November 15, 2013
— Ace The House is debating the Upton bill. It will pass; the only question is how much Democratic support it will have. Upton himself told Greta Van Sustern that he hasn't whipped this, so he doesn't know how many votes they'll have. But he guessed that even after Obama's fake administrative fix, the bill might get 50 Democratic votes.
I previously predicted that Democrats would resort to arguing against changes to Obamacare by claiming the changes constituted "socialism," whereas the Democratic mandates represented "free markets.' The idiot of Northern Virginia, Jim Moran, Washington, Jim McDermott, just made that exact case, misrepresenting the Upton bill as mandating that insurance companies sell policies.
He got confused. That's the Landrieu bill. Or, more likely, he was simply, get this, lying as usual.
These seem to be the differences between Upton and Landrieu:
Upton provides only for a year-long ability to buy your old policy. Landrieu's bill says the policy must be offered until there are no longer any subscribers to the policy. Advantage: Landrieu
Landrieu's bill applies only to people who actually had the policy before October 1st. Upton is much more expansive: Upton says that if the policy is being offered to anyone, then new customers may buy into that policy as well. Landrieu thus seeks to limit the pool of people who can self-exempt from Obamacare, whereas Upton seeks to expand it. Advantage: Upton
Upton's bill says that insurance companies may offer the old plans. Landrieu says they must.
Many conservatives don't like that last part, because it's a "new mandate." Fine, but insurance companies have been mandated to do things for 50 years, and Obamacare imposes a slew of new mandates. One more mandate won't hurt -- and further, this mandate is necessary to undo the harm that Obama is imposed.
Let's face it, insurance companies are in bed with Obama (but getting uncomfortable with being used by him). They have no more interest in exempting people from Obamacare than Obama himself does. To get them to actually offer these policies will in fact take a mandate -- otherwise, they'll be content to dump everyone in the exchanges.
The insurance companies went along with every other mandate. I will not cry if they get hit with a new one. They were fine with mandates so long as citizens were being mandated themselves, to buy their product; they have, as a group, announced their openness to mandates.
So, impose the mandate on them. They surrendered their right to complain on this point. They're not victims, they're volunteers.
Advantage: Landrieu
My call: Go with Landrieu... but, if possible, add in Upton's provision that any other similar customer who qualifies for a plan that's being offered can also buy it.
The "drawback" of this is that it destroys Obamacare. It undermines the system. Yes, fine: This is what is needed. A decision must be made, and that decision must be forced.
Even if we have to make things so bad that insurance companies bring suit against the government, or begin dropping out of the individual market entirely.
The insurance companies are currently afraid of Obama, and are still playing footsie with him. The only way to overcome the Chicago Mob's coercion of insurance companies is, frankly, to coerce them from the other direction.
We may not be able to repeal Obamacare in one swoop, but we can repeal it piece-by-piece, exempting this class of the population, then this one, then the next one, until no one at all is in Obamacare except the uninsurable.
At that point, the American people can decide whether or not it wants to accept huge new spending levels to insure the uninsurable, or not. But at least the public will have an honest accounting of the actual costs, as opposed to Obamacare's current scheme, in which Obama imposes hidden taxes on specific citizens to pay for his boondoggle.
Obama, as you probably know, has threatened to veto any bill that forces him to keep his promise:
The President just threatened to veto our bipartisan bill to allow you to #KeepYourPlan. pic.twitter.com/dXMhsTXWtn
— Eric Cantor (@GOPLeader) November 15, 2013
We must make him do that.
And we must make Democrats vote to override his veto.
Corrected: It was Jim McDermott who made the "Republicans love socialism, and Obamacare is 'free market' capitalism" argument, not Jim Moran. I have trouble telling these two crusty communists apart.
Posted by: Ace at
07:48 AM
| Comments (328)
Post contains 741 words, total size 5 kb.
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at November 15, 2013 07:51 AM (0fdrC)
Posted by: Barky O'Links at November 15, 2013 07:52 AM (KQp38)
I love the optics.
Go ahead, Dogeater, veto a bill that seeks to make your vociferous and oft repeated promises come true.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2013 07:52 AM (LA7Cm)
Posted by: Daniel Simpson Day at November 15, 2013 07:53 AM (aA2hG)
Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 56% more DOOM! at November 15, 2013 07:53 AM (09o/X)
Posted by: Barack Hussein Obama at November 15, 2013 07:53 AM (+H/11)
Fuck Landrieu and fuck Upton.
Let the country stew in its awfulness then go full repeal.
Nothing less than repeal.
Posted by: rrpjr at November 15, 2013 07:53 AM (rNCV5)
Did Obama never hear the phrase "stop diggin?" God, I hope not. Watching this marxist asshole implode is making my holiday season.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 07:53 AM (x3YFz)
Go get 'em and don't forget the pitchforks.
Posted by: Barack the Magnificent at November 15, 2013 07:53 AM (JRmiD)
Posted by: Insurance companies in bed with B.O. at November 15, 2013 07:54 AM (LA7Cm)
Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at November 15, 2013 07:54 AM (0fdrC)
Posted by: ace at November 15, 2013 07:54 AM (/FnUH)
Posted by: RolandTHTG at November 15, 2013 07:55 AM (QM5S2)
Posted by: Yeah.Probably at November 15, 2013 07:55 AM (pj6Nr)
More of this, please. Is that so much to ask?
Posted by: Lizzy at November 15, 2013 07:56 AM (JRmiD)
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 07:56 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: Paranoidgirlinseattle at November 15, 2013 07:56 AM (RZ8pf)
"Am I a wacko-bird if think I see the hand of God in this chaos? "
No. You'd just be, like me, tired of fixing sh!t after liberals have FUBAR'd it.
Posted by: G.O.D. at November 15, 2013 07:57 AM (LA7Cm)
The Upton bill is, in essence, enabling ChoomCare. Solidifying the cement holding the bricks of horrendously bad policy together. In the end, it will make things easier for our felonious president no matter how he chooses to deal with it,
I know it's impossible -- see: Boner, John, C*ntor, Eric, and other notable sellouts -- but what should happen is an endless line of Republican House members walking their bills, each repealing ChoomCare in full, and nothing more, up to the front desk.
Playing politics with this regime is a lose/lose proposition, no matter how many pundits are making hay off of gaming it and offering optically correct solutions that won't offend their Democrat pals.
Posted by: MrScribbler at November 15, 2013 07:57 AM (kaGpp)
Posted by: Jane at November 15, 2013 07:57 AM (J+Bq4)
Posted by: Countrysquire at November 15, 2013 07:58 AM (LSJmV)
Posted by: MaureenTheTemp at November 15, 2013 07:58 AM (hslAc)
I have come to the conclusion that there is going to be massive chaos either way, changing the law or keeping the law as is or killing the whole thing outright.
That box that got opened with this flustercluck belonged to Pandora.
Killing the whole thing is the best option, but everyday that goes by that that happens is going to make it that much worse.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at November 15, 2013 07:58 AM (iGPSR)
More of this, please. Is that so much to ask?
Posted by: Lizzy at November 15, 2013 11:56 AM (JRmiD)
When faced with difficult situations, politically or otherwise, Obama flails about like a 4 year old in a tantrum.
It's freaking hilarious.
He's an infant.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 07:58 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: CAC at November 15, 2013 07:59 AM (rXzWE)
-
Maryann v. the Skipper
Posted by: WalrusRex at November 15, 2013 11:59 AM (Hx5uv)
Skipper. Sarcasm always wins.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 07:59 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 08:00 AM (659DL)
Posted by: FenelonSpoke at November 15, 2013 08:00 AM (23Kgq)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of
doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 12:00 PM (659DL)
I doubt he's even read it.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:00 AM (x3YFz)
Of course, if you go with Landrieu's plan, all the chaos teh insurance companies were talkinga bout after Obammy's presser yesterday would be forced into fruition. They've set up their premiums and their actuary tables for the upcoming year, so telling them they now have to sell their old policies again is going to completely screw them and their customers.
I don't care about the insurance companies -- fuck them, the traitorous swine -- but I do care about the people who are going to be double fucked by this stupid law and its cheerleaders. Unlike our idiot Preezy and his lackeys, I actually want people to feel safe and comfortable again.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/i][/u][/s][/b] at November 15, 2013 08:01 AM (4df7R)
Posted by: Mr. Powerstroke Super Duty 4X4 King Ranch Edition at November 15, 2013 08:01 AM (LSJmV)
Posted by: Powderhouse Rules at November 15, 2013 08:01 AM (Xv7f/)
"Am I one of the few who thinks doing something for the sake of optics is wrong? "
Politics is optics. It conveys a message as well. We have a POTUS who the general population and media at large is now coming around to understanding to be a liar. Driving home that impression, large, loud, and, publicly, by having him deny to allow what he explicitly said would happen if we just "trusted" him is a gigantic message.
LIVs don't understand much but when the POTUS has become a "liar" they get it. See. G.W.B.
Posted by: Father Mulcahy at November 15, 2013 08:01 AM (LA7Cm)
Posted by: Eton Cox at November 15, 2013 08:01 AM (q177U)
Posted by: UWP at November 15, 2013 08:02 AM (fdXMW)
***
Finally....A law I can get behind.
Posted by: B at November 15, 2013 08:02 AM (twiRb)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at November 15, 2013 08:03 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: zombie at November 15, 2013 08:03 AM (+cx5n)
Posted by: Jose at November 15, 2013 08:03 AM (zc/sw)
Posted by: UWP at November 15, 2013 12:02 PM (fdXMW)
It's amazing how many Congress critters (among others in DC) don't know to follow the simple advice, "It's better to be thought an idiot than to open your mouth and remove all doubt."
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/i][/u][/s][/b] at November 15, 2013 08:03 AM (4df7R)
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2013 08:04 AM (LA7Cm)
Posted by: Stirner at November 15, 2013 08:04 AM (l1p2K)
Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at November 15, 2013 08:04 AM (+lsX1)
As long as the law passed by both Houses of Congress have identical wording, it is constitutional. Now, if the bill changes taxes then it must originate with the House.
Thus, if the House and Senate bills are different--one way is to go to conference where House and Senate members produce the final bill for both houses to vote upon. Another way is for either chamber to simply pass the other chamber's bill and give up their own bill. Last, but not least, sometimes an existing bill passed by one house is gutted and an amendment is passed that is essentially the other house's bill that has passed. If I recall correctly, this is how the Senate's Obamacare bill was passed--a House bill with minor taxes was amended with the Obamacare bill--thus recounciliation procedures could be used and also the tax bill theoretically originated in the House. Then, the Obamacare bill was passed by the House. Voila--the current law.
Posted by: wg at November 15, 2013 08:04 AM (P5HVp)
Gives me the chance to say once again, they aren't who you think they are.
Both sides are doing this dance to save their phoney baloney jobs, nothing more.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at November 15, 2013 08:04 AM (iGPSR)
Posted by: Paranoidgirlinseattle at November 15, 2013 08:04 AM (RZ8pf)
-
I'm fine with that but it must remain 100% Donk chaos.
Posted by: WalrusRex at November 15, 2013 08:04 AM (Hx5uv)
Posted by: jakeman at November 15, 2013 08:05 AM (vH4YP)
Posted by: Lauren at November 15, 2013 08:05 AM (hFL/3)
Posted by: Roy at November 15, 2013 08:05 AM (VndSC)
Posted by: Romeo13 at November 15, 2013 08:05 AM (lZBBB)
So Obama is threatening to veto two acts which will, in essence, put in writing the very thing which he was blathering about yesterday?
If I were an insurance company executive, I sure as heck would want that guarantee in writing - that way, I wouldn't get burned when the President capriciously changes his mind again.
That is, after all, why we have LAWS.....
Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX (@Teresa_Koch) at November 15, 2013 08:05 AM (PZ6/M)
Posted by: Y-not on the phone at November 15, 2013 08:06 AM (zDsvJ)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 08:06 AM (659DL)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at November 15, 2013 08:07 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: FenelonSpoke at November 15, 2013 08:07 AM (23Kgq)
Has any president before Obama ever had a formal printed "Veto Threat" document? I sure as hell don't remember seeing one.
I'm sure there's always been some kind of formal notification of a President's intent to veto, as a way to get the legislature to work on crafting something more palatable instead of wasting time and money putting the finishing touches on a bill that's going to end up in the round file anyway.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/i][/u][/s][/b] at November 15, 2013 08:07 AM (4df7R)
I don't see, and probably am missing something, but why do we need do anything? The Dems aren't going to give credit to the GOP for saving their asses. Transactionally I don't see what we get out of this. And please don't say we get to look like our guys are being proactive, because that and $5 will get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.
Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at November 15, 2013 08:07 AM (rSTkb)
Posted by: Romeo13 at November 15, 2013 08:07 AM (lZBBB)
QUESTION: “My question would be about accountability. Would you be willing to accept 100% responsibility, 100% accountability for the failure or success of whatever you vote for?”
LANDRIEU: “I do, already, because that’s what I do every election. I mean I, you all have to…when I run for reelection you say to me ‘Senator we like what you’ve done we voted for you, we don’t like what you’ve done we voted against you.’”
Posted by: WalrusRex at November 15, 2013 08:07 AM (Hx5uv)
That's not a fumble on the opponent's 45 yard line.
That's a preconceived fumble where you didn't game plan and you put 9 men on the field instead of 11, and 3 were hockey players, two were hookers and 2 were hobos.
on the 1 yard line.
which led to the other team scoring 45 unanswered points.
That's the fumble.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:08 AM (x3YFz)
>>>These seem to be the differences between Upton and Landrieu:<<<
missed one: indoor and outdoor plumbing.
Posted by: Roy at November 15, 2013 08:08 AM (VndSC)
*
*
I've always thought Mary looked more like Miss Piggy. Once upon a time ML was fairly cute for a lib, but she's been porking out on the sausage gumbo in recent years.
Posted by: Wolfus Aurelius at November 15, 2013 08:08 AM (BDU/a)
Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX (@Teresa_Koch) at November 15, 2013 08:08 AM (PZ6/M)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 08:08 AM (659DL)
"Can this be fixed in a month? I really, really, really don't think so."
No, they can't. Acts like these simply add to the chaos that makes this behemoth unworkable, unmanageable, and unviable. It adds to the crash. Good.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2013 08:08 AM (LA7Cm)
Posted by: Teh Obama at November 15, 2013 08:08 AM (OZmbA)
Posted by: rickb223 at November 15, 2013 08:08 AM (p9JxP)
Posted by: Countrysquire at November 15, 2013 08:08 AM (LSJmV)
Posted by: Y-not on the phone at November 15, 2013 08:09 AM (zDsvJ)
Posted by: Sean Bannion[/i][/i][/u][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:09 AM (sbV1u)
Posted by: Eton Cox at November 15, 2013 08:09 AM (q177U)
What lifeline? It guts Obamacare. You will have the market flooded with "substandard" policies and make them even more popular. You will force Obama to veto keeping his promise.
Why does Obama want to veto this? If he signs it, he drags the Republicans into this hot mess. He can say he did what the GOP wanted and things are still screwed up.
He'll sign this if it passes the House and Senate.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at November 15, 2013 08:09 AM (uhAkr)
Posted by: Paul at November 15, 2013 08:10 AM (JM48I)
Posted by: Teh Obama at November 15, 2013 08:10 AM (OZmbA)
"Can this be fixed in a month? I really, really, really don't think so."
No, they can't. Acts like these simply add to the chaos that makes this behemoth unworkable, unmanageable, and unviable. It adds to the crash. Good.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2013 12:08 PM (LA7Cm)
Guess I'm not the only one who snorted coffee out my nose at the Nov 30 deadline/rope they decided to hang themselves with.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:10 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: Paranoidgirlinseattle at November 15, 2013 08:10 AM (RZ8pf)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at November 15, 2013 08:10 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: johnd01 at November 15, 2013 08:10 AM (ukNFU)
Posted by: VADM(Red) Cuthbert Collingwood (Mentioned in Despatches) at November 15, 2013 08:11 AM (O7OxF)
Posted by: Countrysquire at November 15, 2013 08:11 AM (LSJmV)
Posted by: FenelonSpoke at November 15, 2013 08:11 AM (23Kgq)
Posted by: Barry Il Douche at November 15, 2013 08:11 AM (FcR7P)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 08:11 AM (659DL)
Posted by: Lauren at November 15, 2013 08:11 AM (hFL/3)
Posted by: zombie at November 15, 2013 08:12 AM (+cx5n)
Posted by: Oprah at November 15, 2013 08:12 AM (OZmbA)
Posted by: Countrysquire at November 15, 2013 08:12 AM (LSJmV)
Posted by: Schwalbe: The Me-262© at November 15, 2013 08:12 AM (9Bdcz)
Posted by: Sean Bannion[/i][/i][/u][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:12 AM (sbV1u)
An Obama guarantee written in blood and sworn on a stack of bibles is worth about as much as the rolled bathroom paper product it would be written on.
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (Xlbr8)
Posted by: zombie at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (+cx5n)
Posted by: GM at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (K0tm3)
Posted by: Matt S. at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (m7EhJ)
Posted by: Barry Il Douche at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (FcR7P)
Posted by: Tron at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (j6Pk9)
Posted by: rickb223 at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (p9JxP)
Posted by: AmishDude at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (T0NGe)
"Simple. It's an act against him, personally. That can not stand..."
True. true. He takes this entire thing very personally. Thin skinned he be and all.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (LA7Cm)
Posted by: Sean Bannion[/i][/i][/u][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (sbV1u)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (659DL)
And without 10 million healthy people forced by law to fund ObamaCare, it simply sits there in the driveway, dead.
Posted by: zombie at November 15, 2013 12:12 PM (+cx5n)
Another project, brought you courtesy of the letter "E" and the liberals.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:13 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: MaureenTheTemp at November 15, 2013 11:58 AM (hslAc)<<<
There's still time for them to get an abortion....
*sorry, couldn't resist*
Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX (@Teresa_Koch) at November 15, 2013 08:14 AM (PZ6/M)
Posted by: Paul at November 15, 2013 12:10 PM (JM48I)
Obammycare's already fucked, and they know it. These aren't fixes; they're political theater meant to make the masses believe that Things Are Being Done At The Highest Levels By Top Men (tm). Neither of these "fixes" will fix a damn thing. All they do is provide some semblance of political cover for those who vote for them: "See, we tried! Please don't vote us out of office."
Personally I'm not for providing any of these assclowns with political cover, but YMMV.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/i][/u][/s][/b] at November 15, 2013 08:14 AM (4df7R)
You get free blood pressure screenings!!!!
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of
doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 12:13 PM (659DL)
Um... buy a bp cuff? Spend 10 minutes on google?
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:14 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:14 AM (Xlbr8)
And then we can have a Constitutional discussion...crisis, I mean. It's high time.
Posted by: PJ at November 15, 2013 08:14 AM (ZWaLo)
If the GOP alters the bill, the Dems will have a bill to wave in the face of angry constituents,"It would have worked if not for those damned wreckers in the TEA-O-PEE!"
Attempting to be 'too clever by half' is dangerous enough even before factoring in the Stupid Party.
Posted by: weft cut-loop [/i] [/b] at November 15, 2013 08:14 AM (rSTkb)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 08:14 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at November 15, 2013 08:14 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: Sean Bannion[/i][/i][/u][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:15 AM (sbV1u)
Posted by: MaureenTheTemp at November 15, 2013 11:58 AM (hslAc)<<<
There's still time for them to get an abortion.....
*sorry - couldn't resist*
Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX (@Teresa_Koch) at November 15, 2013 08:15 AM (PZ6/M)
Posted by: OMoobaCare at November 15, 2013 08:15 AM (MhA4j)
Stick your arm in the thingie at any WMT pharmacy.
Free is always the right price.
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:15 AM (Xlbr8)
Simple. It's an act against him, personally. That can not stand. He can wave his hands and allow us to keep our plans thanks to his benevolence, but he'll be damned before he lets anyone else take his glory or expose his failure.
Obama's defining trait is shifting blame. If Republicans offer him a way to take some blame, he'll give it to them.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at November 15, 2013 08:16 AM (uhAkr)
OT "sorta"
EPA not letting cities install lead fire hydrants...
one catch almost all fire hydrants are lead based because of cost and reliability.
Your EPA overlords at work...
Posted by: sven10077 at November 15, 2013 08:16 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Romeo13 at November 15, 2013 08:16 AM (lZBBB)
The Dems then get to go out and campaign that they TRIED to help people but Obama "held them hostage" or whatever stupid phrase they'll come up with.
They will think they are off the hook with their voters, but in fact they passed this piece of shit to begin with.
Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at November 15, 2013 08:16 AM (f9c2L)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:16 AM (0LHZx)
1. Just as a matter of practicality, neither Upton's nor Landrieu's bills can be implemented before 1/1/14. There's simply not time to get the rates approved, get the programming done, get the letters out, get the letters back, collect the premium, etc.
2. That might be fine, you say, because it further degrades Obamacare. However, it will severely destabilize the insurance industry. Recall what happened when AIG went bankrupt. Now consider how much worse it would be if Kaiser, Aetna, United and a couple of the Blues went down.
That latter scenario sounds extreme, but if they get caught between the Obama Administration on one hand and legislation that requires them to keep offering plans from the status quo ante, they could easily be in big trouble.
It's one hell of a mess, and I don't see a way out at the present time. I think the only thing to do is to allow the law to go forward as written, with the full brunt of the consequences, intended and unintended, to unfold on the populace.
Then, once it turns 2014, we can begin to plan for a properly considered way to retrench, overturn, etc.
Note that as a practical matter, the closer we get to elections in 2014, the more the Dems have an incentive to play ball.
Posted by: Andrew at November 15, 2013 08:16 AM (cq0FO)
Posted by: zombie at November 15, 2013 08:17 AM (+cx5n)
If you like your D.C. goatfuck, you can keep your D.C. goatfuck.
Posted by: wth at November 15, 2013 08:17 AM (wAQA5)
Posted by: urg at November 15, 2013 08:17 AM (+H/11)
It doesn't matter really, insurance companies or any other business can operate under this sort of changing environment. Its the same as Venezuela taking over those retail stores and telling them what price to charge.
Posted by: Guy Mohawk at November 15, 2013 08:17 AM (iGPSR)
CYA.
Repeal!
Posted by: PJ at November 15, 2013 08:17 AM (ZWaLo)
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at November 15, 2013 08:17 AM (olDqf)
Posted by: rickb223 at November 15, 2013 08:18 AM (p9JxP)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 12:14 PM (da5Wo)
Bah. 2 boobies for every girl, with 50/50 population distribution that means there's 66/33 boobie distribution.
I've done the math. It's on the white board.
we're virtually covered in boobs.
Mathematically speaking.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:18 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:18 AM (0LHZx)
Skipper. Sarcasm always wins.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 11:59 AM (x3YFz)
Not over tits it doesn't.
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 12:14 PM (da5Wo)
The Skipper had tits, too.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/i][/u][/s][/b] at November 15, 2013 08:18 AM (4df7R)
"if that were the case the insurers would have to comply, for good or ill..."
The black and white letter of the law still stipulates that insurers have to comply with the provisions of the ACA in 2014. Period.
Is "well, the President said in a press conference that we didn't have to after all" going to have legal standing should the letter of the law get challenged in court?
Fuck. No.
Posted by: Ricardo Kill at November 15, 2013 08:18 AM (LA7Cm)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 08:18 AM (659DL)
Posted by: artisanal 'ette at November 15, 2013 08:19 AM (IXrOn)
Posted by: genew at November 15, 2013 08:19 AM (0Titl)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 08:19 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:19 AM (0LHZx)
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at November 15, 2013 12:17 PM (olDqf)
Or a colon. Which, given the ass-raping the gubmint intends to force upon every American, is looking less and less likely.
Glad to hear all's well, though. ^_^
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/i][/u][/s][/b] at November 15, 2013 08:19 AM (4df7R)
It's a watch!
//Judas Iscariot Roberts
More seriously the only law Presidents create is Martial Law our whole Republic is fucked because of hyper-regulatory fiat.
Posted by: sven10077 at November 15, 2013 08:19 AM (9jfyN)
No, they do not. They differ based on geography, age, and sex in a great many ways. Most of the differences, as one would now expect, don't make a great deal of sense.
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of
doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 12:18 PM (659DL)
Thanks for putting that meme down. They're not even close to equal. Benefits vary wildly.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:20 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: Nip Sip at November 15, 2013 08:20 AM (0FSuD)
The biggest lead threat was always from hot water lines. Leaching from cold water lines is a much slower process. These people are imbeciles. Dangerous imbeciles.
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:20 AM (Xlbr8)
Posted by: GM at November 15, 2013 08:20 AM (K0tm3)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 08:20 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 08:20 AM (659DL)
====
The insurance companies are also afraid of their stockholders. And the markets.
Posted by: mrp at November 15, 2013 08:20 AM (HjPtV)
Mathematically speaking.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 12:18 PM (x3YFz)
Fixed. Hopefully.
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 12:19 PM (da5Wo)
One can dream.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:20 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: Bigby's Thumb at November 15, 2013 08:20 AM (CozRk)
Posted by: RWC at November 15, 2013 08:21 AM (fWAjv)
Posted by: Havedash at November 15, 2013 08:21 AM (gvqyH)
Ace's key paragraph: "The "drawback" of this is that it destroys Obamacare. It undermines the system. Yes, fine: This is what is needed. A decision must be made, and that decision must be forced"
Absolutely. Tension has been building and we're rapidly approaching the climax. If we want to survive when the curtain drops we need to force into effect the conditions that will ensure the debate ends where we desire it to.
Can't they pass the Landrieu bill and then tack-on the one Upton conditional opening up enrollment as an amendment in the House or during conference?
I'm rust on my procedural knowledge.
Posted by: Uriah Heep at November 15, 2013 08:21 AM (jhI6f)
Posted by: Romeo13 at November 15, 2013 08:21 AM (lZBBB)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at November 15, 2013 08:21 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:21 AM (0LHZx)
Posted by: artisanal 'ette at November 15, 2013 08:21 AM (IXrOn)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 12:18 PM (659DL)
That's true, but those differences are the same (yeah, I know -- makes sense) whether you buy your plan through the marketplace or direct from the insurer. The only difference is buying direct from the company means you don't get the subsidy; or at least you don't get it automatically applied.
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/i][/u][/s][/b] at November 15, 2013 08:22 AM (4df7R)
Quadrupling down on stupid...YES!!!!!! For the win.
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:22 AM (Xlbr8)
The Romans grasped it for fuck's sakes...
a bunch of neo-luddite motherfuckers who give narry a fuck to maintaining our society.
Posted by: sven10077 at November 15, 2013 08:22 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: FenelonSpoke at November 15, 2013 08:22 AM (23Kgq)
Now they say masturbation increases it?
Studies are like statistics, in other words...
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at November 15, 2013 12:21 PM (7ObY1)
The most disturbing part is that the study/studies actually exists.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:22 AM (x3YFz)
I would propose that the way to cheaper coverage through ins. co.s: do away with as many previous mandates as possible. That would be truly radical/revolutionary. (within bounds of course.... but minimize the bounds.)
Posted by: jb at November 15, 2013 08:23 AM (tByES)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 08:23 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 12:20 PM (da5Wo)
! I just calls 'em like I sees 'em!
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/i][/u][/s][/b] at November 15, 2013 08:23 AM (4df7R)
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:23 AM (Xlbr8)
Posted by: Lauren at November 15, 2013 08:23 AM (hFL/3)
0_o
Posted by: WisRich at November 15, 2013 12:22 PM (hdpay)
She's like one of those dolls with the string you pull and just says the same stupid shit over and over and over.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:23 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: GM at November 15, 2013 08:23 AM (K0tm3)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:23 AM (0LHZx)
Posted by: polynikes at November 15, 2013 08:24 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at November 15, 2013 08:24 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: Purp at November 15, 2013 12:23 PM (Xlbr
I was hoping on natural selection.
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:24 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: Nip Sip at November 15, 2013 08:24 AM (0FSuD)
Ken is gay, but Rico is hung like a stud....
//San Fran Barb Pelosi
Posted by: sven10077 at November 15, 2013 08:24 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: rickb223 at November 15, 2013 08:24 AM (p9JxP)
In five years we'll all be consigned to the shadows, forced into back alley colonoscopies like our forefathers.
Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at November 15, 2013 08:24 AM (+lsX1)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 08:24 AM (659DL)
Posted by: EPA at November 15, 2013 08:25 AM (+H/11)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 12:23 PM (0LHZx)
well, isn't "Coverage" = "Price"?
Isn't that the whole freaking point?
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 08:25 AM (x3YFz)
Posted by: the littl shyning man at November 15, 2013 08:25 AM (tmFlQ)
Posted by: Mama AJ at November 15, 2013 08:25 AM (SUKHu)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 08:25 AM (da5Wo)
Posted by: Lauren at November 15, 2013 08:25 AM (hFL/3)
Posted by: John Boehner and Mitch McConnell at November 15, 2013 08:26 AM (ugAvG)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:26 AM (0LHZx)
Posted by: Nip Sip at November 15, 2013 08:26 AM (0FSuD)
Posted by: Jesse Pinkman, PhD Bitches! at November 15, 2013 08:26 AM (kkbgQ)
Posted by: FenelonSpoke at November 15, 2013 08:26 AM (23Kgq)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 12:25 PM (da5Wo)
*big, sad eyes* Why do you hate me?
*single tear rolls down cheek*
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/i][/u][/s][/b] at November 15, 2013 08:26 AM (4df7R)
Oh I have believe me.
Basically they have undermined every cornerstone of actuarial theory and got the insurance companies to go along via the "heads we win, tails they lose" bail out mechanism.
If I had one wish I'd use it to totally obliterate all contra market intervention in healthcare and obliterate the frankenstein monster of insurance.
Posted by: sven10077 at November 15, 2013 08:27 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:27 AM (0LHZx)
Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 15, 2013 08:28 AM (32Ze2)
Posted by: 7 Days in May at November 15, 2013 08:28 AM (j6DTo)
This is where they start screaming"date rape"
Posted by: George Orwell at November 15, 2013 08:28 AM (Vv4Go)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 08:28 AM (da5Wo)
You'll have to talk over the bleeding in my ass from the double standard dildo Barry is slinging bud.
Posted by: sven10077 at November 15, 2013 08:28 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here)-also drooling imbecile incapable of doing algebra or something at November 15, 2013 08:29 AM (659DL)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:29 AM (0LHZx)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 12:27 PM (0LHZx)
so you're saying the same plans are the same except for the plans that are not the same.
Posted by: polynikes at November 15, 2013 08:29 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at November 15, 2013 08:29 AM (/Crba)
And we must make Democrats vote to override his veto.
Nice thought but it's just that: wishful thinking.
It'll never happen. There's not enough vulnerable Democrat senators in 2014.
Posted by: Ed Anger at November 15, 2013 08:29 AM (tOkJB)
Oh holy crap..........are you kidding me.....
Oh Lord. Obama will not sign it for 3 reasons. First, he said he would veto it. If he backs down now he looks completely ineffectual, no one will ever take his threat seriously and his second term is, at that point, over. Second, if he signs it, he pisses off his left wing base and his left wing donor base....and that means no more money for OFA. Third, his minions are up there right now telling Democrats to vote no against Upton. If these idiots walk the plank, vote no and then see Obama cave........they will never, ever, ever walk a plank for him again.
So your claim is that Barry would rather veto a bipartisan bill? That's looney. He becomes 100% the villain as he flounders about in abject failure. Something has to change to fix this. If Barry does it on his own, he's going to look ineffectual times a million.
It's a nice fantasy, Mallamutt, but it probably won't happen like that. This isn't a magic sword that will kill all the Democrats forever.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at November 15, 2013 08:29 AM (uhAkr)
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at November 15, 2013 08:30 AM (oFCZn)
Just look to NHS to see where this leads.
Posted by: Lizzy at November 15, 2013 08:30 AM (JRmiD)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:31 AM (0LHZx)
Posted by: Hoss at November 15, 2013 08:31 AM (LkCGG)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at November 15, 2013 08:31 AM (/Crba)
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at November 15, 2013 12:30 PM (oFCZn)
That's not as embarrasing as waking up with just the hood and nothing else. Neighbors didn't like it when I went to pick up the paper.
Posted by: polynikes at November 15, 2013 08:32 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at November 15, 2013 08:32 AM (olDqf)
Posted by: Hoss at November 15, 2013 08:32 AM (LkCGG)
Posted by: t-bird at November 15, 2013 08:32 AM (FcR7P)
EPA not letting cities install lead fire hydrants...
one catch almost all fire hydrants are lead based because of cost and reliability.
Your EPA overlords at work...
Posted by: sven10077 at November 15, 2013 12:16 PM (9jfyN)
**
Unless we're drinking water from hydrants, licking said hydrants or if lead poisoning could magically jump into my dog's dick, the EPA can go FOAD.
Posted by: dananjcon at November 15, 2013 08:32 AM (wmU4G)
He is blaming them now for not doing anything. He will blame them later for just wanting repeal and nothing more. He will blame them if the sun rises in the east, he will blame them if the sun sets in the west, he will blame them if the day ends in y, he will blame them till he dies.
This doesn't have anything to do with who Obama is blaming. It has to do with who is being blamed. Blaming Republicans for not doing anything (or wanting repeal) doesn't work.
If Republicans pass something that doesn't fix anything (which it probably won't), you'll hear about it.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at November 15, 2013 08:33 AM (uhAkr)
Posted by: Lauren at November 15, 2013 08:33 AM (hFL/3)
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at November 15, 2013 08:33 AM (7ObY1)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at November 15, 2013 08:33 AM (/Crba)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:33 AM (0LHZx)
Best Doc I ever had was a short Indian named "George John"
Posted by: sven10077 at November 15, 2013 08:33 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Moochelle O at November 15, 2013 08:33 AM (ztKLQ)
Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 15, 2013 12:28 PM (da5Wo)
Harumph!
Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/i][/u][/s][/b] at November 15, 2013 08:33 AM (4df7R)
It could have been worse....a Reggie Love mask.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at November 15, 2013 08:33 AM (oJ5Fd)
If you still have a doctor, that is. And don't expect us to cover you for it, because your insurance is cancelled. And you can't get new insurance, because that's all screwed up. And without new insurance, you owe the federal government a fine.
Hey, that schadenboner went away on its own! You're welcome!
Posted by: We're From The Federal Government, And We're Here To Help. Ourselves. at November 15, 2013 08:34 AM (DLu2s)
Posted by: rickb223 at November 15, 2013 08:34 AM (p9JxP)
No, fucking no. When will conservatives smarten the fuck up?
If we push repeal the story instantly change from "Obamacare is a total and unmitigated disaster" (today's NYPost cover) to something else entirely: "Republicans want to take away your healthcare -- see this single, poor latino mother!!"
Only an idiot would expend energy pulling down something which is already crashing down. We just guide the process, we set boundaries so that when it falls it falls where we want it. Think of cutting down a tree and tying ropes to pull the pieces where you want them to end up (and not on your house!).
Think strategically.
We push policy decisions which expedite the unraveling of Obamacare organically so that it becomes unworkable. Either it just collapses; or it's collapsed by voter revolt in 2014/2016; or -- IMHO, in the best case -- it's so bad that Obama tries to change it via executive fiat and we can force a fatal blow in the Supreme Court.
Just remember, the Court has already supported the law and maintained it's perception of being impartial and fair on this law. If it goes back to them again, and they knock it down 5-4 when 50-60% of the country hates it -- it's a HUGE win not only for us, as it's politically clean, but the court maintains it's perceived impartiality.
Posted by: Uriah Heep at November 15, 2013 08:34 AM (jhI6f)
Posted by: tsrblke PhD(c) (No Really!) at November 15, 2013 08:34 AM (GaqMa)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:34 AM (0LHZx)
Posted by: Barky The Magical Fuckstick at November 15, 2013 08:35 AM (FcR7P)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 12:33 PM (0LHZx)
Are all the deductibles identical?
Posted by: polynikes at November 15, 2013 08:35 AM (m2CN7)
Posted by: rickb223 at November 15, 2013 08:35 AM (p9JxP)
Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2013 08:35 AM (Y92Nd)
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at November 15, 2013 08:35 AM (/Crba)
Posted by: EPA at November 15, 2013 08:37 AM (+H/11)
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at November 15, 2013 08:37 AM (0LHZx)
Posted by: J.J. Sefton at November 15, 2013 08:37 AM (olDqf)
Posted by: Nip Sip at November 15, 2013 08:37 AM (0FSuD)
The accent made me pay closer attention and ask more questions...
ANYWAY if we're really going to make America look like the 2d and 3d world then we may as well get used to it...
India is gonna have a manned space program before us.
Thanks America.
Posted by: sven10077 at November 15, 2013 08:38 AM (9jfyN)
The Federal Executive Response Form Library (FERFL) contains a lot of other useful forms too, including "Icy Glare" and "WTF?"
Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at November 15, 2013 08:38 AM (8ZskC)
The law specifies minimum offerings, not maximums. You can offer anything you want above the minimum and charge more for it
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:38 AM (Xlbr8)
My Balonium Fire Electrical plant works gangbusters!
Thanks EPA
Posted by: sven10077 at November 15, 2013 08:39 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: Y-not on her last nerve reserve at November 15, 2013 08:40 AM (zDsvJ)
Then you'll have no problem citing say...3 different vendors offering absolutely identical policy product.
I'll take two examples to make it easier for you.
Proof by repeated assertion != data
Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at November 15, 2013 08:40 AM (Xlbr8)
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at November 15, 2013 08:41 AM (CJjw5)
Posted by: Purp at November 15, 2013 12:40 PM (Xlbr
Says you.
Posted by: EPA at November 15, 2013 08:42 AM (+H/11)
Posted by: John Boehner and Mitch McConnell at November 15, 2013 08:42 AM (ugAvG)
Posted by: Hoss at November 15, 2013 08:43 AM (gTnJn)
Posted by: t-bird at November 15, 2013 08:43 AM (FcR7P)
Hey republicans!
You can't fix FUBAR!
stoopid jackwagons
Repeal or do nothing.
and I went to public school
Posted by: Fred Q. at November 15, 2013 08:44 AM (W6iIX)
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at November 15, 2013 12:41 PM (CJjw5)
That's not sufficiently clever for the geniuses who we have elected to higher office in America.
And it's the truth, is short and snappy, uses words people understand, and it's not in legalese.
So....they definitely won't use it.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at November 15, 2013 08:44 AM (oJ5Fd)
Posted by: Y-not on her last nerve reserve at November 15, 2013 08:45 AM (zDsvJ)
*
What he said^^^
Posted by: dananjcon at November 15, 2013 08:45 AM (wmU4G)
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at November 15, 2013 12:41 PM (CJjw5)
Yep. 'Destroying' ObamaCare in part or 'fixing' it isn't going to do any good for anybody. People are still going to lose their plans, there will still be chaos.
We need to push to go back to the old system. The old system is better and not chaos. We shouldn't be talking about the old system's 'problems.' It's better than this. Let's get back to there.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at November 15, 2013 08:45 AM (uhAkr)
Posted by: VADM(Red) Cuthbert Collingwood (Mentioned in Despatches) at November 15, 2013 08:45 AM (O7OxF)
Posted by: Countrysquire at November 15, 2013 08:45 AM (LSJmV)
He's had at least 7 Krugatons worth of fuck ups there Hoss
Posted by: sven10077 at November 15, 2013 08:46 AM (9jfyN)
Posted by: RS at November 15, 2013 08:46 AM (YAGV/)
0_o
Posted by: WisRich at November 15, 2013 12:22 PM (hdpay)
The botox needles obviously penetrated her tiny brain a long time ago.
Posted by: TheQuietMan at November 15, 2013 08:47 AM (1Jaio)
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at November 15, 2013 08:47 AM (CJjw5)
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at November 15, 2013 08:47 AM (oFCZn)
None of the two will work. It's only more chaos. The way to end a nightmare is to wake up, not open another closet with a monster in it. Repeal!
But Obama will veto a Repeal bill! Except the claim is that Obama will veto either of these two plans also...
I don't get it.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at November 15, 2013 08:48 AM (uhAkr)
Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at November 15, 2013 08:48 AM (Y92Nd)
Posted by: Damiano the Economic Traitor at November 15, 2013 08:48 AM (j0wOO)
The insurance companies are currently afraid of Obama, and are still playing footsie with him. The only way to overcome the Chicago Mob's coercion of insurance companies is, frankly, to coerce them from the other direction.
We may not be able to repeal Obamacare in one swoop, but we can repeal it piece-by-piece, exempting this class of the population, then this one, then the next one, until no one at all is in Obamacare except the uninsurable.
At that point, the American people can decide whether or not it wants to accept huge new spending levels to insure the uninsurable, or not. But at least the public will have an honest accounting of the actual costs, as opposed to Obamacare's current scheme, in which Obama imposes hidden taxes on specific citizens to pay for his boondoggle.
EXCELLENT ANALYSIS, ACE
Posted by: Chants at November 15, 2013 08:48 AM (cdS5P)
Posted by: MSNBC Expert Commentator at November 15, 2013 08:49 AM (O7OxF)
All cancellations or modifications of rates or coverage in insurance plans that start in or continue into the next year have to be announced by October 15th of the current year.
Don't let the bastards delay next year's pain until after the election.
Posted by: Pluskat's Dog at November 15, 2013 08:49 AM (YN3Q4)
Posted by: Countrysquire at November 15, 2013 08:50 AM (LSJmV)
“I don’t know how he f—-ed this up so badly,” said one House Democrat who has been very supportive of Obama in the past.
Posted by: Ralph Malph at November 15, 2013 08:50 AM (e8kgV)
Posted by: Fritz at November 15, 2013 08:51 AM (UzPAd)
I think language is the problem here. The same diseases, mental health and other things are covered. But pay out differently. With insurance my only benefit is when they start paying. So the benefits to me are quite different between plans.
Posted by: Buzzsaw at November 15, 2013 08:51 AM (tf9Ne)
Posted by: Trav at November 15, 2013 08:51 AM (m8PQQ)
Posted by: Jewel's Fucked Up Grill at November 15, 2013 08:51 AM (/Crba)
http://tinyurl.com/npsqetj
Ummmm. NO. Nyet. Nein. Nunca.
Posted by: Sean Bannion[/s][/i][/u][/b] at November 15, 2013 08:51 AM (JpC1K)
Posted by: Barky O'Genius at November 15, 2013 08:51 AM (8ZskC)
Posted by: Nip Sip at November 15, 2013 08:52 AM (0FSuD)
Posted by: artisanal 'ette at November 15, 2013 08:53 AM (IXrOn)
“I don’t know how he f—-ed this up so badly,” said one House Democrat who has been very supportive of Obama in the past.
Posted by: Ralph Malph at November 15, 2013 12:50 PM (e8kgV)
LIVs: You have no idea how stupid and gullible we are
Posted by: TheQuietMan at November 15, 2013 08:53 AM (1Jaio)
0_o
Posted by: WisRich
And then ... back to the attic.
Posted by: mrp at November 15, 2013 08:54 AM (HjPtV)
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at November 15, 2013 08:55 AM (oFCZn)
Posted by: Hoss at November 15, 2013 08:55 AM (Fw/gZ)
"Success for President Obama is success for everyone in America"
Ah. This is obviously some strange usage of the word "success" that I hadn't previously been aware of.
Posted by: Arthur Dent at November 15, 2013 08:57 AM (+H/11)
Posted by: OMoobaCare at November 15, 2013 08:57 AM (MhA4j)
Posted by: Raul Johnson at November 15, 2013 08:57 AM (5rdqb)
Posted by: 1940s Republicans re: Social Security at November 15, 2013 08:58 AM (j0wOO)
Posted by: phoenixgirl at work at November 15, 2013 08:58 AM (8v/hq)
Posted by: Romeo13 at November 15, 2013 08:59 AM (lZBBB)
Posted by: John Boehner and Mitch McConnell at November 15, 2013 08:59 AM (ugAvG)
Posted by: OMoobaCare at November 15, 2013 08:59 AM (MhA4j)
It will be hammered every night by democrats on the airwaves - the history will be changed from Obamacare failing to Obamacare working until the republicans broke it.
We laugh today - "Nobody would buy that garbage"... but in 2014 the LIV will have forgotten, and will accept this new history.
Repeal all or none ... the time to strike is now - make democrats own this and do not give them your hand to allow them to pull you into this fire. Put the democrats on record as supporting either all or none of this - don't let them pick and choose what to blame republicans for.
Posted by: Reality Man at November 15, 2013 09:00 AM (obXkJ)
Posted by: Romeo13 at November 15, 2013 09:03 AM (lZBBB)
Posted by: The Kraken wing of the GOP at November 15, 2013 09:07 AM (ugAvG)
Posted by: OCBill at November 15, 2013 09:15 AM (rFipM)
139
I disagree. The best solution is repeal now.
You would be surprised how quickly insurance companies (unlike the govt.) could get up and running to provide replacement plans to the people they cancelled. And, they could do so in time to be protected from much (if not all - of the financial fallout predicted).
Right now the most reasonable thing to do for everyone's sake is to repeal Obamacare.
So let's get on with demanding repeal - not pursuing this silly gamesmanship. I have zero confidence that our side will win these political machinations. And when we demand repeal, lets have some free market-based reforms ready to take its place.
Posted by: Brian at November 15, 2013 09:16 AM (Hd5n8)
Posted by: red speck at November 15, 2013 10:59 AM (9/Ug/)
Insurance executives have a fiduciary responsibility to their stockholders to preserve and earn the best possible return on their equity, NOT to save the Republican Party or America from the fruits of their own follies.
If you are out to punish the insurance industry, you're just as much a socialist as the Democrats. You just have different cronies.
Posted by: Adjoran at November 15, 2013 11:18 AM (473jB)
Upton, by a mile. She's hot. I don't even want to think of Landrieu in body paint.
Posted by: red speck at November 15, 2013 02:59 PM (9/Ug/)
Maxine Waters in a thong. All oiled up.
Have a great day!
Posted by: tangonine at November 15, 2013 11:36 AM (x3YFz)
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Posted by: Mallfly at November 15, 2013 07:50 AM (bJm7W)