April 05, 2013

Reports Of The Aircraft Carrier's Demise May Have Been Premature
— DrewM

Lots of defense folks have been talking about how useless aircraft carriers might be in a shooting war with China.

The theory is, China is working on a ballistic missile that can target ships and therefore no carrier is going to get near enough to the battle space to matter. We should simply build smaller carriers for everyday use, cut our capability and call it a day.

Not so fast. It turns out that attack and defense is a cycle (who knew?) and we can build weapons that would work against China's new missile.

Ronald O’Rourke, a CRS specialist in naval affairs, argues that China’s new DF-21D ASBM, dubbed the “carrier killer,” can be defeated by “employing a combination of active and passive measures” along the ASBM’s “kill chain.”

Despite dire warnings by a variety of defense analysts that the U.S. risks losing an aircraft carrier to a Chinese ASBM, O’Rourke said the U.S. Air Force has already “taken [China’s] kill chains apart to the ‘nth’ degree.”

...

First, the U.S. Navy could do more to control electromagnetic emissions or using deception emitters.

Second, it could also acquire systems for disabling or jamming ChinaÂ’s long-range maritime surveillance and targeting systems, destroy ASBMs in various stages of flight, and decoy and confuse ASBMs as they approach their intended targets.

Options for destroying ASBMs in flight include developing versions of the SM-3 Ballistic Missile Defense (BMD) interceptor missile, including the planned SM-3 Block IIA.

The U.S. Navy also should accelerate the procurement of the Sea-Based Terminal interceptor, which is the planned successor of the SM-2 Block IV terminal-phase BMD interceptor.

Wait, the Chinese aren't 150 feet tall and invincible? There new weapon isn't the end of warfare as we know it? Next you'll tell me weapons development is a constant cycle of innovation and adaptation, offense and defense by both sides.

The report says we could also build missile killing lasers, which...yes, yes we should. Because lasers.

Two related posts here and here talk about the need to build a new class of surface ships the Navy is going to need to house the radars needed to deal with the new threats.

There will always be people who say, "oh we can't compete with (fill in the blank). Don't buy it. It's simply a matter of will. Do we as Americans have that will any more?

And since not everyone is a naval strategy/defense geek...open thread.

Posted by: DrewM at 08:58 AM | Comments (326)
Post contains 423 words, total size 3 kb.

1

Well, sure Drew, we *could*

But that doesn't mean we *will*.

Posted by: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus at April 05, 2013 09:01 AM (YYJjz)

2 Nuclear powered egg roll.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:01 AM (tqLft)

3 Only problem with this:

A half hour after you kill the first Chinese ASBM, you want to kill another.

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 09:02 AM (GQ8sn)

4 Let's send them our judges on a raft.

Posted by: AmishDude at April 05, 2013 09:02 AM (T0NGe)

5 I believe the United States' military/industrial complex can accomplish anything. The only thing that can stop it is an asshole President and a shit-for-brains Congress.

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:03 AM (8sCoq)

6 I have complete confidence in the military to get the job done. I don't have confidence in the Feds or possibly even the American people to back them up anymore.

Posted by: RebelYankee at April 05, 2013 09:03 AM (w6iq1)

7 We just need to get close enough to spray Wasabi in their eyes.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at April 05, 2013 09:03 AM (jucos)

8 My concern is that we are at risk from low tech, asymmetrical warfare. I think China would go all Sun Tzu on our ass. I agree with the premise of Drew's article overall, though.

Posted by: Eaton Cox at April 05, 2013 09:03 AM (q177U)

9
3 Only problem with this:

A half hour after you kill the first Chinese ASBM, you want to kill another.

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 01:02 PM (GQ8sn)



This is a problem?

Posted by: BCochran1981 at April 05, 2013 09:03 AM (da5Wo)

10 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a malignant traitor.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) at April 05, 2013 09:04 AM (/PCJa)

11

I always hear people say "hitting a missile with another missile is like trying to get to bullets to hit in mid air."

 

Why yes that may be true, except bullet #2 is shot by a computer and GPS/radar/whatever guided to it's target.  So that's not really an applicable analogy.

Posted by: tsrblke at April 05, 2013 09:04 AM (GaqMa)

12 KARATE CHOP!

Posted by: Truck Monkey at April 05, 2013 09:04 AM (jucos)

13 You destroy all missile! You go now! No personal check!

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:04 AM (8sCoq)

14 In before someone calls for an all-drone airforce.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) at April 05, 2013 09:04 AM (/PCJa)

15 Actually, since carriers are always moving, the Chinese missile would not be as awesome as people think. Consider a moving carrier vs. a land base. Land base is far easier to hit. Also, our carriers are huge now - they are not WWII escort carrier . They could sustain damage, be repaired on the go, or back in port and keep fighting. We could even build new ones in around 2 years in a full court press. Thus, it would not be the end of the world to mothball a couple carrier groups. They are not as delicate and irreplaceable as I once assumed. (Though I did learn that since there is not ballistic missile vs. carrier experience, that one or the other size would probably be disappointed.) The best solution would be to lease any carriers we cannot afford to the Japanese, actually. They might even agree to pay the lease but have us operate them.

Posted by: sexypig at April 05, 2013 09:04 AM (dZQh7)

16 7 We just need to get close enough to spray Wasabi in their eyes. Posted by: Truck Monkey at April 05, 2013 01:03 PM (jucos) Dental floss blind folds. Now I denounce myself.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:04 AM (tqLft)

17 oh good. A palette cleanser.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:05 AM (qPCAa)

18 O’Rourke said the U.S. Air Force has already “taken [China’s] kill chains apart to the ‘nth’ degree.”

Why is the Air Force doing the Navy's work?

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 09:05 AM (GQ8sn)

19 Rutgers jihad continues. Coach, asst coach, AD now all gone. President trying to save his job. AD was the one who got them into the Big Ten. Biggest thing for Rutgers athletics ... probably ever. But he didn't immediately fire the coach so he's officially scum of the earth now.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 09:05 AM (ZPrif)

20

Why is the Air Force doing the Navy's work?

 

Because the Navy isn't?

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) at April 05, 2013 09:06 AM (/PCJa)

21 So speculation on future counter-measures beats missiles?

Cool.

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at April 05, 2013 09:06 AM (mN8D3)

22 PRO TIP: Frickin' sharks with frickin' laser beams attached to their frickin' heads.

Posted by: Cicero, Semiautomatic Assault Commenter at April 05, 2013 09:06 AM (8ZskC)

23 19 Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 01:05 PM (ZPrif) "We're all Larry Summers now..."

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:06 AM (tqLft)

24 22 PRO TIP: Frickin' sharks with frickin' laser beams attached to their frickin' heads. Posted by: Cicero, Semiautomatic Assault Commenter at April 05, 2013 01:06 PM (8ZskC) Mossad did it first.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:07 AM (tqLft)

25 How will all of this affect Teh Gheys, both in the military and the ones that want to marry.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at April 05, 2013 09:07 AM (jucos)

26 Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 01:05 PM (GQ8sn)

1- Air/Sea Battle

2- Joint is teh Hawt

3- Solve the problem, build the solution, get the budget money.

Posted by: DrewM. at April 05, 2013 09:07 AM (AFi9e)

27 I'm thinking Dennis Rodman's trip to North Korea may have emboldened the Chinese.  Bear with me here.  If they are afraid we will deploy lasers against their anti-ship missiles, that might constrain them.  But seeing Rodman with all those ridiculous tattoos they might just conclude that we don't have sophisticated laser technology.  Maybe we'd better bring Rodman in and do a total body erasure, just to show that we can.

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 09:08 AM (pxDth)

28

Also, our carriers are huge now - they are not WWII escort carrier . They could sustain damage, be repaired on the go, or back in port and keep fighting. We could even build new ones in around 2 years in a full court press.

 

I have seen the Ronald Regan up close during my trip to Pearl Harbor (it was in port there for a ceremony so we got to sail past it.)

It is a thing of awe when you see it in person and it's size cannot be put in simple words.

It's bigger than any cruise ship I've seen by far. (And I used to consider those things huge.)

Posted by: tsrblke at April 05, 2013 09:08 AM (GaqMa)

29 palate

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:08 AM (8sCoq)

30 Premature  decraftulation.



Posted by: eleven at April 05, 2013 09:09 AM (KXm42)

31 And since not everyone is a naval strategy/defense geek...open thread. *runs around waving arms in the air* What?

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Mmmm. Tea. at April 05, 2013 09:09 AM (VtjlW)

32 It's simply a matter of will. Do we as Americans have that will any more?


*snort*

Posted by: Cicero, Semiautomatic Assault Commenter at April 05, 2013 09:09 AM (8ZskC)

33 When all that BS first came out my first words were that they have to find it before they can shoot at it, and then it has to remain in one place to hit it.



That is a lot harder to do than people think.  We were able to hide from the Russians on three different occasions when the admiral wanted to play games.  We beat them every time.

Posted by: Vic at April 05, 2013 09:09 AM (53z96)

34 Mossad did it first. *** But of course.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 05, 2013 09:09 AM (piMMO)

35

So speculation on future counter-measures beats missiles?

 

Well, with some of the "future counter-measures" it's not so much that they're "future" as that they're just not in use yet.  That is- we have them, and we've pretty well proven them, but they're not quite in the real world yet.  Like missile killing lasers.  IIRC, we could already be using those from Aircraft Carriers- they're one of few mobile platforms that have a big enough powerplant to use one.

 

But the point is that China hasn't perfected their missile yet, either.  Rather than say, "Oh, we're screwed" we should work on our "trace-buster-buster-buster."

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) at April 05, 2013 09:09 AM (/PCJa)

36 Two words: Giant Robots

Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at April 05, 2013 09:09 AM (oBhEo)

37 1 So speculation on future counter-measures beats missiles? Cool. Posted by: weft cut-loop at April 05, 2013 01:06 PM (mN8D3) For years, the USAF spent billions developing supersonic bombers to beat the USSR's SAM's. B-58 Hustler and XB-70 Valkyrie in particular. To counter this, the Russkies spent tons of rubles on supersonic interceptors. When our programs were dumped in favor of stealth and cruise missiles, the Russkies got caught in the lurch. Anyway, Putin!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:09 AM (tqLft)

38 22 PRO TIP: Frickin' sharks dolphins with frickin' laser beams attached to their frickin' heads.

Posted by: Cicero, Semiautomatic Assault Commenter at April 05, 2013 01:06 PM (8ZskC)

 

 

Flippered it for ya.

 

 

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 09:10 AM (pxDth)

39 Carriers are on the verge of obsolescence, but not because of this. Rail guns are on the verge of being viable ship mounted weapons, and the DOD/DOE/DARPA has been balls to the wall on getting next generation nuclear reactors online (btw, there have been serious breakthroughs in this field, as in, passive reactors the size of a semi-truck that can power a city for 50 years and need 0 maintenance). Here is how this works: 1) railgun 2) stealth destroyer/cruiser 3) next gen nuclear reactor 4) can deliver the firepower of an entire aircraft carrier, every few minutes, over the same range. Carriers are still important for prestige, and power projection. But in terms of bringing the fucking fury? Railguns are the future.

Posted by: Hopeless at April 05, 2013 09:10 AM (2CuCY)

40 Rather than say, "Oh, we're screwed" we should work on our "trace-buster-buster-buster."


*awards AllenG 10 AoSHQ credits for "The Big Hit" reference*

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 09:11 AM (GQ8sn)

41 >It's simply a matter of will. Do we as Americans have that will any more? I believe Americans do. But the government has been taken over by dicks who are too busy buying votes with money we should be spending on aircraft carriers.

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:11 AM (8sCoq)

42 I believe the United States' military/industrial complex can accomplish anything. The only thing that can stop it is an asshole President and a shit-for-brains Congress. Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 01:03 PM (8sCoq) So. You're saying we're fucked then?

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Mmmm. Tea. at April 05, 2013 09:11 AM (VtjlW)

43 Two words: Giant Robots

Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at April 05, 2013 01:09 PM (oBhEo)

 

Two more awesome words: Gauss Rifle

Posted by: tsrblke at April 05, 2013 09:11 AM (GaqMa)

44 Forget carriers. Clone an army of Gorns.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:11 AM (tqLft)

45 Two words: Giant Robots *** Heh. I picture China developing some kind of super-inefficient type of marine craft, akin to the leap-frogging warships in Battleship.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 05, 2013 09:12 AM (piMMO)

46 The report says we could also build missile killing lasers, which...yes, yes we should. Because lasers.

_______

Austin Powers was right.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at April 05, 2013 09:12 AM (HDgX3)

47 How will all of this affect Teh Gheys, both in the military and the ones that want to marry.

And there must be a prominent role for the girlie soldiers because self-esteem and stuff.

Posted by: Amanda Marcotte at April 05, 2013 09:12 AM (8ZskC)

48 April 5, 2005 Ace announced his retirement from blogging. Unbeknownst to me, it was a gag. I stopped lurking and made my 1st comment pleading with Ace not to retire. And something about boobs. I don't remember. And that's how it all began.

Posted by: Soothsayer at April 05, 2013 09:12 AM (/eLjI)

49

Even a large ship... is not that big compared to the water around it... and its moving...

 

Which means you need terminal guidance... an active seeker head on the missle itself to do final course corrections.... so.... Electronic Warfare... For teh Win...

 

Also.... its going to be fast, BUT, coming from a high angle (easy to spot on radar)... and coming STRAIGHT at you.... its a simple software fix for even an OLD intercepter missle to hit this thing (the interceptor missle explodes before contact... you just hav to have it explode sooner)...

 

Carriers are not obsolete IMO.... the ability they give for sustained force projection is just too great...

 

And note... if Carriers are so obsolete?  Why is CHINA building them?

Posted by: Romeo13 at April 05, 2013 09:12 AM (lZBBB)

50 *runs around waving arms in the air* What? Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Mmmm. Tea. at April 05, 2013 01:09 PM (VtjlW) did you see spiders on the ceiling? b/c I hate when they go up there.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:12 AM (qPCAa)

51 Not Austin Powers, Dr. Evil.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at April 05, 2013 09:12 AM (HDgX3)

52 I am thinking if we had followed through with Star Wars defense all this would be moot. Democrats killed it. Now, it's catch up. I see space platforms as the new carriers. WTF do you think the mini AF space shuttle is?

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectal at April 05, 2013 09:12 AM (wR+pz)

53 38 22 PRO TIP: Frickin' sharks dolphinswith frickin' laser beams attached to their frickin' heads.
Posted by: Cicero, Semiautomatic Assault Commenter at April 05, 2013 01:06 PM (8ZskC)

But are they GANG-RAPING DOLPHINS!!?!

Posted by: Tex Lovera at April 05, 2013 09:13 AM (wtvvX)

54 Why choose?

Giant  robots  and  Gorn clones.

Posted by: eleven at April 05, 2013 09:13 AM (KXm42)

55 I believe Americans do. But the government has been taken over by dicks who are too busy buying votes with money we should be spending on aircraft carriers. Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 01:11 PM (8sCoq) I'd like to agree with that. But, somewhere around 53% of Americans elect, then re-elect those assholes. (Unless you're seeing a trend in Colorado I'm missing.)

Posted by: jwb7605 (Let It Burn) at April 05, 2013 09:13 AM (Qxe/p)

56 49 And note... if Carriers are so obsolete? Why is CHINA building them? Posted by: Romeo13 at April 05, 2013 01:12 PM (lZBBB) To sell them back to us. Just like every other damned shoddy/dangerous thing we buy from them.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:13 AM (tqLft)

57 >>And that's how it all began.<<


Tell us about the fucking monkeys.  Were they there too Uncle Soothie?

Posted by: Muad'dib at April 05, 2013 09:14 AM (KjlbF)

58 how can I filter my zappos "new style added" alerts so they stop sending me notices of the ugly shoes?

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:14 AM (qPCAa)

59 54 Why choose? Giant robots and Gorn clones. Posted by: eleven at April 05, 2013 01:13 PM (KXm42) Giant. Robotic. Gorns.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:14 AM (tqLft)

60 Posted by: Eaton Cox at April 05, 2013 01:03 PM (q177U)

Asymmetric warfare isn't new, and while it forces changes in planning, it cannot win a war absent the political pressure it creates.

And....where are the guarantees written for big carriers? I wasn't aware that they were built with the expectation that they are invulnerable.

Sure, they can protect themselves very well from most threats, but in a shooting war people get killed and ships get sunk. There's no way around that.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at April 05, 2013 09:14 AM (0zDXv)

61 Now, it's catch up. I see space platforms as the new carriers.

WTF do you think the mini AF space shuttle is?

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectal at April 05, 2013 01:12 PM (wR+pz)

 

My wife (the astrophysicist) tells me that missile armed satellites is apparently "not worth the math." Which I take mean development is not worth it because aiming would be hard to impossible.

I can't speak to laser equipped ones. (Different set of math).

Posted by: tsrblke at April 05, 2013 09:14 AM (GaqMa)

62 >So. You're saying we're fucked then? Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Mmmm. Tea. at April 05, 2013 01:11 PM (VtjlW) for now. We have a President who reacts to threats of nuclear war by going to fund-raisers and attempting to shoot hoops.

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:14 AM (8sCoq)

63 I'm reminded of that SouthPark movie where the General shoots Bill Gates

Posted by: Bigby's Bunny-Ear Fingers at April 05, 2013 09:15 AM (9DE7n)

64 Target Responds to Plus-Size ‘Manatee Grey’ Dress Fiasco http://tinyurl.com/cr85uy4 With bonus manatee video.

Posted by: rickl at April 05, 2013 09:15 AM (zoehZ)

65

Carriers are still important for prestige, and power projection. But in terms of bringing the fucking fury? Railguns are the future.

 

Except that they're not as versatile as aircraft, and their ordinance has less variance in angle-of-attack.  A railgun is never going to be as good as a strafing run.  There's also the CAP/Air Supperiority argument.  A railgun is unlikely to be able to take out an oncoming aircraft, and we found carriers/destroyers/etc. by eye long before we were doing it by radar.

 

Like Drew pointed out- military tech is a cycle.  We thought people wearing metal armor was a thing of the past.  Now our warriors do it fairly regularly (albeit, without the cool plumes and spurs.  And less shiny).

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) at April 05, 2013 09:15 AM (/PCJa)

66 You wanna know how to get China? They pull a knife, you pull a gun. They send one of ours to the hospital, we send one of theirs to the morgue. *That's* the American way! And that's how you get China. Now do you want to do that? Are you ready to do that? I'm offering you a deal. Do you want this deal?

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 05, 2013 09:15 AM (piMMO)

67 And since not everyone is a naval strategy/defense geek...open thread.

I'm pretty sure that most people on the internet are more than qualified to advise the Navy on strategy and weapons systems.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at April 05, 2013 09:15 AM (+lsX1)

68 My concern is that we are at risk from low tech, asymmetrical warfare. I think China would go all Sun Tzu on our ass. I agree with the premise of Drew's article overall, though.

Posted by: Eaton Cox at April 05, 2013 01:03 PM (q177U)

 

While not a Navy guy and not even vaguely acquainted with how the Navy thinks or does things, I'd like to think I have a grasp of the essentials and, for the life of me, have no idea what you mean by '...at risk from low tech, asymmetrical warfare' and '...China would go all Sun Tzu on our ass'.

 

As Liddel-Hart pointed out in his book, 'Strategy', William Tecumseh Sherman went 'all Sun Tzu' on his march to the sea, with no evidence Sherman had ever read Sun Tzu--the point being that there are certain universal principles in military strategy, just as there are universal principles in philosophy and music. Sun Tzu put a few of those principles to paper but those principles were/are still out there, waiting to be applied without benefit of documentation. 

 

Thus, if China goes 'all Sun Tzu on our ass', we can respond by going 'all Sherman' on theirs. Or 'all Washington', or 'all Patton', or all 'Ike'. Screw Sun Tzu. 

Posted by: troyriser at April 05, 2013 09:15 AM (vtiE6)

69 Biggest thing killing defense is out of control personnel spending. Repubs and Dems constantly outbid each other to lavish pay and benefits on veterans. So now Obama has been slashing weapons systems and modernization. The military is slowly being turned into a pensions program with nukes. We either have to control pay and benefits or radically automate systems so we don't have to hire nearly as many sailors and soldiers.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 09:15 AM (ZPrif)

70 >Now, it's catch up. I see space platforms as the new carriers. The US is currently testing a hypersonic aircraft that can close on a target from space at Mach20+

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:16 AM (8sCoq)

71 Target Responds to Plus-Size ‘Manatee Grey’ Dress Fiasco http://tinyurl.com/cr85uy4 With bonus manatee video. Posted by: rickl at April 05, 2013 01:15 PM (zoehZ) Now THAT's a palette cleanser. LOL!

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:16 AM (qPCAa)

72 Giant. Robotic. Gorns.

It's getting sexy in here!

Posted by: Mecha Godzilla at April 05, 2013 09:16 AM (I88Jc)

73 Karate beats Kung Fu. Karate. Train your body.

Posted by: wooga at April 05, 2013 09:17 AM (mi68K)

74 The key takeaway: you don't need to kill the ASBM itself. You need to deny the Chinese what CAPT Wayne Hughes, USN(Ret) calls an "effective shot" (i.e., one that hits the target). Over-the-horizon naval warfare is, inherently, a duel not of missiles and antimissiles, but of information collection, analysis, and dissemination systems. That is where we should focus our key attack and defense efforts.

Posted by: Cobalt Shiva at April 05, 2013 09:17 AM (OY/SZ)

75 did you see spiders on the ceiling? b/c I hate when they go up there.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 01:12 PM (qPCAa)

The worst is when they weave webs on the underside of toilet seats.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at April 05, 2013 09:17 AM (0zDXv)

76 Railguns are great except for the fact that they don't actually work yet. Chickens. Counting. Hatched. Don't.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 09:17 AM (ZPrif)

77 >>The US is currently testing a hypersonic aircraft that can close on a target from space at Mach20+<<


Is that the one that keep 'sploding every time they test it?

Posted by: Muad'dib at April 05, 2013 09:17 AM (KjlbF)

78

 And since not everyone is a naval strategy/defense geek...open thread.

Does playing Battleship count?

Posted by: Javems at April 05, 2013 09:17 AM (nTgAI)

79 The primary mission of aircraft carriers is not to project force, but too emphasize the contributions made to shipbuilding by the Arabic culture.

Posted by: Lincolntf at April 05, 2013 09:17 AM (ZshNr)

80 The worst is when they weave webs on the underside of toilet seats. Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at April 05, 2013 01:17 PM (0zDXv) Oh no no.. uncalled for. seriously uncalled for.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:17 AM (qPCAa)

81 I can't speak to laser equipped ones. (Different set of math).


Three words:  source programmable guidance.

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 09:18 AM (GQ8sn)

82 Why is the Air Force doing the Navy's work?



Sequester.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at April 05, 2013 09:18 AM (da5Wo)

83 Jehmu Green, of course, defending the Plan B pill for kids ruling.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 05, 2013 09:18 AM (piMMO)

84 " size" = side....

Posted by: sexypig at April 05, 2013 09:18 AM (dZQh7)

85 Thus, if China goes 'all Sun Tzu on our ass', we can respond by going 'all Sherman' on theirs. Or 'all Washington', or 'all Patton', or all 'Ike'.Screw Sun Tzu.

-----

Conan

Crushed enemies
see them driven
lamentations of the women


..... some dis-assemblage required.

Posted by: fixerupper at April 05, 2013 09:19 AM (nELVU)

86 The primary mission of aircraft carriers is not to project force, but too emphasize the contributions made to shipbuilding by the Arabic culture. *** It's a form of Muslim outreach.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 05, 2013 09:19 AM (piMMO)

87 The US is currently testing a hypersonic aircraft that can close on a target from space at Mach20+ Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 01:16 PM (8sCoq) Sounds OK as long as they're shooting something going Mach21. Our pilots in Vietnam had to be careful conducting strafing runs in a powered dive -- they occasionally outran the bullets and took damage as a result.

Posted by: jwb7605 (Let It Burn) at April 05, 2013 09:19 AM (Qxe/p)

88 Notwithstanding the fact that Chinese guidance systems have not been sufficiently tested (yes I know they were largely stolen and cloned, but have u ever owned a Chinese mad watch?), but why would anyone ever surrender arguably the most effective battle space to a weapon innovation.

Unless it was part of the ruse to freeze the Chinese in their current development cycle and not further innovate. Then have them pour energy into another space.

See what I did there genius?

Posted by: Marcus at April 05, 2013 09:19 AM (VDNo2)

89 no worries, we have the top brainiacs in control of our destiny. kerry , hagel, 

c'mon at least hillary is now  drinking at home!

Posted by: willow at April 05, 2013 09:19 AM (nqBYe)

90 >>>Let's send them our judges on a raft.


Too commie even for us. Do. Not. Want.

Posted by: Chi-Coms at April 05, 2013 09:19 AM (voeac)

91 Screw all these carriers. China can be effectively countered by a single Powers Boothe, provided you also include booze, fire, and teenage girls.

Posted by: wooga at April 05, 2013 09:20 AM (mi68K)

92 One    sailor's    aircraft    carrier    is    another    fella's    cruise    ship.

Posted by: Reggie Love at April 05, 2013 09:20 AM (wIgpo)

93 82 Why is the Air Force doing the Navy's work? Sequester. Posted by: BCochran1981 at April 05, 2013 01:18 PM (da5Wo) Sea-Quester (DSV)

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:20 AM (tqLft)

94 @79 ROFL. Awesome.

Posted by: sexypig at April 05, 2013 09:20 AM (dZQh7)

95 I have wondered if China  is using  the norks to check our boundaries?


Posted by: willow at April 05, 2013 09:20 AM (nqBYe)

96 China can be effectively countered by a single Powers Boothe, provided you also include booze, fire, and teenage girls.

Ummm...China was our ally in that movie.

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 09:20 AM (GQ8sn)

97 The primary mission of aircraft carriers is not to project force, but too emphasize the contributions made to shipbuilding by the Arabic culture.


You know camel called Ship of the Desert?  That was ours. Every one, filled with Arab seamen.

Posted by: Hassan al-Goatfuck at April 05, 2013 09:21 AM (8ZskC)

98

I'm pretty sure that most people on the internet are more than qualified to advise the Navy on strategy and weapons systems.

 


 

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at April 05, 2013 01:15 PM (+lsX1)

 

 

Sadly?  With the current crop of PC Admirals?  and their Green "Force for Good" Agenda???

 

You may be right.....

 

(says the Ret. USN guy, who used to work directly for an Admiral...).

Posted by: Romeo13 at April 05, 2013 09:21 AM (lZBBB)

99 >Sounds OK as long as they're shooting something going Mach21. no. it attacks ground targets. The thing flies up into space, then comes screaming down at mach20+ at the target, and by the time you detect it you're already blowing up.

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:21 AM (8sCoq)

100 Posted by: BCochran1981 at April 05, 2013 01:18 PM (da5Wo) did your stuff get mailed yet?

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:21 AM (qPCAa)

101 Also, when that Chinese sub popped up unannounced inside one of our carrier groups...did we ever find out if that was blind luck or not?

Posted by: sexypig at April 05, 2013 09:21 AM (dZQh7)

102 72 Giant. Robotic. Gorns. It's getting sexy in here! Posted by: Mecha Godzilla at April 05, 2013 01:16 PM (I88Jc) Giant. Robotic. Kirks...

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:22 AM (tqLft)

103 I plan to clean my naval...then knit a sweater with the lint I pull out.

Posted by: Tilikum the Killer Assault Whale at April 05, 2013 09:22 AM (uhftQ)

104 Ummm...China was our ally in that movie.

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 01:20 PM (GQ8sn)




Funny how shit changes, isn't it?

Posted by: The Taliban at April 05, 2013 09:22 AM (da5Wo)

105 We should have flying aircraft carriers, scratch that, orbiting carriers by now.

Posted by: SpongeBob Saget at April 05, 2013 09:22 AM (epxV4)

106 palate cleanser artist's palette a pallet of bricks

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:22 AM (8sCoq)

107 It's simply a matter of will. Do we as Americans have that will any more? We elected, then reelected Obama. Does that answer your question?

Posted by: blaster at April 05, 2013 09:22 AM (pZDxu)

108 no. it attacks ground targets. The thing flies up into space, then comes screaming down at mach20+ at the target, and by the time you detect it you're already blowing up.


So it's a ballistic missile then?

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 09:22 AM (GQ8sn)

109 Posted by: Lincolntf at April 05, 2013 01:17 PM (ZshNr)

And....we are done here.

Game, set and match to Lincolntf

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at April 05, 2013 09:23 AM (0zDXv)

110

Exactly. There is usually a huge gap between what China's weapons R&D folk promise and what the completed systems deliver.

Anyone who thinks the Navy doesn't pay attention to missile defense of those bird farms hasn't paid attention to the last forty years going back to the R&D of the original Aegis-class ships.

Posted by: SGT Dan's Cat at April 05, 2013 09:23 AM (jCQ+I)

111 do i want to google  gorns or kirks, i bet not.

Posted by: willow at April 05, 2013 09:23 AM (nqBYe)

112 did your stuff get mailed yet?

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 01:21 PM (qPCAa)




No. No it most decidedly did not. And apparently we're scrapping even the effort to get it set up until Monday.



I really, really, really need a drink.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at April 05, 2013 09:23 AM (da5Wo)

113 Also, when that Chinese sub popped up unannounced inside one of our carrier groups...did we ever find out if that was blind luck or not?

Posted by: sexypig at April 05, 2013 01:21 PM (dZQh7)


----


Water displacement......  I saw that slanty eyed guy on Battleship do it to the aliens.

Posted by: fixerupper at April 05, 2013 09:23 AM (nELVU)

114 105 We should have flying aircraft carriers, scratch that, orbiting carriers by now. Posted by: SpongeBob Saget at April 05, 2013 01:22 PM (epxV4) Captain Scarlet had them years ago.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:23 AM (tqLft)

115 There is no hyper-sonic aircraft. There is a hypersonic missile that's been tested. And it's never worked and all the tests have failed catastrophically. And they don't know why. Also it'll be a crazy-expensive weapon and rarely used. If it ever works.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 09:23 AM (ZPrif)

116 No need to drag the monkeys into this.

Posted by: Soothsayer at April 05, 2013 09:23 AM (b8TXQ)

117 > So it's a ballistic missile then? Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 01:22 PM (GQ8sn) no, it's remotely piloted

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:24 AM (8sCoq)

118 Exactly. There is usually a huge gap between what China's weapons RD folk promise and what the completed systems deliver.


True.

Posted by: Wal-Mart at April 05, 2013 09:24 AM (8ZskC)

119 But GAY RIGHTS!!!!

Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 09:24 AM (xmcEQ)

120 Besides, warfare is more a test of wills than weaponry. Clear, effective righteous leadership and an unreserved posture to completely annihilate your enemy always wins. Always.

Which is seriously why China and the NorKs are testing this President and so far they are chortling like schoolgirls.

Posted by: Marcus at April 05, 2013 09:24 AM (VDNo2)

121 did hillary  send any more of our secrets to china as she went out the door?

Posted by: willow at April 05, 2013 09:24 AM (nqBYe)

122 >And it's never worked and all the tests have failed catastrophically. And they don't know why. Also it'll be a crazy-expensive weapon and rarely used. If it ever works. Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 01:23 PM (ZPrif) except it kinda worked last week

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:24 AM (8sCoq)

123 no, it's remotely piloted

Ballistic drone missile?

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 09:24 AM (GQ8sn)

124 palate cleanser artist's palette a pallet of bricks Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 01:22 PM (8sCoq) thanks Jones in CO. now do affect/effect.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:24 AM (qPCAa)

125 Our pilots in Vietnam had to be careful conducting strafing runs in a powered dive -- they occasionally outran the bullets and took damage as a result.

Posted by: jwb7605 (Let It Burn) at April 05, 2013 01:19 PM (Qxe/p)

 

 

*******

 

Okay, color me skeptical.  So  are you saying that   an airplane fired a bullet, then flew fast enough to catch up with and pass the bullet, and then the bullet caught up with the plane and inflicted damage?   Can somebody on this smart military blog explain the physics of this?

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 09:25 AM (pxDth)

126 105 We should have flying aircraft carriers, scratch that, orbiting carriers by now. Posted by: SpongeBob Saget at April 05, 2013 01:22 PM (epxV4) Also USS Akron and USS Macon, but those were failures...

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:25 AM (tqLft)

127 Our secret weapon in a war with the Chinese is the Japanese sex-bot with a built-in IED.

Posted by: Fritz at April 05, 2013 09:25 AM (WM+rJ)

128 OT:  MORON HERD ASSISTANCE REQUIRED

My mind is blank today.  It's Friday.

Please give me whatever input you can.  I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief.

Thank you for your time and consideration.

Posted by: Herr Morgenholz at April 05, 2013 09:25 AM (imJLZ)

129 Besides, warfare is more a test of wills than weaponry. Clear, effective righteous leadership and an unreserved posture to completely annihilate your enemy always wins. Always.

----

Oh..... really.

Posted by: The Japanese Empire - Cira 1945 at April 05, 2013 09:25 AM (nELVU)

130 We're going to have President Obama throw basketballs at the incoming missiles.  He's assured us he's a pro, so no problems will occur.

Posted by: The Pentagon at April 05, 2013 09:25 AM (B/VB5)

131 Okay, color me skeptical. So are you saying that an airplane fired a bullet, then flew fast enough to catch up with and pass the bullet, and then the bullet caught up with the plane and inflicted damage? Can somebody on this smart military blog explain the physics of this?

Bullets start to slow down after they clear the muzzle.

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 09:26 AM (GQ8sn)

132 Saks? Seriously, Saks? My, my..., we are  moving upscale.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at April 05, 2013 09:26 AM (aDwsi)

133 And, as if the news out of Nork wasn't awesome enough...Russia recently practiced bombing runs against US Missile Defense in Asia.



http://freebeacon.com/russian-bomber-roulette/

Posted by: BCochran1981 at April 05, 2013 09:26 AM (da5Wo)

134

No, no, no. Leftists have been telling us for decades that shooting down incoming missiles can never be accomplished. Right from the early days of SDI, they've insisted that there cannot ever be an effective missile defense system and they're really, really smart (they keep telling us). So, we should just stop having aircraft carriers at all since China has this new missile.

 

Hey, wait a minute... isn't China, right now, in the process of building their own carriers?  But don't they know how outdated carriers are since they're the ones that built the missile that makes them obsolete? I wonder why they haven't noticed that.

Posted by: MLCross at April 05, 2013 09:26 AM (taib7)

135 126 Can somebody on this smart military blog explain the physics of this? Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 01:25 PM (pxDth) Not sure about the bullets, but depending on the placement of the shell ejector chute, the jet intake could suck up the shells and there's your damage. Outrunning the bullets? That sounds dubious.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:26 AM (tqLft)

136 inept and imprecise decisions?

Posted by: willow at April 05, 2013 09:26 AM (nqBYe)

137 My mind is blank today. It's Friday.

Please give me whatever input you can. I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief.

Thank you for your time and consideration.

Posted by: Herr Morgenholz at April 05, 2013 01:25 PM (imJLZ)

 

"Highly irregular circumstance."

"Event with a low probability of a good outcome."

Posted by: tsrblke at April 05, 2013 09:26 AM (GaqMa)

138 I believe the United States' military/industrial complex can accomplish anything. The only thing that can stop it is an asshole President and a shit-for-brains Congress.

 Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 01:03 PM


Really can't say much more than that, other than double the emphasis on asshole president

Posted by: Berserker at April 05, 2013 09:26 AM (FMbng)

139 I really, really, really need a drink. Posted by: BCochran1981 at April 05, 2013 01:23 PM (da5Wo) Well it IS Friday! And it's after noon! So I think you are in the clear. Let me check to the AoSHQ lifestyle handbook to see what you should be drinking in this situation... brb.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:26 AM (qPCAa)

140 I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief.


"SCOAMF"

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 09:26 AM (GQ8sn)

141 >I'm pretty sure that most people on the internet are more than qualified to advise the Navy on strategy and weapons systems.<

I think you would be surprised at who is commenting.

It's not always some guy wearing pajamas and eating microwave food in mom's basements

Posted by: Marcus at April 05, 2013 09:27 AM (VDNo2)

142

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 01:25 PM (pxDth)

 

Planes are still under thrust.... and maybe accelerating as they dive...

 

Bullets are at max verlocity when they leave the barrel, and start to decelerate due to the resistance of the air...

Posted by: Romeo13 at April 05, 2013 09:27 AM (lZBBB)

143 Okay, color me skeptical. So are you saying that an airplane fired a bullet, then flew fast enough to catch up with and pass the bullet, *** I'm gonna take a shot and say that they didn't pass the bullets, but rather ran into them, doing damage to the front of the plane.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 05, 2013 09:27 AM (piMMO)

144 128 Our secret weapon in a war with the Chinese is the Japanese sex-bot with a built-in IED. Posted by: Fritz at April 05, 2013 01:25 PM (WM+rJ) I think you mean "built-in I.U.D."

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:27 AM (tqLft)

145 Have the brilliant commanders established ROE for a North Korean conflict?

Posted by: jwb7605 (Let It Burn) at April 05, 2013 09:27 AM (Qxe/p)

146 Also, how will we combat Global Warming without aircraft carriers?

Posted by: Fritz at April 05, 2013 09:27 AM (WM+rJ)

147 132 Okay, color me skeptical. So are you saying that an airplane fired a
bullet, then flew fast enough to catch up with and pass the bullet, and
then the bullet caught up with the plane and inflicted damage? Can
somebody on this smart military blog explain the physics of this?

Bullets start to slow down after they clear the muzzle.
Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 01:26 PM
==========

There have problems in the past (particularly with jets) over runing their own fire.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at April 05, 2013 09:27 AM (aDwsi)

148 A single shot railgun is not a weapons system. When I say they don't work yet. I mean -- they don't work. You have to be able to fire many, many times in a row. You have to be able to supply the energy quickly for repeat shots. The rail itself has to last for many, many shots. Railguns do not work at this moment. They are non-functional as a weapons system. Hopefully that will change.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 09:28 AM (ZPrif)

149 >>Please give me whatever input you can. I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief.<<


charlie foxtrot

debacle

SNAFU

train wreck

Fiasco

Posted by: Muad'dib at April 05, 2013 09:28 AM (KjlbF)

150 Ace used to put up a post once in a while inviting lurkers to comment. He hasnt done it a long time.

Posted by: Soothsayer at April 05, 2013 09:28 AM (b8TXQ)

151 "Please give me whatever input you can. I need a word for 'clusterfuck' that can be used in a legal brief." Chinese Fire Drill.

Posted by: Cobalt Shiva at April 05, 2013 09:28 AM (OY/SZ)

152
fluster cuck????

Two words.... I know.... but....

Posted by: fixerupper at April 05, 2013 09:28 AM (nELVU)

153 http://freebeacon.com/russian-bomber-roulette/

Posted by: BCochran1981 at April 05, 2013 01:26 PM (da5Wo)


oh yeah, and here i thought the world would adore us because, obama.


and inviting the world to be fellow citizens. and no more sovereignty just UN helping us all decide how to love one another.

Posted by: willow at April 05, 2013 09:28 AM (nqBYe)

154 Look, this missile is no BFD.

All they need to do is blast warning shots from both barrels of a shotgun into the water in front of the ship.

It'll work like a charm.

Posted by: Joe Biden at April 05, 2013 09:29 AM (voeac)

155
If their missiles fly
Like their drivers drive
Where they land
Cannot be planned

Posted by: Electric Chopstick at April 05, 2013 09:29 AM (Opo0Q)

156 Once those Chinese see our lunar colony and our nuclear-powered aircraft, they'll just surrender, right???

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at April 05, 2013 09:29 AM (mN8D3)

157 . B-58 Hustler and XB-70 Valkyrie in particular. To counter this, the Russkies spent tons of rubles on supersonic interceptors. When our programs were dumped in favor of stealth and cruise missiles, the Russkies got caught in the lurch. They were TRYING to get us to dump the programs. We got played by a handful of "special" Mig-25's that were lightened, hotrodded, and stripped to the max...so much so that they were never even intended to land - they even had drop away landing gear to reduce weight, and engines that were so stressed, they only'd last for one flight before falling apart. The con worked. The "specials" were seen doing incredible things, and we canceled the programs because the previously untouchable bombers were touchable. Configured for actual deployable use the Mig-25 was far less impressive and wasn't capable of touching the XB-70.

Posted by: @PurpAv at April 05, 2013 09:29 AM (/gHaE)

158 Imbroglio for "clusterfuck". I used it once in an E-mail and half a dozen people came to my desk to ask what it meant.

Posted by: Lincolntf at April 05, 2013 09:29 AM (ZshNr)

159 Please give me whatever input you can. I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief. Thank you for your time and consideration. Posted by: Herr Morgenholz at April 05, 2013 01:25 PM (imJLZ) fracas, pileup, misadventure, calamity! I like the last one personally.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:29 AM (qPCAa)

160 Railguns do not work at this moment. They are non-functional as a weapons system.

Hopefully that will change.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 01:28 PM (ZPrif)

 

Ahh, I see, weapons system got it.

See the scientist in me went "but they do work! Just not really well."

If memory serves they mounted one of these to a cruiser somewhere as part of a test.  But yeah, not really up to "weapons system" level yet.

Posted by: tsrblke at April 05, 2013 09:29 AM (GaqMa)

161 Have the brilliant commanders established ROE for a North Korean conflict?

Posted by: jwb7605 (Let It Burn) at April 05, 2013 01:27 PM (Qxe/p)


----


Hold your fire till you see the whites of their eyes.....


... wait...wut?

Posted by: fixerupper at April 05, 2013 09:29 AM (nELVU)

162 My mind is blank today. It's Friday.

Please give me whatever input you can. I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief.

Thank you for your time and consideration.

Posted by: Herr Morgenholz at April 05, 2013 01:25 PM (imJLZ)



Monkeys fucking a football?

Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 09:29 AM (xmcEQ)

163 reckless endangerment

Posted by: willow at April 05, 2013 09:29 AM (nqBYe)

164 >now do affect/effect. Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 01:24 PM (qPCAa) I thought this comment would affect me in some way. That depends on what the desired effect was.

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:30 AM (8sCoq)

165 145 128 Our secret weapon in a war with the Chinese is the Japanese sex-bot with a built-in IED.
Posted by: Fritz at April 05, 2013 01:25 PM (WM+rJ)


I think you mean "built-in I.U.D."

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 01:27 PM
============

I'm thinking that we just ship Un a boatload of cakes sweetened with refined sugar. I mean, we all know how deadly that stuff is...

Posted by: Mike Hammer at April 05, 2013 09:30 AM (aDwsi)

166 oh. go with imbroglio.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:30 AM (qPCAa)

167

>> Please give me whatever input you can. I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief.<<

 

 

Bidened.

Posted by: Cicero Kid at April 05, 2013 09:30 AM (iT7+e)

168 Imbroglio for "clusterfuck". I used it once in an E-mail and half a dozen people came to my desk to ask what it meant. **** So, too lazy to look it up, they'd rather walk to your office to admit their ignorance. Sounds about right for an office setting.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 05, 2013 09:30 AM (piMMO)

169 You imperialist running dogs afraid of China? Fear me, more. I have nuke now. Kill you long time. I give you till Wednesday to get off this blog before I pull string.

Posted by: Kim Jong-un [/i] at April 05, 2013 09:30 AM (feFL6)

170 Exactly. There is usually a huge gap between what China's weapons RD folk promise and what the completed systems deliver. How would we know? We don't teach physics or engineering to anybody who can pass a security clearance.

Posted by: AmishDude at April 05, 2013 09:30 AM (T0NGe)

171 Holy Crap Death Wish marathon on AMC

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:30 AM (8sCoq)

172 OT: MORON HERD ASSISTANCE REQUIRED

My mind is blank today. It's Friday.

Please give me whatever input you can. I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief.

Thank you for your time and consideration.

Posted by: Herr Morgenholz

***

 

Obama

Posted by: Tilikum the Killer Assault Whale at April 05, 2013 09:30 AM (uhftQ)

173 I thought this comment would affect me in some way. That depends on what the desired effect was. Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 01:30 PM (8sCoq) *claps* do emigrant/immigrant!

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:30 AM (qPCAa)

174 With bonus manatee video. Posted by: rickl at April 05, 2013 01:15 PM (zoehZ) I will admit that my response to this whole thing is yaaaaay manatees!

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Mmmm. Tea. at April 05, 2013 09:31 AM (VtjlW)

175 charlie foxtrot

debacle

SNAFU

train wreck

Fiasco


Yes..I think fiasco is the pants on version of clusterfuck.

Posted by: eleven at April 05, 2013 09:31 AM (KXm42)

176 158 Posted by: @PurpAv at April 05, 2013 01:29 PM (/gHaE) Appreciate the correction. Too bad about the XB-70; the technology could've been useful for commercial SST development. The Hustler was supposed to be a dud. Allegedly, the airframe at the time costs more than its weight in gold.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:31 AM (tqLft)

177 Please give me whatever input you can. I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief.

Posted by: Herr Morgenholz

I believe the term of art is "catastrophic failure"

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at April 05, 2013 09:31 AM (mN8D3)

178 I'm gonna take a shot and say that they didn't pass the bullets, but rather ran into them, doing damage to the front of the plane. Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 05, 2013 01:27 PM (piMMO) Yes. That, too. Poorly worded on my part. Bullets slowed down (no longer being "pushed"), but aircraft did occasionally pass them and took damage on the "pull out of dive" maneuver.

Posted by: jwb7605 (Let It Burn) at April 05, 2013 09:31 AM (Qxe/p)

179 From a website:


Imbroglio is excellent as well. And I can imagine this conversation, which pleases me.

This has turned into quite the imbroglio.

Whats imbroglio mean?

Oh, you know. Clusterfuck.

Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 09:31 AM (xmcEQ)

180 >Please give me whatever input you can. I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief.<< kerfuffle hornet's nest SNAFU

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:31 AM (8sCoq)

181 How would we know?

We don't teach physics or engineering to anybody who can pass a security clearance.

Posted by: AmishDude at April 05, 2013 01:30 PM (T0NGe)[/I

 

 

Yeah on behalf of my wife, I'm going to take that as a personal insult.

Posted by: tsrblke at April 05, 2013 09:31 AM (GaqMa)

182 OT: MORON HERD ASSISTANCE REQUIREDMy mind is blank today. It's Friday.Please give me whatever input you can. I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief.Thank you for your time and consideration. Posted by: Herr Morgenholz Liberalism, Progressivism, Socialism. JISM...

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:31 AM (tqLft)

183 Also railgun projectiles will have to be guided. Currently the tests only fire hunks of metal. This is not what the Navy wants. There is an R&D program to design and build a GPS-guided projectile that can survive the acceleration of a railgun launch. Currently non exists. The decades long trend is towards ever greater precision. The US military won't be going back to the days of mass unguided projectile volleys.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 09:32 AM (ZPrif)

184 Configured for actual deployable use the Mig-25 was far less impressive and wasn't capable of touching the XB-70.

 

 

Posted by: @PurpAv at April 05, 2013 01:29 PM (/gHaE)

 

 

That.... and was it the Buffalo Bomber?  the one we thought the Soviets had THOUSANDS of?  when they had 3, and those didn't fly correctly?

 

But we were so scared of them we changed the designs of interceptors?

Posted by: Romeo13 at April 05, 2013 09:32 AM (lZBBB)

185 165 >now do affect/effect.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 01:24 PM (qPCAa)


I thought this comment would affect me in some way. That depends on what the desired effect was. Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 01:30 PM
=============

I just dropped in to see what condition my condition was in...

Posted by: Kenny Rogers at April 05, 2013 09:32 AM (aDwsi)

186 Bullets start to slow down after they clear the muzzle.

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 01:26 PM (GQ8sn)

----------------------------------

I'm gonna take a shot and say that they didn't pass the bullets, but rather ran into them, doing damage to the front of the plane.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at April 05, 2013 01:27 PM (piMMO)

 

*********

 

So, okay, but when the bullet catches up with the plane, or the plane catches up with the bullet,  I'm thinking  the relative speed would be pretty low, so the chance of taking damage would be minuscule.  Also, the chance that there would not be some small angular difference in the relative trajectories, the likelihood of them actually occupying the same physical space downrange would also be minuscule.

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 09:32 AM (pxDth)

187 I say build Zepplins for combined arms use with our cavalry. If all else fails fall back to the maginot line and fire mustard gas.

Posted by: ALittleEnglish at April 05, 2013 09:32 AM (VDsQI)

188 The Hustler was supposed to be a dud.

You Morons all liked it well enough when you were 14.

Posted by: Larry Flynt at April 05, 2013 09:32 AM (B/VB5)

189 fluster cuck???? Two words.... I know.... but.... Posted by: fixerupper at April 05, 2013 01:28 PM (nELVU) fuster cluck is when your hens start fighting over who gets next shot at the rooster.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:32 AM (qPCAa)

190 Yeah on behalf of my wife, I'm going to take that as a personal insult. Oh, OK, maybe a handful. But mostly we tell American students that math is good for nothing and they should do more ***** studies.

Posted by: AmishDude at April 05, 2013 09:33 AM (T0NGe)

191 Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 01:31 PM (xmcEQ) Steve Miller had a spacey electro-instrumental called "ElectroLux Imbroglio."

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:33 AM (tqLft)

192 (CNN) -- China announced Sunday that it had landed a fighter jet on the deck of an aircraft carrier for the first time, but it may be years before the ship is fully operational. China's "first generation multi-purpose carrier-borne fighter jet," known as the J-15, successfully completed its first landing on the Liaoning, an aircraft carrier China built using an abandoned Soviet hull, according to China's official news agency Xinhua. The J-15's capabilities are comparable to the Russian Su-33 jet and the U.S. F-18, Xinhua reported. The Chinese-designed jet can "carry multi-type anti-ship, air-to-air and air-to-ground missiles, as well as precision-guided bombs, the report said. ******* That's a report from 11/25/2012 Thus thus became a "craze" in China-- PICTURES ‘Aircraft Carrier Style’ Chinese Internet Meme Goes Viral by Fauna on Thursday, November 29, 2012 http://www.chinasmack.com/2012/pictures/aircra ft-carrier-style-chinese-internet-meme-goes- viral.html (resolve the gaps)

Posted by: tasker at April 05, 2013 09:33 AM (r2PLg)

193 188 I say build Zepplins for combined arms use with our cavalry. If all else fails fall back to the maginot line and fire mustard gas. Posted by: ALittleEnglish at April 05, 2013 01:32 PM (VDsQI) Trebuchet!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:33 AM (tqLft)

194 >How would we know?

We don't teach physics or engineering to anybody who can pass a security clearance.

Posted by: AmishDude at April 05, 2013 01:30 PM (T0NGe)<

What?

You mean an Art History or Sociology Major can't work on a nuke?

WTF.

It's frankly just sad how dumb people in this country have largely become.



Posted by: Marcus at April 05, 2013 09:34 AM (VDNo2)

195 I think the Nork military would defect if we just filmed an episode of BBQ Pit Masters on the border.

Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 09:34 AM (xmcEQ)

196 Monkeys fucking a football?

Posted by: © Sponge

***

 

Got any videos of that? For research purposes of course.

Posted by: Tilikum the Killer Assault Whale at April 05, 2013 09:34 AM (uhftQ)

197 189 The Hustler was supposed to be a dud. You Morons all liked it well enough when you were 14. Posted by: Larry Flynt at April 05, 2013 01:32 PM (B/VB5) I built the one from Revell. The Lindberg one sucked. Oh, wait a minute...

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:34 AM (tqLft)

198

Leftists have been telling us for decades that shooting down incoming missiles can never be accomplished.

 

That's because the Soviets were scared shitless that we might develop this capability. So the KGB put out the word to oppose it through demonstrations and claims that it would never work.

 

See also our missles in Europe to counter SS-20s. Numbnuts following orders originating in Moscow were protesting against outgoing missles, but had no problem with Soviet incoming ones.

 

The rot runs deep, my friends.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at April 05, 2013 09:34 AM (IDSI7)

199 Thus *this* became a "craze" in China--

Posted by: tasker at April 05, 2013 09:34 AM (r2PLg)

200 I was working at a bookstore/local publisher at the time. The imbroglio was over where on the retail floor we would keep the Crossword puzzle books. Literally took a month of meetings to get the people involved to drop their petty squabbles and realize that it didn't fucking matter.

Posted by: Lincolntf at April 05, 2013 09:34 AM (ZshNr)

201 I'm thinking the relative speed would be pretty low, so the chance of taking damage would be minuscule.

It doesn't take many of them going into the jet intake to ruin your whole day though, regardless of relative velocity.

I'd like to see actual reports on what the mode of damage was though.

Posted by: Ian S. at April 05, 2013 09:35 AM (B/VB5)

202 well, as long as the carriers are manned with longbows, I don't see how we can lose.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:35 AM (qPCAa)

203 Why was there no link dump today?  There threads all smell like ass.

Posted by: Captain Hate at April 05, 2013 09:35 AM (twIz7)

204 >do emigrant/immigrant! Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 01:30 PM (qPCAa) He left his home country as an emigrant. He landed in the US as an immigrant.

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:35 AM (8sCoq)

205 Fuck!  TheSe threads all smell like ass.

Posted by: Captain Hate at April 05, 2013 09:35 AM (twIz7)

206 196 I think the Nork military would defect if we just filmed an episode of BBQ Pit Masters on the border. Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 01:34 PM (xmcEQ) ______________ Some of them are already defecting to China. China sends them back. It's leading some to speculate that Junior is having some troubles.

Posted by: tasker at April 05, 2013 09:35 AM (r2PLg)

207

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 01:32 PM (pxDth)

 

Sucking a piece of Lead into a Jet Engine, is considered a BAD thing by pilots for some reason....

Posted by: Romeo13 at April 05, 2013 09:35 AM (lZBBB)

208 I was working at a bookstore/local publisher at the time. The imbroglio was over where on the retail floor we would keep the Crossword puzzle books. Literally took a month of meetings to get the people involved to drop their petty squabbles and realize that it didn't fucking matter. Posted by: Lincolntf at April 05, 2013 01:34 PM (ZshNr) *rethinks lifelong dream to retire and work in a bookstore*

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:35 AM (qPCAa)

209 184 Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 01:32 PM (ZPrif) Guided gravity weapon dropped from low earth orbit. Supposed to drill through 500 feet of granite or concrete. Looks like a large titanium telephone pole.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:36 AM (tqLft)

210 We need everything at our disposal. Why be under-prepared?

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at April 05, 2013 09:36 AM (XYSwB)

211 You use off the shelf parts. Made in China! Win Win!

Posted by: Zombie Mousie Tongue at April 05, 2013 09:36 AM (HiKk0)

212 You want nuclear scientists?

We can't even engineer a decent comment function that actually works the same with each browser.

Posted by: Marcus at April 05, 2013 09:36 AM (VDNo2)

213  April 10 2013?
Dear sirs and Madam's I'm sorry to inform you of our news, we are facing a coming together  of countries as never seen before it is magnificent .


China has taken Tawain  and Japan. and Russia has taken back all the insignificant countries on Her borders.

finally  we shall all live in harmony .

 do not be alarmed we have pass'd the amnesty plan,  abortificants for children, and property rights to the children . we are well on our way to proclaiming you may be have/anything you want at alice's restaurant.

Posted by: willow at April 05, 2013 09:36 AM (nqBYe)

214 Why was there no link dump today? There threads all smell like ass. Posted by: Captain Hate at April 05, 2013 01:35 PM (twIz7) ace realized we were reading all the good stories before he could get around to posting about them.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:37 AM (qPCAa)

215 My wife (the astrophysicist) tells me that missile armed satellites is apparently "not worth the math." Which I take mean development is not worth it because aiming would be hard to impossible. She's right. More than just aiming, you have to build, and place in orbit a launch system that can't be maintained, or upgraded, and has to work perfectly for years all on it's own. Then, when you desperately need it, it's over India, instead of China. Ground, and ship based systems can be placed where they're needed, when they're needed. You can't do that with a satellite.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at April 05, 2013 09:37 AM (eyJh9)

216 >Some of them are already defecting to China. China sends them back. Just like no Arab country wants the palestinians

Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 09:37 AM (8sCoq)

217 188 I say build Zepplins for combined arms use with our cavalry. If all else fails fall back to the maginot line and fire mustard gas. Posted by: ALittleEnglish at April 05, 2013 01:32 PM (VDsQ) ************* Jeebus they are doing some blimp stuff, where the heck did I see that?

Posted by: tasker at April 05, 2013 09:38 AM (r2PLg)

218 Some of them are already defecting to China.

China sends them back.

It's leading some to speculate that Junior is having some troubles.

Posted by: tasker at April 05, 2013 01:35 PM (r2PLg)



They don't want a war.  They know he's a crazed lunatic.  They just want to eat.

China has no room.  That and they give a fuck about people.

Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 09:38 AM (xmcEQ)

219 184 Also railgun projectiles will have to be guided. Currently the tests only fire hunks of metal. This is not what the Navy wants. There is an R&D program to design and build a GPS-guided projectile that can survive the acceleration of a railgun launch. Currently non exists.

The decades long trend is towards ever greater precision. The US military won't be going back to the days of mass unguided projectile volleys. Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 01:32 PM
============

True. M712 Copperhead has been around a while, for example. All very scary stuff, given that the location of the source of a projectile can now be targeted while it is still in flight. Which is to say, if you fire something, you have a very brief time to get moved before you are a pin-pointed target.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at April 05, 2013 09:38 AM (aDwsi)

220 American Sailor have IPhone on board. Made in China. Phone calls home. Win Win.

Posted by: Zombie Mousie Tongue at April 05, 2013 09:38 AM (HiKk0)

221 We can't even engineer a decent comment function that actually works the same with each browser.

FIFY.

Posted by: Ian S. at April 05, 2013 09:38 AM (B/VB5)

222 *rethinks lifelong dream to retire and work in a bookstore* Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 01:35 PM (qPCAa) Hehe. Watch Black Books, it's like a sadist running the bookstore. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0262150/?ref_=sr_1

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at April 05, 2013 09:39 AM (XYSwB)

223 Railguns show a lot of promise. I hope they work. But there are still many, many hurdles to overcome. Personally I think laser weapons are much closer to actually being fielded. Biggest 3 technical challenges right now are probably 1) A rail that can survive hundreds or thousands of firings. 2) And ship-based energy system that can provide that huge amounts of energy required. This is a big reason DDG-1000 went to all electric drive -- so power can be flexibly routed to future weapons systems like lasers and railguns. 3) A guided projectile that can survive a railgun launch. I think #2 might be the biggest problem. It's not clear if our current fleet inventory can ever be retrofitted with power systems capable of powering railguns. So when we finally perfect it, they will likely only be feasible on new build ships. Great thing about missiles is they carry their own power and can be put on nearly any ship with space.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 09:39 AM (ZPrif)

224 er, leave me alone to amuse myself and i can't see the difference between glee and tears.

Posted by: willow at April 05, 2013 09:39 AM (nqBYe)

225 18 O’Rourke said the U.S. Air Force has already “taken [China’s] kill chains apart to the ‘nth’ degree.”

Why is the Air Force doing the Navy's work?

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 01:05 PM (GQ8sn)


They have dog in the fight (THAAD) too. Trust me, I know. I worked (somewhat obliquely, meaning not TS/SCI) in the field. The AF is all over missile defense.

Posted by: Trelawney Hope at April 05, 2013 09:39 AM (ylG8S)

226

Remember, Chinese high-tech weapons are built with Chinese-manufactured parts.

 

And funding for the Chinese military depends on the robustness of the Chinese economy.

Posted by: Wm T Shermans at April 05, 2013 09:39 AM (w41GQ)

227 217 >Some of them are already defecting to China. China sends them back. Just like no Arab country wants the palestinians Posted by: Jones in CO at April 05, 2013 01:37 PM (8sCoq) ***************** It could get--how shall we say this, really interesting.

Posted by: tasker at April 05, 2013 09:39 AM (r2PLg)

228 She's right. More than just aiming, you have to build, and place in orbit a launch system that can't be maintained, or upgraded, and has to work perfectly for years all on it's own. Then, when you desperately need it, it's over India, instead of China.

Ground, and ship based systems can be placed where they're needed, when they're needed. You can't do that with a satellite.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at April 05, 2013 01:37 PM (eyJh9)

 

I never said she was wrong.  I asked about "weaponizing space" she seemed to think it wasn't worth it.

I'll defer her for this. (Keeping in mind that "weaponizing space" isn't the same as "screwing up enemies satellites" or having our own.) 

Posted by: tsrblke at April 05, 2013 09:39 AM (GaqMa)

229 With six carriers, you get eggroll.

Posted by: dogfish at April 05, 2013 09:40 AM (X3HQR)

230 o/t and, I know some of you hate hotair, but... did you see how the university police were warned about the aurora shooter? Psychiatrist warned campus police about Aurora shooter a month before mass murder They tried to keep it sealed...

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at April 05, 2013 09:40 AM (XYSwB)

231 197 Monkeys fucking a football?
Posted by: © Sponge
***

Got any videos of that? For research purposes of course.

Posted by: Tilikum the Killer Assault Whale at April 05, 2013 01:34 PM (uhftQ)



http://www.monkeyfuckingafootball.com/order.html


http://youtu.be/khEPc_0MpgY

Posted by: BCochran1981 at April 05, 2013 09:40 AM (da5Wo)

232 206 Fuck! TheSe threads all smell like ass. Posted by: Captain Hate at April 05, 2013 01:35 PM (twIz7) Why is your face in the seat of the chair?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:40 AM (tqLft)

233 Not sure about the bullets, but depending on the placement of the shell ejector chute, the jet intake could suck up the shells and there's your damage.

Outrunning the bullets? That sounds dubious.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 01:26 PM (tqLft)

 

 

--------------------------------------------

 

 

On Sept. 21st, 1956,  during  a test flight of the F11F Tiger naval fighter on a gun test, was shot down by three of it's own 20mm rounds 11 seconds after firing them.  The same thing happened with an F-100 Super Sabre a short time later on a practice gun run.

 

Not only is it physically possible, but has happened on several occasions.

Posted by: Soona at April 05, 2013 09:40 AM (dzVIa)

234 208 Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 01:32 PM (pxDth)

Sucking a piece of Lead into a Jet Engine, is considered a BAD thing by pilots for some reason....

Posted by: Romeo13 at April 05, 2013 01:35 PM (lZBBB)

 

*******

 

So  have there  been crashed fighter jets where analysis of the wreckage conclusively determined that the cause of damage was a round fired by that aircraft?   As opposed to say a round fired by the enemy, or a slow flying goose who got sucked into the engine or some other piece of debris?   If you have a link I would be interested.

 

I'm not saying it isn't possible, I am just applying my inherent skepticism to what sounds like an implausible scenario.

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 09:40 AM (pxDth)

235 Watch Black Books, it's like a sadist running the bookstore. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0262150/?ref_=sr_1 Posted by: artisanal 'ette at April 05, 2013 01:39 PM (XYSwB) hey! thanks. That looks like something I might actually want to watch. I have to admit, I first read it as "black boots" and I wondered what a documentary about AtC had to do with bookstores. and then I read it as "black boobs" and I just didn't even want to go there.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:40 AM (qPCAa)

236 Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 01:05 PM (GQ8sn)

They have dog in the fight (THAAD) too. Trust me, I know. I worked (somewhat obliquely, meaning not TS/SCI) in the field. The AF is all over missile defense.

More specifically, the AF does the nitty-gritty evaluation that the Navy uses to develop their BMD capability and upgrades.

Posted by: Trelawney Hope at April 05, 2013 09:41 AM (ylG8S)

237 I heard Joe Donnelly (D-IN) just came out for same sex marriage. When he was just a lowly congressman, I used to see him at Mass on Sunday sometimes. Now that he's a Senator, I guess he thinks he's above God. I haven't seen him since the election. He's one of those pretend-conservative Democrats that only votes with the radicals when they really need him.

Posted by: zmdavid at April 05, 2013 09:41 AM (8mttr)

238 On Sept. 21st, 1956, during a test flight of the F11F Tiger naval fighter on a gun test, was shot down by three of it's own 20mm rounds 11 seconds after firing them. The same thing happened with an F-100 Super Sabre a short time later on a practice gun run.

Not only is it physically possible, but has happened on several occasions.

Posted by: Soona at April 05, 2013 01:40 PM (dzVIa)

 

*****

 

link?

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 09:41 AM (pxDth)

239 They don't want a war. They know he's a crazed lunatic. They just want to eat.

China has no room. That and they give a fuck about people.

Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 01:38 PM (xmcEQ)



Maybe they care compared to the Norks but if we lived in the toxic pollution of the urban shitholes we wouldn't be too pleased.

Posted by: Captain Hate at April 05, 2013 09:42 AM (twIz7)

240 and then I read it as "black boobs" and I just didn't even want to go there.

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 01:40 PM (qPCAa)



How YOU doin?!?

Posted by: Ron Jeremy at April 05, 2013 09:42 AM (xmcEQ)

241 I think you would be surprised at who is commenting.

It's not always some guy wearing pajamas and eating microwave food in mom's basements

Cool. Is this the part where you hint cryptically at the missions you carried out for a secret team of elite operators?

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at April 05, 2013 09:42 AM (+lsX1)

242 227
Remember, Chinese high-tech weapons are built with Chinese-manufactured parts.

And funding for the Chinese military depends on the robustness of the Chinese economy.

Posted by: Wm T Shermans at April 05, 2013 01:39 PM (w41GQ)



OTOH, the keyboard and computer you used to make that statement were made with Chinese-manufactured parts.

Posted by: Trelawney Hope at April 05, 2013 09:43 AM (ylG8S)

243

And out of the 1.3 billion people in China, how many sunk aircraft carriers has their most successful naval commander had? Ok, how many naval battles then upon which to draw from their experiences?

 

 

I'll bet it's a bitch of a learning curve....

Posted by: Stateless Infidel at April 05, 2013 09:43 AM (AC0lD)

244 Honestly. sometime I think this blog is run on a technology platform that cro-magnon man chiseled in a cave wall.

Posted by: Marcus at April 05, 2013 09:44 AM (VDNo2)

245 They don't want a war. They know he's a crazed lunatic. They just want to eat. China has no room. That and they give a fuck about people. Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 01:38 PM (xmcEQ) ******** Hopefully you are right but every once in awhile I get afraid for the economics and what a country like China does when things get unstable--they look for an external scapegoat. For a bit just recently they were staging protests outside Japanese embassies in China, something to that effect. China's economic stability is a worldwide benefit.

Posted by: tasker at April 05, 2013 09:44 AM (r2PLg)

246 They don't want a war. They know he's a crazed lunatic. They just want to eat.

China has no room. That and they give a fuck about people.

Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 01:38 PM (xmcEQ)

 

 

----------------------------------------------

 

 

When a crazy dictator  of a country with nothing to lose if they go to war starts threatening war, we need to pay attention.

Posted by: Soona at April 05, 2013 09:44 AM (dzVIa)

247 228 It could get--how shall we say this, really interesting. Posted by: tasker at April 05, 2013 01:39 PM (r2PLg) Nork refugees that get caught get sent back to certain death. Not just them, but their whole families.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:44 AM (tqLft)

248

Screw Sun Tzu.

 

Done and done!

Posted by: Mrs. Sun Tzu at April 05, 2013 09:45 AM (5iuEW)

249 I heard Joe Donnelly (D-IN) just came out for same sex marriage. When he was just a lowly congressman, I used to see him at Mass on Sunday sometimes. Now that he's a Senator, I guess he thinks he's above God. I haven't seen him since the election. He's one of those pretend-conservative Democrats that only votes with the radicals when they really need him.

Posted by: zmdavid at April 05, 2013 01:41 PM (8mttr)



My question is, what the fuck is the federal government doing being involved in WHO gets married?!?!

That's NOT a federal issue.


I'll campaign for the next politician that comes out and says "SSM is not a federal issue.  Our government has more national issues to address and shouldn't be required to act on such things."

Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 09:45 AM (xmcEQ)

250

Ok y'all.....

Survey Monkey survey for NoVAMoMee is up.  Those of you who responded got an email.  Those who are interested, hit me at the link.

Posted by: Sean Bannion at April 05, 2013 09:45 AM (4tmHG)

251 Guided gravity weapon dropped from low earth orbit. Supposed to drill through 500 feet of granite or concrete. Looks like a large titanium telephone pole.

The Rod from God.

GI Joe: Retaliation has it.

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 09:45 AM (GQ8sn)

252 http://www.monkeyfuckingafootball.com/order.html
http://youtu.be/khEPc_0MpgY

Posted by: BCochran1981

***

 

I'll be back in about 30 minutes as I need to document the information.

Posted by: Tilikum the Killer Assault Whale at April 05, 2013 09:45 AM (uhftQ)

253




Daily space tithe to Pixy.   Now back to knapping flint tools to hunt cave bears with.

Posted by: Muad'dib at April 05, 2013 09:45 AM (KjlbF)

254 I never said she was wrong. I asked about "weaponizing space" she seemed to think it wasn't worth it.I'll defer her for this. (Keeping in mind that "weaponizing space" isn't the same as "screwing up enemies satellites" or having our own.) I know. I'm just chiming in. I'm not impugning you, or your wife.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at April 05, 2013 09:46 AM (eyJh9)

255 Do "WE" have the will? WE, as in, you and me, YES. Does America have the will, as in, the same America that voted Obama into office twice.....uhhhhhh, let me get back to you on that.

Posted by: Dan at April 05, 2013 09:46 AM (/7gN/)

256 I picked .14 grams of belly-button lint from my belly-button today. It smelled like aged baby swiss cheese.

Posted by: Navel Geek at April 05, 2013 09:46 AM (G9qZk)

257 When a crazy dictator of a country with nothing to lose if they go to war starts threatening war, we need to pay attention.

Posted by: Soona at April 05, 2013 01:44 PM (dzVIa)



I agree.  The little fat kid is just a puppet being lead by the crazed lunatics that couldn't get Kim Jung Il to do anything.

Posted by: © Sponge at April 05, 2013 09:46 AM (xmcEQ)

258

I stand ready, willing, and honored to help any attractive women reduce their risk of breast cancer. No thanks required, thats just the way I roll.......

 

http://tinyurl.com/bmbld63

Posted by: maddogg at April 05, 2013 09:46 AM (OlN4e)

259 >OTOH, the keyboard and computer you used to make that statement were made with Chinese-manufactured parts.<

Which is why they suck ass and don't last.


Posted by: Marcus at April 05, 2013 09:47 AM (VDNo2)

260 Ready your weapons and Fire at Will.  That'll teach him.

Posted by: Sphynx at April 05, 2013 09:47 AM (OZmbA)

261 Leftists have been telling us for decades that shooting down incoming missiles can never be accomplished. Fast microprocessors changed that. When first proposed, the idea was unworkable because no missile could tote around a fridge sized processor that was fast enough to do the needed sense/correct cycles fast enough to match its target's jinking.

Posted by: @PurpAv at April 05, 2013 09:47 AM (/gHaE)

262 Rodman: I'm going on vacation with Kim in August oreally? tell me more, roddy

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at April 05, 2013 09:47 AM (XYSwB)

263 257 I picked .14 grams of belly-button lint from my belly-button today. It smelled like aged baby swiss cheese. Posted by: Navel Geek at April 05, 2013 01:46 PM (G9qZk) Roll it in flour, let rise and bake...

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 09:48 AM (tqLft)

264 And out of the 1.3 billion people in China, how many sunk aircraft carriers has their most successful naval commander had? Ok, how many naval battles then upon which to draw from their experiences?
Posted by: Stateless Infidel

Give me a million shots and it really won't matter.

Why on earth do people think the Chinese would only deploy one of any particular weapon?

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at April 05, 2013 09:48 AM (mN8D3)

265 The Rods from God idea is neat but would be banned by current arms treaties. I predict they would never be allowed in peacetime. If we ever have another total war WW2 style then that'll be an option. Also, people totally overestimate the amount of "secret" weapons we build. Almost all of the cool, "secret" weapons that get unveiled are developed pretty much in the open. If you follow defense news and DARPA news and stuff like that it's easy to watch the development of tech over years and decades it takes to become a real weapons system. Some things really are kept ultra-secret -- like stealth coatings. But most aren't. DoD is mostly pretty open with defense R&D. Especially so in peacetime So fantasies that we might have super-awesome miracle weapons in a secret bunker in Utah ... are just that. Fantasies. I'm no defense insider, though, so maybe I'm just not in on the secrets. But almost every cool new weapon unveiled in recent history I knew about long before just by reading the defense trade press. Defense R&D has an academic and industrial base it has to communicate with. And it does so publicly.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 09:48 AM (ZPrif)

266

http://aerofiles.com/tiger-tail.html

 

 The combination of conditions reponsible for the event was (1) the decay in projectile velocity and trajectory drop; (2) the approximate 0.5-G descent of the F11F, due in part to its nose pitching down from firing low-mounted guns; (3) alignment of the boresight line of 0° to the line of flight. With that 0.5-G dive, Attridge had flown below the trajectory of his bullets and, 11 seconds later, flew through them as their flight paths met..

 

So, this answers my question about the physics.  I still would maintain that the likelihood of those two trajectories matching up is extremely small, especially in a shooting war where the enemy is actually "trying" to hit you. 

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 09:48 AM (pxDth)

267 260 Posted by: Marcus at April 05, 2013 01:47 PM (VDNo2)

You got me there. But they still work for at least a little while.

Posted by: Trelawney Hope at April 05, 2013 09:48 AM (ylG8S)

268 When a crazy dictator of a country with nothing to lose if they go to war starts threatening war, we need to pay attention. Posted by: Soona at April 05, 2013 01:44 PM (dzVIa) even Bolton thought it out of character/odd

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at April 05, 2013 09:49 AM (XYSwB)

269 Nude.

Posted by: EC at April 05, 2013 09:49 AM (GQ8sn)

270 Please, go ahead and underestimate us...

Posted by: Fu Manchu, Stereotype Extraordinaire at April 05, 2013 09:49 AM (XvHmy)

271 I agree with #1. If we lose 5000 people in one engagement, the Democrats will bail on the war.

Posted by: Chris Balsz at April 05, 2013 09:49 AM (fTPTP)

272 so, artisanal 'ette. What do you artisan?

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:49 AM (qPCAa)

273 link?

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 01:41 PM (pxDth)

 

 

--------------------------------------------

 

 

No link.  It's from an aircraft  illustration series book "Naval Fighters Number Forty - F11F Tiger" by Corwin  Meyer and Steve Ginter.

Posted by: Soona at April 05, 2013 09:50 AM (dzVIa)

274 248 228 It could get--how shall we say this, really interesting. Posted by: tasker at April 05, 2013 01:39 PM (r2PLg) Nork refugees that get caught get sent back to certain death. Not just them, but their whole families. Posted by: J.J. Sefton at April 05, 2013 01:44 PM (tqLft) ************ That's why I don't understand the Korean military defectors going to China...

Posted by: tasker at April 05, 2013 09:50 AM (r2PLg)

275 I guess there is no other way out?

Posted by: tasker at April 05, 2013 09:50 AM (r2PLg)

276 Y'know, when Starwars defense strategy was being developed all these crazy libs (or their daddys) were poo-poo'ing it. It'll never work. That Reagan's crazy. What a joke . . .etc. etc.

Now they rely on it and assume it's going to work. They're all a piece of work, the ca-ca for brains butt-buttered rump ranger fools. (trying to keep it clean here)

Posted by: Sphynx at April 05, 2013 09:52 AM (OZmbA)

277 The only decent thing that ever came out of Korea was BBQ.

And even then, it sure smells a lot like my dog when it comes in from the rain.

Posted by: Marcus at April 05, 2013 09:52 AM (VDNo2)

278 Leftists have been telling us for decades that shooting down incoming missiles can never be accomplished.

Fast microprocessors changed that. When first proposed, the idea was unworkable because no missile could tote around a fridge sized processor that was fast enough to do the needed sense/correct cycles fast enough to match its target's jinking.

Posted by: @PurpAv at April 05, 2013 01:47 PM (/gHaE)



Again, every one of those snotty cocksuckers that called Reagan a dunce for investing in this need to be tied up in the town square and pelted with rotten fruit, vegetables and dogshit for being obvious fuckheads and too dumb to exist in polite society.  Technologies develop over time and these idiots are stuck in the static universe of their imbecile minds.

Posted by: Captain Hate at April 05, 2013 09:52 AM (twIz7)

279
No link. It's from an aircraft illustration series book "Naval Fighters Number Forty - F11F Tiger" by Corwin Meyer and Steve Ginter.

Posted by: Soona at April 05, 2013 01:50 PM (dzVIa)

 

*******

 

Thanks, see my #267

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at April 05, 2013 09:53 AM (pxDth)

280 269 When a crazy dictator of a country with nothing to lose if they go to war starts threatening war, we need to pay attention.

Posted by: Soona at April 05, 2013 01:44 PM (dzVIa)


>>even Bolton thought it out of character/odd




Micheal Bolton?  I celebrate the guy's entire catalog.

Posted by: Sphynx at April 05, 2013 09:53 AM (OZmbA)

281 That's Michael.

Sorry, 3 martini lunch

Posted by: Sphynx at April 05, 2013 09:53 AM (OZmbA)

282 The only decent thing that ever came out of Korea was BBQ.

And even then, it sure smells a lot like my dog when it comes in from the rain.

Posted by: Marcus at April 05, 2013 01:52 PM (VDNo2)

 

Maybe it's just that hazy glow of nostalgia from my youth as a soldier, but I still think Korean women are especially lovely.

Posted by: troyriser at April 05, 2013 09:54 AM (vtiE6)

283 what does POSSLQ stand for?

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 09:54 AM (qPCAa)

284

Seems to me there was a bit of a story  a couple years ago about a USAF 747 slap full of chemical laser goodies.  Unless it's been sequestered or otherwise Obama'd, I'd suppose there are going to be one of more of these  orbiting the area of any future  ballistic  unpleasantness.

Posted by: Jaws at April 05, 2013 09:56 AM (4I3Uo)

285 I know young male dolphins can be problematic. But the prehensile penis dragging you to a rape cave sounds like Japanese sci fi. Tough to imagine I missed that in dolphin country.

Posted by: Beagle at April 05, 2013 09:56 AM (sOtz/)

286 Maybe it's just that hazy glow of nostalgia from my youth as a soldier, but I still think Korean women are especially lovely.



Yeah, but they give birth to plump, cherub faced little megalomaniacs.

Posted by: Sphynx at April 05, 2013 09:56 AM (OZmbA)

287

262 Leftists have been telling us for decades that shooting down incoming missiles can never be accomplished.

"Fast microprocessors changed that. When first proposed, the idea was unworkable because no missile could tote around a fridge sized processor that was fast enough to do the needed sense/correct cycles fast enough to match its target's jinking. "

Not possible. See, as I'm sure you're aware, Leftists are much smarter than everyone else (they keep telling us) so they would've considered future technological advancement in their thinking when they said it could never work. Therefore, it doesn't matter how fast or small processors get, it's always going to be impossible to shoot down and incoming missile.

Posted by: MLCross at April 05, 2013 09:56 AM (taib7)

288

what does POSSLQ stand for? Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 01:54 PM (qPCAa)

Persons of the Opposite Sex Sharing Living Quarters

Posted by: Sean Bannion at April 05, 2013 09:56 AM (4tmHG)

289 Please give me whatever input you can. I need a word for "clusterfuck" that can be used in a legal brief. **************************************** Montage of boned.

Posted by: The Hobo Wears Prada (Team Plover) at April 05, 2013 09:56 AM (jopHG)

290 >Maybe it's just that hazy glow of nostalgia from my youth as a soldier, but I still think Korean women are especiallylovely.<

Standing guard duty for hours and years with nothing to do, in a foreign country will do that to you. lol.

Personally, I have never seen a particularly attractive Korean woman unless I was half in the bag. Even then sometimes...

Posted by: Marcus at April 05, 2013 09:57 AM (VDNo2)

291 persons of opposite sex sharing living quarters
Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 01:54 PM (qPCAa)

Posted by: zmdavid at April 05, 2013 09:57 AM (8mttr)

292 One elephant-class Vimana and all your carrier belong to us.

Posted by: Vishnu at April 05, 2013 09:57 AM (oqzXc)

293 Again, every one of those snotty cocksuckers that called Reagan a dunce for investing in this need to be tied up in the town square and pelted with rotten fruit, vegetables and dogshit for being obvious fuckheads and too dumb to exist in polite society. Technologies develop over time and these idiots are stuck in the static universe of their imbecile minds.

Yeah, Israel's had reasonable luck with Iron Dome, but the MFM barely mentions it.

Posted by: Ian S. at April 05, 2013 09:57 AM (B/VB5)

294 what does POSSLQ stand for? It's a term from the 80's: Person of Opposite Sex Sharing Living Quarters ... Frazier & Lilith, on "Cheers"

Posted by: Arbalest at April 05, 2013 09:58 AM (yldXV)

295 The chemical laser system was killed off a while back. DoD has killed all investment in chemical lasers to focus on things like solid-state lasers. The giant airborne chemical laser was killed off years ago. Safely handling the large amounts of dangerous chemicals was a huge logistical problem. Obama killed it early in his first term I believe.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at April 05, 2013 09:59 AM (ZPrif)

296 The idea that US aircraft in Vietnam ran over its own bullets when fired in a powered dive for strafing  is ludicrous.


Even the venerable A1 Sky Raider which was most often used in this mode used the 20mm canon which is over 3,000 fps (> 2000 mph).  That aircraft is not capable of Mach 1.



The fastest aircraft used in Vietnam for combat was the old F4 Phantom.  It had no machine guns or canons.



The Ky Raider was replaced by the A6 in the ground attack mode. It also had no guns.  Missiles only and its max speed was about 900 mph.


So I must throw the BS flag on that one and see some proof.

Posted by: Vic at April 05, 2013 10:00 AM (53z96)

297

"Obama killed it early in his first term I believe."

 

Fabulous.

Posted by: Jaws at April 05, 2013 10:01 AM (4I3Uo)

298 Pretty sure Obamaphones is more important than some carrier thingy.

Posted by: Schwalbe: The Me-262© at April 05, 2013 10:02 AM (UU0OF)

299 "The theory is, China is working on a ballistic missile that can target ships and.."

A ballistic missile can be tracked (and intercepted) a lot easier than one that's skimming the sea surface.

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at April 05, 2013 10:03 AM (vd7A8)

300 o/t and, I know some of you hate hotair, but... did you see how the university police were warned about the aurora shooter? Psychiatrist warned campus police about Aurora shooter a month before mass murder They tried to keep it sealed... Posted by: artisanal 'ette at April 05, 2013 01:40 PM (XYSwB) Also, Jared Laughner's father reported that he was worried what his son might do when Jared left the house in an agitated mood, taking his guns with him. Did Mr. Laughner call the police and if so, what was the police response? Why isn't law enforcement responding when these situations are reported?

Posted by: Mindy at April 05, 2013 10:03 AM (wk9P4)

301 Hell, as recently as 10 years ago leftists were going on about how missile defense couldn't possibly work.  "Like hitting a bullet with a bullet" was the common refrain they parroted.

Never you mind that a missile is guided, unlike a bullet.  Or that a missile is in flight for far longer than the fraction of a second that most bullets are.

Of course every single test failure was proof that it was a pipe dream.  Because testing and development never, ever involve trial and error.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at April 05, 2013 10:03 AM (SY2Kh)

302 It's a term from the 80's: Person of Opposite Sex Sharing Living Quarters ... Frazier & Lilith, on "Cheers" Posted by: Arbalest at April 05, 2013 01:58 PM (yldXV) doh! forgot my cheers. *hangs head in shame*

Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 10:03 AM (qPCAa)

303 so, artisanal 'ette. What do you artisan? Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 01:49 PM (qPCAa) I'll answer you here, even though a new thread is up, so hopefully you'll see it. No reason to share with the entire horde. I've cast metal and worked with stones, etc and bezeling jewelry. Have hand thrown pots/ceramics. Including some black firing techniques. And, kiln fired pieces. Including raku. My all time favorite/and most time spent on, is woodworking. I've built some furniture, etc. I've built some fine pieces for the house (china cabinet/buffet, coffee table, even a bench for the foyer). And, made stuff for outside. Cedar table for the deck, bird feeder, etc. Pretty much anything I can do with my hands, I try it, and try to learn it pretty well. Only thing I haven't mastered is oil or water color painting. I haven't invested the time for it. And, of course, I garden. Body rooted in the earth.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at April 05, 2013 10:03 AM (XYSwB)

304 so, artisanal 'ette. What do you artisan? Posted by: elizabethe at April 05, 2013 01:49 PM (qPCAa) oh, and I write. full length sci-fi short stories poems, etc When writing, however, nothing else gets done.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at April 05, 2013 10:04 AM (XYSwB)

305 According to this article the airborne laser made it's last flight on Feb 14 2012.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/space/systems/abl.htm

So Obama killed it late in his first term, I guess.

Posted by: zmdavid at April 05, 2013 10:05 AM (8mttr)

306 Ace up

Posted by: Vic at April 05, 2013 10:06 AM (53z96)

307 "The fastest aircraft used in Vietnam for combat was the old F4 Phantom. It had no machine guns or canons."

I recall that one was added via an external pod when the missiles being used back then didn't perform as expected.

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at April 05, 2013 10:08 AM (vd7A8)

308 33.2097° N, 87.5692° W...North Korea, that's the coordinates of Tuscaloosa, Alabama...just saying...

Posted by: YaHump at April 05, 2013 10:08 AM (i0zjt)

309

@275 That's why I don't understand the Korean military defectors going to China...

-------------------------------------

I would imagine that the Chinese actually like military defectors.  China is nominally responsible for North Korea, but Norks are notoriously secretive.  Military defectors could give insight into what the Norks are hiding from the Chinese, and if there's anything going on in the Nork military that the Chinese should start to get alarmed about (such as yet another shooting incident with the South Koreans).

 

Posted by: junior at April 05, 2013 10:10 AM (UWFpX)

310 A ballistic missile can be tracked (and intercepted) a lot easier than one that's skimming the sea surface. Some of the early rev CIWS couldn't even depress low enough to shoot them. They're probably being phased out over time though.

Posted by: @PurpAv at April 05, 2013 10:10 AM (/gHaE)

311 I recall that one was added via an external pod when the missiles being used back then didn't perform as expected.

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at April 05, 2013 02:08 PM (vd7A


I never saw a single one like that with 2 cruises to Vietnam and I saw a LOT of F-4 before we replaced them with the F-14 which never saw combat in Vietnam. .

Posted by: Vic at April 05, 2013 10:13 AM (53z96)

312 And besides, even if they did one like that you could not fly an F-4 in ground attack strafing runs at speeds > 2000 mph without ripping the wings off.

Posted by: Vic at April 05, 2013 10:14 AM (53z96)

313 311 Some of the early rev CIWS couldn't even depress low enough to shoot them. They're probably being phased out over time though.

Posted by: @PurpAv at April 05, 2013 02:10 PM (/gHaE)


Those are all gone now. CIWS is a nice system; a bit fragile and maintenance intensive, but works well. We also have RAM, which was designed to defeat supersonic ASCMs.

Truth is, no ASCM-specific missile or gun system has ever defeated and ASCM in anger; it's been almost always active-electromagnetic jamming or (once) anti-aircraft radar-guided missiles.

Posted by: Trelawney Hope at April 05, 2013 10:16 AM (ylG8S)

314 Of course every single test failure was proof that it was a pipe dream. Because testing and development never, ever involve trial and error.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at April 05, 2013 02:03 PM (SY2Kh)



But the skeptics never tire of telling us that they're the smart and reality based ones.

Posted by: Captain Hate at April 05, 2013 10:20 AM (twIz7)

315 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_6uBOXVEJM Go to 15:00 Pretty good video overall.

Posted by: The Hobo Wears Prada (Team Plover) at April 05, 2013 10:50 AM (jopHG)

316 Wasn't the argument against Battleships that they could be too easily targeted by missiles? If we can prevent aircraft carriers from falling to that, cant we prevent other similarly-sized ships from the same?

Couldn't we, theoretically, resurrect the concept of a battleship not in BB but BBG or CBC capacity? Not only would we again get the heavy gun support we lost, but the platforms would certainly be large enough to fit all the C3 abilities such a defense system to protect a naval force would require. One of the Iowa class hulls was supposed to be converted to a guided missile carrier design, and it'd give us an excellent platform to continue our tests into railgun technology.

Posted by: SOCR at April 05, 2013 11:01 AM (RTNve)

317 The CV's demise has been predicted since 1946.  A day will come when, like the big gun battleship it will be obsolete, but predicting that day is always difficult.

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Pirate Scum of Umbar at April 05, 2013 11:17 AM (hLRSq)

318

287 Sphynx -You suck dude...clearly you haven't seen Hyuna or Shin Se-kyung (basically Charlie in the South Korean version of Top Gun). Those non starved, non brainwashed Korean gals are...stuning.

 

  

Posted by: Danny at April 05, 2013 11:46 AM (g+g9W)

319 JonesinCO, I've decided that I'm really in love with you......

Posted by: IntheBellyoftheBeast at April 05, 2013 11:49 AM (A5iH4)

320

I think the key question regarding American power over the 21st century is to what extent will the young genration be willing to protect America? I have all the confidence in the world when I'm in uniform and I see my fellow Marines. I have less confidence when drill weekend secures and I'm back in my college class, listening to entitled kids brag about scoring "awesome foriegn internships" or "study abroad semesters." Not because I have anything against foriegn studies (hell being billingual is pretty cool, let me tell ya) but because entitled kids who live off Daddy's money and who have no conception of the valor of pain and sacrifice are not likely to be willing to suffer to ensure their country is top dog. The Chinese will, however.

 

Then again, the Japanese (with the exception of people like Yamamoto) felt that Americans would be too soft to be willing to fight for the Pacific. So we'll see I guess.

Posted by: Danny at April 05, 2013 11:53 AM (g+g9W)

321 WE HAVE BOTES THAT GO UNER THE WATER NAOW, DUMASS!

Posted by: Dave M at April 05, 2013 12:04 PM (ZjaBA)

322 China seems to be pretty interested in building carriers for their fleet. Our DOD has been filled with anti-war, pro-reduction pencil-necks, so anything that suggests we should minimize the reach of our navy is a-ok with them.

Posted by: Chairman LMAO at April 05, 2013 12:20 PM (9eDbm)

323 _________________________________

Hey, did anyone remember to send Bill Clinton and Al Gore 'thank you' notes for doing such a bang up job in guarding US Military secrets?

Those bastards.

We should have (easily could have) maintained such a stark lead on the Chi-Coms that there would be no need to adapt against their ASBM.





Posted by: _Dave_ at April 05, 2013 03:46 PM (J+Q+d)

324 Of course, if we know that one of these weapons has been launched, then it's also possible to just beging maeuvering to elude the warhead to begin with. If, in fact, the DF-21 is a "kinetic energy" weapon, then it has to actually HIT the target to start with.  assuming a high mach-number of reentry, then the warhead has to be some kind of maneuverable to be able to hit a CVN if there's any sort of evasive action being taken by the target.

   Mach 10+ reentry vehicles just do NOT change course like a TIE fighter, so doing some "S" maneuvering should be able to defeat it altogether.

  Having said all of that, the BIG worry is whether the DF-21 is a charade to begin with. Although it's claimed to be a kinetic energy weapon, there's nothing keeping the Chinese from putting a nuclear warhead onboard it and having a shot at a CVBG out in the vasty deep of the Pacific. Do we really want to take that chance?

   United States policy regarding the DF-21 ought to be that any launch of such a weapon, aimed at any US Mi9litary ( or other) target, will be considered a nuclear strike against these United States requiring a  retaliatory nuclear strike against the nation of China at a time and place and strength of our choosing. In other words, launch one, and it's nuclear war between us.

Posted by: AW1 Tim at April 05, 2013 07:52 PM (c89SQ)

325 The Chinese are at least a full ten years behind in military strength compared to US capabilities. They are working towards eventually becoming competitive, but they have not arrived as of yet.

Posted by: I'd rather be surfin at April 06, 2013 12:26 PM (g5wi5)

326 Ye who enter these waters, abandon all hope.....wait.....Never Mind.

Posted by: The Dread Pirate Emily Litella at April 06, 2013 02:22 PM (8msqX)

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