February 19, 2014

I Love You, Government: As New Jersey Faces Transportation Crisis Due to Lack of Snow-Melting Rock Salt, 40,000 Tons of the Stuff Are Held Up in Maine by Bureaucracy and Ancient Law
— Ace

Let's regulate all the things.

With the region hit by yet another blast of winter weather, a mountain of 40,000 tons of rock salt destined for New Jersey is being held up at a port in Maine by a century-old maritime law, forcing state officials to scramble to retrieve a portion of the load even as salt sheds across the state are down to their final grains.

...

Jim Simpson, New JerseyÂ’s transportation commissioner, said in a radio interview on Friday that there was a ship in Maine that could carry the entire load to the Port of Newark within days but cannot do so because it does not sail under an American flag.

“We’ve been going back and forth with the feds for the last two days,” Mr. Simpson told the station, New Jersey 101.5 FM. “This is the kind of stuff we’re dealing with. Even government, the federal government, gets in the way.”

On Tuesday, Joseph Dee, a spokesman for the transportation department, said that the stateÂ’s request for a waiver had been denied on Thursday and that they were not sure that the larger ship was even in port anymore.

As an alternative, they dispatched a barge to retrieve 9,500 tons of salt. It will take several trips to transport all 40,000 tons, which could take weeks.

Apparently there's some protectionist law that says only American-flagged ships can transport our precious patriotic rock salt from American port to American port. Because America.*

We need to start passing laws that sunset huge blocks of law within, say, three years. Give Congress a chance to re-pass the ones that make sense. But it's time to just start repealing laws en masse.

Oh, by the way: Notice the Obama Administration, by denying a crucial waiver, is not just shutting down a bridge for one day, but is shutting down all the state roads.

Time for some traffic problems in New Jersey?

From @slublog.

*It's a standard leftist trope to goof on the right for what they claim to be false assertions of patriotic spirit for various laws and measures. And yet when it comes down to ridiculous protectionist schemes such as this one -- a scheme which is actually putting people in actual danger, as snowy, icy roads are an oft-lethal hazard -- they will of course resort to claiming that we need to protect our patriotic American-flagged ships from foreign competition, Because America.

Clarification/Correction: Blaster tells me the law specifically forbids foreign-flagged ships from carrying goods from one American port to another:

The law is that only US flagged ships may go from US port to US port.

So they could take that ship full of rock salt under non-US flag up to Canada, then go to New Jersey.

Posted by: Ace at 06:55 AM | Comments (491)
Post contains 524 words, total size 3 kb.

1 Laws are for little people.

Posted by: O'Bumbles at February 19, 2014 06:57 AM (zllbf)

2 HAW HAW HAW!!! this story made me laugh.

Posted by: Tom Servo at February 19, 2014 06:57 AM (8Fa5Z)

3 Lawfare on offense.

I blame Big Salt.

Posted by: noone, really [/i] [/b] at February 19, 2014 06:57 AM (5ikDv)

4 Antiquated sex laws of the state should be repealed!

Posted by: Roman Polanski at February 19, 2014 06:58 AM (cvbFl)

5 Can they blame Christie?

Posted by: Bertram Cabot Jr. at February 19, 2014 06:58 AM (kVfSG)

6 I Love You, Government: As New Jersey Faces Transportation Crisis Due to Lack of Snow-Melting Rock Salt, 40,000 Tons of the Stuff Are Held Up in Maine by Bureaucracy and Ancient Law
=====

That ancient law is nearly as old as the Constitution, probably.

Posted by: mrp at February 19, 2014 06:58 AM (JBggj)

7 "Even government, the federal government, gets in the way.” "Even crocodiles, saltwater crocodiles, try to eat people."

Posted by: AMDG at February 19, 2014 06:59 AM (t7OO0)

8 How DO such laws get passed?

Posted by: Phat campaign cash [/i] [/b] at February 19, 2014 06:59 AM (SwHqo)

9 All laws should sunset. Add this to my "should" pile. BTW, another messaging opportunity to be skipped by the party of stupid?

Posted by: Tonic Dog at February 19, 2014 07:00 AM (TyCa2)

10 Even government, the federal government, gets in the way.” Now, isn't that the shocker of the day!

Posted by: t-bird at February 19, 2014 07:00 AM (FcR7P)

11 I'm a NJ resident. Anyone here who voted for The Historic Worst and is upset with the fedgov handling of this gets no sympathy from me.

Posted by: Iasonas at February 19, 2014 07:00 AM (RUraj)

12 The law is that only US flagged ships may go from US port to US port. So they could take that ship full of rock salt under non-US flag up to Canada, then go to New Jersey. Good luck getting that law changed.

Posted by: blaster at February 19, 2014 07:01 AM (4+AaH)

13 Actually, If memory serves the law requires you to hit a non-US port every so often. Like 3 US ports requires your next port be non-US. I know this because I took a cruise in Hawaii, and the NCL ship down there is the only one that can do a 7 day Hawaii only cycle because it's American flagged and the other ships have to hit a non US port (often going all the way to disembark in Vancouver.) The real odd thing is that to be an American flagged ship you have to have been built in America, and we don't build many cruise liners anymore. We might have more US flagged ships if we ditched that rule.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (No Really!) at February 19, 2014 07:01 AM (GaqMa)

14 I guess the credits earned from his tongue bath of Obama have run out for the fat man. Has he realized that the media doesn't really love him yet?

Posted by: ejo at February 19, 2014 07:02 AM (GXvSO)

15 With the salt rejected by a NJ Democratic Party donor: http://tinyurl.com/lh68cln Bridgegate II: Briny Boogaloo

Posted by: Thomas at February 19, 2014 07:02 AM (NFKDG)

16 Give Congress a chance to re-pass the ones that make sense. But it's time to just start repealing laws en masse. Silly wingnutz. Like we have time to read all those moldy old laws. We don't even read the ones we pass NOW. There's only so much time in the day for banging Congressional aides and attending fundraisers and cocktail parties.

Posted by: Your Betters, the US Congress at February 19, 2014 07:02 AM (7ObY1)

17 Global Warming is moving our supplies of rock salt further and further north!

Posted by: The Left at February 19, 2014 07:02 AM (FcR7P)

18 I can't wait for the big MSNBC expose on this!

Why in holy hell, BTW, is Homeland Security in charge of freaking rock salt?

Posted by: PJ at February 19, 2014 07:02 AM (ZWaLo)

19

I'd ram that ship into that damned bridge.

Posted by: Roy at February 19, 2014 07:03 AM (VndSC)

20 They should use beet juice. Works here in MO.

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at February 19, 2014 07:04 AM (bCEmE)

21 What did Chris Christie know and when did he know it?

Posted by: The Media (D-Media) at February 19, 2014 07:04 AM (RJMhd)

22 The one time Obama has the legal authority to waive his magic wand to fix a problem (the law allows waivers of the rule), he refuses to do so.

Posted by: Duke at February 19, 2014 07:05 AM (d3clc)

23 If memory serves the law requires you to hit a non-US port every so often. So, load the ship up, and ram the UN hard on the way down to Jersey. Problem solved.

Posted by: t-bird at February 19, 2014 07:05 AM (FcR7P)

24 And these are the people who want to centralize your health care.


(Love your sunset idea, ace. The US code has been begging for reform for 50 years or more.)

Posted by: joncelli at February 19, 2014 07:05 AM (RD7QR)

25 Couldn't they just buy one of those U.S. flags made in China for $1.99?

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 07:06 AM (6bMeY)

26 So they could take that ship full of rock salt under non-US flag up to Canada, then go to New Jersey. That's kind of what Obama's dimwitted Importer Security Filing (ISF) requirements have caused. A lot of Canadian companies who used to import direct to their US customers are now giving up and importing into Canadian ports, then trucking the stuff down. Since this clownish administration is threatening enormous, crippling fines for not complying with a poorly-written law that even the idiots who passed it don't understand. I wonder how the stevedores and other port unions feel about their Obamessiah stealing work from them and outsourcing it to Canada? Oh wait, their unions. They ain't gonna vote Republikkkan.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 07:06 AM (7ObY1)

27 Christie should seize all the Pretzel Salt.

Posted by: garrett at February 19, 2014 07:06 AM (BPXWE)

28 Oh, by the way: Notice the Obama Administration, by denying a crucial waiver, is not just shutting down a bridge for one day, but is shutting down all the state roads.

I noticed something similar in the propane shortage a few weeks ago...producers had propane, but the new Obama-admin federal trucking restrictions throttled the transport from producer to wholesaler, then again from wholesaler to the retailer, then again from the retailer to customers who needed home delivery.  Three bottlenecks, maybe four (I'm not terribly familiar with the industry), between the production and the people running low on heating fuel in sub-zero weather.

Some governors got waivers.  But the whole "begging the king to stop damaging your people" thing...damn.

Posted by: HR at February 19, 2014 07:06 AM (ZKzrr)

29 Homeland Security is the umbrella department for USCG and US Customs.

Posted by: Jinx the Cat at February 19, 2014 07:07 AM (cvbFl)

30 Someone once said there's no such thing as a free lunch. That may be true, but from what I can see there are a lot of fuckers eating free lunches.

Posted by: prescient11 at February 19, 2014 07:07 AM (6c5YU)

31 1 Hr. to puck drop for the US Hockey Quarterfinal.

Posted by: garrett at February 19, 2014 07:07 AM (BPXWE)

32 Why in holy hell, BTW, is Homeland Security in charge of freaking rock salt? All your rock salt are belong to us.

Posted by: The DHS at February 19, 2014 07:07 AM (7ObY1)

33 When it rains it pours.

Posted by: Morton at February 19, 2014 07:07 AM (6bMeY)

34 Jones Act for the win!

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at February 19, 2014 07:07 AM (ZPrif)

35 If we could get the laws to sunset every three years, congress would be busy reviewing all the stuff we already have on the books.  This would leave them with less time to come up with NEW ways to fuck their constituents.  I'm all for it!

Posted by: sweet...ish at February 19, 2014 07:08 AM (bj+Nc)

36 Funny thing is, I live on the Maine/NH border and Maine uses almost no salt. Compared to NH the winter driving sucks. When I get across the line into NH commuting to work I can take it out of 4 WD.

Posted by: ontherocks at February 19, 2014 07:08 AM (4bAP5)

37 Salt is bad for you.


Posted by: Moochelle : Let's Move! [/i] [/b] at February 19, 2014 07:08 AM (SwHqo)

38 Thanks for that BJ Chris, now go fuck yourself.

Posted by: Barry at February 19, 2014 07:08 AM (Aif/5)

39 31 1 Hr. to puck drop for the US Hockey Quarterfinal. Oh yeah! And I'm really liking this team. We've got to advance and get an epic matchup with Canada. Go USA!!!

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 07:08 AM (7ObY1)

40 Like tonight, Â….in the snow Â….again

Posted by: ontherocks at February 19, 2014 07:08 AM (4bAP5)

41 The Law is the Jones Act. It does serve a strategic purpose, however, to address two questions: The law is regulated by the USCG which is now a part of Homeland Security. The vessel can get a waiver from the Feds quite easily as was done for vessels after Katrina. One phone call could solve the issue well within the confines of the law but simplicity is not the Gov't way.

Posted by: Hawsepiper at February 19, 2014 07:09 AM (ubvtk)

42 I'd like a law that puts the sunset at 7:58 PM as seen from the back porch of my house.

Posted by: Turnip Defense League [/i] at February 19, 2014 07:09 AM (O7Q1u)

43 I wonder if this century-old 'maritime' law isn't in fact a union protection law from Woodrow Wilson's ilk.

Posted by: t-bird at February 19, 2014 07:09 AM (FcR7P)

44
I blame global warming.  And Bush of course.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at February 19, 2014 07:09 AM (n0DEs)

45 They should have dumped that salt straight into the harbor.


A salt party.

Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 07:09 AM (GQ8sn)

46 This post needs more Salt-N-Peppa.

Posted by: garrett at February 19, 2014 07:09 AM (BPXWE)

47 Trust me, the NJ DOT doesn't need any other challenges to their incredibly bad snow clearing.

I have driven in the winter in lots of states, and NJ is by far the worst in my experience.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at February 19, 2014 07:09 AM (QFxY5)

48 The lefty press is going nuts over Nugent campaigning for Abbott. Love it!

Posted by: Judge Pug at February 19, 2014 07:10 AM (6Nj7A)

49 So they could take that ship full of rock salt under non-US flag up to Canada, then go to New Jersey.


Adding another 20% to the total cost too.


Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 07:10 AM (GQ8sn)

50

Stanton Evans' Law of Inadequate Paranoia seems applicable here:

 

1. Federal government run by liberal Democrats.

2. Liberal Democrats fear Chris Christie in 2016.

3. Federal government takes action to make life difficult for New Jersey, whose governor happens to be Chris Christie.

 

Hmmmmmm....

Posted by: The Regular Guy at February 19, 2014 07:10 AM (qHCyt)

51 Posted by: t-bird at February 19, 2014 11:09 AM (FcR7P)

Do you really have to wonder?

Posted by: Iasonas at February 19, 2014 07:10 AM (RUraj)

52 If the      flag laws are appropriately followed, the entire load of     salt can be delivered before the end of May.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 07:10 AM (AskuI)

53 46 This post needs more Salt-N-Peppa. Let's talk about sex bay-bee Let's talk about you and me Let's talk about all the good thing and the bad things that may be Let's talk about sex!

Posted by: Salt-n-Pepa at February 19, 2014 07:10 AM (7ObY1)

54 We need to start passing laws that sunset huge blocks of law within, say, three years. Give Congress a chance to re-pass the ones that make sense. But it's time to just start repealing laws en masse. I like Insty's idea of a special part of Congress that does nothing but repeal laws. It's one of things we should "alter or abolish" should the need arise (which it has). Of course, our Founders never envisioned politics as a lifelong profession, or the legal system as an industry, so I can forgive them for this oversight.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 07:10 AM (0HooB)

55 But, yeah, Jones Act of 1920. Been reauthorized a billion times, including by Obama not long ago. Original rational was some national security req to maintain a certain sized fleet. Guess they used WW1 experience to justify it. Not sure. Mainly it's just protectionism for US shipping industry, ship builders, and unions. NatSec angle is, I guess, to require a decent-sized US fleet so, in case of war, it can be mobilized. Mostly it's just protectionist BS, though.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at February 19, 2014 07:10 AM (ZPrif)

56 Just one reason I call it "gooberment...."

Posted by: backhoe at February 19, 2014 07:11 AM (ULH4o)

57 Hoist the Tea Party flag. arrrr

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at February 19, 2014 07:11 AM (IXrOn)

58 Salt is good for you. Studies show that salt intake moves you BP numbers by about 1 top and bottom. They don't want you to get your Iodine because it fouls up the poison the Feds put in your water. If you get enough Iodine you will shed all of that Fluoride within days.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 07:12 AM (6bMeY)

59
All laws should sunset. Add this to my "should" pile.

BTW, another messaging opportunity to be skipped by the party of stupid?

Posted by: Tonic Dog at February 19, 2014 11:00 AM (TyCa2)






Yes, they should.

Also, Kate Upton should show up at my place in the nude to do the weightless Cat Daddy before humping my brains out. Which probably has a better chance of happening.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at February 19, 2014 07:12 AM (TIIx5)

60 This is a gift to Christie. Will he use it?

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at February 19, 2014 07:12 AM (IXrOn)

61 They should have dumped that salt straight into the harbor.
A salt party.

I find it offensive that you would have them pollute the ocean with salt.

Think about the whales, man.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at February 19, 2014 07:12 AM (SY2Kh)

62

So they could take that ship full of rock salt under non-US flag up to Canada, then go to New Jersey.

 

 

China apparently does this all the time.  When they cleared the "world's largest exporter" threshold it was pointed out that there are tax advantages to importing. Or exporting. I forget.  But it makes economic sense for Chinese managers to ship stuff to Taiwan and ship it back in.  So a lot of Chinese exports are really exported to China.

 

It's almost as if people respond rationally to incentives.

Posted by: Frumious Bandersnatch at February 19, 2014 07:13 AM (A0sHn)

63 Salt is , of course, a greenhouse gas.

Posted by: EPA [/i] [/b] at February 19, 2014 07:13 AM (SwHqo)

64 Russia is out? RUSSIA. IS. OUT????????

Posted by: CNN Reporter Extraordinaire at February 19, 2014 07:13 AM (BF+2f)

65

Its listed as a patriotic law, but if you started looking into it, I guarantee you there's a Union sticker somewhere, be it Longshoremen or Harbor workers, or Merchant marine.

This law was put on the books to maintain union jobs.

Posted by: Jollyroger at February 19, 2014 07:13 AM (t06LC)

66 Salt March?

Posted by: garrett at February 19, 2014 07:13 AM (BPXWE)

67 All it takes is a phone call from Obama (not sure who else can issue waivers.)

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at February 19, 2014 07:14 AM (ZPrif)

68

TFG to NJ - "Go Pound Salt !"

Posted by: McCool at February 19, 2014 07:14 AM (nCSwS)

69 !

Posted by: tasker at February 19, 2014 07:14 AM (RJMhd)

70 Weirder part of the story to me is he's saying there's only one ship in Maine which could carry it all, and its not a US ship. Maine? WTF really?

Posted by: Bigby's Typing Hands at February 19, 2014 07:14 AM (3ZtZW)

71

@55

Flatbrush Joe beat me to it.

Posted by: Jollyroger at February 19, 2014 07:15 AM (t06LC)

72 We need to start passing laws that sunset huge blocks of law within, say, three years. Give Congress a chance to re-pass the ones that make sense. But it's time to just start repealing laws en masse.
...........
^^ THIS ^^

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 19, 2014 07:15 AM (Z7PrM)

73 So this is just Obama/DHS showing New Jersey (Christie) the pimp hand, eh?
Nice state you've got there, shame if you couldn't keep your roads clear....

Posted by: Lizzy at February 19, 2014 07:15 AM (POpqt)

74 When it rains it pours. Posted by: Morton ------------------ Nicely played..., nicely played.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at February 19, 2014 07:15 AM (aDwsi)

75 Also interesting that Obama can't just unilaterally change this law on a whim. Only his Obamacare can be changed like that, I guess.

Posted by: Bigby's Typing Hands at February 19, 2014 07:15 AM (3ZtZW)

76 The one time Obama has the legal authority to waive his magic wand to fix a problem (the law allows waivers of the rule), he refuses to do so.

 

 

Posted by: Duke at February 19, 2014 11:05 AM (d3clc)

 

 

Yeah, funny isn't it how  some  laws are strictly enforced, no exceptions even in times of unusual  need, and other are not enforced/defended at all.  [taps chin with forefinger]  Very strange. 

Posted by: Count de Monet at February 19, 2014 07:16 AM (BAS5M)

77 Let there be traffic.

Posted by: Barakhenaten I at February 19, 2014 07:16 AM (BPXWE)

78 FWIW? I've lobbied for and pressed for Sunset clauses all my life. All laws should be reviewed periodically and renewed only on a recorded vote. No voice votes. So you can tell the SOB's who renewed it "Your GD law really screwed me, my family, my business."

Posted by: backhoe at February 19, 2014 07:16 AM (ULH4o)

79

We need to start passing laws that sunset huge blocks of law within, say, three years. Give Congress a chance to re-pass the ones that make sense. But it's time to just start repealing laws en masse.

-

I was under the impression that that was the GOP platform for the past twenty years.  Apparently, I was mistaken.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 07:16 AM (AskuI)

80 Weirder part of the story to me is he's saying there's only one ship in Maine which could carry it all, and its not a US ship. Maine? WTF really?

The way I read it was that a foreign-flagged ship that delivered salt to Maine was to deliver the remainder of their load in NJ.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at February 19, 2014 07:17 AM (SY2Kh)

81 >>Also interesting that Obama can't just unilaterally change this law on a whim. Only his Obamacare can be changed like that, I guess.

I know, right?

Posted by: Hobby Lobby and The Little Sisters of Denver at February 19, 2014 07:17 AM (POpqt)

82 They don't want you to get your Iodine because

Because people who don't get enough iodine suffer mental deterioration.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cretinism

And then they vote pinko en masse.

Posted by: HR at February 19, 2014 07:17 AM (ZKzrr)

83 Sochi had a similar salt problem; of course in their case, they stupidly ignored an expert opinion of how much salt to order, then were left scrambling when they almost ran out. But it's amazing, when a country is threatened with having to halt a major sporting event, and make their country and their imposing ex KGB leader look bad, the AMOUNT of red tape that magically vanishes to get salt imported in the nick of time.

Posted by: LizLem at February 19, 2014 07:17 AM (BF+2f)

84 Because government makes things more efficient and shit.

Posted by: --- at February 19, 2014 07:17 AM (MMC8r)

85 Also interesting that Obama can't just unilaterally change this law on a whim. Only his Obamacare laws unfavorable to the re-election of Demtards can be changed like that, I guess. Posted by: Bigby's Typing Hands

...........
FIFY

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at February 19, 2014 07:17 AM (Z7PrM)

86 Some enterprising group of individuals could, possibly, if they chose to, make some political points about the pervasiveness of ineffective government. I wonder who could do that?

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 07:18 AM (0HooB)

87 Figures, up to now they were doing great keeping the roads clear.

Posted by: Berserker-Dragonheads Division at February 19, 2014 07:18 AM (FMbng)

88 No industry has received more in the way of government protections than U.S. merchant shipping and those same protections failed to actually protect the industry. Instead, the number of U.S. flagged merchant vessels has dwindled since the passage of the Jones Act. Read 'The Abandoned Ocean' by Andrew Gibson and Arthur Donovan to get the full sad story. 

Posted by: The Emperor Cletus Augustus at February 19, 2014 07:18 AM (xvN0P)

89

Delaware has no problem getting rock salt.

 

*wink

Posted by: Joe Biden at February 19, 2014 07:18 AM (XxAYS)

90 held up in Maine due to lane closure

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 07:19 AM (MhA4j)

91

No industry has received more in the way of government protections than U.S. merchant shipping and those same protections failed to actually protect the industry.

 

It's almost as if people respond rationally to incentives.

Posted by: Frumious Bandersnatch at February 19, 2014 07:19 AM (A0sHn)

92 Salt is , of course, a greenhouse gas.

It's a deadly poison that threatens to murder all life on the planet.

Posted by: Mayor Bloomberg at February 19, 2014 07:19 AM (SY2Kh)

93 33 When it rains it pours.Posted by: Morton at February 19, 2014 11:07 AM (6bMeY)

*Golf Clap*

Posted by: LizLem at February 19, 2014 07:19 AM (BF+2f)

94 With gay marriage now permitted why are the Feds still punishing us?

Posted by: MTF at February 19, 2014 07:20 AM (F58x4)

95

"Even government, the federal government, gets in the way.”

 

I love that.   "Even government... gets in the way."      No shit, Sherlock.     Welcome to    the world.   What are you,   6mos old?   Everyone and their    fucking brother, sister, and ancient Auntie Mabel already knew that.  

 

 

So they could take that ship full of rock salt under non-US flag up to Canada, then go to New Jersey.

 

 

So where exactly in Maine is this ship docked?  I couldn't find in the article.   Because   it should not take THAT LONG to go up to Canada, pull into port for a minute in, like, Nova Scotia, and then chug off down to NJ.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/i][/b][/u] at February 19, 2014 07:20 AM (4df7R)

96 Makes me wonder if this didn't involve New Jersey if the waiver would have been granted.

Posted by: Mainah at February 19, 2014 07:20 AM (659DL)

97
His high majesty papa doc obama believes Americans are a bane to the world, we are imperial colonialists and our standard of living must be brought down to the level of the third world.  No Salt for You!

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at February 19, 2014 07:20 AM (n0DEs)

98 Some enterprising group of individuals could, possibly, if they chose to, make some political points about the pervasiveness of ineffective government. I wonder who could do that? Rotarians? Lion's Club?

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 07:20 AM (p9JxP)

99 We need someone with Merchant Marine experience to weigh in -- get Bill Ayers on the phone stat! I need a nautical metaphor!!

Posted by: Obama the Fascist at February 19, 2014 07:21 AM (ZPrif)

100 Surely Emperor TehWon can issue a retroactive waiver for his bestest buddy, Chris "Lardass" Cristie and help the fellow out?

Posted by: I R A Darth Aggie © at February 19, 2014 07:21 AM (1hM1d)

101 88. yet another overbearing disappointment to top the camel's back

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 07:21 AM (MhA4j)

102 8 How DO such laws get passed? Posted by: Phat campaign cash at February 19, 2014 10:59 AM (SwHqo) That's how they get proposed. They get passed because of patriotism and protectionism and "how can you be against American jobs???" I know that anyone with a grant from the NSF or similar federal agency must travel on a US flag carrier if possible. Now, in reality a simple form and a declaration that there wasn't a reasonable alternative gets you out of it, but the practical effect is that if you fly from Detroit to Amsterdam, you buy your ticket from Delta rather than KLM, so corporate HQ gets the $$ even though the flight is exactly the same.. But I flew Ryan Air from London to Karlsruhe Germany and since Delta doesn't fly that route.

Posted by: AmishDude at February 19, 2014 07:22 AM (T0NGe)

103
All is proceeding according to plan.

Posted by: Big Pepper at February 19, 2014 07:22 AM (n0DEs)

104 Because people who don't get enough iodine suffer mental deterioration. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cretinism And then they vote pinko en masse. Posted by: HR at February 19, 2014 11:17 AM (ZKzrr) Weird -- people on the coasts are most likely to naturally get enough iodine while people in flyover country are least likely to get enough iodine.

Posted by: Mindy at February 19, 2014 07:22 AM (mQwL2)

105 Salt is , of course, a greenhouse gas. It's a deadly poison that threatens to murder all life on the planet. Kills grass.

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 07:22 AM (p9JxP)

106

Some enterprising group of individuals could, possibly, if they chose to, make some political points about the pervasiveness of ineffective government.

I wonder who could do that?

 

-

 

I would say the US Chamber of    Commerce, but they have something     far more important on their plate.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 07:22 AM (AskuI)

107 Raping Gaia is way over-rated. She's all hard and crusty.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 07:22 AM (7ObY1)

108 I'd help, but I can't find my phone...

Posted by: Baraka O'Douche at February 19, 2014 07:22 AM (FcR7P)

109 Rachel Maddow is going to be all over this. If shutting down a bridge is bad, image her outrage when the feds shut down the entire state. sarc/off

Posted by: Duke at February 19, 2014 07:22 AM (d3clc)

110 OT: I just switched over to Chrome and I wanted to see if my premium membership ported over: &

Posted by: Buck Farack, Gentleman Adventurer at February 19, 2014 07:23 AM (Nk6GS)

111 I've got a pen and a phone...but not for you, Fat Boy.

Posted by: Da Preezy at February 19, 2014 07:23 AM (7ObY1)

112 Excellent!

Posted by: Buck Farack, Gentleman Adventurer at February 19, 2014 07:23 AM (Nk6GS)

113 We need someone with Merchant Marine experience to weigh in -- get Bill Ayers on the phone stat! I need a nautical metaphor!! Whatever floats your boat.

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 07:23 AM (p9JxP)

114 Think Heinlein proposed a bicameral approach where one house could pass laws but with a 2/3 majority, while the other house could rescind laws with only a 50+ % majority.

Posted by: Hrothgar at February 19, 2014 07:24 AM (o3MSL)

115

Some enterprising group of individuals could, possibly, if they chose to, make some political points about the pervasiveness of ineffective government.   a killing by shipping some dump   trucks full of rock salt down to NJ    and selling the contents.

 

 

FIFY

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/i][/b][/u] at February 19, 2014 07:24 AM (4df7R)

116 It will take several trips to transport all 40,000 tons, which could take weeks. Just in time for all those Memorial Day snowstorms!

Posted by: t-bird at February 19, 2014 07:24 AM (FcR7P)

117 Sounds like a local story, definitely not of national interest

Posted by: Rachael Maddow at February 19, 2014 07:24 AM (Q6pxP)

118 Definitely a local story

Posted by: Chrissy Mathews at February 19, 2014 07:25 AM (Q6pxP)

119 Posted by: Buck Farack, Gentleman Adventurer at February 19, 2014 11:23 AM (Nk6GS So google is your friend? &&&&

Posted by: Hrothgar at February 19, 2014 07:25 AM (o3MSL)

120 #115 a killing by shipping some dump trucks full of rock salt down to NJ and selling the contents. A Capitalist, innovative, do-it-yourself solution? The hell you say.

Posted by: Your Betters - The Progressives at February 19, 2014 07:25 AM (7ObY1)

121 I gotta be me!

Posted by: Your Democrat Goon Squad[/i][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 07:26 AM (DL2i+)

122 Kills grass. Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 11:22 AM (p9JxP) So does my neighbor's dog.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at February 19, 2014 07:26 AM (IXrOn)

123 Sorry.  A local story.  People around the country really won't care about the roads and bridges of New Jersey.

Posted by: Chris Hayes at February 19, 2014 07:26 AM (Q6pxP)

124 117 Sounds like a local story, definitely not of national interest 118 Definitely a local story Sounds like one for the cables, if you ask me.

Posted by: Charlie Gibson at February 19, 2014 07:26 AM (7ObY1)

125 We need to start passing laws that sunset huge blocks of law within, say, three years. Give Congress a chance to re-pass the ones that make sense. But it's time to just start repealing laws en masse. Who's "we?" There ain't no home team in the game we're watching.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at February 19, 2014 07:26 AM (JQuNB)

126

So where exactly in Maine is this ship docked? I couldn't find in the article. Because it should not take THAT LONG to go up to Canada, pull into port for a minute in, like, Nova Scotia, and then chug off down to NJ.[i/]

 

The graphic in the article has a dot on Searsport, ME.  Using google maps and my thumb as a yardstick, Yarmouth NS looks like 160 miles across the fjord.  (I know it's not a fjord).  So, getting out of port and doing 12 kts and sleeping in Canuckistan overnight delays the start by 2 days.  For argument's sake.

 

Otoh, the diesel exhaust of the merchant ship will add enough to global warmening that the snow will all be melted anyway when it gets to NJ.

Posted by: Frumious Bandersnatch at February 19, 2014 07:27 AM (A0sHn)

127 Think Heinlein proposed a bicameral approach where one house could pass laws but with a 2/3 majority, while the other house could rescind laws with only a 50+ % majority. That sounds interesting, but I'd rather see an automatic sunset provision built into each and every law, say every five years. We should keep the camels out of it altogether.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 07:27 AM (0HooB)

128 Is not this tale of procuring salt, against all odds, also the story of Obama ?

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 19, 2014 07:27 AM (PATb9)

129 I hadn't thought of trying Chrome- thanks for the tip.

OTOH I used to keep Netscape on board.... loved their logo.

Posted by: backhoe at February 19, 2014 07:27 AM (ULH4o)

130 The Jones Act is really a heroic law when you think about it.

Posted by: Chris Hayes, All In at February 19, 2014 07:28 AM (Aif/5)

131 41 The Law is the Jones Act. It does serve a strategic purpose, however, to address two questions: The law is regulated by the USCG which is now a part of Homeland Security. The vessel can get a waiver from the Feds quite easily as was done for vessels after Katrina. One phone call could solve the issue well within the confines of the law but simplicity is not the Gov't way. Posted by: Hawsepiper at February 19, 2014 11:09 AM (ubvtk) I think this goes to the same issue that ace has talked about regarding unenforced laws (specifically, sodomy laws and the harsher marijuana penalties). If you go by the book, the laws are harsh. If you know somebody in the system, the laws are waived. That's the way a lot of law and regulation is going these days.

Posted by: AmishDude at February 19, 2014 07:28 AM (T0NGe)

132 This is such a stark example of the regulatory state's mindless rigidity that you think anyone would get the point. Amazingly, the commenters at the NYT article all seem to think that this is an example of rightwing stupidity, and others merely handwave this as a good thing because "the environment". The willfully blind cannot learn lessons from reality.

Posted by: Roadrunner at February 19, 2014 07:29 AM (K1Xp3)

133 107 Raping Gaia is way over-rated.

She's all hard and crusty.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 11:22 AM (7ObY1)


It makes me love the Horde all over again when I see something like this. Metaphorically. Because physically...well...

Posted by: joncelli at February 19, 2014 07:29 AM (RD7QR)

134 123 Sorry. A local story. People around the country really won't care about the roads and bridges of New Jersey. Posted by: Chris Hayes at February 19, 2014 11:26 AM (Q6pxP) Thread winner!

Posted by: AmishDude at February 19, 2014 07:29 AM (T0NGe)

135 97 Posted by: Guy Mohawk Yet Obama is a Colonialist. He usurps a government/nation/people to exploit, to impose his own dictatorship DESPITE such being rejected by well over 71% of his own initial voters which doesn't include all the voters who opposed his deceits all along. Yes, I'm extrapolating there. He knows full well what a hypocrite he is, his Marxist Liberation Theology, his perversion of "social justice" co-opted of legitimacy since revised to justify reverse prejudice and destruction of contract law, and defiance of Constitutional Rule of Law juxtaposed with Authoritarianism.

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 07:29 AM (MhA4j)

136 The current US skater is all arms and legs! And she's 15.

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at February 19, 2014 07:29 AM (bCEmE)

137 130 The Jones Act is really a heroic law when you think about it. In a way, isn't the story of the Jones Act also the story of Barack Obama?

Posted by: The MFM at February 19, 2014 07:29 AM (7ObY1)

138 Amazingly, the commenters at the NYT article all seem to think that this is an example of rightwing stupidity, and others merely handwave this as a good thing because "the environment". They'd think differently if it were inconveniencing them.

Posted by: --- at February 19, 2014 07:30 AM (MMC8r)

139 Isn't it about time someone comment about....letting it burn,salting the earth, and some third thing?

That's it - Obama's waiting for the burning to commence *before* releasing the salt. Got it.

Posted by: Lizzy at February 19, 2014 07:30 AM (POpqt)

140 The law is called the Jones Act. Also known as the Merchant Marine Act. It was enacted in 1920 to protect US shipping interests from foreign competition. In addition to the port to port rule it only allows US made vessels from becoming US flagged vessels.  It literally takes an act of congress to ok a foreign made vessel to become a US flagged one.
As a yacht broker I like the law. It keeps prices up for US made inspected vessels; vessels authorized to carry passengers within the US.

Posted by: thefritz at February 19, 2014 07:30 AM (lEKuQ)

141 Just in time for all those Memorial Day snowstorms!

I don't understand this joke.

/Minnesotan

Posted by: Hollowpoint at February 19, 2014 07:31 AM (SY2Kh)

142 If you are not tall enough to stab a zombie in the head, you are not a man...

Posted by: Judge Pug at February 19, 2014 07:31 AM (6Nj7A)

143 Fatboy didn't suitably rub me when he gave me that hug before the election.

Posted by: Barack O'Stalin at February 19, 2014 07:31 AM (Q6pxP)

144 That 15 year old skater would be hot ... three years ago.

Posted by: Harry Reid at February 19, 2014 07:31 AM (PATb9)

145 In a way, isn't the story of the Jones Act also the story of Barack Obama? Bridget Jones?

Posted by: t-bird at February 19, 2014 07:31 AM (FcR7P)

146 "I think this goes to the same issue that ace has talked about regarding unenforced laws (specifically, sodomy laws and the harsher marijuana penalties). If you go by the book, the laws are harsh. If you know somebody in the system, the laws are waived." It's worse than that. Stories of absurdly unprofessional police conduct (like the gang who beat an unarmed passive homeless man to death "in self defense" in California http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Kelly_Thomas) which result in exceedingly light punishment are ubiquitous, yet at the same time how many otherwise harmless people get butt-f*cked with every prosecutorial inch of the law over minor possession charges?

Posted by: Roadrunner at February 19, 2014 07:32 AM (K1Xp3)

147 We must not allow a rocksalt gap!

Posted by: General 'Buck' Turgidson at February 19, 2014 07:33 AM (DErq5)

148 The law is that only US flagged ships may go from US port to US port.

So they could take that ship full of rock salt under non-US flag up to Canada, then go to New Jersey.

============


I suspect that that rule specifically forbids this by requiring the ship to "port" in Canada for either a set number of days or to unload a set weight.

Either way, resulting in significant delay.

Posted by: RoyalOil at February 19, 2014 07:33 AM (VjL9S)

149 WASHINGTON -- President Obama signed an order Wednesday that officials say will cut the waiting time on permits to import and export goods "from days to minutes." Currently, businesses submit information to dozens of government agencies, often on paper forms, and must then wait for days before moving goods across U.S. borders. The changes to the International Trade Data System will let businesses send the required information electronically through a single portal before importing or exporting cargo, a White House official said Wednesday morning.‎ Obama's order will direct government agencies to complete work on the new system by December 2016, at the end of his term, the official said. --------- Oh NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !!!

Posted by: RWC at February 19, 2014 07:33 AM (fWAjv)

150 Me. Like. Sunset all laws in 3 years unless they are re- passed by both houses and re-signed by prez. And it must be done long-form (pass the entire bill, not just a stub that says "we re-authorize 1789 USC") and individually, law-by-law, rather than in bulk. Make our would-be betters work for their fat salary for once.

Posted by: sock_rat_eez at February 19, 2014 07:34 AM (SwHqo)

151 And if this was being delivered to  socialist NYC that law would be waived in a second.

Posted by: gracepmc at February 19, 2014 07:34 AM (rznx3)

152 This is why we need comprehensive immigration reform, we need a train of immigrants to do the jobs our ships won't do

Posted by: John McCain at February 19, 2014 07:34 AM (Q6pxP)

153 105. Posted by: rickb223 Ha. Oceans galore. Quick, dilute the oceans!

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 07:34 AM (MhA4j)

154 This was also a problem during the BP spill if I remember correctly. Foreign vessels were not allowed to move their oil booms from port to port or something. But yeah, love the close a bridge vs the whole state angle.

Posted by: Schwalbe: The Me-262© at February 19, 2014 07:34 AM (9Bdcz)

155

"Just in time for all those Memorial Day snowstorms!"

 

This would be taken as further evidence of Global Warming

Posted by: McCool at February 19, 2014 07:34 AM (nCSwS)

156 Government is just not big enough... obviously. 

This country needs to be fundamentally changed.    Maybe healthcare or something.

Posted by: LoneStarHeeb at February 19, 2014 07:35 AM (BZAd3)

157 The purposes of the Jones Act are still sound, even though it was originally passed in 1920.  But the process for    obtaining a waiver should be much easier than it currently is.  This is just ridiculous.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/i][/b][/u] at February 19, 2014 07:36 AM (4df7R)

158

The changes to the International Trade Data System will let businesses send the required information electronically through a single portal before importing or exporting cargo, a White House official said Wednesday morning.ý

 

Because the Feds have demonstrated how good they are at creating single portals / sarc



Posted by: McCool at February 19, 2014 07:36 AM (nCSwS)

159 Okay, here's my plan: Put Christie in a sweatsuit. Put him in a sauna. Let him sweat a while. Bring him out, scrape the body salt out of the sweatsuit, repeat until you have enough for the roads.

Posted by: joncelli at February 19, 2014 07:36 AM (RD7QR)

160 Its funny. This is one of those things that our continued "respect" for the law or gov't does us in. Honestly, that needs to stop. WTF are they going to do if that ship sets sail from Maine and goes to NJ ? Is the Coast Guard going to intercept it and risk the kind of news this bullshit should be getting ? Doubtful. Just another piece of the "burn it down" strategy. Why do we continue to respect the gov't that works against us at every turn ? I have no idea.

Posted by: deadrody at February 19, 2014 07:37 AM (aT8Zk)

161 The changes to the International Trade Data System will let businesses send the required information electronically through a single portal before importing or exporting cargo, a White House official said Wednesday morning.ý



Hahahaha!!!  They just got signed up for Medicare too!


Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 07:37 AM (GQ8sn)

162 Ghandi conducted civil disobedience by making salt against regulations. He was ahead of his time.

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 07:37 AM (mb+MK)

163 The proposal to periodically sunset all laws is a good one. Too bad we have a government that never does anything except lie. There is no legislation that will fix this shit.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at February 19, 2014 07:37 AM (JQuNB)

164 The Feds are pouring salt into Christie's open Bridegegate wounds.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 07:38 AM (6bMeY)

165 Another obvious fix to this problem would be to raise the minimum wage.

Either that or have Kate Upton float around in the vomit comet. 


Either one would probably work.

Posted by: LoneStarHeeb at February 19, 2014 07:38 AM (BZAd3)

166 And if this was being delivered to socialist NYC that law would be waived in a second. Yeah, but try getting all that salt past Bloomie and his ban.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 07:38 AM (0HooB)

167 Can't they find a solution that will allow that rock salt to be taxed at least 4 more times?  I figure 2 more state and 2 more fed (international) extortion schemes should suffice. 

What about the unions? Can't we sweeten the pie for the Unions as well?  Damn it man, there's a crisis here to be managed!

Posted by: Fritz at February 19, 2014 07:38 AM (UzPAd)

168 We need to start passing laws that sunset huge blocks of law within, say, three years. Give Congress a chance to re-pass the ones that make sense. But it's time to just start repealing laws en masse. That is a very reasonable, common sense, practical thing to do. So that will never happen.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at February 19, 2014 07:39 AM (VtjlW)

169 At least we're moving in the right direction.  West, I think.

Posted by: LoneStarHeeb at February 19, 2014 07:39 AM (BZAd3)

170 The changes to the International Trade Data System will let businesses send the required information electronically through a single portal before importing or exporting cargo, a White House official said Wednesday morning. Physical portal server address: 1600 Penn or IRS HQ?

Posted by: Mainah at February 19, 2014 07:39 AM (659DL)

171 157 The purposes of the Jones Act are still sound, even though it was originally passed in 1920. But the process for obtaining a waiver should be much easier than it currently is. This is just ridiculous. This is one instance where the JEF has full legal authority to use his pen and his phone. He just chooses not to.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 07:40 AM (7ObY1)

172 Taxing carbon emissions would be another good way to fix this. 

Posted by: LoneStarHeeb at February 19, 2014 07:40 AM (BZAd3)

173 Obama's order will direct government agencies to complete work on the new system by December 2016,  <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

A normal software company could probably do it by Labor Day.


Posted by: Guy Mohawk at February 19, 2014 07:40 AM (n0DEs)

174 You elitists and your ampersands!

We will rise up and oppose the 1% of people who can use shift+number keys!

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 07:40 AM (x3YFz)

175 We need to start passing laws that sunset huge blocks of law within, say, three years. Give Congress a chance to re-pass the ones that make sense. But it's time to just start repealing laws en masse.


I worry if this could be applied to gun laws that protect our rights.

Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 07:40 AM (GQ8sn)

176 I can tell some of you are feeling a little salty this a.m. and i want to try an (&) did it work?

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:40 AM (nqBYe)

177 Ask not what your country can do for you. Ask why the fuck is my country keeping me from getting rock salt?

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 07:40 AM (mb+MK)

178 for goodness sake i found ampersands! i feel like a woman with a pair of new shoes.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:41 AM (nqBYe)

179 i feel like a woman with a pair of new shoes.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 11:41 AM (nqBYe)



Or a new bra in a shopping bag.



Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 07:41 AM (GQ8sn)

180 All your ampersands are belong to us. &&&&&&&&&&

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 07:41 AM (6bMeY)

181 172 Taxing carbon emissions would be another good way to fix this.

Posted by: LoneStarHeeb at February 19, 2014 11:40 AM (BZAd3)

My dog just cleared the room with a gastrointestinal gift.

Send me the bill.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 07:41 AM (x3YFz)

182 how many otherwise harmless people get butt-f*cked with every prosecutorial inch of the law over minor possession charges? Not many, actually. No, it's true. The reason why you don't hear of it is that it's rare for somebody who otherwise has obeyed the law to get a harsh penalty for possession. It happens, but it's rare. There are two issues with this. First, the lie that the jails are full of simple possession cases. They're not and it undermines the legalizers' case and their integrity. But, second, it makes a mockery of the law. We don't want to put people in jail for simple pot possession, but we want a moral suasion against it, fearing the long-term effects of it. So, instead of being afraid of a well-written and concrete law, we're afraid of an arbitrary and capricious legal system. I should point out that even the legalizers have this arrow in their quiver. In CO, since there is no test for marijuana intoxication, the law says that you can be brought in for DUI if you test positive for pot (which may just mean you smoked at some point within the last 30 days) but the police can just let you on your way if you don't "appear" high. You can guess what will happen: The white college kid in the used beamer gets set free and the black guy with the neck tats gets hauled in.

Posted by: AmishDude at February 19, 2014 07:41 AM (T0NGe)

183 Do I want to attempt an ampersand and risk a trip to the barrel? Thinking, thinking...

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 07:41 AM (7ObY1)

184 149. WASHINGTON -- President Obama signed an order Wednesday that officials say will cut the waiting time on permits to import and export goods "from days to minutes." Currently, businesses submit information to dozens of government agencies, often on paper forms, and must then wait for days before moving goods across U.S. borders. Posted by: RWC Propaganda next round... by refusal to secure borders re: law enforcement of content import/export, the fed neglect amounts tova more efficient use efforts, given the establishment's agenda being open borders. Secondly, he'd claim to be leveling the playing field, since the only businesses that actually submit to the legal process are at a disadvantage to the cheats that ignore the laws already. Make it official: Gumbent Organized Crime.

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 07:42 AM (MhA4j)

185 Kathleen Sebelius always seems to have good long incoherent answers.  Maybe we should ask her.

Posted by: LoneStarHeeb at February 19, 2014 07:42 AM (BZAd3)

186 Everyone here has a Carbon Emitter right behind them.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 07:42 AM (6bMeY)

187 & what do any of you have to say about bridges & roads or State & local govt . on the east coast not having prepared? & look i think they are here to stay!

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:42 AM (nqBYe)

188 My dog just cleared the room with a gastrointestinal gift.

Send me the bill.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 11:41 AM (x3YFz)


Does yours do that and then look around as if to ask "Who did that? Who?"

Posted by: joncelli at February 19, 2014 07:42 AM (RD7QR)

189 When rocksalt is outlawed, only outlaws will have rocksalt.

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 19, 2014 07:42 AM (PATb9)

190 180 All your ampersands are belong to us. &&&&&&&&&&

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 11:41 AM (6bMeY)

"World War III began, oddly enough, over an ASCII character"

First words of my history text.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 07:43 AM (x3YFz)

191 Yes, willow. It worked. I'm rather jealous. *mumbles something about ampersand inequality and walks away*

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 07:43 AM (0HooB)

192 Don't bother me. I'm busy staring at a rice mat, contemplating the sound of one hand clapping and the difference between our government and a mafia protection racket.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at February 19, 2014 07:43 AM (JQuNB)

193 Every time the Carnival commercial featuring four kids 'bobsledding' down the pool slide is shown he notes, "That is against the rules." Even pools have too many laws.

Posted by: New Madrid Fault at February 19, 2014 07:43 AM (YHegH)

194 Blue state.. neener. one never knows if they don't try!

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:43 AM (nqBYe)

195 187 & what do any of you have to say about bridges & roads or State & local govt . on the east coast not having prepared? & look i think they are here to stay! Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 11:42 AM (nqBYe) You're ampersand drunk!

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at February 19, 2014 07:43 AM (bCEmE)

196 & you might like it.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:43 AM (nqBYe)

197 &

Posted by: nnptcgrad at February 19, 2014 07:43 AM (3Y8NA)

198
of course that's just salt.  this is more serious:

The fourth Georgia hospital in two years is closing its doors due to severe financial difficulties caused by ObamacareÂ’s payment cuts for emergency services.

link at drudge.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at February 19, 2014 07:44 AM (n0DEs)

199 I shot an & just to watch it die.

Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, think mink. at February 19, 2014 07:44 AM (kXoT0)

200 Does yours do that and then look around as if to ask "Who did that? Who?"

Posted by: joncelli at February 19, 2014 11:42 AM (RD7QR)

She has no shame. 

Immediately rolled over and asked me to rub her tummy.

I want to be a dog.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 07:44 AM (x3YFz)

201 That is a very reasonable, common sense, practical thing to do. So that will never happen. Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with extra taunting. at February 19, 2014 11:39 AM (VtjlW) Given how complicated the USC is, I doubt you even could do this. "Strike Paragraph's 1-100" "But they refer to 435 and 950? What of those?" "Uhhh, strike them, too, and I guess that strikes 423 and 550, but doubles the power of 224." And that's before you even get to the regulatory apparatus. Good god, I don't know how to even begin untangling this leviathan.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c) (No Really!) at February 19, 2014 07:44 AM (GaqMa)

202 I approve of this.

Posted by: Emperor Bloombucks of the Anti-Sodiumites at February 19, 2014 07:44 AM (EAFHG)

203 199 I shot an ampersand just to watch it die.

Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, think mink. at February 19, 2014 07:44 AM (kXoT0)

204 Tami lol, well all my betters here have been sneaking ampersands into their posts and i was filled with a mighty hope for some of my own! (I read you comment about firefox and noscript) Thanks & i really love you a lot.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:45 AM (nqBYe)

205 The fourth Georgia hospital in two years is closing its doors due to severe financial difficulties caused by ObamacareÂ’s payment cuts for emergency services. Free health care. If you can find it.

Posted by: AmishDude at February 19, 2014 07:45 AM (T0NGe)

206 Rock salt, shotguns, grumpy old men & stolen watermelons......

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 07:45 AM (p9JxP)

207 Common Sense Ampersand Control. &&&&&&&&&&

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 07:45 AM (6bMeY)

208 The Maritime law is the same reason that cruise ships (at least the major lines, which are all foreign-flagged) all include at least one foreign port in their itinerary. As for automatic sunset of laws, I'd actually be in favor of a Constitutional Amendment that would limit the effective period of all laws in a maximum of five years, and that no law may be renewed/extended without being voted on specifically (as opposed to a simple bulk renewal of all of U.S. Code, for example). I'll leave it as an exercise for the lawyers to come up with draft wording.

Posted by: can of spam at February 19, 2014 07:45 AM (b+cLl)

209 I wonder if you FOIA all the records involving the request to waive the law so the ship could transport the salt if there would be any gloating from liberal government workers at screwing over Jersey just because of Christie.  Though they are probably doing that on their illegal fake yahoo accounts.

Posted by: buzzion at February 19, 2014 07:45 AM (LI48c)

210

Apparently there's some protectionist law that says only American-flagged ships can transport our precious patriotic rock salt from American port to American port. Because America.*

 

 

The Jones Act.  Been around for quite some time.

Posted by: Mikey NTH - KaBoom- The Cereal of Settling Now at the Outrage Outlet at February 19, 2014 07:45 AM (hLRSq)

211 On the other side of the Delaware here in PA, we have had 16 'weather events' this winter that have required our DOT to respond. At least 12 snowfalls, but I think I lost count maybe more. We are having freezing rain right now. Last week a little section of the Pa Turnpike didn't get salted and a 100 car pile-up ensued. It's a big fucking deal with weeks of winter left.

Posted by: SE Pa Moron [/i] at February 19, 2014 07:45 AM (CnA98)

212 alex look &&&&&&&&&! woo hooo! & tea.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:46 AM (nqBYe)

213 So google is your friend? &&&& Posted by: Hrothgar at February 19, 2014 11:25 AM (o3MSL) Must be. FF 27 was fucking up generally and FF for Android crashes every time I access the HQ. So fuck 'em I don't owe shit. Although I already miss the integrated RSS in the bookmarks. Are there any extensions/apps/ & whatever to help?

Posted by: Buck Farack, Gentleman Adventurer at February 19, 2014 07:46 AM (Nk6GS)

214 194 Blue state.. neener. one never knows if they don't try! Okay, here goes...(deep breath) &&&&&&

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 07:46 AM (7ObY1)

215 Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at February 19, 2014 11:38 AM (0HooB)

Ah yes salt the enemy of the people.  Forgot.

Posted by: gracepmc at February 19, 2014 07:46 AM (rznx3)

216 No one needs more than 10 ampersands in a single post.  If you do, then you might be a terrorist!


Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 07:46 AM (GQ8sn)

217 Anybody else noticed the GM's flagship, Cadillac, lost their spokesguy, Fishburne, to the new Kia luxury model?  I LOLed.

Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, think mink. at February 19, 2014 07:46 AM (kXoT0)

218 Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 11:45 AM (nqBYe) Party on! Is there any other site on the internet where the commenters celebrate the ability to have an & appear in there posts?!

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at February 19, 2014 07:47 AM (bCEmE)

219 196 & you might like it.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 11:43 AM (nqBYe)

197 &

Posted by: nnptcgrad at February 19, 2014 11:43 AM (3Y8NA)

both of you! to the camps!

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 07:47 AM (x3YFz)

220 Hooray Bluestate! No One can hold us back now!

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:47 AM (nqBYe)

221 Off geological feature lurking and biding its time.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 07:47 AM (YHegH)

222 I like Insty's idea of a special part of Congress that does nothing but repeal laws. It's one of things we should "alter or abolish" should the need arise (which it has). -- Call it the six sigma committee or something

Posted by: Votermom at February 19, 2014 07:47 AM (GSIDW)

223 And FF has been fucking up comment formatting here for ages. No & and line spaces were schizo.

Posted by: Buck Farack, Gentleman Adventurer at February 19, 2014 07:47 AM (Nk6GS)

224 >>The fourth Georgia hospital in two years is closing its doors due to
severe financial difficulties caused by ObamacareÂ’s payment cuts for
emergency services.

Greedy wreckers! I'm getting out my pen and phone and I'm drafting an EO that makes closing hospital illegal. Reggie, get me the IRS, too....

Posted by: Barack the Magnificent at February 19, 2014 07:47 AM (POpqt)

225 It's not just a simple matter of going to a Canadian port and returning to a U.S. port. The Jones Act was written to preclude a foreign vessel from doing that. The cargo would need to be offloaded, then re-stowed. Essentially the salt would have to be imported into Canada, then exported to the U.S.

Posted by: mushdogs at February 19, 2014 07:47 AM (Y21Lm)

226 tangonine er... & try to make me ! runs waiving &&&&& all over the blog.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:47 AM (nqBYe)

227 206 Rock salt, shotguns, grumpy old men & stolen watermelons...... I'll take Unused Verses from Billy Joel's "We Didn't Start the Fire" for 1000, Alex.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 07:48 AM (7ObY1)

228 OK, Willow, what's the secret to ampersands?

Posted by: Lizzy at February 19, 2014 07:48 AM (POpqt)

229 Anybody else noticed the GM's flagship, Cadillac, lost their spokesguy, Fishburne, to the new Kia luxury model? I LOLed.


Was he?  I can't remember any commercial with Fishburne.

I do like the new ad with Neal McDonough, even though I have no intention of buying a hybrid ever.

Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 07:48 AM (GQ8sn)

230 220 Hooray Bluestate! No One can hold us back now! I am shocked & stunned.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 07:48 AM (7ObY1)

231 It's always the same with you right wingers.  You would have us all believe that more &&&'s are the answer to every problem.

Posted by: LoneStarHeeb at February 19, 2014 07:49 AM (BZAd3)

232 Tami, we are humble creatures (snicker) being grateful for the little things.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:49 AM (nqBYe)

233 And that's before you even get to the regulatory apparatus.

Good god, I don't know how to even begin untangling this leviathan.

Posted by: tsrblke, PhD(c)

Apparently just waving a pen and phone around will get you out of any jam these days.

Posted by: weft cut-loop[/i] [/b] at February 19, 2014 07:49 AM (xrX4n)

234 226 tangonine

er... & try to make me !

runs waiving &&&&& all over the blog.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 11:47 AM (nqBYe)

it won't even cut and paste!  It's demons!  I'm possessed by demons!

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 07:49 AM (x3YFz)

235 &&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 07:49 AM (p9JxP)

236 179 i feel like a woman with a pair of new shoes.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 11:41 AM (nqBYe)

Or a new bra in a shopping bag.

Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 11:41 AM (GQ8sn)

 

I'm going to have to see what's in that bag under your seat.

Posted by: Some cop at February 19, 2014 07:49 AM (LI48c)

237 Lizzy firefox will do it if you add on noscript (hint from Tami)

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:49 AM (nqBYe)

238

This is crazy ....

 

... &.

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 19, 2014 07:49 AM (PATb9)

239

Aha! The rock salt corruption scandal. Something else we can hit Chris Christie with!

Rocksaltgate.

Posted by: Big Freakin Media at February 19, 2014 07:50 AM (OZmbA)

240 Wider.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 07:50 AM (6bMeY)

241 If only we had a chief executive with a pen and and telephone...

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at February 19, 2014 07:50 AM (659DL)

242 188?
joncelli?

My current and last dog did that. Thankfully, neither passed gas often- but when they did it startled them. They both would look at their butts like 'WTF  was that?"

Posted by: backhoe at February 19, 2014 07:50 AM (ULH4o)

243 You people wanting to legislate are dinosaurs. Pick up the phone and call Obama's pen.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 07:50 AM (YHegH)

244 ....... and the difference between our government and a mafia protection racket.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at February 19, 2014 11:43 AM (JQuNB)


-----


Mafia protection rackets turn a profit.

Posted by: fixerupper at February 19, 2014 07:50 AM (nELVU)

245 some cop & that was a very, very cruel reminder of my innocent past.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:50 AM (nqBYe)

246

Appears to tie in with the truism that government is not a benevolent force for the good of the people, but simply another institution driven by a wide variety of people with the aim, above all else, to protect their own jobs and turf. 

 

At least an eeevil for profit company will not typically act totally irrationally.

Posted by: RM at February 19, 2014 07:51 AM (fRppw)

247 Mafia protection rackets turn a profit.

Posted by: fixerupper at February 19, 2014 11:50 AM (nELVU)



People that fuck up end up sleeping with the fishes out of a job.


&&&&

Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 07:51 AM (GQ8sn)

248 Are you ready? Are you ready for the Viking Apocalypse? Norse myth predicts world will end this Saturday

Posted by: Judge Pug at February 19, 2014 07:51 AM (6Nj7A)

249 It's time for Christie to start bellowing to the media about this.

"Obama closed the roads for political revenge!" or something a little more subtle.
 

Posted by: PJ at February 19, 2014 07:51 AM (ZWaLo)

250 I think that's a barreling, probably. Sorta. I just don't know anymore, and without my own ampersands, I may never know.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 07:51 AM (0HooB)

251 Amp amp amp, amp ampersand Amp amp amp, amp ampersand Oh Ampersa-a-and, take my hand Ampersa-a-and You got me rockin' & a rollin' Rockin' and a reelin' Ampersand

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 07:51 AM (7ObY1)

252 This may have been covered upthread, tbut hey can waive the Jones Act in cases of emergency. That is what happened when they used cruise ships as dormitories during Katrina. Only a very few (I think less than 2 or 3) cruise ships sail under the American flag.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at February 19, 2014 07:51 AM (OSzB9)

253 Was he? I can't remember any commercial with Fishburne.Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 11:48 AM (GQ8sn)

Yes, mere months ago, he was all over the debut of the new Cadillac CTS.  He was their "official" spokesperson.  Must not have moved enough units or Kia offered him a ton more money.


Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, think mink. at February 19, 2014 07:52 AM (kXoT0)

254 Norse myth predicts world will end this Saturday

Posted by: Judge Pug at February 19, 2014 11:51 AM (6Nj7A)

 

So Ragnarok    will get us    before    the giant disappearing   killer asteroid    (aka, SMOD)?       Or will SMOD be part of Ragnarok?

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/i][/b][/u] at February 19, 2014 07:52 AM (4df7R)

255 OT: President Barack Obama has elevated the right to have sex with a member of the same sex to the level of universal “fundamental freedoms” in a new presidential statement criticizing Uganda.


Fundamental freedom. Is that something like rights endowed by our creator?
Oh, yeah, doesn't really work in this case....

Posted by: Lizzy at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (POpqt)

256 (holding breath)

&

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (x3YFz)

257
Big homemade ice cream has all the rock salt tied up.

Posted by: Sphynx at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (OZmbA)

258 5 minutes till ice time. U-S-A! U-S-A! U-S-A!

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (7ObY1)

259 Mafia protection rackets are not as well armed.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (YHegH)

260 This just highlights the need for a single rock salt provider system.

Posted by: Frumious Bandersnatch at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (A0sHn)

261 First they came for the ampersands but I had no ampersands so I did nothing.

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (mb+MK)

262 uh oh did rick en widen our hip script box?

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (nqBYe)

263 252 Fat man has the power to declare a state of emergency.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (6bMeY)

264 We're in an Ampersand Desert.

Posted by: ScoggDog at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (PATb9)

265 My current and last dog did that. Thankfully, neither passed gas often- but when they did it startled them. They both would look at their butts like 'WTF was that?" My dogs do that then give the old stink eye to the cat.

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (p9JxP)

266 Posted by: joncelli at February 19, 2014 11:42 AM (RD7QR) Only at the HQ.

Posted by: Golfman in NC at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (G7zbY)

267 Norse myth predicts world will end this Saturday



*waits for the Valkyries with bewb armour to come take me away*


Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 07:53 AM (GQ8sn)

268 We must insure we have an American sailor in my port.

Posted by: Bwarney Fwank at February 19, 2014 07:54 AM (Q6pxP)

269 Apparently all I needed for & was an iPad. Maybe some sort of Flash plug-in is possessing your computer tangonine. I'd suggest sacrificing a goat, and learning the coding from its' entrails.

Posted by: nnptcgrad at February 19, 2014 07:54 AM (3Y8NA)

270 nope.  I am ampersandless.

I'm barren.

Forced to wander the earth aimlessly until my dying days.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 07:54 AM (x3YFz)

271 My current and last dog did that. Thankfully, neither passed gas often- but when they did it startled them. They both would look at their butts like 'WTF was that?"

Posted by: backhoe at February 19, 2014 11:50 AM (ULH4o)

My dog was bad about it.  Small dog, huge odor.  I just bought some probiotics at Petsmart that have helped a lot.

Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, think mink. at February 19, 2014 07:54 AM (kXoT0)

272 What about Season 2 of Vikings?

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 07:54 AM (6bMeY)

273 Actually, the Jones Act may not apply in the case of the Katrina cruise ship use. But I think exemptions can be made in emergency situations.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at February 19, 2014 07:54 AM (OSzB9)

274 President Barack Obama has elevated the right to have sex with a member of the same sex to the level of universal “fundamental freedoms” in a new presidential statement criticizing Uganda. Meanwhile in Saudi Arabia...

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at February 19, 2014 07:54 AM (659DL)

275

    Test


     &

Posted by: irongrampa at February 19, 2014 07:54 AM (SAMxH)

276 (holding breath)


Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 11:53 AM (x3YFz)



Get the No-Script add-on if you use Firefox.  Turn off the scripts for this blog and ampersand till the cows come home.



Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 07:54 AM (GQ8sn)

277 Don't look at me.  I'm on a low sodium diet to get rid of this bloat.

Posted by: Chris Christie at February 19, 2014 07:55 AM (Q6pxP)

278 268 We must insure we have an American sailor in my port.
Posted by: Bwarney Fwank
<<



Heh. That made me laugh.  One in _every_ port, eh Barney?

Posted by: Sphynx at February 19, 2014 07:55 AM (OZmbA)

279 Fat Boy can't declare a state of emergency. To do so might diminish Obama's majesty.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 07:55 AM (7ObY1)

280 First, the lie that the jails are full of simple possession cases. [link?] AmishDude You'd be referencing the statistic regarding overcrowding of prisons with NON-VIOLENT offenders -- problematic in costs to incarcerate compounded by societal victimized by early-release of violent inmates on early parole due to overcrowding and legislation designed with such miscarriage of justice as an economic "fix". You wrote "simple possession cases" that may or may not represent all non-violent offenses. True enough, pinstripe crime still pays extremely well without negative consequences from prosecution. Who you know, as ever, can easily erase what you possessed. Disparaître!

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 07:55 AM (MhA4j)

281 *waits for the Valkyries with bewb armour to come take me away* We call them moronettes.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at February 19, 2014 07:56 AM (659DL)

282 @248 Scandi witch doctor crap. The world might end us, but earth is not going anywhere.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 07:56 AM (YHegH)

283 242 188?
joncelli?

My current and last dog did that. Thankfully, neither passed gas often- but when they did it startled them. They both would look at their butts like 'WTF was that?"

Posted by: backhoe at February 19, 2014 11:50 AM (ULH4o)


Yes, my Boston terrier is perpetually astonished by his flatulence, and he farts A LOT. On the other hand, the expression of amazement on his face is so hilarious that I don't mind.

Posted by: joncelli at February 19, 2014 07:56 AM (RD7QR)

284 248
Are you ready?

Are you ready for the Viking Apocalypse? Norse myth predicts world will end this Saturday

Posted by: Judge Pug at February 19, 2014 11:51 AM (6Nj7A)

 

Chris Hemsworth better watch out.  Jormungand might get him.

Posted by: buzzion at February 19, 2014 07:56 AM (LI48c)

285 downloaded EC.  Holding breath.

&&&&

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 07:56 AM (x3YFz)

286 What about Season 2 of Vikings? Next week, IIRC, along with The Americans and Perception. And NASCAR, naturally. Our long national nightmare is at an end.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 07:56 AM (0HooB)

287 tangonine, i will share the joy of finally my personally achieving ampersand script land with you. I realize it isn't the same thing, but it is the thought that counts, yes?

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:56 AM (nqBYe)

288 uh oh did rick en widen our hip script box? I hope not. Don't want no barrel trip.

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 07:56 AM (p9JxP)

289
   That was a test with the newest version of  Firefox and NoScript enabled.

   Since ampersands did not show, obviously more work is needed.

   I DID notice the blog got much wider.

Posted by: irongrampa at February 19, 2014 07:56 AM (SAMxH)

290

The power to tax is the power to destroy, but the power to regulate is the power to destroy absolutely!

Posted by: Hrothgar at February 19, 2014 07:57 AM (o3MSL)

291 SONOFAMF (cussing, lots of cussing)

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 07:57 AM (x3YFz)

292 271 My current and last dog did that. Thankfully, neither passed gas often- but when they did it startled them. They both would look at their butts like 'WTF was that?" Posted by: backhoe at February 19, 2014 11:50 AM (ULH4o) My dog was bad about it. Small dog, huge odor. I just bought some probiotics at Petsmart that have helped a lot. Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, think mink. at February 19, 2014 11:54 AM (kXoT0) Our first sheltie could clear a room, until we got her on a lamb and rice kibble diet. Such a small change, and yet sooooo much less stink.

Posted by: nnptcgrad at February 19, 2014 07:57 AM (3Y8NA)

293 *waits for the Valkyries with bewb armour to come take me away*

We call them moronettes.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at February 19, 2014 11:56 AM (659DL)


Sniff, as if, mere armor can't contain us!


-- Les Girls of Les 'Ettes

Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, think mink. at February 19, 2014 07:57 AM (kXoT0)

294 Posted by: irongrampa at February 19, 2014 11:56 AM (SAMxH)

Noscript never seemed to work for me on FF, but my trusty iPad, now....

Posted by: Hrothgar at February 19, 2014 07:58 AM (o3MSL)

295 No, not the power of government. This is the power of unions.
That salt won't move until unions get their fair share.

These are Obama's people. Democrat party loyalists to the core. America held hostage by mobs in the street. The unions say, 'Pay Me!' or your factories will burn, your ships won't move, and you will starve.


Posted by: Work defines us at February 19, 2014 07:58 AM (bty+M)

296 && ̴̡ı̴̴̡ ̡̡͡|̲̲̲͡͡͡ ̲▫̲͡ ̲̲̲͡͡π̲̲͡͡ ̲̲͡▫̲̲͡͡ ̲|̡̡̡ ̡ ̴̡ı̴̡̡ barge filled with salt stuck in traffic under the GW bridge // FF NoScript user

Posted by: SE Pa Moron [/i] at February 19, 2014 07:58 AM (CnA98)

297 252 This may have been covered upthread, tbut hey can waive the Jones Act in cases of emergency. That is what happened when they used cruise ships as dormitories during Katrina. Only a very few (I think less than 2 or 3) cruise ships sail under the American flag.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at February 19, 2014 11:51 AM (OSzB9)

 

Its in the quoted text that it can be waived.  The Feds denied their request.

Posted by: buzzion at February 19, 2014 07:58 AM (LI48c)

298 If you like your Bewb Armor you can keep your Bewb Armor.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 07:58 AM (6bMeY)

299 287 tangonine, i will share the joy of finally my personally achieving ampersand script land with you.
I realize it isn't the same thing, but it is the thought that counts, yes?

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 11:56 AM (nqBYe)

I appreciate the thoughts.  I'm befuddled.  Mostly because befuddled is fun to type.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 07:58 AM (x3YFz)

300 rick i hope it wasn't me . slinks over to the corner & frets

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 07:58 AM (nqBYe)

301 Why the hell did I just read about the history of & ? And don't let em fool you! Through folk etymology, the word ampersand has sometimes been falsely interpreted as "Amper's and", giving rise to the notion that the sign was invented, or at least popularised, by a certain Mr. Amper.

Posted by: RWC at February 19, 2014 07:59 AM (fWAjv)

302 Sniff, as if, mere armor can't contain us!

So topless then?!?!?



=O

Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 07:59 AM (GQ8sn)

303 Oh, by the way: Notice the Obama Administration, by denying a crucial waiver, is not just shutting down a bridge for one day, but is shutting down all the state roads. I seem to remember Christie was all buddy-buddy with him when he came up to see the Sandy damage. So, Gov Christie, how does it feel to be used?

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at February 19, 2014 07:59 AM (vd7A8)

304 O/T

My bacon haiku....

yes yes yes yes yes
nom nom nom nom nom nom nom
mmm mmm mmm mmm mm



Posted by: fixerupper at February 19, 2014 07:59 AM (nELVU)

305 279. Posted by: BlueStateRebel to call a state of emergency is to feed the "need" for gubmint intervention, fat man's GOP excuse? Like Obama, is Christie saying, "Suck it up!"?

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 07:59 AM (MhA4j)

306 one last try. Then I climb to the top of a clock tower with a high powered assault squirrel: &

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 08:00 AM (x3YFz)

307 Transport it in canoes. Think of how many canoeists that would take and the great benefit it would bring to alleviate the unemployment problem.

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars™ [/i] [/b] [/s] at February 19, 2014 08:00 AM (WAH9w)

308 woah SE Pa moron. looks at my little ampersand .... i'm never satisfied it seems.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 08:00 AM (nqBYe)

309 Congrats tangonine!  I knew you could do it!

Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 08:00 AM (GQ8sn)

310 V I C T O R Y!

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 08:00 AM (x3YFz)

311 Did you guys who just downloaded NoScript and still aren't getting &&&'s restart your computer or Firefox?

Posted by: [/i][/b][/u][/s] Tami at February 19, 2014 08:00 AM (bCEmE)

312 So topless then?!?!?



=O

Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 11:59 AM (GQ8sn)


Pay attention, man, leather corsettes, it's all in the flex.

Posted by: Sherry McEvil, Stiletto Corsettes, think mink. at February 19, 2014 08:00 AM (kXoT0)

313
   This latest iteration of FF seems to be problematic.

   None of the other version I used ever had glitches like this does.  Tempting to revert to an older version.

Posted by: irongrampa at February 19, 2014 08:00 AM (SAMxH)

314 The Jones Act was waived more recently when the Russian tanker Renda delivered fuel to Nome. http://tinyurl.com/lmsfku4

Posted by: Skookumchuk at February 19, 2014 08:00 AM (OSzB9)

315

SE Pa Moron

-

It looks like the barge is   full of pi, which would also be welcome in New Jersey

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at February 19, 2014 08:01 AM (AskuI)

316 OK.... gonna go youtube some MC Hammer for a bit... brb

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 08:01 AM (x3YFz)

317 tango wow! here we are in the land of new toys. so we need to focus on other stuff to conquer.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 08:01 AM (nqBYe)

318

*waits for the Valkyries with bewb armour to come take me away*



 

Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 11:53 AM (GQ8sn)

 

Alas, you'd have to fall in valiant combat to earn a Valkyrie visit,   otherwise you're off to Helheim.     Pick a fight with a dickcheese   enviroweenie right before    TSHTF and you've got a chance.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/i][/b][/u] at February 19, 2014 08:01 AM (4df7R)

319 >>Oh, by the way: Notice the Obama Administration, by denying a crucial waiver, is not just shutting down a bridge for one day, but is shutting down all the state roads.

Hey, we need more casualties to underscore the damage that "extreme weather" can cause. The debate is over, we MUST do something about Climate Change now blah blah pen blah phone....

Posted by: Barack the Magnificent at February 19, 2014 08:01 AM (POpqt)

320 Oh, NJ won't need that salt. Temp here is forty degrees. Perfect weather for shoveling three feet of snowpack off the porch. Perfect for a young man. I'm needing two days for what should take an hour.

Posted by: Work defines us at February 19, 2014 08:01 AM (bty+M)

321 311 Did you guys who just downloaded NoScript and still aren't getting &&&'s restart your computer or Firefox? Posted by: Tami at February 19, 2014 12:00 PM (bCEmE) I had to disable minx.cc

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 08:02 AM (x3YFz)

322 US will be playing hockey on the USA channel on cable tv, Shortly.

Posted by: Ms. M at February 19, 2014 08:02 AM (+qScL)

323 Russia is now out? Putin is royally pissed. Watch your ass, Ukraine!

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars™ [/i] [/b] [/s] at February 19, 2014 08:03 AM (WAH9w)

324 Internet Exploder seems to work better here.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 08:03 AM (6bMeY)

325 Chris Hemsworth better watch out. Jormungand might get him.

Posted by: buzzion at February 19, 2014 11:56 AM (LI48c)

 

 

Forget the     snake.   He'd better watch out for ME.

 

Sexy Aussies/Kiwis are   one of my many weaknesses.  *cough*

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit [/s][/i][/b][/u] at February 19, 2014 08:03 AM (4df7R)

326

Oh, and I guess one has to not read the comments when there are delayed sports events to be watched?  Was hoping to watch the Finland-Russia hockey game today (delayed, on the computer, haven't watched one second on the TV), but now that I know the outcome, thanks to the intermittent "updates" here ......

 

Would be nice if we had a "no spoiler" approach to comments when the event is before 5AM on the left coast. 

 

Meanwhile, NJ, Christie?  Ha.  Who cares.  My concern now extends as far as my nose, thanks to the disappearance of anything resembling "Americans" in the US.   Including where I live.  My tiniest violin broke some time ago.  No plans to replace it.

 

Posted by: non-purist at February 19, 2014 08:03 AM (afQnV)

327
  One more test

  &&

Posted by: irongrampa at February 19, 2014 08:03 AM (SAMxH)

328 Oh... now that I can format text? The beast is unleashed.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 08:03 AM (x3YFz)

329 Still nothing.

Posted by: irongrampa at February 19, 2014 08:03 AM (SAMxH)

330 New Jersey is on the ocean. The ocean is full of salt water. Evaporating salt water leaves salt behind.

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at February 19, 2014 08:04 AM (5xmd7)

331 We need to start passing laws that sunset huge blocks of law within, say, three years. Give Congress a chance to re-pass the ones that make sense. But it's time to just start repealing laws en masse.


... this is a perfect idea to keep those folks in DC busy .. going something.

Posted by: Harry Reid's liver at February 19, 2014 08:04 AM (e8kgV)

332 Alas, you'd have to fall in valiant combat to earn a Valkyrie visit, otherwise you're off to Helheim.Pick a fight with a dickcheese enviroweenie right before TSHTF and you've got a chance.


*rises up and dons helmet*


*falls in an attempt to get same-day service at the DMV*


Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 08:04 AM (GQ8sn)

333 I had to disable minx.cc

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 12:02 PM (x3YFz)


----


Soooooo..... you had to install NoScript..... then disable it.... on minx..... to get ampersands???


Posted by: fixerupper at February 19, 2014 08:05 AM (nELVU)

334 looks at my little ampersand .... i'm never satisfied it seems. Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 12:00 PM (nqBYe) Cheer up! Here... (slides willow roofie through USB port)

Posted by: SE Pa Moron [/i] at February 19, 2014 08:05 AM (CnA98)

335 What about treating roads with seawater?

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 08:05 AM (6bMeY)

336 Did the Finns beat the Russkies? They must be celebrating in Suomi (I think).

Posted by: joncelli at February 19, 2014 08:05 AM (RD7QR)

337 327 One more test Posted by: irongrampa at February 19, 2014 12:03 PM (SAMxH) i had to block minx.cc.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 08:05 AM (x3YFz)

338 Randomness.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Door_to_Hell

Posted by: HR at February 19, 2014 08:05 AM (ZKzrr)

339 Cicero's slave Tiro invented the ampersand and an entire system of shorthand which is why we still have so many of Cicero's speeches.

Posted by: WalrusRex at February 19, 2014 08:05 AM (mb+MK)

340 Oh... now that I can format text?

The beast is unleashed.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 12:03 PM (x3YFz)



Your posts should now look normal after you hit POST.  You should not have any more issues with paragraph or line breaks.

Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 08:05 AM (GQ8sn)

341 V I C T O R Y! Posted by: tangonine For you. Assault squirrel is now pissed off for the call out & stand down order.

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 08:05 AM (p9JxP)

342 Off to scare up some lunch. I see if I can find some rock salt at the Giant.

Posted by: joncelli at February 19, 2014 08:06 AM (RD7QR)

343 What about treating roads with seawater?

*deadpan* Bad for the environment.


There's a couple places in WI that use the brine leftover from cheesemaking.

Posted by: HR at February 19, 2014 08:06 AM (ZKzrr)

344 And heeeeere we go! Our boys are on the ice. Let's go USA! America-FUCK YEAH!!!!!

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 08:06 AM (7ObY1)

345 I know this probably won't work, but I'll try anyway. &&&&&&&&&&&

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 08:06 AM (0HooB)

346 Christie is anti-transportation. He's for stay-at-homers. Hell, we're all bound for unemployment at some point at which time, what difference does it make? (Hillary Ruthless Clinton) Peabrains will say he's environmentally conscious. Commuters call him something else. What the hell stump is he going to POTUS campaign on? "Fly-mobiles: get above it all!" You want your ground mobiles? You can keep them -- in your garage. But get those eyesores off the street!

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 08:06 AM (MhA4j)

347 We get another 6" of microagressive racist snow tomorrow. Yea!!!!

Posted by: Minnfidel at February 19, 2014 08:06 AM (/o+xv)

348 If there was a margarita shortage in Congress they would find a solution to the rock salt gap.

Posted by: Mr. Dave at February 19, 2014 08:06 AM (8mhW/)

349 Huh? How can this be? &&&&&&

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 08:07 AM (0HooB)

350
    Snowing again here.

   I blame ampersands.

Posted by: irongrampa at February 19, 2014 08:07 AM (SAMxH)

351 Posted by: SE Pa Moron at February 19, 2014 11:58 AM (CnA9 I see the volcano; where is the barge?

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars™ [/i] [/b] [/s] at February 19, 2014 08:07 AM (WAH9w)

352 Huh? How can this be?

&&&&&&

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at February 19, 2014 12:07 PM (0HooB)



Are you typing on an Apple product or using a browser that doesn't have issues with javascript?



Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 08:07 AM (GQ8sn)

353 It's New Joisey. Outside their borders, nobody gives a fuck. Least of all, me. They love their government dominated society.

Posted by: maddogg at February 19, 2014 08:07 AM (xWW96)

354
Wahoo.  USA USA

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at February 19, 2014 08:07 AM (n0DEs)

355 I'm one of Pixy's Chosen Ones! Hooray! &&&&&&&&&

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 08:08 AM (0HooB)

356 SCOOOOOORE! Already! USA 1-0

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 08:08 AM (7ObY1)

357 I should be watching Canada vs Latveria, but US vs Czech Republic seems like it'll be way more interesting.

Posted by: Waterhouse at February 19, 2014 08:08 AM (t8ySh)

358 Did the Finns beat the Russkies? They must be celebrating in Suomi (I think). Posted by: joncelli at February 19, 2014 12:05 PM ..Since it was already posted by someone (thanks allot) Yes. HAHAHAHAHAAHA!!!! bastards! The pic of Pooty Poot was priceless.

Posted by: Minnfidel at February 19, 2014 08:08 AM (/o+xv)

359 Now witness the firepower of this fully ampersandable battle station.

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 08:08 AM (6bMeY)

360 looks at my little ampersand .... i'm never satisfied it seems. Posted by: willow Do it with the lights off. It'll feel bigger.

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 08:08 AM (p9JxP)

361 .Since it was already posted by someone (thanks allot) Yes. HAHAHAHAHAAHA!!!! bastards! The pic of Pooty Poot was priceless.


Oh shit!!!  Where?!?!?


Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 08:09 AM (GQ8sn)

362 I see if I can find some rock salt at the Giant. You should also buy a bag of play sand at half the cost. Mix the two 50/50. It's what a bunch of the local towns are doing to cut costs and increase supplies now. I only use sand on my driveway. I can't possible melt the luge run we used to call a driveway. The sand gives good traction and goes a long way.

Posted by: SE Pa Moron [/i] at February 19, 2014 08:09 AM (CnA98)

363 & Hmmmm....

Posted by: fixerupper at February 19, 2014 08:09 AM (nELVU)

364 p soon there will be a corner with discarded ampersands lonely. &. crying when we find a new toy.

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 08:09 AM (nqBYe)

365 Through folk etymology, the word ampersand has sometimes been falsely interpreted as "Amper's and", giving rise to the notion that the sign was invented, or at least popularised, by a certain Mr. Amper. What a load of shit.

Posted by: Sir Thomas Crapper at February 19, 2014 08:09 AM (JQuNB)

366 Live Stream of USA Hockey Game?

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 08:09 AM (6bMeY)

367 366 Live Stream of USA Hockey Game? USA Network has the stream, Boss

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 08:10 AM (7ObY1)

368 Don't forget the BP gulf oil spill, and the refusal by the Feds to allow foreign-flagged skimmer boats to assist in the cleanup. Of course, bear in mind the left craved worst results for America.

Posted by: Erowmero at February 19, 2014 08:10 AM (OONaw)

369 For you. Assault squirrel is now pissed off for the call out & stand down order. Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 12:05 PM (p9JxP) He'll be fine. SSgt Furry is a solid vet of the 3d BDE. He'll drop his nuts and rally up within minutes. If he's not called upon for direct action I throw out some extra walnuts. My squirrels are loyal warriors. He does need a bath, though.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 08:10 AM (x3YFz)

370 290. The power to tax is the power to destroy, but the power to regulate is the power to destroy absolutely! Posted by: Hrothgar at February 19, 2014 11:57 AM (o3MSL) That wrapped it up here. /later

Posted by: panzernashorn at February 19, 2014 08:10 AM (MhA4j)

371 Huh? How can this be? ...For he is the Kwizatz Haderach...! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Posted by: Brother Cavil has wormsign at February 19, 2014 08:10 AM (naUcP)

372 Latveria? Peruvia's distaff cousin? How can they even afford ice?

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars™ [/i] [/b] [/s] at February 19, 2014 08:10 AM (WAH9w)

373 Pussies .

Posted by: Canada at February 19, 2014 08:11 AM (XWw96)

374 Are you typing on an Apple product or using a browser that doesn't have issues with javascript? Nope. I'm on a PC running Win7 and IE 11. Actually, it's B'Gal's, a late Christmas gift we got Monday. I updated Windows and installed the latest Java first thing. Damn. I have &&&&&&&&&!

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 08:11 AM (0HooB)

375
We could use a hockey thread.  and by use it, I mean pound it like a virgin on prom night at the whiskey-a-go-go.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at February 19, 2014 08:11 AM (n0DEs)

376 Valkyries?

NorthWorld....

Posted by: backhoe at February 19, 2014 08:11 AM (ULH4o)

377

So I guess I have to watch the US game now, or not read the comments?

 

Oh well.  So does the US team play NHL style (dump and sort-of chase, lots of hitting from behind, slap shots that miss the net from the face-off circle, holding and interference, slow)?  Or is there any hockey in their hockey?

 

 

Posted by: non-purist at February 19, 2014 08:11 AM (afQnV)

378 Huh? How can this be?

...For he is the Kwizatz Haderach...!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Posted by: Brother Cavil has wormsign at February 19, 2014 12:10 PM (naUcP)



*golf clap*


Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 08:11 AM (GQ8sn)

379 348 If there was a margarita shortage in Congress they would find a solution to the rock salt gap. Posted by: Mr. Dave at February 19, 2014 12:06 PM (8mhW/) If that rock salt was instead methamphetamine coming from Canada, all 40,000 tons would be on the streets days ago.

Posted by: model_1066 at February 19, 2014 08:11 AM (LIQGY)

380 TÊst

&

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at February 19, 2014 08:12 AM (Y+MEB)

381 The assault squirrel is probably a Russian black squirrel. Packs of them have allegedly done some unbelievable things. Seriously. IIRC, they attacked a dog about ten years ago.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 08:12 AM (YHegH)

382 If you print an ampersand in Constantina or Trebuchet font, you will see it's no contraction of the Latin word for "and". It is just the injection of "Et" into English sentences.

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at February 19, 2014 08:12 AM (5xmd7)

383
a new thread would keep the spoilers away.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at February 19, 2014 08:13 AM (n0DEs)

384 Starring Chris Christie as Baron Harkonnen.


Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 08:13 AM (GQ8sn)

385 No! Fuck. The Czechs just scored. C'mon, Jonathan Quick! US- 1, CZ- 1

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 08:13 AM (7ObY1)

386 So we're up by a basket?

Posted by: Boss Moss at February 19, 2014 08:13 AM (6bMeY)

387 Erowmero, yes i do remember and something about skimmers that could be attained to grab the oil layer?

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 08:13 AM (nqBYe)

388 Test. &&&&

Posted by: Skookumchuk at February 19, 2014 08:14 AM (OSzB9)

389 The salt must floooowww

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at February 19, 2014 08:14 AM (5xmd7)

390 Hot damn.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at February 19, 2014 08:14 AM (OSzB9)

391 Do you know what is in the hearts of the roads? Even if so, does that grant you the wisdom to use this salt of the rock?

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars™ [/i] [/b] [/s] at February 19, 2014 08:14 AM (WAH9w)

392 Of course, bear in mind the left craved worst results for America.

That's their normal operational mode.  Crises just intensify it.

Posted by: HR at February 19, 2014 08:14 AM (ZKzrr)

393 If that rock salt was instead methamphetamine coming from Canada, all 40,000 tons would be on the streets up Mayor Rob Ford's nose days ago. Fixed for accuracy.

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 08:15 AM (p9JxP)

394 Erowmero, yes i do remember and something about skimmers that could be attained to grab the oil layer?

Posted by: willow at February 19, 2014 12:13 PM (nqBYe)



There was also the bizarre requirement from the Coast Guard that all vessels had to have a certain number of approved lifejackets or show that whatever technology or method they were using had to reduce the oil content down to a certain percentage or parts per million.  I remember reading that they had to dump the oil water back into the gulf!   How f-ing crazy is that?????



Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 08:15 AM (GQ8sn)

395 Chris Christie is the bacon whisperer.

Posted by: model_1066 at February 19, 2014 08:15 AM (LIQGY)

396 I'ma happier than willow. If I could spin around whilst sitting on the couch, I would.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 08:15 AM (0HooB)

397 381 The assault squirrel is probably a Russian black squirrel. Packs of them have allegedly done some unbelievable things. Seriously. IIRC, they attacked a dog about ten years ago. Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 12:12 PM (YHegH) Not mine. My squirrels are trained in COIN, recon, combat tracking, intel. They'd never engage in DA against a canine. They'd trap said K-9 and place IEDs.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 08:15 AM (x3YFz)

398 T9, i apologize if you already announced it, but is the morale patch good to go?

Posted by: fastfreefall at February 19, 2014 08:16 AM (6A2U7)

399 Oh shit!!! Where?!?!? Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 12:09 PM .On the Drudge link lower right. It is priceless.

Posted by: Minnfidel at February 19, 2014 08:16 AM (/o+xv)

400 The salt must floooowww

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at February 19, 2014 12:14 PM (5xmd7)



We have just folded space from New Jersey.



Many new bridges in New Jersey.



Posted by: Guild Navigator at February 19, 2014 08:16 AM (GQ8sn)

401 Second on the play sand recommendation. Also, ampersand test: &&&&&

Posted by: Darles Chickens at February 19, 2014 08:16 AM (z4vvZ)

402 WTF? I have Latvia v. Canada on PMSDNC. Where is the US?

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 08:16 AM (YHegH)

403 What a load of shit.

Posted by: Sir Thomas Crapper

There's always room for dessert~!

Posted by: Martin Bashir [/i] [/b] at February 19, 2014 08:16 AM (xrX4n)

404 So, is this the Salic Law of which historians speak?

Posted by: Krebs v Carnot: Epic Battle of the Cycling Stars™ [/i] [/b] [/s] at February 19, 2014 08:17 AM (WAH9w)

405 On the Drudge link lower right. It is priceless.


Aww crap, it's gone!


Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 08:17 AM (GQ8sn)

406 402 WTF? I have Latvia v. Canada on PMSDNC. Where is the US? The USA Network

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 08:17 AM (7ObY1)

407
   Freaking 1-2" snow storms we've been getting after the big ones are a total pain.  Especially since the Committee decreed my policy of "Mother Nature put it there, she can take it away" is no longer operable.

   Not to mention what a budget buster for the town they are.

Posted by: irongrampa at February 19, 2014 08:17 AM (SAMxH)

408 Not mine. My squirrels are trained in COIN, recon, combat tracking, intel. They'd never engage in DA against a canine. They'd trap said K-9 and place IEDs. Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 12:15 PM (x3YFz) I'm still working on my squirrel army...all the bastards seem to want to do is grab half-eaten food out of the dumpsters and tease my dog. No discipline at all.

Posted by: model_1066 at February 19, 2014 08:18 AM (LIQGY)

409 Figure skater with boobs on NBCSN.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 08:18 AM (YHegH)

410 "Not many, actually. No, it's true. The reason why you don't hear of it is that it's rare for somebody who otherwise has obeyed the law to get a harsh penalty for possession. It happens, but it's rare. " I'm not even talking specifically about drugs. Ever hear about this guy? http://tinyurl.com/lbkrgdo "Mark Witaschek, a successful financial adviser with no criminal record, is facing two years in prison for possession of unregistered ammunition after D.C. police raided his house looking for guns. Mr. Witaschek has never had a firearm in the city, but he is being prosecuted to the full extent of the law. The trial starts on Nov. 4." Personally, some people on the right wing are a little too naive about the current state of our police force and their professionalism. I'm not a loon who thinks that every instance of the police getting rough is wrong (Rodney King deserved what he got), but on the whole there clearly is a disturbing trend of militarization of the police and over-zealous enforcement of possession laws.

Posted by: Roadrunner at February 19, 2014 08:18 AM (K1Xp3)

411 They'd have to shift some cargo around in Halifax though. The Jones Act is idiotic though. But these days the trucking industry is as much part of the problem as anyone. No one competing with ocean shipping wants to open up the market. Rent seekers all.

Posted by: Roy at February 19, 2014 08:18 AM (ggEAc)

412

Late to the discussion (are all threads going to eventually become ampersands and hockey updates?), but I'm on  the side of not letting smelly foreign boats floating all over the place. 

 

If NJ needs salt, maybe  they shoulda hired a true, red-blooded Amerkin boat. 

Posted by: BurtTC at February 19, 2014 08:18 AM (TOk1P)

413 BREAKING NEWS !!!!!


Friday, February 14, 2014 – Nestlé USA’s Prepared Foods Division today announced the voluntary recall of HOT POCKETS® brand Philly Steak and Cheese in three different pack sizes and HOT POCKETS® brand Croissant Crust Philly Steak and Cheese, in the two pack box.

The voluntary recall is limited to these two products, which were distributed nationwide.


... Cartman was unavailable for comment.

Posted by: Harry Reid's liver at February 19, 2014 08:19 AM (e8kgV)

414 T9

Tried the email addy you gave me.
No joy.

And....I am still ampersandless.


Oh, the Pain!!
*Places back of hand against forehead*

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at February 19, 2014 08:19 AM (Y+MEB)

415 Friday, February 14, 2014 – Nestlé USA’s Prepared Foods Division today announced the voluntary recall of HOT POCKETS® brand Philly Steak and Cheese in three different pack sizes and HOT POCKETS® brand Croissant Crust Philly Steak and Cheese, in the two pack box.

The voluntary recall is limited to these two products, which were distributed nationwide.



From my cold, dead hands.



Posted by: EC at February 19, 2014 08:19 AM (GQ8sn)

416 398 T9, i apologize if you already announced it, but is the morale patch good to go? Posted by: fastfreefall at February 19, 2014 12:16 PM (6A2U7) I sent a fix this morning to my almost-speaka-de-engrish contact at the patch co. "Wolverines" has been replaced with "But First..." It'll take a week or #twoweeks to get the initial order of 50 in. 5 bucks each, paypal. (oddly enough, the patches I bought at SHOT were $20.... freaking thievery) details will follow, I don't charge anyone anything until I have patches to ship.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 08:20 AM (x3YFz)

417 I was just talking to an executive for a cruise ship line the other day. I asked why it is that there's no way to simply take a cruise ship up the West Coast of America -- LA, SF, Seattle, for example. She rolled her eyes and went on a rant about the Jones Act. It drives the entire cruise industry crazy. Forces them to ALWAYS have to go to Mexico or Canada or the Caribbean on EVERY cruise. They could do huge business simply doing cruises up and down the Eastern Seaboard as well, she said, but crazily it's illegal. (Because cruise ship are always registered in foreign countries with -- ta da!! -- lower taxes. Even if it's an American company.) The rationale for the law is long past, really.

Posted by: zombie at February 19, 2014 08:20 AM (+cx5n)

418 410?
RR?

I'm with you. With all the video gear we have now I've seen far too much thuggishness by LEO's. It needs to be publicized and stopped.

Posted by: backhoe at February 19, 2014 08:21 AM (ULH4o)

419 Ampersand is literally the three letters  a-n-d.

It wasn't meant to mean and.  Just the sound a-n-d makes.

Lllliterally.

Posted by: eleven at February 19, 2014 08:21 AM (KXm42)

420 There could be a video of Barky the Magnificent eating human flesh while butt-fucking a dead boy and cackling "TIME FOR SOME TRAFFIC PROBLEMS IN JOISEY!!!!!" and the press would still defend him.

OT:  Entire Russian Hockey Team Scheduled To Shoot Itself in the Back of the Head Three Times and Then Throw Itself Off a Ten Storey Building (AKA, eliminated from tournament by the Dirty Scandi Finns).

Posted by: Sharkman at February 19, 2014 08:22 AM (TM1p8)

421 I hope they didn't ship any of those hot pockets to Alabama.

Posted by: SE Pa Moron [/i] at February 19, 2014 08:22 AM (CnA98)

422 The rationale for the law is long past, really. And not just that one law, either. I'm sure there are some laws concerning buggy whips that are still on the books.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 08:22 AM (0HooB)

423 Oh, the Pain!!
*Places back of hand against forehead*

Do you see what you're doing to this person?

Posted by: eleven at February 19, 2014 08:23 AM (KXm42)

424 Ramparts and Ditches - the Roman Killing Zone http://goo.gl/GQ2Vh5 This is what we need to do: build a moron killing zone.

Posted by: Judge Pug at February 19, 2014 08:23 AM (6Nj7A)

425 414 T9 Tried the email addy you gave me. No joy. And....I am still ampersandless. Oh, the Pain!! *Places back of hand against forehead* Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at February 19, 2014 12:19 PM (Y+MEB) ok. T9 tech support. If you're running firefox, download https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/noscript/ install and restart, then under options (lower right corner of your screen) forbid minx.cc

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 08:23 AM (x3YFz)

426

A companion law to the Jones Act is the PSA, Passenger Services Act. The PSA is a failed law that only allows US flagged ships to transport passengers between US ports without a "distant foreign port" stop.

The law was passed to protect US flagged passenger ships (we call them cruise ships now) from cheap foreign competition. The net effect of 80 years of the PSA is that we have exactly (drum roll please....) ONE US flagged major passenger ship while dozens of foreign flag ships from a dozen lines call on US ports daily taking millions of Americans on vacation. these ships are required to do stupid things like call in Ensenada or vancouver while doing a simple West Coast cruise or sail two days out of the way to Kirabati instead of spending time in the Hawaii islands and spending money there. It's a big waste of time and fuel and lost revenue for US ports just to keep the one remaining US ship sailing.

Posted by: Max Entropy at February 19, 2014 08:23 AM (cgtTL)

427 @406 BSR Thanks! Though the figure skater with boobs was not bad. On triples landings especially.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 08:24 AM (YHegH)

428 Couple of good chances there for the US. Damn!

Posted by: Minnfidel at February 19, 2014 08:24 AM (/o+xv)

429 This is what we need to do: build a moron killing zone. Posted by: Judge Pug at February 19, 2014 12:23 PM (6Nj7A) Naw... worse than killing is mocking. To a liberal, being made fun of is a fate worse than death.

Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 08:25 AM (x3YFz)

430 5 bucks each, paypal. (oddly enough, the patches I bought at SHOT were $20.... freaking thievery) details will follow, I don't charge anyone anything until I have patches to ship. Sweet!

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 08:25 AM (p9JxP)

431 There could be a video of Barky the Magnificent eating human flesh while butt-fucking a dead boy and cackling "TIME FOR SOME TRAFFIC PROBLEMS IN JOISEY!!!!!" and the press would still defend him. FNC had the story yesterday of the new coal regs adding to the price of energy. They failed to show the YooToob video of TFG saying he'd make everyone's energy bills "necessarily skyrocket." FNC...

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 08:26 AM (0HooB)

432 Personally, some people on the right wing are a little too naive about the current state of our police force and their professionalism. I'm not a loon who thinks that every instance of the police getting rough is wrong (Rodney King deserved what he got), but on the whole there clearly is a disturbing trend of militarization of the police and over-zealous enforcement of possession laws. Posted by: Roadrunner at February 19, 2014 12:18 PM (K1Xp3) Shut up, wingnut!

Posted by: US Dept of Agriculture Swat Team at February 19, 2014 08:27 AM (JQuNB)

433 5 bucks each, paypal --------------- Right-effin-on! &

Posted by: fastfreefall at February 19, 2014 08:28 AM (6A2U7)

434 I'm sure there are some laws concerning buggy whips that are still on the books. Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at February 19, 2014 12:22 PM (0HooB) Not if you're Robert Mapplethorpe: you probably don't want to go here: NSFW http://www.artnet.com/magazine/FEATURES/kuspit/kuspit6-10-18.asp

Posted by: model_1066 at February 19, 2014 08:28 AM (LIQGY)

435 Other comments blocked for badness.

Posted by: AMDG at February 19, 2014 08:29 AM (t7OO0)

436 2-0 USA Woot!

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 08:30 AM (7ObY1)

437 I mean 2-1 USA, sorry

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 08:30 AM (7ObY1)

438 Firstly, screw New Jersey. Secondly, screw New Jersey.

Posted by: blue at February 19, 2014 08:30 AM (T0P22)

439 Oh, the Pain!! *Places back of hand against forehead* Do you see what you're doing to this person? We need a fainting couch! Stat!

Posted by: rickb223 at February 19, 2014 08:30 AM (p9JxP)

440 Nah. Every little town and government agency needs a SWAT team in body armor deploying Barret 50s out of an MRAP.

Posted by: Hitler, Lenin, Mao, Pol Pot, and Stalin in Hell at February 19, 2014 08:31 AM (YHegH)

441 Ain't no way I'ma clicking on a Mapplethorpe link. I've heard things, bad things. I'll be over here, playing with my &&&&&s. Don't mind me.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit[/i][/u][/b][/s] at February 19, 2014 08:31 AM (0HooB)

442 We need a fainting couch! Stat! ... have you seen what the Horde does to couches...?

Posted by: Brother Cavil has wormsign at February 19, 2014 08:31 AM (naUcP)

443 Fun Fact: There are FIVE players on the US hockey team named "Ryan." Ryan Kesler, Ryan Suter, Ryan McDonagh, Ryan Callahan, Ryan Miller.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at February 19, 2014 08:32 AM (7ObY1)

444 Ryan Kesler, Ryan Suter, Ryan McDonagh, Ryan Callahan, Ryan Miller


Buncha freakin cloverbacks.

Posted by: eleven at February 19, 2014 08:33 AM (KXm42)

445 >>She rolled her eyes and went on a rant about the Jones Act. It drives the entire cruise industry crazy. Forces them to ALWAYS have to go to Mexico or Canada or the Caribbean on EVERY cruise. They could do huge business simply doing cruises up and down the Eastern Seaboard as well, she said, but crazily it's illegal. (Because cruise ship are always registered in foreign countries with -- ta da!! -- lower taxes. Even if it's an American company.) " There's a war on Terror on that coast. We'd have to charge hazard rates.

Posted by: Guild of Legitimate Businessmen at February 19, 2014 08:34 AM (5xmd7)

446 "Shut up, wingnut!" Do what you will to me, but don't confiscate and euthanize my pet deer like the Wisconsin Department of Natural Resources. http://tinyurl.com/mmc6jm5 But seriously, think about it; how branches of the government--both on the local, state, and federal level--can mobilize armed agents to raid your property for the most minor of possession infringement, be it deer, guns, or pot? That should scare anyone who believes in small government and individual rights.

Posted by: Roadrunner at February 19, 2014 08:34 AM (K1Xp3)

447 Ryan Seacrest can really kill a power play.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 08:35 AM (YHegH)

448 440 Nah. Every little town and government agency needs a SWAT team in body armor deploying Barret 50s out of an MRAP. Posted by: Hitler, Lenin, Mao, Pol Pot, and Stalin in Hell at February 19, 2014 12:31 PM (YHegH) That's only because the heavy artillery spooks the livestock and violates local noise laws. And ICBMs are just aren't fashionable anymore.

Posted by: model_1066 at February 19, 2014 08:35 AM (LIQGY)

449 "then under options (lower right corner of your screen) forbid minx.cc" And that's when the fight started. I don't have "options" in the lower right hand corner.

Posted by: Village Idiot'sApprentice at February 19, 2014 08:35 AM (Y+MEB)

450 In the spirit of my long-departed girlfriend Marple (google my nic), I am allowing myself one long deep sigh.

What about the Catholic conservative argument that sometimes when you come to a gate, it's there for a reason, and you shouldn't teat it down all at once? Didn't a major moronette hold, stridently, just yesterday, with support, that a nation's laws are a reflection of its culture, and ever ought to be?

At least nobody has called them Merchant Marines yet. Due any second.

I note no more than three commenters here even trying to imagine what the purpose of the Jones Act might have been, and everybody else is just nyaa-nyaa. We're carrying on like a dormroom of College Libertarians. There'a teensy-weensy li'l bit of shallowness creeping into the level of discourse here, and frankly it makes my dog fart ampersands. Yay us!

Frankly I blame Richard Henry Dana and his damned sentimental songs.
Try spending two years before this mast, baby!


Posted by: Stringer Davis at February 19, 2014 08:38 AM (xq1UY)

451 Go and read "The FBI Story" which was printed in 1950. Go and read "Red Harvest" which Hammett based on his Pinkerton days helping bust unions in Wyoming. The only thing "militarized" about today's cops is the invention and use of effective personal armor. 100 years ago police departments had belt-fed .30 caliber Browning machine guns and used them against perps holed up in apartment buildings.

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at February 19, 2014 08:38 AM (5xmd7)

452 I believe that the Jones Act was one of the reasons that the Obama Administration used to prevent the clean up of the Gulf oil spill several years ago.  At the time I thought that they were merely being phenomenally stupid by throwing an endless series of bureaucratic obstacles against everybody who was trying to stop the slow moving oil slick from reaching the Gulf Coast beaches and wetlands.  But then, when they used that ecological damage to justify shutting down new drilling and oil exploration in the Gulf of Mexico it became obvious that this was a variation on the "Fast and Furious" strategy of the Obama Administration creating a problem in order to justify their response to it.

Posted by: Obnoxious A-hole at February 19, 2014 08:40 AM (BcCwi)

453 But... but... Christie HUGGED Obama!  That has to count for something in DC!

Posted by: Richard McEnroe at February 19, 2014 08:42 AM (XO6WW)

454 Posted by: Obnoxious A-hole at February 19, 2014 12:40 PM (BcCwi) I think it was the Dutch who offered to send over the biggest and baddest oil skimming vessel in the world...and of course Asshole In Thief said no...gotta stick it to those Gulf Coast rednecks who don't vote the right way, you see.

Posted by: model_1066 at February 19, 2014 08:42 AM (LIQGY)

455 Naw... worse than killing is mocking. To a liberal, being made fun of is a fate worse than death. Posted by: tangonine at February 19, 2014 12:25 PM (x3YFz) Oh, shut up! It was a joke. No one proposed killing anyone and only drew attention to a neat archaeology website. You are ace's definition of a busy body.

Posted by: Judge Pug at February 19, 2014 08:42 AM (6Nj7A)

456 @451 Gangsters, not guitar companies and mining operations.

Posted by: Beagle at February 19, 2014 08:42 AM (YHegH)

457 The last US flagged drill ship I know of was the Glomar Explorer, which was leased from the Navy by Transocean. I did a big project on it a few years ago. It's a historic ship, the secret CIA Russian submarine picker from the 70's. The Navy presence is Singapore gave us a Class A reception when we brought it into port there. When Transocean bought it finally they had to re-flag it to Majuro, Marshall Islands due to the outrageous taxation policy of the USA. It was sad to see the flag come down for the last time.

Posted by: Mr. Dave at February 19, 2014 08:43 AM (8mhW/)

458 453 But... but... Christie HUGGED Obama! That has to count for something in DC! Posted by: Richard McEnroe at February 19, 2014 12:42 PM (XO6WW) Obama was turned off by those big sweaty bitch-tits.

Posted by: model_1066 at February 19, 2014 08:46 AM (LIQGY)

459 Still no ampersands, or patch. I haz sads

Posted by: Village Idiot'sApprentice at February 19, 2014 08:50 AM (Y+MEB)

460 So where exactly in Maine is this ship docked? I couldn't find in the article. Because it should not take THAT LONG to go up to Canada, pull into port for a minute in, like, Nova Scotia, and then chug off down to NJ.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit at February 19, 2014 11:20 AM (4df7R)

They might have to actually take on or discharge cargo, not just tie up at the pier.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at February 19, 2014 08:54 AM (60Q+L)

461 sorry ace, we can't change the law because MURDER.

Posted by: X at February 19, 2014 08:55 AM (KHo8t)

462 Trust me, the NJ DOT doesn't need any other challenges to their incredibly bad snow clearing. I have driven in the winter in lots of states, and NJ is by far the worst in my experience. --- I used to spend a lot of time in Vermont. Their roads were great, even in winter. NJ has a third world infrastructure by comparison. But in-state tuition for illegals!

Posted by: whoever at February 19, 2014 08:57 AM (kGSN0)

463 I haven't read the comments, so apologies if others have noted this as well. The antiquated Jones Law is the same nightmare that prevented oil skimmers from reaching the BPS spill. Because we care more about unions than human safety. http://www.nola.com/news/gulf-oil-spill/index.ssf/2010/06/red_tape_keeps_prized_oil-figh.html

Posted by: Michael the Hobbit who is now Chelsea at February 19, 2014 08:58 AM (vVMIQ)

464 Obnoxious A-hole @ 452-
You are exactly right. This tactic of creating a problem and then capitalizing on it is what the Nazis did with the Reichstag fire. Only difference in the gulf was the oily BP bushchenyhalliburtons or whatever. Expect this kind of fecal matter to appear more and more often on the path to 2016.

Posted by: Erowmero at February 19, 2014 08:58 AM (OONaw)

465 This is called "cabotage" law. Most people think of it in the context of airlines, but it's a major PITA for people like me who work in the maritime shipping business. If, for example, I have cargo bound for Shanghai, and it discharges the vessel, we cannot then pick the cargo back up, restow to the vessel, and move it to Hong Kong. It's definitely rooted in protectionism whether here or in China or Greece, and it's problematic given that the majority of vessels are "flagged" in tax-haven countries like Liberia, who have far more permissive tax and regulatory structures. Maritime law is a goat rodeo of conflicting regulations and statutes.

Posted by: Flyover Country at February 19, 2014 09:01 AM (QRIOy)

466 "I used to spend a lot of time in Vermont. Their roads were great, even in winter. NJ has a third world infrastructure by comparison. But in-state tuition for illegals!" Michigan is pretty terrible too. You can hardly even drive 1/2 the speed limit on some city roads without having your wheeled rattled off.

Posted by: Roadrunner at February 19, 2014 09:03 AM (K1Xp3)

467 "Go and read "The FBI Story" which was printed in 1950. Go and read "Red Harvest" which Hammett based on his Pinkerton days helping bust unions in Wyoming. The only thing "militarized" about today's cops is the invention and use of effective personal armor. 100 years ago police departments had belt-fed .30 caliber Browning machine guns and used them against perps holed up in apartment buildings." I'm not naive enough to think that police were these magical beings of professionalism in the past, but past silliness does not excuse present silliness in the form of my small hometown of under 10k people having a bloated police force armed with a hummer and all sorts of bullshit they don't need. It is probably true that Republicans are partly responsible for this, as in the goal of wanting to be "tough on crime" a lot of excessive funds have been rained on police departments that they don't need.

Posted by: Roadrunner at February 19, 2014 09:07 AM (K1Xp3)

468 Didn't the same thing happen during the BP oil well fiasco?

Posted by: Joe Bar at February 19, 2014 09:41 AM (dHHIr)

469 OK, dumb law, but trafficland.com shows clear roads in NJ with traffic flowing, at least for now.

Posted by: PersonFromPorlock at February 19, 2014 09:46 AM (lILC0)

470 The purposes of the Jones Act are still sound, even though it was originally passed in 1920. But the process for obtaining a waiver should be much easier than it currently is. This is just ridiculous.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit at February 19, 2014 11:36 AM (4df7R)


The purpose of the Jones Act was to maintain a U.S. flagged merchant fleet sufficient to serve the needs of our national defense. In that it has failed. We contracted with foreign-flag carriers to move material to for our various excursions into Iraq and Afghanistan. So, sure, maintaining a U.S. flag fleet for national defense seems like a reasonable thing to do. But there is absolutely no doubt that the effect of the Jones Act was to reduce American merchant shipping from world leader down to a negligible asterisk in the shipping world. The ships available today are mostly aged bulk carriers used to transport USAID grain shipments around the world. Those are reserved cargoes but even much of that goes under foreign-flags for lack of available ships. One thing we don't have much of are container ships -- despite having pioneered the technology for moving supplies to Vietnam -- so the 495 or so U.S. flagged vessels are all but useless for moving anything but bulk grains and liquids.

Posted by: The Emperor Cletus Augustus at February 19, 2014 09:53 AM (xvN0P)

471 I do know a thing or two about the Jones Act, so I want to say up front that there are good reasons to keep it around. Number one being that we will continue to need a way to deploy military assets overseas and we need both U.S.-flag ships and American citizen crews to do it. That doesn't mean that the Jones Act is going to "save" the U.S.-flag merchant marine -- it's not. But we have to hold on to what we possibly can or else the next time we need to move a lot of equipment we're going to have to ask the Chinese to move it for us. That's just the way it is. The U.S. Navy's sealift capability is based on two things -- USNS ships it runs (nominally civilian) with U.S.-citizen civilian crews, and commercial U.S.-flag vessels it can call into service, also with U.S.-citizen crews. Furthermore, the argument that the Jones Act has led to the deterioration of the U.S.-flag merchant marine is misleading. Opponents of the Jones Act like to cite the age of the U.S.-flag fleet. What they're not telling you is that they are including the Great Lakes fleet. Lots of those ships are very old hulls, but the reason why they continue to operate those old ships is obvious: fresh water = no rust. Oceangoing ships rust out eventually. Meanwhile, there are Great Lakes carriers operating hulls laid down in the 1940s. The engines wear out, they swap them out for new ones. There's no need for bigger ships, because the St. Lawrence isn't going to get any wider and the ports on the Lakes won't accommodate bigger ships. Here's the thing -- the DOD has long been quite expert at gaming the Jones Act to put its cargoes on foreign-flag ships. Of course, they get a special exemption for national security. In this case, I'm amazed that no one had enough leverage to lean on the Maritime Administration to get a waiver.

Posted by: Brewdog at February 19, 2014 10:27 AM (2eKQX)

472 The Jones Act is a failure.

Full stop.

Period.

This. Is. Inarguable.

The merchant fleet it was intended to protect is decimated and aged. U.S. flag vessels are some of the oldest hulls on the ocean at this point.

Most of them are bulk carriers.

Lake boats are NEVER going to be called into service to carry war material overseas. If we go to war with Canada, we will send stuff over land. Those hulls are useless anywhere else in the world. But yes they do skew the age of the fleet somewhat.

Our ocean-going fleet is aged too. Perhaps not as much a lake boats but still pretty old. It wasn't that long ago that the S.S. Cleveland was removed from service.

http://themaritimeblog.com/fleet-profile-the-c-5-s-75a-class/

It mainly carried USAID cargoes around. It was launched in 1969 and scrapped only recently. Much younger ships than that routinely go under the torch on the beaches of Alang and Chittagong. To put it politely, the Cleveland would have been of limited utility were it necessary to press her into service. This is a not atypical example.

Basically, there are only a few U.S. flag container ships and those are mostly to carry stuff back and forth from the west coast to Hawaii. Those ships would actually be useful in a crisis but there are too few of them to matter. Likewise, the U.S. flagged RO/ROs. The rest are tankers and bulk carriers. Most of the tankers are small which may or may not be useful. The bulk ships are mostly for carrying reserved cargoes for USAID and would otherwise be scrapped.

The law fails to protect American ship builders, American mariners, or provide anything like a fleet ready to aid in the cause of national defense. On the other hand, it does allow the politically favored class to collect fees carrying government cargoes so that's something...

Posted by: The Emperor Cletus Augustus at February 19, 2014 11:07 AM (xvN0P)

473 Here's the best argument I can muster for maintaining the Jones Act -- a maritime cabotage law. Let's say you have a shipment you want to move from Baltimore to Jacksonville. You hire my trucking company to move it. You expect, and rightly so, that my company employs drivers that are legally allowed to work in the U.S., that my drivers have CDLs, that my trucks are maintained to the standards required by the DOT and state agencies, basically that I obey the law. If you don't like the price I offer you, there are other trucking companies available to you, and you expect them to also comply with U.S. law. A Jones Act carrier is the same way -- U.S. citizen crews, U.S.-flag vessels, inspected by the Coast Guard, etc., etc. It just doesn't seem morally right to make the Jones Act carrier compete against a foreign-flag operator who doesn't pay U.S. taxes (or much of any taxes), has a foreign crew paid far less than U.S. citizens, and is substantially less regulated. You wouldn't be able to operate trucks between Baltimore and Jacksonville and expect to be largely free from U.S. taxes, wages and rules. Just because you move the cargo by water from Baltimore to Jacksonville, that doesn't mean you should be able to avoid the same rules that U.S.-flag carriers have to live by. Anyway, that's the argument.

Posted by: Brewdog at February 19, 2014 11:10 AM (2eKQX)

474 @472 -- It's not that the Lake carriers would be called in to service. It's that they provide employment opportunities for American citizen crews. Military Sealift Command doesn't hire inexperienced people off the street to operate sealift vessels. The only source we've got for American citizen merchant mariners is what's left of the U.S.-flag domestic and oceangoing fleet. Those guys who run the LMSRs and who get sent to Diego Garcia with the pre-positioned fleet all have many years of valuable experience. And, more importantly, they're American citizens. The harsh reality is that, yes, the Jones Act can suck, but the alternative sucks more -- without it, the next time we need to move a lot of armor and helicopters and supplies overseas, we will have to go begging to Cosco, the China Overseas Shipping Company, which will get to make a very political decision regarding whether they will allow us to make that deployment.

Posted by: Brewdog at February 19, 2014 11:16 AM (2eKQX)

475 The people who have the best argument against the Jones Act are the people in Hawaii and Puerto Rico. They basically have only one carrier they can deal with. Another thing about the Jones Act -- Really, the only U.S.-flag, U.S-citizen crewed cruise ships are a couple of old, relatively small ones that operate around the Hawaiian Islands. Everything else is foreign-flag. So is the Jones Act all good? No, no way. It's that the alternative is worse. Much worse. If you want to get rid of the Jones Act, you need to phase it out and have a plan spanning ten or more years in order to get the Military Sealift Command away from it's current model -- hiring experienced U.S.-citizen civilian crews to run its ships. If we just drop the Jones Act, we're screwed. If we need to move the 1st Armored from Fort Bliss to somewhere overseas, they move those tanks to Galveston and put them on a ship. If there's not a U.S.-flag ship and there are no Americans to run the MSC's LMSRs -- then what? We're going to pretty much have to beg foreign carriers to take it -- and pay whatever they decide to charge us.

Posted by: Brewdog at February 19, 2014 11:28 AM (2eKQX)

476 @473 The reason waterborne cargo from Baltimore to Jax loses out is because the trucking company (and even the rail roads) can make better deals. They are free to purchase trucks manufactured overseas. They have substantially lower costs because they are free to hire union or non-union drivers as they see fit. They have greater choice in where they send their trucks to be repaired. Etc. American shipping has none of those advantages. As a practical matter there is very little coastwise shipping because of the implications of the Jones Act. It's true that by removing the Jones Act you might get some foreign flag carriers getting in on the coastwise trade but it is also probably true that if an American company could use, say, a Korean-built ship with a non-union American crew that was repaired in a foreign shipyard it might just be able to compete.

@474 The Jones Act put more American sailors out of work than it currently preserves. If there were more ships to work on we'd produce more mariners. As it is, many U.S. trained mariners go overseas to work because there is limited opportunity here. See: McPhee, John "Looking for a Ship".

See also: Gibson, A and Donovan, A. "The Abandoned Ocean"

Posted by: The Emperor Cletus Augustus at February 19, 2014 11:33 AM (xvN0P)

477 @157  The purposes of the Jones Act are still sound, even though it was originally passed in 1920. But the process for obtaining a waiver should be much easier than it currently is. This is just ridiculous.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Assault Hobbit at February 19, 2014 11:36 AM (4df7R)


And @ 475


What they said.  And, also, how many active shipyards do we have in the US today?  Anyone?   Not many.   Because anything bigger than a jon boat is cheaper to build in the far east -- Korea, Singapore, or China.  Mostly China. 

Most tankers are Chinese nowadays.  

We have Newport News and a few others, but mostly to build military vessels.

Without the Jones Act there would be no large vessel shipyards in the US today.  None.  The costs are nearly twice as high.

Instapundit had a link earlier this week stating that there are no manufacturers left in the US making any of the components for antibiotics and steroids and some other important drugs.  Most of these US supply comes from China.


That's sure to work out well if we get into a real fight with them.  Not having any shipyards would be bad for the same reasons.

Posted by: Troll Feeder at February 19, 2014 12:02 PM (fTZ8c)

478 NJ has access to the sea, why not spray salt water on the roads?

Posted by: Just Spitballing Ideas Here at February 19, 2014 12:03 PM (nbGZj)

479 Pretty fascinating to read the comments of The Emperor Cletus Augustus and Brewdog on this. There are intelligent mammals posting here :-D

Posted by: Roadrunner at February 19, 2014 12:05 PM (K1Xp3)

480 Brewdog, 475 - "If you want to get rid of the Jones Act, you need to phase it out and have a plan spanning ten or more years in order to get the Military Sealift Command away from it's current model -- hiring experienced U.S.-citizen civilian crews to run its ships. If we just drop the Jones Act, we're screwed." We definitely do need a robust MSC, no question. We need to put more resources into things like MITAGS and we need a revamped and professionalized Merchant Marine Academy. And other advanced nations with high labor costs have been able to retain dominance at least in specialized, high-tech aspects of shipping, like chemical carriers, icebreakers, and oilfield exploration and support vessels. We should examine these examples.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at February 19, 2014 12:09 PM (OSzB9)

481 Clearly, the Jones Act causes economic disruption and is offensive to libertarian ideals. I'm down with that. The problem, and it is a very serious problem, is that without some small protected market we will no longer have a source of experienced U.S.-citizen merchant mariners. That's just the way it is. When we send a carrier group somewhere, along with them go Military Sealift Command combat logistics vessels -- all of them crewed by American citizen civilian mariners. We simply cannot operate a carrier without them. Food, fuel, ammunition, spare parts -- all of it comes across on US Naval Service vessels. If you get rid of the Jones Act and you get rid of preferences for U.S.-flag carriers to move U.S. government cargo, then what?

Posted by: Brewdog at February 19, 2014 12:10 PM (2eKQX)

482 "Clearly, the Jones Act causes economic disruption and is offensive to libertarian ideals. I'm down with that. The problem, and it is a very serious problem, is that without some small protected market we will no longer have a source of experienced U.S.-citizen merchant mariners. That's just the way it is." This is what happens when you have a mixed economy like we do. Reforms that would increase liberty can actually unintentionally cause destruction because of how the system functions, and the way things have settled into a distorted equilibrium. Take immigration for example. My wife is an immigrant, and I've hated every second of going through the lawyer process to get her a green card. But I'd be even more scared of opening up the flood gates and allowing for free immigration, because Hispanics will culturally displace Americans and recreate their own spanish socialist hellholes from whence they came. This is why government controls are so insidious; once they are in place they burrow themselves in, so that removing them without care would probably cause more destruction. Wouldn't a lot of this problem with the Jones act be fixed if we just had a more sizable military/gov fleet? If we weren't hemorrhaging money on bullshit we could probably afford this.

Posted by: Roadrunner at February 19, 2014 12:15 PM (K1Xp3)

483 "Take immigration for example. My wife is an immigrant, and I've hated every second of going through the lawyer process to get her a green card. But I'd be even more scared of opening up the flood gates and allowing for free immigration, because Hispanics will culturally displace Americans and recreate their own spanish socialist hellholes from whence they came. " With immigration what I mean is that without the welfare state free immigration (assuming sensible screening for criminals and infected people) wouldn't be a problem. With the welfare state in place it obviously become icky, because one political party has a vested interest in importing vast quantities of future welfare recipients. One government control over our liberty fucks up another area of liberty.

Posted by: Roadrunner at February 19, 2014 12:19 PM (K1Xp3)

484 Roadrunner, 482 - "Wouldn't a lot of this problem with the Jones act be fixed if we just had a more sizable military/gov fleet"? Probably, in my opinion. And as I said upthread, it is a systemic decay that affects everything - naval architecture, the decay of shipbuilding talent, the decline in standards at the Merchant Marine Academy - a whole interrelated group of problems. One example, we are now considering designs for a new class of Coast Guard cutter and the leading contenders are from Holland and Spain.

Posted by: Skookumchuk at February 19, 2014 12:23 PM (OSzB9)

485 "Probably, in my opinion. And as I said upthread, it is a systemic decay that affects everything - naval architecture, the decay of shipbuilding talent, the decline in standards at the Merchant Marine Academy - a whole interrelated group of problems. One example, we are now considering designs for a new class of Coast Guard cutter and the leading contenders are from Holland and Spain." And meanwhile NASA has been sitting on their ass for decades, and is no longer leading the world in space. It's been a sad, long fall :-(

Posted by: Roadrunner at February 19, 2014 12:28 PM (K1Xp3)

486 @483

Exactly. You can have a generous welfare state with limited immigration and things will probably mostly work. Or you can have open borders and a limited welfare state and things will probably be mostly okay. But having a lavish welfare state and open borders is madness.

Posted by: The Emperor Cletus Augustus at February 19, 2014 12:30 PM (xvN0P)

487 For those looking for more reading matter on the subject of merchant shipping you could do worse than to pick up a copy of 'The Box: How the Shipping Container Made the World Smaller and the World Economy Bigger' by Marc Levinson. It is a fascinating explanation of the development of modern container shipping. It deals with Malcolm McLean and the creation of Sea-Land and its influence on the Port of NY and NJ. It discusses Cam Rahn Bay in Vietnam and a lot more besides. If any of the above is of any interest to you it is a good read.

Posted by: The Emperor Cletus Augustus at February 19, 2014 12:39 PM (xvN0P)

488 FWIW...

Qualified mariners -- in the experiential sense of the term rather than the bureaucratic sense -- leave our navy and coast guard every day... and promptly go into some other line of work. This is because if they choose to remain mariners they would have to seek civilian licensing which is burdensome, often redundant, and always costly. Once that hurdle is passed they can promptly go down to some union hall and sit around hoping to find a job. Unsurprisingly, most mariners leave the the military and never go to sea again.

So it's not that we aren't training people to become mariners. We are. It's just that we don't really have a viable maritime economy anymore. There are a handful of jobs on the Great Lakes or on the inland waterways. There are even fewer ocean-going jobs. These jobs are almost all union jobs that are handed out based on seniority which means young folks can expect to sit around... a lot. So if you spent 20 years learning ship handling in the navy you are basically S.O.L. when you separate and try to go civilian.

Would scrapping the Jones Act increase opportunities for some of these folks? Maybe. Maybe not. But it's at least worth asking why we have a Jones Act in the first place. And there can be no doubt that if fails to do the thing is was enacted to do and leads to a lot of economic absurdity besides. That alone should should be enough reason to do away with the thing. But maintaining a pool of skilled mariners is not really a problem we have. Currently, we actively discourage folks from pursuing maritime careers despite the high-flown rhetoric about our maritime heritage and national defense.

The Jones Act is just a weird fetish for crony capitalists and nautical nostalgics.

Posted by: The Emperor Cletus Augustus at February 19, 2014 12:57 PM (xvN0P)

489 @488

We have a Jones Act so that we have an indigenous ship-building capacity so that we retain the possibility of having an effective Navy.

Posted by: Troll Feeder at February 19, 2014 05:18 PM (xJTVU)

490 "Ancient Law"

1920, if memory serves.

Its a union thing.  They like their monopolies.  The law is there to protect a union from competition.  That's it.  Most people experience it, without knowing why, as higher prices on a variety of goods and services.

That's the same law that prevented help intended for Katrina victims reaching its destination.

It also prevented help in cleaning up the oil spill in the Gulf in Obama's 1st term.

Posted by: Aarradin at February 19, 2014 11:43 PM (+7Wfv)

491 @489

So basically we have Philadelphia, Newport News, Bath Iron Works, and Pascagoula. Each of which exists mainly because of DOD contracts. True enough that Philly built a couple container ships for Matson's Oakland - Honolulu run.

See here: http://www.ship-technology.com/projects/manukai_maunawili/manukai_maunawili1.html

In another 30 years or so Matson may come back and order ships to replace those. I think my original assertion stands. If the Jones Act is to provide us with "indigenous ship-building capacity" it has failed. What capacity we have is almost exclusively to build ships for the navy - no Jones Act required.

Posted by: The Emperor Cletus Augustus at February 20, 2014 05:33 AM (xvN0P)

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