March 23, 2013

About That Government Ammo Purchasing ...
— andy

Charles C.W. Cooke has a good piece over at NRO on the ammo purchases.

It’s all about scale. Forty-six thousand rounds also sound like a lot for the National Weather Service. (Actually, the ammo was requested by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration’s Fisheries Office of Law Enforcement, which is overseen by the same department.) In reality, it’s not that much. The service has only 63 armed personnel, which brings the purchase out at around 730 rounds per officer. This, suffice it to say, does not present a great threat to the Republic. As the NRA has noted, “more than a few NRA members would use that much ammunition in a weekend shooting class or plinking session.” There are enough risks to the right to bear arms and to American liberty in general, the NRA continued, without “inventing threats.”

On a related note, one thing I've found amazing in recent months is that what you'd have to think what was only a slight uptick in demand after the election translated into essentially a run on the bank as far as ammo's concerned.

Between the government purchase stories that circulate around and the actual gun control mania that ensued after Sandy Hook, it's been really eye-opening as to how thin the ammo supply chain really is.

I've had a policy in place for years now that basically is "never pass up a chance to buy ammo" ... meaning that I never leave the gun store empty handed, even if it's only a couple of boxes of .45 or something. Over time, this really adds up when you look at the ol' ammo cabinet, and it's also nice being an ant to all the panic-buying grasshoppers.

When things return to normal, as they hopefully will and soon, you might want to think about doing the same.

(open thread in the comments - I just wanted to throw up a new one to cut down on the scrolling)

Posted by: andy at 11:17 AM | Comments (466)
Post contains 337 words, total size 2 kb.

1

First.  And I have a good supply of ammo myself.

Posted by: Jaimo at March 23, 2013 11:20 AM (rNR/C)

2 What you're failing to see is why most of these agencies even have a law enforcement arm...

Posted by: Gmac - Waiting for the revolution at March 23, 2013 11:20 AM (IanLz)

3

"never pass up a chance ..."

 

I have the same policy re: playgrounds.

Posted by: Roman Polanski at March 23, 2013 11:21 AM (16on4)

4 Things are not normal. Not gonna be normal for a long, long time. Pretty far from normal.

Posted by: navybrat at March 23, 2013 11:22 AM (44dD6)

5 What you're failing to see is why most of these agencies even have a law enforcement arm..
You think some deadbeat will pay their student loan if we just send a letter?

Posted by: Dept. of Education SWAT team at March 23, 2013 11:22 AM (z9HTb)

6 >> What you're failing to see is why most of these agencies even have a law enforcement arm... That's a different topic entirely. I'll go one better ... why do most of these agencies even exist in the first place?

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 11:23 AM (OZPoa)

7 It's the paucity in supply that's frightening, not government demand. While the original stories sounded scary, when you break it down per shooter, it's not that bad. Additionally, I believe it's more likely that federal agencies are using bullets as an off-the-books accounting currency than it is they're gearing (further) up to kill us.

Posted by: Truman North at March 23, 2013 11:23 AM (I2LwF)

8 Probably right about the panic buying leveling off. Still, kind of frustrating to be unable to find 9mm for so long. Got tons of 12 gauge though.

Posted by: Pug Mahon, Shirking Homework at March 23, 2013 11:23 AM (6rcHp)

9 What you're failing to see is why most of these agencies even have a law enforcement arm...


And your point is...?

Posted by: The Paramilitary Assault Service of the National Endowment for the Arts at March 23, 2013 11:24 AM (8ZskC)

10 This is from over 2 weeks ago. I've already lived several lives in internet time.

Posted by: Stan at March 23, 2013 11:25 AM (5J3Mj)

11 Back from the gun show earlier.  Surprised at the light crowd and the number of AR's available at only slightly elevated prices.  A fair amount of .223/5.56 and other popular calibers, but still way over-priced ($80 for a 525 round pack of .22LR?  Kiss my ass!).

Wound up buying a Gerber machete, since I still have to tackle the jungle behind the house.

Posted by: Country Singer at March 23, 2013 11:25 AM (CgcOa)

12 What you're failing to see is why most of these agencies even have a law enforcement arm...

Posted by: Gmac - Waiting for the revolution at March 23, 2013 03:20 PM (IanLz)

 

 

Actually he addresses that in the article.

FWIW, I'm not horribly concerned about the SSA having even 500 armed agents.

1) 500 isn't a staggering amount, especially compared to the military.

2) Some of these fraud outfits are in fact (shockingly I know) run by gangs, mobsters and unsavory characters.  Is every raid a smart choice? No of course not, but that doesn't mean we should assume there are no smart raids. 

And that only speaks to a raid, if you're about to bring down a several million dollar hammer on a dude by seizing documents, I would not be stunned if you wanted a side arm when you did it. (which it seems most of the SSA ammo was for.)

Posted by: tsrblke at March 23, 2013 11:26 AM (GaqMa)

13 Andy, you get a chance to check out that site I sent you? I don't have the knowledge to know if it's crap or not. And I don't want to recommend crap to the Horde.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 23, 2013 11:26 AM (6GeMV)

14 Reload, especially pistol rounds when the primer shortage eases.  Components last for a long time and you can ramp up production any time you want (usually when it is expensive or simply non existent).  Going cheap, you can reload using a single stage press and still produce about 75-100 rounds per hour which is enough to do some range practice.  Buy commercial ammo when it is cheap and plentiful and save the brass.  Over time, you accumulate a lot of brass which is usually the most expensive component of a cartridge.  Instead of stocking up ammo, I stocked up on primers last year. 

Posted by: wg at March 23, 2013 11:26 AM (f5/3H)

15 >> While the original stories sounded scary, when you break it down per shooter, it's not that bad. Right. And some of the stories' authors clearly don't understand how the government's IDIQ contracts work, either. This is the source of the real eye-popping numbers in the billions of rounds as Cooke mentions.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 11:26 AM (OZPoa)

16 You all should have seen this coming after the mooslims sacked the twin towers FEAIGM...

Posted by: clemenza at March 23, 2013 11:26 AM (HMQ8k)

17 I did all my panic-buying in 2008 (or should I say, started it). I managed to accrue a decent amount (somewhere between "not prepared at all" and "paranoid survivalist"). It's all stored in an array of military surplus ammo cans with a desiccant packet thrown into each one for good measure. Hey gun-savvy Morons... is that enough to keep ammo long-term, or are there any better measures I should take?

Posted by: weew at March 23, 2013 11:27 AM (ElfHn)

18 >> Andy, you get a chance to check out that site I sent you? I looked at it briefly. Will do some more digging.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 11:27 AM (OZPoa)

19 http://minx.cc/?blog=86&post=338578#c20369775 Holy Shit. Granted, the AoSHQ logo needs to be vectored, but that is some nice work. Andy, you and John E. need to take a fucking bow.

Posted by: sithkhan at March 23, 2013 11:27 AM (qWAB9)

20 And I don't want to recommend crap to the Horde Poop Magazine is very popular here.

Posted by: Truman North at March 23, 2013 11:27 AM (I2LwF)

21 Actually the Cooke piece is lousy. From the article:

"The FBI and DHS’s apparently vast orders are deceptively presented by the conspiracy theorists. It is true that in 2011, the FBI ordered up to 100 million bullets for its 13,913 special agents (which works out to 7,187 per agent). And, yes, the Department of Homeland Security — a composite department that oversees USCIS, Customs and Border Protection, FEMA, ICE, the TSA, the Coast Guard, the Secret Service, and the National Protection Directorate — placed a request for up to 450 million rounds for its 65,000 armed personnel (which works out to 6,923 per agent)."

450 MILLION rounds. That is a lot of ammo. Cooke's response:

"But in the real world, ammunition is not divided up and handed out on such a basis. What is bought is stockpiled and then allocated on the basis of need. The DHSÂ’s order is expected to last for at least five years, and it was placed up front primarily as a cost-saving measure."

So because the government is STOCKPILING the ammo and not distributing it (yet) we shouldn't be concerned. How in the fuck should that be reassuring. Any military or pseudo military force stockpiles ammo. Of course they don't give it out until it is needed.

7000 rounds of ammo per man is expected to last 5 years? That is a lot of range time, I should think they wouldn't be doing much else with their time to use that amount up.

It is sad to say Ace's co-bloggers are far inferior. This is the best site around for Conservatives but the bench is weak.

Posted by: Ken Royall at March 23, 2013 11:28 AM (x0g8a)

22 You know if Cooke wanted to button down the sinister aspect of the buys he could have looked up ammo purchases prior to 2008.

If it is above and beyond what the agencies have purchased in the past, then perhaps the scrutiny is warranted.

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at March 23, 2013 11:29 AM (UCv7P)

23 Never leave without some ammo? Yeah, I thought of that too late last month. I was in a Wal Mart that was sold out of most everything, but had some 243. After I left, I remembered I had a 243. I fucked up. If it wasn't so fucking cold and rainy, I would go out and clean up my ammo room just to figure out WTF I do have. When you have two sons that hunt, you never know what is left in my "depot". One thing is sure, they never restock whatever they shoot. Assholes!

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 11:29 AM (wR+pz)

24 >> $80 for a 525 round pack of .22LR? Kiss my ass! Holy shit. I should go look and see what I bought my last brick of 22 for. It was nowhere near that and I remember thinking how ludicrously expensive it was then.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 11:29 AM (OZPoa)

25 Andy, you and John E. need to take a fucking bow.. ***** Take a Long Bow.

Posted by: Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. at March 23, 2013 11:30 AM (MhA4j)

26 2 What you're failing to see is why most of these agencies even have a law enforcement arm...

If you got a brick/mortar office other than in a big regional "federal building", you're probably gonna have at least one security guard.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 11:30 AM (j5k1n)

27 >> Andy, you and John E. need to take a fucking bow. That was all John. I don't want to show you all the other Blizzard-designed logo. You'd cry.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 11:31 AM (OZPoa)

28 I'm not a conspiracy nut on these things. I also understand government purchase aspects such as multi-year contracts and "up-to" allocations.

But keep in mind plants like LCAAP produce 1.6 billion rounds a year (all calibers) and these types of terms have never been included in similar contracts before.

There are certainly several potential explanations but I am not completely buying Cooke's analysis.

Posted by: Marcus at March 23, 2013 11:32 AM (CBs3a)

29  You are completely missing the point.  Hollow point ammunition is not used for practice, it's for killing people.  It's way too expensive to use at the range.  Target shooters use "ball" ammunition for practice.

Posted by: Dan in michigan at March 23, 2013 11:32 AM (2yD4G)

30 Okay, I have a shotgun now. What else should I look for? I'm not a hunter, but for the SHTF moments...

Posted by: NWConservative at March 23, 2013 11:33 AM (M1gmo)

31 >> 450 MILLION rounds. If you read the piece, you'd understand that this is the cap in an IDIQ contract, not rounds that they've actually taken delivery of or even ordered.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 11:33 AM (OZPoa)

32 7000 rounds of ammo per man is expected to last 5 years? That is a lot of range time, I should think they wouldn't be doing much else with their time to use that amount up.

Posted by: Ken Royall at March 23, 2013 03:28 PM (x0g8a)


__________


Say you shoot 100 rounds per visit to the range. That's 70 visits. Over 5 years that averages out to 14 per year or a little more than once a month.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 23, 2013 11:33 AM (HDgX3)

33 Someone else pointed this out recently. There are now fewer black PGA pro golfers than before Tiger Woods burst on the scene. Tiger has done nothing to increase black golfers. But there's lots more Asian golfers on the PGA today. Tiger doesn't get any credit for that even though he's more asian than he is black. The silly racial politics of the day. Any black golfer would be compelled to say Tiger's success motivated him. But none of the asian golfers get asked a similar question. Golfers have gotten so good that the key to becoming a pro is starting very, very early. So, more than ever, golfers are rich kids born into families with country club memberships in the Sunbelt. That let's them play every day as a kid. The key to becoming elite in a sport is spending huge hours playing before puberty. It lets your developing brain grow around the sport. Your skills become second-hand in a way that is nearly impossible if you pick up the game post-puberty. It's like learning a foreign language. For pros in most sports -- from baseball to basketball to golf to Nascar -- if you aren't out there at 4 or 5, it's really almost too late. There are occasional counter-examples, of course. It's not impossible to succeed if you start late. But your odds go way, way down.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at March 23, 2013 11:33 AM (ZPrif)

34

Posted by: Ken Royall at March 23, 2013 03:28 PM (x0g8a)

 

It is not uncommon for me to shoot 50-100 rounds when I go to the range.

1/month that'd be 1200 rounds. (And dear god, I hope armed agents are devoting at least 1 day/month to target practice.)

Over 5 years that'd be 6000 rounds. (Plus as Andy and Cooke point out this is an "up to" order not a "at least."

 

But what we totally need is some fear mongering, because it makes us SOOOO much more appealing to people.

 

That's why Piers Morgan the idiot had Alex Jones on, because he just connects to the American people.

Take that shit somewhere else man.

Posted by: tsrblke at March 23, 2013 11:33 AM (GaqMa)

35 @17 I think you are fine. Except for rust I don't think you need to worry about shelf life of ammo. I shot some of my dad's WWII 45 ammo a year ago, worked fine. I do have some old paper 12 ga shells. The paper sometimes swells, but I wouldn't shot them, since they are more valuable as collectors pieces.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 11:33 AM (wR+pz)

36 Right. And some of the stories' authors clearly don't understand how the government's IDIQ contracts work, either. This is the source of the real eye-popping numbers in the billions of rounds as Cooke mentions.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 03:26 PM (OZPoa)

 

 

------------------------------------------

 

 

This  ammo  purchase by the government has been out there for awhile now.  Why  is it that Sebielus still won't talk about it when asked?   Seems as though they'd have some sort of an answer hashed out by now.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 11:33 AM (8YDij)

37 ::::I don't want to show you all the other Blizzard-designed logo. You'd cry.:::: I couldn't buy that kind of favor. How the hell do you leave that lying on the floor. Oh, and see you on the ramparts, Ken. No, I'm coming. You just go on ahead. If I'm not there in a little bit, just wait longer.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 11:34 AM (JDIKC)

38 I have a policy of always picking up a box or two of ammo when it's on sale. If not for that, I wouldn't be able to start CAS shooting this year.

Posted by: Taro Tsujimoto at March 23, 2013 11:34 AM (celt+)

39 One explanation would be the government is trying to create an artificial shortage to slow down the sales to civilians. Of course Cooke never explores that. He would rather "Ben Smith" the entire thing. We have a DHS who has targeted Tea Party types as being possible domestic terrorists. We have a financial calamity coming. Civil unrest WILL occur. We do not owe it to the Obama administration to put our head in the sand.

Posted by: Ken Royall at March 23, 2013 11:34 AM (x0g8a)

40 29 You are completely missing the point. Hollow point ammunition is not used for practice, it's for killing people. It's way too expensive to use at the range. Target shooters use "ball" ammunition for practice.

Posted by: Dan in michigan at March 23, 2013 03:32 PM (2yD4G)


_________


Since when does the govt care about what's expensive and what is cheap?

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 23, 2013 11:34 AM (HDgX3)

41 OT Know what's awesome? Your tax guy no-showing when you have an appt with him. That you made yesterday.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 23, 2013 11:34 AM (6GeMV)

42 Did all my bulk buying for Ammo several years ago. Now I only pick up what is cheap! Also I reload every caliber we own!

Posted by: Old Dog at March 23, 2013 11:34 AM (tQYJH)

43 Andy, I got the rich copy program on my 2 trig WD drive and opened it. Will the program copy the name of the drive I copy on it, or should I create a folder for each drive before I copy and merge them?

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 11:35 AM (wR+pz)

44 >> You are completely missing the point. Hollow point ammunition is not used for practice, it's for killing people. It's way too expensive to use at the range. Target shooters use "ball" ammunition for practice. Ummm, no. The government doesn't go to the range with a target shooter's penny-pinching mentality. They go with a "practice with the same ammo you carry on duty" mentality. I mean, this is the wasteful-ass federal government we're talking about here.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 11:35 AM (OZPoa)

45 Say a person had, oh, 15 or so f ire ar ms of various types, just saying.  And say that person had, oh, about 16 thousand rounds of am mo set aside to accommodate such.  Would that amount be considered enough, say, for emergency situations? Or should a person keep stock piling more?  I don't know whether to keep buying more, er, heavy little boxes or shift my stockpiling over to something else like (additional) rum and whiskey.

Posted by: Say, a Person at March 23, 2013 11:35 AM (P6QsQ)

46 One of my good ol' boy coworkers turned me onto this ammo reseller aggregator:
http://www.gunbot.net/ammo

It's pretty cool, but prices still suck pretty much everywhere.

Posted by: CJ in atx at March 23, 2013 11:35 AM (U/LXS)

47 >> should I create a folder for each drive before I copy and merge them? That's how I've always done it.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 11:36 AM (OZPoa)

48 You are completely missing the point. Hollow point ammunition is not used for practice, it's for killing people. It's way too expensive to use at the range. Target shooters use "ball" ammunition for practice.

Posted by: Dan in michigan at March 23, 2013 03:32 PM (2yD4G)

 

 

 

Yeah, shooters on a budget.  There's certainly an argument to be made that the government shouldn't be buying the real full priced thing for practice.  But the government has never been good at "cost/benefit" analysis.

Occam's razor on this one seems to point to "government can't not by the best thing ever, so they buy the same thing they'll use in the field for practice."

Why? Because they have no sense of a dollar.

Someone in another gun thread said they keep up on fundamentals using their .22 to save money.  If they could do nothing but practice with the .357 or whatever I'm sure they would.

I think "government should be better using it's money" is not a bad argument.  It's also not a conspiracy theory.

Posted by: tsrblke at March 23, 2013 11:36 AM (GaqMa)

49 >>>Forty-six thousand rounds also sound like a lot for the National Weather Service. Not when you're fighting Global Warming.

Posted by: Dr. Varno at March 23, 2013 11:36 AM (x6weF)

50  Weew,
Keep it where the temperature doesn't fluctuate much and is on the cool side and that ammo will be good for one hundred years.

Posted by: Dan in michigan at March 23, 2013 11:36 AM (2yD4G)

51 Add into that the restriction for buying up used brass.

Posted by: Mrs Compton at March 23, 2013 11:37 AM (dX4hn)

52 Cyprus is having a run on their banks.

The US is having a run on ammo that continues.

Psychology, how does that work? 

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 23, 2013 11:37 AM (6EgxM)

53 >> Would that amount be considered enough, say, for emergency situations? Have you ever heard anyone complain about being in a gunfight with too much ammo?

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 11:37 AM (OZPoa)

54 I think it would be kind of interesting to where this ammo was being stored.

Posted by: Grey Fox at March 23, 2013 11:37 AM (/ZHx6)

55 Seems as though they'd have some sort of an answer hashed out by now.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 03:33 PM (8YDij)

 

 

Meh, it doesn't really benefit them to answer though.

The answer is banal, but if they don't answer it'll stoke conspiracy theories that they then get to use when demonizing the right as "Crazy extremist."

Posted by: tsrblke at March 23, 2013 11:38 AM (GaqMa)

56 37 Oh, and see you on the ramparts, Ken. No, I'm coming. You just go on ahead. If I'm not there in a little bit, just wait longer. Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 03:34 PM (JDIKC) You just pull a King David/Uriah scenario? Cruel man. You gonna steal his wife too?

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 23, 2013 11:38 AM (6GeMV)

57 52 Cyprus is having a run on their banks.

The US is having a run on ammo that continues.

Psychology, how does that work?

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 23, 2013 03:37 PM (6EgxM)


They still don't know what the hell to do in Cyprus. The Russians turned them down, the European Oligarchs turned them down, and their banks are still "closed" for business with the ATMS running dry.


I can't wait until that happens here!!

Posted by: NWConservative at March 23, 2013 11:39 AM (M1gmo)

58 It could all be a protest over a youtube video. That's what they told us last time.

Posted by: Temper Tantrum at March 23, 2013 11:39 AM (AWmfW)

59 BTW, went to the range today and ranges are really depleted on a lot of ammo.  However, they had quite a few firearms including the AR 15 and AK 47.  Next stop was a very large gun store--usually around 7000-10000 guns in stock.  They had plentiful evil black rifles, shotguns, and bolt actions.  Prices on EBRs was from $900 for AK's and $1100 and up for AR 15s. 

Most of the crowd seemed to be interested in handguns, particularly hi-cap Glocks, Sigs, Berettas, Rugers, and Taurus.  Store was crowded with little ammo except 7.62x39 and 7.54x54r.  Price for 1k Wolf FMJ steel cased 7.62x39 was $440 and $550 for 1k PMC 7.62x39 FMJ.  Some shotgun ammo and some oddball stuff like 44-40, 45 GAP, and some Speer Lawman 45 ACP.  No 22 at all except for shot shells.

At least in Metro Atlanta, it appears that the panic hit first for hi-cap firearms, then next for the magazines, then for ammo and reloading components (powder and primers).  It is easing on AR 15's right now but still appears pretty strong demand for semi automatic handguns. 





 

Posted by: wg at March 23, 2013 11:39 AM (f5/3H)

60 I think it would be kind of interesting to where this ammo was being stored.

Posted by: Grey Fox at March 23, 2013 03:37 PM (/ZHx6)

 

 

As been pointed out these are "orders up to." meaning delivery hasn't even been taken on much of this yet.

Posted by: tsrblke at March 23, 2013 11:39 AM (GaqMa)

61 Have you ever heard anyone complain about being in a gunfight with too much ammo?

-----------



No, but then again it doesn't come up much at my church potlucks.

Posted by: Say, a Person at March 23, 2013 11:40 AM (P6QsQ)

62 My motto in the 80's was buy until your asshole bleeds. There was waaay too much cool stuff going for way cheap back then.

Posted by: Berserker at March 23, 2013 11:40 AM (FMbng)

63 24>> $80 for a 525 round pack of .22LR? Kiss my ass!

Holy shit. I should go look and see what I bought my last brick of 22 for. It was nowhere near that and I remember thinking how ludicrously expensive it was then.

Posted by: Andy

 

I paid $13.95/box for the last 550 rnd boxes I bought  per my records. I was thinking I could sell off 10,000 rounds or so to invest in other purchases and easily quadruple my original investment without really denting my stock.

Posted by: Gmac - Waiting for the revolution at March 23, 2013 11:41 AM (IanLz)

64 What this shows to me isn't so much a "the govt wants to shoot us all" situation. But it does show just how fucking big govt has become where they need hundreds of millions of rounds of ammo to keep their law enforcement peeps supplied.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 23, 2013 11:41 AM (HDgX3)

65 The liberals in government are (pick one) 1. Incompetent retards who couldn't organize a clusterfuck in a whorehouse with a briefcase of Benjamin's 2. Evil geniuses who have secretly built, staffed and supplied a secret shadow army, the details of which have never been discovered. Except by Alex Jones. Who also blew the lid off the whole "Lizard People wearing human skin suits who control the One World Government" thing.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 11:41 AM (JDIKC)

66 tsrblke- I don't need to "take my shit somewhere else". I am not claiming the government is needlessly stockpiling ammo for nefarious purchases. However, based on the crap they have been up to I don't see any reason to just play dumb and ignore it.

If you like what DHS and ATF have been doing, if you think killing American citizens on sight is cool, having drones flying over American air space is great, having unlawful searches and seizures at every airport is a good thing, naked attempts to disarm the populace, targeting political adversaries as possible threats, then have another beer and play dumb.

Democrats claim "assault weapons" are weapons of war. Meanwhile dozens of government agencies whose jurisdiction is within the US have them. They are stockpiling ammo. Who are they planning on going to war with?

Posted by: Ken Royall at March 23, 2013 11:41 AM (x0g8a)

67 Been saying much the same for months. First off, I have searched the FBO.GOV website where the contracts are listed, and I can't come up with anywhere near 1.6 billion, which leads me to believe that a journalist with weak reading? comprehension or math skills pulled the numbed out of his ass (every story I've read sources back to Infowars, so that could also be the problem). Second, they aren't buying all of it upfront. The contracts specifically state that DHS can buy the minimum of 10,000 up to the max for the year in the contract (the highest I saw was 40 million per year on one contract). They have the option to exercise four one year options after that for the same amounts. But 1.6 billion sounds scary, and we all know that journalists only lie when we disagree with them.

Posted by: elliot at March 23, 2013 11:42 AM (UOYbf)

68 Prices on EBRs was from $900 for AK's that is some expensive AK's they were $400 pre panic

Posted by: Jake in ID at March 23, 2013 11:42 AM (zzeVM)

69 NW Conservative, posted this earlier this morning about Cyprus,

And in Cyprus, the banks are scheduled to reopen on Tuesday.  All these measures to prevent instability have in fact created it.  People are going to cash only transactions and it seems many want to bail out of the Eurozone.  Pamplona has the running of the bulls, Nicoasia will have the running of the banks on Tuesday I think and a lot more will be gored than some idiot too slow to dodge.
http://tinyurl.com/bh63wke

Interesting times we live in...  *thud*

Off to buy lottery tickets in hope of wining $320 million Powerball jackpot.  Then I can afford more ammo and a better place to defend.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 23, 2013 11:42 AM (6EgxM)

70 >> I shot some of my dad's WWII 45 ammo a year ago, worked fine. Oh, man, that reminds me. Way back when, my dad got hold of some WWI (or maybe between the wars) vintage .45 ACP. It was only a box or two, but we shot it up in my Colt M1917. Two things I remember: the powder smell was completely different than any other round I've ever shot, and it didn't have quite as much oomph as a new round, as you could easily see the bullets flying to the target.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 11:42 AM (OZPoa)

71 >29 You are completely missing the point. Hollow point ammunition is not used for practice, it's for killing people. It's way too expensive to use at the range. Target shooters use "ball" ammunition for practice.<

Depends on the caliber. Some of us do use HP routinely. Depending on the round they can either be less expensive or more accurate.

Posted by: Marcus at March 23, 2013 11:43 AM (CBs3a)

72 61 No, but then again it doesn't come up much at my church potlucks. Posted by: Say, a Person at March 23, 2013 03:40 PM (P6QsQ) You need a different church. I ran into our head deacon at gander mtn when I was picking up my Mossberg. Nice convo about guns/ammo and what we each had.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 23, 2013 11:43 AM (6GeMV)

73 65 The liberals in government are (pick one)


1. Incompetent retards who couldn't organize a clusterfuck in a whorehouse with a briefcase of Benjamin's

2. Evil geniuses who have secretly built, staffed and supplied a secret shadow army, the details of which have never been discovered. Except by Alex Jones. Who also blew the lid off the whole "Lizard People wearing human skin suits who control the One World Government" thing.



Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 03:41 PM (JDIKC)


3.

Posted by: ambassador Chris Stevens at March 23, 2013 11:43 AM (AWmfW)

74 O/T How did MI and MI St. both end up playing in Michigan in the first round? When brackets are set, don't they take this into consideration?

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 23, 2013 11:44 AM (HDgX3)

75 :::You just pull a King David/Uriah scenario? Cruel man. You gonna steal his wife too?::: Steal? When she gets a look at this, she'll volunteer.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 11:44 AM (JDIKC)

76 Out of the blue the other day, Mrs. Chronda asked "why don't we have a gun?"

Stumbled and fumbled a bit before coming up with "because California". Don't know where I'd stash one here in the trailer park.

Posted by: Assault Citizen Anachronda at March 23, 2013 11:44 AM (1c58W)

77 Let's also not discount the fact that we have people driving across state lines and paying money to their friends at Chinamart to try and make a buck on ammo.

I am a little sick of people gobbling up supply to make a few bucks and driving the price up for the rest of us. It's bullshit.

Posted by: Marcus at March 23, 2013 11:45 AM (CBs3a)

78 I'll also add that I am a firearms instructor for a fed LEO agency, and we train four times a year and shoot an average of 250 rds per quarter per agent, all duty ammo (hollow point). We haven't used "training" ammo in at least 12 years.

Posted by: elliot at March 23, 2013 11:46 AM (UOYbf)

79 I wish I'd been smart and bought everything I need years ago. Now I wonder if I'll ever be able to get it. Not that I'm unarmed, but there's definitely room for improvement.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 11:46 AM (JQuNB)

80 Re 17--if you are really bored with nothing to do or really paranoid, you can buy Makron sealant for the bullets and primers.  A sealed cartridge can even take a bit of a dunking and still perform.  Try Midway USA for that.

Posted by: wg at March 23, 2013 11:47 AM (f5/3H)

81 Say a person had, oh, 15 or so f ire ar ms of various types, just
saying. And say that person had, oh, about 16 thousand rounds of
am mo set aside to accommodate such. Would that amount be considered enough,
say, for emergency situations? Or should a person keep stock piling
more? I don't know whether to keep buying more, er, heavy little boxes or shift my stockpiling over to something else like (additional) rum and whiskey.

Posted by: Say, a Person at March 23, 2013 03:35 PM (P6QsQ)

 

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

 

I'm older now and move a bit slower than I did when I was young.  I figure if  the SHTF I'll have enough to make my mark on the cause.  Otherwise, I'll probably be an easy target for a scoped weapon.

 

It's reality.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 11:48 AM (8YDij)

82 The liberals in government are (pick one)

1. Incompetent retards who couldn't organize a clusterfuck in a whorehouse with a briefcase of Benjamin's

2. Evil geniuses who have secretly built, staffed and supplied a secret shadow army,

Posted by: Empire of Jeff

Except for the fact that it takes very little brainpower to be dangerous. And in most cases, stupid people can't help but be a danger to everyone around them.

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at March 23, 2013 11:48 AM (UCv7P)

83

**Looks at Phaser**

 

Why does this thing even have a 'Stun' setting?

Posted by: Capt. Kirk at March 23, 2013 11:49 AM (fMVxQ)

84 Didn't the US Army run out of 9mm ammo durring Clinton? or was that Bush 2? anyone remember?

Posted by: Jake in ID at March 23, 2013 11:49 AM (zzeVM)

85 Posted by: Dept. of Education SWAT team at March 23, 2013 03:22 PM (z9HTb) *** I've got BIG plans for you!

Posted by: President Rand Paul at March 23, 2013 11:49 AM (piMMO)

86 80 Re 17--if you are really bored with nothing to do or really paranoid, you can buy Makron sealant for the bullets and primers. A sealed cartridge can even take a bit of a dunking and still perform. Try Midway USA for that. Clear nail polish will do the same trick. Around the primer and at the neck/bullet seam and you've got waterproof ammo.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 11:49 AM (JDIKC)

87

Also I reload every caliber we own!

I'd try that....but you'd probably end up reading about me in the news. Not in a good way.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at March 23, 2013 11:49 AM (0IhFx)

88 69 NW Conservative, posted this earlier this morning about Cyprus,

And in Cyprus, the banks are scheduled to reopen on Tuesday. All these measures to prevent instability have in fact created it. People are going to cash only transactions and it seems many want to bail out of the Eurozone. Pamplona has the running of the bulls, Nicoasia will have the running of the banks on Tuesday I think and a lot more will be gored than some idiot too slow to dodge.
http://tinyurl.com/bh63wke

Interesting times we live in... *thud*

Off to buy lottery tickets in hope of wining $320 million Powerball jackpot. Then I can afford more ammo and a better place to defend.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 23, 2013 03:42 PM (6EgxM)


There will be a running on the banks, Cyprus will collapse, and the same is going to happen in every country thinking about trying this: Italy, Spain, Portugal. It may not happen on Tuesday, but the Euros have sealed their fate. I really hope this wakes people the fuck up.

Posted by: NWConservative at March 23, 2013 11:49 AM (M1gmo)

89

Posted by: Ken Royall at March 23, 2013 03:41 PM (x0g8a)

 

 

You can build a strawman!  And knock him down.  How good for you.

 

Here's a thing.

You say you're not convinced the government isn't stockpiling ammo for nefarious purposes, but also saying you're not claiming that.  Explain yourself better.

Secondly, as has been pointed out "I'd like to tell you we may buy as many as X rounds over the next 5 years" does not equal "I just bought X rounds." (meaning it's not really stockpiling.)

 

Thirdly, at what point did I say "and so since this really isn't anything to be concerned about the government may go ahead and start doing drone strikes on American soil."  I didn't.  EVER.

What I did say is if you get all worked up over the wrong things, it really hurts your arguments on the right ones. (See also: Ron Paul.)

But it's OK, because I think you have EoJ to contend with on this one, so I defer to the better destroyer of conspiracy theories.

Posted by: tsrblke at March 23, 2013 11:50 AM (GaqMa)

90 The government SWAT teams will come to confiscate your junk food. http://www.americanthinker.com/2013/03/were_all_cvs_employees_now.html

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 11:50 AM (dBYCN)

91 @70 Yeah, they do seem to lose some velocity when the ammo is old. Bye the way, my son looked up my dad's 1911 serial number at the Colt site. Manufactured in 1918. Thanks for the advice on rich copy. I will get on that as soon as I stop fucking off here.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 11:50 AM (wR+pz)

92 ::::Except for the fact that it takes very little brainpower to be dangerous. And in most cases, stupid people can't help but be a danger to everyone around them. :::: They don't even have to be stupid. They just have to not care. Look at Benghazi. That wasn't stupidity or evil. That was fucking apathy.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 11:51 AM (JDIKC)

93 75 When she gets a look at this, she'll volunteer. Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 03:44 PM (JDIKC) For what? Front line infantry?

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 23, 2013 11:51 AM (6GeMV)

94 Have any of you also noticed almost no one has Fleshlights® in stock?

A friend told me that.  I'm not even sure what those are.

Posted by: Dang at March 23, 2013 11:51 AM (R18D0)

95 Into the fuckin barrel, steevy

Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 23, 2013 11:52 AM (6GeMV)

96 >> I'll also add that I am a firearms instructor for a fed LEO agency, and we train four times a year and shoot an average of 250 rds per quarter per agent, all duty ammo (hollow point). We haven't used "training" ammo in at least 12 years. Glynco says they use 15 million rounds a year. http://goo.gl/vaIOZ And that's just for Raylan.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 11:52 AM (OZPoa)

97 74 O/T How did MI and MI St. both end up playing in Michigan in the first round? When brackets are set, don't they take this into consideration? Yeah they do and they usually try to let the teams play as close to home as they can. Selling game tickets is still important!

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 11:53 AM (wR+pz)

98 I haven't fired a gun in years, but damn I can't believe the prices of stuff. I remember when 5.56mm was $15 per 100. You used to be able to get sealed 400 rd combat packs for $60. 7.62X39 used to come in 1100 rd big sardine cans on SKS stripper clips for $100 or so.  Man times have changed.

Posted by: Berserker at March 23, 2013 11:54 AM (FMbng)

99 94 Have any of you also noticed almost no one has Fleshlights® in stock?

A friend told me that. I'm not even sure what those are.

Posted by: Dang at March 23, 2013 03:51 PM (R18D0)


Ummmm....

Posted by: NWConservative at March 23, 2013 11:54 AM (M1gmo)

100 Obama is, if nothing else,  a thin-skinned little twerp who sees the rush to purchase guns as a personal attack. So in retaliation, he orders these various departments to order ammo knowing that it's going to have an adverse affect on people looking to buy the same, a metaphorical middle finger so to speak. His history reeks of antagonism, division, and intimidation, and of course blatant lying.

Posted by: jksisco in OC at March 23, 2013 11:54 AM (AnfcZ)

101

@74,

 

They stack the deck for teams they want to see advance.  "Neutral ground" is for teams the committee couldn't care about.

See Also the Jayhawks (who might as well have played in their home stadium.  It wasn't even 1 city over.)

Had they been a team not cared about, they'd have lost to the 16 seed.

Posted by: tsrblke at March 23, 2013 11:54 AM (GaqMa)

102

A lot of old timers in the military are starting to talk about how it was in the 90s, with discussions about what to do when they're limited to running their Bradley engines for 15 minutes and no more. 


It wouldn't surprise me if the rest of the federal agencies were doing the same thing, and planning appropriately.  The feeling seems to be to spend the money that they have and start stocking up for the five or six years.

Posted by: Colorado Alex at March 23, 2013 11:56 AM (lr3d7)

103 100 Obama is, if nothing else, a thin-skinned little twerp who sees the rush to purchase guns as a personal attack. So in retaliation, he orders these variousdepartments to order ammo knowing that it's going to have an adverse affect on people looking to buy the same, a metaphorical middle finger so to speak. His history reeks of antagonism, division,and intimidation, and of course blatant lying.

Posted by: jksisco in OC at March 23, 2013 03:54 PM (AnfcZ)


Never thought of that. That sure can stop the little guy/gal from purchasing guns and ammo if there is sky high prices.

Posted by: NWConservative at March 23, 2013 11:56 AM (M1gmo)

104 95 Did it do something to the page?I don't see anything.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 11:56 AM (dBYCN)

105 Yeah they do and they usually try to let the teams play as close to home as they can.

Selling game tickets is still important!

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 03:53 PM (wR+pz)


______


There's playing close to home and then there's playing AT home which is a big disadvantage for their opponents.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 23, 2013 11:57 AM (HDgX3)

106  The only time serious shooters use hollow points for practice is to check whether ammunition is feeding the gun properly.  Once you have run a few magazines of new ammunition you then know if it feeds correctly.  Ball ammunition is ballistically  equivalent so it makes no fucking sense not to practice with it.  It's easy to say that the government is stupid and wasteful, that's usually the case, but not always.

Posted by: Dan in michigan at March 23, 2013 11:57 AM (2yD4G)

107  You may be right, but forgive me if I don't trust NRO 100% like I used to (and I shouldn't have then).

Posted by: Baldy at March 23, 2013 11:57 AM (opS9C)

108 Did it do something to the page?I don't see anything. Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 03:56 PM (dBYCN) Well, on my phone the blog was enwidened, but now I'm back on the computer and it's fine.

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at March 23, 2013 11:58 AM (GEICT)

109 11Back from the gun show earlier. Surprised at the light crowd... A fair amount of .223/5.56 and other popular calibers, but still way over-priced ($80 for a 525 round pack of .22LR? Kiss my ass!).

Posted by: Country Singer at March 23, 2013 03:25 PM (CgcOa)

 

The "light crowd" is a good sign; buyers are saying "Hell No" to Mr. $80 ammo -- who is going to take a lot of it back to the shop at the end of the show.

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 11:58 AM (w7J/R)

110 106 They don't give a shit.Saving money is for little people.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 11:59 AM (dBYCN)

111 108 Sorry.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 12:00 PM (dBYCN)

112 The "light crowd" is agood sign; buyers are saying "Hell No" toMr. $80 ammo -- whois going to take a lot of it back to the shop at the end of the show. I hope you're right. I've resisted paying inflated prices. 12ga has been available at close to the pre-freak-out price, so I've bought more of that.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 12:02 PM (JQuNB)

113 >> 111 108 Sorry. Fixt. You can owe me.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 12:02 PM (OZPoa)

114 That FBO site only has a database of 1 year. It would take one afternoon to go over to one of the agencies and ask for the RFQ's for Ammo going back 8- 10 years.

If these current requests were normal, the evidence is there.

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at March 23, 2013 12:02 PM (UCv7P)

115

Wow it only takes 1 Friedman video to kill a thread these days.

I is sad

Posted by: tsrblke at March 23, 2013 12:02 PM (GaqMa)

116 96. Re: Raylan. I love the Glynco references on Justified. Glynco is the old school way to refer to FLETC, back when it was run by Treasury. I was there last year for two advanced instructor courses, and we probably shot 75,000 combined.

Posted by: elliot at March 23, 2013 12:03 PM (4hQC8)

117

Hollowpoint ammo isn't used for target practice.

Janet Napolitano refuses to answer any questions regarding this ammo purchase or the receipt of 2,700 MRAPs.

State and local law enforcement agencies are limiting the number of rounds officers can carry per magazine, limiting rounds expended on the firing range, and begging/bartering for any ammo they can get.

This is NOT normal.

Whoever said "the bench is weak," I agree.

Posted by: Sam Adams at March 23, 2013 12:03 PM (OYGps)

118 Good to see so many people making the same assertions without checking anything. And on a Saturday, too!

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:04 PM (bxiXv)

119
7.62X39 used to come in 1100 rd
big sardine cans on SKS stripper clips for $100 or so. Man times have changed.

That was why I originally bought an SKS. The weapon was simple, and tough, and ammo for it was dirt cheap. After I'd had it for a couple years, all the good deals dried up.....with the exception of old soviet bloc boxer primed corrosive ammo. Eventually it was more expensive for 7.62X39 than .223. I got rid of my SKS, (I shouldn't have.....any weapon that pisses off the dessicated senior senator from California is worth keeping).

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at March 23, 2013 12:04 PM (0IhFx)

120 There's playing close to home and then there's playing AT home which is a big disadvantage for their opponents. Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 23, 2013 03:57 PM (HDgX3) What, you mean UCLA didn't like playing in Greensboro NC in 1974? I am fucking shocked, I tell you, shocked!

Posted by: Zombie Norm Sloan, NCSU NCAA 1974 Champs at March 23, 2013 12:04 PM (wR+pz)

121 One point against "the gov't" being the driver of the shortage is the lack of.22 ammo. I can get .40 .45 9 mm, and lots of rifle calibers, but NO WHERE can I get. .22 ammo. No LE agencies buy any 22 so at least in that caliber it is scared citizens stockpiling.

Posted by: Terry at March 23, 2013 12:05 PM (uRqp0)

122

A lot of old timers in the military are starting to talk about how it was in the 90s, with discussions about what to do when they're limited to running their Bradley engines for 15 minutes and no more.

 

 

---------------------------------------------------

 

 

That's the way it was in the Carter years when I was in the military.  We even ran out of money  in the winter where we couldn't start them up at all.  Look for this to start happening in the next year or two.

 

Most of our training was done on leather personnel carriers.  Sucks being in an armored Cav unit and have no armor to play with.

 

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 12:05 PM (8YDij)

123 Come on Merovign, these folk love being in a circular.... 

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 23, 2013 12:06 PM (6EgxM)

124 It's all the hoarders and speculators, though *cough* I say that as shouldn't since I've stocked up myself.

Posted by: toby928© presents at March 23, 2013 12:06 PM (QupBk)

125 One point against "the gov't" being the driver of the shortage is the lack of.22 ammo. Yeah. I'm undecided about the govt's role in this, but the shortage of .22LR seems to indicate they're not the driving factor. .22 is about all I can afford to shoot, and I can't find any either.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 12:07 PM (JQuNB)

126 123 One moron talked about doing guard duty armed only with an ax handle in the Carter years.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 12:07 PM (dBYCN)

127 115. I saw contracts going back to 2009. It was an ICE/CBP purchase from Winchester or Remington for. 40 cal.

Posted by: elliot at March 23, 2013 12:09 PM (df8Sh)

128

124

 

Jerk, Circular Jerk.

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet at March 23, 2013 12:09 PM (S8bH5)

129 Is it cheaper to buy components and built your own ammo?

Posted by: Temper Tantrum at March 23, 2013 12:10 PM (AWmfW)

130 so there is no shortage? ok

Posted by: phoenixgirl,commenter on a conservative award winning blog at March 23, 2013 12:11 PM (GVxQo)

131
So my take is ok that's not a whole lot of ammo for the NOAA Fisheries, but wtf does the fisheries need the armed law enforcement for anyway.  They are not getting a threat from wild crazed fisherman armed with automatic rifles to protect their one over the limit catch.  They get a ticket, they move on.

This is typical govt excess bureaucracy.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 23, 2013 12:11 PM (IY7Ir)

132 Nanny Bloomberg says we should just get used to being under constant surveillance.I'd post a link but I don't want to fuck up again.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 12:11 PM (dBYCN)

133 >> Glynco is the old school way to refer to FLETC, back when it was run by Treasury. My dad's an old-school LEO in Georgia. He's been to a bunch of training courses down there and I can't recall ever hearing it called anything but "Glynco" (BTW, morons, that comes from Glynn County, where it's located). The only recollection I have of it being called FLETC is that there was a sign as you enter Brunswick that (IIRC) spelled it F.L.E.T.C.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 12:12 PM (OZPoa)

134

That's the way it was in the Carter years when I was in the military. We even ran out of money in the winter where we couldn't start them up at all. Look for this to start happening in the next year or two.

Most of our training was done on leather personnel carriers. Sucks being in an armored Cav unit and have no armor to play with.


Yup, and ammo and fuel are the first things that will get cut.

Posted by: Colorado Alex at March 23, 2013 12:12 PM (lr3d7)

135 I haven't been able to buy ammo for my 38 from Walmart for months.  I haven't tried anywhere else.  Thought about going on line.  Their ammo shelves have been empty for a long time.

Posted by: jewells45 at March 23, 2013 12:13 PM (u25eL)

136 I think perhaps the funniest part is none of the "journalists" or commenters just call the NSSF or the manufacturers like Speer, Winchester, Remington, et al. Try it Monday, see what they say about where the ammo is going (retailers, mainly). While production of small arms ammo *doubled* from last year, *supply* is somewhat inflexible for ammo because while manufacture is not highly regulated, setting up space and more importantly equipment to manufacture new bulk ammunition is *incredibly* difficult. It doesn't take *that much* of a run to clear the shelves, and then people panic and the shelves stay clear for a while, just like four years ago, the last panic run.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:13 PM (bxiXv)

137


So my take is ok that's not a whole lot of ammo for the NOAA Fisheries, but wtf does the fisheries need the armed law enforcement for anyway. They are not getting a threat from wild crazed fisherman armed with automatic rifles to protect their one over the limit catch. They get a ticket, they move on.


Actually, poachers can get really nasty if pushed.

Posted by: Colorado Alex at March 23, 2013 12:13 PM (lr3d7)

138 I'm so bored. I've been on youtube trying to troll the joo hater comments and no one will bite.

Posted by: Waldo Truth at March 23, 2013 12:13 PM (2U4NN)

139 118. I just posted that we only train with hollow point duty ammo. Have since at least 2001, and it was a liability issue that caused the switch. That being said, I believe that our duty ammo, at the contract price, is very cheap. I have the exact number somewhere, but can't recall off the top of my head.

Posted by: elliot at March 23, 2013 12:14 PM (xqauy)

140

I believe that Uncle  Miltie Friedman would say:  

With increased demand, prices rise. 

Buyers reduce buying and look to substitutes (e.g., .22LR).  

Producers produce more at higher prices. 

So, supply goes up and prices come down

 

But, the wrinkle here is the fear that the government will interfere with the supply in the future, so even increased supply is not enough.  For a while.    I can wait.  

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 12:14 PM (w7J/R)

141 Target shooters use "ball" ammunition for practice.

Duffers, yes.  Pros practice with that they'll use for real.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 12:15 PM (j5k1n)

142 >> It doesn't take *that much* of a run to clear the shelves That's the thing that surprised me, like I said in the post. It's amazing how little of a change it takes downstream to clear the shelves and keep them cleared.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 12:16 PM (OZPoa)

143 Is it cheaper to buy components and built your own ammo? Posted by: Temper Tantrum at March 23, 2013 04:10 PM (AWmfW) generally, but with no powder or primers available today you can't make anything if you have no inventory

Posted by: Jake in ID at March 23, 2013 12:16 PM (zzeVM)

144 Benghazi. "That wasn't stupidity or evil. That was fucking apathy." ...or all of the above, by degree. And you are describing the current administration rather than the people under attack. Decades earlier, after the Shah was deposed, when the US Embassy was being protested for DAYS on end, US embassy employees coming and going through the crowd to and from work each day took no care to collect and relocate to the incinerator or simply destroy in advance to vacating the premises their embassy documents (said officially after Benghazi to be more precious than the US human lives, according to Ob/ary) until AFTER the protesters actually climbed over the walls. imo, stupidity there included the CIA assessment and advice to State Department. Certainly, the feeling of American invincibility must have colored the embassy employee conduct and priorities for days during the protests outside their wall that led up to their being taken hostage, a hugely grotesque set of circumstances. That was a micro-deja-vu of the US evacuation of Saigon with the military's Vietnam withdrawal. THAT was horribly planned, no thanks to Kissinger, top down onus. But then, if it's not your life lost, being one of the untouchables as Kissinger is, you may have hit the apathy nail on the head.

Posted by: panzernashorn at March 23, 2013 12:16 PM (MhA4j)

145 Catch everyone later - OSP, PG, and Merovign.

Little trip to satiate the fantasy of winning.  Then a free casino buffet.  Thence home.  Jya ne!

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 23, 2013 12:16 PM (6EgxM)

146 It doesn't take *that much* of a run to clear the shelves, and then people panic and the shelves stay clear for a while, just like four years ago, the last panic run. Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile at March 23, 2013 04:13 PM (bxiXv) So you expect price and supply to return to pre-freak conditions?

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 12:16 PM (JQuNB)

147 Oh,and not surprisingly,Erdogan has already backtracked on friendlier relations with Israel.More great diplomacy from Obama and his genius team.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 12:17 PM (dBYCN)

148 130 Is it cheaper to buy components and built your own ammo? Posted by: Temper Tantrum at March 23, 2013 04:10 PM (AWmfW) *Sort of*. Components are as affected by panics as ammunition, so prices are high now. You re-use the shell casing, so that saves money, but you pay for equipment. Between panics, it is a little cheaper *per round* to reload, but the general rule is you will make up for that by shooting more - not many people actually save any money. Now, "cowboy shooters" and others who primarily cast their own lead projectiles - save a little more. I shoot mostly high-velocity jacketed ammo, no such savings for me.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:17 PM (bxiXv)

149 For pros in most sports -- from baseball to basketball to golf to Nascar -- if you aren't out there at 4 or 5, it's really almost too late. There are occasional counter-examples, of course. It's not impossible to succeed if you start late. But your odds go way, way down. That's my excuse.

Posted by: Roman Polanski at March 23, 2013 12:18 PM (I2LwF)

150 134. It has always been called FLETC, but everyone called it Glynco. DHS took it over after 9-11. I remember the locals calling it "flea-tec" back in the 90 s when I went through basic agent training.

Posted by: elliot at March 23, 2013 12:19 PM (p12qs)

151
That's the way it was in the Carter years when I was in the military. We even ran out of money in the winter where we couldn't start them up at all. Look for this to start happening in the next year or two.

Yep. Been there...it was feast/famine. At times we couldn't afford to get leaky faucets in the barracks fixed...and by 'leaky', I mean a few of them were running like the tap had been turned wide open. Field exercises were a joke...we'd drive about half a mile from the motor pool, put everything up, but we wouldn't start a single generator. We'd just sit there, or 'train' on how to dig a hole. At the end of the day, we'd drive the half mile back to the motor pool.

Lunches in the mess hall often consisted of canned vegetable medley, and sliced baloney in bbq sauce. For a while we had to request toilet paper from the company 1st Sgt.

That all changed in a hurry once it was obvious Carter was not going to be enjoying a second term...we even got a very decent pay raise...something like 11 percent, if I recall correctly.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at March 23, 2013 12:20 PM (0IhFx)

152 So you expect price and supply to return to pre-freak conditions? Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 04:16 PM (JQuNB) depends what the Senate does next month. I think it will be fall before this simmers down.....

Posted by: Jake in ID at March 23, 2013 12:20 PM (zzeVM)

153

Reminder it is

 

EARTH HOUR 

Tonight 830-930

When all the good little enviro-weenies save electricity for an hour by living in the actual dark (as opposed to the mental darkness).  

 

So you know what this Moron will do to mock them!

 

I need to run out to the store and get two new halogen bulbs for my burnt out worklights.  Then I need to get the oven ready for its self cleaning and move the portable electric heaters around the house.  It's 30 deg here, so I cannot run the A/C too. 

Posted by: rd at March 23, 2013 12:20 PM (zLp5I)

154 >> but the general rule is you will make up for that by shooting more - not many people actually save any money. Yup. The only reason I reload is to custom-tailor rounds for squeezing performance and accuracy out of a particular gun. Also, I load a pointed .30-30 for hunting with my Contender because you can't buy that off-the-shelf. I never have noticed much in the way of savings. At least enough for it to be a compelling reason to get into it.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 12:21 PM (OZPoa)

155 My best friend is a drug rep and covers half of our state. He shops every store in his territory that might have decently priced ammo that he or I use. (We have purposely not duplicated most of our calibers in our guns) I am able to hit the stores in our area early am. Between the two of us we have been able to keep well stocked. To the point that our group of friends have been able to shoot several hundred rounds on the weekends without getting low. Get a good tribe.

Posted by: traye at March 23, 2013 12:21 PM (99vXN)

156 420 dude

Posted by: Dr. Varno at March 23, 2013 12:21 PM (x6weF)

157 I was a stocker also. Particularly hard to get stuff, like .243 varmit rounds that go 4,000 fps. Heck. I have ammo for my .35 Whelan. We can't mail order in my State, so must rely on small store stuff.
Some of the premium makers such as CCI say they are having trouble getting components.

Posted by: pat at March 23, 2013 12:21 PM (jlQR7)

158 153 Obama said he's still pushing for it.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 12:21 PM (dBYCN)

159

I need to run out to the store and get two new halogen bulbs for my burnt out worklights. Then I need to get the oven ready for its self cleaning and move the portable electric heaters around the house. It's 30 deg here, so I cannot run the A/C too.


I'm going to sit out in the snow on a lawn chair wearing nothing but a speedo and running three space heaters at full blast to keep me warm.

Posted by: Colorado Alex at March 23, 2013 12:22 PM (lr3d7)

160 I just posted that we only train with hollow point duty ammo. Posted by: elliot at March 23, 2013 04:14 PM (xqauy) You're Not Helping The Narrative!!! It's amazing how little of a change it takes downstream to clear the shelves and keep them cleared. Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 04:16 PM (OZPoa) They've been able to *double* production, but demand more than doubled and it would be a *massive* investment to increase further. Think back to econ 101 and inflexible supply. They can't just ramp up more production by hiring people, they have to manufacture complex, precision high-speed industrial equipment that is so specialized nobody actually makes it on a regular basis - they're all custom jobs. So you expect price and supply to return to pre-freak conditions? Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 04:16 PM (JQuNB) It depends on the politicians. Which is why everyone is freaking out.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:22 PM (bxiXv)

161 EARTH HOUR Tonight 830-930

Maybe I'll go torch a dumpster in recognition of it.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 12:23 PM (j5k1n)

162 I will be sure to turn on all my lights. But truth be told, I don't live in the kind of neighborhood that is home to a lot of nutbags.

Posted by: Truman North at March 23, 2013 12:24 PM (I2LwF)

163 ::::Also, I load a pointed .30-30 for hunting with my Contender because you can't buy that off-the-shelf. :::: You never tried Hornady's LeveRevolution ammo? I got some for my Marlin 1895 CB. It's a spite point with a polymer tip that won't set off the primer in front of it when sacked in a tubular magazine. They also come in .30-30 flavor.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 12:24 PM (JDIKC)

164 It's amazing how little of a change it takes downstream to clear the shelves and keep them cleared.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 04:16 PM (OZPoa)


_________


That's the case for any product. Manufacturing is run on a JIT (Just In Time)  basis now. Which means you use the supplies as soon as they come into teh factory. Nothing (or very little) is warehoused. So even a 10% spike in demand will fuck you up since you don't have any extra supply. And you can't just call up your supplier and say, give me 10% more because your supplier is using JIT and he's in the same situation as well.


So everyone in the supply chain is stuck and nobody wants to commit to a 10% increase because they know if demand suddenly drops back by 10%, they're going to be screwed.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 23, 2013 12:24 PM (HDgX3)

165 I know the strip mall where the local Earth First! Eco-terrorist cell has its front organization.  Maybe I'll torch their dumpster ;->

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 12:25 PM (j5k1n)

166 Maybe I'll go torch a dumpster in recognition of it. Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 04:23 PM (j5k1n) Don't forget to toss a couple tires in for that aromatic effect.

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at March 23, 2013 12:25 PM (GEICT)

167 Our latest purchases 22lr $13 for 325 box 22lr $20 for 500 38sp $13 for 50 357 $52 for 100 jhp 40sw $22 for 50 fmj 44-40 $50 for 50 9mm $14 for 50fmj Not great but can shoot enough to stay sharp

Posted by: traye at March 23, 2013 12:26 PM (99vXN)

168 Posted by: jewells45 at March 23, 2013 04:13 PM (u25eL) . I just picked up another 100 rounds of Fiocci. Italian components assembled in America. Good stuff.Try a gun store or if in midwest, a hardware store. They tend to stock up on stuff shooters can afford to shoot.

Posted by: pat at March 23, 2013 12:26 PM (jlQR7)

169 I have several boxes of 9mm I don't need btw

Posted by: TejasJudio de la Frontera at March 23, 2013 12:26 PM (lD8ju)

170 >> You never tried Hornady's LeveRevolution ammo? That didn't exist when I got the Contender. I should give it a try.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 12:26 PM (OZPoa)

171 Lunches in the mess hall often consisted of canned vegetable medley, and sliced baloney in bbq sauce. For a while we had to request toilet paper from the company 1st Sgt.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at March 23, 2013 04:20 PM (0IhFx)

 

It was tough in the USAF as well.  Steak and lobster at dinner only  on alternating days.  Damn, times were tough back then.  Just kidding, we had steak and lobster every day.

Posted by: Ammo Dump at March 23, 2013 12:27 PM (YYyqq)

172

Interesting that .22LR is also in high demand.  Folks are going back to a caliber that great for learning and for practicing fundamentals of shooting.

 

And a whole lot of fun to shoot.

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 12:27 PM (w7J/R)

173 Sold my Sig several months ago

Posted by: TejasJudio de la Frontera at March 23, 2013 12:27 PM (lD8ju)

174 40sw $22 for 50 fmj Where'd you get that?

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at March 23, 2013 12:28 PM (GEICT)

175

It doesn't take *that much* of a run to clear the shelves, and then people panic and the shelves stay clear for a while, just like four years ago, the last panic run.
Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile at March 23, 2013 04:13 PM (bxiXv)

 

 

Ammo is not the only thing to be stocking up on.  A little booze, medicine, a lot of food, water and necessities like TP can also go quick when it finally happens.  And IT might be weather, hurricanes, economics, or someone like Am a dinner jacket or Kim III thinking that America is an empty shell. 

Posted by: rd at March 23, 2013 12:28 PM (zLp5I)

176
I think 'just in time' production came about in the eighties (getting supplies where need just in time to not empty a shelf).  It made companies very efficient and save on warehousing.

The one downside is a 'run on the bank', very hard to get back to normal.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 23, 2013 12:28 PM (IY7Ir)

177 I look at all the prices and freaking out, and *boy* am I glad I stocked up when things were slow.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:29 PM (bxiXv)

178 I received my two imported P64s that I bought from ClassicFirearms this morning and I'll be damned if one isn't broken. The safety fell right out of the side. The other one looks great but now I'll have to find out about returns and exchanges. Crap.

Posted by: toby928© presents at March 23, 2013 12:29 PM (QupBk)

179 I got about a half dozen boxes of .45ACP and no .45 to go with it.  I figure it maybe easier to find a ah..."used" .45 than its ammo at some point.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 12:30 PM (j5k1n)

180
A ? for people who have sold guns.  Where did you usually meet people for a transaction?  I don't want to do it at my house.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 23, 2013 12:31 PM (IY7Ir)

181 >> That's the case for any product. Manufacturing is run on a JIT (Just In Time) basis now. Exactly. I just mean it's amazing to see the supply chain disruption happening in real time. You know why it's happening, but to watch it tip over like this is a sight to behold.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 12:31 PM (OZPoa)

182 Target shooters use "ball" ammunition for practice.

Duffers, yes. Pros practice with that they'll use for real.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 04:15 PM (j5k1n)

 

 

---------------------------------------------

 

 

Well!  *picks up his unprofessional weapon and walks off*

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 12:31 PM (8YDij)

183 168 Not great but can shoot enough to stay sharp

Posted by: traye at March 23, 2013 04:26 PM (99vXN)

 

Those prices are like November 2012 and great for today. How readily available is that? 

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 12:31 PM (w7J/R)

184 170 I have several boxes of 9mm I don't need btw Posted by: TejasJudio de la Frontera at March 23, 2013 04:26 PM (lD8ju) Too bad I need the money more than the ammo now. I actually need to find my manifests, I did an inventory early last year and I'm a little fuzzy on the numbers now.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:31 PM (bxiXv)

185 I good pair of bolt cutters and some quality hacksaw blades may come in handy...I'm just saying.  A small Harbor Freight cutting torch rig might not be a bad investment either.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 12:32 PM (j5k1n)

186 We've got a couple of good gun/ammo forums/blogs here and I'm seeing some guys starting to part with some of their stash at somewhat less than outlandish prices.

Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 23, 2013 12:32 PM (4Mv1T)

187 This has been going on since Clinton first it was the AWB in 94, then Clinton Executive Ordered no importation or foreigh made ammo. Remember that? 7.62x39 doubled that week. If you have been shooting long enough, you acquire an inventory....

Posted by: Jake in ID at March 23, 2013 12:32 PM (zzeVM)

188 It's out there. The stores are getting it. You just have to be there when it comes out of the back. Buddy was at gander mountain when they wheeled out entire cart of 223, gone in minutes. Be a patient and persistent hunter.

Posted by: traye at March 23, 2013 12:33 PM (99vXN)

189 The NRA says that one of the reasons for the ammo shortage is new purchasers. A dealer told me that 5 million weapons have been sold since the election. Many of these are first timers, perhaps half a million. Many have bought guns in cartridges that they did not have before. Everyone wants to shoot them. Many are already ordering their second gun. Ranges say they are packed and are reserving member hours. Women are blowing holes in paper for the first time and enjoying it.

Posted by: pat at March 23, 2013 12:33 PM (jlQR7)

190 A ? for people who have sold guns. Where did you usually meet people for a transaction? I don't want to do it at my house. Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 23, 2013 04:31 PM (IY7Ir) Oh, you know, the usual. Dark alleys, abandond warehouses... police department garages. That sort of thing.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:33 PM (bxiXv)

191 I sell through a dealer He takes his cut and finds the buyer It's all very legal Kind of a consignment thing

Posted by: TejasJudio de la Frontera at March 23, 2013 12:33 PM (lD8ju)

192 I'm still hoping that the commiebloc importers are holding out some containers of 7.62X39 milsurp.

Posted by: toby928© presents at March 23, 2013 12:33 PM (QupBk)

193 Guy M- Any place public where both parties are comfortable. NO schools, of course.

Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 23, 2013 12:34 PM (4Mv1T)

194 I'm doubly glad because Evil Morning People are the ones paying all the high prices now. I told you you didn't win at *everything*.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:35 PM (bxiXv)

195 Gonna be a lotta sturdily locked doors you'll want to get behind too...

...good locks are tough, but a sledge hammer can make a new doorway through a block wall faster than working through a well secured door.

Put a sledge hammer on the must have list.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 12:35 PM (j5k1n)

196 I think 'just in time' production came about in the eighties (getting supplies where need just in time to not empty a shelf). It made companies very efficient and save on warehousing.

The one downside is a 'run on the bank', very hard to get back to normal.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 23, 2013 04:28 PM (IY7Ir)


___________


Toyota came up with the concept in the 50s. It became mainstream in the US/West by the late 80s, early 90s. And yep that is the downside, if either demand spikes or there's a glitch somewhere in the supply chain, you're stuck.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 23, 2013 12:35 PM (HDgX3)

197 173 Interesting that .22LR is also in high demand. Folks are going back to a caliber that great for learning and forpracticing fundamentals of shooting. And a whole lot of fun toshoot. Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 04:27 PM (w7J/R) It's all of those things, plus .22LR would have great utility if the shit really does hit the fan.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 12:35 PM (JQuNB)

198 On the demand end of things, remember it was already high, even before the election and Sandy Hook. For example, see this piece about Ruger's orders outstripping capacity in 2012. http://fxn.ws/GVDO06

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 12:35 PM (OZPoa)

199 A ? for people who have sold guns. Where did you usually meet people for a transaction? I don't want to do it at my house. Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 23, 2013 04:31 PM (IY7Ir) I don't sell gun, just purchase. But the parking lot of a local gunshop might be something to think about. nobody would notice someone with a gun there

Posted by: Jake in ID at March 23, 2013 12:36 PM (zzeVM)

200  Women are blowing holes in paper for the first time and enjoying it.

Posted by: pat at March 23, 2013 04:33 PM (jlQR7)

 

Good point. I took my wife out shooting for her first time last month.  She loved it, and told me "You've created a monster."  Multiply that by millions of new gun owners.

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 12:36 PM (w7J/R)

201 193 I'm still hoping that the commiebloc importers are holding out some containers of 7.62X39 milsurp. There was plenty of that shit at the last gun show, but they had doubled the price and it was that corrosive shit that ruins your gun.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 12:37 PM (wR+pz)

202 Ammo is not the only thing to be stocking up on. A little booze, medicine, a lot of food, water and necessities like TP can also go quick when it finally happens. And IT might be weather, hurricanes, economics, or someone like Am a dinner jacket or Kim III thinking that America is an empty shell.

Yes indeed. By the way, rd, I appreciate your post after my outburst a few days ago. I mistook your comment and overreacted. My bad.

Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 23, 2013 12:37 PM (4Mv1T)

203 The stores are getting it. You just have to be there when it comes out of the back. Buddy was at gander mountain when they wheeled out entire cart of 223, gone in minutes.

-------------



Very true.  You have to hit the stores when the shipment comes in.  Even then, you may not be able to grab it before the store clerks or stockers set it aside for themselves.   An aquaintance of mine works the sporting goods counter at a store here , and always sets aside a box or two of whatever caliber for himself before it ever gets put on the shelf.

Posted by: mama winger at March 23, 2013 12:38 PM (P6QsQ)

204

40sw $22 for 50 fmj

 

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

 

I picked up 1000 rounds of .223 of $375 the other day.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nah.  Just kidding.


Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 12:38 PM (8YDij)

205 The bores of the Chinese and Russian AK and SKS are usually chrome plated, so the corrosive stuff ain't a big deal with them.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 12:38 PM (j5k1n)

206 I have over 500 rounds of .40 that I bought months ago.
Of course the only reason I have that much is every time I go to the range the wait line is at least over an hour.
Then I go play golf because I still might have to wait but at least I can get my drink on.

Posted by: CozMark at March 23, 2013 12:38 PM (6QN3y)

207 180 I got about a half dozen boxes of .45ACP and no .45 to go with it. I figure it maybe easier to find a ah..."used" .45 than its ammo at some point.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 04:30 PM (j5k1n)



Funny. I just ordered a new stainless .45 though I've got no ammo to fire. I figured that I'd better get whatever firearms I want before the defacto national gun registration takes effect.

Posted by: Sandra Fluke's award-winning solid gold diaphragm at March 23, 2013 12:39 PM (7xeJQ)

208 Nah. Just kidding. Ha! You got me, dude.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 12:40 PM (JQuNB)

209 The bores of the Chinese and Russian AK and SKS are usually chrome plated, so the corrosive stuff ain't a big deal with them. Corrosive primers aren't really a big deal period, as long as you don't just throw your weapon in a closet after shooting. Even plain water down the bore will wash out the salts.

Posted by: toby928© presents at March 23, 2013 12:40 PM (QupBk)

210 >> A small Harbor Freight cutting torch rig might not be a bad investment either. Be warned! Once you've cut metal with fire, you can't really go back to a saw.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 12:41 PM (OZPoa)

211 204. Make friends with the female clerks. Not saying they don't shoot and set aside, just saying has worked for me.

Posted by: traye at March 23, 2013 12:41 PM (99vXN)

212 Good point. I took my wife out shooting forher first time last month. She loved it, and told me "You've created a monster." Multiply that by millions of new gun owners.

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 04:36 PM (w7J/R)

What I see is the woman gets a .380. Goes to the range, has a great time, but sees people having even more fun with various .22lrs. She gets her hands on a Henry lever or a Mark II or a 10/22 and falls in love. My wife still fondles the Nylon 66.

Posted by: pat at March 23, 2013 12:41 PM (jlQR7)

213

On the demand end of things, remember it was already high, even before the election and Sandy Hook.

For example, see this piece about Ruger's orders outstripping capacity in 2012.

 

 

--------------------------------------------

 

 

When  Baraka won in 2008 it didn't take  a rocket scientist to see what was going to be coming down the pike.  I started my  ammo  stocking then.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 12:42 PM (8YDij)

214 While I oppose the dumbass enhanced registration crap, I personally am already on every list that counts, and the feds and many state DOJs have been illegally keeping "backups" of the records they are supposed to destroy, so you probably are, too. A confiscation bill just barely failed here in CA, so yes, when they tell you they don't want to take your guns, they're lying to you. Just like when they say they want to balance the budget... pretty much every political promise equals "sure I'll respect you in the morning!"

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:42 PM (bxiXv)

215 Corrosive primers aren't really a big deal period, as long as you don't just throw your weapon in a closet after shooting. Even plain water down the bore will wash out the salts. Posted by: toby928© presents at March 23, 2013 04:40 PM (QupBk) I was told anything with ammonia would clean them out. Windex was mentioned.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 12:42 PM (wR+pz)

216 This whole thing still smells of FEMA Camps and contrails type stuff. Does the report that DHS was to get billions of bullet come from someone other than infowars or does it always lead back there somehow. The story is been spread to far that no one knows where it came from and even DHS has no idea under oath in congress what this buy was all about and even if true. Where is the purchase orders and cancelled checks.

Why does the US government not make their own bullets with its own contractors that do not do public sales. And then the public manufacturers do no have to sell to the government.

Posted by: Trevor (@tjexcite) at March 23, 2013 12:43 PM (jOPzC)

217
This has been going on since Clinton first it was the AWB in 94, then Clinton Executive Ordered no importation or foreigh made ammo. Remember that?

I remember that. The excuse used to ban the importation of that ammo was because there existed a hand gun that fired that particular round...and a lot of the imported surplus ammo was solid steel slug. So....armor piercing! Cop Killer! Even though one would have enjoyed more accuracy by simply throwing such a hand gun at his target, instead of firing it.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at March 23, 2013 12:43 PM (0IhFx)

218 212 204. Make friends with the female clerks. Not saying they don't shoot and set aside, just saying has worked for me. Posted by: traye at March 23, 2013 04:41 PM (99vXN) Yeah, I can see more than one reason to do that.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:43 PM (bxiXv)

219 I took my wife out shooting forher first
time last month. She loved it

--------------------------




Guns and ammo make great Mothers Day gifts. 

Posted by: mama winger at March 23, 2013 12:43 PM (P6QsQ)

220 At her apartment Saturday, West had filled several bags with her son's clothes and diapers to donate to charity. She said she hopes prosecutors pursue the death penalty in the case. The above is in reference to the baby shot in the face by the teen in Georgia. This happened on Thursday and the mom already has all his stuff gathered to give away. Doesn't that seem a little quick??

Posted by: Lezbian Avenger! at March 23, 2013 12:43 PM (2U4NN)

221  My wife still fondles the Nylon 66.

Posted by: pat at March 23, 2013 04:41 PM (jlQR7)

 

 

---------------------------------------

 

 

So many jokes.  Where to begin......

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 12:44 PM (8YDij)

222 I was told anything with ammonia would clean them out. Windex was mentioned. So I've been told as well so I'm using a 50/50 of ammonia and water, because I can, but if I didn't have that, I'd just dump some canteen water down the bore and then swab a bit of solvent and then oil. Like a commie peasant.

Posted by: toby928© presents at March 23, 2013 12:45 PM (QupBk)

223 I am feeling sort of guilty, not. I had a friend going broke two years ago and I bought all of his guns for cash. Gave him whatever he wanted for them, and really didn't want half of them. Just trying to help him. Now, I feel like the guy who robbed a bank and never got caught. I bought 20 guns. Some really good stuff too.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 12:45 PM (wR+pz)

224 Why does the US government not make their own bullets with its own contractors that do not do public sales. And then the public manufacturers do no have to sell to the government. Posted by: Trevor (@tjexcite) at March 23, 2013 04:43 PM (jOPzC) 1) US Steel. 2) How would you legally forbid them from selling legal products to the public? 3) What would you actually gain other than *gigantic* start-up costs? 4) Solyndra.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:46 PM (bxiXv)

225

Women are untrustworthy on guns. I got mine a SnW  9mm for our anniversary and she' not bad with it.. Recently, I was oiling some guns from the safe and showed her an old Beretta .25 with the intention of sneering at it, but she fell in love. Wouldn't listen to a thing I said. Oooo, it's cute!!11!

 

Disgusting really. I may trade her in.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 12:46 PM (OQpzc)

226 A confiscation bill just barely failed here in CA, so yes, when they tell you they don't want to take your guns, they're lying to you. I believe that. That's why I'm not even looking at dealers for my next gun purchase. It just seems to me that buying privately is the way to go.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 12:46 PM (JQuNB)

227 Also when I travel, I stop at Wal-Mart. I have picked up a few hundred rounds of 38sp for my 357 practice and .40 jhp and fmj. Winchester, Remington, Federal. no tulo but Ihave seen it, just didn't buy it. Last weekend even found 300 rounds of 38 at Wal-Mart on Sunday afternoon. $37 for 100 box.

Posted by: traye at March 23, 2013 12:47 PM (99vXN)

228 What I see is the woman gets a .380. Goes to the range, has a great time, but sees people having even more fun with various .22lrs. She gets her hands on a Henry lever or a Mark II or a 10/22 and falls in love. My wife still fondles the Nylon 66.

Posted by: pat at March 23, 2013 04:41 PM (jlQR7)

 

My wife loved the Ruger MKIII .22  but she THINKS she wants a Kimber(!) .45.   A .38 or 9mm would be better, I have gently suggested.

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 12:48 PM (w7J/R)

229

Corrosive primers aren't really a big deal period, as long as you don't just throw your weapon in a closet after shooting. Even plain water down the bore will wash out the salts.

 

As a flintlock guy, the hoopla over corrosive primers always seems a little funny to me.

Posted by: Grey Fox at March 23, 2013 12:48 PM (/ZHx6)

230 65 The liberals in government are (pick one)

1. Incompetent retards who couldn't organize a clusterfuck in a whorehouse with a briefcase of Benjamin's

2. Evil geniuses who have secretly built, staffed and supplied a secret shadow army, the details of which have never been discovered. Except by Alex Jones. Who also blew the lid off the whole "Lizard People wearing human skin suits who control the One World Government" thing.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 03:41 PM (JDIKC)


====

one does not have to be in Jones camp to see what is wrong with the choice you offer.  I am not in any way commenting on the main theme of this post.  Rather, I am commenting on your offer of a "pick one" as the only possibility.


There is an interesting suggestion in the Banality of Evil.  I took the quote below from the introduction of this paper:  http://preview.tinyurl.com/647w69c --


(and no, I did not read the whole paper.)


Arendt's first reaction to Eichmann, "the man in the glass booth," was — nicht einmal unheimlich — not even sinister." (4) She argues that "The deeds were monstrous, but the doer ... was quite ordinary, commonplace, and neither demonic nor monstrous." (5) Arendt's perception that Eichmann seemed to be a common man, evidenced in his transparent superficiality and mediocrity left her astonished in measuring the unaccounted evil committed by him, that is, organizing the deportation of millions of Jews to the concentration camps. Actually, what Arendt had detected in Eichmann was not even stupidity, in her words, he portrayed something entirely negative, it was thoughtlessness. Eichmann's ordinariness implied in an incapacity for independent critical thought: "... the only specific characteristic one could detect in his past as well as in his behavior during the trial and the preceding police examination was something entirely negative: it was not stupidity but a curious, quite authentic inability to think."



I urge you to consider a substitute premise -- that when the intensity is turned up enough, stupidity, or thoughtlessness, actually becomes indistinguishable from evil.


Should you decide upon reflection that you still don't agree, OK, I'm fine by that.  However, I urge you to at least consider that that those of us that do entertain the suggestions presented in the Banality of Evil are not by definition followers of Alex Jones.

Posted by: jc at March 23, 2013 12:48 PM (PlzOe)

231 226 A Beretta .25 was what James Bond carried before they got him to switch to a PPK I think.(though in the books he uses other guns as well)

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 12:49 PM (dBYCN)

232 Alright Rons, I'm the current owner of a handgun and a shotgun. I have enough familiarity with both to feel comfortable. What's a good "starter" rifle? Understand that I've never fired a rifle in my life.

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at March 23, 2013 12:49 PM (GEICT)

233

A confiscation bill just barely failed here in CA, so yes, when they tell you they don't want to take your guns, they're lying to you.

It is the government. When was the last time they didn't lie to you?

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 12:49 PM (OQpzc)

234 @225 Didn't the government own Springfield armory before it closed?

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 12:50 PM (wR+pz)

235 Be aware that there are probably a lot of things with a "Thin Supply Chain".  I remember a part in "Lucifer's Hammer" where the hero has gotten back to his summer home in the mountains, only to find repair people moved in.  He asks to be allowed to get some personnel stuff.  The men are hesitant, then he offers to trade for them.  He brings out a big package of toilet paper.  ON of the squatters wives comes up behind her husband "Give him anything he wants."

Stock up on Ass-Wipe as well as ammo morons.

Posted by: Paladin at March 23, 2013 12:50 PM (5kFGJ)

236 My wife loved the Ruger MKIII .22 but she THINKS she wants a Kimber(!) .45. A .38 or 9mm would be better, I have gently suggested. Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 04:48 PM (w7J/R) Those words *appear* to be English words, but when put together in that order they do not appear to make any sense. Except for the "Kimber is way too pricey" part. If she's shot all three and likes the 1911, find a less-expensive alternative 1911. Rock Island is fine if you're not going to convert to .460 Rowland.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:50 PM (bxiXv)

237

Now, I feel like the guy who robbed a bank and never got caught.

 

Feel free to expiate your guilt by donating to the Grey Fox Armory. I could use a nice handgun or a shotgun.

Posted by: Grey Fox at March 23, 2013 12:51 PM (/ZHx6)

238 He brings out a big package of toilet paper. One of the squatters wives comes up behind her husband "Give him anything he wants."

---------------




I stockpile TP.  Like I tell my kids, during the Apocalypse, people will still want to wipe their butts.

Posted by: mama winger at March 23, 2013 12:52 PM (P6QsQ)

239 My thousands of rounds of old Czechoslovak, Yugoslav and East German (yes, that old) ammo still shoots very well. 7.62x39mm Rocks the Mike, baby!

On a related note, I took inventory of my hi-cap magazines for both the AKs and the Armalites and just realized that in NY, Cali or Colorado, I'd be a felon on the order of Lex Luthor or Pablo Escobar. Me, who's never had anything worse than a traffic ticket, is now a super-felon in those states, just because of some pressed metal, springs and hardware. Wow... gun laws are REALLY stupid.

When those states passed their hi-cap mag laws, how many felons dropped theirs off at the local Fuzz? [crickets]

That's what I thought!

Posted by: Maus at March 23, 2013 12:53 PM (amo0F)

240

The above is in reference to the baby shot in the face by the teen in Georgia. This happened on Thursday and the mom already has all his stuff gathered to give away. Doesn't that seem a little quick??

 

Yes, but it could be her way of dealing with grief. Something to do + getting the memories out of the way.

Posted by: Grey Fox at March 23, 2013 12:53 PM (/ZHx6)

241 215 While I oppose the dumbass enhanced registration crap, I personally am already on every list that counts, and the feds and many state DOJs have been illegally keeping "backups" of the records they are supposed to destroy, so you probably are, too.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile at March 23, 2013 04:42 PM (bxiXv)


Oh, I don't doubt it. However, as is the case in many other states, SC residents may legally transfer firearms to other SC residents sans paperwork. Thus, by procuring firearms *NOW*, I have plausible deniability *LATER* when Frau Feinstein's henchmen come knocking.

Posted by: Sandra Fluke's award-winning solid gold diaphragm at March 23, 2013 12:54 PM (7xeJQ)

242 240 Those laws were never about criminals.They never are.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 12:54 PM (dBYCN)

243 >> I'd be a felon on the order of Lex Luthor or Pablo Escobar. Un-friggin'-believable, isn't it?

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 12:54 PM (OZPoa)

244 A Beretta .25 was what James Bond carried before they got him to switch to a PPK I think.(though in the books he uses other guns as well)

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 04:49 PM (dBYCN)

 

I'm not even sure what it is. I inherited it. It looks like a jefire, but it does not have an external hammer.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 12:54 PM (OQpzc)

245 The higher seeds get games closer to home. They've earned them. If you don't like that set up maybe you think the higher seeds should all have to play each other in the early rounds? Kansas City not even one town over from Lawrence? I'll be generous and accept you meant to say only one town over.

Posted by: teej at March 23, 2013 12:55 PM (xDlyw)

246 Posted by: Trevor (@tjexcite) at March 23, 2013 04:43 PM (jOPzC)

Why does the US government not make their own bullets with its own contractors that do not do public sales. And then the public manufacturers do no have to sell to the government.

........

They do.Lake City Army Ammunition. Perhaps you have seen boxed or wrappers at gun shows. Good stuff. The HUGE factories are run by Alliance Technosystems, the parent company for Federal, which explains why Federal ammo has gone from second class to first class stuff.
No private firm needs to sell, but the government can go to wholesalers and sometimes does.

Posted by: pat at March 23, 2013 12:55 PM (jlQR7)

247 >> What's a good "starter" rifle? Ruger 10/22.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 12:56 PM (OZPoa)

248 What's a good "starter" rifle? Understand that I've never fired a rifle in my life. Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at March 23, 2013 04:49 PM (GEICT) For what *purpose*? I mean, literally just to fire any rifle for the sake of a rifle? Potential hunting? Zombie apocalypse? Didn't the government own Springfield armory before it closed? Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 04:50 PM (wR+pz) They still do, it's a museum. Now, Springfield Armory Inc., maker of modern M1a clones and others (I have a Sprinfield FAL), they just licensed the *name*.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 12:56 PM (bxiXv)

249

237 Those words *appear* to be English words, but when put together in that order they do not appear to make any sense.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile at March 23, 2013 04:50 PM (bxiXv)

 

True -- too many periods / decimal points close together.  She has only fired a .22 and a snub nose .38.    She has never fired anything bigger. So, I have my doubts about her really liking a .45 after she actually tries one.

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 12:56 PM (w7J/R)

250  Alright Rons, I'm the current owner of a handgun and a shotgun. I have enough familiarity with both to feel comfortable. What's a good "starter" rifle? Understand that I've never fired a rifle in my life.

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at March 23, 2013 04:49 PM (GEICT)

 

 

----------------------------------------------

 

 

Anything with ammo readily available right now.  Later on is a different matter.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 12:57 PM (8YDij)

251 Ruger 10/22. Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 04:56 PM (OZPoa) +1

Posted by: Jake in ID at March 23, 2013 12:57 PM (zzeVM)

252 Posted by: jc at March 23, 2013 04:48 PM (PlzOe) No. Occam's Razor.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 12:58 PM (mblRd)

253 I've never fired a rifle in my life. Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at March 23, 2013 04:49 PM (GEICT) after the Ruger 10/22 an AR15

Posted by: Jake in ID at March 23, 2013 12:58 PM (zzeVM)

254 213 Maybe a Model 1919.Those are hammerless.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 12:59 PM (dBYCN)

255 So, I have my doubts about her really liking a .45 after she actually tries one. Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 04:56 PM (w7J/R) I admit I have an incredible pet peeve about the whole "give the little woman a 22" thing. People should *try* things, and everyone is *very* different when it comes to recoil (among other things). One of the teeniest little ladies I ever knew carried (and was quite competent with) a 3" 357 Smith. Personally I could take or leave revolvers, for a long list of reasons not worth going into - because everyone is different.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 01:00 PM (bxiXv)

256 @238 He he. My problem is I need to inventory my damn guns and I am too fucking blind to see half the damn serial numbers. I found a program, http://tinyurl.com/clt3jns That looks like the ticket to keep up with your shit. I just need to find someone to help me read the damn numbers.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 01:00 PM (wR+pz)

257 (I have a Sprinfield FAL) Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile at March 23, 2013 04:56 PM (bxiXv) Very nice

Posted by: Jake in ID at March 23, 2013 01:01 PM (zzeVM)

258 Does the report that DHS was to get billions of bullet come from someone other than infowars or does it always lead back there somehow

Nope.  Infowars is just repeating the figures from the DHS bid requests on govt servers.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 01:01 PM (j5k1n)

259 "When things return to normal, as they hopefully will and soon, you might want to think about doing the same." Andy, this was also discussed (recent article will hunt for it) as part of what's going on with ammo. Many are getting extras "just in case" and it's prolonging the shortage. Not a bad thing to do, just what happens when a shortage occurs.

Posted by: mare at March 23, 2013 01:01 PM (A98Xu)

260 10/22s are nice and have lots of aftermarket parts. But Marlin and Remington and some other 22 rifles tend to cost about half as much. Check out as many as you can get your hands on.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 01:01 PM (bxiXv)

261 Mini 14 is really nice.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 01:02 PM (dBYCN)

262 Serious question for you morons. Why the recent jokes about Ace's being a "smart military blog?"

No the smart part. That's clearly ironic.

But military? That's a rare topic.

Is this something lost in history?

Posted by: Pious Agnostic at March 23, 2013 01:02 PM (PpLfy)

263 Ok. Let's say worst case scenario. Your house or bunker or whatever is surrounded by elements of the 24th Mechanized. Your ass is grass there Kemosabe no matter how much ammo you got squirreled in the basement. On the other hand, if you're surrounded by the TSA, you won't need any ammo because the safest place is wherever they're aiming. I wouldn't worry about HRT or any other so called "elite" unit. They only engage when confronted by women with small children. So sayeth the shepherd; so sayeth the flock.

Posted by: The Camptown Ladies at March 23, 2013 01:03 PM (p4U6S)

264
I have 3 Rugers and 3 antique working rifles that my MIL wants to sell that belonged to my late FIL.  I (she) have to do this before July 1 because of CO new stupid laws take effect.  I personally would just not comply, but she is old school a law is a law.  I may have her consign them to an auction with reserve limits.  The good side is the market is hot, so she should get a pretty penny.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 23, 2013 01:03 PM (IY7Ir)

265 I hope Magpul follows through and leaves Colorado.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 01:04 PM (dBYCN)

266 Very nice Posted by: Jake in ID at March 23, 2013 05:01 PM (zzeVM) Match/target version, too, with a fairly unique laminate stock. Weighs a ton! I just need to find someone to help me read the damn numbers. Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 05:00 PM (wR+pz) LED flashlight and a magnifying glass, courtesy of your local discount store. Use the light at different angles for better definition.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 01:04 PM (bxiXv)

267 What's a good "starter" rifle? Understand that I've never fired a rifle in my life.

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at March 23, 2013 04:49 PM (GEICT)

 

What kind of use are you going to put it? Any .22 will provide fun and opportunity to develop good skills. And it is a very versatile round. But it you can afford only one, get the one you need. Bolt action rifles are pretty cheap.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 01:04 PM (OQpzc)

268 @240 Yeah, I have thought the same thing. One MSM story talked about a man arrested for having an "arsenal" of over 20 guns in his home and hundreds of rounds of ammunition! Fuck, I've got that many that I am not sure where they are in the house. I KNOW I have more than 20 shotguns.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 01:05 PM (wR+pz)

269 233 Alright Rons, I'm the current owner of a handgun and a shotgun. I have enough familiarity with both to feel comfortable. What's a good "starter" rifle? Understand that I've never fired a rifle in my life.
-------------------------
You're going to get a lot of answers on that one. If these were normal times, someone (like me) would probably suggest something 'introductory', interesting, and versatile, say, a bolt action .243. These are *not* normal times. I'm betting that most most suggest something in .223, and probably an AR15.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 23, 2013 01:05 PM (aDwsi)

270 Alright, Ruger 10/22. There's about a half dozen models. The idea behind a potential purchase would be getting familiar with the operation of a rifle, defense is a plus. And what do you hunt with a .22?

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at March 23, 2013 01:05 PM (GEICT)

271 >> Why the recent jokes about Ace's being a "smart military blog?" It's part of HQ Lore and was coined by the late Tony Blankley. http://ace.mu.nu/archives/325445.php

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 01:06 PM (OZPoa)

272 Starter rifle: Henry lever, Marlin  XT22 target, Marlin 60, Ruger 10/22, Remington 597 are all fun. So is a .22 mag, a .22 hornet, and a .223 bolt action.

Posted by: pat at March 23, 2013 01:07 PM (jlQR7)

273 >> And what do you hunt with a .22? Legally ... squirrels, rabbits and whatnot. In a survival-type situation, whatever the hell you want.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 01:07 PM (OZPoa)

274 Thank you Andy. That clears things up.

Posted by: Pious Agnostic at March 23, 2013 01:07 PM (PpLfy)

275 @267 Yeah, I know how to do that, now tell me how to type the fucking number in the computer while I am holding the fucking magnifying glass and flashlight. Oh, and a mini 14 is a great fucking gun. It just a 10/22 for 223.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 01:07 PM (wR+pz)

276 One MSM story talked about a man arrested for having an "arsenal" of over 20 guns in his home and hundreds of rounds of ammunition! Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 05:05 PM (wR+pz) What, they can arrest people for being below average now?!?!

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 01:07 PM (bxiXv)

277 I'm not even sure what it is. I inherited it. It looks like a jefire, but it does not have an external hammer. Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 04:54 PM I am positive the only Beretta .25 with no external hammer is the 1920 series starting with the 1920 and ending with the Modelo 418. If it has PB in a large oval at the top of the grips it is a 1920, 26 or 1934. If it has PB in a small circle low on the grips it's a 318 or 418.

Posted by: Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. at March 23, 2013 01:07 PM (MhA4j)

278 >> One MSM story talked about a man arrested for having an "arsenal" of over 20 guns in his home and hundreds of rounds of ammunition! Piker.

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 01:07 PM (OZPoa)

279 I never even wanted an AR15 until the government wanted to ban them. I have plenty of rifles, carbines, shotguns. I like wood, hate plastic parts.

Posted by: navybrat at March 23, 2013 01:08 PM (44dD6)

280 A .22 target pistol, a bolt action rifle, and a .38 revolver, plus a couple hundred rounds of ammo is an "arsenal" to the media.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 23, 2013 01:08 PM (j5k1n)

281 261 10/22s are nice and have lots of aftermarket parts. But Marlin and Remington and some other 22 rifles tend to cost about half as much. Check out as many as you can get your hands on.Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile at March 23, 2013 05:01 PM (bxiXv) OK, here we go. The Ruger is considered the gold standard, no doubt about it. I received a Remington 597 as a gift and I've been perfectly happy with it. Lots of FTF's in the first 100 rounds or so, and practically none since then. My brother has a Ruger and we both fired both rifles. We both shot more accurately with the Remington. Of course, all of his bolt-action .22's are more accurate than either of these.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 01:08 PM (JQuNB)

282 I have 3 Rugers and 3 antique working rifles that my MIL wants to sell that belonged to my late FIL. I (she) have to do this before July 1 because of CO new stupid laws take effect. I personally would just not comply, but she is old school a law is a law. I may have her consign them to an auction with reserve limits. The good side is the market is hot, so she should get a pretty penny.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 23, 2013 05:03 PM (IY7Ir)

 

 

-----------------------------------------

 

 

Perhaps you need to sit her down and have a serious come-to-Jesus talk.  Tell her these are the times all of us need to stand firm for our Constitution.  I  had this talk with my sister a while back.  These laws are not "business as usual".

 

 

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 01:09 PM (8YDij)

283 ::::Ok. Let's say worst case scenario. Your house or bunker or whatever is surrounded by elements of the 24th Mechanized. Your ass is grass there Kemosabe no matter how much ammo you got squirreled in the basement. :::: That's why I never worry about having the latest, greatest M4gery clone, tons of magazines, rail mounted accessories, etc. If I need those, I'll get em off dead bodies in my ambush site. In a true Burning Times scenario, distance, speed and concealment are your tools - you're not *looking* for contact. A scout rifle or any bolt gun that'll reach a tick past 300 yards will do. If you have to use it, you're probably toast. Just hang in there until relieved and you can link up with my Death's Head legions. Just ask for the guy in the metal hockey mask and leather slingshot jockstrap. That'll be me.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 01:09 PM (FEqS6)

284 The .243 is an incredibly versatile and accurate weapon . The recoil is not a factor (we have a Thompson/Center Icon). However the noise and shock waves will startle a new shooter, even with really good plugs.

Posted by: pat at March 23, 2013 01:10 PM (jlQR7)

285 Yeah, I know how to do that, now tell me how to type the fucking number in the computer while I am holding the fucking magnifying glass and flashlight. Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 05:07 PM (wR+pz) ... ... ... Well, I'm glad to finally meet someone who has a worse memory than I do. Do you have an over-complicated phone and does it have a voice-record feature? Speak and play back. Or if you have voice recognition in your computer (you might be surprised) and a microphone. You have to download it (free) for XP (some versions) but it's built into Win7.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 01:11 PM (bxiXv)

286 253 Posted by: jc at March 23, 2013 04:48 PM (PlzOe)


No.

Occam's Razor.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 04:58 PM (mblRd)


==


my guess is you will never see the irony in that answer.

Posted by: jc at March 23, 2013 01:12 PM (PlzOe)

287 So sayeth the shepherd; so sayeth the flock.

Posted by: The Camptown Ladies at March 23, 2013 05:03 PM (p4U6S)

 

If SHTF, HRT is going to have better things to do than smoke you out of your bunker, although an escape tunnel is always a good idea.

 

My contingency plans for dealing the military is Run Away.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 01:13 PM (OQpzc)

288 Perhaps you need to sit her down and have a serious come-to-Jesus talk. Tell her these are the times all of us need to stand firm for our Constitution.

Good luck with that. I continue to be surprised by people I thought were decent and American, who suddenly these days think it's vitally important to obey the government.

Posted by: Methos at March 23, 2013 01:14 PM (hO9ad)

289 Just ask for the guy in the metal hockey mask and leather slingshot jockstrap. Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 05:09 PM (FEqS6) Thanks for that! I needed another item to round out my "things I will never, ever do it a thousand million years" list!

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 01:14 PM (bxiXv)

290 276 Agreed, Mini-14 a fine rifle. I didn't want to get in a squabble with the AR15 guys. A used Mini-14 can be had at a somewhat lower price for sure. I'm inclined toward the 18.5" barrel models.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 23, 2013 01:14 PM (aDwsi)

291 What's a good "starter" rifle? Understand that I've never fired a rifle in my life. Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at March 23, 2013 04:49 PM (GEICT) The 6.5X55 Swede. It is versatile for everything from varmint to Elk. It comes in loads from 87grains to 160 Grains. It is the flattest shooting, most stable flight of anything besides .50 Cal. How do you say Bulls-eye in Swedish? 6.5X55.

Posted by: Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. at March 23, 2013 01:15 PM (MhA4j)

292 Just hang in there until relieved and you can link up with my Death's Head legions. Just ask for the guy in the metal hockey mask and leather slingshot jockstrap. That'll be me.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 05:09 PM (FEqS6)

 

 

--------------------------------------

 

 

What?  No  external  titanium cup? 

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 01:15 PM (8YDij)

293
Yeah, you sit down YOUR MIL.  I'll just keep my nuts attached.  She's keeping HER guns.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 23, 2013 01:15 PM (IY7Ir)

294 I admit I have an incredible pet peeve about the whole "give the little woman a 22" thing. People should *try* things, and everyone is *very* different when it comes to recoil (among other things).

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile at March 23, 2013 05:00 PM (bxiXv)

 

There's really no "little woman" element in using a .22. Why risk ruining the "fun factor" the first time out? I could not be more delighted that she is now interested in this sport. Next outing will be with a .357 and a (rented) .45.   

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 01:16 PM (w7J/R)

295 I'd like to think that our military would turn on it's CinC if he tried to turn them on the American people.I'd like to think that.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 01:17 PM (dBYCN)

296  Starter rifle: Henry lever, Marlin XT22 target, Marlin 60, Ruger 10/22, Remington 597 are all fun. So is a .22 mag, a .22 hornet, and a .223 bolt action.

Posted by: pat at March 23, 2013 05:07 PM (jlQR7)

 

Most accurate rifle I ever bought was the HnK model 300 in .22 mag. Amazing rifle and a good varmint gun. I've hit crows in the head at over 100 yards. It is more accurate than I an and a blast to shoot. They don't make them anymore, but they are still findable.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 01:17 PM (OQpzc)

297 I don't have an M4gery because of tanks, I have it because it's light, accurate, ergonomic, easy to handle, customizable, holds lots of ammo, and yes, Virginia, it's even *reliable*. Not because of tanks. I admit my scout rifle is too heavy, I should do another one at some point. Actually I could just convert my 7mm to use detachable magazines - still outside the realm of a scout, but a handy, light rifle.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 01:17 PM (bxiXv)

298 @286 All that sound great. The numbers have to be entered into the program, not just recorded. I have dragon whatever, but saying the numbers and then printing them out and then copying them to the fucking program is too much work. I need a HS kid I can trust and pay to come over and read the fuckers to me. Key word here is trust. I don't want a kid telling all his buddies the guy down the street has a hundred fucking guns. That's a good way to get robbed.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 01:18 PM (wR+pz)

299 I am positive the only Beretta .25 with no external hammer is the 1920 series starting with the 1920 and ending with the Modelo 418.
If it has PB in a large oval at the top of the grips it is a 1920, 26 or 1934. If it has PB in a small circle low on the grips it's a 318 or 418.

Posted by: Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. at March 23, 2013 05:07 PM (MhA4j)

 

I think you are right. The pics of the 418 Bantam look just like it.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 01:19 PM (OQpzc)

300 Next outing will be with a .357 and a (rented) .45. Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 05:16 PM (w7J/R) Then no worries. I thought your first post came across as you trying to talk her out of *trying* things.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s] at March 23, 2013 01:20 PM (bxiXv)

301 285 The .243 is an incredibly versatile and accurate weapon . The recoil is not a factor (we have a Thompson/Center Icon). However the noise and shock waves will startle a new shooter, even with really good plugs.
-------------------
Yes. But he is the owner of pistol(s) and shotgun(s), so, report should not be a big deal. As I said, it depends on what he has in mind, if hunting is in the mix, a .243 gets one in the game, if targets, well..., fine there also.

Jack O'Connor's If-I-Only-Get-One choice was the .270. But then O'Connor wasn't thinking anything but hunting.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at March 23, 2013 01:20 PM (aDwsi)

302 I'd like to think that our military would turn on it's CinC if he tried to turn them on the American people.I'd like to think that.

You mean the one that is being repurposed to promote gay and wymyn's issues? That "our military"?

On the upside, I imagine they won't be quite so fearsome a sight with pink ARs as Anne Barnhardt.

Posted by: Methos at March 23, 2013 01:21 PM (hO9ad)

303 Key word here is trust. I don't want a kid telling all his buddies the guy down the street has a hundred fucking guns. That's a good way to get robbed.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 05:18 PM (wR+pz)

 

 

--------------------------------------------

 

 

Go to a range  or a gunshop  and find someone there that will help you.   Have them put the numbers on a disk, or better yet, a USB. 

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 01:22 PM (8YDij)

304 Well,it was predictable this would become a gun thread.

Posted by: steevy at March 23, 2013 01:23 PM (dBYCN)

305 I use to have one of these jetfires http://tinyurl.com/c5rkpgu Kind of neat, the flip up loading and trigger. I didn't like the trigger for a pocket gun. Traded it for this http://tinyurl.com/bwzd4j6 32 not 25 and no hammer. They are NOT cheap.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 01:23 PM (wR+pz)

306

"When things return to normal..."

 

Well that's not going to happen until we get someone like Rick Perry in the WH.

 

As far as the "don't be paranoid" thing goes...it's hard not to be a little paranoid, looking at the sum total of all the spooky shit our current government is doing.

 

Posted by: wheatie at March 23, 2013 01:24 PM (UMBJ2)

307 Well,it was predictable this would become a gun thread

With a post header that says "...Ammo",  where else could we go?

Although it's past five here. I'd vote for a drinkin' thread.

Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 23, 2013 01:25 PM (4Mv1T)

308 Go to a range or a gunshop and find someone there that will help you. Have them put the numbers on a disk, or better yet, a USB.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 05:22 PM (8YDij)

 

 

-------------------------------------------

 

 

And I forgot to add, then you can upload it to your computer and print them out in whatever font is big enough for you.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 01:26 PM (8YDij)

309 Nobody   is     hoarding    The    Alamo!

Posted by: Joe Biden at March 23, 2013 01:27 PM (wIgpo)

310 Go to a range or a gunshop and find someone there that will help you. Have them put the numbers on a disk, or better yet, a USB. Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 05:22 PM I save them in an email draft on three different free services.

Posted by: Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. at March 23, 2013 01:27 PM (MhA4j)

311 Go to a range or a gunshop and find someone there that will help you. Have them put the numbers on a disk, or better yet, a USB. Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 05:22 PM (8YDij) Great idea. They would have to come to my place, too many guns to transport. Same problem. Wouldn't be on the inventory program, but I would have the numbers. Going to talk to our scout troop and see if I can find someone trustworthy who's parents wouldn't freak out.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 01:27 PM (wR+pz)

312 Speaking of SHTF...

A senior Cypriot official suggested late on Saturday that his government was not close to an agreement with the troika over a range of measures aimed at securing a 10-billion-euro bailout for his country.

“We are not in touching distance of an agreement,” the official, who preferred to remain anonymous, told the Cyprus News Agency.


Posted by: Methos at March 23, 2013 01:28 PM (hO9ad)

313 What should I expect to pay if I bring an old pistol, buy .22 rounds and shoot for say 30 minutes? In NC. My guess was less than 50 bucks, my friend thinks more.

Posted by: Lincolntf at March 23, 2013 01:28 PM (ZshNr)

314 :::my guess is you will never see the irony in that answer.:::: Yes. Because I am Teh Stoopid! Now run along and tell your Internet friends how much ass you just kicked in a comments section, Pointdexter. Fuckin jagoff.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 01:29 PM (FEqS6)

315 Getting hungry.  Maybe pizza tonight.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 01:31 PM (8YDij)

316 #181 A ? for people who have sold guns. Where did you usually meet people for a transaction? I don't want to do it at my house.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 23, 2013 04:31 PM (IY7Ir)

Dunno about anybody else, but I live way out in the boonies, so when I sell a gun, I tend to favor supermarket parking lots for meet-ups. For a number of reasons:
1. I don't wanna put my buyer out by making them drive out to the middle of nowhere.
2. I don't think the middle of nowhere is a good place to meet strangers when guns and money are involved.
3. I've noticed that supermarket parking lots tend to have a lot of those, what do you call them? Ah, yes: Potential witnesses.

Oh, and I've found Armslist to be an excellent place to advertise.

Posted by: jwpaine at March 23, 2013 01:31 PM (VcDCJ)

317 Because a millions-strong, highly regimented Nazi genocide operation sprang out of nowhere. All because some fucking twerp with more book smarts than experience looked at Aldoph Eichmann through a window at Nuremberg and thought, "Hmph. He doesn't LOOK smart enough to have done the things he's on record as doing." Choke on my e-cock, shitneck.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 01:33 PM (FEqS6)

318 @314 Shooters Express, just outside CLT charges $15 an hour for range time and $15 and hour to rent a gun, plus ammo costs.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 01:33 PM (wR+pz)

319 Where did you usually meet people for a transaction? I don't want to do it at my house. **** Any alley in the Crips side of town.

Posted by: Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. at March 23, 2013 01:33 PM (MhA4j)

320 @179, Toby, I got a P-64 years ago made in 1974 and it looks brand new. I just got another one from Classic (made in 1975) and it is a solid pistol, but not nearly in the NIB (new in box) condition the first one was in. I think they are starting to scrape the bottom of the barrel on those. As for Ammo I just bought another 5 crates of 7.62 x 54r (4400 rounds) to feed the mosins, the Finn and the VEPR. I like crates, but the UPS guy hates me! BTW, That VEPR rocks!

Posted by: Judge_Roy_Bean at March 23, 2013 01:34 PM (mjHO/)

321 Then no worries. I thought your first post came across as you trying to talk her out of *trying* things.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile at March 23, 2013 05:20 PM (bxiXv)

 

I see what you are saying. If she likes the .45, it will be the one "mechanical" gift I can safely give her for her birthday or Mother's Day. 

 

Those damn Kimber ads on the back cover of the NRA magazine, I may be eating rice krispies for breakfast all year to pay for it.  But to have a happy wife... :-)   

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 01:34 PM (w7J/R)

322 320 Where did you usually meet people for a transaction? I don't want to do it at my house. Movie theaters?

Posted by: The Joker at March 23, 2013 01:35 PM (wR+pz)

323 246 The higher seeds get games closer to home. They've earned them. 

Posted by: teej at March 23, 2013 04:55 PM (xDlyw)


_________


You're absolutely right. Which is why Gonzaga (ranked #1 overall) is playing in Salt Lake City, about 750 miles from the university.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 23, 2013 01:36 PM (HDgX3)

324 730 rounds per law enforcement officer isn't much?!?!?!?

With a 10-round mag, each officer could reload 72 times.  What the hell kind of laws are they enforcing?

You can say what you want, but that makes no sense at all.

Posted by: Zombie John Gotti at March 23, 2013 01:36 PM (1hekh)

325 Thanks, Billy Bob. Judging by comments the ammo costs might be exorbitant, but if they are at all reasonable then I think a trip could be done for 50 bucks or less. We'll see this week, hopefully.

Posted by: Lincolntf at March 23, 2013 01:37 PM (ZshNr)

326 325 730 rounds per law enforcement officer isn't much?!?!?!?

With a 10-round mag, each officer could reload 72 times. What the hell kind of laws are they enforcing?

You can say what you want, but that makes no sense at all.

Posted by: Zombie John Gotti at March 23, 2013 05:36 PM (1hekh)


____________-


That's 730 rounds ***OVER FIVE YEARS****

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 23, 2013 01:38 PM (HDgX3)

327 Because a millions-strong, highly regimented Nazi genocide operation sprang out of nowhere.

Doesn't have to. A tyrant just needs to make it clear that certain, easily identifiable, people's rights won't be protected.
http://tinyurl.com/cpjjztd

Posted by: Methos at March 23, 2013 01:40 PM (hO9ad)

328 As for Ammo I just bought another 5 crates of 7.62 x 54r (4400 rounds) to feed the mosins, the Finn and the VEPR.


So you're the guy ruining things for the rest of us!!!


Posted by: EC at March 23, 2013 01:41 PM (doBIb)

329 I am a firearms instructor for a fed LEO agency
Posted by: elliot at March 23, 2013 03:46 PM (UOYbf)


Elliot old buddy...where, exactly is all this ammo stored?  ; )

Posted by: Paladin at March 23, 2013 01:41 PM (ESHa1)

330

Where did you usually meet people for a transaction? I don't want to do it at my house.


 

Movie theaters?

Posted by: The Joker at March 23, 2013 05:35 PM (wR+pz)

 

 

------------------------------------------

 

 

A pr0n movie  theater is  ideal.  Multi-purpose.

 

 

 

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 01:41 PM (8YDij)

331 A pr0n movie theater is ideal. Multi-purpose.

Shoot your wad. Just don't shoot your wad.

Posted by: Methos at March 23, 2013 01:43 PM (hO9ad)

332 Don't accept a wad of cash

Posted by: Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. at March 23, 2013 01:44 PM (MhA4j)

333 @328 That video was too depressing to watch. One of the richest countries in Africa now bankrupt by a racist fucking socialist. Does ANYONE not think that we would not suffer the same fate in this country if we were not a majority. Reparations baby! That would be the cry. This is how it would go! He he http://tinyurl.com/cuy7ecq

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 23, 2013 01:44 PM (wR+pz)

334

If asking questions about these ammo purchases is so ludicrous, it's very odd that the very same questions are being posed by national publications such as Forbe and Investor's Business Daily, as well as by numerous members of Congress. Janet Napolitano has thus far refused to answer.

Why was DHS purchasing $2,000,000 worth of full-color range targets featuring pictures of pregnant women, women holding firearms within their own households, an old man holding a shotgun in his own home, etc? The products sold by Law Enforcement Targets were called, "No More Hesitation" targets. Who, precisely, are they planning to shoot, and why?

Why does DHS need 2,700 Mine-Resistant Armored Protected vehicles?

Posted by: Sam Adams at March 23, 2013 01:45 PM (OYGps)

335 ::: oesn't have to. A tyrant just needs to make it clear that certain, easily identifiable, people's rights won't be protected. http://tinyurl.com/cpjjztd:::: That's funny. I thought we were talking about how the DHS ammo purchases mean that Obama has built a shadow army, possibly led, trained and or staffed by Lizard People in human skin suits. And yet your link does not pertain to any of that. What it does pertain to is that there is a state-organized operation to confiscate land from white farm owners. That didn't happen by accident. It was done via state policy, state personnel and state resources. All I'm asking for is a fucking scintilla of proof that there is this Sekrit DHS Army, and all I've gotten is "the government is buying bullets" and a quote from some fag's term paper. I am not convinced.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 01:47 PM (FEqS6)

336 Thosedamn Kimberads on the back cover of the NRA magazine,I may be eating rice krispies for breakfast all year to pay for it. But to have a happy wife... :-) Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 05:34 PM (w7J/R) See if you can get her hands on a Rock Island Tactical, or, if she Loves Teh Bling, the blinged up Taurus 1911s. Some people hate Taurus as a brand, and I admit they have good days and bad days. I honestly don't know what street prices on them are, but S&W makes 1911s, too. Sig 1911s are expensive like Kimber.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 01:47 PM (bxiXv)

337 Mentioned here before, armslist.com is a great place to buy/sell/trade, or get an idea of what's available, and for how much. You can search locally, or multiple towns in your region, statewide, or nationally. It is teh awesome, and free.

Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 23, 2013 01:50 PM (4Mv1T)

338 NOBODY EVER FUCKING LISTENS. Nobody reads the thread, and if they do, they only see shit that confirms their prejudices. Nobody does the math. Nobody actually CHECKS with people, like to see if all that extra ammo the manufacturers is going to dealers or the DHS (mostly dealers, per the NSSF and major manufacturers), or if the MRAPs are going to the DHS for re-fits because that's where they budgeted the money. The MRAPs aren't going to the IRS or HUD or anything. It's so much easier just to believe rumors and small children than do any fucking homework. It is galloping bureaucracy and budget-mongering, it's just not the fucking blue-helmet army (yet). GAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 01:52 PM (bxiXv)

339 Mentioned here before, armslist.com is a great place to buy/sell/trade, or get an idea of what's available, and for how much. You can search locally, or multiple towns in your region, statewide, or nationally. It is teh awesome, and free.


Will trade .22LR for hand love.  Meet me in back of bowling alley.

Posted by: EC at March 23, 2013 01:52 PM (doBIb)

340 I still buy ammo even though I lost all of my guns in that water skiing accident. I don't think I'll ever recover them...... sad.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at March 23, 2013 01:52 PM (jucos)

341 :: osted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at March 23, 2013 05:52 PM (bxiXv)::: Bullshit. Secret army. The Internet said so. THE INTERNET, Merovign.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 01:54 PM (FEqS6)

342 I mean, the primary fucking strategy of the Obama Administration in dealing with issues of law and propriety is to encourage every rumor, idiot hypothesis, and when they don't exist to *create* them, to keep people going a hundred different directions and keep us from accomplishing anything. That's why every day is scandal day, because when you're spinning your wheels, you're not going anywhere. But it's apparently *fun* to spin your wheels!

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 01:56 PM (bxiXv)

343

I couldn't justify a Kimber, but I got the Springfield Armory 1911 in stainless, rosewood grips and those glow in the dark sights for much less. Lemme find a pic. I am proud of the thing:

 

http://tinyurl.com/cafej6r

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 01:56 PM (OQpzc)

344

See if you can get her hands on a Rock Island Tactical, or, if she Loves Teh Bling, the blinged up Taurus 1911s. Some people hate Taurus as a brand, and I admit they have good days and bad days.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at March 23, 2013 05:47 PM (bxiXv)

 

Thank you for the recommendations, including the "hands on" part, (so she will like how it fits the hand).  I am out on the Rock Island and Taurus web sites now.   Cheers! 

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 01:56 PM (w7J/R)

345 I still buy ammo even though I lost all of my guns in that water skiing accident. I don't think I'll ever recover them...... sad.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at March 23, 2013 05:52 PM (jucos)

 

 

 

---------------------------------------------------

 

 

It's a sad story that many of us share.  Chin up.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 01:58 PM (8YDij)

346 Heehhhh!! Teh sigh.

Posted by: teej at March 23, 2013 01:58 PM (PNi9V)

347 I couldn't justify a Kimber, but I got the Springfield Armory 1911 in stainless, rosewood grips and those glow in the dark sights for much less. Lemme find a pic. I am proud of the thing:

http://tinyurl.com/cafej6r


I thought 7 round mags didn't exist?!?!  Gov Cuomo said so!

Posted by: EC at March 23, 2013 01:58 PM (doBIb)

348 Now that you're whipped into a paranoid frenzy, have you considered Food Insurance? Available in 3-day, one week and two week supply packages, Food Insurance brings you peace of mind for when the Secret DHS army occupies your neighborhood. Meals come in a variety of flavors and feature reusable foil containers suitable for cranial shielding.

Posted by: Glenn Beck at March 23, 2013 01:58 PM (FEqS6)

349

I've got a pre-64 Winchester .375 HnH magnum I'll trade for an M1a if anyone wants a really big game rifle.

 

You can win the BFG bragging rights at nearly any deer club.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 01:58 PM (OQpzc)

350 Will trade .22LR for hand love. Meet me in back of bowling alley. Posted by: EC at March 23, 2013 05:52 PM (doBIb) What time? You won't tell Barney will you?

Posted by: Mrs. Barney. at March 23, 2013 01:59 PM (wR+pz)

351 Unasked ...

a) Why do we have a National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration?

b) Why do we have a Fisheries Office?

c) Why do they have a law enforcement office?

d) Why do they need to be armed?

e) Why do they need to have the firepower to use 700+ rounds?

Posted by: Mark E at March 23, 2013 02:01 PM (aOwya)

352 You know, we need a read-the-comments rule or something.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 02:02 PM (bxiXv)

353 That's funny. I thought we were talking about how the DHS ammo purchases mean that Obama has built a shadow army, possibly led, trained and or staffed by Lizard People in human skin suits.

Sure. That's what you and the other guy were talking about. I'm saying it doesn't matter if they have the troops mustered. One could, hypothetically, draft them on the spot when the time was right. Or assume you could since it worked elsewhere. You might not even need to do that-I can't find it, but the video I was looking for involved no guns on either side. Just twenty of the favored people showed up on a farm and told the elderly couple that owned it that it was theirs now and the couple needed to leave. Beyond the statement and the numbers, there wasn't anything particularly threatening, they jjust kind of stood around because someone had told them to be there.

I imagine that behavior continued after the couple left which is why they all starved.

Posted by: Methos at March 23, 2013 02:02 PM (hO9ad)

354 Hey, what's everybody talking about?

Posted by: Truck Monkey at March 23, 2013 02:04 PM (jucos)

355 I thought 7 round mags didn't exist?!?! Gov Cuomo said so!

Posted by: EC at March 23, 2013 05:58 PM (doBIb)

 

Heh. I went out and got some 10 round extended magazines for it just because. But, I live in Texas so I'm not a felon. Crazy times.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 02:04 PM (OQpzc)

356 >> Bullshit. Secret army. The Internet said so. I particularly liked the "Ace is great but the cobs are lame" thing from way upthread. Because you know Ace just jumps right on every conspiracy theory that comes down the pike. Stupid cobs!

Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 02:05 PM (IS2o0)

357 Wal-Mart and the box stores and most sporting goods outlets for that matter are usually out. These places are where the average gun owner buys their stuff. If you live near a big outdoor store like Cabellas or a Bass Pro Shops, same thing. Your more enterprising gun owner will check these places, but also check their local gun stores. Here where I live, those gun store have been getting in stock, usually weekly. Check in at these places and they have stuff. Not a lot and many will have a limit, depending on the caliber. The are tons of places you can look online. Again, though, most of the big sites like MidwayUSA, Brownells, etc will not have much if any. Some other places have had supply for weeks, but again with either a limit or they are only selling their supply by bulk. So if you have the money, you can get the ammo. Or roll your own. The biggest problem with that is, depending on the caliber you’re loading, you can’t find primers. Small pistol primers is almost impossible to find pretty much everywhere. Brass and bullets were hard to find a month or so ago, but stock is starting to replenish for those. The government orders for ammo are not causing the shortage, either. It is exacerbating it. Not causing it. I know this because not only those calibers used by the government are hard to find. A LOT of other ammo the government doesn’t use is hard to find. The government isn't buying .500 S&W Special or mag. It’s not buying .38 S&W or .22 mag or 7.62×54 or 8mm or 6.8 SPC or 9mm Makarov or 7.62×39 or any number of other calibers which are popular with shooters – not the government. Same thing for magazines, lower receivers (even blanks), and other gun parts. Panic buying and hoarding, mostly driven by the Leftist new gun-control push is driving the shortages. Up until Newtown, there was no problem finding anything. I go out every week here where I live, make my rounds and check online distributors. Supply is coming back, though it is slow. You can even find Pmags now, though they are going for prices 2-3 times what the manufacturers list for them is (depending on where you get them). I know a lot of people like to believe the government is driving this but it’s simply not true. If you're on social media, follow or friend your local gun stores if possible. Same thing for online dealers. Some have a significant online footprint and have stock you might not be able to find where you live. There were ammo shortages after Obama’s election in 2008 and it took almost a year for supply to normalize and that was prior all the current happenings. People are driving the shortages and supply and demand is driving prices. The economics are pretty much textbook, really.

Posted by: Catmman at March 23, 2013 02:05 PM (C8XlI)

358 355 Hey, what's everybody talking about? Posted by: Truck Monkey at March 23, 2013 06:04 PM (jucos) Oh, you know, just saying the same things over and over again, as usual. You?

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 02:06 PM (bxiXv)

359 You know, we need a read-the-comments rule or something.

Just don't expect me to read the post.

Posted by: The Spirit of Andrew Breitbart at March 23, 2013 02:06 PM (hO9ad)

360 You know, we need a read-the-comments rule or something.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at March 23, 2013 06:02 PM (bxiXv)

 

 

-------------------------------------------

 

 

Aaahhh, man.  I love commenting  out of context.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 02:07 PM (8YDij)

361 Find a used PT-1911B from the second production batch. From 2006 - 2007 Best .45 1911 platform ever.

Posted by: Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. at March 23, 2013 02:07 PM (MhA4j)

362 352 Unasked ...

a) Why do we have a National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration?
b) Why do we have a Fisheries Office?

c) Why do they have a law enforcement office?

d) Why do they need to be armed?

e) Why do they need to have the firepower to use 700+ rounds?

Posted by: Mark E at March 23, 2013 06:01 PM (aOwya)

 

And trained like SWAT teams.  Cable TV has a COPS-like "Fish and Wildlife  Service" show, officers armed with M16 type rifles who do the home-entry  on an old guy who shot a few too many animals. 

 

Granted, the F&W are confronting armed people, but this also shows how government regulations are backed by deadly force.

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 02:08 PM (w7J/R)

363 Rats. Spaces and line breaks get lost somehow.

Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 02:09 PM (w7J/R)

364 >>> a) Why do we have a National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration? These are worthwhile things to study and observe. Doesn't mean these have to be done by the gov't >>> b) Why do we have a Fisheries Office? It's an important resource. Could be better managed at a state level, but some fisheries cross state boundaries. >>> c) Why do they have a law enforcement office? "I he-ah Tom Nickerson's been pullin' short lobstahs" >>> d) Why do they need to be armed? Lobsterman go out armed. Don't pull someone else's pots. >>> e) Why do they need to have the firepower to use 700+ rounds? This one has been covered in this discussion.

Posted by: fluffy at March 23, 2013 02:09 PM (z9HTb)

365

#364,

experiencing the same thing with my posts.

Posted by: Sam Adams at March 23, 2013 02:10 PM (OYGps)

366 Posted by: Andy at March 23, 2013 06:05 PM (IS2o0) ---------------------------------------------------------- THE Andy? THE one and only Andy... the cob? Missed your hunting thread from earlier. Wild Turkeys are hunting humans in Frederick County MD. Funny Turn the tables story.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at March 23, 2013 02:11 PM (jucos)

367

As for rifle recommendations, there's plenty of  .270 ammo at every store I've visited....

Posted by: Sam Adams at March 23, 2013 02:11 PM (OYGps)

368 I finally got around to producing reloads with the Dillon 550 I got for Christmas. Made and fired about a dozen 9mm target rounds. Still have all my fingers, thumbs, etc, so I must've done it right. Now if only I had stocked up on powder, primers, and bullets....

Posted by: PabloD at March 23, 2013 02:11 PM (H1Omk)

369 The government is buying these bullets to protect the Evil Lizardoid King Can you deny the Truth of the Lizard People? Or grave robbers from Outer Space? There are billions and billions of pigeons, yet have you ever seen a single baby pigeon? I thought so.. Occam's Razor indeed..

Posted by: TejasJudio de la Frontera at March 23, 2013 02:12 PM (lD8ju)

370 I looked up this place 3 years or so ago because I thought it might be run by Special Forces / Air Cav / Rangers  guys--especially from I Corps or II Corps.    Long ago, far away, etc


I'd even settle for Marine Recon or, in desperate times, Navy riverine guys   ( just kidding ).   Instead, it was Kittens and Boobs, kittens and boobs.......


and dick jokes; lots of wieners.  Funny, though--and smart.  Often funnier and smarter than most other sites you're likely to stumble into on the net

Posted by: Al from the Alamo at March 23, 2013 02:15 PM (Dll6b)

371 There are billions and billions of pigeons, yet have you ever seen a single baby pigeon?


Ummm...yes.

Posted by: EC at March 23, 2013 02:15 PM (doBIb)

372

 

I think the "prepper movement" is also driving a lot of the demand...not just fear of new gun-banning laws.

 

There is a long list of various doom scenarios that people are 'prepping' for.

Guns and ammo are considered to be good barter items, in every one of those doomsday scenarios.

 

Which is why I'm hoping that it will be political suicide for the Dems, to be pushing gun control right now.

 

Posted by: wheatie at March 23, 2013 02:16 PM (UMBJ2)

373 OT:  This had me LOLing.


http://preview.tinyurl.com/lucy-pelosi

Posted by: Sandra Fluke's award-winning solid gold diaphragm at March 23, 2013 02:17 PM (7xeJQ)

374 As for rifle recommendations, there's plenty of .270 ammo at every store I've visited....

Posted by: Sam Adams at March 23, 2013 06:11 PM (OYGps)

 

Lots of 22-250 from what I've seen, but the last thing I need is one more caliber that nothing else will shoot. I was into collecting, not arming for the apocalypse. Makes the ammo thing impossible.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 02:17 PM (OQpzc)

375 Via DougRoss

"Here are the 20 Republicans who voted (this week) to give the Obama Administration the funding it needs to implement Obamacare. The highlighted senators are running for re-election in 2014.

*Alexander (R-TN)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Blunt (R-MO)
Boozman (R-AR)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coats (R-IN)
*Cochran (R-MS)
*Collins (R-ME)
Corker (R-TN)
*Cornyn (R-TX)

Hatch (R-UT)
Hoeven (R-ND)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johanns (R-NE)
*McConnell (R-KY)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Thune (R-SD)
Wicker (R-MS)"

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at March 23, 2013 02:18 PM (UCv7P)

376 Oh, and those MRAPS aren't going to DHS. They're going to the Marine Corps. The story was misreported from a misread of a press release. business Insider added the correction to their original story, though Gsteway Pundit and the other blog that reported it are still running with the story as far as I know. As for an alternate 1911: how 'bout Taurus? Just bought their 1911AR for $760 back in February at a local gun show. Great gun, though the factory mags aren't very good. Well, me is, one isn't. Need to get some more mags anyway. And I didn't go back and read the whole thread. sorry, Merovign...

Posted by: Catmman at March 23, 2013 02:20 PM (C8XlI)

377 :::370 The government is buying these bullets to protect the Evil Lizardoid King Can you deny the Truth of the Lizard People? Or grave robbers from Outer Space? There are billions and billions of pigeons, yet have you ever seen a single baby pigeon? I thought so.. Occam's Razor indeed.. Posted by: TejasJudio de la Frontera at March 23, 2013 06:12 PM (lD8ju):::: Good enough for me, friend. Let me tell you about Goldline.

Posted by: Glenn Beck at March 23, 2013 02:21 PM (FEqS6)

378 I feel threatened when the federal government buys a single round of ammo for bureaucrats.

Posted by: Kristophr at March 23, 2013 02:21 PM (wYVte)

379 Cooke ignored the largest purchases and focus on the smaller strange purchases which he then dismissed with statements like the NRA guy saying a member could shoot thousands of rounds in a weekend ... he didn't check to see if DHS bought ammo last year and how much ... he didn't even try and prove his point ...

Posted by: JeffC at March 23, 2013 02:22 PM (dtOe6)

380 I feel threatened when the federal government buys a single round of ammo for bureaucrats.

Posted by: Kristophr at March 23, 2013 06:21 PM (wYVte)


-----------------



While at the same time trying to disarm the populace.

Posted by: mama winger at March 23, 2013 02:23 PM (P6QsQ)

381 Still banned?

Posted by: teej at March 23, 2013 02:26 PM (JCIjD)

382 And I didn't go back and read the whole thread. sorry, Merovign... Posted by: Catmman at March 23, 2013 06:20 PM (C8XlI) Well, you spelled my name right, that alone makes you a 1%'er!

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 02:26 PM (bxiXv)

383 Hmmm. Tried to post a comment a few minutes ago and got the ban hammer notice for my IP. Now I can post again. I'm guessing the Big Guy just wanted me to stay out of that "discussion".

Posted by: teej at March 23, 2013 02:28 PM (JCIjD)

384 @ 329, EC, "So you're the guy that's ruining it for the rest of us". I'm sorry. I bought that from Classic firearms. It arrived one day as 4 cratres, and then 1 the next day. They are now sold out. I think I snagged the last 5 crates. I did see where crates and tins of that are mostly sold out at all the online vendors. I like military surplus (affordable) and I like crates. They have handles..easy to move. I'm in a kind mood today (started drinking beer and cleaning guns when I woke up) and just checked and SOG (Southern Ohio Gun..use your google fu) has individual boxes of 20 rounds in that caliber for 3.99. Not a terrible price for a round similar in ballistics to a 30-06. Get em while you can!

Posted by: Judge_Roy_Bean at March 23, 2013 02:29 PM (mjHO/)

385 I don't think we should be worried about the government until they start telling us what to buy.  It'll never get that bad though.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 02:30 PM (8YDij)

386 I don't think we should be worried about the government until they start telling us what to buy. It'll never get that bad though.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 06:30 PM (8YDij)

 

The Supremes would never allow that. It'll be a gun insurance tax.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 02:32 PM (OQpzc)

387
OT: This had me LOLing.


http://preview.tinyurl.com/lucy-pelosi

That was funny.

I also saw that the infamous Michelle Jenneke video was linked at the top of the page. I watched it again....purely for research purposes, and I noticed the little North Korean dude she was racing against looks really pissed off.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at March 23, 2013 02:32 PM (0IhFx)

388 There are billions and billions of pigeons, yet have you ever seen a single baby pigeon?


Ummm...yes.

Posted by: EC at March 23, 2013 06:15 PM (doBIb)


You're just saying that because YOU"RE IN ON IT.

Posted by: Methos has his eye on that pigeon at March 23, 2013 02:35 PM (hO9ad)

389 I don't think we should be worried about the government until they start telling us what to buy. It'll never get that bad though.

Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 06:30 PM (8YDij)


-----------



I agree. It's not like they're making our doctors ask us if we have any guns in the house or anything.  And it's not like that's going into a database somewhere. 

Posted by: mama winger at March 23, 2013 02:36 PM (P6QsQ)

390 I'm in a kind mood today (started drinking beer and cleaning guns when I woke up)
No problem, you don't need to come to work today.

Posted by: Judge Roy Bean's nervous boss at March 23, 2013 02:41 PM (z9HTb)

391 There are some stories going around about newer primers that are designed to break down over time, so that six - eight months after they're manufactured, they become somewhat inert.

Anybody know if these stories are true, or are they just urban legend?

Posted by: Reno_Dave at March 23, 2013 02:43 PM (OL4L4)

392 45 I don't know whether to keep buying more, er, heavy little boxes or shift my stockpiling over to something else like (additional) rum and whiskey. Posted by: Say, a Person at March 23, 2013 03:35 PM (P6QsQ) Whichever you have less of, that's what you should buy more of.

Posted by: rickl at March 23, 2013 02:45 PM (sdi6R)

393 Anybody know if these stories are true, or are they just urban legend?

Were they made by Apple?

Posted by: Methos at March 23, 2013 02:46 PM (hO9ad)

394 Anybody know if these stories are true, or are they just urban legend? Posted by: Reno_Dave at March 23, 2013 06:43 PM (OL4L4) A few lefty politicians have proposed that, *all* the manufacturers have said that you can't make a primer that's unreliable only after a certain date. These things happen in ranges, you would end up with some bad off the line and some that lasted much longer. Also, they would be liable if they didn't work, so Fuck You, Politicians. So, no, nobody is doing it, though, as usual, Politicians Want Stupid Shit To Hurt People So They Know They Are Alive. Or whatever idiot reason.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 02:52 PM (bxiXv)

395
Just checking in to see if Mervo or someone has heard about DHS hoarding bullets and the secret TSA army they are developing?

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 23, 2013 02:53 PM (IY7Ir)

396 @393, "Judge Roy Beans Boss" "No Problem, You don't need to come to work today" Hah, that made me smile. Actually I am a CEO, a small business owner and am working from the home office today. I make all my employees get a CHL, join the NRA, and buy at least 1 rifle and pistol. It's in their employment contract. And I teach them how to shoot on company time. They really seem to like it! I am amazed I haven't been sued yet. But its Texas and we like that kinda thing down here.

Posted by: Judge_Roy_Bean at March 23, 2013 02:53 PM (mjHO/)

397 I make all my employees get a CHL, join the NRA, and buy at least 1 rifle and pistol. It's in their employment contract. And I teach them how to shoot on company time. They really seem to like it! Posted by: Judge_Roy_Bean at March 23, 2013 06:53 PM (mjHO/) Yeah, about a million people are gonna try to track you down to see if you're hiring now...

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 02:55 PM (bxiXv)

398 I like pistols, but I don't own any. I used to have a really nice Ruger .22, but it got stolen by one of my brother's dog-ass friends. For SHTF, a .22 handgun would be very handy. But for SHTF, it seems to me that a revolver is preferable to a pistol. Name brand .22 revolvers are seriously pricey. That sucks.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 02:56 PM (JQuNB)

399 Politicians are idiots. I'm surprised none have demanded retinal scanners be built into the stock.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 02:56 PM (OQpzc)

400 403 Politicians are idiots. I'm surprised none have demanded retinal scanners be built into the stock. Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 06:56 PM (OQpzc) Bzzt. Biometric identification for guns has been a hot topic among the control freaks. They keep pushing it despite the fact that it doesn't exist at a practical level and compromises reliability, the *single* most important factor in weapon design.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 02:58 PM (bxiXv)

401 Yeah, about a million people are gonna try to track you down to see if you're hiring now
I work in IT. Got an opening?
The original joke is "Can't come to work today. The voices said to stay home and clean the guns"

Posted by: fluffy at March 23, 2013 02:59 PM (z9HTb)

402 Yes, but it could be her way of dealing with grief. Something to do + getting the memories out of the way. Posted by: Grey Fox I dunno. Why would you want to get the memories out of the way so soon? They haven't even buried the poor kid yet. Now I read that she had another son who died violently 5 years ago.

Posted by: Lezbian Advenger! at March 23, 2013 02:59 PM (2U4NN)

403

::::A few lefty politicians have proposed that, *all* the manufacturers have said that you can't make a primer that's unreliable only after a certain date. These things happen in ranges, you would end up with some bad off the line and some that lasted much longer. ::::

 

They like to demand lots of things that aren't technically possible, like brewing 2 million gallons of  biofuel per year out  of hemp and clam pussy, or something like that, when the combined might of America's industrial output can only  squeeze out  50,000.

 

Or  "microstamping."  I would love to spend one hour in a locked room  insulting the dumb motherfucker that thought up this stupidity.  Yes, we'll make a firing pin that can stamp every shell casing with a wee  little serial number, so that the police can trace  any shell casing to an individual firearm.  Really.   We'll just use the same FM Technology (Fucking Magic) that we use to not create fuels that don't exist.

 

Nevermind that  even if your stupid, childish fantasy were even possible, REVOLVERS EXIST.  They don't spit out brass.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 03:00 PM (JDIKC)

404 Bzzt. Biometric identification for guns has been a hot topic among the control freaks. They keep pushing it despite the fact that it doesn't exist at a practical level and compromises reliability, the *single* most important factor in weapon design. Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at March 23, 2013 06:58 PM (bxiXv) Reichwing knuckledraggers deny the existence of reliable pistols controlled by magic decoder rings. Don't you dare argue with me. I have a master's in women's studies. From Bucknell.

Posted by: You Know Me. I Was in a Video You Recently Watched. at March 23, 2013 03:03 PM (JQuNB)

405 The only recollection I have of it being called FLETC is that there was a sign as you enter Brunswick that (IIRC) spelled it F.L.E.T.C. Posted by: Andy I've heard it referred to as FLECTC and rarely as Glynco.

Posted by: Lezbian Advenger! at March 23, 2013 03:04 PM (2U4NN)

406 Nevermind that even if your stupid, childish fantasy were even possible, REVOLVERS EXIST. They don't spit out brass. Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 07:00 PM (JDIKC) Sanding the firing pin - $1 Replacement firing pin - $10 Brass-catcher - $10 Moving the body - $5 Stealing a gun - free Realizing that Canada actually dropped its registry because they weren't closing any crimes by tracing - priceless

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 03:06 PM (bxiXv)

407 Reichwing knuckledraggers deny the existence of reliable pistols controlled by magic decoder rings. Don't you dare argue with me. I have a master's in women's studies. From Bucknell. Posted by: You Know Me. I Was in a Video You Recently Watched. at March 23, 2013 07:03 PM (JQuNB) Congratulations on your achievement, here, have a grenade. I'll keep that little part, it doesn't do anything anyway.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 03:07 PM (bxiXv)

408 REVOLVERS EXIST. They don't spit out brass. Another argument in their favor for SHTF.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 03:07 PM (JQuNB)

409 I have a master's in women's studies. From Bucknell. A women's studies major from the #1 undergrad engineering school in the nation. Savvy consumer you are. (yes...I know you're a sock)

Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 23, 2013 03:08 PM (gBSVA)

410 Speed loaders seem reasonably priced, and some are quite fancy.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 03:09 PM (OQpzc)

411 @  409

   Interesting, I Googled Glynco and read their blurb.  In it was a paragraph detailing training scenarios.  One sentence states they use frangible ammo in most instances.

   That made me wonder why, if the prevailing wisdom is train with what you use, all the purchases for service are jacketed.

   Not reading anything into this, but I am curious.

Posted by: irongrampa at March 23, 2013 03:09 PM (SAMxH)

412 In the final analysis, Government's only product is the point of a gun. For a long while now, it hasn't really had to exert that force to generate revenue. I'm guessing the Government recently began to suspect that the day is nigh when it will have to remind its customers of its limited, but effective, product line.

Or, to look at it from a different perspective: The weaker the mugger feels, the more likely he's gonna show you the gun.

Posted by: jwpaine at March 23, 2013 03:10 PM (VcDCJ)

413 I have a master's in women's studies. From Bucknell. A women's studies major from the #1 undergrad engineering school in the nation. Savvy consumer you are. (yes...I know you're a sock) Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 23, 2013 07:08 PM (gBSVA) I'm terribly marginalized and I'm fighting the fight. What's your excuse?

Posted by: You Know Me. I Was in a Video You Recently Watched. at March 23, 2013 03:14 PM (JQuNB)

414 Oh, and as far as arming the DHS, Dept. of Ed., Social Security offices, etc..? Remember that a Reich always needs its Gauleiters.

Posted by: jwpaine at March 23, 2013 03:16 PM (VcDCJ)

415

I'm terribly marginalized and I'm fighting the fight. What's your excuse?

 

 

Survival of the fittest.

Posted by: Grey Fox at March 23, 2013 03:16 PM (/ZHx6)

416 I'm terribly marginalized and I'm fighting the fight. What's your excuse? I'm a white, heterosexual male. Since I am a card-carrying member of the patriarchy you must first request permission to speak to me. 'Cause anything less really wouldn't be oppression...would it?

Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 23, 2013 03:16 PM (gBSVA)

417 Survival of the fittest. Posted by: Grey Fox at March 23, 2013 07:16 PM (/ZHx6) That's why I'm thinking I need a good .22 revolver that I can afford.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 03:19 PM (JQuNB)

418 Why O why does even marginal cleverness elude me until a thread has died?

Posted by: jwpaine at March 23, 2013 03:20 PM (VcDCJ)

419 420 I'm terribly marginalized and I'm fighting the fight. What's your excuse? I'm a white, heterosexual male. Since I am a card-carrying member of the patriarchy you must first request permission to speak to me. 'Cause anything less really wouldn't be oppression...would it? You're obviously a speciesist, too. FREE THE NUTRIA!!!!

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 03:21 PM (JQuNB)

420 Godammit. Sockin' is hard work.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 03:22 PM (JQuNB)

421 Wait. I know why. I read the fucking comments first. Christ. No wonder.

Posted by: jwpaine at March 23, 2013 03:24 PM (VcDCJ)

422 I believe Colt makes a pretty bitchin .22 revolver. I've got a Ruger Super Single Six, that shoots .22 and .22 mag depending on which cylinder you install, but it is not quick to reload. Fun, but slow.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 03:24 PM (OQpzc)

423 REVOLVERS EXIST. They don't spit out brass. Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 07:00 PM I have an eight shot .22 Mag that is teh awesome It's louder than my .45

Posted by: Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. at March 23, 2013 03:25 PM (MhA4j)

424 You're obviously a speciesist, too. FREE THE NUTRIA!!!!

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 07:21 PM (JQuNB)

 

Isn't a capybara the largest rodent short of a Jarret?

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 03:26 PM (OQpzc)

425 I've got a Ruger Super Single Six Nice, excellent quality gun. I've fired it and I like it, but I can't afford it.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 03:26 PM (JQuNB)

426 Well Janet Napolitano says there is nothing to it. Good enough for me. Oh, wait. She refused to answer.

Posted by: blaster at March 23, 2013 03:27 PM (/1U3u)

427 @ 405 Merovign, Yep my company is outstanding. We are profitable. Small biz, itÂ’s the backbone of America, or at least it was at one time. I have no company opening at the moment. It's just me, my wife and lazy girl daughter (Family biz). But I'm looking to expand in the future. @ 105 Fluffy. I need an IT guy but I can't afford one. I'm self taught. I remember widows 3.1. (Yes I'm old and been doing it since then) The screen was a brick wall. The computers were so slow I swear they had nano guys in there filling in the screen 1 brick at a time. I will save further elucidation on this for the gun and hunting thread. I live for that ya know!

Posted by: Judge_Roy_Bean at March 23, 2013 03:28 PM (aTfg2)

428 Oh, wait. She refused to answer. **** She probably had a mouthful of pudenda at the time.

Posted by: Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. at March 23, 2013 03:28 PM (MhA4j)

429 FBI ordered up 7,187 per agent.
Department of Homeland Security 6,923 per agent.

If it is spread over five years that works out to 1400 rounds per LEO per year.
I have been told that is reasonable.

Reasonable for someone whose primary function of carrying a weapon is purely defense, because LEOs are somewhat more likely have somebody else pull a gun on them (like the pizza guy).

Meanwhile, the Army, whose primary function is going out, and not serving warrants, but death and destruction. They do not carrying that weapon because somebody might shoot at them (when writing parking ticket), they carry because there will be shooting.

to compare apples with apples - how many rounds a year does the Army need for practice and qualification? Last I knew it 40 rounds for qualification (per year), and you say 'bang-bang' as many times as you wanted during the dime-washer practice exercises.



Posted by: Obamao at March 23, 2013 03:28 PM (JtyGg)

430 Nice, excellent quality gun. I've fired it and I like it, but I can't afford it.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 07:26 PM (JQuNB)

 

Good lord. I just checked GunsAmerica. They've gotten proud of those. I got mine about 20 years ago. I think I paid $150 and it came with a gunslinger holster. Wow.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 03:29 PM (OQpzc)

431 how many rounds a year does the Army need for practice and qualification? Last I knew it 40 rounds for qualification (per year), and you say 'bang-bang' as many times as you wanted during the dime-washer practice exercises. You shoot 40 to qualify. You shoot about 1000 before you go to qualify, just to make sure you qualify.

Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 23, 2013 03:33 PM (gBSVA)

432 Good lord. I just checked GunsAmerica. They've gotten proud of those. I got mine about 20 years ago. I think I paid $150 and it came with a gunslinger holster. Wow. Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 07:29 PM (OQpzc) Yeah. Serious inflation on those. Not that they don't deserve those prices. I'm not bitching about it. It's a great product, and demand drove up the price.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 03:35 PM (JQuNB)

433 Harrison, I am considering ordering 2 more nagant revolvers. They are cheap. I would not consider them for self defense. They are revolvers with a horrible double action trigger pull. But the ammo is cheap (7.62 x 38r). The revolver is an interesting design. The bullet has a neck that fits into the barrel. The cylinder moves forward when firing. It seals it so there is gap between the cylinder and firing. This is a psitol that lends itself to silenced fire. (The gooks used them in Nam). I may just have to buy 2 more and play around with them and get that tax stamp for, the "gummit" Although silenced (supressed) semi autos have been ther4e for a while, That one will come closer to the Holly weird 'Pfffffft!" for silenced pistols than any other revolver.

Posted by: Judge_Roy_Bean at March 23, 2013 03:40 PM (aTfg2)

434 214 When Baraka won in 2008 it didn't take a rocket scientist to see what was going to be coming down the pike. I started my ammo stocking then. Posted by: Soona at March 23, 2013 04:42 PM (8YDij) ^^This. I did my panic buying in 2008-2009. I tapered off when I started running out of room to put it. Today I regret tapering off.

Posted by: rickl at March 23, 2013 03:43 PM (sdi6R)

435 Posted by: Judge_Roy_Bean at March 23, 2013 07:40 PM (aTfg2) Judge, why would you not consider them for self defense? I don't have a problem with single-action revolvers. It seems to me, and again--I'm not an expert--that in self-defense situations the danger is in firing too quickly, not in firing too slowly. I'm not being argumentative or anything. I really want your opinion.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 03:48 PM (JQuNB)

436 I think I'd rather hang out here than on the primary thread.

Posted by: rickl at March 23, 2013 03:52 PM (sdi6R)

437 That FBO site only has a database of 1 year. It would take one afternoon to go over to one of the agencies and ask for the RFQ's for Ammo going back 8- 10 years. Try www.fpds.gov. Larger database.

Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 23, 2013 03:54 PM (gBSVA)

438 Yeah, this thread was kind of nice with comradery and stuff. I'm boycotting politics today.

Posted by: Ook? at March 23, 2013 03:55 PM (OQpzc)

439 I have a case of ammunition (500-1000 rounds) for every important firearm I own. They stay in the back of the ammo safe and are never opened, not even the shipping carton.

Posted by: John Skookum at March 23, 2013 04:00 PM (AjzSk)

440 250 True -- too many periods / decimal points close together. She hasonlyfired a .22 and a snub nose .38. She has never fired anything bigger. So, I have my doubts about her really liking a .45 after she actually tries one. Posted by: Die Trying at March 23, 2013 04:56 PM (w7J/R) FYI, my petite 14-year-old daughter shoots my 1911 in 45 just fine. The recoil of the 45 is nothing good technique can't manage. Having said that, both my daughter and wife prefer "their" 1911 in 9mm. It's a sweet shooter, for sure. It's too big for my wife to CCW, however (thank God), so she prefers something with a smaller frame for that purpose, say a Sig 239 or J-frame. My 15-year-old son prefers the G17--he lacks the shooting discipline of my daughter and wife and tries to make up for it with volume of fire. I'll break him of that habit eventually, but right now we're just having fun.

Posted by: Law of Self Defense at March 23, 2013 04:01 PM (iZ0BY)

441 271 And what do you hunt with a .22? Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk You can hunt a LOT of stuff with a .22, if you're capable of hitting a ping-pong ball sized target at the relevant distance. Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement.

Posted by: Law of Self Defense at March 23, 2013 04:06 PM (iZ0BY)

442 Having said that, both my daughter and wife prefer "their" 1911 in 9mm I know I hate the recoil of my light-weight .38 snub revolver. I hate it. I've shot a 1911 in .38 and it was nothing. I haven't shot a 1911 in 9mm, but I suspect I'd like it. I don't like big recoil. Call me a pussy. I'm fine with my 12ga, but in a handgun I don't like big recoil.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 23, 2013 04:20 PM (JQuNB)

443 441
Try www.fpds.gov.

Larger database.

Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 23, 2013 07:54 PM (gBSVA)

That looks like a good database to figure out the real numbers, if you had a couple days.  I am guessing (based on a quick scan) that these are the actual purchases of ammo by the individual agencies down to Field Office level (that is how we order ours).

 



Posted by: elliot at March 23, 2013 04:23 PM (8zGOf)

444 Nevermind that even if your stupid, childish fantasy were even possible, REVOLVERS EXIST. They don't spit out brass. Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 23, 2013 07:00 PM (JDIKC) FYI, on standard combat caliber semi-auto pistols, you can just VERY firmly press your thumb against the back of the slide, and it won't spit out the brass, either. Of course, then you do need to manually cycle the slide again before you can shoot it again, so it's only really useful for single-shot operation. But sometimes the single-shot is all the situation calls for. Just don't let the slide get a running start. That would leave a mark. :-)

Posted by: Law of Self Defense at March 23, 2013 04:26 PM (iZ0BY)

445 First it is not 450 million rounds it is 1.6 billion per multiple sources including congress. Second, he lumps the Coast Guard into that group but DHS specifically excluded them as being supplied from this purchase. Last DHS says they have 100,000 armed officers. That works out to 16,000 rounds per officer. That doesn't sound like a reasonable amount to me.

Posted by: bill at March 23, 2013 04:32 PM (8jdkV)

446 415 @ 409 Interesting, I Googled Glynco and read their blurb. In it was a paragraph detailing training scenarios. One sentence states they use frangible ammo in most instances. That made me wonder why, if the prevailing wisdom is train with what you use, all the purchases for service are jacketed. Not reading anything into this, but I am curious. Posted by: irongrampa at March 23, 2013 07:09 PM (SAMxH) When I taught at the SigSauer Academy (and still, I believe), they only ever used frangible ammo because it also happened to be lead-free ammo. A huge hurdle in building their (beautiful) indoor range facility was lead-control. By going to frangible they avoided all that hassle. In fact, I was told that the air exhausted from the indoor range is actually cleaner than the air sucked into the building to begin with. Also, my understanding is that frangible ammo was developed to be used in live fire, not just practice, in places where lead bullets might be problematic, like nuclear facilities. I can tell you that it leaves a considerable, and definitely mortal, gouge in mid-sized small game, although penetration in the traditional sense is not very much. Still, I wouldn't want to be shot with it. Another plus--you shoot steel plates from feet, almost inches, away, and you just feel a bit of frangible "dust" coming back. I shoot and RO/SO steel plate matches quite a bit, and the amount of razor-sharp copper jacket and chunks of lead that come back is considerable even at distances measured in tens of feet. I know I've gotten small cuts here and there on exposed skin. Safety glasses rock. :-)

Posted by: Law of Self Defense at March 23, 2013 04:32 PM (iZ0BY)

447 @439, I like revvlers. wheel guns as the kids call them! I have a model 29 S&W that shoots like a rifle at 100 yards. I was considering buying 2 more nagant pistols to teach my employees (wife and dauthter) the old ways. I have 1 now, but its a 1927 CCCP marked so it's for looking at and not for shooting. I shot it, it works just fine. I want to teach them how to be a double duelist...2 revolvers, one in each hand. You cock the hammer on one, while you pull the trigger on the other. When you get good, you can even do it while running. You can shoot them pistols faster than a machine gun. The problem with a nagant is its hard (time consuming) to reload. But its a good afforable gun and the ammo is cheap too! It is Russian Gun..hammer fixes it! The nagant round is a bit wimpy, but I wouldn't want to stand in front of 1. My wife likes semi autos, but I think she needs to learn the old ways that my great uncle (a sheriff that died 40 years ago) passed down to me. He survived the wild west and taught me alot of stuff. I just don't want that skill/ knowledge to die out.

Posted by: Judge_Roy_Bean at March 23, 2013 04:34 PM (aTfg2)

448 They are revolvers with a horrible double action trigger pull. But the ammo is cheap (7.62 x 38r). Posted by: Judge_Roy_Bean at March 23, 2013 07:40 PM (aTfg2) They make .32 S&W conversion cylinders. It occurs to me a .327 Federal cylinder might be a possibility (and void your "warranty." It is much higher pressure than the mechanism is used to. FYI, on standard combat caliber semi-auto pistols, you can just VERY firmly press your thumb against the back of the slide, and it won't spit out the brass, either. Posted by: Law of Self Defense at March 23, 2013 08:26 PM (iZ0BY) Low-pressure loads, locked-breech firearms, sure! Just be sure that's what you have, not blowback, gas-operated or something obscure. Because a broken thumb *hurts*. If you haven't tried this, try holding the top of the slide firmly with a gloved hand first. That way, if your gun is not right for this, you get a bruise instead of a break.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 04:39 PM (bxiXv)

449 433 FBI ordered up 7,187 per agent. Department of Homeland Security 6,923 per agent. If it is spread over five years that works out to 1400 rounds per LEO per year. I have been told that is reasonable. When I was aggressively competitive in IDPA I shot 10,000 rounds a year in practice and matches (almost all of that for practice, of course). 1,400 rounds per LEO per year strikes me as pathetically inadequate if we expect them to have a reasonable degree of shooting proficiency under life-and-death pressure. That's only about 100 rounds a month. I wouldn't even both driving to my range to shoot for fun if all I had to bring was 100 rounds, and my range is only 15 minutes from my house. But, of course, we don't expect the to be proficient from a practical perspective, really, just from an administrative perspective. Heck, I've seen dash-cam footage of a cop and bad guy both emptying their semi-autos at each other from just feet away, and not a round hit flesh. 1,400 rounds could easily be burned up in an upper-level two-day CIVILIAN pistol class (although you'd finish the two days with target patching tape wrapped around all the sensitive spots on your fingers and hands).

Posted by: Law of Self Defense at March 23, 2013 04:41 PM (iZ0BY)

450 It's not that much.
It's just enough to stop the supply chain, not one bit more.

Posted by: Cebo at March 23, 2013 04:46 PM (GWlHG)

451 Posted by: bill at March 23, 2013 08:32 PM (8jdkV) Hi, Bill! We talked about all that a few hours ago. You can read it up in the rest of the discussion, where we went over all that in great detail, usually several times. Mind you, most of the people above ignored all that as well, so, there you are. This is all Gell-Mann Amnesia anyway, journalists fuck everything else up horribly, journalists on the "right" are not automatically immune. Basically most of what's been published on this subject is bullshit. I'd agree we have too many agencies and too many officers and a government that spends too much and thinks it's everyone's boss... but we need to fight that with the facts and not random distorted BS that is only casually associated with the facts.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 04:47 PM (bxiXv)

452 This has been a good thread. I finally finished reading the comments (I got here late). The government is already doing enough nefarious things without us going off into the weeds inventing stuff to get worried about.

Posted by: rickl at March 23, 2013 04:55 PM (sdi6R)

453 Realizing that Canada actually dropped its registry because they weren't closing any crimes by tracing - priceless Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at March 23, 2013 07:06 PM (bxiXv) Handguns are still registered, and have been since the 1930's. It was the long-gun registry that has been given the heave-ho. I'd like to see the handgun registry shitcanned, too, but the political will to do it is lacking.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at March 23, 2013 04:55 PM (29+x5)

454 You shoot 40 to qualify. You shoot about 1000 before you go to qualify, just to make sure you qualify. Posted by: Sean Bannion

Memory's fleeting - I remember a hell of a lot less than a thousand practice rounds, even with a SAW.

Either way, what is reasonable practice for someone training in defensive use of a weapon (on the off chance they will need it incidental to their job) vs. someone training in offensive use as a primary function of their job.

Posted by: Obamao at March 23, 2013 04:59 PM (JtyGg)

455 452 Low-pressure loads, locked-breech firearms, sure! Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at March 23, 2013 08:39 PM (bxiXv) My experience in this regard is limited to the "traditional" combat pistol calibers of 9mm, 40S&W and 45ACP, all in locked-breech design (so, not MP7, for example). Both 9mm and 40S&W run at about 35,000 PSI, and 45ACP runs a little over 20,000 PSI. (All PSI figures are SAAMI.) 357 Sig runs at a very high 40,000 PSI, and 38 Super at a surprisingly low 27,000 PSI. I've never tried the technique with either of these calibers, though, so . . . let me know. :-)

Posted by: Law of Self Defense at March 23, 2013 05:09 PM (iZ0BY)

456 @ 452 Mergovign, Yes Iam acquainted with the 32 cylinders. I just can't bring myself to alter a perfectly goo weapon. I know people that shoot 32's thru nagant revolvers. Yep they are my peeps! I always cringe when that happens. Sometimes it spits lead out the left side. All those AR-15 guys always complain about us, but after several rounds from the mosin carbines , and the VEPR they see those fireballs, feel the concussion wave in their chest and just go home. Weekend warriors....I hate me!

Posted by: Judge_Roy_Bean at March 23, 2013 05:12 PM (aTfg2)

457 I know people that shoot 32's thru nagant revolvers. Yep they are my peeps! I always cringe when that happens. Sometimes it spits lead out the left side. Sounds like sloppy manufacturing more than anything. Also, for the price of doing all that you could buy a .327 gun anyway. All those AR-15 guys always complain about us, but Posted by: Judge_Roy_Bean at March 23, 2013 09:12 PM (aTfg2) I don't get "team" things. I got no use, particularly, for Combloc stuff, but I don't have anything against people who do. I don't know why *everyone* has to split up into groups who hate each other, but I'm sure billions have died uselessly because of it. As I've said before, it's why I avoid car, music, and food threads and I'm on the verge of avoiding gun threads.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i][/b][/s][/u] at March 23, 2013 05:22 PM (bxiXv)

458 As I've said before, it's why I avoid car, music, and food threads and I'm on the verge of avoiding gun threads. That will just leave you the political and homo threads. Luckily, those are all kumbaya and poppy seeds. RINO.

Posted by: toby928© presents at March 23, 2013 06:34 PM (QupBk)

459 We're approaching the point where you could establish an economy based on ammo as currency. Can the Ammo Rebellion can succeed where the Whisky Rebellion failed?

Posted by: TooCon at March 23, 2013 08:38 PM (f+yEj)

460 415 @ 409

Interesting, I Googled Glynco and read their blurb. In it was a paragraph detailing training scenarios. One sentence states they use frangible ammo in most instances.

That made me wonder why, if the prevailing wisdom is train with what you use, all the purchases for service are jacketed.

Not reading anything into this, but I am curious.

Posted by: irongrampa at March 23, 2013 07:09 PM (SAMxH)


FLETC is mostly lead free now.  I think they have one or two (out of a shit load) of ranges that are lead ranges. 

Out in the field, we are seeing more police ranges, especially indoors, that are lead free.  We keep some on hand for occasions where they are the only ranges available, but we mostly shoot outdoors where it hasn't been an issue yet.


Posted by: elliot at March 23, 2013 09:37 PM (8zGOf)

461 Looks to me like it has been established above -

- Federal LEOs are not stock piling ammo to kill Americans
- The ammo is for training
- Training to a military level of proficiency
- Military proficiency is required for offensive ops against the enemy

Therefore ????


BTW 'Smart Military Blog' is sarcasm.

Posted by: Obamao at March 24, 2013 08:41 AM (JtyGg)

462 But 1.6 billion sounds scary, and we all know that journalists only lie when we disagree with them.

Posted by: elliot at March 23, 2013 03:42 PM (UOYbf)



1.6 billion should sound scary when you consider it isn't being purchased to use against terrorists but against citizens.

Posted by: Sarah at March 24, 2013 08:42 AM (ug+Vo)

463 So roll over and go back to sleep huh andy??
No Thanks...I will stay awake and guard your lazy ass for you too, There are Too MANY things this Admin. are doing that  make me way too uneasy about where we're heading (hell in a handbasket typeplaces) .

Posted by: Dien Cai Dau at March 24, 2013 09:48 AM (DmsGc)

464

In the not so old Marine Corps, we shot about 250 rounds over four days for annual rifle qualification...I can't see why Fedeal Agencies need to allocate thousands of rounds per year to agents...And, doesn't the five year contracting remind you of the old Soviet Five Year Plans?  Weird...

Posted by: Name withheld by request at March 24, 2013 04:09 PM (unF5M)

465 1. The NRO has been liberal since they went insane and sided against Sarah Palin
2. The NRA backed dingy harry reid. Winning The Future?
3. Why would the fish and game, is state owned and operated btw NOT federal need a thousand rounds per year.
4. I am not buying into the multi-year purchase CRAPOLA reasoning either
5. Very interesting how Andy proposes there is nothing to see here meanwhile he "never misses a chance to buy some ammo" paradox, hypocrite, or PARALLAX?

hmmmm?


Posted by: Blacksmith8 at March 24, 2013 06:53 PM (Yzu6e)

466 If there were a run on the banks the Government would print more money. The responce should be to fulfill the orders and restore confidence to the market.

I have empty casings half of the time. That being said I have full rounds the other half. Be American and be proactive.

Posted by: Ray at April 01, 2013 06:13 AM (11kCY)

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