Ace of Spades HQ

November 27, 2013

READY/// Hard things, squishy things
— Purple Avenger

Is the universe squishy or hard? What happens when all that you thought you knew is called into question?

For example: something as seemingly well established as the radius of the lowly proton is being called into question.

(Phys.org) Â—Officially, the radius of a proton is 0.88 Â± 0.01 femtometers (fm, or 10-15 m). Researchers attained that value using two methods: first, by measuring the proton's energy levels using hydrogen spectroscopy, and second, by using electron scattering experiments, where an electron beam is shot at a proton and the way the electrons scatter is used to calculate the proton's size. But when trying to further improve the precision of the proton radius value in 2010 with a third experimental technique, physicists got a value of 0.842 Â± 0.001 fmÂ—a difference of 7 deviations from the official value.

Explanations for this discrepancy are actively being sought. We're like prehistoric cave men looking at shadows dancing on the cave wall. We're just waving our hands and making shit up a lot of the time.

And apparently we really don't know squat about how the Sun really operates. Ra does this kinda shit just to remind us how much we don't know about Ra. Our "reality" is held hostage by the limitations of our ability to see. It is at best an approximation.

Dogma? Settled.
Science? Never settled.

Posted by: Purple Avenger at 10:48 AM | Comments (87)
Post contains 236 words, total size 2 kb.

1 First? Surely not.

Posted by: toby928© beating memes to death since 2006 at November 27, 2013 10:49 AM (QupBk)

2 dogma? we need the video link pls

Posted by: navycopjoe at November 27, 2013 10:50 AM (JFrBt)

3 It's hard on the outside with a chewy center!

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at November 27, 2013 10:50 AM (f9c2L)

4 Hard things, squishy things. Is this still about getting hummers while driving from the last thread?

Posted by: rickb223 at November 27, 2013 10:50 AM (8D0/R)

5 I have found, at least in my case, turning squishy into hard requires a woman.

Posted by: maddogg at November 27, 2013 10:50 AM (xWW96)

6 I was in the pool!

Posted by: Proton at November 27, 2013 10:50 AM (ThG3L)

7 Magnets. How do they work?

Posted by: EC at November 27, 2013 10:51 AM (GQ8sn)

It's hard on the outside with a chewy center!

Turtles. All the way down.

Posted by: garrett at November 27, 2013 10:51 AM (ThG3L)

9 Dogma? Settled. I'm sorry. My karma ran over your dogma.

Posted by: rickb223 at November 27, 2013 10:52 AM (8D0/R)

10 Femtometers... clearly sexist.

Posted by: War On Wymmins at November 27, 2013 10:52 AM (xKK9v)

11 I'll settle for Catma....

Posted by: backhoe at November 27, 2013 10:52 AM (ULH4o)

12 With apologies to Master Zhuang, last night I dreamed I was a butterfly. When I awoke, I had to ask myself if I was a man who dreamed he was a butterfly, or am I a butterfly dreaming he is a man?

Posted by: toby928© beating memes to death since 2006 at November 27, 2013 10:52 AM (QupBk)

with a third experimental technique, physicists got a value of 0.842 Â± 0.001 fmÂ—a difference of 7 deviations from the official value.

Let me tell you about deviations.

Posted by: Horsemanbaby at November 27, 2013 10:52 AM (fsLdt)

14 "Ra does this kinda shit just to remind us how much we don't know about Ra. Our "reality" is held hostage by the limitations of our ability to see. It is at best an approximation." Ra, w/e.

Posted by: Helios at November 27, 2013 10:53 AM (X866z)

15 I had the help of 15 women, all day long! They made me squishy!

Posted by: George Brownridge at November 27, 2013 10:53 AM (IanLz)

16 Like Terry Pratchett's Universe turtle?

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at November 27, 2013 10:53 AM (f9c2L)

17 Ra does this kinda shit just to remind us how much we don't know about Ra. Ba ram ewe.

Posted by: rickb223 at November 27, 2013 10:53 AM (8D0/R)

18 I always knew .88 sounded a little high.

Posted by: eleven at November 27, 2013 10:54 AM (fsLdt)

19 How many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop?

Posted by: toby928© beating memes to death since 2006 at November 27, 2013 10:54 AM (QupBk)

20 Science? Never settled.

Ahem.

Posted by: Al Gore at November 27, 2013 10:54 AM (HsJeN)

21 It is obvious that we've reached the point where we need another one of those black monolith thingies from 2001.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at November 27, 2013 10:55 AM (8ZskC)

22 Hard things... Math.

Posted by: Hussein Clown Posse at November 27, 2013 10:55 AM (xKK9v)

23 And that's as close as I can get to explaining color to a blind man.

Posted by: WalrusRex at November 27, 2013 10:55 AM (Hx5uv)

24 Reverse the polarity!

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at November 27, 2013 10:55 AM (S8glN)

25 I always knew .88 sounded a little high.

Posted by: eleven at November 27, 2013 02:54 PM (fsLdt)

Meh. Close enough for government work.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at November 27, 2013 10:55 AM (8ZskC)

26 I always knew .88 sounded a little high. It's not a femtometer over .82. Settled!

Posted by: rickb223 at November 27, 2013 10:55 AM (8D0/R)

27 I'm sorry, I was told there would be no molecular science discussed today...

Posted by: H Badger at November 27, 2013 10:55 AM (n/0Nw)

Most guys measure with about six or seven deviations from how most women measure.

Posted by: polynikes at November 27, 2013 10:56 AM (m2CN7)

29 Meh, big ball of fire in sky hurt squishy man's eyes. Some say they can predict it, I say it rises in the East.

Posted by: Gmac-Pondering the coming implosion, and hoping its 404care at November 27, 2013 10:56 AM (IanLz)

30 But, but, but ... The climate science is settled, now give us your money.

Posted by: Decaf at November 27, 2013 10:57 AM (UW/PH)

31 This is what irritates me so much about watching programs on various Discovery network channels. They state theories and speculations as actual fact. I find myself yelling at the screen; Bullshit! You fucking clowns made that shit up. All of it is specualtion pure and simple and you fucks are presenting it as fact. Bullshit.

Posted by: maddogg at November 27, 2013 10:57 AM (xWW96)

32 But how is this going to help Moochelle's chillren?

Posted by: Soona at November 27, 2013 10:57 AM (FtgP2)

33 I always knew .88 sounded a little high. It's not a femtometer over .82. Settled! Thanks Purp! Now I sound like Sheldon Cooper!

Posted by: rickb223 at November 27, 2013 10:57 AM (8D0/R)

34 I love how we can measure something so small with such accuracy.

and the sun thing? That thing is like really large, you know? and something could happen in side and we wouldn't know about it for centuries, man.

so like if those neutrinos ever stop, you would want to max out your credit.

Posted by: Sleepy Time Temp Agency at November 27, 2013 10:58 AM (kUNiC)

35 If you liked your seven deviations from the official value, you can keep your seven deviations from the official value. Period.

Posted by: SCOAMF at November 27, 2013 10:58 AM (xKK9v)

36 We spend lots of money on studies like this. Give these guys a good tape measure and let them measure it that way. Do I have to think of everything?

Posted by: Zombie John Gotti at November 27, 2013 10:58 AM (uzmcT)

37 You know what else is squishy? Hamsters. I mean, they have to be or you can't stuff 'em in.

Posted by: Joe Biden at November 27, 2013 10:58 AM (8ZskC)

38 Meh, big ball of fire in sky hurt squishy man's eyes. Some say they can predict it, I say it rises in the East. Does it? Does it? Does it really rise, or do we turn towards it?

Posted by: rickb223 at November 27, 2013 10:59 AM (8D0/R)

39 I have a crazy ass theory about neutrinos and dark matter...maybe I'll float in tomorrow.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at November 27, 2013 10:59 AM (Xlbr8)

40 What is red in the morning, Yellow at noon, And orange in the evening ?

Posted by: The Sphinx ... at November 27, 2013 10:59 AM (jdRXP)

41 How big does the president want it to be?

Posted by: Jay Carney at November 27, 2013 10:59 AM (Hx5uv)

42 Oh yeah, how about consensus? Fact I'm telling you.

Posted by: Chaos the other dark meat at November 27, 2013 10:59 AM (oDCMR)

43 37 You know what else is squishy? Hamsters. I mean, they have to be or you can't stuff 'em in.

Posted by: Joe Biden at November 27, 2013 02:58 PM (8ZskC)

You need one of those patented hamster insertion tools. I sell them if you're interested. I have a franchise.

Posted by: Gere Enterprizes at November 27, 2013 11:00 AM (xWW96)

44 What is red in the morning, Yellow at noon, And orange in the evening ? A baboon's ass?

Posted by: rickb223 at November 27, 2013 11:00 AM (8D0/R)

45 ( doodles on notepad )
( YAWN )

Posted by: Thinky King Obama [/i] [/b] at November 27, 2013 11:00 AM (S8glN)

46 Um, I was told there'd be no math in this debate. But I did enjoy YES's 1974 one-song double-album "The Radius of a Proton."

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at November 27, 2013 11:01 AM (7ObY1)

47 But thanks to global warming, we're unlikely to see another ice age.

and everything that could be discovered already has been discovered, and everything that could be invented has already been invented. So go to business school. Management is where the big money will be in the future.

Posted by: Sleepy Time Temp Agency at November 27, 2013 11:01 AM (kUNiC)

48 What's 9 inches long and white? Nothing.

Posted by: JackStraw at November 27, 2013 11:01 AM (g1DWB)

Most guys measure with about six or seven deviations from how most women measure.

It depends on where you measure from.

Posted by: garrett at November 27, 2013 11:01 AM (ThG3L)

50 Halp us, Mr Wizard.

Posted by: Soona at November 27, 2013 11:02 AM (FtgP2)

51 48 What's 9 inches long and white? Nothing. --- What about ATC's "little friend"?

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at November 27, 2013 11:02 AM (/Crba)

52 We know everything there is to know about ____ (fill in blank). Until something new is discovered that tells us we don't really know much about it at all.

Posted by: RightWingProf at November 27, 2013 11:02 AM (RtR5I)

53 What's 9 inches long and black? Joan Walsh's sweetest, most private dreams, baby.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at November 27, 2013 11:02 AM (7ObY1)

54 40 What is red in the morning,
Yellow at noon,
And orange in the evening ?

Posted by: The Sphinx ... at November 27, 2013 02:59 PM (jdRXP)

Wait.....I know I kow that one.

Posted by: eleven at November 27, 2013 11:02 AM (fsLdt)

55
I've got a hard squishy thing between my legs.

Posted by: Sandra Fluke at November 27, 2013 11:02 AM (pJF+c)

56 I wanted a dogma for Xmas one year, all it got was a lousy BB gun. And no I didn't put out an eye.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at November 27, 2013 11:02 AM (HVff2)

57 It depends on where you measure from. I measure from the anus. Wait ... what?

Posted by: obligatory Barney Frank at November 27, 2013 11:02 AM (QupBk)

58 What's 9 inches long and white? Nothing. --- What about ATC's "little friend"? Piiiiiiiiink??

Posted by: rickb223 at November 27, 2013 11:03 AM (8D0/R)

59 derp

Posted by: eleven at November 27, 2013 11:04 AM (fsLdt)

60 Is this going to be on the test?

Posted by: suitably adequate at November 27, 2013 11:04 AM (d0dHb)

A fm is 10-15m? Somewhere around there?

Posted by: burmatar at November 27, 2013 11:04 AM (x6Qp7)

62
Are you guys talking about my taco?

Posted by: S E Cupp at November 27, 2013 11:04 AM (pJF+c)

63 sock off

Posted by: maddogg, prince of arachnids at November 27, 2013 11:04 AM (xWW96)

64 47 But thanks to global warming, we're unlikely to see another ice age. Saturday morning at 4am it was -10, I was praying for global warming before heading out to use the privy.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at November 27, 2013 11:04 AM (HVff2)

65 Don't look now but we've been stomped by an even more sciency post.

Posted by: toby928© insists on talking about robots at November 27, 2013 11:04 AM (QupBk)

66 I've heard new measurements of the speed of light have usually fallen outside the error bounds of previous measurements. I'm not sure it's the scientists' faults. It's just the limitations we live with. People can only quantify the errors they're aware of. And there are always things we don't know.

Posted by: Dave at November 27, 2013 11:05 AM (Fd3C/)

67 Due to the exclusion principle squishy and hard can not occupy the same space but once the squishy is observable it turns hard before returning into a squishy.

Posted by: Angel with a sword at November 27, 2013 11:05 AM (hpgw1)

68 62 Are you guys talking about my taco? --- Honey, I think the only reason your taco may be in the discussion would be if it were bearded. Your Cupps are what interest most people instead.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at November 27, 2013 11:05 AM (/Crba)

69 Misanthropic Humanitarian

oh, yer outa deer camp, eh?

seein' any?

Posted by: Sleepy Time Temp Agency at November 27, 2013 11:06 AM (kUNiC)

70 I remember a paper a couple years ago which established, using some pretty sophisticated formulas concerning accuracy of measurement, that if everything in the universe had a hard, underlying basic existence, then you should be able to refine your measurement methods until you were able to define it precisely. However, if what we call the universe was instead some type of holographic projection, then the measurement error would become uncontrollable once you dropped below the resolution of the projection, no matter what you tried, because there would be no actual underlying "reality" to measure. Rather interesting that the latest and best nano-measurement methods show resolution breaking down when we start looking at the smallest level. How far the rabbit hole do you want to go, Neo? But I think I think, therefore I think I am. What I am is something else altogether.

Posted by: Tom Servo at November 27, 2013 11:06 AM (8Fa5Z)

71 Did you read all the way to the end of the article on the sun, Purp? "But thanks to global warming, we're unlikely to see another ice age. "Things have not started to cooling, they just have not risen as quickly," Biesecker said." Gorebal warming dogma injected into sun science.

Posted by: NotCoach at November 27, 2013 11:07 AM (rsudF)

72 Does it? Does it? Does it really rise, or do we turn towards it?

Posted by: rickb223 at November 27, 2013 02:59 PM (8D0/R)

-----------------------------------------

Sit down. Let me tell you about the story of the giant turtle.....

Posted by: Soona at November 27, 2013 11:08 AM (FtgP2)

73 Women measure it from the wallet.

Posted by: soothsayer is connectin the dots at November 27, 2013 11:08 AM (W1IQO)

74 Dogma? Settled. It's because my carma ran over your dogma.

Posted by: Arbalest at November 27, 2013 11:15 AM (FlRtG)

75 no matter what you tried, because there would be no actual underlying "reality" to measure.

I think the "basic stuff" more resembles a "probability field" akin to the heat equation diffusion behaviors rather than solid BB's.

That WOULD explain the phenomenon of quantum entanglement.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at November 27, 2013 11:21 AM (Xlbr8)

76 Well said, Purp!

Posted by: CanaDave at November 27, 2013 11:24 AM (92zVn)

77 We're like prehistoric cave men looking at shadows dancing on the cave wall. We're just waving our hands and making shit up a lot of the time.
Yes. We've reached the limits of practical science where we can actually study and understand what's happening and are into the realm of they unknown and theoretical. I'm fine with that, its what has to be done before we can understand.
But that's not how its presented. People make bold, absolute statements about things they can't even make an educated guess about. They're like a doctor in 1812 saying you need to have your blood let to reduce ill humors to fix a headache. They didn't know what the hell was going on, but were damn sure they did and were arrogant and condescending about it. There's way too much of that going on in science today.
We can know to a reasonable level of certainty that water is made of H2O. We cannot know to that level of certainty about continental drift, and we cannot know to any level of certainty how subatomic particles work. Quantum Physics has moved beyond the scientific theory into bone-in-the-nose oogabooga territory.
Maybe its right, after all penicillin is made from mold and witch doctors used it. But we don't have any basis for any confidence whatsoever and people are not only acting terribly sure, but building theories upon theories built upon this uncertainty like a house of jello.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at November 27, 2013 11:29 AM (zfY+H)

78 Today: "1000 years ago scientists thought that everything in the universe was some combination of 4 elements...Earth, Wind, Fire, or water. Those guys were idiots. There are 100+ elements, not 4, and everything is made up of atoms, duh." 1000 Years from now: "1000 years ago scientists thought that everything in the universe was made up of atoms of some combination of 100+ elements. They claimed they were these little particles that were too small to be seen. Those guys were idiots. We obviously know now that everything is made up of...."

Posted by: Donkey at November 27, 2013 11:32 AM (Ggh94)

79 As long as we have a consensus, I am willing to accept that a proton is the size of a Burrito Supreme from Taco Bell. I'll be over here pretending it's 98 degrees outside.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at November 27, 2013 11:34 AM (659DL)

This is why I never believe anything particle physicists or astrophysicists claim. I doubt their accuracy, their percision, their assumptions, and their veracity.

Until they can build something useful based on their "science", I'm not really going to believe or care about anything they say.

Posted by: OSUsux at November 27, 2013 11:37 AM (DFXmi)

81 They way I see it, we're dealing with a very large anomaly. Think of the ordinary energy being the size of a Twinkie. Now imagine a Twinkie the size of Manhattan.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at November 27, 2013 11:40 AM (zfY+H)

82 Obviously, we need to put super-genius Barry Obama on the case. He'll have the entire universe figured out in no time. He's such an intellectual heavyweight, and it's so so sad that he's had to go through his entire life being so terribly bored all the time, because he knows it all and everything is so darn easy for him, and there is just nothing new under Ra to learn. Right Valerie?

Posted by: Trivial Pursuer at November 27, 2013 11:49 AM (/sohm)

83 Some protons have extra layers of paint.

Posted by: eman at November 27, 2013 11:59 AM (n6NK7)

84 This is new knowledge and not a cause for concern. Measurements get refined all the time. This measurement does not mean Harry Potter is real.

Posted by: eman at November 27, 2013 12:04 PM (n6NK7)

85 I don't know where these idiots order their protons from but the 0.88 Â± 0.001 fm protons are the standard. Any protons measuring different are imported garbage. Go ahead and use them if you want to fuck up your shit.

Posted by: Dang at November 27, 2013 02:11 PM (YWXTN)

86 It's only the merest wisp of anything that holds the universe together. As our ability to measure becomes greater, we seem to discover only more vagueness in the construction of it.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit [/i][/s][/b] at November 27, 2013 04:07 PM (0HooB)

"but thanks to global warming were not going to have a little ice age'.

And may all your Thanksgivings be white, like ours is today.

Posted by: deepred at November 28, 2013 05:52 AM (RHYM4)

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