September 18, 2013

Starbucks Reverses Policy, Asks Customers No Longer Open Carry In Stores
— JohnE.

Last night, Starbucks CEO Howard Schultz announced a policy reversal regarding open carry in Starbucks coffee shops. The announcement was made on the company's website last night. Some are quick to blame Starbucks and liberal whining and complaining, but I don't really see it that way. From his post:

We appreciate that there is a highly sensitive balance of rights and responsibilities surrounding America’s gun laws, and we recognize the deep passion for and against the “open carry” laws adopted by many states. (In the United States, “open carry” is the term used for openly carrying a firearm in public.) For years we have listened carefully to input from our customers, partners, community leaders and voices on both sides of this complicated, highly charged issue.

Our company’s longstanding approach to “open carry” has been to follow local laws: we permit it in states where allowed and we prohibit it in states where these laws don’t exist. We have chosen this approach because we believe our store partners should not be put in the uncomfortable position of requiring customers to disarm or leave our stores. We believe that gun policy should be addressed by government and law enforcement—not by Starbucks and our store partners.

Starbucks, of course, is not a conservative organization. They champion plenty of liberal/progressive causes from the corporate level. They were however, quite accommodating to the issue of gun rights on the local storefront level. Essentially, they were just mirroring whatever state law was on the books.

Liberals, as they often do, staged boycotts and protests. This isn't the first boycott of Starbucks by the left, by the way. Newtown kicked this thing into overdrive.

Gun rights activists started "Starbucks Appreciation Day", which encouraged people to open carry in stores where the law allowed. Frankly, I think this is where it started to go off the rails. Gun rights is an issue we're winning pretty comfortably. The left seeks to paint gun rights supporters as "gun nuts" and nothing helps their case more than pulling stunts like this.

Now tell me, what was the point of that? Any CCW class, or NRA gun safety program you take will relentlessly preach the importance of responsibility. There are few things more irresponsible as a gun owner than bringing a rifle to a business with the express purpose of creating an argument or altercation, all for the glory of your YouTube channel.

Apparently, Starbucks didn't want to continue to have their stores be ground zero for a political debate. You know what? They are completely within their rights to make this call as a private business. Starbucks CEO:

Recently, however, we’ve seen the “open carry” debate become increasingly uncivil and, in some cases, even threatening. Pro-gun activists have used our stores as a political stage for media events misleadingly called “Starbucks Appreciation Days” that disingenuously portray Starbucks as a champion of “open carry.” To be clear: we do not want these events in our stores. Some anti-gun activists have also played a role in ratcheting up the rhetoric and friction, including soliciting and confronting our customers and partners.

For these reasons, today we are respectfully requesting that customers no longer bring firearms into our stores or outdoor seating areas—even in states where “open carry” is permitted—unless they are authorized law enforcement personnel.

Notice, this is not a ban. It's a polite request they are asking customers to honor (It's a little unclear as to whether this applies to just open carry or concealed as well). Some are claiming he just buckled to liberal pressure and he's lying through his teeth. I'm willing to take him at his word, because I assume the company just wanted to sell coffee without the endless headaches that go along with people making a spectacle of the previous policy.

Please understand, I am a strong supporter of both open and concealed carry. The issue I have here is one of strategy. I do not think this type organized campaign wins us any converts in the middle, because it seems very much like intimidation to "moderates" on the issue. I think even people who are inclined to support expanding gun rights would be turned off by the sight of a bunch of people walking around with rifles in Starbucks.

It's a shame they decided to change the policy. Had gun rights activists sent emails or letters thanking the company for their policy and simply continued their patronage (while carrying when they otherwise would), I don't think it would have come to this.

Oh, I'll be on NRA News at 3PM discussing this.

Posted by: JohnE. at 10:10 AM | Comments (331)
Post contains 786 words, total size 5 kb.

1 Guns=scary & mystifying to the left. Seems to me the more people are exposed to responsible carry the less mystifying and scary, no?

Posted by: Amy Shulkusky at September 18, 2013 10:15 AM (bdged)

2 I thought Ace was the only one who double posts?

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at September 18, 2013 10:15 AM (gqgiP)

3 Their coffee is crap anyway. Maetenloch would like it.

Posted by: FUBAR at September 18, 2013 10:17 AM (Cs2tJ)

4 Have they said anything about those who have concealed carry permits?

I do understand that the spectacle of open carry specifically to attract attention to -- open carry -- may be disruptive in their stores.

If they are carefully ignoring CCW and just asking that those who choose open carry go elsewhere, then I don't have much of a problem.

Their coffee still sucks.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at September 18, 2013 10:19 AM (gqgiP)

5 ( cough )

Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at September 18, 2013 10:19 AM (uctT+)

6 The details paint a different picture than what one might first assume. There's always some asshole in the crowd that will ruin it for the rest. This is why we can't have nice things.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at September 18, 2013 10:19 AM (DmNpO)

7 Pussy. It smells like pussy. Or chicken shit. The post I mean.

Posted by: nip at September 18, 2013 10:20 AM (jI23+)

8 Well this is basically the same post as Ace did an hour or two ago, but it deserves to be reiterated: these "Open Carry" activists are their own worst enemy.  I might even buy the idea of trying to 'normalize' the idea of having an openly holstered handgun, but when these people claim they're trying to "get people used to" the idea of openly carrying an unslung AR-15 into a suburban Starbucks they're either disingenuous or retarded.  Newsflash: nobody is ever going to 'get used to' the idea of a stranger walking into a coffeeshop with a massive semi-automatic rifle in his hand.  It's purely an intimidation move, a power play.  And it hurts us all.

Dicks.

Posted by: Jeff B. at September 18, 2013 10:20 AM (yemTi)

9
News so nice
We post it twice

Posted by: Unofficial AoSHQ Motto at September 18, 2013 10:21 AM (uYaYO)

10 Oh, and 'll add the obligatory... their coffee sucks. It does. But a hot cup of their caramel apple cider and a slice of their gingerbread on a cold day in Winter is mighty, mighty tasty.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at September 18, 2013 10:21 AM (DmNpO)

11 There's certainly a place for open carry, like US female reservists toting M4s at the beach, but only if they're physically fit, alert, and in swimwear.

Posted by: mrp at September 18, 2013 10:21 AM (HjPtV)

12 Seeing someone with a gun in a visible holster is a little disturbing to people and I understand that.  Nevertheless I was all for the Open Carry law in Oklahoma.  That is because it removes any penalties for accidental exposure of a concealed weapon which is common with conceal carry laws.  The wise men and women, in my opinion, will be those people who continue to conceal their weapons in public.  Concealed weapons significantly raise the risk to bad people wanting to hurt people.  Open weapons can be avoided by wrong doers.

Posted by: Bill at September 18, 2013 10:22 AM (epPn/)

13 Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at September 18, 2013 02:19 PM (DmNpO) Speaking of which.. http://tinyurl.com/py34tus Open carry douche but the cop handles it awesomely. (yeah, 2 years old.) Compare him with that POS Officer Harliss.

Posted by: RWC at September 18, 2013 10:22 AM (fWAjv)

14 Well this is basically the same post as Ace did an hour or two ago


That was Andy.

Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 10:22 AM (GQ8sn)

15 I support 2nd Amendment Rights, but despise Starbuck's coffee, which tastes like gun lubricant, strangely enough.

Posted by: Bigby's Shadow Puppet Hands at September 18, 2013 10:23 AM (3ZtZW)

16 Backfire.

Didn't see that one coming, huh?


Posted by: Jaws at September 18, 2013 10:26 AM (4I3Uo)

17 I don't go to Starbucks for several reasons: 1: Their coffee sucks. I like coffee flavored coffee, not a shot of this of a foam of that. Blech. 2: The CEO is on record as saying that if you don't agree with liberal politics, they don't want your business. OK. 3: Their coffee really sucks. Tastes like burned chicory. 4: I hate being surrounded by smug hipster trash, waxing rhapsodic about their lattes. 5: Did I mention that their coffee really, really sucks? Maybe they should go to making their stores gun free zones. As recent events have shown us, that works out really well.

Posted by: Weirddave at September 18, 2013 10:26 AM (jt8G9)

18 All the pics I have seen of open carry people in Starbucks have been clean cut, white, young people.

Now, imagine you are sitting in a starbucks when a bunch of dreadlocked rastafarians come in exercising that same "right".

Yeah, I thought so.

Open carry in otherwise peaceful, public, urban places is just a very dumb idea, legal or not. It will not advance the cause of the 2nd Amendment. It paints us all as nut jobs.

Posted by: navybrat at September 18, 2013 10:27 AM (kb15h)

19 How many more times am I going to have to read about some dumb ass lib store policy? Not complaining about the content of this thread, but how is this news? Seems to me to be just about the same as forbidding service to someone based on race, but its a private place and an use whatever dumb ass criteria they want to avoid having a certain customer. So how would they justify one arbitrary criteria and not another.

Posted by: UWP at September 18, 2013 10:27 AM (vj51i)

20 What's with the dickery by nip at #6?

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at September 18, 2013 10:27 AM (ZPrif)

21 13 Well this is basically the same post as Ace did an hour or two ago


That was Andy.

Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 02:22 PM (GQ8sn)



Shit.  I was wrong.   That was ace, not Andy.


Why did I think Andy?  I must have read one of his comments in the thread.

Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 10:27 AM (GQ8sn)

22 13 Well this is basically the same post as Ace did an hour or two ago


That was Andy.

Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 02:22 PM (GQ8sn)

 

I was ace, Andy was in the comments.

Posted by: buzzion at September 18, 2013 10:27 AM (LI48c)

23 Rastafaraphobe.

Posted by: Lincolntf at September 18, 2013 10:27 AM (ZshNr)

24 their coffee sucks.


Longbows.

Posted by: real joe at September 18, 2013 10:27 AM (uitGY)

25 I said it before, as a businessman Schultz just want to sell coffee and promote a balanced protection of his customers right to enjoyment.

People carrying for YouTube fame, to show the "intolerance" of police or the shock value of carrying your AR like a notebook are just as bad as the idiots screeching about gun "control".

Carrying a firearm requires a certain level of maturity and discipline. While problematic incidents are a minority occurrence at Starbucks, they do absolutely zero to help our cause or persuade any potential fence sitters.

Posted by: Marcus at September 18, 2013 10:28 AM (GGCsk)

26 I am not a Starbucks fan. In fact, I don't drink 5 dollar coffee. But I don't really see where they deserve to be made shuttlecocks in this battle.

Posted by: maddogg at September 18, 2013 10:28 AM (xWW96)

27 I guess I'll have another cup of coffee. Later.

Posted by: Foghorn Leghorn at September 18, 2013 10:28 AM (EGPJQ)

28 Speaking of which.. http://tinyurl.com/py34tus Open carry douche but the cop handles it awesomely. ** What? the dude was just walking down the side of a busy street with his gun out in the open? I don't understand why, even in open carry states, folks don't choose to cover them up.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at September 18, 2013 10:28 AM (DmNpO)

29 I was ace, Andy was in the comments. I was spartacus.

Posted by: Spartacus Price Blair at September 18, 2013 10:28 AM (QF8uk)

30 The comments on the Buzzfeed article are very revealing. Especially the ones from Brits, Aussies and Canadians. One of the Canucks is wishing death upon us again.

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at September 18, 2013 10:28 AM (YmPwQ)

31 So let me boil this down: Leftist fascists stage protests at Starbucks because Starbucks to try to drum up support for their latest bright and shiny issue. Rightist freedom-lovers try to show there is nothing to fear by successfully and legally carrying into a store. Starbucks' response is to stop the response by the Right. Note that if they say, "Please don't protest outside of our stores" they'll get nothing but contemptuous noncompliance, but still... If you're going to have an effective strategy to avoid being ground zero for a political fight in which you are not a primary participant, then you should just ignore it. They just emboldened the Lefty protest trolls, so next time there's some kind of controversy that has nothing to do with Starbucks, there will be the protesters, marching (well, sitting, usually) outside of Starbucks.

Posted by: AR-15 AmishDude at September 18, 2013 10:29 AM (T0NGe)

32 "It's déjà vu all over again"

Posted by: Yogi Berra at September 18, 2013 10:29 AM (Pr6hk)

33 Kind of like how John E. is going "behind enemy lines" and posting at Buzzfeed-- it looks like the photo at New Yorker Magazine is two Liberals going out of their way to dress in black and look irresponsible while carrying. IOW ye olde Moby trick.

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 10:29 AM (r2PLg)

34

"Apparently, Starbucks didn't want to continue to have their stores be ground zero for a political debate."

 

Unless it is the faggots rights, in that case they allow themselves to be ground zero for that meaning that they gladly destroy any other point of view.

 

Frankly I fear homo-fanatics and al-gayeda more than I fear any person with a gun.

Posted by: fromabroad at September 18, 2013 10:30 AM (rnV3B)

35 The only Starbucks coffee I like the blonde, less incinerated, stuff.  A lot like the way vicious racist Jim Messina hires only blonde Vikings to staff his campaigns.  

Posted by: Beagle at September 18, 2013 10:30 AM (sOtz/)

36 "Open carry in otherwise peaceful, public, urban places is just a very dumb idea, legal or not. It will not advance the cause of the 2nd Amendment. It paints us all as nut jobs."

The Venn Diagram of  "OC Movement"  and "Retarded Capital-L Libertarian Ron Paul Fanboy"  in pretty much O.  This result was predictable to everyone but them.


Posted by: Jaws at September 18, 2013 10:30 AM (4I3Uo)

37 Hell, Starbucks should have a special limited time dark roast named the AR-15 roast. Bold and badass. That's the way you deal with controversy. You have to spank the Left like the children that they are. Even the Left should know this.

Posted by: AR-15 AmishDude at September 18, 2013 10:30 AM (T0NGe)

38 This post was half-written when Ace put his up, so I just went ahead anyway.

What are you idiots looking for, coordination and communication? Don't you know where you are?

Posted by: JohnE. at September 18, 2013 10:30 AM (nRTou)

39

We have done gone through the looking glass.  We have travelled back in time and revisited a post.

 

Take that Laws of Thermodynamics!

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Outrage Outlet Happy Hour! Cocktails of Betrayal 50% Off! at September 18, 2013 10:31 AM (hLRSq)

40 I believe strongly that "shall issue" with no BS hoops to jump thru should be the law of the land in all 50 states.  I also believe concealed carry is far better than open carry.  Open carry on parade to make a point is stupid and does nothing to advance acceptance of what really is important, concealed carry, among the general public.  If you want to open carry, get on the police force.
I am totally sympathetic to Starbucks plea to not use them to make political points....makes us no friends.

Posted by: changey at September 18, 2013 10:31 AM (f3GW1)

41 I already boycott Starbucks. Basically because the fetid sludge they call coffee tastes like it was brewed in Satan's asshole. The non-coffee frozen drinks are the only things in the joint that don't taste like shit and I am not inclined to pay $5+ for what is basically a milkshake. Just my 2cents. (Lurk mode: engaged)

Posted by: Mandy P., lurking lurker who lurks at September 18, 2013 10:32 AM (qFpRI)

42 The old "we'll be painted as nut jobs" theory. Tell me, do the Leftards have any other color of paint besides "RWNJ, Gun-nut and Racist"?


Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at September 18, 2013 10:32 AM (YmPwQ)

43 37This post was half-written when Ace put his up, so I just went ahead anyway.

What are you idiots looking for, coordination and communication? Don't you know where you are?

Posted by: JohnE. at September 18, 2013 02:30 PM (nRTou)

 

 

 

 

Exactly what I was thinking John. Fucking Kaboomers.......

Posted by: maddogg at September 18, 2013 10:32 AM (xWW96)

44 34 The only Starbucks coffee I like the blonde, less incinerated, stuff. A lot like the way vicious racist Jim Messina hires only blonde Vikings to staff his campaigns.

Posted by: Beagle at September 18, 2013 02:30 PM (sOtz/)



Just to be clear, I like my Vikings to be young and male, none of them dirty scandi chicks in my treefort

Posted by: Jim Messina, vicious racist and Obama Campaign Director at September 18, 2013 10:32 AM (Pr6hk)

45

Kind of like how John E. is going "behind enemy lines" and posting at Buzzfeed--

 

About that, while you're here JohnE.   I take it you're not on BuzzFeed's staff. How'd you do that?

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at September 18, 2013 10:33 AM (0HooB)

46 Forgot "homophobe". My bad.

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at September 18, 2013 10:33 AM (YmPwQ)

47 Exactly.

Posted by: Timwi at September 18, 2013 10:33 AM (pdhxN)

48 Open carry of a rifle in an urban or suburban setting should be legal. And other, more responsible gun owners should mock those assholes for being...assholes.

Open carry for me would be a full-sized semiautomatic pistol in a retention holster.

What the fuck is the point of carrying an AR-15? It's heavy, uncomfortable, bangs against shit when you sit down?

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at September 18, 2013 10:33 AM (gqgiP)

49

Clean up, aisle 33. 

Posted by: Beagle at September 18, 2013 10:33 AM (sOtz/)

50 Have I recently mentioned that Jim Messina, vicious racist and Obama Campaign Director, likes young boys as much as I do???

Posted by: Harry Reid is a pederast at September 18, 2013 10:33 AM (Pr6hk)

51 when did everybody decide to agree that Starbucks coffee sucks?

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 10:34 AM (8sCoq)

52

This is worth mentioning again, because coffee is an important part of life.

 

If you're financially in a position to do so, purchase a Jura Capresso machine.  It automatically makes a great espresso and their service is the best in the business.

 

If you just want great coffee, buy the liquid  coffee  concentrate (in small sizes (8- 32  oz, on Amazon.com) because it has a limited refrigerated shelf life.  Just add hot or cold water and it's ready.  Best fucking coffee ever. 

Posted by: jwest at September 18, 2013 10:34 AM (u2a4R)

53 *downs Midol* Huh. I thought we already fought this out fairly well already. Also, I read this as a request to not conceal carry either because the don't bring firearms in doesn't say openly. It says firearms. That would include concealed. It's a shame they decided to change the policy. Had gun rights activists sent emails or letters thanking the company for their policy and simply continued their patronage (while carrying when they otherwise would), I don't think it would have come to this. I maintain my position that this is passive aggressive dickweedery. Why? Because the only people being directly asked to stop doing something are those openly carrying firearms. Sure, sure, there's some oh and anti-gun people were rude too language in there but there is no direct "So stop causing a fuss in our stores and leave people alone". It's there by implication, but not directly. The only ones who are being told they are making others uncomfortable are those who are carrying. That right there says what side won. Oh and there is no change to the policy. Nope. It's just nudging and shaming. If anything, this has just dramatically increased the likelihood that people will open carry, just to make the counter point. That being said, Starbucks has every right to do this, being a confrontational douchebag is not restrained to one side of the aisle and using someone else's property for your political stunt is a dick move. I still want to open carry into a "progressive" bakery asking them to make my and LtK's wedding cake. Hilarity, etc.

Posted by: alexthechick - Team Buttercream Frosting With A Spoon at September 18, 2013 10:34 AM (VtjlW)

54

News so nice
We post it twice

 

The first post was for people who only read the comments.

 

This post is for people who read the post.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at September 18, 2013 10:35 AM (zF6Iw)

55 >>>http://tinyurl.com/py34tus

Open carry douche but the cop handles it awesomely.

That cop is a credit to his police force.  The "open carry douche" (well put) is absolutely insufferable.  He was clearly carrying in ORDER to cause a scene and maybe get in trouble with the cops.  Videotaping, refusing to provide any identification (which I don't quite understand - how can the cops verify that the guy is permitted to carry if they don't know his name?), acting all surly, and not even lightening up when it became obvious that the cop was a good guy. 

That's the same type as our "AR-15 Starbucks asshole" friend from the photo.  It's not about exercising a right to self-defense consistent with Second Amendment liberties, it's about empowering themselves with a public display of their brazen awesomeness.  I know I'm using dimestore psychology here and that's obviously speculative, but damn if these guys don't all come off the same way.

In the meantime they hurt the cause of liberty with their little exercise of Maslovian self-actualization, rather than promoting it.

Posted by: Jeff B. at September 18, 2013 10:35 AM (yemTi)

56 I don't even like AR-15s. What is the big fucking deal? Varmint rifle, light bullet, medium power. Give me an AR-10 and I am much more impressed.

Posted by: maddogg at September 18, 2013 10:35 AM (xWW96)

57 There a few things more irresponsible as a gun owner than bringing a rifle to a business with the express purpose of creating an argument or altercation, all for the glory of your YouTube channel.

------------------------------------------------------------

Yes, that's right. Open carry is a right, and one that should be defended...but not through actually open carrying. That's just outright irresponsibility and you're clearly looking for a fight, you crazy gun nuts.

Okay, now that I've returned to the article poster his own unfair mischaracterization of principles, intentions, and words, we're on even ground.

Concealed carry is now legal in my home state because of, not in spite of, the efforts of many open carriers when open carry was the only legal means of carrying a weapon. I don't give a flying fuck if it makes you uncomfortable. The guys in the corner making out make me uncomfortable. The big black guy with the "Kill Whitey" tattoo makes me uncomfortable. The fat cop who looks like he wants a fight(and has the authority to start one that he will win one way or another) makes me uncomfortable. The woman on her cell phone calling the cops because I told her kids to "shh" makes me uncomfortable.

America is supposed to be based on getting over your petty insecurities and allowing others to live their lives even if you disagree with them. You want to throw a fit because we're actually exercising our Second Amendment rights and you would not choose to do so? Too fucking bad.

Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 10:35 AM (U1/SO)

58 Trollbusters/janitors to #33 on the double, please.  Classic liberal moby bullshit.

Posted by: Jeff B. at September 18, 2013 10:36 AM (yemTi)

59 Don't get sidetracked into-- the Starbucks Battle. The winning argument is-- The Navy Shipyard Washington was about as close to a Liberal Gun Control Reality as you will ever get- and look what happened. No one engaged the shooter until the DC police arrived seven minutes after the 911 call--and then it took them two to three minutes to reach the building. Meanwhile 12 people were killed and 14 were injured. A military officer was sheltering in an office--behind the shooter--now if he had been legally allowed to carry a gun that he was trained to do.....

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 10:36 AM (r2PLg)

60 "The old "we'll be painted as nut jobs" theory. Tell me, do the Leftards have any other color of paint besides "RWNJ, Gun-nut and Racist"?"

I own guns, sometimes I carry. You will never see my gun, ever. If you do, it is because we are in immediate peril.

I don't give a crap what Leftards think.

I give a crap what normal people, my peers, think.

Posted by: navybrat at September 18, 2013 10:36 AM (kb15h)

61 >>>Pussy. It smells like pussy. Or chicken shit.

>>>The post I mean.

i'm not going to ban it but this is the sort of comment that's ripe for banning.

this is just the typical Angry Guy Without Anything Much to Say so he just says it as a drive by insult because he needs that catharsis of running his mouth (fingers) to let the world know he exists.

Like the YouTube commenters who just post "This sucks" and "ur gay"

Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 10:36 AM (/IWYB)

62

"What the fuck is the point of carrying an AR-15?"

 

It's to get attention.  And see, they got attention.  Which was the point of the exercise.  Sort of like the artists that paint a picture that is blasphemous to Christians.  It gets them attention which their lack of talent denies them.

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Outrage Outlet Happy Hour! Cocktails of Betrayal 50% Off! at September 18, 2013 10:36 AM (hLRSq)

63

when did everybody decide to agree that Starbucks coffee sucks?

 

Mine was at the first spit,  which was the price.   I've had better coffee from a 7-11.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at September 18, 2013 10:36 AM (0HooB)

64 >> About that, while you're here JohnE. I take it you're not on BuzzFeed's staff. How'd you do that?

They have an open community posting section.  My post was crushing their "hot views" section, which is why it was moved to the front page.

Posted by: JohnE. at September 18, 2013 10:36 AM (nRTou)

65 Look, we'll just let Starbuck's borrow the background screeners from the Navy and thus reassure the public that no harm will befall them.

Posted by: Bigby's Shadow Puppet Hands at September 18, 2013 10:36 AM (3ZtZW)

66

  An interesting comment or two in their discussion thread.... the ceo seems to be targeting open carry but.....

  ...he did ask that all patrons no longer bring guns into his stores or on the café seating outside his stores (this part of the letter doesn't make a distinction between open carry or CC) ...

 

  ...one commenter said that this is an effective ban per state laws (not sure which state he/she was referring to), so that even someone with a CC permit could possibly be prosecuted for carrying in a business that doesn't want any guns on their property?.... not sure if this is correct or not....not a lawyer or politically connected so best just to avoid all starbucks in future until this is made clear regarding CC.

 

  I like starbucks once in a while, but, I wouldn't want to face a potential criminal charge....due to one of their moonbat liberal customers or employees seeing a part of a holster under the shirt and then calling the cops...

Posted by: Some Guy in Wisconsin at September 18, 2013 10:37 AM (N/HlO)

67 >>>12

He's a douche because he's open carrying? I guess that makes you an asshole for internet commenting. Both are lawful, protected ways of exercising rights.

I see you don't see fit to call the cop a douche for also open carrying.

Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 10:37 AM (U1/SO)

68 Now tell me, what was the point of that? Any CCW class, or NRA gun safety program you take will relentlessly preach the importance of responsibility. There a few things more irresponsible as a gun owner than bringing a rifle to a business with the express purpose of creating an argument or altercation, all for the glory of your YouTube channel.

But they were open carrying empty guns. And they weren't seeking confrontations. Granted, they had reason to expect one might find them (courtesy the anti-gun folks), but they were merely seeking to exercise and show their support for the exercising of their rights. What's the point of rights if you have to be so cautious that you can't exercise them?

Posted by: red sweater at September 18, 2013 10:37 AM (oATMN)

69 i'll let 33 stand as and just let it embarrass the writer.

if it's a moby, whatever.

Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 10:37 AM (/IWYB)

70 Once again the liberal left wins the argument because they are willing to escalate the confrontation and escalate the intensity.

Posted by: Lewis Prothero, the Voice of Reason at September 18, 2013 10:38 AM (eL9Ah)

71 "...but there is no direct 'So stop causing a fuss in our stores and leave people alone.'"

Posted by: alexthechick - Team Buttercream Frosting With A Spoon at September 18, 2013 02:34 PM (VtjlW)

Hmmmm....AtC....not just a pretty face.

Excellent point.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at September 18, 2013 10:38 AM (gqgiP)

72 >>>Why did I think Andy? I must have read one of his comments in the thread.

well andy is the go-to gun guy.

Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 10:39 AM (/IWYB)

73 Counter-argument is a lot of gay rights activists did tons of over-the-top shit that, short term, hurt their cause. Of course, the gay rights movement was working from protected strongholds in the universities and big cities. The gun rights movement is more widespread, but has a strategic weakness in being unable to vanquish the anti-gun strongholds -- which are in the exact same place as the gay rights strongholds, universities and big cities.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at September 18, 2013 10:39 AM (ZPrif)

74 >>> Yes, that's right. Open carry is a right, and one that should be defended...but not through actually open carrying. That's just outright irresponsibility and you're clearly looking for a fight, you crazy gun nuts.  Okay, now that I've returned to the article poster his own unfair mischaracterization of principles, intentions, and words, we're on even ground.

I encourage you to actually watch the video.

Posted by: JohnE. at September 18, 2013 10:39 AM (nRTou)

75 You cannot "win" the Starbucks debate. Stay focused.

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 10:39 AM (r2PLg)

76 I see you don't see fit to call the cop a douche for also open carrying. *** Oh sheesh

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at September 18, 2013 10:40 AM (DmNpO)

77 He's a douche because he's open carrying? I guess that makes you an asshole for internet commenting. Both are lawful, protected ways of exercising rights. I see you don't see fit to call the cop a douche for also open carrying. Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 02:37 PM (U1/SO) ------------------- Look at the size of the e-cock on this fella!

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at September 18, 2013 10:40 AM (2fm0d)

78 Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 02:37 PM (/IWYB) Yeah, I'm thinkin' moby. Handle we've never heard before...hit and run posting... Of course, it may be a repeat visitor, I don't know.

Posted by: AR-15 AmishDude at September 18, 2013 10:41 AM (T0NGe)

79 Seeing someone with a gun in a visible holster is a little disturbing to people and I understand that. Nevertheless I was all for the Open Carry law in Oklahoma. That is because it removes any penalties for accidental exposure of a concealed weapon which is common with conceal carry laws. That second part pisses me off. If I carry concealed and I accidentally reveal a small part of the gun I can get nailed for brandishing. But open carry is legal without a CCW and I can carry in the open without meritorious legal hassle.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 10:41 AM (yETln)

80 All the people with sympathy for the lefty starbucks crap here is giving the left an inch that they'll use to take a mile.

Posted by: GMan at September 18, 2013 10:41 AM (sxq57)

81 50 when did everybody decide to agree that Starbucks coffee sucks? Well for me, the pivotal moment was when I accidentally put some in my mouth. YMMV

Posted by: Weirddave at September 18, 2013 10:41 AM (jt8G9)

82 Are we sure the guy with the AR is a gun rights advocate  and not   a   lefty provocateur?    I hate to agree because if I saw someone enter a store with an AR,   I would have to assess the situation in seconds to either,  if possible  exit the store or if not,  seek cover and be prepared to draw down.   Don't like to feel foolish just because someone decides to bring his  AR for cofffee. 

Posted by: polynikes at September 18, 2013 10:41 AM (m2CN7)

83 when I went to Starbucks I would drink my coffee at one of their outside tables, so I could smoke. Now they're taking that away. I don't care about the gun thing as much as I care about not being permitted to smoke OUTSIDE their store. OUTDOORS, where the wind is.

This pisses me off more than the gun issue.

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 10:42 AM (8sCoq)

84

I am a 20+ year Starbucks shareholder.  I work 5 minutes from the corporate office.  I don't own a gun... today.

 

The problem I have with the letter is its dishonest regarding who instigated the mess.  SBUX was dragged into the issue by the gun control advocates.  Then and only then the gun right side showed support for SBUX when in fact SBUX position was no position.  Now that SBUX has somewhat caved, they are encouraging the same bullying behavior from the left that started this whole mess.  Very cowardly on SBUX side if you ask me.

Posted by: AndrewsDad at September 18, 2013 10:42 AM (C2//T)

85

"You cannot "win" the Starbucks debate."

 

And that is mostly because it is the owner's right to say 'don't bring that into my store' and make that stick.

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Outrage Outlet Happy Hour! Cocktails of Betrayal 50% Off! at September 18, 2013 10:42 AM (hLRSq)

86 Well for me, the pivotal moment was when I accidentally put some in my mouth.

Just the sip.

Posted by: Starbucks at September 18, 2013 10:42 AM (uYaYO)

87 81 Are we sure the guy with the AR is a gun rights advocate and not a lefty provocateur? I hate to agree because if I saw someone enter a store with an AR, I would have to assess the situation in seconds to either, if possible exit the store or if not, seek cover and be prepared to draw down. Don't like to feel foolish just because someone decides to bring his AR for cofffee. Posted by: polynikes at September 18, 2013 02:41 PM (m2CN7) ******************* Well look at her damn gun--and the way she has it. Plus they dress up in black. Maybe Andy can take a closer look at it--but it looks fake to me.

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 10:43 AM (r2PLg)

88

They have an open community posting section. My post was crushing their "hot views" section, which is why it was moved to the front page.

 

Thanks. Good for you.  I don't    frequent BuzzFeed because BuzzFeed. If it's a Leftard site, I don't waste my   time  since I already know what it'll say.

 

That sounds like fun. I should maybe try    to  add to the 16 people over at my   little slice of Intawebz Heaven, conveniently linked in my nic.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at September 18, 2013 10:43 AM (0HooB)

89 Agreed.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at September 18, 2013 10:43 AM (IXrOn)

90 "It's a shame they decided to change the policy. Had gun rights activists sent emails or letters thanking the company for their policy and simply continued their patronage (while carrying when they otherwise would), I don't think it would have come to this." Most of did send emails and letters thanking the company for their policy and simply continued our patronage. That did happen. It has simply been overshadowed.

Posted by: BornLib at September 18, 2013 10:43 AM (zpNwC)

91 84 "You cannot "win" the Starbucks debate." And that is mostly because it is the owner's right to say 'don't bring that into my store' and make that stick. Posted by: Mikey NTH - Outrage Outlet Happy Hour! Cocktails of Betrayal 50% Off! at September 18, 2013 02:42 PM (hLRSq) ***************** Exactly.

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 10:43 AM (r2PLg)

92 >>>78 If I carry concealed and I accidentally reveal a small part of the gun I can get nailed for brandishing. But open carry is legal without a CCW and I can carry in the open without meritorious legal hassle.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Do you live in Texas? I have relatives who have had the same complaint. I don't understand the logic, either.

I bet you could get a few state legislators to bundle legalization of CC exposure in a bill and call it the "Gun Violence Minimization and Elimination Act". Hey, if they can do it with background checks...

Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 10:43 AM (U1/SO)

93 The most important point in this argument is Starbucks coffee sucks and I wouldn't drink it at gum point. It tastes like burnt dirt.

Posted by: JackStraw at September 18, 2013 10:44 AM (g1DWB)

94 The gun rights movement is more widespread, but has a strategic weakness in being unable to vanquish the anti-gun strongholds -- which are in the exact same place as the gay rights strongholds, universities and big cities. So why don't the liberals want gays to have guns? For that matter, I think gun control comes more from urbanites who are just afraid of scary black people with guns. Racism, straight up.

Posted by: AR-15 AmishDude at September 18, 2013 10:44 AM (T0NGe)

95

Wait.... so a company cannot decide not to serve you based on your Ethnicity, or Sexual orientation.... but can decide not to allow you in if you are following the Law of your State?

 

How is that NOT Discrimination?   If we are going to play by those rules.... then those rules should be equally applied...

 

Wow... back to that whole equal application thing the Repubs have been missing out on....

 

Either you have the RIGHT, as a business, NOT to Associate with others (as businesses are people according to the Supremes... and the right to associate must also give you the right not to associate).... or you MUST serve everyone equally as long as they are not breaking the law...

 

Can't see how you can have it both ways.

Posted by: Romeo13 at September 18, 2013 10:44 AM (lZBBB)

96 Well look at her damn gun--and the way she has it.


She's a lefty?  Left-handed?

Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 10:44 AM (GQ8sn)

97 "Are we sure the guy with the AR is a gun rights advocate and not a lefty provocateur?"


^ ^ ^ Ding, Ding, Ding!
We have a winner.

Posted by: navybrat at September 18, 2013 10:44 AM (kb15h)

98 What's the point of carrying an AR-15 into Starbucks? To make the hippies move a bit quicker and when I say "extra whip" I fucking mean it. You know how many times my order has been screwed up when the barrista says "The guy with the AR-15 is in a hurry and wants extra whip." Never. I show up with a yoga mat and I'm there for half a day and the extra whip just seems a little light.

Posted by: scofflawx, PhD Candidate at September 18, 2013 10:44 AM (Mmwdu)

99 And that is mostly because it is the owner's right to say 'don't bring that into my store' and make that stick.

Then maybe the owner shouldn't be a giant pussy and actually make that the policy.

Posted by: GMan at September 18, 2013 10:45 AM (sxq57)

100 when did everybody decide to agree that Starbucks coffee sucks? *** This is nothing new. The argument has been in play as long as Starbucks has been around. Their coffee is over-roasted and has a distinctly bitter and burnt taste to it. I do like their other items.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at September 18, 2013 10:45 AM (DmNpO)

101 >>>83

And that's what so frustrating. The Left demonstrates, and gets results. We are then lambasted for doing demonstrations of our own, because we "can't win".

Sounds like Boehner.

Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 10:45 AM (U1/SO)

102 All the people with sympathy for the lefty starbucks crap here is giving the left an inch that they'll use to take a mile.

Proof:
when I went to Starbucks I would drink my coffee at one of their outside tables, so I could smoke. Now they're taking that away. I don't care about the gun thing as much as I care about not being permitted to smoke OUTSIDE their store. OUTDOORS, where the wind is.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™, BFD, ZOMG, WTF, BBQ, QED at September 18, 2013 10:45 AM (/kI1Q)

103 Do you live in Texas? I have relatives who have had the same complaint. I don't understand the logic, either. Washington State.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 10:45 AM (yETln)

104 95 Well look at her damn gun--and the way she has it. She's a lefty? Left-handed? Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 02:44 PM (GQ8sn) ************** If it was a real weapon--the weight of it--I doubt it would stand in her shallow pocket like that.

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 10:46 AM (r2PLg)

105 The push for gun rights in America did come around the same time that blacks migrated from the South to the big cities in the northeast and midwest.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at September 18, 2013 10:46 AM (ZPrif)

106 1 Guns=scary mystifying to the left. Seems to me the more people are exposed to responsible carry the less mystifying and scary, no? And how is this responsible carry? If you come walking into a coffee shop crowded with women and children brandishing an AR15 with the mag inserted, why shouldn't I pull my legally concealed pistol and put your lights out before you get a chance to unload on said women and children? How is anyone supposed to know that you're just a jack ass and not some murderous nut?

Posted by: VADM (Red) Cuthbert Collingwood (Mentioned in Despatches) at September 18, 2013 10:46 AM (YLI2v)

107 Well stated.

It's a polite request.  A business should be able to maintain an environment that it's comfortable with.

Just like a bar should not *have* to allow transvestites if it doesn't want to.

I can respect that.

Posted by: eleven at September 18, 2013 10:46 AM (KXm42)

108 Once again the liberal left wins the argument because they are willing to escalate the confrontation and escalate the intensity.

In this case it was the attention whoring aspect of the open carry advocates that lost the argument by escalating the intensity. Hold your demonstrations on your own property douchebags.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at September 18, 2013 10:46 AM (+lsX1)

109 There's no open carry at Western Auto stores either. Or Howard Johnson's restaurants. The fad is passing, and in a geologically short time we'll laugh at the notion that there ever was a Starbuck's.

Starbuck's was the gourmet coffee for people who had never actually developed a taste for gourmet coffee, but wanted to be seen that way. Kind of a beatnik throwback. Cute marketing trick, but it's about over. They're not McDonald's.

And that name had nothing to do with Moby Dick. They're named after Georgie Starbuck, an anti-war poet of the old coffeehouse scene. He should have sued.

Posted by: Stringer Davis at September 18, 2013 10:46 AM (JNUY4)

110

82 "when I went to Starbucks I would drink my coffee at one of their outside tables, so I could smoke. "

 

God, those were the good old days. 

 

There is just something wonderful about sitting at an outside table, enjoying a coffee and a cigarette.  One of the most relaxing and enjoyable sensations in this life.

 

I miss it so much.

Posted by: jwest at September 18, 2013 10:47 AM (u2a4R)

111 Attention-grabbing protests at commercial establishments to influence public policy? Never heard of it. Except for every successful movement on the Left in the last two decades. Gay advocates, green-dolts, food-nazis, they didn't get their way by writing letters to the editor. Ditch the AR's, carry normally and make Starbucks enforce their policy, if they will.

Posted by: Lincolntf at September 18, 2013 10:47 AM (ZshNr)

112 "Are we sure the guy with the AR is a gun rights advocate and not a lefty provocateur?" ^ ^ ^ Ding, Ding, Ding! We have a winner. I'm not so sure. I've met my share of people chatting at the gun store who say outrageous things like, "I could put two in your chest before you draw." *blink* We were having a nice chat and you made it weird. I could see one of these douches being a open carry douche.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 10:47 AM (yETln)

113 And that is mostly because it is the owner's right to say 'don't bring that into my store' and make that stick.

 

 

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Outrage Outlet Happy Hour! Cocktails of Betrayal 50% Off! at September 18, 2013 02:42 PM (hLRSq)

 

 

Make them live by their own rules...  point out the Hypocricy of the idea that a business MUST cater to Gays, but may decide not to do business with someone doing something LEGAL in their State.

Posted by: Romeo13 at September 18, 2013 10:47 AM (lZBBB)

114 i sorta do see the point of the protest, normalizing gun ownership and etc.  Certainly the men were not threatening at all.  They were smug, but smug is not a crime.

I guess the trouble is basically the same trouble the leftist protesters bring.  A lot of times people just don't feel like dealing with someone else's issues.  No one feels like breaking through a crowd of "Chicken Killer" PeTA chanters just to get a bucket of KFC.

And yet such exhibitions, as annoying as they are, are usually legally protected (up to a point).

I dunno.  I think I may agree with John's emotional response but disagree with him on a rational level.  If the left does this sort of thing, I guess we're allowed to as well, right?

as far as winning converts: Most people don't really care about winning converts and most people really have no good idea how to go about doing that anyway.  People are going to be people.  They're going to Act Up because that's what a lot of people like doing.

I don't know if that's a bad thing.  Annoying, sure, but not bad.

Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 10:47 AM (/IWYB)

115 Fluke Starbucks. Maxwell House/Folgers for this non-pretentious moron. But I'm really posting this to say: Jim Messina is a racist.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at September 18, 2013 10:48 AM (7ObY1)

116 No shoes, no shirt, no service. It's the same law--I would hazard.

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 10:48 AM (r2PLg)

117 Yeah, what is the law on this? Restaurants actually aren't allowed to serve whoever they want. Is it just protected classes they can't refuse service to? Can Starbucks have a fuck-all-you-Republicans policy and refuse service?

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at September 18, 2013 10:48 AM (ZPrif)

118 If you're expecting corporations not to blow with winds of the loudest pressure groups, you'll be disappointed. Boeing caved on same-sex couple benefits even before California started allowing gay marriage. Corporations always run to avoid controversy, whatever that means in the location they're at.

Posted by: Hurricane LaFawnduh at September 18, 2013 10:48 AM (pginn)

119

>>>Plus they dress up in black.

 

So do Italian grannies... waitaminnit, I see the connection now

Posted by: Bigby's Shadow Puppet Hands at September 18, 2013 10:49 AM (3ZtZW)

120 From the prior thread if Bonhomme is still around.

302
If a private business has a "no firearms" sign, then you cannot enter with a concealed weapon."



True in WA. Also any place with no admittance to under 21 signs, also schools.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 01:59 PM (yETln)

Not true in WA. You can CC, and if asked to leave, you must comply. If you don't leave, you can be arrested for criminal trespass. Otherwise, nothing in the law requires you to avoid posted private businesses. The schools and under 21 prohibited places (such as bars or bar areas of restaurants) are specifically listed off limits areas in the RCWs.

Posted by: flounder at September 18, 2013 10:49 AM (Kkt/i)

121 >>>105 If you come walking into a coffee shop crowded with women and children brandishing an AR15 with the mag inserted, why shouldn't I pull my legally concealed pistol and put your lights out before you get a chance to unload on said women and children?

-------------------------------------------------------------

First, do you know what "brandishing" even means? Were these people walking in with rifles/pistols in hand? If not, then they were not brandishing them. They were carrying them. You may not care about the difference, but the cops sure would when you had to explain that you "put someone's lights out" because they were lawfully carrying a weapon.

I will say that your logic falls nicely in line with gun control advocates, though. Pre-emptive strikes before those crazy gun owners can go even crazier!

Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 10:49 AM (U1/SO)

122 Cute marketing trick, but it's about over. They're not McDonald's.

I never got the Starbucks thing.  It's coffee.

Posted by: eleven at September 18, 2013 10:49 AM (KXm42)

123

74 You cannot "win" the Starbucks debate.

Stay focused.

 

Kind of like 'you cannot win a land war in Asia' thingy. I quite agree.

Posted by: Chaos, it the other dark meat at September 18, 2013 10:49 AM (oDCMR)

124 I respect, but don't understand, the argument to not display weapons in legal open carry areas.  Yeah, those inherently evil pieces of metal are scary to some, but  as long as it's the law, they should be the ones to have to suck it up.  Lots of things near and dear to leftists are in our faces every day.  I don't like it, but no one is hot to ask them to hide the stuff that offends us.  That wouldn't even be considered.  This is exactly how the left has beat us for the last many years.  They cry and we decide that we must not offend.  I get the argument that we should be the grown-ups in the room, self-police, etc., but where does giving up our rights stop?  We are losing enough every day without volunteering to surrender more. 

Posted by: Havedash at September 18, 2013 10:49 AM (F0WNa)

125 I agree with the original poster.

Posted by: Serious Cat at September 18, 2013 10:49 AM (UypUQ)

126 If it was a real weapon--the weight of it--I doubt it would stand in her shallow pocket like that.


Doesn't look that odd to me.  It looks like a Kydex paddle holster to me.

Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 10:50 AM (GQ8sn)

127 Kenny Marchant ‏@RepKenMarchant 2m I'm about to question the #IRS Acting Commissioner in a Ways & Means Oversight hearing. Watch the hearing live here: http://bit.ly/1brxLBK

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at September 18, 2013 10:50 AM (DmNpO)

128 118 >>>Plus they dress up in black. So do Italian grannies... waitaminnit, I see the connection now Posted by: Bigby's Shadow Puppet Hands at September 18, 2013 02:49 PM (3ZtZW) ************* LOL! Vinchenzo!!!

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 10:50 AM (r2PLg)

129 "All the pics I have seen of open carry people in Starbucks have been clean cut, white, young people. Now, imagine you are sitting in a starbucks when a bunch of dreadlocked rastafarians come in exercising that same "right"." Now imagine they are all petite Asian women.

Posted by: BornLib at September 18, 2013 10:50 AM (zpNwC)

130 Starbucks  roasts  the  finest  coffee  beans  over  an  open  tire  fire  giving  their  swill  that  heady  aroma  of  the  city  dump. 

Posted by: Larsen E. Whipsnade at September 18, 2013 10:50 AM (rXcBX)

131

114  "Fluke Starbucks. Maxwell House/Folgers for this non-pretentious moron."

 

Try the liquid concentrate.  It's cheaper and so much better tasting.  You'll name your children after me for this tip. 

Posted by: jwest at September 18, 2013 10:50 AM (u2a4R)

132 I don't like open carry... why give the bad guy his first target?

I will continue to concealed carry into Starbucks until such a time as they post a legal sign prohibiting firearms.  I will also continue to carry  "conservative" books into the store and make sure the title is clearly visible.  Known and unknown tends to really set the moonbats hair on fire.  It seems to be the most effective way to drive leftists insane is to let them know you're not one of them.

Posted by: Sarah at September 18, 2013 10:50 AM (tRDWn)

133 In a way, this is not much different than the nudism debate in San Francisco.
People are exercising what they perceive to be their rights, but are managing to piss off every other person around them in the process. 

Posted by: navybrat at September 18, 2013 10:51 AM (kb15h)

134 "But they were open carrying empty guns. And they weren't seeking confrontations. Granted, they had reason to expect one might find them (courtesy the anti-gun folks), but they were merely seeking to exercise and show their support for the exercising of their rights."

Not looking for a confrontation?  Please.

You don't carry an empty AR into a coffeehouse for its utilitarian effectiveness as a self-defense weapon.  It's a political statement.  Political statements are usually confrontational one way or another.

A core tenet of  being a responsible armed citizen it to NOT seek confrontation.  They failed miserably.  Now we all have less than when we started because guys like this can't noodle out a proper venue for politicking.

Posted by: Jaws at September 18, 2013 10:51 AM (4I3Uo)

135 The Left has used attention whoring protests my entire life. Giant pink vaginas count as attention whoring, I think.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at September 18, 2013 10:51 AM (ZPrif)

136 This topic keeps bringing to mind the classic Sopranos scene where Christoper shoots the bakery clerk in the foot for not moving fast enough. And then utters the classic line "shit happens." Classic because of the meta-reference to the same actor's big scene in Goodfellas.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at September 18, 2013 10:51 AM (7ObY1)

137 Thanks for the info flounder.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 10:51 AM (yETln)

138 There were 10,924 Starbucks in the US in 2012. They did $13.29 Billion in sales.

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 10:51 AM (8sCoq)

139 You'll name your children after me for this tip.

"Dipshit Knight" has a nice ring to it.

Posted by: Name That Film at September 18, 2013 10:51 AM (/kI1Q)

140 As a white racist right wing gun nut job (what else am I missing) I will very happily avoid carrying in Starbucks. Because their coffee tastes like burned piss, strained through a layer of dung.

Posted by: traye at September 18, 2013 10:51 AM (W5G4i)

141 Try the liquid concentrate. It's cheaper and so much better tasting. You'll name your children after me for this tip. Interesting. I'll do just that.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at September 18, 2013 10:52 AM (7ObY1)

142 Yeah Starbucks isn't going away in our lifetimes.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at September 18, 2013 10:52 AM (ZPrif)

143 >>I never got the Starbucks thing. It's coffee. It's bad coffee. There's a little one off bakery/coffee shop not far from me. Great coffee, excellent pastries, etc., really nice kids who don't have fauk hawks, a ton of shit in their face and a snotty attitude and I can walk across the street to a nice park and have a cigarette and a great cup of coffee without having to speak a work of Italian or take out a loan.

Posted by: JackStraw at September 18, 2013 10:52 AM (g1DWB)

144 I am not a moby by any stretch of imagination and if reading at the sentence "Apparently, Starbucks didn't want to continue to have their stores be ground zero for a political debate." you did not think the same it means that  conservatives are no more and there is nothing to save any longer.

Posted by: fromabroad at September 18, 2013 10:52 AM (rnV3B)

145 "All the pics I have seen of open carry people in Starbucks have been clean cut, white, young people. Now, imagine you are sitting in a starbucks when a bunch of dreadlocked rastafarians come in exercising that same "right"." Now imagine they are all petite Asian women. Now imagine they're Black Panthers. Isn't that what led to Reagan supporting "gun control" in CA?

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 10:53 AM (yETln)

146 IMHO... Starbucks is trying to have their espresso and mocha latte too.

Posted by: 2nd Amendment Mother at September 18, 2013 10:53 AM (L4CWX)

147 >>>I'm not so sure. I've met my share of people chatting at the gun store who say outrageous things like, "I could put two in your chest before you draw." *blink*

there is a level of fetishization that gets creepy and crazy and wingutty.

Still, in any population, there are going to be wingnuts.  The guys who seek attention by being More Catholic Than the Pope on whatever cracks their nut.

But I guess John's post is useful in this way: A lot of times those guys are doing this because they think they're getting Hero Points.  They've constructed a Hero Narrative where they become heroes by engaging in silly nonsense.

Any time something has a some kind of secondary benefit attached to it, you're going to get more of that thing than you otherwise would (just as a basic economic point).

So perhaps we get too much of this sort of thing because not enough people on the right say, "Dude, you're not getting Hero Points from me for this."

That is to say, if only the people who grant the Hero Points speak up, and the people who either won't grant the Hero Points or will actually deduct them remain silent, it creates a dysfunctional market in which vendors of a good (Conspicuous Displays are the good here) are encouraged to produce more of that good than the market actually wants because the market signals that would otherwise indicate "We don't want more of this good" are being suppressed.




Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 10:53 AM (/IWYB)

148 I dunno. I think I may agree with John's emotional response but disagree with him on a rational level. If the left does this sort of thing, I guess we're allowed to as well, right?

Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 02:47 PM (/IWYB)

---------------------------------------------------------------

But isn't relying on emotional responses the prerogative of the Left, and their desire to ban "scary AR-15s", regardless of their actual usage in crime? Sure, we all want to give in to emotional responses, especially if we perceive a situation where our lives are in danger, but in the end our criteria for restricting the behavior of others needs to rely on reason.

And there is no rational thinking involved when people like the author of the post slander open carriers as "Youtube glory seekers". That's as much a smear as when Tea Partiers are called racist religious fanatics.

Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 10:53 AM (U1/SO)

149 He's a douche because he's open carrying? I guess that makes you an asshole for internet commenting. Both are lawful, protected ways of exercising rights. I see you don't see fit to call the cop a douche for also open carrying. Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 02:37 PM (U1/SO) No, he's a douche because the only reason he was open carrying was for attention. Then he wouldn't even give him his name. I can see if the cop was an ass but he was professional.

Posted by: RWC at September 18, 2013 10:53 AM (fWAjv)

150

113  No one feels like breaking through a crowd of "Chicken Killer" PeTA chanters just to get a bucket of KFC.

 

Personally, I would love to do this. Colonel Sanders' chicken deserves our respect and defense. I admit I was a little sore at KFC when they dropped the greens but the coleslaw softened the blow. The only reason to protest KFC is to prod them to improve their biscuits. Hint: use lard.

Posted by: Chaos, it the other dark meat at September 18, 2013 10:54 AM (oDCMR)

151 There were 10,924 Starbucks in the US in 2012. They did $13.29 Billion in sales.

Yeah but nobody likes it!

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at September 18, 2013 10:54 AM (+lsX1)

152

Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 02:47 PM (/IWYB)

 

You can overcommit though ace, and in doing so, lose your support.

Even though I told my comps committee in my paper "animal rights didn't catch on until the 1970s" that's actually not entirely true.

Anti-vivisectionists were a huge part of the background until about WWII.  Some stuff happened (not important) and then Animal rights (specifically Singer) were born.

Suddenly, there's terrorism related to it, and crazy claims that you should do experiments on infants rather than dogs.

The movement radicalizes for sure, but it's not entirely clear that it gained ground (I'm still working on that.)

So far based on what I'm looking at, only when other people came in and sorta "stabilized it" did the it really start picking up mainstream support again. (And even now, PETA is arguably still heavily discredited, but other less extreme organizations persist.)

The same thing could happen here too, if you start going off the wall with the "open carry everything!" you risk overcommitting and losing mainstream support.  Sure you get a more fervent crowd, but it's less in size.

Posted by: tsrblke at September 18, 2013 10:54 AM (GaqMa)

153 It's funny how everyone wants to outdo each other in describing how bad Starbucks coffee is

just say it tastes like Hitler

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 10:54 AM (8sCoq)

154

>>>Maxwell House/Folgers for this non-pretentious moron.

 

Fk that shit! Pabst Blue Ribbon!

 

I mean Chock Full O' Nutz

 

 

Posted by: Bigby's Shadow Puppet Hands at September 18, 2013 10:55 AM (3ZtZW)

155 >>>Wait.... so a company cannot decide not to serve you based on your Ethnicity, or Sexual orientation.... but can decide not to allow you in if you are following the Law of your State?

How is that NOT Discrimination? If we are going to play by those rules.... then those rules should be equally applied...

They are.  The general rule is that a private business can discriminate on pretty much any damn basis that they want.  That's why it's perfectly legal to post signs that say "no shoes, no shirt, no service" and enforce it, or why a fancy restaurant is well within its rights to not seat you and ask you to leave if you don't show up in proper attire.  They're trying to attract a certain clientele, and they have every right to ask someone who can't observe the dress code, or is creating a disturbance, to leave their property.  That's why Augusta National was well within its rights to prevent women from becoming members (although they let one in recently).

A key exception, post 1964 Civil Right Act, is discrimination on the basis of race.  This is the precise issue that got Rand Paul into trouble on MSNBC with Maddow, actually: his argument (the libertarian argument, basically) is that the CRA was problematic because private businesses (as opposed to, say, public carriers like a city bus line or a train) ought to have a right to discriminate against any citizen on any basis, and reap the consequences or rewards as society deems fit.  The problem with Paul's argument is that it was made for a fantasy world, not the one where a century's worth of Jim Crow law had created intense societal pressures and incentives for businesses to keep discriminating against blacks for no other reason than skin color.

Note that I'm only talking about discrimination in a commercial context.  Employment law is a whole 'nother ball of wax entirely.

Posted by: Jeff B. at September 18, 2013 10:55 AM (yemTi)

Posted by: Kansas at September 18, 2013 10:56 AM (X+Pyv)

157 Yeah but nobody likes it!

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at September 18, 2013 02:54 PM (+lsX1)


Its kind of like that shitty movie that everybody raves about to be cool and with the 'in' crowd but its just a really shitty movie.

Posted by: Red Shirt at September 18, 2013 10:56 AM (FIDMq)

158 >>>But isn't relying on emotional responses the prerogative of the Left...

no, that's just a pleasing self-flattery we tell ourselves.

>>>And there is no rational thinking involved when people like the author of the post slander open carriers as "Youtube glory seekers". That's as much a smear as when Tea Partiers are called racist religious fanatics.

slander?  Well, let's look at the facts: They posted it on YouTube, and they sought some kind of approbation.


Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 10:56 AM (/IWYB)

159 >>>148 Why give information to the police if you're not required by law to do so, especially if the police are hassling you over legal activity? They don't have a right to it.

Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 10:56 AM (U1/SO)

160 somebody deploy the 'hill to die on' meme for open carry at Starbucks

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 10:56 AM (8sCoq)

161 Hitler was pretty bitter, so I guess it does taste like him..

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at September 18, 2013 10:56 AM (ZPrif)

162 >>It's funny how everyone wants to outdo each other in describing how bad Starbucks coffee is Even funnier that people are worked up about anything Starbucks does. If they don't want your kind, don't go.

Posted by: JackStraw at September 18, 2013 10:56 AM (g1DWB)

163 >>>It's funny how everyone wants to outdo each other in describing how bad Starbucks coffee is

>>>just say it tastes like Hitler

Hitler wasn't burned.  Bitter yes, burned no.


Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 10:57 AM (/IWYB)

164 Woo hoo, Ben's keeping the pump going! Best news I've had all week. That means S&P 1700, pay raises in 2014....

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at September 18, 2013 10:57 AM (Ec6wH)

165 "First, do you know what "brandishing" even means? Were these people walking in with rifles/pistols in hand? If not, then they were not brandishing them. They were carrying them. You may not care about the difference, but the cops sure would when you had to explain that you "put someone's lights out" because they were lawfully carrying a weapon. I will say that your logic falls nicely in line with gun control advocates, though. Pre-emptive strikes before those crazy gun owners can go even crazier! Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 02:49 PM (U1/SO)" I agree with you in general but if you look at the pic in Ace's post that dumbass is brandishing.

Posted by: BornLib at September 18, 2013 10:57 AM (zpNwC)

166

Yeah but nobody likes it!

 

And the portions are small, too.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at September 18, 2013 10:57 AM (0HooB)

167 what I'm saying is that Starbucks is worse than Hitler.

obviously.

Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 10:57 AM (/IWYB)

168 I'm not seeing how my argument is emotional.  It's a disagreement with this strategy.

Posted by: JohnE. at September 18, 2013 10:57 AM (nRTou)

169 Hitler wasn't burned. Bitter yes, burned no. Well, actually....

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie in the Reichsgarten at September 18, 2013 10:57 AM (Ec6wH)

170 Yeah Starbucks isn't going away in our lifetimes.

Bizarre.  It's just coffee.

Obviously there's more to it than that.  I'm just missing it.

Posted by: eleven at September 18, 2013 10:58 AM (KXm42)

171

"Make them live by their own rules... point out the Hypocricy of the idea that a business MUST cater to Gays, but may decide not to do business with someone doing something LEGAL in their State."

 

It is legal to carry a protest sign.  I can tell you to take that out of my store.

Gay is a little different from carrying a protest sign or a slung rifle.  The property owner does have certain rights and can say that and make it stick.  And I do not have a problem with that. 

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Outrage Outlet Happy Hour! Cocktails of Betrayal 50% Off! at September 18, 2013 10:58 AM (hLRSq)

172 Perhaps you think this will appease those that do not like guns. As a side note: I am all for the pissing on and burning of Korans. What would the neighbors say?!

Posted by: nip at September 18, 2013 10:58 AM (jI23+)

173 Mr. Schultz should have the balls to change his policy and put a NO FIREARMS sign on all his stores.

Just settle the debate once and for all instead of mealy-mouthing around.

Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 10:58 AM (GQ8sn)

174 Once again the liberal left wins the argument because they are willing to escalate the confrontation and escalate the intensity.

In this case it was the attention whoring aspect of the open carry advocates that lost the argument by escalating the intensity. Hold your demonstrations on your own property douchebags.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at September 18, 2013 02:46 PM (+lsX1)


Thank you for that effective demonstration of how to win an argument.

Posted by: Lewis Prothero, the Voice of Reason at September 18, 2013 10:58 AM (eL9Ah)

175 >>>157

Yes, they posted the video of the incident that led to them being criminally charged for lawful conduct on YouTube. Wouldn't you, under similar circumstances, in order to keep the record straight?

Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 10:58 AM (U1/SO)

176 >>>Bizarre. It's just coffee.

>>>Obviously there's more to it than that. I'm just missing it.

you obviously know nothing of my work


Posted by: ace wants to know how many damn times he has to write the same post at September 18, 2013 10:58 AM (/IWYB)

177 Boeing caved on same-sex couple benefits even before California started allowing gay marriage. Corporations always run to avoid controversy, whatever that means in the location they're at. Universities had such policies too. They would give "spousal benefits" based on a joint bank account. No, really. But, thanks to budget cuts, etc., that's all going away. They're starting to say "Gotta be married or nothing" because there's not an excuse anymore. Unintended consequences.

Posted by: AR-15 AmishDude at September 18, 2013 10:59 AM (T0NGe)

178 Carrying a holstered or pocketed handgun, concealed or open, is practical. The weapon is secured to your body and readily accessible, while not ostentatiously displayed, or required to be carried in your hand. There's no practical way to carry an AR-15 except at the ready. They're bulky, heavy and a pain in the ass to keep track of, unless they're slung, rendering them useless for their supposed purpose. I should know. For most of my 20s, I carried M-16 and M-4s, with and without grenade launchers, M249 SAWs, M60s and M240Bs. I wouldn't carry any of them into a coffee shop unless I was trying to make a spectacle of myself. Because you know what's necessary to drink coffee? Your fucking HANDS.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at September 18, 2013 11:00 AM (2fm0d)

179 you know a nursing woman has the right to nurse her baby at a restaurant but if she's got big gigantic cans and starts showing them off with no discretion it's going to cause some problems.


Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 11:00 AM (/IWYB)

180 in CO 'brandishing' means to display a firearm in a threatening manner


I suppose the jury would decide what threatening means



Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 11:00 AM (8sCoq)

181

Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 02:57 PM (/IWYB)

 

You're unaware of how Hitler died aren't you ace. (Or rather the "after" part.)

Posted by: tsrblke at September 18, 2013 11:00 AM (GaqMa)

182 Corporations always run to avoid controversy, whatever that means in the location they're at. Ace lets my life partner post here on my subscription. BTW, I say "where's he/she/it at" too. Is that a Midwestern thing?

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at September 18, 2013 11:01 AM (Ec6wH)

183 >>>166

Folgers' Law?

Posted by: YourPoopyPants at September 18, 2013 11:01 AM (U1/SO)

184 Obviously there's more to it than that. I'm just missing it. *** I started going to Starbucks when they started popping up at every other interstate exit. They have clean bathrooms. And, I never use the facilities at an establishment without buying something. That's how I came to try their gingerbread.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at September 18, 2013 11:01 AM (DmNpO)

185 Hitler wasn't burned. Bitter yes, burned no. WUT? Do you believe the rumors he got away and went to Argentina? They shot him and Eva, then burned them in a ditch with gasoline.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 11:01 AM (yETln)

186 125 If it was a real weapon--the weight of it--I doubt it would stand in her shallow pocket like that. Doesn't look that odd to me. It looks like a Kydex paddle holster to me. Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 02:50 PM (GQ8sn) ************* Okay. Still it looks too light in her pocket--if you know what I mean....

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 11:01 AM (r2PLg)

187 I'd say Starbucks is more like Mussolini: oddly dressed, annoying, overly dramatic but largely forgettable. No one forgets Hitler - he goes to eleventy.

Posted by: Chaos, it the other dark meat at September 18, 2013 11:01 AM (oDCMR)

188

Posted by: Jeff B. at September 18, 2013 02:55 PM (yemTi)

 

Tell that to the Cake company in Washington who is being sued out of existence for not making a cake for a Gay wedding...

 

Tell that to the companies who have been forced to spend tons of cash on the American for Disabilities act overboard insanity ( I have yet to visit a hotel pool where the lift chair has been used...).

 

Yes.... a company should be able to choose who they do business with... but the Government has already stuck its fingers in that pie and muddied the rules... so the question becomes what is the line TODAY.... (and how do we force that line back towards Private Property being PRIVATE).

Posted by: Romeo13 at September 18, 2013 11:02 AM (lZBBB)

189 >>>You're unaware of how Hitler died aren't you ace. (Or rather the "after" part.)

i guess so. I just know he shot himself and his she-whore.


Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 11:02 AM (/IWYB)

190 For most of my 20s, I carried M-16 and M-4s, with and without grenade launchers, M249 SAWs, M60s and M240Bs.

When you weren't chasing us down in a Bradley, you mean.

Posted by: Pronghorn Local 132 at September 18, 2013 11:02 AM (uYaYO)

191

And a newspaper.

 

An outside table, a great cup of coffee, a cigarette and a newspaper.  That's all I need.

 

 

 

Oh, and a thermos.

Posted by: jwest at September 18, 2013 11:02 AM (u2a4R)

192 I don't drink Starbucks. Or coffee at all, really. It's just gonna take a lot more than pissing off gun activists to bankrupt Starbucks. They are everywhere. Starbucks has the 3rd most # of stores in America. #1 is McDonalds 26k #2 is Subway 14k #3 is Starbucks 11k #4 is Dunkin 7k #5 is Burger King 7k Starbucks isn't going anywhere

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at September 18, 2013 11:02 AM (ZPrif)

193 but i'm actually very sick and rundown this week so my brain is going to be missing some things.

I'm taking friday off I think.


Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 11:02 AM (/IWYB)

194 "Hitler wasn't burned. Bitter yes, burned no."

Yeah, he and Ava kinda were barbecued  in the courtyard  postmortem.

Posted by: Jaws at September 18, 2013 11:02 AM (4I3Uo)

195 Is it true that Maetenloch uses his skivvies to filter his coffee?

Posted by: Maete at September 18, 2013 11:02 AM (Cs2tJ)

196 The real pussy is the guy that decided to bring his rifle into the Starbucks and then posed to have his photo taken. Might as well have pulled out his dick too. Wouldn't be surprised to find he has one of those nut sacks dangling from the trailer hitch on his truck. Douche.

Posted by: steve walsh at September 18, 2013 11:03 AM (ANvDa)

197 142 >>I never got the Starbucks thing. It's coffee. It's bad coffee. There's a little one off bakery/coffee shop not far from me. Great coffee, excellent pastries, etc., really nice kids who don't have fauk hawks, a ton of shit in their face and a snotty attitude and I can walk across the street to a nice park and have a cigarette and a great cup of coffee without having to speak a work of Italian or take out a loan. Posted by: JackStraw at September 18, 2013 02:52 PM (g1DWB) Do you remember Barnie's? To this day it's the only chain of coffee shops I've ever been to where I actually enjoyed their coffee. And they weren't crazy on the prices. All of them here went out of business about 8 or 9 years ago and were promptly replaced by fricking Starbucks. I was very disappointed.

Posted by: Mandy P., lurking lurker who lurks at September 18, 2013 11:03 AM (qFpRI)

198 180 Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 02:57 PM (/IWYB) You're unaware of how Hitler died aren't you ace. (Or rather the "after" part.) Posted by: tsrblke at September 18, 2013 03:00 PM (GaqMa) ****** Eva poisoned his coffee--and his last words were-- "this tastes kind of bitter"?

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 11:03 AM (r2PLg)

199

Posted by: AR-15 AmishDude at September 18, 2013 02:59 PM (T0NGe)

 

One of the progressive universities around here grants it to "two adults living at the same address regardless of relationship" (if you chose that plan).

The lab manager at my university switched to our insurance so his wife could switch to that plan (she worked at the progressive university) and enroll their son as her "+1" after he lost his job in the great recession (he found a new one about a year later.)

I laughed at the whole situation as a clever use of a rule.

Posted by: tsrblke at September 18, 2013 11:04 AM (GaqMa)

200 >>>They shot him and Eva, then burned them in a ditch with gasoline.

really? So he actually COULD have been spirited away to Argentina with another body standing in for his own?


Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 11:04 AM (/IWYB)

201 Starbucks' response is to stop the response by the Right. StarbucksÂ’ response was to continue selling as much coffee as they can. Leftist protests werenÂ’t influencing people to buy coffee elsewhere, IÂ’m guessing. When open carry was just something people did only in areas where it was normal anyway, that also did not influence people against buying Starbucks coffee. When open carry started to make coffee purchasers uncomfortable in Starbucks stores, then Starbucks did something. ThatÂ’s my guess, anyway. I very often make the argument that things are not seen as political when the left argues it, and only become political when thereÂ’s a response. IÂ’m not seeing that here.

Posted by: Stephen Price Blair at September 18, 2013 11:04 AM (QF8uk)

202 For the top 50 chains in America. Starbucks was the 2nd fastest growing in 2012. Subway was #1 with 956 new stores. Starbucks was #2 with 341 new stores. America has spoken. And they like Starbucks. I personally don't. But I don't do coffee.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at September 18, 2013 11:04 AM (ZPrif)

203 As it turns out I am sitting in a Starbucks right now drinking a large cup of their Pike Place coffee.  I am not carrying openly because that is not legal in Texas but I am exercising my CHL.

Posted by: Obnoxious A-hole at September 18, 2013 11:04 AM (ms5Fa)

204 alright, I'm going to kick the hornet's nest here, just for the hell of it. Because y'all is my boon companions.


what is the purpose of open carry? And just to make it harder, you can't say 'because I have rights dammit!' What gun ownership/use problem are you trying to solve by carrying a handgun on your hip in plain view?


Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 11:04 AM (8sCoq)

205

I'm taking friday off I think.

 

Rest up, oh Furry One.  Just have one of the cobs run a music thread on Friday afternoon and we'll all be fine.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at September 18, 2013 11:05 AM (0HooB)

206 Meh. Never been a big fan of open carry anyway, though that could be an unconscious concession to shit like this. Concealed is easy enough to do with the right gun/holster combo.

Posted by: Scott M at September 18, 2013 11:05 AM (AdBfq)

207

>>>but i'm actually very sick and rundown this week so my brain is going to be missing some things.

 

You should ban everybody for a day LOL

Posted by: Bigby's Shadow Puppet Hands at September 18, 2013 11:05 AM (3ZtZW)

208 There are many reasons to be hesitant about open carry - one of which is that there WILL be many 911 calls, and it ties up resources better spent on other shit than the carrier's vanity.

Posted by: grognard at September 18, 2013 11:05 AM (/29Nl)

209 Because you know what's necessary to drink coffee? Your fucking HANDS.

Hello, this is what a sling is for! So you can wear your insulated Camelbak filled with coffee while you carry your unloaded rifle to demonstrate your rights to the idiot sheeple.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at September 18, 2013 11:05 AM (+lsX1)

210 but i'm actually very sick and rundown this week so my brain is going to be missing some things. *** I'm sorry to learn you're not feeling well. On the bright side, you seem very casual and light-hearted today. Feel better soon!

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at September 18, 2013 11:05 AM (DmNpO)

211 >As it turns out I am sitting in a Starbucks right now drinking a large cup of their Pike Place coffee.


some commenters will make fun of you. Don't you know that coffee tastes like dirt. The science is settled.

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 11:05 AM (8sCoq)

212

@Ace,

They burned his remains so his body couldn't be burned through the streets.

(The crappy software won't let me link Wikipedia, so I twitted it at you.)

Posted by: tsrblke at September 18, 2013 11:05 AM (GaqMa)

213 QSR magazine is the source for these stats. Quick Service Restaurant magazine. Starbucks is also #3 in revenue. McDs and Subwas are #1 and #2. Wendy's and Burger King are #4 and #5.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at September 18, 2013 11:06 AM (ZPrif)

214 I carried an M16 for just a few years and unless I was going to the range, I hated lugging the thing around, especially for months in the field. Talk about the panic of "Hey, where's my wallet?" , try "Fuck, where's my rifle!?!". I don't need to spend all day in a hyper vigilant state over a gun I don't intend to fire.

Posted by: Lincolntf at September 18, 2013 11:07 AM (ZshNr)

215 but i'm actually very sick and rundown this week so my brain is going to be missing some things.

I'm taking friday off I think.


Posted by: ace

 

That comment SUX!  UR GAY!

Posted by: Youtube Commenter at September 18, 2013 11:07 AM (BrQrN)

216 really? So he actually COULD have been spirited away to Argentina with another body standing in for his own? Last I heard the Russians had a piece of his jaw and skull from the site and they weren't allowing forensics on it.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 11:07 AM (yETln)

217 >>Do you remember Barnie's? I don't think we had them here. I'm in the northeast and this is the home of Dunkin Donuts. Lot's of open carry in Dunkins. Most of them wearing badges. Don't think they get robbed to often.

Posted by: JackStraw at September 18, 2013 11:07 AM (g1DWB)

218

>>>As it turns out I am sitting in a Starbucks right now drinking a large cup of their Pike Place coffee. I am not carrying openly because that is not legal in Texas but I am exercising my CHL.

 

**every hipster in the joint looks up from their laptops tablets and iphones, eyeing each other like it was a B-movie Mexican standoff**

 

**tumbleweed blows by**

 

'quiet. too quiet.'

Posted by: Bigby's Shadow Puppet Hands at September 18, 2013 11:08 AM (3ZtZW)

219 what is the purpose of open carry? And just to make it harder, you can't say 'because I have rights dammit!' What gun ownership/use problem are you trying to solve by carrying a handgun on your hip in plain view?

-----------------------------------------------------------

Up until 2012, it was the only way to lawfully carry in the State of Wisconsin. It's also one of the only lawful ways to carry in the State of California because getting a CC permit can be damned near impossible. And for what it's worth, OWB holsters, in my experience, are a lot more comfortable and easy to draw from than most CC holsters.

All that aside...yes, it is a right. If that's not enough, oh well. Still a right.

Posted by: Michael at September 18, 2013 11:08 AM (Y/HG5)

220

I  know its  not exactly on point but  even when open carry was the way of the land in the western territories ,  cowboys and ranchers and settlers  didn't go into establishments with their long rifles.  It would send a different message to other patrons.   You want to show Starbuck appreciation for allowing open carry,  wear your  sidearm.   

 

Yes they were within  the law.  No it is not helpful to the cause.

 

Posted by: polynikes at September 18, 2013 11:09 AM (m2CN7)

221 Starbucks tastes like Pol-Pot's dump if he ate Hitler wearing Stalin's skin. What do I win?

Posted by: Mr. Feverhead at September 18, 2013 11:09 AM (SzAZ7)

222 Last I heard the Russians had a piece of his jaw and skull from the site and they weren't allowing forensics on it. *** Bob Hope was one of the folks allowed into his bunker by the soldiers. He took his flag and the handle off his toilet.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at September 18, 2013 11:09 AM (DmNpO)

223 Posted by: JackStraw at September 18, 2013 03:07 PM (g1DWB) Dunkin Donuts coffee isn't bad. Not my favorite, but not bad either. It tastes better with a toasted coconut donut, though.

Posted by: Mandy P., lurking lurker who lurks at September 18, 2013 11:09 AM (qFpRI)

224 >but i'm actually very sick and rundown this week so my brain is going to be missing some things.I'm taking friday off I think.
Posted by: ace <

Dude you need to take better care of yourself. If I had a nickel for every time you've been sick or didn't feel good- I'd be a rich man.

Posted by: Marcus at September 18, 2013 11:09 AM (GGCsk)

225 I thinks Starbucks coffee tastes pretty damn great.

Posted by: Jeff B. courting controversy as only he can at September 18, 2013 11:10 AM (yemTi)

226 We had Barnie's down here. They had a  Holiday coffee  called "Santa's White Christmas" that was  awesome. 

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at September 18, 2013 11:10 AM (0HooB)

227 "They're not going away in our lifetime"?
Neither is communism, but I don't have to buy stock in it.
HoJo's didn't vanish because somebody else came up with cheaper clam strips.

For God's sake, people, can't anybody make their own coffee anymore?
It's just not that hard. Or time consuming. Once you get it right, you'll never want nut-flavored sodee-pop again. If you're so busy and important you can't spend 5 minutes preparing your own drink, you're too damn busy and important. Grow up.

Posted by: Stringer Davis at September 18, 2013 11:10 AM (JNUY4)

228 what is the purpose of open carry? And just to make it harder, you can't say 'because I have rights dammit!' What gun ownership/use problem are you trying to solve by carrying a handgun on your hip in plain view? I don't carry openly so grain of salt here. Concealed carry is uncomfortable, and limits your clothing options. Also I think most open carry people believe that if a bad guy sees you with a gun they're less likely to do something illegal near you.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 11:10 AM (yETln)

229

My wife just downloaded the Starbucks app for Iphone that finds the nearest location.

 

It doesn't work.

Posted by: jwest at September 18, 2013 11:10 AM (u2a4R)

230 "What gun ownership/use problem are you trying to solve by carrying a handgun on your hip in plain view?"

I'll answer by saying OC is faster to access and a hell of a lot more comfortable in carrying a bigger pistol when it's hotter than hell.  That said, those  are rarely the  reasons The OC Movement does it.  They do it   as  political shock theatre.

Tactically (yeah, I used the T-word), the tradeoff  in conspicuousness and potential police harassment is  not worth it.


Posted by: Jaws at September 18, 2013 11:11 AM (4I3Uo)

231

Posted by: Lincolntf at September 18, 2013 03:07 PM (ZshNr)

 

I had that feeling once when I thought I had left my carry gun in a public restroom.   100 foot pit drop in the stomach. 

Posted by: polynikes at September 18, 2013 11:11 AM (m2CN7)

232 222 >but i'm actually very sick and rundown this week so my brain is going to be missing some things.I'm taking friday off I think. Posted by: ace < Dude you need to take better care of yourself. If I had a nickel for every time you've been sick or didn't feel good- I'd be a rich man. Posted by: Marcus at September 18, 2013 03:09 PM (GGCsk) ****************** It's possible that over exposure to the news--can make you sick. Unfortunately in the Information Age--the survival instinct and terrorism probably gets people hooked on it. News Junkie.

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 11:11 AM (r2PLg)

233

The simple fact of the matter is this: Starbucks, as a Prog company, has endorsed laws that take away a business owner's property rights and ability to determine who s/he will or will not serve, as well as laws that create a magical "offended" category for words, speech, and deeds.

Therefore, as far as I am concerned, their attempt to prevent me from open-carrying in their stores constitutes discrimination, is offensive to me, and interferes with my Constitutional rights.

And they can and should be sued for it.

That is what it will take -- forcing the Progs to live under the rules that they intend to impose on the rest of us and that we are historically disinclined to support.

Take a lesson from Israel. They long ago realized they were up against murderous fanatics that would not stop killing until they were killed, and they made the choice that killing the fanatics was a less-worse choice than dying.

When the Progs are properly cowed, then we can return to respect and civilized behavior. But Progs do not respect others and do not act civilly, and it is stupid and foolish for us to sacrifice our rights for their behavior.

Posted by: North Dallas Thirty at September 18, 2013 11:11 AM (VcVIw)

234

223  "I thinks Starbucks coffee tastes pretty damn great."

 

Always trying to stir up some shit.

 

Why can't you just get along like me?

Posted by: jwest at September 18, 2013 11:12 AM (u2a4R)

235

>>>HoJo's didn't vanish because somebody else came up with cheaper clam strips.

 

Nope. Roofers refused to handle orange tiles

Posted by: Bigby's Shadow Puppet Hands at September 18, 2013 11:12 AM (3ZtZW)

236 200 For the top 50 chains in America. Starbucks was the 2nd fastest growing in 2012. Subway was #1 with 956 new stores. Starbucks was #2 with 341 new stores. America has spoken. And they like Starbucks. I personally don't. But I don't do coffee. Posted by: Flatbush Joe at September 18, 2013 03:04 PM (ZPrif) Starbucks also closed a whole mess of locations a few years back. The economic downturn hurt them. They closed two locations just on the street where I work.

Posted by: BornLib at September 18, 2013 11:12 AM (zpNwC)

237 For God's sake, people, can't anybody make their own coffee anymore? *** I LOVE my Keurig and have played with all the different coffees as if I were a kid in a toy store. In the end, my favorites are Folgers Black Silk and Starbucks House decaf. See. There IS a Starbucks I like.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at September 18, 2013 11:12 AM (DmNpO)

238 some commenters will make fun of you. Don't you know that coffee tastes like dirt. The science is settled.

It tastes like coffee.  Which is....coffee.

It's like if there was this booming lemonade franchise on every street corner.

Posted by: eleven at September 18, 2013 11:13 AM (KXm42)

239 For God's sake, people, can't anybody make their own coffee anymore? It's just not that hard. Or time consuming. Once you get it right, you'll never want nut-flavored sodee-pop again. If you're so busy and important you can't spend 5 minutes preparing your own drink, you're too damn busy and important. Grow up. Slow Clap! And having just spent a week of percolating coffee on a campfire (takes about half an hour to be stronger than weak tea) I appreciate a 5-minute Mr. Coffee or a 10-second Keurig machine even more.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at September 18, 2013 11:13 AM (7ObY1)

240 I went to Starbucks and stirred a latte with my AR barrel while a mother and child hid in the corner by the bean selection. That will show them.

Posted by: Billy-Bob Beer Can at September 18, 2013 11:13 AM (GGCsk)

241 What the hell? Are you all getting your Hitler death knowledge from wikipedia or something? The Soviets released photos of his death back in the late 80's and it was NOT a gunshot wound. http://tinyurl.com/npm38jk

Posted by: RWC at September 18, 2013 11:13 AM (fWAjv)

242 >I thinks Starbucks coffee tastes pretty damn great.

Posted by: Jeff B. courting controversy as only he can at September 18, 2013 03:10 PM (yemTi)



Jeff, you have given me the courage to speak out.

I buy Starbucks Espresso Roast at the grocery and I bring it home and make the coffee with my trusty Mister Coffee maker I got at Lowe's and I gotta tell you, the coffee tastes pretty good.

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 11:13 AM (8sCoq)

243 Pancho was a bandit boy,
His horse was fast as polished steel
He wore his gun outside his pants
For all the honest world to feel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMPydiR4NaQ


Posted by: LC LaWedgie at September 18, 2013 11:13 AM (6xhLc)

244 Hey Maet, your Civet grande with a twist of foreskin is ready.

Posted by: FUBAR at September 18, 2013 11:13 AM (Cs2tJ)

245 You sound great John E! Listening now. I think Starbucks misses their cooler-than-thou clientele, this is a crappy PR attempt to get them back. But I don't see a Starbucks appreciation day from the left in their future for it.

Posted by: LizLem at September 18, 2013 11:14 AM (8wqqE)

246 I enjoy the coffee. But since the office got a Keurig machine I am saving about $1,000 a

Posted by: Marcus at September 18, 2013 11:14 AM (GGCsk)

247 The worst feeling ever. Fortunately, mine was in the cab of my vehicle, where I had foolishly left it when I took a nap in the tent. If anyone had opened my vehicle door, I'd probably have been Article 15'd ( think small claims court martial) on the spot.

Posted by: Lincolntf at September 18, 2013 11:14 AM (ZshNr)

248 "I like the Starbucks dark roast along with my .45 on my hip." FUCK YOU. Starbucks blonde with a 9mm you fucking fuckerer of .45 fuckery!

Posted by: RWC at September 18, 2013 11:15 AM (fWAjv)

249 I had a guy tell me that Hitler's favorite cartoon character was Donald Duck...well credentialed in the area too. I cannot find verification of that anywhere. He has this whole Donald Duck vs. Mickey Mouse joke...

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 11:16 AM (r2PLg)

250 >For God's sake, people, can't anybody make their own coffee anymore?

now when you say 'make their own' do you mean using a coffeemaker at your house, or buying land in Central America and planting coffee plants and harvesting and roasting the beans and then grinding them up and making coffee?

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 11:16 AM (8sCoq)

251 224 We had Barnie's down here. They had a Holiday coffee called "Santa's White Christmas" that was awesome. Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at September 18, 2013 03:10 PM (0HooB) BB, you're in Central FL, right? I remember when I was working in downtown Orlando/Colonial area and they had the Barnie's store in the same plaza as that big Barnes and Noble. I loved the Santa's White Christmas coffee. It was a nice seasonal treat. And yes, I do make my own coffee. I am, at this moment, enjoying my third cup of cheap-ass Harmony Bay coffee I got in a huge tin from Wal-Mart. I am also a big fan if the Mystic Monks coffee.

Posted by: Mandy P., lurking lurker who lurks at September 18, 2013 11:16 AM (qFpRI)

252 Its kind of like that shitty movie that everybody raves about to be cool and with the 'in' crowd but its just a really shitty movie. Posted by: Red Shirt at September 18, 2013 02:56 PM (FIDMq) I thought the Horde consensus was that Prometheus sucked donkey balls.

Posted by: alexthechick - Team Buttercream Frosting With A Spoon at September 18, 2013 11:16 AM (VtjlW)

253

FUCK YOU. Starbucks blonde with a 9mm you fucking fuckerer of .45 fuckery!

 

Aaaaand    they're off.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at September 18, 2013 11:17 AM (0HooB)

254 Basically if you like Donald Duck better than Mickey Mouse--you could be an assh*le. (or something.)

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 11:17 AM (r2PLg)

255 Hey remember in the 90's when people who wanted to own ARs, AKs, and SKSs were just a bunch of assholes who were going to ruin the 2nd Amendment for the rest of us?

Posted by: BornLib at September 18, 2013 11:17 AM (zpNwC)

256 I make my own Ketchup.

Posted by: eleven at September 18, 2013 11:17 AM (KXm42)

257 OT: Helicopter Ben not ready to taper yet, printers continue roaring along.

Posted by: joncelli at September 18, 2013 11:17 AM (RD7QR)

258 just say it tastes like Hitler

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 02:54 PM (8sCoq)


I loved me a good cup of Hitler.

Posted by: flounder at September 18, 2013 11:18 AM (Kkt/i)

259 "I like the Starbucks dark roast along with my .45 on my hip."


FUCK YOU. Starbucks blonde with a 9mm you fucking fuckerer of .45 fuckery!

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Fuck you both, since you're too pussy to pack 357SIG.

Posted by: Michael at September 18, 2013 11:18 AM (Y/HG5)

260 If I was still in a metal band as I was in my 20s, I'd totes call the band "Brewed in Satan's Asshole." Beats our old ripped-off-from-Sabbath name (Electric Funeral) all to hell.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at September 18, 2013 11:18 AM (7ObY1)

261 >>>>>>What gun ownership/use problem are you trying to solve by carrying a handgun on your hip in plain view?

Carrying a gun in your waistband is uncomfortable and you could probably draw more quickly when carrying openly.***


** I neither conceal nor open carry because I don't want the responsibility.

Posted by: Warden at September 18, 2013 11:18 AM (bmp0d)

262 Basically if you like Donald Duck better than Mickey Mouse--you could be an assh*le. (or something.) Ever talk with a German? They love love love Donald over there! Especially the comics, they love him.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 11:18 AM (yETln)

263 I thought the Horde consensus was that Prometheus sucked donkey balls. Posted by: alexthechick - Team Buttercream Frosting With A Spoon at September 18, 2013 03:16 PM (VtjlW) ~ No, it was a bad movie.

Posted by: Bawny Fwank at September 18, 2013 11:18 AM (SzAZ7)

264 I ADDED 4 INCHES TO MY GUN DICK IN 250 COMMENTS - ASK ME HOW!

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at September 18, 2013 11:19 AM (2fm0d)

265

Posted by: Lincolntf at September 18, 2013 03:14 PM (ZshNr)

 

same here.  I had  put it in a different place in my car when I came out of the establishment and when I got home and  reached over to the normal location (passengers seat )  to grab it and it wasn't their ,  my memory worked back to the bathroom and for those five seconds I was terrified I had left it there.  Makes me queesy just thinking about it.     

Posted by: polynikes at September 18, 2013 11:19 AM (m2CN7)

266 I thought the Horde consensus was that Prometheus sucked donkey balls.

Posted by: alexthechick - Team Buttercream Frosting With A Spoon at September 18, 2013 03:16 PM (VtjlW)

 

 

 

 

It  needed  more  spiders.

Posted by: Larsen E. Whipsnade at September 18, 2013 11:19 AM (rXcBX)

267 Fuck you both, since you're too pussy to pack 357SIG. I had one of those. I loved it! Is the ammo more available now? Even after they fixed the neck issue I could only ever find one box at a time. This is before the great ammo panic we're seeing the tail of now.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 11:20 AM (yETln)

268  >>>just say it tastes like Hitler

It tastes like Hitler's ass mixed together with ashes from Auschwitz.


Posted by: Warden at September 18, 2013 11:20 AM (bmp0d)

269 Fuck you both, since you're too pussy to pack 357SIG. Posted by: Michael at September 18, 2013 03:18 PM (Y/HG5) Bitch please. I carry a punt gun IWB.

Posted by: RWC at September 18, 2013 11:21 AM (fWAjv)

270 Chicory coffee in a little french press. Takes Maybe three minutes. Yum.

Posted by: thunderb at September 18, 2013 11:21 AM (1LbB2)

271 >It tastes like Hitler's ass mixed together with ashes from Auschwitz.


Posted by: Warden at September 18, 2013 03:20 PM (bmp0d)



ah, see, you went too far

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 11:21 AM (8sCoq)

272

BornLib 128: "Now imagine they are all petite Asian women."

 

I see I must do a better job of scrubbing my porn search history...

Posted by: Azenogoth at September 18, 2013 11:21 AM (Kh+vp)

273 Its DD Pumpkin coffee and Pumpkin Muffin season.


Everything else is lightweight nancy-boy stuff.


 

Posted by: dananjcon at September 18, 2013 11:22 AM (wmU4G)

274 same here. I had put it in a different place in my car when I came out of the establishment and when I got home and reached over to the normal location (passengers seat ) to grab it and it wasn't their ,my memory worked back to thebathroom and for those five seconds I was terrified I had left it there. Makes me queesy just thinking about it. My Dad knew a guy who left his on the back of the toilet. He was a newly-minted CCW at the time. He was absolutely mortified!

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 11:22 AM (yETln)

275 Its DD Pumpkin coffee and Pumpkin Muffin season. Mmm double-D pumpkins.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 11:23 AM (yETln)

276 Posted by: Empire of Jeff at September 18, 2013 03:00 PM (2fm0d)


An AR-15 is not particularly heavy.  You know what's heavy?  A base
plate for an 81mm mortar.  Not quite as heavy, but heavier than an AR-15/M-16 is an M-14.


Oh, by the way.  Get off my lawn. 

Posted by: Obnoxious A-hole at September 18, 2013 11:23 AM (ms5Fa)

277 Very similar. I wokje up, panicked internally, checked the whole tent, praying nobody would stop by, found nothing. I didn't want to go outside without it, but I had no choice. Bolted to the Humvee when no one was looking and felt a flood of joy when I saw it standing up in my seat. The nap was a couple hours long, anyone could've come by. Felt like I had cheated the devil.

Posted by: Lincolntf at September 18, 2013 11:23 AM (ZshNr)

278 >Everything else is lightweight nancy-boy stuff.

Posted by: dananjcon at September 18, 2013 03:22 PM (wmU4G)



because nothing says 'baddass mofo' like Pumpkin Muffin

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 11:24 AM (8sCoq)

279 178 you know a nursing woman has the right to nurse her baby at a restaurant but if she's got big gigantic cans and starts showing them off with no discretion it's going to cause some problems.


Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 03:00 PM (/IWYB)


Now that's worth protesting over.

Posted by: flounder at September 18, 2013 11:24 AM (Kkt/i)

280 Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 03:17 PM (r2PLg) I love an underdog so I always preferred characters like Donald, Daffy, Sylvester, Wile E and Tom over their counterparts. Do not EVEN get me started on Tweety, can't stand him.
I also like paintings, but that and my Daffy love does not mean that I'm planning a murderous genocide of millions of innocent people...yet. I'm all marshmallow inside, not gonna happen.

Posted by: LizLem at September 18, 2013 11:24 AM (8wqqE)

281 Pumpkin spice latte is what Walter white drinks. Totes bad ass.

Posted by: thunderb at September 18, 2013 11:25 AM (1LbB2)

282 What doesn't taste better along with a toasted coconut donut? For that matter, along with ANY donut?

Posted by: steve walsh at September 18, 2013 11:25 AM (ANvDa)

283 We have these guys who walk around SF naked. Their joints are hanging out at eye level to kids.

These guys are equally adamant about their rights. And equally despised for exercising them.

Posted by: navybrat at September 18, 2013 11:26 AM (kb15h)

284 It's not a double post. It's a recontextualization.

Posted by: Andy at September 18, 2013 11:26 AM (dqUox)

285 - 280 What doesn't taste better along with a toasted coconut donut? For that matter, along with ANY donut? Posted by: steve walsh at September 18, 2013 03:25 PM ----------- I like donuts and beer.

Posted by: irright at September 18, 2013 11:26 AM (Ze8oh)

286 Meh.  Who the hell wants to chill at Starbucks with a rifle?  Even a sidearm seems odd under most circumstances.  Whatevs.

Posted by: Fritz at September 18, 2013 11:27 AM (UzPAd)

287 OT

it looks like Senate Dems have defeated a resolution to create a Benghazi select committee

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 11:27 AM (8sCoq)

288 you know a nursing woman has the right to nurse her baby at a restaurant
but if she's got big gigantic cans and starts showing them off with no
discretion it's going to cause some problems.


No problems here.  I just sit and watch quietly.

Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 11:27 AM (GQ8sn)

289 If open carry at Starbucks is your 'hill', you need a better hill

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 11:27 AM (8sCoq)

290 alright, I'm going to kick the hornet's nest here, just for the hell of it. Because y'all is my boon companions.


what is the purpose of open carry? And just to make it harder, you can't say 'because I have rights dammit!' What gun ownership/use problem are you trying to solve by carrying a handgun on your hip in plain view?


Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 03:04 PM (8sCoq)


I like the way the Israelis do it (did it), open carry by civilians. Everyone on the planet knew why. Obviously the government had some kind of 'understanding', some regulation that permitted the open carrying of a weapon. It wasn't until the government got into a dispute with 'settlers', citizens building residences without the approval of the state, that open carry becomes a political statement, a threat against the state. 'Settlers' building communities in locations not approved by the state, openly carrying weapons, would be seen as open defiance of the state.


That's where this open carry argument causes all the problems. First, the left sees it as a political statement, and a threat. Which makes it a political protest against an oppressive state, which is a threat the state can not ignore. The more vocal calls by government officials to repress citizen ownership of weapons, including openly carrying those weapons, the more the display of a weapon becomes a political protest against the oppressive state.

No government can tolerate a challenge to the authority of the state. No law enforcement officer can tolerate an open challenge to their authority. Which is why the debasement of our legal system by (mostly, if not entirely) democrats is such an insidious thing.

Posted by: Lewis Prothero, the Voice of Reason at September 18, 2013 11:28 AM (eL9Ah)

291 Han't been to a Stubbucks for years.  My local coffee house has better drinks and better clientele to hang with.

Nothing in this article encourages me to change that.

Posted by: Richard McEnroe at September 18, 2013 11:28 AM (1flKi)

292

O/T bit need help:

 

Petiiton going around my community (Jewish) decryng cuts in SNAP. My understanding is there are no cuts, simply effect of sequester or reduction in % increase. But no idea if that's correct - any morons with some facts so I can rebut?

 

TIA!!

Posted by: speedster1 at September 18, 2013 11:29 AM (v40Bj)

293 HOLD THE PHONE


Mike Shanahan says the Redskins are practicing how to tackle. That's brilliant. Now I know why Snyder hired him.

Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 11:29 AM (8sCoq)

294 I believe his request does not qualify as a demand (such as a sign) as far as being a direct violation of store policy if a CC or OC person walks in. He's corporate and it won't stick without them also posting the policy in every store. (making them a target)

What it does do is give cover for stores who do wish to post a sign (they are a franchise mostly aren't they?) and/or cause trouble for anyone who does OC or CC.

It's a Lefty response to SBux's inadvertent support of the 2A.

It's his way of giving the lefties a thumbs up and a poke in the eye for the 2A crowd without making a definitive rule that could be adjudicated. (from either side).

SBux was never FOR 2A. They were just trying to be legally neutral to prevent repercussions for taking a position either way. (Or because they attract so many lefties that they never thought it would become a big deal.)

I think after this, they'll find out how many customers were 2A and Righty leaners.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Ecclesiates 9:11) at September 18, 2013 11:30 AM (lAZep)

295 "259 >>>>>>What gun ownership/use problem are you trying to solve by carrying a handgun on your hip in plain view?

Carrying a gun in your waistband is uncomfortable and you could probably draw more quickly when carrying openly.***


** I neither conceal nor open carry because I don't want the responsibility.

Posted by: Warden at September 18, 2013 03:18 PM (bmp0d)"



If you carry IWB with one of these



http://www.alessigunholsters.com/hideout-1/



you will not have a problem with it being uncomfortable.  You might have a problem with forgetting that you are carrying it and sitting down on a hard bench and the gun makes a loud klunk sound.

Posted by: Obnoxious A-hole at September 18, 2013 11:30 AM (ms5Fa)

296 202 alright, I'm going to kick the hornet's nest here, just for the hell of it. Because y'all is my boon companions.


what is the purpose of open carry? And just to make it harder, you can't say 'because I have rights dammit!' What gun ownership/use problem are you trying to solve by carrying a handgun on your hip in plain view?


Posted by: I Am Rex Ryan's Spleen at September 18, 2013 03:04 PM (8sCoq)


FWIW - Some people in states where both is allowed but only CC is able to be licensed (e.g., WA) believe that there is no constitutional reason to apply for a license to exercise a constitutional right that shall not be infringed.

Posted by: flounder at September 18, 2013 11:31 AM (Kkt/i)

297 >>>We have these guys who walk around SF naked. Their joints are hanging out at eye level to kids.

What right, precisely, are they exercising? Does SF not have any laws against public indecency/nudity?

I was under the impression that the cops just let it slide because, well, San Francisco.

Posted by: Warden at September 18, 2013 11:31 AM (bmp0d)

298 138 You'll name your children after me for this tip. "Dipshit Knight" has a nice ring to it. Posted by: Name That Film at September 18, 2013 02:51 PM (/kI1Q) Best film of all time. Wanna see a demonstration of gravity?

Posted by: NFLMocklessburger at September 18, 2013 11:31 AM (jt8G9)

299

Ok, let's nail this down...

 

Outside table, great cup of coffee, cigarette, newspaper, early Fall, mid-60's with a slight wisp of burning leaves in the air. 

 

Yes, it's just about perfect.

Posted by: jwest at September 18, 2013 11:31 AM (u2a4R)

300 >>>No problems here. I just sit and watch quietly.

me too, but it's the same way with guns. I don't have a problem with this schtick myself but I can understand if someone else does.


Posted by: ace at September 18, 2013 11:32 AM (/IWYB)

301 "Dipshit Knight" has a nice ring to it.

Posted by: Name That Film at September 18, 2013 02:51 PM (/kI1Q)

 

Nobody named Real Genius yet? Really?

Posted by: Austin in TX at September 18, 2013 11:33 AM (/6EeB)

302 "What right, precisely, are they exercising?"

Doesn't matter. It is a protest. No different than walking in to a Starbucks with an AR.

Posted by: navybrat at September 18, 2013 11:33 AM (kb15h)

303 navybrat,

I'm not advocating walking around with an AR-15, but I can't see how you draw the equivalence between that and exposing your wang to a bunch of children on a public street.

Legally or morally.

Posted by: Warden at September 18, 2013 11:35 AM (bmp0d)

304 Visit San Francisco! Home of Cable Cars, Rice-a-Roni and Unfettered Wang!

Posted by: Lincolntf at September 18, 2013 11:35 AM (ZshNr)

305 "I'm not advocating walking around with an AR-15, but I can't see how you draw the equivalence between that and exposing your wang to a bunch of children on a public street."

Both actions are being done for reasons of political activism, both actions are guaranteed to elicit responses of disgust  and/or outrage from a large segment of the population. Both actions will usually draw the attention of law enforcement.

Morality?  In San Francisco?  

Posted by: navybrat at September 18, 2013 11:39 AM (kb15h)

306 Pulling out my fave standup joke about hitler (very stream-of-consciousness but funny when you hear it. . .) And Hitler ended up in a ditch, covered in petrol, on fire...So that's fun. I think that's funny. Cos he was a mass-murdering fuckhead. And that was his honeymoon as well. Double trouble. "Eva, let's marry." "Where should we honeymoon?" "ln a ditch, covered in petrol, on fire. I've already arranged it." "Oh, how romantic, Adolf." "Yes, I thought." Fun. What a bastard. He was a vegetarian and a painter. He must've said, "I can't get ze fucking trees right... "Damn! I will kill everyone in ze world!" He was a mass-murdering fuckhead, as many historians have said. But others got away with it. Stalin killed many millions. Died in his bed. Well done there. Pol Pot killed 1.7 million Cambodians. Died under house arrest, Well done, indeed. They got away with it because they killed their own people. We're sort of fine with that. "Oh, help yourself. "We've been trying to kill you for ages, so kill your own people." Seems to be. Hitler killed people next door. Ohhh. Stupid man. After a couple of years we won't stand for that, will we? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5uDWvEzZYk

Posted by: LizLem at September 18, 2013 11:39 AM (8wqqE)

307 Posted by: LC LaWedgie at September 18, 2013 03:13 PM (6xhLc)


We could have had him any day.

Posted by: A gray haired Federale at September 18, 2013 11:39 AM (ms5Fa)

308 Seriously, I'm not a coffee aficionado, but Starbucks is perfectly cromulent coffee as far as I can tell.  Wouldn't rave about it, but it gets the job done.

Posted by: Jeff B. at September 18, 2013 11:40 AM (yemTi)

309 No problems here. I just sit and watch quietly. I have a special "Yay America, Yay Boobies" dance routine for just that occasion.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 11:41 AM (yETln)

310 Walking around with your junk in full view = cloak of invisibility


Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 11:42 AM (GQ8sn)

311 Walking around with your junk in full view = cloak of invisibility. Also walking around a city looking like a hobo. In Vi Si Bull.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 11:43 AM (yETln)

312 @153 Bigby, I see you make Chock'ful joke. I'll take you up on that.

First, you do know Bigby's Coffee is the "fastest-growing franchise in the Midwest," no? And they started out "Beaner's" without getting it, and had to fight off the perpetually aggrieved, boycotts and all, for like ten years before they gave up and changed the name? This is why I always mention Georgie Starbuck.

Now, Chock Full o'Nuts was a very respectable coffee: hired Jackie Robinson, in good with the railway chefs, bought their own beans, fought off a takeover. After the founder died, the name passed into the hands of an Italian company. And that company changed their recipe, using more of the cheaper Robusta beans, to cut the price -- after their publicly-announced market research proved that people really didn't care anymore what their coffee tasted like. While Starbuck's was becoming the Greatest Fluffy Drink Purveyor in The History of Business Statistics. Hmm. 

   

Posted by: Stringer Davis at September 18, 2013 11:45 AM (JNUY4)

313 Look, an overreaction! SB made people read between the lines, but basically this is "don't be a dick, don't try to change us from a coffee shop to an open political forum. We're a coffee shop." If you don't want your private property Occupied, don't fucking Occupy others. Oh and now would be a good time to thank OC activists from being a dick about it and pushing CA until they repealed the law that allowed OC. Good job, I see you've done it again. What was it, once is an accident, twice is coincidence...

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith's Other Mobile[/i][/b][/s][/u] at September 18, 2013 11:46 AM (qyfb5)

314 Also walking around a city looking like a hobo. In Vi Si Bull.

Posted by: bonhomme at September 18, 2013 03:43 PM (yETln)



People can still look at a hobo.


People will NOT look at a guy with his inflated scrotum hanging out getting sun.

Posted by: EC at September 18, 2013 11:46 AM (GQ8sn)

315 281 We have these guys who walk around SF naked. Their joints are hanging out at eye level to kids.

These guys are equally adamant about their rights. And equally despised for exercising them.

Posted by: navybrat at September 18, 2013 03:26 PM (kb15h)


Sounds like a great place to spill a hot cup of Starbucks.

Posted by: flounder at September 18, 2013 11:47 AM (Kkt/i)

316 278 Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 03:17 PM (r2PLg) I love an underdog so I always preferred characters like Donald, Daffy, Sylvester, Wile E and Tom over their counterparts. Do not EVEN get me started on Tweety, can't stand him. I also like paintings, but that and my Daffy love does not mean that I'm planning a murderous genocide of millions of innocent people...yet. I'm all marshmallow inside, not gonna happen. Posted by: LizLem at September 18, 2013 03:24 PM (8wqqE) ***************************** I don't know what the deal was. Supposedly FDR liked Mickey and Hitler liked Donald. It's probably bs.

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 11:47 AM (r2PLg)

317 "295 >>>We have these guys who walk around SF naked. Their joints are hanging out at eye level to kids.

What right, precisely, are they exercising? Does SF not have any laws against public indecency/nudity?

I was under the impression that the cops just let it slide because, well, San Francisco.

Posted by: Warden at September 18, 2013 03:31 PM (bmp0d)"



I believe that the history of this is that they never got around to passing a law against public nudity in San Francisco if for no other reason that, given the weather in San Francisco, most people consider it to cold to go about unclothed.  Now, of course, San Francisco is populated by and governed by the insane so this is just one of the things they do there.

Posted by: Obnoxious A-hole at September 18, 2013 11:47 AM (ms5Fa)

318 And I could have that backwards--or maybe I dreamt that crap. gawd.

Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 11:49 AM (r2PLg)

319 Today in SF is absolutely spectacular. Makes me wonder what the heck I am doing inside, typing on blogs when I could be over on Castro St. spilling hot coffee on the joints of naked guys. Later.

Posted by: navybrat at September 18, 2013 11:50 AM (kb15h)

320 @299, I got it at 296. Forgot to take off my sock though.

Posted by: Weirddave at September 18, 2013 11:53 AM (jt8G9)

321 It's probably bs. Posted by: tasker at September 18, 2013 03:47 PM (r2PLg) Probably. But now I wonder who Churchill liked best...

Posted by: LizLem at September 18, 2013 11:55 AM (8wqqE)

322 "65
An interesting comment or two in their discussion thread.... the ceo seems to be targeting open carry but.....
...he did ask that all patrons no longer bring guns into hisstores or on the café seating outside his stores (this part of the letter doesn't make a distinction between open carry or CC)...

...one commenter said that this is an effective ban per state laws (not sure which state he/she was referring to), so that even someone with a CC permit could possibly be prosecuted for carrying in a business that doesn't want any guns on their property?.... not sure if this is correct or not....not a lawyer or politically connected sobest just to avoid all starbucks in future until this is made clear regarding CC.

I like starbucks once in a while, but, I wouldn't want to face a potential criminal charge....due to one of their moonbat liberal customers or employeesseeing a part of a holster under the shirt and then calling the cops...

Posted by: Some Guy in Wisconsin at September 18, 2013 02:37 PM (N/HlO)"



In Texas a business owner can tell the public that he does not want anyone with a CHL to carry on his property by posting a "30.06" sign.  If that sign is not posted, the public is not properly notified and there is no legal issue with concealed carry in his establishment.



My personal opinion is that every other state would be much improved by adopting the Texas laws but, sadly, most other states choose to persist in their error.

Posted by: Obnoxious A-hole at September 18, 2013 11:58 AM (ms5Fa)

323 No, I don't agree that Texas's approach is better.  I prefer Georgia's where they can ask you to leave or face trespass charges but private signs have no legal weight and only the proprietor or their representative can make that call. 

Posted by: wg at September 18, 2013 01:29 PM (pFHCC)

324

No matter what the pro-gun types did, it would have come to this.  Remember, the squeaky violent wheel gets its way, and the oh-so-peaceful gun-grabbers are violent.

Posted by: steveegg at September 18, 2013 02:01 PM (o44nj)

325 105 1 Guns=scary mystifying to the left. Seems to me the more people are exposed to responsible carry the less mystifying and scary, no?

And how is this responsible carry?

If you come walking into a coffee shop crowded with women and children brandishing an AR15 with the mag inserted, why shouldn't I pull my legally concealed pistol and put your lights out before you get a chance to unload on said women and children?

How is anyone supposed to know that you're just a jack ass and not some murderous nut?

Posted by: VADM (Red) Cuthbert Collingwood (Mentioned in Despatches) at September 18, 2013 02:46 PM (YLI2v)


Lefty or just hijacking their tactics? Conflating "the more people are exposed to responsible carry the less mystifying and scary" with "brandishing an AR15 with the mag inserted" is inflammatory.

If that wasn't your intent, you need to check yourself - the left has you playing by their rules.

Posted by: Amy Shulkusky at September 18, 2013 03:31 PM (bdged)

326 As the Insane Clown Posse asked, "Fucking guns, how do they work?"

Posted by: Frank Underwood (D-SC) at September 18, 2013 03:47 PM (OpaBw)

327 You know what is odd? How a business can be punished for mistreating/discriminating  people because of their race or religion, yet they can ignore the 2nd Amendment rights of customers. It is odd how "civil rights" trumps God-given rights. Thanks to the SCOTUS, I guess.

Posted by: Baldy at September 18, 2013 06:17 PM (tyDFN)

328 Sorry you are wrong OP.

We will not normalize guns unless people OC and people see that merely doing so does not mean you call 911 nor that a mass shooting occurs. We are battling the media, but battling ourselves is a special stuck on stupid the GOP and conservatives and libertarians sadly excel at.

The left never makes this mistake.

OC folks are wrongly treated from the populace on down, and you can can thank in part the media's over hyping of "mass shootings" and from gun culture erosion all the way into the schools, where riflry and such has been dismantled and even drawing a gun gets suspensions and thought conditioning of little ones who grow up fearing guns and OC of them by law abiding persons.

We do not need fewer OC activists, we need many many more who educate the public, and several YouTubers are doing that, and showing people that simply having a holstered firearm does NOT mean you are an Adam Lanza waiting to happen...

Posted by: Mehnow at September 18, 2013 07:43 PM (GC8Xg)

329 The assumption the person with the AR 15 is an Adam Lanza is media brainwashing. Nobody should assume instantly a person carrying openly is by default a mass shooter seconds from acting out his fantasy.

It's incredible to read comments even by those on OUR side who do not realize that normalizing guns means commonality and making them everywhere on private non-cop bodies in random situations, WHERE PEOPLE DO NOT GET SHOT.

We normalize by increasing OC, not decreasing it, and by educating people who stop us that we are 2nd amendment supporters and first responders if a bad guy appears, not mass shooters simply for packing heat by default...

Posted by: Mehnow at September 18, 2013 07:48 PM (GC8Xg)

330 You also have to think long term, the left does so, and they are right.

If the left had our views on guns, OC Youtube vids would be in the hundred of thousands, not like 50 or so as now.

You have to normalize the behavior. You also have to see that CC will die if OC does not prosper, ultimately. They are joined at the hip.

You do not fall for leftist guilt trips like "those OC folks are making an intimidation try" etc. and other BS that it's weird for a person to OC in public in any setting.

It's not.

And it's a shame our own side has plenty of self abusing folks who buy into this fiction and fear it will set us back and do more harm that good.

The long term is what is matters...

Posted by: Mehnow at September 18, 2013 07:56 PM (GC8Xg)

331 "I think even people who are inclined to support expanding gun rights would be turned off by the sight of a bunch of people walking around with rifles in Starbucks." John should be warned not to stop in at a gas station, convenience store or diner on the first weekend of deer season in rural southern Ohio.

Posted by: Cloudbuster at September 19, 2013 09:34 AM (nUbHY)

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