April 19, 2012
— Ace You know what we need after an emotionally-bruising primary?
A new fight over a hot-button issue we thought we'd resolved.
If Rubio really goes ahead with this it will do significant damage to the GOP and Mitt Romney (who will have to pick sides between seeming anti immigrant or the GOPÂ’s enforcement first base. HeÂ’ll get no credit if he goes with the former and will be bashed if he sides with the latter).You know who would love to run on who can be more pro-amnesty than anyone? Barack Obama, thatÂ’s who. It beats talking about this economy and especially the part where Hispanic unemployment is running about 3.5% higher than for the general population.
All this damage over a plan that will win no votes and will never see the light of day in the Senate or the House.
Seriously, is Rubio nuts?
Posted by: Ace at
01:44 PM
| Comments (189)
Post contains 155 words, total size 1 kb.
Posted by: mare at April 19, 2012 01:46 PM (A98Xu)
Posted by: Bill Mitchell at April 19, 2012 01:46 PM (hlUJY)
If Romney starts pushing this dream act a LOT of conservatives will sit this one out.
Posted by: Vic at April 19, 2012 01:49 PM (YdQQY)
Posted by: toby928 at April 19, 2012 01:49 PM (NG097)
Do you, or do you not, want to defeat Obama? Legislation like this with Rubio at the helm could deliver Florida and most of the West, *and* itÂ’s at least arguably good policy on the merits. For anyone who takes policy seriously, itÂ’s a no-brainer.
"Not politically smart. Not smart in general. Well, at least we know now."
Rubbish. If you want to bury Obama beyond the threshold of fraud, you need Hispanics. This is a low-cost way to do it. The glow has already come off of him since 1) it became apparent that he intended to dangle the carrot of immigration amnesty forever and not actually deliver, and 2) he leaped on board with the lynching of George Zimmerman, history's first "white Hispanic."
Posted by: dawnfire at April 19, 2012 01:49 PM (bIeax)
Posted by: mare at April 19, 2012 01:50 PM (A98Xu)
Posted by: Chilling the most at April 19, 2012 01:50 PM (6IV8T)
Posted by: pep at April 19, 2012 01:50 PM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: E.M. August at April 19, 2012 01:51 PM (zeBNm)
Posted by: toby928 at April 19, 2012 01:51 PM (NG097)
Romney is to be held directly responsible for anything and everything proposed, said or done by anyone who has publicly endorsed, supported, or campaigned for him?
Or are those rules no longer in place now that he's got the nomination sewn up?
Posted by: Hollowpoint at April 19, 2012 01:52 PM (SY2Kh)
Posted by: mare at April 19, 2012 01:52 PM (A98Xu)
I will not stand any amnesty fools, gladly. I will not stand them, at all.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 01:52 PM (X3lox)
Maybe they're just dipping their toes in the water to test the temperature? At least Rubio's version doesn't give away the whole damn kit and kaboodle (No, Baraka, I didn't say 'poodle')
If R's want to 'win over' any 'Hispanics' (especially the dreaded white Hispanics!) they're going to have to take away the D's steam on this issue.
Posted by: the Butcher at April 19, 2012 01:53 PM (8g9qq)
If he taps Rubio for VP, I'd say he's agreeing with him. Why oh why do Republicans insist on getting on the wrong side of a 70-30 voter split?
Posted by: toby928 at April 19, 2012 01:53 PM (NG097)
with Rubio at the helm could deliver Florida and most of the West, *and*
itÂ’s at least arguably good policy on the merits. For anyone who takes
policy seriously, itÂ’s a no-brainer.
Well, I agree with one part of your argument. If Romney endorses this, it really doesn't matter what the policy actually is, he might win FL (which he'll win anyway), but he'll lose a bunch of other states. He's too smart for that.
Posted by: pep at April 19, 2012 01:53 PM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: mare at April 19, 2012 01:53 PM (A98Xu)
with Rubio at the helm could deliver Florida and most of the West
Fuck them.
Maybe someone thinks Mittens should campaign in Mexico City? WTFFFFF?
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 01:55 PM (X3lox)
Posted by: mare at April 19, 2012 01:55 PM (A98Xu)
-----------------------
Uh... everything that girl just said is bullshit... Thank you.
Posted by: Vinni Gambino at April 19, 2012 01:56 PM (YdQQY)
Here's my guess. The issue IS going to come up. The party stance has never been "send them all home". Why not get the discussion out of the way while we are still sorta arguing rather than letting Obama use it as a wedge in October?
Think about how you thought of Romney last September? That's how much time we have to November. Mix in the wedge issues early so they are baked in the cake. We've been fighting, let's air the wedge issues now, so that when we're done fighting, we're done. So when it's time to circle and defend, we've come to terms with what we are defending and we don't hesitate or show weakness.
Unity. It doesn't mean agreeing. It means agreeing where we disagree and dealing.
That's my guess.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter! at April 19, 2012 01:57 PM (0q2P7)
I read this in the sidebar earlier today. ....Wasn't going to say anything, but.....yeah, this is nightmare that should not have been brought up.
Perry got pounded for the Texas version of this.....which was waaay less of a 'give away' than what Rubio has advocated for in the past. ....And I guess Rubio has learned nothing from that.
Posted by: wheatie at April 19, 2012 01:57 PM (+5U+B)
"Due deliberation needs to be given to Sen. Rubio's proposal. As President I look forward to working with Sen. Rubio and others to try and resolve this vexing issue." - Proposed non-answer to this idea.
Posted by: Anna Puma at April 19, 2012 01:57 PM (Kl2s3)
I followed Rubio's campaign down here closely, close enough to vote proudly for him. This sounds so unlike him, it's creepy.
WTF happened to him?
Posted by: BackwardsBoy at April 19, 2012 01:58 PM (d0Tfm)
Posted by: pep, petunia and the rest of the MItten-eers at April 19, 2012 01:58 PM (Zw/H7)
Mmmmmm.....Waffle....that was the name of my favorite
Posted by: Barky O'Bummer at April 19, 2012 01:59 PM (UOM48)
He'll probably be asked about it, but Rubio isn't Romney's VP pick (and probably won't be). Thus there shouldn't be any major conflict / intra-party Civil War if Romney chooses not to endorse Rubio's proposal.
We've seen this over and over again from the likes of Drew M and others- "OMFG! A guy who shook hands with a guy who works with a guy who donated $5 to the Romney campaign said he's a moderate! SEE??? That proves Romney is a RINO sellout!!!".
Posted by: Hollowpoint at April 19, 2012 01:59 PM (SY2Kh)
Republican presidency with Mr. Rubio in the VP seat. It omits a “special
path” to citizenship and only allows kids brought here as minors (who,
obviously, had no say in the matter) to transition to being legal
American residents rather than risk being deported to a “home country”
that they donÂ’t know. ItÂ’s an excellent compromise, brought by a
popular, charismatic, conservative Hispanic Republican Senator.
Here is the problem: You cannot advocate anything resembling amnesty anymore because of two issues. First, it's a slippery slope. Any common-sense reform will get pushed by the Dems into real amnesty territory. Second, the electorate simply doesn't trust the political establishment to act in good faith when it comes to immigration.
Anyway, this proposal will simply encourage more of this behavior and the kid will bring a chain migration. Look, I'm sorry their home country sucks, but we have a waiting list here and if you aren't on it, you're not getting a table. Life sucks sometimes.
And sometimes your parents make decisions for you and you have to live with the consequences.
Anything even smelling of amnesty is a huge loser electorally. Unless this is Rubio playing Good Cop, expecting it to go down in flames, I don't see an upside.
Posted by: AmishDude at April 19, 2012 02:00 PM (T0NGe)
Posted by: Mitt " Nothing LIke McCain" Romney at April 19, 2012 02:00 PM (Zw/H7)
seriously
if you rethugs put as much effort into winning an election as you do losing, there wouldnt be any democrat seats
Posted by: navycopjoe knows Teh SARAH!!!! can save us at April 19, 2012 02:00 PM (aeve0)
that they donÂ’t know.
They can blame their parents who did this to them. America owes them nothing. They owe America the decency of leaving without costing us even more money.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 02:01 PM (X3lox)
Posted by: Ken Royall at April 19, 2012 02:02 PM (9zzk+)
And when you become an adult, you get to make decisions for you. Choosing to compound your parents' bad decision with bad decisions of your own--that's on you (lots of kids have shitty childhoods and don't grow up to murder their own children, for example...).
Posted by: HeatherRadish™ at April 19, 2012 02:02 PM (/kI1Q)
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter! at April 19, 2012 02:02 PM (0q2P7)
Yup. It's more radioactive than Fukushima dai ichi.
Posted by: pep at April 19, 2012 02:03 PM (6TB1Z)
Assume 12 million illegals of Hispanic flavor. Pick a few swing states. Assume there is approximately the same percentage of population of illegal immigrants as legal. Multiply the current percentage of Census reported Hispanics for said swing state by 12 million. Take that number and multiply it by the percentage of Hispanics who voted for the Democrat in the last election.
Answer: GOP DOOM in every swing state--every single swing state becomes safe Dem.
Why?
Because in every single swing state, Hispanics vote 55% to 60% for the Dems.
Fucking GOP, "we're going to make up our losses in volume boys, volume!"
Posted by: jimmuy at April 19, 2012 02:03 PM (kSaUf)
Posted by: eureka! at April 19, 2012 02:03 PM (81yf8)
Posted by: Daybrother at April 19, 2012 02:04 PM (WCuHB)
Sorry gang, my Bullshit Meter is pegged. Something's wrong with this, but I can't put my finger on it.
Bad wrong.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy at April 19, 2012 02:04 PM (d0Tfm)
Brilliant.
The Stupid Party - snatching defeat from the jaws of victory yet again.
Posted by: reality check at April 19, 2012 02:05 PM (Zw/H7)
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 02:05 PM (X3lox)
Posted by: NBC News at April 19, 2012 02:06 PM (vjyZP)
Who says that? You don't pull over every speeder.
Posted by: AmishDude at April 19, 2012 02:06 PM (T0NGe)
Posted by: Optimizer at April 19, 2012 02:06 PM (As94z)
Posted by: Daybrother at April 19, 2012 06:04 PM (WCuHB)
Rubio isn't eligible to be VP, anyway.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 02:07 PM (X3lox)
It's surprising because it's awful politics.
Posted by: AmishDude at April 19, 2012 02:08 PM (T0NGe)
Bingo.
Did someone spike Rubio's water with Stupid Pills? If Democrats really wanted amnesty or "the path" to it, they'd have brought it up immediately after getting the House, the Senate, and the Executive. It's a political killer for both sides and everyone knows it. It's the third rail of third rails.
Do not pursue this. The GOP will lose.
Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at April 19, 2012 02:09 PM (eHIJJ)
To be a moron. To be moronical. An imbecile. Like the dumbest mother fucker that ever lived. Marco, you went full retard, man. Never go full retard. Everybody knows you never go full retard.
Posted by: Kirk Lazarus at April 19, 2012 02:09 PM (FsqHK)
Posted by: Daybrother at April 19, 2012 02:09 PM (WCuHB)
Personally, I'm reassured that, even if the differences dwindle between the GOP and the completely unacceptable radical statism of the Democrats, the daylight between the two will be so stark that we simply MUST rally behind the former and defeat the latter. That's what we're supposed to believe, right?
Posted by: Lawrence at April 19, 2012 02:10 PM (dX1XT)
Posted by: AmishDude at April 19, 2012 06:08 PM (T0NGe)
Yeah. That part shocked me, too. Just not that he felt this way.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 02:10 PM (X3lox)
Posted by: blindside at April 19, 2012 02:10 PM (x7g7t)
Posted by: steevy at April 19, 2012 02:10 PM (7W3wI)
@7 I actually agree with you, and that's a new opinion for me.
I don't mind hard working Mexicans who want to become Americans, that work, pay taxes and raise families here. They're generally conservative, and largely Christian. I WANT these people here. I'd take a 1000 of them for every whiny, non productive freeloading OWS type I could deport to Mexico. They system for legalization is broken (on purpose) so that it becomes a power game for a constituency. We are FOOLS to alienate these people. Their work ethic and basic morality put them far closer to 'traditional' American's than any leftist will ever be. As far as I'm concerned, we could swap our leftists for any conservatives trying to flee Communist states around the world. We can offer 5 of ours for 1 of there. Whatever it takes to make the deal.
What I don't want are criminals, La Raza reconquistadors and assorted pure freeloaders - which means controlling the border and making sure we know who's here, and who's coming and going. I also want to empty the prisons of illegals after we do this - fly them all to Mexico City and wash our hands of them. And I want significant penalties in place to keep these people out, while punishing those who break the rules.
There ARE sane positions to be had here that can solve the problem. As a conservative, I'd encourage us to find it and do our best to win these natural allies to our side. If we don't take the long view and find something that works, we'll find ourselves eventually fighting a demographic war we can't win. Don't fight math. It will fuck you up.
Posted by: JQ Public at April 19, 2012 02:10 PM (NBj0d)
Posted by: E.M. August at April 19, 2012 02:11 PM (zeBNm)
come on pep !
Tell us how Mitt DOESN'T have a deep personal religious connection to Mexico and how that will not influence any border policy decision that he makes!
Posted by: reality check- voting for SMOD and down ticket at April 19, 2012 02:12 PM (Zw/H7)
http://is.gd/dPgi6N
This after he said he would veto the Dream Act. He has flip-flopped again.
Posted by: Vic at April 19, 2012 02:12 PM (YdQQY)
Posted by: phoenixgirl at April 19, 2012 02:12 PM (UOZms)
Posted by: joeindc44 says hide your dogs, SCOMDEF's in town at April 19, 2012 02:14 PM (QxSug)
Suppose they are doing this to get the hispanic vote, then say they can't get it past in the House and Senate?
Or Is Mitt too stupid for that?
Posted by: no name at April 19, 2012 02:15 PM (O/fK8)
Posted by: blindside at April 19, 2012 02:15 PM (x7g7t)
It is amnesty round III or IV depending on how you count it.
Posted by: Vic at April 19, 2012 02:15 PM (YdQQY)
Posted by: Daybrother at April 19, 2012 02:15 PM (WCuHB)
Posted by: NewBrunswicker at April 19, 2012 02:16 PM (triNw)
Republican presidency with Mr. Rubio in the VP seat
Oh bullshit. Rubio is Cuban, a very rare Conservative voting group among the usually Democratic Hispanic voting bloc. He knows damn well Hispanics are not going to magically start voting for Republicans because of his position this.
This is about trying to find a solution to a very difficult problem. It's easy to say they should be sent back, but imagine if you found out you weren't here legally and you were going to be sent back to Poland or something.
I just wish he'd held off til after the election.
Posted by: Tammy al-Thor at April 19, 2012 02:16 PM (SsG4J)
Same goes with immigrants.
Posted by: E.M. August at April 19, 2012 06:11 PM (zeBNm)
I never said one word about "immigrants" so I have no idea what the hell you are talking about.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 02:16 PM (X3lox)
Posted by: Vic at April 19, 2012 06:15 PM (YdQQY)
Rubio's isn't, per se, but this is my main argument against anything like this at all. The potential for fraud is staggering.
Posted by: Tammy al-Thor at April 19, 2012 02:17 PM (SsG4J)
Pure stupidity and ignorance.
The problem no one want to admit is that America is STILL importing foreign workers " legally " through H and L etc. temporary work visas EVERY DAy. BLEEDING
It's not about deportation (yet) , it's about stopping the bleeding.
Department of Labor , USCIS and Department of State are importing hundreds of thousands of alien workers EVERY YEAR who "overstay" their "legal" visas and never go home.
Which makes them "illegal".
There is NO record of people leaving the country ONLY those entering.
Make their kids legal with Rubios plan and ---- GUESS WHAT !
Posted by: reality check- voting for SMOD and down ticket at April 19, 2012 02:18 PM (Zw/H7)
Posted by: AmishDude at April 19, 2012 06:08 PM (T0NGe)
Yeah. That part shocked me, too. Just not that he felt this way.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 06:10 PM (X3lox)
That said, THIS is also true. DUMBASAFUCKINGHAMMER politics. Face palmable.
Posted by: JQ Public at April 19, 2012 02:18 PM (NBj0d)
He lost the Hispanic vote 70% to 30%. The Mexican Hispanics are another huge Democrat voting block and they outnumber the Cuban Hispanics by orders of magnitude..
Posted by: Vic at April 19, 2012 02:19 PM (YdQQY)
This is why we don't want freshman as Veeps (and this is coming from someone who until recently wanted West as Veep). They need to build a record of steadiness. I'm leaning Paul Ryan or Bob McDonnell now.
Oh, and if Mitt embraces this, then what will his excuse be for how he attacked Perry over TX's in-state tutition thing? Remember how he lied about it paying $100,000 for every illegal and how outrageously outraged he was by it? Yeah. He better not be coming out for amnesty after that.
As a Perry supporter, I'm more than willing to support Mitt (in fact he was my second choice behind Perry because the "Not-Romneys" all sucked), but if Mitt backs this, it's the kind of thing that made people like me look for an alternative to Mitt in the first place: flip-flops.
Posted by: Aslan's Girl at April 19, 2012 02:19 PM (KL49F)
==========================
So what? A lot of "issues" lie ahead.
It's timing.
How..how, can anyone not see the stupidity of this?
Dumb.
Posted by: Make it stop. at April 19, 2012 02:19 PM (uCaJS)
Yes. The fraud and subsequent molding/amending of the law will be inevitable. Just as was the result of Reagan's amnesty.
Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at April 19, 2012 02:20 PM (eHIJJ)
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter! at April 19, 2012 02:20 PM (0q2P7)
--
Watch your ass, Ted.
Romney's hunting experience is limited to hiring someone to set mouse traps.
Posted by: SCOAMF Media at April 19, 2012 02:20 PM (lpWVn)
Better to just let them be here illegally and close the borders.
Posted by: slatz at April 19, 2012 02:20 PM (igH9j)
Posted by: Tammy al-Thor at April 19, 2012 06:17 PM (SsG4J)
It is a short path to amnesty if it is like how he described it a few weeks ago.
Posted by: Vic at April 19, 2012 02:21 PM (YdQQY)
Posted by: tubal at April 19, 2012 02:21 PM (BoE3Z)
Posted by: Oscar at April 19, 2012 02:21 PM (4TBK2)
Posted by: Mitt Taggert at April 19, 2012 02:22 PM (KWdVT)
It's timing.
How..how, can anyone not see the stupidity of this?
Dumb.
When would you like to do this? Now while Harry is going "wait wha?" or August/September/October when the debate will be framed by a completely ready Obama/Media coalition?
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter! at April 19, 2012 02:23 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: steevy at April 19, 2012 02:23 PM (7W3wI)
Today was a pretty good day, what with all the dog-eating allegations, and now this.
Can't we at least bill Mexico for their citizens' healthcare? That would be a winning plan.
Posted by: Lance McCormick at April 19, 2012 02:26 PM (zmRMp)
Posted by: JQ Public at April 19, 2012 02:26 PM (NBj0d)
Posted by: Fritz at April 19, 2012 02:26 PM (KWdVT)
"This is what we get when even the right pushes identity politics."
You've hit the nail on the head. What we should be hearing is the "Rule of Law where all are equal."
I'm still somewhat flabbergasted at this. This just doesn't make any sense.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy at April 19, 2012 02:26 PM (d0Tfm)
Posted by: blindside at April 19, 2012 02:28 PM (x7g7t)
Posted by: Hard Right at April 19, 2012 02:28 PM (uhftQ)
@112 Maybe, maybe not. There is a certain reality on the ground. We've got a fuck ton of people here illegally. That fact IS being politicized effectively. Now what? That's the problem.
Posted by: JQ Public at April 19, 2012 02:29 PM (NBj0d)
Posted by: wheatie at April 19, 2012 02:30 PM (+5U+B)
Posted by: Lincolntf at April 19, 2012 02:31 PM (hiMsy)
God, how I hate this. We're a nation of legal immigrants and of laws. It's illegal to break into someone's house and live there, and it's illegal to break into someone's country and live there. If you don't love the US enough to obey the law, you don't love it enough to live here.
Why do seemingly sensible people have such a hard time with this? If Mexico's such a hellhole, overthrow it--don't break into the United States. Even my own church has a crush on these criminals. I just don't get it.
Posted by: Palandine at April 19, 2012 02:33 PM (g7D8V)
Posted by: chemjeff at April 19, 2012 02:34 PM (VE1KN)
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter! at April 19, 2012 06:23 PM (0q2P7)
A sentient person would say, "Never." Stupid, treasonous amnesty drives to kill the concept of American sovereignty are what destroyed the GOP, made it a laughing stock of a party and allowed an ineligible dog-eating retard from the Third World to take our nation down the shitter.
You want to do that again? There will not be a Tea Party II. There will be the Constitutional Union of American States.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 02:34 PM (X3lox)
Meanwhile the Democrats get to successfully demagogue the issue and obtain votes because of it.
Posted by: chemjeff at April 19, 2012 02:35 PM (VE1KN)
Harry will have to do one of three things.
1. Pass the bill as is. At which point the House has to pass it; Then Obama can either veto it and make himself the dick, or sign it, at which point a Republican bill wins the day and we win the issue.
2. Amend it to death. Rubio turns on his own bill. Harry looks like a dick for bickering away a chance at reform. Topic is off the table for the election.
3. Never vote on it. Harry (dems) is the stonewaller for reform therefore the topic is off the table for the election.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter! at April 19, 2012 02:35 PM (0q2P7)
Makes you kinda sound like a dumbass.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 02:37 PM (X3lox)
Posted by: Schaeffer at April 19, 2012 02:37 PM (ZN0re)
Nahh, it is more like:
4. Never vote on it, Democrats lie about blocking it, then go out and scare Hispanics some more accusing Republicans of wanting to deport them all.
Posted by: chemjeff at April 19, 2012 02:37 PM (VE1KN)
[31 Is this a good time to use: Full.On.Retard.?]
Personally, I like to keep my retard at about 10-20%. I think that's the best way to maintain a happy, optimistic mindset (seriously, those retards are always super happy), while still retaining enough mental acuity to put my own shoes on before leaving the house.
Posted by: Warden at April 19, 2012 02:37 PM (75nmt)
Posted by: Mace at April 19, 2012 02:38 PM (giywE)
Meanwhile the Democrats get to successfully demagogue the issue and obtain votes because of it.
Posted by: chemjeff at April 19, 2012 06:35 PM (VE1KN)
Let them. Giving away American sovereignty for votes is a bad trade.
P.S. my above comment to you was lighthearted. I just couldn't help myself.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 02:38 PM (X3lox)
Never is not an option. This discussion will be had. And we will lose it if "Deport Everybody" is our stance.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter! at April 19, 2012 02:39 PM (0q2P7)
Which means "deport 'em all", right?
Posted by: chemjeff at April 19, 2012 06:38 PM (VE1KN)
I guess I'll have to change the tone to "serious".
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 02:39 PM (X3lox)
I am getting really fucking tired of identity politics. So tired in fact that I have decided that I will only vote for candidates of Central European heritage. And they have to be short and fat. And be called LGoPs.
So there. Fuck.
Posted by: LGoPs at April 19, 2012 02:40 PM (lHn6+)
Never is not an option. This discussion will be had.
Amnesty - even extending legal residency - is OFF THE TABLE. Period. End of story.
Let history be your teacher on this. The GOP will die its last death if it goes down this road and America won't be long after. You've already seen this movie. You're friggin living it right now allegedly trying to stop it, but you want to travel the route that killed the GOP in 2006 and 2008 and brought America to this very place. WTF? Really.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 02:42 PM (X3lox)
Posted by: erg loughner at April 19, 2012 02:45 PM (eelf6)
Yes but we force them to lie. Romney exposes their BS while in interviews on the topic. They look like partisan hacks and lose independents.
>>>Giving away American sovereignty for votes is a bad trade.
No path to Citizenship is conferred. How is this giving away sovereignty? How is saying "If you entered into the country as a juvenile with your lawbreaking parents, we will give you a visa so long as you're working or in school" some sort of sovereignty giveaway?
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter! at April 19, 2012 02:45 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: Chilling the most at April 19, 2012 02:46 PM (6IV8T)
Then the issue comes up. We lose in November. America tanks.
We can't win on "send everybody home"
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter! at April 19, 2012 02:50 PM (0q2P7)
Posted by: erg loughner at April 19, 2012 02:51 PM (eelf6)
Posted by: packsoldier at April 19, 2012 02:52 PM (G/brl)
99....if Mitt embraces this, then what will his excuse be for how he attacked Perry over TX's in-state tutition thing? Remember how he lied about it paying $100,000 for every illegal and how outrageously outraged he was by it? Yeah. He better not be coming out for amnesty after that.
Yup!
140.....perry fans will feel betrayed.
Yup!
Posted by: wheatie at April 19, 2012 02:55 PM (+5U+B)
Posted by: FRONT TOWARD LEFT at April 19, 2012 02:55 PM (p7SSh)
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter! at April 19, 2012 06:45 PM (0q2P7)
Look at your own sentence. They violated our sovereignty to steal the privilege of residence in America. Not to steal citizenship, but residency. Giving them legal residence just delivers to them exactly what they stole - that bit of American sovereignty every time. Those who go even further and want to give them citizenship are delivering to illegals something of a bonus on top of what the illegals were looking to steal, in the first place, which was just residency. Such "path to citizenship" people are commiting out and out treason - though it might be a different legal term for just trying to destroy America without aiding some organized enemy.
No. No legal residency. They have the right of legal residency in the countries they are citizens of, not America.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 02:56 PM (X3lox)
Posted by: chemjeff at April 19, 2012 06:38 PM (VE1KN)
Of course! Any enforcement of immigration laws = mass deportation.
dumbass.
Posted by: reality check- voting for SMOD and down ticket at April 19, 2012 02:58 PM (Zw/H7)
Obama and Holder are responsible for empowering the Cartels by delivering thousands of assault weapons into their hands resulting in the deaths of hundreds of Mexicans and at least two border patrol agents and created climate that has resulted in the increasing frequency of "spillover" violence into sovereign American territory.
If you wish to split the hispanic (IE MEXICAN-American vote) you need to mention this every day.
Every.
Single.
Day.
Amnesty is a losing issue. Repeat after me, AMNESTY IS A LOSING ISSUE!
Border secuirty in the context of Obama Administration criminality. That is the issue. Run on that and nothing else.
Bend those lefty sonsabitches over the table and ream their assholes raw.
Gracias,
Robert
Posted by: Robert at April 19, 2012 02:58 PM (F79HU)
Listen hardliners. This issue lies ahead. Unless you want to try and defend "Send them all home" which is a 100% loser, this is about as reasonable a stance as you are going to get.
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter!
"Not the hill to die on." Got it.
Might as well map that phrase to alt-F7 on my keyboard. Figure I'll be needing it pretty often this campaign.
Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at April 19, 2012 03:00 PM (kdS6q)
Posted by: FRONT TOWARD LEFT at April 19, 2012 03:00 PM (p7SSh)
Posted by: Christopher Taylor at April 19, 2012 03:02 PM (r4wIV)
Posted by: chemjeff at April 19, 2012 03:04 PM (VE1KN)
Posted by: Jean at April 19, 2012 03:07 PM (/FT0A)
Posted by: CoolCzech at April 19, 2012 03:12 PM (niZvt)
Or he might just be nuts...
Posted by: Dumas at April 19, 2012 03:15 PM (eyhrK)
Are roundups and deportations the official party line on this? These cases of people brought in as children are the "rape or life of the mother" case of the illegal immigration debate. Rubio may be trying to defuse that matter, or just soften the party's image among hispanics, but it's just not going to fly with the full-on Yosemite Sam types.
Even if successfully implemented, mass deportation would not effectively control the growth of the Hispanic population (which is now driven primarily by birthrate.) Illegal crossings are actually down since Obama bungled the economy, not that they should be tolerated in the first place. But really, the idea of preventing D votes by kicking out illegals (who can't vote to begin with) isn't effective.
Posted by: Tad Blatherton at April 19, 2012 03:17 PM (HueOF)
Great, hundreds of thousands if not millions of Illegals children armed with drivers liscenses voting cause unless Rube O passes a national law demanding proof of citizenship he destroys any chance of ever defeating the Rat Party
Posted by: ConcealedKerry or SubMitt at April 19, 2012 03:19 PM (nonzP)
When would you like to do this? Now while Harry is going "wait wha?" or August/September/October when the debate will be framed by a completely ready Obama/Media coalition?
Posted by: MikeTheMoose Troll Hunter! at April 19, 2012 06:23 PM (0q2P7)"
After the election.
Handwave it away until then...waaay after then. We have waay more imortant things to deal with besides a bunch of criminal aliens wanting a free lunch.
How about we save the Republic from a communist takeover first?
Posted by: Make it stop. at April 19, 2012 03:52 PM (uCaJS)
Posted by: chemjeff at April 19, 2012 06:35 PM (VE1KN)"
=================
Only if we let the left set the debate issues.
Enough of that "we have to play by their rules" shit.
Posted by: Make it stop. at April 19, 2012 03:57 PM (uCaJS)
Posted by: BeckoningChasm at April 19, 2012 04:11 PM (i0App)
Posted by: Bawney at April 19, 2012 04:23 PM (D60pP)
Posted by: MagicalMaggieT at April 19, 2012 04:25 PM (rZZA3)
If Romney is doing this on purpose...
Posted by: runninrebel
Doubt there's any "strategy" behind it. Rubio is just soft on La Raza issues.
Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at April 19, 2012 04:37 PM (kdS6q)
Posted by: Kerry at April 19, 2012 05:00 PM (AYfPj)
"They would be permitted to stay in the country to study or work, could obtain a driver's license but would not be able to vote. They later could apply for residency, but they would not have a special path to citizenship."
"We have to come up with an immigration system that honors both our legacy as a nation of laws and also our legacy as a nation of immigrants," Rubio told The Associated Press on Tuesday.
Daily Kos is calling this the "SCAM Act" so the Dems are pretty worried about this turn of events.
Democratic Majority Leader Harry Reid has already said he will try to defeat the effort.
Rubio has always talked of a "path to citizenship." This is nothing new. He has always spoken of the fact that illegals don't pay taxes and the USA needs to find a way of adding to the tax roles as legal citizens...LEGAL workers who pay taxes to support the future needs instead of sending money to Mexico.
Instead of a knee jerk attitude towards this, the problem is there and not going away. I do think a lot of illegals have deported themselves as I don't see as many in this county of Florida as I did five years ago. I used to see them mailing remittance wires from the Post Office, riding around doing lawn service, shopping with huge wads of cash and not speaking a word of English. This is probably not true for some areas of our country, but it is here. The economy sucks, so many went home and deported themselves. E Verify is also in Florida.
Not one time have I ever listened to Rubio and heard him support illegal immigration, blanket amnesty...he speaks of immigration reform, legal immigration, and strengthening/protecting our borders. In fact, he ticked off some Hispanics (but not Cubans) running for Senate (meanwhile Crist supported amnesty and all things Obama) by NOT supporting the original DREAM Act.
"Rubio said his alternative plan would only allow applicants to receive nonimmigrant visas.Rather than a path to citizenship for children who are in the country illegally if they go to college or serve in the military, the Republican alternative would give them a visa that would permit them to legally live in the country, go to school and work. They could then apply for citizenship following the existing routes, but wouldnÂ’t be given a special, shorter one---which is what the Dems proposed under Reid."
So, the GOP actually has ideas about a legal pathway to citizenship vs the Democrats blanket amnesty. Don't you think it will be egg on the Dems faces if this gets some traction?
If a Hispanic kid has gone through our school system all his life (on my dime) and sought healthcare in an ED (on my dime), I see nothing wrong with him getting in line to become a legal citizen and pay taxes. I have seen nothing about blanket amnesty for the parents mentioned in the Rubio plan.
Posted by: Christy Blinky still loves Rubio at April 19, 2012 05:05 PM (baL2B)
Identity politics and wish-casting, it's not just for Democrats.
Posted by: MlR at April 19, 2012 05:26 PM (vj9lA)
Marco Rubio discusses Immigration, the DREAM Act, the Latino Vote, and SB 1070.
You be the judge on his own words. Could be he will let me down, but I still believe he is a good guy.
Posted by: Christy Blinky still loves Rubio at April 19, 2012 05:28 PM (baL2B)
Posted by: MlR at April 19, 2012 05:29 PM (vj9lA)
Posted by: madmama at April 19, 2012 05:37 PM (GI1ik)
Posted by: Dick Nixon at April 19, 2012 05:46 PM (g1Um7)
We can only honor a legacy of being a nation of laws by BEING A NATION OF LAWS. There is nothing to balance here. Law is NOT BALANCED by any empathetic bullshit that someone with no respect for American sovereignty wants in a bargain. Rubio is an ass. And dumb. He's got half a brain when it comes to the clear fact that we are broke. Great. He'd rather print citizenships than print dollars.
Posted by: ThePrimordialOrderedPair at April 19, 2012 07:09 PM (X3lox)
(Romney) said the GOP will have to propose its own initiatives to win support from Hispanic voters, such as a Republican version of the Dream Act. As offered by Democrats, the act offers a path to permanent residency for those illegal immigrants who entered the U.S. as minors and serve in the military or earn a college degree.
"We're going to be able to get Hispanic voters," Mr. Romney said. "We're going to overcome the issue of immigration."
Wall Street Journal April 15, 2012
http://tin yurl.com/75vhgdy (take out the space)
Posted by: Sad Dad at April 19, 2012 07:23 PM (3PHCO)
I absolutely WILL NOT abide an open-borders Republican, I would MUCH rather have a Republican engage in nonsense like raising taxes on the rich than I would turning a blind eye to illegal immigration.
Republicans have got to get this notion out of their head that once they grant Amnesty, every Hispanic becomes a conservative.
It didn't work when Reagan did it, and Democrats are ALWAYS able to outbid Republicans on this sort of stuff.
Posted by: BradleyJ at April 19, 2012 08:25 PM (XDRsa)
Posted by: sexypig at April 19, 2012 10:52 PM (IZdYT)
Posted by: Pragmatic at April 19, 2012 11:45 PM (elHhH)
I'm a Floridian and know that Rubio has been advocating for illegal aliens all his legislative life. He's a Jeb Bush puppet who pulled the wool over everyone's eyes by lying about his positions and past during the Senatorial race. In 2003 and 04 he introduced the DREAM Act here, and in 2008 as Speaker of the House bottled up all bills aimied at controlling illegal immigration, in a particularly obnoxious way. He and Jeb have been on a mission for amnesty for a long time -- now's their chance.
Posted by: rjc at April 20, 2012 01:39 AM (SdYo1)
Posted by: Y-not hasn't read the comments at April 20, 2012 06:18 AM (5H6zj)
Posted by: Crystal Gardens ePub at April 21, 2012 02:52 AM (tgLUM)
Posted by: Never Say Never ePub at April 21, 2012 06:32 AM (fFIut)
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Posted by: Dr. Varno at April 19, 2012 01:45 PM (u7dxO)