Ace of Spades HQ

June 23, 2013

Gun Thread (6-23-2013)
— andy

Bloomingidiot

First, as I said yesterday, John E.'s work on MAIG's website has been picked up by, basically, everybody. Here's CBS (web).

What prompted this research was the stupid MAIG rally in New Hampshire where they listed Speedbump Tsarnaev as a "gun violence" victim.

Now, the reaction to the Speedbump thing was swift and MAIG apologized for being insensitive ... or whatever ... but I think this episode is really instructive for the pro-gun side. When your opponent has to include justifiable homicides, suicides, etc. on their list of "gun violence" victims to pump up the stats, they're pretty clearly not winning.

"Knock-down" power revisited

CDR M linked this piece in Friday night's ONT, and it's a must-read.

I've shot lots of deer with high-powered rifles and handguns at point-blank range. The number of immediate incapacitation events could be counted on one hand. They usually run a pretty decent distance after they're dead (as described at the link) and if they had a gun (and fingers), they'd most likely have time to get off some return shots.

The immediate-incapacitation-in-one-shot wound is as much the stuff of Hollywood as the exploding gas tank is. You can't depend on it.

Bottom line: if, God forbid, you ever have to use a firearm in self-defense, shoot and keep on shooting. When you go to the range with your carry piece, don't practice hitting dead center of the bullseye so much as putting 5 rounds in the black quickly.

Also, this is why "high capacity" magazines are a must. All the anti-gunner "who needs 10 rounds?" crap is belied by the fact that you most likely need to put at least half of them into a single attacker.

Gun Of The Week

(answer below)

Marksmanship Award

Homeowner fights back against home invader. #gunversation #2A http://t.co/uUMin1j7vS
— CamEdwards (@CamEdwards) June 21, 2013

Gun Of The Week - Answer

That's the Mosin-Nagant, a Russkie bolt-action rifle designed late in the 19th century and used in WWI and WWII. It's very popular today due in no small part to the sheer numbers produced (17.4 million by the end of WWII according to the link) and the availability of surplus 7.62x54R ammo.

Tips

If there are topics you're interested in seeing in the gun thread, please send them to AoSHQGunThread at gmail. You can also send them to me on Twitter at @AndyM1911.

Defend the Second Amendment. Join: The National Rifle Association * Gun Owners of America * The National Shooting Sports Foundation * Your state's second amendment org.

Celebrate America's firearms heritage: participate in Project Appleseed.

Posted by: andy at 05:32 AM | Comments (210)
Post contains 435 words, total size 4 kb.

1 The Moisin-Nagant was used by the US Army. During the 1918-1919 Allied intervention in Murmansk to fight the Red Bolsheviks.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 23, 2013 05:35 AM (wPxCh)

2 So can we combine a Paula Deen and Herman Goering thread into "Guns & Butter?"

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at June 23, 2013 05:36 AM (+98Gb)

3 For ONCE I actually knew what weapon without having to cheat. And I still want one.

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 05:38 AM (MnSla)

4 Your point about knock-down power is well taken.

The last deer I shot was a California coastal deer -- maybe 125 pounds. I was able to fire from a rest (a vine stake), and the deer was only about 80 yards away. By far my best shot ever, and the only time I ever dropped an animal in its tracks. My dad was with me and when we dressed it he pointed out that the bullet clipped off the top of the deer's heart.

30-06 out of a Remington 700BDL. 180 grain (I was hoping for wild boar).

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 23, 2013 05:39 AM (WW8xK)

5 How about a sawed-off Moisin Nagant? (scroll down the Wikipedia page) Thing looks like it was made in a prison. Meh, gulag.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at June 23, 2013 05:39 AM (+98Gb)

6 our friend the Mosin Nagant....

and frankly it is our friend....

add the Mosin Nagant to one of these babies...

http://www.archangelmanufacturing.com/new-products-2013/

and you have a 5 or 10 shot magazine fed bolt rifle.....

turn down your bolt handle and ass a scope and you have a 300 or so dollar precision rifle that depending on bore quality will perform like a 1000 rifle...

ammo's inexpensive and it is a range queen on noise...

what's not to love?

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 05:40 AM (LRFds)

7 "When you go to the range with your carry piece, don't practice hitting dead center of the bullseye so much as putting 5 rounds in the black quickly."

At which point you will run into the restriction that EVERY range I've been to has a range rule against "rapid fire", which is defined as no more than one shot every 1-2 seconds.... and is in the ear of the range officer, not a clock.

Posted by: SDN at June 23, 2013 05:41 AM (9QWym)

8 on stopping power....

people underestimate how hard retiring a client can be....

wound channel cavitation is hard and unpredictable...

there's a reason Mossad trains shooting in twos

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 05:42 AM (LRFds)

9 That sawed off thing is teh ugly. I'd still take it if I didn't have to get an SBR stamp

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 05:43 AM (MnSla)

10 "knock-down power" when it comes to handguns is bullshit. 9mm/.40/.45, just pick one you like. I like having more bullets.

Posted by: HoboJerky, Hash Hunter at June 23, 2013 05:43 AM (X4HxX)

11 My uncle, who saw a lot of Russian troops at the end of WWII, described them as "squirrel rifles", because they were long, and especially if the bayonet was fixed on it, looked really long and skinny. My former brother-in-law who was an avid hunter, said that deer hunting was better with a bow, because the wound would not close up on the arrow shaft, and the deer would bleed out and fall faster than with a shot (deer slugs from shot guns are all that's allowed in Ohio).

Posted by: Reader C.J. Burch writes more nonsense...... at June 23, 2013 05:45 AM (I2uSp)

12 Desert Eagle .50 Caliber

Posted by: Mil-Dot at June 23, 2013 05:45 AM (Cs2tJ)

13 That Russian rifle is popular today primarily because it is cheap.

Posted by: Vic at June 23, 2013 05:47 AM (lZvxr)

14 At which point you will run into the restriction that EVERY range I've been to has a range rule against "rapid fire", which is defined as no more than one shot every 1-2 seconds....

At the range I frequent (as I recall) rapid fire is fine (maybe just double taps though) so long as you are actually in control. But yes, the 1 second rule was enforced everywhere else I've been (indoor ranges).

Posted by: dudenolongerinsantacruz at June 23, 2013 05:47 AM (A3rQI)

15
@ 10
I actually like a wheel gun better than a semi. It limits me as far as rounds available I know, but I'm more comfortable with them.

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 05:47 AM (MnSla)

16 11 CJ Burch,

I've taken deer with Bow and Slug...

I'd prefer the bow all things considered....

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 05:47 AM (LRFds)

17 I have a new acquisition. To copy and paste from last night: While I was driving back from up north, I stopped at my Pop's house and traded aging Father928 my best P64, two holsters and a couple of hundred rounds of 9X18 for the family 03A3 that hasn't been fired in at least 15 years. It's a Smith-Corona made in Sept of '43 and has a 4 groove Bombproof barrel, also from '43. Perfect wood, great bore, all the parked parts look great. Only the bolt handle has rust. I'm guessing that whoever used it last, sweated it up and didn't wipe it down before putting it away for a decade in a utility closet.

Posted by: toby928© at June 23, 2013 05:48 AM (QupBk)

18 I still haven't bought it, but somewhere in an online shopping cart I have reserved a Mosin Nagant, totally non-functional, for about a hundred bucks. It was one of many found after being stored and forgotten/lost for generations. It'll be to put over the fireplace when I finally bother to order it. I think the batch I decided to buy from ( you don't buy a specific gun, just one that meets minimum criteria for the price) was uncovered in Nepal a few years ago. Dates to preWW1, and they still have some of the original grease on them, etc. Often the stock is wormed out, and the mechanism is locked solid, but they still look cool and have a bit of a story.

Posted by: Lincolntf at June 23, 2013 05:49 AM (ZshNr)

19 Back in the 80s you could buy those at Roses for $79. All the ammo you wanted dirt cheap too.

Posted by: Freak Out! at June 23, 2013 05:49 AM (XeFpo)

A link to Ace of Spades from CB F'n S.

Wow.

Posted by: Mama AJ at June 23, 2013 05:50 AM (SUKHu)

21 13 Vic,

eh in part...

It really is a well engineered rifle Vic especially if you paid the extra money and have a Finn.....

the Finns didn't screw around and their armorers did great work on even their 91/30s let alone the "M" series...

The Nagants main failings are trigger(fixable) and less than stellar ergonomics...

Archangel just fixed that......

I am down to a Retired Sniper 91/30 and wife's Polish M44 carbine....

one of the two is gonna get a new suit with that stock I linked and a nice optic set up.....

maybe both

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 05:50 AM (LRFds)

22 Alink to Ace of Spades from CB F'n S. Wow. Posted by: Mama AJ at June 23, 2013 09:50 AM (SUKHu) I know, right?

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet Palin/Bolton 2016 at June 23, 2013 05:51 AM (XIxXP)

23 22 OSP,

We're big time....

arguably....

point is I think we need more reporting.....and maybe a news editor....

if See BS fires Atkisson I'm hoping the web picks her up....

it'd be a good precedent

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 05:54 AM (LRFds)

24 The M91 has a large following of enthusiasts in Finland, similar to our love of the Garand. During the Winter War, a Finn sniper sent over two hundred Reds to Commie heaven, using only open sights. This guy, name of Simo and I forget his last name also did in high double digits of the invader with his trusty Suomi SMG. He was a simple reservist farmer who picked up his M91 kept in the barn or milkhouse and went out and did what he evidently did best.

Posted by: Bill at June 23, 2013 05:55 AM (uvyrw)

25 Must go walk the doggehs. Later rons.

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet Palin/Bolton 2016 at June 23, 2013 05:56 AM (XIxXP)

26 24 Bill,

Simo Haya....

one of my heroes....

and why in the end I am not terribly afraid of Barky or the mules...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simo_H%C3%A4yh%C3%A4

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 05:57 AM (LRFds)

27 >> At which point you will run into the restriction that EVERY range I've been to has a range rule against "rapid fire" Yeah, we don't have that rule. Of course, we allow full-auto fire too, so there's that.

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 05:57 AM (li+aS)

28 Some of you NYC Morons can lay some knowledge on us. Using NYC resources for a political anti-gun campaign is against the law is most places. Is Bloomingidiot in violation of NYC law?

Posted by: Vic at June 23, 2013 05:57 AM (lZvxr)

29 .410 shell in a short barrel revolver. Guaranteed one shot stop. Oh, I won't guarantee it but I'm sure a gun counter guy will.

Posted by: RWC at June 23, 2013 05:58 AM (8FeS+)

Question for all the clinger's on here: We have a gun in my family, my Gr.Grandfather's deer rifle. It is passed down to the youngest male in the family, and currently is in my little bros. custody. I *think* it's a rare/valuable piece, but my only evidence of this is a trip to a gun store back in the 70's w/my dad. The guy behind the counter offered him $10K for it on the spot.

The gun: a .54 cal (I think) Colt, slide action, hex. barrell. The story goes that for a brief period in the mid 1800's, Colt started making long arms, and Winchester was prompted by that to start making revolvers. After seeing the folly of their ways a couple of years later, they got into a gentleman's agreement to stop, and do what each did best. Not sure about any of that, just family lore.

Any ideas about what this thing would be worth? We haven't cleaned it, it has a rich mahogony patina, and you can still see the little dancing colt on the receiver.

Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at June 23, 2013 05:58 AM (qpah5)

31 Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 09:50 AM (LRFds)

In that type of rifle I have always been partial to the 03-A3 but those are getting to be expensive as hell now.

Posted by: Vic at June 23, 2013 05:59 AM (lZvxr)

32 24 Bill,

His favorite thing in the world was skiing through a Russian squads' campfire and using his friend the Suomi to liven up the morning.....

he preferred iron sights because he felt telescopic optics twinkled too much and made it too easy to break cover...

Ivan tried interdicting *him* with an Arty battery once....

after being shot in the face and in a coma he woke up as the war was ending.....

and was happy it was over....

the guy was a true badass

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 05:59 AM (LRFds)

33 >>> Some of you NYC Morons can lay some knowledge on us. Using NYC resources for a political anti-gun campaign is against the law is most places. Is Bloomingidiot in violation of NYC law? It's a little murky, but it appears that's a real possibility. Politico isn't done investigating.

Posted by: JohnE. at June 23, 2013 06:00 AM (nRTou)

34 31 Vic,

Agreed and I'd prefer the '03 of course were price no object...the ammo being so much cheaper allows one to really practice their butts off though.

Who knows I gave away two M-39s over the years and a few 91/30s...

You never know what may wind up under the Xmas tree if/when we meet in Carolina Vic...

I gave my boss back in Louisiana my Swiss K-31 I have always given people I respect and will miss a rifle to say "goodbye"....still will right up until the Feds make it a felony.

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:02 AM (LRFds)

35 Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at June 23, 2013 09:58 AM (qpah5) Just to clarify, do you mean 'octagonal' barrel?

Posted by: RWC at June 23, 2013 06:03 AM (8FeS+)

36 @ 10 I actually like a wheel gun better than a semi. It limits me as far as rounds available I know, but I'm more comfortable with them. Posted by: JoethefatmanÂ™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 09:47 AM (MnSla) First, the best gun is the one that you have.

Posted by: HoboJerky, Hash Hunter at June 23, 2013 06:04 AM (X4HxX)

37 30 Brave Sir Robin,

If it's a slide rifle it is a Colt Lightning, if it is a lever gun it is the Colt Burgess....

yes either one is valuable.....

I'd have it appraised and send it to a antique gunsmith to stabilize any decay....

Wife's SASS rifle is a copy of the spirit of the Colt Lightning called a Taurus Thunderbolt....

Slicked up and broken in they are as rapid firing as an AR

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:05 AM (LRFds)

Just to clarify, do you mean 'octagonal' barrel?

I haven't counted the sides, but yeah, if that makes more sense...

Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at June 23, 2013 06:05 AM (qpah5)

39 1 The Moisin-Nagant was used by the US Army. During the 1918-1919 Allied intervention in Murmansk to fight the Red Bolsheviks. Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at June 23, 2013 09:35 AM (wPxCh) Also used domestically as a training rifle and by the National Guard in the 20s. Remington and Westinghouse made Mosins for the Czar during WWI but they got stuck with around 200k rifles when the Russians stopped paying their bills in 1917. The US govt bought up most of the rifles to save the two companies from bankruptcy. The Finn versions are sweet. My unissued M39 is a damned tack driver, built on an 1896 Izhevsk receiver. Plus, the Finn Mosins are almost guaranteed to have been used to kill commies at some point in their lives. Warms my heart.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at June 23, 2013 06:06 AM (MBqvE)

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 23, 2013 09:39 AM (WW8xK)

I still have 0 deers to my name (only been out 3 seasons though.)

But a few years back my Cousin got one at about 150 yards that dropped instantly (we heard the shot at the cabin, where we were winterizing so we could leave) and about 2 seconds later he came over the radio to announce it.

When we dressed it (which we did in the field because the fucker shot it at the bottom of the deepest ravine on the property with no ATV access) both atria of the heart had goon boom and one lung.

In fairness, Coz is a great shot and had a drop reticle on his rife that he's practiced with.

Posted by: tsrblke at June 23, 2013 06:08 AM (GaqMa)

41 Morning all. in the year of obama 5, Russia, China, Cuba and Venezuela are shitting all over America.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at June 23, 2013 06:08 AM (jE38p)

42 Nice, Toby. My dad has a couple of '03-A3's. One is a sporterized version that he's had as long as I can remember (IIRC, it's a Smith-Carona as well). The other is a more recent acquisition that's in the original configuration.

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 06:08 AM (li+aS)

43 Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 10:02 AM (LRFds)

I used to have one of those and I traded it off. I kick myself every day over that.

My younger brother had a Russian rifle and a Swiss. He got rid of both of them and concentrated on collecting 03-A3s.

Posted by: Vic at June 23, 2013 06:08 AM (lZvxr)

44 35 RWC,

I'm assuming that'd be a yes...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_Lightning_Carbine

http://tinyurl.com/ls5oxtl

I like the Burgess design a lot...about my only complaint on it is the lack of protection from debris and clutter the Winchester has....

slicked up it is a smooth rifle

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:09 AM (LRFds)

45 Or "... Corona". Whatever.

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 06:09 AM (li+aS)

46 Thanks, Esteban for the memory refresher on Simo's last name. I'm not sure of the spelling and I'm of Finnish extraction (the old man was born there) but it's close enough. Simo was messed up badly, having seen a photo of him, and he was given a field commission for his service. I think he was awarded the Mannerheim Cross, and he returned to farming and lived into his eighties. It's the quiet ones you have to watch.

Posted by: Bill at June 23, 2013 06:10 AM (uvyrw)

47 Well a young relative asked if I had a gun. I said no. Which is true. He has entered that phase, which in my family can last decades, where every question might be a trick question, so I was a little taken aback.

Posted by: Baldy at June 23, 2013 06:11 AM (tyDFN)

48 47 Bill,

Indeed...

My Danish friend says the Finns are the "Americans of Europe"...

my Finnish contacts hate the notion....

they're a tough, honorable people.

I wish we were importing them in as great a number as our little amigos

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:12 AM (LRFds)

49 Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 10:09 AM (LRFds) I was thinking Lightning, but can't find one chambered in .54. Either way Brave Sir Robin, I'll give you 200 for it. You know, there really isn't a market for this, and it's a fair price. I'll have ruble moving it. I'm losing money here! -RWC, Shifty Pawn Broker Mode

Posted by: RWC at June 23, 2013 06:12 AM (8FeS+)

50 48 Baldy,

My son has been trained in the notion of "Inside" and "outside" info.....

it's crazy that the current climate is making "crazy" sane bit by bit...

it is not paranoia when they really are out to get you

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:13 AM (LRFds)

51 Posted by: Vic at June 23, 2013 09:57 AM (lZvxr)

Bloomberg has already claimed that it is within the duties and prerogatives of the mayor.

He is saving lives!

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 23, 2013 06:13 AM (WW8xK)

52 Corker amendment text is out. 1,190 pages. Vote on Monday. Gotta pass it to find out what's in it!

Posted by: HoboJerky, Hash Hunter at June 23, 2013 06:14 AM (X4HxX)

53 My father has a browning 22 rifle that loads the bullets through the butt end of the rifle, and has a rod in the butt that has a spring load at the end. It has no bolt action. I can't for the life of me figure out how it shoots. It is 40 plus years old and only shot about 10 times. It seems rather unique? How do the spent cartridges eject? Anyone here familiar with this?

Posted by: Derak at June 23, 2013 06:14 AM (u32Nc)

54 50 RWC,

the 54 threw me off as well...

if it is .54 caliber it'd almost have to be a Spencer rifle or a Burnside carbine but "Pump" says lightning.....

the thing is the lightning's highest caliber that was "stock" was .44-40 ah fun with guns....

any minute spent contemplating guns is a better minute than one spent contemplating the bastards on the hill

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:15 AM (LRFds)

55 >> Anyone here familiar with this? This? http://goo.gl/DO6Wi Wonderful little rifle.

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 06:15 AM (li+aS)

56 Mike Lee is kicking Goober Graham's pansy ass on FNS.

Posted by: Captain Hate at June 23, 2013 06:16 AM (x4gwG)

57 Ms Puma,

Our ill-fated Russian Civil War deployments are part of the seedcorn of Soviet paranoia about us...

if you talk to 500 history majors maybe ten know the story.

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:16 AM (LRFds)

58 OMG, mosins. I likey the mosins and have more than a few. Tulas, Izzy's, long ones, short ones (m-44's), Chinese variants (T-53's). I'm hooked on the ole 7.62 x 54r. Where else can you get a crate of 880 rounds of commie 30-06 for less than 180 dollars? The UPS guy hates me and hates the ammo crates too!

Posted by: Jude Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 06:17 AM (k5CC9)

59 56 Andy,

Yes it is...

King's Island in Ohio used them back when they had a .22 rifle range at the park....

dad was like a demigod with one...

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:18 AM (LRFds)

60 Thanks all...I believe it is the Lightning Express, .50 caliber.

Posted by: Brave Sir Robin at June 23, 2013 06:18 AM (qpah5)

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 10:15 AM (li+aS)

I recall my friends dad having a Remington Nylon that loaded the same way, but for the life of me I don't remember much about it.

Being all grown up, I moved to shotguns, and my friend bought his own Ruger.

Posted by: tsrblke at June 23, 2013 06:18 AM (GaqMa)

62 59 Judge Roy Bean,

heh.....then you keep your eyes peeled for the SVT-38 SVT-40 comrade...

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:19 AM (LRFds)

63 I had one of the little Browning .22's when I was a kid. I wish I hadn't sold it, it was a great little rifle. It ejects out of the bottom. If you shoot leftie be careful wearing long sleeves--you can end up with hot brass down the sleeve of your right arm.

Posted by: the guy that moves pianos for a living... at June 23, 2013 06:19 AM (zIe7k)

64 OT
So I got some shit show on Hulu playing in the background while I'm doing my Sunday morning stuff and they play a trailer for a movie called Copperhead, which as far as I can tell is a sympathetic retelling of those gutless fucks.
Why doesn't Hollywood just get it over with and start making movies extolling the wonderfulness that is the Nazi's? Fucking Assholes.

Posted by: lowandslow at June 23, 2013 06:20 AM (Fz2C7)

65 61 Brave Sir Robin,

nice search fu comrade...

I did not realize it had the .50-95 in the express.....

dear lord that would be an awesome scene in a cowboy flick....

Yeah that rifle is valuable as hades then...

http://www.rockislandauction.com/viewitem/aid/52/lid/3250

here's an example....

Looks like a Win 97 heh

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:21 AM (LRFds)

66 65 lowandlsow,

not OT.....

that is how through the fucking looking glass we are lowandslow...

the fucking copperheads are heroes....

you know the guys who had they had their way would have cost us the war...?

The liberals internal monologue is a maze

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:23 AM (LRFds)

67 The Badass Of The Week article for Simo Hayha is good, with very few exaggerations.

http://www.badassoftheweek.com/index.cgi?id=474030732596 And my favorite blog post on the Finns, which I've linked here about 20 times. http://anarchangel.blogspot.com/2009/11/finland-be-afraid-be-very-afraid.html?m=1

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at June 23, 2013 06:23 AM (MBqvE)

68 Read the post and reading all the comments. I can't stop. It's like watching a slow train wreck. All of you people talking about one shot stops different guns. Don't you know that guns are teh eeeevil?!!? I hate them. Think they bought it guys & gals?

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 06:24 AM (pQdNP)

69 Bloomberg has already claimed that it is within the duties and prerogatives of the mayor.

He is saving lives!

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at June 23, 2013 10:13 AM (WW8xK)

Yeah I saw what he said, but he is just as big a liar as Obama.

Posted by: Vic at June 23, 2013 06:24 AM (lZvxr)

70 @ 63 Esteban, Geez I have wanted an SVT 40 for the longest time. I like them more than the sks..I had 10 sks, which were recently lost in a boating accident in the desert! In the great white north (Canuck land) the SVT's and SKS's are cheap but down in Obama land they be pricey. I settled for a 7.62 x 54r VEPR for the short term to appease my craving. That is one is a bad mama jamma!

Posted by: Jude Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 06:26 AM (k5CC9)

71 Bloomberg has already claimed that it is within the duties and prerogatives of the mayor. Yes, because he needs to use tax money he took from you to lobby to take away more rights from you. Classic statist.

Posted by: zsasz at June 23, 2013 06:27 AM (MMC8r)

72 Corker amendment

http://minx.cc/?blog=86&post=341137#c20798115

Nothing good.

Posted by: Vic at June 23, 2013 06:28 AM (lZvxr)

73 Watching Gabriel Gomez on FNS, he looks like the second coming of Scottie Centerfold crossed with Zeppo Rubio: anti gun rights, believes in climate change, pro comprehensive immigration reform and homo marriage. What a great choice between him and Anti Biz Markey. Frick and Fuck.

Posted by: Captain Hate at June 23, 2013 06:29 AM (x4gwG)

74 It's good to practice putting multiple rounds on target quickly, but at least around here, ranges have rules against shooting fast....

Posted by: KG at June 23, 2013 06:29 AM (IPz9m)

75 71 Judge Roy Bean,

If I recall you are in the land of the Sino sun on occasion....

you should also keep your eyes peeled for the AVS-36

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AVS-36

It was Simonov's ideas towards the Tokarev's evolution....

The Finns captured a bunch....

It is more like a BAR than a Garand and it is prone to fouling....but one can't have it all

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:29 AM (LRFds)

76 54 My father has a browning 22 rifle that loads the bullets through the butt end of the rifle, and has a rod in the butt that has a spring load at the end. It has no bolt action. I can't for the life of me figure out how it shoots. It is 40 plus years old and only shot about 10 times. It seems rather unique? How do the spent cartridges eject? Anyone here familiar with this? Posted by: Derak at June 23, 2013 10:14 AM (u32Nc) No bolt action. It's an auto-loader. The spent casings should eject downwards.

Posted by: RWC at June 23, 2013 06:30 AM (8FeS+)

77 74 Captain Hate,

if amnesty passes we're all Mexifornia and the GOP will be Gomez's party...

no bullshit, no hyperbole

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:30 AM (LRFds)

78 Fuck the entire Repuke party. They've played the Tea Party like a bunch of fucking chumps for giving them and that weepy pile of shit Boehner control of the House, with which they haven't done a significant thing toward stopping the march of statism. They hate conservatives just as fucking much as the donks do.

Posted by: Captain Hate at June 23, 2013 06:36 AM (x4gwG)

79 Been regulating with a newly acquired slide stock for a bushmaster carbon 15 and it is truly amazing. If you don't have one you should definarely get one

Posted by: kreplach at June 23, 2013 06:36 AM (eiJIn)

80 Andy, great work as usual. Thanks

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at June 23, 2013 06:37 AM (Cydud)

81 Standing in line at the Fort Worth gun show. Nary a liberal in the area. Lotta women today too. Hopin' to find a lever action 357 or a 45-70.

Posted by: CrotchetyOldJarhead at June 23, 2013 06:37 AM (P1Tw6)

82 @ 76, just got back to Dongguan (Guangdong Province). Yep, I am in sino land working because I can't find meaningful work in Obama land and I am too proud to take welfare. Hey I heard tell of a legend over here. Thousands of broom handle mauser pistols tied down with barb wire onto pallets rusting away in caves under the control of the red guard. When I get some time I am chasing that rumor down!

Posted by: Jude Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 06:38 AM (k5CC9)

83 Derak, Here is the SA .22. Pretty sure if it isn't the same rifle that the action of yours is pretty similar if not the exact same- http://tinyurl.com/m3429ae

Posted by: RWC at June 23, 2013 06:38 AM (8FeS+)

84 56 >> Anyone here familiar with this? This? http://goo.gl/DO6Wi Wonderful little rifle. That looks exactly like the rifle I describe in my comment at 54.

Posted by: Dherak at June 23, 2013 06:39 AM (u32Nc)

85 @10

More bullets?

This is why this is my favorite pistol. THIRTY rounds. No recoil.

http://tinyurl.com/75t9g6

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at June 23, 2013 06:40 AM (Cydud)

86 in northeast ohio anyone know of a pistol range that allows rapid fire and/or a gun club/ outdoor range that allows holster draw and fire?

Posted by: a creeping sense of remorse at June 23, 2013 06:40 AM (BmWNr)

87 Hah, Jude Roy bean was my handle. I drank too much. I am putting the beer down and putting pants back on!

Posted by: Judge Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 06:40 AM (k5CC9)

88 82 Crotchety Old Jarhead,

The Marlin 95 in .45-70 is on my wishlist in the XBL(?) version....

Ghost Rings and Picatinny

*boom*

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:40 AM (LRFds)

89 @54

<a href="http://ww2.justanswer.com/uploads/TR/Tritac1911/2012-11-16_150512_category100.jpg">This one?</a>

If it is, you load the cartridges in the tubular magazine, cock the gun by pulling back the tab sticking out the bottom in front of the trigger and fire by pulling the trigger. The spent cartridges are ejected out the bottom.

Remington also made this (Browning-designed) gun, as their model 241, from 1935 to 1949.

Posted by: PersonFromPorlock at June 23, 2013 06:41 AM (K2Y5N)

90 83 Judge Roy Bean,

Yup they're real....don't know how easy to find...

They had the M96 in .45ACP yeehaw

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:42 AM (LRFds)

91 54 My father has a browning 22 rifle that loads the bullets through the butt end of the rifle, and has a rod in the butt that has a spring load at the end.>>

Is it this Browning design but made by several companies including Remington?

http://tinyurl.com/mu223mf

http://tinyurl.com/jwksskd

Posted by: McGregor at June 23, 2013 06:43 AM (qo244)

92 79 Captain Hate,

They pass amnesty I'll be the caboose...

you know how hard I tried to keep tea partiers and Luap Nor on the reservation as well...

what the GOP is saying if they pass amnesty is "fuck the American worker"...

to which the answer is "no fuck you"

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:43 AM (LRFds)

93 Ok all, off to watch a two hour documentary on what happens when the F$A payments be late, mane! Oh, I mean WWZ.

Posted by: RWC at June 23, 2013 06:44 AM (8FeS+)

94 "30 The gun: a .54 cal (I think) Colt, slide action, hex. barrell."

If it's a Colt Lightning in .50-95 Express, then it should be worth a few shekels. I'll gladly trade a nice modern firearm for your old obsolete piece of junk.

Posted by: Rufus T. Firefly at June 23, 2013 06:45 AM (ymovd)

95 Do you guys think this is too much? http://www.gunco.net/forums/f132/do-you-guys-think-too-much-73881/ How do you do that tiny url thingy?

Posted by: Judge Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 06:45 AM (k5CC9)

96 Btw, although it goes better in the Sunday Book section, Chris Kyle's 'Ten Guns' is a very good primer.

Posted by: Almirnte Marcus at June 23, 2013 06:45 AM (Jsiw/)

97 I have gone back and forth over time on the relative merits of 9mm and .45. I have swung back towards the 9mm lately simply because it is easier to stack a lt of rounds in one. has anyone seen a study or have any experience with stopping a single person with a single magazine?

Posted by: yankeefifth at June 23, 2013 06:47 AM (Z9EHQ)

98 How do you do that tiny url thingy?>>

Go here and copy paste the new url.

http://tinyurl.com/create.php

Posted by: McGregor at June 23, 2013 06:47 AM (qo244)

99 Guangdong Province- There's a good chance that's where my instructor's master was from. Start with the local Kempo, steal whatever works and is practical from other styles and you have ours.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 06:47 AM (PcFsV)

100 I'd go with an 1894c too. Had a chance to get one with Dan Wesson .357 but when I got there, the guy changed his mind and bumped the price. They weren't in very good shale either. Dickhead...

Posted by: CrotchetyOldJarhead at June 23, 2013 06:48 AM (U7Ivf)

101 96 Judge Roy Bean,

1) go here http://tinyurl.com/

2) paste the url you want truncated in box for example www.CosPlayHillary.com

3) hit the tab to generate a tiny url

4) copy and paste the result which should look like this

http://tinyurl.com/l67qs62

enjoy

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:49 AM (LRFds)

102 Regarding knockdown power, "All the anti-gunner "who needs 10 rounds?" crap is belied by the fact that you most likely need to put at least half of them into a single attacker" is the way the Rangers see it. Don't double tap, keep firing until he's down.

Posted by: formwiz at June 23, 2013 06:49 AM (Kv1kb)

103 >>>My father has a browning 22 rifle that loads the bullets through the butt end of the rifle, and has a rod in the butt that has a spring load at the end.<<<

Look up SA-22. They still make/sell them. One of John Browning's finest designs.

Posted by: Fritz at June 23, 2013 06:49 AM (G9Mmf)

104 and another thing, anyone have any experience with the springifeld xds? is there any risk of all of all the indicators and safetys reducing the reliability?

Posted by: yankeefifth at June 23, 2013 06:49 AM (Z9EHQ)

105 The anti-gun crowd has been padding their numbers for years. Included in the "child deaths" for example are "kids" up to 25 years old, and include gang-bangers shooting each other as well as suicide and suicide-by-cop.

I knew the gun right away this time, the 91/30 is a pretty distinctive piece. I have the full length and lust for an M-38 carbine version.

Good morning roonz and roonettez!

Posted by: GGE of the Moron Horde, NC Chapter at June 23, 2013 06:50 AM (yh0zB)

106 has anyone seen a study or have any experience with stopping a single person with a single magazine?>>

Not so much a study as a truism. "The gun you have at that moment is the most effective."

Posted by: McGregor at June 23, 2013 06:50 AM (qo244)

107 Thx rwc and porlock. Now to show my complete ignorance..... Do you load the bullets in the butt end or the little side port which is also on the stock? What does the rod do? I don't know if I'm using proper terminology. Maybe I'll look for a utube. Someone surely has a video.

Posted by: Derak at June 23, 2013 06:51 AM (u32Nc)

108 103 Regarding knockdown power, "All the anti-gunner "who needs 10 rounds?" crap is belied by the fact that you most likely need to put at least half of them into a single attacker" is the way the Rangers see it. Don't double tap, keep firing until he's down. Posted by: formwiz at June 23, 2013 10:49 AM (Kv1kb) From the USMC Rules For Gunfighting: Anything worth shooting once is worth shooting twice. Ammo is cheap, life is expensive.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at June 23, 2013 06:51 AM (MBqvE)

109 what the GOP is saying if they pass amnesty is "fuck the American worker"...

to which the answer is "no fuck you"

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 10:43 AM (LRFds)

I've been opposed in the past to "teaching those cocksuckers a lesson" and have dutifully gone to the polls and voted for their squish du jour. But I've had it with their undisguised contempt for conservatives and am very close to just saying they're on their own. They promote increased control of the state over our lives and the erosion of the concept of freedom. And then send their toadies out to say that Reagan would agree with them after they've shit all over everything he ever did. They are a miserable bunch of fucking liars who all deserve to be out on their asses and nowhere near the levers of power.

Posted by: Captain Hate at June 23, 2013 06:52 AM (x4gwG)

110 How do you do that tiny url thingy? Posted by: Judge Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 10:45 AM (k5CC9) If you're using Firefox, you can download an add-on called 'CreateTinyURL'. Once you do that, go to the page that you want to create a tiny url for, right click and select 'Create Tiny URL' from the drop down menu. It automatically copies it to your clipboard and you just come here and paste it.

Posted by: Tami[/i][/b][/u][/s] at June 23, 2013 06:52 AM (X6akg)

111 98 Yankeefifth,

I've posted and will post again a database of documented one shot stops...

http://www.handloads.com/misc/stoppingpower.asp

Jim Cirillo did extensive analysis of autopsies when he was on the stakeout squad and agrees essentially with the notion that a one shot stop takes a rifle round....

he considered double barrel shotguns inadequate for stakeout work b/c of the lack of follow up....

he was personally a huge fan of the .30 carbine

.45 has arguably greater potential for psychological stops and is inarguably a better wound channel cavitator when similar warhead configurations are used...

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:53 AM (LRFds)

112 I had an Izhmash Dragunov in 7.62x54 That... was a hell of a rifle I put it on Gun Broker with no reserve and a BUY NOW price of $4500. It sold in less than five minutes.

Posted by: panzernashorn at June 23, 2013 06:53 AM (MhA4j)

113 >> Do you load the bullets in the butt end or the little side port which is also on the stock? Either one works >> What does the rod do? The spring in the rod is the magazine spring. It pushes the rounds into the action as it cycles. Here's a PDF of the owner's manual: http://goo.gl/901Vm

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 06:56 AM (li+aS)

114 113 Panzernashorn,

Yeah the SVD series was a nice sharpshooter class rifle... a properly accurized M-21 was a better sniper gun but not by a bunch

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 06:56 AM (LRFds)

115 I am not sure if I saw this link here or if I just ran across it but if you haven't seen it it is a worthwhile discussion by a doctor who has witnessed the effects and does not seem to have any particular ax to grind.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=tku8YI68-JA&NR=1

Posted by: Obnoxious A-hole at June 23, 2013 06:58 AM (31Nrp)

116 Derak,
You twist the little knob on the push rod in the stock and pull it back. You feed the rounds into the little port on the side of the stock (14 if I remember right) then push the rod back in ad twist to lock it in place. The rod has a spring in it and pushes the rounds into the chamber when it cycles.

Posted by: the guy that moves pianos for a living... at June 23, 2013 07:00 AM (Nl4r1)

117 >> Watching Gabriel Gomez on FNS, he looks like the second coming of Scottie Centerfold crossed with Zeppo Rubio: anti gun rights, believes in climate change, pro comprehensive immigration reform and homo marriage. What a great choice between him and Anti Biz Markey. Frick and Fuck. What I keep telling people ... if you hated Scott Brown, you'll absolutely loathe Gomez. I like Brown. He's a good guy who never made himself out to be anything he wasn't. Gomez, OTOH, is a fucking snake.

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 07:01 AM (li+aS)

118 Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 10:53 AM Hey, Thanks. I have read your link before, I am assuming it was your link.

Posted by: yankeefifth at June 23, 2013 07:03 AM (Z9EHQ)

119 I've been opposed in the past to "teaching those cocksuckers a lesson" and have dutifully gone to the polls and voted for their squish du jour.
Posted by: Captain Hate at June 23, 2013 10:52 AM

I feel your pain, Cap'n.

Two days until I have to make up my mind whether I'll trot down to the polls and vote for a turncoat "Republican" shitweasel. His opponent is a Democrat in the finest MA tradition -- crooked, lazy, nanny-state-loving POS with 37 years of "experience" sucking on the public teat in D.C. -- who makes me physically ill, but why (further) sell out my country to support a guy who went begging to Devil Patrick (our very own Baby Choom Boy) to get Kerry's seat?

Fuck Republicans. They have sold out to the Poppin' Fresh brigade. We're right in the middle of World War D, and guess what? We're losing.

Posted by: MrScribbler at June 23, 2013 07:04 AM (/RIVS)

120 Thx mcgregor. The smith and Wesson forum was pretty informative. No doubt it is a browning sa22.

Posted by: Derak at June 23, 2013 07:04 AM (u32Nc)

121 Thanks Esteban, McGregor Tami, et al , for the tiny url advice. I am drunk as a skunk now and copying that down for future reference. @ 100 Teej, I took kenpo when I was a kid. The I took Moo Duk Kwan for a while (an old traditional form of Tai kwon do, which I affectionately refer to as "take your dough")

I settled on Kung fu, took it for 10 years. Im pushing 60 now. So no Kung fu for me too much any more, with my gun collection you culd say I am into 'ching , ching pow" style. Although I am heavy into the Tai Chi (Chen , Yang and Wu-Hao styles). It's funny, people in China ask me to teach them tai chi. Hah!

Posted by: Judge Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 07:05 AM (k5CC9)

122 119 YankeeFifth,

No problem yeah I always bust out the link.

One shot stops are real but never count on them....

The Walls and Halls of Honor in most Regimental HQs have examples of people enduring damage that is well nigh unimaginable and finishing their tasks....

fire 'til you're dry and then reload...

heh

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 07:06 AM (LRFds)

123 MrScribbler, I've pretty much decided to write in Scott Brown on Tuesday. I said early on that I'd vote for Gomez because R, but I just can't do it.

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 07:07 AM (li+aS)

124 105 and another thing, anyone have any experience with the springifeld xds? is there any risk of all of all the indicators and safetys reducing the reliability? I have an XD(M), which I believe is an identical action, just full sized. Been reliable for me, but haven't been able to shoot it a whole lot since I got it. It was a little tough getting used to the lack of an external safety - my previous handgun was a Beretta 92FS - but it feels much better in my hand than my Beretta did.

Posted by: Emile Antoon Khadaji at June 23, 2013 07:07 AM (KvKOu)

125 Book thread up now

Posted by: Vic at June 23, 2013 07:07 AM (lZvxr)

126 120 Mr Scribbler,

Hey I feel your pain...

I'd ordinarily say send the cocksucker Gomez b/c hey "GOP" but you know what?

He's just another Pelosi mole in the caucus...

not excusing Boner too much but I get the feeling he has a revolt barely being contained from the left...

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 07:08 AM (LRFds)

127 MrScribbler, I've pretty much decided to write in Scott Brown on Tuesday.

I said early on that I'd vote for Gomez because R, but I just can't do it. Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 11:07 AM

I'm going to write in Vermin Supreme, I think.

He's a local boy (just the most visible of the local wackos).

I agree, Andy. Gomez is a step too far in the downard spiral.

Posted by: MrScribbler at June 23, 2013 07:09 AM (/RIVS)

128 124 Andy,

Yeah it's tough I don't envy you....

I guess you need to decide if you think he'll show any loyalty to the GOP Caucus....

if not he's just another McRino gang member

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 07:10 AM (LRFds)

129 and by Pelosi mole I am saying it now...

Nancy Pelosi is running the Hill agenda for the Mules in the house and the senate

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 07:11 AM (LRFds)

130 Derak, my late grandfather absolutely loved that little Browning. He had tons of them, including several from the custom shop in the high grades with gold inlay, engraving, etc. My uncles have these and they've never been shot. God only knows what they're worth now.

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 07:11 AM (li+aS)

131 Thx for the PDF Andy!!! Dad is 90 and he can't remember exactly how it fires. This just solved the problem.. You morons are the greatest!

Posted by: Derak at June 23, 2013 07:11 AM (u32Nc)

132 126 Book thread up now Posted by: Vic at June 23, 2013 11:07 AM (lZvxr) Dang, I was just about to say that I slept through the morning thread. Sheesh. I slept through the morning thread and the gun thread.

Posted by: rickl at June 23, 2013 07:11 AM (sdi6R)

133 MAIG is part of a Communist-styled effort to disarm law-abiding Americans and increase internal strife by ignoring actual crime. Bloomberg's efforts are only one small part of the enemy operation that is systematically attacking the social and moral pillars of America. This is all according to plan, and the plans are proceeding without a hitch - don't let the recent supposed "setbacks" for the Communist gun-grabbers or the anti-US Sovereignty activists fool you into complacency.

Make no mistake, Bloomberg is an actual enemy agent working against us. As is our current President, and many people in the administration - and also so many others working behind the scenes, unelected and unaccountable. We are currently involved in a "cold" civil war. It will go hot. You best prepare.

...and if we start lobbing nukes at each other... God help us.

Posted by: .505 Gibbs at June 23, 2013 07:12 AM (y6uCF)

134 Judge, you're a man after my own heart. Pushing 60 now myself. Wish I could find a proper Tai Chi master. Studied Yang family for a bit under a remarkable Chinese guy in his mid 70's but he retired and turned it over to his 20 yrs younger American wife. It went down hill quick. Ah well. I was fortunate to have who I had for as long as I did back when.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 07:13 AM (PcFsV)

135 MrScribbler, I've pretty much decided to write in Scott Brown on Tuesday.

I said early on that I'd vote for Gomez because R, but I just can't do it.

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 11:07 AM (li+aS)

To Scottie Centerfold's credit, he kept his word on voting against JEFcare and forced those fucking fucks to do something surely illegal (thanks again Roberts, you worthless turd) to pass the pile of shit. I wouldn't trust Gomez as far as I could kick him.

Posted by: Captain Hate at June 23, 2013 07:14 AM (x4gwG)

136 Derak, my late grandfather absolutely loved that little Browning. **** I found a Remington 511 ScoreMaster at an Estate Sale. It has a monster long barrel. acc-u-right to extreme. The estate sale guy was an FFL too and did transfers right and proper.

Posted by: Beto at June 23, 2013 07:15 AM (MhA4j)

137 The main thing that's really turning me off about Gomez isn't even Gomez. It's the idiots like Jen Rubin who say I need to vote for him because HISTORIC or something. I don't give a rat's ass that he's Hispanic myself; I just think he'll make a shitty senator and it's not worth inflicting more damage to the R brand to send him to D.C. Markey can and will fuck us at least as well as Gomez, so good on him.

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 07:17 AM (li+aS)

138 138 Andy,

Jen Rubin is conservative like I'm David Hasselhoff

Posted by: Esteban10077@sven10077 at June 23, 2013 07:19 AM (LRFds)

139 My Remington-made Model 24 (1919, I think), is a takedown model, and I assume all of them were. It uses an interrupted thread and a locking tab, not a nut. The soft spot of the design is that the threads can wear rather severely, forcing a "brace" against one of the other end of the travel for consistent shots. The action is slick and simple, though, and the loading tube system works well. I last saw one at a gun show almost 15 years ago, and they wanted a hefty $450 for one in fair-to-good condition.

Posted by: comatus at June 23, 2013 07:20 AM (JNUY4)

140 Beto, I think I've mentioned this on the blog before, but the late grandfather of which I spoke was an FFL too. He opened a gun store when I was 12, and I worked there from then all the way through college. "Kid in a candy store" ... ummm, candy's for pussies. That should be "kid in a gun store".

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 07:20 AM (li+aS)

141 Andy, is there a true conservative, in a word, constitutionalist, that you can write in?

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 07:21 AM (/BwGa)

142 Ah well. I was fortunate to have who I had for as long as I did back when. Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 11:13 AM (PcFsV) When I was a young man, I found a garage dojo run by an Ed Parker student and 3rd deg. BB I was exceptionally lucky all my life that way. I studied Kodokan Judo from Eight to Thirteen with the #1 Anglo instructor in the world at an Air Force Base for free.. Good times

Posted by: Beto at June 23, 2013 07:22 AM (MhA4j)

143 In case I haven't said it before, thanks for sharing the knowledge folks. Just because I've gone semi OT doesn't mean I'm not paying attention and soaking up what I can.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 07:26 AM (/BwGa)

144 If you're using Firefox, you can download an add-on called 'CreateTinyURL'. Once you do that, go to the page that you want to create a tiny url for, right click and select 'Create Tiny URL' from the drop down menu. It automatically copies it to your clipboard and you just come here and paste it.

Posted by: Tami at June 23, 2013 10:52 AM (X6akg)

Thanks Tami. I've added that to my Ff now.

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 07:27 AM (MnSla)

145 Congrats and all that to John E for figuring out that the Mayors against guns was actually an NYC.gov site. Even congrats to CBS with their gazillion journalists who are too stupid to do a whois themselves.

I would suggest that John E et al take a look at the Mayors against guns 990 forms. They have some very interesting finances.

So, yeah, kudos and all but what am I, chopped liver?

I figured this out 6 months ago with a simple whois on the mayorsagainst... URL. It took all of 15 seconds or so.

In a forum on the Madison WI Isthmus site I pointed out the following last Dec 28:

"And I note that you don't tell us who did the poll. Really, Stebben. In any event, it was "Mayors Against Illegal Guns" www.mayorsagainstillegalguns.org which turns out to be the New York City Government. www.nyc.gov

They too have an interesting balance sheet. They took in around $1.2mm in 2010 yet had about $1.3mm cash on hand at the end of the year. (According to their 990)

When you click on the Mayors... link it redirects to www.demandaplan.org which has proxy registration so who knows who is behind it."

<snip>

http://bit.ly/15vGICc

John Henry

Posted by: John Henry at June 23, 2013 07:30 AM (bUJOq)

146 "Kid in a candy store" ... ummm, candy's for pussies. That should be "kid in a gun store". Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 11:20 AM My Pop too. That's where I learned to run a lathe and mill. I've been a machinist for 47 years now.

Posted by: Beto at June 23, 2013 07:30 AM (MhA4j)

147 @135, Teej, I will try to breathe the breath of life into the ole gun thread as long as I can before the new thread sniffers all run off. I live for this. What state do you live in if I may be so bold to ask? Maybe I can hook you up with a good teacher. If you are in Texas, seek out Jimmy Wong in Plano. If you are in B-more/DC area seek out Goh's Kung fu . He is not known for his Tai Chi, but he hires great people out of China from time to time to teach it. I studied Yang style for years from Coach Xiaoling lu, who was very good . Then I studied Yang, Chen, and 8 trigram boxing (Ba Qua) under Xu Yuru. She was the bomb! That lady forgot more about internal arts than most people I know. I was lucky to come to China. I have been to shaolin temple and Chen village (birthplace of tai Chi). I want to go to Ermei mountain and also Wu-dang Mtn. I hope to do that this year.

Posted by: Judge Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 07:31 AM (k5CC9)

148 Posted by: Judge Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 11:31 AM Amazing who you meet in here. As an old man I use Nine Dragon (Shifu - John P. Painter Ph.D. ND.)

Posted by: Beto at June 23, 2013 07:35 AM (MhA4j)

149 >> I would suggest that John E et al take a look at the Mayors against guns 990 forms. Already on it.

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 07:36 AM (li+aS)

150 Judge Bean,
How does that Tai Chi stuff work for someone that is fat, physically unfit, can't stand for more than 30 minutes (not weight related) without eating pain pills for a couple of day after and is a lazy f^ck to boot?

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 07:36 AM (MnSla)

151 Garage donor, ah, memories. Wintertime. Totally closed garage. Kero-sun heater. About the end of the hour or so exercise portion of class a 4th degree Shotokan instructor steps in for a visit and gasps. Asks sensei how we breath in here. Sensei's reply... Through our gills. Always getting hollered at about not getting caught between him and at wall. Yeah. You could barely get a full sized Ford in that garage and get the door open far enough to get out. When he planted himself in the middle... An Ed Parker Sandan and judo from a great instructor at 8-13. Yeah, you were lucky. And I'll bet you know your breakfalls. And kuzush, tushiri, gaki.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 07:36 AM (GhSTE)

152 >> My Pop too. That's where I learned to run a lathe and mill. I've been a machinist for 47 years now. Sweet. My grandfather had two sons. One of these uncles ran his gun store and the other ran his hardware store. Between working at the two, I basically learned all I needed to know.

Posted by: Andy at June 23, 2013 07:39 AM (li+aS)

153 Dad gummed auto crap... dojo. Now it accepts it. I'm stickin' with ya judge and Beto. I'm in ne Kansas.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 07:41 AM (Nsomq)

154 I type real slow on the fone folks so bare with how long my replies take. I really have no one to talk martial arts with.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 07:47 AM (Nsomq)

155 152 I was a master of hip techniques. I was so good at countering anything with a combination Harai Goshi, Osoto Gari I won Gold in my division at 12 years in an International AFJA Tournament. I could launch people to shoulder height yet let them down completely controlled with my chi.

Posted by: Beto at June 23, 2013 07:48 AM (MhA4j)

156 @ Joe, Tai Chi is most likely the most forgivng martial art you will ever take. It is like a 3 leg stool. I leg is Chi Kung (energy/body work), the 2nd leg is meditation (calms the mind and spirit). The third leg is martial. Chinese martial artist guys used to challenge each other. China don't allow the duel, so they would slip down to malaysia to fight. I seen them Tai Chi guys draw blood when the challenger was in the radius. At Teej, let me make some calls to find someone good close to you.

Posted by: Judge Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 07:49 AM (k5CC9)

157 Joe, if you find a good instructor it will be great for you. You can start out with your stances, like the bow stance, being shorter and work your way to longer. Always keeping in mind that if your in a longer stance it makes you more vulnerable to being swept off balance.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 07:51 AM (d4o2E)

158 Thanks Judge!!!

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 07:53 AM (d4o2E)

159 157, 158 Just learning to channel his chi will help him to lose weight and lower blood pressure.

Posted by: Beto at June 23, 2013 07:54 AM (MhA4j)

160 Youngest Boy and I took the Marlins out for some exercise last weekend, I zeroed both the sights in. The 795 has Tech-Sights aperture sights and the 60 has a cheapie WallyWorld scope. I zeroed them in on a stand at 25 yards and now they are both bullseye shooters.

We did a little competition at the end of the day, 30 rounds each, mine through the 795's open sights and him through the 60's scope, and I whupped his young arse (I had a gaping hole where the 9/10 ring should have been and he was all over the paper). We swapped rifles and had the same result. I didn't have to hear about him being such a great shot after that.

Posted by: GGE of the Moron Horde, NC Chapter at June 23, 2013 07:57 AM (yh0zB)

161 Thanks Judge and teej. So maybe there's some hope for me yet. I tried something called Tang Soo Do and that was one of the most painful failures of my life.

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 07:58 AM (MnSla)

162 I do so miss the competing Beto. I love how some folks think point tournaments don't mean anything. I know they went downhill due to lawsuits but back in my day... Oh, so you got your ribs cracked from a good side kick or underhand reverse punch and don't want to continue? So sorry. You lose. He didn't draw blood from your face. Crack a cup with a heel counter kick...point.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 08:00 AM (AoY8i)

163 Judge, I guess you are in Texas? Anyone who even knows the slightest about Ba Qua is a rarity.

Posted by: Beto at June 23, 2013 08:00 AM (MhA4j)

164 162 Tang Soo Do.... Korean torture form.

Posted by: Beto at June 23, 2013 08:01 AM (MhA4j)

165 @BetoI don't have a BP problem believe it or not. If anything it tends more to the low end of good. The weight thing is not something I eorry an awful lot about. It's the not being able to stand or sit a reasonable amount of time that does.

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 08:03 AM (MnSla)

166 *worry

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 08:03 AM (MnSla)

167 And Judge, Tae Kwon Do = take your dough I love it and with your permission, so stealing that.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 08:04 AM (/BwGa)

168 Where is the pain from standing or sitting at Joe?

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 08:06 AM (/BwGa)

169 165 162 Tang Soo Do....

Only thing going with in 40 miles. But with only that as my reference point, why torture?

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 08:07 AM (MnSla)

170 Regarding take down shots, B.I.L owned a gas station in Chicago. Night shift guy had to shoot an attacker several times with a 9mm before the guy went down. Had it all on Video tape so the clerk was only charged with illegal posession of a firearm, and lost his gun. No criminal charges.

Posted by: Cicero Skip at June 23, 2013 08:08 AM (tC8HQ)

171 I guess The Judge is off finding Teej a teacher...

Posted by: Beto at June 23, 2013 08:13 AM (MhA4j)

172 @: teej
Mid back for sitting due to a wreck and both knees due to falling off a loaded flatbed for standing. Cracked one knee on the rub-rail on the way down, and blew out the other one doing therapy for the first. And no I ain't a .gov leach.

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 08:15 AM (MnSla)

173 Off to project the house....

Posted by: Beto at June 23, 2013 08:17 AM (MhA4j)

174 The Judge seems to be a good man. As do you Beto. True martial artists are some of the most trustworthy people around. If you stick around for years you learn to be humble and respectful. And not to judge a book by it's cover. And boy have I been humbled over the years.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 08:18 AM (JCIjD)

175 The Finnish Mosins are the best, at least by reputation, but any Mosin with a good bore will be a good rifle. The M38 tanker carbine is a ton of fun to shoot, and I'd bet the M44 is the same. Just look around until you find one with a good bore.

Posted by: Ken at June 23, 2013 08:19 AM (fFh95)

176 Beto, Yep My residence in the US is TX, although I am never there, and let the family hold down the fort. I took baqua. Still remember a little but I was no good at it. My tai Chi and kung fu is OK. There is an old story over here about Yang Lu Chan (father of Yang tai Chi) and how he fought the baqua master to a standstill. They could not defeat each other. We call that "Wild History" over here but I think there is a kernel of truth in there somewhere. I always like Xing yi too (Heart and Mind Boxing), but was too old to study it. Xu Yuru refused to teach me because she hated her Xing Yi master. I did learn some eagle claw from the lau sisters. (Lilly and Gina). I'm a gunslinging Tai Chi boy now.

I likey the Chen style, it is quick, with coiling and emitting power.

Posted by: Judge Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 08:22 AM (k5CC9)

177 Beto- have fun sir. Joe, getting the weight off would help with both. And getting the abs in shape would probably help with the back. I hurt my lower back in the service lifting an artillery section chest onto the back of a deuce and a half by myself. When I'm in proper shape the back never bothers me. If you decide to do sit ups let me know. But don't do crunches!!

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 08:23 AM (RYVE/)

178 Lady who has a restaurant demonstrated Chen style form for me once Judge. Amazing the difference from Yang family, and man could she move. Wouldn't teach though.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 08:28 AM (K4AdI)

179 OK, I'm off to see if I can't get a little more sleep before I have to get up and work all night. Later roonz and roonettez!

Posted by: GGE of the Moron Horde, NC Chapter at June 23, 2013 08:36 AM (yh0zB)

180 @ teej

I rolled a truck and was upside down when it stopped. It herniated two disks and I learned to live with it, yeah it hurts but oh well. The weight really came about after I fell. I've always been obese but I am firmly it the morbidly faction now. I'm 6' 3" and 260# was normal for me before. I ain't saying what it is now. But yeah the weights gotta go.

Oh, and why not crunches?

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 08:39 AM (MnSla)

181 Night GGR

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 08:40 AM (MnSla)

182 "...quick, with coiling and emitting power. And people wonder why it's also called martial science. Kinetic energy anyone? Judge, did you happen to catch the talk re movies the other night about how a trained female wouldn't stand a chance against an untrained guy who outweighed her by 50-100 lbs due to physics? Inwardly chuckle worthy.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 08:40 AM (xDlyw)

183 Damn it. GGE I mean

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 08:40 AM (MnSla)

184 I have a mosin but I lost the bolt in a car accident. No,really. Not a Boating accident. Once shot a small deer with a .50 cal smoke pole and could see clear thru its chest. It ran a hundred yards with no lungs. This is why only libtards must carry single shot self defense weapons

Posted by: Igotnothing at June 23, 2013 08:43 AM (cDbuN)

185 Joe, you bend your spine doing crunches. Old school is most often the best...in many things. Bent knee with feet under couch or whatever. Keep entire spine, including neck, perfectly straight. Hands in a proper fist next to ears and keep em there. Don't throw them forward to help yourself up. If you can only do one doing them right, then start out with one. Fun fact- When doing sit ups during class we sat on each others feet. If your hands came forward, the guy sitting on your feet smacked you on the side of your hard. Good times.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 08:48 AM (GX2fm)

186 Ahhhh sigh. Side of your head.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 08:50 AM (GX2fm)

187 15
@ 10
I actually like a wheel gun better than a semi. It limits me as far as rounds available I know, but I'm more comfortable with them.

Posted by: JoethefatmanÂ™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 09:47 AM (MnSla)

I knew a lot of cops growing up that resisted the change from revolvers to semi autos, my father and brother included (my brother was in the last police academy class in Philadelphia that was issued revolvers). If you were issued a revolver, there was no regulation that forced you to change, at least back in the 90's.

Except for one old timer who had been in (and won) a crap load of shootings, every cop I knew that had been in a gunfight with a revolver (after the change), immediately requested a Glock.

I like revolvers, and shoot mine as often as I can, but if I knew I was going to get into something, I would bring a semi auto (more than one, if available), and lots of ammo in hi-cap mags.

Posted by: elliot at June 23, 2013 08:50 AM (8zGOf)

188 Joe, I don't know the reason teej has for telling you not to do crunches....but he's right...don't! Forward flexion, which is how most people perform a crunch, puts extreme stress on your discs. Any rounding of your back will do that. Look up how to do planks, maybe first from your knees and then from your toes, to strengthen your back muscles. When you bend over, bend from the hip and not from the waist.

Posted by: Tami[/i][/b][/u][/s] at June 23, 2013 08:52 AM (X6akg)

189 Need to add second ammendment foundation to your list of organizations. It might be the best 2a group out there.

Posted by: Vt_02 at June 23, 2013 08:53 AM (xBps2)

190 Joe, you bend your spine doing crunches. Old school is most often the best...in many things. Bent knee with feet under couch or whatever. ====== That puts stress on your hip flexors. Don't anchor your feet. If you must do a crunch, do it by pointing/lifting your nose to the ceiling and only lifting up a short distance.

Posted by: Tami[/i][/b][/u][/s] at June 23, 2013 08:54 AM (X6akg)

191 And 6'3"- 260lbs. Heh. Senior student in my class, a couple years ahead of me. Could do the chinese splits, without warming up. 6'3"-240. Nothing like getting kicked in the head by a foot with a 33" thigh attached.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 08:54 AM (d4o2E)

192 and lots of ammo in hi-cap mags. Posted by: elliot at June 23, 2013 12:50 PM (8zGOf) I'd like one of those 33rd magazines. MD bans the sale, but I'm guessing getting one across the border isn't too hard.

Posted by: HoboJerky, Hash Hunter at June 23, 2013 08:56 AM (X4HxX)

193 teej

Got it. lol. The bent knee thing is a little more of an issue. Not impossible, just what it is. And thanks for the encouragement. The "get Joe off his fat ass" program has started. I just have to do it at home this time and without Kathy, Christy and Lauren to help me get off the floor! lol. Well I've gotta go teej, thanks again!

Posted by: Joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at June 23, 2013 08:58 AM (MnSla)

194 has anyone seen a study or have any experience with stopping a single person with a single magazine? Posted by: yankeefifth at June 23, 2013 10:47 AM (Z9EHQ) The FBI has studied it vigorously. The evidence isn't conclusive, other than "stopping power" is probably a vastly over-rated concept in handguns. People can muscle through multiple .45 rounds if they are on adrenaline, just like 9mm.

Posted by: HoboJerky, Hash Hunter at June 23, 2013 08:59 AM (X4HxX)

195 Hi Tami!! Glad we agree on keeping the spine straight. My hips were never bothered and I have a bit of hip displasia from birth. Could never get quite do the chinese splits due to pain on outside of left hip as oppose to tendons and ligaments inner groin due to this. I think we can both agree Joe needs to start out sloooow and listen to his body.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 09:02 AM (cWpCn)

196 "Pete Kasler shows photos of shots into a 170 lb free swinging bag ... " Human beings are not free swinging bags. The best heavyweight in the world has trouble knocking a 170lb bag back a few inches. But if a heavyweight punches a 170lb man standing on 2 feet, he will go flying.

Posted by: Bruce at June 23, 2013 09:03 AM (vJfir)

197 "See" ya Joe. Good luck.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 09:04 AM (cWpCn)

198 Dog gone it. Battery running dry. Well, it's long past time for breakfast. Love and respect Judge and Tami if you're both still here. Love each other fellow babies. It is the second great commandment after all. And it is Sunday.

Posted by: teej at June 23, 2013 09:14 AM (tWrwm)

199 Tai Chi is like rehearsing for a fight in slow motion. It is good stuff.

Posted by: navybrat at June 23, 2013 09:16 AM (L12M0)

200 Speed it up Navy Brat, Chen is fast. etc. Teej, check out Master Randy Li ; Randy Li. I met him but never studied from him. Tell Him Lenny, Sifu Goh's problem child sent ya!

Posted by: Judge Roy Bean at June 23, 2013 09:26 AM (k5CC9)

201 I did Tang Soo Do back in elementary school. Seemed legit but closer you get to black belt (used to be white->yellow->orange, 1 stripe->green, 1, 2 stripes->red, 1, 2 stripes>-black) the more sessions and money they'll want you to spend. I stopped because my parents could not afford us going to three sessions a week for black belt.

Posted by: Gaff at June 23, 2013 10:04 AM (iV8i3)

202 Also on a related topic I stopped over a gunshop yesterday after taking my dad shooting for the first time in his life (he's in his 60s), and saw a Ruger 10/22 takedown for $320. Kind of kicking myself for not buying it.

Posted by: Gaff at June 23, 2013 10:08 AM (iV8i3)

203 When it comes to stopping power from a hand gun, I am told that the .357 SIG is actually impressive that way. The story is that of the police departments that have adopted it, the only shooting that was not a one shot stop was in Virginia where the suspect was shot several times by multiple officers almost simultaneously. He did stop but you can't really call it a one shot stop.

Since most shootings actually take place at a range of 0 to 5 feet, most hand gun cartridges are comparable in effectiveness. Even a .22 will be effective at that range if you have the skill and presence of mind to shoot someone in the eye, forehead or temple so that the bullet enters the skull where it ricochets off the inside of the brain pan and whips around three to five times creating a brain smoothie.

Posted by: Obnoxious A-hole at June 23, 2013 10:09 AM (31Nrp)

204 I read somewhere that about 80 to 85 percent of all victims of handgun shootings survive. I forget where, I think maybe in the NRA magazine.

Posted by: navybrat at June 23, 2013 12:43 PM (L12M0)

205 6:32 AM PST.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s][/u] at June 23, 2013 01:10 PM (qyfb5)

206 Last!

Posted by: Jake in ID-aquavit at June 23, 2013 04:43 PM (s/TCI)

207 Nope.

Posted by: toby928© at June 23, 2013 05:57 PM (QupBk)

208 I'm late. Really late.

Posted by: Ronster at June 23, 2013 06:04 PM (9+3no)

209 I love my Mosin Nagants. Bought several varieties just after 9/11 for $20 to $30 each, carbine and long barrel. Surplus ammo from the 60s and 70s is still plentiful. Online, about $0.22 per round including shipping. Was getting it for $0.18 per round at gun shows through last November. Last show I went to, the dealer quoted $180 for a case. "880 rounds?" I asked. "440" was the reply. Went home and ordered online. Wont go back to a show until the price gouging stops.

Posted by: David at June 23, 2013 09:42 PM (RdjAN)

210 I'll defer my opinion of your "Knock-down" power deer slayings to Black Jack Pershing and the Philippines expedition.

Guess who won?

Posted by: Blacksmith8 at June 24, 2013 02:48 AM (3zW8P)

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