December 05, 2013
— Ace It'll take a while to get a ruling on these cases, and then come appeals, but it's something to keep your eye on.
If the law known as Obamacare gets struck down in the latest court challenge, the victors will thank a Hudson resident and Case Western Reserve University law professor who discovered what the law's critics say is a major flaw.Jonathan Adler, 44, says he didn't even appreciate initially how significant his discovery might be. He thought it was an interesting bit of legal arcana, worthy of scholarship. But his analysis of the Affordable Care Act, or ACA, has led to four pending cases in federal courts, two likely to be decided within months, that offer ACA opponents their best chance of gutting the law.
Oral arguments were heard in one of the cases, in U.S. District Court in Washington, DC, on Tuesday.
Adler, a Case law professor since 2001, pored over the ACA after it passed in 2010 and found this: Congress created a system for providing tax subsidies and penalties in order to give incentives for people to buy health insurance or for employers to provide it. States were supposed to create new agencies that would offer online insurance-shopping options, and states would tie into a federal tax system to dole out the subsidies and assess the penalties.
But the ACA made clear, Adler says, that the subsidies were to be used in these new state marketplaces, or "exchanges." There is no record, he says, that shows Congress directed the subsidies to what has since evolved: a large, federally run, health-policy shopping exchange. When the subsidies are mentioned in the law, Adler says, it is always and only in the context of state exchanges.
The IRS fabricated a regulation that stated, basically, that no matter what the law itself says, they're providing subsidies through the federal exchanges anyway.
These are Gabe's favorite dark-horse candidates for ending Obamacare in a year or two. He mentioned in the podcast that he'd watched arguments in court, and the Administration's line seemed to be that it didn't matter what the law said -- Obamacare needs this.
Apparently Obamacare contains its own Necessary and Proper Clause amid its penumbras and emanations.
Posted by: Ace at
11:48 AM
| Comments (186)
Post contains 394 words, total size 3 kb.
Posted by: NWConservative at December 05, 2013 11:53 AM (Crpyw)
Posted by: artisanal 'ette at December 05, 2013 11:54 AM (IXrOn)
Posted by: Mallfly at December 05, 2013 11:54 AM (bJm7W)
Speaking of Obamacare, I just notes on twitter, my doctor's office just made me sign a financial statement that agreee.to pay the insurance rate *or the charge master.*
AFAIK that last part is new. Ominous, since high level people at this very system have insisted no one actually pays that rate.
I suspect but cannot confirm this is related to Ocare.
meanwhile dude in front of me had no insurance and paid only $50, which isn't that bad.
Posted by: tsrblke (Phone) at December 05, 2013 11:54 AM (J3IzX)
Posted by: Lizzy at December 05, 2013 11:54 AM (JRmiD)
Posted by: King Putt I at December 05, 2013 11:55 AM (f9c2L)
Posted by: teh Wind at December 05, 2013 11:55 AM (B3WUC)
Posted by: Nevergiveup at December 05, 2013 11:55 AM (t3UFN)
Posted by: The Crooner at December 05, 2013 11:55 AM (DrC22)
Posted by: AMDG at December 05, 2013 11:55 AM (eFytx)
Posted by: Ook? at December 05, 2013 11:55 AM (FBkKA)
Posted by: NWConservative at December 05, 2013 11:56 AM (Crpyw)
Posted by: Nevergiveup at December 05, 2013 03:55 PM (t3UFN)
There is a good chance that if it stays in effect there will be chaos
Posted by: The Jackhole at December 05, 2013 11:56 AM (nTgAI)
Posted by: Roland THTG at December 05, 2013 11:56 AM (QM5S2)
Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 56% more DOOM! at December 05, 2013 11:56 AM (09o/X)
I think it'll be a close race, between those court cases, and just the grudging, passive boycott of the American people, as they just don't bother to comply with the whole damn sordid mess.
Enough millions of us just go "Refusenik" on 'em, and it all comes crashing down, anyway.
Jim
Sunk New Dawn
Galveston, TX
Posted by: Jim at December 05, 2013 11:56 AM (vvk2F)
@16
The chaos already is unimaginable. I can see Roberts latching on this for round two. After all, he made this possible with his ruling removing the punishment for states in not expanding Medicaid.
Posted by: Jollyroger at December 05, 2013 11:57 AM (t06LC)
The "law" is whatever Obama decides it should be.
Obviously, you weren't paying attention when he was teaching this at U. Chicago....
Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX (@Teresa_Koch) at December 05, 2013 11:58 AM (PZ6/M)
It was designed to fail anyway.
Next up: No more private insurance because it's all wrecked up now.
Posted by: Roland THTG at December 05, 2013 11:58 AM (QM5S2)
Posted by: USA at December 05, 2013 11:58 AM (VIaw0)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 05, 2013 11:59 AM (GEICT)
>>>When the subsidies are mentioned in the law, Adler says, it is always and only in the context of state exchanges.
I originally thought of this when living with my uncle. I meant to include it, but forgot until just now.
Posted by: Preznit BHO at December 05, 2013 11:59 AM (CMbMd)
... and the law... came tumbling down
... and the law... came tumbling down
....tumbling tumbling
... and law came came tumbling down.
Posted by: Chief JusticeJohn "Mellencamp" Roberts at December 05, 2013 11:59 AM (nELVU)
Posted by: Willie Shoemaker... at December 05, 2013 12:00 PM (jdRXP)
Posted by: toby928© insists on talking about robots at December 05, 2013 12:00 PM (QupBk)
Posted by: Mallfly at December 05, 2013 12:00 PM (bJm7W)
Posted by: JackStraw at December 05, 2013 12:00 PM (g1DWB)
Posted by: Chief Justice Roberts at December 05, 2013 03:53 PM (nELVU)
Yeah, that was a nice touch. States are employers and they will eventually fall under the mandate except states cannot be taxed. This statute is going to provide hours of entertainment.
Even more than it has already.
Posted by: Mikey NTH - Death Capades - ObamaCare on Ice! Sponsored by the Outrage Outlet at December 05, 2013 12:01 PM (hLRSq)
Posted by: NWConservative at December 05, 2013 12:01 PM (Crpyw)
Granted this hot mess can't be described as in operation but enough so that the claim can be made by the dishonest (and what Democrat isn't?) politicians who have an interest in it's existence.
Given that the GOP is too feckless OR desirous of another give away that they in turn can control to even try to make an honest effort at repealing it, what hope can their be other than legal or extra-legal efforts to sink the program?
Face it, we're stuck with it and as time goes on, it will seem better and better to those who are being forced to accept it. Regardless of all it's problems, it's the law of the land and most will not make the effort or take the risk by defying the proscriptions. At least not in great enough numbers to sink the program.
Which by the way is okee dokee with Democrats because they want single payer anyway which is what will happen if O'Care is shot down no matter the cause.
Let the Lord of Chaos Rule.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Unexpurgated Edition) at December 05, 2013 12:01 PM (LSDdO)
Ok so if we win this battle then what?
we going to yank subsidies from everyone who thinks they're getting one?
seems like a winning issue for dems to run against.
Bread and circuses always wins....
Posted by: tsrblke (Phone) at December 05, 2013 12:01 PM (J3IzX)
Posted by: rickb223 at December 05, 2013 12:02 PM (NKBxV)
Posted by: Gangstas of Minney Soda, you betcha! at December 05, 2013 12:03 PM (jdRXP)
Posted by: dwagyak at December 05, 2013 12:03 PM (VcJS9)
Posted by: JackStraw at December 05, 2013 12:03 PM (g1DWB)
If I kill my wife because she refuses to answer a simple, straightforward question and insists upon responding with, "I don't know....what do you think," is it murder? Or entirely legal and justifiable?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 05, 2013 12:04 PM (oJ5Fd)
Posted by: Mr. Wizard at December 05, 2013 12:04 PM (S5LPT)
Posted by: grease monkey at December 05, 2013 12:04 PM (qQk+U)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 05, 2013 12:04 PM (ZPrif)
Posted by: Bitter Clinger
Right. Besides slavery, prohibition, price and wages controls, and the telephone monopoly.
Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at December 05, 2013 12:05 PM (uCNam)
Which is why Obama wants to stack that court with liberal, anti-American acolytes...
Posted by: Marcus at December 05, 2013 12:05 PM (5RVx8)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at December 05, 2013 12:05 PM (7ObY1)
Posted by: Emperor Zero at December 05, 2013 12:05 PM (zDsvJ)
Speaking of Obamacare, I just notes on twitter, my doctor's office just made me sign a financial statement that agreee.to pay the insurance rate *or the charge master.*
ALL SHALL PAY ME!
Posted by: The Charge Master at December 05, 2013 12:06 PM (5iuEW)
Posted by: Jane D'oh at December 05, 2013 12:06 PM (lVPtV)
Posted by: Perry Masonjar at December 05, 2013 12:06 PM (jdRXP)
yeah. and look how long it took to repeal and how much damage it did. The country has never recovered from the attitudes nurtured and the criminal conspiracies hatched.
Plus Prohibition didn't put people at risk of their lives. They could opt out of drinking.
Health care? Not so much.
Then there's the number of beneficiaries that would be affected by a repeal.
So although superficially you appear correct, the programs defined are drastically different than each other and cannot be compared directly.
Try again.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Unexpurgated Edition) at December 05, 2013 12:06 PM (LSDdO)
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 05, 2013 04:04 PM (oJ5Fd)
----
No.
But it IS justifiable if you finally cave and give your your opinion..... she then finds fifty one faults with "what you think".
Not that I would know anything about that........
Posted by: fixerupper at December 05, 2013 12:07 PM (nELVU)
Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at December 05, 2013 12:08 PM (bCEmE)
Posted by: DCPensFan at December 05, 2013 12:08 PM (ma/2m)
Four Cases Making Way Through Courts That Might Wind Up Overturning Obamacare
-
Hyah. And monkeys might fly out of our butts.
Posted by: Wayne and Garth at December 05, 2013 12:08 PM (8GKDa)
Posted by: JackStraw at December 05, 2013 12:08 PM (g1DWB)
Posted by: toby928© insists on talking about robots at December 05, 2013 12:09 PM (QupBk)
We no longer live in that world. The specific words of a law are meaningless now.
Such is life in post-Constitutional Amerika
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at December 05, 2013 12:09 PM (L0b3J)
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Unexpurgated Edition) at December 05, 2013 04:01 PM (LSDdO)
+1 for the WoT reference.
Posted by: Ook? at December 05, 2013 12:09 PM (FBkKA)
The jokes, they write themselves.
Posted by: Ian S. at December 05, 2013 12:10 PM (B/VB5)
Posted by: JackStraw at December 05, 2013 12:11 PM (g1DWB)
Posted by: jarhall40@gmail.con at December 05, 2013 12:11 PM (VjL9S)
Posted by: Gangstas of Minney Soda, you betcha! at December 05, 2013 12:11 PM (jdRXP)
>>>Plus Prohibition didn't put people at risk of their lives.
Someone should have told Mr. Capone that.
Posted by: Edward J. O'Hare at December 05, 2013 12:11 PM (CMbMd)
Posted by: Harry Reid, Pedarist at December 05, 2013 12:11 PM (0FSuD)
Posted by: --- at December 05, 2013 12:11 PM (MMC8r)
Posted by: ejo at December 05, 2013 12:12 PM (GXvSO)
Posted by: NWConservative at December 05, 2013 12:12 PM (Crpyw)
Posted by: Justice Roberts[/i][/b][/s] at December 05, 2013 12:12 PM (DL2i+)
Posted by: rickb223 at December 05, 2013 04:02 PM (NKBxV)
It's already doing that. The question would be "Which chaos do you want? The never-ending chaos of ObamaCare or the short-term chaos of ending this misbegotten thing and turning back to the prior system?"
Interesting times ahead.
Posted by: Mikey NTH - Death Capades - ObamaCare on Ice! Sponsored by the Outrage Outlet at December 05, 2013 12:13 PM (hLRSq)
Posted by: Nevergiveup at December 05, 2013 12:13 PM (t3UFN)
Posted by: Bill Clinton at December 05, 2013 12:14 PM (DrC22)
Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl at December 05, 2013 12:14 PM (8JJ6O)
Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at December 05, 2013 12:15 PM (bCEmE)
I always loved that song. Here's a you-tube link if you're in the mood to hear it: http://tinyurl.com/8dk96w
Posted by: kathysaysso at December 05, 2013 12:15 PM (6H6o8)
We (well, not US...) seem to have learned nothing from this.
Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at December 05, 2013 12:15 PM (/kI1Q)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 05, 2013 12:15 PM (GEICT)
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 05, 2013 12:16 PM (m2CN7)
Posted by: Hurricane LaFawnduh at December 05, 2013 12:16 PM (pginn)
Posted by: --- at December 05, 2013 12:18 PM (MMC8r)
Posted by: AtParisParamus at December 05, 2013 12:19 PM (WkbnP)
You go with that argument Democrats.
Maybe it was Democrats intent to have flying, Skittle shitting, rainbow leaping unicorns but that's not in the text of the act.
You can't imply something is in the act based on "intent". It needs to be consistent with the text. Otherwise you could use every act of Congress to contravene the law and our Constitution.
We call that lawless or unconstitutional. At least there was a time before Obama when we did.
Oh and I have zero confidence Roberts will do anything other than invent law out of thin air again.
Posted by: Marcus at December 05, 2013 12:19 PM (5RVx8)
Posted by: NWConservative at December 05, 2013 12:19 PM (Crpyw)
Posted by: Margarita DeVille at December 05, 2013 12:19 PM (dfYL9)
>> Can I say, once again, that Roberts is a pud.
It really is a shame we couldn't prevent the Democrats from appointing him.
Wait, what?
Posted by: sandy burger at December 05, 2013 12:20 PM (6ClcK)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at December 05, 2013 12:20 PM (7ObY1)
Posted by: Barack the Magnificent at December 05, 2013 12:20 PM (DrC22)
don't know....what do you think," is it murder?
Tell her to make you a sammich while you think about it. WTH you wanted to drive to that crabcake joint someone mentioned this AM anyways. A drive and a nice meal with a motel stay might be great.
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 05, 2013 12:21 PM (DL2i+)
Posted by: Insomniac at December 05, 2013 12:21 PM (jI1Av)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at December 05, 2013 12:22 PM (7ObY1)
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at December 05, 2013 12:22 PM (oFCZn)
Turned out they had the wrong guy. Not much help to him since he was dead by then.
That case turned the locals against Prohibition in a big way.
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at December 05, 2013 04:20 PM (7ObY1
What?? I thought those kinds of things only started happening recently. s/
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 05, 2013 12:22 PM (m2CN7)
Had a really interesting talk with the guy from Blue Cross.
They know AS A FACT that this will NOT work. AT ALL. But they are doing what they are legally obligated to do.
I bitched at him a bit, and he totally understood, and said "I'm surprised more people aren't complaining." Of course it's early in the process, but still, it makes me nervous that there are not TONS of people at the door with torches and pitchforks.
The guy I spoke with was maybe in his mid 30's. Said that he can't believe we're doing this, it's going to ruin our children's lives.
It made me feel good that he understood.
Posted by: shibumi at December 05, 2013 12:23 PM (25HWz)
Posted by: SFGoth at December 05, 2013 12:23 PM (VxV3H)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 05, 2013 04:15 PM (GEICT)
Perfect!
Could you just shoot me a hard copy on letterhead?
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 05, 2013 12:23 PM (oJ5Fd)
----
Never in the field of human history has so much been taken from so many to redistribute to so few...... ya fuckin putz.
Posted by: fixerupper at December 05, 2013 12:24 PM (nELVU)
Dunno about this. The intent of those who passed the law is pretty clear -- just ask them.
And it's hard to see a Supreme Court that's comfortable with an "it's a tax -- no it's a fee!" Heisenberg approach to the letter of the law is going to care about nuance.
Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 05, 2013 12:24 PM (kdS6q)
Posted by: logprof, 'Nole Fan at December 05, 2013 12:24 PM (fETNt)
Posted by: WalrusRex at December 05, 2013 12:24 PM (Hx5uv)
Posted by: JackStraw at December 05, 2013 04:11 PM (g1DWB)
Passed by Democrats/Republicans, repealed by Democrats.
See the difference?
You all just don't want to admit that
a) the GOP has NO interest in repealing this mess
b) the Democrats have NO interest in repealing this mess
c) the courts don't want to deal with this mess.
Result, it ain't going to get repealed.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Unexpurgated Edition) at December 05, 2013 12:24 PM (LSDdO)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at December 05, 2013 12:24 PM (7ObY1)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 05, 2013 12:25 PM (GEICT)
Posted by: Nip Sip at December 05, 2013 12:25 PM (0FSuD)
I was just listening to Jamie Dupree on Hannity talking about Jonathan Turley's testimony the other day. Dupree said the Obamacare law gives TFG and the Executive Branch the power to change the law's dates whenever.
And he said he blames Congress more, because they handed Obama that power.
Can it be true that Obama is legally changing the law? If that's true - crap! I want him impeached and removed from office, and f***ing around with Obamacare dates is the best chance we've got for that.
Posted by: Marybeth at December 05, 2013 12:25 PM (Ks0w4)
The law itself jack hole.
man you guys are as adept as liberals in avoiding facts.
Keep setting up them strawmen.
Keep putting up them apples to compare with the oranges.
anything to admit that the GOP has NO intention of repealing ObamaCare.
NONE NADA ZIP ZILCH ZERO
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Unexpurgated Edition) at December 05, 2013 12:26 PM (LSDdO)
>>One McFluke, hold the STDs.
Heh. Working, as I do, for STD clinics, whenever we get donuts the Chlamydia ones are the Boston Cremes, Gonorrhea the vanilla creme, etc.
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 05, 2013 12:28 PM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: Jeanne of the North at December 05, 2013 12:28 PM (GdalM)
Posted by: Tex Lovera at December 05, 2013 12:29 PM (wtvvX)
Posted by: Margarita DeVille at December 05, 2013 12:29 PM (dfYL9)
The only people trying to do anything are those from the states themselves or a few true conservatives in the Congress.
The leadership of both parties wants this program.
They don't care if it works, doesn't work, costs too much, whatever.
The politicians LOVE the idea of having bennies to dole out and contracts to write into law for their friends.
And just wait until Amnesty is passed.
You ain't seen chaos yet until that gets passed.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Unexpurgated Edition) at December 05, 2013 12:29 PM (LSDdO)
Insurers have written millions of lines of code implementing it in their bsiness rules. They can fallback to pre-Obamacare code, but that will require reintegration of any non-Obamacare patches/maintenance that have happened since...and of course all the retesting of the updated "old" code...plus hundreds of thousands of desktop app updates that need to be pushed out into the field at doctors offices, insurance agent offices, etc to revert those workstations...and the retraining of any new'ish employees that weren't familiar with the "old" way.
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at December 05, 2013 12:30 PM (L0b3J)
Posted by: logprof, 'Nole Fan and ABA h8er at December 05, 2013 12:30 PM (fETNt)
Posted by: Jeanne of the North at December 05, 2013 04:28 PM (GdalM)
I have to admit that my retirement age would be a lot younger if I had a way to afford health insurance. Of course without having some other poor slob paying for it for me.
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 05, 2013 12:31 PM (m2CN7)
Posted by: JackStraw at December 05, 2013 12:31 PM (g1DWB)
-
Another incident: the FBI thought correctly that John Dillinger and his gang were holed up in the Little Bohemia Lodge. But as they were moving in, some innocent civilians were driving away. FBI started a one-sided Tommy gun fight with the civilians which left one dead and two others badly shot up.
Posted by: WalrusRex at December 05, 2013 12:31 PM (Hx5uv)
Posted by: jwest at December 05, 2013 12:32 PM (u2a4R)
Duke picked the wrong year to get respectable.
Though the Noles have been beating up on a suspect conference.
Don't go counting chickens before the pudding is cooked.
Posted by: eleven at December 05, 2013 12:33 PM (VhqUZ)
Posted by: Kreplach at December 05, 2013 12:33 PM (5PkZK)
Posted by: DangerGirl, home sweet home at December 05, 2013 12:33 PM (GrtrJ)
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at December 05, 2013 12:33 PM (L0b3J)
Posted by: WalrusRex at December 05, 2013 04:31 PM (Hx5uv)
As an aside, didn't the Dillinger gang get away from that fight because they had BARs ? Or was that another 30's gang?
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 05, 2013 12:34 PM (m2CN7)
Posted by: logprof, 'Nole Fan and ABA h8er at December 05, 2013 12:34 PM (fETNt)
Posted by: garrett at December 05, 2013 12:35 PM (BM/jX)
Posted by: eleven at December 05, 2013 12:36 PM (VhqUZ)
Because the public will be really jazzed to embrace Obamacare II, right?
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at December 05, 2013 12:36 PM (L0b3J)
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Unexpurgated Edition) at December 05, 2013 04:24 PM (LSDdO)
Okay, you have your conclusion and you are going to stick with even when people do answer your original question. Bitter Clinger is actually a pretty good nick for you.
Posted by: Mikey NTH - Death Capades - ObamaCare on Ice! Sponsored by the Outrage Outlet at December 05, 2013 12:36 PM (hLRSq)
Posted by: Margarita DeVille at December 05, 2013 12:36 PM (dfYL9)
Posted by: garrett at December 05, 2013 12:37 PM (BM/jX)
Posted by: logprof, 'Nole Fan and ABA h8er at December 05, 2013 12:37 PM (fETNt)
Republicans had an alternate plan (several) prior to the PPACA passage. They already included the most popular aspects (or actually the Democrats borrowed them and place them into their health care Blitzkrieg).
They have also resurfaced these again as alternatives.
The main problem is a lack of courage and stupidity which results from Republican leadership thinking this will collapse on its own. It wont.
Posted by: Marcus at December 05, 2013 12:37 PM (5RVx8)
>>You all just don't want to admit that
a) the GOP has NO interest in repealing this messb) the Democrats have NO interest in repealing this messc) the courts don't want to deal with this mess.
Result, it ain't going to get repealed.
IMHO, its more that nobody wants to touch it while there is a significant chance of political fallout to either themselves or their group, whatever that may be. They're protecting themselves from a demonstrably vindictive President and his dead-eyed zombie followers - and you would, too.
Another President would have sufficient clout to do the Necessary, but he or she would pay a price nonetheless. The Courts have the strongest claim to immunity from retribution, maybe, but whatever is ruled must be final and ironclad so do not count on them.
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 05, 2013 12:38 PM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: Nip Sip at December 05, 2013 12:39 PM (0FSuD)
>>A year or two may be too late.
IMHO, it already is. But that depends on what we're saying has gone too far, too long.
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 05, 2013 12:40 PM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: Nip Sip at December 05, 2013 12:40 PM (0FSuD)
Posted by: logprof, 'Nole Fan and ABA h8er at December 05, 2013 12:41 PM (fETNt)
Posted by: logprof, 'Nole Fan and ABA h8er at December 05, 2013 04:37 PM (fETNt)
----
** cough cough **
I coached 15 National Championships by myself. 10 of them in a row......
Posted by: Dan Gable at December 05, 2013 12:42 PM (nELVU)
Posted by: Nip Sip at December 05, 2013 12:42 PM (0FSuD)
Posted by: Nip Sip at December 05, 2013 04:40 PM (0FSuD)
----
The Rock.
Posted by: Dan Gable at December 05, 2013 12:42 PM (nELVU)
The professional/businessman with a 6 figure income or the family of four with the $60,000 / year income?
The only reason for buying insurance through healthcare.gov is to get the subsidy. If you don't get a subsidy, and you can still afford it, you probably already bought another policy directly from an insurer or through an agent.
Give it another month or two and the Dems themselves will be repealing it.
Posted by: Jimbo at December 05, 2013 12:43 PM (V70Uh)
Posted by: Schwalbe: The Me-262© at December 05, 2013 12:43 PM (9Bdcz)
Championship #3? So...you'd have he same number that Bama has gotten in the last four years?
Posted by: Country Singer at December 05, 2013 12:44 PM (LUkGY)
Buddy Epson went to UF though, so advantage Gaytors there.Posted by: logprof, 'Nole Fan and ABA h8er at December 05, 2013 12:44 PM (fETNt)
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 05, 2013 12:45 PM (m2CN7)
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 05, 2013 12:46 PM (m2CN7)
-
Yeah, John and the guys escaped. Various movies have portrayed it as members of the gang getting killed killed but only innocent persons and FBI agents were killed. Baby Face Nelson shot three FBI agents, killing one, and stole their car to make his getaway.
Posted by: WalrusRex at December 05, 2013 12:46 PM (Hx5uv)
Posted by: Country Singer at December 05, 2013 12:46 PM (LUkGY)
Posted by: Weirddave at December 05, 2013 12:47 PM (N/cFh)
Posted by: McAdams at December 05, 2013 12:51 PM (2TMCu)
Posted by: I R A Darth Aggie © at December 05, 2013 12:52 PM (1hM1d)
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at December 05, 2013 12:57 PM (oFCZn)
Posted by: PAgirlinNC at December 05, 2013 12:57 PM (mPKiR)
what makes you think you're my friend?
You don't have any friends. At least not here.
Just unknown acquaitances.
And anyone who would select a beer commercial actor as his icon/nic has some serious self esteem issues.
Just sayin'
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Unexpurgated Edition) at December 05, 2013 01:02 PM (LSDdO)
keep these morons trollin
raw lies.
Don't try to understand me
just snark and try to brand me
raw lies.
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Unexpurgated Edition) at December 05, 2013 01:05 PM (LSDdO)
There's more. Adler points out that Congress considered and rejected offering subsidies through the federal exchange, but decided on state-only availability as an inducement to the states.
Only when a majority of the states told them to go screw themselves did the Obama administration decide they had no choice but to defy the law, and offer illegal subsidies, if they wanted to get the early sign-ups rolling. All along they've banked on getting people into the exchanges and signed up, thinking the GOP would never take away insurance or subsidies from voters once they had the advantages of those things.
Posted by: MTF at December 05, 2013 01:06 PM (B5y+v)
Posted by: Dandolo at December 05, 2013 01:09 PM (0XBx+)
Posted by: Trevor@TJexcite at December 05, 2013 02:22 PM (bkAvJ)
Hell, why not just pass a law that says: "The Executive branch shall do whatever it thinks will reduce the number of uninsured people wants"?
FTFY
Posted by: jbarntt at December 05, 2013 07:00 PM (UNFot)
Posted by: Mikey NTH - Death Capades - ObamaCare on Ice! Sponsored by the Outrage Outlet at December 05, 2013 04:36 PM (hLRSq)
And you blithely elide over the fact that I pointed out their "answers" weren't answers to the question.
Just because you claim that you've "answered" doesn't mean you actually have.
I pointed out a PROGRAM and questioned when has any been REPEALED and got answers ranging from Executive orders to constitutional amendments.
See the difference.
But then YOU had your mind made up and don't want to face the facts or give any credence to the idea that ObamaCare ain't getting repealed any time soon nor likely ever. Just because folks are complaining now doesn't mean they can't tweak and twitch things to keep it alive. UNLESS the GOP actually tries to repeal it. Which doesn't seem to be happening.
And so what if I do have that as the answer? Why make a big deal out of it? Are you the blog cop?
Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Unexpurgated Edition) at December 05, 2013 07:59 PM (LSDdO)
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Posted by: Mallfly at December 05, 2013 11:50 AM (bJm7W)