March 06, 2013
— DrewM Jim Geraghty asks that provocative question in his Morning Jolt newsletter and concludes the answer is...not really.
It's a very interesting essay that I think gets near but not at the heart of the matter. Yes, the Democratic narrative is as he lays it out...
In the beginning, there was Bush, and Bush was bad. There was war, and it was bad; the war created the deficits, and so did Bush’s tax cuts for the rich. Because all the money went to tax cuts and wars, the government didn’t make necessary “investments” in “roads and bridges” and “green energy.” People couldn’t get health care. The oceans were rising.Then we elected Obama, and it started getting better immediately! Okay, not everywhere, and maybe the progress and improvement was really hard to measure, but Obama inherited the worst crises of any president ever. Nobody could have generated better results than he did. The arc of history bent more toward justice, and better days are ahead, just you wait and see…
Now, you can come up with dozens of objections to those few sentences, but for the average Obama voter, thatÂ’s the gist of the state of the country from 2001 to today. ItÂ’s not all that different from your usual religious narrative, you have a fall of paradise (the election of Bush) the Devil (Bush), the messiah figure (Obama), the coming of a new kingdom and ultimate utopia. The purpose of the believer is to continue to believe in the redeeming messiah figure in the face of skepticism and doubt, because belief in him makes you one of the special and enlightened ones, and so on.
The problem for conservatives is the story starts before that. The internecine fighting we see today on the right isn't simply on how we should react to what Jim describes as "swarms of voters who believe that government – the very same government who had disappointed them and failed them time and again – will solve their problems." Our problem is we don't trust each other as conservatives. It's the "grassroots" vs. "establishment" fight were seeing and it predates "fiscal cliffs" and sequestration.
The Gingrich Revolution of 1994 eventually became the Hastert-Bush conservative malaise. Yes, the War on Terror dominated the Bush presidency but from No Child Left Behind to Medicare Part D and across the board spending hikes, many conservative felt betrayed. You can even argue it goes further back than that. The Reagan Revolutionizes saw their hard work to move the GOP to the right rewarded with...George H.W. Bush.
One reason so many on the right are unwilling to allow the governing part of the GOP/conservative coalition any room for strategic retreats is we've simply seen that when you give them an inch, they'll take a mile.
Conservatives hear how the GOP is a wholly owned subsidiary of the far, far right, we look at H.W. Bush, Dole, W. Bush, McCain, Romney (along with Lott, Frist, McConnell, Hastert and Boehner) and say, "if only!".
You can say, well they were elected and nominated by Republicans (including conservatives) and you'd be right. That's the problem. Most conservatives don't trust other conservatives or Republicans let alone moderates or liberals.
Until we find a solution to the fractured nature of the center-right coalition (beyond "we hate Obama"), the Obamabots are a secondary problem.
As for those Obama voters, yeah I trust them. I trust them to mindlessly internalize media propaganda. I trust them to continue to talk a good game ("polls show most Americans want a smaller government!") and then vote like the big government liberals they are.
That's why I think Jim's question misses the mark, it's not whether we trust them to be the people we think they can and should be but why to we continue to disbelieve them when they've been saying for longer than Obama's been around, "no, we're not those kinds of people".
Posted by: DrewM at
05:53 AM
| Comments (420)
Post contains 671 words, total size 4 kb.
Overall, only 26% believe the sequester cut spending too much. Forty-two percent (42%) believe the cuts did not go far enough. Most (54%) recognize that the sequester does not really reduce government spending but merely slows the growth of future spending.
Just 25% of Americans believe the economy will be stronger in a year. That's down 11 points since January and the lowest level of optimism measured since January 2009. Forty-eight percent (48%) expect the economy will be weaker in a year.
Posted by: Rich Bastard at March 06, 2013 05:56 AM (e8kgV)
Posted by: Dan Collins at March 06, 2013 05:57 AM (Rag47)
Posted by: Captain Hate at March 06, 2013 05:59 AM (62UoP)
Posted by: Ace's Anus at March 06, 2013 05:59 AM (IuKAf)
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Wily Wrepublican Wench at March 06, 2013 06:01 AM (kXoT0)
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 09:57 AM (bb5+k)
As much as I agree with that, it wasn't that much of a difference with how a lot of VP choices are made; ie to improve a weak point. What really pisses me off is that it had to be done to keep the country clubbers on board, yet we're always hearing about how keeping conservatives happy is the problem.
Posted by: Captain Hate at March 06, 2013 06:01 AM (62UoP)
Posted by: 98ZJUSMC Waiting for the Sun at March 06, 2013 06:01 AM (hWDNn)
And now, we are not even getting the least of the evils. I am one step away from abandoning the Republican Party.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 06:02 AM (53z96)
Posted by: SH at March 06, 2013 06:03 AM (gmeXX)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 06:03 AM (VtjlW)
Sandie D begs to differ.
Posted by: SH at March 06, 2013 09:59 AM (gmeXX)
You'll have to give me more than that. What are you talking about?
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 06:03 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 06:03 AM (GFM2b)
Here's something to lighten the mood. It's from the Hill, and there are parts with which I disagree, but on the whole, things are better than they might seem.
http://tinyurl.com/b4cpb35
You may now resume your previously scheduled doom.
Posted by: pep at March 06, 2013 06:03 AM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 06, 2013 06:04 AM (Cm7V/)
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 06, 2013 10:04 AM (Cm7V/)
They did not trust the rabble at all. They feared Democracy more than Monarchy.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 06:06 AM (bb5+k)
I live in a state with clean and honest elections and it enrages me to watch the big Dim strongholds strangle state after state with voter fraud. I think the best thing Conservatives can do at this point is run for local elections to get on school boards and election boards. Get the indoctrination out of the schools and true the vote.
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Wily Wrepublican Wench at March 06, 2013 06:06 AM (kXoT0)
You'll have to give me more than that. What are you talking about?
---
Sandra Day O'Connor. And of course to a lesser extent Kennedy.
Posted by: SH at March 06, 2013 06:07 AM (gmeXX)
And almost from the onset beginning with the second President some of them started undoing that.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 06:07 AM (53z96)
Posted by: Berserker at March 06, 2013 06:08 AM (FMbng)
Posted by: esch at March 06, 2013 06:08 AM (7usep)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:09 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: Miss Marple at March 06, 2013 06:10 AM (GoIUi)
Thank you, FDR, for pushing the idea of Free Shit for the masses.
Posted by: MrScribbler at March 06, 2013 06:10 AM (cFhY4)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:10 AM (QupBk)
Well, no snow yet and probably just going to be rain by quitting time. We had a bet going as to who the first employee to whine about getting an early release would be, and I won the bet! Gotta love those gubmint 'workers'. (I of course don't count, hitting F5 at AoSHQ all morning is very hard work)
Posted by: mugiwara at March 06, 2013 06:11 AM (W7ffl)
Agree absolutely. However, we are conservatives, and by nature we don not trust. We assume that humanity is bent and always will be. Therefore, we need systems in place that control our own worst impulses, without becoming dictatorial. That's nothing new, and is why the FFs designed our government as they did. I see nothing new in that.
Posted by: pep at March 06, 2013 06:11 AM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Wily Wrepublican Wench at March 06, 2013 06:12 AM (kXoT0)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 06:12 AM (GFM2b)
Hell no I don't trust anyone. Or, rather I trust people to act in untrustworthy ways once given power.
Thats why we're conservatives in the first place. You know who else didn't trust people? The Founders. Thats why they created a limited government, seperation of powers, Bill of Rights, habeas corpus, etc.
That crap only makes any sense if you just don't trust anyone, and I for one like it that way.
Posted by: Jollyroger at March 06, 2013 06:13 AM (t06LC)
--
What really pisses me off is that it had to be done to keep the country clubbers on board, yet we're always hearing about how keeping conservatives happy is the problem. -March 06, 2013 10:01 AM (62UoP)
----
There was the John Anderson factor. He still got 6.6% of the vote.
Posted by: RioBravo at March 06, 2013 06:13 AM (eEfYn)
Posted by: a mindful webworker at March 06, 2013 06:13 AM (yFFC0)
Posted by: SpongeBob Saget at March 06, 2013 06:14 AM (epxV4)
Posted by: Miss Marple at March 06, 2013 10:10 AM (GoIUi)
I'm just glad we can trust him for that.
Posted by: Jollyroger at March 06, 2013 06:14 AM (t06LC)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 06:15 AM (GFM2b)
Posted by: The Political Hat at March 06, 2013 06:15 AM (Vk2pI)
The scales are off my eyes.
We are a nation of mal-educated citizens with little working knoweldge of civic virtue, economics, capitalism, freedom, liberty, law.
Until we fix that, trusting ourselves is a secondary issue. (Then again, there is a point to saying we have to fix ourselves to be effective at fixing the society at large.)
Posted by: Tonic Dog at March 06, 2013 06:15 AM (X/+QT)
Posted by: J. Locke at March 06, 2013 06:16 AM (9RGT+)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 10:12 AM (GFM2b)
Obama is failing because he is an incompetent, inept, shiftless, lazy, mendacious boob with delusions of grandeur and rampant malignant narcissism. Only our kneepad media could take a guy who wears Mom jeans, rides a girl's bike, throws like a wuss, and sings like a frog into Mr. Cool.
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Wily Wrepublican Wench at March 06, 2013 06:16 AM (kXoT0)
Geraghty asks do we still trust the people. My response is when have we ever trusted the people? This goes back to the founding. The Constitution was set up precisely because humans cannot be trusted, particularly those in power.
Now having said that, I do agree with Winston Churchill, eventually America gets it right. We will never have the perfect conservative utopia I and others dream of. And we are certainly at a point where the pendulum has swung far to the left. I do have faith that things will start swinging back in the other direction. Yes, itt will be a painful process, and no I really don't know how or when it will happen.
I for one would not be surprised to see a third party emerge, which would basically be a break-up of the base into a new party. Nor am I all that fearful of this. Its happened before in America, and I see no reason to assume it can't happen again or assume that if it did it would be catostrophic.
So no I don't trust the people, but I have faith in the Constitution and the republic. Perhaps I am just a fool. But an optimistic one.
Posted by: SH at March 06, 2013 06:17 AM (gmeXX)
Posted by: philhartmonic at March 06, 2013 06:17 AM (u0ZiS)
Posted by: clemenza at March 06, 2013 06:17 AM (m3kwT)
Posted by: Fritz at March 06, 2013 06:18 AM (UzPAd)
Posted by: nip at March 06, 2013 06:18 AM (11Tdq)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:18 AM (QupBk)
Obama is failing because he is designed to fail - and to bring America down with him. He isn't a President, he's a custodian of decline. He is installing like-minded custodians in all areas of our innermost workings. See them for who they are. John Kerry as Sec of State?
A deliberate policy of failure. Never lose sight of that.
Posted by: Tim Conway at March 06, 2013 06:18 AM (AjnrJ)
Posted by: clemenza at March 06, 2013 06:19 AM (m3kwT)
I STILL trust all those people.
Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 06, 2013 06:19 AM (wR+pz)
Posted by: Tsar Nicholas II at March 06, 2013 06:19 AM (r2PLg)
Posted by: annoyed at March 06, 2013 06:19 AM (uEm7J)
That part of the Constitution was completely shredded and no longer exists at all in any form. Indeed, Roberts says they can force you to buy medical insurance of what ever nature they think is good for you in DC.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 06:20 AM (53z96)
Obama is failing because he won't listen and doesn't care about us.
Obama is failing because he is incompetent.
----
No, one arguably Obama isn't failing, he is advancing his ideology in ways that haven't been seen since LBJ. So I'm not sure Obama is failing.
The country is failing because it is using a bad and flawed ideology designed to fail and proven to fail.
----------
Founding Fathers to Funding Fathers
----------
Agree, this is a great line.
Posted by: SH at March 06, 2013 06:20 AM (gmeXX)
WSJ had a buzz kill on that yesterday.
Inflation adjusted, the current Dow is less than it was in 2000.
Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 06, 2013 06:20 AM (wR+pz)
Posted by: The Political Hat at March 06, 2013 06:21 AM (Vk2pI)
Posted by: clemenza at March 06, 2013 06:21 AM (m3kwT)
The Office of Management and Budget issued a memo Wednesday broadly outlining how agencies should prepare for the $85 billion in budget cuts that will begin March 1 unless Congress and the White House come to a last-minute agreement averting or delaying sequestration. Until further notice, that memo said, agencies should hand out discretionary cash awards to employees only if they are legally required to.
Agencies should also make sure when they hire new employees or approve spending on training, conferences and travel that those new costs are absolutely necessary.
Posted by: Danny Werfel at March 06, 2013 06:22 AM (e8kgV)
Well, I am going to go do something productive. I will check in on a thread later this afternoon.
Posted by: Miss Marple at March 06, 2013 06:22 AM (GoIUi)
Posted by: @PurpAv at March 06, 2013 06:22 AM (/gHaE)
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Wily Wrepublican Wench at March 06, 2013 10:06 AM (kXoT0)
A point I always make. *WE* have to pay money to get ads onto Television. The media GIVES Democrats the equivalent or better advertising for free.
Today on ABC News I saw Brian Ross trying to debunk the Dominican Prostitute Scandal. He alleges the whole thing is made up by "GOP Operatives."
When is the last time you heard any media folk alluding to "Democrat Operatives"?
Liberal Media Delenda est!
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 06:22 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 06:22 AM (GFM2b)
Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 06, 2013 10:19 AM (wR+pz)
Don't get me started on how only property owners should vote on issues having to do with the funding of public schools. Or the topic of how public schools are funded. Or why there are public schools.
Posted by: Captain Hate at March 06, 2013 06:23 AM (62UoP)
I would love to have someone explain HOW Choom Boy is "failing," because I wanna believe it.
Did he not get re-elected? Have his nominees for various posts gone down in flames? Did Congress say "fuck you and your little healthcare scam, too?" Has he been restrained from jetting off (in OUR airplane) for a jazzy weekend fartin' around on the links? Has Moo-Chelle been forced to stay how and do the laundry?
Sadly, WE are the ones "failing" right now. As far as I can see, President Historic First© is stylin' and profilin', without a care in the world.
Posted by: MrScribbler at March 06, 2013 06:23 AM (cFhY4)
Posted by: Tip O'Neill at March 06, 2013 06:23 AM (Vk2pI)
Voters: If you let us eat our dessert first, we PROMISE we'll eat our vegetables!
(later)
Voters: Ooo, we're too FULL to eat any vegetables!
Posted by: BeckoningChasm at March 06, 2013 06:23 AM (xjpRj)
Get back to the day when duty, honor, and character mean something, not just for the rich, and the powerful, but for everyone, and we'll get our country back.
Posted by: Skandia Recluse at March 06, 2013 06:23 AM (vntm6)
Unnecessary training and conferences used to be the norm?
Huston, I think we've got a problem...
Posted by: @PurpAv at March 06, 2013 06:23 AM (/gHaE)
No, it wasn't. Yes, they blew it, but nothing is forever in politics. The same people we don't trust also have minuscule attention spans, and are easily diverted. There are neoNazis in Germany and Stalinists in Russia because many, if not most, people can't think beyond their immediate experience. A people's collective memory is erased within 30-40 years, thus explaining the FDR-Carter-Obama cycle. The pendulum will return, or civilization will collapse. I'm hoping it's the pendulum.
Posted by: pep at March 06, 2013 06:24 AM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: rickl at March 06, 2013 06:24 AM (zoehZ)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 06:24 AM (VtjlW)
Posted by: The Political Hat at March 06, 2013 06:24 AM (Vk2pI)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:24 AM (QupBk)
Sandra Day O'Connor. And of course to a lesser extent Kennedy.
Posted by: SH at March 06, 2013 10:07 AM (gmeXX)
I thought you were referring to Sandy Duncan. 
Yeah, I don't think much of these two Reagan Choices, but these mistakes are nothing compared to backing George Bush. That "Kinder, Gentler" crap just grew the government more. Breaking his tax pledge gave us Bill Clinton. Much disaster was the result of the Clinton Presidency.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 06:26 AM (bb5+k)
We're in a pit, that pendulum ain't innocuous dood.
Posted by: @PurpAv at March 06, 2013 06:26 AM (/gHaE)
Posted by: HoboJerky, profit of DOOM! at March 06, 2013 06:27 AM (FsUAO)
Yeah man, look at it come down.
http://www.trafficland.com/city/WAS/index.html
Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 06, 2013 06:28 AM (wR+pz)
Posted by: MrScribbler at March 06, 2013 10:23 AM (cFhY4)
Technically, Obama is a failure, not that the nightly news will ever give anyone a clue. He has presided over a depression with record unemployment accompanied by unreported and ignored scandal after scandal all the while committing one tasteless excess after another using public money. His administration let an Ambassador be murdered and his body used for sport. But, thanks to the bigotry of racial upscoring, he and Mooch will be treated like mythic figures in the history books.
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Wily Wrepublican Wench at March 06, 2013 06:28 AM (kXoT0)
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 06:28 AM (53z96)
Posted by: SH at March 06, 2013 06:29 AM (gmeXX)
Democrat ads will feature Boner's support of everything Choom Boy wants to do.
Posted by: MrScribbler at March 06, 2013 06:29 AM (cFhY4)
Posted by: TT at March 06, 2013 10:11 AM (uWzcG)
Here is this old saw again. We GOT something for Reagan's expenses. We Got the collapse of the Soviet Union and the avoidance of massive destruction. Do you know what we got for all those Democrat Expenditures?
Massive debt and corruption. It is the Job of the Federal government to Defend the nation. It is NOT the Job of the Federal government to provide jobs or welfare for citizens.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 06:29 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:29 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: ExSnipe at March 06, 2013 06:31 AM (PBm/l)
The O'Conner nomination was AA writ large in a campaign promise. The Kennedy nomination was a direct result of the communists crucifying Bork with the aid of 6 flaming RINOs who are well representative of today's Republican leadership.
----
Doesn't mean they weren't mistakes.
Posted by: SH at March 06, 2013 06:31 AM (gmeXX)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 10:24 AM (VtjlW)
Deep breaths, in and out.
Here, do what I do. Peruse imdb.com for trailers of new movies.
After Earth 2 http://www.imdb.com/video/imdb/vi3750536985
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 06:31 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: Jones in CO at March 06, 2013 06:32 AM (8sCoq)
“The Solar Cycle 24 Prediction Panel has reached a consensus. The panel has decided that the next solar cycle (Cycle 24) will be below average in intensity, with a maximum sunspot number of 90. Given the date of solar minimum and the predicted maximum intensity, solar maximum is now expected to occur in May 2013. Note, this is not a unanimous decision, but a supermajority of the panel did agree.”
Aztecs suggest that we sacrifice virgin Democrats, but there aren't any (according to Sandra Fluke).
Posted by: Danny Werfel at March 06, 2013 06:32 AM (e8kgV)
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 10:26 AM (bb5+k)
Plus Poppy Bush, when he wasn't barfing in the lap of the Japanese prime minister, gave us that shithead Souter who, after Kelo, should be trapped in that shanty eyesore he inhabits while it burns down around him.
Posted by: Captain Hate at March 06, 2013 06:32 AM (62UoP)
Reagan/debt argument, and what we 'got' in return.
Exactly - that debt list needs to be listed next to other indices as well: unemployment, GNP, Soviet containment, etc.
Posted by: annoyed at March 06, 2013 06:32 AM (uEm7J)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 06:33 AM (VtjlW)
Posted by: The Political Hat at March 06, 2013 06:33 AM (Vk2pI)
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Wily Wrepublican Wench at March 06, 2013 10:16 AM (kXoT0)
The Media is the key to power in this nation. They set the agenda, and they lead the foolish to think the way they do.
Elections are always decided by the middle percentage of fools. The Media steers this group.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 06:33 AM (bb5+k)
Both parties have their share of problem children and disparate cats that are hard to herd at times. If Romney had won in 2012, the Democrats would have had the same sort of massive navel-gazing going on, calls to push out the old liberal lions like Pelosi and Biden, and some progressives yelling that Obama blew it because he wasn't progressive enough. (In fact, they did have just this sort of brawl after the 2004 election which they all thought they were going to win.) They would have been castigating Axelrod and Plouffe for the lightweight issue-free bullshit campaign Obama ran, for his horrible debate performances, etc. etc.
Winning always papers over a lot of fissures.
Posted by: rockmom at March 06, 2013 06:33 AM (aBlZ1)
Posted by: Truman North, last of the famous international playboys at March 06, 2013 06:34 AM (cQBh3)
I think the question Drew (and by extension Geraghty) should be asking is if we on the right ever trusted people.
Nope. Never did.
Posted by: Jollyroger at March 06, 2013 06:34 AM (t06LC)
Posted by: Buzzsaw at March 06, 2013 06:34 AM (81UWZ)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 06:34 AM (GFM2b)
Posted by: annoyed at March 06, 2013 06:35 AM (uEm7J)
Posted by: Truman North, last of the famous international playboys at March 06, 2013 06:35 AM (cQBh3)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 10:18 AM (QupBk)
---
That seemed so BIG in 1990. What a difference a generation makes.
Posted by: RioBravo at March 06, 2013 06:35 AM (eEfYn)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:35 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: BurtTC at March 06, 2013 06:36 AM (TOk1P)
Posted by: Whatev at March 06, 2013 06:36 AM (A7Wh1)
Posted by: Jenny tries too hard and also hates her phone at March 06, 2013 06:37 AM (dkh08)
Posted by: Fritz at March 06, 2013 06:37 AM (UzPAd)
You forget, most of that was to rearm after Carter had disarmed us, not for entitlements.
How did that work out? The USSR collapsed.
I'd say that was a good investment.
Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 06, 2013 06:38 AM (wR+pz)
Winning always papers over a lot of fissures.
Posted by: rockmom at March 06, 2013 10:33 AM (aBlZ1)
The donks never fucking change, though; they just look for a new way of packaging their commie garbage. They found what they were looking for in the JEF after that 2004 speech at the convention; imo that's been the whole basis of his ascent and it has been revealed, for people that are paying attention, as a big fucking lie.
Posted by: Captain Hate at March 06, 2013 06:38 AM (62UoP)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:38 AM (QupBk)
Two things.
Thing 1 - I can't trust the left because they don't even think I am human.
Thing 2 - the main goal of the establishment is to maintain the status quo.
In other words, no hope and no change.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at March 06, 2013 06:38 AM (p/cQy)
An Obama-loving friend of hers burst into tears, yelled, "It's not his fault!" and fled the room.
Apropos of nothing, I guess, except Obama supporters truly do have a major emotional investment in him. I think with the secularization of society, the basic human desire to worship a God has been transferred to him.
I have never seen this kind of thing before, and it worries me.
Posted by: Ferb Fletcher at March 06, 2013 06:39 AM (Q8Wa9)
comingsoon.net also provides high level trailer crack
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 10:33 AM (VtjlW)
Something mindless and fun. Cause the good Lord knows we need something mindless and fun on occasion.
http://www.imdb.com/video/imdb/vi2857346841
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 06:39 AM (da5Wo)
Especially the fat fuck from NJ?
Or the pudgy fuck from FL?
Posted by: RoyalOil at March 06, 2013 06:40 AM (VjL9S)
On a more pessimistic note, right after the election I did have the thought that the Reagan years were just a brief hiccup in America's long slide toward dependency and ruin that began a century ago with Roosevelt and Wilson. There are fewer and fewer of us fighting the slide, and to the rest who have become resigned to it we sound crazier and crazier. No amount of better candidates, better technology, better messaging, etc. will change that. The only thing that will is an economy that gets so horrible by the end of Obama's term that the people do blame him and his progressive policies, and another Reagan emerges to yank us back from the brink. But as has been said, it's not clear that Reagan would have been elected by an electorate that looked like the 2012 electorate.
We have bred, miseducated, and admitted too many people who think lots of government is just fine and dandy. They do not and never will understand the principle of killing the goose that laid the golden eggs, until the goose is good and dead and we're all out of eggs.
Posted by: rockmom at March 06, 2013 06:40 AM (aBlZ1)
Vice President of the United States
Joe Biden
Department of State
John Kerry
Department of the Treasury
Jack Lew
Department of Defense
Chuck Hagel
Department of Justice
Eric Holder
Department of the Interior
Kenneth L. Salazar
Department of Agriculture
Thomas Vilsack
Department of Commerce
Acting Secretary Rebecca Blank
Department of Labor
Acting Secretary Seth Harris
Department of Health and Human Services
Kathleen Sebelius
Department of Housing and Urban Development
Shaun L.S. Donovan
Department of Transportation
Ray LaHood
Department of Energy
Steven Chu
Department of Education
Arne Duncan
Department of Veterans Affairs
Eric "Black Beret" Shinseki
Department of Homeland Security
Janet A. Napolitano
...and that's just the crockery in the Cabinet. In a sane America, are these the people you want to "have your back"? "In your foxhole"?
I'll say it again - they are custodians of decline, and they mean to reforge America into... something else.
Posted by: The Larch at March 06, 2013 06:40 AM (AjnrJ)
Posted by: Opus An Arcus at March 06, 2013 06:40 AM (cfNCa)
122 -
There was a tipping point somewhere in there. I remember thinking when Gore was nominated "is this idiot really going to run on government giveaways being the answer for everything?" And truth be told, I was afraid it was going to work. Well, here we are.....
Posted by: BurtTC at March 06, 2013 06:41 AM (TOk1P)
They did not trust the rabble at all. They feared Democracy more than Monarchy.
----
I confirm their judgement
Posted by: HISTORY at March 06, 2013 06:41 AM (SO2Q8)
Posted by: Captain Hate at March 06, 2013 10:32 AM
Look, name ONE president in the entire history of the country who didn't screw the pooch in some major way during his term. Ya can't. Not Washington, certainly not Reagan.
Doesn't mean they were all bad; it's human nature.
But we have a right to expect anyone elected to lead the country to do better than batting 0.000, which is Choom Boy's percentage.
By comparison, ever other president -- including several loathsome turds who, IMO, should have their names excised from the history books -- was a friggin' saint.
Posted by: MrScribbler at March 06, 2013 06:42 AM (cFhY4)
Posted by: Captain Hate at March 06, 2013 10:32 AM (62UoP)
HW was a horrible President, and the biggest problem with him is how badly he damaged the Republican Brand. Yeah, Souter sucks. I wish they had been successful at taking his house away from him.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 06:43 AM (bb5+k)
What we can do about this, aside from cloning Reagan, I don't know. But it's something that's always bugged me about this trust thing---of course we don't trust either "the people" or the establishment. That's kind of why we're conservatives
----
Exactly. Those on the left and right experience the same things - longiness, feelings of guilt/sin and a cause, need for redemption. In general, the right finds its answers through Judea-Christian teachings, the left finds those answers in liberalism with Western Civilization playing the role of the Devil. The reason why they are so tireless is because they never find the answer to their longiness because the only answer is God.
Anyway, that is a gross generalization and simplification of things, but it makes sense to me.
Posted by: SH at March 06, 2013 06:43 AM (gmeXX)
Conservatives trust the people as individuals to govern their individual lives.
We have never trusted the mob as a governing force for all.
Posted by: Nicholas Kronos at March 06, 2013 06:44 AM (m2IdD)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 06:44 AM (VtjlW)
I trust a lot of people. People do what they decide is in their best interest. You can trust them on that.
If you give them shit and they don't have to work, for some that is in their best interest.
We can not confuse the issues.
Do I trust a democrat to be honest? Not often, it is not in his best interest to explain how his programs will work, even if he understands how they work.
Do I trust a Republican to be honest? More often than a Democrat, but that is a mighty low bar.
Low intellect voters have a lot in common, mostly that they can not envision the long term. It's only today they see.
Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 06, 2013 06:44 AM (wR+pz)
Posted by: William Henry Harrison at March 06, 2013 06:45 AM (Vk2pI)
Along that line, we need to encourage long term thinking among the low intellect voters.
How is the question.
Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 06, 2013 06:45 AM (wR+pz)
I had a hard time laughing at any of it after the last 5 years . . . .
Do I trust the people?
Posted by: RoyalOil at March 06, 2013 06:46 AM (VjL9S)
Posted by: Opus An Arcus at March 06, 2013 10:40 AM (cfNCa)
You're forgetting something. These people are cowards. It took a fucking fossil like Bernstein to show them the way, and now they're trying to sodomize the man for his transgression.
Posted by: Fritz at March 06, 2013 06:46 AM (UzPAd)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:46 AM (QupBk)
136 -
Exactly. As Agent K said (I'm paraphrasing, I think) "a person is smart, but people are stupid."
Posted by: BurtTC at March 06, 2013 06:46 AM (TOk1P)
Posted by: HoboJerky, profit of DOOM! at March 06, 2013 06:47 AM (FsUAO)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:47 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 10:35 AM (QupBk)
I do not even accept THAT premise. Reagan's expenditures were reasonable and necessary for the time. The Tip O'Neal expenditures were not. The excessive and unreasonable portion of those deficits rests on the heads of the Democrats, not Reagan.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 06:47 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 06:48 AM (GFM2b)
Posted by: Whatev at March 06, 2013 06:48 AM (A7Wh1)
Posted by: HoboJerky, profit of DOOM! at March 06, 2013 06:48 AM (FsUAO)
Posted by: jeannebodine at March 06, 2013 06:48 AM (x0dlI)
Posted by: MTF at March 06, 2013 06:49 AM (B5y+v)
Anyone who feels betrayed by such an electorate is an idiot and, most likely, still sends their kids to public school.
Posted by: goy at March 06, 2013 06:49 AM (QsFws)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:49 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 10:44 AM (VtjlW)
Better than avg chance of some super spiffy hats too.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 06:49 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: SH at March 06, 2013 06:49 AM (gmeXX)
George Washington
Posted by: Jones in CO at March 06, 2013 06:50 AM (8sCoq)
>>>I do not trust the majority of American voters to put the best interests of the United States uppermost in their minds when they enter the voting booth.
Nominate leaders who will represent those interests then.
Posted by: Bigby's Chinese Finger Traps at March 06, 2013 06:50 AM (3ZtZW)
Do I trust the people?
Q: Why do we have so many dumb-ass politicians ?
A: Because we have so many dumb-ass VOTERS!
Posted by: I'm the honey Badger, BITCH! at March 06, 2013 06:51 AM (U3CzV)
The biggest tactical mistake Bush made was to ignore his chance to put a GOP'er into the Veep slot in the second term whohad a shot towin the presidency. Running with incumbancy on his side would have done wonders even for someone as lame as Senator Gang-of-Sixteen. Dumb, dumb, dumb not to do it.
--
I don't know if I agree with this or not, but it is a good question and one I suspect future presidential candidates and candidates will think long over. I would love to hear someone expound on it.
Posted by: SH at March 06, 2013 06:51 AM (gmeXX)
Coolidge?
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 10:47 AM (QupBk)
I'm saying William Henry Harrison.
Posted by: Jollyroger at March 06, 2013 06:52 AM (t06LC)
You forget, most of that was to rearm after Carter had disarmed us, not for entitlements.
How did that work out? The USSR collapsed.
I'd say that was a good investment.
Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at March 06, 2013 10:38 AM (wR+pz)
In an episode in one of PJ O'Rourke's books he's on a US Navy ship watching the squiddies launch a bunch of Tomahawk missiles, and he admiringly quips "THIS is how you waste government money!"
The ONE thing that gov't does fairly well is to destroy things and kill assholes. Unfortunately, the SCOAMF and his minions consider conservatives and American culture to be the assholes worthy of destruction.
Posted by: IllTemperedCur at March 06, 2013 06:52 AM (TIIx5)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:52 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: Al at March 06, 2013 06:52 AM (V70Uh)
Hanson I go to for clear vision and commentary. I come here for whatever reason, I don't know.
"People", generally, are despicable swine. Everyone wants to get fed. The only people that can be trusted, and only provisionally, are the ones that answer to a higher moral authority than their appetites.
These people are in short supply these days.
I don't know why I bothered posting this, it's not reassuring or optimistic. The basest people are running the country, by the consent of the governed. God help us.
Posted by: tubal at March 06, 2013 06:53 AM (BoE3Z)
Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 06, 2013 06:53 AM (+q0tv)
Obama is failing because he is incompetent.
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 10:12 AM (GFM2b)
Obama isn't failing. He's succeeding at destroying the country
Posted by: TheQuietMan at March 06, 2013 06:54 AM (1Jaio)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 06:55 AM (QupBk)
Can you imagine what our Congress would look like if we'd have kept that same ratio of representatives to population?
Can you imagine if Chicago had 26 Senators?
Two thoughts if that was the case today:
1) There's no way any law would get passed as there'd be way too many votes needed.
2) There's no way there'd be just two political parties; we'd have a dozen or so regional parties and 4 or 5 super-regional parties.
Posted by: RoyalOil at March 06, 2013 06:56 AM (VjL9S)
Look, name ONE president in the entire history of the country who didn't screw the pooch in some major way during his term. Ya can't. Not Washington, certainly not Reagan.
---
William Henry Harrison
Posted by: HISTORY at March 06, 2013 06:56 AM (SO2Q8)
Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 06, 2013 06:56 AM (+q0tv)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 06:57 AM (VtjlW)
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Posted by: Max HeadRoom at March 06, 2013 06:58 AM (e8kgV)
Example: "Why do you oppose affirmative action?"
Answer "I oppose affirmative action because I'm not a racist. I find the implication that Black Americans are somehow less capable than other Americans to be repugnant."..and then go from there.
Guess what? That's what I believe. The key is not to be afraid of saying it. "OH MY GOD YOU'LL OFFEND PEOPLE!!" wail the "experts". Fuck 'em. There's nothing offensive in what I said there, and I refuse to cede that high ground to the enemy. THIS is what I believe, THIS is why, and HERE is where we can go if we work together is how you win elections. Look at TFG, it's all bullshit, but that's what he does. It can be done in reverse, and more powerfully because we win on facts. Just think about the last time someone pandered to you. Did that inspire you? Make you want more of that person? Of course not. It never does.
Posted by: Weirddave at March 06, 2013 06:58 AM (aH+zP)
Nominate leaders who will represent those interests then.
Every election for President represents a choice. At the very least, one of those candidates will be the lesser of two evils, if they are dispassionately examined by an informed and thinking voter. Last November, it should have been clear that Romney was a better choice than Obama. It should have been clear, if voters made their decision based on which candidate was better suited to be President... which man was 'better' for America.
But this did not happen.
Posted by: Jones in CO at March 06, 2013 06:58 AM (8sCoq)
166 -
It's hard to blame schools when the vast majority of the people who willfully remain ignorant are long past their school years.
I honestly believe there has been a change. 20 years ago Dems were saying "Republicans are evil for wanting to starve kids and kill black people," but nobody really believed that. Today they do. Long into their adulthoods, you have people on the left who believe they are saving the country from YOU and your cunning plan to..... whatever it is they think you want to do. That's not terribly clear. But whatever it is, they're against it. Because they're good. And you are not.
Posted by: BurtTC at March 06, 2013 06:58 AM (TOk1P)
Posted by: akula51 at March 06, 2013 06:58 AM (hNXHo)
We are a nation of mal-educated citizens with little working knoweldge of civic virtue, economics, capitalism, freedom, liberty, law.
We are a Hardcore Pawn nation. Those people are our "fellow citizens." And there is absolutely nothing the GOP can do - even if they had the energy - to reach them. That is the poisoned fruit of the universal franchise.
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 06, 2013 06:58 AM (zF6Iw)
Posted by: Opus An Arcus at March 06, 2013 06:59 AM (cfNCa)
I certainly don't trust people.
For the most part, the vast majority of people are too fucking stupid to make decisions on the most basic items, let alone complex policy. It's a tribute to my unwavering optimism that I still believe the U.S. can remain a republic, considering how many idiots are allowed a vote.
As to the rest of the world, I'm convinced that it would be far better if most countries reverted to monachies. The wealthiest people in the world should take on the responsiblity of taking over countries and running them in competition with other billionaire kings and queens in an ego fueled search for perfection.
Posted by: jwest at March 06, 2013 06:59 AM (u2a4R)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 10:57 AM (VtjlW)
Well I'm sold.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 06:59 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 06, 2013 07:00 AM (+q0tv)
They would be a LOT closer to the people that elect them with a damn good chance that the people in their district know them personally. AND....
It would be damn near impossible for the special interest groups to buy their votes and lobby them for crony corruption. AND
When they screwed up and did something their voters did not like it would be one hell of a lot easier to get them out of office.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 07:01 AM (53z96)
Not to mention personal protection squads made up of ninja babes.
Are these a gift for the 'Pleasure Guard'?
Posted by: garrett at March 06, 2013 07:01 AM (KCoLk)
Posted by: Closing time at March 06, 2013 07:01 AM (/0DF2)
Posted by: akula51 at March 06, 2013 07:02 AM (hNXHo)
Shay's Rebellion
The Whiskey Rebellion
The Alien and Sedition Acts
The Election of 1800
Afterwards: The Know Nothing Party, the Civil War, Jim Crow, Woodrow Wilson, Japanese internment camps, yada yada yada.
We're Americans - we thrive in chaos and distrust because we are still a free people.
Posted by: mrp at March 06, 2013 07:02 AM (HjPtV)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 07:02 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 07:03 AM (GFM2b)
Posted by: Ed Anger at March 06, 2013 07:03 AM (tOkJB)
Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at March 06, 2013 07:04 AM (Tgggp)
Posted by: akula51 at March 06, 2013 10:58 AM (hNXHo)
I'll grant you the growing part, if you mean "hemp." As for the smoking part? Link please.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 07:04 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 11:02 AM (QupBk)
The Whiskey Rebellion was the first instance of crony corruption after the Constitution was ratified. The people on the "rebelling" side had a very legitimate beef.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 07:05 AM (53z96)
Posted by: The Larch at March 06, 2013 07:05 AM (AjnrJ)
Posted by: vote Lord Humungus 2016 at March 06, 2013 07:06 AM (HEa5q)
Yeah, I guess so. Heck, he may actually have been doing us a favor when he didn't take his NyQuil....
You'd think by now I would know the Horde has people who can and always will come up with a smart-ass response for any occasion.
It's one of the reasons I come here, in fact.
Posted by: MrScribbler at March 06, 2013 07:06 AM (cFhY4)
Posted by: Closing time at March 06, 2013 07:06 AM (/0DF2)
192 -
Washington was painfully naive, and unaware of the snakes operating in his own government (including Jefferson). In some ways Washington was what they accused Reagan of being... an aging figurehead, with little understanding of the complexity of the events of the day.
Posted by: BurtTC at March 06, 2013 07:07 AM (TOk1P)
Have you any idea what the term "Naval Stores" means when applied to the 1700s and 1800s?
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 07:07 AM (53z96)
Posted by: joncelli, dodging the Zombies of Sequester at March 06, 2013 07:07 AM (RD7QR)
>>>Last November, it should have been clear that Romney was a better choice than Obama. It should have been clear, if voters made their decision based on which candidate was better suited to be President... which man was 'better' for America.
I'll agree with you and add that I voted for Romney but.... its all just theory at this point. Theory that it should have been obvious, and theory that he'd have been better. Hell, it was theoretical that he was electable during the Primaries and reality stubbed that out, too.
Against that I think we can put the fact of GOP malfeasance and misgovernment. Look, I'm from the NE and left the Dems when they left me - now its the GOP doing the same. I've been through it before, took the leap of faith and held on for dear life. Its been a good ride and I'm for it if they're for me - but they aren't. Dems said the same shit about "where else you gonna go?" and so what. I'm looking to be represented, as is my right as an American. I will not reward this shit and do not care if its 'throwing away my vote' since the GOP looked like that for a number of years too.
Posted by: Bigby's Chinese Finger Traps at March 06, 2013 07:08 AM (3ZtZW)
I trust the people to manage their own affairs
---
We don't even need to do that. People fuck up their affairs with alarming regularity. Back in the day it took so much effort to not fuck up your own affairs that you had little time to busybody everyone else.
We've become victims of success.
Posted by: Buzzsaw90 at March 06, 2013 07:08 AM (SO2Q8)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 07:09 AM (VtjlW)
Posted by: Closing time at March 06, 2013 11:06 AM (/0DF2)
And this is why we ought to help the system collapse. We aren't going to be able to repair it from within the existing framework. There is just too much damage already done.
We have become Idiocracy.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 07:09 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 11:05 AM (53z96)
Do you see this as an antecedent of the War of Southern Rebellion?
They may have had a legitimate beef, but they resorted to violence to express that belief. And was crony corruption? The country owed money that had been used to finance the war. How else was it to be paid back, if not through taxes?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 06, 2013 07:11 AM (GsoHv)
Posted by: fastfreefall at March 06, 2013 07:11 AM (zUvAE)
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Wily Wrepublican Wench at March 06, 2013 10:06 AM (kXoT0)
The cheating in 2012 was real, widespread, and largely unreported. In some instances the Democrats were brazen about it, barely bothering to conceal it and--in some instances--boasting about it. What they don't seem to realize is that delegitimizing the voting process and stifling redress forces their opposition to seek political solutions by means other than the ballot. For some reason, I don't think that occurs to them.
President Obama is reportedly desperate to flip the House in 2014. If that's the case, we'll see the Chicago Way played out on a grand scale. The thing to look for, I think, is the reaction of various GOP leaders such as Rubio, Jindal, Paul, et al to widespread cheating, voter intimidation and suppression. View it as a litmus test for suitability in 2016.
Posted by: troyriser at March 06, 2013 07:12 AM (vtiE6)
I'll start with several of the most prominent;
1- We've traded a principled approach for an issues oriented approach.
Not only have party members pushed their favorite issues and made them a sine qua non of their support, but they've flamed others who don't agree with them. Broad, intellectually developed principles gather wide support when explained appropriately. But their interpretation can not be too narrow or too broad. Yes there is a happy meaningful medium.
2- (really part of 1) We've traded demographics for principled approach. The "we need to appeal to Hispanics therefore we need to trade principle" conflation. No we don't. With the right principles we bring all demographics to the table. This is a favorite of people in power and inflexible party stalwarts who no longer lead courageously because they are too concerned with their personal longevity.
3- We've forgotten how to meaningfully compromise. Parties and governments are not built on a singular set of ideals installed overnight. Look at the Democrat Party since FDR on the successful gradualism approach. IF you want "your guy" or nothing or want "your issue to win uncompromisingly" ever time- get familiar with the outside view. In every negotiation you get what is achievable, not what is desired.
Posted by: Marcus at March 06, 2013 07:12 AM (GGCsk)
Whaaaaa? George Washington was the least naive president in our country's history.
Posted by: mrp at March 06, 2013 07:12 AM (HjPtV)
We've become victims of success.
Posted by: Buzzsaw90 at March 06, 2013 11:08 AM (SO2Q
Prosperity has made us foolish. Some of that prosperity is the result of money borrowed from the future to splurge in the present. Also foolish.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 07:12 AM (bb5+k)
The leaders we have in Congress, believe it or not, think they're doing pretty well. Here's a Boehner partisan explaining that they are "cleaning the floor with Obama".
Those dimwits really do think they are doing well, mostly because they win little victories every now and then that limit in some very minor way the damage the President and Democrats are doing. Truly unbelievable,
Posted by: MTF at March 06, 2013 07:13 AM (B5y+v)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 11:09 AM (VtjlW)
Racist.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 07:13 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 07:14 AM (GFM2b)
Voters do not care about what is better for America, voters care about what it is better for themselves. (Obviously, I'm talking broad sweeps here)
---
Which is actually quite rational. Which is a reason for having a government of limited powers. Fewer oportunities for beter-for-me worse-for-you.
Posted by: Buzzsaw90 at March 06, 2013 07:14 AM (SO2Q8)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 07:14 AM (VtjlW)
I firmly believe that Math is going to win this race. I also firmly believe that the majority of people care most about what is in their best interest right now now now now. The conflict between those two is not going to end well.
Now, if you'll excuse me, I have some popcorn futures to buy.
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 11:09 AM (VtjlW)
I concur. I see the math as predicting an economic collapse followed by a social collapse. We are not the America of 1930. If given austerity, These people will throw a hissy fit before dying.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at March 06, 2013 07:15 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 07:15 AM (QupBk)
Obama - The greatest story NEVER told
Posted by: The Jackhole at March 06, 2013 07:15 AM (nTgAI)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 11:14 AM (GFM2b)
You found some ?
Posted by: The Jackhole at March 06, 2013 07:16 AM (nTgAI)
Now, if you'll excuse me, I have some popcorn futures to buy.
Agreed. Now, if you'll excuse me, I have some ammo to buy.
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 11:14 AM (GFM2b)
Yes, but what comes after math? Reform or people clamoring for somebody to take care of them? If the latter, the tyrants win.
Posted by: joncelli, dodging the Zombies of Sequester at March 06, 2013 07:16 AM (RD7QR)
Look, name ONE president in the entire history of the country who didn't screw the pooch in some major way during his term.
Chester Alan Arthur.
Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at March 06, 2013 07:16 AM (zF6Iw)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 11:14 AM (VtjlW)
Oooohhhhhh. Thank you.
Now the only question is do I eat it in front of him or do I put it on display and taunt him with it?
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 07:16 AM (da5Wo)
Yup.
We have fat poor people who own automobiles and flat-screen TVs and cell phones.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 06, 2013 07:16 AM (GsoHv)
Obama, I'm not saying that you lie because you're black. All black people don't lie. You do. Black people should be ashamed of you because you lie, then when called on it, you say "you're calling me a liar because I'm black."
This is the kind of logic we need out of those who call themselves "conservative" in the media haze...
Posted by: Tony253 at March 06, 2013 07:16 AM (PryWG)
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 11:16 AM (da5Wo)
This is AOSHQ.
What the fuck else would you do?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 06, 2013 07:17 AM (GsoHv)
That people have demurred to the likes of Obama and gratuitous, overreaching government is our fault. For too long we've taken government and parties for granted and let those in power run away from principle because they belonged to our party. Only with GW Bush did we really start to deride a departure from principle. Meanwhile for years, we all kept electing the same people to office in spite of the fact many were slowly destroying the party.
Now everybody wants to deride Boehner and Co. as the cause of our ills.
Sure. Right. Look in the mirror and start to change things. Don't be a carnival barker- be a builder of things.
Posted by: Marcus at March 06, 2013 07:18 AM (GGCsk)
Posted by: PeeWee Herman at March 06, 2013 07:19 AM (e8kgV)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 07:20 AM (VtjlW)
Man Faces 30 Days In Jail For Laughing
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/it_laughable_sEXykGNgabFDCNlGvdXuBK
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 07:21 AM (da5Wo)
race. I also firmly believe that the majority of people care most about
what is in their best interest right now now now now. The conflict
between those two is not going to end well. <
Unless you lead people with your heart and wisdom, you are doomed to the status quo.
This can't go on forever and the game in Washington is one where rivals play us off against each other until one of them is left holding the bag.
It's an existential game of musical chairs and either way all of us lose.
Posted by: Marcus at March 06, 2013 07:21 AM (GGCsk)
What the fuck else would you do?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 06, 2013 11:17 AM (GsoHv)
It's a cupcake. From the Queen. Who you know doesn't skimp on the pastries.
I'd eat the fuck out of it and then beg for more.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 07:22 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: akula51 at March 06, 2013 07:22 AM (hNXHo)
Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 06, 2013 07:22 AM (+q0tv)
Posted by: Trimegistus at March 06, 2013 07:22 AM (OLgc9)
Sooo, now there's supposed to be a reason why we're screwed?
I thought it was just the natural order of things.
SNAFU. G'mornin', all you short-bus people.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at March 06, 2013 07:22 AM (+z4pE)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 07:22 AM (GFM2b)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 07:23 AM (VtjlW)
The fact of the matter is that most people want to be told what to do. They want a higher authority to watch out for them, to see that no one gets more than they do, some entity that they can appeal to when shit doesn't go their way.
In the U.S., there are a large number of people who are happy relying on themselves and their ability to think and make decisions. However, we're still not a majority. We can weaken and slow the movement to become a nanny state, but we can't stop it.
Personally, I like the idea of encouraging monarchies in lesser developed countries. The aura of nobility would be impossible for the world's billionaires to pass up and their egos would insure that things would improve in the hell holes they would take over. On top of that, the most motivated U.S. citizens who despirately want a king to bow down to would have a place to immigrate to.
Let's quit trying to defy gravity and give the people what they want. Just not here.
Posted by: jwest at March 06, 2013 07:23 AM (u2a4R)
Biden and an ashtray? They're both butt receptacles.
Posted by: Clutch Cargo at March 06, 2013 07:23 AM (Qxdfp)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 07:24 AM (GFM2b)
My advice to my young adult kids:
1. Trust no one in politics. No one. Never. Ever.
2. Trust no media. Anywhere. Ever.
3. Verify everything with facts. Use. Your. Brain
4. Trust your instincts.
5. Live within your means. Save your money. And move it to safe tax havens.
6. Work your a$$ off in whatever field you pursue.
7. Never take the government handout. Ever. For any reason.
8. Never fill out government surveys / info requests / census info. Never. Ever.
9. Have and maintain at least one firearm. This includes conceal/carry permits.
10. Shoot to kill. Empty the magazine. Never look back.
Posted by: Foghorn Leghorn at March 06, 2013 07:25 AM (EGPJQ)
Posted by: ejo at March 06, 2013 07:25 AM (GXvSO)
Posted by: Truman North, last of the famous international playboys at March 06, 2013 07:25 AM (cQBh3)
Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 06, 2013 07:26 AM (+q0tv)
It is only March 6. It will take a while longer for all of the doom stories to end.
For perspective*, look back at the wailing and crying the Democrats were doing after Bush was elected and re-elected. Heck, look back at the 1930's and see how well Republicans and conservatives were doing nationally.
*My take is that those who are serious partisans see any setback of any kind as a Portent of DOOM! forever, and not as the typical back-and-forth of US politics.
Posted by: Mikey NTH - Pirate Scum of Umbar at March 06, 2013 07:27 AM (hLRSq)
Reporters asked: Will you charge the 19-year-old Miami woman with perjury?
The state's lead prosecutor, Bernie de la Rionda, gave an ambiguous answer: "You can all read the law and make your own decision."
The woman had told prosecutors she was in the hospital on the day of Trayvon's funeral.
"In fact, she lied," defense attorney Don West said.
Posted by: PeeWee Herman at March 06, 2013 07:27 AM (e8kgV)
214 -
Jefferson was openly battling Hamilton for control over the direction of the federal government, and actively working with the french to undermine Washington's stated positions. Washington either didn't know, or he didn't care, so if it's something other than naivete, I'm not sure what it is.
Posted by: BurtTC at March 06, 2013 07:27 AM (TOk1P)
Ummmmm
Posted by: Baby Doc Duvalier, Muammar Qaddafi and Hugo Chavez (D-Toast) at March 06, 2013 07:28 AM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: sauropod at March 06, 2013 07:29 AM (WdzGK)
I don't now about the antecedent to the war of Northern Aggression but it was a forerunner of the corrupt practices of taxation that came about later which was one of the major causes of the the secession movement in the South. That was the tariffs of abomination.
However, in the Whiskey Rebellion people had already tried just about everything short of armed revolt that they could do. And much like today they were ignored because the people in the urban areas on the coast held all the power in the government. That was the same way with Shay's Rebellion in MA which really may have been the first, but it was before the Constitution.
Sure we owed money for the war. How is it that VA managed to pay its debts and the others didn't, even when they had a much larger cash flow than VA?
Any time the federal government (or the States for that matter) implements taxation it MUST be in a fair manner that taxes everyone, not an unlikely few. We did not have it then, we do not have it now. Which is why you keep seeing these same taxation arguments over and over and over and over.
And that is why sooner or later it is GOING to burn.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 07:29 AM (53z96)
What about the surveys compelled by law? I got a 36 pager for my business this year that fell into that category (from Dept of Commerce). The same day I got a 26 pager at home for my farm (from USDA). Both mandatory. Should I have blown them off and gone to jail?
Posted by: Muad'dib at March 06, 2013 07:30 AM (KjlbF)
Posted by: GalosGann at March 06, 2013 07:30 AM (vW1n3)
I don't believe that because it is not sustainable.
People trust government because despite the rhetoric it always seems to be there. The Achilles Heel in that argument is that massive, unsustainable social spending is not sustainable and at some point needs to be significantly pared back.
To a certain degree, I believe Obama's attempt to massively change this country and plunge her into debt may be liberals ultimate undoing. They have succeeded largely because they've plodded along slowly and consolidated their gains over years. Thus, Obama has moved very quickly and the veil is starting to slip. When we can no longer afford the gratuitous, unachievable, unsustainable and therefore fallacious promises many people will get it. They will connect the lies and foolishness of their trust when none of these things materialize and a true crisis arises.
That's happening now. We are slowly taking from whole classes of our society and people see it. They are becoming less apathetic since it has started to hurt them personally.
It's a leisure to engage in political arguments which are hypothetical or philosophical. But almost everyone knows what failure looks like. Especially when it starts to hurt them personally.
Posted by: Marcus at March 06, 2013 07:30 AM (GGCsk)
Do we on the right still trust the people? Did we ever?
"Why should I agree to swap one tyrant three thousand miles away for three thousand tyrants one mile away?" ~ Mel Gibson's character in the The Patriot channeling, Mather Byles, Sr., Boston, 1776
"If one set of private subjects may at any time take upon themselves to punish another set of private subjects just when they please, itÂ’s such a sort of government as I never heard of before; and according to my poor notion of government, this is one of the principal things which government is designed to prevent; and I own I had rather be a slave under one master (for I know who he is I may perhaps be able to please him) than a slave to a hundred or more whom I donÂ’t know where to find, nor what they will expect of me..." ~~Theophilus Lillie, Boston, 1770
Posted by: Radeaminnit at March 06, 2013 07:31 AM (Xv7f/)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at March 06, 2013 11:20 AM (VtjlW)
This is why I'm angling for a position of some power in Alextopia.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/i][/u][/b] at March 06, 2013 07:31 AM (4df7R)
The people are idiots. Occasionally they elect the right person, usually by accident.
Posted by: TallDave at March 06, 2013 07:32 AM (/s1LA)
I agree that the real problem facing the Conservative movement and some in the Republican party is the question--can we trust the electorate?
I remember coming to the same conclusion when Bill Clinton was elected because he displayed chaem and empathy when both George Bush and Ross Perot seemed to lack empathy.
I believe conservatives need to stop arguing with democrats about issues like abortion and, instead, turn the arguement back to government itself. Point out that Obama and the DEms rammed through Obamacare but exempted themselves. Point out that we all will eventually struggle with Social Security but that government officials have a different plan. Point out that every 'Savior' who comes to power like Chavez, Mugabe, Assad in Syria, Hussein in Iraq; any savior from the right or left ends up hurting the country and the people he supposedly represents and significantly enriches himself. Point out that Obama is closing the White House because of the sequester so 8th graders can't visit during spring break but hasn't cut a single person employed in the White House. Point out that the Agricultural department is slowing down meat inspections which could lead to shortages but won't cancel any conferences it has scheduled where they will spend lavishly. Point out that our government employees no longer serve us but rather we, the tax payers, are servants of the government class.
We have to create an angry electorate because, in my opinion, we can't trust them. They will accept any freebie you give them as long as they feel that they you are being fair. We need to point out the Obama and Pelosi and the entire government is taking the entire electorate for a ride and it will end badly--eventually. We need to point out that these very same government employees are already doing everything to insulate themselves from any coming disaster. We nned to create an angry electorate not an informed one because I'm not sure they can truly be informed.
Posted by: John M at March 06, 2013 07:32 AM (XygAY)
My Southern friends call this the War of Northern Aggression ;-)
Posted by: Marcus at March 06, 2013 07:32 AM (GGCsk)
I'd like to see the "Big-government-as-the-oppressor" angle tried by someone on the right.
Even better would be someone, preferably well respected (I don't know who that'd be) who could put together the facts about how the wrong people writing stupid laws can cause a great deal of economic damage. Exhibit One would be the CRA. It has now pretty much been proven that this one POS law has caused the lion's share of our current troubles, yet no one in Washington ever says anything about it. It's as though politicians think they are infallible and so is the government.
I suppose that would be all "radical" and "extremist" and shit to point out the truth and place the blame squarely where it belongs.
As long as politicians hide the truth from their constiuents, we'll never be free.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at March 06, 2013 07:34 AM (+z4pE)
(1) The CR does not raise the debt ceiling.
(2) The discretionary budget authority subject to caps under the BCA (post-sequestration) is $984B. (1.usa.gov/13Fnf5X)
(3) The two departments given full-year budgets are Defense and Veterans Affairs. (http://1.usa.gov/Wrf2jA)
(4) The legislation was posted online earlier this week.
3/4/13: @rebeccagberg @nielslesniewski Per House aide: "Looking at Thursday but we're staying flexible on schedule because of possible weather."
2/27/13: "Key House conservatives say they can support measure to fund the government"- http://bit.ly/VNKS7K
3/6/13: @frankthorpNBC By my count, at least 13 House Cmte hearings have been postponed b/c of the snow hitting the DC area.
Posted by: 80sBaby at March 06, 2013 07:34 AM (YjDyJ)
Posted by: L, elle at March 06, 2013 07:34 AM (O6zkv)
Voter preference for small government is like having a preference for a smaller waistline. In total, voters would LOVE a small government, but piece by piece they have a hard time resisting. "What harm will one little regulation/benefit/piece of cake have on the diet?", they ask themselves.
Our strategy should be to become America's personal trainer.
Posted by: Serious Cat at March 06, 2013 07:34 AM (UypUQ)
Please, do go on about this mythical country populated by a True Conservative majority. We do have a lot of sci-fi fans here, after all.
Does the story take place in an alternate universe? Another planet?
Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 06, 2013 07:36 AM (SY2Kh)
Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 06, 2013 07:36 AM (+q0tv)
Posted by: Serious Cat at March 06, 2013 11:34 AM (UypUQ)
Can we drag America out of bed in the morning and make it run laps? Because that would be awesome.
Posted by: joncelli, dodging the Zombies of Sequester at March 06, 2013 07:36 AM (RD7QR)
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit at March 06, 2013 11:31 AM (4df7R)
I'm told that attractive female nudity does wonders in Alextopia.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 07:38 AM (da5Wo)
Please don't interrupt the hyperbole and propaganda with facts.
You want to know what's wrong with the party? Exhibit number 1 is people clinging to rumors propagated by others who have a parochial interest in promoting divisions and ultimately have no idea how to govern.
Posted by: Marcus at March 06, 2013 07:38 AM (GGCsk)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 07:39 AM (GFM2b)
<
Please don't interrupt the hyperbole and propaganda with facts.
You want to know what's wrong with the party? Exhibit number 1 is people clinging to rumors propagated by others who have a parochial interest in promoting divisions and ultimately have no idea how to govern.
Posted by: Marcus at March 06, 2013 11:38 AM (GGCsk
No, the problem isn't the rumors on what they have in the CR. The problem is that they are passing yet another CR at all. They have sent multiple budgets to the Senate for which Harry the pederast refuses to even vote on. Fuck them with a rusty unlubed chain saw on high speed.
Then maybe they will at least vote on it after their assholes are thoroughly reamed out. .
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 07:41 AM (53z96)
Posted by: Ken Royall at March 06, 2013 07:41 AM (x0g8a)
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at March 06, 2013 07:42 AM (+z4pE)
Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 06, 2013 07:43 AM (+q0tv)
Posted by: Baby Doc Duvalier, Muammar Qaddafi and Hugo Chavez (D-Toast) at March 06, 2013 11:28 AM (6TB1Z)
Civilization has been built by the wealthy and powerful taking control of a more-than-willing populus, exchanging order and protection for submission to authority.
The two-bit dictators are nothing more than colonels who saw an opportunity to lead a coup. Monarchies are established by those who can fund and lead ongoing governments.
Billionaires who don't step up, establish mercenary forces and take over third world countries are neglecting their duty to humanity.
Posted by: jwest at March 06, 2013 07:44 AM (u2a4R)
Posted by: sherlock at March 06, 2013 07:44 AM (BaQuW)
Civilization has been built by the wealthy and powerful taking control of a more-than-willing populus, exchanging order and protection for submission to authority.
I would counter that we were the exeption to that rule. The 20th century saw the greatest increase in the worldwide standard of living through the efforts of the free people of America.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at March 06, 2013 07:47 AM (+z4pE)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 07:47 AM (GFM2b)
Posted by: jeannebodine at March 06, 2013 07:47 AM (x0dlI)
283 http://tinyurl.com/d55a49p
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 06, 2013 11:45 AM (Cm7V/)
A link to your FB page? Brave girl.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 07:47 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: Daybrother at March 06, 2013 07:47 AM (9Xj/b)
Posted by: Rule #2 at March 06, 2013 07:48 AM (CypDC)
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 06, 2013 07:48 AM (Cm7V/)
If it's all the same to you, I'd prefer not to be the subject of Mayor Bloomberg or George Soros, thanks very much.
Posted by: pep at March 06, 2013 07:48 AM (6TB1Z)
You mean the ones who elected Al Franken to the Senate?
Trust no one.
Posted by: pep at March 06, 2013 07:50 AM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 07:50 AM (GFM2b)
Posted by: chique d'afrique (the artist formerly known as african chick) at March 06, 2013 07:50 AM (6zgse)
Trust no one.
Posted by: pep at March 06, 2013 11:50 AM (6TB1Z)
He was not elected.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 07:50 AM (53z96)
Trust no one.
Posted by: pep at March 06, 2013 11:50 AM (6TB1Z)
No one is exactly who elected Franken. I can't think of a more open stealing of an election in my lifetime than that.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 07:51 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 06, 2013 07:51 AM (+q0tv)
Oh, Washington cared. He cared a lot. And he was well aware of Jefferson's political leanings, especially after reading Jefferson-subsidized newspapers that criticized his administration, and while following the well-publicized tour of Citizen Genet as the newly-appointed French ambassador was feted in the southern US.
Posted by: mrp at March 06, 2013 07:51 AM (HjPtV)
Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 06, 2013 07:52 AM (jE38p)
Posted by: chique d'afrique (the artist formerly known as african chick) at March 06, 2013 07:52 AM (6zgse)
Posted by: AuthorLMendez at March 06, 2013 07:52 AM (yAor6)
To answer the question of the post, yes, I do trust the people, but there is a qualifier: they absolutely MUST be properly and truthfully informed.
As we have seen, the edumacation system and the MFM are actively working to make sure that never happens.
PT Barnum was right.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at March 06, 2013 07:52 AM (+z4pE)
Posted by: andrew breitbart at March 06, 2013 07:53 AM (SrCwM)
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at March 06, 2013 11:47 AM (+z4pE)
This is absolutely true. The U.S., for some reason, was a magnet for those who had advanced to the point that they wanted to have a say in directing how the government was run.
The big mistake was projecting this desire on our part to the rest of the world, who were very content to have someone calling all the shots. Regretably, we demonized the practice of having those with the means and ambition to run countries that weren't ready to govern themselves take over and rule.
What's right for us isn't necessarily right for everyone else at this particular moment in history.
Posted by: jwest at March 06, 2013 07:53 AM (u2a4R)
@261 Marcus
"They are becoming less apathetic since it has started to hurt them personally."
Unfortunately thats what it takes. As an army travels on its stomach, the FSA is no different and the rumbling is just starting.
Posted by: Buckeye Abroad at March 06, 2013 07:53 AM (f+TdG)
Posted by: blindside at March 06, 2013 07:55 AM (x7g7t)
Washington was not totally against Jefferson's treatment of the French. They both agreed that the French Monarchy could not be trusted but for different reasons. Washington knew that what the Frech were really after was reclaiming land in the Americas that they lost to the British in the 7 years war. Jefferson distrusted them because of the way they were treating the French citizens in the run-up to the French Revolution.
As for Hamilton, that is no different than the stu8ff we have going on today, except for the most part, Jefferson was right and Hamilton was wrong. (referring to a national bank)
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 07:55 AM (53z96)
Posted by: akula51 at March 06, 2013 07:55 AM (hNXHo)
Posted by: jeannebodine at March 06, 2013 11:47 AM (x0dlI)
We don't. That's the whole point.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at March 06, 2013 07:56 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: chique d'afrique (the artist formerly known as african chick) at March 06, 2013 11:52 AM (6zgse)
Yes, I am. You get that way when you have had your face rubbed in crap for over 60 years.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 07:56 AM (53z96)
Posted by: pep at March 06, 2013 11:48 AM (6TB1Z)
Maybe not you, but there would be millions of people who would benefit from living under the rule of King Soros and Emperor Bloomburg - especially if their kingdoms were next door to King Koch's.
Posted by: jwest at March 06, 2013 07:56 AM (u2a4R)
Posted by: Wonkish Rogue at March 06, 2013 07:57 AM (IqMNQ)
It doesn't matter who we get anymore, they all want the same thing. Rubbing my nose in shit.
LIB
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 07:58 AM (53z96)
I understand why a level of distrust exists between certain GOP leaders and the base but that does not mean that everything is conspiracy. A number of lawmakers have been complaining about the snowstorm and they want to get home sooner rather than later. Aides were still considering when to hold the vote due to the weather as of Monday. If you have a solid whip count, you would try to take the vote sooner rather than later. I also do not understand how anyone can claim that they were taken by surprise by this particular bill.
Posted by: 80sBaby at March 06, 2013 07:58 AM (YjDyJ)
Posted by: RioBravo at March 06, 2013 07:58 AM (eEfYn)
Posted by: chique d'afrique (the artist formerly known as african chick) at March 06, 2013 07:59 AM (6zgse)
Posted by: akula51 at March 06, 2013 07:59 AM (hNXHo)
Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 06, 2013 07:59 AM (+q0tv)
As for the stolen election conspiracy theories, I don't buy it. Yes there was most likely voter fraud. Yes there's some evidence a state or two may have been close enough to be effected by voter fraud but you still have the issue that the electorate was just more Democrat heavy and that some voter-id states went to Obama. Voter fraud most definitely occurred but not enough to shift who won or lost this election in my mind.
Posted by: AuthorLMendez at March 06, 2013 08:00 AM (yAor6)
@ Vic
Still sick of Franken here in MN. It was an election sham of all time. It doesn't help that he such a dufous. I am hoping a strong conservative candidate comes forward to run against him next year.
Posted by: Foghorn Leghorn at March 06, 2013 08:00 AM (pDRpv)
Posted by: chique d'afrique (the artist formerly known as african chick) at March 06, 2013 11:59 AM (6zgse)
LOL, yes I did, I was being with the snark as well.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 08:00 AM (53z96)
My recollection is that they will not need to discuss the debt ceiling until May.
Posted by: 80sBaby at March 06, 2013 08:01 AM (YjDyJ)
Posted by: akula51 at March 06, 2013 11:59 AM (hNXHo)
A King Koch would probably grant someone like you a portion of their kingdom and give you the title and lands to run them - for a piece of the action.
Posted by: jwest at March 06, 2013 08:02 AM (u2a4R)
Posted by: RWC at March 06, 2013 08:02 AM (fWAjv)
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 08:03 AM (53z96)
Posted by: jwest at March 06, 2013 11:44 AM (u2a4R)
I don't see anything in the Rulebook for Billionaires that they're required to do anything other than build little play fortresses with bales of cash (p. 6, para. b) and jump around showering themselves with gold coins like Scrooge McDuck (p.10, para a). Nope, nothing about 'duty to humanity' anywhere in there.
Posted by: troyriser at March 06, 2013 08:03 AM (vtiE6)
Posted by: soothsayer at March 06, 2013 08:04 AM (+oin+)
Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 06, 2013 08:04 AM (+q0tv)
s for the stolen election conspiracy theories, I don't buy it. Yes there was most likely voter fraud. Yes there's some evidence a state or two may have been close enough to be effected by voter fraud but you still have the issue that the electorate was just more Democrat heavy and that some voter-id states went to Obama. Voter fraud most definitely occurred but not enough to shift who won or lost this election in my mind.
IIRC, no state that required Voter ID carried TFG. Plus, close elections don't need much fraud to succeed. Throw a couple of states, and Viola! You have what we have today.
I'd like to see the death penalty for anyone caught in any type of voting shenanigans, but that's just me.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at March 06, 2013 08:05 AM (+z4pE)
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 06, 2013 08:05 AM (Cm7V/)
Vanity Fair has an excerpt up of the just-published Zev Chafets biography of Roger Ailes, in which he describes Biden as "dumb as an ashtray" (my favorite part). Libtards are, at root, totalitarians. Some of them think they aren't, but they really are, while some just come right out and admit the truth. Pussy footing around with these clowns in some push-me-pull-you political fight is stupid: I hope we start off asking Americans straight out to reject tyranny.
"“What if you get there [to heaven] and it turns out that God is a liberal?” I asked.
Ailes paused. It was something that evidently hadn’t occurred to him. “Well, hell, if God’s a liberal, that’s his business,” he said. He paused again, imagining it. “But I doubt very much that he is. He’s got a good heart.”
http://tinyurl.com/akkncrn
Posted by: MTF at March 06, 2013 08:05 AM (B5y+v)
the one I live and vote in did*
*by just 0.9%
Posted by: AuthorLMendez at March 06, 2013 08:06 AM (yAor6)
------
Well what we have here is the need for a coercive law and a new tax.
Posted by: RioBravo at March 06, 2013 08:06 AM (eEfYn)
Interesting idea. Vote fraud is essentially the non-democratic overthrow of our government. How does that differ from treason?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 06, 2013 08:07 AM (GsoHv)
Posted by: Paladin at March 06, 2013 08:07 AM (YNPwP)
Posted by: Ian S. at March 06, 2013 08:07 AM (B/VB5)
I will come back later.
Oh, by the way, Drew, there is a new book out.
It details Roger Ailes opinions of many people. You might want to take a look at it.
Posted by: Miss Marple at March 06, 2013 08:07 AM (GoIUi)
Context. Washington became president in April, 1789, the same year that the Bastille was stormed (July). The French monarchy was bankrupt after the American Revolution and was in no position to threaten any country. Washington was alarmed at the upswelling of support for the Jacobin cause in the US and viewed Citizen Genet's blatant attempts to drag the fledgling US into direct conflict with Great Briain with deep concern.
Posted by: mrp at March 06, 2013 08:07 AM (HjPtV)
Posted by: Sean Bannion at March 06, 2013 08:08 AM (+q0tv)
The problem with America is that it's full of Americans.
The problem with Americans is that they're all allowed to vote.
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 06, 2013 08:08 AM (CJjw5)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 08:08 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: Ian S. at March 06, 2013 12:07 PM (B/VB5)
GOOD! R. Paul just went up a notch.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 08:09 AM (53z96)
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 06, 2013 08:09 AM (Cm7V/)
Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 06, 2013 08:09 AM (jE38p)
309 -
Jefferson was still wearing his french cheerleader outfit, and wearing lipstick to kiss french arse long after they started cutting off each others' heads.
Now that I would not call naivete. Jefferson was blinded by his own foolish and misguided belief in his own brilliance.
Posted by: BurtTC at March 06, 2013 08:10 AM (TOk1P)
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at March 06, 2013 08:10 AM (Cm7V/)
I'd like to see the death penalty for anyone caught in any type of voting shenanigans, but that's just me.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at March 06, 2013 12:05 PM (+z4pE)
Meh, the correlation there could flow the opposite direction: states that vote heavily republican are more likely to enact voter ID laws. So it's really not indicative of anything frankly.
Posted by: tsrblke (work) at March 06, 2013 08:10 AM (IsyJh)
true enough. how someone who doesn't pay taxes can vote on whether to raise how much I pay in them is beyond me
Posted by: AuthorLMendez at March 06, 2013 08:10 AM (yAor6)
Interesting idea. Vote fraud is essentially the non-democratic overthrow of our government. How does that differ from treason?
It doesn't.
It does, however, explain my nic. I haven't gotten what I have voted for in a long, long time. Somtimes I even wonder why I manage to give a shit on some days.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at March 06, 2013 08:11 AM (+z4pE)
Posted by: Paladin at March 06, 2013 08:11 AM (YNPwP)
I think it was that he was so enamored of revolution that he could not see that the American version was the perfect confluence of events and people.
And because those French chicks put out for him.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 06, 2013 08:12 AM (GsoHv)
Posted by: Ian S. at March 06, 2013 12:07 PM (B/VB5)
Why? I thought Rand said the president was entitled to to 'some leeway' on his picks....that's why he voted 'yes' on Hagel.
Posted by: Tami[/i] at March 06, 2013 08:12 AM (X6akg)
Posted by: akula51 at March 06, 2013 08:13 AM (hNXHo)
That was a rhetorical question...I agree with you.
I still give a shit because we have brats who will probably bear the brunt of our 50 year experiment in socialism.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 06, 2013 08:14 AM (GsoHv)
353 -
Maybe. That's a generous interpretation, but at least he was in the position to buy the land where I'm currently sitting from the french, so for that at least I should be grateful. But generally, I'm not a Jefferson fan.
Posted by: BurtTC at March 06, 2013 08:15 AM (TOk1P)
It never would've come down to a recount if Coleman hadn't run such a lousy campaign.
A "strong conservative" isn't going to get elected Senator here in MN. The idea that True Pure Conservative can win anywhere if only they fight hard enough just doesn't hold water.
Conservative suburban and outstate House reps? Sure. Senator? No.
Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 06, 2013 08:15 AM (SY2Kh)
Posted by: mrp at March 06, 2013 12:07 PM (HjPtV)
I may have my time frames off by some working straight from memory but Washington was genuinely concerned about the French desire to get land back it lost in the 7 years war. He did not trust the French government.
And Jefferson had no intention of trying to drag the US into a war with GB. He initially supported the revolution until they went bananas with the guillotine. And some of the statement he made in support were made BEFORE he learned that the King had been executed.
That effectively ended his support for the cause when he found out. That is what I remember. I just do not believe there was a lot of animosity between Washington and Jefferson. They were both from the same State, they were both patriots.
And either one of them had more personal and professional integrity than any politician we have alive today.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 08:15 AM (53z96)
true enough. how someone who doesn't pay taxes can vote on whether to raise how much I pay in them is beyond me
Posted by: AuthorLMendez at March 06, 2013 12:10 PM (yAor6)
The 24th Amendment was a total disaster. Banning the poll tax, OK. But banning any linkage between paying taxes and voting was a colossal mistake.
Posted by: Jay Guevara at March 06, 2013 08:16 AM (IDSI7)
Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 06, 2013 08:17 AM (jE38p)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 08:17 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: troyriser at March 06, 2013 12:03 PM (vtiE6)
There used to be, but in just the last 100 years it's been changed to "set up a foundation and watch your money be used for shit that would spin you in your grave within 20 years of your death".
Give the gift that keeps on giving to your heirs - a nice little kingdom.
Posted by: jwest at March 06, 2013 08:18 AM (u2a4R)
Posted by: Ian S. at March 06, 2013 12:07 PM (B/VB5)
GOOD! R. Paul just went up a notch.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 12:09 PM (53z96)
Really? I thought Rand Paul ultimately went along with Hagel's SecDef appointment because the President, according to Paul, should be able to choose whom he likes. So what changed?
Posted by: troyriser at March 06, 2013 08:19 AM (vtiE6)
I still give a shit because we have brats who will probably bear the brunt of our 50 year experiment in socialism.
Yeah. I'd like for the young'uns to grow up free, but the tide seems to be against that today. One or two more generations of indoctrination and we'll officially be history as the Land of Freedom and Opportunity.
Is it too early to start drinking? /rhetorical
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at March 06, 2013 08:19 AM (+z4pE)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 08:20 AM (GFM2b)
Posted by: troyriser at March 06, 2013 12:19 PM (vtiE6)
Yes he did, and if he had filibustered that one he would have went up another notch.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 08:20 AM (53z96)
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 08:20 AM (53z96)
Posted by: Brother Cavil, the future Pope Ampersand I at March 06, 2013 08:21 AM (GBXon)
In his new book, At the Brink, economist and author John Lott Jr., assesses the presidency of Barack Obama and recalls conversations regarding gun laws they had while working at the University of Chicago.
In Chapter Three, Mr. Lott discusses gun-control and takes the reader back to his time at the University of Chicago, where he and then-professor Barack Obama spoke on numerous occasions about guns in America.
"I don't believe people should be able to own guns," Obama told Lott one day at the University of Chicago Law School.
Lott explains that he first met Obama shortly after completing his research on concealed handgun laws and crime.
"He did not come across as a moderate who wanted to bring people together," Lott writes.
After he introduced himself to Obama, Lott suggested that they have lunch one day to discuss their views on guns. According to Lott, Obama "grimaced and turned away." That was the way many conversations with Obama ended, Lott says.
Although the Law School was famous for the openness of its faculty and friendly engagement, Lott says, "Obama...preferred silent, scowling disdain to collegiality."
http://is.gd/pCdY0T
Posted by: Jones in CO at March 06, 2013 08:21 AM (8sCoq)
Daddy must've sent a note telling him to filibuster in response to the CIA and the Zionist Lobby responsibility for the Sandy Hook shooting.
It's only a matter of time before Rand fully unleashes his inner Paul crazy. He's not to be trusted.
Posted by: Hollowpoint at March 06, 2013 08:22 AM (SY2Kh)
Posted by: Jay Guevara at March 06, 2013 12:16 PM (IDSI7)
My guess is that they were worried about taxation becoming a de facto poll tax. Of course a radically simplified tax code would ensure more people pay a bare minimum of taxes (which I think is the bigger problem here.)
Posted by: tsrblke (work) at March 06, 2013 08:22 AM (IsyJh)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 08:22 AM (GFM2b)
Hagel had made questionable comments about Jews and Rand Paul is a Paul when all is said and done...
Posted by: AuthorLMendez at March 06, 2013 08:22 AM (yAor6)
The final straw was that the revolutionary fervor of 1789 inspired the Haitian Revolt, and that hit too close to home for Jefferson and his fellow plantation owners.
Posted by: mrp at March 06, 2013 08:23 AM (HjPtV)
Hmm. If I had billions and the ability to rule...no. You don't want that. Everything would be fine and dandy, you could go your own way and live in peace...
...until someone even looked like they wanted to change that.
Then I take out them, their family, their friends, and anyone who had close contact with. Just to make sure the contagion couldn't spread.
Yeah. I'm not ideal ruler material.
Cut. Jib. Newsletter.
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at March 06, 2013 08:24 AM (+z4pE)
Posted by: navybrat at March 06, 2013 08:24 AM (CgiRY)
Posted by: rickb223 at March 06, 2013 08:25 AM (GFM2b)
So I don't know how he is filibustering it now. The filibuster quits working once it makes it to the floor.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 08:25 AM (53z96)
Domestic drones.
Sen. Paul's letter to Brennan: http://wapo.st/YNuVv6
Posted by: 80sBaby at March 06, 2013 08:25 AM (YjDyJ)
Posted by: AuthorLMendez at March 06, 2013 08:25 AM (yAor6)
Posted by: Ian S. at March 06, 2013 08:25 AM (B/VB5)
Posted by: Dr. Mr. Badman at March 06, 2013 08:26 AM (D8pR3)
Cons/Reps fight each other 99% of the time.
That's why they win and we lose each election.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 06, 2013 08:27 AM (HDgX3)
Posted by: mrp at March 06, 2013 12:23 PM (HjPtV)
Out of ALL the biographies I have read about Jefferson I have never seen that. They do have an interesting writeup about his support and then pull back over the Monticello web site. It reasonable compares to the biographies I have read.
Check it out.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 08:27 AM (53z96)
Cons/Reps fight each other 99% of the time.
That's why they win and we lose each election."
+1
Posted by: AuthorLMendez at March 06, 2013 08:28 AM (yAor6)
Yes and some of them are allowed to vote 15-20 times. We cede elections to fraud time after time and nothing is done. Why? No one died for the right for Shakaykay to have an EBT card and abortion on demand and yet any threat to that is meet with withering fire from every possible direction. Good men, great men, and even bad men died for the right to vote in free and fair elections. If you subvert that, no withering fire ensues, just a couple of billion dollars in campaign money, a Nobel Prize, and the press kissing your feet. Is this a great country or what? Paging Hadji, the comic, maybe he can find a joke in this steaming mess, I can't.
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Wily Wrepublican Wench at March 06, 2013 08:28 AM (kXoT0)
Sen. Paul's letter to Brennan: http://wapo.st/YNuVv6
Posted by: 80sBaby at March 06, 2013 12:25 PM (YjDyJ)
Ah, so he has a new crusade. I agree with that one too. See post #9 in the news thread this morning.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 08:29 AM (53z96)
Posted by: Brother Cavil, the future Pope Ampersand I at March 06, 2013 08:32 AM (GBXon)
Posted by: rickl at March 06, 2013 08:32 AM (zoehZ)
"The Haitian revolution came to North American shores in the form of a refugee crisis. In 1793, competing factions battled for control of the then-capital of St. Domingue, Cap-Français (now Cap-Haïtien.) The fighting and ensuing fire destroyed much of the capital, and refugees piled into ships anchored in the harbor. The French navy deposited the refugees in Norfolk, Virginia. Many refugees also settled in Baltimore, Philadelphia, and New York. These refugees were predominantly white, though many had brought their slaves with them. The refugees became involved in émigré politics, hoping to influence U.S. foreign policy. Anxieties about their actions, along with those of European radicals also residing in the United States, led to the passage of the Alien and Sedition Acts. The growing xenophobia, along with temporarily improved political stability in France and St. Domingue, convinced many of the refugees to return home."
Posted by: RioBravo at March 06, 2013 08:32 AM (eEfYn)
Yeah, but I told those bitchez to get out my BIDNESS. Nome Seine.
Posted by: Sally Hemmings at March 06, 2013 08:32 AM (6TB1Z)
Posted by: AuthorLMendez at March 06, 2013 08:33 AM (yAor6)
The alien and sedition acts were passed by Adams because the people opposed to his regime were writing newspapers opposed to it.
That state depart stuff is full of shit and looks like more modern PC.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 08:34 AM (53z96)
As do I, though it is just one reason in a long list of objections.
Posted by: 80sBaby at March 06, 2013 08:38 AM (YjDyJ)
The federal government spent something like 22.7% of GDP in 2011. Our 537 elected representatives (Congress, Senate, Pres and Veep) should have paid 22.7% of their joint spousal gross income in 2011. No deductions, exemptions, preferential treatment for capital gains, munis, etc.-they spent 22.7% of our GDP, and so it's only fair that should pay 22.7% of their income.
Imagine if Romney had said, when the issue of his taxes came up, "If the budget I sign spends 22% of GDP I will pay 22% of my income in taxes, and I will work with Congress to pass a law mandating that they pay at the same rate they spend." That could shift the focus of the tax and spending conversation from "the 1%" to our elected leadership, where it belongs. It may have put pressure on Obama and on members running for Congress to support it. It's not a Democrat or Republican issue-it's a Congressional Accountability issue, and I think people would naturally support it.
Posted by: MartyH at March 06, 2013 08:46 AM (0fbJ+)
That state depart stuff is full of shit and looks like more modern PC.
Posted by: Vic at March 06, 2013 12:34 PM (53z96)
---
The Sedition Act certainly took advantage of the need or perceived need for the 3 Alien acts to pass a law intended to stifle dissent through the 1800 elections. the Sedition Act didn't work, of course. 'Never let a crisis go to waste.'
I believe the Alien Enemies Act is still law.
Posted by: RioBravo at March 06, 2013 08:47 AM (eEfYn)
Posted by: AuthorLMendez at March 06, 2013 08:48 AM (yAor6)
Posted by: TT at March 06, 2013 09:13 AM (ez58q)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 09:21 AM (QupBk)
It was an interesting essay in Morning Jolt, worthy of comment, and Drew's reaction to it is also appreciated.
To me, the Obama voters, most of them are who they are. There are going to be 20% liberals who would be waterboarded everyday before they would vote for a non-leftist. Fuhgeddaboudem. No shot.
The problem is that other 32%. Within that cluster, how do conservatives/Rs pick off enough of the low information voters, and the "moderates" who live pretty conservative lives, have normal values and are reasonably intelligent folk for the most part?
I see them as the viable target. We didn't lose in a landslide. We don't need all of them, just enough to craft a majority at the polls.
The LIVs may be a lost cause. But that block of people out there who we call the squishes, some of them can be turned. No idea how, but Reagan managed. Heck, W managed against a sitting veep.
Posted by: RM at March 06, 2013 09:26 AM (/Frlf)
Posted by: RM at March 06, 2013 09:32 AM (/Frlf)
Posted by: Chris Balsz at March 06, 2013 09:34 AM (vBZaW)
Posted by: toby928© furthers the meme at March 06, 2013 09:50 AM (QupBk)
Alexander Hamilton turned the US Customs Service into the most powerful intelligence-gathering agency in the 18th century. His deputies sent him reports that were as close to real-time as the contemporary technology allowed. Washington was the country's spymaster during the American Revolution. The idea that Washington was out of the loop is ludicrous..
Posted by: mrp at March 06, 2013 10:19 AM (HjPtV)
The problem is that conservatives like to think that Reagan was elected because people were on board with his ideas.
Reagan got elected the same way as Clinton and Obama - charisma, plain and simple. Obama - unlike the other two - almost missed out on re-election despite that advantage (and the advantage of having an automatic 10-12% of the vote!) because his results were abysmal. Obama's performance has been SO BAD that if he did not have that "racist vote" advantage, he would have been outta there.
It's a mistake to conclude that Obama's continuance represents some sort of ideological shift.
Geraghty really nails the Obamabot phenomenon, in that quote, though.
Posted by: Optimizer at March 06, 2013 11:17 AM (Mxt9o)
Just know far too well exactly what to expect.
...at this point, trust (like deserve) has nothing to do with "it".
Posted by: panzernashorn at March 06, 2013 11:48 AM (MhA4j)
I'm not saying there shouldn't be pushback when Republicans leave the reservation, but can we at least be adults and recognize that no political party or President is going to roll in and magically fix everything?
There's certain Republicans I dislike, but I don't buy for a minute that "RINOs" or Republicans less conservative than Jim DeMint are why the country is in dire shape. It's in dire shape because of Obama Democrats having the levers of power.
Posted by: McAdams at March 06, 2013 11:51 AM (+egHA)
Posted by: JohnKerryIsADoucheBag at March 06, 2013 12:50 PM (2T1u7)
Posted by: teej at March 06, 2013 02:42 PM (r60DJ)
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Posted by: 98ZJUSMC Waiting for the Sun at March 06, 2013 05:55 AM (hWDNn)