Ace of Spades HQ

December 16, 2013

Paul Ryan: I'm Going to Bring the Same Kind of Conservative, Republican Principles to the Amnesty Issue That I Brought to the Budget Compromise
— Ace

Oh, yay!

Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI) told a local Wisconsin radio station that the U.S. immigration system is "broken" and indefensible" and he'll support reform as long as it "maintains Republican, conservative principles."

Sure, like the budget deal. Very cool.

Speaking to 620WTMJ radio's Charles Sykes, Ryan described his principles for reform as: "Guaranteed border security, guaranteed interior enforcement, no amnesty -- then I think that's productive. I think that's in our interest. I think that's good for our country," he said. "A legal immigration system that's wired for your economy, versus the chain migration system we have today where he don't have the rule of law, we don't know who's coming and going -- is bad."
...
"First we must have the border security, and independently verified. First we must have the interior enforcement like E-Verify in place and independently verified before the other parts of the law that they want to go into place go into place," he said. "So it's not a 'trust, hope and promise.' It's a 'get what we want, verify it's there, then the rest of the law can be triggered.'"

Triggered. Ah yes.

The GOP has a cool euphemism for "Amnesty." That euphemism is "No Amnesty," by which they mean "amnesty." They always tick down the hard-sounding things they say they're going to demand -- E-Verify, "border security" (usually of the "virtual" sort) and then go right to the Same Old Deal they've been offering forever. First we get these supposed concessions to security, then some kind of "independent" panel staffed by people chosen by Obama gets to verify that the border is secure, and then that triggers amnesty.

See, it's not amnesty. It's "no amnesty," which is like amnesty, except we get border walls which are not walls ("virtual walls!!!") and we get a gaggle of pro-amnesty people to "independently verify" that everything's cool and then we get amnesty.

Except it's not amnesty, they tell us. Why, in many ways, this will be a a far more severely conservative regime than the current one.

Just like Paul Ryan's budget deal will produce even more conservative reduction in government in 2022-2023.

Posted by: Ace at 02:17 PM | Comments (443)
Post contains 406 words, total size 3 kb.

1 just great

Posted by: west coast watcher at December 16, 2013 02:17 PM (5fkya)

2 Ryanator II, rise of the severe conservatives. No thanks.

Posted by: duke at December 16, 2013 02:18 PM (d3clc)

3 So,what good does giving the R's majorities do?

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 02:19 PM (zqvg6)

4 And he's 75-10 favorable/unfavorable in IOWA. Maybe I just don't get it.

Posted by: LRob in OK at December 16, 2013 02:19 PM (0EkGc)

5 and this is the guy leading the iowa polls, my neck is sore from shaking myhead in disgust

Posted by: west coast watcher at December 16, 2013 02:19 PM (5fkya)

6 So,what good does giving the R's majorities do?

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 06:19 PM (zqvg6)

we win? No real tangible benefits, just the ability to say that we won

Posted by: The Dude at December 16, 2013 02:20 PM (vJdyz)

7 Maybe we are out if step,maybe everybody wants hordes of Mexican immigrants.Wait,what?

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 02:21 PM (zqvg6)

8 Como esta usted?

Posted by: meh at December 16, 2013 02:21 PM (W2qJe)

9 I fear that some form of amnesty is coming, if only because it's impractical to get all of them to self deport, plus it seems to be political unpopular (in part, because people accuse us of wanting to break up families.) What I don't get is why everyone jumps to citizenship. Here's a plan: lawful permanent resident. No voting, no benefits. But even that's horribly shitty.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (tablet) at December 16, 2013 02:22 PM (a8eFL)

10 Our regular menu is "broken" Here's a shit sammich.

Posted by: NYC Parent at December 16, 2013 02:22 PM (HEo6y)

11 No one is clamoring for amnesty, why do Republicans always think there's some big outcry from voters on this?

And it's definitely Amnesty, the report I saw said 99.5% of illegals here already would not be able to be deported if the Senate bill passed.

And the few voters that do want it aren't going to "reward" Republicans, Reagan already tried this and Hispanic support actually decreased in the very next election.

Americans are far more hawkish on the border than people realize, the problem is Republicans are scared of their own shadow on it. Democrats are going to call you a racist no matter what you do on this issue.

When the AZ SB 1070 law passed, it had something like 70% plus of support among Americans nationwide.

Republicans could get a lot of populist appeal by standing up to the open border crowd.

Posted by: McAdams at December 16, 2013 02:23 PM (2TMCu)

12 The way to advance conservative principles is to import 20 million voters from socialist countries? How about the redskins become a better football team by signing everyone is that gets cut by the Jaguars.

Posted by: mr Pink at December 16, 2013 02:24 PM (Mp/2D)

13 So he is just another lying sack of shit back stabbing son of a bitch. Well, not like he doesn't telegraph it.

Posted by: maddogg at December 16, 2013 02:25 PM (xWW96)

14 Do I get a subsidy after the family of 12 moves into my upstairs bedroom???

Much Groceries!!!

and Boners Notches.......

Posted by: Portnoy at December 16, 2013 02:25 PM (CjCPZ)

15 -7 steevy

Has it ever occurred to you most Americans do not hate Mexicans? Many White Americans have Mexicans in their family due to intermarriage. It's only in Extereme Conservative circles where Mexicans are viewed as evil demonic beings. Most mainstream Conservatives don't hate Mexicans.

Posted by: Lethium at December 16, 2013 02:26 PM (Ciffv)

16 So he is just another lying sack of shit back stabbing son of a bitch. Well, not like he doesn't telegraph it.

Posted by: maddogg at December 16, 2013 06:25 PM (xWW96)

hey, the GOP elects that type of person all the time because shitheel #2 has an R behind his name

Posted by: The Dude at December 16, 2013 02:26 PM (vJdyz)

17 Yep. I'm done with him

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 02:27 PM (zOTsN)

Just caught a few seconds of him on with the (nice, but clueless) outgoing Rep. Campbell (CA) who is hosting the Hewitt show. Wow. He actually said this budget deal "takes back" the constitutional power of the purse from the executive branch.

Ya know, the one that, under the actual constitution, cannot be "taken" by the executive branch, without the Congress going along. And Ryan added that the GOP has to who they "can govern", which he defined as avoiding shut-downs. And then he and nice-but-clueless-Campbell agreed furiously about "see we get blamed for shutdowns no matter what" (Ryan even tried some clumsy sarcasm about "gutless Republicans", referring to those unimpressed by their instant/pre-emptive surrender to orwellian press distortion).

But boy howdy sounds like our fiscal problems are over. Ryan said that all the last 5 years of budget insanity are wiped away, and we're going back to the 2008 levels on spending (something many of us have specifically urged for years). Thing is, based on recent experience, I might just have to take his outlandish boasts with a wee bit skepticism, at this point.

Posted by: non-purist at December 16, 2013 02:27 PM (afQnV)

It's like Paul Ryan is suffering from 'Battered Conservative Syndrome'.

Or something.

And yes...I'm being kind here.

Posted by: wheatie at December 16, 2013 02:28 PM (5Nhsl)

20 The amnesty isn't the only bad part of the bill. It's also biased against middle class kids who go to college and follow the rules- the plan includes importing lots of STEM types from foreign countries to drive down wages for young graduate Americans as well older engineering types in their 40s and 50s. It's a direct threat aimed at the American middle class.

Posted by: The Albino Freckled Desert Sand-Breathing Fish at December 16, 2013 02:28 PM (0cMkb)

21 Ryan is retarded, there is no "guaranteed" anything when it comes to the federal government except more incompetence, waste and corruption. We have a president who is making up laws as he goes along and choosing not to enforce ones he doesn't like. Depressing that Ryan would insult us this way.

Posted by: George Lynch at December 16, 2013 02:28 PM (h+2SD)

22 Who said anthing about hating them?They want in there are legal ways to get in.Otherwise,get the fuck out.

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 02:28 PM (zqvg6)

23 and this is the guy leading the iowa polls, my neck is sore from shaking myhead in disgust

Posted by: west coast watcher at December 16, 2013 06:19 PM (5fkya)

He is NOT leading the Iowa polls. He's leading one worthless poll which only asked about "favorability" and did not screen for likely caucus goers.

Posted by: Jon (not the troll) at December 16, 2013 02:28 PM (DPMu1)

24 There's a difference between a system that is broken and a system that sits, unused.

Posted by: garrett at December 16, 2013 02:29 PM (64xVq)

25 I'm gonna go bone up on my Spanish. Sigh.

Posted by: Sphynx at December 16, 2013 02:29 PM (OZmbA)

26 - 9 tsrblke,

Legalization withoiut Citizenship is the solution most Americans even Republicans support. But that can only be done after sealing our borders and keeping track of people entering on Visas. Employers should also face heavy jail time and/or losing property if they hire illegals. Once you establish these steps then most people would support legalization short of citizenship.

Posted by: Lethium at December 16, 2013 02:30 PM (Ciffv)

27 A 'send money' email from the Dems today: Paul Ryan Says GOP Wants Ransom For Another Debt Ceiling Hostage Yesterday, Paul Ryan paraded around the Sunday shows threatening to hold the economy hostage to his Tea Party wish list. Had enough of RyanÂ’s threats to repeal Obamacare and slash Medicare? So have we. With our year-end fundraising deadline approaching fast, we have a real chance to send an unmistakable message to Ryan and his Republican buddies that weÂ’re standing together -- stronger than ever! -- to defeat this Tea Party House once and for all. Trying to walk the "moderate" line is a losing proposition. The base hates a weakling and so do the Dems.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at December 16, 2013 02:30 PM (DmNpO)

28 Can someone explain Paul Ryan to me? I held my nose and voted for Romney because I thought Ryan got it. He made the case that we were $17 trillion in debt, a debt we cannot possibly pay off. He made the case that SS, Medicare, and Medicaid were going to collapse in ugly heaps. They were hard things that needed to be heard, because they were the truth.

Now he's McCain--we have to increase government spending, we have to increase the size of government, government is broken, we need amnesty.

Were all those things he said in 2012 lies to get us conservative rubes to vote for him? What's the deal? Who's the real Paul Ryan?

Posted by: Palandine[/i] at December 16, 2013 02:30 PM (OldRG)

29 Don't rock the boat, baby

http://youtu.be/FfBwsG8ubFw

Posted by: The Dude at December 16, 2013 02:30 PM (vJdyz)

30 Hey Ryan, stop stealing my schtick. I already said that same thing.

Posted by: Marco duh Rubio at December 16, 2013 02:31 PM (MaP11)

31 It's almost like we need an alternative, alternative media to interview these guys and get them to explain their real, real positions.

Posted by: Sphynx at December 16, 2013 02:31 PM (OZmbA)

32 Yeah, I swear and I mean really really really swear that future congresses are going to hold to the spending limits we place on them in 10 years to pay for lots free cash today. Just like we're holding to the spending limits established by past Republican congresses. Wait. what?

Posted by: Paul Ryan at December 16, 2013 02:31 PM (0cMkb)

33 So like I better learn spanish?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at December 16, 2013 02:32 PM (t3UFN)

34 I'm astonished by the level of Republican stupidity. They had an opportunity to wipe the floor with democrats in 2014. They are not only throwing that away, they will destroy their base. I'll never vote for a Republican again.

Posted by: Dan in Michigan at December 16, 2013 02:32 PM (a8GeM)

35 Independent Verification - how about certification by all state and local authorities that it is secure -- at which time they lose significant grants of federal dollars to improve security. Make the solution politically asymptotic.

Posted by: Jean at December 16, 2013 02:32 PM (4JkHl)

36 Power corrupts,power in Washington corrupts absolutely.

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 02:32 PM (zqvg6)

37 "Reform" sounds alot like "enforcement." Why the fcuking weasel words?

Posted by: Fritz at December 16, 2013 02:32 PM (UzPAd)

38 You know I remember quite a few people swearing that after the shutdown and the clusterfuck off obamacare that amnesty was definitely a dead issue and we not have to worry about it at all before the elections, and those that bring it up were paranoid etc. I'm sure they'll be around to apologize eventually.

Posted by: Buzzion at December 16, 2013 02:32 PM (4tKIm)

39 It's really a no brainer...we NEED more unskilled low wage workers who can vote Democrat and agitate for $15.00/hr minimum wage. It's not like we have high unemployment and record numbers on the dole. Right?

Posted by: GatorGirl at December 16, 2013 02:33 PM (ktyv+)

40
Can someone explain Paul Ryan to me?

He's an opportunist without principles.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 16, 2013 02:33 PM (MaP11)

that is "show they can govern" (the GOP) by avoiding shut-downs

Savor this one more time. A "shut-down" featuring almost nothing that anyonce anywhere could detect in terms of impact, alongside a bizarre, unprecedented bit of histrionic vandalism by the govt. against the country including renting barricades and calling in extra staf to bar 90-something WWII vets from seeing their own memorial at a public unstaffed open space on the national Mall.

And exit polls from the most heavily affected state in the union (VA) showing no impact on the gubernatorial election just weeks later.

Because "showing you can govern" means coasting along with trillion dollar deficits and exploding welfare coverage of all kinds while defense gets an arbitrary cut-back.

Posted by: non-purist at December 16, 2013 02:33 PM (afQnV)

42 Got an idea for a trigger. When the budget deficit is 25% less than it was in 2013, amnesty kicks in.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 16, 2013 02:33 PM (QI9SE)

Posted by: Paul Ryan at December 16, 2013 06:31 PM (0cMkb)

building Social Security Part Deux is totally a conservative idea

Posted by: The Dude at December 16, 2013 02:33 PM (vJdyz)

44 How stupid does one have to be to lose a debate to Joe Biden? Ahhhh . . . finally Ryan has answered that sticky wicket for me.

Posted by: BlackOrchid at December 16, 2013 02:34 PM (EZNxq)

45 But since we can't expect purity, we must settle for the best deal we can get. So, open borders and amnesty it is then!

Is it Christmas recess yet?

Posted by: Randall Hoven at December 16, 2013 02:34 PM (0oPDq)

46 Prior Thread AtC
Now, I think the better way to handle this is through legislation rather than ad hoc judicial rulings

I applaud the sentiment and the comedy.

Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 16, 2013 02:34 PM (DL2i+)

47 Hey, DHS--ya'll certify via some mechanism...maybe a website that the border is secure by say, June and we'll give a pathway to citizenship in time for...yeah, the November elections.

Conservative.

Dear Chamber of Commerce and asshat corporate dipshits, this is where we will definitely part company.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at December 16, 2013 02:35 PM (ltdV/)

48 Lethium I hate TB and polio flooding into Texas I hate a mindset that celebrates drunk driving on payday I hate that thousands of young women are dragged across the border in human trafficking and forced to work as prostitutes I hate gun fire from drug cartels in Mexico into Texas I hate MS13 gangs and all their kith and kin I hate a culture that does not value education and by doing so guarantees their children will always be dependent on tax dollars I hate all that. Doesn't matter what country they come from. That good enough for you

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 02:35 PM (zOTsN)

49 -20 The Albino Freckled Desert Sand-Breathing

Its importation of Stem Workers that was the real big problem with the Amnesty Bill. The whole legalization of Mexican illegals is just a distraction to the real agenda.

Posted by: Lethium at December 16, 2013 02:35 PM (qesNA)

50 FAVORITISM! FAVORITISM! (in my best Gomer Pyle voice). They're favoring Mexican and Central American immigrants over all others!

Where's the easy path immigration for Chinese and Europeans and Africans? Huh? Where is it???? Damn racists in Congress.

Posted by: Sphynx at December 16, 2013 02:36 PM (OZmbA)

51 he'll support reform as long as it "maintains Republican, conservative principles." Well, make up your mind. Which principles will it be?

Posted by: t-bird at December 16, 2013 02:36 PM (FcR7P)

52 Go long on Horchata Futures.

Posted by: garrett at December 16, 2013 02:36 PM (64xVq)

53 oh I have more to add to ThunderBs most excellent list! - Lice - Hepatitis - Bedbugs all totally worth my peers being able to pay peanuts to their nannies/cleaners/gardeners!

Posted by: BlackOrchid at December 16, 2013 02:36 PM (EZNxq)

54 The GOP is going to end up being the one that gets "triggered."

I denounce myself for my shameful violence-promoting rhetoric.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 16, 2013 02:36 PM (8ZskC)

55 I promise to use conservative, Republican principles to lower your tax rates. For example, say you were paying $10k in taxes. I promise to use conservative, Republican principles to lower your taxes to $15k.

Posted by: Psul Ryan at December 16, 2013 02:37 PM (ZPrif)

56 Texas just completely shut down our border problem for 3 weeks by throwing everything we have down to the valley. We proved that the problem can be solved if the government is willing to actually, you know, want to solve the problem. So, Paul, here's my counterproposal. Any bill you propose must include an extension of Texas' efforts to seal the border. First. Then we can talk about everything else.

Posted by: Lauren at December 16, 2013 02:37 PM (hFL/3)

57 *repeatedly slams face into keyboard.*

Posted by: Meremortal, bloodied at December 16, 2013 02:37 PM (1Y+hH)

58 So like I better learn spanish?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at December 16, 2013 06:32 PM (t3UFN)

PRO TIP: The smart crowd is opting for Mandarin.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 16, 2013 02:37 PM (8ZskC)

59 Tell me again why republicans are against, wait, FOR the feds writing laws on people from other countries coming here? Prior to the 1900's there were NO laws on this. Explain how that was bad.

Posted by: UWP at December 16, 2013 02:38 PM (2hQRj)

60 Second look at Whooping Cough?

Posted by: garrett at December 16, 2013 02:38 PM (64xVq)

61 PRO TIP: The smart crowd is opting for Mandarin.
Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 16, 2013 06:37 PM (8Zskc)

already learned Mandarin 13 years ago in highschool :/

Posted by: The Dude at December 16, 2013 02:39 PM (vJdyz)

62 PRO TIP: The smart crowd is opting for Mandarin.

The way the Sun is acting...I'm going Inuit.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at December 16, 2013 02:39 PM (ltdV/)

63 I vow to use conservative principles to advance the pro-Life agenda by requiring devout Catholics to perform late term abortions.

Posted by: Psul Ryan at December 16, 2013 02:40 PM (ZPrif)

64 If you do not embrace the suck then you are filled with hate.

Posted by: Nancy Pelosi at December 16, 2013 02:41 PM (VpMO0)

65 So we can agree to disagree, even though you're being ridiculous and you don't have a whole lot of credibility.
But I'm totally going to be there for you when my budget forces a debt ceiling increase.

Posted by: Paul Ryan at December 16, 2013 02:41 PM (IV4od)

66 Lethium One more thing Most Americans have not even considered a guest worker program because it's it NEVER presented as an option

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 02:41 PM (zOTsN)

67

They are setting the table now with the media discussions. The dinner is already cooked, the legislation is written. You will see this debated just as soon as the new year obamacare fiasco kicks in.... or some other big distraction happens.

It should take about a week.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 16, 2013 02:41 PM (MaP11)

I've got it. Let's have a bill that, like Ryan's amazing budget accomplishments, binds future congresses to pass amnesty (oh, excuse me, some kind of legal permanent resident status that is amnesty in all but name). In the short term, the only legislation with practical effect will be to secure the border, achieve strict internal enforcement, and start reintroducing sense and rule of law (e.g. defunding states/cities with "sanctuary" lawlessness on their books).

I kind of like this. Hey Paul, what do you say, let's try to match your budget masterpiece.

Posted by: non-purist at December 16, 2013 02:42 PM (afQnV)

69 "60 Second look at Whooping Cough?" Huge problem down here. Now new mothers have to badger all of our family members into getting DTap boosters because babies cant be immunized until they're 6 months old. Fun. Oh, and before we started homeschooling there was a confirmed TB case at his school. 99% Latino, and I was the only parent at registration who actually had a US ID. Why were we there? Because the city of Austin redrew the school district borders to even the income distribution and pulled us across two highways into Little Mexico Apartment Land. Not bitter, clearly.

Posted by: Lauren at December 16, 2013 02:42 PM (hFL/3)

70 >>Most Americans have not even considered a guest worker program because it's it NEVER presented as an option

You don't manufacture voters out of guest workers.

Posted by: Sphynx at December 16, 2013 02:42 PM (OZmbA)

71 Posted by: UWP at December 16, 2013 06:38 PM (2hQRj) In the 1900s there was no social "safety net", welfare, etc. Eliminate those and you can have open borders.

Posted by: The Albino Freckled Desert Sand-Breathing Fish at December 16, 2013 02:42 PM (0cMkb)

72 I vow to use conservative principles to strengthen defense by slashing defense spending and trading our advanced weapons designs to China in exchange for $5 coupons off tennis shoes and lacrosse equipment.

Posted by: Psul Ryan at December 16, 2013 02:43 PM (ZPrif)

73 So in sum Lethium You can kiss my ass

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 02:43 PM (zOTsN)

74 Posted by: UWP at December 16, 2013 06:38 PM (2hQRj)

In the 1900s there was no social "safety net", welfare, etc.

Eliminate those and you can have open borders.

Posted by: The Albino Freckled Desert Sand-Breathing Fish at December 16, 2013 06:42 PM (0cMkb)

____

I agree

Posted by: UWP at December 16, 2013 02:44 PM (2hQRj)

75 Most Americans have not even considered a guest worker program because it's it NEVER presented as an option

Those are H visas.

We have those.

What we do not have is border enforcement.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at December 16, 2013 02:44 PM (ltdV/)

76 Fuck That Guy - also.

Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 16, 2013 02:44 PM (DL2i+)

77 When conservative principles are at stake, I have not yet begun to fight!

Posted by: John Paul Ryan at December 16, 2013 02:44 PM (8ZskC)

78 Ryan: "Guaranteed border security, guaranteed interior enforcement, no amnesty -- then I think that's productive. I think that's in our interest. I think that's good for our country."

So enforce the law as it already stands? Good idea. Now why do you need this "Comprehensive Immigration Reform" again?

You're full of sh*t, Ryan. And, just to get nasty with you and your peers' defrauding, so's your mother.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 16, 2013 02:45 PM (eHIJJ)

79 Why haven't the House Repubs launched a Select Committee to investigate Benghazi?

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 16, 2013 02:45 PM (ZPrif)

80 Bed Bugs are back because they don't use hot enough water anymore ,isn't that the reason?

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 02:45 PM (zqvg6)

81 The only way to have an immigration system with conservative values is to screen immigrants for conservative values. I understand certain Afrikaners might fit the bill . . .

Posted by: boulder toilet hobo says, free toby at December 16, 2013 02:45 PM (iQxYV)

82 UWP, we can talk about the differences between 1900 and 2013 all effing night.

Don't be deliberately asinine.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at December 16, 2013 02:45 PM (ltdV/)

83 we win? No real tangible benefits, just the ability to say that we won

Posted by: The Dude at December 16, 2013 06:20 PM (vJdyz)

So, it's like clearing a level of Pac Man?

Posted by: Methos at December 16, 2013 02:46 PM (hO9ad)

84 Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 16, 2013 06:45 PM (eHIJJ)

----------

His mother is actually very nice.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 02:46 PM (P6QsQ)

85 He's an opportunist without principles. *** Hey! That's my schtick!

Posted by: Marco Rubio (Did I tell you about my Cuban heritage yet?!) at December 16, 2013 02:46 PM (DmNpO)

86 "What we do not have is border enforcement." Link in sig about how Texas solved that problem (temporarily).

Posted by: Lauren at December 16, 2013 02:46 PM (hFL/3)

87 This is more of the same shit recently seen coming from McConnell and Boehner: an outright declaration of war by the Beltway incumbent wing of the party on the Tea Party insurgent wing of the party.

How DARE anyone propose to primary we incumbents! Upstart rabble. Don't they know who we are? We are their betters! And we are NOT to be questioned.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 16, 2013 02:46 PM (gqT4g)

88 Paul Ryan & the GOP, dead to me. Fucking death wish idiots how long will it be before the GOP is pronounced dead on arrival?

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 16, 2013 02:46 PM (HVff2)

89 Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI) told a local Wisconsin radio station that the U.S. immigration system is "broken" and indefensible" NO. IT'S. FUCKING. NOT. It's unenforced. It's ignored. It's flagrantly violated.

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 16, 2013 02:47 PM (GEICT)

90 Bed Bugs are back because they don't use hot enough water anymore ,isn't that the reason? It's a Greentard thing. Hotels change sheets less often and wash in cold, not hot, water to save energy and thus Save The Planet(TM)

Posted by: The Albino Freckled Desert Sand-Breathing Fish at December 16, 2013 02:47 PM (0cMkb)

91 So, it's like clearing a level of Pac Man?

Posted by: Methos at December 16, 2013 06:46 PM (hO9ad)

yep, we even have a kill screen just like Pac-Man

Posted by: The Dude at December 16, 2013 02:47 PM (vJdyz)

92 - 74 Thunderb

It must suck being on the fringe of society.

Posted by: Seeker at December 16, 2013 02:47 PM (Ciffv)

93 We may decide to give some type of permanent legal status to people who came here and stayed here illegally, but we will be making a GRAVE MISTAKE if that includes the right to vote. While we owe every human in our borders humane treatment, and lesser nations would brutally expel such people. We even give such people open-ended access to our welfare system. We do not owe them much more. We do not owe them a right that so many Americans gave their blood to secure.

Posted by: theBuckWheat at December 16, 2013 02:48 PM (nmcha)

94
Rep Ryan, have I told you to fuck off today? No?

Well, remind me before dinner time.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at December 16, 2013 02:48 PM (TIIx5)

95 "In the 1900s there was no social "safety net", welfare, etc."

And because multi-culturalism wasn't a world wide philosophy. People didn't know they were being oppressed by evil conservatives by choosing to stay and live with their own people.

Posted by: lowandslow at December 16, 2013 02:48 PM (IV4od)

96 What

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 02:48 PM (zOTsN)

97 Shorter Ryan: We hope to gain Republican voters by making citizens of these hordes from Mexico and Central American countries. Even though that doesn't really happen. Rarely if ever. And Chamber of Commerce lobby.

Posted by: Sphynx at December 16, 2013 02:48 PM (OZmbA)

98

When he said he read Ayn Rand, he did, and took all the best principles to heart, even though he never did.

This guy...

Posted by: Rev Dr E Buzz Commissar at December 16, 2013 02:48 PM (HQml1)

99 Reasonable people can disagree on what representation in gov't means, I suppose.

Posted by: lesson learned at December 16, 2013 02:48 PM (R6JT1)

100 nevergiveup, you around here?

Posted by: yankeefifth at December 16, 2013 02:48 PM (rDidD)

101 Here in NC, our great and almighty speaker who is going to run against Kay Hagan (and most NC republican pols are supporting him in the primary) says we need (totallynot)amnesty for the farm workers. Piss up a rope#

Posted by: traye at December 16, 2013 02:48 PM (1OFc/)

102 Throughout the entire 2012 campaign, Karl Denninger repeatedly called Ryan a liar and a fraud for his budget proposals. I thought that maybe he was engaging in hyperbole. Not any more. He was right.

Posted by: rickl at December 16, 2013 02:49 PM (sdi6R)

103 1. There should be an on-line pledge not to vote for any Republican who votes for Amnesty. This would have impact, especially if signatories include their district.

2. Republicans must be asked, as often as possible, why they want to flood the country with cheap foreign labor when millions of Americans are out of work and middle class incomes are declining.

Posted by: Rod from Birdemic: Shock and Horror at December 16, 2013 02:49 PM (azHfB)

104

Honest Immigration Reform, that's what they should call it.

Pass the border and enforcement and rule of law measures now. With heartfelt statements that, down the road a few years, and depending on how well these measures work, we can consider the situation of any illegals that remain, on a case by case basis. And not many should remain.

Posted by: non-purist at December 16, 2013 02:49 PM (afQnV)

105 On one hand, you have your Permanent Residence Visa programs where you can spend thousands of dollars in legal fees, invest additional thousands in an American business, create a specified number of American jobs which will gain you the conditional right to live in the United States of America.

Then, on the other hand you have your "Drop-In Plan" where you just show up with your leafblower and you receive unconditional access to a full range of public benefits for the entire family.

Posted by: ICE at December 16, 2013 02:49 PM (8ZskC)

106 91 Yeah,that's what I thought.

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 02:50 PM (zqvg6)

107 We didn't get near enough people signed up on Medicaid via Obamacare, amnesty should fix that.

Posted by: Drider at December 16, 2013 02:50 PM (jrpuQ)

108 Sock reset

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 02:50 PM (azHfB)

109 Just wait until we get the details...

The whopper would be judicial review of visa decisions. The lawyers would friggin' LOVE that since it undoubtedly would be financed with federal grant money.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at December 16, 2013 02:50 PM (ltdV/)

110 Comprehensive Immigration Reform must address anchor babies and the 14th Amendment. Plus, should we trust the same ones that did not secure the border in the late 80's (see Schumer, McCain et al)? Address those issues, the. We'll talk.

Posted by: Golfman in NC at December 16, 2013 02:50 PM (+jDNv)

111 "- Lice
- Hepatitis
- Bedbugs "

Chagas disease.

Drug-resistant tuberculosis.

Dengue fever.

Man, they better hurry up and get that Obamacare thingy working!

Posted by: torquewrench at December 16, 2013 02:50 PM (gqT4g)

112 I forget who it was at Breitbart who touched on something WRT amnesty and big business. Perhaps the "conservasphere" should join the double-the-minimum-wage army right now and make the cost of legal labor skyrocket. Perhaps all these Chamber of Commerce blue chips might step back if they knew all that new, cheap domestic labor they're desperate for wasn't actually going to arrive to drive down costs.

Pretty radical, but in the grand scheme, maybe it's time to start political repositioning.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 16, 2013 02:51 PM (eHIJJ)

113 I must say, this website has really gone down hill. Has Stormfront taken over this place? Such a shame that a once great blog has embraced xenophobia and White Supremacy.

Posted by: Seeker at December 16, 2013 02:51 PM (Ciffv)

114 Hotels change sheets less often and wash in cold, not hot, water to save energy and thus Save The Planet(TM)

The problem with taking measures to save the planet is that eventually the planet starts coming back.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 16, 2013 02:51 PM (8ZskC)

115 so anyone who voted for obama may as well have voted for romney ryan since they could have had everything obama gave them plus keeping their insurance, doctors, premium/deductible, and had everything else competently implemented.

Posted by: yankeefifth at December 16, 2013 02:51 PM (rDidD)

116 76 Most Americans have not even considered a guest worker program because it's it NEVER presented as an option

Those are H visas.

We have those.

What we do not have is border enforcement.
Posted by: Circa

Not H Visas - that's a skilled worker program. A labor oriented guest worker program. My solution would be a privately managed solution in which manpower firms are bonded to provide insurance, pay costs, and ensure return of the workers. Miguel skips off the strawberry patch, you surrender the bond. You have it happen too often, you get de-certified. Miguel gets drunk and causes and accident - you better have insurance. On the flip side, Miguel actually gets paid what he is owed via bank drafts into Mexico (not cash), gets basic health care, and has steady work.

Posted by: Jean at December 16, 2013 02:51 PM (4JkHl)

117 Funny thing is they are pretty strict at deporting Europeans whose visa expire,even if they have jobs,places to live etc.

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 02:51 PM (zqvg6)

118 *then

Posted by: Golfman in NC at December 16, 2013 02:51 PM (+jDNv)

119 and landmines. It all starts with security.

Posted by: Jean at December 16, 2013 02:52 PM (4JkHl)

120 I smell troll.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 16, 2013 02:52 PM (8ZskC)

121 I know I'm in the minority, but I don't see the House passing anything like the Senate bill. I think they would have already done it by now if they were going to bring it up for a vote.

It's not that I have faith in leadership, I don't, but even they are not stupid enough to go into the 2014 elections passing something that will split the party like that. You're talking every incumbent having a bitter primary battle and 3rd party challengers galore. For what? A few meaningless checks from the Chamber of Commerce?

I know some like Ryan might want this, but I have to think 90% of Republicans in the House DON'T want this headache, and they will boot Boehner and every other leader if they let it come to a vote.

That's my hope anyway. Even if they want this secretly, there's too many incentives not to go there.

Posted by: McAdams at December 16, 2013 02:53 PM (2TMCu)

122 114 You sound concerned. Don't be.

Posted by: rickl at December 16, 2013 02:53 PM (sdi6R)

123 A LGF troll.

Posted by: lowandslow at December 16, 2013 02:53 PM (IV4od)

124 Such a shame that a once great blog has embraced xenophobia and White Supremacy. Well done.

Posted by: garrett at December 16, 2013 02:53 PM (64xVq)

125 Jean,

H2As are for farm workers. You are thinking H1Bs.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at December 16, 2013 02:53 PM (ltdV/)

126 MOAR MOAT

Posted by: Immigration Reform 2 x 4 at December 16, 2013 02:54 PM (64xVq)

127 AoSHQ: A Once Great Blog for a Once Great Nation

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 16, 2013 02:54 PM (8ZskC)

128 I smell troll.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 16, 2013 06:52 PM (8ZskC)

----------

So that's what it is. For a moment there I thought it was my pickled herring.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 02:54 PM (P6QsQ)

129 118 steevy

You support Europeans coming here illeglay then. Stormfront would concur with you.

Posted by: Lethium at December 16, 2013 02:55 PM (Ciffv)

130 "It's not that I have faith in leadership, I don't, but even they are not stupid enough to go into the 2014 elections passing something that will split the party like that"

That's why I still believe they will try to ram it through next years lame duck session.

Posted by: lowandslow at December 16, 2013 02:55 PM (IV4od)

131

He had me at bedrock conservative principles, because anyone who knows Ryan and John Boehner knows not to question their conservatism.

Posted by: Rev Dr E Buzz Commissar at December 16, 2013 02:55 PM (HQml1)

132 For a moment there I thought it was my pickled herring. Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 06:54 PM (P6QsQ) Euphemism?

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 16, 2013 02:55 PM (GEICT)

133 AoSHQ: A Once Great Blog for a Once Great Nation Under a Once Great Sun FIFY

Posted by: The Albino Freckled Desert Sand-Breathing Fish at December 16, 2013 02:55 PM (0cMkb)

134 F'n troll. I make points. You call names.

Posted by: Golfman in NC at December 16, 2013 02:55 PM (+jDNv)

135 I like my AoSHQ Enchilada Style.

Posted by: garrett at December 16, 2013 02:55 PM (64xVq)

136 Tell us about the Chetniks, Hector. That's always amusing.

Posted by: Waterhouse at December 16, 2013 02:55 PM (vX2Du)

137 I just don't see why immigrants from south of the border should get preferential treatment over people from other countries. It doesn't seem fair. I thought progressives were all about fair.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 02:56 PM (P6QsQ)

138 Employers should also face heavy jail time and/or losing property if they hire illegals.

The IRS knows where and when every SSN is used. This would dry up all the jobs, but cash payments.

Posted by: Paladin at December 16, 2013 02:56 PM (DPvCq)

139 I haven't read the comments so I don't know if any has already noted that the very word "comperhensive" is a red flag. If Ryan wants better border security, pass a bill for better border security. If he wants better internal enforcement, pass a bill with internal enforcement. If he wants to go to an Economic model instead of familial chain migration, pass one of those. When the "Republican" parts are in effect, and proven effective, then consider those other parts.

But he won't do any of that, because Paul Ryan is a lying sucker of cock.

Posted by: toby928© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 02:56 PM (evdj2)

140 AoSHQ: A Once Great Blog for a Once Great Nation Under a Once Great Sun...JOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOS

Ok, there.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at December 16, 2013 02:56 PM (ltdV/)

141 Posted by: McAdams at December 16, 2013 06:53 PM (2TMCu) You are so wrong, sorry to burst your bubble. But the GOP will fuck up, after all they are the party of stupid.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 16, 2013 02:56 PM (HVff2)

142 It must suck being on the fringe of society.Posted by: Seeker at December 16, 2013 06:47 PM (Ciffv)
Is that anything like living in the shadows?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 16, 2013 02:56 PM (VpMO0)

143

All trolls are AJ. And they all suck cock by choice.

Posted by: Soona at December 16, 2013 02:56 PM (iuBG8)

144 UWP, we can talk about the differences between 1900 and 2013 all effing night.

Don't be deliberately asinine.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at December 16, 2013 06:45

-----

But I will be. If the argument is against welfare, make it against welfare. And NOT people showing up to work., BTW, this formating sucks. Cant wait for version 1.1. But all the illegals I knew just came here to work for cheap and no red tape was involved in hiring them. They even came with their own form of employment agency. For instance, when Jascinto had to go back home, a new guy would just show up in his place. No taxes,m no workers comp, no nothing. You just wrote a check to the new guy.

Posted by: UWP at December 16, 2013 02:56 PM (2hQRj)

145 Euphemism?

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 16, 2013 06:55 PM (GEICT)

------------

Heavens no. I am actually eating pickled herring, with Havarti and vodka.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 02:57 PM (P6QsQ)

146 Paul Ryan, "I must abandon my principles in order to save my principles." No surprises. Expect treachery from Mr. Nice Guy. Gee, his smile is so sincere. Makes the knife in the back hurt less? pfft

Posted by: panzernashorn at December 16, 2013 02:57 PM (MhA4j)

147 Throughout the entire 2012 campaign, Karl Denninger repeatedly called Ryan a liar and a fraud for his budget proposals.

The famed Ryan budget was going to balance the budget in ten years, assuming 5% growth during that entire time.

Which anyone paying attention knew was a lie because it has never occurred over any ten year period of our history.

Karl was one of the few who bothered to do so.

Posted by: Methos at December 16, 2013 02:57 PM (hO9ad)

148 It's true that our current immigration system makes less sense than even the tax code. It is damn near impossible to immigrate here legally, unless you've got heap of cash. I am all for a system that gives people (and not just people from Mexico) a more sensible way to come here legally. That said, none of these fucksticks are talking about anything sensible. They're simply doing what they always do- "What kind of bribe can we throw at target demographics to get them to vote for us?" Amnesty is right out. And while I am ranting, the only discussion anyone should be having about immigration law at the moment is why is Obama being allowed to ignore current law and why aren't there busloads of illegals (like Aunt Zenuti and the rest of Obama's relatives) and the people that harbor them being catapulted across the nearest border? (I could care less which border you toss them over- south, north, Atlantic Ocean, Pacific Ocean... I'm not picky). When Obama is impeached and he and Holder are occupying prison cells next to the other criminals that ignore current law, then we can talk about next steps.

Posted by: Damiano the Economic Traitor at December 16, 2013 02:57 PM (j0wOO)

149 How stupid does one have to be to lose a debate to Joe Biden?

If you're a fan of moronic guffaws and transparent lying I suppose you could claim that Biden won that debate. Regardless of what you think of the budget deal or the (yet to be written) immigration bill, you don't get to rewrite history just to fit the most recent PanicOutrage narrative.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at December 16, 2013 02:58 PM (+lsX1)

150 "He had me at bedrock conservative principles, because anyone who knows Ryan and John Boehner knows not to question their conservatism."

Boehner owned a bar you know, so he's a rocked ribbed conservative who had to sweep the floor and do the stuff you do when you run a bar. No shit, he just reminded us of that again the other day.

Posted by: lowandslow at December 16, 2013 02:58 PM (IV4od)

151 What's worse: Subaru hippy leftist car ads or Honda's Michael Bolton ads?

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 02:58 PM (zqvg6)

152 I live in the valley of the shadows of the fringe in a tiny place you have never been to called reality

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 02:59 PM (zOTsN)

153 The people on this blog are just a fringe minority of American society. Most Americans are not racists and have no problems with Mexicans. I actually feel sorry for people here. It must suck going through life full of hate and fear.

Maye the love of Christ full your hearts and turn your souls back to the light.

Posted by: Lethium at December 16, 2013 02:59 PM (Ciffv)

154 I live in western Washington, a reliable Democrat county, depressed for decades, mostly working class. People vote D because Roosevelt and "Rs are for the rich". Mills shut down all over the place and swarming with illegals. Brush picking for export of floral greenery is their mainstay. An hour or 2 before dawn the 7-11s are full of convoys of vans stuffed with brush pickers heading out. Drive down the highways and you can see 2nd growth cedar trees with all the limbs missing except for a few on the top, 85 cents a pound for the limber , thin parts of the boughs for export to Europe for floral greenery arrangements, same for some shrubs such as salal.

Loggers are the exception to the D voters, they've been at war with the Dems for decades and have had to contend with competition of off the books illegals and some very unsafe work practices. I talked candidly with a co-worker from Mexico, he was legal and was furious that he jumped through all the hoops and was going to a J-college night school to better his English and learn US history and such, when it seemed to be wasted effort to him with illegals jumping the line. He reminded me that all the illegals here were not from Mexico, there were loads from Guatemala and El Salvador and they hated each other, to the extent that a local town had to shut down a "Hispanic Center" for teens at night because of all the brawling.My friend was killed in the woods about 5 years ago.

The Rs seem to be completely clueless on this issue, they could break decades of Democrat dominence in places like this where the working class is struggling, but are scared to death of being accused of racism. I don't think people desperate for work would be happier if they were competing with cut rate, off the books Swedish ilegal immigrnts.

Posted by: JHW at December 16, 2013 02:59 PM (fP7ld)

155
Ooooo, a new Horde chew toy.

Play nice and share with the other children.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at December 16, 2013 02:59 PM (TIIx5)

156 114. I agree. I am concerned. This place is so hateful now, and as a conservative Christian I am appalled.

Posted by: Killbore Pout at December 16, 2013 03:00 PM (jucos)

157 Why do they talk about amnesty if it's all about Obamacare pain now?

Posted by: Temper Tantrum at December 16, 2013 03:00 PM (AWmfW)

158 Cramnesty

Posted by: The Mega Independent at December 16, 2013 03:00 PM (4/o9U)

159 I like my AoSHQ Enchilada Style.

Posted by: garrett at December 16, 2013 06:55 PM (64xVq)

so you want it to come out of your ass in liquid form?

Posted by: The Dude at December 16, 2013 03:00 PM (vJdyz)

160 Lethium Tell me, what race is "Mexican" ? Oh and, I'm a Jew!

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 03:00 PM (zOTsN)

161 Actually,we knew the Ryan budget wasn't great but it was a start.Yeah,it didn't go far enough.Nobody has the balls to go far enough though.They rather kick the can down the road until the inevitable smash.

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 03:00 PM (zqvg6)

162 Seeker, We don't give a damn what color,race or where they come from there are many of us here that care that they BROKE our law. I can't break the law and go there so why should they break the LAW and get rewarded when they come here. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. If we don't value our nation then no one else will GET IT !!!

Posted by: Fourth Horseman RN now your dr under obummercare at December 16, 2013 03:00 PM (KuZ6A)

163 Posted by: Lethium at December 16, 2013 06:59 PM (Ciffv)

PRO TIP: Check your dosage.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 16, 2013 03:01 PM (8ZskC)

164 Maye the love of Christ full your hearts and turn your souls back to the light. Posted by: Lethium at December 16, 2013 06:59 PM (Ciffv) Quit trolling the blog, Senator Pryor.

Posted by: garrett at December 16, 2013 03:01 PM (64xVq)

165 But all the illegals I knew just came here to work for cheap and no red tape was involved in hiring them.

That word there "illegal"--there is the problem. The welfare aspect simply compounds the problem. And then there are schools. The MS13 and similars. Ties to Mexican drug cartels. Chinese snakeheads. Russian white slave merchants. And the grandaddy of them all, the unknown unknowns from the Al Qaeda nitwits.

This is not/not about LEGAL immigration. We have plenty of that and it works quite well.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at December 16, 2013 03:01 PM (ltdV/)

166 troll powers!!!

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 16, 2013 03:01 PM (ZPrif)

167

Rock Ribbed Bedrock Conservatives.

Paul Ryan and John Boner. Rock Ribbed and Bedrock for Extra Sensations.

Posted by: Rev Dr E Buzz Commissar at December 16, 2013 03:01 PM (HQml1)

168 Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 06:57 PM (P6QsQ)

Filthy Scandi.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 16, 2013 03:01 PM (QFxY5)

169 I share Killgore's appallednessness.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 16, 2013 03:01 PM (8ZskC)

170 Posted by: Paladin at December 16, 2013 06:56 PM (DPvCq) Sorry. We had an illegal that worked for the company. We received letters for about 6 consecutive years stating his SSN did not jive. Second paragraph of letter started "this notification should not be used for discharge" or something along those lines. Huh?

Posted by: Golfman in NC at December 16, 2013 03:01 PM (+jDNv)

171 Average Joe, Hermes of the Guatemalan beard, or erg. They all suck cock by choice.

Posted by: toby928© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 03:01 PM (evdj2)

172 I think the troll is Hammer's cat.

Posted by: Soona at December 16, 2013 03:02 PM (iuBG8)

173 The troll actually went Concerned Christian? Wow.

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 16, 2013 03:02 PM (GEICT)

174 Lithium, This goes double for you!

Posted by: Fourth Horseman RN now your dr under obummercare at December 16, 2013 03:02 PM (KuZ6A)

175 The Seeker guy was copy pasta'ing a similar troll made here earlier. Lethium / Hector needs banning.

Posted by: boulder toilet hobo says, free toby at December 16, 2013 03:02 PM (iQxYV)

176 Maye the love of Christ full your hearts and turn your souls back to the light.

Posted by: Lethium at December 16, 2013 06:59 PM (Ciffv)

Ah...an anti-Semite.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 16, 2013 03:03 PM (QFxY5)

177
The Rs seem to be completely clueless on this issue, they could break decades of Democrat dominence in places like this where the working class is struggling, but are scared to death of being accused of racism. I don't think people desperate for work would be happier if they were competing with cut rate, off the books Swedish ilegal immigrnts.

Posted by: JHW at December 16, 2013 06:59 PM (fP7ld)

It's like GOP dont mean what they say...

Posted by: Temper Tantrum at December 16, 2013 03:03 PM (AWmfW)

178 That's why I still believe they will try to ram it through next years lame duck session.
Posted by: lowandslow

It's a possibility, but again, what's the payoff? It would be an ENORMOUS victory for Obama and a huge middle finger to rank and file Republicans. Why would GOP leadership want to hand him that? I don't really buy into the "Most Republican leaders are closet Democrats" meme.

I can understand (although not condone) when Republicans betray conservative principles on small issues because of political expediency, but when you're talking something like a full blown Amnesty that Obama and Democrats can point to for generations, it's just stupid all the way around.

Stay vigilant, but unless the leadership just wants to destroy the GOP for good and likely lose everything, I'm just not seeing the incentive.

Posted by: McAdams at December 16, 2013 03:03 PM (2TMCu)

179 It must suck being on the fringe of society.

Still better than being a douchebag troll.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:03 PM (azHfB)

180 La Puerta, esta abierta... LA PUERTA ESTA, ABIERTA!

Posted by: The Busboy at December 16, 2013 03:03 PM (64xVq)

181 I pray the light of Jesus Christ leads the souls here back to a place of love. Hate is the way Lucifer worms into you and damns your soul. Only the love of Christ will make you right.

May the Holy Spirit bless everyone on the blog and bring you back to the light of the love of Christ.

Posted by: Lethium at December 16, 2013 03:04 PM (Ciffv)

182 ;">That word there "illegal"--there is the problem. ;">---- ;">If you ask me the law is an ass. Yes, its federally illegal. Just like waking up and yawning. But hiring an illegal is the logical thing to do.

Posted by: UWP at December 16, 2013 03:04 PM (2hQRj)

183 I think the troll is Hammer's cat.

Can't be, the cat is usually coherent.

Posted by: Blanco Basura at December 16, 2013 03:04 PM (JawqV)

184 We don't give a damn what color,race or where they come from there are many of us here that care that they BROKE our law. I can't break the law and go there so why should they break the LAW and get rewarded when they come here.

-------------

That's the essence of it, right there.

It has nothing to do with nation of origin, it has everything to do with following the laws of the land. I can not emigrate to any other country that I am aware of without following their immigration requirements. I am certain that I could not sneak into another country and make them educate my children, provide welfare benefits and free health care for me and my family. It's neither reasonable or sustainable to run a nation under those circumstances.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 03:04 PM (P6QsQ)

185 What really gets my blood boiling is when politicians talk about border security as some kind of bargaining chip. Securing our borders is their fcking duty and not a means to extort mass legalization of illegals from the public. But its completely normal for politicians to talk like that. Unbelievable.

Posted by: The Awkward-Turtle at December 16, 2013 03:04 PM (GHSak)

186
It's funny how the troll can't figure out a Pixy hash.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at December 16, 2013 03:04 PM (TIIx5)

187 Wowsers! Gee... it's almost like... like he has no clue what people who value conservative principles THOUGHT of his Budget Compromise!

Posted by: Book at December 16, 2013 03:04 PM (qWES6)

188 I just heard on the radio that country music singer Ray Price died at 87. RIP.

Posted by: rickl at December 16, 2013 03:04 PM (sdi6R)

189 when you're talking something like a full blown Amnesty that Obama and Democrats can point to for generations, it's just stupid all the way around.

And yet, 14 Republicans senators voted for it.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:05 PM (azHfB)

190 I would love, love, for all the people complaining about how we hate Mexicans!!11! to come and enroll their precious children at a school where 80% of the the kindergarten class doesn't speak English. Is it racist to acknowledge that this is a problem? Apparently so.

Posted by: Lauren at December 16, 2013 03:05 PM (hFL/3)

191 But wait till Boehner breaks out the sombrero and Paul Ryan says 'Hola!' Republican membership will skyrocket among migrant workers who want to send money to their real homes.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at December 16, 2013 03:05 PM (uhAkr)

192 I ask for two things from anyone coming to this country: Obey the laws, speak the language (or at least make real attempts to learn it) Apparently that's too much.

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 16, 2013 03:05 PM (GEICT)

193 Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at December 16, 2013 06:58 PM (+lsX1) In that regard, Ryan is too polite for his own good. He should've called Biden out on his BS- calmly and factually. Same thing happened, by the way, when he "debated" Obama over healthcare at the Grand Health Foo-Fra. Paul was masterful with the numbers and facts. Obama just barfed out bumper sticker slogans and Dim boilerplate.(embarrassing what a dullard TFG is) Again Ryan was to polite to callout the President with the result that many thought Obama won or at least they tied.

Posted by: The Albino Freckled Desert Sand-Breathing Fish at December 16, 2013 03:05 PM (0cMkb)

194 If it has to be 1986 again, then I want my figure from back then back.

BC, gimme the pics and vid. *grabby hands*

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD, you taunty bitch. at December 16, 2013 03:06 PM (Gk3SS)

195 Posted by: Lethium at December 16, 2013 07:04 PM (Ciffv) Hector.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at December 16, 2013 03:06 PM (uhAkr)

196 Filthy Scandi.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 16, 2013 07:01 PM (QFxY5)

-------------

Ya, hey dah!

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 03:06 PM (P6QsQ)

197 PRO TIP: Check your dosage.
Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 16, 2013 07:01 PM (8ZskC)
Especially if you are a bonehead for more than four hours.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 16, 2013 03:06 PM (VpMO0)

198 Only a fool would assume they are all Mexican anyway. They aren't. Fool

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 03:06 PM (zOTsN)

199 I remember seeing a poll that said that Hispanic-Americans were against amnesty, too. It's just they're more anti-anti-amnesty because they view anti-amnesty as anti-Hispanic.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 16, 2013 03:06 PM (T0NGe)

200 191 Lauren

Those people you hate are Christians who are blessed as you are through the blood of Christ. How can you hate another follower of Jesus?

Posted by: Lethium at December 16, 2013 03:06 PM (Ciffv)

201 "189 I just heard on the radio that country music singer Ray Price died at 87. RIP." Love Ray Price, that's sad to hear.

Posted by: Lauren at December 16, 2013 03:06 PM (hFL/3)

202 They never seem to get it these foreigners never integrate if they have no skin in the game. Let em in to wallow on welfare and make money under the table and they will never love this nation.make them follow the Rules and they better appreciate getting to live in this great nation.

Posted by: Fourth Horseman RN now your dr under obummercare at December 16, 2013 03:07 PM (KuZ6A)

203 I'd like for the idiots who call me a racist to meet my wife.

200% Latina.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at December 16, 2013 03:07 PM (ltdV/)

204 Now a want a Carne Seca Burrito.

Posted by: garrett at December 16, 2013 03:08 PM (64xVq)

205 BC, gimme the pics and vid. *grabby hands* Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD, you taunty bitch. at December 16, 2013 07:06 PM (Gk3SS) Lol. I feel bad that MWR isn't here. HereÂ…how about a pic to tide you overÂ… http://tinypic.com/r/v6umx5/5

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 16, 2013 03:08 PM (GEICT)

206 I feel so superior embracing chaos

Posted by: lesson learned at December 16, 2013 03:08 PM (R6JT1)

207 "He reminded me that all the illegals here were not from Mexico, there were loads from Guatemala and El Salvador and they hated each other, to the extent that a local town had to shut down a 'Hispanic Center' for teens at night because of all the brawling."

FFS, even the Mexicans hate each other.

I came across a parking lot full of cops late one night. The pavement was glistening under the street lamps. I thought the cops were there because a water line was leaking.

No. It was human blood. A huge amount of human blood. Sonora and Jalisco had gotten into it and the blades had come out. They all have a blade, every man jack of them.

These guys don't stop their blood feuds anywhere. Hospital ERs here now have metal detectors and armed guards. Because some Mex gang member will come in on the ambulance with a gut full of shiv, and then the guys from the other Mex gang will try to come kill him right there on the gurney in the ER. That's how they roll.

"Doing the jobs Americans won't do."

Posted by: torquewrench at December 16, 2013 03:08 PM (gqT4g)

208
So,what good does giving the R's majorities do?
Posted by: steevy

John Boehner gets a bigger office.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 16, 2013 03:08 PM (kdS6q)

209 I'm in Iowa and I'm not voting for this peckerhead, er cheesehead. I'm tired of LIARS and I believe two terms is enough for any of em, anyone in DC over two terms should be gone!
Lyin ass wipe is no conservative, spawn of McSame!

Posted by: ConcealedKerry or SubMitt at December 16, 2013 03:09 PM (uUXp6)

210 SombreroCare

Posted by: The Mega Independent at December 16, 2013 03:09 PM (4/o9U)

211 In before Hollowpoint and rockmom call us all emo - wingnuts!

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 03:09 PM (5ikDv)

212 "but when you're talking something like a full blown Amnesty that Obama and Democrats can point to for generations, it's just stupid all the way around."

Then explain Ryan's comments? There's something about this amnesty issue that politicians just can't reject. I don't know if the political atmosphere in Washington just causes these guys to instinctively pander to anyone the left labels as victims of the mean conservatives or what. But even the most "rock ribbed" conservatives just won't come out and say any form of amnesty is wrong for this country. Hell the mindset even weeps into the conservative punditry.

Posted by: lowandslow at December 16, 2013 03:09 PM (IV4od)

213 Lethium. Assuming you can read. I do not hate them. I hate the behavior. Lover the sinner, hate the sin. Unfamiliar with that are you?

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 03:09 PM (zOTsN)

214 He'll bring "Republican principles" alright, but not conservative ones.

Posted by: Aslan's Girl at December 16, 2013 03:09 PM (KL49F)

215 Only a fool would assume they are all Mexican anyway. They aren't. Fool

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 07:06 PM (zOTsN)

In my experience they are from further south than Mexico, and mexicans hate them. I can't tell the difference from looking at them. Apparently mexicans can. And last I checked, the capitalists were moving to Mexico anyway. Unemployment in Mexico is better than the US. What dumb ass Mexican is still here?

Posted by: UWP at December 16, 2013 03:09 PM (2hQRj)

216 I wonder what Christ would have to say about stealing from your neighbor, which is exactly what you are doing when you come into a country illegally and demand a free education and a mountain of benefits. I don't hate these people, but the fact that they are breaking the law demonstrably hurts my family. Am I not allowed to say anything?

Posted by: Lauren at December 16, 2013 03:09 PM (hFL/3)

217 Hey, Lethium/Seeker/Trolldouche, why do you hate American workers? Why do you want them to have their wages undercut by cheap foreign labor in a time of massive unemployment?

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:10 PM (azHfB)

218 I'd like for the idiots who call me a racist to meet my wife.

I'd just like them to meet me so I push those chicklets they call teeth down their throats. But oddly, no one says such to me in meatspace.

Posted by: toby928© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 03:10 PM (evdj2)

219
Lol. I feel bad that MWR isn't here.

HereÂ…how about a pic to tide you overÂ…

http://tinypic.com/r/v6umx5/5 Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 16, 2013 07:08 PM (GEICT)

Word to your mother, baby. Word. To. Your. Mother.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD, you taunty bitch. at December 16, 2013 03:10 PM (Gk3SS)

220 Hey Paul Ryan & all you other taint sniffing weasels. The 2 biggest problems facing our country is Obamacare & the economy. Fucking around with immigration reform is the last thing we need. Focus on repealing Obamacare. Worry about law enforcement concerning the borders. Just enforce what is on the books already

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 16, 2013 03:10 PM (HVff2)

221

Paul, you are so not my political boyfriend anymore.

Ah, well, as I tell the younglings in my family, "If you know nothing else about politics, know this: all politicians are, at heart, prostitutes."

Posted by: Tired Wench at December 16, 2013 03:10 PM (HGPVQ)

222 Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at December 16, 2013 07:07 PM (ltdV/) A white hispanic?

Posted by: The Mega Independent at December 16, 2013 03:10 PM (4/o9U)

223 Tell me again why republicans are against, wait, FOR the feds writing laws on people from other countries coming here? Prior to the 1900's there were NO laws on this. Explain how that was bad.
Posted by: UWP at December 16, 2013 06:38 PM (2hQRj)

No welfare state, no war on drugs (or the drug cartels the war on drugs has created), and no WMDs prior to 1900.

Posted by: ol_dirty_/b/tard at December 16, 2013 03:10 PM (KSjsb)

224 Word to your mother, baby. Word. To. Your. Mother. Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD, you taunty bitch. at December 16, 2013 07:10 PM (Gk3SS) 8D

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 16, 2013 03:11 PM (GEICT)

225 Well. That failed.

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 16, 2013 03:11 PM (GEICT)

226

Hey, Lethium! You're full of shit.

Posted by: Soona at December 16, 2013 03:11 PM (iuBG8)

227 O/T: I just got a call from a local left-wing candidate. I told 'em I'd vote for 'em when Hell freezes over so they better hope global warming's not real. But it was only a robo-call so no response.

Posted by: Aslan's Girl at December 16, 2013 03:11 PM (KL49F)

228 I keep hoping that others will come to the conclusion that all incumbents must be voted out of office. All. As in every one of them. Yes, him too. Baby, bathwater, rubber ducky. Out. This will need to be done more than once to deplete the farm system.

Posted by: Meremortal, hoping at December 16, 2013 03:12 PM (1Y+hH)

229 And a big empty continent to populate.

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 03:12 PM (zqvg6)

230 Here's a simple little question/experiment that I haven't really seen put forward.

Replace everything "Mexican" with "Canadian" in this whole illegal immigration situation...

Let's pretend Canada was the failed narco-state on our border, sending wave after wave of illegals at us, creating so much havoc within our system, having French become our second national language -- you know, all the things we associate with the invasion from the South, but in this, it's from the North.

Anybody think that those opposing amnesty for largely "brown skinned" illegals would alternately be fine if the illegals were of the pigmentally challenged variety?

The "hatred," such that it is of illegals is is the unlawful acts they are committing, not what/who they are.

Would members of Congress still be looking to jeopardize the sovereignty and security of this nations' acutal citizens if it were for "white" Canadians, or is it that fear so permeates our "leaders" of this government that they put the welfare of our nation and it's citizens below the needs of lawbreakers from other countries lest they be accused or thought of as racist?

Posted by: just a thought at December 16, 2013 03:12 PM (VJpOJ)

231 I don't give a damn if these people are purple with yellow polka dots WRONG is WRONG period... And the president could be red with blue polka dots I care what they Do not what their race is or the color of their skin period. Get that period.

Posted by: Fourth Horseman RN now your dr under obummercare at December 16, 2013 03:12 PM (KuZ6A)

232 I keep hoping that others will come to the conclusion that all incumbents must be voted out of office.

All. As in every one of them.

----------------

Hard to do when no one will primary them.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 03:12 PM (P6QsQ)

233 Arrrrrggh! Fuck the RINOs and their amnesty bullshit with the barbed cock of Satan!

Posted by: Insomniac at December 16, 2013 03:13 PM (UAMVq)

234
Only a fool would assume they are all Mexican anyway. They aren't. Fool
Posted by: Thunderb

It's 62% Mexican. About 80% overall Latin American of one sort or another.

Close enough for jazz.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 16, 2013 03:13 PM (kdS6q)

235 Posted by: toby928Â© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 07:10 PM (evdj2)

What are you...a minority?

We don't like your kind around here.

Unless you're funny...then you can stay.

Or hot. Definitely if you are hot.

Or just average but with great boobs.

Or smart.

Oh...fuck it. just stay.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 16, 2013 03:14 PM (QFxY5)

236 I blame the internet for only thinking of that Vaii Vaii video when I see "latino women" written anywhere

Posted by: The Dude at December 16, 2013 03:14 PM (vJdyz)

237 On the positive side, I got my CDNN Sports catalog in the mail today. Page after glossy page of gun pron!

Posted by: Insomniac at December 16, 2013 03:14 PM (UAMVq)

238 Fine, we'll let in the Mexicans and the Canadians, but no Irish.

Posted by: toby928© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 03:14 PM (evdj2)

239 I gave Ryan a pass on the budget deal because I don't want to see any budget battles before the 2014 elections. Republicans always get hammered that way, and no real budget reform can happen without holding both the House and Senate. However, immigration reform is a deal breaker for me. I emailed Boehner the other day and told him I would never support immigration reform without the borders being certified secure by border state sheriffs. Secure the border, verify it, then we can look at an immigration reform bill. I would like to see Ryan and fellow Republicans who support immigration reform sign a legal contract stipulating that if the federal government allows any kind of immigration reform before border security, they forego their office and must step down.

Posted by: Marmo at December 16, 2013 03:15 PM (pcgW1)

240 And forget about the Finns too. They're nuts.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 03:15 PM (P6QsQ)

241 60% of the time it works everytime

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 03:16 PM (zOTsN)

242 And forget about the Finns too. They're nuts.

Drunken Finns with knives, but I repeat myself.

Posted by: toby928© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 03:16 PM (evdj2)

243 I can't tell the difference from looking at them. Apparently Mexicans can. There are some physical attributes that distinguish certain Latin American people from others. However, the biggest indicators are accent and certain words used. Foods are a prime example. Eg: peanut butter as cacahuate vs manteca de mani.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 03:16 PM (A0glY)

244 It's the Scott's I'm suspicious of you know all those skirts and swords.

Posted by: Fourth Horseman RN now your dr under obummercare at December 16, 2013 03:17 PM (KuZ6A)

245 Why do they talk about amnesty if it's all about Obamacare pain now?

Every GOP poll advantage is an opportunity to screw us because our votes are less necessary for them.

Posted by: Methos at December 16, 2013 03:17 PM (hO9ad)

246 Replace everything "Mexican" with "Canadian" in this whole illegal immigration situation...Posted by: just a thought at December 16, 2013 07:12 PM (VJpOJ)
I'd tell those hosers to take off to the great white north.
It's a beauty when you go.

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at December 16, 2013 03:17 PM (VpMO0)

247 I hope that many of you have come to the same conclusion that I have - that I will vote for conservatives, but never for a Quisling "Republican" again. Time to be done with them.

That and the realization that this used to be a pretty nice country. Good luck to all of you as the suck begins in earnest.

Posted by: Roland The Headless Thompson Gunner at December 16, 2013 03:17 PM (U7y8N)

248 I can't believe I'm still blackballed. I think I'll send Ace another email.

Posted by: toby928© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 03:17 PM (evdj2)

249

I'm Going to Bring the Same Kind of Conservative, Republican Principles to the Amnesty Issue That I Brought to the Budget Compromise

woot. I'm going to call my new investment Mini-Mitt's Taco Trucks.

Posted by: Paul "Mini-Mitt" Ryan at December 16, 2013 03:17 PM (wAQA5)

250 "I would love, love, for all the people complaining about how we hate Mexicans!!11! to come and enroll their precious children at a school where 80% of the the kindergarten class doesn't speak English."

It's actually pretty funny to watch liberal yuppie parents here in the SF Bay Area completely hysterically panic when their precious darlings get assigned to a low-performing school, which is of course low-performing because of its ethnicity mix.

But that last part can NEVER EVER be openly admitted to by liberal parents. There are always elaborate discreet circumlocutions for why they resort to white flight, and immediately move to a new house in a better academic catchment area.

"Oh, the new place is closer to my husband's work. It allows more family time.The commute was just murdering him."

Yeah, it's all of seven minutes closer. Pull the other one.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 16, 2013 03:18 PM (gqT4g)

251 And carneys, Small hands. Smell of cabbage. Especially Jay Carney

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 03:18 PM (zOTsN)

252 Posted by: Fourth Horseman RN now your dr under obummercare at December 16, 2013 07:17 PM (KuZ6A)

They pretend that they are manly by calling them kilts...but we know better.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 16, 2013 03:18 PM (QFxY5)

253 Talking about the Finns and Irish, UWP is actually wrong about no immigration restrictions prior to 1900. We completely stopped the Chinese from immigrating in the 1880's for a while.

Posted by: lowandslow at December 16, 2013 03:18 PM (IV4od)

254 And yet, 14 Republicans senators voted for it.
Posted by: Gregory of Yardale

Rubio gave them an incredible amount of cover, now even he is disowning it as he saw his Presidential ambitions go up in smoke. The politics of amnesty were most ripe right after the election, the momentum is gone. Those Republicans are going to have problems win their next primary, just like Rubio. For what? How much money and support did voting for that bill really get them?

If Boehner is stupid enough to go down this road so 15 or so Republicans in the House can vote with Democrats and hand Obama a big win? Maybe, but why didn't he do it already after the Senate passed it?

Posted by: McAdams at December 16, 2013 03:18 PM (2TMCu)

255 Hard to do when no one will primary them. Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 07:12 PM (P6QsQ) Yes. I've been thinking about it and decided it's somewhat similar to Churchill's remark about democracy being the worst possible political system except for all the other systems. It's hard but easier than any of the alternatives.

Posted by: Meremortal, hoping at December 16, 2013 03:18 PM (1Y+hH)

256 Just what we need a race war with the sons of Obama and the sons of Juan Valdez fighting over the free chit provided to em by the labor of the Sons of Davey Crockett!
Remember the Alamo or just Moe!

Posted by: ConcealedKerry or SubMitt at December 16, 2013 03:18 PM (uUXp6)

257

And forget about the Finns too. They're nuts.

-----------------------------------------------------

The Finns are the sharks of that nasty Scandi gang.

Posted by: Soona at December 16, 2013 03:19 PM (iuBG8)

258 Toby is on the fringe, in the shadows. Poor dear

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 03:19 PM (zOTsN)

259 OT Crazed crackpot director turns racist and attacks first American President of color. http://tinyurl.com/mmkcffa

Posted by: Wonkish Rogue at December 16, 2013 03:20 PM (dvRYt)

260 I would like to see Ryan and fellow Republicans who support immigration reform sign a legal contract stipulating that if the federal government allows any kind of immigration reform before border security, they forego their office and must step down.

"Immigration reform" doesn't necessarily imply amnesty, though I don't doubt that Ryan is pushing for some form of it.

The plight of illegals aside, there are definitely improvements (reforms) that could be made to our immigration system that don't include amnesty.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 16, 2013 03:20 PM (X9Mnx)

261 The Dutch. They are the bastards.

Posted by: UWP at December 16, 2013 03:21 PM (2hQRj)

262 The Finns are the sharks of that nasty Scandi gang.

Posted by: Soona at December 16, 2013 07:19 PM (iuBG

------------

They're like the Russians, only without the charm and humor.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 03:21 PM (P6QsQ)

263 We're gonna kill it. A Mini-Mitt Taco Truck in every town, of course each one towing two chemical toilets. One for thee Senoreeeetahs, baby!

Posted by: Paul "Mini-Mitt" Ryan at December 16, 2013 03:21 PM (wAQA5)

264 The Finns are the sharks of that nasty Scandi gang.

That's why I got a bigger boat.

Posted by: Zombie Joe Stalin at December 16, 2013 03:21 PM (8ZskC)

265 Quite an experience to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be banned. Time to sock..

Posted by: toby928© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 03:22 PM (evdj2)

266 Secure the border, verify it, then we can look at an immigration reform bill.

Posted by: Marmo at December 16, 2013 07:15 PM (pcgW1)

Thats a horrible idea.What if you verify that the border is secure, immigration reform, i.e. amnesty, happens and the next Democrat administration trashes border security untill it is back to its current, sorry state? Legalization will never be undone once it happened, but border security can be sabotaged easily. And then we start stacking up on illegals again and can look forward to the next amnesty debate 2 decades later.

Posted by: The Awkward-Turtle at December 16, 2013 03:22 PM (c5wDw)

267 This country would be much better without the filthy Swedes.

Posted by: Bohannon at December 16, 2013 03:22 PM (hFL/3)

268 249 I can't believe I'm still blackballed. I think I'll send Ace another email. Posted by: toby928Â© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 07:17 PM (evdj2) Ace is swamped with emails and you have a pretty good chance of being lost in the shuffle. Get a hold of Andy. He'll probably get it sorted out quicker.

Posted by: Buzzion at December 16, 2013 03:22 PM (uy+bA)

269 Toby we should just give you a bunch of free shit

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 03:22 PM (zOTsN)

270 I wonder what Christ would have to say about stealing from your neighbor, which is exactly what you are doing when you come into a country illegally and demand a free education and a mountain of benefits.

Um, that's every single person who votes for a democrat, or an accomodationist goper.

Posted by: Methos at December 16, 2013 03:22 PM (hO9ad)

271 Hard to do when no one will primary them.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 07:12 PM (P6QsQ)

The two most important politicians who need primarying are McConnell and Boehner. They have opponents: Matt Bevin and Winteregg respectively.

One thing that would've helped in '10 was if Palin hadn't endorsed two encumbants who badly needed ousting (she endorsed McCain and Hatch).

Posted by: Aslan's Girl at December 16, 2013 03:23 PM (KL49F)

272 Talking about the Finns and Irish, UWP is actually wrong about no immigration restrictions prior to 1900. We completely stopped the Chinese from immigrating in the 1880's for a while.

Posted by: lowandslow at December 16, 2013 07:18 PM (IV4od)

------------------------------------------

Foah dat, you American numba ten! You no get good asian pussy. We mad. Fuck you, Joe.

Posted by: Angry Chinaman at December 16, 2013 03:23 PM (iuBG8)

273 A visual representation of toby's posting status:

http://youtu.be/siwpn14IE7E

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD, you taunty bitch. at December 16, 2013 03:23 PM (Gk3SS)

274
The Finns are the sharks of that nasty Scandi gang.
Posted by: Soona

Buncha Arctic Circle hugging reindeer botheres....

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 16, 2013 03:23 PM (kdS6q)

275 255 And yet, 14 Republicans senators voted for it. Posted by: Gregory of Yardale Rubio gave them an incredible amount of cover, now even he is disowning it as he saw his Presidential ambitions go up in smoke. The politics of amnesty were most ripe right after the election, the momentum is gone. Those Republicans are going to have problems win their next primary, just like Rubio. For what? How much money and support did voting for that bill really get them? If Boehner is stupid enough to go down this road so 15 or so Republicans in the House can vote with Democrats and hand Obama a big win? Maybe, but why didn't he do it already after the Senate passed it? Posted by: McAdams at December 16, 2013 07:18 PM (2TMCu) Right I mean it's not like boehner just recently hired one of John mccains amnesty pushers or anything right? Oh wait....

Posted by: Buzzion at December 16, 2013 03:24 PM (uy+bA)

276 >>I would like to see Ryan and fellow Republicans who support immigration reform sign a legal contract stipulating that if the federal government allows any kind of immigration reform before border security, they forego their office and must step down. You might want to read Ryan's website. He's laid out a pretty clear plan, actually an expansion of what he said in this interview, and he deals with border security and independent verification as the first step. He also lays out exactly what he means by no amnesty. It sounds pretty clear to me.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 03:24 PM (g1DWB)

277 This country would be much better without the filthy Swedes.

----------------

Hey now. Let's not get personal.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 03:24 PM (P6QsQ)

278 Letting in Irish immigrants has led directly to Joe Biden.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 16, 2013 03:25 PM (8ZskC)

279 Biden kicked his ass

Posted by: Mr. Wizard at December 16, 2013 03:26 PM (MhA4j)

280 stealing from your
neighbor, which is exactly what you are doing when you come into a
country illegally and demand a free education and a mountain of
benefits.-----The free education part isn't exactly free. A landlord will integrate property taxes into the rent. Sure there's 10% from the feds, but that argument would be to shut off the 10%. And benefits can go.

Posted by: UWP at December 16, 2013 03:26 PM (2hQRj)

281 Can we all agree to deport Biden?

Posted by: Thunderb at December 16, 2013 03:26 PM (zOTsN)

282 A visual representation of toby's posting status:

Heh. I never notice how much I looked like Kenny Loggins back then. I'll have to find a recent picture and see how he's aged.

Posted by: toby928© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 03:27 PM (evdj2)

283 I can't wait for these two jerkoffs, Rubio and Ryan, show up at CPAC and get booed. Fuck Them.

Posted by: soothsayer at December 16, 2013 03:27 PM (hbvPW)

284 "One thing that would've helped in '10 was if Palin hadn't endorsed two encumbants who badly needed ousting (she endorsed McCain and Hatch)."

Palin has a problem in that her personal loyalties are ironclad, even when they shouldn't be. She'll stick by people who are incompetent and/or treacherous when she really should discreetly sever ties.

If McQueeg were worth her endorsing him, he should have publicly said to his former staffers who have consistently rubbished Palin to cover up their own incompetence that they need to knock that shit off. He hasn't done that.

McQueeg should also have told his mad cow of a daughter that her trust fund was being donated to charity and that she was going to have to go work for a living for a few years. He hasn't done that, either.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 16, 2013 03:28 PM (gqT4g)

285 #267 I understand your point, but aren't we in this mess because of a lack of border security and a lack of enforcement of immigration laws? You seem to be saying there is no solution. Maybe you're right.

Posted by: Marmo at December 16, 2013 03:28 PM (pcgW1)

286 So the story says: "Speaking to 620WTMJ radio's Charles Sykes, Ryan described his principles for reform as: "Guaranteed border security, guaranteed interior enforcement, no amnesty " Which of course means the opposite somehow and now everyone is back in purge mode. sure, get rid of everyone and winder why we have no power.

Posted by: You really are morons at December 16, 2013 03:28 PM (88OyH)

287 Maybe, but why didn't he do it already after the Senate passed it?

I remind you, Boehner just hired John McCain's Immigration advisor to help him pass Amnesty.

What is going on right now is Boehner/Cantor/Ryan are trying to figure out exactly how much fake border security is necessary to fool the rubes so they can pass the Amnesty they really want.

Tell me I'm wrong.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:28 PM (azHfB)

288 Like this wasn't obvious when they passed the budget shit sandwich. Lines are being drawn. Boehner has a primary challenger in Eric Gurr. You have to take out the head vampire to destroy them all.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at December 16, 2013 03:29 PM (PVNda)

289 sorry but OT since I didn't get to yesterday, pls parden me 274 hey AtC, how about them BROWNS? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA thank you

Posted by: navycopjoe Go RAVENS!!! at December 16, 2013 03:30 PM (JFrBt)

290 I feel more like this http://is.gd/s5X20f

Posted by: toby928© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 03:30 PM (evdj2)

291 You might want to read Ryan's website. He's laid out a pretty clear plan, actually an expansion of what he said in this interview, and he deals with border security and independent verification as the first step. He also lays out exactly what he means by no amnesty.

It sounds pretty clear to me.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 07:24 PM (g1DWB)

Just wait til I get hold of him again.

Posted by: Patty Murray, DC vixen at December 16, 2013 03:30 PM (hO9ad)

292 The Federal Government isn't enforcing current immigration laws; how can we trust them to enforce the supposedly tougher laws they would pass in addition to Amnesty?

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:30 PM (azHfB)

293 #277 Jack Straw Thanks, I'll check it out.

Posted by: Marmo at December 16, 2013 03:30 PM (pcgW1)

294 282 Can we all agree to deport Biden? Posted by: Thunderb I hear his teeth have a foreign passport.

Posted by: Mr. Wizard at December 16, 2013 03:31 PM (MhA4j)

295 Ooooh Joaquin Castro just emailed me to tell me I should be a Spring Fellow for the Wendy Davis campaign. He promises I'll be taught to organize by some of the best in the business. This is tempting...

Posted by: Bohannon at December 16, 2013 03:31 PM (hFL/3)

296 I always pictured toby as Eddie Rabbit in his Drivin My Life Away days.

Posted by: soothsayer at December 16, 2013 03:31 PM (hbvPW)

297 We should all go down and buy Mexican oceanfront property....no wait, that's illegal.

Posted by: Jinx the Cat at December 16, 2013 03:31 PM (l3vZN)

298 They could pass a zero tolerance law tomorrow, full deportation of all illegals, and a minefield on the southern border. It would mean nothing if they refuse to enforce it.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:31 PM (azHfB)

299 I can't wait for these two jerkoffs, Rubio and Ryan, show up at CPAC and get booed.

Fuck Them.

Posted by: soothsayer at December 16, 2013 07:27 PM (hbvPW)

--------------------------------------------

A more cutting response? Complete silence. Silence when they're introduced and silence when they give their speeches. Silence to a politician is unnerving.

Posted by: Soona at December 16, 2013 03:31 PM (iuBG8)

300 So to recap. We don't want the filthy swedes. LOL, I'm laughing my ass off here. And on my last beer of the 12 pack of Milwaukees Best 5.9.

Posted by: UWP at December 16, 2013 03:32 PM (2hQRj)

301 Ahh go away sexy, sexy sock.

Posted by: Lauren at December 16, 2013 03:32 PM (hFL/3)

302 thank you Posted by: navycopjoe Go RAVENS!!! at December 16, 2013 07:30 PM (JFrBt)

SO MEAN TO ME!

*sobs*

SO SO MEAN TO ME!

*weeps more*

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD, you taunty bitch. at December 16, 2013 03:32 PM (Gk3SS)

303 A more cutting response? Complete silence. Silence when they're introduced and silence when they give their speeches. Silence to a politician is unnerving.

Posted by: Soona at December 16, 2013 07:31 PM (iuBG

^^^^^^^^^This^^^^^^^^

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:32 PM (azHfB)

304 Ooooh Joaquin Castro just emailed me to tell me I should be a Spring Fellow for the Wendy Davis campaign. He promises I'll be taught to organize by some of the best in the business. This is tempting...

You're certain to score, without ... er .. issue, as it were.

Posted by: toby928© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 03:33 PM (evdj2)

305 282 282 Can we all agree to deport Biden? wouldn't that be an act of war?

Posted by: navycopjoe Go RAVENS!!! at December 16, 2013 03:33 PM (JFrBt)

306 I'm sorry, why am I getting Sandy Hook memorials on ESPN's pregame show?

Posted by: Methos at December 16, 2013 03:33 PM (hO9ad)

307 --- ""Guaranteed border security, guaranteed interior enforcement, no amnesty""

"Which of course means the opposite somehow and now everyone is back in purge mode."

I no longer trust what the Beltway GOP say on this issue, because of what the Beltway GOP have previously said on this issue.

Look at Rubio. He was going on English-language network TV interviews where he said, "Of COURSE there is no immediate citizenship or immediate government benefits. We would never do that."

Then he would turn round and go on Spanish-language TV, and tell Univision viewers that, "Si, you get the citizenship and the benefits RIGHT AWAY!"

I'm allergic to smoke, and never more so than when it's being blown up my ass.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 16, 2013 03:33 PM (gqT4g)

308 My favorite part of Ryan and Boehner's kabuki act is the pretension that Ogabe will simply not ignore enforcement of any parameters he finds odious.

As Oliver Cromwell said at the dissolution of the Rump...

"Just go home, if you have no stomach to do the business of the people go home, you've stayed enough."

Posted by: sven at December 16, 2013 03:34 PM (9jfyN)

309 303 you're just trying to get free booze (not bad) i'm making shrimp and chicken fried rice come on over, i'll save you a plate

Posted by: navycopjoe Go RAVENS!!! at December 16, 2013 03:34 PM (JFrBt)

310 I like that 'guaranteed' shit. I can't tell it from Shinola.

Posted by: torabora at December 16, 2013 03:35 PM (1jp4v)

311 It sounds pretty clear to me. Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 07:24 PM (g1DWB) Maybe it is, but as we saw with the budget deal, he doesn't get what he wants and he gets easily rolled by the Democrats. If he can introduce a bill with no amendments, I might be more inclined, but he will not get what he wants, he will have to compromise. And Paul Ryan has proven that he is a weak-kneed negotiator.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 16, 2013 03:36 PM (T0NGe)

312 Ah here's good old Jack Straw to explain how the sell out on the Budget is not a harbinger of another sell out on Amigo Grande!

Hey Jack we pass the horsefuckery piecemeal then the House GOP goes and own goals conference and the GOP never wins again.

That is the game here bub.

Posted by: sven at December 16, 2013 03:36 PM (9jfyN)

313 I'm allergic to smoke, and never more so than when it's being blown up my ass.

I have the same reaction to sunshine.

Posted by: pep at December 16, 2013 03:36 PM (6TB1Z)

314

Ooooh Joaquin Castro just emailed me to tell me I should be a Spring Fellow for the Wendy Davis campaign. He promises I'll be taught to organize by some of the best in the business. This is tempting...

-------------------------------------------

Join and become a wart to her campaign. A big ugly wart. A wart so big and so ugly that the newsies can't ignore you.

Posted by: Soona at December 16, 2013 03:36 PM (iuBG8)

315
You might want to read Ryan's website.
Posted by: JackStraw

'Kay.

"Wisconsin, for instance, relies on seasonal labor for agriculture and other industries, but due to a lack of seasonal H-2B visas, some Wisconsin businesses face annual labor shortfalls. If we can link legal immigrants with small businesses, we can help spur economic growth."

I guess businesses could increase wages to attract more workers, or look to other states for labor.

Naw -- that's silly. Open the gates and drop green cards from helicopters. That's the conservative way.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 16, 2013 03:37 PM (kdS6q)

316 you're just trying to get free booze (not bad)

i'm making shrimp and chicken fried rice
come on over, i'll save you a plate Posted by: navycopjoe Go RAVENS!!! at December 16, 2013 07:34 PM (JFrBt)

Well, not just. Om nom nom nom.

So this is kind of the Platonic ideal of clusterfuckery: http://bit.ly/1kOCb5L

I mean, more so than the Browns even.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD, you taunty bitch. at December 16, 2013 03:37 PM (Gk3SS)

317 312 AmishDude at December 16, 2013 07:36 PM (T0NGe)

You mean "we tried" is not going to salve the wounds of 40 million more jackass voters?

Posted by: sven at December 16, 2013 03:37 PM (9jfyN)

318

from Paul Ryan's site

Our immigration system is broken, and the evidence is overwhelming. First, 11 million undocumented immigrants are living in the United States. Because they lack legal status, they are outside the scope of the law. We donÂ’t know who they are or in what activities they are involved.

But then...

We should reform our immigration system because it will help America. Immigrants contribute to our economy. They started one-fourth of all new businesses in 2011. And immigrant-owned small businesses employ 4.7 million people. In fact, first- or second-generation immigrants founded 40% of all Fortune 500 companies, including AT&T, Kraft, Google, Yahoo!, and eBay. As a result, the American Action Forum estimates that immigration reform will boost per capita income by $1,700 over ten years and reduce the federal deficit by $2.7 trillion.

We don't know what they are doing here except breaking the law.

But let's talk about the good immigrants, conflate the two issues bullshit bullshit bullshit bullshit bullshit bullshit bullshit bullshit

AMNESTY means deficit reduction!

Thanks for the reading material JackStraw.

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 03:38 PM (5ikDv)

319 Biden made himself look the fool that he is in that debate. Ryan made himself look like a beta wimp. Biden cost his own side points in the short term. Long term, Ryan made people (like me) wonder if the Romney ticket was going to be a milquetoast nothing in office.

Posted by: boulder toilet hobo says, free toby at December 16, 2013 03:38 PM (iQxYV)

320 I guess businesses could increase wages to attract more workers

------------

They pay me 25 bucks an hour, I'll go out there and de-tassle that corn my own self.

Oh heck who am I kidding. It's itchy out there.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 03:39 PM (P6QsQ)

321 Republican Party, what is the point of you??

Posted by: soothsayer at December 16, 2013 03:39 PM (hbvPW)

322 It sounds pretty clear to me.
Posted by: JackStraw

Gotta disagree with you on this one, Jack. I don't care what's on his website. This whole game is about giving illegals the right to stay in the country. The Dems will be relentless on giving them citizenship after that. You don't want to deny little Juan the rights of a citizen just because he isn't one, do you?

It's like the cloture votes. You can say you voted against the bill, but you knew full well that voting for cloture was the game.

Posted by: pep at December 16, 2013 03:39 PM (6TB1Z)

323 320 boulder toilet hobo says, free toby at December 16, 2013 07:38 PM (iQxYV)

I was SO giddy when he picked Ryan, I took it as a sign we were going to have a grown-up conversation about phasing in privitization of the entitlement bombs we shackle the kids with.

No instead we got P-90x Bowhunting Crist sans executive experience and cheetoh tan."

Posted by: sven at December 16, 2013 03:40 PM (9jfyN)

324 296 Ooooh Joaquin Castro just emailed me to tell me I should be a Spring Fellow for the Wendy Davis campaign. He promises I'll be taught to organize by some of the best in the business. This is tempting... Posted by: Bohannon at December 16, 2013 07:31 PM (hFL/3) Go ahead. Have them spend money on you. Tell them to save a spot for you.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 16, 2013 03:40 PM (T0NGe)

325 They should not get shit untill they fence the fuckin entire southern border. A fence just like the Israelis have. (double fence etc.)

Posted by: sump at December 16, 2013 03:40 PM (aeZx0)

326 "Speaking to 620WTMJ radio's Charles Sykes, Ryan described his principles for reform as: 'Guaranteed border security, guaranteed interior enforcement, no amnesty'"

He forgot "If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor. If you like your plan, you can keep your plan."

Posted by: torquewrench at December 16, 2013 03:41 PM (gqT4g)

327 "Speaking to 620WTMJ radio's Charles Sykes, Ryan described his principles for reform as: "Guaranteed border security, guaranteed interior enforcement, no amnesty "Which of course means the opposite somehow and now everyone is back in purge mode. sure, get rid of everyone and winder why we have no power.
Posted by: You really are morons at December 16, 2013 07:28 PM (88OyH)

Because politicians never lie, right? This is more "not-amnesty" amnesty in exchange for border security provisions that will never happen. If Ryan thinks Obuttfuck will follow the enforcement provisions of an immigration law when he routinely violates every other law he finds inconvenient then he's too fucking stupid to be in a position of leadership.

Posted by: ol_dirty_/b/tard at December 16, 2013 03:41 PM (KSjsb)

328 Jack is just desperately trying to run the Socialist actuals con on their caucus the donks run.

I hate socialism, loathe the fuckers who indoctrinate the kids in it but the socialists actually are my ally in hating the fascist corporatist crony culture as built...

Ogabe keeps them on the reservation with tales of my racism.

Ryan tries to keep us on the reservation with tales of court appointments and imaginary deficit and debt reduction.

Posted by: sven at December 16, 2013 03:42 PM (9jfyN)

329 the American Action Forum

A group founded by John McCain's campaign manager and the guy who lost his senate seat to Stuart Smalley

estimates that immigration reform will boost per capita income by $1,700 over ten years and reduce the federal deficit by $2.7 trillion.

And yet, thirty+ years of open borders have driven middle class incomes down while the deficit has exploded.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:42 PM (azHfB)

330 >>Ah here's good old Jack Straw to explain how the sell out on the Budget is not a harbinger of another sell out on Amigo Grande! >>Hey Jack we pass the horsefuckery piecemeal then the House GOP goes and own goals conference and the GOP never wins again. How did that government shutdown work out for you? Yea, that was masterful strategy. Guess what? Boehner has already addressed the issue of a conference committee on immigration and the answer was a resounding no. I realize this didn't get covered much on blogs but it actually happened. More than once. What Boehner and others have indicated they want to do is offer multiple single issue bills starting with border security which they will send over to the Senate where Reid will promptly let them die. This allows them to at least partially defuse an issue they get beat on regularly by showing they are doing something without doing amnesty. And no, the budget deal wasn't a sellout. It was a compromise budget due to divided government. But you keep saying you are going to vote for Dems so you must love sellout and divided government crap. Me, I'd rather win so we can get a budget a lot closer to what we want.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 03:43 PM (g1DWB)

331 326 They should not get shit untill they fence the fuckin entire southern border. A fence just like the Israelis have. (double fence etc.) Posted by: sump at December 16, 2013 07:40 PM (aeZx0) How about a fence just like the Mexicans have? On their southern border.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 16, 2013 03:43 PM (T0NGe)

332 The thing that really worries m about Ryan and amnesty is that he's described it as a Christian, human rightsy sort of thing to do. I don't need instructions in morality from you, Paul, nor from any other politician. If you need further instruction in the perils of this approach, see Mike Huckabee.

Posted by: pep at December 16, 2013 03:43 PM (6TB1Z)

333 Me, I'd rather win so we can get a budget a lot closer to what we want. Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 07:43 PM (g1DWB)

2002-2006 called. They were laughing hysterically at you.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD, you taunty bitch. at December 16, 2013 03:44 PM (Gk3SS)

334 "Speaking to 620WTMJ radio's Charles Sykes, Ryan described his principles for reform as: "Guaranteed border security, guaranteed interior enforcement, no amnesty I got one better, If you like your plan you can keep your plan....

Posted by: sump at December 16, 2013 03:44 PM (aeZx0)

335 i'm making shrimp and chicken fried rice Well, that's not very Mexican.

Posted by: garrett at December 16, 2013 03:44 PM (YLvhI)

336 331 JackStraw at December 16, 2013 07:43 PM (g1DWB)

Guess what Jack I don't trust the dumbfucks not to own goal it.

The shutdown worked out fine overpowered by SCOAMFCare just like a lot of us said it would be.

Now to celebrate the DNC footbullet the GOP plans to blow its own brains out.

There's plenty enough on the plate for the GOP to not need to grab shit from the donk one.

Fuck this, and if they pass amnesty fuck the GOP.

Posted by: sven at December 16, 2013 03:45 PM (9jfyN)

337 And yet, thirty+ years of open borders have driven middle class incomes down while the deficit has exploded.

The odds say things have to turn around any day now.

Posted by: Paul Ryan at December 16, 2013 03:45 PM (8ZskC)

338 Because politicians never lie, right? This is more "not-amnesty" amnesty in exchange for border security provisions that will never happen. If Ryan thinks Obuttfuck will follow the enforcement provisions of an immigration law when he routinely violates every other law he finds inconvenient then he's too fucking stupid to be in a position of leadership.

Posted by: ol_dirty_/b/tard at December 16, 2013 07:41 PM (KSjsb)

-------------------------------------------------

All this law needs to do is reach the floor of the house or senate and Dear Leader/Harry Reid will deem it passed. Just having it brought up to debate is all they're waiting for.

Posted by: Soona at December 16, 2013 03:46 PM (iuBG8)

339 I've gotta new server, everyone, thanks to my wives from Guatemala and Peruvia (Ciffv)!

Posted by: hector's dick at December 16, 2013 03:46 PM (YQUIz)

340 What Boehner and others have indicated they want to do is offer multiple single issue bills starting with border security which they will send over to the Senate where Reid will promptly let them die. This allows them to at least partially defuse an issue they get beat on regularly by showing they are doing something without doing amnesty.

Reid has already said that no matter what comes their way from the house, they'll turn it into amnesty in conference committee, and there are enough amnesty supporters among the GOP Repubs to pass it with the help of all of the Dems. If any bill leaves the house, we're dead.

Posted by: pep at December 16, 2013 03:46 PM (6TB1Z)

341 They started one-fourth of all
new businesses in 2011.

New businesses? 4 illegals 4 lawnmowers and the remains of a old Uhaul paying half the cost (taxfree labor!) of an American company to cut yards.
Which is why my brother in law's landscape business can't compete.

And immigrant-owned small businesses employ 4.7
million people

Yeah that would be 4.7 million of those illegal employees from " the shadows".

But Deficit Reduction!

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 03:46 PM (5ikDv)

342

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 03:47 PM (5ikDv)

343 How did that government shutdown work out for you? Yea, that was masterful strategy. That's a strawman, JackStraw. A clean CR would have been better than this. On top of it, Ryan was deceitful about the budget deal (which I didn't think was horrible, but it was bad) and he clearly got snowed by the Dems and their little Senate trick. I don't like people who lie to me but tell the truth to the Democrats.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 16, 2013 03:47 PM (T0NGe)

344 How about a fence just like the Mexicans have? On their southern border. Posted by: AmishDude at December 16, 2013 07:43 PM (T0NGe) I'd be down with that Really like those Israeli fences though

Posted by: sump at December 16, 2013 03:47 PM (aeZx0)

345 The fact that Republican leaders are all about going for Amnesty and never do squat about... oh, the EPA and their job-killing regulatory agenda, just to cite one example ... pretty much tells you what they really care about.

Where a man's treasure is, there is his heart, also. And by their fruits, ye shall know them.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:48 PM (azHfB)

346 "I guess businesses could increase wages to attract more workers, or look to other states for labor. Naw -- that's silly. Open the gates and drop green cards from helicopters. That's the conservative way."

There are a couple of charity sites and social service agencies that I occasionally drive past, and I get a chance to scope out the people waiting out front.

The vast majority of them fall into two categories:

(a) Those who have chowed down so enthusiastically on the food provided to them by the munificent welfare state that they have become grossly obese. These people aren't going to bend over to pick a tomato. They can't even see their own feet. They'd have heart attacks after ten minutes of exertion.

(b) Those who can't be bothered with eating because they're trading off their food benefits for booze and/or drugs. These spindly addicts are too emaciated and fragile to do any sort of physical work. They'd snap like twigs. Plus you have to figure that they're disproportionately carrying bugs like hepatitis that you really don't want on field produce.

This actually is a big problem. The welfare state takes millions of people and by its mechanisms renders them quite literally unfit for work. It's almost as though the scheme were set up to be infinitely self-perpetuating.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 16, 2013 03:48 PM (gqT4g)

347 Reid has already said that no matter what comes their way from the house, they'll turn it into amnesty in conference committee, and there are enough amnesty supporters among the GOP Repubs to pass it with the help of all of the Dems. If any bill leaves the house, we're dead.

Yes.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:49 PM (azHfB)

348 >>2002-2006 called. They were laughing hysterically at you. Did you support the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan? The Bush tax cuts? Math is laughing right back at you. And if we are going to be factual here, Bush had the second lowest deficit to GDP going back to and including Reagan. Clinton was best, Obama, no surprise, worst. http://tinyurl.com/cfwdfgq

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 03:49 PM (g1DWB)

349 "They started one-fourth of all new businesses in 2011."

That's because you give them preferential treatment over natural citizens via the SBA. They use the SBA as scam. We've had one restaurant in this town that has been run by various members of the same family for years now. Every six months they close and reopen with a new owner, in other words a new supply of federal money.

Posted by: lowandslow at December 16, 2013 03:49 PM (IV4od)

350 336 my life is one big wtf

Posted by: navycopjoe Go RAVENS!!! at December 16, 2013 03:50 PM (JFrBt)

351

Hey, can we just let the Mexicans in already? My mail-order wife has that itch again, That itch I just can't scratch.

Posted by: Hector

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 16, 2013 03:50 PM (kdS6q)

352 How did that government shutdown work out for you?

Great actually.

Have you seen Cruz' poll numbers?

Also you might have noticed that the President is debating the possibility of taking the Cruz option into consideration.

Yeah you might want to pick a conservative failure that , you know , actually failed when making your point.

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 03:50 PM (5ikDv)

353 One good thing I'm hearing from Ryan is undoing the stupid chain immigration for legal immigration.

But I don't want any effing 'amnesty' either the wink wink nod nod kind we have now or the semi-official version where they can stay but won't get official blessing until the border is secured. Fuck that shit. You sign up to be a (non-voting for X years) citizen today and deal with all the same taxes and regulations we do or you get deported tomorrow. The big problem is that all these illegal labor lawn contractors, and construction contractors etc. have such an advantage vs the citizens that have to pay all these taxes or go to jail.

The aliens know damn well that the worse that happens if the state does bust them for some labor law is they get sent home and resume their citizen rights there so they are perfectly comfortable blowing raspberries at the state WRT to withholding, FICA, workmans comp. never mind shit like EPA regs and so on. and since they aren't paying all that vig to the state they can offer so much better prices and honest citizen businesses cant compete.

Posted by: palerider at December 16, 2013 03:51 PM (dkExz)

354 This actually is a big problem. The welfare state takes millions of people and by its mechanisms renders them quite literally unfit for work. It's almost as though the scheme were set up to be infinitely self-perpetuating. The Deuce you say!

Posted by: Insomniac at December 16, 2013 03:51 PM (UAMVq)

355 Posted by: navycopjoe Go RAVENS!!! at December 16, 2013 07:50 PM (JFrBt)

------------

Oh no. NCJ and I are in the unfortunate position of rooting for the same team tonight.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 03:51 PM (P6QsQ)

356 The question is moot since McConnell is holding up all the Senate work in retaliation for the Democrats trashing the filibuster. Because he was really pissed about that. Wait ...

Posted by: toby928© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 03:51 PM (evdj2)

357 my life is one big wtf Still Home Alone?

Posted by: garrett at December 16, 2013 03:52 PM (YLvhI)

358 357 toby928Â© makes jokes from the Phantom Zone at December 16, 2013 07:51 PM (evdj2)

Hey Juan McQueeg and Lindsey fucking Graham both said they were deeply saddened what the fuck else do you want?

Posted by: sven at December 16, 2013 03:52 PM (9jfyN)

359 And the reason why dogs have been with us so very long despite all the mess and fuss?

Those that have dogs live longer, live better and reproduce more.

Plus they always have some fun in their lives no matter how bad it gets.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Unexpurgated Edition) at December 16, 2013 03:52 PM (LSDdO)

360 How did that government shutdown work out for you?

The Republican Establishment did everything they could to sabotage the shutdown, then they turn around and blame Conservatives for its "failure."

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:53 PM (azHfB)

361 oh dear God please no

Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl at December 16, 2013 03:53 PM (u8GsB)

362
And if we are going to be factual here, Bush had the second lowest deficit to GDP going back to and including Reagan.
http://tinyurl.com/cfwdfgq
Posted by: JackStraw

by James K. Glassman

"I am the founding executive director of the George W. Bush Institute, part of the George W. Bush Presidential Center"

Hmmm -- about the objectivity of your source....

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 16, 2013 03:53 PM (kdS6q)

363 >>That's a strawman, JackStraw. A clean CR would have been better than this. Thats an opinion not a fact. A CR would have lasted a couple months and we would have been right back to shutdown theater, right smack in the middle of the Obamacare meltdown and the 2014 elections. If you want a real budget that is closer to our terms then we have to win the Senate. I don't understand why this is hard for people who live on a political blog to understand. Screaming and insults don't mean squat, votes do.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 03:54 PM (g1DWB)

364 With the way my signature law is going, I may just build that fence but to keep you suckas in.

Posted by: King Barky the Liar at December 16, 2013 03:54 PM (WGm5T)

365 Pictures of Precedent Barrycade shutting down the Memorial with veterans groups protesting?

Priceless.

MOAR shutdown please.

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 03:54 PM (5ikDv)

366 361 Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 07:53 PM (azHfB)

Quite...

The GOP is an interesting party it takes a fucking from the democrats and returns that fucking to the conservatives in its caucus.

I look forward to reciprocal fucking if they sell the nation to Mexico.

Posted by: sven at December 16, 2013 03:54 PM (9jfyN)

367 Hmmm -- about the objectivity of your source....

I LOL'd

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:54 PM (azHfB)

368 Don't Fence me in!

Posted by: luaP noR at December 16, 2013 03:54 PM (YLvhI)

369 356 Oh no. NCJ and I are in the unfortunate position of rooting for the same team tonight. no we're not we both want to settle this once and for all in two weeks till then both our teams win

Posted by: navycopjoe Go RAVENS!!! at December 16, 2013 03:54 PM (JFrBt)

370 Oh no. NCJ and I are in the unfortunate position of rooting for the same team tonight.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 07:51 PM (P6QsQ)

-----------------------------------------------------

I'm sorry. Why don't you beg off tonight and root for Dallas next weekend.

Posted by: Soona at December 16, 2013 03:55 PM (iuBG8)

371 358 nah, they got in last night

Posted by: navycopjoe Go RAVENS!!! at December 16, 2013 03:55 PM (JFrBt)

372 And if we are going to be factual here, Bush had the second lowest deficit to GDP going back to and including Reagan. This is correct but it should also be said that lower deficits coincide more with Republican congress majorities than Republican presidents. And I'm not even a Republican.

Posted by: Meremortal, hoping at December 16, 2013 03:56 PM (1Y+hH)

373 Did you support the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan? The Bush tax cuts?

Math is laughing right back at you.

And if we are going to be factual here, Bush had the second lowest deficit to GDP going back to and including Reagan. Clinton was best, Obama, no surprise, worst.

http://tinyurl.com/cfwdfgq Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 07:49 PM (g1DWB)

Oh!   Look!   Medicare Part D is on the line!

If we're going to be factual, please name for me all the actual cuts to spending, not to mention entire programs, not to mention entire departments, that took place during that time. But but but wars is laaaaaaaammmmmmeeeeeeee.   So fucking lame.

Tell you what, sweetie, the reason I keep flogging that dead horse is because you and others who continue to insist that nothing can be done without control of the House and Senate have yet to come up with anything approaching a non-ludicrous explanation as to why it is that when the Republicans controlled all three branches of government, none of the things that conservatives were promised for, ooooohhhh, 20 odd years came to pass. Because Wars is not the excuse you're looking for.

To repeat myself, it's about trust.   That trust has been shattered into tiny little shards based upon actual actions by the GOP in the past.   Trying to handwave that away does nothing to make your argument more persuasive.

What used to be the base is highly suspicious of everything any politician, yes, including St. Ted of the Cruz, says.   With good reason.   Acting as if that is not the case is ridiculous.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD, you taunty bitch. at December 16, 2013 03:57 PM (Gk3SS)

374 >>The Republican Establishment did everything they could to sabotage the shutdown, then they turn around and blame Conservatives for its "failure." Ok. Tell me how it was supposed to work. All I've heard so far is 1. Shutdown 2 3. Victory! Explain step number 2 where the Democrat controlled Senate under Harry Reid votes to defund Obamacare which had already been funded in the statute that passed in 2010 and then Obama signs it. I haven't heard anyone, not even Cruz or Lee, tell me how that was going to work.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 03:57 PM (g1DWB)

375 If you want a real budget that is closer to our terms then we have to win the Senate.

And the way to do that is with pedigreed, Establishment-approved, centrist candidates like Tommy Thompson, Scott Brown, George Allen, Connie Mack, Heather Wilson, Lisa Lingle, Pete Hoekstra, Denny Rehberg, Nick Berg, Charlie Crist, Arlen Specter, and Lincoln Chaffee.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 03:58 PM (azHfB)

376 The biggest problem with immigration reform/amnesty is that, for those of us paying attention, the federal government has demonstrated that they can't be trusted to enforce its/our own laws. That's a big hurdle. Once trust is gone, it's a bitch earning it back. I honestly don't think there is a solution that most people, leftards or conservative, would agree to. One side will like it and the other will hate it. The side that doesn't like it will be disenfranchised for a long time to come. It's sad that we've come to this point. It kind of leads into the LiB scenario. Health care is FUBAR, immigration is FUBAR, our debt is FUBAR, and our racial intolerance is FUBAR. Other than that, we're doing great!

Posted by: Marmo at December 16, 2013 03:58 PM (pcgW1)

377 I think the shutdown was a good thing when it happened in that it called attention to the fact that conservatives were trying to derail Obamacare. That turns out to be a good political position to be able to hold up to the voters.

I do NOT think shutdowns are the way to go heading into 2014. They may satisfy the red meat instincts of people like me, but I don't think the average voter feels the same. The ones we are trying to sway.

I think trying to appear as the reasonable grown-up in the room is a good strategy right now. Shutdowns and continuing crises lose their positive effects if they are over-done IMO.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 03:59 PM (P6QsQ)

378 Tell you what, sweetie, the reason I keep flogging that dead horse is because you and others who continue to insist that nothing can be done without control of the House and Senate have yet to come up with anything approaching a non-ludicrous explanation as to why it is that when the Republicans controlled all three branches of government, none of the things that conservatives were promised for, ooooohhhh, 20 odd years came to pass. Because Wars is not the excuse you're looking for.

If I were a woman and Ted Cruz had just said that, you'd be able to drown a toddler in my pants.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 04:00 PM (azHfB)

379 "The big problem is that all these illegal labor lawn contractors, and construction contractors etc. have such an advantage vs the citizens that have to pay all these taxes or go to jail."

Not just taxes. Regulatory burdens.

Here in Scum Scamfrisco, I recall a case in which a Mex illegal working on the steeply pitched roof of a three-story house put a foot wrong and fell to his death. No safety harness. No scaffolding. Nothing.

Roofing firm was run by Korean illegals. Rather than deal with OSHA and lawsuits, they just instantly folded the company and disappeared. You can be sure they are now open for business under a different name, again employing illegal Mexican labor, again without any of the costly safety regulations under which legit citizen-owned firms have to operate.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 16, 2013 04:01 PM (gqT4g)

380 Yeah,if it wasn't for that pesky terrorist attack on 9/11/01 GW and the GOP congress were going to slash spending to the bone,get rid of agencies left and right.

Posted by: steevy at December 16, 2013 04:01 PM (zqvg6)

381 #374 AtC GMTA

Posted by: Marmo at December 16, 2013 04:02 PM (pcgW1)

382 The War didn't force George W. Bush to sign Medicare Part D, No Child Left Behind, McCain-Feingold, or Sarbanes-Oxley. The War didn't force George W. Bush to double the budget for the Department of Education. The War didn't force George W. Bush to sign the incandescent light bulb ban (authored by Republican congressman Fred Upton).

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 04:04 PM (azHfB)

383 @374

Wow!
Ditto everything that she said!

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 04:05 PM (5ikDv)

384 #383 But hey, we got a new Dept. Of Homeland Security. So we have that going for us.

Posted by: Marmo at December 16, 2013 04:06 PM (pcgW1)

385 375 >>The Republican Establishment did everything they could to sabotage the shutdown, then they turn around and blame Conservatives for its "failure." Ok. Tell me how it was supposed to work. All I've heard so far is 1. Shutdown 2 3. Victory! Explain step number 2 where the Democrat controlled Senate under Harry Reid votes to defund Obamacare which had already been funded in the statute that passed in 2010 and then Obama signs it. I haven't heard anyone, not even Cruz or Lee, tell me how that was going to work. Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 07:57 PM (g1DWB) Disingenuous bull shit on your part just like the last time you pulled this crap. You have already decided that the shut down was a failure. Period. End of story. There is no explanation anyone could provide you that you would find satisfactory. To act as if you are looking for an explanation is dishonest.

Posted by: Buzzion at December 16, 2013 04:07 PM (uy+bA)

386 >>Oh! Look! Medicare Part D is on the line! In other words you're going to ignore what I said and bring up something else. Ok. I didn't say that the Bush years were perfect. Nor was the spending problem nearly as acute. Very few people were ranting and raving about the debt way back then although I was. And pretending that politics wasn't consumed with war after being attacked is ludicrous. Nothing else was getting any oxygen. Bush did try for entitlement reform and failed. His political capital was gone by his 2nd term and that is the only way big things like this will happen. It won't start in the House or even the Senate. I've always been mistrustful of politicians specifically because they are politicians, long before the last Republican majority in Congress. But I do think there are people who are more inclined to do some of the stuff I want and they aren't on Team Liberal. Sweetie.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 04:07 PM (g1DWB)

387 Why do you hate Korean ~~illegals~~ immigrants, torquewrench? I'm looking to marry one of them next.

Posted by: hector's dick at December 16, 2013 04:08 PM (YQUIz)

388 uh oh

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 04:08 PM (P6QsQ)

389 By 2007 it was obvious the Republican party was not interested in financial reform that would stave off the coming major trainwreck. This is the central issue of our time, and we have no power structure willing to address it. So I became an independent to wait out the inevitable. It may not happen in my lifetime, look at Europe. But the math says the tipping point has been passed, so I have prepared.

Posted by: Meremortal, hoping at December 16, 2013 04:08 PM (1Y+hH)

390 Jack Straw is now in a foetal postion crying like Tony Romo.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 04:08 PM (azHfB)

391 @385

DHS is a squished together mess which successfully swallowed up Immigration's enforcement missions in order to pursue Customs enforcement missions thereby keeping lettuce prices low.

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 04:09 PM (5ikDv)

392 >>Disingenuous bull shit on your part just like the last time you pulled this crap. You have already decided that the shut down was a failure. Period. End of story. There is no explanation anyone could provide you that you would find satisfactory. To act as if you are looking for an explanation is dishonest. As usual, Buzzion, you are full of shit. I asked from Day 1 what the winning strategy for the shutdown was and neither you nor anyone else could give me one. Period. End of story. And you keep up the same bullshit now. You are either incapable or unwilling to answer a simple question, how was shutting down the government ever going to work in our favor? Refusing to answer a question and impugning the motives of the other person is not winning an argument, just opposite. It's showing you have nothing but insults and vitriol.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 04:11 PM (g1DWB)

393 I do think there are people who are more inclined to do some of the stuff I want and they aren't on Team Liberal.

Is the Republican Leadership laying any groundwork now for future entitlement and regulatory reform? Or are they too busy trying to pass Amnesty and undo the sequester for their big donors?

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 04:11 PM (azHfB)

394 #392 I forgot the sarc tag. Yes, DHS is a mess and should never have been created. I think it was a knee-jerk reaction to the events of 9/11.

Posted by: Marmo at December 16, 2013 04:13 PM (pcgW1)

395 The House offered multiple bills to avoid the shutdown.

Harry and Barry shut it down. Get that part right.

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 04:13 PM (5ikDv)

396 @395

sarc received

The crazy thing is that the vast majority of terrorism related responsibilities were and still are already, by statute, delegated to other agencies.

Joint Terrorism Task Forces are made up of multiple agencies. There was no need to screw up Customs and Immigration beyond , as you said the knee jerk " DO SOMETHING, ANYTHING" response.

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 04:17 PM (5ikDv)

397 Since Jack is fond of the formula...

1. Cave in on Democrat spending.
2.
3. Fiscal solvency.

Or...

1. Pass Amnesty
2.
3. Newly citizenized illegals don't become a massive Democrat voting bloc, don't drive down the wages of American workers, don't massively expand welfare rolls.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 04:17 PM (azHfB)

398 393 >>Disingenuous bull shit on your part just like the last time you pulled this crap. You have already decided that the shut down was a failure. Period. End of story. There is no explanation anyone could provide you that you would find satisfactory. To act as if you are looking for an explanation is dishonest. As usual, Buzzion, you are full of shit. I asked from Day 1 what the winning strategy for the shutdown was and neither you nor anyone else could give me one. Period. End of story. And you keep up the same bullshit now. You are either incapable or unwilling to answer a simple question, how was shutting down the government ever going to work in our favor? Refusing to answer a question and impugning the motives of the other person is not winning an argument, just opposite. It's showing you have nothing but insults and vitriol. Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 08:11 PM (g1DWB) See once again jackstraw you are full of dishonest bullshit. People here did say how they felt a shutdown was working in our favor. But like I said you have made up your mind that no answer is good enough or sufficient to satisfy you. Why answer a pathetic hack like you when you will just go "not good enough." You are not looking for discussion.

Posted by: Buzzion at December 16, 2013 04:18 PM (uy+bA)

399 Ryan/Hollowidiot 2016 All appeasement of the Left all the time. Winning slogan~!

Posted by: Dan at December 16, 2013 04:18 PM (gR5OX)

400 Here's what the shutdown illustrated for me: 1. Obama would rather shut down the government than grant a one year extension on the individual mandate. 2. Obama would rather shut down the government than require Congress to live equally under the law. 3. Obama would rather shut down the government than have his family live under that law. 4. Conservatives stuck to their principles and warned us of the problems with Obamacare.

Posted by: Marmo at December 16, 2013 04:19 PM (pcgW1)

401 And Jack Straw as campaign manager, Dan!

Posted by: hector's dick at December 16, 2013 04:20 PM (YQUIz)

402 Paul Ryan says immigration reform will reduce the deficit.I'm sure that entitlement spending will drop drastically with the Amnesty of 8 million +.

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 04:20 PM (5ikDv)

403 Good summary Marmo.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 04:21 PM (P6QsQ)

404 In other words you're going to ignore what I said and bring up something else. Ok.

Just following your lead there.

I didn't say that the Bush years were perfect. Nor was the spending problem nearly as acute. Very few people were ranting and raving about the debt way back then although I was. And pretending that politics wasn't consumed with war after being attacked is ludicrous. Nothing else was getting any oxygen.

Are you insane that people weren't ranting and raving about the debt then? The debt has been an issue since, what, the early 1980's? Earlier? Seriously? Wow. Okay then.

So your position is Because War precluded any other actions by the Republicans who, again, were in control of all three branches of government. If so, then how did all of the things mentioned above get passed?

Bush did try for entitlement reform and failed. His political capital was gone by his 2nd term and that is the only way big things like this will happen. It won't start in the House or even the Senate.

Please square the circle of we must have the Senate before we can do anything with this statement. Because, taking your comments seriously, that means that the Republicans can do nothing without the Presidency. Well, then we're back to where we started, now, aren't we?

I've always been mistrustful of politicians specifically because they are politicians, long before the last Republican majority in Congress. But I do think there are people who are more inclined to do some of the stuff I want and they aren't on Team Liberal.

Sweetie. Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 08:07 PM (g1DWB)

They do not appear to be on Team Republican either.

You claim to be mistrustful of politicians and then attempt to do everything in your power to explain away the actual history which forms much of the basis for the current lack of trust by what used to be the base for the GOP. Fine.

I do not agree with you. You won't agree with me. Okay then.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD, you taunty bitch. at December 16, 2013 04:21 PM (Gk3SS)

405 >>Is the Republican Leadership laying any groundwork now for future entitlement and regulatory reform? Or are they too busy trying to pass Amnesty and undo the sequester for their big donors? Well I don't think they are trying to pass amnesty but other than that, both. They can't do entitlement or regulatory reform until they have both houses of Congress. Thats just a fact. As long as Harry Reid is in control of the Senate neither of those things is happening. We can disagree on that but I'd like to see any evidence that liberals are in favor of either of those things. So yea, I think they are doing everything to remove those things that will get in the way of them running on Obmacare next fall because they want the Congress. I think there are some of them who genuinely want to do at least some of the things we want. Romney and Ryan ran not just in the primary but in the general election on entitlement reform, killing Obamacare, regulatory reform, no amnesty and a host of other things we want. They could have run to the center but they didn't. Why if that was the harder road if they weren't serious? And that includes at least going through the motions on dealing with illegals. If they don't it will be just another shiny for the liberals and the msm to beat them with. But thats what I think most of it is, kabuki. Just like ZOMG GUN CONTROL, which last I looked is dead. As to rewarding their donors, yep, thats what politicians do. Not surprised. We don't have a perfect system and it runs on money. Huge amounts. So sure, they will pander. Its our job to make sure that pandering only goes so far.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 04:22 PM (g1DWB)

406 #404 Thanks, GW.

Posted by: Marmo at December 16, 2013 04:22 PM (pcgW1)

407 They can't do entitlement or regulatory reform until they have both houses of Congress.

But they can make the case for entitlement and regulatory reform, which they are not. Boehner didn't hire an expert on entitlement reform, he hired John McCain's Amnesty stooge.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 04:26 PM (azHfB)

408 Think of all the jobs we'd save or create building a couple of really nice fences. And manning them with smiling Americans checking documents. The Northern border needs them too. I worry about economically screwed folks pouring into our nation via our Southern border, but I *really* worry about al-Qaeda. That's my idea of comprehensive.

Posted by: akula51[/b][/i][/s] at December 16, 2013 04:28 PM (54dkR)

409 >>See once again jackstraw you are full of dishonest bullshit. People here did say how they felt a shutdown was working in our favor. But like I said you have made up your mind that no answer is good enough or sufficient to satisfy you. Why answer a pathetic hack like you when you will just go "not good enough." You are not looking for discussion. And people here were wrong. Find me one poll, one example anywhere, that the shutdown helped Republicans. This place is an echo chamber where disagreement gets you called a troll or a RINO and only the most extreme position is accepted. Or a dishonest hack because I've asked you since the beginning of the shutdown what the winning strategy was and all you could do was amp up the insults. And to this day, nothing. Would have been easier to just say there was no strategy and left it at that.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 04:29 PM (g1DWB)

410

This amnesty - no other word for it - pisses me off almost as much as obumblecare.

My husband is an immigrant. Respected our laws, jumped through all the government hoops, got his medical exam, provided proof of vaccinations, submitted to a criminal background check from the age of 16 forward, paid his fees, and is living and working here LEGALLY. As in obeying the laws of his adopted home country.

As far as I'm concerned, any talk of amnesty is giving a hearty "F*** YOU for being stupid enough to follow US law" to all those immigrants who have done just that - including my husband, my grandparents, and great-grandparents.

Posted by: Marybeth at December 16, 2013 04:30 PM (Lktpy)

411 When the GOP had everything, they didn't reverse the closing of the NFA Class III registry. That told me that they weren't about freedom, but power. The left pulled a BS last minute game with the Firearms Owners Protection Act. When the GOP had complete control of the Legislative and Executive they didn't do squat to reverse it, despite pleas to do so.

Posted by: AZ Hi Desert (All my Hate cannot be found) at December 16, 2013 04:35 PM (ial2b)

412 To repeat myself, it's about trust. That trust has been shattered into tiny little shards based upon actual actions by the GOP in the past. Trying to handwave that away does nothing to make your argument more persuasive.

They're in negative trust territory for me. I'd like negative term limits. Fire everybody inside the beltway and start over. If it's still bad next year repeat.

330M - 30M = 300M, 30M/300M = 10% dilution of my citizenship.

Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 16, 2013 04:36 PM (DL2i+)

413 Find me one poll, one example anywhere, that the shutdown helped Republicans.

Despite the shutdown and debt ceiling debate, Sen. Ted Cruz hasnÂ’t lost any ground with support among Republican voters in Texas, a new poll shows.
The Texas senator leads a field of GOP lawmakers with 32 percent of Texas Republican voters wanting Cruz as their presidential candidate in 2016, according to a poll from left-leaning Public Policy Polling released Thursday.

Cruz is a Republican. Seems to have worked for him. Especially with Texas trending blue.

Good for our side. Right , Jack?

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 04:39 PM (5ikDv)

414 Ted Cruz compromised and asked for a one year delay. Treat businesses and people equally. Now at least 10 democrat senators have said this.

Not bad for a minority party vs the ACA juggernaut?

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 04:43 PM (5ikDv)

415 The contrast is, when Democrats get power, they really do move the ball down the field on behalf of their base. They may not get everything, but they get a helluva lot more than we do.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 04:44 PM (azHfB)

416

Victor Davis Hanson - October 2013

Democratic senators up for reelection in 13 months are now embracing, in their calls to delay Obamacare, the same themes as did the House Republicans and a few senators a few weeks agoÂ—hoping to preempt mounting criticism. In this surreal landscape, three weeks ago Obamacare was unquestioned Â“settledÂ” law (despite the fact that the president himself unsettled the law by suspending the employer mandate) that only dead-ender Â“anarchistsÂ” and Â“hostage takersÂ” wished to stop or amend.

Now some Democrats apparently think the law still is fluid, and thus, as we were once reminded, want to go against the administrationÂ’s mandate of the last election, the ruling of the Supreme Court, and the majority of the Senate in stopping the federalization of health care. If the rollout of Obamacare gets any more incoherent, soon Barack Obama may be echoing the same concerns of Ted Cruz and the former naysayers in his willingness to suspend or delay his own signature legislation. At that point, do the tea-party Â“TalibanÂ” become rebranded as prescient, sober and judicious legislators who provided a model for what Democrats now in Johnny-come-lately fashion emulateÂ—or do Democrats up for reelection become obstructionists who need to get over it and move on?

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 04:45 PM (5ikDv)

417 damn formatting

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 04:46 PM (5ikDv)

418 >>>>This place is an echo chamber where disagreement gets you called a troll or a RINO and only the most extreme position is accepted. Or a dishonest hack because I've asked you since the beginning of the shutdown what the winning strategy was and all you could do was amp up the insults. And to this day, nothing. You truly are a pathetic liar. Constantly shifting the goal posts here. About like your claims with Issa being successful with getting the head of the irs fired. No wait not the head of the irs. And she retired she didn't get fired.

Posted by: Buzzion at December 16, 2013 04:46 PM (uy+bA)

419 >>Cruz is a Republican. Seems to have worked for him. Especially with Texas trending blue. >>Good for our side. Right , Jack? If the best you can do is a conservative Senator being popular in a conservative state that elected him on a platform of repealing Obamacare, ok. But I think the fact that the Republicans reached their lowest polling data in years, in some polls ever, sort of balances that out. Good thing Obamacare is as bad as it is and that pulled us back, right none?

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 04:47 PM (g1DWB)

420 >>You truly are a pathetic liar. Constantly shifting the goal posts here. About like your claims with Issa being successful with getting the head of the irs fired. No wait not the head of the irs. And she retired she didn't get fired. You're getting pretty pathetic. So she just decided to retire to spend more time with her family? The Issa hearings that exposed her and forced her to take the 5th (which she fucked up and was about to force her to testify in open committee where she would have been forced to tell the truth or commit perjury) had nothing to do with it? Are you really such an angry little man that you can't admit when you are wrong and just keep throwing shit against the wall to see what will stick?

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 04:51 PM (g1DWB)

421 Gosh where could I have ever gotten the idea that no matter what someone provides as an answer you will declare it insufficient.

Posted by: Buzzion at December 16, 2013 04:53 PM (uy+bA)

422 Texas is under assault by Obama's ACORN types and their taxpayer funded GOTV . Every state is a battle.

Cruz' argument during the shutdown was almost 100% against Obamacare. He brought it to the forefront when practically every other member of Congress had surrendered to what they believed was a fait accompli.

If he hadn't pressed like he did, you can bet your ass that a "bipartisan" fix it squad led by McCain and his ilk would have jumped in to "save" Obamacare.

And the MSM would have hung Obamacare on the D's and the R's.

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 04:55 PM (5ikDv)

423 Obamacare is radioactive now.

Beyond the website problems, why do you think that is?

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 16, 2013 04:58 PM (5ikDv)

424 >>Gosh where could I have ever gotten the idea that no matter what someone provides as an answer you will declare it insufficient. My question was how did the shutdown help Republicans not Ted Cruz. Try again.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 04:59 PM (g1DWB)

425 My question was how did the shutdown help Republicans not Ted Cruz.

---------------

Several people have done exactly that. You just refuse to take yes for an answer.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 16, 2013 05:00 PM (P6QsQ)

426 >>Obamacare is radioactive now. >>Beyond the website problems, why do you think that is? Oh, gee I don't know. Maybe because as of October 1st it has gone live and been as bad or worse than most of us predicted? Yes, I'm pretty sure thats why the generic Republican ballot has gone up while the Democrat has gone down by double digits, in the words of Charlie Cook the biggest swing in the generic ballot in 6 weeks in history. The website is just a symptom. There are polls all over the place showing big majorities of people who say that their premiums are going up and they blame Obamacare. Not a website, Obamacare. That was always the point with this, Obamacare is going to start taking huge hits for everything that goes wrong with any health care related issue. People here have been yelling about the debt, yelling about Obamacare, for years. And few listened. Because it was always just words. Its not words now and thats why the liberals are on the run. Most LIVs believe the shit they hear in the msm and they don't move until they feel pain. Pain has been applied.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 05:06 PM (g1DWB)

427 >>Several people have done exactly that. You just refuse to take yes for an answer. No they haven't. They've tried to justify their position supporting the shutdown and the only evidence I've heard is that Ted Cruz is popular with his constituents. Texas is one of the most conservative states in the country and Cruz, a Tea Party candidate, was elected to do anything he could to fight Obamacare. It helped him. No kidding. Who else? You're free to site a specific example of how the shutdown helped Republicans.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 05:10 PM (g1DWB)

428 "And people here were wrong. Find me one poll, one example anywhere, that the shutdown helped Republicans." Nobody suggested that Republicans hold a shutdown, cave after 21 days, and then give Democrats more than the Democrats proposed at the start. Nobody asked for that. If I send my car to be painted, and it comes back green with purple polka dots, it doesn't prove the fallacy of seeking a paint job. I obviously hired the wrong crew of painters.

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at December 16, 2013 05:10 PM (5xmd7)

429

So judging by Ryan-Murray.

The Ryan Immigration Bill, will be even worse then the Gang of Eight?
So bad maybe even Rubio will go "I'm out" ?

Posted by: midwestconservative at December 16, 2013 05:12 PM (eFTkY)

430 Ryan wants to import a new base, because the one he currently has embarrasses and constrains him. We're seeing a New Majority form before our eyes: Big Media, Big Banks, Big Business, Big Unions, and Big Billionaires, buttressed by Big Immigration. Good-bye middle class, hello Big Permanent Government.

Posted by: Dirty Old Man at December 16, 2013 05:14 PM (Yv5v6)

431 "They can't do entitlement or regulatory reform until they have both houses of Congress. " Every person of this opinion is unfit to serve in Congress.

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at December 16, 2013 05:19 PM (5xmd7)

432 >>Nobody suggested that Republicans hold a shutdown, cave after 21 days, and then give Democrats more than the Democrats proposed at the start. >>Nobody asked for that. I agree. All I've ever asked is how, without holding the Senate or the Presidency, were we going to win? How were we going to get Reid and the rest of the Dems who fought to the death to get Obamacare, to vote against it in the Senate and then get Obama to sign a bill killing it? Before it even started? Liberals have been lusting to take over health care since the 1930's. They have been running on it and chipping away it ever since. This isn't just an Obama thing, this is core to what liberals are. >>If I send my car to be painted, and it comes back green with purple polka dots, it doesn't prove the fallacy of seeking a paint job. I obviously hired the wrong crew of painters. Yep. Or maybe expecting guys to give you a beautiful clear coat cobalt black paint job when you hired a company that is 2/3 clown car painters wasn't just the wrong crew, it was the wrong company. I don't remember any Republicans voting for Obamacare. The clowns currently own the car painting company in DC. Time to build a new company.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 05:22 PM (g1DWB)

433 The money is more important than September 2013 polling. Nobody in November 2014 is going to care what "damage" hit the poll numbers. We could be still doing the shutdown, making it illegal for Democrats to spend money to fix Obamacare, without any problem. The money is more power than the polls. Harry Reid can stage 100-0 votes in the Senate to spend money and it dies if the House refuses to approve the same bill. That's reality. The nonsense that you can betray everybody who bothered to vote for a Republican instead of a Democrat, because you don't have total power? That's going to hurt more than the shutdown. Conservatives have no voice in Washington. Time for a purge.

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at December 16, 2013 05:34 PM (5xmd7)

434 Chris_Balsz at December 16, 2013 09:34 PM (5xmd7) That's actually the first response to my question since I started asking before the shutdown. Agree with your conclusion but appreciate a full response.

Posted by: JackStraw at December 16, 2013 05:41 PM (g1DWB)

435 "They can't do entitlement or regulatory reform until they have both houses of Congress. "

They had it. They didn't do it.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at December 16, 2013 06:26 PM (azHfB)

436 "The GOP has a cool euphemism for "Amnesty." That euphemism is "No Amnesty," by which they mean "amnesty." "

"Triggers" = phony language to throw some bones to the low-info conservatives.

"Legalization" = amnesty. They will pretend that amnesty is giving them citizenship, and then republicans will pretend that NOT giving them instant citizenship is 'not amnesty' ... when it is just delaying the inevitables. They stay. They become citizens. They get 30 relatives to come

"They always tick down the hard-sounding things they say they're going to demand -- E-Verify, "border security" (usually of the "virtual" sort) and then go right to the Same Old Deal they've been offering forever..."

'virtual border security' = $$$ for some DoD contractors selling toys.
E-verify = The senate immigration bill pretended to do it, but actually gutted it.
Same Old Deal = 2007 = 2006 =1986. It's time to overthrow that whole shebang and come up with a New Deal.

Here's a simple Quid Pro Quo:
MAKE OBAMACARE REPEAL THE CONDITION FOR AMNESTY.

Oh, and let's have the amnesty in 2023, just like those unicorn fart budget cuts they negotiated.

Oh, and lets rigorously enforce E-verify follow entry / exit visas, and deport people for real for 9 years ... and then amnesty whoever is left in 2023.

Posted by: Zombie Commie Walter Cronkite at December 16, 2013 07:28 PM (oNqbW)

437 "Ooooh Joaquin Castro just emailed me to tell me I should be a Spring Fellow for the Wendy Davis campaign. He promises I'll be taught to organize by some of the best in the business. This is tempting..."

Translation: YOU DONT EVEN RATE GETTING A MINIMUM WAGE, THEY WANT YOU TO WORK FOR FREE. Anyone falling for that is a true sucker!!!

Posted by: Zombie Commie Walter Cronkite at December 16, 2013 07:31 PM (oNqbW)

438 "It's true that our current immigration system makes less sense than even the tax code. It is damn near impossible to immigrate here legally, unless you've got heap of cash. I am all for a system that gives people (and not just people from Mexico) a more sensible way to come here legally. "

Yet a million people a year come here legally.

That ought to be enough.

Posted by: Zombie Commie Walter Cronkite at December 16, 2013 07:32 PM (oNqbW)

439 Paul: fuck off. Please.

Posted by: tourslepantovienna at December 16, 2013 09:29 PM (SBdwW)

440 Amnesty from Obamacare for citizens first! Then we can talk.

Posted by: Seipherd at December 16, 2013 11:42 PM (AortR)

441 I'm looking forward to Nancy being speaker again. At least she doesn't lie about what she believes.

Posted by: Huggy at December 17, 2013 02:52 AM (VctSv)

442 "No they haven't. They've tried to justify their position supporting the shutdown and the only evidence I've heard is that Ted Cruz is popular with his constituents. Texas is one of the most conservative states in the country and Cruz, a Tea Party candidate, was elected to do anything he could to fight Obamacare. It helped him. "

Duh, so did every other conservative Republican from Sen Ron Johnson to every Republican voted in 2010 on the obamacare backlash. No kidding.
THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IS THAT CRUZ TOOK HIS CAMPAIGN PROMISES SERIOUSLY. for that he got appreciate and admiration from constituents and loathing from the DC political class.

"You're free to site a specific example of how the shutdown helped Republicans."

First, nobody is for the shutdown, rather its what you are willing to accept in the budget. Reid and Obama proved they'd rather shut down government than delay obamacare.

Look at the deal they announced last week - total nothing deal. busts the caps and funds obamacare. This is the deal they would have taken in October, and then they'd try amnesty.

So for one, the shutdown:
- gave us a reprieve on amnesty
- made it clear instead of muddy that defund/delay/defer of Obamacare *is possible* if the Democrats move on it

Both of these will IMPROVE our chances in 2014.

Posted by: Zombie Commie Walter Cronkite at December 17, 2013 07:44 AM (oNqbW)

443 Oh, gee I don't know. Maybe because as of October 1st it has gone live and been as bad or worse than most of us predicted? Yes, I'm pretty sure thats why the generic Republican ballot has gone up while the Democrat has gone down by double digits, in the words of Charlie Cook the biggest swing in the generic ballot in 6 weeks in history.

Beyond the website problems, why do you think that is?

bolded for reading comprehension.

Posted by: noone, really [/i][/b] at December 17, 2013 09:48 AM (5ikDv)

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