1 Hmmm...something seems strange here.  Even for me.

2 Where the fuck are all you bitter clingers?

3 Wow, we boldly went where no gun thread had gone before for a second there. That's AoSHQ standard html tag closing, people. Don't try it at home.

4

Hmmm....

 

First!  And Second!

5

That's AoSHQ standard html tag closing, people. Don't try it at home.

 

 

I would pass judgement but....well, you know.

6 My handgun of choice is the Beretta 9mm, like my issued sidearm in the army. Mostly becacuse I'm really comfortable with, what with the years of training and what not. But, I like a hammer and what I consider the best safety. Saftey first, and the confidense to stride around with one in the pipe- knowing I can draw and shoot is one fluid motion. Glock make a fine pistol, but not for me.

7 As a callback to that stupid "Earth Hour" thing last night, please allow me to veer from the topic of guns for a brief second to talk about sticks ... particularly, Michael Mann & Co.'s "Hockey Stick" graph.



Fox weather guy was just on.  Said it was going to be nationwide cold right up through next Wed.  Last year in the much bally-ho'd hottest year of forever the average daily high for the year was 7° lower than the previous year. 


Liars lie, it is what they do.

8 Now that AR prices are coming down to quasi-reasonable levels, I'm now in the market for one of the cheaper ones (sorry, no LWRC or LaRue money here).  Building one's out of the question at the moment since uppers are still expensive and because I'd like to get familiar with them before I attempt a build.  I'm leaning towards an S&W M&P 15, but if anyone has any better recommendations brand-wise (Bushmaster, DPMS/Panther, Stag, Del-Ton, Sig, Windham, etc.), any suggestions are appreciated.  It'll mostly be configured for varmint hunting in wooded areas  (coyotes and such).  Thanks.

9 Howdy ya'all.

10 Unlike Mann, whose work is worshipped and protected by the Gaia cult, Bellesiles' fraud was uncovered, and his study was tossed in the wastebin. But human beings' capacity for self-delusion is a powerful thing, it seems.



And yet this discreted fk is still quoted by libtards.

11 Look at all the shooting trees on that dude's range! Badass, brah!

12 Professor, a Bushmaster is a fine choice. I bought one the week after the previous ridiculous AWB expired, and have been adding to it ever since.

13 PS: by "configured", I mostly mean furniture, attachments, and scope, not changing out the barrel, etc.

14 I trust that in Bellesiles' new book, he'll go into great detail about how the Ku Klux Klan was the paramilitary arm of the Democrat Party. Right?

15 I have a Chinese AK, and luv me some 7.62. I don't have much experience with civvy AR, but I'm really curious: Why is 223 seemiingly more popular than 5.56?

16 Posted by: Professor Marius von Totenkopf (formerly Hoss Fuentes) at March 24, 2013 10:21 AM (aozUR)

I have the plain-Jane Bushmaster A2 and it is very nice. Never jammed, the fit and finish is surprisingly good, and it is relatively accurate. If I were buying again,  would get a flat-top rather than one with the carry handle.

However, I am not an expert on these rifles, so take these comments with that in mind.

17 The lesson of Bellesiles and Mann is that once a lefty gets something in print,  it is accepted as gospel truth no matter if it is proven wrong.

Their self-promotion machinery goes into auto-pilot, and only a complete collapse of civilization will remove it from the public memory.

They will believe in global warming as the glaciers advance over Tennessee.

18 Posted by: Beefy Meatball at March 24, 2013 10:18 AM (i7B17)

Some dead White dude designed one a long time ago. It's sort of nice if you are looking for an exposed hammer, and don't mind using antiques.

It's called the Colt 1911.

19 Vic, its amazing, no? The ability to lie to oneself (and others) is a striking feature of today's left...

20 Global warming shot my dog with an assualt rifle.

21 "8 Now that AR prices are coming down to quasi-reasonable levels, I'm now in the market for one of the cheaper ones... I'm leaning towards an SW MP 15"

------------

Stop right there. I've heard nothing but great things about the M&P15 Sport, and no, you don't need the dust cover and forward assist. The 5R rifling is great, although I heard a rumor they're not using that rifling anymore.

I'll be getting one before the year is out, hopefully.

22 CBD - definitely going with a flat top, if only to make it easier to attach a scope.

Also, does mil-spec vs commercial spec matter if I'm primarily using it for targets and hunting (unless, of course, the Burning Times come, and I decide to volunteer for EoJ's Death's Head Legions)?

23

Andy-  The lying liars do nothing but lie.  This is also deeply imbedded in supposedly expert scientific organizations.  The American Academy of Pediatrics in testimony to the Senate Subcommittee last month intentionally twisted already dubious "research" to their advantage.  (Link in my nick)

 

The sequence went something like this:

 

1. Original research showed people out of doors, with a gun on them, late at night, in parts of town with high crime rates were more likely to be shot in an assault.

 

2. The original researchers mathematically cancelled all of those factors except 'having a gun on them', and claimed that having a gun in your possession makes you four times more likely to be shot.

 

3. AAP wrote a policy statement saying evidence "suggests" you are four times more likely...

 

4. AAP refers to its own policy statement in testimony, saying flat out "individuals possessing a firearm are more than four times more likely to be shot".

 

These people are despicable.  We need to shine every light we have on every little dark crevice where they are hiding.

24

Colt 1911? Never heard of it.

25 That's a soft air revolver. Don't doubt me, I'm an expert.

26 Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 24, 2013 10:26 AM (3Mkrp)



Guess you're not the person in New Jersey that won the powerball jackpot.....being here right now and all.




Has anyone seen Nevergiveup?

27 Big article defending Mann in the Yale Alumni Magazine this month, further confirming why I do not contribute to my alma mater. As bad as it was in the late '80s, it is worse now.

28

Miss Marple,

 

Last thread you asked about a bizarre post by Deety. She, I think it's a she, made some equally bizarre posts near the end of last night's ONT.

29 Just picked up my second Nagant revolver. Yes, it's the dumbest military revolver ever made, but $150 for a genuine piece of Romanov- and deserter-killing history is cheap. If you have one, you can reduce the trigger pull from impossible to just heavy by pulling the sideplate, bringing it to full cock, and inserting a properly-shaped hunk of lead under the mainspring in the little recess there to pre-load the spring. Just Bing "lighten nagant revolver trigger pull" or somesuch and you'll find a Nagant forum thread about it. Go to page 2 to see the original Russian mashed-bullet method. Don't use the hex nut method the first poster describes, and I didn't use needle-nose pliers to compress the spring, either.

30 My favorite Yale experience (well, only one): 1986, football game, in my cadet greys: got spat on and called babykiller by 3 teenie bitches. I laughed at them and walked on.

31 I don't get why people say "an historic." You don't say, "I'm going to buy an hickory tree."

Where did this rule come from? It makes no sense.

32
"...his Bancroft Prize-winning book Arming America"




Psst. Columbia UniversityÂ’s trustees took back the Bancroft history prize it had awarded the book.

33 Liberals never change. No matter how badly one of their number is exposed as a liar, they won't ever question the beliefs the liar was working to support. Note how the article author insists those who exposed Bellesiles 'got lucky.' After all, they're just a bunch of gun nuts. They couldn't possibly be intelligent people who did better work on a historical issue than the academics who actively chose to avoid the truth.

34 Oh, I see. In days of yore, historic was pronounced with a silent H. Thanks, Google.

35 #28  I am uneasy about things where people infer illegal activity on this site.

Perhaps someone should go take a look at that post.  It was creepy to me.

36 My favorite Yale experience (well, only one): 1986, football game, in my cadet greys: got spat on and called babykiller by 3 teenie bitches. I laughed at them and walked on. First of all, thank you for your service. Second of all, that anecdote (unfortunately) doesn't surprise me. My gang and I did what we could to be vocally conservative, but we were vastly outnumbered by douchebags.

37 So basically, when you say "an historic,"  you're using an antiquated rule that makes no sense given how the word is pronounced today.

38 OK, let me try that Tinyurl thing. Here's the second page of that Nagant trigger-pull thread:

http://tinyurl.com/acbdwh8

39 #31

It's because 'H' is often unpronounced, leaving the resulting word said as if it began with a vowel. So 'an' is used to insert a hard consonant separator. Same thing with words beginning with 'X' but those don't up nearly as often.

40 Gotcher sexy right here.

Got one of these in memory of Chris Kyle.  I didn't know Chris, I know men that did.  I tried to track him at SHOT in Jan to shake his hand, but always missed him by 1 minute or less as he hit the booths.  Little bit mad at the universe that our paths never crossed, he was a good man.

http://tinyurl.com/cde367g

41 Posted by: Tami at March 24, 2013 10:32 AM (X6akg)

Ah yes...the lottery. A tax on stupid people.

42 Liberals lie to themselves everyday; it's fucking bizarre- especially pols and punds. They'll make up a lie- knowing it's a lie, to dodge or deflect. But, then the Juice Box Mafia parrots the lie, they- like forget they made it up and think, "Hey, I saw this on Madcow, so it must be a true fact!!!11!!"


I think maybe acid flashbacks can be passed on to your children.

43 My favorite Yale experience (well, only one): 1986, football game, in my cadet greys: got spat on and called babykiller by 3 teenie bitches. I laughed at them and walked on.

That happened to me in uniform on Division Street in Chicago in '68.  I was enlisted so my options were a bit more extensive.  Somewhere there is an aging hippy with a crooked nose.  The memory still warms me on cold nights.

44 well shit, apparently the gaming thread has been picked up by Breitbart

45 I ate an hot dog yesterday.

46 Somewhere there is an aging hippy with a crooked nose. The memory still warms me on cold nights.

Posted by: trainer @ LIB at March 24, 2013 10:44 AM (1QEkm)


I wish it'd been on camera.  I'd pay good money to see that.

47 Tokarev (the gun designer) borrowed heavily from Browning's 1905 for the design of his famous pistol. I only bring it up because, of all the handguns I own, the Polish Radom Tokarev is my hands-down favorite, with my Smith and Wesson K-38 Target Masterpiece .38 Special revolver running a close second. I simply can't miss with my Tokarev. Strangely enough (to me), friends of mine who've shot my Tok at the range don't care for it at all. They tell me it doesn't feel right in the hand. Which brings up a point I've wondered about: are we attracted to and better at using firearms that accommodate different body type variations? For example, I'm very familiar with the 1911 platform. The Army Colt .45 was my issued weapon when I was an Assistant Gunner on an M60 machinegun team (yes, it was a long time ago). I qualified with the .45 regularly and was good with it, but never really liked the way it felt. I'm a small-framed guy with somewhat smallish hands and--to me--the 1911 always felt cumbersome and unbalanced while my Tokarev feels melded to my hand, a natural extension of my arm.

48 21 I would not not not get an AR without a dust cover ever

49 21 I would not not not get an AR without a dust cover ever

Posted by: DAve at March 24, 2013 10:47 AM (XDC0v)

...the hell? that's like buying a car without doors.

50 15 223 is supposedly cheaper and will work better in a 5.56 gun than 5.56 does in a .223 gun

51 @17 The lesson of Bellesiles and Mann is that once a lefty gets something in print, it is accepted as gospel truth no matter if it is proven wrong. Their self-promotion machinery goes into auto-pilot, and only a complete collapse of civilization will remove it from the public memory. They will believe in global warming as the glaciers advance over Tennessee. Posted by: Miss Marple at March 24, 2013 10:27 AM (GoIUi) The best example of this is Margaret Mead- who was absolutely proven decades ago, beyond a shadow of a doubt, to be a complete fraud. Every bit of her "research" into the sexual mores of Pacific Islanders was not only a lie but counter-factual. But, who, last I saw, still has a wing dedicated to her in a NY Museum of Natural History. And is still quoted by leftard "scientists" and Social "scientists" because she p"proves" their theories on human society and sexuality. And as the final cherry on the top- Mead spent her final days practicing witchcraft. So...you know...that was a mighty fine scientific brain right there.

52 That happened to me in uniform on Division Street in Chicago in '68. I was enlisted so my options were a bit more extensive. Somewhere there is an aging hippy with a crooked nose. The memory still warms me on cold nights.

Posted by: trainer @ LIB at March 24, 2013 10:44 AM (1QEkm)

Happened to me at the SF airport back in 1972.  Only they did not hit me just the floor.  When I turned on them they ran like the chickenshit SOBs they were.

We had to wear uniforms then to get a military discount on our flights.

53 49 21 I would not not not get an AR without a dust cover ever

----------------------

There's no dust where I live.

54

Same thing with words beginning with 'X' but those don't up nearly as often.

 

 

No respect I tells ya....no respect.

55 22  For normal use it doesn't matter.  Milspec costs almost twice as much- let that be your second AR.  And yes there will be a second

56 15 223 is supposedly cheaper and will work better in a 5.56 gun than 5.56 does in a .223 gun

Posted by: DAve at March 24, 2013 10:48 AM (XDC0v)

you want to shoot the caliber the gun was manufactured to fire.  I'll save the physics discussion.

That said, avoid the 855.  Steel core sounds sexy, but it blows when it comes to making the bad guy fall down.

57 #23

So the 'high crime rate' didn't overwhelm every other factor? Once you have that in the mix, all of the other details lack weight. I'd give 'carrying a gun' as much importance as 'wearing denim' if the list starts with 'high crime rate.'

But that would require thinking and I imagine that is a bothersome waste of valuable Congressional time.

58

The best example of this is Margaret Mead- who was absolutely proven decades ago, beyond a shadow of a doubt, to be a complete fraud. 

 

 

Now that's just crazy talk.

59 For normal use it doesn't matter. Milspec costs almost twice as much- let that be your second AR. And yes there will be a second

Posted by: DAve at March 24, 2013 10:50 AM (XDC0v)

I went Sig for #2.  or was it #4?  or #7... anyway...

60 54  I left one of my dust covers open one day and ended up with a small beach in my action.  CA desert-

61

#35

MM,

 

I did. If you go to last night's ONT it's first post is #845. It makes several more equally bizarre posts.

62 31 I don't get why people say "an historic." You don't say, "I'm going to buy an hickory tree."

Where did this rule come from? It makes no sense.

Posted by: Warden at March 24, 2013 10:38 AM (0DlnM)

I dunno if it's a rule, but it kinda makes sense when the stress is on a non-leading syllable. "A history lesson" versus "An historical event."

63 Good stuff.

64 Then consider that people (like the publisher interviewed in the IHE piece) defend Bellesiles to this day. Like modern environmentalism, hating guns and, by extension, gun owners and the NRA is a matter of faith on the left.


Yup.  If I had done what Bellesiles did while I was doing my research on my history degree, I would have been expelled with no hope of being readmitted and my professors would have made sure that anywhere else I applied knew exactly why.   I've gotten into what I consider shocking arguments by those who defend what he did because he was seeking of a Higher Truth. 


If you ever wanted to know why I don't have a career in academia, that's part of the reason why.  I cannot sit there and shut up about fraud, even if it were to support my side.  Truth is truth and if it's inconvenient for your position, mayhap it's your position that should be reevaluated, not reality.

65 60 Hahaha nice choice.  I got a Spike's in Dec. for $900 that I haven't even shot yet

66
"I dunno if it's a rule, but it kinda makes sense when the stress is on a non-leading syllable. "A history lesson" versus "An historical event."

------------------

Bingo.

67 Someone put me some knowledge. Whats the best way to remove cosmoline? I was going to use degreaser on the metal and a hair dryer on the wood. Better ideas?

68 AR's are like potato chips (can't have just one), except that an AR can get you more potato chips while potato chips will rarely get you any AR's

69 "A history lesson" versus "An historical event."

the rule is in how you'd verbalize it.  First example starts with a "HISSS" sound.  Second it an "Istorical."

This is why we all hate english majors.

70 I ordered a BSA scope for my .22 upon the advice of Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. in the last thread and a set of cheapo medium height rings.  Can't wait until Tuesday...

71 Truth is truth and if it's inconvenient for your position, mayhap it's your position that should be reevaluated, not reality. Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Take us away. at March 24, 2013 10:54 AM (Gk3SS) Yes, this. I try to follow the logic and go where it takes me. Sometimes it takes me to unhappy places. So be it.

72

So the 'high crime rate' didn't overwhelm every other factor? Once you have that in the mix, all of the other details lack weight. I'd give 'carrying a gun' as much importance as 'wearing denim' if the list starts with 'high crime rate.'

*******

 Yeah, kind of a "duh" moment, eh?   In addition- the original researchers listed 677 shooting victims, of whom 40 (less than 6%) had a gun on them when they were shot, compared to 94% who did not have a gun.  What kind of statistical contortionism do you have to engage in for that to come out as 4 times more likely to be shot if you have a gun? 

73 71  Brown truck Santa is da MAN!!!

74 @59 Yeah, Rachel Carson > Margaret Mead Cuz Mead's phoney-baloney scientific fraud didn't lead to the agonizing, slow death of millions as has Carson's. So, yes, congratulations Rachel you win first prize as "The Totally Irresponsible Fraudulent Scientific Dickweed Murderess of the 20th Century." Please collect your prize in hell.

75 Now I will entertain y'all by playing a tune on an xylophone.

76 miss marple someone needs and intervention tout de suite!

77 Someone put me some knowledge. Whats the best way to remove cosmoline? I was going to use degreaser on the metal and a hair dryer on the wood.

Better ideas?

Posted by: DC in Towson, assault human at March 24, 2013 10:56 AM (jIaZt)

Kerosene in a galvanized steel trashcan.  But do not blow yourself up.

78 I ordered a BSA scope for my .22 upon the advice of Dept. Of Accuracy Dept. in the last thread and a set of cheapo medium height rings. Can't wait until Tuesday...

Posted by: Sandra Fluke's award-winning solid gold diaphragm at March 24, 2013 10:56 AM (7xeJQ)

Marksmanship has more to do with consistency and technique than equipment when you start out.

You can buy a Daisy bb gun and build solid fundamentals and start shooting smiley faces on targets at 20 meters.  THEN you start upgrading.  Most people do it in reverse order.

79 Snappy tune. You can dance to it.

80 Someone put me some knowledge. Whats the best way to remove cosmoline? I was going to use degreaser on the metal and a hair dryer on the wood. Better ideas? Posted by: DC in Towson, assault human at March 24, 2013 10:56 AM (jIaZt) Brake cleaning spray on the metal, followed by a mineral spirit bath for the smaller parts. I used a hair dryer on the last two Mosin stocks I cleaned up but read about a guy who sticks the stocks in garbage bags, puts them in his trunk in the summertime, and leaves them in there for a week or so. According to him, it works like a charm.

81 "68 Someone put me some knowledge. Whats the best way to remove cosmoline? I was going to use degreaser on the metal and a hair dryer on the wood."

----------------

For the metal, I just boil a kettle of water and pour it over. Repeat as necessary. Dissolves the cosmo right quick. Do it outside or clean the tub before the missus gets home.

Afterwards, oil the metal up immediately, everywhere. I shoot WD-40 to displace the water, then gun oil.

For the wood, wipe as much as you can, leave it in the sun for a day, wipe up what sweats out, repeat for days until it stops sweating. Some guys keep it in their hot cars with paper underneath, but I don't want my whip smelling like cosmo.

82

But I do have to get an X-ray. 

 

 

So go figure.

83 @8: I've got an (a?) S&W MP15OR (flat top optics ready) with an Eotec that drives tacks and runs like a John Deere tractor. Keep away from the Russian Tula ammo, though. It is pure crap in a good AR.

84 Yes, this. I try to follow the logic and go where it takes me. Sometimes it takes me to unhappy places. So be it. Posted by: troyriser at March 24, 2013 10:56 AM (ptcFO)


We've discussed this here before, but if the various QEs and the like actually worked, then I would reevaluate my views on economics.   That they've failed does not appear to affect those who believe in those views in the least. 

85 An halibut?

86

Please collect your prize in hell.

 

 

Satan has yet to find a barbed cock big enough for me.

87 I turned on the TV early this am to check news and weather. Fox and local on commercial, so I began scrolling through. CNN's "I Just ate an entire bag of " Candy Crowley was gleefully interviewing Hickenlooper regarding CO new gun grab. Immediately moved to next channel, HLN was highlighting it's own version of the CO gun grab, and the next channel, ESPN, had an hour story about athletes and guns. Asking friend of Belcher if he thought had Belcher not had a gun , would he and girlfriend still be alive.... But when I desperately scrolled ahead to get back to Fox, there was channel after channel with movies, series, etc. all featuring lots of violence, guns, etc. MTV channels were having a Rhiannathon...video was her S & M several people while she was crooning about somebody she just met.....I turned the entire thing off. Which way to church....

88 My personal experience with lying and academia (BIRM): You remember hearing about how Eskimos had like 23 different words for snow? And how it was supposed to show how close the Eskimos were to nature, unlike the evil white men who stole their land? Well, randomly picking through the stacks in the library I found the original work. It turned out that point of the author* was that the 23 (or whatever number) different terms for snow used by Eskimos were the equivalent of "sleet", "powder", "slush", "wet snow", etc. -- basically the same descriptions of snow used by western culture. We all described snow in the same basic terms, only westerners commonly used adjectives while Eskimos used different words. Which makes perfect sense, since the work was done by an anthropologist and the main goal of anthropology is to discover cultural constants. I discussed the subject with a visiting professor from England (stuffy bastard) and he, a professional anthropologist, believed in the whole "noble savage" explanation of the 23 terms for snow. When I showed him a copy of the article he was stunned -- so stunned that he insisted I let him keep the copy. *I believe the original research was done by Frazer but I may be wrong on that. It was, however, done by a very prominent British anthropologist of the day.

89

An halibut?

 

 

Ahem.

 

 

An halibut event.

90 86 An halibut?

----------

Nope. The stress is on the first syllable.

91 with an Eotec that drives tacks and runs like a John Deere tractor. Keep away from the Russian Tula ammo, though. It is pure crap in a good AR.

Posted by: Felix Arabia, MD, Chancre Mechanic to the Stars at March 24, 2013 11:02 AM (Pjq2D)


depending on range.  My EoTech is fine for door kicking but at 200 meters the "tacks" are the size of basketballs.  Swap it out for a Trij.

92 That INSIDE HIGHER ED article spares no contempt for the ignernt gun-lovin' hillbillies, does it? Perhaps showing the kind of bias that made Bellesiles comfortable enough to think he could get away with it?

93 They couldn't possibly be intelligent people who did better work on a historical issue than the academics who actively chose to avoid the truth.

Posted by: epobirs at March 24, 2013 10:39 AM (kcfmt)

Than the academics who actively chose to VOID the truth (slight change for  fullness  of truth)

94 I turned the entire thing off. Which way to church....

Posted by: Jen at March 24, 2013 11:04 AM (UvHXN)

...and this is why we dropped cable/DirecTV 9 months ago.  Nexflix and Amazon prime.  You'll never go back.

95 As a TRADOC XO, I'd walk the firing line until I heard a struggling private complain about his crappy weapon. And, they were shit. But, I'd pull the private off the line, take his weapon, miss the first shot- then ping the shit outta the rest. "See there? Now listen to your drill sergeant, an learn how to shoot."

96 Keep away from the Russian Tula ammo, though. It is pure crap in a good AR. Posted by: Felix Arabia, MD, Chancre Mechanic to the Stars at March 24, 2013 11:02 AM (Pjq2D) Tula is crap in an AR platform (and I won't use any of their ammo in my American/western-made pistols), but shoots reliably enough in my commie surplus firearms; e.g., Mosin, Makarov, Radom, Tokarev.

97

"See there? Now listen to your drill sergeant, an learn how to shoot."

 

 

An learning event.

98 Posted by: phoenixgirl,commenteron a conservative award winningblog at March 24,2013 10:59 AM(GVxQo Sent her a message on Twitter to ask if she's okay. She doesn't follow me so I can't send her a more detailed private message.

99 An learning event.

Posted by: Lurking Canuck at March 24, 2013 11:08 AM (vN7SY)

ya'll canadeeans never did learn to speak right!

100

An histrionic hippy? 

or

 

A histrionic hippy

 

Emphasis is on the third syllable the way I say it.

101 #89

I never understood that myself. Having a sophisticated vocabulary seems to me the opposite of being close to nature. Rather, it's a manifestation of what separates humans from the beasts. If all you've got is snow, snow, and more snow, you'll soon have snow nerds who correct any casual observation that there is snow by insisting it be winnowed down to the exact form.

102 There's lots of good ARs out there. I have a Bushie A2M2 flat top and a Colt 6920 now, but have owned several others in the past. Do an online search and you'll find articles out there that compare different ARs. The Bushie has a 1 in 9 twist and the Colt a 1 in 7 twist. 1 in 7 was the mil spec initially 'cause they started out shooting heavier bullets. 1 in 9 is fine as you'll likely be using 55 gr bullets. You can buy nearly any twist you want aftermarket (when there's not a run on things) so twist rate really shouldn't be a consideration. I also have a couple AK47s. Ammo used to be cheap for these beasts, and they were designed to fire no matter, requiring little maintenance. 223 can be reloaded as most of it is brass (the Russians also make 223 steel). 7.62 for the AKs is almost all Russian steel cased and cannot be reloaded. You can get brass 7.62 but it's expensive. You just can't have too many guns.

103 Just went with my buddy to pick up 2 mossberg500 12 and 410. Virtually unshot.$200 each. Then 100 box of shells for $25. Cheaper than shooting anything except 22.

104

Swiftboating:  Pointing out the lies and deceptions of the left and identifying them as such.

 

It takes two for a lie to be successful:  One to tell it and one to believe it.  Swiftboating is a threat to the Left's success because it undermines the belief in the lie.

105 It is always instructive to track back to the original research.   Not something most modern day "journalists" are willing, much less able, to do.

106 91 86
An halibut?

----------

Nope. The stress is on the first syllable.

Posted by: Taro Tsujimoto at March 24, 2013 11:04 AM (celt+)

Non-limeys stress the first syllable and the 'h'.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/halibut?s=t

No, I am not an English major.

107 Hey, "Anaxerxes" is not the same as an Xerxes.

'Taint about the Henglish, it's about the Greek. We don't think of "H" as an imported letter, but it kinda-sorta is. A Greek "H" is eta, sounds like "A." Greek does its voicings with little-bitty marks up above, strokes -- strophes. A bad stroke is a catastrophe. A high stroke is an apostrophe.

So English uses "H" differently from its original use, to avoid using breath-marks. The rest is Cockney, and elision. A lot of speech is silence: mostly very brief silences. And to write in Cockney or Northumbrian, you use a lot of strophes.

Sure, "X" is an imported Greek letter. I wonder if UPS ever realized that in Greek they could put all their initials in one letter. Oopsilon. You don't often think of "Y" as being foreign to Yerp. I was shopping in Verviers, Belgium, and a shopkeeper insisted on writing me out a receipt with my name on it. My meat-world surname has a "Y" in it,  and he couldn't do one. My splendidly multilingual guide had to prompt him, "Griechischen" - and he dutifully penned in an upsilon in place of a "Y."

108 It is always instructive to track back to the original research. Not something most modern day "journalists" are willing, much less able, to do.

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at March 24, 2013 11:13 AM (p8Mda)

The problem is that most reporters will never list the source document (or any document) for their lying bullshit.

109

ya'll canadeeans never did learn to speak right!

 

 

It's 'you  'all'!  Remember to add the extra 'u's!

 

 

Speaking of snow....I have about 79 different word for it.

 

 

And they all start with fuckingoddamnmutherfuckin.

110 An heteronormative  exercise?   I don't think so. It's not the location of the emphasis, it is the spoken pronunciation of the word that governs usage of 'a' versus 'an'.  

111 102 If all you've got is snow, snow, and more snow, you'll soon have snow nerds who correct any casual observation that there is snow by insisting it be winnowed down to the exact form. Posted by: epobirs at March 24, 2013 11:10 AM (kcfmt) OK, that made me LOL.

112 book thread up

113

I was at the Marverick Arms (Mossberg) plant this week, doing bidness. Short version: the meager production still in Connecticut is coming to Texas; they expect to produce 700K units this year.

 

 

So, help a brother out and buy a new one.

114 The problem is that most reporters will never list the source document (or any document) for their lying bullshit.

Posted by: Vic at March 24, 2013 11:14 AM (53z96)

 

********

 

Yep.  It takes time and diligence on the part of the reader.  And most readers  do not bother  to do that  any more than the writers do.  The trick, I think, is to determine those who are willfully lying and expose them. Hard to do in practice, I know.

115 Posted by: naturalfake at March 24, 2013 10:49 AM (G9qZk) I was a anthro major in grad school (never finished) and was delighted when Mead was exposed as a liar and fraud. Of course, I had suspected that much of anthropology was a fraud for most of my academic career. That, and the fact that I was sweating my ass off digging square holes with lots of people with Master's Degrees, made me realize that getting one wasn't going to help me any.

116 111 An heteronormative exercise? I don't think so

----------

You're right. Because it's the first syllable that's stressed in "heteronormative." Or "hickory."

If the second syllable is stressed, it's "an." As in, "an historic."

117 depending on range. My EoTech is fine for door kicking but at 200 meters the "tacks" are the size of basketballs. Swap it out for a Trij. The 3X magnifier brings the groups right back in at 200 and swings out of the way for up close and personal. YMMV, but I like it

118 1 in 7 was the mil spec initially 'cause they started out shooting heavier bullets. 1 in 9 is fine as you'll likely be using 55 gr bullets.

Posted by: laddy at March 24, 2013 11:10 AM (znNnT)


Yes, but what always jacks you up is during night ops when you've got 1 in 4 of 856 that come in 64 grain.  You'd think the energy loss due to thermal would fix it (and fk me if it doesn't tear through barrels) but you still have to adjust for precision shooting.

Tracer sounds sexy.  It ain't.

119 Dirty, filthy commie Tula runs just fine in a 5.56 Galil. Probably run fine in any of the gas piston 5.56 systems out there.

120 The 3X magnifier brings the groups right back in at 200 and swings out of the way for up close and personal. YMMV, but I like it

Posted by: Felix Arabia, MD, Chancre Mechanic to the Stars at March 24, 2013 11:21 AM (Pjq2D)

Hey, it's whatever works and keeps you not dead.

121 106 It is always instructive to track back to the original research. Not something most modern day "journalists" are willing, much less able, to do. I did just that for a few months and found every citation I researched was either misquoted, out of context or had morphed over time by researchers citing other researchers on and on until the original point was totally lost.

122 So, help a brother out and buy a new one.

Posted by: Beefy Meatball at March 24, 2013 11:17 AM (i7B17)

Already have a 590.  Can't duel wield shotguns (wish!).  Behind you in spirit.

123 Andy, Late to the party. Just a short note to thank you for the great gun thread and the great posts yesterday!

124 We've discussed this here before, but if the various QEs and the like actually worked, then I would reevaluate my views on economics. That they've failed does not appear to affect those who believe in those views in the least. Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Take us away. at March 24, 2013 11:03 AM (Gk3SS) Many economists on the Left are driven by ideologically based and very false assumptions. The Democrats, for example, are dismissive of debt and bullish on spending not because they're complete idiots but because they seem blissfully unaware that spending creates a drag that becomes a weight that becomes an impossible obstacle to any forward movement. They also seem to think the federal government is an engine of growth, and that additional taxation will stimulate the economy. They believe it because they believe it, not because it's based on facts or anything. I strongly doubt Bernanke believes yet another round of qualitative easing will accomplish anything useful. He's a smart guy in an impossible position attempting to forestall the inevitable.

125 111 An heteronormative exercise? I don't think so. It's not the location of the emphasis, it is the spoken pronunciation of the word that governs usage of 'a' versus 'an'.

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at March 24, 2013 11:15 AM (p8Mda)

Right. But, the focus upon syllabic emphasis came about due to the observation regarding pronunciation of H-words--which, in turn, dictates the usage of "a" versus "an."

126 I learned the "how not to" lesson many years ago - the hard way.  Only did it once but I still have the scar to remind me.

127 I love the term "automatic Colt pistol," or ACP. My ACP-user is the Hechler & Koch HK45, produced by the Koch brothers, famous gun manufacturers. At the gun counter at the Bass Pro Shop store in San Antonio, I asked if they had the Beretta TX-4 Storm 12 gage semiauto tactical shotgun. They do not carry them, I wuz told.

128 it's "an." As in, "an historic."

Posted by: Taro Tsujimoto at March 24, 2013 11:20 AM (celt+)

Who says "historic" that way tho? That's not how you pronounce it...

129 I bought two stripped AR lowers. I built one into a 15lb "sniper" with a 1x8 twist 5.5 barrel for heavier bullets, a two stage Nation Match trigger, heavy-duty everything, and used a dozen or more manufacturers. I had the mag well engraved with a 9-11 memorial logo. The thing will shoot into about a half-inch at 100 yards with match ammo. The second lower I'm building into a .45 CQB carbine.

130 Right. But, the focus upon syllabic emphasis came about due to the observation regarding pronunciation of H-words--which, in turn, dictates the usage of "a" versus "an."

Posted by: Sandra Fluke's award-winning solid gold diaphragm at March 24, 2013 11:25 AM (7xeJQ)

you guys are trying to pin down a language held together by baling wire and duct tape.

131 About the use of a vs. an and the pronunciation of the letter H: The usage of an vs. a depends upon whether the leading H is aspirated. That's one thing I did learn from anthropology. Second hand, mind you, from a co-worker with an anthro degree.

132 Ponca City home defender ... article does not name homeowner, or give his address, but does name neighbor "across the street." Doesn't this undercut whatever protection is afforded by not ID'ing the homeowner? "As the caller waited for police, the intruder managed to break into the home." Gee, it's just like that saying...

133 Swiftboating: Pointing out the lies and deceptions of the leftand identifying them as such. It takes two for a lie to be successful: One to tell it and one to believe it. Swiftboating is a threat to the Left's success because it undermines the belief in the lie. Posted by: Minuteman at March 24, 2013 11:11 AM (dSE0q) 'Swiftboating': Rightfully questioning the character and integrity of a highly touted war hero politician awarded three Purple Hearts without spending a single day in the Infirmary.

134 I bought two stripped AR lowers. I built one into a 15lb "sniper" with a 1x8 twist 5.5 barrel for heavier bullets, a two stage Nation Match trigger, heavy-duty everything, and used a dozen or more manufacturers. I had the mag well engraved with a 9-11 memorial logo. The thing will shoot into about a half-inch at 100 yards with match ammo.

The second lower I'm building into a .45 CQB carbine.

Posted by: Trainer @ LIB at March 24, 2013 11:26 AM (y5n9/)

my book rec for you:

Navy SEAL Sniper (by Glen Doherty, KIA, Brandon Webb, and Chris Kyle)

We've got 24/7 security on BW to keep him breathing... seems this particular crew is given to gettin' shot.

135 All Team 3 guys.  (and for you little up and coming gremlins who want to be studs?  Team 3)

136 Who says "historic" that way tho? That's not how you pronounce it...

Posted by: KG at March 24, 2013 11:26 AM (IPz9m)

--------------------

How do you pronounce "the"? Do you pronounce it "thuh" or "thee"?

Depends, doesn't it?

137 lying & academia... what did Rather say... wrong but true... no... Always knew about the snow words thing. Oklahomans have forty words for dirt, though.

138 I love these Sunday grammar threads.

139

How come I'm A SOB for not taking my wife to AN estate sale?

140 Mind you, I've also an fruit bat, named Eric.

141 Watching him shoot the KSG in the follow-up video makes me want to keep my head down, for sure. That is a nice weapon. Lots of capacity and setup the way he has it rigged, a real yum-yum lip-smacker.

142 @137 Has to be a Duh Ohio State University joke in there, somewhere...

143 How do you pronounce "the"? Do you pronounce it "thuh" or "thee"?
Depends, doesn't it?

Posted by: Taro Tsujimoto at March 24, 2013 11:32 AM (celt+)

Huh? I'm talking about the word, historic, you pronounce the h, at least that's what I was taught and I just checked on one of those online dictionaries, and it seems to be so...

144 #140

Because you're applying a decoded interpretation of the acronym. If you regard SOB as a word in it's own right, then you can be an SOB.

145 That happened to me in uniform on Division Street in Chicago in '68. I was enlisted so my options were a bit more extensive. Somewhere there is an aging hippy with a crooked nose. The memory still warms me on cold nights. Posted by: trainer @ LIB at March 24, 2013 10:44 AM (1QEkm) There are more than one! I went to the democrat convention in Chicago in 68 and had the pleasure of watching Chicago's finest beat the shit out of a bunch of hippies on Michigan Ave. Good times, baby. Ole Mayor Daily did not take any shit.

146 You fuckers continue to argue over "A" or "AN" and I'm going to claymore the whole goddam place.

147 143 @137 Has to be a Duh Ohio State University joke in there, somewhere... Posted by: comatus at March 24, 2013 11:38 AM (qaVK+) Golf clap.

148 There are more than one! I went to the democrat convention in Chicago in 68 and had the pleasure of watching Chicago's finest beat the shit out of a bunch of hippies on Michigan Ave. And I have 2 cousins who were members of the Chicago PD administering those ass whuppins. Good times indeed.

149 147 You fuckers continue to argue over "A" or "AN" and I'm going to claymore the whole goddam place. Posted by: tangonine at March 24, 2013 11:47 AM (x3YFz) Shouldn't that be "goddamn", with an "n"? [Shouted from behind adequate cover from a M18A1.]

150 ... I'm going to claymore the whole goddam place. THUH whole goddam place or THEE whole goddam place?

151 Ok, bringing us back to GUNS, as is wont of the threat, I have this to pose as either a future topic or current thread thingy: Has anyone used the 'ol filter' adaptation of the 'cleaning solvent' adapter/silencer? I've got all my parts for multi applications, but not been to a range to fire one yet....

152 No. I have "goddam" from T.E. Kinney PhD, a Swarthmore man.
And of course, it's DIS goddam place. Settles everything, don't it?

153 Got my SASS membership materials today. Nickel City Dave is in da hoose(gow)!

154 "Has anyone used the 'ol filter' adaptation of the 'cleaning solvent' adapter/silencer?"

--------------

Er?

155 Just received my M&P with 17 round mags with plenty of time before the new limit goes into effect here in Colorado. Now if only I could find some ammo. Can't even find snap caps locally.

156
We've got 24/7 security on BW to keep him breathing... seems this particular crew is given to gettin' shot.

Posted by: tangonine at March 24, 2013 11:31 AM (x3YFz)

I had not known they were both seals known to eachother.

it's really odd they are both dead mths from eachother

157 Back in the day, I bought Arming America, and it sucked ass so badly I couldn't get all the way thru it.  I don't normally throw away books when I'm done with them, but that one went right in the fucking dumpster.

158 Yup. The proper grip was a big part of the gun classes I took.

159 This discussion about the grammatical use of the indefinite artcle for words that begin with "H" is giving me an headache.

160

A major new work of popular history, 1877 is also notable as the comeback book for a celebrated U.S. historian.

 

Classic Communist technique, as detailed by Whitaker Chambers.

 

Reds disperse themselves throughout opinion-forming organizations, then validate each other through describing other Reds with honorifics ("celebrated," in this case), awards, honors, and other recognition (e.g., Nobel Peace Prizes).

 

Then the cite their comrade as a manufactured authority on the subject, with whom the unwashed are not permitted to disagree. Anyone questioning the credentials of said comrade is immediately subjected to ad hominem vituperation, and discounted as a "crank," a "right-winger," etc.

161

We've discussed this here before, but if the various QEs and the like actually worked, then I would reevaluate my views on economics. That they've failed does not appear to affect those who believe in those views in the least.

 

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Take us away. at March 24, 2013 11:03 AM (Gk3SS)

 

Bullseye. I would do exactly the same. If any of the leftist crap actually worked, I would have a rethink too. But the fact that I can predict what will happen - and be borne out by events - supports my original hypothesis regarding the leftist crap. Namely, that it is crap.

162 The proper grip was a big part of the gun classes I took. Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at March 24, 2013 12:30 PM When I was a kid we were trained six weeks before a handgun was actually in our hands. A 30" piece of 2" wooden dowel was drilled in the middle and a 3' piece of rope was knotted to it. The other end was tied to a brick. Roll it up, roll it down. Every afternoon after school for five minutes. Did that for two weeks. Then two bricks for two weeks, then a cinder block. Then twice a week for years. I still have Popeye arms from that shit but I can still draw and shoot a .45LC single handed and hit a soda can at 15yrds every time.

163 Taro-
As in what my sig is linking to.

http://tinyurl.com/bbbs6os

164 Scuffed blueing on new Mossberg 18.5" and 20" 12 ga barrels. Not sure if it happens at the factory, or afterwards in shipping due to minimal packaging.

I read multiple reviews at various outfitter websites regarding this issue on the $100 18"  cylinder-bore barrel, so I sprung for the $170 20" barrel with vent rib and accu-set choke. Came scuffed up, too, and I expect if I sent it back I'd end up with another one based on what I've read. Will have to brush on my art skills with a blueing pen.

Anyone else noticing this quality or packaging issue?

165 The premise of Michael A. Bellesiles 'research' made no sense from the inception. Not only do most Americans not have a will, simply because it is often unnecessary, but personal possessions are usually disposed of inter vivos. For instance, does the failure of wills in America to mention rocking chairs mean there was a deficit?

166 Why the fuck are we having a grammar lesson when there's GUNZ to be discussed???



5.56 vs .223. It has to do with case pressures, the 5.56 isn't tested in the same labs (being military) as .223 so the case pressures are a bit higher. Bottom line, .223 in a 5.56 chamber is OK, 5.56 in a .223 chamber probably not so much.


Here's a pretty good study: http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/5-56-vs-223/



I like my Saiga in .223. Maybe it's not a MOA tack-driver at 10,000 miles like the vaunted AR-15, but it will make minute-of-dickbeater shots at 200 yards all day long, and that's all I need it to do. And, fully accoutremented and modified by moi made it mine mine mine, and for about half the total cost (at the time) as a generic AR, plus I know if it ever doesn't go bang when it should I can fix it with a screwdriver, a pair of pliers and a BFH.

167 Posted by: Jay Guevara at March 24, 2013 12:48 PM (IDSI7)

Perhaps our inability to predict the results of limited government and maximum personal freedom is what disturbs the lefties so much?

They are afraid of the unknown, while freedom-loving people tend to see opportunity in an uncontrolled future.

168 Should have said...Saiga in 5.56.

169 Hey GGE, did you get a chance to load up those 230g boolits yet?

170 Posted by: GGE of the Moron Horde, NC Chapter at March 24, 2013 01:11 PM (U7ErG)

In the barrel!

They are nice rifles, although the AR-15 platform fits me really nicely, so I haven't branched out into anything else.

171 [i["Has anyone used the 'ol filter' adaptation of the 'cleaning solvent' adapter/silencer?" [/i] try it out and report back, ok? maybe check that 2 liter pepsi trick also

172 >> Perhaps someone should go take a look at that post. It was creepy to me. It was a Justified reference. One that looked like it was translated from English to Chinese to Engrish, but still ...

173

#68, Towson DC, here's my cosmoline removal recipe:

 

*  soak all small parts in mineral spirits - 24 hours or more - then wipe down vigorously, make sure it's all gone (I use an empty 7.62X54R spam can, perfect for this sort of thing)

 

*  the receiver/barrel I heat by standing in a large bucket of boiled water; after about 15 minutes (before it all starts to really cool down), I then stand the receiver, bottom end down, in a bucket of mineral spirits.  I will then repeat this step again, THEN wipe/inspect/push-pull many patches down the barrel.  Two reps should get the cosmo out of the receiver end; barrel can be patched/brushed with mineral spirits until clean.

 

*  stock - I built a small little solar oven by taping clear plastic wrap over a long box (rifle box one of my guns came in) after cutting off one big side of it; then I stuff tp into every nook and cranny of the stock - and wrap/tape tp onto handguards or other small stock pieces - and bake in the sun for days and days.  Depending on cosmo situation, I might replace the tp after a week and do another cycle.  Eventually most of the cosmo will bake out - though not always ALL of it.  And in your neck of the woods, by late May you'll have weeks/months of good hot days for this sort of thing.

 

Anyway, that's it.  For my milsupr bores, I plan to do the electronic bore-cleaner thing once my massive house project is done.  Seems simple once you have the right hardware, and if you do it repeatedly I'd think these old Soviet bores would shine as brightly as the glorious communist future I used to see beckoning to me on Soviet billboards in Leningrad .....

 

 

174 You fuckers continue to argue over "A" or "AN" and I'm going to claymore the whole goddam place. Posted by: tangonine at March 24, 2013 11:47 AM (x3YFz) Also known as "copy and paste from Word".

175 SW MP 15, but if anyone has any better recommendations brand-wise (Bushmaster, DPMS/Panther, Stag, Del-Ton, Sig, Windham, etc.), Posted by: Professor Marius von Totenkopf (formerly Hoss Fuentes) at March 24, 2013 10:21 AM (aozUR) any of those listed will do what you expect it to do

176 cosmoline removal... **** My old man used Diesel. He learned it back in WWII Works great for cleaning your firearms regularly too. When it dries it leaves a coating of oil on all the parts.

177 any of those listed will do what you expect it to do Posted by: Jake in ID at March 24, 2013 01:22 PM Always buy extra gas tubes and springs.

178 cosmoline removal... **** I'm old school some Hoppes #9 and about 473 patches

179 Off to the gun show to see if there are any late deals. First time by myself- time for stupid buys!

180 >>>and about 473 patches

Ran out of nearly all my patches in all sizes last weekend. Went to the new little gun shop up the road. He had those little packs of Hoppe's patches that are thick and absorbent, but only look like there's about 12 in each sleeve. No, no, no, no NO.

Went to Walmart where they had those WADS of bulk Hoppe's patches, for like 3 bucks.

181

But wait, there's more. (I'm still on about Bellesiles.) 

 

The publisher of his latest book is "The New Press." The name set my antennae twitching, because Commies love to prepend "New" to anything they're involved in (e.g., the Communist propaganda rag of back when, "New Masses). 

 

So I Binged "New Press." It describes itself as "Publishing in the Public Interest," which really got my antennae twitching. Here are a few of their offerings, which prove my point above about recognition of Reds by Reds: 

 

"Michelle Alexander, author of The New Jim Crow, has been awarded the Michael Harrington Best Book Award, given for a book of excellent academic quality with the potential to mobilize change on a pressing social and political issue." 

 

The "Michael Harrington Best Book Award?" THAT Michael Harrington? Oh. 

 

"Jefferson Cowie, author of Stayin' Alive , was awarded the 2011 Annual Labor History Book Prize, presented by Labor History magazine to the best book in labor history studies." 

 

Well, you can't go wrong with Labor History magazine. "Jane RhodeÂ’s Framing the Black Panthers wins the 2010 North East Black Studies AssociationÂ’s (formerly the North East Black Studies Alliance) annual W.E.B. Du Bois Book Prize. 

 

The W.E.B. du Bois Book Prize? The Lenin Prize wasn't available?

 

And my personal favorite: 

 

"Howard Zinn

A Life on the Left
 

Martin Duberman

From the award-winning historian and activist Martin Duberman, a sweeping political biography of Howard Zinn, “the people’s historian” who himself made history, changing forever how we think about our past."

 

Conclusion: The "New Press" is obviously an outlet for Communist propaganda, and validates my point above about Commies lauding each other.

182 I am not an whore!

183 Which thread am I in?

184 Off to the gun show to see if there are any late deals. First time by myself- time for stupid buys! Posted by: RWC at March 24, 2013 01:31 PM (sqp6o) There are no deals today in March 2013, there aren't Considder it a sight seeing event unless you are desperate for something specific

185 Bore snake?  ...or Cotton patches?

Inquiring minds want to know.

186 some Hoppes #9
and about 473 patches

Posted by: Jake in ID at March 24, 2013 01:27 PM (zzeVM)

Heh. I picked up an old Lee Enfield which was covered in cosmoline.

MY buddy the wood scientist (no shit...a real thing) took care of the stock, and all I did with the barrel and action was lots and lots of hot water. I poured boiling water down the barrel several times as as well.

It worked, although it did take a while, and once it dried (quickly, because it was hot) the action started to rust within minutes.

187 WADS of bulk Hoppe's patches, for like 3 bucks. Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 01:31 PM (4Mv1T) Hoppes make the best patches also, no lint !!

188 >>>Hoppes make the best patches also, no lint !!

Call me crazy, but I keep a stack of Q-tips in the gun cleaning box. Makes it easy to clean the nooks and crannies soaked with Hoppe's Elite Gun Cleaner. But they can leave fibers behind.

189 Inquiring minds want to know. Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 01:36 PM (4Mv1T) IMO bore snakes are a field use only item

190 Don't bring a hot dog to a gun fight

191 I was at a match where somebody got bit by the slide..... your thumb bleads alot, and for a long long time

192 Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 01:39 PM (4Mv1T)

So do I. And I'll peel off the cotton afterward and use it as a guide to run a patch along the rails. It gets the crud out nicely.

But I don't clean the way most people do. I'll do a thorough cleaning after 1,000 rounds, but between? Just a wipedown and a quick clear out the gunk session.

193 Had to be mindful of the exposed slide on my new shootin' iron. Up until recently my 1911 was the only semi-auto I owned before I procured an XDs. More of an issue with the newer stuff I think. And by newer, I mean anything after 1911.

194 104 Just went with my buddy to pick up 2 mossberg500 12 and 410. Virtually unshot.$200 each. Then 100 box of shells for $25. Cheaper than shooting anything except 22. Posted by: traye at March 24, 2013 11:11 AM (99vXN) Wow! That sounds like a great deal. I'd love to have a Mossy .410. And yeah, bulk 12ga ammo is still a bargain.

195 Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 01:53 PM (4Mv1T)

New and untested.

If it's not a John Browning design, it's too new to use.

Now get off my lawn!

196 to have a Mossy .410. And yeah, bulk 12ga ammo is still a bargain. Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 24, 2013 01:58 PM (JQuNB) you might want to do a price check on .410 generally it is noticeably more expensive than 12 or 20ga.

197 you might want to do a price check on .410 generally it is noticeably more expensive than 12 or 20ga. Posted by: Jake in ID at March 24, 2013 02:01 PM (zzeVM) Yeah, I know. It must be a matter of economy of scale. I'd still like to have a .410 pump, though.

198 >>>If it's not a John Browning design, it's too new to use.

Not sure if it's a design issue or just a size/weight issue, but the new pocket cannon felt like holding a firecracker in my hand every time I pulled the trigger. Made shooting the 1911 afterwards feel like shooting a .22.

199 Re the Colt 1905: To me, this is the best-looking pistol ever made. If you ever have a chance to hold one, do it. It's strikingly modern in its design.

200

Tobacco, and everyone else, if you use Q-Tips (as I do) in gun cleaning or lubricating, and would like to try something that might not leave fibers behind, check out Bore-Tips by Swab-its (bing/ixquick these terms).  They're Q-Tips with foam tips instead of cotton - I'm thinking of getting some mostly for lubricating the 1911, Garand, and M1 Carbine.  Foam tips will definitely be better for lubricating - cleaning, might use both regular Q-Tips and those.

 

Jake in ID, bore snakes are actually quite handy for "regular" light cleaning, I have found.  Depending on the ammo, the number of rounds, and how long it's been since a thorough cleaning, I'll just bore-snake the barrel (and cylinder on revolvers).  I use them dry, don't add any solvent, as I figure that will just gunk them up.  So for example if I've shot 200 rounds from the 9mm XD, and used factory ammo (not my perfectly good but dirty lead bullet reloads), I'll just do a good CLP/rag wipe down of all the surfaces after disassembly, then snake the barrel 4 or 5 times, and the gun's quite clean.

 

Another advantage of bore snakes is for example with the carbines.  I don't want to take them out of the stock any more than absolutely neccessary, so I'll just snake the bores and wipe down the metal very vigorously after most sessions (and I always use FMJ bullets, incl. my reloads, so they're much cleaner than say my Model 66 revolver after a day of Trail Boss and lead, which leaves it filthy).  Especially for any old or milsurp guns of a vintage age, bore snakes can be one more trick to maintaining them with minimal additional wear and tear.

 

Back on cosmo removal, heat and solvents are really your best bet.  That's why I use a bit of both, esp. for the receiver/barrels.  Use the white milky looking mineral spirits and you have a good visual indicator of any cosmo coming off, and likewise on your second or third soak, an indicator if there's any still left on the gun parts.

 

201 Bore snakes are excellent for the field. But you have to clean them periodically or you're just smearing old carbon grit all over the bore. One thing that sucks about 'em, keep them stored separately. A nest of bore snakes in your cleaning box is hell. Besides getting them tangled up in a ball, it's sometimes difficult to tell one from the other, especially the 30cal and 38cal/9mm varieties.

202 Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 02:08 PM (4Mv1T) It is an XDs? What caliber?

203 Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 02:08 PM (4Mv1T)

Is the new one in .45ACP also? If so, the difference in recoil is probably a function of weight, because most of them seem to be well-designed ergonomically.

The 1911 is 100+ years old and it still kicks ass.

I love it!

204 Wow! That sounds like a great deal. I'd love to have a Mossy .410. And yeah, bulk 12ga ammo is still a bargain.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 24, 2013 01:58 PM (JQuNB)

 

I bought my dad a Mossberg pump .410 about 20 years ago because he always said he wanted one. It has never been fired.

205 Posted by: non-purist at March 24, 2013 02:11 PM (afQnV)

At my old range in CA, they sold really good reloads for next to nothing. I could shoot all day, then the last magazine I would fire jacketed bullets, and it seemed to clear out some of the leading. I never did a study, but that was my impression.

Anyone do the same thing?

206 Hey GGE, did you get a chance to load up those 230g boolits yet?

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at March 24, 2013 01:12 PM (MBqvE)

Not yet, I haven't been able to spend any quality time with my reloading bench lately. I use a boresnake and then run a couple of patches to wipe everything out and check the cleanliness of the bore, if the patches come out dirty I go back with the boresnake a couple of times until the patches are clean. Except the Mosin, that damn thing is never going to be clean ever again, it's Windex down the bore at the range and then the boresnake/patches at home just to dry the bore out. I've been thinking about building one of those electronic bore cleaners that I've read about.

207 I just cut up old tshirts for small rags.

208 I bought my dad a Mossberg pump .410 about 20 years ago because he always said he wanted one. It has never been fired.Posted by: Ook? at March 24, 2013 02:15 PM (OQpzc) I'm with you. When my dad retired, we bought him a Browning Lite 5 in 12ga, hoping he'd get back into hunting. I don't think he's ever fired it.

209 Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at March 24, 2013 02:17 PM (JQuNB)

Just owning guns is a pleasure in and of itself.

210 Why didn't he eat the hotdog?

211 I used to be meticulus about cleaning, cleaned everything after each range session. Once I started shooting matches, I only clean when necessary (not competing with safe queens) for example my IDPA pistol... I competed in 8 or 10 matcher per year for almost 3 years before I cleaned it. yep, it was a dirty pig after 3,000+ rounds but it worked flawlwssly the entire time

212 Just owning guns is a pleasure in and of itself. Ain't it the truth. When I want to go shooting but don't have time, I start wiping down guns. I pretend it's to keep them clean.

213 Hey folks-- Brought three new shooters out to the trap & skeet range yesterday--in, wait for it, northern Nj! Nothing better than seeing the smiles after busting their first clays. Thunder Mountain in Ringwood, NJ is about 45 min from NYC--recommended. The staff was great to them.

214 @185 True. I went to the gun show in CLT about a month ago. Got a couple of holsters, they were the only thing not marked up like the end of the world was near. I tried to buy 2,000 rounds of 5.7x28 that the guy wanted $54 a box of 50, old price $23. Asked him what price he'd give me if I bought them all. A dollar off each box. I didn't buy any, period.

215 8 Now that AR prices are coming down to quasi-reasonable levels, I'm now in the market for one of the cheaper ones (sorry, no LWRC or LaRue money here). Building one's out of the question at the moment since uppers are still expensive and because I'd like to get familiar with them before I attempt a build. I'm leaning towards an SW MP 15, but if anyone has any better recommendations brand-wise (Bushmaster, DPMS/Panther, Stag, Del-Ton, Sig, Windham, etc.), any suggestions are appreciated. It'll mostly be configured for varmint hunting in wooded areas (coyotes and such). Thanks.

Posted by: Professor Marius von Totenkopf (formerly Hoss Fuentes) at March 24, 2013 10:21 AM (aozUR)

 

Doublestar makes a nice M4.  They provide parts to many of the major AR manufacturers.  Got mine from Buds Police Supply for $665.  However, this was before the tragic boating accident.

216 Sorry, had to run take boy#2 to the gym.

Yes, the XDs is .45ACP. A little beast, it is. I think .45 is that's the only caliber for the XDs . The "s" denotes single stack.

I must be seriously OCD. I field strip and clean my guns after every session at the range, which may only be 50 rds per piece in these times of ammo scarcity, say for .223/5.56.

But, then I might go months, sometimes years between trips, and I never know when that'll be.

217 Why the fuck are we having a grammar lesson when there's GUNZ to be discussed???

You know, no question is rhetorical enough (that's "an rhetorical" to you) that some moron won't take it seriously, or sort of.

The answer, of course, is Aristotle's doctrine of predication -- like so many other things. Until Aristotle's time, the telling of truth was considered to be like shooting an arrow at a target: you either hit it or you didn't. A miss was the same as nonsense. Some guys thought about that and realized that it required the importation of a concept of truth being out there, behind a veil, and us gesturing at it. Some of those guys found that explanation sufficient, or attractive.

Aristotle put forward the idea that you chose a subject, and an action ascribed to it, when you make a statement. This opens up the whole idea of a statement being mostly right, or partly right, instead of a mystical hit or miss.

Say what you like about horseshoes and hand grenades, marksmanship is like that too. Consider the notion of a strong nine vs a weak ten. You build skills, or improve equipment, gradually approaching accuracy and consistency. The idea of a natural who just picks up the super-gun of all time and blazes away is stunningly Hollywoodian in its fantasy.

Also, if you can't do a hard-voiced "H" you'll never get good at air rifle.   

218 Those long, one-ended Q-tips, sometimes called "cue sticks"? Most of the ones I've gotten milsurp, and all the surgical ones, are wound a different way and have a lot less lint than consumer grade ear-cleaners. I think they are great for nooks and crannies, too. After an early learning experience with a commission rifle, I'm tetchy about disassembling a hard-sprung bolt every damn time. Snappy.

219 I field strip and clean my guns after every session at the range Hell that's not OCD thats common sense

220 @220- Thank you.

221 Nobody's here so I can hold a conversation with myself. Notice how trolls never visit the gun threads?

Refreshing.

222
I had not known they were both seals known to eachother.
it's really odd they are both dead mths from eachother

Posted by: willow-ette at March 24, 2013 12:25 PM (nqBYe)


Brandon was teamed with Glen through sniper school, and then went on to be Chris' instructor.  It's a small community.

223 Considder it a sight seeing event unless you are desperate for something specific Posted by: Jake in ID at March 24, 2013 01:34 PM (zzeVM) Waste of time. Small show and 95 percent were historical guns. (NTTAWWT)

224 RWC- Looking for something in particular?

225 "The 1911 is 100+ years old and it still kicks ass.

I love it!"

------------------

I own a Sportster and a 1911. I bet there's a connection.

226 212 I used to be meticulus about cleaning, cleaned everything after each range session. Once I started shooting matches, I only clean when necessary (not competing with safe queens) for example my IDPA pistol... Posted by: Jake in ID at March 24, 2013 02:23 PM (zzeVM) I invariably clean my IDPA gun after every match--it's my daily carry gun, too--but I often do it on the drive home from the match, while I'm driving. Where I usually shoot matches I have a good 45 minutes on interstates). I have my bag with cleaning gear on the passenger seat, I put the smaller gun parts like the slide lock on the between-the-seats console, and 20 miles or so later I'm good to go. :-) Obviously that doesn't result in a firearm clean enough to satisfy a Drill Instructor, but it gets the gun functionally clean, and that's all I'm looking for. I've got maybe 100,000 rounds through that gun, and it's never malfunctioned for any reason other than an error in one of my reloads (usually a flipped primer).

227 >>>while I'm driving 

I put 17K miles on an H-D without a helmet back in the day, but I don't think I would attempt this. Maybe it's just me.

228 228 >>>while I'm driving I put 17K miles on an H-D without a helmet back in the day, but I don't think I would attempt this. Maybe it's just me. Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 03:40 PM (4Mv1T) Why not? Without bullets in it, the gun's just a bunch of steel parts put together (or steel-and-plastic, if that's your thing, NTTAWWT). Field stripping a 1911 requires no more dexterity than texting on a cell phone or working a GPS, which most folks feel comfortable doing while driving. Most more modern guns, like Glock or Sig, are even simpler. To each his own, I guess. :-)

229 Closest IDPA chapter I can find here is an hour away. Wish it was closer.

230 Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 03:28 PM (4Mv1T) Not really. Was going to see if they had any deals on a shotgun but there really weren't any to choose from. Besides, they're pretty cheap retail. This show was a last minute thing on my part so I hadn't had a chance to ask around about it.

231 RWC- I sold an old 16ga, and bought a newer 12ga locally via armslist.com. last week. It is the heat. Just a great site.

232 L.S.D.  - I guess if you are on Interstate with no traffic. No such thing here. Texting while driving is also illegal here. I even hate manipulating my GPS while driving cause I invariably hit those rumble strips in the emergency lane. If I tried to strip and clean a gun while driving, and I did it often enough, something wrong would happen.

I'm not trying to bust your chops here. I'm just an old guy raising two young males who has seen more than his fair share of shit go wrong.

Stay safe. 

/rant off.

233 230 Closest IDPA chapter I can find here is an hour away. Wish it was closer. Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 03:52 PM (4Mv1T) Maybe start one? IDPA.com will be very helpful in that regard.

234 >>>Maybe start one? IDPA.com will be very helpful in that regard

Hmmmm. Interesting thought. I'm in a fairly blue metro area, in a red state. However, the number of new gun owners is surging like crazy, like everywhere else. Might be possible. I need to go check out the one closest to me in Oxford NC.

235 L.S.D. - I guess if you are on Interstate with no traffic. No such thing here.
Texting while driving is also illegal here. I even hate manipulating my
GPS while driving cause I invariably hit those rumble strips in the
emergency lane. If I tried to strip and clean a gun while driving, and I
did it often enough, something wrong would happen.

I'm not
trying to bust your chops here. I'm just an old guy raising two young
males who has seen more than his fair share of shit go wrong.

Stay safe.

/rant off.

Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 04:04 PM (4Mv1T)


You clear and clean off time. not while mobile.  That's just fn stupid.

236 Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 04:03 PM (4Mv1T) Man, what the hell. I knew about armslist but never checked it out. Thanks for the heads up/reminder.

237 >>>That's just fn stupid.
Posted by: tangonine

Preachin' to the choir here, my friend. I was just trying to make that point a little more gently.

238 "I used to be meticulus about cleaning, cleaned everything after each range session." Posted by: Jake in ID at March 24, 2013 02:23 PM (zzeVM) I'm that way--meticulous, I mean. I shoot a lot, every weekend unless something comes up, and always clean my weapons thoroughly. Depending on the firearm, there are some parts I won't disassemble, but otherwise, I try to keep them as immaculate as I can. My son is in an infantry unit and he says a lot of his buddies bitch and moan about cleaning weapons all the time. He says he doesn't mind. It makes him think about home.

239 What say the Horde? How many rounds through a semi-auto pistol or rifle before disaasembling to clean beyond a field strip?

240 I invariably clean my IDPA gun after every match--it's my daily carry gun, too--but I often do it on the drive home from the match, while I'm driving. Posted by: Law of Self Defense at March 24, 2013 03:33 PM (iZ0BY) I'm all about multi-tasking, but no conceivable way would I try to clean a firearm while driving.

241 Hickock45 also has video on how not to shoot a revolver as well. Scary actually. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFBAcz16GvU

242 >>>242 Hickock45 also has video on how not to shoot a revolver as well. Scary actually.

Wow. Just watched.

243 What say the Horde? How many rounds through a semi-auto pistol or rifle before disaasembling to clean beyond a field strip? Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 04:32 PM (4Mv1T) For me, how often I do a 'beyond field strip' disassembly depends on the complexity of the gun and on what you mean by field-strip. My Makarov, for example, only has 22 parts and I break it down to its essentials every time I shoot it. The same with most of my rifles. However, if takedown and disassembly requires multiple tools and a lot of time and trouble, I'd recommend every 500 or so rounds, which translates to fairly often, but that's just me. I'm a stickler for clean guns.

244 236 I'm not trying to bust your chops here. I'm just an old guy raising two young males who has seen more than his fair share of shit go wrong. No offense taken. :-)

245 >>>I'm a stickler for clean guns.

Likewise. First, thinking of the bolt in my AR. Beyond just extractor removal, those springs seem awfully stiff. Like it will fly apart into my neighbors yard if I remove.

Then my 1911. Never had it apart more than a field strip. I may or may not even have 500 rounds though it.

246 240 What say the Horde? How many rounds through a semi-auto pistol or rifle before disaasembling to clean beyond a field strip? Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 04:32 PM (4Mv1T) For my IDPA gun, I field-strip it (by which I mean taking apart the slide, too, so removing firing pin, extractor, etc.) for a "normal" post-match or post-practice cleaning. Twice a year (spring and fall) I detail strip the gun down to its smallest components and do a thorough cleaning. I shoot enough (5,000 to 10,000 rounds a year, although it's been some years since I've been at that higher number) that there's always a bit of accumulation of lead and lube in the innards. Just before a thorough cleaning the trigger has started acting a bit "gummy", and it's always back to its like-new self afterwards.

247 I'm all about multi-tasking, but no conceivable way would I try to clean a firearm while driving. Posted by: troyriser at March 24, 2013 04:33 PM (ptcFO) Whatever. Once the slide is off the gun, it's nothing but a bunch of inert metal parts, and no more dangerous than a full can of soda. I suppose I might drop the slide on my junk, but I've suffered worse. :-) It's not likely that the parts are going to spontaneously assemble themselves, load a mag, and shoot me. It's not a Decepticon. I can think of dozens of things normal people do every day in a car that are more complicated than running a cloth over a piece of metal, or a patch down a steel tube, neither of which takes any more of an occasional glance than changing the radio or temperature controls. But, hey, if you don't like it, don't do it. Fine by me.

248 It's not likely that the parts are going to spontaneously assemble themselves, load a mag, and shoot me. It's not a Decepticon. But, hey, if you don't like it, don't do it. Fine by me. Posted by: Law of Self Defense at March 24, 2013 05:05 PM (iZ0BY) Don't presume to patronize me, Deadeye. I'm fairly conversant with firearms and know it's not a decepticon or whatever. I wouldn't be afraid it would magically reassemble and shoot me in the groin. It just strikes me as bad practice.

249 Then my 1911. Never had it apart more than a field strip. I may or may not even have 500 rounds though it. Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 04:52 PM (4Mv1T) Detail stripping a 1911 is fun enough that it's worth doing at least once just for the heck of it, and to really see how the individual pieces all work together so beautifully. JMB really was a genius. After you've done it a few times it's really quite easy. A couple of punches are useful for the pins and to depress the firing pin to remove the stop, and forceps or something similar can be very helpful when re-positioning the disconnector/sear combo. Other than that, a screwdriver or allen wrench for the grip screws, a tiny screwdriver for the mag release, and that's pretty much it. (Oh, and whatever you need for a full-length guide rod, if you are saddled with one of those.) But detail strip is not something I'd consider necessary from a maintenance point of view until I had something on the order of thousands of rounds through the gun--at least two or three. Certainly not after just 500 rounds, unless you're doing it just for the fun of it.

250 Don't presume to patronize me, Deadeye. I'm fairly conversant with firearms and know it's not a decepticon or whatever. I wouldn't be afraid it would magically reassemble and shoot me in the groin. It just strikes me as bad practice. Posted by: troyriser at March 24, 2013 05:09 PM (ptcFO) Deadeye. Great stuff.

251 Today I swung my front door wide open and placed my Assault rifle right in the doorway. I gave it a full 30 round magazine, then left it alone and went about my business. While I was gone the neighbor boy across the street mowed the yard, a girl walked her dog down the street, and quite a few cars stopped at the stop sign right in front of our house. After about an hour, I checked on the rifle. It was still sitting there, right where I had left it. It hadn't moved itself outside. It certainly hadn't killed anyone, even with the numerous opportunities it had been presented to do so. In fact, it hadn't even loaded itself. Well you can imagine my surprise, with all the media hype about how dangerous assault rifles are and how they kill people. Either the media is wrong, and it's the misuse of guns by PEOPLE that kills people, or I'm in possession of the laziest gun in the world. All right, well I'm off to check on my spoons. I hear they're making people fat.

252 >>>All right, well I'm off to check on my spoons. I hear they're making people fat.

I think Leno has a spot open for a stand-up next week.

Hilarious :-)

253 Never turn your back on your toaster. The thing is nefarious.

254 I'm back. Finished my taxes I can buy 47 PMags with my refund at current market

255 There are 2 local IDPA clubs in SW ID one is about 45 minutes, the other is 65 minutes each has a diffrent 'flavor'

256 Here's an odd product. http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=333908306 At first glance I'm thinking Yeah, that's clever. But then I think Wait a minute, it's attached to the slide, not the muzzle, so it's going to move back over the barrel and not be shooting gas up after a millisecond. And it will be stealing energy from the action unless the gas is just going straight up. And won't having the gas on the top side be diverted, but not the sides or the bottom, affect accuracy? Like have a big gouge in your crown.

257 And won't having the gas on the top side be diverted, but not the sides or the bottom, affect accuracy? Like have a big gouge in your crown. Posted by: toby928© presents at March 24, 2013 05:39 PM (QupBk) It's a Tokarev compensator. I have one on my Polish Radom TT-33. It reduces muzzle flip, for which the Tokarev is notorious. It replaces the barrel bushing, so no mods are required. I've encountered no damage to the crown.

258 So the gas goes straight up, yes? So as not to weaken the action, right? But, like a nick in your crown, the expanding gas is going to be uneven at the point the bullet leaves the barrel I would think. Maybe this isn't a concern with pistols and the range they generally shoot but rifles at 2 or 300 yards care if the muzzle is damaged and the shockwave exits unevenly.

259 RWC I cauget this from yesterdays ONT Damn. Calling me out :-) Ok, do I need a holster for it? i'm assuming so. Now would be a great time to just jump in since my buddy just got his Beretta Storm (Christmas) and is upset with his accuracy and loves a challenge. (he was going for Force Recon until the only thing that is stronger than Black Democratium- 'Pussilium.'. Wife would cut him off. I don't think he likes a civvy (me) shooting better. Posted by: RWC at March 24, 2013 02:10 AM (sqp6o) standard load out for IDPA/USPSA *gun, derr! *mags, IDPA=3 minimum, USPSA=5 or 6 *belt *mag carrier/s *200 rds, you prob won't shoot all that, depends on club *range bag or something to carry other misc crap around you don't have to practice to get good to shoot matches. Just start shooting IDPA/USPSA, matches are practice don't drop a loaded gun or break the 180 and all is good

260 "I can buy 47 PMags with my refund at current market"

------------

Holy shit! You got $30,000 back?!?

261 256 There are 2 local IDPA clubs in SW ID, one is about 45 minutes, the other is 65 minutes each has a diffrent 'flavor' Posted by: Jake in ID at March 24, 2013 05:38 PM (zzeVM) Yeah, that's often the case. My closest IDPA club is at my "home" range only 15 minutes away. But I invariably shoot my matches up in Hopkinton, NH or at SigSauer, both of which are more like 75 minutes away. Nothing against the local guys, but I simply prefer the "atmosphere" at the further matches.

262 260 standard load out for IDPA/USPSA *gun, derr! *mags, IDPA=3 minimum, USPSA=5 or 6 *belt *mag carrier/s *200 rds, you prob won't shoot all that, depends on club *range bag or something to carry other misc crap around you don't have to practice to get good to shoot matches. Just start shooting IDPA/USPSA, matches are practice don't drop a loaded gun or break the 180 and all is good Posted by: Jake in ID at March 24, 2013 05:47 PM (zzeVM) And, of course, a holster, which I'm sure Jake intended. IDPA has had varied rules on holsters--I think they may have done away with the formal holster list now--but any reasonable holster should be adequate for your first few matches. Make sure the trigger guard is covered, and that the holster works for you when worn on the strong-side hip, just behind center-line (so, not too much of a cant). As for the belt, use as stiff a belt as possible. Invariably, you'll end up buying a "real" gun belt if you stick with things, and those typically price around $80 to $100. But they are made very stiff to allow an efficient draw without the holster torquing on the gun. If all you have are "regular" belts, use the heaviest one you have, consistent with your holster. Oh, and if you're new to the sport be sure to let the ROs know that when you get to the line, they'll be happy to help you make as few missteps as possible, and have the best (and safest) possible time.

263 Pretty spoiled here in SW ID Within a 2 hour drive of the Boise Area 2 IDPA monthly matches 4 USPSA monthly matches 2 3Gun monthly matches 1 Tactical Rifle(ie. sniper) match 5 silhouette monthly matches 3 CMP/NRA High Power matches and on and on

264 annnnddd....... a holster would be good also brain, fingers, typting HTF does that all work??

265 Posted by: Jake in ID at March 24, 2013 06:05 PM (zzeVM)

Braggart.

I live in Northern NJ.

266 I think they may have done away with the formal holster list now Posted by: Law of Self Defense at March 24, 2013 06:02 PM (iZ0BY) yes, the holster list went away. The rule book is on line

267 Braggart. I live in Northern NJ. Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at March 24, 2013 06:07 PM (3Mkrp) I didn't even get into trap skeet 5 stand sporting clays cowboy action wild bunch tactical shotgun he man 3 gun- - M1 Garande, 1911, 12ga pump small bore egg shoots varmint 1000 yard+ rifle bench rest Palma well, you get it

268 Posted by: Jake in ID at March 24, 2013 06:14 PM (zzeVM)

I lived in CA before it went completely insane, and I used to live 20 minutes from my gun club.

But now? Awful.

Enjoy!

269 Looked IDPA at rules, and didn't find this. How many rds/mags neccessary for matches? My Series 80 1911 holds 8rds  per mag. My XDs, not so much. 5 rds per mag, or 7 with extended mag, which as yet I don't own. $40 apiece

270 270 Looked IDPA at rules, and didn't find this. How many rds/mags neccessary for matches? My Series 80 1911 holds 8rds per mag. My XDs, not so much. 5 rds per mag, or 7 with extended mag, which as yet I don't own. $40 apiece Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 06:22 PM (4Mv1T) Max round count per magazine is defined within each division. For SSP and ESP it's 10 rounds in the mag (plus one in the chamber to start, pages 19 and 21 of the online rulebook, respectively). In CDP it's 8 rounds in the mag (plus one on the chamber, page 23 of online rulebook ). You can use high-cap mags if you want, just so long as you don't load them to higher capacities than listed above. Also, usually you MUST load to the stated capacities (you cannot down-load a mag to attempt to shoot to slide-lock at a particularly opportune time in a course of fire). Online rulebook can be found here: http://bit.ly/X673Jg

271 My XDs, not so much. 5 rds per mag, or 7 with extended mag, which as yet I don't own. $40 apiece Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 06:22 PM (4Mv1T) a normal match is generally between 80 and 125 rounds depending on the club for a 1911, I'd bring 3 mags minimum, 4 mags would be better and 5 mags if you had them I have not checked out an XDs, 5rd mags are not optimal.

272 270 Looked IDPA at rules, and didn't find this. How many rds/mags neccessary for matches? My Series 80 1911 holds 8rds per mag. My XDs, not so much. 5 rds per mag, or 7 with extended mag, which as yet I don't own. $40 apiece Posted by: Tobacco Road at March 24, 2013 06:22 PM (4Mv1T) In terms of how many mags you can carry, rules state you can only carry two spare mags on your belt. You can have others in your pockets, if you wish, and for some courses of fire--like the classifier--you will DEFINITELY want to do this, for time management purposes. You can't have too many mags, really. But I wouldn't let any of that hold you back, just bring what you have, the SOs will make it work somehow. Your score might not count "officially" if they have to cut too many corners, but you'll get to shoot and have a great time. (In the unlikely event that your experience at a local IDPA match is different than that, then it's just not a good place to shoot IDPA.)

273 I'd previously stated: Also, usually you MUST load to the stated capacities (you cannot down-load a mag to attempt to shoot to slide-lock at a particularly opportune time in a course of fire). Just to clarify, you CAN shoot an IDPA match with a gun that can't be loaded to the max allowed mag capacity--so, you CAN shoot your XD that with mags that only hold 5 mags (just don't expect to be competitive), but then you have to limit yourself to that same limited mag capacity for the entire match. You can't pick and choose mag capacities on a stage-by-stage basis, for example.

274 Thanks guys- I was over at the local gun forum looking for IDPA matches.

275

Wonder what kind of "foreign relations" Hillary was talkin' bout in 2008.

276 I did have a disappointment this week. My two P64's arrived on Saturday morning and one of them has a broken safety, which also hold the firing pin in, so it's totally useless. I'll have to contact the distributor tomorrow and arrange something. The other one is in great condition though, so there's that.

277 Toby, Congrats on the P-64's. Those are neat pistols. My wife uses 1 of mine for carry. For carry purposes I use the CZ-82 which takes the same ammo.

278 While I was gone the neighbor boy across the street mowed the yard, a girl walked her dog down the street, and quite a few cars stopped at the stop sign right in front of our house.

After about an hour, I checked on the rifle. It was still sitting there, right where I had left it. It hadn't moved itself outside. It certainly hadn't killed anyone, even with the numerous opportunities it had been presented to do so. In fact, it hadn't even loaded itself.

Well you can imagine my surprise, with all the media hype about how dangerous assault rifles are and how they kill people. Either the media is wrong, and it's the misuse of guns by PEOPLE that kills people, or I'm in possession of the laziest gun in the world.

All right, well I'm off to check on my spoons. I hear they're making people fat.

Posted by: lindafell at March 24, 2013 05:19 PM (PGO8C) 

I'd never leave a weapon with a full mag unattended.  There's no reason to and there's plenty of reasons not to. 

Not a good idea. ever.  That's just stupid.  actually: offense intended.  This ranks right up with running round with your booger hook on the bang switch.  It's dumbassery.

279 Posted by: lindafell at March 24, 2013 05:19 PM (PGO8C)

You get an F- in securing your weapon.

Military?  I'd article 15 your ass.  At least.

LE?  I'd fire you.

280 I did have a disappointment this week. My two P64's arrived on Saturday morning and one of them has a broken safety, which also hold the firing pin in, so it's totally useless. I'll have to contact the distributor tomorrow and arrange something. The other one is in great condition though, so there's that. Posted by: toby928© presents at March 24, 2013 09:02 PM (QupBk) I absolutely love my P-64, which is my carry weapon in the summer because of its compact size and extremely slender profile. I changed out the mainspring to reduce the horrendously heavy double action trigger. It's now a perfect little shooting machine. Its very smooth trigger, especially its single action, is equivalent to pistols three times the price. I also found a great IWB carry holster my P-64, and can't help but plug Jonna at Turtlecreek holsters, one of the few places I've found online that makes P-64 holsters to order. Usually, P-64 owners have to buy Walther PPK holsters since it's closest in size and frame. She puts love into her work.

281 280 Posted by: lindafell at March 24, 2013 05:19 PM (PGO8C) You get an F- in securing your weapon. Military? I'd article 15 your ass. At least. LE? I'd fire you. Posted by: tangonine at March 24, 2013 10:39 PM (x3YFz) Well, the horror, we have something known as a private residence, not subject to military or police regulation. So you can't 15 him, nor can you fire him. Why? Because it's a free damn country, that's why. The military and police rules regulate those who are in their service. Not their bosses. And by "their bosses" I mean the rest of us. If you've forgotten, remember.

282 I'd never leave a weapon with a full mag unattended. There's no reason to and there's plenty of reasons not to. Not a good idea. ever. That's just stupid. actually: offense intended. This ranks right up with running round with your booger hook on the bang switch. It's dumbassery. Posted by: tangonine at March 24, 2013 10:35 PM (x3YFz) More idiotic advice. I routinely leave a fully loaded gun (maybe several) secured in lock-boxes around my home, so that I, or my family members, can quickly access those arms in the event that goblins start kicking down the door. A couple of button presses, and the gun is ours. Don't know the button combo? SOOL. All are loaded with full mags. None of them are "attended". We routinely leave the house without additionally securing them. They're merely ready for authorized hands to gain access, as circumstances warrant. Why? Because I don't like hauling around a 1911 while I'm showering. Tell you what, tangonine--hey, that's like, Tango Nine, you mean like Modern Warfare, Tom Clancy, and stuff?-- why don't YOU secure YOUR guns in YOUR house as YOU think best, and leave the rest of us the F alone? To do as WE think best for OUR families in OUR homes? I grew up with loaded firearms hanging in racks throughout my house, and the only person ever to suffer harm was a person who meant US harm. What would you have had us do, keep the guns locked in a safe, ammo in a different safe somewhere in the house, just ask the ""bad man to wait while we get everything together? Do you not understand how fast home attacks happen? Or do you just expect everyone to carry a weapon on their person at all times, even when at home in the shower? And, really. "Booger hook" on the "bang switch"? Gag.

283 "Tell you what, tangonine--hey, that's like, Tango Nine, you mean like Modern Warfare, Tom Clancy, and stuff?-- why don't YOU secure YOUR guns in YOUR house as YOU think best, and leave the rest of us the F alone? To do as WE think best for OUR families in OUR homes? ...Do you not understand how fast home attacks happen? Or do you just expect everyone to carry a weapon on their person at all times, even when at home in the shower?" And, really. "Booger hook" on the "bang switch"? Gag. Posted by: Law of Self Defense at March 25, 2013 12:35 AM (iZ0BY) Andrew, many of us who post here are veterans, some of us combat veterans, and you can catch the references in some of our nicks. (I don't use an anonymous username myself.) Anyway, I doubt you'd find many (or any) Tom Clancy fantasists or keyboard commandos on here who pretend to be something they're not. After all, such people are fairly easily found out. That said, I agree with your central point; i.e., accessibility. Although most weapons are secured in a safe, I keep other guns all over the house (along with a scattering of gun parts for which I get endless grief). My children are grown and gone. If small children are coming over, those guns are secured. That bit about the 1911 in the shower? I keep a Ruger LCP in a plastic bag near the shower, within hand reach. No one is more vulnerable than when they're bathing. The swordsman Musashi was known for his disreputable appearance, and is reputed to never have bathed for that reason. Just sayin'.