December 06, 2013
— Ace In a movie or book, "The MacGuffin" is the thing the hero wants.
Usually the villain wants it too, and their conflict over who will end up with The MacGuffin forms the basic spine of the story.
In Raiders of the Lost Ark, the MacGuffin is, of course, the Lost Ark. Indy wants it; the Nazis have it. This basic conflict over simple possession animates a two hour long movie.
Alfred Hitchcock noted -- counterintuitively, when you first hear this -- that the specifics of the MacGuffin don't really matter at all to a movie. He pointed out that the audience doesn't care at all about the MacGuffin. The hero in the movie itself cares, but the audience doesn't.
In one Hitchcock film, the MacGuffin was some smuggled uranium hidden in vintage wine bottles. But Hitchcock noted it didn't matter if it was uranium in wine bottles, or a fragment of a diplomatic dispatch from the Nazi high command, or a hidden murder weapon, or photographs proving a Senator's affair.
The Lost Ark in Raiders of the Lost Ark could have easily been replaced with some missing Shankara Stones from a Thuggee temple, or the Holy Grail. In fact, that's exactly what they changed the MacGuffin to in the sequels.
No audience member really cared if the Nazis wound up with the Ark of the Covenant. For one thing, the audience walked into the theater knowing, as a matter of real-world historical fact, that Adolf Hitler had not ever possessed a holy artifact of unspeakable power, and that, even if had possessed such a thing secretly, it availed him not at all, because he shot himself through the temple in a bunker as the Allied forces closed in around him in 1945.
But we cared about Indy. He was a character we liked, a character that sparked our imaginations; whether he was looting a South American burial mound (illegally, by the way!) or blowing off his students by sneaking out a back window during office hours (poor work ethic, incidentally), we rooted for him to win.
A MacGuffin only has one requirement: That it be important-sounding, so that the audience understands he hero isn't engaged in some trivial matter, but that the Stakes Are High. (Woody Allen inverted this rule in his parody espionage film What's Up Tiger Lily?, where the MacGuffin was a top-secret recipe for chicken salad.)
But an important sounding MacGuffin is just another way to increase the audience's emotional attachment to the Hero, not to the idea of possessing the MacGuffin.
And that, of course, explains all you need to know about the abnormal political situation we find ourselves in, and the Cult of Barack Obama.
For Obama's fanbois, this is not politics. This isn't even America, not really, not anymore.
This is a movie. And Barack Obama is the Hero. And the Republicans are the Villains. And policy questions -- and Obama's myriad failures as an executive -- are simply incidental. They are MacGuffins only, of no importance whatsoever, except to the extent they provide opportunities for Drama as the Hero fights in favor of them.
Watching Chris Matthews interview Obama, I was struck by just how uninterested in policy questions Matthews (and his panel) were, and how almost every question seemed to be, at heart, about Obama's emotional response to difficulties-- not about policy itself, but about Obama's Hero's Journey in navigating the plot of President Barack Obama: The Movie.
As with a MacGuffin in the movie, only the Hero's emotional response to the MacGuffin matters.
Again and again, Matthews and his panel focused not on weighty questions of state, but on what toll these important-sounding MacGuffins took upon the Star of the Picture, Barack Obama.
Matthews was not terribly interested in hearing about the problems with Obamacare, or how Obama planned to address them.
But he was very interested in learning how Obama was coping with the challenges.
Matthews didn't care all that much about disputes over the budget. But he was keenly interested in Obama's thoughts on his opponents in such struggles.
Chris Matthews' called Obama's last answer the most important in the interview, and his entire panel agreed it was simply amazing.
That last question was about Obama's -- the Hero's -- travails.
Wrapping up the interview, Matthews ended the night with a question about whether going into politics is really worth it, especially considering that the great majority of students in the audience expressed interest in some day joining the congressional ranks."It continues to be a way to serve that I think can be noble. It's hard. It can be frustrating. You have got to have a thick skin," Obama said. "But I tell you, the satisfaction you get when you've passed a law or you've taken an executive action and somebody comes up to you and says you know what, my kid's alive because you passed that health care bill. Because he was uninsured, he got insurance, got a check up and we caught a tumor in time [...] So for those young people who don't mind a little gray hair, it's something that I not only recommend, but I'd welcome."
Matthews' panel gushed over Obama's answer here. And why shouldn't they? Usually the Hero offers a self-reflective but somewhat grim speech as he sits in the belly of the beast, at his lowest point in his journey. It's this speech that lets the audience know the Hero may be down, but he's not yet out.
And the audience for President Barack Obama: The Movie just loved it:
HOWARD FINEMAN: i would like to say that you and the students here from AU got a once in a lifetime opportunity to see in person a president talking about what it’s like to be president, while he’s actually president. Now, he’s gone from Superman to Sisyphus. He’s talking about rolling a boulder up the hill. He has a much more mature view, but he has a moral view. I thought he made the moral case for Obamacare, for you folks to consider Obamacare as a measure of community in America. That’s what motivates Barack Obama. He knows it’s tough –CHRIS MATTHEWS: And he lifted up. He lifted up when he talked about –
FINEMAN: The last 15 minutes of this interview were extraordinary. IÂ’ve never seen anything like it, where a president kind of unburdened himself to you about why heÂ’s in the ball game. And I thought he made a very compelling case for his own decency, whatever the screw-ups were managerially, and they were real.
Note what they're not talking about: America. Policy. The economy. Obamacare. Actual live political controversies and possible programmatic responses to the difficulties we face (many of which Obama has caused himself, or made worse).
No, American politics is now merely a MacGuffin, an important-sounding but ultimately inconsequential and disposable plot device for holding interest in the Hero's Journey.
Ultimately the only thing that matters is the Hero itself. It doesn't matter why the Hero Barack Obama wants the Lost Ark of Sensible Gun Control, or the Shankara Stones of Comprehensive Immigration Reform, or the Democratic Holy Grail of Affordable Health Care. These are very minor details and only matter to the extent the Hero exerts himself to achieve them.
The viewers of this film don't really care about these things, but only Obama's frustration at being denied them, or his joy in attaining them.
"This is a big f***ing deal," his incompetent Comic Sidekick said as he signed Obamacare into law. What the "this" was didn't matter then, as it scarcely matters now.
What counted was that the Hero had won.
Politics is now a MacGuffin in American politics, at least for the frothing fanbois of the Hero Barack Obama.
It doesn't matter what his goals actually are -- it only matters that he succeeds in those quests, whatever they might be.
And this isn't a new phenomenon, either. Since the beginning of this movie, the fanbois have cared very little for MacGuffins (notice they don't care how many thousands of Americans have died in Afghanistan), but have been intensely interested in the Hero's emotional response to it all.
You root for the Hero to win because you like the Hero -- not because you're particularly invested in the Hero's actual goals. And you despise the Villains simply because they're standing in the way of the Hero's triumph.
Chris Matthews sums up, neatly, his only genuine interest in American politics for the past five years:
“We have real people in this country with real power and status who have used that status of power to hurt the country so they could hurt the president.”
Only the Hero matters. The MacGuffin never does.
The Hero is our hopes and dreams. And the Hero has come to us; he has come amongst us.
Posted by: Ace at
10:46 AM
| Comments (612)
Post contains 1489 words, total size 9 kb.
Posted by: Student Loans Consortium Uber Alles at December 06, 2013 10:48 AM (kXoT0)
--
because before we just let tots die, Because we are a mean country!
Posted by: willow at December 06, 2013 10:49 AM (nqBYe)
Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 06, 2013 10:50 AM (HVff2)
Now that you say that, I guess it's kind of insulting to those of us who take our chicken salad seriously.
Posted by: Phinn at December 06, 2013 10:50 AM (KOGmz)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 10:50 AM (/Crba)
Posted by: AE at December 06, 2013 10:51 AM (HYceo)
Barky is a genius -- floats up
Barky lifts up -- floats up
etc.
What the heck would he do if, "Barky is a clueless cretin" floats up?
Posted by: Student Loans Consortium Uber Alles at December 06, 2013 10:51 AM (kXoT0)
Posted by: awkward davies at December 06, 2013 10:51 AM (WK8VM)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 10:51 AM (/Crba)
Posted by: Cicero Kid at December 06, 2013 10:52 AM (6fSty)
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Weary and Wary at December 06, 2013 10:52 AM (kXoT0)
all the time, agitating .
if it wasn't for me, you would not have lived!
contrary to thousands of years of history before HE arrived.
Posted by: willow at December 06, 2013 10:53 AM (nqBYe)
Posted by: Jenny Hates Her Phone but Likes This Post at December 06, 2013 10:53 AM (r1ruo)
Posted by: Frumious Bandersnatch at December 06, 2013 10:54 AM (A0sHn)
Posted by: bestie21 at December 06, 2013 10:54 AM (AzO5R)
Posted by: toby928© at December 06, 2013 10:56 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 06, 2013 10:56 AM (HVff2)
Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at December 06, 2013 10:57 AM (+lsX1)
Posted by: Komissar Vladimir at December 06, 2013 10:57 AM (sBegS)
Posted by: Chris Christie at December 06, 2013 10:58 AM (5M2+1)
Posted by: RS at December 06, 2013 10:58 AM (YAGV/)
Posted by: Stay Puft Marshmellow Man at December 06, 2013 10:59 AM (5M2+1)
Posted by: toby928© at December 06, 2013 10:59 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: JX at December 06, 2013 11:00 AM (hPjYm)
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at December 06, 2013 11:00 AM (pqBkB)
TL;DR. Another movie review? Raiders of the Lost Ark?
Just kidding. Ace, you have accurately distilled the essence of politics in the Age of Obama, the subjugation of policy to emotions. No wonder I've developed a seething hatred of 52% of the voting public.
Posted by: BUTCH at December 06, 2013 11:01 AM (0APJ3)
Posted by: Dr. Jesse Pinkman at December 06, 2013 11:01 AM (kkbgQ)
Nobody knew what it was, what it looked like or what it did. And nobody gave a shit, even the midgets trying to get it. They just knew they wanted it.
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at December 06, 2013 03:00 PM (pqBkB)
Hey! We were just talking about you.
Posted by: EC at December 06, 2013 11:01 AM (GQ8sn)
Posted by: Oil Field Trash at December 06, 2013 11:01 AM (oZ6Js)
Posted by: Stringer Davis at December 06, 2013 11:01 AM (xq1UY)
Posted by: Walter Freeman at December 06, 2013 11:02 AM (kqGWM)
Posted by: Baron Von Ottomatic at December 06, 2013 03:01 PM (kUgpq)
Depends on who wins and writes the History.
Posted by: willow at December 06, 2013 11:02 AM (nqBYe)
I've been thinking about the Buffalo Springfield song, "Stop, hey what's that sound?" "blah blah blah and carrying signs / mostly say hooray for our side".
It's like that on both sides, cheerleading for Our Team, but the sycophancy and smug superiority on Team Obama's side are getting really hard to take.
Posted by: White House Jugend at December 06, 2013 11:02 AM (A0sHn)
Posted by: Mr Pink at December 06, 2013 11:02 AM (oXeuc)
Posted by: Walter Freeman at December 06, 2013 03:02 PM (kqGWM)
As long as it's been a smart vajayjay knitting blog...at least.
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Weary and Wary at December 06, 2013 11:02 AM (kXoT0)
You have captured the essence of Obama's presidency. Well done, Ace.
Posted by: Lizzy at December 06, 2013 11:02 AM (JRmiD)
Posted by: Xander Crews at December 06, 2013 11:03 AM (LGz3p)
EXCELLENT post, ace. I hope this gets shared around on Insty and the like, because it really gets to the heart of the Cult of Obama.
My only argument would be this:
No, American politics is now merely a MacGuffin, an important-sounding but ultimately inconsequential and disposable plot device for holding interest in the Hero's Journey.
I wouldn't say American politics is the MacGuffin. Rather, America has become the MacGuffin. Politics is the sacrificial blood by which the adulating hordes of Obama's cultists can pledge their fealty to him.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/b][/i][/u] at December 06, 2013 11:03 AM (4df7R)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:03 AM (sByIH)
And as the president left the studio Chris pressed his TrapperKeeper tightly against his chest and sighed.
"If only, if only...." he whispered to the perfectly tailored suit walking away.
Posted by: Mikey NTH - Death Capades - ObamaCare on Ice! Sponsored by the Outrage Outlet at December 06, 2013 11:03 AM (hLRSq)
Imagine if Obama murdered some children and it was caught on tape. Chris Matthews wouldn't be sorrowful at the loss of some innocent lives. Instead, he'd be crying because the video of the murder might hurt Obama. Frankly, I don't how to talk to people like that unless they're in a straightjacket and locked in a padded cell.
Posted by: physics geek at December 06, 2013 11:03 AM (MT22W)
That's because liberals are emotional, not intellectual.
Think about any issue and put it in those terms. It follows as a paradigm for the entire parade of issues Mr Obama has foisted upon us since 2008.
He immediately appeals to emotion. Damn the facts. Those are just artifacts the opposition uses to foil Mr. Obama and Democrats plans.
And he wouldn't get away with except for the press. The media used to serve as a check against such MMM because they dealt in tangible facts.
They don't anymore. They've become the largest group of fanboi's. Every issue is retrofitted into their personal emotional perspective. It's never broken down into component parts and scrutinized in a deliberate and meaningful way. It is simply crafted to fit a predetermined conclusion based on bias.
I cannot express my loathing and hate enough for the media. There is not a more worthless group of people on this planet. I mostly blame them for our predicament.
Posted by: Marcus at December 06, 2013 11:04 AM (GGCsk)
Posted by: Chris Matthews at December 06, 2013 11:04 AM (5M2+1)
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/b][/i][/u] at December 06, 2013 11:04 AM (4df7R)
Posted by: Baron Von Ottomatic at December 06, 2013 03:01 PM (kUgpq)
Yeah, most history gets written by extremely Liberal College Professors, so I have little hope that anything real will be written about him until around 2114 or so.
Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Weary and Wary at December 06, 2013 11:04 AM (kXoT0)
Indiana Jones and Obama walk into an Irish bar.
The bartender says " How you guys doing? My name's MacGuffin. What can I get you ?
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:04 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:04 AM (/FnUH)
egypt, yep those nasty republicans
gov health care website, yeah somehow republicans
emancipation proclamation.= republicans. woops!
Posted by: willow at December 06, 2013 11:05 AM (nqBYe)
Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith[/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at December 06, 2013 11:05 AM (qyfb5)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:05 AM (ZPrif)
Posted by: Mr Pink at December 06, 2013 11:05 AM (oXeuc)
But that's only because the Republicans are not worthy of a leader like Barack Neville Nelson Obama.
Posted by: Hrothgar at December 06, 2013 11:05 AM (XdnQT)
Posted by: Minnfidel at December 06, 2013 11:06 AM (5M2+1)
Posted by: kalel666 at December 06, 2013 11:06 AM (gSqI7)
Good post.
Thing is, and I know ace didn't say it, but MacGuffinization is not the exclusive province of the Left. I think you see it from Establishment GOPers as well.
How many times do we keep hearing from them that electing Rs is the most important thing, so don't worry about amnesty for illegals....?
Posted by: @JohnTant at December 06, 2013 11:06 AM (PFy0L)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at December 06, 2013 11:06 AM (VtjlW)
Posted by: Caliban at December 06, 2013 11:06 AM (DrC22)
And here I was gonna thrash the room-temperature equine by making an Ace movie review joke.
Meta-Ewok confuses and frightens me.......
Posted by: IllTemperedCur at December 06, 2013 11:06 AM (TIIx5)
Posted by: JackStraw at December 06, 2013 11:06 AM (g1DWB)
Posted by: Havedash at December 06, 2013 11:07 AM (SIR+t)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at December 06, 2013 11:07 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: JPS at December 06, 2013 11:07 AM (Brc00)
Posted by: Paid for by Citizens for Clyde the Orangutan at December 06, 2013 11:07 AM (QF8uk)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:07 AM (ZPrif)
If it's true that the Cult of Obama really sees this as a fictional movie setting, then aren't they all, by definition, psychotic? The definition of psychosis is when thought and emotion are so fucked that you have literally lost contact with the real world. If they think that Obama is some sort of hero with a quest that must be won, lest darkness fill the land, then it really is only a matter of time until they start on some typical "let's all get together and wish away the bad men" crusade to support their valiant warrior.
Posted by: YourPoopyPants at December 06, 2013 11:07 AM (Y/HG5)
Posted by: eleven at December 06, 2013 11:07 AM (fsLdt)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:08 AM (sByIH)
Posted by: edj[/i] at December 06, 2013 11:08 AM (klzyR)
---
One death is a tragedy. A million deaths is a statistic.
Posted by: Stuff Stalin Said, Vols I - IV at December 06, 2013 11:08 AM (wcLJG)
Posted by: Barky Oblowme at December 06, 2013 11:08 AM (D2zE2)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at December 06, 2013 11:08 AM (7ObY1)
Speaking of Raiders of the Lost Ark....
How, exactly, did Indy get off the Nazi Island with the Ark?
Posted by: @JohnTant at December 06, 2013 11:08 AM (PFy0L)
Posted by: Vizzy at December 06, 2013 11:09 AM (H0lcY)
Posted by: bigjack at December 06, 2013 11:09 AM (N/rPL)
Posted by: toby928© at December 06, 2013 11:09 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at December 06, 2013 11:09 AM (bCEmE)
What about the 100s real dead from the ObamaFail for each one of these theoretical saves. I'm pretty sure we won't see any of them "walking" up to him.
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (DL2i+)
Posted by: Minnfidel at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (5M2+1)
Zero said it himself; "I am the change", or "the change is me".
That's it.
Elect Zero POTUS, and it's Mission Accomplished. Everything that has followed from Nov '08 -the domestic policy, foreign policy, budgetary issues, defense, the economy, all of it, is just afterdivinebirth.
Posted by: aquaviva at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (wFinq)
Oh, you mean the insurance almost no one can buy and even if they can and have, hasn't kicked in yet? That insurance? That speculative, future insurance has had time to catch cancerous tumors in uninsurable children and have such successes reported up to the President in private and they just, you know, decided *not* to trumpet this wonderful Obamacare triumph to all and sundry?
Jesus Christ, what a shameless fucking liar.
And Matthews and co. are grade A morons to believe a word of it. I don't even mean that pejoratively. I mean that they are fucking stupid.
Posted by: dawnfire82 at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (1/hzQ)
Posted by: elaine at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (GNZ0/)
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Mama AJ at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (SUKHu)
Posted by: flounder at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (Kkt/i)
Posted by: Miller at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (/Crba)
The rest of America = Kids enslaved in the mines
Winnie = John Boehner
Short Round = Mitch McConnell
Indy = Who will take up the fedora and whip???
Posted by: hates this movie at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (bvtgt)
Posted by: toby928© at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: boulder toilet hobo at December 06, 2013 11:10 AM (yvLNt)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 06, 2013 11:11 AM (da5Wo)
You root for the Hero to win because you like the Hero -- not because you're particularly invested in the Hero's actual goals. And you despise the Villains simply because they're standing in the way of the Hero's triumph.
I think the only movie I've seen that contradicts this sentiment for me is A Few Good Men. Also in politics , the MacGuffin factor of hero / villain doesn't apply fully because usually about half the people have a different opinion on who the hero is and who the villain is.
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:11 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: cajun caret at December 06, 2013 11:11 AM (UZQM8)
Posted by: Stringer Davis at December 06, 2013 11:11 AM (xq1UY)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:11 AM (sByIH)
Btw, that's why people went apeshit over rush's "I hope he fails". You're not supposed to root for the Nazis in "Raiders of the Lost Ark".
Posted by: boulder toilet hobo at December 06, 2013 03:10 PM (yvLNt)
Clinton was better than Bush? Mary mother of Hey Zeus.
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:12 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:12 AM (ZPrif)
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 11:12 AM (iGP6J)
Posted by: Roy at December 06, 2013 11:13 AM (VndSC)
Well if it costs one Hot Blonde and a Nazi to repeal it then, Sorry Babe.
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 11:13 AM (DL2i+)
Posted by: Dr. Jesse Pinkman at December 06, 2013 11:13 AM (kkbgQ)
This dovetails with Noonan's comments about how the Bright Young Things surrounding Sir Puttsalot view what is happening as a movie. It's not. It's reality. Real people are experiencing real problems as a result of the real decisions that are being made. There's no resent. There's no rewind. There's no flipping the script. It's real.
Which is what makes the continued opposition to repealing Obamacare so revolting. Anyone should be able to look at what this awful "law" is doing to the country -- to actual PEOPLE who are actually HURTING because of it -- and know that the right thing to do is to repeal it. To UNMAKE it, and to try and set the stage for people to get their lives together again.
But no. Repeal the MacGuffin? That would be like giving the Grail to Donovan! Or Luke using his targeting computer instead of the Force and not being able to blow up the Death Star! Or Frodo failing to throw The One Ring into Mount Doom! It would be a devastating blow to the audience that's followed their Hero's story! You can't DO that to the Hero. They have to succeed! Against all odds, regardless of what happens, they have to succeed!
It's sickening. Beyond reason.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/b][/i][/u] at December 06, 2013 11:13 AM (4df7R)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:13 AM (/FnUH)
Posted by: Mr Pink at December 06, 2013 11:14 AM (oXeuc)
"...In the 25-54 demo, Chris Matthews‘ show came in second place on MSNBC with 216K viewers, behind Rachel Maddow who had 274K.
***
At what point is MSNBC going to be considered "an expensive hobby" by the IRS for NBC? When Matthews is doing his nightly jerk-off in an NBC broom closet with a hairbrush as a microphone?
Posted by: B at December 06, 2013 11:14 AM (5OEha)
Changing my show name to "Money Shot" to better reflect what I like my boyfriend to spray all over my face!
Lean Forward, Stick Out Your Tongue!
Posted by: Chrissy Matthews at December 06, 2013 11:14 AM (27KAF)
Amnesty is an example. Same admin that allowed guns to walk to Mexico is concerned about the welfare of Mexicans? So they say. But that MacGuffin matters to the scalawags, not the politicians. They only care about it enough to make it a Thing.
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 06, 2013 11:14 AM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: Minnfidel at December 06, 2013 11:14 AM (5M2+1)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:15 AM (/FnUH)
Posted by: edj[/i] at December 06, 2013 11:15 AM (klzyR)
The Administration as an Adventure Movie.
Except the blood and bodies and suffering is real, not a script, and not CGI.
Posted by: Mikey NTH - Death Capades - ObamaCare on Ice! Sponsored by the Outrage Outlet at December 06, 2013 11:15 AM (hLRSq)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at December 06, 2013 11:15 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:15 AM (ZPrif)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:15 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Hrothgar at December 06, 2013 11:16 AM (XdnQT)
Posted by: Mama AJ at December 06, 2013 11:16 AM (SUKHu)
Posted by: Mr Pink at December 06, 2013 11:16 AM (oXeuc)
community agitator .all.the.way.
Posted by: willow at December 06, 2013 02:50 PM (nqBYe)
Wouldn't matter much , if it wasn't for the media. Amazing mass hysteria.
Posted by: Temper Tantrum at December 06, 2013 11:16 AM (AWmfW)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 11:16 AM (/Crba)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:17 AM (/FnUH)
Posted by: Andy at December 06, 2013 11:17 AM (qZRAa)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:17 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Dr. Jesse Pinkman at December 06, 2013 11:17 AM (kkbgQ)
MacGuffins aside, this Obama movie sucks ass.
Posted by: MacGruber at December 06, 2013 11:17 AM (sWgE+)
Posted by: Zombie Walter White at December 06, 2013 11:17 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:17 AM (sByIH)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 03:15 PM (ZPrif)
I'm in the minority. I hate chase scenes.
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:18 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: the Butcher at December 06, 2013 11:18 AM (8g9qq)
Posted by: elaine at December 06, 2013 11:18 AM (GNZ0/)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:18 AM (ZPrif)
And I always thought the Biden dialogue was a bit on the nose with the, "This is a big, fucking deal." line. What happened to show, don't tell?
Hopefully we're still in draft.
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 03:05 PM (ZPrif)
A nice companion is Hillary's, "At this point, what difference does it make?"
Posted by: flounder at December 06, 2013 11:18 AM (Kkt/i)
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 03:12 PM (iGP6J)
Oh shit.....you're right. Hopefully Hillary's extreme unlikeablity will sink her.
Posted by: eleven at December 06, 2013 11:18 AM (fsLdt)
Posted by: Mr Pink at December 06, 2013 11:19 AM (oXeuc)
This is a religion.
Obama never makes mistakes .. these are meant to be that way.
You just don't understand yet.
Posted by: Jimmy Swaggart at December 06, 2013 11:19 AM (e8kgV)
As a couple of people have noted, to get to true McGuffinism, you have to care about the fate of the nation, and life in general, only as much as a movie plot.
Movie-thinkers are amused that the rest of us could give a shit about anything.
No offense meant to actual film-craftsmen who toil in that vineyard and post here.
Posted by: Stringer Davis at December 06, 2013 11:19 AM (xq1UY)
Also, what would have happened to the Ark if Indy didn't exist? It'd be sitting on that island maybe? Or would Hitler have people retrieve it and gone melty like everyone else?
-------------
Hell, good points. Basically, nothing Indy did in that whole movie made a damned bit of difference in the end.
Posted by: @JohnTant at December 06, 2013 11:19 AM (PFy0L)
Posted by: BignJames at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (j7iSn)
The Nazis never bothered to submerge which makes no frickin' sense!
Posted by: EC at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (GQ8sn)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (ZPrif)
The MacGuffin is Hanks' life and both he and the elements are vying for it?
Posted by: BCochran1981 -
Not all movies have to have one, and I'd certain say that a protag's life is a lot more important to be called a plot device.
If you have to have one for Castaway it'd prolly be the raft. It's a device to further the plot; it bridges the turning point ( the tree and the rope ) to the journey back.
Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (uCNam)
Really great stuff, Ace.
You wonder if what we've lost is not the ability to think or talk about policy per se, but the ability to think at all, period. We are so awash in narratives, stories, celebrities, hype, movies, TV shows, etc., that we literally can't get back outside the frame of the Hero-Villain arc that every story has to be jammed into.
Obamacare and birth control is a perfect example. The birth control is exactly what Ace says, a MacGuffin... no one seriously believes that anyone lacks access to inexpensive birth control and could easily pay for it themselves. Nevertheless we have to have heroines (Sandra Fluke) threatened by evil villains (the Catholic Church)... we have to have a "War on Women."
Posted by: The Regular Guy at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (qHCyt)
Posted by: Roy at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (VndSC)
Posted by: lael at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (j4QK7)
Posted by: Roland THTG at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (QM5S2)
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (m2CN7)
I liked the shower scene in Porky's because you got to see so many elbows and macguffins.
Posted by: garrett at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (Ovu5k)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (/Crba)
Posted by: TexasDan at December 06, 2013 11:20 AM (Fa3Hi)
Excellent post.
And I agree that obama: the socialist movie and obama II: the condescending marxist movie both get a double thumbs down. or down twinkles if you will.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 06, 2013 11:21 AM (caCiW)
Posted by: Jimmy Swaggart at December 06, 2013 11:21 AM (e8kgV)
If we had an opposition party or a free press they'd be finding these victims.
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 11:21 AM (DL2i+)
Posted by: garrett at December 06, 2013 11:21 AM (Ovu5k)
I'd kinda like to see the Nazis kick his ass
Posted by: Albie Damned at December 06, 2013 11:21 AM (cGaCp)
It was just the minimum regulated level of shit that needs to be given to you before giving you credit, dude. Incredible article, and it's something I've pondered before but never been able to parse the way you have.
Posted by: YourPoopyPants at December 06, 2013 11:22 AM (Y/HG5)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:22 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Minnfidel at December 06, 2013 03:14 PM (5M2+1)
This shit drives me insane. I won't watch it. Sopranos, Sons of Anarchy etc
Posted by: The Jackhole at December 06, 2013 11:22 AM (nTgAI)
Posted by: ejo at December 06, 2013 11:22 AM (GXvSO)
Posted by: Lauren at December 06, 2013 11:22 AM (hFL/3)
Posted by: Brother Cavil at December 06, 2013 11:22 AM (naUcP)
Posted by: General lady from Starship Troopers at December 06, 2013 11:22 AM (92zVn)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:23 AM (/FnUH)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at December 06, 2013 11:23 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: Barrackankamen I at December 06, 2013 11:23 AM (pginn)
Posted by: whoever at December 06, 2013 11:23 AM (zu9Ee)
Posted by: SS Colonel Doogie Howser at December 06, 2013 11:23 AM (/Crba)
Did the movie The Neverending Story have a MacGuffin? I never watched it because I didn't think I would have the time.
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:23 AM (m2CN7)
When Matthews swooned over Obama, the word that came to mind was Gilroy, not MacGuffin.
Posted by: Roy at December 06, 2013 11:23 AM (VndSC)
Barky is not even the MacGuffin.
It's the whole First Ever Black Presiden of the USA.
'They' can't allow him to be seem to fail.
Posted by: Roland THTG at December 06, 2013 11:23 AM (QM5S2)
Posted by: Bob's House of Flannel Shirts and Wallet Chains at December 06, 2013 11:23 AM (pj6Nr)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:24 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Hurricane LaFawnduh at December 06, 2013 11:24 AM (pginn)
So the take away for the GOP is either (1) hang in there and give up the idea of winning, or (2) start collecting, building, and communicating stories that can only logically (sic) be solved by conservative policy.
What candidate or public official has gone to bat for the guy who says "My kid is dead because you **** with our insurance just when we happened to need it most, and we couldn't see the doctor who just might have helped him"
What candidate or public official has gone to bat for the guy in Nebraska who can't get a job at the packing plant (you know who I mean) because the mean old meat packer is hiring people who are not citizens, not here legally, and send their paychecks back to Mexico instead of spending it in the community where the furniture store is going out of business?
Posted by: P Mike at December 06, 2013 11:24 AM (R9qZf)
It's a long running trend.
I mean, who actually rooted for the Road Runner?
Posted by: Ian S. at December 06, 2013 11:24 AM (B/VB5)
Posted by: Duke at December 06, 2013 11:24 AM (d3clc)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:24 AM (/FnUH)
Posted by: Jenny Hates Her Phone but Likes This Post at December 06, 2013 11:25 AM (r1ruo)
Posted by: Barky Oblowme at December 06, 2013 11:25 AM (D2zE2)
Remember this chestnut from summer 2012?
Obama reflects on his biggest mistake as President
CBS News: http://tinyurl.com/m6rg3ll
(CBS News) President Obama's biggest mistake during his first term, he told CBS News in an exclusive interview, has been putting policy over storytelling.
Mr. Obama and First Lady Michelle Obama sat down Thursday with "CBS This Morning" anchor Charlie Rose in the White House Blue Room, where they discussed the failures and successes of his administration as he heads into another election, among other things.
"When I think about what we've done well and what we haven't done well," the president said, "the mistake of my first term - couple of years - was thinking that this job was just about getting the policy right. And that's important. But the nature of this office is also to tell a story to the American people that gives them a sense of unity and purpose and optimism, especially during tough times."
It's all about the story, and always has been. Every time I remember this interview, I get livid. Telling people fairytales to make them feel better accomplishes nothing. It's patronizing and degrading. And it's Obammy's go-to strategy.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/b][/i][/u] at December 06, 2013 11:25 AM (4df7R)
Posted by: Joe Biden at December 06, 2013 11:25 AM (bvtgt)
I've gotten to the point more and more lately where I find it difficult to enjoy movies. The suspension of disbelief simply gets harder every year, especially with all the propaganda pumped into American Movies.
Foreign movies just seem more satisfying nowadays.
Here's an indie movie I saw recently and enjoyed, "The Way". It stars father and son, Martin Sheen and Emilio Estevez.
It's about the El Camino de Santiago pilgrimage in Spain. Sheen stars as the dad who goes to France to retrieve the body of his son (Estevez) who died on the first day of his 800km walk due to bad weather. Sheen's character isn't religious, but his son was sort of hippie-ish and wanted to travel around the world experiencing people and cultures. Sheen decides to complete the pilgrimage himself as a final homage to his son and leaves little bits of his son's cremated remains along the way to mark his passage that he never got to complete.
Now my wife wants to do it.
Posted by: EC at December 06, 2013 11:25 AM (GQ8sn)
Posted by: Mr Pink at December 06, 2013 11:25 AM (oXeuc)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:25 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Albie Damned at December 06, 2013 11:25 AM (cGaCp)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at December 06, 2013 11:25 AM (VtjlW)
Don't subs go faster when they don't submerge?
The war hadn't started yet so there was no need to.
Posted by: eleven at December 06, 2013 11:25 AM (fsLdt)
Posted by: BignJames at December 06, 2013 11:26 AM (j7iSn)
Posted by: Chavez the Hugo at December 06, 2013 11:26 AM (fO/rU)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:26 AM (/FnUH)
Posted by: Dr. Jesse MacPinkman at December 06, 2013 11:26 AM (kkbgQ)
Hey man, I heard a rumor that McGuffin was going to open up for Hillary's Hairy Snatch at Lilith Fair in 2016.
Posted by: Havedash at December 06, 2013 11:26 AM (SIR+t)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at December 06, 2013 11:27 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 06, 2013 11:27 AM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: Roland THTG at December 06, 2013 11:27 AM (QM5S2)
That insight is really quite profound and represents a hugely important piece of the puzzle for anyone trying to construct a Unified Field Theory that explains Leftard behavior that, on the surface, appears inexplicable. Thank you Ace. Not bad at all for an Ewok.
I think this helps to explain why people on the Left are so completely obsessed by political personalities and are so oblivious to the creepiness quotient that its Tiger Beat manifestations suggest to normal people.
Posted by: Chris Matthews at December 06, 2013 11:27 AM (8ZskC)
Posted by: moviegique at December 06, 2013 11:27 AM (7zeA4)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:27 AM (ZPrif)
It's about the El Camino de Santiago pilgrimage in Spain. Sheen stars as the dad who goes to France to retrieve the body of his son (Estevez) who died on the first day of his 800km walk due to bad weather. Sheen's character isn't religious, but his son was sort of hippie-ish and wanted to travel around the world experiencing people and cultures. Sheen decides to complete the pilgrimage himself as a final homage to his son and leaves little bits of his son's cremated remains along the way to mark his passage that he never got to complete.
Now my wife wants to do it.
------------
Does that mean you're going to be cremated?
Posted by: @JohnTant at December 06, 2013 11:27 AM (PFy0L)
Posted by: garrett at December 06, 2013 11:27 AM (Ovu5k)
Posted by: JackStraw at December 06, 2013 11:28 AM (g1DWB)
Posted by: elevenwing plover at December 06, 2013 11:28 AM (fsLdt)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:28 AM (sByIH)
Posted by: TexasDan at December 06, 2013 11:28 AM (Fa3Hi)
Posted by: moviegique at December 06, 2013 11:28 AM (7zeA4)
Posted by: Roland THTG at December 06, 2013 11:29 AM (QM5S2)
For example Anakin. Ripped away from his mother and treated like a step child by the Jedi order whom he thought would help him. Then to find out his mother gets killed by Sand People. So he never wanted to see that happen again, so Palpatine played him like a 10 credit Twi'lek dancer. So *boom* Darth Vader.
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 11:29 AM (iGP6J)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:29 AM (/FnUH)
Posted by: Guy Who's Been Watching Neverending Story Since 1984 at December 06, 2013 11:29 AM (7ObY1)
Now... What was the MacGuffin in Love Story?
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 06, 2013 11:29 AM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: Roy at December 06, 2013 11:29 AM (VndSC)
Posted by: @JohnTant at December 06, 2013 03:27 PM (PFy0L)
Hope not! I told her she can go do it if she wants, but we're going to watch "Taken" first.
Posted by: EC at December 06, 2013 11:29 AM (GQ8sn)
Posted by: National Lampoon at December 06, 2013 11:29 AM (/Crba)
This perfectly describes the attitude of the entire MFM during the passage of Obamacare. They're all rending garments now with articles and columns about why they missed all these possible problems in this law which are now all too real for millions. Well, it was just a MacGuffin to them. They did not care at all what was in that bill. All they cared about was whether Hero Obama would win it. They had the same attitude during the shutdown fight, there was no way Republicans were ever going to be heard about the actual, real, problems with Obamacare because all the press cared about was that Hero Obama Already Won This And We're Not Letting Those Horrible Villain Republicans Take It Away From Him.
Posted by: rockmom at December 06, 2013 11:29 AM (Q4elb)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:29 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at December 06, 2013 11:30 AM (VtjlW)
Posted by: rdbrewer at December 06, 2013 11:30 AM (Iyg03)
The MacGuffin in Castaway was the stupid package with the angel wings on it.
----------
I think that was the character's MacGuffin, but not the story's MacGuffin. Hanks' goal was to get off the island to deliver that package. What was in it was not important to him...just having the goal was.
Posted by: @JohnTant at December 06, 2013 11:30 AM (PFy0L)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:30 AM (ZPrif)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:30 AM (/FnUH)
Posted by: Mama AJ at December 06, 2013 11:30 AM (SUKHu)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 03:13 PM (/FnUH)
*modest cough* that was me.
Posted by: Blaise Pascal at December 06, 2013 11:30 AM (whMsz)
This posture about Mr. Obama is not surprising at all. Look how he was elected, foisted upon the shoulders of his fans like some winning athlete- all while being fed grapes by the media. It had the air of a campaign for prom queen or finding the next American idol. It possessed very little of the serious, introspective analysis or consideration normally afforded such an important election.
What should scare people is that Mr. Obama was an empty vessel into which liberals projected their hopes and dreams. They used that gratuitous, undeserved flattery combined with an implied appeal to assuage "racial guilt" to get him elected, and despite the obvious destruction, got him elected twice.
That can happen again. People were already fooled twice and they can't wait to vote for the next winner of Dancing with the Stars. Despite the fact they've lost their jobs, ability to provide for their families, standard of living, health care or personal safety.
Posted by: Marcus at December 06, 2013 11:30 AM (GGCsk)
Also, I must add:
IF the GOP are the Villains in this dumbass movie WE need a fkn awesome LAIR. Guarded by sharks with fricken lasers
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 06, 2013 11:31 AM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: moviegique at December 06, 2013 11:31 AM (7zeA4)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:31 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: BurtTC at December 06, 2013 11:31 AM (TOk1P)
Posted by: The debate continues at December 06, 2013 11:31 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:31 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 11:31 AM (/Crba)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 06, 2013 11:31 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: Mr Pink at December 06, 2013 11:32 AM (oXeuc)
Posted by: BumperStickerist at December 06, 2013 11:32 AM (NQyj0)
Posted by: Sunny at December 06, 2013 11:32 AM (Xnxty)
Posted by: Zombie Robin Sachs[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:33 AM (sByIH)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:33 AM (ZPrif)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at December 06, 2013 11:33 AM (VtjlW)
Posted by: moviegique at December 06, 2013 11:33 AM (7zeA4)
>>>Good piece of writing. Now I realize I didn't give a crap about the Ark itself at all.<<<
That's what makes that Top. Men. ending scene so correct. It didn't matter.
Posted by: Roy at December 06, 2013 11:33 AM (VndSC)
One could make the argument that the Angel Package represented his struggle to maintain his identity in surviving....
but yeah of course Castaway is hardly an action movie it is a character study/romance.
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 11:33 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 03:31 PM (m2CN7)
The Sorceror's Stone in the first Harry Potter.
Posted by: Insomniac at December 06, 2013 11:33 AM (DrWcr)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:33 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:34 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: Dr. Jesse MacPinkman at December 06, 2013 11:34 AM (kkbgQ)
Posted by: cajun caret at December 06, 2013 11:35 AM (UZQM8)
And Matthews and co. are grade A morons to believe a word of it. I don't even mean that pejoratively. I mean that they are fucking stupid.
Posted by: dawnfire82 at December 06, 2013 03:10 PM (1/hzQ)
They dont believe it , they play their part.
Posted by: Temper Tantrum at December 06, 2013 11:35 AM (AWmfW)
Posted by: Roy at December 06, 2013 11:35 AM (VndSC)
Posted by: Insomniac at December 06, 2013 11:36 AM (DrWcr)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:36 AM (ZPrif)
Also you missed me being banninated earlier.
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at December 06, 2013 03:25 PM (VtjlW)
Ah, but you see, he DOES throw it into Mount Doom. He doesn't do it willingly, but It Was Fate. It Was Fate that Frodo would get it to the precipice, and It Was Fate that Gollum would steal it, and It Was Fate that Frodo would have to make a sacrifice (his finger) to retain his humanity (err... hobbitanity?). You know It Was Fate because when Sam has to rescue him, it's Frodo he rescues, not some hollowed out husk like Gollum or a sneering jerk like Isildur.
(Oh, and by the way, Mister Pissy Pants Elrond: it's pretty rich you being all "Men are Weak" because Isildur wasn't strong enough to destroy The One Ring when he had the chance. Well who was standing RIGHT THE FUCK THERE on the edge of the chasm, huh? Who could have rushed up behind Isildur and hacked his hand off and kicked it into the lava? Or kicked ISILDUR into the lava, and spared Middle-Earth from so much destruction? Huh? HUH???
Pfft! You might be hot, Elrond, but humble? Not a chance.)
And our AtC was banninated? Why!?
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/b][/i][/u] at December 06, 2013 11:36 AM (4df7R)
Bill Clinton was elected because he largely gave America permission to be fuck ups....
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 11:36 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Jay in Ames at December 06, 2013 11:36 AM (i2Lsf)
THERE WAS ONLY ONE FREAKING MOVIE HOW WAS IT A BEGINNING?
They're upto #145 Dragon Bones
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 11:36 AM (DL2i+)
Posted by: Meremortal,, at December 06, 2013 11:36 AM (1Y+hH)
So for best speed the U-boat would have to run on the surface. And we are talking the Mediterranean which is not a terribly large body of water. Though I would expect the Royal Navy to get in a rather frightful snit if one of their cruiser launched Walrus seaplanes spotted a U-boat in the Med.
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 11:37 AM (iGP6J)
http://bitmaelstrom.blogspot.com/2011/11/way-of-all-estevezes.html
Posted by: moviegique at December 06, 2013 03:31 PM (7zeA4)
Thanks! I liked it!
Posted by: EC at December 06, 2013 11:37 AM (GQ8sn)
What about the trend in movies and TV to make you root for the bad guy?
-----------
I dunno - I think there's some neat things in antihero stories. Dirty Harry is a bit of a "bad guy" but we like him since we can live vicariously through him. To me that's the allure of the antihero.
Posted by: @JohnTant at December 06, 2013 11:37 AM (PFy0L)
Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at December 06, 2013 11:37 AM (bCEmE)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:37 AM (bb5+k)
@159 The Nazis never bothered to submerge which makes no frickin' sense!
------------------
It does, actually. Subs back then (not sure about today) got better speed on the surface than they did underwater. And since the war hadn't started yet, no one was hunting them. So best speed to the Nazi sub base would have required the sub to stay on the surface.
Though this is likely all just a happy coincidence as far as the intent of the scriptwriters is concerned...
Posted by: junior at December 06, 2013 11:37 AM (UWFpX)
>>>Because he was uninsured, he got insurance, got a check up and we caught a tumor in time.<<<
Ummm.....those "insurance" policies haven't kicked in yet - how did that hypothetical kid get in to see a doctor yet?
And how much of a co-payment/deductible did that check-up cost his family?
Did anyone bother to tell Barky how incredibly rare childhood cancers are in the first place? Sad when they happen, to be sure, but the chances of a child being diagnosed with a tumor on his first doctor's visit is infinitesimally less than his mom and dad losing their house because they can't afford to pay an insurance premium and a deductible.
Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX (@Teresa_Koch) at December 06, 2013 11:38 AM (PZ6/M)
Posted by: that kid in the movie that yells Shane, come back! at December 06, 2013 11:38 AM (VndSC)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 06, 2013 11:38 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: Zombie Robin Sachs[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:38 AM (sByIH)
And that's how they can hate us so much--we are villains.
Remember how in the old movies, the death of a bad guy was rarely shown?
Now, we are supposed to cheer and clap when the latest Hero blasts a bad guy through the wall with a shotgun.
See? They're bad guys and our perspective has already convicted them of their crimes.
And that's the silly thing they've carried into the real world--If the Hero says Person X is a bad guy, that's all you need to know. No need to consider that there are valid, honest, real and thoughtful reasons for my position.
Posted by: RoyalOil at December 06, 2013 11:39 AM (VjL9S)
Can anyone think of a movie where the MacGuffin was awesome, meaningful, and/or made the movie? Like Ace says, in Repo Man or Pulp Fiction, f/x, it was just a glow or an effect. Likewise, there was nothing special about the Shankara Stones.
I can't think of one.
You'd probably have to get away from objects and into cool concepts to find one.
Posted by: rdbrewer at December 06, 2013 11:39 AM (Iyg03)
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:39 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:39 AM (ZPrif)
Dear HeroPants McNarrative I am from THE FUTURE and in 85 yearsafter they clean up the mess the ACA saves my son's life...
by the way Mr. President I fully support your bigamous marriage to Reggie Love and Worf.
//Composite McTimeTraveler
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 11:39 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Dr. Jesse MacPinkman at December 06, 2013 11:39 AM (kkbgQ)
Posted by: Wicked Witch of the McGuffin at December 06, 2013 11:40 AM (aTXUx)
Posted by: Jenny Hates Her Phone but Likes This Post at December 06, 2013 11:40 AM (r1ruo)
Communism: First appeared in Europe as a tragedy, now appearing in America as a farce.
Posted by: Sudden Clarity Clarence at December 06, 2013 11:40 AM (2tjte)
I researched it and found out that it is VERY commercialized now. You can bike, ride horseback, and even drive parts of the El Camino. Purists will walk the entire thing, but there are many nice hotels and restaurants all set up along the way. The original path is mostly paved and you are never farther than a quarter mile from a highway or road.
Posted by: EC at December 06, 2013 11:40 AM (GQ8sn)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:40 AM (sByIH)
>>Can anyone think of a movie where the MacGuffin was awesome, meaningful, and/or made the movie?
The Matthew Broderick one with the chimps. Because I don't give a shit about chimps and neither should you.
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 06, 2013 11:40 AM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: rdbrewer at December 06, 2013 03:39 PM (Iyg03)
Yes, speaking of Mel Gibson movies both Ransom and Braveheart had meaningful MacGuffins.
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:40 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:41 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Brock O'bama at December 06, 2013 11:41 AM (eDWZG)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:41 AM (ZPrif)
Posted by: Dr. Jesse MacPinkman at December 06, 2013 11:41 AM (kkbgQ)
Posted by: Jay in Ames at December 06, 2013 11:41 AM (i2Lsf)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:41 AM (/FnUH)
Posted by: BignJames at December 06, 2013 11:41 AM (j7iSn)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 06, 2013 03:38 PM (da5Wo)
...
PICS.
OMG pics so hard.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/b][/i][/u] at December 06, 2013 11:42 AM (4df7R)
A very compelling case for his own decency, whatever the screw-ups were managerially? Reallly? And the next time Barry stands up and tells another bald-faced lie, what then, Howard? The next time an ambassador is murdered, the next time a senior government official invokes her Fifth Amendment right, the next time an IRS Counsel repeats, 80 times, "I don't recall", what in the Hell are you going to say, Mr. Fineman?
Posted by: mrp at December 06, 2013 11:42 AM (HjPtV)
Posted by: BignJames at December 06, 2013 03:41 PM (j7iSn)
The money he owed the Russian mob.
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:43 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: BignJames at December 06, 2013 03:41 PM (j7iSn)
The money to pay off the Russian mob, I would think.
Posted by: Insomniac at December 06, 2013 11:43 AM (DrWcr)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:43 AM (ZPrif)
Posted by: Dr. Jesse MacPinkman at December 06, 2013 11:43 AM (kkbgQ)
In RPGs the training manuals for scenario w\riters quite literally call the plot device "the MacGuffin" often times....
Stories are not about artifacts they are about conflict resolution and moral analysis.
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 11:43 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Leftarded Lefty Libtard at December 06, 2013 11:43 AM (0cMkb)
If Allah wills a man to die (by having his face melt off) in a place, His footsteps will lead him to that place.
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 11:43 AM (DL2i+)
Well if they didn't want him to fail, they should have picked a non-Democrat black President.
Allen West would seem the obvious choice to me.
Agreed, but you think the libs would let themselves get out blacked by the cons?
Look what they did to Herman Cain.
We could have marched out Martin Luther King himself and they would have had 15 baby mamas parading thru the morning shows.
Posted by: Roland THTG at December 06, 2013 11:43 AM (QM5S2)
Posted by: typical Moron at December 06, 2013 11:44 AM (bvtgt)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 11:44 AM (/Crba)
Wasn't it alien corpses from the crash site or am I mixing movies.
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 11:44 AM (DL2i+)
Posted by: that kid in the movie that yells Shane, come back! at December 06, 2013 11:44 AM (VndSC)
Posted by: BignJames at December 06, 2013 11:45 AM (j7iSn)
So I do not consider that reviewer in any way worthwhile.
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 11:45 AM (iGP6J)
Can anyone think of a movie where the MacGuffin was awesome, meaningful, and/or made the movie?
Posted by: rdbrewer
Yes, but then it would be called a not-Macguffin.
Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at December 06, 2013 11:45 AM (uCNam)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:45 AM (/FnUH)
Posted by: Dr. Jesse MacPinkman at December 06, 2013 03:43 PM (kkbgQ)
His prostitute girlfriend in the movie just came out as a late life lesbian. Maria Bello. Girls be crazy.
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:45 AM (m2CN7)
the Stanley Cup is simply the medal at the end of Star Wars a New Hope...
the brawls and incidental and often seemingly accidental goals scored are the story
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 11:45 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: chique d'afrique (the artist formerly known as african chick) at December 06, 2013 11:45 AM (r+7wo)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:45 AM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 11:46 AM (ZPrif)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:46 AM (sByIH)
Posted by: Dr. Jesse MacPinkman at December 06, 2013 11:46 AM (kkbgQ)
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 06, 2013 11:46 AM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: Cicero Kid at December 06, 2013 11:46 AM (6fSty)
Posted by: TANSTAAFL at December 06, 2013 11:46 AM (tqAT4)
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 11:46 AM (DL2i+)
Posted by: moviegique at December 06, 2013 11:46 AM (7zeA4)
299 -
You mean other than that ring thing, where everyone's ultimate fate would be determined by who had it?
Posted by: BurtTC at December 06, 2013 11:47 AM (TOk1P)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 03:45 PM (/FnUH)
The baddies didn't know they would be melted.
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 11:47 AM (m2CN7)
Which again is why the press should have to have their dentists on speed dial....
as John Madden once said "Referee the Referees"
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 11:47 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at December 06, 2013 11:47 AM (659DL)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at December 06, 2013 11:47 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: rickl at December 06, 2013 11:48 AM (zoehZ)
His prostitute girlfriend in the movie just came out as a late life lesbian. Maria Bello. Girls be crazy.
Crap. That's an L for team Penis.
Posted by: eleven at December 06, 2013 11:48 AM (fsLdt)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 11:48 AM (/Crba)
Posted by: FreeProofreading at December 06, 2013 11:48 AM (I6Wu7)
AH but see the film in fact establishes the baby is indestructible and thus your conscience is allowed to focus on the mayhem
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 11:48 AM (9jfyN)
I sat through Frida hoping to see Salma Hayek's MacGuffin.
Posted by: garrett at December 06, 2013 11:48 AM (BbAPj)
I think you are missing the point. In a way, Ace's examples are the McMuffin, where our hero, Ace, ultimately slays our villian, the cum-guzzling cult of Barack Hussein Obama, mmm, mmm, good.
To be honest, at the age of eight to ten, I had no clue to the significance of the Ark other than what came from the movie.
Posted by: flounder at December 06, 2013 11:49 AM (Kkt/i)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:49 AM (sByIH)
WE DON`T NEED ANOTHER HERO
WE DON`T NEED TO KNOW THE WAY HOME
ALL WE WANT IS LIFE BEYOND
OBAMADOME
Posted by: Tina Turner at December 06, 2013 11:49 AM (P3U0f)
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at December 06, 2013 11:49 AM (oFCZn)
Ace, don't fret about repetition, it's part of your charm. I wrote this about you in a recent email:
"He does sometimes take a point and beat it into the ground, then stomp on it, the pick it back up so he can light it on fire and put it out with his spit, and then stomp on it again. But that can be a fun thing to watch. "
Posted by: White House Jugend at December 06, 2013 11:49 AM (A0sHn)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 11:49 AM (/Crba)
Posted by: Fritz at December 06, 2013 11:50 AM (TKFmG)
Yeah, that's probably right.
Posted by: rdbrewer at December 06, 2013 11:50 AM (Iyg03)
Wait a minute, that could be the allegory for all the people who become useful tools. Like an earworm whispering their fondest dreams and thus making them do what the earworm wants. Not necessarily what the person wants.
And there is an earlier movie with a similar plotline to Payback. A con left high and dry by his partner and all he wants is what is owed him. Alas the name now escapes me.
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 11:50 AM (iGP6J)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 11:50 AM (bb5+k)
I know some people that represent the idea that b.o. is a hero and must be defended no matter if the mcguffin is their health or their child's health.
Its sad.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at December 06, 2013 11:50 AM (caCiW)
Posted by: toby928© at December 06, 2013 11:50 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 11:51 AM (/Crba)
Posted by: Brother Cavil at December 06, 2013 11:51 AM (naUcP)
Posted by: chique d'afrique (the artist formerly known as african chick) at December 06, 2013 11:51 AM (r+7wo)
Posted by: FenelonSpoke at December 06, 2013 11:51 AM (BC6cY)
Posted by: moviegique at December 06, 2013 11:51 AM (7zeA4)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:52 AM (sByIH)
Lee Marvin's Point Blank?
Same movie by the way....
http://youtu.be/UVvUYudujZU
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 11:52 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 11:52 AM (iGP6J)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:52 AM (/FnUH)
A Presidency that was actually like TWW would be infinitely better than what we've gotten from real Democrats in the last century or so, so there's that.
Posted by: Ian S. at December 06, 2013 11:53 AM (B/VB5)
Posted by: Animal Mother at December 06, 2013 11:53 AM (UZQM8)
I saw Mareilyn Chambers open for MacGuffin back in 1979.....
man was dad pissed.
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 11:53 AM (9jfyN)
Can anyone think of a movie where the MacGuffin was awesome, meaningful, and/or made the movie?
That's the point of a MacGuffin, though. It's just a thing around which the plot is structured, to provide the necessary conflict between the Hero and the Villain. By definition it's something that isn't irrelevant, but also could be swapped out for something else without changing the dramatic or emotional core of the movie/book/tv show, etc. If it becomes something that is itself the star of the film, then it couldn't be a MacGuffin.
The Ark of the Covenant is awesome, and meaningful. But it didn't NEED to be the Ark to make the story awesome and meaningful. So long as the story itself establishes that The MacGuffin is something desirable, that's all that really matters.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/b][/i][/u] at December 06, 2013 11:53 AM (4df7R)
In a bad movie, the only motivation the villain has is to make the hero suffer. Greed, you like to see motivating your villain; revenge? Not so much.
Why did the new Red Dawn suck so much? Because the motivation for the villains was merely to punish America. Did they have a (real) backstory of previous conquest? No.
That's not a real enemy, that's a cardboard cut-out.
So, the JEF has ascribed nothing but revenge and spite as the motivations to his opposition.
But, a hero is only as big as his villain--and if the villain is small, petty and of weak motivations well, all the JEF is doing is weakening himself.
So, the JEF keeps knocking the shit out of these strawmen and some people are starting to notice--"hey, he's been fighting this same guy over and over and over, when's he going to do something to help me?"
Posted by: RoyalOil at December 06, 2013 11:54 AM (VjL9S)
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at December 06, 2013 11:54 AM (CJjw5)
The baby was just the contrivance that let Ed and H.I. to end up in a sequence of hilarious situations. It could just as easily have been a Maltese Falcon. A classic MacGuffin.
Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 06, 2013 11:54 AM (8ZskC)
http://tinyurl.com/kmuo4b5
Stars Blair from Facts of Life when she was a kid.
Posted by: EC at December 06, 2013 11:55 AM (GQ8sn)
You could also take this even further, Ace. The whole MacGuffinization thing is largely a result of aging Baby Boomers trying to recreate the "Camelot" movie that JFK starred in when they were kids. Certainly this is true of Chris Matthews, he doesn't even try to hide his conflation of the mythical Barack Obama and the mythical JFK of his childhood. To him and those like him in the media, time stood still on November 22, 1963 and they waited from then until November 2008 for the Second Coming of their first hero who was killed before he could get the MacGuffin.
There is a reason why Obama and the Clintons fought so bitterly for Ted Kennedy's endorsement, and why Obama made sure Caroline was there on the stage when Ted delivered his endorsement.
It's all a movie they've constructed in their own minds. They don't even care about the policies, they want their childhood Hero back and they think Obama is him.
Posted by: rockmom at December 06, 2013 11:55 AM (Q4elb)
Posted by: chique d'afrique (the artist formerly known as african chick) at December 06, 2013 11:55 AM (r+7wo)
Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 56% more DOOM! at December 06, 2013 11:55 AM (09o/X)
Point Blank? Yes that is the movie title.
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 11:55 AM (iGP6J)
Posted by: navycopjoe FORZA AZZURRI!!! at December 06, 2013 11:55 AM (JFrBt)
Posted by: navycopjoe FORZA AZZURRI!!! at December 06, 2013 11:56 AM (JFrBt)
Much lower HorsePower on electric than diesel.
And unlike modern sub hulls lots of draggy crap all over the top.
Modern nukes will IIRC go faster under water as there is less drag with the whole thing under than with the deck or sail creating surface wave interference.
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 11:56 AM (DL2i+)
Much lower HorsePower on electric than diesel.
And unlike modern sub hulls lots of draggy crap all over the top.
Modern nukes will IIRC go faster under water as there is less drag with the whole thing under than with the deck or sail creating surface wave interference.
I'm sure that deck gun also slowed things down a bit if they submerged.
Posted by: EC at December 06, 2013 11:57 AM (GQ8sn)
Posted by: The Jackhole at December 06, 2013 11:57 AM (nTgAI)
Posted by: ace at December 06, 2013 11:59 AM (/FnUH)
Hmm, sounds like an episode of The Big Bang Theory.
Posted by: Jay in Ames at December 06, 2013 03:41 PM (i2Lsf)
I saw the theory first proposed in a very well-written British horror series called 'The Shades' a few years ago when one of the characters, the nerdy sidekick, brings it up. It makes absolute sense: Indy was irrelevant to outcome.
Posted by: troyriser at December 06, 2013 11:59 AM (2jF2B)
The village dried up and died without it.
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 11:59 AM (DL2i+)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at December 06, 2013 11:59 AM (VtjlW)
I think every time somebody posts FIRST! that qualifies as a MacGuffin.
it matters to them, and to maybe the first few commenters who say things like arg you beat me to it, and it still gets the thread going...
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 06, 2013 11:59 AM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 11:59 AM (/Crba)
Can anyone think of a movie where the MacGuffin was awesome, meaningful, and/or made the movie?
Les Miserables, perhaps. The MacGuffin is mercy for Jean Valjean.
But that movie would never have been written in Hollywood. There would have been some stupid shootout in the end between Valjean and Javert, rather than Javert killing himself.
Posted by: rockmom at December 06, 2013 11:59 AM (Q4elb)
There isn't one because Mad Max is a Revenge Story...the MacGuffin is I guess his sense of familial normalcy and thinking killing pond scum will bring calm...?
It's a stretch....
Revenge Stories are moral analysis more so than madcap romps.
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 11:59 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 11:59 AM (sByIH)
Posted by: toby928© at December 06, 2013 11:59 AM (QupBk)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 12:00 PM (ZPrif)
Posted by: Dr. Jesse MacPinkman at December 06, 2013 03:46 PM (kkbgQ)
But the baby was still the MacGuffin. You're allowed to care about the MacGuffin, but that doesn't change what it is: a desirable object. The puppies in "101 Dalmatians" are a MacGuffin, too. They didn't have to be puppies. They could have been anything furry and small, or rare and lustrous, that Cruella wanted to exploit and the heroes wanted to liberate. That doesn't mean you don't care about the puppies.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/b][/i][/u] at December 06, 2013 12:00 PM (4df7R)
Posted by: cajun caret at December 06, 2013 12:00 PM (UZQM8)
Posted by: DaveA at December 06, 2013 03:59 PM (DL2i+)
That can happen to anyone.
Posted by: Helen Thomas at December 06, 2013 12:01 PM (8ZskC)
The Road Warrior was a more pure adventure in the Campbellian Myth sense...
Max was existing and relearned how to live or something.....
then he fell into a Peyote Oasis and Hallucinated beyond thunderdome...
(I hope)
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 12:01 PM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 12:01 PM (/Crba)
The Matthews interview like the whole Obama presidency was like one of the side interviews in a reality show where the contestant does color analysis about ...me! ... how I am processing what just happened ... or is about to happen ... or will never happen ... to me!
Posted by: Neil at December 06, 2013 12:01 PM (Xv7f/)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 12:01 PM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Ron at December 06, 2013 12:02 PM (A6yyZ)
Posted by: --- at December 06, 2013 12:02 PM (MMC8r)
Posted by: Chris Methews at December 06, 2013 12:02 PM (aTXUx)
Posted by: toby928© at December 06, 2013 12:02 PM (QupBk)
Well it was the 80s...and uh "cool" or something...
*sigh*
I think he was really looking for his teeth around the rig
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 12:02 PM (9jfyN)
It was Short Round for me.
Posted by: EC at December 06, 2013 12:03 PM (GQ8sn)
Posted by: Roy at December 06, 2013 12:03 PM (VndSC)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 12:03 PM (/Crba)
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at December 06, 2013 12:04 PM (CJjw5)
Posted by: kbdabear at December 06, 2013 12:04 PM (aTXUx)
Red Ryder BB gun with a compass in the stock!
What happens when he finally got it? HE SHOT HIS EYE OUT! Just like his mother said it would happen.
Then they all went out for Chinese.
Posted by: EC at December 06, 2013 12:04 PM (GQ8sn)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 12:04 PM (/Crba)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 12:04 PM (sByIH)
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 06, 2013 12:04 PM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 06, 2013 12:04 PM (HVff2)
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at December 06, 2013 12:05 PM (CJjw5)
I think Lao Tsei air freight was sorta a "what the fuck really so lazy?"
Then as I aged I realized it was not really important...of course neither was the entire movie in Indy's Arc...as a matter of fact Kingdom of the Crystal Skull managed to destroy Indy's entire narrative.
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 12:05 PM (9jfyN)
Posted by: dirks strewn at December 06, 2013 12:05 PM (kfcYC)
I was referring to the artifact not the attitude.
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 12:05 PM (DL2i+)
The Gato and Type IXc are surface vessels that can stay under water for short periods of time. Hence when you view them as surface ships the flat decks and superstructure items as deck guns make sense. Those old cruiser rules also affected their design since the Kriegsmarine and US Navy viewed submarines as more than mere fleet scouts. Contrast that tactical flexibility vs the IJN who used their I and RO boats purely in an anti fleet role. Even the Sen Toku's were designed as elements of a fleet taking combat to the enemy. IJN never thought about hitting the American supply convoys, which considering the vast distances that make up the Pacific, was truly monumentally stupid.
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 12:05 PM (iGP6J)
Posted by: SFGoth at December 06, 2013 12:05 PM (3WO2A)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 12:06 PM (ZPrif)
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 12:06 PM (m2CN7)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 12:06 PM (sByIH)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 12:06 PM (/Crba)
Posted by: suitably adequate at December 06, 2013 12:06 PM (d0dHb)
Posted by: RWC at December 06, 2013 12:07 PM (fWAjv)
Posted by: grognard at December 06, 2013 12:07 PM (/29Nl)
>>The highest possible praise for this piece: Iowahawk is recommending it.<<
Crap - better clean up around here quick, before the twitterverse rings the doorbell.
Posted by: Roy at December 06, 2013 12:07 PM (VndSC)
Posted by: toby928© at December 06, 2013 12:07 PM (QupBk)
Either 10,000 marbles or the pot Fawn Liebowitz was going to make.
Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 06, 2013 12:07 PM (8ZskC)
I wish all movies could star Shia LeBouef.
Hah....he's actually a pretty decent actor, just not a lead man.
Posted by: eleven at December 06, 2013 12:07 PM (fsLdt)
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 12:07 PM (m2CN7)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 12:08 PM (/Crba)
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 12:08 PM (m2CN7)
Posted by: gewa76 at December 06, 2013 12:08 PM (k8m83)
But when the cloud of rhetoric has passed Â… when the roar of the crowd fades away Â… when the stadium lights go out, and those Styrofoam Greek columns are hauled back to some studio lot - what exactly is our opponent's plan? What does he actually seek to accomplish, after he's done turning back the waters and healing the planet? The answer is to make government bigger Â… take more of your money Â… give you more orders from Washington Â… and to reduce the strength of America in a dangerous world.
Posted by: mrp at December 06, 2013 12:08 PM (HjPtV)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 12:08 PM (sByIH)
The war hadn't started yet so there was no need to.
Posted by: eleven at December 06, 2013 03:25 PM (fsLdt)
But the scene, as I recall, had the sub clearing the decks and the decks becoming awashed, which portends transit under the surface. So the question is valid and one that has stuck in my mind.
Modern cigar-shaped subs may go faster under the water due to a number of factors.
Older subs went faster on the surface in large part due to diesel operation providing electricity versus battery power and the efficient ship-like hull shape, of which, many of the protuberances are not causing drag when operating on the surface.
It's actually an improvement that modern subs can transit as fast or faster than on the surface.
Posted by: flounder at December 06, 2013 12:09 PM (Kkt/i)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 12:09 PM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Havedash at December 06, 2013 12:09 PM (SIR+t)
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 06, 2013 12:09 PM (3ZtZW)
Posted by: navycopjoe FORZA AZZURRI!!! at December 06, 2013 12:10 PM (JFrBt)
Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 06, 2013 12:10 PM (HVff2)
Posted by: Caliban at December 06, 2013 12:10 PM (DrC22)
Posted by: eleven at December 06, 2013 12:10 PM (fsLdt)
Posted by: jwb7605[/u][/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 12:10 PM (Qxe/p)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 12:10 PM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Inspector Cussword at December 06, 2013 12:10 PM (bB1P0)
Posted by: Roy at December 06, 2013 04:03 PM (VndSC)
This isn't exactly a new thing. One of the best books ever written about Reagan was Lou Cannon's "President Reagan: The Role Of A Lifetime." I highly recommend it if you haven't read it. Cannon covered Reagan from the time he first entered politics in California through his Presidency. And he made a good case in his book that Reagan was successful largely because he understood what Americans wanted in the guy who plays the President in their movie. He knew that stagecraft was as important as statecraft.
Obama's problem is that he can't do statecraft at all, and only does a half-ass job of stagecraft. That's why it is so sickening to see people like Chris Matthews contonue to swoon over him. It's like watching a movie version of "The Emperor's New Clothes."
Posted by: rockmom at December 06, 2013 12:10 PM (NYnoe)
Posted by: AlanR at December 06, 2013 12:10 PM (Vxb1M)
Posted by: Bigby's Tiny Fists at December 06, 2013 03:27 PM (3ZtZW)
I'd say it was his girlfriend, played by Helen Hunt.
Posted by: flounder at December 06, 2013 12:11 PM (Kkt/i)
Posted by: dzmudz9646@aol.com at December 06, 2013 12:11 PM (rHThR)
eh maybe....
of course if you used the right soundtrack and made a good biting social commentary on the debasing nature of socialist machine politics it could rock...
I'd love to hear the Beatmasters' Mix of Route 66's Depeche Mode Cover with him engaging in corrective training drills with a nice 12ga duster
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 12:11 PM (9jfyN)
That stupid rail car ride in the first movie. All I could think was Temple of Doom followed by how is this moving the movie forward? It was not advancing the plot and was just Jackson and his CGI crew wanking off with their CPUs.
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 12:12 PM (iGP6J)
Do these things cause the audience to feel qualms about their hero? No, on the contrary. Especially when clearly directed at the "bad guys," the reaction is rather, glee.
IRS targetting conservatives, the Senate goes nuclear, vote fraud, no one cares about Benghazi (eat it, repugs), the constant brazen lies, etc.
It may be surreal for us (not the target audience) to witness, but such things hardly repel Obama's audience.
Occasionally, when it hits too close to home for the audience (i.e. the MSM)-- e.g. excluding FOX from press conference, White House treating journalists as criminals, excluding non-WH photographers from events, -- they'll squirm a little, object. But even this is half-hearted.
Obama at his thuggiest gives them a vicarious badass thrill.
For them, it's like Indy shooting the guy with a sword. There's no "ugh, that's so wrong and unfair." It's "fuck, yeah!"
PS Check out Obama scolding his audience-- of "liberal" and "progressive" journalists-- for their reporting on the IRS scandal. Scoffing at it, as just another faux-scandal. Unreal. At this point, it's like Obama is openly trolling us all.
Posted by: lael at December 06, 2013 12:12 PM (j4QK7)
Posted by: gewa76 at December 06, 2013 04:08 PM (k8m83)
Silver Linings
Just a supporting actor though
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 12:12 PM (m2CN7)
Posted by: navycopjoe FORZA AZZURRI!!! at December 06, 2013 12:12 PM (JFrBt)
If it was, the specifics of it mattered a whole lot to the movie.
Posted by: Chief Brody at December 06, 2013 12:13 PM (Xv7f/)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 12:13 PM (sByIH)
Posted by: toby928© at December 06, 2013 04:07 PM (QupBk)
For starters, we have to pick a candidate in 2016 that a lot of people can identify with as a hero and not a villain. And stop worrying so much about the MacGuffin.
Posted by: rockmom at December 06, 2013 12:13 PM (Q4elb)
Which means simply we turn t into Rocky Horror Picture show and make it audience participation then.....
if we're doomed to suck do it in fishnet
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 12:13 PM (9jfyN)
There was no danger in Hitler getting The Bomb either, but we didn't know that.
Posted by: SFGoth at December 06, 2013 12:13 PM (3WO2A)
Posted by: toby928© at December 06, 2013 12:13 PM (QupBk)
Posted by: garrett at December 06, 2013 12:13 PM (Xjd5r)
Posted by: chique d'afrique (the artist formerly known as african chick) at December 06, 2013 12:14 PM (r+7wo)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 12:14 PM (/Crba)
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at December 06, 2013 12:15 PM (VtjlW)
Posted by: navycopjoe FORZA AZZURRI!!! at December 06, 2013 12:15 PM (JFrBt)
Lael I am at this point 75% certain I would prefer the nation split rather than be dragged into Obamavision.....
You are correct in yoru analysis but the reason I am not angered by Tingles' antics is he is doing my legwork in creating a separate national identity for the new America.
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 12:15 PM (9jfyN)
Posted by: RWC at December 06, 2013 12:16 PM (fWAjv)
Deck gun, scopes, open wood deck, anchors, cables, etc., etc.
http://tinyurl.com/yp6z5b
vs.
http://tinyurl.com/32zxdu7
There's another maybe prototype only streamliner that was to have H202 propulsion.
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 12:16 PM (DL2i+)
Posted by: Eton Cox at December 06, 2013 12:16 PM (q177U)
---
The money "the team" needs to go to their competition.
Or perhaps the muffin of the chick who gets it from the owners of the candle-shop.
Technically speaking, that would be a McMuffin.
Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 06, 2013 12:16 PM (8ZskC)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 12:16 PM (bb5+k)
I'd love to hear the Beatmasters' Mix of Route 66's Depeche Mode Cover with him engaging in corrective training drills with a nice 12ga duster
Posted by: sven10077 at December 06, 2013 04:11 PM (9jfyN)
In today's Hollywood, the world gone mad pockiclipse will be caused by global warming. Algore will have a cameo as Lord Humungous.
Posted by: Havedash at December 06, 2013 12:16 PM (SIR+t)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 12:16 PM (ZPrif)
Posted by: navycopjoe FORZA AZZURRI!!! at December 06, 2013 12:16 PM (JFrBt)
Posted by: Caliban at December 06, 2013 04:10 PM (DrC22)
That's not a plot hole though because the Nazis and the Americans did not know or understand or accept this. Also its not like its a fact that can be proved or disproved beforehand by the Nazis.
Posted by: polynikes self proclaimed king of walked into a bar jokes at December 06, 2013 12:16 PM (m2CN7)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 12:16 PM (/Crba)
Posted by: eleven at December 06, 2013 12:16 PM (fsLdt)
Posted by: gewa76 at December 06, 2013 12:17 PM (k8m83)
Posted by: Romeo13 at December 06, 2013 12:17 PM (lZBBB)
Posted by: gewa76 at December 06, 2013 12:17 PM (k8m83)
If they glow, just stay away.
Posted by: The Mexican Government at December 06, 2013 12:18 PM (8ZskC)
Posted by: cajun caret at December 06, 2013 12:18 PM (UZQM8)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 12:18 PM (sByIH)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 12:18 PM (/Crba)
Posted by: Romeo13 at December 06, 2013 12:18 PM (lZBBB)
@357 You know what I want? A boring-ass President, who does 9-5 and stays off the damned television.
------------------
This is what a smart president does. Every time the president has a televised address, it chips away at the overall effectiveness of that move. People get used to it. The novelty wears off just a bit. But Obama doesn't exactly have any accomplishments that he can depend on to maintain his support, so...
Posted by: junior at December 06, 2013 12:18 PM (UWFpX)
Posted by: Sambo at December 06, 2013 12:19 PM (4PftV)
Posted by: RWC at December 06, 2013 12:19 PM (fWAjv)
Posted by: Duke at December 06, 2013 12:19 PM (d3clc)
Posted by: mrp at December 06, 2013 12:20 PM (HjPtV)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 12:20 PM (bb5+k)
Posted by: SFGoth at December 06, 2013 12:20 PM (3WO2A)
Posted by: moviegique at December 06, 2013 12:20 PM (7zeA4)
Posted by: Carol at December 06, 2013 12:20 PM (QMRMM)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 06, 2013 12:21 PM (/Crba)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 12:21 PM (ZPrif)
Far more unattainable than say a princess locked in a tower by a wicked witch and guarded by a fire breathing dragon.
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 12:21 PM (iGP6J)
Leftists have spent years labeling conservatives as evil. Sometimes you have to go a little outside the lines to thwart evil.
Posted by: Duke at December 06, 2013 04:19 PM (d3clc)
Eaxctly, and now they are gearing up to label us all Confederates who want to bring back slavery. You know what Lincoln had to to to defeat those Confederates!
Posted by: rockmom at December 06, 2013 12:22 PM (Q4elb)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 12:22 PM (ZPrif)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 12:23 PM (sByIH)
Posted by: He Who Came Amongst Us at December 06, 2013 12:23 PM (1H+lb)
Lots of people didn't like the movie 'Sucker Punch'. I did. The main reason I liked it so much was the central character's realization that she wasn't the central character. That was new, that was different.
Anyway, life is not a movie, Obama is not the star, we are not bit players in the story of his life and this country we love is no one's MacGuffin. There won't be any scrolling credits telling us the show's over and it's time to go. There will be, however, the very real damage wrought by this administration. The heroes are the ones who strive to make things right again.
Posted by: troyriser at December 06, 2013 12:23 PM (2jF2B)
----
I believe that was Danny Glover. Gibson didn't have the moral authority.
Posted by: Biff Boffo at December 06, 2013 12:23 PM (YmPwQ)
Posted by: Shrek at December 06, 2013 12:24 PM (lZBBB)
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 06, 2013 12:24 PM (ZPrif)
Ahem. The black guy gets to kill the evil white racist.
Posted by: Roger Mutaugh (Danny glover) at December 06, 2013 12:24 PM (bvtgt)
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 06, 2013 12:25 PM (iGP6J)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 12:25 PM (bb5+k)
That speech convinced me that Sarah Palin is a fucking genius.
They hate her because she almost cancelled their most excellent Hero Movie.
Posted by: eleven at December 06, 2013 12:25 PM (fsLdt)
Posted by: Daybrother at December 06, 2013 12:25 PM (QyrUO)
Posted by: eleven
Again, the problem with that is Mt. Doom was under Sauron's control. He sends the flying Nazgul out, hobbits become fellbeast shit, and the ring is Sauron's.
Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at December 06, 2013 12:25 PM (uCNam)
Posted by: Carol at December 06, 2013 12:26 PM (4BXhj)
Posted by: artisanal 'ette at December 06, 2013 12:26 PM (IXrOn)
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at December 06, 2013 12:26 PM (oFCZn)
Posted by: Duke at December 06, 2013 12:27 PM (d3clc)
I grok the Bushes going, but I can't for the life of me figure out why they'd spend any time at all with people who have done nothing but bash them for six years.
Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at December 06, 2013 12:27 PM (/kI1Q)
Posted by: Reggie Love at December 06, 2013 12:28 PM (FcR7P)
Posted by: Lincolntf at December 06, 2013 12:28 PM (ZshNr)
Ding! Ding! Ding!
Posted by: mrp at December 06, 2013 12:29 PM (HjPtV)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 12:29 PM (bb5+k)
Posted by: Meremortal,, at December 06, 2013 12:29 PM (1Y+hH)
Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at December 06, 2013 04:27 PM (/kI1Q)
Because the Bushes are so wrapped up in noblesse oblige that they indulge those who despise them to the point of cartoony exaggeration. Would to God the GOP Establishment they represent treated the conservative base of the Republican Party with the same deference and regard.
Posted by: troyriser at December 06, 2013 12:32 PM (2jF2B)
Posted by: Paid for by Citizens for Clyde the Orangutan at December 06, 2013 12:32 PM (QF8uk)
Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 06, 2013 12:32 PM (sByIH)
Posted by: Romeo13 at December 06, 2013 12:34 PM (lZBBB)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 12:35 PM (bb5+k)
O.T.
So is the new Yoko Ono basically Judge *udy, or perhaps like the Menendez Brothers, basically suing anyone or anything which mentions them?
Posted by: horatio n at December 06, 2013 12:35 PM (Kxz3Y)
Posted by: D-Lamp at December 06, 2013 12:36 PM (bb5+k)
One of the key points to the analogy here, which Ace touches on (referring to Indy's illegal acts or not-great work ethic), but I think goes further, is the audience reaction to acts by the hero that "we" (not the target audience) are appalled by, see e.g. as immoral, unjust, unconstitutional, hateful, egregiously unpresidential.
Do these things cause the audience to feel qualms about their hero? No, on the contrary. Especially when clearly directed at the "bad guys," the reaction is rather, glee.
--------------------
It's referred to as "protagonist-centered morality". Books by the author David Eddings are a prime example of this sort of thing.
Posted by: junior at December 06, 2013 12:40 PM (UWFpX)
Posted by: Chilling the most at December 06, 2013 12:40 PM (gxtMZ)
Shortest transcript translation of last night's Matthews/0Bama rhetorical fondling:
"So, uhmmmm, if you want.....call me?"
Posted by: MtTB at December 06, 2013 12:43 PM (8E9QA)
Posted by: Arbalest[/i][/s][/u][/b] at December 06, 2013 12:43 PM (FlRtG)
Posted by: iowaan at December 06, 2013 12:45 PM (tPywp)
By people who don't understand the concepts of Horizon and Line of Sight.
Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 06, 2013 12:46 PM (DL2i+)
Posted by: Bluto at December 06, 2013 04:05 PM (Xv7f/)
At the top of the ladder.
Posted by: flounder at December 06, 2013 12:52 PM (Kkt/i)
Posted by: Joe Biden who suspects he's smarter than you at December 06, 2013 01:05 PM (nbGZj)
What's the McGuffin in Animal House?
Posted by: Bluto at December 06, 2013 04:05 PM (Xv7f/)
At the top of the ladder.
Posted by: flounder at December 06, 2013 04:52 PM (Kkt/i)
********************************
I think Otter and the Dean's wife were discussing it in the grocery store.
Posted by: Hoover at December 06, 2013 01:14 PM (HubSo)
Posted by: marine43 at December 06, 2013 01:35 PM (KHa93)
The policies MUST be the right ones for the country, BECAUSE they come from ObamaHero. So there is no need to discuss details of Obamacare and open borders, they will be made good if the Hero runs them, and the villains will cause all the trouble.
The hero worship allows LIVs to skip learning details, and to live in fantasy land. BUT the issues themselves are not fantasy to them. The assignment of credit to Obama, and all blame to Repub's ... THAT is the fantasy part. The feel real pain, and respond with misguided anger at Republicans.
Crazy people do this ... they convince themselves of some simple "religion" ... AGW, real religions, leftist theology ... and they follow gurus ... Gore, televangelists, Obama. This makes hard issues easy, until their fake world is shattered by harsh reality. (like "your insurance is now double")
Posted by: Illini Bill at December 06, 2013 01:46 PM (V7EQG)
However, just like in the Depression, movies always end and you end up in dreary reality. Obama's magic movie moments will end soon enough just so his audience can stumble into reality that resembles a typical Ingmar Bergman film. Depressing, hollow, and empty.
Posted by: wg at December 06, 2013 01:46 PM (Dg+t6)
Posted by: nadavegan at December 06, 2013 02:00 PM (JqzMm)
This is maybe the logical end of treating politics as a horse-race, as Teddy White made mainstream with his "Making of the President 1960" and several follow-on books, and is now the predominant for of political reporting.
It's all about who wins and who loses. Issues only matter to the extent they help you win or lose, they have no meaning except to the competitive contest. Good vs. Evil and whether one is Good or DEvil is not a matter of substantive policy, but style. Obama on The View, anyone?
Of course, having brain-dead liberals in the competitive mix reinforces the media's tendency to do this, because the liberals' policies are in many cases so transparently silly, stupid, counter-productive, or unpopular, the media would much rather focus on the horse race and the polls, and not on the substance. Their guy loses on substance, but can win on style with everyone working together to push him over the top.
Also, mastering the substance well enough to write about it is hard work, it's much easier to just be snarky and carry one side's water, the side that you like for reasons having little or nothing to do with subsdtance and everything to do with style (JFK, the crease in Obama's pants, Clinton's hip-ness, etc.)
That's what we the people vote for, and it won't change unless the electorate changes... and no immediate sign of THAT happening.
Posted by: mhjhnsn at December 06, 2013 02:03 PM (FZdvr)
http://tinyurl.com/nvzl6yg
It's a perfect illustration of Ace's point. The consensus-- as of not too long ago, before Obama's election-- among most economists, including liberal economists-- including Krugman!-- was, basically, that a minimum wage hike is a bad idea. Doesn't empirically work; would have bad consequences, effects in actuality counter to its intentions. At best, it's a highly dubious idea.
Now many of those very same economists/ wonks-- notably, of course, Krugman-- have suddenly reversed opinion. Now, of course, a minimum wage hike = WIN! Boosting the economy, creating jobs. No question.
So what has changed, from then to now, to change these wonks' opinion, to change the predominant consensus?
Well, Barack Obama became POTUS, and endorsed a minimum wage hike in a SOTU speech-- and now, it's a centerpiece of his (mid-second term) campaign.
If that's the macguffin, by golly, whatever the macguffin might be, the wonks will cheer the hero on.
Posted by: lael at December 06, 2013 02:09 PM (j4QK7)
Posted by: rfichoke at December 06, 2013 02:14 PM (J87gl)
Speaking of the Mexico radioactive heist.
Posted by: lael at December 06, 2013 02:16 PM (j4QK7)
Posted by: TexasDan at December 06, 2013 02:22 PM (Fa3Hi)
Posted by: TexasDan at December 06, 2013 02:26 PM (Fa3Hi)
Posted by: Minuteman at December 06, 2013 03:05 PM (zhFI8)
Posted by: Jesusland at December 06, 2013 04:26 PM (jIlzK)
Posted by: Nori at December 06, 2013 04:54 PM (txdJ+)
Posted by: ron n. at December 06, 2013 07:45 PM (c7HxG)
Posted by: DrEvil007 at December 07, 2013 05:42 AM (YIriA)
Posted by: JCW at December 07, 2013 06:45 AM (0emJy)
Posted by: Photoguy at December 07, 2013 10:18 AM (VsDLF)
Obama bristles at criticism because he is a child-man without real accomplishment. He is a vicious political campaigner who knows how to shiv his enemies, but he cannot claim any achievements. None. And he knows it. He is the guy who went to the good colleges but got shitty grades. He is a bullshitter whose manufactured persona is the cool, erudite, sophisticated man. His petulance is an overcompensation for his miserable inadequacy in everything he has ever done, save campaigning...which is at its core all bullshit.
Posted by: PD Quig at December 07, 2013 10:49 AM (0f/yT)
"But I tell you, the satisfaction you get when you've passed a law or you've taken an executive action and somebody comes up to you and says you know what, my kid's alive because you passed that health care bill. Because he was uninsured, he got insurance, got a check up and we caught a tumor in time "
I wonder how he feels now that real people are dying because his bill caused them to lose their insurance. Does he have real feelings?
Posted by: mikulin at December 07, 2013 10:57 AM (AUchl)
Ace,
I thoroughly enjoyed your succinct and incisive overview of MacGuffin / Hero Storytelling theory. I especially liked that you highlighted the relative irrelevancy of whatever the MacGuffin happens to be with importance of the audience's identification with the Hero as he tracks the MacGuffin down.
But to be honest, when you began to apply these storytelling theories to our contemporary politics, I thought you were wading ankle deep into oversimplification. How ironic! I thought. Ace is trying to squeeze complicated facts about the world of politics into the overused formulas of crappy Hollywood film making: in order to promote his own too-clever-by-half theory.
But pretty soon into your theory overlay, you had me convinced. Because it is not you who is distorting political facts to fit a preferred story or theory. Rather it is the media distorting those facts to maintain their Hero Concept of Obama.
Your simple observation that Mathews and his panel had virtually no interest in substantive policy issues (or, more importantly, their impact on America) but were almost exclusively focused on Obama the man and his moral struggle is a powerful one.
I only wish I knew whether these (and similar) cheer leading members of the media have the first clue that they are utterly ensconced in such a ridiculous (and corrosive) mental paradigm.
It would seem that they are either naive to the point of blindness or that they are savvy propagandists who realize they can only sell the tripe if they themselves appear to, as a matter of course, buy it themselves.
If the latter is true, I suppose that would raise the question as to why they would be so invested in consciously selling ugly tripe. If they are willing to gloss over and glide by all the substantive policy issues, then what's the point?
The best I can come up with is that it's a matter of _direction_.
They are happy to try and build back up a flailing president and his disastrous policies because he's generally headed in the 'right' direction. He serves the ultimate cause.
In that case, they realize they are caking on layer after layer of makeup to cover true ugly. - But that's okay because beyond that unfortunate ugly is ultimate justice in leftist power.
And in the process of making over the ugly, they have no problem pretending like that's not what they are doing - in order to be able to better convince LIV who happens to be listening as well as the ranks of the truly naive on their side.
- But again, I honestly cannot figure out if this is what they are doing (intentional gross manipulation of public impression) or if they are just utterly naive themselves.
Posted by: _Dave_ at December 07, 2013 10:57 AM (J+Q+d)
Posted by: steve-Oh at December 07, 2013 05:17 PM (aBNDH)
Posted by: steve-Oh at December 07, 2013 05:21 PM (aBNDH)
Excellent post, Ace.
What sucks for us, is that the JEF's MacGuffins are toxic to the health of this country.
Posted by: wheatie at December 07, 2013 09:37 PM (4ydWa)
US culture has been becoming more emotion-based and immature over the decades. Increasingly reporters haven't asking "what happened?" at the scene of some incident but "how do you feel about what happened?" This is also seen in promotions for stories coming up on the news. They generally refer to "shocking" stories or more directly "emotional" ones.
People seem less capable of rational thought these days, perhaps because the schools no longer teach how to think, which stands to reason since they don't make the kids learn anything with which to think in the first place. They just fill the kids with false self-esteem and propaganda.
Back to the point: people just don't think these days. Emotion is easier and more rewarding in the short term because of the hormones and brain chemicals released during emotional fits. Politicians, especially on the left, are highly adept at manipulating those stimuli and making addicts out of their followers. Don't think: it might harsh your buzz, just bow down and emote.
Posted by: William at December 09, 2013 06:16 AM (7Q0Tb)
Posted by: Bill at December 09, 2013 08:25 AM (+VRRE)
Posted by: Ed at December 09, 2013 08:38 AM (Rq2rZ)
Posted by: sulla at December 09, 2013 10:45 AM (0GucZ)
Posted by: Bill Colley at December 10, 2013 04:20 AM (KwETS)
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Posted by: Cicero Kid at December 06, 2013 10:47 AM (6fSty)