>>The "tea party" isn't about going after Democrats, that's the job of the GOP, conservatives are increasingly focused on policing the GOP. <<

I hear you, Drew, but there are good times to police and bad times.  This was a bad time to police.  We should be focused on winning the Senate, increasing the lead in the House - ie, focus on the midterms.  Then, you can start meaningful action about rolling back ObamaCare.  Once, of course, ObamaCare shows the American public how shitty it really is.

Then you work on the White House in 2016.  When your party is in control and you don't have to worry about the left flank, you can start policing your own.

But when the Democrats are assailing the GOP on one side and the Tea Party is attempting to police the GOP on the other, you get a big mess for the GOP and conservatives as well.

Hear, hear.

Anybody listening?

Their immediate target, the precinct level of the various states GOP, then the state level GOP, and from there, the national level.

While I donÂ’t disagree with that battle plan, itÂ’s obvious (until the 17th Amendment is repealed) that the main battlefield is at the national/federal level.

Given that, the TP still needs the GOP as the best ‘battle taxi’ to get to that front. The current inertia (still) favors the Beltway Leviathan, and continue to do so until ‘non-establishment’ Republicans gain control of the House, Senate, and the Presidency.

Even under the best scenario, that going to take a loooong time.

The other big problem (as I see it) is that conservatives have yet to develop a coherent ‘target list’… focused attacks on Left’s money pipelines from the Federal level to the ‘cultural/societal/lawfare subversives’*.

(*This wonÂ’t happen until GOPe surrenders the steering wheel to the Conservatives in the party)

The current rhythm of the dance favors the statistsÂ… and the Right is doing nothing but racing from fire to fire, while dancing to the LSMÂ’s DJ beat.

NOTHING will change until that reflexive behavior ceasesÂ… and the GOPe ceases sniping at the TP/Conservative wing of GOP."

Ignore, or discuss, as you will...

Yep, they'll lose the base, but gain 10 million or so foreigners entrenching them as the permanent minority "opposition". Us balanced budget extremists are already being labeled as terrorists, and will be blamed for all the inevitable failures. The colleges are instructing the utes how to identify the saboteurs, straight white men and the juice. If you fall into one of these categories, it might be wise to start developing a lisp and a fine appreciation for the taste of penis.

Yep, they'll lose the base, but gain 10 million or so foreigners entrenching them as the permanent minority "opposition". Us balanced budget extremists are already being labeled as terrorists, and will be blamed for all the inevitable failures. The colleges are instructing the utes how to identify the saboteurs, straight white men and the juice. If you fall into one of these categories, it might be wise to start developing a lisp and a fine appreciation for the taste of penis.

When it's time to vote, vote, don't talk. Vote out all career politicians.

Today's Democrats and Republicans are an axis of service to self.

We are looking for a new breed, those who come to Washington to serve the country.

I understand that the GOP "establishment" feels under siege from the right and wants to see that heat turned on the Democrats

Riddle me this Batman; any number of republican congressmen pissed and moaned about what Ted Cruz was doing to them. Last time I checked he was a senator from Texas and not in their states. Why would he be a problem if their constituents didn't think a bit like Cruz?  Seriously, I am not being argumentative. Why would Cruz be an issue to anyone of them but for the fact that voters at home are more in tune with the Tea party and less with the Republican Party. Just a guess but each major party's "base " may be a much smaller base and more of an ideological LIV and the active subset is more polarized and motivated. That doesn't quite feel right but I think we need to understand why the Tea Party threatens the establishment so much if they have such crappy little numbers.

the GOP has shown itself unworthy of the trust conservatives have placed in it and this is the new reality. The sooner the mainline GOP accepts the new reality, the sooner things can begin to settle down.

Truer words were never spoken.

Of course, the GOP may decide that they can simply live without the right wing and file for divorce. As Reagan famously said, it's a time for choosing.

And this is the direction I'm confident the GOP will take.  I predict that next year we'll get the same "but you have to eat this shit sandwich or the Dems will win!" caterwauling that came along with Mitt's run.  The mainstream GOP (the McStains, Grahamnestys, Cuban Combovers) are betting that, once again, we're just having a temper tantrum and will be scared into putting their lard-filled asses back in power again.

"We need all three branches!  Then we'll get rid of Obamacare!  Pinky swear!"

Yeah.  And my wife, Morgan Fairchild, is on her knees playing Monica with me right now.  That's the ticket.

Jerry,

I'm a very conservative voter, in a swing state.  I haven't voted for a Republican candidate for federal office in a general election because I'd rather waste my vote on a third party because ultimately the bond market vigilanties will control spending if the two parties don't. 

It's a two-way street, Drew. Ultra-conservative (includes Tea Party) want their asses kissed. They don't want to be "wooed". They want complete capitulation. They are not willing to do politics. They want their way and that is that.

This "ultra-conservative" would appreciate a party that told senile old fucks like McShit that calling fellow members "wacko birds" and "terrorists" to STFU.

They are not willing to do politics.

I've rarely read a more breathtakingly obtuse sentence.  And I read Mary Cloggenstein.

It's a two-way street, Drew. Ultra-conservative (includes Tea Party) want their asses kissed. They don't want to be "wooed". They want complete capitulation. They are not willing to do politics. They want their way and that is that.

What should happen is both sides need to woo each other.. both sides need to sit down and come up with a comprehensive approach that each side can live with.

You speak of the GOP as some sort of single entity. It is not. It is a couple hundred politicians who come from districts that vary tremendously. They are not always going to agree with each other. But, they do have to learn to work with each other.

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at October 17, 2013 10:43 AM (f9c2L)

---------------------

You're  not a RINO, if it helps.

I am.

The Republican party no longer represents my interests,  and  I have no interest in supporting it with my dollars and votes anymore.   The only connection I have left with it  is the party affiliation on my Voter Identification Card.  That will be remedied shortly.

You win.  The GOP's all yours.  Good luck.

It.  Will.  Burn.

So the elite GOPers are so brilliant in the senate they let that "Kentucky Kickback" get in there.  The background on the appropriation aside, who's stupider, Lamar Alexander for partnering with Feinstein to attach it to the bill, or Mitch McConnell for not seeing the potential damage it'll cause his reelection efforts?

Did O whisper in Feinstein's ear via Reed to do this and  dullard Alexander fell for the reasoning behind it?  Did McConnell, in his self-serving haste to be the GOP saviour in brokering a truly crappy deal,  not have the wherewithall to hear the damage-will-robinson alarm?

There's a reason why O and Reed chose to deal only with McDonnell and the no-power senate Republicans, thereby knee-capping Boehner.  And it ain't because McConnell is a brilliant negotiator.

Posted by: Bigby's Thumb at October 17, 2013 10:52 AM (AFLVz)

Yeah the Tea Party really needs to stop thinking that the entrenched government powerholders are out to get them.

You're still going to vote?!!? From up there?!?!

------------------------

As long as I'm a U.S. citizen, I'll continue to vote.  Civic  duty was drummed into me too thoroughly  as a young'un to not feel guilty about sitting out.

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at October 17, 2013 10:43 AM (f9c2L)"

Or, after watching the DC Republicans fold yet again for the I've lost count how many'th time, maybe it is just time for me to give up and stop voting.  I've seen this Juarez donkey show too many times before.  Republicans take the PR hit and then give up so that they have nothing to show for it.  In this case, there also seems to be a distinct "We have to teach those Tea Party assholes a lesson" vibe coming from the GOP establishment.  OK.  Lesson learned.  There is no political party that represents my interests. 

Also,  it's important  to me that I remove my name from their rolls. So they know that  I've left.

Yes, I'm only one of millions.   How will they know I've left?  From the letter  I send them explaining  why I've left.

But here;'s the thing.. I see Tea Party types (and, just to be clear here, I am fully behind Tea Party goals - smaller gov't - less taxes - fewer regulations) all over the internet mouthing off, but when push comes to shove they don't lift a finger to get out the vote. There are very few primaries against incumbents. And when there are, we get fucking nutballs like Christine (I'm not a witch) O'donnell, Akin and Mourdock. Not exactly a stellar record there, eh?

You'd make a better point if you didn't list three races where only one of them was a challenge to an incumbent.

Posted by: MacGruber at October 17, 2013 10:40 AM (xvtYZ)

and the GOP helps assail the Tea party which was to Help GOP stand firm in adversity against those stealing the rights of Americans.

yeah.

And let me add a little bit on this "playing politics" crap:

Somebody - either Ace or Gabe - accused me of not being satisfied unless Romney called Obama a worthless cocksucking liar live on TV during a debate.  Now politics may be the art of the possible, as the cliche goes, but it is also warfare by other means.  Which tells you that, when you find an opponent's weakness, you concentrate on it.

Barack Obama - known companion of domestic terrorists, arrogant, petulant, possibly illegal candidate with a decades-long string of questionable, if not outright treasonous, connections.  An open Marxist.

McCain publicly assures people that we have nothing to fear from his presidency.  Sarah Palin, the only one willing to call the bastard out, is stabbed in the back.

Barack Obama - known companion of domestic terrorists, arrogant, petulant, possibly illegal candidate with a decades-long string of questionable, if not outright treasonous, connections.  An open Marxist.

Romney calls him a good man who is in over his head.

But I'm the one who's to blame for the GOP brand being trash.

Quick, somebody name one federal agency that has been disbanded by the GOP, or one onerous non-constitutional law that has been stricken from the books by the GOP.

-

Just one.

-

I rest my case.

We conservatives want limited govt. This puts us completely at odds with Republicans. Tough marriage.

Ann Coulter once said of the Democrats' minority base, that "they need them, but they don't want them"

I feel the same way about the GOP's treatment of conservatives since Bush 41.  We're the old wife that will always be there while they try and woo hot new tail.  I mean, who else wants us?

Need votes you put on the "Conservative mask" and throw red meat, but if you're safe, it's one of those "well, we need to be diplomatic so that the people who call you racists and homophobes might like us"

Just as Newt did in the '90s, the Tea Party needs to come up with a plan.  They were originally for smaller government (NOTE TO ASSHOLES:  THIS DOES NOT SAY THE ELIMINATION OF GOVERNMENT), lower taxes and less regulation.

You'll also note that in the beginning, the Tea Party had nothing to do with gay marriage, abortion, immigration or anything else.

Politics is the art of bringing people together to accomplish their goals.  To do this, you need to state what it is you want to do.  If a leader, or group put together a plan and then ran on it, they would win.

If someone from the left attacked a candidate on something not in the plan, say abortion, the person could simply say that "my personal beliefs on that subject have no bearing on my commitment to enact all the provisions outlined in the plan." 

End of discussion.

Posted by: Jones in CO at October 17, 2013 11:03 AM (8sCoq)

I see another Gang of Supreme Intelligence and 'Compromise' in our future.

Posted by: Wake Up at October 17, 2013 11:04 AM (ZPrif)

and how were They treated by the GOP?

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at October 17, 2013 10:54 AM (CJjw5)"

This.

They won.  I'm done.

Instead of challenging GOP moderates in primaries, the Tea Party should run candidates in the Democratic Primaries of "safe" Republican districts.  The Democratic line on the fall ballot in many of these districts can be had for the cost of filing and the collection of a few thousand nominating signatures.  They can then outflank the moderate Republican on the right in the general election. 

If the Tea Party loses, we get a moderate Republican who was forced to tack to the Right and make a whole lot of promises that just might be kept.  If  the Tea Party wins, we get another small government conservative in the House, and we inject a little bit of necessary ideological diversity into the Democratic Congressional Caucus.

We must suffer socialist RINOs.  Why shouldn't the Democrats have to suffer with a few Tea Party Demos? 

The GOP leadership has done a very poor job of leading.  The Tea Party is a faction - a sizable one - in the GOP coalition.  Like all factions in a political party they have an agenda, and to keep them in the party and working for the party the party leadership must - must - make some effort to get the Tea Party agenda enacted.

This is not rocket science this basic coalition politics since the dawn of politics.  All factions have to receive some assurance that their concerns are being addressed.  Failure to do so will break the coalition.  Someone needs to sit the GOP leadership down and explain to them the number of people in the party that identify with the Tea Party agenda and explain the significance of that to the electoral chances of the GOP.

I hear you, Drew, but there are good times to police and bad times. This was a bad time to police. We should be focused on winning the Senate, increasing the lead in the House - ie, focus on the midterms. Then, you can start meaningful action about rolling back ObamaCare.

It is always a bad time to police. This has been the message to us since 2004 - keep quiet, make no waves, don't cause trouble. In two years, then the policing can begin. All is lost if we don't win in 2012. Keep quiet.

I don't want to give Mitch McConnell power. I don't want to spend my money and time so that a lousy corrupt turtle can sell me out for his own gain.

Posted by: DaveA at October 17, 2013 10:41 AM (DL2i+)

Yes, they didnt fight the democrats.

Yeah.. take your ball and go home, EoJ.. Instead of trying to fix it, just leave.

Look, EoJ, there's lettuce and tomato right here!  Put them on that shit sandwich and see how good it tastes!

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at October 17, 2013 11:01 AM (f9c2L)

----------------------

You have it backwards.  I'm saying, "Take my BALLS, wash them with your tongue, then I'm leaving." 

Why should  I try to fix it?  You have no interest in my ideas  about fixing it.  You  want  me to shut up and get in line.  Fuck that.  Not doing it anymore.

I will no longer be  part of the GOP.  I may vote for a GOP candidate, but if  it is another McCain  lib-lite  pussyboy,  I will vote  for another party's candidate or write myself in.

You know  how your faction in the GOP  is always talking about how  they have to attract Independents?  THAT'S ME NOW.  I'm no longer  the conservative base that you took for granted; now I'm an outsider.

What are you going to do to attract me now, Jerry?  It's your party.  YOU fix it and figure  out how to get my  vote.  If there is a push  to form  a conservative, constitutionalist  party that represents my  values, I will support  it.  What I will NOT do is take any more of the GOP  establishment's shit.  Those days are over. 

I'm still playing.  I'm  just not on your team. 

Requiring that the GOP treat conservatives -- as a voting constituency demonstrably essential to the party's faintest hopes of success at the federal level -- as courteously and attentively as they do, say, La Raza or CAIR isn't "ass-kissing"; it's simple, baseline respect.
-------- --------- ----------- --------

And it would be nice if the Democrat-media complex gave the Tea Party the same respect they do al Qaeda.   

Posted by: jwest at October 17, 2013 11:05 AM (u2a4R)

If somebody objects to being murdered, do you ask them to provide you a plan of how they want to keep living?

Saying 'stop doing this' is a perfectly valid position.  It requires no opposing plan.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at October 17, 2013 11:03 AM (AskuI)

I started to mention the Office of Price Administration (OPA) from WW2. But then I checked and even though it was "officially" closed it lives on in places like Dept. Agriculture.

Obama, at this very second, is starting the final push for the democrat's version of immigration reform.

We don't have a conservative version of immigration reform.

Does anyone want to bet which one will win?

Posted by: jwest at October 17, 2013 11:05 AM (u2a4R)"

That's right.  You won.  Lot's of luck with your party. 

Posted by: Hollowpoint at October 17, 2013 11:13 AM (SY2Kh)

Hey look, EoJ, it's Republican outreach!

We want lower taxes, lower spending, smaller govt.

Those used to be GOP platform items.

Now, wanting those things gets us this response:

"Ultra-conservative (includes Tea Party) want their asses kissed"

Posted by: JackStraw at October 17, 2013 11:15 AM (g1DWB)

So the GOP is a leaderless swarm without a hierarchy, and it constantly replaces members?

138 "Not sure if "Tea Party" = "conservative." Could just mean people who don't want the country to spend itself down a shithole. (Why give the lib media a label to hang it with?)"

That's what made the Tea Party so strong and effective.  It was people united for smaller government, less taxes and less regulation.

But then, people started coming in saying we had to be anti-abortion.  We needed to fight gay marriage.  We needed to love Jesus and return prayer to our schools.

That's not the Tea Party. 

Posted by: Hollowpoint at October 17, 2013 11:13 AM (SY2Kh)

Yeah, because the constitution is so crazy.

Unfuck yourself, how's that?

Posted by: sven10077 at October 17, 2013 10:51 AM (9jfyN)

Yes, some serious hardball play by the base.

And when there are, we get fucking nutballs like Christine (I'm not a
witch) O'donnell, Akin and Mourdock. Not exactly a stellar record
there, eh? 

I won't carry water for the other two but Mourdock is the real deal. I was struck by what a straight shooter he was. Actually said his principles aloud. That is what made him step on his dick. Read what he actually said. It is simple and  not very outlandish. Pretty much verbatim from the Pro-Life movement and I do not mean fringy shit. Basically you don't compound an evil with more evil. What came out was twisted of course. But I would bet if we all read what he said and meant the majority of us would agree. His failure was to stand on his principles. We cannot have it both ways. Unprincipled fuckheads like McCain who can say anything will get reelected. Great.  Or we put up guys like him and Lonegan in NJ. When we win, and Tea Party types sure as fuck did win, we actually get something.

"We should be focused on winning the Senate, increasing the lead in the House - ie, focus on the midterms."

Why?  The Left is the enemy, so I understand why they hate us. But to work my ass off again for these bozos? Last time we gave them a majority in both houses they pissed it away - couldn't keep their hand out of the till. Couldn't keep their zipper closed.

Why do I want to spend time money and energy on politicians that will just betray us when its time to step up? Fuck the GOP, they're done.

The crazy people are the ones who oppose skyrocketing debt and deficit, and the HealthCare plan that doesn't work.

The smart people are the ones who believe in the Prophecy.

If I  get to pick a label  to replace the soiled Tea Party brand  I'd  go with 'limited government constitutional conservative'.    

Maybe I am slow in realizing just how awful McCain is to the Republican Party, but when he's a  leader of the so-called pragmatists   who needs enemies?

Just his influence makes the entire party dysfunctional.     

So much petulant whining and crazy in this thread.

Hey look, EoJ, it's Republican outreach!

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at October 17, 2013 11:13 AM (TpXEI)

---------------------------

I don't understand  why  his ass is all sore.  After  all, he'll no longer have to worry about my "petulant whining and crazy"  since I won't have a say in internal Republican  politics anymore, just observations.

Politics  is the art  of the possible, Hollowpoint.  I'm sure that without all of  our petulant, whining, crazy  votes weighing  you down,  the possibilities  for the GOP's  success are boundless.

Get  Your    Possible  On,  Republicans. 

I'll be over here not giving  a fuck.

Posted by: SunSwordTiger at October 17, 2013 11:06 AM (cVtEO)

Eh, that assumes that those 144 would stick to their guns if they were the deciding vote.

My guess is many wouldn't.

Such is the nature of these votes, once it's assured it'll pass, people vote for political cover.

Posted by: Peter King's Single Brain Cell at October 17, 2013 11:22 AM (Cs2tJ)

Now who can argue with that.

We should be focused on winning the Senate, increasing the lead in the House

-

Why?  As a reward to McConnell for selling us out?  As a reward to Boehner for   breaking the Hastert rule?

Posted by: Hollowpoint at October 17, 2013 11:16 AM (SY2Kh)

We have a longer term view. We know we've been marginalized already. The GOP is a party of big govt. We aren't interested.

I went indy in 2007 when it became obvious that the GOP had no interest in fiscal sanity. I'll stay indy until a party rises that works for less govt.

I am in a quandry,  I  both   like and hate the GOP and Tea Party equally. 

There are many issues where I think the Tea Party can't see the forest because of the trees and many issues where the GOP only sees the forest and forgets its made up of trees.  

Oh, look- yet another lunatic who slept through 6th grade civics class.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at October 17, 2013 11:25 AM (SY2Kh)

This is like watching the Apostle Paul work his trade, winning converts to the cause.

Posted by: willow at October 17, 2013 11:26 AM (nqBYe)

uhh.... bduh.... umm... don't tell me, I know this one... Okay, I give. Why?

Posted by: toby928© considers going Democrat at October 17, 2013 11:27 AM (QupBk)

wow.  just wow. 

We have a two party system, and pretending otherwise doesn't change that fact.

--------------------------

Let me hep you to the jive, Hollowpoint:

One of those parties needs to die,  so that another can take its place.   And I'm not talking about  the Democrats.

This Tea Party, like the old Tea Party of the Revolution, is a precursor, a beginning and not an end of itself, a reaction to the transformation of the traditional Democratic Party into a completely radicalized neo-Marxist socialist party. Remember: there was a time when most Democratic politicians, except for those in the fringe Henry Wallace wing, hated communism and believed in free market capitalism and the primacy of individual freedom, as we do.

What do these new Democrats believe? They believe in centralized control of major sectors of the economy, particularly healthcare and energy. They believe in abortion up to and including the ninth-month moment of birth--and some even after birth: infanticide as a matter of choice. They believe objective truth is a fallacy and conventional reason is a construct of the patriarchy, which in turn allows them to believe in other things, such as man-caused climate change, which have little or no foundation in fact. Many of them hate God and hate the idea of God, openly booing at the mention of His name at their convention.

And they hate us, you and me and all who believe as we do, and (provably) view us as a greater threat to their power than any foreign enemy. To them, we are not political opponents; we are enemies and wreckers and we're In The Way of the Brave New World they dream about.

So yeah: the Tea Party is a reaction. And no, this doesn't end well for any of us.

. Conservatives rallied around the elder Bush and put aside their distrust and dislike of him mostly out of respect for Ronald Reagan only to find out Bush the Elder was exactly who conservatives thought he was all along...an old school country club Republican.

This is where the cognitive dissonance  rolls  in.

Reagan promised to eliminate the DOE.  Didn't do it.   Bush raised taxes after saying read my lips (it  was not that simple  though)     Both  went back on a significant promise to their voters.   Both had valid reasons.    One is  one of the greatest ( agreed  and the other is a traitor (disagree) . 

Posted by: Hollowpoint at October 17, 2013 11:25 AM (SY2Kh)"

Yeah but the problem I have is that both of those two parties hate me.  Which one should I vote for?  How about neither.

Posted by: willow at October 17, 2013 11:26 AM (nqBYe)

A Republican will have to explain that to you.

The RINOs see the TEA Party as Country Class.
---

To use an HG Wells reference, the RINOs think they are Eloi while the TEA Party are the Morlocks.

Problem with that equation is that the Morlocks are the ones who run all the machinery which give the Eloi their standard of living.  If the Morlocks don't make it work, the Eloi come crashing down.

You really can't have a ruling party without different interests pulling together, but the TEA Party has been getting goddamn sick and tired of doing work and then getting fucked up the ass by the RINOs.

All you are saying is that you are fine with living in a Communist country as long as the few dissenters tow your ideological line.

This is a total cop out.  And a way to try to avoid blame for the mess you created when you started eating your own.

You are as big of liars as the far left. 

You like communism, just like the left says you do.  And you just don't want to admit you like it.

Posted by: mrp at October 17, 2013 11:32 AM (HjPtV)

Even while being outspent 10 or 12 to 1.

Posted by: polynikes at October 17, 2013 11:30 AM (m2CN7)

Calling Bush the elder a traitor gets you nowhere fast. Save the hyperbole for the rubes.

 BTW this blog needs a congratulatory thread for our new ambassador to Japan, Caroline Kennedy

Posted by: Jones in CO at October 17, 2013 11:32 AM (8sCoq)

-------------------

What's Japanese for,  "You know?"

"We have a two party system, and pretending otherwise doesn't change that fact."

We have entrenched career politicians squatting in both parties enriching and empowering themselves instead of working for the citizens of the USA.

"Two parties" means little when both are headed in the same direction.

@CTJ

When I had time, I gave of my time; and went door to door for McCain in NH. Not because I loved McCain, but because I believed he was better than Obama.

When I had $, I gave $; I didn't have time in 2012, so instead I gave some $ to Romney's campaign. Not because I loved Romney, but because I believed he was better than Obama.

And for this priviledge, of promoting the lessor of two liberals, I am castigated by the likes of you, McCain, etc. and told to get back in line.

Well, isn't that ultimately the point? I don't want to be told, by Washington, what to do for my own good? And exactly how have I benefitted by giving my time and energy to candidates who routinely, while still in office, frustrate my goals by partnering with the opposition party?

I suppose in Chi-town you don't see a lot of "Tea Party" activists giving their time and money, but I suspect that has more to do with Chi-Town and the representative population of Tea Partiers, than it does with Tea Party activism, which is alive and well elsewhere.

Finally, you use a broad brush to tar Tea Partiers with establishment failures like Akin; ignore establishment failures of McCain and Romney, among others; and further ignore Tea Party successes like Cruz. All of the data is relevant; not just your cherry picked examples of what you characterize as Tea Party failure.

Posted by: petunia at October 17, 2013 11:33 AM (DAcBA)

-

That is a load of crap.  I am no longer voting R in fear of D.  You want my vote, start actually doing what you run on, GOP.

Posted by: ConservativeMonster at October 17, 2013 11:31 AM (0wHyk)

**

I for one, welcome our new/old wooly, mammoth overlords and look forward to years of indentured servitude in thanks for sparing my existence.

Posted by: Jackj at October 17, 2013 11:09 AM (EM+Cs)

He is protected by the media because the GOP lets him get away with it!  The moment that fat scrunt Crowley opened her yap to "refresh" Barky's memory, Mitt should have blown a gasket - who the fuck are you, Crowley, you supposedly "neutral' moderator, to think you ought to be helping Obama?

If more GOPers took a fucking blowtorch to the MFM, the base would be a hell of a lot more enthusiastic.

Posted by: Brother Cavil at October 17, 2013 11:35 AM (naUcP)

-

Much better      visual, thanks

Posted by: Buddha at October 17, 2013 11:36 AM (8NlUk)


unpossible!

Heh... AllahPundit gets it right for once

"Exit question: Am I hallucinating or does John “Wacko Birds” McCain, who accused a Republican colleague in the House of being a moron on national television less than 24 hours ago, actually warn the GOP at the end here to observe the 11th Commandment?"

Posted by: troyriser at October 17, 2013 11:34 AM (V9ol4)

I guess you missed the point of my comment or it was not clear.  I'm not the one who has called him a traitor to the conservative cause.  That's from people who are now Tea Party people. 

Posted by: Marcus at October 17, 2013 11:28 AM (GGCsk)"

If you think that convincing what used to be the conservative base of the GOP that they no longer have a place in the Republican Party a move in the right direction, I guess so.  I'm not seeing it, though.

296

+100000

c'mon people i'm mad i realize i might not be thinking clearly , so tell me why it is beneficial to vote republican.
Posted by: willow at October 17, 2013 11:26 AM (nqBYe)

Because the GOP still has potential candidates and incumbents of real worth, character, and conviction, and they merit support. Further, the GOP is one of two parties in a two-party system. Unless and until a viable third opposition party emerges, as the Republicans emerged after the dissolution of the Whigs, then reason dictates continued GOP support.

Lastly, one can't be too picky choosing friends and allies when confronted by a not-so-stealthy Marxist socialist takeover of the United States. I'm even willing to side with a Ron Paul libertarian, if that's what it takes. If I can do that, I can vote Republican.

Posted by: petunia at October 17, 2013 11:33 AM (DAcBA)

Somewhere there's an English teacher that needs a shovel upside the head.  How did you even get through high school?

Posted by: Jones in CO at October 17, 2013 11:22 AM (8sCoq)

You forgot "When's Ace going to wake up and post something?"

Posted by: Jones in CO at October 17, 2013 11:45 AM (8sCoq)

uh... hey, look, Pikes Peak!

It's Japan. The worst that can happen is having her senses assaulted with bad anime.

---

You say that.

I can see her being dumb enough to unintentionally slight a bunch of Yakuza and end up having to be removed from the country for security reasons.

Posted by: tangonine at October 17, 2013 11:45 AM (x3YFz)

yes

and it's 'row to hoe', 'no holds barred', and 'reap what you sow'

Some of you are still basing your arguments on a strategy that was doomed to fail. Some of us told you that there was no way that Cruz's strategy would work because we did not have the necessary numbers. But you called us RINOs, establishment types, rather than acknowledge the facts.

------------------------

Attention:  I will be using the "royal you."

You understand nothing of my motivations.  You're  big  on telling me what you THINK  my motivations are,  while ignoring  what I actually tell you.

And the scorn  and condescension  with which  you  so clearly  regard  me  and those who think like me  does not lead me to believe that there is any possibility  of repairing the divide in the GOP.  I guess  we just want different things.

It's not you.  It's me. 

So, I'm leaving.   I may come back,  but not with that fucking attitude.  You  may want to outsource  your Independent  outreach efforts.  So far,  your bedside manner fucking sucks.

Posted by: Jones in CO at October 17, 2013 11:45 AM (8sCoq)

bitten nails, a sore head, high bp , and checking out who facilitates   the republican old guard?

Posted by: JackStraw at October 17, 2013 11:47 AM (g1DWB)

-

That is   a cop-out.  He was a sitting incumbent who was    not conservative, just like Graham, Ayotte, and many others.

Seven years of "conservative" revolt.  What one thing is better now?  One thing?  What did it accomplish?  Any goal reached at all?

Is America more or less socialist now than when you refused to vote Republican in 2006?  When you started taking heads?

What does it matter if the entire Republican establishment gives in completely to your demands?  It is a shrinking minority losing power everyday.

What good will it do to rule over a shrinking minority that offers nothing to people while the Democrats buy votes?

You have been throwing that same hissy fit since 2006.  Where has it gotten us?  It has doubled our debt, and gotten us socialized healthcare.  it has put more people on food stamps, made us more and more socialist.

This isn't working. 

Your strategy has failed to produce the results you wanted.  Our country is worse and worse off because you think you can win with a minority.

A minority, a shrinking minority,will not do anything but help the left establish a permentnant socialist America.

You have failed.  Your strategy has failed. 

I think this sidebar item is more important to the future of Republicans than the rift with the Tea Party.

And it is an increasingly common theme of liberal Democratic politics, which seek to unify a coalition of multiple minorities by demonizing whites.”

With a growing coalition of anti-white Democrats, this development will do more to determine the fate of the GOP than any other single thing.

right now the Tea Party (those who self-identify as) makes up 20% of the general adult population.....my guess is that they make up a larger share of likely voters.

Drew and his establishment buddies keep throwing out terms like 'right wing', 'fringe', they talk about the Tea Party actions as 'purity tests' or 'internal affairs' situations......all negative tone words, and they've done it since Palin took center stage, all in an effort to try to shrink the size of the Tea Party folks.

Well, it hasn't worked, and now the GOP finds that almost half of it's constituents self-identify with the Tea Party, hmmmmmm and they still call it the 'right wing' and wonder if they can do without them.

What happens in two years when that 20% is 25% and constitutes over half of the GOP voters?  Then do we get to call Drew and his establishment GOP what they really are, the right wing of the socialist party?

Grow the fuck up- it ain't going to happen.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at October 17, 2013 11:42 AM (SY2Kh)

-------------------------

I'd  think you would be delighted  that you don't have my childish vote  and financial  support  holding you back, anymore.  Let me know how  that GOP thing works out for you.

Posted by: Jones in CO at October 17, 2013 11:47 AM (8sCoq)

I'm ADD/OCD.  Nothing will send me into a killing spree like "that's a tough road to ho."

The Tea Party has made mistakes, just as any passionate, young political organization is bound to. There is this thing called a learning curve. (I am also not convinced it was a mistake to fight against deficits and Obamacare.)

The Establishment GOP has made mistakes: John McCain, Mitt Romney, The Bush Domestic Agenda, Tommy Thompson, Denny Rehberg, George Allen, Connie Mack, Nick Berg, Pete Hoekstra, Linc Chaffee, Arlen Specter.

WhatÂ’s their excuse?

As for the Libertarian Party, they are not so much a political movement as an intellectual pissing match.

I am willing to help the Tea Party improve their tactics because I want their principles to prevail. Those who want them destroyed and outcast do not want their principles to prevail.

In which case, what on earth is it you would like to see the GOP do?

-

How about doing what they ran on, instead of rubber-stamping the dems' plans?

"McCain and Graham need gone...

if it takes a D to get them gone then the D it will be."

And Alexander and Corker too......blood oath on it.  I will do whatever damage to these jackwagons that I can.

Posted by: willow at October 17, 2013 11:46 AM (nqBYe)

The problem you will have to overcome.... and I don't think it can be done... is that the Republican brand itself... the NAME... is tainted with too much history.

There are way too many folks out there who will NEVER vote for a Republican.  Who even when they agree with them 100% won't pull the Lever because there is an R next to the name.

Heck... you'll have that problem with ME!!! now just think about some Ex Union guy or Hispanic who has been told the Repubs HATE them... and believe it...

Posted by: willow at October 17, 2013 11:46 AM (nqBYe)

All political parties are vehicles to be used in order to attain political goals, so yes, by all means let's use the GOP and shape it to our purposes. As to your second point regarding Tea Party strategy, yes: primary the RINOs and go after the Dems. With a caveat: I understand why Northeast Rockefeller Republicans talk and vote and govern like Northeast Rockefeller Republicans, but there is a line. If they cross that line, then primary their asses. Christie crossed that line, in my view. So did Dick Lugar, which is why I voted against him in the primary, knowing that Mourdock was a weak candidate and that Donnelly would almost certainly win as a result.

Ford was a unique case. A senator who replaced a corrupt VP who replaced a nearly impeached president. He was never voted into the presidency by a will of the people.
Posted by: JackStraw at October 17, 2013 11:47 AM (g1DWB)

If you are going to give a history lesson, at least know that Ford was a Rep., the House Minority Leader to be exact

Liberals aren't going anywhere.  They own the country, the media, and the means whereby the populace is educated.

Name one thing accomplished by this stragegy of fighting the GOP has gotten us?  One law, one penny saved.

It has been seven years since 2006 when this began.

Name one way the country is better off.

Posted by: Jaws at October 17, 2013 11:42 AM (4I3Uo)

apparently you've missed some of my earlier comments regard to the criticism of the Tea Party.   I've already opined that much of the ciriticism is the result of mischaracterization  and misrepresentation  from the media.     But  if  you think the Tea Party is  without  any   faults  then  I think  that would  go to proving my statement. 

Lots of smoke, little clarity.

A yet to be determined number of people have a problem with the Republican party and have either left it or are thinking about leaving it.

That's a problem for the party, which says it's views are in line with those who are dissatisfied.

The problem, as seen by the dissatified group, is that the party doesn't seem to follow its own core principles as they have long been defined.

The "party" is a set of rules. The problem lies with the people in power in the party. They aren't interested in the core priniciples, so I'm not interested in them.

So I will vote to remove them at every oppotunity.

weirdest negotiating strategy I have ever seen.

Posted by: Jeff B. at October 17, 2013 11:49 AM (n/+FT

The problem is, you think I'm "negotiating".  And I don't want my "ass kissed" either. I'd just like y'all to take your dick out of it. No more. It fucking ends right now. No negotiation.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at October 17, 2013 11:49 AM (AskuI)

Oh, for Heaven's sake. Now you're blasting Gerald Ford? Give it a rest.

It is time you looked in the mirror and figured out that the "establishment" of the GOP is not what is holding us back.

Name one thing that is better because you have done this.  ONE.

430 Romney was too nice to win. He was unwilling to bloody his opponent. An opponent who, if one were to look closely, has a glass chin and is a bleeder. Obama was eminently beatable in '12. But Romney was unwilling or unable to sweep the leg, as was needed.

 ----

You are correct.  Romney did not play to win. 

Posted by: Jones in CO at October 17, 2013 11:57 AM (8sCoq)

And All American and Captain if I remember right

ENOUGH of the winning the Senate talk. We need to flip 6 seats...

Posted by: CAC at October 17, 2013 11:26 AM (VpNm0)

To gain a "majority" that will depend on McCain, Graham, Collins and Corker. Thats the GOP "winning" for you!

Oh, for Heaven's sake. Now you're blasting Gerald Ford? Give it a rest.

-

Oh yes.  I forgot.  WIN buttons FTW!

Posted by: Elize Nayden at October 17, 2013 12:00 PM (NsWus)

So we do it your way and complain our way to success?

Posted by: Jeff B. at October 17, 2013 12:00 PM (n/+FT)

They sure seem like they want to listen to a lot of other groups that they get no financial support or votes from, and never will.  No matter how much they fantasize about it.

Boy, I just love all the Democrat-lite comments here condemning Tea Party conservatives for not being leftist enough........

Enjoy those cocktail-party invites you WON'T be getting from your Democrat Massas, Republi-tards.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at October 17, 2013 11:57 AM (SY2Kh)

Damndest thing about new organizations - they can be different from old ones. 

I'd love to hear you argue why that's impossible.

Which is why we should have been pursuing scorched earth tactics against the mainstream media.

We need to wipe them out financially.

Posted by: Diogenes' Lamp at October 17, 2013 11:43 AM (bb5+k)

Exactly.  We also need to embarrass them at every opportunity.  And it isn't hard to do.  A while back, I said that every conservative who attends an event or protest should carry with them a business card with the number of the DNC.  When any reporter approaches you, hand them the card and tell them, "call this number.  They tell you what to say anyway."

Where's the RNC MFM war room?  The moment some blowhole like Wolf Blitzer asks a stupid question, respond with something embarrassing, "Hey, Wolf, how did those child porn charges pan out?"  If you metaphorically (unfortunately) punch their teeth down their throat every moment, they might just change their behavior.  And if they don't?  Well, they weren't going to be nice to you anyway, were they?

Poor Republicans. A failing party trying to hold its conservative base while moving left.

It won't work.

I am 52 years old.  I have watched politics since Nixon.  And you have not had ONE success!!!!!

I know enough to know that you can not change anything without a majority.  Not one thing.

That means politics is impure and you NEVER get what you want.  You get what can be got.  Nothing more.  Ever.

The Republican establishment is treating the conservatives in much the same way as the Democrat party treats the black vote...."So where are you going to go?"  The difference is that there is no system of controllers in place to keep the conservatives in line and voting the way the establishment wants.  Using the Dems as a boogey-man won't work much longer.  I don't see conservatives staying home, I think we will actively oppose the Republican establishment before it is all over.

If this happens, the Dems may win in the short term, but their prize would be Detroit on a national scale.

477

An excuse for the GOP's failed track record, and failed leadership.

We talk about how TFG distracts us from the real issues, well targeting the Tea Party supporters from within is a great distraction.

And what is this magic Conservative successful leadership again?  Has the country gotten more or less conservative since you all began this revolt?

We now have socialized medicine and more and more people on food stamps, and we are about to get amnesty.

That is the success of the Conservative revolt!!!!  Faster communist take over.

In which case, what on earth is it you would like to see the GOP do?

Barack Obama has committed demonstrable and proveable impeachable acts.  How about actually defending the Constitution from this puffed-up tinpot martinet?

We all know where this stands... 

I've got a deal for McConnell and Boehner ---- you get McCain to retire before Christmas, and I'll shut up until Jan 15

Posted by: Nozzle at October 17, 2013 12:08 PM (unF5M)

Funny, I was going to say the same thing to the fuckers in the Establishment.

Anyway, I roll my eyes at this thread.   The 'Pubbie supporters will never change their minds, and the conservatives like myself have no desire to continue being beaten daily for having the gall to call the 'Pubbies out on their lackluster record and piss poor defense of the Constitution.     There's no use in talking about it anymore.  

Name one success this stupid revolt has gotten in 7 years!!!!

There is no long game without some short term goals.

>>>Seven years of "conservative" revolt. What one thing is better now? One thing? What did it accomplish? Any goal reached at all?

We retook the House and also increased the Governorships to 30 states.   That's  one of the issues I have  with the GOP vs Tea Party  issue.  Both sides conveniently forget facts that are not conducive to proving their point.  

So we do it your way and complain our way to success?

Posted by: petunia at October 17, 2013 12:02 PM (DAcBA)

I made a factual statement. If you have problems understanding, you should go and ask a liberal about Joe Lieberman and the Public Option.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit Chelsea at October 17, 2013 12:11 PM (4df7R)

_______

What is your record of success again?  NOTHING!!!!!!!

It is defeat after defeat after defeat!!!!!!!

Because you win with a majority and you will never be a majority on your own!!!

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at October 17, 2013 12:10 PM (ZPrif)

Last I checked the definition of insanity was doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.   Does that sound more like the Pubbie establishment, or the conservative revolt?

Come back and answer when you've got more than insults.

Brit Hume on the GOP vs Teaparty.

http://tinyurl.com/le64gdq

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at October 17, 2013 12:13 PM (qyplE)

Only a shake?    I think a knee rub is in order.

"then get on the team and come in for the big win"

He said staring at a pile of bodies.    (FMJ reference)

Part of what I'm getting at here is that it seems what many of you want is just some fiery rhetoric to make you feel good. But rhetoric is cheap and useless. It doesn't, say, move votes in the Senate. What practical goals are you seeking?

Good point.  Right now I see:

1. Let it Burn

2. ????

3. Victory

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit Chelsea at October 17, 2013 12:13 PM (4df7R)

Well he also has a lifetime supply of Huggies.  Its the only explanation for why he keeps doing these daylong pants wetting episodes day after day.

Posted by: EC at October 17, 2013 12:15 PM (GQ8sn)

And I'm a spitting image of Karl Urban too.

Nickelfucker!

Barrel time.

A Parlimentary system allows many parties, and a monarch.

You want a government like Europeans, the same as the far left.  So go ahead and join up with your true like minded serfs.... the Democrat Party.

All the Republicans do is lose anyway, right?  So join up with the winners, they are your true ideological allies.

Unless you join us, you are worthless to us anyway.

Your way is defeat no matter how you slice it.

Posted by: petunia at October 17, 2013 12:13 PM (DAcBA)

Keep shrieking, harpy.  It's hysterical.

I guess you won't be winning anything on your own either. 

We have done it your way.  You're talking to people who swallowed the bitter pill in 08 and 12. 

Where is YOUR winning record? 

Oh yeah.  2010.  Delivered by the tea party movement. Funny thing, that.
Too bad it has all been pissed away since then.

Posted by: willow at October 17, 2013 12:09 PM (nqBYe)

Willow willow willow. 

Giving lip service to problems     is one thing, actually doing something about them     would mess up the perks of Washington life.

Posted by: KG at October 17, 2013 12:17 PM (p7BzH)

------- ------- -------- ----

Shhhhhh.  He's on a roll.  

Posted by: petunia at October 17, 2013 12:13 PM (DAcBA)

Explain to me why it is the conservative wing of the party that must compromise to "join" the majority, rather than the establishment wing of the party that must "change" to join the conservative wing?   The conservative wing being the one that actually acts like an opposition party.  That actually thinks about the Constitution and separation of powers and State's rights and individual liberty and all the things the Pubbies are more than happy to CAMPAIGN on, because it gets them votes, but then abandon instantly once they've been elected.  

How is     forcing conservative legislators to STOP doing what THEY said they'd do    during their election campaigns    somehow  okay,    but    demanding   the Pubbies DO WHAT THEY SAID THEY'D DO to get elected is anathema?

My state got gay marriage and legal pot.

Thanks Tea Party.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at October 17, 2013 12:19 PM (oFCZn)

No don't remember that.  

I think I'm seeing the difference   between Republicans and Democrats now.

Democrats say I'm racist.

Reublicans say I'm stupid.

I'll just   go enjoy life until   the reckoning comes, which I am well prepared to face.

Now explain to me what that actually MEANS in concrete real-world political terms. Are you saying you want the House to impeach Obama? (Remember, it's a guaranteed loss because the Dems hold the Senate. Oh, and America will conclude that Republicans are fucking bonkers, too, so there's that as well.) If not that, what concrete thing are you asking for?

Posted by: Jeff B. at October 17, 2013 12:12 PM (n/+FT)

**pokes head out of barrel**

I'll go with something easy.  Obama has no power to grant waivers to "the law of the land."  Yet he has done so.  Why is there no pushback?  Why does the GOP not get together with one voice and say "Obamacare for everybody, Barky?"

And if your response is, "well, what can we do?  He'll just ignore the law," then you've given up the battle before it starts.

**back in barrel**

Posted by: slowburn at October 17, 2013 12:22 PM (qxBIt)

Well, he is a Theater Major....

Posted by: Purp at October 17, 2013 12:22 PM (l5zzX)

which one?

"Let us please remember, the Republican Party itself began as a "third party.""

Personally, I now look forward to it DYING as a "third party". Without it, the Democrats have a chance of LOSING their majority, which they currently have with all the R's voting with them for Socialism.

Posted by: Begonia at October 17, 2013 12:24 PM (Dwehj)

I thought Chlamydia was next?

It almost sounds like the Tea Party is being referred to as the "far Right" here, and that's just picking up on the Leftist propaganda that they are "extremists".

It's the social conservatives that are the "far right". Small government is a libertarian (and I'd say "inherently American") stance. Being a "fiscal conservative" doesn't explicitly put you at ANY point on the political spectrum - it does not speak to social or economic tyranny. It's only because the Left is employing Cloward-Piven as a strategy that they are at odds with social conservatism. Theoretically, you could be a liberal, and still be for a balanced budget (through high taxes, for example).

By the same token, libertarians could go for either the Republican or Democratic party - at least that used to be the case. The Democrats have been moving AWAY from the Left - and moving straight towards outright totalitarianism. The main players are all a bunch of socialists, and worse.

Perhaps if the Republican party was smart, it would embrace, instead of fight, the libertarians, and start advertising how the Dems are a bunch of statists. They'd be the Party of Freedom, vs. the Party of Tyranny. Instead, they're fighting to stay the Party of the Church Lady.

Posted by: t-bird at October 17, 2013 12:24 PM (FcR7P)

He's missing the fact that majorities don't just appear out of thin air.  Just pat him on the head and make sure he wears a helmet at all times.

I'll sum up the problem I have with members  of   the Tea Party and  not what the Tea  Party stands for.

Ted Cruz is just one misstep away from being shunned by the Tea Party advocates.

Posted by: Purp at October 17, 2013 12:25 PM (l5zzX)

thread winner.

"The Teabaggers have destroyed what little was left of the GOP after President Obama's landslide 2012 victory." -  Lawrence M. at October 17, 2013 12:23 PM

You know, this sounds like something a Establishment Republican would say; Coinicidence?

A tiny example before I go. I serve on my county Plannign Commission. I recently went to P+Z to get a county map. They charge $20 bucks for them but the clerk said since I was on the Commission, she would just give me the map at no charge.

  -----   - -   - - -  - - - -  - - - - - -  - - -

I said no, I want to pay for it like everyone one else. I'm on the lowest possible rung of govt service, and at the first opportunity I was offered privelege above the public. It's everywhere, people it's everywhere, it's insidious to the point that the clerk had no idea why I would want to pay for   the map.

----    - - -  -  - -- -   -   - - - - -   - - - -  -

Bye now.  I still like almost all the GOPe people here. You aren't stupid, or racist. You are just misguided, or seem to suffer from Stockholm syndrome.    

There are two problems Drew.

First, Republican messaging sucked in this entire shutdown debate.  For a long time, think back to the pre-Reagan, and even Reagan, days, Republicans were Democrats light.  "we agree with them, but lets spend less"  on defense issues, it was more or less the opposite.   That still carries weight in the caucus, but I would argue the caucus as a whole is far more to the right than it was during the Bob Michel days.  We have Newt to thank for that. 

However, there were no positive messages coming from the Republican establishment during this discussion.  Other than everyone noting it was not a fight the leadership wanted, at least as a tactical matter, where was the positive.  There were no speeches about how we need to get our debt under control or how simply raising the debt ceiling without addressing the underlying issues was nothing but a temporary fix and we will find ourselves back here in  [fill in a time period]. 

The Tea Party caucus was even worse.  Other than Obamacare sucks, which it does, there was no alternative.  Yes, we heard from Cruz about the infringement on freedom, but nothing more specfic.  There needs to be an alternative for people about how they intend to fix a system that nearly everyone agrees is screwed up.  Obamacare makes it worse.  Other than not wanting the government in, how would you Tea Party types fix it.  There was no voice on that.

The worst part of this for Republicans/Conservatives/Tea Partiers is not that the deal itself is nothing, or that they won nothing in it.  That was always going to happen given the battlefield that was chosen.  The worst part is that there was a huge microphone available to all sides, and NOT ONE PERSON stepped up and took advantage of that microphone with a meaningful alternative.  We can not win a debate that we are not prepared to enter.  We can win the debate with meaningful proposals that make sense and represent our values.  Cruz put forth values in a highly generic sense.  He failed to tie them to a policy proposal.

The failure to seize the microphone is the real loss in this deal.  There will be another shutdown and debt ceiling increase needed, we can fight this fight again.  We will fight this fight again.  Hopefully, this time we will come armed with meaningful proposals reflecting our values, not just Obamacare sucks and needs to be defunded.   

Posted by: Purp at October 17, 2013 12:29 PM (l5zzX)

Whole subnet filter.

Fucking works!

Posted by: Meremortal at October 17, 2013 12:29 PM (1Y+hH)

passive aggressive fail.

Has anyone here threatening to leave  the GOP actually run for a GOP committee post?

To what extent did you do  something concrete to change the party?

Posted by: Kinley Ardal at October 17, 2013 12:34 PM (sPEf3)

yeah... um.  No.

Thinking the "curl up in a ball and die" approach isn't my thing.

Never Quit.

Posted by: Purp at October 17, 2013 12:33 PM (l5zzX)

Gah!!!!

When will pixy/ace ever do a solid and make the leap to the 20th century?

Posted by: Jeff B. at October 17, 2013 12:36 PM (n/+FT)

Jeff, I disagree with most everything you say, but at the same time you stand your ground.  So +1 respect.

Having said that, your comment and analogy make no goddam sense at all. 

603 "... then you've given up the battle before it starts."

That actually seems to be something of a favorite sport, I've noticed, and one that is strongly reinforced by the pundits and media of the Right. They sermonize that various things must not be done, because the media will use it to make them look bad.

Well, no matter WHAT you do, the Democratic media will do propaganda against you. So they're really saying, "Do nothing", or "Appease the Democratic propaganda machine", like that would be some sort of brilliant long-term strategy. It's scary.

In this latest episode, the Republicans were (finally!) acting against Obamacare, which is what they were elected to do, and which the public is against, while still being FOR funding the rest of the government. That's a position the public FAVORS, and yet they still submit to being made to look like the bad guys. What the hell is wrong with these guys, when they can't come off looking good, when pursuing a popular position?

Pushback? Three weeks of the most pushback in 20 years, and no ground gained.

Three weeks of "pushback" with GOP heavyweights sabotaging it every day is hardly my idea of pushback.  And if you think I'm exaggerating, then tell me why Chuckles Schumer is creaming his feculent jock strap today.

Posted by: Rev Dr E Buzz Commissar at October 17, 2013 12:38 PM (HQml1)

yeah, Rove is about as helpful as syphilis.  Someone call him and tell him to stop "helping."

Posted by: McAdams at October 17, 2013 12:33 PM (KJqz6)

The reason the Republican Party supplanted the Whigs is because the Whigs would not confront the Democrats over the slavery, the single most divisive issue facing the country at that time.

I have long considered myself a Party of Lincoln Republican. However, if the GOP continues to play go-along and get-along and refuses to confront the Democrats over the transformation of the United States into an authoritarian, neo-Marxist socialist superstate and the inevitable destruction of the Republic, then I'll have no choice. I'll leave the GOP and look elsewhere.

I won't presume to speak for anyone else, just myself, but think my feelings on the matter are shared by a great many others. So, to the GOP: step up or step aside.

Posted by: Kinley Ardal at October 17, 2013 12:41 PM (sPEf3)

Heh... you couldn't be more off-base. 

Take ten seconds and scroll up.  I'm most definitely not a GOP supporter.

662   "Use   your   time   constructively,   rather   than   waste   it   on   a   Quixotic   quest   to   save   a   people   that   have   chosen   destruction."

This.   Look   after   your   families   and   those   close   to   you.   Hold   firm   to   your   principles   and   faith.   Let   those   who   have   chosen   the   whirlwind   reap   what   they   have   sown.

"Therefore   everyone   who   hears   these   words   of   mine   and   puts   them   into   practice  ^B)">B)'> is   like   a   wise   man   who   built   his   house   on   the   rock.  The   rain   came   down,   the   streams   rose,   and   the   winds   blew   and   beat   against   that   house;   yet   it   did   not   fall, because   it   had   its   foundation   on   the   rock.   But   everyone   who   hears   these   words   of   mine   and   does   not   put   them   into   practice   is   like   a   foolish   man   who   built   his   house   on   sand.   The   rain   came   down,   the   streams   rose,   and   the   winds   blew   and   beat   against   that   house,   and   it   fell   with   a   great   crash.”

To what extent did you do something concrete to change the party?

I voted...with my feet.

Posted by: Purp at October 17, 2013 12:36 PM (l5zzX)

Seriously, I was asking what you DID, not what you didn't do.

Posted by: Kinley Ardal at October 17, 2013 12:47 PM (sPEf3)

Boo.  Fucking.  Hoo.

I know the nation has been on a path to destruction but that doesn't mean I stop identifying and doing my best to curb same. 

 We fight.

Posted by: sven10077 at October 17, 2013 12:38 PM (9jfyN)

I appreciate your passion sven. But I think you'll be back to vote in the 2016 primary,  if it's  contested.

Posted by: Kinley Ardal at October 17, 2013 12:52 PM (sPEf3)

And your problem?  you have no hope.

@662

I really want to argue against all that, but the socialists own the schools, K through college, they own the media, and they own popular culture.

The thing about "Let it Burn" is that it's either a presumption that there will be a useful reaction when everything goes wrong, or a capitulation.

As to the "useful reaction", Cloward-Piven is formulated on the idea that freedom dies most easily in times of turmoil. They are specifically working to create the crises that they intend not to waste.

As to capitulation, every individual seeks to be free - especially anyone who really understands the concept of being an American - and "Freedom works". Things that work are inherently stronger than things that don't work.

So I guess I DID manage to argue against it, after all. People are unhappy with schools, colleges are "bubbling" themselves into decline (as employers discover that automated online courses - that take few academics, of certain types - are a more practical way to get what they really need, and a "Women's Studies" major is LESS qualified for an entry-level job than a High school graduate with a good attitude, and as students discover that a useless degree and $100k of debt is a bad way to start off life). MSNBC has the worst ratings on cable. The Tea Party came out of nowhere. It's not all bad!

Gold star, Hollowpoint! I look forward to your party earning my vote again.
But first, you will blow me.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at October 17, 2013 12:54 PM (qyplE)

Since the Tea Party is in the GOP, does this mean you won't vote for TP candidates because of their party allignment?

Just wonderin.

sven,

Politics is about persuasion.   A bunch  of folks on the right think it's enough to express their passion, over and over. The GOP will listen to us when it's safe to do so. Just like Democrats treat their liberal base.  Again, the work doesn't begin in D.C. it ends there.

Posted by: Purp at October 17, 2013 12:56 PM (l5zzX)

Too many euphamisms to sort out.  Black flag?  Slitting throats?  Secession? 

what exactly?

This nation jumped off a roof decades ago. Deploy an umbrella to break the fall now is NOT a plan. Calling for the coroner's wagon IS a plan.

Holy shit, get outside and talk to some regular folk. Enough with the insular apocalyptic talk.

Posted by: EC at October 17, 2013 12:57 PM (GQ8sn)

You understand that most voters aren't ready for this right? That we  won't win  one race with this?  We have a lot of heavy lifting to do before we start  razing federal buildings.

Has anyone here threatening to leave the GOP actually run for a GOP committee post?

-

I did.  Half the committee told me to shut up and support   Romney and the entire GOP ticket   without any question, and the other half told me I had to support Santorum because he wasn't a Mormon.     I then told them I could think for myself, and was uninvited to participate    further.

Posted by: CJ at October 17, 2013 01:00 PM (9KqcB)

Posted by: Andrew at October 17, 2013 12:51 PM (VjlMj)

No, that is historical fact--except for that bit you wrote about the Whigs, which is further proof you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. I take you are one of those neo-confederate assholes whose great-great-granddaddy had his ass handed to him at Stones River or Vicksburg or St. Petersburg or Gettysburg or wherever. Confederate battle flag bumpersticker type? Of course you are. Every time one of you opens your piehole all I hear is how the poor South was persecuted by the dictator Lincoln and evil Northern industrialists for being so pure and true and all of that other shit you and the boys talk about around the fire every Saturday night.

Slavery had everything to do with it, asshole.

Posted by: CJ at October 17, 2013 01:01 PM (9KqcB)

It explains a lot about voters.

Posted by: Kinley Ardal at October 17, 2013 01:01 PM (sPEf3)

As a christian, I offer this advice:  God made this world and you're in it.  Do something other than wait for Jesus.