawful warrant signed by a judge in good legal standing. Same thing goes with drinking out of a glass.

208 DogNet has become self-aware.

209 Putting common sense restrictions on the use of aerial surveillance is a much more effective and less hysterical response that the banning of drones.Posted by: JamesR

Ha! Common sense. Good one.

Strangely enough I've been able to reformulate common sense to meet whatever the we want to get away with.

Common sense is only slightly less elastic that my sense of 'fairness.'

Fair share!

210

Fa Cube

Long time.....

211 Kind of reminds me of when the tax man comes around every ten years to "re-assess" my tax bill. He's real polite, wants to come in and ask some questions about improvements to my property, then he acts all dejected when I tell him no, and to kindly do the assesing from the road. He complies, but acts like a dick.

212 12 204 Many police officers will be fapping to tapes of women around pools etc.Bet on it. Posted by: steevy at May 14, 2012 09:48 PM (7W3wI) I'd operate my drone over Pensacola beach and Orange beach. Down load it to my new webpage... you_drone_porn

213 @167 The answer is that individual communities and states are going to have to put guidelines and restrictions on the police use of drones

Funny, the Great Lords in Washington can impose all this, but we have to limit it individually? You got something ass-backward there.

When Mayberry buys its own fleet of drones, or UAV's, or Hueys, waal then old Andy kin use 'er to look in on Goober. But that's my federal, borrowed, $15 tril in debt, tax money sending those secret weapons in.

BIG fucking difference to me.

214 They told me if I voted McCain / Palin my freedoms would be eroded....

215 209 nope, gp s is an invasion of privacy because to attach the device you are technically entering their property Same reason a cop can't stick his hand in your car without permission or a warrant

216 Police or DNR helicopters are not secret and invisible.  I can see them, I can hear them, and I can take appropriate measures accordingly.  I can also have much more say in local law enforcement issues through local and state elections, and can vote the SOB's out of office if they start getting too big for their britches.  They are much more accountable to the local population to whom they answer.

I do not welcome secret invisible silent spying from my Federal government.  From Washington.  Who is completely beyond my local control.

No difference?  Pshaw.

217 Brought to you by your new gods, The TSA

218

 

Don't forget the FLIR...Droners in the night...

219 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_wLVCLPx0M

220
121 See! I knew it. EoJ is a excuse-making commie surveillance-lover.

Damn commies.

Posted by: Don't pull my Pudsey at May 14, 2012 09:24 PM (q5fYz)

EoJ is very much a statist. It becomes more apparent with more and more of his pro-statist posts.

221 I say bring on the drones. Catch me if you can, motherfuckers.

222 I am conflicted on this issue. First of all, I agree they are a tool, and should be allowed as "legal." But in California, they take this to flying planes over neighborhoods to catch people doing building without a licence. Doesn't that sound a little different than "following suspected drug dealers."

223
88 It is all bullshit. Even if I was cultivating marijuana in my acreage, I still don't think the local, state, feds have the right to fly over my farm to find it unless they got off of their lazy asses and did the required footwork necessary to get a lawful warrant. Once they have the lawful warrant, then do your worst. I say this as a 10 year law enforcement officer. I don't give a fuck what the feds say, my land is the same as the airspace above it. You can't use anything against it unless you have a lawful warrant. All flying over it means is that the cops have to start doing some buy-busts or a CI to be able to legally get a warrant.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at May 14, 2012 09:18 PM (ZOf1l)

Preach it brother. In the land of the free.

224 234 Of course,they will use it to "generate revenue".Hmm they have their garbage out early,fine.Etc etc.

225

"...and yet, meter readers, nosy neighbors and ex-girlfriends account for the majority of grow busts. "

 

 

You seem to be hanging out with the wrong people.

226

 

The U.S. is one of a handful of countries where police are generally respected and trusted. They shouldn't take that for granted. 

 

More and more of us are distrusting the police.  Why?

Tickets are revenue enhancement, not for safety.

 

SWAT teams are used for no-knock arrests and for search warrants way too often. 

They sic the SWAT team on office raids? 

WTF?  Afraid they are going to flush the file cabinet down the toilet? 

The CPA is going to stab them with a letter opener?

Why does the FDA have a SWAT Team?

Why does the Education Dept have a SWAT Team?

 

Police are not policing themselves.  Every day you hear of criminal behavior by police and covered up by police. 

A police officer was fired in NJ for pulling two police officers off a mentally ill person they were beating. 

 

227 After the drones come, we'll all start living under ground. Then we enslave the liberals by keeping them happy and joyous, but susceptible to being picked off for food. /Time Machine

228 238 If you have a hammer everythinbg looks like a nail.Every little shit town now has a heavily armed and armored SWAT(not necessarily heavilky trained)so they use them.A lot.

229 What's next? The cubs winning the world series?

Posted by: navycopjoe at May 14, 2012 09:49 PM (3A7PP)

-----------

YES !!!

230 I really shouldn't be here.

231 If you want to know what police think of you, go check a police forum for about 5 minutes. They don't think to highly of the herd.

232 238 Police are not policing themselves. Every day you hear of criminal behavior by police and covered up by police. A police officer was fired in NJ for pulling two police officers off a mentally ill person they were beating. Yep, and you'll occasionally hear about police firing dozens of shots at a suspect with most of them missing. Any civilian who does that will have hell to pay.

233 If you want to know what police think of you, go check a police forum for about 5 minutes. They don't think to highly of the herd. Posted by: Jimmah at May 14, 2012 10:03 PM (UpwlP) any links??

234 "Butt" it's a better place than where I was.

235 Yep, and you'll occasionally hear about police firing dozens of shots at a suspect with most of them missing. Any civilian who does that will have hell to pay. Posted by: rickl at May 14, 2012 10:04 PM (sdi6R) national hit rate for cops firing their sidearms is 16%. or 1 out of 6 good luck

236 If you want to know what police think of you, go check a police forum for about 5 minutes. They don't think to highly of the herd.
Posted by: Jimmah at May 14, 2012 10:03 PM (UpwlP)




any links??

Posted by: moron #4 at May 14, 2012 10:05 PM (AZ8Mb)

-----

No, but google would, its been a few years since I've seen one, but especially telling is when some poor sap comes asking questions on something he thought was unfair. Whether right or wrong, its like some lib stumbling into AoS. You get 20 cops in a room, speaking relatively anonymously and its pretty obvious how they operate.

237

You seem to be hanging out with the wrong people.

 

If I was the type to hang with others I wouldn't be here, now would I?

238 198 .They can zoom in to read your lips when you have a conversation.
Posted by: steevy at May 14, 2012 09:43 PM (7W3wI)

Doubtful. Even with a super high-res camera there are still limits to optics - diffraction limit, MTF, etc - that would make this almost impossible if the camera is more than say 200m away.

239

No drones -- the alleged purpose is for security, but in the government's hands, its purpose will soon turn into surveillance of the citizenry. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a complete and utter idiot. This is where that feckless body called Congress needs to get its s**t together and block this Orwellian nightmare.

240 They can zoom in to read your lips when you have a conversation.
Posted by: steevy at May 14, 2012 09:43 PM (7W3wI)

Doubtful. Even with a super high-res camera there are still limits to optics - diffraction limit, MTF, etc - that would make this almost impossible if the camera is more than say 200m away.

Posted by: Mætenloch at May 14, 2012 10:10 PM (VDusq)

-----

Video I've seen isn't that sharp. It can make out a human shape from 5 miles though, which makes it a good tool for looking OVER the border. And Mexico is free to look over here, as far as they can see from Mexico. They have no jurisdiction here to fuck with anyone over what they think they see.

This might offend some people here, but cops are fairly stupid. So are jurys. I'd rather not have some dumb shit cop come busting in on what his dumb ass thought he saw from a drone, 5 miles away, then show it to a dumb ass jury. Did I mention dumb asses?

241 The only way I don't have a reasonable expectation of privacy is if my neighbor's window is looks over my property. Maybe. To lighten the mood, I'll tell a true story from our little town. Near the bay, the houses are all small cottages on small lots. Of late, people have been buying them and then tearing them down to build massive 3 storey homes that go right to the edges of the property. In one case, the new folk complained to the city that they could see the old couple next door were sunbathing nude in their backyard from their upper bedroom windows. I'm talking 90 year olds here. The city told them that they could buy curtains, because the old people were there first and had always had a privacy fence. Victory for the Prunes!

242

Let me play too, or, rather, let me muddy the water. I don't have answers, just thoughts.

 

Several of the objections voiced on the video seem just a bit manufactured:

 

- Drones are an instrument of war
- You can hear a helicopter coming but not a drone
- Drones can stay up much longer than a helicopter

 

In each case: so what?

 

Make the history clock run backwards, and the differences between standard police firearms and military-issue firearms start to disappear. It was not so very long ago that very many Americans went about with gunbelts and guns ... and the murder and general crime rates were lower.

 

Ok, I prefer a majority visible, uniformed police force to a majority plainclothes, undercover one, but forcing the police to actively announce their presence as they go about seems clearly self-defeating; Hogan's Heroes come to life, except that instead of downed Allied airmen trying to sabotage various Nazi military operations, it will be dealers, pimps, buglars, and other predators perying upon ... you.

 

Like most people, I don't like being surveilled, and I also don't go around committing crimes. But I also realize that reality rules, and there are bad people in the world, and a police presence is frequently a good thing. But crime isn't like a bank, only open M-F 9:00-5:00 (and maybe Saturday too), where a police presence could be scheduled. And there are places where a police presence will result in catching more criminals. A longer presence will catch more perps. Sad but true.

 

But there were some serious objections.

 

The "Loss of Privacy" objection: As per the previous paragraph: "Like most people ...". I'm a bit conflicted here: The Right to Privacy while in public is very different than when at home. OTOH, there are times when being under surveillance might be the only thing between me and mine (or you and yours) and being stomped and robbed. This does mean that clothing-optional backyards now need more than just privacy fences. You know who you are. The airspace above your land is yours in the sense that no one is allowed to build over it without your consent. Flying over it is quite legal, and seeing what is in plain view, ... sunblock alone is not enough. But read on.

 

Then there's the potential for "abuse". The main reason that drones have such high military value is that they're armed. Their sensors have tremendous value as well. An armed drone could be used to stop a gang assault, a rape, a kidnapping, ... or to assassinate. One with a loudspeaker and highly sensitive and directional mike could be used to communicate with the occasional road accident victim, or to command and then verify that a perp had surrendered ... or to eavesdrop ...

 

And there are times when being under armed surveillance might be the only thing between me and mine (or you and yours) and being stomped and robbed.

 

There's the "Militarization of Civil Society" objection. Looking at the past 6000 years of written human history, prior to 1900AD, and maybe earlier, every "civil society" has been armed, every (able-bodied) male subject to military duty, ... effectively, "Civil Society" alwasy has been "Militarized" ... everywhere and at all times. That US society has not been "Militarized" since 1970,or 1945, or 1900, or ... has been our good fortune. I'd like to keep it that way, but reality seems to have a different idea.

 

It may be that we face the ugly choice of accepting less privacy and freedom (while waiting for reality to run it's course), and more risk to future freedom (i.e., it will be a long time before we get back what we gave up), or allowing society to fragment and collapse ... something rather "Roman" in outcome ...

 

The Classical Greeks had "democracy" at times, and all kinds of rights. One of them was to, upon a vote of the Citizenry, exile a named individual or individuals, ... legally, they all voted. The Constitutional Republic that we have, that limits rights, seems much better to me.

 

"Those who give up a little freedom ..." ... 200+ years later, we see this for the comic-book-level philosophy that it is. While the Founding Fathers might have been geniuses,  they did not foresee the situations and threats we face today.

 

The problem is that there are some people who will not play by our rules. And either they are powerful enough, or there are enough of them, or both, that we cannot continue as previously.

 

I'm conflicted too, and I do not see easy yet good answers.

243

Another funny story - some feds infiltrated a militia group with an informant. Said informant planted bomb parts on a group members property. Reported to the feds that he planted them. Feds bust the property owner. Jury KNOWS thats how it went down, but are instructed to follow the law and not common sense. Finds property owner guilty and he's doing decades in federal prison.

This is all from memory of reading about the case, I don't remember the names involved.

244 Actually, YOU are wrong. You can get automatic weapons permit. It cost $200 a year and is a federal permit. Class 3 ------------------------------------- Yep! You can have an automatic weapon. And the ATF will become your best friend. They'll even come over for Thanksgiving dinner.

245

If I was the type to hang with others I wouldn't be here, now would I?

 

Posted by: garrett at May 14, 2012 10:09 PM (Br0dO)

 

Yeah, I fucked up the sarc tag on that.

246

255 continued - William James "Jimmy" McCranie, I was wrong about "decades". He got 8 years for telling an informant (on tape!) he wants nothing to do with bombs and to go away. Informant then buried the parts on his property without his knowlege and turned him in.

247 Color me pictured, bitch. God forbid our side requires impeccability of aim, when all the other side requires is winning a tort case.

248 The increase in law enforcement budgets is not due to preventing crimes or capturing criminals--it is, 100% due to ever and ever more efforts to extract revenue from easier and easier targets. Remove the financial incentive from police work and you could cut every law enforcement staff by 1/3 to1/2. These drones are not to catch local drug kingpins, they are to catch middle class fellows whom they know won't fight and will pay the fines.

249

Just think what would've happened if Bush had suggested this! (I'm sure someone above said the same thing, but I'm late to it, and haven't time to read it all).  Can you just imagine the protests, they would be out for his blood.

 

BTW can anyone tell me why it was wrong to say we want 0b0z0 to be a one term president, but it was OK for them to say all those hateful things about Bush, and did that mean they didn't want him to be a one term president?

What a bunch of turds!

250 Yep, for a while I'd watch the council meetings of my town. The police Chief was always coming up with new ways to increase revenue. Luckily most of his ideas were rejected.

251 "Limbaugh quietly added to Missouri hall of fame" http://tinyurl.com/88y8kav

252

262 cont...

Like the time he informed them he was merely breaking even on charging for police reports, and wanted to double the 25 cent a page price.

-

I'm just going to stay in this thread and talk to myself.

253 Where can I get an anti drone gun? Make one that shoots potatoes like those Iranians did?

254 Billy Bob, Did I say it was illegal to own a automatic weapon?

I did not. I referred to grandfathered exceptions. Sure, there are several thousand, but no new ones.

For all intents new M16's in civilan hands are illegal.

Priced a M16 lately?

255 This is a dead thread, so let's end it here.

We're on the same side. Yes you can own a fully automatic M16 and pay the tax, if you can afford to buy one of the grandfathered rifles.

Not many can.

That's life as we know it.

256 Did we, the American people, get to vote on this? I missed it? Damn.

257 SFGATE has an article with a list of local bars that are putting in facial recognition software analyzing cameras. They will log you in as "checked in" when you enter.

Patrons waiting outside the bar to get in can get a phone app that tells them who is inside, what is the mix of males to females, what age group, etc.

This is a good list to have as places to avoid...

258 War is inevitable. Because the first instinct of a human in society, with a moment to spare, is to fuck with somebody else and start a fight. Because power and control are *always* in more demand than peace. Also, the stupid. So we'll have drones, and permanent surveillance, and pat-downs on all public transportation, and then publicly-accessible buildings like malls, and then at random... until people get too sick of it and find out voting won't change it. I am not looking forward to the next 40 years.

259 Police already have paramilitary units. SWAT and inter-agency (city+county/parish) narcotic task force units are two examples. Helicopters are kitted with FLIR employed by police agencies and CAMP in Cali use a wide array of electronic snooping devices originally developed by the military.

yet we can't check ID at polling precincts.

260

@221: "Long time....."

 

Yeah, no kidding.  Hiya!

261 Actually no it doesn't start with Obama but it could end with him and given that Dems are so so hot about freedom of speech and privacy and what not, you'd think he would be but no, no we've got the TSA feeling up Henry f'n Kissinger as if he's a shoe bomber.

No this started when too many people decided it would be a good thing that we have a war on drugs. They neglected to mention that since it's US citizens consuming those drugs that therefore the war would be against US citizens. Then, since they weren't winning, they decided it would be okay to confiscate money and property from anyone who THEY thought did have a good reason for it and who MIGHT have been involved with drugs. None of that do they have to prove. No you have to go into court and prove YOUR INNOCENT to get your property back. Most folks can't afford the legal bills and so the Police depts get the dough. There's the mistake. Letting the money confiscated by the Police go TO the Police. It's a setup guaranteed to be abused. And it has.

Now that they're losing the war more, they've decided that they'll watch EVERYONE and catch SOMEONE doing SOMETHING illegal.

Years ago when the laws were commonsense and about property and violence, that seemed reasonable. Now that we've made putting up your own awnings or holding a bake sale misdemeanors, it's another story.

The only people we have to blame for this is each other.

Hope you all enjoy living in this Brave New World.

262 That was DIDN'T HAVE A GOOD REASON FOR THE MONEY OR PROPERTY.

Sorry.

263 270 So we'll have drones, and permanent surveillance, and pat-downs on all public transportation, and then publicly-accessible buildings like malls, and then at random... until people get too sick of it and find out voting won't change it. I am not looking forward to the next 40 years. Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at May 14, 2012 11:54 PM (bxiXv) you can already see igns of the liberals surrendering the Southwest to the drug cartels. Soon the piles of mutilated bodies will pop up in Arizona.

264 Sounds like billion dollar targets to me. Hell, we pay for them.

Need to work on my steel net, anti-drone shells.

265

As mentioned in the video, this is where left and right can agree and move forward on making a better nation.  Hell, this subject is one of a very few subjects where my quasi-Marxist father and I can have a civil political discussion.

 

We'd better figure out a way (counter to all known human history) to roll back all this police state business peacefully or we're in for some dark  and murderous times once everyone's ability to suffer this crap is gone.

 

Every podunk town DOES NOT need an SWAT team, Armored Personnel Carriers, belt-fed weapons, and flying drones to snoop on a free citizenry.  The police are "peace officers", not soldiers.  Every time I hear some HSLD cop talk about how he needs to do "everything he has to to make it home at the end of his shift" I want to scream. 

 

I realize the job is sometimes dangerous.  I think wearing body armor and having a patrol rifle in the trunk of the cruiser is a good thing.  But all this has ended up with SWAT teams kicking in doors at 3am, often at the wrong address, shooting innocents and their dogs, and generally ratcheting up the danger.  All this Fallujah shit  to serve warrants that used to be handled peacefully - it's time to de-escalate.

266 These things can't be all that difficult to site on, can they? I understand their awful expensive, too...put a few of them in a lake and they'll stop...our government ought never be allowed to use military weapons against its citizens, this shit is in direct violation of Posse Comatatus and is illegal!!! And still they go on and on about the rebublicans wars on everything while their putting military aircraft in the air over America to spy on Americans, yet still can't find the zeta cartels, the muslims jihadi training camps in s america, or obama's REAL birth certificate or anything else about him....something has gone terribly wrong if this is allowed to happen...its time for another tea party, folks? A REAL one where we go to the swamplands and evict every one of these motherfuckers!!!