July 19, 2013

Are Movies More Awful and Cliched Now?
— Ace

I think the answer is yes, and so does this guy.

There's a reason movies feel the same under the surface -- it's because they're structured exactly the same, under the surface.

Screenplay gurus like Syd Field and Robert McKee touted the essential virtues of three-act structure for decades. For Field and McKee, three-act structure is more of an organizing principle—a way of understanding the shape of a story. Field’s Story Paradigm, for example, has just a handful of general elements attached to broad page ranges.

Field and McKee offered the screenwriter’s equivalent of cooking tips from your grandmother—general tips and tricks to guide your process. Snyder[, author of a book that goes even further into codifying this structural cheat-sheet,] offers a detailed recipe with step-by-step instructions.

Each of the 15 beats is attached to a specific page number or set of pages. And Snyder makes it clear that each of these moments is a must-have in a well-structured screenplay. The page counts donÂ’t need to be followed strictly, Snyder says, but itÂ’s important to get the proportions fairly close.

[O]nce you know the formula, the seams begin to show. Movies all start to seem the same, and many scenes start to feel forced and arbitrary, like screenplay Mad Libs. Why does Kirk get dressed down for irresponsibility by Admiral Pike early in Star Trek Into Darkness? Because someone had to deliver the theme to the main character. Why does Gina Carano’s sidekick character defect to the villain’s team for no reason whatsoever almost exactly three-quarters of the way through Fast & Furious 6? Because it’s the all-is-lost moment, so everything needs to be in shambles for the heroes. Why does Gerard Butler’s character in Olympus Has Fallen suddenly call his wife after a climactic failed White House assault three-quarters of the way through? Because the second act always ends with a quiet moment of reflection—the dark night of the soul.

I really cannot take another movie whose Emotional Journey is "Young Man Must Finally Accept How Awesome He Is."

Of course, this could be due to the fact that I'm no longer a young man and no longer harbor secret fantasies of awesomeness. And yet I'm also not keen on the other possible plots, including "Young Man, Who Has the Most Talent of Anyone I've Ever Seen, Can Succeed When He Finally Learns to Control His Passions."

Or, "Young Man Who Is Really Good at Punching Things Must Learn That Punching Things Is Not All There Is To Life -- He Must Also Learn to Bang Hot Chicks, So That His Punches are Powered by Love, and Quality Ginch."

I think there was a time when people in Hollywood felt they had to bring something new and different to the table, even in a hackneyed formula genre picture, to justify their involvement in the project.

I don't think they feel bound to do that anymore. I think it's just by the numbers now.


Posted by: Ace at 12:01 PM | Comments (290)
Post contains 495 words, total size 3 kb.

1 I would love to see a movie where the plot/message is "You are not the Chosen One. This does not mean you cannot become great and live an awesome life."

Posted by: Brother Cavil, proud OCP stockholder at July 19, 2013 12:02 PM (zUi7I)

2 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a malignant traitor.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) - Passing through Rage & Out the Other Side at July 19, 2013 12:03 PM (/PCJa)

3 Burn it down. Scatter the stones. Salt the earth where it stood.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) - Passing through Rage & Out the Other Side at July 19, 2013 12:03 PM (/PCJa)

4 That's because you've realized awesomeness. I expect to be well paid for posting this.

Posted by: Conservative Crank's iPhone at July 19, 2013 12:03 PM (rVwU3)

5 Just wait until they come out with  "Young Woman Must Finally Accept How Awesome She Is." Or "Young Woman, Who Has the Most Talent of Anyone I've Ever Seen, Can Succeed When She Finally Learns to Control Her Passions."

Posted by: rd at July 19, 2013 12:04 PM (D+lxs)

6 It's not a cliche if you do it with love and affection. Then it's a celebration of the genre. Movies need good heart and good dialogue. The story doesn't have to be original if it's made with intelligence and a lack of cynicism. Look at Iron Man 3, they broke all kinds of genre conventions, but ht e movie felt hollow because Shane Black thinks super hero films are stupid.

Posted by: Eton Cox at July 19, 2013 12:04 PM (q177U)

7

>>>Of course, this could be due to the fact that I'm no longer a young man and no longer harbor secret fantasies of awesomeness.

 

Yep. Now its all about revenge.

Posted by: Bigby's Bloody Shirt Waving Hands at July 19, 2013 12:05 PM (3ZtZW)

8 BC, Life of Brian kinda hit the edges of that idea, but as a farce.

Posted by: Conservative Crank's iPhone at July 19, 2013 12:05 PM (rVwU3)

9 The bast movie formula is bad jazz,  poor lighting, and lots of f*cking.

Posted by: Roy at July 19, 2013 12:05 PM (VndSC)

10 5 that's like, every porno movie ever made

Posted by: Bigby's Bloody Shirt Waving Hands at July 19, 2013 12:05 PM (3ZtZW)

11

5 continued   Because that is the plot of every goddamned novel I have read the last 10 years. 

 

Male heroes in books are so last century.

Posted by: rd at July 19, 2013 12:05 PM (D+lxs)

12 Spiderman 2 was totally formulaic, but it was made with heart. Sam Raimi loves the hell out of the character and it shows in every frame.

Posted by: Eton Cox at July 19, 2013 12:06 PM (q177U)

13 I'm just looking forward to "adequate".

Posted by: dfbaskwill at July 19, 2013 12:06 PM (ndlFj)

14 Movies are dumb.  They're almost always a waste of time these days, and most of them that are worth seeing are only worth seeing  for the visual effects.

Visual in the sense that they do something that's never been done before, or they do something  with characters that have been around (usually in book form), and fans just want to see how  the big screen will portray them.

Tell stories?  Eh, not so much. 

Posted by: BurtTC at July 19, 2013 12:06 PM (BeSEI)

15 The book I'm starting to write (while waiting to hear back on the one I just wrote from certain people) has a guy who becomes a hero because there's no one else to do it. I'm a fan of of the "every man" hero. No magic powers, not the most awesomest awesome ever. Just a dude who decides there's a job to do, so he goes and does it. I'd like a movie or two like that every now and again. Of course, if we're talking "action movie" and your complaining about the plot, they either did something wrong, or you're there for the wrong reason.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) - Passing through Rage & Out the Other Side at July 19, 2013 12:06 PM (/PCJa)

16

'You are not the chosen one, but you are still awesome' is 'Big Trouble in Litttle China'

Posted by: jeff at July 19, 2013 12:07 PM (aQ3OJ)

17 A movie doesn't need a screenplay when it ends in a facial.

Posted by: Roy at July 19, 2013 12:07 PM (VndSC)

18 Well it isn't as though you will reliably go to movies about how bad fracking and global warming are.

Posted by: Hollywood Film Industry at July 19, 2013 12:07 PM (gWHwW)

19 BTW... Snyder was a huckster of the worst sort.  He only outright sold like three scripts -- everything else in his CV was only optioned.  Oh, and his successes?  Stuff like Disney's "Blank Check," and Stallone's worst-movie-ever "Stop! Or My Mom Will Shoot!"

Posted by: elaine at July 19, 2013 12:07 PM (4Mzrt)

20 It's not that hollywood movies are so bad,
rather it's that real life is so interesting

Posted by: Chow Illyukhin-Haluk at July 19, 2013 12:08 PM (yRbg4)

21 Do they have a book like that   for  reality TV shows?  They  must.

Posted by: Roy at July 19, 2013 12:09 PM (VndSC)

22 8 BC, Life of Brian kinda hit the edges of that idea, but as a farce. --- "Only the true Messiah would deny his divinity!" "Ok, what kind of chance does that give me?!? I AM the Messiah!" "He admits it!!!"

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at July 19, 2013 12:09 PM (a3iAA)

23 I know ... what about the story of a young shark that learns he must live in a tornado to find love. And snacks.

Posted by: DRH at July 19, 2013 12:09 PM (xFoDt)

24 Porn doesn't need a plot,in fact,plot gets in the damn way.

Posted by: steevy at July 19, 2013 12:09 PM (9XBK2)

25

I don't think formulaic plots are new, I think it's just that the movies now care more about being sold oversseas than they do appealing to american audiences with good dialogue and heart. Instead, it's all explosions and hackneyed catch phrases.

Also, CGI. Ugh.

Posted by: Lea at July 19, 2013 12:09 PM (lIU4e)

26

I'm a fan of of the "every man" hero. No magic powers, not the most awesomest awesome ever. Just a dude who decides there's a job to do, so he goes and does it.

 

As though he is the best trained warrior athlete ever!  Like he's been training since he was four!

Posted by: Hollywood Film Industry at July 19, 2013 12:09 PM (gWHwW)

27 My third example is Dark Knight, like Iron Man 3 it broke a lot of rules of the genre, but it wasn't cynical. Like Spiderman 2, the subject matter is treated with the utmost respect. Bottom line: heart and soul > original idea

Posted by: Eton Cox at July 19, 2013 12:09 PM (q177U)

28

>>>A movie doesn't need a screenplay when it ends in a facial.

 

Right. Those chick-flicks when they've got cucumbers on their eyes and wearing towels have no plot whatsoever.

Posted by: Bigby's Bloody Shirt Waving Hands at July 19, 2013 12:10 PM (3ZtZW)

29 'You are not the chosen one, but you are still awesome' is 'Big Trouble in Litttle China' ...and that's why I love that movie. That, and it started life as a sequel to Buckaroo Banzai...

Posted by: Brother Cavil, proud OCP stockholder at July 19, 2013 12:10 PM (zUi7I)

30
I'd really like to see Hollywood make more of the Hooker, with a heart of gold... movies.

Posted by: Sooth X at July 19, 2013 12:10 PM (+oin+)

31 I only read Salon for the current hair styling fads.

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 19, 2013 12:10 PM (qRasw)

32 Or, "Young Man Who Is Really Good at Punching Things Must Learn That Punching Things Is Not All Their Is To Life -- He Must Also Learn About Sucking Chest Wounds & Bullets to the Heart".

Posted by: rickb223 at July 19, 2013 12:10 PM (MJFVz)

33 HEY!  That sounds like my formula!

Posted by: Bill Shakespear at July 19, 2013 12:10 PM (gWHwW)

34 Instead, it's all explosions and hackneyed catch phrases. --- Hence, why the fake "leaked script" of The Dark Knight as envisioned by Michael Bay was so damn funny, as it showed what the movie could have been if it were done as a shitty generic blockbuster instead of a well-plotted film.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at July 19, 2013 12:10 PM (a3iAA)

35 I would love to see a movie where the plot/message is "You are not the Chosen One.

Quite a few action comedies revolve around this trope. "Big Trouble In Little China" has been name-checked already, so: "Your Highness", "The Other Guys".

Posted by: boulder toilet hobo at July 19, 2013 12:11 PM (d7tB2)

36 I would argue NO.

Exhibit A - Vincent Price Movie Marathon now happenning on MGMHD channel. Featuring Dr Goldfoot and the Girl Bombs, to be followed by Dr Goldfoot and the Bikini Machine.

Then the Dr Phibes double feature.

I'm home in bed after a  procedure, so this is perfect for me.


Posted by: scottst at July 19, 2013 12:11 PM (EMr2t)

37 The dialogue in most movies is just awful. Every movie Ive seen recently sounds like Aaron Sorkin wrote the screenplay.

Posted by: L, elle at July 19, 2013 12:11 PM (0PiQ4)

38 well made original > well made > original

Posted by: Eton Cox at July 19, 2013 12:11 PM (q177U)

39 You want to see a movie full of cliches watch The Magnificent Seven.

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 19, 2013 12:11 PM (qRasw)

40 1 I would love to see a movie where the plot/message is "You are not the Chosen One. This does not mean you cannot become great and live an awesome life." Posted by: Brother Cavil, proud OCP stockholder at July 19, 2013 04:02 PM (zUi7I) Just cause you're 'tarded doesn't mean you can't have a kick-ass life.

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 12:12 PM (NEIxp)

41 I don't think they feel bound to do that anymore. I think it's just by the numbers now. It is by the numbers. And it's because people want to see movies by the numbers. The problem isn't "by the numbers" its poorly done "by the numbers." The Star Trek reboot was fun even though it was formulaic. It was fun because the characters interacted together well, it was fun because explosions, and it was fun because you could tell the actors were having fun. I don't want a move to "speak to me" or preach or whatever. Movies suck at that anyway, for the most part (there are a few exceptions). If I want a story that "speaks to me" I'll read a book, where a writer has 85,000 - 100,000 words to tell me the story, rather than about 36,000.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) - Passing through Rage & Out the Other Side at July 19, 2013 12:12 PM (/PCJa)

42 "Your Highness" Too stonery for my tastes. "The Other Guys" Should rent that one...

Posted by: Brother Cavil, proud OCP stockholder at July 19, 2013 12:12 PM (zUi7I)

43 Whatever script it is you can always make it better by adding a  hot chick who kicks everyones ass!!
Hollywood Executive

Posted by: steevy at July 19, 2013 12:12 PM (9XBK2)

44 A movie doesn't need a screenplay when it ends in a facial. Whomever had threadwinner in 17 comments, please make your way to the betting window to collect your winnings!

Posted by: rickb223 at July 19, 2013 12:12 PM (MJFVz)

45

I think there was a time when people in Hollywood felt they had to bring something new and different to the table, even in a hackneyed formula genre picture, to justify their involvement in the project.

 

I don't think they feel bound to do that anymore. I think it's just by the numbers now.

 

 

When every other movie released in a year is a sequel or a remake, yeah; Hollywood gave up creativity looooong ago.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/b][/u][/i] at July 19, 2013 12:12 PM (4df7R)

46 They need to get back to the redneck formula -   hot  girls,  fast cars and blowing shit up.

Posted by: Roy at July 19, 2013 12:13 PM (VndSC)

47 The end for me was the movie about magic that resorted to CGI for all the magic parts.

Posted by: dfbaskwill at July 19, 2013 12:13 PM (ndlFj)

48
Formulaic? Let's talk Burn Notice, then.

Crap almighty, it's the same episode every week.

Posted by: Sooth X at July 19, 2013 12:13 PM (DlaLh)

49 FIlm is essentially at its core maybe 8 to 12 films...

Now one can make the argument that Cinema from ~'66 to~76 had a 10 yuear period of swerves and creative execution of the 8 to 12 tropes but yeah.

Nice post and a decided breath of calm.

Thanks...

Ponder Silent Running as a work if you can bear it.

http://youtu.be/Yq8y2aYX_8c

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:13 PM (LRFds)

50 46 They need to get back to the redneck formula - hot girls, fast cars and blowing shit up. Posted by: Roy at July 19, 2013 04:13 PM (VndSC) And nekkid boobehs.

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 12:14 PM (NEIxp)

51 "Reality" (which are anything but reality) shows are using a formula too now. It's to the point where the better half and I say "here comes the totally arbitrary time constraint" as in the Gas Monkey guy yelling "If I don't have this car to auction in 14 hours this place goes bust!!!!!" As if there's never going to be another auto auction again in the history of mankind. They do this on every damn reality show now.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at July 19, 2013 12:14 PM (7ObY1)

52 Just wait for the Trayvon Martin movie.

Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 12:14 PM (dKV5k)

53 You want to see a movie full of cliches watch The Magnificent Seven. Watch Blazing Saddles.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 19, 2013 12:14 PM (MJFVz)

54 >>>The problem isn't "by the numbers" its poorly done "by the numbers. THIS ^

Posted by: Eton Cox at July 19, 2013 12:14 PM (q177U)

55 Yeah, it's not like the old days when every John Wayne movie blew your mind with it's fiendishly well written ingenuity.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at July 19, 2013 12:14 PM (+lsX1)

56 Quality suffers, when art become business.

Posted by: yoda at July 19, 2013 12:14 PM (f/qE7)

57 I knew a guy who attended one of Snyder's workshops -- a couple of weeks before Snyder died, in fact.  From what the guy told me, it sounded like a total scam.  As in, the pigeons getting set up for more fleecing with "produced screenwriters" in attendance, singing Snyder's praises and telling the noobs how talented they were.  (I read the outline for the friend's script.  It was garbage...)

Posted by: elaine at July 19, 2013 12:14 PM (4Mzrt)

58

I think creativity is just dead.  Rock is dead,  movies  are  dead.   Hell  music in general is dead.

 

Killed  by post-modernism.  Deader than a hoody gettin it's skittle on.

 

You can blame the forumal book they use but that's just a symptom.

Posted by: eleven at July 19, 2013 12:15 PM (fsLdt)

59 I don't know that this is the case with all movies.  It is certainly so as to any movie aimed at broad appeal.  They are, on par, horrific.  But not all.  It seems we look for novelty or a sense of new story from smaller films that are not released between May and August.  It would have been nice to have an interesting story in-between the fight scenes of "Pacific Rim," but this is the price we pay.     

  

Posted by: Ray Midge at July 19, 2013 12:15 PM (mGU0K)

60
Hollywood doesn't like being reminded that film started out as a circus sideshow.

Literally.




Posted by: IllTemperedCur at July 19, 2013 12:15 PM (TIIx5)

61 Jesus story Fish out of water Boy meets girl

Posted by: Eton Cox at July 19, 2013 12:15 PM (q177U)

62 It's to the point where the better half and I say "here comes the totally arbitrary time constraint" as in the Gas Monkey guy yelling "If I don't have this car to auction in 14 hours this place goes bust!!!!!" The car should be rigged with explosives on a timer. If he doesn't get the car to auction in 14 hours...BOOM!

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 12:15 PM (NEIxp)

63 I don't want a move to "speak to me" or preach or whatever. Movies suck at that anyway, for the most part (there are a few exceptions). If I want a story that "speaks to me" I'll read a book, where a writer has 85,000 - 100,000 words to tell me the story, rather than about 36,000. --- Agreed, partially because I look at movies as an ESCAPE from everyday life and don't want overt political bullshit mixed into it.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at July 19, 2013 12:16 PM (a3iAA)

64

Hollywood should make a movie where the Republican is the bad guy for once.

Posted by: Minnfidel at July 19, 2013 12:16 PM (BsIKy)

65 I've seen three new movies this last couple of weeks. Generally the *pieces* and *moments* of goodness are many, but they just don't hold together well. Overall they try too hard to fit the Obvious Tropes and don't try very hard to be coherent. Also, endings are hard. It is noteworthy that I can only remember the names of two of those movies. They were, like, *okay*, but not great. They had great moments. But they didn't end well, they ended either cliche or breaking the cliche in a way that only existed to break the cliche. I came away with the sense that Movie Life is amazing, but makes no sense.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s][/u] at July 19, 2013 12:16 PM (qyfb5)

66 52 Just wait for the Trayvon Martin movie. Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 04:14 PM (dKV5k) On Lifetime.

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 12:16 PM (NEIxp)

67 Yeah, it's not like the old days when every John Wayne movie blew your mind with it's fiendishly well written ingenuity.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at July 19, 2013 04:14 PM (+lsX1)

 

That's not the point.  The point is that, today, NONE   of the movies made blow anyone's mind with their fiendishly well-written ingenuity.   

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/b][/u][/i] at July 19, 2013 12:16 PM (4df7R)

68 58 -

Not true.  Creativity is NOT dead, it just won't be found in  most  of the popular culture  genres. 

It's out there, but you have to look for it. 

Posted by: BurtTC at July 19, 2013 12:16 PM (BeSEI)

69 OT : Detroit bankruptcy stopped by Obama supporting judge
http://tinyurl.com/n3dq4nk

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 19, 2013 12:17 PM (qRasw)

70 What we need are more movies about movies about movie thugs and politicians schmoozing with actors.

Posted by: Chile Fucking Palmer at July 19, 2013 12:17 PM (bWoh5)

71 "You are not the Chosen One. This does not mean you cannot become great and live an awesome life." A Catholic movie critic recently wrote a column saying that this is basically the theme of most Pixar movies, which is why they are all so refreshingly good.

Posted by: Paul Zummo at July 19, 2013 12:17 PM (Ud5vq)

72 They've stopping competing with themselves and now only battle each other.

Posted by: Bill Shakespear at July 19, 2013 12:17 PM (gWHwW)

73 70 What we need are more movies about movies about movie thugs and politicians schmoozing with actors. Posted by: Chile Fucking Palmer at July 19, 2013 04:17 PM (bWoh5) I don't think I could stomach an Obama biopic.

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 12:18 PM (NEIxp)

74 The Detroit judge :

“It’s cheating, sir, and it’s cheating good people who work,” the judge told assistant Attorney General Brian Devlin. “It’s also not honoring the (United States) president, who took (Detroit’s auto companies) out of bankruptcy.”

Aquilina said she would make sure President Obama got a copy of her order.

“I know he’s watching this,” she said, predicting the president ultimately will have to take action to make sure existing pension commitments are honored.

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 19, 2013 12:18 PM (qRasw)

75 They should also make a movie where the dad is a bumbling idiot and the kids are always smarter

Posted by: Minnfidel at July 19, 2013 12:18 PM (BsIKy)

76 I haven't seen it yet, but I fully expect Pacific Rim to hit these beats: 1) OMG Giant Aliens!!! 2) Oh, look, the Government knew (or suspected) Giant Aliens existed, and so have Sooper Seekrit project to fight them! 3) Sooper Seekrit project gets its ass kicked. 4) This could be one of several, but the upshot will be that Sooper Seekrit project has to change the way it thinks about Giant Aliens. 5) Sooper Seekrit project starts kicking Giant Alien ass. 6) Giant Aliens hit back with something unexpected (nigh invulnerable Giant Alien, hordes of Giant Aliens, or some combination thereof most likely). 7) Sooper Seekrit project gets its ass kicked again. Sooper Seekrit project does something that, earlier in the movie, was shown to be "Stupid, Don't Do This," and it miraculously works this time. In fact, if it doesn't hit some variation on that theme of beats, I may well be disappointed.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) - Passing through Rage & Out the Other Side at July 19, 2013 12:18 PM (/PCJa)

77 The movie Hollywood will never make:  "Young ,an will finally learn that he can strive for excellence only after losing the shackles of public education"

Posted by: SpongeBob ReaverSaget at July 19, 2013 12:19 PM (epxV4)

78 74 The Detroit judge : “It’s cheating, sir, and it’s cheating good people who work,” the judge told assistant Attorney General Brian Devlin. “It’s also not honoring the (United States) president, who took (Detroit’s auto companies) out of bankruptcy.”Aquilina said she would make sure President Obama got a copy of her order.“I know he’s watching this,” she said, predicting the president ultimately will have to take action to make sure existing pension commitments are honored. How'd she say all that with Obama's dick in her mouth?

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 12:19 PM (NEIxp)

79 And this is why I like the Game of Thrones series. Shit happens that you don't think is gonna happen. Life ain't always feel good and I'm tired of movies making it that way.

Posted by: pajama momma at July 19, 2013 12:19 PM (p0mce)

80 I have been ripping thru all the Asian flicks on Netflix.

http://imdb.to/114OZyT

War of the Arrows.

This one was pretty good and I don't notice the A + B = C formula so much. It is there, the subtitles distract me from noticing.

Posted by: sTevo at July 19, 2013 12:19 PM (gmm8Q)

81 >Jesus story

Fish out of water

Boy meets girl




boat sinks
we gotta win this race
damn that's a big shark

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 19, 2013 12:19 PM (8sCoq)

82 They're awful because the all have the same message.

Here's how my ten year old explained why he's sick of kids movies:
*There some scary monster or alien or animal (dragon, shark, whatever)
*At first everyone is scared of them because they are a monster or alien or animal
*Then they make friends and everyone realizes that monsters or aliens or animals are 'just like us' so don't judge them for being a monster or alien or animal.

Oh, and save the planet, man is killing the planet !!!!!!!

Posted by: Lizzy at July 19, 2013 12:19 PM (2mSdf)

83 The sad thing is that "historical" movies make shit it up that the LIVs now take as gospel. All in the name of making it more exciting.

Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 12:19 PM (dKV5k)

84 I really cannot take another movie whose Emotional Journey is "Young Man Must Finally Accept How Awesome He Is."

It's odd that the writer keeps riffing on Synder for his form and formulas and points to shitty movies whose problem is theme.

Theme isn't the same as structure, the focus of Synder's work.

The young messiah theme that make me grind my teeth is a bastardized version of the Hero's Journey, a standard plot.

That a movie is structured around three proportioned acts is a function of genre and, you know, enjoyable movies, as oppose to art-house, emo-crank, affected bullshit you study in film school.

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at July 19, 2013 12:19 PM (xvZYu)

85 whose Emotional Journey is "Young Man Must Finally Accept How Awesome He Is." Wait, are we talking about an Obama movie?

Posted by: George Orwell crosseyed and painless at July 19, 2013 12:19 PM (mCNwt)

86 ""He admits it!!!" Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at July 19, 2013 04:09 PM"

Just fuck off!!!

Posted by: Brian at July 19, 2013 12:20 PM (knoK7)

87 Just wait for the Trayvon Martin movie. Posted by: CDR M
-------------------------------------

I think they already did that one in the 70's, with Charles Bronson.

Posted by: Tobacco Road at July 19, 2013 12:20 PM (4Mv1T)

88 Of course it's all formula.  That's the only way to get a movie made, now, is to pitch a script that has absolutely no sharp edges in it.  And if there's big marketing possible--toys or a soundtrack--that will absolutely sell it.

Only people who like movies want things like story and characters.  Movies today are not made for people who like movies.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at July 19, 2013 12:20 PM (DuH+r)

89 75 They should also make a movie where the dad is a bumbling idiot and the kids are always smarter Posted by: Minnfidel at July 19, 2013 04:18 PM (BsIKy) You could just string TV commercials together and get the same effect.

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 12:20 PM (NEIxp)

90 Hate to tell you, Ace, but it's just going to get worse. Movies are going to get more 'splodey. It's too expensive, so if you're not seeing it in 3D and IMAX, you're wasting your money. The overseas markets don't appreciate the subtleties of language and dialogue. Character arcs, motive, plot, breaking formulas...that's for television now.

Posted by: AmishDude at July 19, 2013 12:20 PM (xSegX)

91 rule one: writing requires talent. a hundred workshops in writing won't teach you to be a writer.

Posted by: Mallfly at July 19, 2013 12:20 PM (bJm7W)

92 Just cause you're 'tarded doesn't mean you can't have a kick-ass life.

Forrest Gump?

Or was the message there that to be successful you have to be REALLY focused at something, anything?

Or was the message that a magic feather makes your life interesting?

Posted by: bonhomme at July 19, 2013 12:20 PM (gtjN1)

93 http://youtu.be/X_l2kZFluzU

Grizzly 1976

Anyway what Happened in '77 was the rise of the era of the BlockBUSTER! and there were already whispers of the rising era...

so you started having the quirky stuff die off especially when United Artists folded.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:21 PM (LRFds)

94

>>>Yeah, it's not like the old days when every John Wayne movie blew your mind with it's fiendishly well written ingenuity.

 

Depends on what you're looking for, I guess. Robert Mitchum in Night of the Hunter is NOT a graphic slasher kind of film, but the way the storyline plays out and the use of shadows in the black and white film really promotes a sense of paranoia and terror. Going from Hollywood flicks of today to that, though, is like going from all-BBQ bold flavors to something light, complex, and subtle - you just won't get it on the first try.

Posted by: Bigby's Bloody Shirt Waving Hands at July 19, 2013 12:21 PM (3ZtZW)

95 I think they already did that one in the 70's, with Charles Bronson. Posted by: Tobacco Road at July 19, 2013 04:20 PM (4Mv1T) Is that what Obama meant today?

Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 12:21 PM (dKV5k)

96 You realize Mag 7 was a remake of 7 Samurai which was itself an homage to Westerns, right?

Posted by: Conservative Crank's iPhone at July 19, 2013 12:21 PM (rVwU3)

97 Once you drop a house on the villain, the movie's pretty much over.

Posted by: The Big Book of Disproved Hollywood Aphorisms at July 19, 2013 12:22 PM (8ZskC)

98  They should also make a movie where the dad is a bumbling idiot and the kids are always smarter
Posted by: Minnfidel at July 19, 2013 04:18 PM (BsIKy)

You could just string TV commercials together and get the same effect.

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 04:20 PM ..............True. Or almost ANY sitcom of the last 20 years.

Posted by: Minnfidel at July 19, 2013 12:22 PM (BsIKy)

99 Also, with movies so expensive to make (which, of course, is Hollywood's fault), Hollywood is scared to make something that breaks the mold for fear that it will fail. Of course, then they make something that doesn't break the mold, but is just done crapily, and it fails massively: but since it used the proven formula, it can be blamed on "the fickle audience," instead of "that movie sucked."

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) - Passing through Rage & Out the Other Side at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (/PCJa)

100 You know, 35 years ago Marlon Brando could have been me.

Posted by: George Orwell crosseyed and painless at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (mCNwt)

101 rule two: the most successful movies can be understood by a reasonably bright eight year old. Easily identified hero, easily identified villain, easily followed story line.

Posted by: Mallfly at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (bJm7W)

102 Magnificent Seven looks cliche also because it was so widely copied.

Posted by: steevy at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (9XBK2)

103 Hollywood cliche? Never heard of it.

But I'd hit it.

'Cause I slice like a fucking hammer.

Posted by: Ace Of Spades Template Comment Generator at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (sYUAj)

104 Forrest Gump? Or was the message there that to be successful you have to be REALLY focused at something, anything? Or was the message that a magic feather makes your life interesting? The message was "Run you dumb SOB".

Posted by: rickb223 at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (MJFVz)

105 60 ITC,

a gizmo for the geeks who couldn't beat the carny games of skill...

and there's something to that my Great Grandfather mocked TV and Film and said "do something."

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (LRFds)

106 91 rule one: writing requires talent. a hundred workshops in writing won't teach you to be a writer. Posted by: Mallfly at July 19, 2013 04:20 PM (bJm7W) ^^^THIS^^^ and if you are getting paid the big bucks to act.....(tom cruise) don't phone in your roll (jack reacher)

Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (8JJ6O)

107

Character arcs, motive, plot, breaking formulas...that's for television now.

 

That sucks for me because I hate the television format.  I love the  three  act movie format.

Posted by: eleven at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (fsLdt)

108 Young Man Learns To Apply Himself A Bit More And Becomes Regional Sales Manager.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (ZPrif)

109 Trayvon Martin stands his ground against racism and oppression in "Hoodied Justice."

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (NEIxp)

110 You guys are pining for a golden day of cinema that never existed. There are plenty of imaginative and original movies that get made today - probably more now than ever, but they don't have a $250 million budget.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at July 19, 2013 12:23 PM (+lsX1)

111 86 ""He admits it!!!" Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at July 19, 2013 04:09 PM" Just fuck off!!! --- How shall we fuck off, Lord?

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at July 19, 2013 12:24 PM (a3iAA)

112 You've got to let the bad guy shoot first.

Posted by: The Big Book of Disproved Hollywood Aphorisms at July 19, 2013 12:24 PM (8ZskC)

113 This is funny coming from the creator of Bearquake!

Posted by: garrett at July 19, 2013 12:24 PM (Z2mf2)

114 John Nolte has explained why Hollywood can't make romance movies anymore: since couples now regularly hop into bed fairly soon in their relationships, the stories have to spend the entire movie overcoming ridiculous, unbelievable  obstacles that keep them apart. Normally this time would be spent on courtship, but that's so last century.

Posted by: Lizzy at July 19, 2013 12:24 PM (2mSdf)

115 Yeah, how stupid of those fools to rely on formulas that, on average, provide a return on investment of hundreds of millions of dollars. They old school.  Why not just say Phuck It! and go balls-out on a risky story no one's ever heard before?  Y'know, life is short n' shit.

Posted by: John the Libertarian at July 19, 2013 12:24 PM (/rhjC)

116 I quit giving Hollyweird any of my money a long time back. I really haven't regretted that decision at all.

Especially when you consider the shitty leftist "message" politics of Hollyweird.

And the use to which Hollyweird money gets put in actual political contributions.

The sooner that whole sorry bunch endure a catastrophic business model collapse and see their lives ruined, the better.

Posted by: torquewrench at July 19, 2013 12:24 PM (gqT4g)

117 rule three: Let the good guys win.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) - Passing through Rage & Out the Other Side at July 19, 2013 12:24 PM (/PCJa)

118 I like Duck Dynasty. They say a prayer at the end of the show. Funny and sweet work for me.

Posted by: ALH at July 19, 2013 12:25 PM (kpMMQ)

119 There were some good satires that come out of the last decade: Anchorman, Starsky and Hutch, Old School, Men in Black, Idiocracy...why? Because our culture made sense, so we could easily lose ourselves in the satire. Living in upside down times, this shit ain't funny anymore, and neither are the comedies. And while I don't seek to antagonize the Trekkies, I couldn't stand the latest Star Treks--the deus ex machina plot twists applying a spurious understanding of quantum mechanics is too much for me, and I don't think humanity is capable of that kind of future. Regression is demographically inevitable.

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at July 19, 2013 12:25 PM (Ec6wH)

120 95 CDRM,

yes M Obama discovered our secret society of racially licensing hunters to stalk black teen males...

we must act rapidly to destroy all the evidence!

funny thought....Logan's Run is damn near a documentary in some ways.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:25 PM (LRFds)

121 Young Man Who Is Awesome At Punching Things Learns Not To Bring Skittles To A Gun Fight.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 12:25 PM (ZPrif)

122 The St Trayvon moving picture; Chick flick or Submarine Movie?

Posted by: sTevo at July 19, 2013 12:25 PM (gmm8Q)

123 102 Magnificent Seven looks cliche also because it was so widely copied.
Posted by: steevy

The Seven Samurai totally ripped them off.

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 19, 2013 12:25 PM (qRasw)

124 You guys are pining for a golden day of cinema that never existed. I'd settle for a new MILF movie.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 19, 2013 12:25 PM (MJFVz)

125 115 John the Libertarian,

Quite...you know what else was once allowed to make high returns on investment?

US Industry and Resource exploitation....

just saying.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:26 PM (LRFds)

126 Hell, video games are better than movies now. The Last of Us was pretty damn good.

Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 12:26 PM (dKV5k)

127 Yinze? Definition anyone?

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 12:26 PM (ZPrif)

128 Who would have guessed that Ace's review of movies would be so much shorter than any of Ace's movie reviews?

Posted by: USA at July 19, 2013 12:26 PM (VIaw0)

129 94 -

I don't remember the exact dialogue, but the scene in the movie "The Searchers," Wayne's character emerges from the house where his brother's family has been slaughtered.  Someone (maybe a relative, I don't remember) is trying to get by John Wayne, to get in to see what happened, and he says something like

"I must see them, I need to see what happened."

Wayne has a look of horror on his face and says something like "do you need me to draw you a picture?"  He won't let the guy in.  That was one of the most horrifying scenes I've ever seen in a movie. 

Posted by: BurtTC at July 19, 2013 12:26 PM (BeSEI)

130 funny thought....Logan's Run is damn near a documentary in some ways. You know, 35 years ago Jenny Agutter was fucking awesome.

Posted by: George Orwell crosseyed and painless at July 19, 2013 12:27 PM (mCNwt)

131 I would love to see a movie where the plot/message is "You are not the Chosen One. This does not mean you cannot become great and live an awesome life."

The Incredibles and Ratatouille both flirted with this concept.  Ratatouille came closest by saying more or less "anyone can learn to cook well without being a rockstar chef, and that's great".

Posted by: Ian S. at July 19, 2013 12:27 PM (B/VB5)

132 They should make movies where a guy meets a girl in some funny situation but they kind of hit it off then they fall in love even though one or both of them has some quirky personality trait and the girl has a gay male friend and anyway it looks like smooth sailing but then OH NO something happens that splits them up and then there's an acoustic guitar solo over a montage and the girl is bummed and talks to her gay friend and the guy lets himself go until he talks to a Magic Negro and then guy and girl get back together and kiss in the middle of the street or something and people walk by without even noticing them and the camera zooms out to show the New York skyline and roll credits

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 19, 2013 12:27 PM (8sCoq)

133 Hollywood is out of ideas. It's why their movies are sequels or the same theme over and over.  

Posted by: Minnfidel at July 19, 2013 12:27 PM (BsIKy)

134 91 rule one: writing requires talent. a hundred workshops in writing won't teach you to be a writer. ___ To the talent, add actual life experience. A talented writer who has done nothing but write has nothing useful to say. See Cormac McCarthy

Posted by: Cowboy Bob at July 19, 2013 12:27 PM (yFb77)

135 "Sorry doesn't get it done Dude."

Posted by: nip at July 19, 2013 12:27 PM (lGVXf)

136 so you started having the quirky stuff die off especially when United Artists folded. --- I wouldn't directly lay it at the feet of the blockbuster... I'd lay it at the feet of egotistical assholes like Michael Cimino and Francis Ford Coppola who were given total control over their movies, including story and budget, then proceeded to go crazy.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at July 19, 2013 12:28 PM (a3iAA)

137
Not to throw two posts into a comment (ok I am, I just like preambles like these predictable movies give you) but the Tray-Zimm made for TV story The Traygedy - No Retreat at Twin Lakes at  will have the all is lost moment being the 3/4 all is lost moment when suddenly Prez Wesley Snipes will give a stirring 'can't we all just get along' speech that was not given by Prez Oblather.

And at the end a shot will ring out as another 6 foot 10 inch muscled white guy shoots the 6 year old black math prodigy with a fully automatic rifle because he solved Pi in colorful crayon chalk violating the neighborhood covenants and restrictions.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at July 19, 2013 12:28 PM (4+FWp)

138 Yeah, how stupid of those fools to rely on formulas that, on average, provide a return on investment of hundreds of millions of dollars.

The millions go into a few hands, everyone else gets screwed. 

I'd rather sit bare naked into a patch of cacti than be a rotoscope artist.

Posted by: bonhomme at July 19, 2013 12:28 PM (gtjN1)

139 The Seven Samurai totally ripped them off.

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 19, 2013 04:25 PM (qRasw)

 

That was mean.

Posted by: eleven at July 19, 2013 12:28 PM (fsLdt)

140 Semi-related:  I thought this David Brooks (yes, that David Brooks) column on the movie The Searchers was interesting.  CAUTION! LINK TOO NYT!!!

http://tinyurl.com/mlwca5a

Posted by: WalrusRex at July 19, 2013 12:28 PM (Hx5uv)

141 Wayne has a look of horror on his face and says something like "do you need me to draw you a picture?" He won't let the guy in. That was one of the most horrifying scenes I've ever seen in a movie.

Seriously? Have you only seen three movies or something?

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at July 19, 2013 12:28 PM (+lsX1)

142 Hard Candy was a good movie. If you're a dude, you got squeamish during that one scene.

Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 12:28 PM (dKV5k)

143 Movies and TV are taken too seriously because pop culture is the only thing we have in common anymore. It's literally religion for many. It's where they find meaning and community. Pop culture and politics are the new meaning machines.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 12:29 PM (ZPrif)

144 Hell, video games are better than movies now. The Last of Us was pretty damn good. See? I think this is the problem. People are jaded because there really are so many other avenues for story. So when I want good story, I'll watch a good TV show, or I'll read a book (or, better: a series of books), or I play a video game (you can pack a lot of story into "100 hours of game play!!!!"). So when I go to a movie, all I want is escape-ism. The 3 act (or 5 for a long movie) framework is fine. Hitting the same beats is fine. Let the be lots of explosions, some eye-candy, let the good guys be good guys, and then let the good guys win. I don't really *want* a story that can be packed into 2 or 3 hours to be much more complicated than that.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) - Passing through Rage & Out the Other Side at July 19, 2013 12:29 PM (/PCJa)

145 124 RickB223,

Would you settle for an old one....?

http://youtu.be/37tHg-sH--o

Elizabeth Montgomery (1972) The Victim

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:30 PM (LRFds)

146 They should make movies where a guy meets a girl in some funny situation but they kind of hit it off then they fall in love even though one or both of them has some quirky personality trait and the girl has a gay male friend and anyway it looks like smooth sailing but then OH NO something happens that splits them up and then there's an acoustic guitar solo over a montage and the girl is bummed and talks to her gay friend and the guy lets himself go until he talks to a Magic Negro and then guy and girl get back together and kiss in the middle of the street or something and people walk by without even noticing them and the camera zooms out to show the New York skyline and roll credits Get'cher periods heah! Get'cher periods heah!

Posted by: rickb223 at July 19, 2013 12:30 PM (MJFVz)

147 Posted by: Guy Mohawk at July 19, 2013 04:28 PM (4+FWp) My God, that's gold!!! In production right fucking now!

Posted by: Hollywood Exec at July 19, 2013 12:30 PM (dKV5k)

148 Pop culture and politics are the new meaning machines. This is a principal reason why the civil society is collapsing.

Posted by: George Orwell crosseyed and painless at July 19, 2013 12:30 PM (mCNwt)

149 >>>I don't think they feel bound to do that anymore. I think it's just by the numbers now.

It's not about what the business did to the art. It's about what the art did the business. All the creative writing the so called artists of the screen play world want to do now is shrill preachy progressive screed scripts. Because that's the only thing the creative artistic side wants to write, and no one, not even progressives want to listen to it, the business side still has to make money, and then tells the artistic side what to write.

If the arteests would ever step out of their narrow little paradigm of pushing progressivism 24/7 and put some real passion in to some other type of story, they could, I think, get support. But they can't, because as you've observed in the past, for a progressive, everything must relate back to the ideology. Everything.

Yet one more good thing in the world ruined by the progress of progressivism.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Laughing Maniacally While Throwing Matches. at July 19, 2013 12:30 PM (0q2P7)

150 "They took my daughter!"

Posted by: Eton Cox at July 19, 2013 12:30 PM (q177U)

151 Bowfinger is a underrated movie.

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 19, 2013 12:30 PM (qRasw)

152 One canned plot I like is where the sorority calls a plumber to fix a leak but they have no money so he has to take it out in trade.

Posted by: WalrusRex at July 19, 2013 12:30 PM (Hx5uv)

153 >>>>> Yinze? Definition anyone? Seconded.

Posted by: L, elle at July 19, 2013 12:31 PM (0PiQ4)

154 Get'cher periods heah! Get'cher periods heah!

That time of the month, rick?

Posted by: bonhomme at July 19, 2013 12:31 PM (gtjN1)

155 They should make a movie where a guy drives a car and then he stops and a truck driver says "Blow me" so the guy shoots the truck and it blows up PWBLAHM and the guy smiles and says something funny like "Keep the change."  I'd watch that 100 times.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at July 19, 2013 12:31 PM (DuH+r)

156 Yep. By the numbers, with an agenda footnote. It's embarrassing to watch most movies, now. Anyone catch Netflix's new show Orange is the New Black? Enough said.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at July 19, 2013 12:31 PM (XYSwB)

157 138 Bonhomme,

I'd rather have a free country that I can use to maximize my gain...

barring that yeah Cacti colonoscopies are more enjoyable than most cinematic fare

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:31 PM (LRFds)

158 144 . . . So when I go to a movie, all I want is escape-ism. The 3 act (or 5 for a long movie) framework is fine. Hitting the same beats is fine. Let the be lots of explosions, some eye-candy, let the good guys be good guys, and then let the good guys win. I don't really *want* a story that can be packed into 2 or 3 hours to be much more complicated than that. ___ Just boobs and car chases is sufficient.

Posted by: Cowboy Bob at July 19, 2013 12:31 PM (yFb77)

159 Mostly I hate movies today for the politics"the sucker punch" John Nolte calls it,that doesn't even belong but just gets inserted to slap the right.

Posted by: steevy at July 19, 2013 12:31 PM (9XBK2)

160 They should make a movie where the bad guy is secretly a rich white guy. Like an oil man or defense contractor.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 12:32 PM (ZPrif)

161 it will never happen but I would really like to see historical war movies made with the new CGI tech...accurate ones....The Battle of Kursk with 3000 AFVs , Midway with a realistic depiction instead of one carrier and 6 real planes and film clips, the Battle of Jutland, Trafalgar... the reason why most war movies are about small groups of men on foot is simply because there isn't that much period hardware around...now there could be!

Posted by: azjaeger at July 19, 2013 12:32 PM (niWgN)

162

>>>>> Yinze? Definition anyone?

 

"Y'all", in Brooklyn

Posted by: Bigby's Bloody Shirt Waving Hands at July 19, 2013 12:32 PM (3ZtZW)

163 One canned plot I like is where the sorority calls a plumber to fix a leak but they have no money so he has to take it out in trade. Wasn't that the plot of "The Music Man?"

Posted by: George Orwell crosseyed and painless at July 19, 2013 12:32 PM (mCNwt)

164 The real solution is that we need MORE sequels and remakes, not less as was mentioned by some commenting above. I mean, hasn't the movie-viewing public waited way too long for "Mannequin 3," "Weekend at Bernie's 3," and "Attack of the Killer Tomatoes 3," among MANY others?

NOTE: That cheesedick actor Andrew McCarthy has a propensity for being in crap movies as evidenced by his appearance in 2 of the 3 listed above. I never liked that guy, as he made EVERY movie worse that he's ever been in.

Posted by: Slappy at July 19, 2013 12:32 PM (LTbLf)

165 If the arteests would ever step out of their narrow little paradigm of pushing progressivism 24/7 and put some real passion in to some other type of story, they could, I think, get support. But they can't, because as you've observed in the past, for a progressive, everything must relate back to the ideology. Everything.

I just don't think that's a story that needs to be told.

--Mover and Shaker

Posted by: bonhomme at July 19, 2013 12:32 PM (gtjN1)

166

Get'cher periods heah! Get'cher periods heah!

Posted by: rickb223

Off my corner, scab!!

Posted by: Paragraph peddler [/i] [/b] at July 19, 2013 12:32 PM (xvZYu)

167 "US Marine Corps Col. George Bristol commanded Special Operations Forces in Northern Africa when terrorists attacked the American Consulate in Benghazi, Libya. The Pentagon has caved to congressional requests to make him available to answer questions about that attack, which left the U.S. Ambassador dead" from the dailymail

Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl at July 19, 2013 12:32 PM (8JJ6O)

168 141 -

Are you not very bright?  That might explain your comments.  I've seen many more movies than you have, silly person. 

Posted by: BurtTC at July 19, 2013 12:33 PM (BeSEI)

169 Just boobs and car chases is sufficient. Which reminds me: I still need to watch Shoot 'Em Up.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) - Passing through Rage & Out the Other Side at July 19, 2013 12:33 PM (/PCJa)

170

Bowfinger is a underrated movie.

 

I liked  it  better the first time when it was called "Roshomon".

 

Hello.

Posted by: eleven at July 19, 2013 12:33 PM (fsLdt)

171 I go to or watch movies to suspend reality  and/or have fun for a time.  If  a movie can do that for me, then I'll like it.  Being anal about structure, plot motivations, or the "profound messaging" is not my reason for  watching a movie.

Posted by: Soona at July 19, 2013 12:33 PM (pid0P)

172 So when I go to a movie, all I want is escape-ism. The 3 act (or 5 for a long movie) framework is fine. Hitting the same beats is fine. Let the be lots of explosions, some eye-candy, let the good guys be good guys, and then let the good guys win. I don't really *want* a story that can be packed into 2 or 3 hours to be much more complicated than that.

Yeah, I have very similar expectations.  I'm perfectly fine with almost any movie now that involves explosions and Jason Statham wearing an Irish hat, and business for that "genre" has been good lately.

Posted by: Ian S. at July 19, 2013 12:33 PM (B/VB5)

173 How about the western where one group of guys bands together to fight off another group of guys

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 19, 2013 12:33 PM (8sCoq)

174 Anyone else find the movie audio tracks unbearable in theaters? Does anyone find the volume and dynamic range appealing?

Posted by: USA at July 19, 2013 12:33 PM (VIaw0)

175 Relatively harmless example,Blade Trinity(which sucks),Blade gets captured,they are questioning his sanity.One agent says "do you even know who the president is?" (at the time GW Bush,of course) Blade snarls "An asshole!"

Posted by: steevy at July 19, 2013 12:34 PM (9XBK2)

176 This reads like a Hollywood script: "What happened was a young Hispanic man shot a black man in self defense, was tried by a jury of women and somehow Bobby Rush thinks itÂ’s a white manÂ’s fault." ~Congressman Steve King therightscoop.com

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at July 19, 2013 12:34 PM (XYSwB)

177 One canned plot I like is where the sorority calls a plumber to fix a leak but they have no money so he has to take it out in trade. Good times. Good times.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 19, 2013 12:34 PM (MJFVz)

178 "Ratatouille came closest by saying more or less "anyone can learn to cook well without being a rockstar chef, and that's great".
Posted by: Ian S. at July 19, 2013 04:27 PM"


They blew it by giving even a voice part to Jeanine Garofolo, or however the heck her name is spelled.

Posted by: Brian at July 19, 2013 12:34 PM (knoK7)

179 I'd rather have a free country that I can use to maximize my gain...

I wasn't agitating class warfare.  I was responding to the person that said movies make megabucks, and don't complain about retreads because they're obviously popular.

Posted by: bonhomme at July 19, 2013 12:34 PM (8ifMA)

180
John Nolte has explained why Hollywood can't make romance movies anymore: since couples now regularly hop into bed fairly soon in their relationships, the stories have to spend the entire movie overcoming ridiculous, unbelievable obstacles that keep them apart. Normally this time would be spent on courtship, but that's so last century.

Posted by: Lizzy at July 19, 2013 04:24 PM (2mSdf)








Even that can be turned on it's head. NewsRadio had Dave and Lisa jumping into the sack in the second episode. The tension comes when they try to keep their relationship secret from the rest of the office.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at July 19, 2013 12:34 PM (TIIx5)

181 Hollywood just has no imagination. Bunker Hill would make a good film. Sort of "Tora, Tora, Tora" quality to it, in the sense of parting of ways, "now we are really at war" at the end. Cicero would be a good subject--miniseries perhaps better. Shiloh--the reality of what a bloody war it was actually going to be. More casualties than all the other wars up to that point combined, if I remember correctly. The drama of Grant actually reacting well, but taking a fall anyway. Two parter with Vicksburg as the sequel, where he redeems himself. Lindbergh 1927 is a good story--one guy from nowhere, with Byrd serving as a usefully ambivalent character (I think Byrd lied vis a vis the North Pole). Leyte Gulf would be good--don't try to capture all of it, but focus on major theme: courage under adversity (action off Samar, Japanese willingness to fight), as well as the foolishness of the Japanese refusal to surrender after the Marianas. Evan Thomas' book is a good focus. Battle of Wake Island Robert Goddard--Spielberg could take that one. Life arc story. Big dreams, moment of glory in the 30s, then return to quiet work, never achieved greatness, made an impact, but some futility involved too. Mawson. There are plenty of good stories to tell. You start out by thinking of the theme of it, the big takeaway, and then weave your tale around it.

Posted by: Baron bon Mot at July 19, 2013 12:35 PM (7d1L5)

182 Undercover Brother needs a sequel. This time The Man is SCOAMF. Then show the confusion of why shit is still fucked up when The Man is one of their own.

Posted by: Hollywood Pitchman at July 19, 2013 12:35 PM (dKV5k)

183 Speaking of Sucker Punch. Crack had a recent photoshop piece -- 27 Things About People Who Annoy You, or something like that. 23 of them were funny (ish) pics about people who drive slow in the right hand lane or don't use their blinker or talk during movies. But 4 or so were just straight up, Republicans suck. It was about every 5th one. So it went funny, funny, heh, funny, sucker punch, funny, heh, funny, sucker punch.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 12:35 PM (ZPrif)

184 136 Brandon in BR,

There's a lot to that notion to.

I can't believe how insufferably horrible Heaven's Gate was totally self-indulgent shit.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:35 PM (LRFds)

185 We'd like to see a movie about McCarthyism. That would be new and refreshing.

Posted by: Ed Harris and Amy Madigan at July 19, 2013 12:35 PM (dCigj)

186

"I would love to see a movie where the plot/message is "You are not the Chosen One. This does not mean you cannot become great and live an awesome life."

Forrest Gump?

Posted by: newguy at July 19, 2013 12:35 PM (kduZC)

187 169 Just boobs and car chases is sufficient. Which reminds me: I still need to watch Shoot 'Em Up. ___ Or Sound of Music

Posted by: Cowboy Bob at July 19, 2013 12:35 PM (yFb77)

188 Roshomon is actually a rip off of A day At The Races.

Posted by: Dr Spank at July 19, 2013 12:36 PM (qRasw)

189 Posted by: Baron bon Mot at July 19, 2013 04:35 PM (7d1L5) If done right, I'd see those! Especially Leyte Gulf.

Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 12:36 PM (dKV5k)

190

'The Three Amigos'

That was a good movie.

Posted by: garrett at July 19, 2013 12:36 PM (Z2mf2)

191 "Quality Yinze"? what does that mean?

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 12:37 PM (ZPrif)

192 179 Bonhomme,

wasn't saying you were acting was supporting you actually...

it galls me that a medium that has spent 80% of its history bitching for more freedom elects people who hate it for the economy so...

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:37 PM (LRFds)

193 The sad thing is that "historical" movies make shit it up that the LIVs now take as gospel. All in the name of making it more exciting. Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 04:19 PM (dKV5k) I avoid movies based "historical facts". Probably the two best examples are Brave Heart and Red Tails. I'm sure their are more.

Posted by: YIKES! at July 19, 2013 12:37 PM (mETGQ)

194 According to Google nobody in the history of the world has ever said "Quality Yinze" before this article. This page is the one and only search result.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 12:38 PM (ZPrif)

195 Who can forget the horror of Pearl Harbor?That  movie gives me nightmares to this day.

Posted by: steevy at July 19, 2013 12:38 PM (9XBK2)

196 169 Just boobs and car chases is sufficient. Which reminds me: I still need to watch Shoot 'Em Up. Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) - Passing through Rage & Out the Other Side at July 19, 2013 04:33 PM (/PCJa) Love that movie, but the anti-second amendment propaganda they stick in there pisses me off. On the other hand, over the top gunfights and Monica Bellucci's boobehs.

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 12:38 PM (NEIxp)

197 "Quality Y'all" doesn't make any more sense.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 12:38 PM (ZPrif)

198 Hollywood is an incestual tribe. Desert dry.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at July 19, 2013 12:39 PM (XYSwB)

199 190 'The Three Amigos' That was a good movie. Posted by: garrett at July 19, 2013 04:36 PM (Z2mf2) Sometimes you just have to face your El Guapo.

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 12:39 PM (NEIxp)

200 The movies aren't nearly as awful and cliched as modern American life. WTF?

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at July 19, 2013 12:39 PM (YmPwQ)

201 "Seven Men of Gascony" would make a decent movie, especially as the comrades go away one by one.

Posted by: Baron bon Mot at July 19, 2013 12:39 PM (7d1L5)

202 Think 50's and 60's Westerns. They all had the same plot, just different actors and locations.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectal at July 19, 2013 12:39 PM (wR+pz)

203

Actually, I was nine feet tall and shot fireballs from my arse.

 

True story.

Posted by: William Wallace at July 19, 2013 12:39 PM (dCigj)

204 Agreed. The movie Pearl Harbor was worse than the actual Pearl Harbor. It was a cinematic surprise kamikaze attack!

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 12:40 PM (ZPrif)

205 Posted by: azjaeger at July 19, 2013 04:32 PM (niWgN) Unfortunately, Pearl Harbor makes studio execs gunshy. Too bad they don't realize that it was screwed up because they tried to make it like Titanic with a love story instead of just making a damn war movie. Oh and Ben Affleck.

Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 12:40 PM (dKV5k)

206

"I avoid movies based "historical facts"."

 

Me too.

Try "Man for All Seasons", "Is Paris Burning?" "Battleground."

 

 

Posted by: newguy at July 19, 2013 12:41 PM (kduZC)

207 "What happened was a young Hispanic man shot a black man in self defense, was tried by a jury of women and somehow Bobby Rush thinks itÂ’s a white manÂ’s fault."

***

In a world where white Hispanics shoot black children at random, a cool, young president must take a stand.

Posted by: WalrusRex at July 19, 2013 12:41 PM (Hx5uv)

208 Amelia Earhart movie. Plane taxis down runway, lifts off, fade to black.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 19, 2013 12:41 PM (MJFVz)

209 *I think there was a time when people in Hollywood felt they had to bring something new and different to the table, even in a hackneyed formula genre picture, to justify their involvement in the project. I don't think they feel bound to do that anymore. I think it's just by the numbers now. What does that mean? brb, need some toilet paper to write the script for "Grown Ups 3"!

Posted by: Adam Sandler at July 19, 2013 12:41 PM (X866z)

210 In a way, all of us has an El Guapo to face. For some, shyness might be their El Guapo. For others, a lack of education might be their El Guapo. For us, El Guapo is a big, dangerous man who wants to kill us. But as sure as my name is Lucky Day, the people of Santa Poco can conquer their own personal El Guapo, who also happens to be *the actual* El Guapo!

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 12:41 PM (ZPrif)

211

>>>The sad thing is that "historical" movies make shit it up that the LIVs now take as gospel. All in the name of making it more exciting.

 

 

Thats because there really hasn't *been* any history. What, you think people were really in black and white? HA! History was something made up by the Mob so they could make movies about it. WW2 never happened! WW1 was a brainfart idea by Mattie before he got wacked. Don't even get me started on the Crimea.

Posted by: Bigby's Bloody Shirt Waving Hands at July 19, 2013 12:41 PM (3ZtZW)

212 If you are looking for movie ideas, you should call my 2nd cousin-in-law( by his second wife Dilara) Mahmoud in Aleppo. He knows about blowing things up. He's an engineer. Well you would probably have to call my first cousin in Diyarbakir and have his send a messenger; the phones aren't working in that part of the city where Mahmoud works. It would be a great adventure for a young boy, a coming of age in a difficult time story, as it were. It would be very popular almost anywhere that isn't in the United States. Especially if you had some dancing (boys or girls, either would work), and feasting. Lots of feasting. My second sister in Egypt says people will pay to go to a movie where they can see people feasting and dancing.

Posted by: Chow Illyukhin-Haluk at July 19, 2013 12:42 PM (yRbg4)

213 The obvious movie to watch to combine this and the last thread is Don't be a Menance to South Central While Drinking Your Juice in the Hood

Posted by: Wonkish Rogue at July 19, 2013 12:42 PM (dvRYt)

214
The other reality tv by the numbers is:

And the winner of the challenge is.....commercial break or

And the contestant going home is.....commercial break or

Wow look what I found, its a ......commercial break.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at July 19, 2013 12:42 PM (4+FWp)

215

"Battle Los Angeles" was a very well made budget movie.  It also spun a very  positive light on  the military.  I  do like that movie.

Posted by: Soona at July 19, 2013 12:42 PM (pid0P)

216 204 Agreed. The movie Pearl Harbor was worse than the actual Pearl Harbor. It was a cinematic surprise kamikaze attack! Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 04:40 PM (ZPrif) Girl I need you more than Ben Affleck needs acting school He was terrible in that film.

Posted by: Insomniac at July 19, 2013 12:42 PM (NEIxp)

217 Actually, I was nine feet tall and shot fireballs from my arse. True story. _________________________________________ I am skilled in military tactics and the art of war...

Posted by: Nobel Laureate Legal Scholar Racial Healer at July 19, 2013 12:42 PM (Ec6wH)

218 213 The obvious movie to watch to combine this and the last thread is Don't be a Menance to South Central While Drinking Your Juice in the Hood --- Can we get Barky a job as a crash-test dummy?

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at July 19, 2013 12:42 PM (a3iAA)

219 They need to get back to the redneck formula - hot girls, fast cars and blowing shit up. Posted by: Roy at July 19, 2013 04:13 PM

This, plus some ultra-low-budget sci-fi flicks!

But whatever the friggin' talent-less loons in Hollywood do, I would beg them to pleasepleasepleasepleaseplease dump all the CGI shit.

I might actually go to a movie again if they did that.

Posted by: MrScribbler at July 19, 2013 12:43 PM (/RIVS)

220 Probably the two best examples are Brave Heart and Red Tails. I'm sure their are more.

***

Mississippi Burning

Posted by: WalrusRex at July 19, 2013 12:43 PM (Hx5uv)

221

>>>"Quality Y'all" doesn't make any more sense.

 

You're not hearing it right. "Call at Tea, ya'll"

Posted by: Bigby's Bloody Shirt Waving Hands at July 19, 2013 12:43 PM (3ZtZW)

222 202 Billy Bob,

eh "mostly" and that is why I said ~66 to 76 and part of that I suspect was the Warren court loosening shit up....

3:10 to Yuma was different...

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:43 PM (LRFds)

223 Posted by: Soona at July 19, 2013 04:42 PM (pid0P) Agreed. I enjoyed that movie.

Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 12:43 PM (dKV5k)

224 Think 50's and 60's Westerns. They all had the same plot, just different actors and locations.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectal at July 19, 2013 04:39 PM...........Yes, But they had a good guy and a bad guy, the good guy won and you got to escape reality for 2 hours while eating popcorn with real butter. Now we get fake oil shit and every movie decides it needs to be some social justice indoctrination bullshit.

Posted by: Minnfidel at July 19, 2013 12:44 PM (BsIKy)

225

And the winner of the challenge is.....commercial break or

And the contestant going home is.....commercial break or

Wow look what I found, its a ......commercial break.

 

I just change the channel and start watching something else because fuck them.

Posted by: eleven at July 19, 2013 12:44 PM (fsLdt)

226 _________________________________ I am skilled in military tactics and the art of war... Posted by: Nobel Laureate Legal Scholar Racial Healer at July 19, 2013 04:42 PM (Ec6wH) Didn't I throw your pansy ass out a window?

Posted by: Edward the Longshanks at July 19, 2013 12:44 PM (NEIxp)

227 Amelia Earhart movie.

Plane taxis down runway, lifts off, fade to black.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 19, 2013 04:41 PM (MJFVz)

 

 

---------------------------------------------

 

 

That's a Cannes award-winner right there.

Posted by: Soona at July 19, 2013 12:44 PM (pid0P)

228 3:10 to Yuma was different... Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 04:43 PM (LRFds) Shit that was just on last week on AMC or TCM.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectal at July 19, 2013 12:45 PM (wR+pz)

229 http://tinyurl.com/k6frjh8

Posted by: Wonkish Rogue at July 19, 2013 12:45 PM (dvRYt)

230 Advances in technology will hit two points that will change the industry forever. First, tech will eventually allow any director to essentially show us whatever story is in his or her head. Second, big explosions and special effects won't mean as much when the technical threshold to show them is lowered far enough. We're already approaching the first point, and it's clear that most studios have very little in their head worth sharing anymore. All their expertise brings is overpaid actors and recycled scripts. The second point will change movies forever. When low budgets don't look low budget anymore, then the medium will open up to more than a handful of giant studios, and real competition to produce good stories will emerge. At the point when basically everything looks good, simply looking good won't sell anymore. Good stories will. Until then ... Fast and Furious 14!! JUST WHEN YOU THOUGHT IT WAS SAFE TO STEAL CARS IN SPACE AGAIN ... YOU WERE WRONG! AGAIN!!

Posted by: Artemus Khan, Supervillain-billionaire-layabout at July 19, 2013 12:45 PM (27tUc)

231 http://youtu.be/WMTAh8Gx9Eo

Hurricane (1974)

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:45 PM (LRFds)

232 I need to watch Stripes. I haven't seen that in awhile.

Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 12:46 PM (dKV5k)

233 219 They need to get back to the redneck formula - hot girls, fast cars and blowing shit up. Posted by: Roy at July 19, 2013 04:13 PM Smoky and the Bandit were on recently, I and II. I had forgotten how stupid they were.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectal at July 19, 2013 12:46 PM (wR+pz)

234 WTH just happened!? Its all embiggened

Posted by: Bigby's Bloody Shirt Waving Hands at July 19, 2013 12:46 PM (3ZtZW)

235 I would love to see a movie where the plot/message is "You are not the Chosen One. This does not mean you cannot become great and live an awesome life."

Posted by: Brother Cavil, proud OCP stockholder at July 19, 2013 04:02 PM (zUi7I)

 

Then watch Zack Snyder's 'Sucker Punch', which has a near-match for the plot/message you'd like to see except for the bit about 'live an awesome life'.

Posted by: troyriser at July 19, 2013 12:46 PM (vtiE6)

236 There have been great idea movies that suffered so much because no one decided to make the story their passion. The most recent disappointment that comes to mind is Prometheus. Such a great idea wasted on a mediocre, nay, bad story written by some prog who didn't really want to tell the Alien story in a compelling manner. They wanted to tell an anti-corporate anti-military story.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Laughing Maniacally While Throwing Matches. at July 19, 2013 12:47 PM (0q2P7)

237 Hell, they are sdome real good short films on YouTube that are better than some feature length movies.

Posted by: CDR M at July 19, 2013 12:47 PM (dKV5k)

238 228 Billy Bob,

yeah I enjoyed the closer attention to detail on the equipment in likely use in some ways in the remake BUT I really appreciated the original's acting and subtlety....

at any rate I am not pretending this was the Platinum age just saying there was a lot more diversity and creativity in that window than the 10 following....

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:47 PM (LRFds)

239 Advances in technology will hit two points that will change the industry forever. First, tech will eventually allow any director to essentially show us whatever story is in his or her head. If PRISM can't do that now, shut down the NSA.

Posted by: rickb223 at July 19, 2013 12:48 PM (MJFVz)

240 232 CDR M,

No Joy on that on YouTube skipper

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:48 PM (LRFds)

241

at any rate I am not pretending this was the Platinum age just saying there was a lot more diversity and creativity in that window than the 10 following....

 

ALSO: Silent era

Posted by: Bigby's Bloody Shirt Waving Hands at July 19, 2013 12:49 PM (3ZtZW)

242 They wanted to tell an anti-corporate anti-military story.

***

The Hollywood addict/pervert community declared war on America and Americans a long time ago.  (I think that may be the reason Rolling Stone was so blind to reality when decided to put Djoker on the cover.)  And yeah, that's big reason why movies suck.  You might even say that they suck donkey dongs.

Posted by: WalrusRex at July 19, 2013 12:49 PM (Hx5uv)

243 89 Insomniac,

or run CSpan and the White House Security Feed

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:50 PM (LRFds)

244 First, tech will eventually allow any director to essentially show us whatever story is in his or her your own head. Posted by: rickb223 at July 19, 2013 04:48 PM (MJFVz) Productivity at a new low Bunk sales at an all time high

Posted by: RWC at July 19, 2013 12:50 PM (fWAjv)

245 One thing that irks me is that too many filmmakers and screenwriters take the easy way out when it comes to creating a non-fiction movie based on an actual historical event. They start fiddling with the facts for entertainment purposes and their film ends up depicting the event much differently than how it happened. It's laziness because they're poor to mediocre filmmakers and screenwriters and can't find an entertaining and informative way to present true events so they start changing them. We then end up with a populace that doesn't know history very well because the only version they know was obtained from a movie that adapted most of the history and events that are depicted. For "artistic purposes," of course.

Posted by: Slappy at July 19, 2013 12:50 PM (LTbLf)

246 Coming soon:   "Purple Drank WHOOPASS!"  -  Starring Rachel Jeantel

Posted by: Soona at July 19, 2013 12:51 PM (pid0P)

247 241 Bigby's Flickering Fingers,

Yeah that's true the early "better era" was about '22-36

I wish MP4 was here to chirp in....

I am a HUGE Chaplin fan despite his scarlet underwear...

there was a freshness in that era.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:51 PM (LRFds)

248 108 Young Man Learns To Apply Himself A Bit More And Becomes Regional Sales Manager. Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 19, 2013 04:23 PM (ZPrif) That would also include "Assistant to the Regional Sales Manager

Posted by: Dwight K. Shrute at July 19, 2013 12:52 PM (BXLPR)

249
it will never happen but I would really like to see historical war movies made with the new CGI tech...accurate ones....The Battle of Kursk with 3000 AFVs , Midway with a realistic depiction instead of one carrier and 6 real planes and film clips, the Battle of Jutland, Trafalgar... the reason why most war movies are about small groups of men on foot is simply because there isn't that much period hardware around...now there could be!

Posted by: azjaeger at July 19, 2013 04:32 PM (niWgN)








Yeah, like several of my fellow morons pointed out......Leyte Gulf,  especially Samar.

I can see the last shot in the trailer now, establishing the overwhelming odds. One of the little destroyer escorts closing to a couple of hundred yards with a monster Jap battleship, trading broadsides.....


Posted by: IllTemperedCur at July 19, 2013 12:52 PM (TIIx5)

250 246 Coming soon: "Purple Drank WHOOPASS!" - Starring Rachel Jeantel

Posted by: Soona at July 19, 2013 04:51 PM (pid0P)

I was thinking "Precious 2" would be a more appropriate role for Jeantel actually.

Posted by: Slappy at July 19, 2013 12:53 PM (LTbLf)

251 215 Soona,

Hollywood does fuck up from time to time and not succeed in shitting on everything noble we are...

I liked Hurt Locker even though it was a cartoon.....

I wish if they can't ever love us they would at least quit beating us.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:53 PM (LRFds)

252 246 Soona,

JUSTIFIED MOTHERFUC*ER!- The Christopher Dorner Story.....


I wonder why Ogabe wasn't in lecture mood THAT week?

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 12:55 PM (LRFds)

253 247 yup yup Jackie Chan is all about the Harold Lloydd and Buster Keaton and Laurel and Hardy stunts. It was all before the violence and obscenity standards, before PC bullshit, before anybody figured out what "worked".

Posted by: Bigby's Bloody Shirt Waving Hands at July 19, 2013 12:55 PM (3ZtZW)

254 Sherman, Atlanta, August--September, 1864. Lincoln's reelection in doubt. Character study, North and South. There's American money to be made making American movies, and without making it a promotion for the DNC platform. And that may ve half the problem--when your politics must take pride of place over story. Take "The Lone Ranger". Those U.S. Cavalry officers? Who do you think freed the slaves? The scriptwriter?

Posted by: Baron bon Mot at July 19, 2013 12:55 PM (q0ujQ)

255 There is a reason why I prefer the SyFy channel's movies to what is coming out of Hollywood. With the SyFy channel, I know exactly what I am getting for my money. With Hollywood, I get the same thing but it costs me a whole lot more. Advantage SyFy channel.

Posted by: Ashley Judd's Puffy Scamper, aka MrCaniac at July 19, 2013 12:55 PM (BXLPR)

256 71 "You are not the Chosen One. This does not mean you cannot become great and live an awesome life." A Catholic movie critic recently wrote a column saying that this is basically the theme of most Pixar movies, which is why they are all so refreshingly good. Posted by: Paul Zummo at July 19, 2013 04:17 PM (Ud5vq) Wall-e. garbage man saves civilization.

Posted by: Buzzion at July 19, 2013 12:55 PM (NSlTs)

257 Well, at least I only show the good parts!

Posted by: Red Tube at July 19, 2013 12:57 PM (dKV5k)

258 I liked Hurt Locker even though it was a cartoon.....

I wish if they can't ever love us they would at least quit beating us.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 04:53 PM (LRFds)

 

 

------------------------------------------

 

 

The best part of that movie is  when the main character is rotated back home and  finds himself  incompatible with the "quiet life".

 

I knew a lot of Vietnam vets like that.  I was one of them. 

Posted by: Soona at July 19, 2013 12:58 PM (pid0P)

259 "In the Heart of the Sea" Bligh, from his side. A guy who was good in certain areas, couldn't get his authority respected (and I haven't read enough to intuitively understand why), but rose to the challenge when deposed and made one of the best sea voyages of all time in an open boat.

Posted by: Baron bon Mot at July 19, 2013 12:59 PM (q0ujQ)

260 A neat idea for a set of action movies could be taking the old civil war stories and the reconstruction era and making them biker flicks...

imagine a James Gang movie set in the "New West"...anyway there's room for creativity there and a new set of stories.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 01:00 PM (LRFds)

261 http://youtu.be/b2d1OIC1Ziw

a boy and his dog (1975)

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 01:02 PM (LRFds)

262 Ace, if you've never read Snow Crash by Neil Stephenson, do so. The main character talks about being a young man with dreams of awesomeness. "Until a man is twenty-five, he still thinks, every so often, that under the right circumstances he could be the baddest motherf*cker in the world. If I moved to a martial-arts monastery in China and studied real hard for ten years. If my family was wiped out by Colombian drug dealers and I swore myself to revenge. If I got a fatal disease, had one year to live, and devoted it to wiping out street crime. If I just dropped out and devoted my life to being bad. Hiro used to feel this way, too, but then he ran into Raven. In a way, this was liberating. He no longer has to worry about being the baddest motherf*cker in the world. The position is taken."

Posted by: Once and Future Lurker at July 19, 2013 01:02 PM (hHMd8)

263 As fate would have it, I am an international award-winning screenwriter. Obviously, all the fine arts are dying in the West, including Cinema. There hasn't been a new movement in Painting since the Sixties. The Pulitzer Prize For Fiction did not even get awarded last year.
The zeitgeist-controlling Left deals in a systematically falsified conscience which is inimical to free Art of any kind. Historically, this same blight overtakes all communist and socialist countries. So, by fiat, Western artists today are forced to deal only with .07% of human reality (aka "dark & edgy").
Beauty as an artistic intention is now expressly forbidden. This, in effect, kills Art, too, because Freedom is Beauty is Art. Strike away any one element, and the entire equation fails.

Posted by: herbork at July 19, 2013 01:02 PM (t1s5e)

264
Here's another cliche that MUST die.

The "hero is a former Navy SEAL/Delta Force/Ranger/007/Agent Orange".

The greatest action movie of all time is probably Die Hard. And the hero isn't some SpecOps Sgt Rock, he's an ordinary city cop. THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT OF THE MOVIE! Ordinary guy against scary, highly trained international terrorist monsters.



Posted by: IllTemperedCur at July 19, 2013 01:02 PM (TIIx5)

265 So Ace, instead of stealing ideas from Allahpundit, you're stealing them from Stacy McCain? http://tinyurl.com/m5hy4fg

But seriously, I think this stylebook form of moviemaking is why I don't care at all for most movies made since about 2007 or so - which would be right at the point after the first Blake Snyder "Save the Cat" beat-sheet formula screenplays would have hit theaters as finished product.

Posted by: Jeff Weimer at July 19, 2013 01:03 PM (ylG8S)

266 >>Yeah, I have very similar expectations. I'm perfectly fine with almost any movie now that involves explosions and Jason Statham wearing an Irish hat, and business for that "genre" has been good lately.

Exactly! Big, dumb movies can be fun, even when they're entirely predictable (sometimes even the predictability is fun). Jason Statham plays the same guy in every movie - a criminal who lives by his own ethical code who has to deal with fellow criminals who are baaaad - and it's great. Same goes for the Fast and Furious franchise.

I had more fun watching Transformers 3 (with my kid, 'natch) than Avatar. The Transformers was fun (even with Shia) whereas Avatar as like a really pretty and colorful Al Gore lecture.
Shut up and entertain me!

Posted by: Lizzy at July 19, 2013 01:03 PM (2mSdf)

267 >>With the SyFy channel, I know exactly what I am getting for my money. With Hollywood, I get the same thing but it costs me a whole lot more.

Also, why pay to be insulted?

Posted by: Lizzy at July 19, 2013 01:04 PM (2mSdf)

268 A neat idea for a set of action movies could be taking the old civil war stories and the reconstruction era and making them biker flicks...

imagine a James Gang movie set in the "New West"...anyway there's room for creativity there and a new set of stories.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 05:00 PM (LRFds)

 

 

--------------------------------------------------

 

 

What might be an eye-opener for some on the left  (and the right)  would be a movie about a race/civil war  as it might be like  in the present day.  Show it with all of it's ugliness.

Posted by: Soona at July 19, 2013 01:06 PM (pid0P)

269 264 ITC,

the series obliterated that but yeah...

you know another movie that glorified the every man?

No Country For Old Men the guy was a mundane infantryman from Vietnam who held his own against Mexicali Terminator...

well done

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 01:06 PM (LRFds)

270 http://youtu.be/xuG8D8oUn_8

Stepford Wives(1975)

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 01:08 PM (LRFds)

271 CGI has ruined action films as well. Now anything you can imagine you can put on the screen. This means our heroes can fall from tall buildings, jump a car doing a triple loop over burning bridges without scratch, fly a plane through a collapsing city flooded by burning s'mores. Okay, I made the last one up (I think.) There's no sense of danger because there's no sense of the reality of physics. When you fall you should die or at least get hurt. Otherwise you're just watching a video game. Before CGI, stuntmen (and stuntwomen) had to perform the stunts and they brought a sense of realism to the action. They couldn't slide down a flaming building because they would die. End of story. Compare the car chase in French Connection to any modern car chase scene done with CGI. There's no comparison. The French Connection is better and more suspenseful because we felt the danger.

Posted by: SouthofReality at July 19, 2013 01:11 PM (eGeJp)

272 They should do a movie about an idealistic young teacher who gets hired to teach in an inner city school despite threats and discouragement she turns the school around.

Posted by: Northernlurker at July 19, 2013 01:14 PM (Gw0d7)

273 164 -  Andrew McCarthy ... made EVERY movie worse that he's ever been in

Weekend at Bernies 2, and Mannequin were destined to be turds whether or not they were polished by Andrew McCarthy

Posted by: Beorn at July 19, 2013 01:15 PM (dGF4J)

274 272 NorthernLurker,

Yeah it'd be about the brave prgressive who fights against the evils of the Conservative biased NEA and School Board...

I've seen this movie.

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 01:18 PM (LRFds)

275 this thread needs a chase scene and more explosions.



hey, FX guys have to pay mortgages, too.  so what if it has absolutely nothing to do with the plot, that is, if we even have a plot.

Posted by: jc at July 19, 2013 01:19 PM (i8c5b)

276

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 05:06 PM (LRFds)








Expanding on the everyman theme in action flicks..... Ellen Ripley is just a junior officer on a commercial tugboat, Indiana Jones is just a college professor, Sarah Connor is a waitress and The Terminator is a toaster oven.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at July 19, 2013 01:20 PM (TIIx5)

277 They should do a movie about an idealistic young teacher who gets hired to teach in an inner city school despite threats and discouragement she turns the school around. Posted by: Northernlurker at July 19, 2013 05:14 PM (Gw0d7) And after the big state test they all put on do rags and dance around the class. Or, they could have a white Female idealistic married teacher that fucks her way through the football team. Of course documentaries never make much money.

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet Palin/Bolton 2016 at July 19, 2013 01:21 PM (XIxXP)

278 277 OSP,

You win the thread...

I concede.

*hat tip*

Posted by: sven10077@sven10077 at July 19, 2013 01:25 PM (LRFds)

279 I meant 'yinze" to mean tookie; I forgot that it was a brooklyn term for "youse."

Darn.  It's such a good word too.

Posted by: ace at July 19, 2013 01:27 PM (/IWYB)

280 273

Weekend at Bernies 2, and Mannequin were destined to be turds whether or not they were polished by Andrew McCarthy

Posted by: Beorn at July 19, 2013 05:15 PM (dGF4J)

Fair enough, but my point still stands. The guy -- and I used that term loosely -- always needed to play the sensitive douche that was non-threatening to women. I loathe Andrew McCarthy. I'd put him somewhere between Idi Amin and Hitler on the spectrum of pure evil.

Posted by: Slappy at July 19, 2013 01:31 PM (LTbLf)

281

>>Yeah, like several of my fellow morons pointed out......Leyte Gulf, especially Samar.

I can see the last shot in the trailer now, establishing the overwhelming odds. One of the little destroyer escorts closing to a couple of hundred yards with a monster Jap battleship, trading broadsides.....

I would watch the hell out of that movie. 

Posted by: Croaker at July 19, 2013 01:38 PM (leNBy)

282 But young men proving their awesomeness to their impressionable young date are buying the tickets.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at July 19, 2013 02:11 PM (Y92Nd)

283 I think "The Hero's Journey," as applied to screenwriting, is responsible for a lot of this dreck. It's an attempt to impose the mythological pattern identified by Joseph Campbell onto screenplays. There's some value to this, but it's been overdone and has created a bunch of movies that follow the same structure with the same "dramatic turning points." The hero first refuses his mission, then reluctantly accepts, then gathers allies, then faces a critical setback, and finally overcomes the setback ... A little of this goes a long way.

Posted by: sauropod at July 19, 2013 02:25 PM (G/vW6)

284 "You are not the Chosen One. This does not mean you cannot become great and live an awesome life."

A Catholic movie critic recently wrote a column saying that this is basically the theme of most Pixar movies, which is why they are all so refreshingly good.

Posted by: Paul Zummo at July 19, 2013 04:17 PM (Ud5vq)

 

Yes, they're good, but even they are formulaic.  I went to see Monsters University, and quite enjoyed it, but my heart sank when we got to the point about 20 minutes before then end, when there was the Quiet Monologue Of Despair.  I've seen this in Toy Story, Monsters Inc, and now here - if I watch other Pixar movies I'll bet I'll find it there too.  It's always the same:  "I just...can't do it..."  Then there's a wild and crazy chase/fight scene and All Is Well.  I give this movie points for a surprise ending, where the moral is NOT "Education is the most important thing in life."  That WAS refreshing, but the framework is still very unvarying.

Posted by: Dr. Mabuse at July 19, 2013 03:00 PM (FkH4y)

285 Yeah, Leyte Gulf would make a GREAT movie...except if accurately depicted then Hollywood would object to the Americans being heroes, and the Japanese admiral deciding to leave right when total victory was near because the escort carrier planes spooked him. Obviously racist against Asians. They'd end up rewriting it so the Japanese admiral in command would be a Nazi that they brought in, and the escort carrier pilots would all be Japanese-Americans and Red Tail Squadron pilots.

Posted by: azjaeger at July 19, 2013 03:27 PM (niWgN)

286 I'm tire of the same old cliche's. Give me some new ones.

Posted by: Samuel Goldwyn at July 19, 2013 06:47 PM (fOFYL)

287 A few years ago a friend of mine pitched a show to one of the big studios. She said to the guy, "...and as you can see, this has never been done before." The dude responded, "Oh....well we don't do that." I'd say that about sums up why movies all suck now, and why Hollywood just keeps regurgitating re-makes.

Posted by: Mistress Overdone at July 20, 2013 04:08 AM (2/oBD)

288 Why are films thinly desguised political indoctrination appratus YOU pay them.  and why are major leading male  film actors coming out one after another after another......gay.  Are they really all gay or is hollywood and the media just demanding they say they are to further p.c. agendas ?

Posted by: ron n. at July 20, 2013 02:59 PM (6fvl0)

289 How is there any "heart and soul" in painting by the numbers?

The only desire involved in that is the desire to be a successful screenwriter. That passes for "heart and soul" nowadays, I guess.

Posted by: The Smacker at July 20, 2013 06:00 PM (KFmt0)

290 So who said movies are supposed to be art anyway? All they are now is product. Unfortunately, they are now our mythmakers. Kids don't know about Jim Bridger, Captain Drake, Magellan, or even Lewis and Clark,- but they know Han Solo, Spiderman and Wolverine. That truly makes me sad.

Posted by: Sum Ting Wong at July 22, 2013 03:15 PM (9iWKq)

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