Ace of Spades HQ

November 06, 2013

Why Next Week's Obamacare Enrollment Numbers May Not Be Very Useful
— Ace

This assumes we will in fact get those numbers next week, which I personally doubt. This Administration is All In on Just Lying About Everything and Concealing Anything That's Left.

But if we do get some numbers....

The administrationÂ’s goal is to enroll about 7 million people in the first year, and about 40 percent of those enrollees need to be young, healthy consumers. Bringing young people into the system is critical to keeping premiums low and avoiding an insurance Â“death spiral.Â”
Hitting that mix across 7 million Americans isnÂ’t good enough, though. Each state has to get the right ratio in its own insurance market.
Â“All of this is very state-specific on how it plays out,Â” said Edwin Park, vice president for health policy at the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities.

Interesting point (sent along by Monty): It's not just about having a total number of young and healthy enrollees to balance out the aged and sick; but each state must have its own proper balance, because each pool of risk is limited to that state.

So having, say, lots of young healthy enrollees in... I have no idea which state will have lots of young healthy enrollees clamoring to pay too much for insurance they don't need, but if Madeupiana has an excess of such enrollees, that doesn't help Missouri.

Now, Hot Air has this story that half of all of Illinois' enrollees signed for Medicaid may not even be eligible for Medicaid, which means they should have been put into the exchanges, but right now are being kept out of them. Correction: Article refers to prior enrollees; see below.

That kind of Obungle incompetence could have a bad effect on the already doomed system. Suppose young and healthy people, crucial to the exchanges, are being erroneously signed up for Medicaid -- thus Obungle is further reducing the number of young, healthy insurance buyers he so desperately needs.

Thanks to Monty, again, who is @AOSHQDOOM on Twitter, and apparently is signed up for Google's Bad Vibes News Alerts.

Update: I completely forgot about this exact thing, being wrongly signed up for Medicaid, happening to our own Niedermeyer's Dead Horse.

Correction: Theresa in Fort Worth did something I didn't -- she read that Medicaid article I linked.

Actually, I read that article a couple of days ago - they aren't referring to ANY new Medicaid enrollees; they are referring to years and years of fraud and waste.
In other words, people who have been on the Medicaid rolls for years who shouldn't be.
The Obamacare enrollees haven't even made it to the trough yet.

Apologies.

Posted by: Ace at 11:04 AM | Comments (345)
Post contains 459 words, total size 3 kb.

1 People being erroneously signed up for Medicaid? Wasn't that an HQ scoop via NDH? Woot! Newsmakers baby!

Posted by: tsrblke PhD(c) (No Really!) at November 06, 2013 11:06 AM (GaqMa)

2 we've been my zeld. and my zeld bad...

Posted by: tully sempronicus at November 06, 2013 11:06 AM (lB/5N)

3 tsrblke, I completely forgot about that.

Posted by: ace at November 06, 2013 11:07 AM (/FnUH)

It looks like labor unions might be getting tax relief from Obamacare, according to a report from Kaiser Health.

Â“Weeks after denying laborÂ’s request to give union members access to health-law subsidies, the Obama administration is signaling it intends to exempt some union plans from one of the lawÂ’s substantial taxes,Â” reads the report.

at Weasel Zippers

Posted by: mama winger, socon warrior nanny at November 06, 2013 11:07 AM (P6QsQ)

5 Myzel-tov!

Posted by: weft cut-Just Win! [/i] [/b] at November 06, 2013 11:07 AM (xz0nG)

6 Ace,

Per yesterday's HHS presser, it was suggested that the numbers would be, how to say, 'highly aggregated' (i.e., Medicare signups lumped with exchange enrollees). If this is the case, the numbers will be as valuable as the "like it, keep it" promise.

Posted by: Kevin in ABQ at November 06, 2013 11:07 AM (XrGnJ)

7 If this is the case, the numbers will be as valuable as the "like it, keep it" promise. It depends on the meaning of promise /promise

Posted by: hello, it's me also a creep-assed cracka.. at November 06, 2013 11:09 AM (9+ccr)

Sebelius had all kinds of canned numbers at the ready in today's Senate hearing - when they supported her points.

Posted by: Count de Monet at November 06, 2013 11:09 AM (BAS5M)

9 Kevin in ABQ,

of course. Why didn't I realize that. of course the numbers will be presented in a form entirely useless for analysis.

Posted by: ace at November 06, 2013 11:09 AM (/FnUH)

10 NDH: Sometimes you break the news; sometimes you are the news.

Posted by: rickl at November 06, 2013 11:10 AM (zoehZ)

11 Now, Hot Air has this story that half of all of Illinois' enrollees signed for Medicaid may not even be eligible for Medicaid, which means they should have been put into the exchanges, but right now are being kept out of them. ==== Are they really enrollees or are they NDH-ees?

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at November 06, 2013 11:10 AM (bCEmE)

12 Per yesterday's HHS presser, it was suggested that the numbers would be, how to say, 'highly aggregated' (i.e., Medicare signups lumped with exchange enrollees).

In translation from the original Obamaese: highly aggregated = total bullshit.

Posted by: Sean Bannion[/s][/i][/u][/b] at November 06, 2013 11:10 AM (JpC1K)

13 Destroying private insurance necessitating a 'bailout' (takeover) is a feature.

Posted by: Beagle at November 06, 2013 11:10 AM (sOtz/)

http://tinyurl.com/mjlqle9

Must read by Karl Denninger on Obamacare. Death panels indeed.

Posted by: The Dead Taint of Helen Thomas at November 06, 2013 11:10 AM (rXcBX)

15 This goes along with my comment on the thread yesterday about the doubling down on the lying and saying that the "sliver" of folks losing their insurance basically don't matter. The admin, tactically speaking, is making a really dumb mistake. I know they're imbeciles and all and they can't stand being called out for their BS, but honestly they really, really, really NEEEEEEEEED these folks they're shitting on right now to sign up for ODeathcare. And pissing them off by lying to them, then lying about lying to them, then telling them they don't matter is not going to win them too many friends.

Posted by: Mandy P., lurking lurker who lurks at November 06, 2013 11:11 AM (qFpRI)

16 not to be Joe Conspiracy Theory but has this gang of gangsters tweaked the software to start signing people up for Medicaid to pad their numbers?

Posted by: ace at November 06, 2013 11:11 AM (/FnUH)

17 In Peruvia, Madeupiana is the ying to their yang.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at November 06, 2013 11:11 AM (eHIJJ)

18 6 Ace,

Per yesterday's HHS presser, it was suggested that the numbers would be, how to say, 'highly aggregated' (i.e., Medicare signups lumped with exchange enrollees). If this is the case, the numbers will be as valuable as the "like it, keep it" promise.

Posted by: Kevin in ABQ at November 06, 2013 03:07 PM (XrGnJ)

I was highly aggregated once but a really powerful laxative took care of that.

Posted by: joncelli at November 06, 2013 11:12 AM (RD7QR)

19 Posted by: ace at November 06, 2013 03:07 PM (/FnUH) I didn't. That storify you linked got 11k hits. That's like 1000 times more popular than anything I've done before. And it kept popping up in the weirdest places (long story, can't tell it right now, maybe someday.) Although I'd caution, it appears this Medicaid problem in IL predates the exchanges.

Posted by: tsrblke PhD(c) (No Really!) at November 06, 2013 11:12 AM (GaqMa)

20

We have nothing to fear with Barack Obama in the White House

Posted by: John McCain at November 06, 2013 11:12 AM (Pr6hk)

21 And how many NDH-ees don't even know they're NDH-ees? She only found out because she signed right back in. How many people signed in once and never went back?

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at November 06, 2013 11:12 AM (bCEmE)

22 nobody in madeupiana has signed up yet. we dont have a site

Posted by: Bigby's Thumb at November 06, 2013 11:12 AM (a3Nqc)

23 And Reuters says "interest" in obamacare is growing despite the "glitches." We allllll just love it now...

Posted by: hello, it's me also a creep-assed cracka.. at November 06, 2013 11:13 AM (9+ccr)

24 No way in hell they'll have the numbers they want.

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:13 AM (GQ8sn)

25 Next Week's Obamacare Enrollment Numbers May Not Be Very Useful When have any of this regimes numbers been useful? Just asking is all

Posted by: Misanthropic humanitarian, now with 50% more sensitivity at November 06, 2013 11:13 AM (HVff2)

26 Barky is having a hard time getting that toothpaste back in the tube.

Posted by: seamrog at November 06, 2013 11:14 AM (9oQs0)

27 Look! An analysis of government-provided Socialized Medicine numbers!
Related: No, really, you can alienate your inalienable rights. Really.

Posted by: Cretin, high grade moron isotopes in thousands of centrifuges at November 06, 2013 11:14 AM (1/4XQ)

28 Madeupiana is one of the 57 states?

Posted by: Count de Monet at November 06, 2013 11:14 AM (BAS5M)

29 Just wait until they get to the billing and payment part of this plan. How long will doctor's have to wait until they get paid for their services?

Posted by: dk70 at November 06, 2013 11:14 AM (JqW1y)

30 We would never lump together other data to make things look better!

Posted by: Unemploy....I mean...disability at November 06, 2013 11:15 AM (5OEha)

Actually, I read that article a couple of days ago - they aren't referring to ANY new Medicaid enrollees; they are referring to years and years of fraud and waste.

In other words, people who have been on the Medicaid rolls for years who shouldn't be.

The Obamacare enrollees haven't even made it to the trough yet.

Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX (@Teresa_Koch) at November 06, 2013 11:15 AM (PZ6/M)

32 I have seen reports that some Sates only have 1 or 2 people signing up.

Posted by: Vic at November 06, 2013 11:15 AM (zZbNF)

33 >>>This assumes we will in fact get those numbers next week, which I personally doubt.<<<

Damn that Ted Cruz!

Posted by: MFM at November 06, 2013 11:15 AM (VNuZf)

34
I saw Madeupiana open for REO Speedwagon in 1981.

Posted by: fixerupper at November 06, 2013 11:15 AM (nELVU)

35 And young people are avoiding it like the plague.

Posted by: Vic at November 06, 2013 11:15 AM (zZbNF)

36 I'm a young, healthy consumer. They will have to pry my hard-earned $$ from my cold dead hands to fund this racket. I have been enjoying the shrieks and tears of various acquaintances (who voted for and supported the SCOAMF and his schemes) at the insurance notices listing the doubling and tripling of their premiums for less coverage. Eat it all up, assholes! You voted for it.

Posted by: Chalky at November 06, 2013 11:15 AM (ds4sN)

37 Whatever numbers are released, they'll be wrong. Intentionally wrong. By orders of magnitude.

There's not a fact or statistic coming out of D.C. that is honest or reliable. Well, other than that 95.428% of beltway actors have perpetually renewing contracts with Satan.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at November 06, 2013 11:16 AM (eHIJJ)

38 Just wait until they get to the billing and payment part of this plan. How long will doctor's have to wait until they get paid for their services? That part should be handled by the insurance companies. So unless the gov't put hurdles in place, shouldn't it be relatively unchanged?

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at November 06, 2013 11:16 AM (sByIH)

39 I still am unclear on whether lower-income people who qualify will be forcibly enrolled in Medicaid. Medicaid sucks. Pretty much none of the good doctors take Medicaid. If you are seeing somebody via Medicaid then you are lucky if you see someone of average competence. Mostly you get the bottom 20-30% of doctors/nurses/etc. In 2014, can a lower-income person scrimp and save on their car/apartment/food budget/etc so they can afford regular insurance and see good doctors? Or are they forced into Medicaid just cause their income is below the cut-off line? Can you buy supplemental Medicaid insurance?

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at November 06, 2013 11:16 AM (ZPrif)

40 I read about the Medicaid situation in IL this am, and what I got from the article (I forget which place had it) is that they are going back and examining their current Medicaid recipients. They found, so far, about 50% of around 700k shouldn't be getting Medicaid at all, though they think the final number will be about 25% when the examine the entire enrollment of 2.5MM(?).

This has nothing to do with 404Care, but is an examination of the Medicaid system in IL. Surprise surprise, it's loaded with fraud.

Posted by: GnuBreed at November 06, 2013 11:16 AM (wNF3N)

41 Now my libtard contacts on FB are talking about the "Kind" of lies that Teh JEF is telling and whether they are truly damaging or not. I shit you not. My only response was if they are stupid enough to put their full confidence in a party and system that parses their words, have at it. I will not submit. I no longer trust any institution.... least of all the Feral Gubmint.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 11:16 AM (32Ze2)

42 Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX (@Teresa_Koch) at November 06, 2013 03:15 PM (PZ6/M) Yeah, my bad. I read the Hot air article but didn't click through to realize that it was previous fraud and waste. Although I'd argue these things are related, just not directly causal.

Posted by: tsrblke PhD(c) (No Really!) at November 06, 2013 11:17 AM (GaqMa)

43 Huh. I have an account (made it that far in the OCare debacle), maybe I should check to see what it signed me up for....

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 06, 2013 11:17 AM (da5Wo)

44 So unions will be exempted as Obama cronies getting their payoff.

Posted by: Vic at November 06, 2013 11:17 AM (zZbNF)

45 fuck it I am moving to peruvia and the hell with you all

Posted by: chelsea danger at November 06, 2013 11:17 AM (KfDDN)

46 I have been enjoying the shrieks and tears of various acquaintances (who voted for and supported the SCOAMF and his schemes) at the insurance notices listing the doubling and tripling of their premiums for less coverage. Be sure to remind them their previous plans were bare-bones or scams.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at November 06, 2013 11:18 AM (sByIH)

of course. Why didn't I realize that. of course the numbers will be presented in a form entirely useless for analysis.

And the unit of measure will probably be barleycorns.

Or hogsheads. Or cubits.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at November 06, 2013 11:18 AM (0HooB)

48 by the way, anyone have a pickup truck and know the way to peruvia?

Posted by: chelsea danger at November 06, 2013 11:18 AM (KfDDN)

49 16 not to be Joe Conspiracy Theory but has this gang of gangsters tweaked the software to start signing people up for Medicaid to pad their numbers?

Sebelius admitted today that there may be felons among the navigators. What could go wrong?

Posted by: Jane D'oh at November 06, 2013 11:18 AM (lVPtV)

50 All these Obama cronies being exempted could be grounds for calling the law unconstitutional because of the 14th amendment and equal justice.

Posted by: Vic at November 06, 2013 11:18 AM (zZbNF)

51 Huh. I have an account (made it that far in the OCare debacle), maybe I should check to see what it signed me up for....

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 06, 2013 03:17 PM (da5Wo)

You're signed up for.....

...a colonscopy!!!

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:18 AM (GQ8sn)

52 Barky is having a hard time getting that toothpaste back in the tube.

Posted by: seamrog

That ain't toothpaste.

Posted by: weft cut-Just Win! [/i] [/b] at November 06, 2013 11:18 AM (xz0nG)

53 ♫ The price of meat has just gone up and Barack's website is still goin' down ♫

Posted by: Frank Zappa [/i] at November 06, 2013 11:18 AM (U2UQk)

54 this reminds me of something that happened in the USSR not too long before the end: some hard line commies called a press conference. Obviously drunk (or definitely not not sober), they announced that they were taking control of the government because Gorbachev was suffering from exhaustion (or something like that.) Anyway, the look on their faces when the reporters at the press conference laughed was almost priceless.

I think we are beginning to reach that point now. Unless they can get the internet and the rest of the media (and FOX news) under complete control, no one will believe that the chocolate ration was raised and the battle for production was being won.

Posted by: Mallfly at November 06, 2013 11:18 AM (bJm7W)

55 47 or rods

Posted by: Misanthropic humanitarian, now with 50% more sensitivity at November 06, 2013 11:19 AM (HVff2)

56 As other noted ace, the Illinois fraud isn't a result of ACA, it's been ongoing. So much better.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 11:19 AM (IV4od)

57
If only there was some type of market with out govt interference where people could contract individually for insurance and/or medical care that suits their specific needs.

Nahh...nevermind, too complex.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at November 06, 2013 11:19 AM (nKUHR)

@4 -
Â“Weeks after denying laborÂ’s request to give union members access to
health-law subsidies, the Obama administration is signaling it intends
to exempt some union plans from one of the lawÂ’s substantial taxes,Â”
reads the report.

--------------------

Laws are for the little people, right, Barry?

At least they are admitting now that it is a tax, and not a "penalty".

And nothing like pissing off the peasants even more than you already have by giving some preferential treatment over others, just because you like them more.

Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX (@Teresa_Koch) at November 06, 2013 11:19 AM (PZ6/M)

59 The numbers probably wont show the net between people who lost policies and people getting insurance for the first time.

Posted by: Wodun at November 06, 2013 11:20 AM (fbqZE)

60 I have been enjoying the shrieks and tears of various acquaintances (who voted for and supported the SCOAMF and his schemes) at the insurance notices listing the doubling and tripling of their premiums for less coverage. Eat it all up, assholes! You voted for it.

***
THIS to the nth power.

Just because you're a guy and will never need pregnancy coverage doesn't mean you aren't going to get fucked.

Posted by: B at November 06, 2013 11:20 AM (5OEha)

61 47 acre-feet

Posted by: Count de Monet at November 06, 2013 11:20 AM (BAS5M)

62 Medicaid sucks. Pretty much none of the good doctors take Medicaid. If you are seeing somebody via Medicaid then you are lucky if you see someone of average competence. Mostly you get the bottom 20-30% of doctors/nurses/etc. Lots of good doctors have some fixed number of Medicaid patients. They're just not accepting any new ones. So the new people on Medicaid are SOL.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at November 06, 2013 11:20 AM (sByIH)

63 Great googley moogely

Posted by: Misanthropic humanitarian, now with 50% more sensitivity at November 06, 2013 11:20 AM (HVff2)

64 So having, say, lots of young healthy enrollees in... I have no idea which state will have lots of young healthy enrollees clamoring to pay too much for insurance they don't need, Peruvia.

Posted by: AmishDude at November 06, 2013 11:21 AM (T0NGe)

65 The numbers will be as accurate as their unemployment numbers and their inflation numbers and their Snap numbers and their.....................

Posted by: seamrog at November 06, 2013 11:21 AM (9oQs0)

66 We're screwed.

Posted by: Florida at November 06, 2013 11:21 AM (OZmbA)

67 All these Obama cronies being exempted could be grounds for calling the law unconstitutional because of the 14th amendment and equal justice.

Posted by: Vic at November 06, 2013 03:18 PM (zZbNF)

____________________

Vic I think you are talking about the Good and Plenty Clause.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 11:21 AM (32Ze2)

68 73.3% of NYC voted for the Sandinista...

heckuva job Big Apple...heckuva job...

here's to you guys getting what you voted for.

Posted by: sven10077 at November 06, 2013 11:21 AM (9jfyN)

69 We have always been at war with Madeupiana.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at November 06, 2013 11:21 AM (0HooB)

70 Â“All of this is very state-specific on how it plays out,Â” said Edwin Park, vice president for health policy at the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities. So would this mean California is one of the places to watch? Thirty-three percent of the entire nation's welfare recipients is no trifling figure, ya know.

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at November 06, 2013 11:21 AM (vd7A8)

71 49 >> Sebelius admitted today that there may be felons among the navigators. What could go wrong?

She HAD to admit it, since some have already been identified Jane. Yeah, there 'may' be some.

I 'may' have taken a leak since midnight.

Posted by: GnuBreed at November 06, 2013 11:21 AM (wNF3N)

72 All these Obama cronies being exempted could be grounds for calling the law unconstitutional because of the 14th amendment and equal justice.

No one has standing.

Posted by: SCOTUS at November 06, 2013 11:22 AM (nKUHR)

73 You're signed up for..... ...a colonscopy!!! Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 03:18 PM (GQ8sn) Of course I drank that stuff you gave me...... .....about 20 minutes ago. ENJOY!!!!!!

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at November 06, 2013 11:22 AM (da5Wo)

74 I am moving to peruvia and the hell with you all Per Davie Crockett, the awesome form of this quote is: You can go to hell, I'm going to Peruvia.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at November 06, 2013 11:22 AM (sByIH)

75 64 AmishDude at November 06, 2013 03:21 PM (T0NGe)

I think it's Peruvia's neighbor the State of Bliss with its capital Delusionville...Ole`

Posted by: sven10077 at November 06, 2013 11:22 AM (9jfyN)

Lies.

Damned Lies.

Statistics.

404Care enrollee figures.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at November 06, 2013 11:22 AM (0HooB)

77 http://preview.tinyurl.com/3y29mz As a palate-cleanser before the kids come home from school, or get their work done in the home school, more or less based on Lk 1,46-55, The Canticle of Mary. Arvo PÃ¤rt, composer.

Posted by: Cretin, high grade moron isotopes in thousands of centrifuges at November 06, 2013 11:23 AM (1/4XQ)

78 Let's say a middle class family with good middle class insurance hits hard times in 2015. Dad loses his job. Medical problems. For whatever reason, unable to work and the family's income goes below the Medicaid qualifying level. Are they forced into Medicaid? Can the family use their savings to keep buying good middle class insurance and avoid crappy doctors in Medicaid? Do they have to prove their income once a year or be forced onto Medicaid?

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at November 06, 2013 11:23 AM (ZPrif)

79 Madeupiana sound like a wonderful place, like a fantasy island of sorts. Can we go!

Posted by: dananjcon at November 06, 2013 11:23 AM (wmU4G)

80 Is anyone familiar with Ft. Jefferson on Dry Tortugas key?

Obamacare IS Ft. Jefferson. The parallels in construction, manner of its failures, and ultimate disposition are uncanney

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/u][/s] at November 06, 2013 11:23 AM (W9e8l)

81 @47

Unexpectedly... only .00028 hectares worth of people without insurance have enrolled in Obamacare.

Posted by: MFM at November 06, 2013 11:23 AM (VNuZf)

82 I suspect the auto-Medicaid signup may be baked in the (untested) code. Somebody made that the default setting for the selected insurance, triggered by the "next page" link, so ANYONE going to just take a look would get signed up, just like NDH. The huge discrepancies in signup percentages point that way.

And to someone speculating we haven't seen any actual sabotage yet -- well, sins of omission can count as sabotage. As in, "I'm not going to report that JUICY bug, let them choke on it."

Posted by: bad cat robot at November 06, 2013 11:23 AM (65lpa)

83 @78 In Ogabedeath, some diagnoses will be mandatory.

Posted by: Cretin, high grade moron isotopes in thousands of centrifuges at November 06, 2013 11:24 AM (1/4XQ)

84 I'm seriously still trying to figure out how Preezy Choom and his merry band of Marxists honestly think average working Americans (young thru middle aged) can possibly, realistically shell out another $200-$500+ more a month from their budgets. Forevermore. I'd wager the vast majority can't pay for these increases. It's just not going to happen. Am I wrong here?

Posted by: Lady in Black, on iPhone & not responsible for typos at November 06, 2013 11:24 AM (687Pr)

85 Equal protection You gonna "tax" citizens differently based o whether they are in a union or who their employer is

Posted by: thunderb at November 06, 2013 11:25 AM (E2Opi)

86 73.3% of NYC voted for the Sandinista...

heckuva job Big Apple...heckuva job...

here's to you guys getting what you voted for.

Posted by: sven10077 at November 06, 2013 03:21 PM (9jfyN)

My guess is that Office Rents around Palm Beach just shot up 50% - Hedge Funds will be upping the rate of emmigration

Posted by: Saul Alinsky at November 06, 2013 11:25 AM (Pr6hk)

87 I hopped a bus for Peruvia and ended up in Madeupiana

Posted by: Sphynx at November 06, 2013 11:26 AM (OZmbA)

88 Will they report bonafide enrollees - those who have submitted payment for their 404Care? If not, then they are just jackin' it.

Posted by: Count de Monet at November 06, 2013 11:26 AM (BAS5M)

89
"If.... by enrollees you mean anybody that ever heard of the Affordable Care Act, we estimate the number of enrollees at about 320 million."

Posted by: Jay Carney at November 06, 2013 11:26 AM (nELVU)

90 87 sucks to be you, ouch

Posted by: Misanthropic humanitarian, now with 50% more sensitivity at November 06, 2013 11:27 AM (HVff2)

91 I was going to see Nickelfucker at the LimaBowl

Posted by: Sphynx at November 06, 2013 11:27 AM (OZmbA)

92 @83, E.g., my chronic wannaownagunosis. Right now I can control it by shooting the guns I have. Not a bad shot. I have a barn with a wide side I can usually hit if I get close enough.

Posted by: Cretin, high grade moron isotopes in thousands of centrifuges at November 06, 2013 11:27 AM (1/4XQ)

93 not to be Joe Conspiracy Theory but has this gang of gangsters tweaked the software to start signing people up for Medicaid to pad their numbers?

Never attribute to malice what could simple be a missing if-then test.

Posted by: DaveA at November 06, 2013 11:27 AM (DL2i+)

I'm seriously still trying to figure out how Preezy Choom and his merry band of Marxists honestly think average working Americans (young thru middle aged) can possibly, realistically shell out another $200-$500+ more a month from their budgets. Forevermore. I'd wager the vast majority can't pay for these increases. It's just not going to happen. Am I wrong here?

I don't think so. The plan is designed to fail, and appears to be imploding as planned.

Which will pave the way for the Socialized medicine that the rest of the world once escaped by coming here. We are so terribly screwed...

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at November 06, 2013 11:27 AM (0HooB)

95 Read the Denninger piece. I want more info on EMOs. Again it would seem we are now seeing a type of policy that was never legally allowed to be sold in any state of the union now being offered through the Fed Collaborators. Does anyone know if this type of Health Insurance was ever legal? Basic info, you are only covered in network - no out of network coverage - zero.

Posted by: Chaos the other dark meat at November 06, 2013 11:27 AM (oDCMR)

96 How can you tax people differently based on union membership or who their employer is?

Posted by: thunderb at November 06, 2013 11:28 AM (E2Opi)

97 @42 - I'd argue these things are related, just not directly causal.

Posted by: tsrblke PhD(c) (No Really!) at November 06, 2013 03:17 PM (GaqMa)

-------------------

Oh, I definitely agree - and with the announcement that all of these new enrollees on Medicaid throughout the land means that now more people are eligible for Food Stamps is just the cherry on this turd sundae.

What scares me, though, is that our daughter (she has Down syndrome) currently qualifies for some benefits through our state's Medicaid system independent of our income. We use our private insurance for her doctors' visits, but Medicaid pays for a part-time attendant and a couple of therapies which we would not be able to otherwise afford.

Given how much we pay into the Federal tax system each year, we figure we are breaking even.

I'm afraid that she will get tossed off of the system in lieu of some lowlife deadbeat (her case workers have told us horror stories of who is allowed to stay on the system), because "Fair". And "You make too much".

Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX (@Teresa_Koch) at November 06, 2013 11:28 AM (PZ6/M)

98 48 by the way, anyone have a pickup truck and know the way to peruvia? Posted by: chelsea danger at November 06, 2013 03:18 PM (KfDDN) No, but I know the way to San Jose.

Posted by: Dee-Dee at November 06, 2013 11:28 AM (DrC22)

99 Don't forget this $5000/month ocare policy. IH Classic 3500 PD: MO Innovation Health Insurance Co. Premium: $5,075.37

Posted by: Lauren at November 06, 2013 11:28 AM (hFL/3)

100 96 How can you tax people differently based on union membership or who their employer is? Posted by: thunderb at November 06, 2013 03:28 PM (E2Opi) Give me a minute....I'll come up with somethin'.

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] John Roberts at November 06, 2013 11:28 AM (bCEmE)

101 When have any of this regimes numbers been useful? Just asking is all

Ohio bus tickets ftw.

Posted by: DaveA at November 06, 2013 11:28 AM (DL2i+)

102 "I'd wager the vast majority can't pay for these increases. It's just not going to happen. Am I wrong here?"

They'll be gaming the system. Pay cash for the small stuff, enroll long enough for some procedures mixed with paying an adjusted fine. That will be the only a vast majority can afford it.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 11:29 AM (IV4od)

103 Blockbuster to close all remaining stores by Jan. 2004: 9000 stores. 2014: 0 Change happens, bitchez!

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at November 06, 2013 11:29 AM (ZPrif)

104 I worry for my oldest stepson who will be forced off our family plan next spring when he turns 26. He is struggling and a premium of several hundred dollars a month will break him, as will the penalty.

It means he'll move back in!!!

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:29 AM (GQ8sn)

105 I finally had to throw Kate Upton out of my bed this afternoon. That woman just won't quit bothering me. Moar, moar, moar. #LieLikeObama

Posted by: GnuBreed at November 06, 2013 11:29 AM (wNF3N)

106

You gonna "tax" citizens differently based o whether they are in a union or who their employer is

No, silly. It's based on who you voted for.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at November 06, 2013 11:29 AM (0HooB)

107 Which will pave the way for the Socialized medicine that the rest of the world once escaped by coming here. What's unsettling about this is that if such a scenario comes to pass, the Republican Party will have to mount the fight of its life. Judging from the recent past, it would not be unreasonable to think that they're not up to the task.

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at November 06, 2013 11:29 AM (vd7A8)

108 >>Blockbuster to close all remaining stores by Jan.
2004: 9000 stores.

I'm little but I'm potent

Posted by: Redbox at November 06, 2013 11:30 AM (OZmbA)

109 72 All these Obama cronies being exempted could be grounds for calling the law unconstitutional because of the 14th amendment and equal justice. No one has standing. Posted by: SCOTUS at November 06, 2013 03:22 PM (nKUHR) Want to have your mind blown? The entire judiciary violates the 14th amendment. Or are all those lawyers-turned-judges just a coincidence? Put me on the bench, coach, I'm ready.

Posted by: AmishDude at November 06, 2013 11:30 AM (T0NGe)

110 Which will pave the way for the Socialized medicine that the rest of the world once escaped by coming here. We are so terribly screwed...

***

No worries about that.

Sure, socialized medicine sucks like a black hole but we've got something better than what they started with.

17 trillion dollars of debt....

Posted by: B at November 06, 2013 11:30 AM (5OEha)

111
http://www.loopnet.com/West-Palm-Beach_Florida_Market-Trends

Office space HAS become scarcer in the WPB area recently

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/u][/s] at November 06, 2013 11:30 AM (W9e8l)

112

>>The administrationÂ’s goal is to enroll about 7 million people in the first year, and about 40 percent of those enrollees need to be young, healthy consumers. Bringing young people into the system is critical to keeping premiums low and avoiding an insurance Â“death spiral.Â”

.I think everyone is missing the 8,000 pound Gorilla in the room here. They need 16 Million young healthy people who have not previously been insured to enter the gene pool to make this work. This is in addition to people who are already insured.

Posted by: Registered Voter at November 06, 2013 11:30 AM (MZGhy)

113 103 Blockbuster to close all remaining stores by Jan. 2004: 9000 stores. 2014: 0 Change happens, bitchez! Posted by: Flatbush Joe at November 06, 2013 03:29 PM (ZPrif) Only in the private sector. Just imagine if the Feds ran Blockbuster.

Posted by: AmishDude at November 06, 2013 11:30 AM (T0NGe)

114

If you wrote this debacle as a story line, a few years ago you would been laughed at.

See what hope and change has done for us ?

Posted by: seamrog at November 06, 2013 11:31 AM (9oQs0)

115 Just imagine if the Feds ran Blockbuster.

Your late fees are $1,000,000.00

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:31 AM (GQ8sn)

116 103 Blockbuster to close all remaining stores by Jan.
2004: 9000 stores.
2014: 0

Change happens, bitchez!

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at November 06, 2013 03:29 PM (ZPrif)

They closed our store here last year. We no longer have a store that rents Blu-Rays, only those shitty Red Boxes which have a limited choice.

Posted by: Vic at November 06, 2013 11:31 AM (zZbNF)

117 They closed our store here last year. We no longer have a store that rents Blu-Rays, only those shitty Red Boxes which have a limited choice.

Streaming FTW!

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:32 AM (GQ8sn)

118 106 You gonna "tax" citizens differently based o whether they are in a union or who their employer is

No, silly. It's based on who you ~~voted for~~ donated to.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at November 06, 2013 03:29 PM (0HooB)

FIFY

Pay for play bitches. Pay me now, or Pay the IRS later. Bend over and 'may I please have another'

Posted by: David Axlerod at November 06, 2013 11:32 AM (Pr6hk)

119 I'm little but I'm potent You're also everywhere.

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at November 06, 2013 11:32 AM (vd7A8)

120 So how many counties in America only have 1 insurance provider now thanks to Obamacare? Has Obama turned the insurance market into the cable TV market -- thousands of local monopolies. Really gonna bring that private sector action in when only one company sells the mandatory product.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at November 06, 2013 11:32 AM (ZPrif)

121 113 we stilling have Sony Betamax

Posted by: Misanthropic humanitarian, now with 50% more sensitivity at November 06, 2013 11:33 AM (HVff2)

122 He is struggling and a premium of several hundred dollars a month will break him, as will the penalty. The penalty, at $95 or 1% of adjusted gross income is not going to break him. Trying to pay those monthly premiums -- like a car payment, without the car -- will be what will break him. Perhaps he needs to be acquainted with my personal physician, Dr Web Md.

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat [/i] at November 06, 2013 11:33 AM (U2UQk)

123 Ahhhhhh, nevermind. The ACA is more of a SHELBYVILLE idea.....

Posted by: Lyle Lanley at November 06, 2013 11:33 AM (32Ze2)

124 I'm little but I'm potent Posted by: Redbox Bitch, please.

Posted by: The Internet at November 06, 2013 11:33 AM (naUcP)

125 Just imagine if the Feds ran Blockbuster.

Posted by: AmishDude at November 06, 2013 03:30 PM (T0NGe)

Check out Iowahawk's twitter feed.

Posted by: phreshone at November 06, 2013 11:34 AM (Pr6hk)

126 #84 I'm seriously still trying to figure out how Preezy Choom and his merry band of Marxists honestly think ... They don't "honestly" anything or "think" things through. They have a delusion and reality will just have to conform to it.

Posted by: Chalky at November 06, 2013 11:34 AM (ds4sN)

127 How can you tax people differently based on union membership or who their employer is?

Posted by: thunderb at November 06, 2013 03:28 PM (E2Opi)

Yooz got a problem wit dat?

Posted by: Union Thug at November 06, 2013 11:35 AM (+H/11)

128 I was listening to a talk radio guy out of Tampa last week, and a female caller said she was sitting near three doctors at lunch, and they were talking about "going underground" and treating patients on a cash basis. If someone came to them with a gunshot wound, they wouldn't even report it to the po-po.

Interesting.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at November 06, 2013 11:35 AM (lVPtV)

129 117 Streaming FTW!
Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 03:32 PM (GQ8sn)

The bandwidth on my cable doesn't support streaming w/o lockups. Really shitty. Besides, that I dropped by satelite coverge that was costing me $80/month. Figured I could buy some books with that $80 and now my insurance bill has eat that up and some more.

Every now and then I will order an older cheap movie from Amazon.

Posted by: Vic at November 06, 2013 11:35 AM (zZbNF)

130 Just because you're a guy and will never need pregnancy coverage doesn't mean you aren't going to get fucked. Posted by: B at November 06, 2013 03:20 PM (5OEha) I wonder how easy it would be for me, a single guy, to collect bennies by claiming I'm transgendered and for some reason, have a kid to take care of, so gimme free housing, food, and all the other loot coming to me. In this (mis)administration, it's probably the equivalent of winning the lotto, except you already knew what the winning numbers were.

Posted by: model_1066 at November 06, 2013 11:35 AM (DK7BF)

131 Folks who have to pay taxes typically wait until the last possible moment to file their taxes. Those expecting refunds file early.

Expect OCare signups to follow this long standing tradition. Those who get free or highly subsidized care plus the sick to sign up early. Expect everyone else to wait and wait and wait. It's not like there's going to be a 'sale day' and Ocare will get cheaper...

"Build it and they will come" only works to stuff that the masses actually want. The liberal wet dream of OCare run by Burros, politicians and the IRS isn't something that the masses want.

It's reasonable to expect there will be millions of the young and healthy willing to take the gamble that they can forgo OCare in favor of using the OCare premium savings to buy a new car or something they actually want... And most will do just fine with that gamble...

Jumping on the OCare premium parade doesn't accumulate into anything of everyday value other than being part of the sucker's parade while owning a new car gets you a new car...

Posted by: Seipherd at November 06, 2013 11:35 AM (AortR)

132 Have we reached the point where doctors are compelled to participate in Obamacare under threat of imprisonment?

Posted by: Fritz at November 06, 2013 11:36 AM (TKFmG)

133 It looks like Illinois has been doing this for quite some time now, which would be prior to the new website. BUT.... my guess is that the system is only going to worsen the situation. In my situation, and here's the update from last week ( http://bit.ly/16RYRB2 ) they have seemingly made a presumption that, despite my income, my disability MAY qualify me for some sort of assistance and thus "initially enrolled" me into the program. This despite not actually completing the full Medicaid application. And according to whom I speak with or what I read I am: 1. Initially enrolled 2. Not enrolled at all 3. Have an application in progress 4. Do not have an application in progress 5. Can expect a call from Medicaid 6. They have forwarded my application to Medicaid 7. I must forward my application to Medicaid. In other words, they, meaning the help-line and the website, don't know their asses from a hole in the ground. As to their claim that it is a "glitch", well, it's been more than a week and, if it's a "glitch" it still hasn't been fixed.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 11:36 AM (DmNpO)

134 Streaming FTW!

Come at me, bro.

Posted by: 250GB monthly caps at November 06, 2013 11:36 AM (SY2Kh)

135 Are these new numbers going to seperate medicaid enrolls from exchange enrolls? Because if you put them to together and fail to make any distinctions, the numbers might not look so bad to the retarded public and media. This is despite them being vastly different- one being a welfare program and the other needing balanced demographics and large enrollments.

Posted by: Skinny Nick at November 06, 2013 11:36 AM (eecHm)

136 "120 So how many counties in America only have 1 insurance provider now thanks to Obamacare?"

I'm in one, and according to their website I don't even get option for the shitty plan, just four of them. Expensive, Really Expensive, Really Really Expensive and Fucking Insanely Expensive.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 11:36 AM (IV4od)

137 Let's be clear. I...uh...kind of wish I, uh...hadn't insisted on calling it, uh...ObamaCare. Uh...in hindsight. Turns out, uh...the name kind of makes it...uh...hard to, uh...convince the LIVs that, uh...this is all the Republicans, uh...fault.

Posted by: President Barack Obama at November 06, 2013 11:36 AM (7ObY1)

138 Who are the retarts signing up for this crap? LMBO!!! Fuck that...

Posted by: Regular Guy at November 06, 2013 11:36 AM (N3Al8)

139 129 Vic, it's all Ted Cruz's fault, ya know

Posted by: Misanthropic humanitarian, now with 50% more sensitivity at November 06, 2013 11:36 AM (HVff2)

140 considering all the cancellations, they'll need more than 7 million to have a 7 million insured net gain. of course they'll just claim victory if they get there by cancellations.

Posted by: Norman and the middle class at November 06, 2013 11:36 AM (KHo8t)

141 We're going to have back-alley gerbil removals!

Posted by: Licolntf at November 06, 2013 11:36 AM (ZshNr)

142 As to their claim that it is a "glitch", well, it's been more than a week and, if it's a "glitch" it still hasn't been fixed.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 03:36 PM (DmNpO)

Have you called your congresscritter?

Posted by: Jane D'oh at November 06, 2013 11:37 AM (lVPtV)

Posted by: SchrÃ¶dinger's cat at November 06, 2013 03:33 PM (U2UQk)

His penalty will be about a couple of hundred a month. He's barely able to cover his rent and utilities as it is with his job. Either way, the penalty or premium will break him.

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:38 AM (GQ8sn)

144 You know what else was a "glitch?" The iceberg the Titanic hit.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at November 06, 2013 11:38 AM (lVPtV)

145 Obamacareless

Posted by: polynikes at November 06, 2013 11:38 AM (m2CN7)

146 And what are these EPO things?

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at November 06, 2013 11:38 AM (ZPrif)

147 Come at me, bro.

Posted by: 250GB monthly caps at November 06, 2013 03:36 PM (SY2Kh)

*laughs*

*hacks yet another neighbour's wifi signal*

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:38 AM (GQ8sn)

148

1. Initially enrolled
2. Not enrolled at all
3. Have an application in progress
4. Do not have an application in progress
5. Can expect a call from Medicaid
6. They have forwarded my application to Medicaid
7. I must forward my application to Medicaid.

That's 7 enrollees right there.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at November 06, 2013 11:38 AM (0HooB)

149 I'm little but I'm potent Posted by: Redbox at November 06, 2013 03:30 PM (OZmbA) Amen!

Posted by: Alec Baldwin's Manhood at November 06, 2013 11:38 AM (DrC22)

150

All your rethuglikkkan numbers are rayceest

Posted by: Math B Hard at November 06, 2013 11:39 AM (Pr6hk)

151 I'm in one, and according to their website I don't even get option for the shitty plan, just four of them. Expensive, Really Expensive, Really Really Expensive and Fucking Insanely Expensive.

----

Yeah.... but.... your current plan is a shitty one. You'll like the new one much better. You can thanks us later.

Posted by: Jay Carney at November 06, 2013 11:39 AM (nELVU)

152 Thanks to increased participation in Medicaid, millions of low income Americans will have affordable access to Oxycontin.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at November 06, 2013 11:39 AM (SY2Kh)

153 103 Blockbuster to close all remaining stores by Jan.
2004: 9000 stores.
2014: 0

Change happens, bitchez!
Posted by: Flatbush Joe at November 06, 2013 03:29 PM (ZPrif)

Only in the private sector.

Just imagine if the Feds ran Blockbuster.

Posted by: AmishDude at November 06, 2013 03:30 PM (T0NGe)

------------------------

There would still be one on every corner.... like McDonalds. It's not like the Feral Gubmint actually has to MAKE money. Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch by the way. They were absolutely mercenary in their business practices in their prime, and had shitty customer service. Good riddance.

Posted by: Lyle Lanley at November 06, 2013 11:39 AM (32Ze2)

154 John Roberts and his family are on Obamacare, right?

/s

Posted by: Jane D'oh at November 06, 2013 11:40 AM (lVPtV)

155 "His penalty will be about a couple of hundred a month."

He makes $240,000 a year?

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 11:40 AM (IV4od)

156 Malpractice? Talk to my attorney, his name is Eric Holder.

Posted by: Dr. Kermit Gosnell at November 06, 2013 11:40 AM (TKFmG)

157 From the desk of It'll Work This Time, Goddammit!:

Driving the crisis in health care are the same forces that have left Venezuelans scrambling to find toilet paper, milk and automobile parts. Economists blame government mismanagement and currency controls set by the late President Hugo Chavez for inflation pushing 50 percent annually. The government controls the dollars needed to buy medical supplies and has simply not made enough availableÂ….

Doctors not allied with the government say many patients began dying from easily treatable illnesses when VenezuelaÂ’s downward economic slide accelerated after ChavezÂ’s death from cancer in March. Doctors say itÂ’s impossible to know how many have died, and the government doesnÂ’t keep such numbers, just as it hasnÂ’t published health statistics since 2010.

Almost everything needed to mend and heal is in critically short supply: needles, syringes and paraffin used in biopsies to diagnose cancer; drugs to treat it; operating room equipment; X-ray film and imaging paper; blood and the reagents needed so it can be used for transfusions.

Last month, the government suspended organ donations and transplants. At least 70 percent of radiotherapy machines, precisely what (Evelina) Gonzalez will need once her tumor is removed, are now inoperable in a country with 19,000 cancer patients Â– meaning fewer than 5,000 can be treated, said Dr. Douglas Natera, president of the Venezuelan Medical Federation.

Posted by: B at November 06, 2013 11:40 AM (5OEha)

158 while owning a new car gets you a new car... And maybe gets you laid. Having a huge student loan, a McJob, and health insurance which eats up the last fucking penny of disposable income? * forms letter 'L' over forehead *

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat [/i] at November 06, 2013 11:40 AM (U2UQk)

159 I was listening to a talk radio guy out of Tampa last week, and a female caller said she was sitting near three doctors at lunch, and they were talking about "going underground" and treating patients on a cash basis. If someone came to them with a gunshot wound, they wouldn't even report it to the po-po.

Interesting.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at November 06, 2013 03:35 PM (lVPtV)

Concierge medicine. "Private" clinics analagous to speakeasies.

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:40 AM (GQ8sn)

160 129 >> The bandwidth on my cable doesn't support streaming w/o lockups. Really shitty.

Vic, you might check with your provider to see if they a have a faster bandwidth plan available. To upgrade your D/L rate usually isn't real expensive. Then get Netflix streaming for $10/month.

Posted by: GnuBreed at November 06, 2013 11:41 AM (wNF3N)

161 Have you called your congresscritter? *** I emailed Ander Crenshaw last week. I received an automatic notice thanking me for my letter. Nothing else. Jamie Dupree has been tweeting about the Medicaid enrollment numbers for various states so, last Friday, I forwarded the email to him along with the links to the story here at AOS and the link to the Storify update and screenshot of the Healthcare. go v website. I haven't heard anything from him.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 11:41 AM (DmNpO)

162 over at cafepress seriously thinking about making a shirt that says "you all can go to hell, I am going to peruvia"

I will piss myself giggling everytime I wear it if I make it

Posted by: chelsea danger at November 06, 2013 11:41 AM (KfDDN)

163 How will they be confirming that you have insurance in order to avoid the penalty? I know you provide them the insurance info but how will they be able to use this info to confirm coverage. Do they have a database that matches your policy number and ss # ?

Posted by: polynikes at November 06, 2013 11:42 AM (m2CN7)

164 "His penalty will be about a couple of hundred a month."

He makes $240,000 a year?

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 03:40 PM (IV4od)

Try again.

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:42 AM (GQ8sn)

165 No apologies needed. This is a government fuck-up, and those are often hard to follow.

Posted by: MTF at November 06, 2013 11:42 AM (B5y+v)

166

143 The penalty, at $95 or 1% of adjusted gross income
is not going to break him. Trying to pay those monthly premiums -- like a
car payment, without the car -- will be what will break him.

Perhaps he needs to be acquainted with my personal physician, Dr Web Md.

Posted by: SchrÃ¶dinger's cat at November 06, 2013 03:33 PM (U2UQk)
His penalty will be about a couple of hundred a month. He's barely able to cover his rent and utilities as it is with his job. Either way, the penalty or premium will break him.

-------

Tell him not to sweat it. Make sure he is claiming 3 exemptions on his with holding. They only collect what they owe you from your overpayments of Income Tax.

Posted by: Chaos the other dark meat at November 06, 2013 11:42 AM (oDCMR)

167 I emailed Ander Crenshaw last week. I received an automatic notice thanking me for my letter. Nothing else.

Jamie Dupree has been tweeting about the Medicaid enrollment numbers for various states so, last Friday, I forwarded the email to him along with the links to the story here at AOS and the link to the Storify update and screenshot of the Healthcare. go v website.

I haven't heard anything from him.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 03:41 PM (DmNpO)

Jeebus.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at November 06, 2013 11:43 AM (lVPtV)

168 How will they be confirming that you have insurance in order to avoid the penalty? I know you provide them the insurance info but how will they be able to use this info to confirm coverage. Do they have a databasethat matches your policy number and ss # ?

Posted by: polynikes at November 06, 2013 03:42 PM (m2CN7)

You have to ask?

Posted by: NSA at November 06, 2013 11:43 AM (+H/11)

169 * forms letter 'L' over forehead *

----

L for Liberal Arts

Posted by: fixerupper at November 06, 2013 11:43 AM (nELVU)

170 Over 20 years ago Blockbuster tried to enlist IBM in a partnership to implement a "burn to order" kind of kiosk in each store.

At the time the bandwidth, burn speeds and storage capacity simply didn't exist to implement on a widespread scale for video.

I got dragged into that one for an opinion and said we don't have the tech yet for it to work in a manner customers would tolerate.

Blockbuster knew shit was changing. When Huizenga cut it loose and foisted it off on some sucker buyers, that was signal it was doomed. He's a scumbag, but he knows when to cut/run on a dead horse.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/u][/s] at November 06, 2013 11:43 AM (W9e8l)

171 NDH:
Sometimes you break the news; sometimes you are the news.

Posted by: rickl at November 06, 2013 03:10 PM (zoehZ)

With Ocare the news breaks you

Posted by: The Jackhole at November 06, 2013 11:43 AM (nTgAI)

172

I'm not sure how this ties in, and I don't know how accurate it is, but I heard recently that the VA is going to end its means testing for indigent Veterans.

Which means no matter how poor you are, you are subject to copays for care and medicine. Now, that may not sound like a big deal to you, but if you know anything about how the VA operates, you know it provides a significant chunk of its care to Veterans who pay nothing.

Supposedly this is a direct result of Obamacare. I would really like to know how much truth there is to this, but if it is, it's going to be a very very big deal.

Posted by: BurtTC at November 06, 2013 11:43 AM (TOk1P)

173 I don't think so. The plan is designed to fail, and appears to be imploding as planned.

Which will pave the way for the Socialized medicine that the rest of the world once escaped by coming here. We are so terribly screwed...

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at November 06, 2013 03:27 PM (0HooB)

=============

I'm actually more optimistic about this since the Virginia election last night. Think about this...... McCalliflower only won by a narrow margin. He had a huge lead and then the oblabocare shit hit the fan and BOOM!! His huge lead started disappearing. Now this is a guy who had NOTHING whatsoever to do with oblabocare. He wasn't a congresscritter who wrote it, or didn't read it, or passed it. He just shared a "D" with the people who did. And yet, he nearly lost a race that was rated "lead pipe cinch" just a few weeks earlier. All because he is a Democrat and oblabocare is a democrat baby. I think the mid terms are going to be a blood bath for the dems and it will effectively nip that single payer bullshit in the bud.

Posted by: madamemayhem at November 06, 2013 11:44 AM (S2RnE)

174 160 Vic, you might check with your provider to see if they a have a faster bandwidth plan available. To upgrade your D/L rate usually isn't real expensive. Then get Netflix streaming for $10/month.

Posted by: GnuBreed at November 06, 2013 03:41 PM (wNF3N)

I am already paying $50/month for internet cable. I don't think there is enough movies out there worth watching to get their high speed plan which would run my bill to > $100/month which is what my MIL here pays.

Posted by: Vic at November 06, 2013 11:44 AM (zZbNF)

175 These are local crime stories and don't have anything to do with health policy. I believe I'll just ignore them.

Posted by: Sarah Kliff at November 06, 2013 11:44 AM (B5y+v)

176 We know who supports our collectivization and who doesn't. We might prosecute, you never know.

Posted by: Eric Holder at November 06, 2013 11:45 AM (B5y+v)

177 EC 1% of $20,000 = $200 (not per month total penalty) 1% of $30,000 = $300 1% of $40,000 = $400 1% of $50,000 = $500 etc etc etc

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat [/i] at November 06, 2013 11:45 AM (U2UQk)

178 It will be poetic justice when the "historical first" has to deal with a massive b-o-y-c-o-t-t of his policy.

Posted by: seamrog at November 06, 2013 11:45 AM (9oQs0)

179 "Try again."

Unless my math is wrong $2,400.00 a year is 1% of $240,000.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 11:45 AM (IV4od)

180 Hey at least we all have an excuse to blow off diets and exercise regimes. You're not gonna be able to see a doctor anyway! Enjoy, indulge! Eat drink and be merry.

Hey...remember that scumbag Grayson said that the Republicans plan was "Don't get sick"

Would this be irony or tragedy or buggery?

Posted by: dananjcon at November 06, 2013 11:45 AM (wmU4G)

181 EC
1% of $20,000 = $200 (not per month total penalty)
1% of $30,000 = $300
1% of $40,000 = $400
1% of $50,000 = $500

etc etc etc

Posted by: SchrÃ¶dinger's cat at November 06, 2013 03:45 PM (U2UQk)

Is the penalty per month or per year?

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:46 AM (GQ8sn)

182 Concierge medicine. "Private" clinics analagous to speakeasies.

Because there is no way the D won't send OFA into doctors offices ala OKeefe bounty hunting.

Posted by: DaveA at November 06, 2013 11:46 AM (DL2i+)

183
three doctors at lunch, and they were talking about "going underground" and treating patients on a cash basis.

Samiz-docs....

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at November 06, 2013 11:46 AM (kdS6q)

184

We have a President, who has Lied his entire life... and gotten away with it....

Hell, his LEGAL name may very well not even be Barrak OBAMA, even though that was his birth name (he was adopted, legal name change there, and no docs to change it back apparently...).

He lied to get into College... Lied on his first book deal (as HE said he was born out of country)... and has lied ever since...

Problem is... he got away with it... as the MEDIA did not want to call him on his lies...

Now? we have a lie so large and blatant, that even though he can't cover it up... he keeps trying...

Now, when the head of your organization Lies... what do you think those under him will do?

The Unemployment numbers are fake... as we should be talking about EMPLOYMENT, not unemployment...

# of Illegals? don't get me started...

Benghazi? Fast and Furious? Hell.... we don't even have corroboration about how Bin Ladin died, as they got rid of the evidence...

Do you really think anyone in this administration will tell the truth here?

If so.... YOU are part of the problem....

Posted by: Romeo13 at November 06, 2013 11:47 AM (lZBBB)

185

Shit, these clowns in Washington need to go all in.

Medical labor camps will turn around attitudes in the medical profession. I like the medical policy expropriation, but I don't undertand why the government is in any hurry at all to give kulaks a replacement policy. Let them use their hidden money, tha bastards.

Posted by: Josef Stalin at November 06, 2013 11:47 AM (B5y+v)

186 You know how to solve the problem of differing pools in each state? Easy: Scrap it and just put everyone in one giant pool. Presto! single payer. I don't doubt that's the plan once it becomes clear the current iteration isn't working.

Posted by: Mainah at November 06, 2013 11:47 AM (659DL)

187 "Is the penalty per month or per year?"

Per year.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 11:47 AM (IV4od)

188 Yeah, they need to force all of those irresponsible deadbeat younguns to get insurance. But my daughter, in her 20's and healthy, HAD insurance. She got a catastrophic care policy with a $10,000 deductible for $45/mo. That way, if something big happened like an accident, she wouldn't have to sponge off the tax-payer. Anything under $10K, she'd pay cash and if it was a big expense, she could borrow, make a deal. First they raised it to $60/mo so she could pay for Sandra Fluke's birth control. Okay. None of us want that chick to reproduce. But now she's looking at $250/mo for a $5000 deductible, no better than what she had before, considering her circumstances. The money is not there. She can't afford it. So there you have one responsible youngun who will now be uninsured.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at November 06, 2013 11:47 AM (dfYL9)

189 Is the penalty per month or per year? For the year!!!

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat [/i] at November 06, 2013 11:47 AM (U2UQk)

190 Just got here. Looks like nothing has changed with the world. Reality sucks sometimes.

Posted by: Soona at November 06, 2013 11:47 AM (JvRFW)

191

Is the penalty per month or per year?

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 03:46 PM (GQ8sn)

Per year... but it goes up next year...

Posted by: Romeo13 at November 06, 2013 11:48 AM (lZBBB)

192 I was just interviewed by someone at CNN. I think I rambled on and on, but the ultimate point that we talked about was Samaritan Ministries and how it's a legal alternative to traditional insurance. She'd never heard of it before. I'm just praying that it doesn't get savaged, but she sought me out after reading my anti-obamacare comments on healthcare.gov, so fingers crossed.

Posted by: Lauren at November 06, 2013 11:49 AM (hFL/3)

193 "Is the penalty per month or per year?"

Per year.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 03:47 PM (IV4od)

Ok, then I'm wrong.

The penalty shouldn't break him but the monthly premium definitely would. I will advise him to pay the penalty (or not) and just pray he doesn't get ill or injured.

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:49 AM (GQ8sn)

194 Teh Glitch is here to push his 404care and to try and pressure Gov. Perry to expand Medicaid in TX. Hardeee-harr-har.

Posted by: dogfish at November 06, 2013 11:49 AM (nsOJa)

195 So, has anyone come to the conclusion yet that this clusterfuck was designed to fail?

Posted by: Soona at November 06, 2013 11:50 AM (JvRFW)

196 How will they be confirming that you have insurance in order to avoid the penalty? I know you provide them the insurance info but how will they be able to use this info to confirm coverage. Do they have a databasethat matches your policy number and ss # ? *** When you file your taxes in 2014 you will have to provide proof of insurance.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 11:50 AM (DmNpO)

197 Posted by: 250GB monthly caps at November 06, 2013 03:36 PM (SY2Kh) A business broadband connection should address the issue of datacaps, shouldn't it?

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at November 06, 2013 11:50 AM (vd7A8)

198 When you file your taxes in 2014 you will have to provide proof of insurance.

That is just all sorts of wrong. The IRS should have no fucking business with people's health insurance information.

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:51 AM (GQ8sn)

199 Is this a baby's jacket? Or, do they make down jackets for dogs now? http://goo.gl/AruywX

Posted by: Jesse Pinkman, PhD Bitches! at November 06, 2013 11:51 AM (ZoglM)

200

Posted by: Soona at November 06, 2013 03:50 PM (JvRFW)

Yes.... from the outset...

but I'm one of those Birther TEA party folks.... thus that must be a conspiracy.... (or MATH, as some of us call it)...

Posted by: Romeo13 at November 06, 2013 11:51 AM (lZBBB)

201 The penalty rises to 2.5% of income in a couple of years. For someone with $240k income, that's a chunk.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 11:52 AM (DmNpO)

202 174 Vic,

Ah well. I have Cable One, with (up to) 50mbps download speed for $50/month. They want $75/month for an upgrade to 60mbps speed. It was just an idea.

Posted by: GnuBreed at November 06, 2013 11:52 AM (wNF3N)

203 *hands on hips* Okay. Who got Math all over the blog? *taps foot as well*

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Mmmm. Blondies with whipped cream. at November 06, 2013 11:52 AM (VtjlW)

204

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 03:51 PM (GQ8sn)

And I'm sure part of the O'care contract with Insurance companies is that they provide who they have written policies for.... to check on us...

Posted by: Romeo13 at November 06, 2013 11:53 AM (lZBBB)

205 You can already get your dental work done in Israel and get a nice vacation for the same money.
Costa Rica, I hear, has a burgeoning medical tourism market with 1st-world care> When you're well, you can climb trees with the howler monkeys. For laffs.
"What were you doing abroad, Mr. and Mrs. Middle America?"
"We were just doing our part to further the Glorious International Worker's Revolution."
"In Nahariya?"

Posted by: Cretin, high grade moron isotopes in thousands of centrifuges at November 06, 2013 11:53 AM (1/4XQ)

206

199 When you file your taxes in 2014 you will have to provide proof of insurance.

That is just all sorts of wrong. The IRS should have no fucking business with people's health insurance information.

Just enter 'none' and insure that you are not overpaying Income Taxes. Then build a self insurance model. I know some churches have been doing this for years.

Posted by: Chaos the other dark meat at November 06, 2013 11:53 AM (oDCMR)

207

Yes it's true: I've signed up to be a Navigator here in jail. I am offically allowed by Kathleen Sebelius to open ObamaCare accounts for my friends here in jail, their families and also anyone else I have time to find on the internet. For an introductory period I will also be glad to open credit card and mortgage accounts in your name via my partners in Kyrgyzstan. They are good at stuff like this.

Posted by: Dzhokhar Tsarnaevs at November 06, 2013 11:53 AM (B5y+v)

208

Three regulars who recently signed up in an Obamacare exchange walk into a bar.

The bartender says 'what can I get for you on this fine evening'

They all replied that they would like their usual , dry martinis.

The bartender says ' I know I asked you what you wanted but what I really meant was here's three beers. Enjoy.

Posted by: polynikes at November 06, 2013 11:54 AM (m2CN7)

209 I love it when AtC throws a temper tantrum

Posted by: Misanthropic humanitarian, now with 50% more sensitivity at November 06, 2013 11:54 AM (HVff2)

210 And I'm sure part of the O'care contract with Insurance companies is that they provide who they have written policies for.... to check on us...

Oh, I'm sure. We're going to be getting a different kind of W-2 from our health provider to file.

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:54 AM (GQ8sn)

211 Couple items on the fine. The fine will be based on only April thru Dec. earning next year, so that cuts it down. After that it is dependent on the months you do carry insurance, so if you have it for six months you only pay the fined based on the other six months income without it.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 11:54 AM (IV4od)

212 A business broadband connection should address the issue of datacaps, shouldn't it?

Yeah, for a price.

Video (especially HD video) does eat up a lot of bandwidth, but you still have to watch quite a bit of Netflix each month to hit 250GB. An HD stream eats about 2.5GB/hr.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at November 06, 2013 11:55 AM (SY2Kh)

213 202 >> The penalty rises to 2.5% of income in a couple of years.

Yep.

Posted by: GnuBreed at November 06, 2013 11:55 AM (wNF3N)

214 Okay. Who got Math all over the blog? *taps foot as well* Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Mmmm. Blondies with whipped cream. at November 06, 2013 03:52 PM (VtjlW) Look out! Math-Squatch!

Posted by: Mainah at November 06, 2013 11:56 AM (659DL)

215 The penalty rises to 2.5% of income in a couple of years. For someone with $240k income, that's a chunk. Come on. Pay 9.5% of income for extremely limited health insurance or pay a 2.5% penalty? I had really shitty car insurance for a long while. Then I got whacked and got mad and wanted to sue. The lawyer asked me some questions then laughed. Called me a cheap bastid and I already saved more then twice as much money as he could possibly collect. He was right.

Posted by: Schrödinger's cat [/i] at November 06, 2013 11:57 AM (U2UQk)

216 "That is just all sorts of wrong. The IRS should have no fucking business with people's health insurance information."

Plus it is linked through the insurance exchange hub. When you enroll, the IRS knows. That I found out through Sebelius this morning.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 11:57 AM (IV4od)

217 The penalty rises to 2.5% of income in a couple of years.

The way o-care is failing, you can bet your ass that percentage will change. It will be "transitioned" to 10% or possibly higher, to encourage people to sign up on the exchange instead of lone wolfing.

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 11:57 AM (GQ8sn)

218 The penalty rises to 2.5% of income in a couple of years. For someone with $240k income, that's a chunk.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 03:52 PM (DmNpO)

Still cheaper than buying one of those shitty policy's for a grand or more a month.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 11:58 AM (32Ze2)

219 The way o-care is failing, you can bet your ass that percentage will change. It will be "transitioned" to 10% or possibly higher, to encourage people to sign up on the exchange instead of lone wolfing. **** You can bet on it.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 11:58 AM (DmNpO)

220

Ya'll some crazy craka's up in heir if you sign up for this FEMA camp registration. LMBO!!!!

Posted by: Regular Guy at November 06, 2013 11:59 AM (N3Al8)

221

206 "You can already get your dental work done in Israel and get a nice vacation for the same money.
Costa Rica, I hear, has a burgeoning medical tourism market with 1st-world care>"

The Swiss Medical Clinics in Argentina are stellar. There are surgical "spas" in India that make the best of U.S. hospitals look like medieval torture chambers.

The cost for the entire procedure would be less than most of the new deductibles.

I'm certain the free market thinkers in the medical field are already putting the packages together.

Posted by: jwest at November 06, 2013 12:00 PM (u2a4R)

222

"... I have no idea which state will have lots of young healthy enrollees clamoring to pay..."

Oh,.,.. PICK ME!!! PICK ME!!!!

Posted by: California at November 06, 2013 12:00 PM (kduZC)

223 Did you guys see this? Krispy Kreme had a cake with a Krispy Kreme action figure on it for the victory party last4 night but something about the likeness is not quite accurate.

http://tinyurl.com/kz4uhvc

Posted by: WalrusRex at November 06, 2013 12:00 PM (Hx5uv)

224 The penalty rises to 2.5% of income in a couple of years. So it is a tax.

Posted by: rickl at November 06, 2013 12:00 PM (zoehZ)

225 ace, WSJ had a story, yesterday? about the death spiral and how the exchanges are not signing up anyone but the people then DON'T want to sign up, the old, the sick and the poor. The pigeons, aka young ones, are nowhere to be found.

Posted by: Nip Sip at November 06, 2013 12:01 PM (0FSuD)

226

this IS the hill

Posted by: Regular Guy at November 06, 2013 12:01 PM (N3Al8)

227 Did you guys see this? Krispy Kreme had a cake with a Krispy Kreme action figure on it for the victory party last4 night but something about the likeness is not quite accurate.

http://tinyurl.com/kz4uhvc

Posted by: WalrusRex at November 06, 2013 04:00 PM (Hx5uv)

The camera ~~adds~~ removes 300 pounds.

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 12:01 PM (GQ8sn)

228 Another thing on the fines. Someone noted this the other day, they claim the IRS takes off your penalty/ACA tax right off the bat. So even if you work it so you get zero refund, what you owe in income taxes may still be outstanding. Nice.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 12:02 PM (IV4od)

229

None of your policies will be grandfathered if they didn't include maternity care for men and prostrate exams for women. This was done on purpose to force everyone on the exchanges and many counties will only have one provider with no out of network coverage. By 2015 everyone will be fucked by this scam.

If there was an opposition party they could destroy the democrats for 100 years over this.

Posted by: The Dead Taint of Helen Thomas at November 06, 2013 12:02 PM (rXcBX)

230 Let's mail a bunch of these to Obama and his minions!

http://tinyurl.com/q426qw4

Posted by: Jane D'oh at November 06, 2013 12:02 PM (lVPtV)

231 Still cheaper than buying one of those shitty policy's for a grand or more a month.

How long before the penalty goes way way up above 2.5% ??

Posted by: SpongeBobSaget at November 06, 2013 12:02 PM (epxV4)

232

Liar, Liar

Pants on fire

nose is longer than

a line of people trying to access ACA wire

Posted by: seamrog at November 06, 2013 12:02 PM (9oQs0)

233 That is just all sorts of wrong. The IRS should have no fucking business with people's health insurance information.

They shouldn't have any fucking business with my housing arrangements, or my marital status, or how many children I have, or how much money I gave to my church last year, but here we are. Didn't hear any of you bitching about the government all up in those things...

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at November 06, 2013 12:03 PM (ZKzrr)

234 three doctors at lunch, and they were talking about "going underground" and treating patients on a cash basis.
---

Is it going to be in a back alley with coat hangers?

Posted by: WalrusRex at November 06, 2013 12:03 PM (Hx5uv)

235 Someone noted this the other day, they claim the IRS takes off your penalty/ACA tax right off the bat. So even if you work it so you get zero refund, what you owe in income taxes may still be outstanding. Nice.

I thought I read that the penalty cannot be levied like a tax lien. If you don't have any overpayment coming back to you, they can't take it out and then hit you for the balance of the penalty.

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 12:03 PM (GQ8sn)

236 My wife went to Chile a few years ago visited family for a month and got a fuck ton of dental work for a 1/4 of the cost of a typical Oba-care plan.

Posted by: dananjcon at November 06, 2013 12:04 PM (wmU4G)

237

You know all of the waivers? They all come with an expiration date. What does that mean? Well, in Chicagoese it means "Fcuk you, pay me." And if you think Obama isn't going to give each of those waivers an expiration date that can be renewed then you really aren't paying attention.

He's a Chicago/Cook County Democrat. And people believed him.

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Outrage Outlet - Your Stop for ThanksMas Squabbles and Festivus Grievances at November 06, 2013 12:04 PM (hLRSq)

238 I ain't signing shit!!!

Posted by: Regular Guy at November 06, 2013 12:04 PM (N3Al8)

239 "I thought I read that the penalty cannot be levied like a tax lien."

Yeah they say a lot of shit. I'm not going to read thousands of pages of legaleze in the federal code to figure it out. I'm sure someone will.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 12:06 PM (IV4od)

240 Sebby testified today her 'navigators' do not have to go through a background check and could be convicted felons......OK and you want my information!!! How about fuck you will that suffice?

Posted by: Regular Guy at November 06, 2013 12:07 PM (N3Al8)

241

The Swiss Medical Clinics in Argentina are stellar. There are surgical "spas" in India that make the best of U.S. hospitals look like medieval torture chambers.

The cost for the entire procedure would be less than most of the new deductibles.

I'm certain the free market thinkers in the medical field are already putting the packages together.

--------------------------------------------------

Same thing in Thailand. Ultra-modern hospitals with top of the line surgical and medical care. And their cash n' carry mentality makes it cheap.

Posted by: Soona at November 06, 2013 12:07 PM (JvRFW)

242 It's all good.

Posted by: United Identity Thieves of America at November 06, 2013 12:07 PM (wAQA5)

243 Raz has Obama at -19

Posted by: Unabomber at November 06, 2013 12:07 PM (e8kgV)

244 Yeah they say a lot of shit. I'm not going to read thousands of pages of legaleze in the federal code to figure it out. I'm sure someone will.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 04:06 PM (IV4od)

You should vote for it, so you can find out what's in it.

Posted by: Nancy Pelosi at November 06, 2013 12:08 PM (+H/11)

245 How long before the penalty goes way way up above 2.5% ?? Posted by: SpongeBobSaget at November 06, 2013 04:02 PM (epxV4) I believe it is 1% Gross adjusted income next year then 2%. My wife wanted to tell them to get fucked, but her dividend income would be a total fuck.

Posted by: Nip Sip at November 06, 2013 12:08 PM (0FSuD)

246 The numbers may not be very useful, but you can be darn sure they will be 'unprecedented'!

Posted by: Clyde Shelton at November 06, 2013 12:08 PM (/9psw)

247 Equal protection only applies to the states not the fed. However courts have used the fifth amendment to apply some of the same protections to the fed. We got any tax lawyers here?

Posted by: Thunderb at November 06, 2013 12:09 PM (zOTsN)

248 I am going under the assumption that OVomitcare won't be around that long. There will be EPIC civil disobedience as people will not or can not comply. It will collapse.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 12:09 PM (32Ze2)

249

Posted by: EC at November 06, 2013 04:03 PM (GQ8sn)

What the law says is that they can't go after you for non payment...

It says nothing about not taking the Penalty FIRST...

and in fact, standard IRS practice is Penalties are paid first...

So if you owe the IRS money, even it they do not take it out of what you have already paid in withholding... they will take it out of NEXT years withholdings, and then bill you for the Tax you did not pay....

There is no provision in the Law that says the ACA penalty, is on a separate line item, from the amount of tax you owe... you will not have separate 'accounts' with the IRS... it will all be lumped together...

Posted by: Romeo13 at November 06, 2013 12:09 PM (lZBBB)

250 >>>The pigeons, aka young ones, are nowhere to be found.<<<

Hell no. They're living it up on the Obamabuck savings from a subsidized education and free student loans.

Posted by: Fritz at November 06, 2013 12:09 PM (UzPAd)

251

>>three doctors at lunch, and they were talking about "going underground" and treating patients on a cash basis.

My dermatologist offered me a 70% discount if I pay cash. I for one plan to embrace this Half Black market.

Posted by: wth at November 06, 2013 12:10 PM (wAQA5)

252 I checked out the Obamacare website out last week and started receiving free 8-tracks through the mail. What gives?

Posted by: Dr Spank at November 06, 2013 12:10 PM (qRasw)

253 The real low-cost option may turn out to be the C.D. one.
Civil disobedience, trial, conviction, publicity, sympathy, let them give you a cell, 3 squares, a Bible, plus medical care if needed. 72-year old little white-haired lady, cute as a button, 14 grandchildren, felon/Ogabedeath resister.

Posted by: Cretin, high grade moron isotopes in thousands of centrifuges at November 06, 2013 12:10 PM (1/4XQ)

254 If this were a joint Apple/SkunkWorks/Navy Nuke project being personally managed by Steve Jobs, Rickover, and Kelly Johnson - the numbers at this point would be bullshit. They would be covered in blood and tears, but they would stil be bullshit. Until people who weren't covered start paying their premiums, and industry reports those numbers and the IRS reports how many are actually enrolled for subsidies and how many are getting taxed, we know nothing.

Posted by: Jean at November 06, 2013 12:10 PM (3tFLC)

255 "I thought I read that the penalty cannot be levied like a tax lien."

Yeah they say a lot of shit. I'm not going to read thousands of pages of legaleze in the federal code to figure it out. I'm sure someone will.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 04:06 PM (IV4od)

----------------------------------------------

It's been confirmed by several reliable sources that the only way they can collect the penalties is through an individual's tax refund. If there's no refund, the IRS has no more legal recourse. No liens. No skimming your paycheck, nothing.

Posted by: Soona at November 06, 2013 12:11 PM (JvRFW)

256 I don't GAS how cheap or supposedly clean the hospitals in some third-world shithole are reported to be. I am not having surgery somewhere where half the population still uses their hands to wipe their ass.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 12:11 PM (DmNpO)

257 I have a feeling we're going to be seeing a LOT of black-market transactions in the future. I for one am perfectly happy to starve the beast of any and all tax dollars possible.

Posted by: President Barack Obama at November 06, 2013 12:11 PM (7ObY1)

258 Almost hate to ask, Truck Monkey, but is there any update on that nightmare from this morning?

Posted by: Licolntf at November 06, 2013 12:12 PM (ZshNr)

259 America-hating POTUS sock OFF

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at November 06, 2013 12:12 PM (7ObY1)

260 I think the penalty will at some point be a percentage of assets. It's not enough to ruin the economy, currency, and use inflation to spread the wealth, inflation will come eventually. Amish.

Posted by: Justamom at November 06, 2013 12:12 PM (Sptt8)

261 Is there any other example of taxing people differently based on their union status That cannot be legal

Posted by: Thunderb at November 06, 2013 12:12 PM (zOTsN)

262 Sebby testified today her 'navigators' do not have to go through a background check and could be convicted felons......OK and you want my information!!! Just tell the "navigator" that anyone caught breaking into your house is likely to get a good taste of hot lead, and would be unlikely to survive the night.

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at November 06, 2013 12:12 PM (vd7A8)

263 I have a feeling we're going to be seeing a LOT of black-market transactions in the future.

I for one am perfectly happy to starve the beast of any and all tax dollars possible.

Posted by: President Barack Obama at November 06, 2013 04:11 PM (7ObY1)

In chaos there is profit.

Posted by: The Dead Taint of Helen Thomas at November 06, 2013 12:13 PM (rXcBX)

264

Republicans shut down the government

Democrats shut down the healthcare industry

Posted by: Buzzsaw90 at November 06, 2013 12:14 PM (SO2Q8)

265 Grand Cayman is a first class surgical destination.

Posted by: Justamom at November 06, 2013 12:14 PM (Sptt8)

266 Well I'm going to get my withholding's down for as close as a wash I can and be prepared to pay the fine at some point in the future.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 12:14 PM (IV4od)

267 It's been confirmed by several reliable sources that the only way they can collect the penalties is through an individual's tax refund. If there's no refund, the IRS has no more legal recourse. No liens. No skimming your paycheck, nothing. *** So then the IRS records you as being late in paying $100 in taxes for the year, and starts to build up penalties and interest, and then you've got the IRS on your back. For $100.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 12:14 PM (DmNpO)

268 254 --- Yep. Get a terrible disease. Commit a felony! Or, if you're like me and can speak Spanish, head for the ER. Play illegal. Make up a name and address. Isn't it grand that they are setting up a system where being a criminal helps you out?!?

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at November 06, 2013 12:15 PM (dfYL9)

269 257 I don't GAS how cheap or supposedly clean the hospitals in some third-world shithole are reported to be. I am not having surgery somewhere where half the population still uses their hands to wipe their ass. Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 04:11 PM (DmNpO) Who do you think cooked your dinner last time you ate out? Amnesty should include hygiene.

Posted by: Jean at November 06, 2013 12:15 PM (3tFLC)

270 Just tell the "navigator" that anyone caught breaking into your house is likely to get a good taste of hot lead, and would be unlikely to survive the night. Posted by: Blacque ----------------------- "Breaking in"? We do not do that anymore. We use your SS number remotely.

Posted by: Navigator Central at November 06, 2013 12:15 PM (aDwsi)

271 Google is your friend. Obama care penalties. http://tinyurl.com/q28qdg9

Posted by: Nip Sip at November 06, 2013 12:15 PM (0FSuD)

272 Whatevs. Gonna be all lies as noted by ace.

Posted by: eureka! at November 06, 2013 12:16 PM (hmMJD)

273 Almost hate to ask, Truck Monkey, but is there any update on that nightmare from this morning?

Posted by: Licolntf at November 06, 2013 04:12 PM (ZshNr)

______________________

Yes, thanks for asking. She is a lucky little girl. 2 fractured legs and a severely bruised liver. Had to do a blood transfusion. Resting in ICU. Seems, at this point, that she is going to pull through. Thank G-d nothing happened to her head.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 12:17 PM (32Ze2)

274 @257 You haven't been to Israel lately?

Posted by: Cretin, high grade moron isotopes in thousands of centrifuges at November 06, 2013 12:17 PM (1/4XQ)

275

Is there any other example of taxing people differently based on their union status

That cannot be legal

---

How about the marriage penalty?

Posted by: Buzzsaw90 at November 06, 2013 12:17 PM (SO2Q8)

276 @274, very good news! Poor thing, poor Dad.

Posted by: Licolntf at November 06, 2013 12:18 PM (ZshNr)

277 Case law prohibiting the collection of. " service fees " (dues) from non union members might be helpful in attacking this

Posted by: Thunderb at November 06, 2013 12:18 PM (zOTsN)

278 Oh, read my link on Obama penalties. Injuin Senator Liz is exempt as are all "native Americans" AND illegal aliens!

Posted by: Nip Sip at November 06, 2013 12:18 PM (0FSuD)

279 Yes, thanks for asking. She is a lucky little girl. 2 fractured legs and a severely bruised liver. Had to do a blood transfusion. Resting in ICU. Seems, at this point, that she is going to pull through. Thank G-d nothing happened to her head. *** WHAT?!!

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 12:18 PM (DmNpO)

280 274 Almost hate to ask, Truck Monkey, but is there any update on that nightmare from this morning?Posted by: Licolntf at November 06, 2013 04:12 PM (ZshNr) ______________________Yes, thanks for asking. She is a lucky little girl. 2 fractured legs and a severely bruised liver. Had to do a blood transfusion. Resting in ICU. Seems, at this point, that she is going to pull through. Thank G-d nothing happened to her head.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 04:17 PM (32Ze2)

Thank God! Hope her poor dad will be okay.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at November 06, 2013 12:19 PM (lVPtV)

281 I don't GAS how cheap or supposedly clean the hospitals in some third-world shithole are reported to be. I am not having surgery somewhere where half the population still uses their hands to wipe their ass.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 04:11 PM (DmNpO)

---------------------------------------------

Then don't go to a muzzie country. There's already been four viable, non-muzzie alternatives just on this thread.

Posted by: Soona at November 06, 2013 12:19 PM (JvRFW)

282

One critical thing these jackholes apparently missed in their master-planning of the economy is that all of those young, healthy people they count on to pay freight for the rest? We're already broke, because the older generations already hollowed the economy via outsourcing and have already stuck us with the bill for everything else they've ever done. Apparently they think "rob the children" is a viable strategy, but they've already robbed us blind. The first rule of being a good parasite is not to kill the host!

Posted by: Cato at November 06, 2013 12:19 PM (i+Vw2)

283 We do not do that anymore. We use your SS number remotely. Ohhh, that kind of breaking in. I understand now.

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at November 06, 2013 12:19 PM (vd7A8)

284 She is a lucky little girl. 2 fractured legs and a severely bruised liver. Had to do a blood transfusion. Resting in ICU. Seems, at this point, that she is going to pull through. Thank G-d nothing happened to her head. Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 04:17 PM (32Ze2) Seems wrong saying that's good news...but considering what it could have been....that's good news! Hope the dad is doing ok too.

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at November 06, 2013 12:20 PM (bCEmE)

285 I have a feeling we're going to be seeing a LOT of black-market transactions in the future.
---

Pssst. Hey, Sport, you look like a sharp guy. How'd you like an appendectomy for $250? $300 if you want anesthetic.

Posted by: WalrusRex at November 06, 2013 12:20 PM (Hx5uv)

286 I am starting to fear Truck Monkey's little girl may have been injured....

Posted by: Cretin, high grade moron isotopes in thousands of centrifuges at November 06, 2013 12:21 PM (1/4XQ)

287

The new Ms. Marvel is now Muslim super hero

Posted by: Velvet Ambition at November 06, 2013 12:21 PM (R8hU8)

288 Oh, penalties? You know your local towel head, aka Muslim, is exempt right?

Posted by: Nip Sip at November 06, 2013 12:21 PM (0FSuD)

289 It's been confirmed by several reliable sources that the only way they can collect the penalties is through an individual's tax refund. If there's no refund, the IRS has no more legal recourse. No liens. No skimming your paycheck, nothing. --------------------------- Why bother about it? Obama has waived income verification. "Not Qualified For Obamacare's Subsidies? Just Lie -- Govt. To Use 'Honor System' Without Verifying Your Eligibility" http://tinyurl.com/kxt4wfc

Posted by: Navigator Central at November 06, 2013 12:21 PM (aDwsi)

290 Seems wrong saying that's good news...but considering what it could have been....that's good news! Hope the dad is doing ok too.

Posted by: Tami at November 06, 2013 04:20 PM (bCEmE)

_____________________

Unfortunately the mother and father were at each others throats because of this. The blame game. I do hope that they give it a rest and realize how lucky they were this morning.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 12:22 PM (32Ze2)

291 How about the marriage penalty?

Penalty my ass. I pay a shit-ton more than I would if I was married.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at November 06, 2013 12:22 PM (ZKzrr)

292 279 Oh, read my link on Obama penalties. Injuin Senator Liz is exempt as are all "native Americans" AND illegal aliens! Posted by: Nip Sip at November 06, 2013 04:18 PM (0FSuD) ----------------- Also Muslims. Because they are (technically) against insurance. Catholics, OTOH, must pay for contraception, abortion, sex changes, and euthanasia. It's kinda funny, really.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at November 06, 2013 12:22 PM (dfYL9)

293 Madeupiana has first class hobo destination.

Posted by: dananjcon at November 06, 2013 12:22 PM (wmU4G)

294 $250? $300 if you want anesthetic.

What kind of anesthetic?

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at November 06, 2013 12:23 PM (ZKzrr)

295 I missed the story. What happened to the little girl?

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 12:23 PM (DmNpO)

296 I am starting to fear Truck Monkey's little girl may have been injured....

Posted by: Cretin, high grade moron isotopes in thousands of centrifuges at November 06, 2013 04:21 PM (1/4XQ)

_____________________

No, not mine. My neighbor ran over his daughter this morning in their driveway. My wife witnessed the whole thing as did the grade schoolers at the bus stop.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 12:23 PM (32Ze2)

297 291 Seems wrong saying that's good news...but considering what it could have been....that's good news! Hope the dad is doing ok too.Posted by: Tami at November 06, 2013 04:20 PM (bCEmE) _____________________Unfortunately the mother and father were at each others throats because of this. The blame game. I do hope that they give it a rest and realize how lucky they were this morning.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 04:22 PM (32Ze2)

I hope once things calm down they'll be there for each other. The dad has to be going through hell.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at November 06, 2013 12:23 PM (lVPtV)

298 Unfortunately the mother and father were at each others throats because of this. The blame game. I do hope that they give it a rest and realize how lucky they were this morning. Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 04:22 PM (32Ze2) That's a shame. Counseling may be needed.

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at November 06, 2013 12:23 PM (bCEmE)

299 So then the IRS records you as being late in paying $100 in taxes for the year, and starts to build up penalties and interest, and then you've got the IRS on your back.

For $100.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 04:14 PM (DmNpO)

------------------------------------------

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but the Ocare penalty comes under a completely different rubric than normal tax law. It's in a catagory all in itself.

Posted by: Soona at November 06, 2013 12:24 PM (JvRFW)

300

Soon we'll be back to back alley abortions and

back alley pediatric visits and

back alley flu shots and

back alley arthroscopic surgury and

back alley physical therapy

...

Posted by: Buzzsaw90 at November 06, 2013 12:24 PM (SO2Q8)

301
This just in - enrollment numbers are racist

Posted by: TheQuietMan at November 06, 2013 12:24 PM (1Jaio)

302 So now, the plague thing on Sleepy Hollow doesn't make any sense.

Too damned many time travel paradoxes in there.

Posted by: RoyalOil at November 06, 2013 12:24 PM (VjL9S)

303 Oh so apropos capice?? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYIVYWQPhTA

Posted by: Regular Guy at November 06, 2013 12:25 PM (N3Al8)

304 Oh, God.
Prayers up.

Posted by: Cretin, high grade moron isotopes in thousands of centrifuges at November 06, 2013 12:25 PM (1/4XQ)

305 That's a shame. Counseling may be needed. If I were the father, suicide watch would damn near be called for. Can't imagine where he's at.

Posted by: The Internet at November 06, 2013 12:25 PM (naUcP)

306 how did my non tiny url get posted??

Posted by: Regular Guy at November 06, 2013 12:25 PM (N3Al8)

307 286 ---Pssst. Hey, Sport, you look like a sharp guy. How'd you like an appendectomy for $250? $300 if you want anesthetic. Posted by: WalrusRex at November 06, 2013 04:20 PM (Hx5uv) ----------- But we won't have back-alley abortions!!!!

Posted by: Planned Parenthood at November 06, 2013 12:26 PM (dfYL9)

308 Somebody's getting the Barbie Dream House this Christmas...

Posted by: Licolntf at November 06, 2013 12:26 PM (ZshNr)

309 Off, all-expansive sock.

Posted by: Brother Cavil, somewhere at November 06, 2013 12:26 PM (naUcP)

310 Black market medicine Medical junkets "Honorary" Indian Tribe Memberships Amish "lite" congregations

Posted by: Jean at November 06, 2013 12:26 PM (bR2AR)

311 She is a lucky little girl. 2 fractured legs and a severely bruised liver. Had to do a blood transfusion. Resting in ICU. Seems, at this point, that she is going to pull through. Thank G-d nothing happened to her head. Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 04:17 PM (32Ze2) Oh thank God, it sounds like the least horrible result. I'm sorry to hear the parents are going after each other though that's somewhat understandable given the stresses involved. Hopefully, they can calm down and work it out.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Mmmm. Blondies with whipped cream. at November 06, 2013 12:26 PM (VtjlW)

312 1. Don't sign up for Obamacare until you get sick, injured, or your tax return is due. 2. When sick/injured/ tax return due, enroll (if you can managed to get on the stupid website) 3. Don't pay premium and allow policy to lapse. Hurray! Free shit!

Posted by: Damiano the Economic Traitor at November 06, 2013 12:27 PM (j0wOO)

313 TM - Thank goodness. Children tend to be more malleable than adults, but there is a limit. A lot of prayers went out for that little girl today. I hope the parents work it out. A moment of carelessness is very different than a deep personal flaw.

Posted by: Navigator Central at November 06, 2013 12:27 PM (aDwsi)

314 Just claim that infected gall bladder is a pesky fetus you want removed.

Posted by: The Dead Taint of Helen Thomas at November 06, 2013 12:27 PM (rXcBX)

315

Does anyone think that this administration will do a more better job in chasing down non-compliant insurees, than they do with everything else that they've f*ked up?

Posted by: seamrog at November 06, 2013 12:27 PM (9oQs0)

316 Doesn't Pervuia have a secret medical facility?

Posted by: Nip Sip at November 06, 2013 12:27 PM (0FSuD)

317 how did my non tiny url get posted?? *** You can post any link that doesn't have the letters I M G in it. Most people uses bitly.com or tinyurl.com because the length of the link is so long that it disrupts the formatting here to us as-is.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at November 06, 2013 12:27 PM (DmNpO)

318 We're already broke, because the older generations already hollowed the economy via outsourcing and have already stuck us with the bill for everything else they've ever done. Apparently they think "rob the children" is a viable strategy, but they've already robbed us blind. The first rule of being a good parasite is not to kill the host!

Posted by: Cato at November 06, 2013 04:19 PM (i+Vw2)

-----------------------------------------------------

Ah, the poor little X-gens and millenials who voted overwhelmingly for Dear Leader.......twice.

Posted by: Soona at November 06, 2013 12:28 PM (JvRFW)

319 As an aside, Harper was heard yelling at her dad that she no longer loved him because he ran her over. Spunky little kid. I am sure it will add to Dads anxiety about the whole thing.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 12:28 PM (32Ze2)

320 Awww very sorry to here of the little girl being injured. TM prayers up!!

Posted by: Regular Guy at November 06, 2013 12:28 PM (N3Al8)

321 "Madeupiana" -- pshaw. Even in an alternate universe, in which all the quantum constants are different and matter and time cannot exist, even there NO ONE would in their right mind willingly sign up for ObamaCare. Especially a young and healthy person made up entirely of leptons and anti-charm equations. So to think that there might be signups in this pedestrian and almost-real place "Madeupiana" is ludicrous. You have to move beyond hypothetical, fictional or alternate-universe places to find a situation where ObamaCare is desirable. Perhaps at the center on the pre-Big Bang singularity? Nah, even there, ObamaCare is a joke.

Posted by: zombie at November 06, 2013 12:29 PM (+cx5n)

322 317 ---If it's secret, how would we know?

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at November 06, 2013 12:29 PM (dfYL9)

323 My wife is demanding a circular driveway ...

Posted by: Jean at November 06, 2013 12:29 PM (bR2AR)

324 Per yesterday's HHS presser, it was suggested that the numbers would be, how to say, 'highly aggregated' (i.e., Medicare signups lumped with exchange enrollees). If this is the case, the numbers will be as valuable as the "like it, keep it" promise. Posted by: Kevin in ABQ at November 06, 2013 03:07 PM (XrGnJ) Every time they talk about how 40 billion people have visited 404care.org, I wonder how they fall in the 5 categories: 1. Reporters looking for information. 2. People who drove by the site to see what the deal was. 3. People who tried to register, got frustrated, and left. 4. People who registered then passed out from sticker shock. 5. People who actually registered and signed up for a plan. I betting 1 thru 3 are the vast majority.

Posted by: Zombie John Gotti at November 06, 2013 12:29 PM (rpnNZ)

325 295 $250? $300 if you want anesthetic. What kind of anesthetic? Jack Daniels in an IV. The corkage charge is going to eat you up.

Posted by: Nip Sip at November 06, 2013 12:29 PM (0FSuD)

326 I'm a white Hispanic, but soy de Puebla. En Mexico. Estoy indocumentado ahora.

Posted by: Humberto Cretinez, high grade moron isotopes in thousands of centrifuges at November 06, 2013 12:29 PM (1/4XQ)

327 Nood

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at November 06, 2013 12:30 PM (bCEmE)

328 320 As an aside, Harper was heard yelling at her dad that she no longer loved him because he ran her over. Spunky little kid. I am sure it will add to Dads anxiety about the whole thing. Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 04:28 PM (32Ze2) ------------------- OMG. I ache for him.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at November 06, 2013 12:30 PM (dfYL9)

329 Running over a child is my worst fear. I crawl at a snails pace out of my driveway so it doesn't happen.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 12:31 PM (32Ze2)

330 319: Yes, you Boomers and Millennials go have it out. Us X's and Y'ers will totally be happy to pick up the pieces for it. Just make sure you leave some good loot behind.

Posted by: Brother Cavil, somewhere at November 06, 2013 12:31 PM (naUcP)

331 Heh. Young, unemployed woman down the street, living on 'disability',was admitted to the hospital last week. She told me that the hospital has 'Homeopathic Practitioners' on hand. She used the guy for an hour. He waved his hand through her 'aura' and she was 'amazed', by how much better she felt. I wonder how much that cost us?

Posted by: Navigator Central at November 06, 2013 12:31 PM (aDwsi)

332 The good news come March of next year, out of all the millions of people that bought insurance through the exchanges, none of them will be smokers. We kind of licked that problem didn't we.

Posted by: lowandslow at November 06, 2013 12:32 PM (IV4od)

333 320 As an aside, Harper was heard yelling at her dad that she no longer loved him because he ran her over. Spunky little kid. I am sure it will add to Dads anxiety about the whole thing. Posted by: Truck Monkey at November 06, 2013 04:28 PM (32Ze2) Poor guy...

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at November 06, 2013 12:32 PM (bCEmE)

334

318

Yea and we used to post hot links here . I am surprised I didn't get the 'your long boring line of letters has been rejected' pop up tks..

Posted by: Regular Guy at November 06, 2013 12:32 PM (N3Al8)

335 @319. Don't lump me in with that lot, I held my nose and voted R both times, despite the sucky candidates, because I kinda knew this was going to happen. Unlike most people my age, I paid attention in history.

Posted by: Cato at November 06, 2013 12:32 PM (i+Vw2)

336 As an aside, Harper was heard yelling at her dad that she no longer loved him because he ran her over. Yikes. Toss-up whose wounds will be worse...

Posted by: Brother Cavil, somewhere at November 06, 2013 12:32 PM (naUcP)

337 331 Brother Cavil "Just make sure you leave some good loot behind" This isn't 1988. All that's left now is IOUs for China.

Posted by: Arbalest at November 06, 2013 12:35 PM (FlRtG)

338

#29 dk70

"How long will doctor's have to wait until they get paid for their services?"

Maybe longer than you think:

"A little-noticed provision of the Affordable Care Act gives exchange participants a 90-day grace period to pay their premiums ... This essentially makes the physician a lender that is expected to float a no-interest loan for up to 90 days before receiving payment. Or, they may never be paid for services rendered."

link: http://tinyurl.com/kac5fnf

Posted by: speedster1 at November 06, 2013 12:36 PM (v40Bj)

339 I betting 1 thru 3 are the vast majority. Posted by: Zombie John Gotti at November 06, 2013 04:29 PM (rpnNZ) Nope. #6 Hacker bots testing every interface and un patched code segment

Posted by: Jean at November 06, 2013 12:39 PM (XwDPQ)

340 "A little-noticed provision of the Affordable Care Act gives exchange participants a 90-day grace period to pay their premiums ... This essentially makes the physician a lender that is expected to float a no-interest loan for up to 90 days before receiving payment. Or, they may never be paid for services rendered." So no real data until Mar31 + 90 days

Posted by: Jean at November 06, 2013 12:40 PM (XwDPQ)

341

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but the Ocare penalty comes under a completely different rubric than normal tax law. It's in a catagory all in itself.

Posted by: Soona at November 06, 2013 04:24 PM (JvRFW)

Nope... by law its a line item on the 1040.... not a separate amount, but one that goes into the overall Tax owed.

They will not criminally prosecute, or put a Lien on if that amount is all that you owe.... but you will still 'owe' that amount on your Taxes.... which will accrue both a further penalty, and interest, until paid (as that is not a CRIMINAL process, but a Civil one)....

Then... next year? You will start the year owing the Penalty, and Interest, when you start the next year.... and will then start to take that out of THAT years withholdings...

There are way too many ways to play this.... without them having to go to Liens or Criminal Prosecution (which is all that Congress took off the table)....

Death.... and Taxes.... and as John Roberts said... this IS a Tax.

Posted by: Romeo13 at November 06, 2013 12:43 PM (lZBBB)

342 That's the point, signing up people is the goal, the means to the end is "inadvertently" dumping people on Medicaid. Then the oophs part, we made a mistake, your health insurance isn't free here's you bill for your coverage and btw you can't withdraw since you signed up, no take backs...we know where you live, we have all your personal information, you can run but you cannot hide. The point of the Law under liberalism is to crush the human soul. ObamaCare is just another boot stamping on the human face, indefinitely... And you're a racist if you don't comply. You are supposed to be better than that, open your pockets and redistribute your wealth to the people in need. It's the right thing to do in a country that is wealthy. Stop being selfish. What did John Lennon say in "Imagine"? "Imagine no possessions I wonder if you can No need for greed or hunger A brotherhood of man Imagine all the people Sharing all the world... You may say I'm a dreamer But I'm not the only one I hope someday you'll join us And the world will live as one" Come on, YES YOU CAN! Do it for Obama.

Posted by: dscott at November 06, 2013 12:44 PM (PQhpg)

343 Nope. #6 Hacker bots testing every interface and un patched code segment Posted by: Jean at November 06, 2013 04:39 PM (XwDPQ) Good point. Based on everything else about the design, it shouldn't take much probing.

Posted by: Zombie John Gotti at November 06, 2013 01:22 PM (rpnNZ)

344 I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but the Ocare penalty comes under a completely different rubric than normal tax law. It's in a catagory all in itself. Posted by: Soona at November 06, 2013 04:24 PM One "feature" of the penalty is that it goes to the government and not the insurers. Given that the whole point of forcing people into buying insurance was for healthy people to pay for sick people, this is not a very good model.

Posted by: Zombie John Gotti at November 06, 2013 01:25 PM (rpnNZ)

345

Are these numbers coming from the Department of Labor?

Posted by: burt at November 07, 2013 06:27 AM (1+kJ5)

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