February 19, 2014

"I Am a Ukranian"
— Ace

Yesterday, thugs did what thugs do. The protesters did something unwise in retaliation-- they set a fire.

With hundreds of riot police officers advancing from all sides after a day of deadly mayhem here in the Ukrainian capital, antigovernment protesters mounted a final desperate and seemingly doomed act of defiance late on Tuesday evening, establishing a protective ring of fire around what remained of their all-but-conquered encampment on Independence Square.

Feeding the blazing defenses with blankets, tires, wood, sheets of plastic foam and anything else that might burn, the protesters hoped to prolong, for a while longer at least, a tumultuous protest movement against President Viktor F. Yanukovych, a leader who was democratically elected in 2010 but is widely reviled here as corrupt and authoritarian.

“It is called the tactic of scorched earth,” said a protester who identified himself as Andriy.

The police reported earlier in the day that at least nine people, including two police officers, had been killed, but then raised this to 14, making it by far the worst day of violence in more than two months of protests and, for most Ukrainians, the bloodiest in living memory. The final death toll appears certain to be higher.

Doctors and nurses treating protesters in a temporary medical center in the Trade Unions building on Independence Square reported gunshot wounds and evidence that the police had doctored percussion grenades in order to inflict more serious injury. By early Wednesday, the union building had caught fire and the blaze raged out of control, with flames spreading to adjacent buildings.

Yesterday's death toll is now put at 26.

An opposition leader said the situation was precarious, but despite the burning fires and police lines, a strange calm pervaded central Kiev -- even as security officials rebranded the protesters as terrorists and announced a nationwide security operation to restore order.

Meanwhile, European and U.S. leaders threatened quick sanctions against the Ukrainian government over what French President Francois Hollande called "unspeakable, unacceptable, intolerable acts."

While insisting that "peaceful protesters (should) remain peaceful," U.S. President Barack Obama made a point in saying that the Ukrainian government carried an especially big burden for what's happened so far and what's to come.

The EU is "weighing" sanctions, which seem useless, given the whole point of Russia's influence/control over Ukraine is to bring them further into the Russian fold anyway.

Following failed talks overnight, Kiev's Independence Square was quieter Wednesday even as the opposition moved to retake the square after thousands of police armed with stun grenades and water cannons rushed at protesters in a camp Tuesday.

That standoff led to stories of individual brutality including that of Vyacheslav Veremiy, a journalist with daily Ukrainian newspaper Vesti. He was returning home from the newsroom around 2 a.m. Wednesday when his taxi nearing a police station was attacked by a group of armed thugs.

The driver and a fellow passenger were beaten. Veremiy was pulled out of the car and shot in the chest. He died shortly after.

Veremiy is one of the victims of roving bands of paid government "helpers" directed to cause disorder, who are currently roaming the streets with bats and guns, according to witnesses of the violence.

As I said, thugs do what thugs do. The Ukranian government is now calling protesters "extremists" and "terrorists," just as Morsi did in Egypt, and just as Erdogan did in Turkey.

The security authorities in Ukraine offered the first indication on Wednesday that the deadly political violence afflicting Kiev had spread far beyond the capital, announcing a crackdown on what the Interior Ministry called “extremist groups” that had burned down buildings and seized weapons nationwide.

The Interior Ministry announcement of an “antiterrorist operation” across the country came a day after Kiev was gripped with the deadliest mayhem since protests erupted in November, leaving at least 25 dead, including nine police officers. The Health Ministry said that 241 people had been wounded but Ukrainian news accounts put the number at more than 1,000.

Below, one face of the opposition.

Thanks to BB for the video.

Posted by: Ace at 12:25 PM | Comments (338)
Post contains 691 words, total size 5 kb.

1 Don't cross that line, bro. 

Posted by: Merry Kerry at February 19, 2014 12:26 PM (Tlix5)

2 Ukrainians are tre hot...oh wait.

Posted by: Guido at February 19, 2014 12:27 PM (OUobZ)

3 Yay doggie.  Ukraine has been 'discovered'.

Just a few more miles down the road than the
good ole USA.

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 12:29 PM (aUQgu)

4

Um, like did you ever see this when it was part of the Soviet Union? Of course not. There was 0% unemployment, society was stable and the people were taken care of.

Socialism. IT WORKS!

Posted by: Qestionmann at February 19, 2014 12:29 PM (TS9aB)

5 As I said, thugs do what thugs do. The Ukranian government is now calling protesters "extremists" and "terrorists,"


Like the Tea party and Fox News

Posted by: Obamanian at February 19, 2014 12:29 PM (OUobZ)

6 If only Walter Duranty were around today, he'd get to the bottom of this!

Posted by: The NYT at February 19, 2014 12:29 PM (YbyjT)

7 Hard to tell the good guys from the bad guys.  They say it was plain clothes government thugs who pulled the guy out of the taxi and shot him but how do we know? Passions run high but there are no simple solutions and we need to let them solve their own problems.

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 12:29 PM (XUKZU)

8 If obama is on the side of the "protesters," I'm on the other side. Because if I know just one thing, I know obama is Always Wrong about everything.

Posted by: st soothsayer's fire at February 19, 2014 12:30 PM (0zKHM)

9 I've got a crayon and a map!! Don't make me use them!!!

Posted by: Pres. Bystander [/i] [/b] at February 19, 2014 12:30 PM (xrX4n)

10 Wow,I'm away all day and ace puts up tons of content.

Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 12:30 PM (zqvg6)

11 Speak to the government? Obama is more interested in playing golf. The Democrats aren't much interested in freedom and the Republicans want to go along to get along? Seeing that beautiful young woman young enough to be my daughter makes me tear up, Terrible situation.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at February 19, 2014 12:31 PM (XyM/Y)

12 Only 20% of republicans give a shit and those should be expunged from the party.

Posted by: Dr Spank at February 19, 2014 12:31 PM (38LLM)

13

a tumultuous protest movement against President Viktor F. Yanukovych, a leader who was democratically elected in 2010 but is widely reviled here as corrupt and authoritarian.

 

 

Are things  that f'd up that they can't  wait until the next election?

Posted by: CJ at February 19, 2014 12:31 PM (9KqcB)

14 There are loads of western    press reporters a few hundred miles away, looking away from this.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 12:31 PM (AskuI)

15 There's a similar outfit, in Venezuela, the Tupamaros, marxist shocktroops trained at a special camp.

Posted by: coriolianus snw at February 19, 2014 12:32 PM (Jsiw/)

16 Talk about some "outsized demands"!

Posted by: aka.john at February 19, 2014 12:32 PM (zPa3K)

17 There was 0%
unemployment, society was stable and the people were taken care of.
Socialism. IT WORKS!

Posted by: Qestionmann

Yah! Only have to kill 100 million people to get it going.

Let's start with you, cupcake.

Posted by: weft cut-loop[/i] [/b] at February 19, 2014 12:32 PM (xrX4n)

18 A new poll shows that "joblessness" is the most important issue today. Imagine that..

Posted by: st soothsayer's fire at February 19, 2014 12:33 PM (0zKHM)

19 I hope that they win their freedom. Notice she said government is corrupt, as ours is becoming more corrupt! I have had television off all day. Has the SCOAMF said anything or is he too afraid of Vlad?

Posted by: Carol at February 19, 2014 12:33 PM (z4WKX)

20 Yah! Only have to kill 100 million people to get it going.

Let's start with you, cupcake.

***

Don't worry, the useful idiots always get theirs eventually.

Posted by: cool arrow at February 19, 2014 12:33 PM (Dqdyh)

21 "And that's about all I have to say tonight. Except for one thing. The past few days when I've been at that window upstairs, I've thought a bit of the 'shining city upon a hill.' The phrase comes from John Winthrop, who wrote it to describe the America he imagined. What he imagined was important because he was an early Pilgrim, an early freedom man. He journeyed here on what today we'd call a little wooden boat; and like the other Pilgrims, he was looking for a home that would be free. I've spoken of the shining city all my political life, but I don't know if I ever quite communicated what I saw when I said it. But in my mind it was a tall proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, wind-swept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace, a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity, and if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it and see it still. And how stands the city on this winter night? More prosperous, more secure, and happier than it was eight years ago. But more than that; after 200 years, two centuries, she still stands strong and true on the granite ridge, and her glow has held steady no matter what storm. And she's still a beacon, still a magnet for all who must have freedom, for all the pilgrims from all the lost places who are hurtling through the darkness, toward home." President Ronald Reagan Reagan's Farewell Address [She''s dead-- Jim.]

Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 12:34 PM (RJMhd)

22 The Ukranian government is now calling protesters "extremists" and "terrorists," just as Morsi did in Egypt, and just as Erdogan did in Turkey.  And just as Democrats recently have to Republicans in the United States of America.


There.  FIFY.

Posted by: DangerGirl at February 19, 2014 12:34 PM (GrtrJ)

23

Are things that f'd up that they can't wait until the next election?

 

-

Pretty much

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 12:34 PM (AskuI)

24 Sorry, but this appears to be a fight I'm (we're) not qualified to opine on. It's Syria: bad vs. bad I don't like to see anyone get kilt, but at the end of the day, this ain't our fight, and nowhere in here do I see the national interest of the US of A, so... ...whatever?

Posted by: tangonine (Squirrel Combat Tracker) at February 19, 2014 12:35 PM (x3YFz)

25 Coming to a continent near you.

Posted by: toby928© mutters in ominous tones at February 19, 2014 12:35 PM (QupBk)

26 Protest babes never hurt.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at February 19, 2014 12:35 PM (ZPrif)

27 Has the SCOAMF said anything or is he too afraid of Vlad?

Posted by: Carol at February 19, 2014 04:33 PM (z4WKX)


He's a little girlie man...

Posted by: Vlad at February 19, 2014 12:35 PM (OUobZ)

28 Because the largest indicators that one is a terrorist is the constant sign waving and demonstrating against tyranny and corruption.

 "Veremiy is one of the victims of roving bands of paid government "helpers" directed to cause disorder, who are currently roaming the streets with bats and guns, according to witnesses of the violence."

Good to know that the EU has turned the Stern Glare Machine on.  That should fix things.  If there's one thing that the Ukraine fears more than anything else, it's Brussels.

Posted by: B at February 19, 2014 12:35 PM (XyoGP)

29 Hmm, what to do now that the Russian hockey team is finished...

... oh look, Ukraine.

Posted by: Vlad Putin at February 19, 2014 12:35 PM (kHyGq)

30 Does anybody in the world give a fuck about anything SCOAMF says about anything?

I got to the part where they gave his reaction and just automatically scrolled down.

He's such a nonce.

Posted by: eleven at February 19, 2014 12:35 PM (KXm42)

31 22 The Ukranian government is now calling protesters "extremists" and "terrorists," just as Morsi did in Egypt, and just as Erdogan did in Turkey. And just as Democrats recently have to Republicans in the United States of America.


There. FIFY.

Posted by: DangerGirl at February 19, 2014 04:34 PM (GrtrJ)

_____________________________

Nail hit.  On Head.

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 12:36 PM (aUQgu)

32 Didn't a certain individual look into Pooty Poot's heart a ways back?

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 12:37 PM (6bMeY)

33 The MSM is interested in Kiev but not Venezuela. Guess they don't want to do any 'boots on the ground' reporting in a country without toilet paper.

Posted by: SE Pa Moron [/i] at February 19, 2014 12:37 PM (CnA98)

34 That girl is really good on camera.  Adorable eyes and accent.  Hope she is OK.

Posted by: Muad'dib at February 19, 2014 12:37 PM (sjdRT)

35 The Ukranian government is now calling protesters "extremists" and
"terrorists," just as Morsi did in Egypt, and just as Erdogan did in
Turkey. And just as Democrats recently have to Republicans in the United
States of America.

***

And what do all these people have in common? 

Hmm, that's a poser.

Posted by: cool arrow at February 19, 2014 12:37 PM (Dqdyh)

36 So Ukraine gets split down the middle with Kiev going west and the rest being incorporated into Russia.  How viable is western Ukraine?  Too bad Easties can't get along with each other.  Met a young Polish woman here the other day.  She said in Poland, it looks like everyone's unhappy.  Here, everyone's smiling and friendly.

Posted by: SFGoth at February 19, 2014 12:38 PM (Oy8yn)

37 The Russians only starved a few million Ukrainians to death. I can't see why they'd hold a grudge or anything.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at February 19, 2014 12:38 PM (SY2Kh)

38 He's such a nonce.

Posted by: eleven at February 19, 2014 04:35 PM (KXm42)


I just want to backhand him every time he starts flapping his gums. Vlad must just laugh out loud.

Posted by: Guido at February 19, 2014 12:38 PM (OUobZ)

39 That girl is really good on camera. Adorable eyes and accent. Hope she is OK.

Posted by: Muad'dib at February 19, 2014 04:37 PM (sjdRT)



She is probably public enemy #1 now.


Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 12:38 PM (GQ8sn)

40 In many ways, this is the story of US. No, really. About 75% of what that Hot Ukraine Chick said could be said about TFG's regime.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 12:38 PM (0HooB)

41 The protesters are the ones who want to join the EU and are afraid of being subsumed into the Russian Federation, correct?

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 12:38 PM (o4Xc4)

42 The Russians only starved a few million Ukrainians to death.

***

Yep, socialism sure works, all right.

Posted by: cool arrow at February 19, 2014 12:39 PM (Dqdyh)

43 Breaking news from AP mobile & FNC app for iPad, they reached a truce. For some reason I think it is not true. I do not know what made me add AP mobile app, it will pit a headline & when you open app, it's "developing." WSJ reported same as I was typing this.

Posted by: Carol at February 19, 2014 12:39 PM (z4WKX)

44 With hundreds of riot police officers advancing from all sides after a day of deadly mayhem here in the Ukrainian capital, antigovernment protesters mounted a final desperate and seemingly doomed act of defiance late on Tuesday evening, establishing a protective ring of fire around what remained of their all-but-conquered encampment on Independence Square. Put on a burkha & vanish into the night.

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 12:39 PM (p9JxP)

45 Anyone else find it odd that other countries big multiday protests in squares are for freedom and anti-corruption. Meanwhile our big campout movement was for "Moar free shit and tax the rich!" (i.e. Occupy). We've clearly gone soft. I hope the Ukrainian mess ends up OK (and doesn't become Syria 2.0) but I wouldn't expect much help from the US. They have 0 political power to exert on Russia (who seems to be backing this.) Plus, the Ukraine is in a tough spot, they still rely on Russia for fuel and such. (Electric is Power as it were.) All the more reason we should be drilling for natural gas at full bore to become energy independent. If we can't help, at least we can learn.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (No Really!) at February 19, 2014 12:39 PM (GaqMa)

46 My friends, as soon as I figure out which side to support which will start WWIII, I will encourage us to get involved.

Posted by: John McCain [/i] at February 19, 2014 12:39 PM (CnA98)

47

Are things that f'd up that they can't wait until the next election?

 

 

*Pretty much

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 04:34 PM (AskuI)

 

 

‘Cause  real democracy requires  you respect election results.

 

 

Posted by: CJ at February 19, 2014 12:40 PM (9KqcB)

48 37 The Russians only starved a few million Ukrainians to death. I can't see why they'd hold a grudge or anything. Posted by: Hollowpoint at February 19, 2014 04:38 PM (SY2Kh) See, Hollowpoint? I knew you weren't all bad. Just a little. On the sharp edges.

Posted by: tangonine (Squirrel Combat Tracker) at February 19, 2014 12:40 PM (x3YFz)

49 If only Walter Duranty were around today, he'd get to the bottom of this! don't worry, I'm on it.

Posted by: I. F. Stone at February 19, 2014 12:40 PM (usZ28)

50 But we could do communism right. Totes promise.

Posted by: Slate at February 19, 2014 12:40 PM (Aif/5)

51 Yep, socialism sure works, all right. For some values of work.

Posted by: Ioseb Besarionis dze Jugashvili at February 19, 2014 12:40 PM (QupBk)

52 The Russians only starved a few million Ukrainians to death.

***

Yep, socialism sure works, all right.

Idiot upthread praised "stability".  Do you know what's very "stable"?  Death. 

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 12:40 PM (o4Xc4)

53

For the record, in 1934, Stalin exported 7 million tons of grain out of the Ukraine.  Also in 1934, 7 million Ukranians died of starvation. 

 

Stalin then forcibly patriated several million Russians into eastern Ukraine.

 

Central planning:  the externalities never end.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 12:41 PM (AskuI)

54 Dare I ask, how long before Putin or either side of the Ukrainian conflict start blamingÂ… "the interest lobby."

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 12:41 PM (olDqf)

55 "Two security officers have been found dead aboard the Maersk Alabama container ship, the same vessel portrayed in the movie “Captain Phillips,” police said Wednesday.

The men, both former Navy SEALs, were found on Tuesday while the ship was moored in the Seychelles, Fox News reported."

http://tinyurl.com/lkkeyze

WTF!???

Posted by: B at February 19, 2014 12:41 PM (XyoGP)

56 Also on the "news" today: Sharon Stone is the cover of a magazine...in a bikini...at age 55!

Posted by: st soothsayer's fire at February 19, 2014 12:42 PM (0zKHM)

57 ‘Cause real democracy requires you respect election results.

Unless you live in Madison.

Posted by: HR at February 19, 2014 12:42 PM (ZKzrr)

58 Anyone else find it odd that other countries big multiday protests in squares are for freedom and anti-corruption.

Meanwhile our big campout movement was for "Moar free shit and tax the rich!" (i.e. Occupy).

I wish it were that simple.  France, England, and Germany have all had recent large protests for "Moar free stuff!"

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 12:42 PM (o4Xc4)

59 Based upon her desires, I would have sworn that woman was from the US if she hadn't announced up front her nationality. 

Posted by: dogfish at February 19, 2014 12:42 PM (NuPNl)

60 Removing the motivation for the protests, this is what half the psychos at Occupy Wherever wanted. Blood and fire in the streets. Just didn't quite have the balls to be first in line for the concussion grenades.

Posted by: Lincolntf at February 19, 2014 12:42 PM (ZshNr)

61 So .. Korn made an anti-Obama video. Interesting Not that I care about or listen to Korn. But interesting.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at February 19, 2014 12:42 PM (ZPrif)

62 Idiot upthread praised "stability". Do you know what's very "stable"? Death.

***

Did anyone else make the mistake of clicking on troll's link?  That's some weapons-grade stoopid.

Posted by: cool arrow at February 19, 2014 12:42 PM (Dqdyh)

63 56 Also on the "news" today: Sharon Stone is the cover of a magazine...in a bikini...at age 55! Posted by: st soothsayer's fire at February 19, 2014 04:42 PM (0zKHM) I'd hit it. Plus, she is very good to her handicapped brother so she gets brownie points for that alone.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 12:43 PM (olDqf)

64 Vlad Putin is awesome!

Posted by: bOB Costas at February 19, 2014 12:43 PM (QM5S2)

65 "the interest lobby."

Wait...is that who I think it is?

Posted by: eleven at February 19, 2014 12:43 PM (KXm42)

66 I don't like to see anyone get kilt, but at the end of the day, this ain't our fight, and nowhere in here do I see the national interest of the US of A, so... I could, however, give the Hot Ukraine Chick asylum here at Casa Backwardio...

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 12:43 PM (0HooB)

67 The regime is going to win. It's simple. Russia will send them all the weapons they need to suppress the protests and any future rebellion. The EU and US would never in 10,000 years support the Ukrainian people with what they need most: guns. Somehow idiotically distributing weapons to Syrian rebels and then stopping is "smart diplomacy" but helping Ukraine escape from the Russian orbit is "meddlesome".

Posted by: Naes1984 at February 19, 2014 12:43 PM (LiHKo)

68 *feverishly takes notes*

Posted by: Barack H. Obama, Esq. at February 19, 2014 12:44 PM (FcR7P)

69 Which reminds me of the only good movie role Michael Douglas has ever done: THE GHOST IN THE DARKNESS. Movies would be a lot better if some of the actors got torn apart by lions.

Posted by: st soothsayer's fire at February 19, 2014 12:44 PM (0zKHM)

70 65 "the interest lobby." Wait...is that who I think it is? Posted by: eleven at February 19, 2014 04:43 PM (KXm42) You want I should sing like Tevye?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 12:45 PM (olDqf)

71 Like I said last night, I am ambivalent about both sides.

Posted by: votermom at February 19, 2014 12:45 PM (GSIDW)

72 ‘Cause real democracy requires you respect election results.

Have you seen any of the recent Project Veritas videos?  The recent ones all demonstrate:

1.  How easy vote fraud is
2.  Democrat workers openly discuss engaging in fraud
3.  Democrat workers regularly break election law

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 12:45 PM (WhJf8)

73 54 Dare I ask, how long before Putin or either side of the Ukrainian conflict start blamingÂ… "the interest lobby." Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 04:41 PM (olDqf) Putin, though he's one evil sonofabitch, former head of the KGB and an assassin, doesn't mince words. You have to respect the fact that if he says you're dead, you're dead. Unlike President girly boy. Putin will just drop the hammer. I think he's a POS, but I respect him more than bicycle helmet.

Posted by: tangonine (Squirrel Combat Tracker) at February 19, 2014 12:45 PM (x3YFz)

74 ..And The Darkness, rather

Posted by: st soothsayer's fire at February 19, 2014 12:45 PM (0zKHM)

75 TMZ ‏@TMZ Korn Singer -- Obama is a Dictator Who Uses Miley Cyrus & Kanye West to Destroy America http://tmz.me/1gH9LM9 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcACvjXuclA

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at February 19, 2014 12:45 PM (ZPrif)

76 The Russians only starved a few million Ukrainians to death.

-

Now we could talk about who starved who or we could all join together and march into a glorious future.

Posted by: Putin the Bear Rider at February 19, 2014 12:45 PM (XUKZU)

77 Syriasly, though, I watch videos of this and wonder how effective our highly armed civilian populace will do against militarized police forces and the forces that will come in behind them.

Posted by: Frumious Bandersnatch at February 19, 2014 12:46 PM (A0sHn)

78 Also on the "news" today: Sharon Stone is the cover of a magazine...in a bikini...at age 55! No link? You need to be forced to use Minx 0.7 Alpha until you get the AoS rulebook memorized. http://tinyurl.com/ID-Hit-It-Twice

Posted by: SE Pa Moron [/i] at February 19, 2014 12:46 PM (CnA98)

79

‘Cause real democracy requires you respect election results.

 

-

 

The current government ran on closer Euro ties, then reneged for some Putin cash.  What's good for the electorate is good for the elected.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 12:46 PM (AskuI)

80 Meanwhile, not in Kiev, it's 71 degrees in last week's snowstorm capitol, North Carolina. Getting ready to grill a steak.

Posted by: Lincolntf at February 19, 2014 12:46 PM (ZshNr)

81 73 Posted by: tangonine (Squirrel Combat Tracker) at February 19, 2014 04:45 PM (x3YFz) I hate generalizing but bitter family experience has taught me that Ukrainians have not been exactly Judeophilic.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 12:47 PM (olDqf)

82 Currently there are uprisings in Kharkiv, Poltava, Sumy.  Major cities EAST of Kiev.

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 12:47 PM (aUQgu)

83

Which reminds me of the only good movie role Michael Douglas has ever done: THE GHOST     AND     THE DARKNESS.

Movies would be a lot better if some of the actors got torn apart by lions.

 

-

 

Great movie, but the parts      with Douglas are the only fiction in the movie.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 12:47 PM (AskuI)

84 Did anyone else make the mistake of clicking on troll's link? That's some weapons-grade stoopid.

I did.  I was especially inspired by his "but for Zimmerman getting out of the truck, Martin would be alive".  Ignoring that it's perfectly legal to approach someone and ask them what they're doing.  Especially when you're on the neighborhood watch in an area that has had multiple recent robberies.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 12:48 PM (WhJf8)

85 The Ukraine is weak! -Kosmo Kramer(?)

Posted by: Lincolntf at February 19, 2014 12:48 PM (ZshNr)

86 Korn video also seemed to include FoxNews footage in a positive manner. Video has news footage of Obama laughing off the NSA stuff, cut with straight FoxNews reporting on NSA building their huge data center in Utah. All of that cut with clips of Miley Cyrus and Beiber and Kanye.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at February 19, 2014 12:48 PM (ZPrif)

87 Posted by: st soothsayer's fire at February 19, 2014 04:30 PM (0zKHM) You have to try to be wrong EVERY time.

Posted by: Golfman in NC at February 19, 2014 12:48 PM (G7zbY)

88 75 Wellll,I don't really care for Korn but I may have to give it another try.

Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 12:48 PM (zqvg6)

89 The Ukranian government is now calling protesters "extremists" and "terrorists," just as Morsi did in Egypt, and just as Erdogan did in Turkey. And Obama did here.

Posted by: Daniel Simpson Day at February 19, 2014 12:48 PM (aA2hG)

90 83 Movies would be a lot better if some of the actors got torn apart by lions. Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 04:47 PM (AskuI) Speaking of being torn apart by lions, the kittehs are yowling, growling and insisting on dinner. Back in a jiff...

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 12:49 PM (olDqf)

91 Posted by: Muad'dib at February 19, 2014 04:37 PM (sjdRT) I thought the same. Hope she is OK.

Posted by: Golfman in NC at February 19, 2014 12:49 PM (G7zbY)

92 84 Did anyone else make the mistake of clicking on troll's link? That's some weapons-grade stoopid. I did. I was especially inspired by his "but for Zimmerman getting out of the truck, Martin would be alive". Ignoring that it's perfectly legal to approach someone and ask them what they're doing. Especially when you're on the neighborhood watch in an area that has had multiple recent robberies. Posted by: bonhomme at February 19, 2014 04:48 PM (WhJf ********** Ha--I clicked too. So bad I thought it was a sock.

Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 12:49 PM (RJMhd)

93 The current government ran on closer Euro ties, then reneged for some Putin cash.
-
It could never happen ijn our country that a politician would run on one thing and then do another.

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 12:49 PM (XUKZU)

94 84 Did anyone else make the mistake of clicking on troll's link? That's some weapons-grade stoopid. --------- Yeah, I thought he was being sarcastic until I saw that shit.

Posted by: Adam at February 19, 2014 12:50 PM (Aif/5)

95

This will end up, sooner rather than later, with Russian tanks in Kiev.

Obama will deplore it and say he has learned more about the Russians in the past week than in his entire previous life.  

Posted by: Jim in Virginia at February 19, 2014 12:50 PM (AVz13)

96 God help me but I do love the burning times. The visceral experience of conflict is exhilarating.

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at February 19, 2014 12:50 PM (Ec6wH)

97 88 75 Wellll,I don't really care for Korn but I may have to give it another try. Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 04:48 PM (zqvg6) *********** Really is it that Korn--wow.

Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 12:50 PM (RJMhd)

98 From over at Legal Insurrection: Three Ukrainian lessons for the United States http://tinyurl.com/mvzfznd

Posted by: The Political Hat at February 19, 2014 12:50 PM (XvHmy)

99 37 Degrees and raining.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 12:50 PM (6bMeY)

100 1. Was the 2010 election legitimate? 2. If so, has the government now attempted to stay in power illegally? 3. If the answer is no to the above questions, I find it hard to be on board with the protestors at this time. When is the next election?

Posted by: Milk Toast at February 19, 2014 12:50 PM (pyh5u)

101 Syriasly, though, I watch videos of this and wonder how effective our highly armed civilian populace will do against militarized police forces and the forces that will come in behind them. So many cold dead hands.

Posted by: Ioseb Besarionis dze Jugashvili at February 19, 2014 12:51 PM (QupBk)

102
I just had a flinch watching that video knowing its gonna hurt when the govt thugs come to beat me with the baton.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at February 19, 2014 12:51 PM (n0DEs)

103 I hate generalizing but bitter family experience has taught me that Ukrainians have not been exactly Judeophilic. Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 04:47 PM (olDqf) I've tried to read up on the history, but time and books and whole shitload of history... So I have to admit I'm ignorant of the region. I've spent the last several years devouring books on African and South American conflicts, history, and a few of Dan Pipes' books on Russian history but I guess I'm a slow reader. I'll pick up my game.

Posted by: tangonine (Squirrel Combat Tracker) at February 19, 2014 12:51 PM (x3YFz)

104 Obama will deplore it and say he has learned more about the Russians in the past week than in his entire previous life.

***

You give him too much credit.  He never tells the truth, even by accident.

Posted by: cool arrow at February 19, 2014 12:51 PM (Dqdyh)

105 Wait until you run into some of my government helpers. Just wait.

Posted by: Barack Obama at February 19, 2014 12:51 PM (oFCZn)

106 Still snow piles in shady nooks and crannies, my yard is a saturated red clay pit.

Posted by: Lincolntf at February 19, 2014 12:52 PM (ZshNr)

107 Come on, who hasn't wanted to starve a bunch of Ukrainians to death.

Posted by: Dr Spank at February 19, 2014 12:52 PM (38LLM)

108 Afternoon all. The Northeast is raining and melting and flooding and the roads are falling apart. The Ukraine, Syria, Iran and Yada Yada Yada is what happens when the US abrogates responsibility int he World. Sad but true.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 12:52 PM (nzKvP)

109 Maybe we can send Hillary! in, so she has a chance to add to her list of "incredible accomplishments".

Posted by: Mallfly at February 19, 2014 12:52 PM (bJm7W)

110 104 Yeah he does." spread the wealth around""bankrupt the coal industry" electricity rates will necessarily skyrocket" etc.

Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 12:53 PM (zqvg6)

111 Maybe we can send Hillary! in, so she has a chance to add to her list of "incredible accomplishments".

***

Watch out for sniper fire!

Posted by: cool arrow at February 19, 2014 12:53 PM (Dqdyh)

112 The regime is going to win. It's simple. Russia will send them all the weapons they need to suppress the protests and any future rebellion. The EU and US would never in 10,000 years support the Ukrainian people with what they need most: guns. An armed revolt at this stage would be a mistake for the very reason you alluded to. Russia would be sorely tempted to step in for "peacekeeping" purposes as they did in Georgia. The EU would respond with a Mildly Perturbed Letter.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at February 19, 2014 12:53 PM (SY2Kh)

113 Has the SCOAMF said anything or is he too afraid of Vlad? Posted by: Carol at February 19, 2014 04:33 PM (z4WKX) He's a little girlie man... Don't worry, Sheriff Joe is on the job!

Posted by: Daniel Simpson Day at February 19, 2014 12:53 PM (aA2hG)

114 My friends, as soon as I figure out which side to support which will start WWIII, I will encourage us to get involved.
-
Hell, John, let's split the difference and fight on both sides.

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 12:53 PM (XUKZU)

115
It's ok, we have President stupid ass to fix everything.


Posted by: Rev Dr E Buzz Christies at February 19, 2014 12:53 PM (3Tss4)

116 Putin is re-forming the Soviet Union minus the dominant Ice Hockey Team

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 12:54 PM (nzKvP)

117 Ukraine has huge deposits of beautiful women: national interest. But any notion of Obama trying to do something which requires guts and competence fills me with dread.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 12:54 PM (sOtz/)

118 The EU would respond with a Mildly Perturbed Letter.

"France will save us!"

Posted by: eleven at February 19, 2014 12:54 PM (KXm42)

119 117 Past 40 they turn into fat babushkas though right?

Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 12:55 PM (zqvg6)

120 Feds warning of possible shoe bomber? Did we all see that movie?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 12:55 PM (nzKvP)

121 I hate generalizing but bitter family experience has taught me that Ukrainians have not been exactly Judeophilic.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 04:47 PM (olDqf)

 

 

Unfortunately you need to replace "Ukranians" with "Europeans".

Posted by: Mikey NTH - KaBoom- The Cereal of Settling Now at the Outrage Outlet at February 19, 2014 12:55 PM (hLRSq)

122 1. Was the 2010 election legitimate?

2. If so, has the government now attempted to stay in power illegally?

3. If the answer is no to the above questions, I find it hard to be on board with the protestors at this time. When is the next election?

Please to be noting:

The Prime Minister of the Ukraine and his government resigned 28 January 2014.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 12:55 PM (WhJf8)

123 So I have to admit I'm ignorant of the region.
-
Many Ukrainians took and active part in the Holocaust.

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 12:55 PM (XUKZU)

124 Scribe! Thou shall compose a sternly worded parchment to be sent to the Tsar!

Posted by: Emperor Barakakaka at February 19, 2014 12:56 PM (Aif/5)

125 I feel as if we are all being Clusterfucked to death.

Posted by: Buzzsaw at February 19, 2014 12:56 PM (tf9Ne)

126 Live feed of the protests: http://espreso.tv/stream Sorry if this was already posted up-thread.

Posted by: BlueFalcon in Boston at February 19, 2014 12:56 PM (A1Dcl)

127 Past 40 they turn into fat babushkas though right? Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 04:55 PM (zqvg6) And the men turn into drunks so there is a balance to it

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 12:56 PM (nzKvP)

128 Posted by: Milk Toast at February 19, 2014 04:50 PM (pyh5u) ?! You're telling me that if a group of people converged on the national mall and protested that Barack Obama SCOAMF in chief should resign he'd be in his right to smash their heads in? Dude, I know that other countries don't have a 1st Amendment, but that doesn't mean I can't hold it as a Lockean natural right they SHOULD have.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (No Really!) at February 19, 2014 12:56 PM (GaqMa)

129 Putin is re-forming the Soviet Union minus the dominant Ice Hockey Team
-
Well, the hockey team has an extended booking in Siberia.

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 12:56 PM (XUKZU)

130 I hate generalizing but bitter family experience has taught me that Ukrainians have not been exactly Judeophilic. Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 04:47 PM (olDqf) ------------------------- The Ukranians out Germaned the Germans at concentration camps. The most vile and vicious people you ever want to come across.... according to my FIL.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at February 19, 2014 12:57 PM (32Ze2)

131 118 The EU would respond with a Mildly Perturbed Letter. "France will save us!" France is the only Western country (other than Israel of course) that has shown any balls in the last few years. Probably more of a sad commentary on our lack of leadership rather than a compliment to France.

Posted by: Naes1984 at February 19, 2014 12:57 PM (LiHKo)

132

Dude, I know that other countries don't have a 1st Amendment, but that doesn't mean I can't hold it as a Lockean natural right they SHOULD have.

 

-

 

Bingo

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 12:57 PM (AskuI)

133 Many Ukrainians took and active part in the Holocaust. Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 04:55 PM (XUKZU) Well that was and is a rather common eastern european characteristic. Western Europe'e history is not so stellar either

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 12:58 PM (nzKvP)

134 Harrumph! "I am AN Ukranian." If nothing else, the Revolution must be LITERATE!

Posted by: Zombie Bill Buckley at February 19, 2014 12:58 PM (6Li7H)

135 Apropos of nothing, my first corn, beans and peas are peeking their heads up above ground. The manifold blessings of the deep south.

Posted by: toby928© at February 19, 2014 12:58 PM (QupBk)

136 I'm a follower of John Loki.

Posted by: st soothsayer's fire at February 19, 2014 12:58 PM (0zKHM)

137 Many Ukrainians took and active part in the Holocaust. -------- There was a guest post at LI a few weeks ago talking about the history of pogroms and other anti-Semitic activity of the nationalists. He argued that regardless of outcome the future probably isn't going to pretty for the Ukraine.

Posted by: Adam at February 19, 2014 12:58 PM (Aif/5)

138 "Two security officers have been found dead aboard the Maersk Alabama container ship, the same vessel portrayed in the movie “Captain Phillips,” police said Wednesday. The men, both former Navy SEALs, were found on Tuesday while the ship was moored in the Seychelles, Fox News reported." http://tinyurl.com/lkkeyze WTF!??? Posted by: B at February 19, 2014 04:41 PM (XyoGP) yeah, weird we'll probably never know

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at February 19, 2014 12:58 PM (IXrOn)

139 Isn't Mila Kunis Ukranian?

Posted by: Name* at February 19, 2014 12:58 PM (q+zA9)

140 SoS mashed potato face is where?

Posted by: Golfman in NC at February 19, 2014 12:59 PM (/djtm)

141 ...which makes me a Lokian.

Posted by: st soothsayer's fire at February 19, 2014 12:59 PM (0zKHM)

142 '"The Ukranian government is now calling protesters "extremists" and "terrorists"' Wow! They must have taken a page out of Nancy Pelosi's playbook. We've been called that for years, along with any other pejorative they could think of.

Posted by: TimothyJ at February 19, 2014 12:59 PM (ep2io)

143 Well that was and is a rather common eastern european characteristic. Western Europe'e history is not so stellar either.

Yep.  The French as a group were pretty happy to ship the Jews off. 

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 12:59 PM (WhJf8)

144 Maybe I should go over there to help?

Posted by: Dennis Rodman at February 19, 2014 12:59 PM (kHyGq)

145 Isn't Mila Kunis Ukranian? Posted by: Name* at February 19, 2014 04:58 PM (q+zA9) She is 1/2 Jewish.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 12:59 PM (nzKvP)

146 First off, that kind of violence against civilians is exactly what the Washington city regime wants to do to the Tea Party.
Secondly, I have a grand-daughter that age.

Posted by: Erowmero at February 19, 2014 12:59 PM (OONaw)

147 The gov at work.  Berkut beating one unarmed protester in Kiev.  Don't watch if you are wussy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAWsiwIbifY

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 01:00 PM (aUQgu)

148 Posted by: toby928© at February 19, 2014 04:58 PM (QupBk) I noticed.

Posted by: Deep South Squirrel at February 19, 2014 01:00 PM (/djtm)

149 There was a time when Washington DC was the shining city on a hill. No longer

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:00 PM (nzKvP)

150 Apropos of nothing, my first corn, beans and peas are peeking their heads up above ground. The manifold blessings of the deep south. Posted by: toby928© at February 19, 2014 04:58 PM ....Don't take this the wrong way, but. Bite me.

Posted by: Minnfidel at February 19, 2014 01:00 PM (/o+xv)

151 @119 For a lot of their history merely reaching 40 was pretty great. Like Brazil there are a lot of model talent scouts there. After all those sharia crapholes, military morale should improve.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 01:01 PM (sOtz/)

152 The French did send troops to whoop ass on some El Quada types. Seemed to have won also

Posted by: Name* at February 19, 2014 01:01 PM (q+zA9)

153 That girl makes a pretty powerful statement with that video.

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 19, 2014 01:01 PM (Z7PrM)

154 The French are ready to capitulate to the mohammedans and round up their jews again. It won't be long before it happens.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at February 19, 2014 01:01 PM (32Ze2)

155 146 Yes,yes they do,they have been " otherizing" conservatives for years to lay the groundwork.

Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 01:01 PM (zqvg6)

156 As bitter clingers to their guns and their bibles, they are nothing but the tea partiers of the Cossacks.

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at February 19, 2014 01:02 PM (Djwm9)

157 Beckel must be off his meds today

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:02 PM (nzKvP)

158 The gov at work. Berkut beating one unarmed protester in Kiev. Don't watch if you are wussy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAWsiwIbifY
-
that does resemble the old footage of the Nazis in action.

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 01:02 PM (XUKZU)

159 They are never getting that genie back in the bottle.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 01:03 PM (6bMeY)

160 157 Beckel must be off his meds today

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 05:02 PM (nzKvP)


++++++++++++++++++++++++++

So you watched the five?  OK

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 01:03 PM (aUQgu)

161 we will do nothing we do nothing against dictators, they do not fear us. Not in Thailand, or Turkey, or Cambodia, or now the Ukraine Communist dictators have free reign now and they know it

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:03 PM (zOTsN)

162 This government should have been more active in resolving this crisis before Sochi and the fires.

Now that the beds are burning, well too late Gaylord.  You are just a spectator like everyone else.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:03 PM (QDvfw)

163 My daughter got "raped" today at a Bloomfield NJ Municipal Court today. Fined for driving in the left lane on the Garden State Parkway. $385 and 500 for the lawyer. What a scam

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:04 PM (nzKvP)

164 So? Has Duh!1 started drawing pretty colored lines yet?

Idiot. No, really....

Posted by: backhoe at February 19, 2014 01:04 PM (ULH4o)

165 My daughter got "raped" today at a Bloomfield NJ Municipal Court today. Fined for driving in the left lane on the Garden State Parkway. $385 and 500 for the lawyer. What a scam Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 05:04 PM (nzKvP) Oh but no points- that was the point of the lawyer

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:04 PM (nzKvP)

166 Communist dictators have free reign now and they know it Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 05:03 PM (zOTsN) Do not worry Captain 'Red Line' will save you

Posted by: Name* at February 19, 2014 01:05 PM (q+zA9)

167

@36 So Ukraine gets split down the middle with Kiev going west and the rest being incorporated into Russia. How viable is western Ukraine? Too bad Easties can't get along with each other.

--------------------

 

Russia would never allow it.

 

The Ukraine has been a part of Russia for a very long time.  And Russian paranoid view of the world practically requires buffer states on the border.  That way, when the inevitable war starts, the fighting takes place on someone else's land, and not in Russia proper.  Letting the western half of the Ukraine go off on its own would be an admission of weakness, and thus would never be allowed.

 

Posted by: junior at February 19, 2014 01:05 PM (UWFpX)

168 Please don't misunderstand. With family members who were direct victims of Hitler as well as of the pogroms in the Ukraine a generation or so earlier, I'm a bit diffident about what happens in Eastern Europe. To me, it's a mass grave. That said, my parents have always instilled in me the importance of taking people as they come and judging them as individuals. Except for the schvatzes.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:05 PM (olDqf)

169 $385 + $500 = $885, that good Sir is an AR-15.  Left lane = HOV?

And I added it all up without Common Core math or the computer calculator.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:06 PM (QDvfw)

170 Listening to Teh JEF flap his purple lips about The Ukraine today was eerily reminiscent of him talking about Syria. He will do nothing. The Ukranians and Putin know it. Teh JEF will once again be Putin's Bitch on the world stage.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at February 19, 2014 01:06 PM (32Ze2)

171 My daughter got "raped" today at a Bloomfield NJ Municipal Court today. Fined for driving in the left lane on the Garden State Parkway. $385 and 500 for the lawyer. What a scam I'd have lost for her for $250. Just sayin'.

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 01:06 PM (p9JxP)

172 Is it me or is the pResident always in Hawaii or Mexico when this happens?
Quite a coincidence.
Dead in the streets in Venezuela and Ukraine.

Posted by: heavily armed redoubt at February 19, 2014 01:06 PM (W43Qb)

173 From previous thread.  A brief history of the Ukraine.

http://tinyurl.com/lnwzxs

Posted by: CUS at February 19, 2014 01:06 PM (wcLJG)

174 168 Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 05:05 PM (olDqf) Diffident is the wrong word to use. I meant indifferent.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:07 PM (olDqf)

175 President Viktor F. Yanukovych, a leader who was democratically elected in 2010 but is widely reviled here as corrupt and authoritarian. Sounds familiar.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at February 19, 2014 01:07 PM (XyM/Y)

176 Many Ukranians, after the Holodomor which Duranty covered up for NYT's Pulitzer, welcomed the Germans as liberators. I doubt their present antisemitism exceeds the modern French, Greeks, British, etc...

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 01:07 PM (sOtz/)

177 FenelonSpoke, either Putin or Karzai.  Not sure which to pick.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:08 PM (QDvfw)

178 A comment upthread... oy. LOL!

Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 01:08 PM (RJMhd)

179 Wasn't Yushenko supposedly poisoned by Yanukovich/Putin a few years ago?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:08 PM (olDqf)

180 $385 + $500 = $885, that good Sir is an AR-15. Left lane = HOV? And I added it all up without Common Core math or the computer calculator. Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 05:06 PM (QDvfw) No, not HOV. There is a law that says you can only be in the left lane to pass. It was late at night. She was coming back from work after closing her Macys. Cop was an asshole. She has DOD sticker on the car and the registration says CDR Nevergiveup on it. I never heard of anyone getting a ticket for that before. It is a scam for these towns to make money

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:08 PM (nzKvP)

181 The Ukraine is and was Russia's breadbasket. Giving the Ukraine up to the west even more than it already has is NOT going to happen.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at February 19, 2014 01:08 PM (32Ze2)

182 Is it me or is the pResident always in Hawaii or Mexico when this happens? Quite a coincidence. Dead in the streets in Venezuela and Ukraine. Posted by: heavily armed redoubt at February 19, 2014 05:06 PM (W43Qb) what do you think happens when the barky is on vaca all the time?

Posted by: Name* at February 19, 2014 01:08 PM (q+zA9)

183 Fined for driving in the left lane on the Garden State Parkway.

Passing lane laws?

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 01:09 PM (45N4D)

184 Ace - you so sure about this horse you're backing? I'd be a lot more circumspect before picking favorites.

Posted by: Mr. Babylon at February 19, 2014 01:09 PM (5Cwv4)

185 178 A comment upthread... oy. LOL! Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 05:08 PM (RJMhd) if it's the one i think it is.....

Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl 8 days (1wk 1days) until spring training at February 19, 2014 01:10 PM (u8GsB)

186 Passing lane laws? Posted by: bonhomme at February 19, 2014 05:09 PM (45N4D) Yes.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:10 PM (nzKvP)

187 vile corrupt authoritarian and communist are OK with this bunch the only exception is NKorea

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:10 PM (zOTsN)

188 "The protesters did something unwise in retaliation-- they set a fire"

They actually burned several policemen to death by setting fire to their vehicles and trapping them inside.  About 25% of those who have died in the violence so far have been police. These aren't "peaceful protestors" as the JEF called them, and about half the country supports the elected government they are trying to overthrow.

Posted by: Jon (not the troll) at February 19, 2014 01:10 PM (DPMu1)

189 185 178 A comment upthread... oy. LOL! Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 05:08 PM (RJMhd) if it's the one i think it is..... Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl 8 days (1wk 1days) until spring training at February 19, 2014 05:10 PM (u8GsB) ********** Well...you gotta know New Yorkers. Dying...

Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 01:11 PM (RJMhd)

190 158  Walrus Rex

Yes it does.

And I fear it's coming here soon.  Please
learn from Ukraine.  Berkut (spec forces militia--pronounced Bear-Koot) are used against their own people.  Notice the military equipment issued to local LE here in the US

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 01:11 PM (aUQgu)

191 They need more Ampersands.

Posted by: & at February 19, 2014 01:11 PM (6bMeY)

192 184 178 A comment upthread... oy. LOL! Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 05:08 PM (RJMhd) if it's the one i think it is..... Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl 8 days (1wk 1days) until spring training at February 19, 2014 05:10 PM (u8GsB) Who, me????

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:11 PM (olDqf)

193 Passing lane law?  Late at night.  Yeah the Crispy Creme Cop had nothing better to do.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:11 PM (QDvfw)

194 I just date one He rants. I don't know the spellings of certain things...

Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 01:11 PM (RJMhd)

195 Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 04:55 PM (zqvg6) Absolutely not. My grandparents were from Ukrainia and my grandmother was beautiful all of her life. She never got gray hair or wrinkles. They both hated Russia, though.

Posted by: Chilling the most at February 19, 2014 01:11 PM (gxtMZ)

196 The Ukraine is and was Russia's breadbasket. Giving the Ukraine up to the west even more than it already has is NOT going to happen.

Are the people of the Ukraine allowed to leave? 

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 01:11 PM (45N4D)

197 195 The Ukraine is and was Russia's breadbasket. Giving the Ukraine up to the west even more than it already has is NOT going to happen. Are the people of the Ukraine allowed to leave? Posted by: bonhomme at February 19, 2014 05:11 PM (45N4D) Yes. But they have to walk east for 6,000 miles then grab shovels and fill in the Bering Strait.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:13 PM (olDqf)

198 Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 05:11 PM (olDqf) ************ Da.

Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 01:13 PM (RJMhd)

199 Ukrainian President just canned the head of the military because he would not use the army against the protestors watch the escalation

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:13 PM (zOTsN)

200 Yeah, in Utah the drivers are very "protective" of their passing lane.  Young guys will drive right up to your bumper in their little red Nissan trucks and ride it until you exit the left lane.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 01:13 PM (45N4D)

201 The USSR declared the WWII insurgency 'over' in the Ukraine in the 1950s.  Was it?  Not hardly.  It just went low key.  Knife a Sov when the opportunity arose became the norm.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:13 PM (QDvfw)

202 These aren't "peaceful protestors" as the JEF called them, and about half the country supports the elected government they are trying to overthrow.

Posted by: Jon

Your belief is that half of the country wants to become a neo-soviet satellite?

Any numbers to back that up?

Posted by: weft cut-loop[/i] [/b] at February 19, 2014 01:14 PM (xrX4n)

203 197 Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 05:11 PM (olDqf) ************ Da. Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 05:13 PM (RJMhd) Guilty. With an explanation?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:14 PM (olDqf)

204 182?
...what do you think happens when the barky is on vaca all the time? Posted by: Name*

Duh!1 is always on vacation.
And the Moocher wears the drapes.
All of the time....

Posted by: backhoe at February 19, 2014 01:14 PM (ULH4o)

205 Yes. But they have to walk east for 6,000 miles then grab shovels and fill in the Bering Strait. Thinking that's not happening this week.......

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 01:15 PM (p9JxP)

206 Michelle Obama sweeping down the grand staircase at Tara in her drape dress.  "I will never go hungry again!  Now gimme tha lobster!"

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:16 PM (QDvfw)

207 They actually burned several policemen to death by setting fire to their vehicles and trapping them inside. About 25% of those who have died in the violence so far have been police. These aren't "peaceful protestors" as the JEF called them, and about half the country supports the elected government they are trying to overthrow. Posted by: Jon (not the troll so far they claim 26 dead 1/4 of those are police? before or after they killed the other 3/4?

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:16 PM (zOTsN)

208 202 197 Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 05:11 PM (olDqf) ************ Da. Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 05:13 PM (RJMhd) Guilty. With an explanation? Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 05:14 PM (olDqf) *********** I dunno....Ace has been hammering things.

Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 01:16 PM (RJMhd)

209 ot that new O'Keefe video turns my stomach how can you not hate these people they are all criminals

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at February 19, 2014 01:16 PM (IXrOn)

210 So you watched the five? OK
-
After Baba Wawa's reveal yesterday, never watch the View.

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 01:16 PM (XUKZU)

211 ) 187 "The protesters did something unwise in retaliation-- they set a fire"

They actually burned several policemen to death by setting fire to their vehicles and trapping them inside. About 25% of those who have died in the violence so far have been police. These aren't "peaceful protestors" as the JEF called them, and about half the country supports the elected government they are trying to overthrow.

Posted by: Jon (not the troll) at February 19, 2014 05:10 PM (DPMu1)

____________________________________

These people are UNarmed.  To prevent a massacre of innocents, they are using the only weapon available.  Smoke screen.  The use of the term "unwise" is itself "unwise" in this context.

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 01:16 PM (aUQgu)

212 @36 So Ukraine gets split down the middle with Kiev going west and the rest being incorporated into Russia. How viable is western Ukraine? Too bad Easties can't get along with each other.
--------------------

Russia would never allow it.

The Ukraine has been a part of Russia for a very long time. And Russian paranoid view of the world practically requires buffer states on the border. That way, when the inevitable war starts, the fighting takes place on someone else's land, and not in Russia proper. Letting the western half of the Ukraine go off on its own would be an admission of weakness, and thus would never be allowed.

Posted by: junior at February 19, 2014 05:05 PM (UWFpX)



Kiev was a developed city when Moscow was just a lot of trees on a frozen river.  There is no fucking way Volodya wants to lose one iota of that place.  That poor girl would have a lot more hope if Reagan was running the show instead of Gaylord Focker.

Posted by: Captain Hate at February 19, 2014 01:17 PM (2RiXU)

213 207 I dunno....Ace has been hammering things. Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 05:16 PM (RJMhd) Oh dear, that was so freaking mild and it's humorous for crying out loud. If I get banned for that, then I'll just have to start my own blog like Allen G.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:17 PM (olDqf)

214 Should I be reading up on the 1956 Hungarian revolution?

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:17 PM (QDvfw)

215 Your belief is that half of the country wants to become a neo-soviet satellite?

Any numbers to back that up?

Look at election results and overlay them with maps of the native Russian speakers vs Ukrainian speakers.  It really is about half that want to join the Russian Federation and the other half want to join the EU.

One of the big spark points after the PM and his gov't stepped down was the Speaker refused to debate the EU deal in Parliament.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 01:17 PM (45N4D)

216 SE PA Moron, The MFM has had to deal with bad conditions in Sochi. Have some feelings for them, that can't do everything because they're too busy trying to keep lies about SCOAMF straight. Of course it would be easier if they just told the facts. I know I am expecting too much from them. Their bias shows & almost everyone knows it, except for the LIVs.

Posted by: Carol at February 19, 2014 01:17 PM (z4WKX)

217 how can you not hate these people they are all criminals ------- We must embrace the criminal when their actions advance the cause of the party.

Posted by: Shit Lenin Said at February 19, 2014 01:18 PM (Aif/5)

218 Well, if you are on vacation you aren't responsive or responsible.

Posted by: heavily armed redoubt at February 19, 2014 01:18 PM (W43Qb)

219 212 207 I dunno....Ace has been hammering things. Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 05:16 PM (RJMhd) Oh dear, that was so freaking mild and it's humorous for crying out loud. If I get banned for that, then I'll just have to start my own blog like Allen G. Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 05:17 PM (olDqf) *********** Ya.

Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 01:18 PM (RJMhd)

220 They are claiming some of the police were shot with sniper precision.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 01:18 PM (6bMeY)

221 yes jj

Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl 8 days (1wk 1days) until spring training at February 19, 2014 01:19 PM (u8GsB)

222 Usually the way a nation that is split like this on geographical lines resolves such a situation is just to divide itself in two. The UN would love that (it's their favorite solution). The western half would join the EU (it's getting to the point that every block in every city will try to join the EU as a "sovereign" nation). The eastern half thinks they'll be on equal footing with Russia (good luck with that, comrade). The passive-aggressive weenies on the international stage don't have to face Putin.

Posted by: AmishDude at February 19, 2014 01:19 PM (T0NGe)

223 I dunno....Ace has been hammering things. Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 05:16 PM (RJMhd) Oh dear, that was so freaking mild and it's humorous for crying out loud. If I get banned for that, then I'll just have to start my own blog like Allen G. Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 05:17 PM (olDqf) It was a NY Jewish joke for G-D's sake. Now one we tend to say over a few beers and not usually put down in print, but still.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:19 PM (nzKvP)

224 213 Should I be reading up on the 1956 Hungarian revolution? Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 05:17 PM (QDvfw) Another one where family have direct experience. Between Hitler and the Hungarian commies, my family was not entirely reunited for 18 years. 1944 to 1962. At least they all miraculously survived. No joke.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:19 PM (olDqf)

225 The Ukranian government is now calling protesters "extremists" and "terrorists," Next they will branding them the Tea Party of Ukraine.

Posted by: redguy at February 19, 2014 01:19 PM (d8wEw)

226 I'll just have to start my own blog like Allen G. What? Allen G. has a blog?!

Posted by: toby928© always the last to know at February 19, 2014 01:19 PM (QupBk)

227 My boyfriend does these impressions of his New Yorker parents and grand parents. They kill me. So it read like one of those.

Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 01:19 PM (RJMhd)

228 ...society was stable and the people were taken care of.

Sounds like a coma.

Posted by: LC LaWedgie at February 19, 2014 01:20 PM (KQp38)

229 it will be interesting if the Army refuses to turn its guns on the people

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:20 PM (zOTsN)

230 Honestly, I don't really care about the protesters in Venezuela. I highly doubt they want what a conservative would call freedom. I'm betting more that they're just pissed that now they've been promised free stuff, and now they're realizing that now there is no stuff to be had for free. Most of them probably were thrilled when their dictator nationalized that electronics store recently.

Posted by: nnptcgrad at February 19, 2014 01:20 PM (Opyrm)

231 Three Major Cities in the EAST of Ukraine are in revolt.  As cited above.

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 01:20 PM (aUQgu)

232

Hmmm... let's see.... per capita gun ownership in Ukraine .... per Wiki ...

 

6.6.

 

Compared to 89.0 in the USA.  Compared to 31.2 in France, 30.8 in Canada; 30.3 in Germany, 21.7 Croatia, 11.9 in Italy ....

 

 

Seems the Ukraine is a tad on the low side.  Perhaps they should have read Solzhenitsyn more carefully.  Or Judge Kozinski.

 

Posted by: Raspail at February 19, 2014 01:20 PM (Xv7f/)

233 Next they will branding them the Conservative Tea Party of Ukraine. Posted by: redguy at February 19, 2014 05:19 PM (d8wEw)

Posted by: Name* at February 19, 2014 01:20 PM (q+zA9)

234 222 It was a NY Jewish joke for G-D's sake. Now one we tend to say over a few beers and not usually put down in print, but still. Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 05:19 PM (nzKvP) Well, let's just pass over it and see if I can slide.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:20 PM (olDqf)

235 224 The Ukranian government is now calling protesters "extremists" and "terrorists," Next they will branding them the Tea Party of Ukraine. Posted by: redguy at February 19, 2014 05:19 PM (d8wEw) They must have skipped over "meddling kids".

Posted by: AmishDude at February 19, 2014 01:21 PM (T0NGe)

236 The Venezuelans are mad that the Chavistas can't produce TP for them.  They are used to being on the dole.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:21 PM (QDvfw)

237 They need to raise their minimum wage.

Posted by: Bob Beckel at February 19, 2014 01:21 PM (kVfSG)

238 Well, let's just pass over it and see if I can slide. Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 05:20 PM (olDqf) Next time we get together, do I have a few jokes for you

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:21 PM (nzKvP)

239 nonetheless, it used to be communist thugs were afraid of us no more

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:21 PM (zOTsN)

240 235 The Venezuelans are mad that the Chavistas can't produce TP for them. They are used to being on the dole. Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 05:21 PM (QDvfw) Cheryl Crow Hardest Hit (no, not like that).

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:21 PM (olDqf)

241 Most of them probably were thrilled when their dictator nationalized that electronics store recently. Posted by: nnptcgrad at February 19, 2014 05:20 PM (Opyrm) er, no buttwipe and no milk revolution you got there

Posted by: Name* at February 19, 2014 01:22 PM (q+zA9)

242 229 Honestly, I don't really care about the protesters in Venezuela. I highly doubt they want what a conservative would call freedom. I'm betting more that they're just pissed that now they've been promised free stuff, and now they're realizing that now there is no stuff to be had for free. That's what happens when people are convinced by disciples of that imbecile, Marx, that economics is a conspiracy. And it's so so easy to believe.

Posted by: AmishDude at February 19, 2014 01:22 PM (T0NGe)

243

@201 Your belief is that half of the country wants to become a neo-soviet satellite?

Any numbers to back that up?

-------------------

 

The thing to remember is that about half of the country is ethnically Russian.  After killing off millions of Ukranians via starvation, the Soviets shipped millions of Russians in to replace all of the dead Ukranians.  So you've got a huge chunk of the country that's essentially Russian in culture.

 

Posted by: junior at February 19, 2014 01:22 PM (UWFpX)

244 jjsefton it made me laugh....reminded me of some relatives that are long gone

Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl 8 days (1wk 1days) until spring training at February 19, 2014 01:22 PM (u8GsB)

245 237 Well, let's just pass over it and see if I can slide. Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 05:20 PM (olDqf) Next time we get together, do I have a few jokes for you Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 05:21 PM (nzKvP) Remind me to tell you "Super Sex!" By the way, me and Dildo are meeting tomorrow in town. Contact him if you want to join.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:22 PM (olDqf)

246 Look at election results and overlay them with maps of the native Russian speakers vs Ukrainian speakers. It really is about half that want to join the Russian Federation and the other half want to join the EU.

One of the big spark points after the PM and his gov't stepped down was the Speaker refused to debate the EU deal in Parliament.

Posted by: bonhomme

No where near half from a cursory look.
http://tinyurl.com/ohwdu7h

Crimea is the only part that has a majority Russia populace.

Posted by: weft cut-loop[/i] [/b] at February 19, 2014 01:22 PM (xrX4n)

247 Another one where family have direct experience. Between Hitler and the Hungarian commies, my family was not entirely reunited for 18 years. 1944 to 1962. At least they all miraculously survived.

No joke.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 05:19 PM (olDqf)



Shit, no wonder you're such a strong voice for freedom.  Congratulations to your family for enduring.  Th

Posted by: Captain Hate at February 19, 2014 01:22 PM (2RiXU)

248 J.J. Sefton what I am remembering of the 1956 Hungarian revolution was Hungarian civilians using Molotov cocktails against Soviet armor because they had no other weapons to stop the tanks.  That was the parallel I was thinking of.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:22 PM (QDvfw)

249 They are claiming some of the police were shot with sniper precision. Aka, deer hunters.

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 01:22 PM (p9JxP)

250 In my fantasies,  President  Cruz  declares  open  borders  and  immediate  citizenship  for  all  Ukrainian  street  protesters. 

Posted by: Powderhouse Rules at February 19, 2014 01:23 PM (Xv7f/)

251 243 jjsefton it made me laugh....reminded me of some relatives that are long gone Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl 8 days (1wk 1days) until spring training at February 19, 2014 05:22 PM (u8GsB) Well good. As it was intended to do.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:23 PM (olDqf)

252 Damn laptop:

That's very inspirational imo.

Posted by: Captain Hate at February 19, 2014 01:23 PM (2RiXU)

253
Oh dear, that was so freaking mild and it's humorous for crying out loud.

If I get banned for that, then I'll just have to start my own blog like Allen G.
-
What? No shovel jokes now?

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 01:23 PM (XUKZU)

254 Soft, absorbent and plentiful bog roll is the make of a civilized country.

Posted by: toby928© always the last to know at February 19, 2014 01:23 PM (QupBk)

255 Remind me to tell you "Super Sex!" By the way, me and Dildo are meeting tomorrow in town. Contact him if you want to join.

A Smart Military Blog....

What the Dildo knows

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:24 PM (QDvfw)

256 The thing to remember is that about half of the country is ethnically Russian. After killing off millions of Ukranians via starvation, the Soviets shipped millions of Russians in to replace all of the dead Ukranians. So you've got a huge chunk of the country that's essentially Russian in culture. Posted by: junior at that is exactly what the Vietnamese did in Cambodia after the fall of Pol Pot Vietnamese get all the contracts, and good jobs and Cambodians are treated like a minority in their own country so Cambodians want immigration reform. To protect them from being eliminated by the Vietnamese funny

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:25 PM (zOTsN)

257 Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (No Really!) at February 19, 2014 04:56 PM (GaqMa) Typical aos either / or comment.

Posted by: Milk Toast at February 19, 2014 01:25 PM (WY3bD)

258 There is a pack of wizards trying to conjure something in Kiev.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 01:25 PM (6bMeY)

259 Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 05:16 PM (aUQgu) Eh, it's a tense situation, I can see an argument that utilizing this tool only provides cover for the cops up the violence.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (No Really!) at February 19, 2014 01:25 PM (GaqMa)

260 There's as many sides to a story as there are participants. "We want to be free," the young Ukrainian lady repeats. As if the Occupy Kiev protesters either want or expect the Ukrainian government elected officials to simply quit and walk away between elections? Nonsense. See Egypt, or worse, see Libya. But of course the protest against human rights abuses is legitimate. Where have the Kiev Orthodox Priests been, or doing towards the physical protection of their flock to date? Or are these young protesters mostly non-religious, existentialist agnostic, even atheist? But really, until there's a Michael Yon "real" journalist to go investigate and report, there's no telling now from our perspective what all is going on in Kiev. Again, choosing to begin protest the month entering the Sochi Olympics, timely for affect, public notice. But the business of causing fires --definitely disturbing the peace and threatening public safety -- shows the protesters' desperation to get what they want while the public view is in their direction, and world travelers are relatively nearby at the Olympics -- Occupy protesters hoping journalists @ Olympics will come over to cover their story.

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 01:25 PM (MhA4j)

261 246 Shit, no wonder you're such a strong voice for freedom. Congratulations to your family for enduring. Th Posted by: Captain Hate at February 19, 2014 05:22 PM (2RiXU) My folks were liberal in the classic sense of the word, and NYC teachers when that profession meant something. But they quickly saw the writing on the wall vis a vis the leftist takeover of the unions and the Democrats. That and their life experiences, plus my own, left an indelible impression. MAKE MINE FREEDOM, indeed!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:25 PM (olDqf)

262 New Venezuelan political slogan: Toilet Paper By Every Pot!

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 01:25 PM (XUKZU)

263
Your belief is that half of the country wants to become a neo-soviet satellite?

Any numbers to back that up?

Posted by: weft cut-loop at February 19, 2014 05:14 PM (xrX4n) 

Obviously the majority who voted for the current government in 2010, and those continue to support it now, don't see it that way. 

"Ukraine is split practically 50/50 over the accession to the European Union or the Customs Union. Europe is favored by 39 percent of Ukrainians, and 37 percent prefer the Customs Union, said the Kyiv International Institute of Sociology."

Another poll in late Dec found that 45% supported the Euromaidan movement, and 50% were opposed. 

If the capital happened to be in the eastern part of the country, these protests probably wouldn't even be happening,.





Posted by: Jon (not the troll) at February 19, 2014 01:26 PM (DPMu1)

264 Russia and America are worth a lot more than the Ukraine. Even if Putin was going to invade the Ukraine, and gas every last "Ukrainian nationalist," as Kaganovich termed them while he was organizing the Holodomor as the Politburo's viceroy to the Ukraine dispatched to "pacify and Communize" the "unruly" region, it would still be unwise to start WWIII over it. Since Putin is unlikely to do that, it is even more unwise to do so. And bombing the Ukraine is probably not going to make things better for the Ukrainians.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at February 19, 2014 01:26 PM (thBHI)

265 The thing to remember is that about half of the country is ethnically Russian. After killing off millions of Ukranians via starvation, the Soviets shipped millions of Russians in to replace all of the dead Ukranians. So you've got a huge chunk of the country that's essentially Russian in culture.

Posted by: junior

Wiki, for what it's worth has the total breakdown as:

77.8% Ethnic Ukrainian
17% Russian

Not close to half, nor a huge chunk. Again outside of Crimea, I'm not seeing the Half Want To Become A Neo-Soviet Satellite idea bearing out.

Posted by: weft cut-loop[/i] [/b] at February 19, 2014 01:27 PM (xrX4n)

266 Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 05:23 PM (olDqf) Just emailed him. Maybe

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:27 PM (nzKvP)

267

@255 that is exactly what the Vietnamese did in Cambodia after the fall of Pol Pot

Vietnamese get all the contracts, and good jobs

and Cambodians are treated like a minority in their own country

so Cambodians want immigration reform. To protect them from being eliminated by the Vietnamese

--------------------

 

At least the removal of Pol Pot meant that the Cambodians got something good out of the deal...

 

 

Having that guy in charge of a big country as opposed to a small place like Cambodia would have been a *real* disaster.

 

Posted by: junior at February 19, 2014 01:27 PM (UWFpX)

268 according to Wiki about 18 per cent of Ukrainians identify themselves as ethnically Russian that's a sizable minority, but hardly a majority

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:27 PM (zOTsN)

269 In Soviet Union, woods shit in Russian bear.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:27 PM (olDqf)

270 These are not protests, they are a prelude to a civil war in the Ukraine. Eastern Ukraine is oriented towards Russia, and wants closer ties to the Motherland. Western Ukraine hates Russia (Holodomor) and wants closer ties with the EU. US is in on the side of the Western Ukrainians. Those guys are a weird coalition of moderates, and whackadoo fascist right wingers that can put goons on the street. At the core though, both parts of the coalition are ethnic Ukrainian nationalists. I have no idea who to root for, frankly.

Posted by: Stirner at February 19, 2014 01:27 PM (l1p2K)

271 I heard a national reporter today pronounce it "Keev." So is that the new cool way to say it, like Pokki-stan, or is she just dumb?

Posted by: PJ at February 19, 2014 01:27 PM (ZWaLo)

272 259. Given the real threat by terrorists against the Olympics, agitating violent revolution in Kiev is not wise. No telling what ugliness will happen, and who will get the blame.

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 01:28 PM (MhA4j)

273 And bombing the Ukraine is probably not going to make things better for the Ukrainians. Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at February 19, 2014 05:26 PM (thBHI) Putin sent troops into Georgia during the Beijing Olympics.... took a few provinces...

Posted by: Name* at February 19, 2014 01:28 PM (q+zA9)

274 267 according to Wiki about 18 per cent of Ukrainians identify themselves as ethnically Russian that's a sizable minority, but hardly a majority Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 05:27 PM (zOTsN) Just like the Danzig corridor, Alsace Lorraine and the Sudetenland, eh?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:28 PM (olDqf)

275 272 Putin sent troops into Georgia during the Beijing Olympics.... took a few provinces... Posted by: Name* at February 19, 2014 05:28 PM (q+zA9) Buckhead and where else?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:29 PM (olDqf)

276 Russia and America are worth a lot more than the Ukraine. Even if Putin was going to invade the Ukraine, and gas every last "Ukrainian nationalist," as Kaganovich termed them while he was organizing the Holodomor as the Politburo's viceroy to the Ukraine dispatched to "pacify and Communize" the "unruly" region, it would still be unwise to start WWIII over it. Since Putin is unlikely to do that, it is even more unwise to do so. And bombing the Ukraine is probably not going to make things better for the Ukrainians. Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at February 19, 2014 05:26 PM (thBHI) Putin does not have to invade. With an impudent President int he White House, he can exert his influence from Moscow. the Iron Curtain is being re-hung

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:29 PM (nzKvP)

277 I have no idea who to root for, frankly. Posted by: Stirner

Ask yourself this question: would Ukraine moving to the EU piss off Vladimir Putin?  Yes?  You know what to do.

Posted by: pep at February 19, 2014 01:29 PM (6TB1Z)

278 Keev is where Alex D. Tokeville is from, no?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:30 PM (olDqf)

279 263. Since Putin is unlikely to do that, it is even more unwise to do so. = Correct. Interventionism has yet to prove results promised.

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 01:30 PM (MhA4j)

280 OMG, the world is going to hell in a hand basket:

 msnbc        ✔ @msnbc

A rash of earthquakes in Oklahoma may be linked to fracking. Report from @Maddow:

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 01:30 PM (XUKZU)

281 J.J. Sefton or Bosnia-Hercegovina.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:30 PM (QDvfw)

282 The Ukraines reject Russian alignment.  Period

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 01:30 PM (aUQgu)

283

@270 I heard a national reporter today pronounce it "Keev." So is that the new cool way to say it, like Pokki-stan, or is she just dumb?

----------------

 

No clue.  The Legal Insurrection article linked above kept spelling it "Kyiv" (which made things a bit odd when a quote later in the article used the traditional spelling).  LI also changed Kharkov's usual spelling to Kharkiv.

 

Posted by: junior at February 19, 2014 01:30 PM (UWFpX)

284 "We want to be free," the young Ukrainian lady repeats.

As if the Occupy Kiev protesters either want or expect the Ukrainian government elected officials to simply quit and walk away between elections?

The PM and his government have already stepped down.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b][/s][/s] at February 19, 2014 01:31 PM (o4Xc4)

285 Having that guy in charge of a big country as opposed to a small place like Cambodia would have been a *real* disaster. Posted by: junior wrong the new Vietnamese installed government took the Khmer Rouge and put them in the new government they made a pantomime of a show trial against Pol Pot, but he died of natural causes

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:31 PM (zOTsN)

286 275 Putin does not have to invade. With an impudent President int he White House, he can exert his influence from Moscow. the Iron Curtain is being re-hung Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 05:29 PM (nzKvP) With matching carpet and cushions.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:31 PM (olDqf)

287 With an impudent President int he White House, he can exert his influence from Moscow. the Iron Curtain is being re-hung

erm

In any case, ain't nothing hung about Barry.

Posted by: pep at February 19, 2014 01:31 PM (6TB1Z)

288 280 J.J. Sefton or Bosnia-Hercegovina. Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 05:30 PM (QDvfw) Uh, I'll take that Hershey Covina for $200 Alex.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:31 PM (olDqf)

289 LI also changed Kharkov's usual spelling to Kharkiv. They should stick with Харків.

Posted by: toby928© always the last to know at February 19, 2014 01:32 PM (QupBk)

290 "272 And bombing the Ukraine is probably not going to make things better for the Ukrainians. Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at February 19, 2014 05:26 PM (thBHI) Putin sent troops into Georgia during the Beijing Olympics.... took a few provinces... Posted by: Name* at February 19, 2014 05:28 PM (q+zA9)" Yes, and Bush "let" him. It wasn't the end of the world, and it was probably the wise thing to do. And no one was gassed.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at February 19, 2014 01:32 PM (thBHI)

291

@284 the new Vietnamese installed government took the Khmer Rouge and put them in the new government
----------------------

 

Did the Vietnamese keep killing anyone who wore glasses?  If not, then I suspect that the Cambodians got at least a little relief when the Vietnamese swept in.

 

Posted by: junior at February 19, 2014 01:33 PM (UWFpX)

292 I would like this sentenced rejected:

"The protesters did something unwise in retaliation-- they set a fire."

Reason:  Smoke screen is the only weapon the people have.

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 01:33 PM (aUQgu)

293 I am not sure there is anyone to root for, only people to root against but I think it just shows how very weak we are and everybody knows it

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:33 PM (zOTsN)

294 Time to prep dinner. Squid. Either curried or just in a simple tomato garlic sauce. Later you pierogi-heads!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at February 19, 2014 01:33 PM (olDqf)

295 And Putin used the excuse of protecting ethnic Russians in Ostia as his justification to invade Georgia.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:33 PM (QDvfw)

296 "sniper precision" Aiming? The only people who ordinarily reject that are Arabs with their "insh'Allah allahu akbar" close eyes technique.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 01:33 PM (sOtz/)

297 Ukraine, according to "Reason":

http://tinyurl.com/kj8x8ab

Posted by: ChrisP at February 19, 2014 01:34 PM (dpXGP)

298 Winston Spenser Churchill March 5 1946: The United States stands at this time at the pinnacle of world power. It is a solemn moment for the American Democracy. For with primacy in power is also joined an awe-inspiring accountability to the future. If you look around you, you must feel not only the sense of duty done but also you must feel anxiety lest you fall below the level of achievement. Opportunity is here now, clear and shining for both our countries. To reject it or ignore it or fritter it away will bring upon us all the long reproaches of the after-time. It is necessary that constancy of mind, persistency of purpose, and the grand simplicity of decision shall guide and rule the conduct of the English-speaking peoples in peace as they did in war. We must, and I believe we shall, prove ourselves equal to this severe requirement. From Stettin in the Baltic to Trieste in the Adriatic, an iron curtain has descended across the Continent. Behind that line lie all the capitals of the ancient states of Central and Eastern Europe. Warsaw, Berlin, Prague, Vienna, Budapest, Belgrade, Bucharest and Sofia, all these famous cities and the populations around them lie in what I must call the Soviet sphere, and all are subject in one form or another, not only to Soviet influence but to a very high and, in many cases, increasing measure of control from Moscow. The more things change the more things stay the same

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:34 PM (nzKvP)

299 That ain't garlic butter in your Chicken Kiev, comrade.

Posted by: Laddie Putin at February 19, 2014 01:34 PM (UzPAd)

300 Enjoy the calamari there J.J. Sefton, just don't invite Admiral Ackbar over.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:34 PM (QDvfw)

301 "276 I have no idea who to root for, frankly. Posted by: Stirner Ask yourself this question: would Ukraine moving to the EU piss off Vladimir Putin? Yes? You know what to do. Posted by: pep at February 19, 2014 05:29 PM (6TB1Z)" Yes, but once the Ukraine joins the EU, the Germans will have their old WWII coalition again, except for Croatia and Bosnia. And then what? And then shit will get real. Allegedly.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at February 19, 2014 01:35 PM (thBHI)

302 If the point of protesting was to garner more public support, produce the timeline of events, who did what first in the protester/police confrontation. And AVOID starting fights! The point is to be civilized, and to negotiate via election the next representatives of the people. A still photo is an isolated moment, so where are the videos?

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 01:35 PM (MhA4j)

303 And Putin used the excuse of protecting ethnic Russians in Ostia as his justification to invade Georgia.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 05:33 PM (QDvfw)



Quite a plan, no?  Relocate a bunch of your citizens to another country and have them raise hell at key moments to justify intervening to protect their interests.

Posted by: Captain Hate at February 19, 2014 01:36 PM (2RiXU)

304 Putin and Russia do not have what it takes to bring back the USSR.

Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 01:36 PM (zqvg6)

305 Cossacks use horsewhips on Pussy Riot.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26265230

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at February 19, 2014 01:37 PM (QDvfw)

306 Yes, but once the Ukraine joins the EU, the Germans will have their old WWII coalition again, except for Croatia and Bosnia. And then what? And then shit will get real. Allegedly. Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney really in todays world you are afraid of Germany seriously?

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:37 PM (zOTsN)

307 I bet Poland really wishes they had that missile defense program

Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 01:38 PM (zOTsN)

308 I bet Poland really wishes they had that missile defense program Posted by: thunderb at February 19, 2014 05:38 PM (zOTsN) I wish we did!!!

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:39 PM (nzKvP)

309 JJ, there is a small park in southeast Denver called Babi Yar park. For years I didn't know what that signified. When I did learn, I never looked at it the same without my heart breaking.

Posted by: LFW - Honorary Pointy Eared Vulcan at February 19, 2014 01:39 PM (l2max)

310 Putin and Russia do not have what it takes to bring back the USSR.

Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 05:36 PM (zqvg6)



Troo dat; but he's still strong enough to suspect him of having expansionist designs of a more limited nature.

Posted by: Captain Hate at February 19, 2014 01:39 PM (2RiXU)

311 Yes, but once the Ukraine joins the EU, the Germans will have their old WWII coalition again, except for Croatia and Bosnia. And then what? And then shit will get real. Allegedly.

Huh? 

In any case, it's Ukraine, not The Ukraine.  Think America, not The America.

Posted by: pep at February 19, 2014 01:39 PM (6TB1Z)

312 Sometimes, you can be very stupid, panzer, the main opposition leader, has been at this since 2000, he has been able to carve out a space in the system, similar with Maria Machado, who's been at this since 2002, at least. Maybe they were too confident that electoral politics were the way to go, well we would never make that mistake, oh wait,

Posted by: coriolianus snw at February 19, 2014 01:41 PM (Jsiw/)

313 Germany is unlikely,at the very least,to be hegemonic military power again.

Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 01:42 PM (zqvg6)

314 In any case, it's Ukraine, not The Ukraine. Think America, not The America.

Posted by: pep at February 19, 2014 05:39 PM (6TB1Z)



I'm doing my best to wean myself away from doing that since I found out that the Rooskis use that term and it pisses the Ukrainians off.

Posted by: Captain Hate at February 19, 2014 01:43 PM (2RiXU)

315 "303 Putin and Russia do not have what it takes to bring back the USSR. Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 05:36 PM (zqvg6)" Putin is pretty much the only thing preventing the Russians from actually reembracing Communism. His main political opponents are the Russian Communist Party.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at February 19, 2014 01:45 PM (thBHI)

316 My neighbors immigrated from Ukrania. When we first moved in the father used to hang his head out of his car window whenever he saw us and yell "Hi! You my neighbors!" He and his wife loved America so much and were so thankful to live here. They reminded me of concentration camp survivors. The people of the Ukraine have experienced an incredible amount of pain in the last 100 years. It must really suck to be them.

Posted by: Ed Anger at February 19, 2014 01:47 PM (tOkJB)

317 "310 Yes, but once the Ukraine joins the EU, the Germans will have their old WWII coalition again, except for Croatia and Bosnia. And then what? And then shit will get real. Allegedly. Huh? In any case, it's Ukraine, not The Ukraine. Think America, not The America. Posted by: pep at February 19, 2014 05:39 PM (6TB1Z)" Exactly. And it's actually the Ukraine. Ask a Ukrainian which they prefer, since you Care so much about them.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at February 19, 2014 01:48 PM (thBHI)

318 It must really suck to be them. Posted by: Ed Anger at February 19, 2014 05:47 PM (tOkJB) There was a time in the not so distant past that it sucked to be anything other than an American. Sigh

Posted by: Nevergiveup at February 19, 2014 01:49 PM (nzKvP)

319 "312 Germany is unlikely,at the very least,to be hegemonic military power again. Posted by: steevy at February 19, 2014 05:42 PM (zqvg6)" So Germany will never be bombed again. Correct?

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at February 19, 2014 01:51 PM (thBHI)

320 "313 In any case, it's Ukraine, not The Ukraine. Think America, not The America. Posted by: pep at February 19, 2014 05:39 PM (6TB1Z) I'm doing my best to wean myself away from doing that since I found out that the Rooskis use that term and it pisses the Ukrainians off. Posted by: Captain Hate at February 19, 2014 05:43 PM (2RiXU)" Don't correct pep. He'll hate you for the rest of your life.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at February 19, 2014 01:52 PM (thBHI)

321



Not close to half, nor a huge chunk. Again outside of Crimea, I'm not seeing the Half Want To Become A Neo-Soviet Satellite idea bearing out.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at February 19, 2014 05:27 PM (xrX4n) 

The political divisions correlate more with language than ethnicity. About 33% of Ukraine speaks Russian as their native language, and the Russophone parts of Ukraine are more solidly pro-Russia than the rest of the country is anti-Russia.  Hence the 50/50 split on the Customs Union.

Posted by: Jon (not the troll) at February 19, 2014 01:52 PM (DPMu1)

322 I wish some big, burly Ukrainian would make a video entitled, "Hey Obama, you big pussy, why don't you take a break from your golf and get your pansy ass over here and help us out?"

Probably wouldn't go over well. But I'd laugh.

Posted by: OregonMuse at February 19, 2014 01:54 PM (I8YZX)

323 300. You might study more the ancient alliances that evolved into the Austro-Hungarian Empire (from which British Royalty derive, certainly the Royal families which America has had relations with politically in defiance and revolution). Also, the unification of the Germanic States including the Prussians of the East, and Bismarck's leadership prior to the Kaiser taking reigns. Finally, remember that Austria was NOT part of the Germanic alliances made, but was invaded by Hitler at the onset of WWII. The more I learn, the more I regret that WWI ever happened, as it was the most hypocritical mandate by nation leaders upon their citizens, to die for EMPIRE, every nationality its own self interest. And the British had no better claim to rule the world than any other -- as such Lording proves abominable, men making themselves gods over other people. Being British, French, German, Spanish, Russian, whatever. All the same refusal to recognize the sovereignty of others. The British Empire was the ONLY empire to benefit grossly from WWI -- and Wilson's declaration to war (with Congress) made ALL the difference in their favor. But really, even had we stayed out, and had Germany won, there wouldn't have been a NAZI Party and Hitler would not have been what he became. It's important to realize that the unjust Versaille Treaty is what MADE Germany starve and suffer intolerably, sowing the fields to harvest World War II. And for any idiot too stupid to figure, Fascism Is Bad, HORRIBLY BAD, just as Communism proved to be for so many that tried it, creating misery and failure to allow and value Individuality. Germany at the turn of the 20th Century was neither communist nor fascist, certainly no worse an authoritarian system than France, or even Britain if you weren't an aristocrat. Neither was Germany any more socialist than Britain at the time.

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 01:56 PM (MhA4j)

324 No discussion of freedom re Ukraine.  I was told this is a 'smart' blog.  Disappointment all round.

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 01:57 PM (aUQgu)

325 "Keev" is what was taught in high school in the 1930's, the era of "Peiping."
Who hates it is the chickens. No, not Chechens.

You want to sound real snotty, you say "Ook-ra-EEN."
Don't really get it, nobody expects us to say Paree, Kooln, Veen or Moonish, but outside da Yerp it's all Pock-ee-ston and Neeha-rahwah.

Posted by: Stringer Davis at February 19, 2014 01:59 PM (xq1UY)

326 The Ukraine is the region, just as The Americas does not denote a specific nation on the American Continents.

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 02:01 PM (MhA4j)

327 Ukrainians protesting haven't made public their grievances formally at the UN, or even outside the UN -- unless the media chose to black it out from broadcast news. They want a "Ukrainian Spring"? Bad move, considering how that's gone elsewhere.

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 02:06 PM (MhA4j)

328 326  panzernashorn


UN?  You are joking, ya?

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 02:14 PM (aUQgu)

329 "The MSM is interested in Kiev but not Venezuela.

Guess they don't want to do any 'boots on the ground' reporting in a country without toilet paper."

The Venezuelan opposition needs to find a photogenic female to be the face of their movement like the Ukrainians did.  That was very good technique - people will watch a video with a beautiful female face in it.  They have a political face of the opposition (he has been arrested, of course), but they need good videos like this Ukrainian one.

Posted by: Beth at February 19, 2014 02:21 PM (Epq7Y)

330 Testing

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That (Microaggressive SoCon) at February 19, 2014 02:22 PM (LSDdO)

331 "325 The Ukraine is the region, just as The Americas does not denote a specific nation on the American Continents."

Uh, no it isn't. It's a nation.  Ukraine.  That is unless you're an old Soviet type.

Posted by: Beth at February 19, 2014 02:23 PM (Epq7Y)

332 *scratch my last comment, I think misunderstood panzernashorn, but others in the thread are wrong about "The" Ukraine

Posted by: Beth at February 19, 2014 02:25 PM (Epq7Y)

333 this is what happens when a government has a monopoly on force...

and no wonder the Left hates the 2nd Amendment.

Posted by: redc1c4 at February 19, 2014 02:31 PM (q+fqH)

334 176 Many Ukranians, after the Holodomor which Duranty covered up for NYT's Pulitzer, welcomed the Germans as liberators. I doubt their present antisemitism exceeds the modern French, Greeks, British, etc... Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 05:07 PM (sOtz/) After what the Soviets did to them, who can blame the Ukrainians for welcoming the Nazis as liberators? Talk about being caught between a rock and a hard place. They were situated between two insanely brutal totalitarian collectivist states. They were fucked no matter what they did. Today's Ukrainians are no more responsible for what their ancestors did in WWII than modern white Americans are for slavery.

Posted by: rickl at February 19, 2014 03:00 PM (sdi6R)

335 This is why I am armed. 2nd Amendment. Molon Labe McGyver, out

Posted by: McGyver at February 19, 2014 03:30 PM (buKS9)

336 334 McGyver


we would be Kiev without 2nd Amendment.

Thank God

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 03:39 PM (aUQgu)

337 336   13times

Ukranian woman 'ragdolled'

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5zymJeyxWM

Posted by: NCwoof at February 19, 2014 04:01 PM (aUQgu)

338 Tell Putin I will have more options to be flexible if I am re-elected.

Posted by: Obama at February 20, 2014 10:12 AM (1+kJ5)

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